Morning Joe - U.S., Iran Reach Tentative Deal Pending Trump Sign-Off

Episode Date: May 29, 2026

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You have consistently been willing to do the hard things. The things that your predecessor said should have been done, but they didn't have the guts to do them. So you have really a very small window. So if you wanted to play that game, then you would wait till the midterms are over. And then the following hour, you'll attack Iran because they cannot have a nuclear weapon. Most people agree with me in that. But then it gets maybe carried into, you know, the next election, whether it's a midterm or not. So you have a very short window for doing anything having to do with war.

But I don't view that window. I view it. I have to do what's right. President Trump, in a taped interview with his daughter-in-law that will air tomorrow on Fox News. That comes as there appears to be a tentative deal between the U.S. and Iran. We're going to go through what may be in it and where it stands this morning. Also ahead, we'll bring you new reporting on the conditions inside immigration detention centers. including the Dilley facility in South Texas, which is holding dozens of children.

Plus, we'll be joined by the reporter who dug into the Pentagon's deal with the company tied to Donald Trump Jr. And how the White House was directly involved. Good morning. And welcome to morning, Joe. It is Friday, you guys, May 29th. Good to have you all with us. Along with Joe, Willie, and me. We have the co-host of our 9 a.m. hour staff writer at The Atlantic, Jonathan Lemire. And President Emeritus of the Council in Foreign Relations, Richard Haas, is with us. So, Joe, before we dive into the news, the president there, getting not a very hard-hitting interview, but there's news this morning of a possible deal.

Yeah, and you know what's so I think remarkable about it is this is the first time the president has dared to even suggest there may be a deal with Iran. Wait a second. This is the 47th time. Yeah, we're not really sure. One, two. I got it. What's after a billion 47? And so, who knows?

Who knows? You know, somebody shorted the oil futures. I guarantee you before this happened. There's going to be another person making tens of millions or maybe some, you know, billions of dollars. We really don't know. The problem is, again, even. even if everything that is being said is interpreted in the most positive way, Willie, the fact is the straight's not open.

We don't know how long Iran will keep this straight open. And the second thing is it goes back to Barack Obama's nuclear deal, which in retrospect actually worked far better than people like me thought it was going to work, and certainly people like Donald Trump. but what was my critique? What were the critiques of so many people? You can't trust Iran to do the right thing on a nuclear deal. And this deal that Donald Trump may be agreeing to, which I don't think he can, if he wants to keep any of his promises, this still seems to say, well, we'll trust Iran to do the right thing on nuclear weapons down the road. that's just absolutely preposterous. They're not going to.

And as Bob Kagan said, if he goes this route, this is an abject surrender. Yeah, and the question is, how badly does Donald Trump want this war to be over? We know he really wants to walk away from it. He thought it was going to be quick and easy. Got more resistance from Iran than he thought somehow, despite the warnings from almost everyone, didn't see the Strait of Hormuz being closed as one of the ramifications for this and for the global economy. Does he want this to be over bad enough that he makes a bad deal effectively?

Because as you say, in the proposal that's being put out right now, the loose details that we're getting, it doesn't touch the nuclear program. It says it guarantees nuclear negