Morning Joe - Trump hails 'amazing' Xi meeting, cuts China tariffs

Episode Date: October 30, 2025

Trump hails 'amazing' Xi meeting, cuts China tariffs Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Snap recipients shouldn't go without food. People should be getting paid in this country. And we've tried to do that 13 times. And you voted no, 13 times. This isn't a political game. These are real people's lives that we're talking about. And you all have just figured out 29 days in that, oh, there might be some consequences. There are people who run out of money.

Yeah, we're 29 days in. And they've done their best to make sure that a lot of these programs are funded. But at some point, the government runs out of money. Thirteen times people over here voted to fund SNAP. Thirteen times they voted to fund WIC. My aching back. Senate Majority Leader John Thune yesterday with a fiery response to Democrats after they introduced legislation to fund SNAP benefits

as the federal assistance is set to run out of money on Saturday. That's day after tomorrow. And this is, Willie. This is starting, I mean, this is going much longer, I think, than Republicans thought it was going to go. And, you know, again, I've been in John Thune's position where you pass bills to fund the government. And in that case, it was Bill Clinton that would veto them.

And then everybody was blaming you. So you're starting to see the frustration. come out, certainly, on the majority leader's part at the same time. The Democrats feel like, and the polls suggest they're holding a winning hand on actually protecting health care. Yeah, but as this game goes back and forth, as you say, 30 days in now coming up on a full month, on Saturday, the SNAP benefits run out. There are food pantries in this city and across the country, ramping up efforts, accepting

donations as many as they can take because people are now going to lose that assistance. it's getting real. I think Americans watch a political game who's up, who's down, who's better in the polls, who's blaming who. And they go, wait a minute, my life is being impacted now. Meanwhile, on Capitol Hill, there's been some Republican pushback to President Trump's tariffs,

as well as the Pentagon's plans to reduce the number of troops stationed in Europe. We'll go through all of that. It all comes as the Trump administration is making another move for direct military involvement in U.S. cities. We'll dig into that new reporting, plus an historic pitching performance

and some early offense have the Toronto Blue Jays one win away from their first World Series title since 1993. Really, what can you say? I mean, the pitching performance last night by this rookie,

extraordinary guy who a couple months ago nobody knew, now everybody that follows baseball knows because he beat Smokey Joe somebody's record from 19, 12, for strikeouts by a rookie. It was an extraordinary performance. Such a humble guy, and it's so wonderful to see his parents up in the stands, cheering and a hug.

This team, man, this is one of the most exciting teams in a really long time. Yeah, that's Trey Savage. He's a rookie. He started the season in A-ball. He was drafted in last year's draft, 2040. He was playing A-ball a few months ago. Playing for a couple hundred people. Yeah, yeah, literally a couple hundred people.

steps up in the biggest moment you can have in baseball, starting a game in the World Series on the road. And we have to say, again, you know, they could have collapsed after losing that 18-inning game a couple of nights ago, and they've done just the opposite. Bounce back with two wins. Blue Jay's win. He has 12 strikeouts the most ever by a rookie in the World Series.

They let off the game with two home runs, including the second one from Glad Guerrero, Jr., kind of setting the tone and never looked back. So Jay's up now, 3 to 2, going home to Toronto with two chances to win the first world series for that city since 1993. And you talk about everybody has a plan until they're punched in the face the first time. First pitch, Richard, home run. The second batter, home run.

And I will say, not only were the Blue Jays really good last night, the Dodgers were bad. They made a lot of mistakes. She had a guy, I think, walk. they get to second and third on wild pitches and then got home, again, without a hit. The Dodgers not looking like a team that has the gross domestic product of most mid-sized countries in Europe. They may lose the World Series, but they'll get a seat in the UN, John. Exactly.

They may. But Willie, it was surprising how sloppy they were last night. Yeah, they haven't looked good the last two nights. They're not hitting again. Not hitting. At all. They're going to have to figure that out quickly. Quickly. Good news for the Dodgers is game six starter is Yamamoto.

Oh, well. And he's been unhittable in his last two games throwing complete games, and then maybe you get Otani to pitch in game seven. So this is a long way from over, but Jay's fans have to be really happy with where they are. By the way, how cool was it, seeing Sandy Cofax? Oh, my gosh. And the front row, cheering. So awesome. All right. Also with us, columnist and associate editor for the Washington Post, David Ignatius. Let's get to our top story. David's our starting pitcher, by the way. He is. Exactly.

And Richard, President Trump is on his way back to Washington this morning after wrapping up his highly anticipated meeting with Chinese leader Xi Jinping. Speaking to reporters aboard Air Force One, the president says the two sides agreed on, quote, almost everything and that a trade deal could be signed, quote, pretty soon, adding that there weren't many stumbling blocks left. Trump, who rated the meeting, a 12 out of 10, offered 30. few specifics, but emphasized that the two leaders made progress on several key issues. He says China will pause restrictions on rare earth exports and buy large amounts of

American soybeans, while the U.S. will reduce fentanyl-related tariffs placed on Chinese goods. That will bring the overall levy on Chinese goods to 47 percent, down from 57 percent. According to Chinese state media, the two sides, reached a consensus on resolving important economic and trade issues. The president also said that Taiwan can, quote, Taiwan, quote, never came up amid speculation that the Chinese leader might push Trump to publicly oppose the island's independence. Moments after today's talks concluded,

President Trump also previewed the next meeting between the two leaders, saying that he plans to visit Beijing in April and that she will travel to the U.S. sometime after that. Richard, so at least when the president's read out on truth, social, and reading through some of what China's state media get to see, would you consider it a successful meeting? A limited success. I'm not sure I'd say 12 out of 10. Look, it was de-escalation, a truce, a pause, ceasefire.

essentially that the idea it bought you some time we'll see what happens in april so treasury secretary has to have more conversations with his opposite number geopolitics warren brought up so essentially joe a limited agenda some progress was made for a while which buys time and it stops the process of escalation right and that's welcome yeah then it's very welcome and uh david ignatius i guess that is the key word the success is, at least for now, de-escalation. I want you to take a step back and just look at the past week and President Trump going to our allies across the region before going to meet with Xi. And how would you consider the president's diplomatic efforts this week?

So, Joe, I think this was a good week in which President Trump really was reading out of the playbook of his predecessors in terms of Asia policy. He made a stop in Japan, seemed to have a very good meeting with a new Japanese Prime Minister Takeuchi, and reinforced the importance of the U.S.-Japan relationship as an anchor for us in Asia. I thought the meeting with Xi, in a sense, the real news is the photo opportunity, the smiles, the handshake. Each country had rolled out its big guns. in trade war. The U.S. Trump announced a 100% tariff, something even he said was not sustainable.

Chinese responded with very tough limits on export of their rare earth minerals. And what happened is, I think, the two sides really got to the edge of the precipice. They saw what people called decoupling between the two economies actually happening or about to happen. And they took a step.

step back. This was a meeting in which they agreed that they didn't want, said to couple for now. The details of this agreement are a little bit fuzzy, but it's clear that there won't be the 100% tariffs the U.S. was going to announce, and that for at least a year, there won't be the Chinese embargo on sale of rare earth minerals. So in that sense, the way is now open for a year of summits. Trump going to China, there'd be enormous fanfare for that, and then Xi coming to the United States. I'm told write in a piece that will be published shortly that Trump has in mind a relationship with Xi a little bit like Ronald Reagan's relationship with Gorbachev. That's what he's told some of his aides. As we remember, the cemetery of that period

was very consequential, ended up having huge arms control implications. Trump said yesterday that he actually would like to be talking about reductions in arms. So photo opportunity of smiles, that's That's the headline. So, Richard, both the White House and Chinese readouts confirm that Taiwan did not come up at this meeting. That's what they both sides said. That wasn't out on the table. They were just talking about trade at this meeting. Are you surprised or disappointed that the president did not raise the subject of Taiwan?

Not surprised the president didn't raise it. Well, I'm surprised a little bit that Chinese didn't. We used to call it radio identification. It was impossible to have a meeting with senior Chinese officials with Taiwan not coming up, Because it's an essential, not just a component, it is the component of their foreign policy. So the fact that the Chinese didn't bring it up, if the president's readout is correct, is interesting. It meant that they wanted to keep the focus narrow on the economics, see if they could, again, get this truce, whatever word you want to use. And that's clearly April.

That's clearly, but that's ultimately for Xi Jinping, when he thinks of his role in history, when he thinks of his legacy, it's not rare earths, it's not fentanyl exports or whatever. it is Taiwan. So if it didn't come up now, trust me, it's going to come up down the road. So shortly before his meeting with President Xi Jinping, President Trump announced the United States will resume testing nuclear weapons. In a social media post, Trump wrote that he has ordered the Pentagon to resume testing on an equal basis with Russia and China. The U.S. conducted its last nuclear weapons test in 1992. Former president, President George H.W. Bush signed a moratorium on testing that year. Here's what the president said on Air Force One overnight when asked about his social media post.

We have more nuclear weapons than anybody. We don't do testing. We've halted it years, many years ago. But with others doing testing, I think it's appropriate that we do also. Did he stills around the testing center? Like, where or when? It'll be announced. You know, we have test sites. It'll be announced. As the New York Times reports, some nuclear scientists were quick to point out. Trump announced testing on an equal basis with other countries.

That would mean testing delivery systems, which is all Russia has done and not warheads. One expert notes it would take the U.S. a considerable amount of time to conduct a nuclear test. So David Ignatius, the president then in the follow-up questions, was asked, are you talking about China here? And he said, effectively, it has to do with others. They all seem to be testing, in his words. China's developing nuclear weapons, not testing them, I guess, as far as we know. But who is this aimed at, as you read between the lines? My guess is it's aimed principally at Russia. Russia is making significant new announcements about strategic weapons, you know, a weapon that can cause a tsunami, was the latest thing

the Russians announced. Russians are big into intimidation with announcing the nuclear weapons-related projects. And Trump hasn't been shy about coming back talking about the U.S. is going to reposition its nuclear subs if Russia seems to be threatening. And there may be some of that in this announcement. One thing that's interesting about Donald Trump is that from the earliest days in politics, he's been interested in nuclear weapons limitation. So the idea that he could somehow draw China and Russia into a discussion about nuclear issues next year, I don't think is far-fetched. I think that would be an ambition for him. But as to today's announcement, I do see them mainly focused on Russia. And Richard, of course, the timing was before he went

into the summit with Xi, at the same time, though there was a response to what Vladimir food and just said a few days ago about nuclear testing. Yeah, a couple of things going on here. One is China has the fastest growing nuclear arsenal in the world. And that's an important thing. The Chinese look at Ukraine, interestingly enough, and they say, hey, the Americans didn't help Ukraine directly. They sent them arms.

They didn't send troops. That's a model potentially for a crisis over Taiwan. Why didn't the Americans go into Ukraine? It's because of Russia's nuclear arsenal. So China is intent on growing its arsenal as fast as it got. not testing, though, just growing it. Russia's building more delivery systems. Plus the U.S. Russian nuclear arms control agreements, basically the current one, the new start agreement, ends in a few months. We have to have massive negotiations with Russia. I also see this aimed

at that show. It's basically pushing back on Putin saying, if you won't agree to have serious nuclear arms control talks, we have options ourselves. Some other news this morning, two top Republicans on Capitol Hill are criticizing the Pentagon's plan to cut the number of of American troops deployed to Eastern Europe. Senator Roger Wicker and Congressman Mike Rogers, who chair their respective Armed Services Committee, say the move jeopardizes the U.S. relationship with key allies on NATO's eastern flank.

Around 700 troops with the 101st Airborne Division will be rotated out of Germany, Romania, and Poland, as the Trump administration shifts its focus toward Latin America and Asia. The Republican chairman, right, in part, this decision also sends the wrong signal to Russia, At the very moment, President Trump is applying pressure to force Vladimir Putin to come to the table to achieve a lasting peace in Ukraine. I mean, it is David Ignatius, why that's a statement straight out of the 19th century, you know, the Monroe Doctrine, alive and well in Pete Hegg's head. Unfortunately, the timing of it just couldn't be worse, as the Republican Armed Services chairman on the House and the Senate boat said,

you're doing this at the same time you're trying to push Vladimir of Putin back in your this sends exactly the wrong message doesn't it it does to Russia it my sense is that Trump really is turning our national security priorities up upside down Russia is an increasingly aggressive threat to Europe and by extension of the United States the threat in in Latin America is limited even Trump describes it in terms of narcotics problem that's not usually seen as national security. You know, we'll have to see whether the Congress can really challenge this. It's a fascinating thing that happened yesterday.

I don't know whether you're going to get to it, but it deserves mention. The Republican leadership of the Senate Intelligence Committee was given a briefing on what the U.S. is doing with Venezuela in Latin America. blowing these drugboats out of the water and refused to give that brief same briefing to democratic members the intelligence committee the vice chairman is unbelievable wonder is furious and and and rightly so that you know that move breaks a committee that has been one of the few islands of bipartisanship the idea that you can only brief one party about vital national security matters uh it's just a a new step even for the Trump administration.

And I think Warner is going to speak out strongly about it today. A lot of things happening at once. It's never done, Willie. Yeah, this is Senator Warner's statement on this. He writes, quote, decisions about the use of American military force are not campaign strategy sessions. They're not the private property of one political party. That used to be obvious, Joe, went without saying. Right.

But now he has to say that out. I mean, Richard, obvious, up until now. I mean, they're blowing up boats. Even Republicans are saying we don't know who's on those boats. And so they're deciding they're only going to bring. Again, this is at the height of the battles between Democrats and George W. Bush during the Iraq war, right? You name it, whatever it was. The Intel Committee, again, there was no separation.

That's one of the reasons why when Marco Rubio, you know, he worked with Democrats to write that report, I believe it was in 2019 saying that, and he was on this same Intel Committee, worked with Democrats to say that the 2016 Trump presidential campaign posed an existential threat to, you know, counterintelligence efforts. You know, when we grew up, we used to say that politics stopped at the water's edge. Now it doesn't even get to the water's edge. You can't get beyond the Potomac. And this committee has been something of a sanctuary or meeting very carefully, as you know, in secret, own special spaces.

The idea that now it is being politicized this way is, it's just an awful thing. I guess I make a larger point also with the troops potentially out of Europe and the question about Asia. This administration, at least the Pentagon, is on the verge, it seems, of her major reset in American foreign policy. Remember, Joe, for years, we would talk about the pivot to Asia. Right. What we're seeing is a pivot a little bit out of Europe, continuing. Not necessarily a pivot to Asia anymore. We're seeing a pivot to the Western Hemisphere.

The greater use of the military here at home, the greater use of the military in the Western Hemisphere. This is enormously consequential. This is really a redirection of American military resources. This has got to be debated. It's questionable. It's bizarre. I mean, you look David Ignatius at where the drugs are coming in from Central and South America, the vast number of them are not coming from Venezuela.

The suggestion that you're going to stop fentanyl trafficking, and the trafficking of cocaine and other drugs by blowing up boats off the coast of Venezuela is just complete lunacy and everybody knows it. Democrats and Republicans like, no, they're lying. This isn't about a drug war. But as Richard rightly says, this is about flexing your muscles in your own hemisphere. The Wall Street Journal cleverly described this as the Don Row. doctrine, playing off the Monroe Doctrine, which asserted that this hemisphere, North and South America, is our space, and nobody's allowed to infringe on it. And Trump, as in so many other ways, seems to be moving back to the 19th century and those definitions of American foreign

policy. At a time when U.S. interests are so clearly threatened in Europe by a very aggressive of advancing Russia and in Asia, by a growing Chinese threat, all this focus on central Latin America is just hard to understand. All right. Still ahead on Morning, Joe. The latest on the government shutdown. Ali Vitale and Jonathan Lemire will both join us with their new reporting on that. Plus, one of our next guests has gone viral for his incredible ability to seemingly read people's

minds. Willie, you woke up to that, right? He's already been working me over. Man, 5.30 a.m. And he got all your pin numbers. Oh, he's got all my personal data. Wait a minute.

Holy count. World renowned mentalist. Ouse Perlman is our guest. He's amazing. I think I'm excited about this. Straight ahead on Morning Joe. We'll be right back. If I brought the house back, we'd pass another CR,

would meet the exact same fate from Chuck Schumer. He would mock it. They would spike it, and they would try to blame it on us. So what in the point, what would be the point of that? Speaker, Mike Johnson, putting a damper on the idea of bringing House lawmakers back before the Senate acts on a government funding bill, telling reporters it would be a futile exercise. Besides, they'd have to swear in somebody that got elected how long ago? A long time ago. A month ago. The defining vote on the Epstein House. Wouldn't want that. The Epstein files release. Why, that would just be few. It's futile if you wanted to keep all that out of Americans' hands.

We'll stop a lot of other things, too, just for that. All right. There may be some small signs of progress, though. Senate Majority Leader John Thune yesterday said there's been an increase in conversations among rank-and-file senators and that he thinks he'll talk with Democrats, quote, pretty soon. That comes with less than 72 hours until vital snobes. MAP benefits expire for nearly 42 million Americans.

Thune and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer have not met at all this month to discuss an exit path. But Schumer told reporters earlier this week, he believes after November 1st, Republicans will face, quote, increased pressure to negotiate with us. With us, we have the co-host of our fourth hour, staff writer at the Atlantic. Jonathan Lemire. MSNBC contributor, Mike Barnacle, is here. senior Capitol Hill reporter Ali Vitale. She's, of course, the host of way too early. And before we get to the reporting, Mike, it's almost as if over the past several days, Republicans have figured out that Medicaid cuts impact red states as much or more than they impact blue

states, cuts to snap benefits, make children in Missouri and Georgia. And even though Tommy Tubberville doesn't know it, Alabama, hungry, that the cutting of these benefits are going to hurt their voters as much are more than it's going to hurt Democratic voters.

And while I certainly understand the frustration of John Thune on the floor about them passing their clean CRs, this debate's gone well beyond that now and it is about health care and Republicans who haven't done anything since claiming they're going to have a better Obama care.

Yeah, I think, yeah, well-being, yeah, we're moving beyond 10 years. They've done absolutely nothing proposed absolutely nothing on health care. It's obvious they lose the health care fight, and that's what this debate's about right now. Well, they have the 10 years of waiting to announce potentially whatever their health plan is supposed to be. 10 years, people have been waiting for, we haven't had it. Now they're facing, obviously, the D-Day of November 1st. November 1st, that's when people go hungry. That's when people can't find enough money in their small allotment of money

to buy food, to put food on the table. That's what, that's what, John Thune yesterday on the floor of the United States Senate. I was shocked, given his nature. John's a mild-mannered guy. Yes, yeah. I was shocked at the end, you know. The upper Midwestern guy comes up. My aching back!

Yeah. I mean, no, he doesn't. I, you know, I've known him for over 30 years. I've never heard him raise his voice once. But don't you think, given his nature, because you do know him, and I was thinking of you when I first saw it on TV yesterday afternoon, don't you think he desperately wants to make a deal? I don't figure out how can they not make a deal?

What is the problem here? Well, they're going to have to make a deal, but it doesn't make a deal. Since, I mean, again, I've been in the exact position where the government shut down in 1995, 96, we would keep sending appropriation bills to Bill Clinton, and he'd keep vetoing him. And he wanted to prove a point. And sometimes, you know, eventually we started sending him exactly what he asked for, like in legislative branch appropriate. He vetoed it. And we said, but we knew exactly what you wanted us to do. And then he'd go out and go, Republicans are cutting Medicare to pay for tax cuts for the rich.

But that's where we are now. So it's very frustrating. And for John Thuny's thinking, okay, we've put a CR that you voted for last time on the floor 14 times. And yet you're still, you know, voting against it and then complaining about the benefits that we're talking about funding. But again, John, this is moved in large, part, I think because the president has been going across Asia, and he's been focused on Middle East peace, he's been focused on not insignificant things. He hasn't really been focused on this, but do you get a sense inside the White House and from your reporting

in Washington that Republicans are starting to understand they're going to have to do something here, especially on Medicaid? Yeah, they're going to have to something and something soon. And I wrote on this yesterday. It's sort of what we've been talking about around the table the last couple of days as well. As the president has been just missing an action when it comes to the shutdown. Now, obviously, he has been very busy on other things. He was in the Middle East. He's currently in Asia. Some of the other things on his plate, perhaps less significant, like the ballroom that's going to go up instead of the now raised East Wing. But at first, this was a deliberate strategy that they wanted to remove him the equation.

They thought Democrats would fold. They thought Republicans had momentum this year and that they would be able to strong arm this through. Now it has changed. They're hearing from the Hill, from some Congress members who were wishing that Speaker Johnson would call the House back into session. We're starting to hear some anxiety from the Senate as well as to where this is going because that November 1st day looms. Republican voters, red states are being impacted by this. So I'm being told, yes. In the last few days, the White House itself getting nervous. They feel like the president is going to have to step back in. At this point, they'll wait until he's back from Asia. So in a day or so.

that Trump himself is going to have to get to a deal or this is just going to get worse for Republicans. Yeah, I hope Mika doesn't, doesn't mind me saying this, Willie, but the reveal a conversation we had about the government shutdown up. Mika is paid, right, to be the catastrophizer. I don't know who's paying her, but I'd like to take all the money out of their bank account because she's very good at catastrophizing. It's very interesting, though, the dynamics of these shutdowns, how how they work. And the psychology. out there, right? Who you think has the advantage going into this? Republicans were sure, the White House was sure, that Donald Trump would have the advantage and would tell Russell vote,

wipe out the government. A couple of days ago, I heard Mika talking to somebody who said, oh, Russell votes going to cut more, and she just left. She was, let him try. Go ahead. Take this from bad to worse. And that was just her attitude, which is the attitude of Democrats, are Democrats, which is, oh, you're actually going to screw things up. Go ahead, Russ. Cut! Cut! Because it will all come back on you.

It will all come back on Republican members of the House. It will all come back on those Republicans that you have to have when in 2026 or else we're going to have a new speaker. It's like it's just the whole mind, you know, the mindset has changed here. and it's not favoring Republicans. That is the mindset of Democrats when you talk to them. They feel like the longer this goes and real pain starts to be inflicted, maybe Republicans will step back from the break, as John says, and come to the table.

Allie, you're writing about this this morning. You're talking to Republicans on Capitol Hill. Leader Thune expressing some small measure of optimism saying at least conversations have ticked up. But what is the breaking point here for either side, where they say, okay, enough is enough. Let's sit down and sort this out. Yeah, I think as you guys are talking about the pressure points that are looming over the weekend,

I think November 1st and the deadline, be it on SNAP benefits running out or on the official start of open enrollment season, both sides see that as a pressure point that's sort of a Rorschach test because Republicans look at it and say, OK, snap is the thing that's going to bring Democrats out of their posture into the negotiating table. Democrats say that increased enrollment prices and people seeing these higher premiums that don't include the Obamacare subsidy, that's going to break Republicans from their posture. But when I heard Senate Majority Leader John Thune yesterday morning say, okay, rank and file negotiations have picked up. We're starting to see them potentially gain some traction. I immediately started asking questions of senators on both sides.

And this is one of the first conversations I had with Senator Daines. Listen to what he told me. Senator Thune keeps talking like something's changed behind the scenes. Hopefully the fever is starting to break. What makes you think? I think there's some cracks developing right now. amongst the Democrats, and I'm glad some common sense may finally prevail. So then immediately we started asking other Democratic senators about that.

Are you seeing a fever breaking? Are you seeing cracks starting to form? And Senator Gene Shaheen, who's one of the Democratic ringleaders of these more quiet bipartisan talks, said, it's funny, we're hearing cracks on the Republican side. And so both sides are sort of talking past each other, which is why the piece that I wrote yesterday, which is titled, There's a Potential New Hope for this Government Shutdown ending, maybe possibly feels apt. Because in my conversations with sources, David Ignatius, I talked to someone yesterday who said these bipartisan talks have been happening regularly over the course of the last

four weeks. There have been calls. There are text messages between this smaller group of bipartisan lawmakers. Yes, potentially they might have something that's worth talking about in more tangible form right now, but they still put the timeline at some time next week. Election day is one of the factors. The president being overseas is another one of the factors. All of these are things that senators have mentioned to me as part of the calculus. And yet, we're still in this shutdown posture with a glimmer of hope, but maybe not so much stock to put behind it. The thing that I find worrisome is that each side is counting on the level of pain for ordinary people, recipients of these benefits, to be the decisive factor. The pain is going to be so great

that the fever will break, the log jam will be broken. It's just another example, frankly, of how broken our government is, that that's how we're talking about how to get back to functioning. You know, it's interesting, Richard Haas, when one of the senators was saying, maybe the fever's breaking in his very nice, mild, reassuring Midwest voice, John said, no, the fever never breaks. It's gone from 106 to 104 and a half. It's still there. But again, though, it is, again, drawing upon my own experiences,

it seemed like a great thing to do at first shutting down the government to try to balance the budget. But I remember when things got real, you were shocked by the number of people that were calling you, that you were constituents where the government and government programs and jobs and everything was hitting. And you were getting calls from everything. And my mom called me at the end of one day. when it was like really dragging on.

She goes, how's it going up there, Joey? I go, I did not sign up for this shit. And I think they're about at that stage now because they're not hearing from left-wing hippie protesters in their districts. They're hearing from their neighbors. They're hearing from their friends. They're being pulled aside at church.

They're being told, hey, this is really hurting me or this is hurting my family or my daughter has a job here and they do great work. and do you understand the vets that are going to not get this? You know, that you start hearing that. And again, after a while, even a guy like me that wanted to eliminate, you know, four cabinet agencies and, you know, slash the budget and balance it immediately, suddenly you start going, yet this is just not politically doable.

Seems like we may be getting close to that. It's the point in every war. It's easier to get into it than it is to get out of it. And I think right now people are seeing the closest. I don't know if you noticed yesterday, the CBO came out with a report and said if this shutdown goes on, say, through another month, say through Thanksgiving, you're looking at a 2% falling off of U.S. GDP in the fourth quarter. This is really slowing the, this is really slowing. Two percent. Fourth quarter, you know, something would be regained afterwards. But this is, this is a major drag on the, on the U.S. economy. So my saying, and things like air traffic controls, I don't think people at this Thanksgiving want to have flights delays. over this. So my sense is you're right, this is beginning, you know, we're probably closer to the end than we are to the beginning. But it's starting to have an impact, Mike, on everything, including air traffic control. I mean, we had ground stops at Newark, which, by the way, it's not unusual, but the ground stops

actually are lasting longer now. It's a news story when you have flights that leave on top. You might know. Do you imagine flying from Newark to Miami? Seriously, get on a Greyhound. You'll get there faster. drive. The weight of it begins at Social Security with elderly people, with people who rely on social security payments. The government's been shut down. It's impossible to get anyone in Social Security to speak to, to address a problem. And then you have November 1st coming up, and you have people continually on TV, public people, elected representatives, both in the Senate and the House, saying nobody wants to see anybody go hungry, except for Tommy Tuberville. And Russell Vaught. I would not, I mean, come on, nobody wants to see anybody to go hungry.

That's certainly true, but they're not behaving like that story. All right. Richard Haas. If I'm a Democrat running in a Biden district against a Republican in Congress, I have Donald Trump, I have chainsaw man, and I have Russell Vaugh. I mean, come on. That is, there are so many 30-second commercials there. Then I just go to France and just run the commercials. come back and let them swear me in. They're making it that easy. Richard

Haas, David Ignatius, thank you both very much for being on this party. What are you laughing about? There's nothing wrong with France. MSNBC senior Capitol Hill reporter and host of way too early, Alley Vitale, thank you as well. And coming up, our next guest says that with the right mindset, we can all have the capacity to achieve more than we think. We're all freaked out now. O'S Whirlman joins us with what he calls, proven habits for success from the world's greatest mentalist. That's straight ahead on Morning Joe. Right now, think of a number between one and a hundred that either means something to you,

or somebody else or something. Don't say, now watch. He did a little shifty eyes. You asked me, what do people do? A little bit of shifty eyes. Like he was debating. Don't know. I'm not going to write this yet.

I was thinking 24, but I don't know you might have shifted. Kelly, I'm going to go with this. You didn't see it yet. Did you take the pen? Take the pen. Was your number two digits? Yes. Me too.

Me too. How do you think I did here? What was the number? Tell us, what were you thinking? 56. Tell him what I wrote. Please tell him what I wrote down. He wrote what I wrote down.

He wrote 56. 56. He wrote Ryan 56. 56. 56. Okay. He's one of the most sought-after entertainers with clients, ranging from former president Barack Obama,

Stephen Spielberg, Tom Brady, and more mentalist. Perlman insists he's not a psychic, but he can read minds. Here he is in action. The movie star that you were focused in on was Tom Cruise. And what movie were you seeing him in on that big screen? Top Gun. No. Since then, O'S Pearlman has been making regular appearances on the Today Show, blowing away the hosts. What word did you pick out of those thousands. Sportsmanship? Sportsmanship. Oh, come on. There's no way. Does he really have special powers? Or is something else going on? This is O's from America's Got Talent. Perelman agreed to hit the streets of New York with me. What is happening? And he amazed everyone when he asked this complete

stranger to pick a big word out of the magazine he provided her. What was the word you thought of out of that whole magazine. Possibilities. So many possibilities. Oh, come on. I don't get it. Pearlman has astounded everyone from strangers on the street to celebrities with his incredible abilities. Back in 2005, he left his Wall Street job to become a professional mentalist going on to gain fame as a contestant on NBC's hit show, America's Got Talent. Now he's out with a new book entitled, read your mind proven habits for success from the world's greatest mentalist in it he shows readers how understanding the mind can unlock your potential build confidence and help you master the art of reading others oh i love that and oz perlman joins us now i love it morning joe thanks for having me

gang ohs morning oz bless you i knew you would sneeze right now i know you'd freak him out already So listen, let's do this. Before you freak us all out, yes, let's sell books. Yeah, let's sell books. If people are going to get this book, they've seen you on social media, TV, you freaked them out. But they can get that on YouTube. 100%.

What do they get when they get the book? What are they going to learn? So a key difference. So for 30 years, I have been learning how to reverse engineer the human mind. That's literally my job. And it's done under the guise of entertainment, which is if I know how you think, I can figure out what you're thinking. And this is very effective, like you said,

to watch me with football stars and movie stars and freaking people out. But I started to distill what are the core skills that what I do, right, that I can teach you where you can apply the craft of mentalism to your life. And this is across the board. This is at work.

This is at home. This is in your relationships. Because reading people more effectively can be a superpower in life. And that's it. It's like, you know, Mel Gibson out of one. what women want. That's exactly the key reference. My wife wishes I had that skill at that

moment. For some reason, this is the one thing you cannot do us. What's wrongly? So talk about how it helps it work, how what you've written in this book, helps negotiating, helps people, helps people succeed better. Absolutely. So I break it down as a kind of modern reinvention of how to win friends and influence people. I am not teaching you tricks. I want people to know, I don't want a single person to be disappointed and go, I bought the book and I don't know how you knew which ball Joe Burrow would throw to people. That's not the skill I'm teaching you. Right. One of the big ones is how to gain confidence, right now, all of us being on TV is something that most people are mortified to do. How do you walk into a room, take control,

command the room, and become the most memorable person when you leave. How do you do it? So there's so many skills associated with that. It comes down from body language to how you choose to converse to how much you pause before you walk up to someone. I'll give you a great example. When I was 14 years old, I was a magician. I've been doing it for a year, and my mom says, if you want to buy more tricks, you've got to go work. So I went to a restaurant. How I sweet talk this, I don't know, or gained the confidence. But what I learned very quickly is that if I'm some little twerpy teenager walking up to your table,

asking if you want to see a card trick, people go, no, get out of here, kid. And so I learned that the way I approach people so simple is just walking up to somebody with two eyes is seen as danger. It puts people at a tent. It's just something from your animal instincts. If I walk up to you at an angle with simply one eye showing, that's that simple, subtle change, and I institute a time constraint. So when I walk up to the table, I go, I only have one minute. But right away, your tension is reduced by an enormous margin, because now you're not staying that long. Who is this person?

And you're one foot in, one foot out. I also notice that people are tense because they don't know who I am. Oh, no. Is this guy asking for money? Oh, no, do I have money to tip him? All of this tension occurred. how quickly could I ease their tension by saying, they also don't know if I work there. They're like, is this guy off the street? What's he about to do?

So how many words and how can I tighten up from the moment I meet them, how many seconds before they know who I am, what I do, establish credibility, and ideally flip the power dynamic, which is when I walk up to you, I'm selling you something, right? You're selling people right now, the attention economy eyeballs. How do I flip it so that now they want me more than I want you. And I realized that if I could walk up to you, never ask a yes or no question when you meet someone, ever. That's a huge mistake because if they say no, they just close the door in your face. Instead, I give them the lottery of happiness, which is, hey, did you hear what's going on tonight? It's your lucky night. What can you say no to that? Did you hear what's going on?

Right away, you're piqued, you're intrigued. I go, I only have a minute, but the owner brought me here is a special treat for you, and I have something amazing to show you. There's very few moments there where you have a no situation. Instead, you're intrigued. You've earned the first few seconds. And then from there on it, you better be good at what you do. But I learned very quickly that just the way you approach someone makes a huge difference. And that's at work events. You make it easy for them. Well, this is easy. Listen, yeah. Do you think I was coming out of 14? It was fake until you make it. So a lot of the skills in the book are actionable takeaways. I don't want pie in the sky. I want things you can do today. So, oh, despite the title of the book,

read your mind. You always say, you're not a mind reader. This isn't like tarot cards and all that mysticism. You are, you read people. So I'm curious about when you first discovered this about yourself. Because we all kind of read body language and do that, but you have a very special ability to do that. When did you realize you had something here? So I start as a teenager with card tricks and magic and close up. And so that's a foundation. It's kind of the same way I mention if you go to premed and then you go medical school and then become a doctor, there's foundational skills involved. So that, for example when i did that you look down i didn't say a word to you but i took control and wait a second and then all of you look down that's what's known in magic as misdirection that's the core of how people deceive your eyes with fast hands because you look at the wrong place at the right time you understand once you learn how to do that just based on your body language your expression you have props so a magician has props so to answer your question i don't mean to skirt it is for about 15 years, I did magic. I hated mentalism. I thought it was boring because there's no tricks. You can practice magic in your room in front of a mirror hours and hours a day, which

trust me, I did. I had waterproof cards. It says it in the book, nerd level 10 out of 10 because in the shower, I still had to keep practicing card tricks. I'm not proud of this fact. But at a certain point, what I started to realize is that I don't need you to pick a card, Joe. I don't need the cards. I could start to deduce what card you're going to go for based on just how you react. Right. And so less and less did I need props. And I kept doing bigger and bigger shows. And then thank you NBC. I did America's Got Talent, changed my life. And there I became O's the mentalist. Before that, I was doing a little bit of magic still. But then I decided to take the leap and just really brand myself. Wow. So where is the root of who you are today? What were you five years old,

10 years? 13. I went on a cruise ship. That was, I had a bar mitzvah. We didn't have a big party. We didn't really have a lot of money. Went on a cruise ship as a celebration. I saw a magician on board.

I'm about 99% sure my dad bribed this guy. I don't know what he greased the wheels. He got me on stage like my kid's birthday. And this guy blew me away. Like I'm telling you, I wasn't even mentalism. It was a magic trick. I got home and if you know anything about me, you'll see the book. I am an obsessive.

I don't do things 100%. It's 190%. Yeah. I checked out every book in the library. This is when borders are still and I had all my bar mitzum. I bought every book in the library. I read them cover to cover. And I just dove in head deep.

Wow. All right. So let's get started. I'm scared. Willie said he came in. Tired this morning. I was getting ready. I looked at him.

I said, wake up. I've been on Willie with the Today Show before. He's experienced this. And he said that he was open up his eyes and saw you and go, ah. Yeah. He's very scared him right away. So let's see this first. Well, you ask me a very poignant question, and it's a chapter in the book, which is how did you learn this?

And one chapter in the book is all about fast-tracking success. It's about stacking the deck in your favor. And how did I learn? Well, people taught me. Finding mentors is so critical. And I bet in each of your lives, given how successful you are, there's people who have given you advice, who have mentored you, who even a throwaway comment might have changed your trajectory. So I want each of you, I don't like to focus everyone right now, rewind back in time to a point in your life. where someone told you something.

Maybe it was a mentor that took you another way and changed who you are. You would not be here without something they did for you. And I'm putting you that spot. Did somebody just pop in your head right that moment? Maybe a few people. I like a Jonathan's like, I didn't know there'd be homework this early in the morning.

Mika, did you have somebody? Joe, did somebody pop their head? Or you're still debating? I saw Willie's nodding. I can tell he has it. Willie, if you were to rewind back in time, I want you to try to visualize this person's face. Can you do that?

Got it. now notice you asked me body language his hands were here he was very his body language remained the same it's kind of a benchmark 50 50 could have been a man put him in a woman 100% it's a guy am I right you are if it's a woman different reaction generally would have touched that healthy head of hair always works yeah I'm starting to sweat before today before today because I got to I want to let them know let's establish credibility we've been on TV together before long time Yeah. So before that, we had not seen each other in years. Is that right? When was the last time before today? Right? And then me asking everybody to do this,

that you thought of this person. Has it been days, months, or years that they've been in your life? Say weeks. Weeks. Okay, let me think. Think of their first name. And I want you to count the letters to yourself in your head. Insta, Insta nod. There's a biggest mistake he could have made. He nodded instantly. Do you have children? Yes. When children are learning to read, kindergarten in first grade, They have sight words, which they learn, which they don't actually know how to read yet, but they can see them by sight. So what you did is you had a sight word. You didn't count the number of letters.

You knew, which instantly tells me the name is three or four letters. Didn't know how much it was until now, but you reacted on three. Is it a three-letter name? Of course it is. I wouldn't be on this show if I didn't get it right. Come on. Mika's freaking out. I love the fact that she didn't realize what was about to hit her this morning.

You're next, by the way. What's funny is that she thought you were like on that baking show from Britain. Right now, I like that one. That was good. Three letter names are very hard. You don't realize it because they're short, but there's lots of them. Mix up the letters. Okay. And I want you to grab one of the letters in his first name.

Just in your head, grab it like a Scrabble Tile. You have it? Now, Willie's struggling right now. Three letter names are tough. Yeah. Because you think if I do the first letter, that's just a giveaway. And he knew that. So he said, ah, I might do it anyway.

You didn't do the first letter, did you? I did not. No, because you said, that's the giveaway. And then we know there has to be a vowel. There has to be a vowel. So then he didn't do the vowel. You didn't do the vowel either, did you? No.

Look at me and your lips. I saw you in the makeup chair. I walked by the room. They gave him chapstick. His lips are supple. Why was he moisturizing? Why was he moisturizing? He didn't even do this, watch you it like this?

Oh, my God. You thought of the letter M, didn't you? You're thinking of the letter M. Close your eyes. Close your eyes. Keep them closed, please. Everyone take a peek. I'm going to show you over on this side.

Quick show to the camera. Jonathan, you can get in here. Willie. Be honest, there is absolutely no conceivable way that we could have known who you would have thought of. And you could have thought of so many different people on the spot. Correct. You could have changed your mind. It's a free country.

Correct. God bless America. You went back in time years ago. Am I right? I feel like maybe even decades ago. You saw this person's face. Who gave you a piece of advice that changed your life? What's his name?

Jim. Jim. Oh, my God. Oh, man. Oh, my Lord. This is fair. You're terrified. You're terrified.

Make it thinks it's sorcery. Yeah, exactly. Now, Mika, you're usually the one asking the questions. I want to do this with you. Imagine that you are asking the questions, and she has so many more questions. It's like we have a four-hour segment. We're extending him by an hour. I'm here.

If you could sit down right here and interview anyone that's ever lived, I like this question. I like posing this to people because it's fascinating where their minds go. Do you think, I want you to close your eyes, and I want you, I know it's a tough question. It's loaded. I want you to visual, yes, yes, yes. I want you to visualize this person's face as if they're right here. And I want you to open your eyes

if you can see their face. Look at that smile. That was, oh, that was, I'm curious now. Because I didn't say it has to be somebody you like or just like, I didn't load it the way you did with mentoring. This could have been anybody. Maybe she wants Trump here.

We got a lot of questions. Do you think your husband would guess who you just picked? Yeah. Don't say, do you think you know who it is? Yeah, my guess. You do think so. I think so.

Okay, don't, I don't want you to say it out loud because if you guess that just means you're a good listener. Let's do this. Think of the last name of the person you think she picked. Okay. And don't tell me, and think of the last letter, because that really doesn't give anything away. Like your last letter is an E, your last letter is a T. What do you think the last letter of this person's last name is? Aye.

I. Okay. Oh, she smiled. That was correct. Hmm. Interesting. I think I got. I think.

When you thought of this question, I saw you not, you looked up, you definitely thought of, will you think of somebody who's alive when I asked this question? I did. Yeah, I could tell. Versus Willie's got dead guy vibes written all over. Is it a dead guy? For me? Yeah, for me.

For you. Oh, yeah. Yeah. 100% dead guy for Willie. 100%. It's got dead guy. Dead guys. And supple lips.

It's up a lip. This way. This way, look at me. I think I know. I think you did a little cheat code here. What? I think this was a smart choice. close your eyes please close your eyes joe i don't want you so awkward anyone could be sitting

across me open your eyes now normally abraham lincoln you did abraham lincoln didn't you yep see that's a classic choice willy's into history but you decided tell us all who's sitting across from you right now you're asking this person i think it's a guy also who's who's who you having this intense conversation tell us who is it do you want me to tell me to Tell you who I chose? Yes. I chose my dad. You chose her dad.

Oh, my God. Are we that easy? Oh, my God. It's amazing. That is amazing. Okay. You know, what if we had, that's amazing?

What if we had put money on this? Like, how do we step this up? The person you thought of Jim, can you put a pin? It's difficult to do this on when you met Jim. Can you visualize? I don't know if you know. the day in the month. That would be unusual. The year. Don't say, take this. John, I don't want you to see this. I don't want anyone to see this. I don't want to even

see this. Grab this mark, please, really? And don't let anyone see this. I want you close to your body. Okay. Very close. Tighten it up. And cover my eyes, please. Make sure I can't be quick. Right down the year that you met this person. This man's taking his job very seriously. Tight fingers. No, no windows. Nothing for a guy. All right. Jonathan, if we put money on this, do you carry cash with you frequently or not really occasionally yeah who does cash anymore imagine you go to your ATM you swipe your card okay uh oh do you don't you don't have to tell right oh my god right you type in your pin code then you decide how much money am i going to pull out you did a hundred bucks right and you take it out and me and me put the money down now rewind watch what happened in this mind rewind back back back you

you went up you swiped your card you typed in your pin code now some people's pin codes are something that they how do i describe it they do a kid's birthday they do something meaningful but in your case random this number you made up completely at random is that right yeah think of the first digit don't say his pen cut i well you can change it later think of the second no no he he made up he made one up he made one up i can tell it doesn't matter to him and we'll steal's banking information later think of the second digit third digit fourth digit the reactions went up and down and and down. They moved around, but what I saw was the same twice. The second and third digit are the same, aren't they, in this number? They all are. Oh, my Lord. Jonathan, tightened up a

little bit. Do you believe in luck? Yes. I don't. My book talks about the fact I don't believe in luck. I think luck is hard work, persistence, dedication. That's what I'm trying to do. The whole book is fast-tracking your success. You make your own luck. You do. Right. Biggest number. Nine. You were thinking of number nine. When I said, said that. Look at me again. This pink 1-990. Is that correct? That is. You ready for the craziest part? Because there is no luck in life. The year you met Jim, can you show us what year did you need, Jim? Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. I get to move away. Come on. As Harrison. I call my head. Get that F out of my studio. Is that your

pin code? You can't. That's not anymore. Not anymore. That's insane. You can't give it away. We'll bleep that out. I've got somebody right now going through all of Jonathan Lamar's accounts. He's doing very well. We'll cut this in place. I don't even believe it. No, I really can't. I don't know what to think.

Well, you're ready. She's ready for the secrets. They're in your hands. He's really great. So let me ask you, I've got his son with Asperger's. Yes. And early on when he had Asperger's, you know, you'd read everything you could. And there were some things that I read that said, you and I are talking right now, we're sending each other 10,000 messages in a split second, right?

Absolutely. Is your secret that you can pick up more of those sort of clues? Because kids with Asperger's can't do that. The social cues are very challenging. The social cues are very fast. So is that, do you think that may be your great skill that we're sending 10,000 signals right now? you just can pick up 98% more of them than most of us who don't focus on this. I'm processing at a higher speed, but it's also send and receive where a big part of what I do has to do with

influencing. Right. So again, I have the, so the skills don't generalize. It's very important. Why don't I just go to Vegas right now and win millions of dollars and let's forget all this other. What do we need the book for, right? Right. So they don't generalize.

If you were to pick a card right now in your mind, one out of 52, I could deduce the card. Right. But at a casino, I can't sit down with you while you're looking at your poker and say, look right, look, left. Think of the, they'll get out of here, buddy. So that's why I'm not teaching you how to become a mentalist. There are books on that. There are videos. I'm teaching you the soft skills surrounding this, which allow you, again, to achieve success. I believe fully that if right now you wipe my memory, I did no single mentalism trick, but I used all the skills surrounding what I do, the packaging around the product. Right. I could be successful at another job right now.

If you put me into a North sales organization in one year, I could be their top salesperson. I was just going to Why wouldn't every business person take you in to their negotiations and say, come sit with us, don't say anything? Take a break. Absolutely. Why wouldn't every lawyer say, I've got to pick a jury for the biggest case in my career. Come sit with me and tell me who to pick and board are. So the biggest problem is only one of me right now. So how are we going to scale this business by taking my skills and giving them to the masses? Right. So the more people can learn some of these skills, the more it's a leg up in life. Do you have, I'm sure a million people have approached you about this, but do you, are you, are you thinking about going out and doing your own TED talks?

I just did a TED talk. Okay. But you do these things where you're saying, okay, I'm going to teach you or, hey, Jamie Diamond. Yeah, I know Jamie very well. Of course you do, because if I were Jamie, I would have called you like three years ago after I saw you cutting footballs up. But you're talking about scaling this. I'm curious.

Is this something that you're doing where you're going out and saying, this is what I do, this is what I look at, this is what you need to look at when you're sitting across the table from somebody negotiating. So honestly, that's probably the next path for me. even though the entertainment, you know, knock on wood, has been incredibly successful, and I'm quite busy with that element. So at some point I might transition right now. The book is the first foray into more of what I would describe as a speaker, a thought leader,

and showing you that, honestly, it's much more than for the value of entertainment, that these are skills you can use in your life. It's incredible. Okay. You got to go to the bank, guys. Jonathan is on with Chase right now, and the support is like, what is the reason for change? Change mentalists.

Yeah, I do want to say, though, I mean, it's reading this book is so extraordinarily important because the difference between success and failure, like you said, in relationships, negotiating, whatever you're doing is being able to read the other person and see what they want. And then figure out how to give it to them, right? Empathy, listening. There's so many tactics. One of the one chapter in the book, I kid you not, is just about notes. And taking effective notes has changed my life. Right. Because every time I meet somebody, I write down everything about them. Every time after a show, I write down everything that happened. and I get credit a year, two years, three years later for meeting somebody, and it's not even

remember it. I can check my notes. I've got a cheat sheet. And when I tell them the things about them in a very casual manner, not even trick, they're blown away because the more you can make other people feel seen and heard, the more they, can I tell you, I don't know we're at in time, but I can tell you a story. We were out of time about nine minutes ago, so go ahead, so go ahead, because I was important. I was at an event, and I met President Obama about a year ago, and he was speaking before I was, and then I was performing. A long story short, we didn't know if he would do a meet-and-grate. So we were kind of on, when am I going on, what's going on?

And right at the end, he goes out and meets everybody, starts shaking hands, and I get out there. And I've been thinking for a few months, if I have the chance to meet the president, what will I say to him? How do I capture him in a moment where he has at most five to ten seconds? And so I thought to myself, what can you say right at that moment? I thought about it. And right when I finally had kind of a turn, we shake hands. And I say, thank you so much for the gift, sir. What would you say to that statement if someone just met you? Thank you so much for the gift.

If I was in a hurry, I would say, well, you're welcome. Chances are good if I had three seconds ago, like him, I'm sorry, what gift? What gift? Right now, everyone else had him in autopilot. Did you go side eye in? I sure did. Look at, Mika's been studying. Come on. I was at side eye, and I go, thank you so much for the gift, sir. And that took him out of autopilot. That's something I want you. If you have one takeaway from this, don't come up to somebody you meet and just ask them, what do you do for living?

where you're from say something different show that you did a little more homework or just change them shake them out of our and he goes what gift and i said to him i go i'm performing in 10 minutes so i forever get to tell people that president baroque obama opened for me which he laughed and i was hoping he'd say what did you what are you performing but he knew he goes oh my god i saw you in hard knocks i go oh my god and then so i just watched him lock in with every single person and make them feel like the only person in the room he's done it better than almost anyone i've met a lot of world leaders and those 30 seconds he gives you, you're all his. And I'm all yours and politicians. And I've seen a lot of people, I think that's the same thing you do. Remembering people's names? My TED Talk, in five minutes, you will remember people's names forever. You will never forget someone's name a second after meeting. I promise you. And so, yeah, I just want these are core skills. So the key is when you read this book, I mean, there are no shortcuts. I want to give you a few. Yeah, but I mean, as far as there are no tricks. A lot of it just comes down to empathy, seeing people. understanding them and being compassionate, right?

Okay. In a world where often people don't look at each other because they're all in their phones, this is amazing. The new book entitled Read Your Mind, Proven Abbotts for Success from the World's Greatest, Mentalist, It's Available Now. And by the way, if you just tuned in, Jonathan O'Meer's PIN number is 1-990. But we didn't do, Joe. I got to go.

Okay, mentalist Ouse Perlman. Thank you. There is. Very much. That's crazy. Do you want to guess who Joe wrote down? No, I'm leaving it for next time. That's how I get back on the show.

Come on. Come on, man. I know what it is. All right, still I had work. Oh, you don't know who it is. I do. No.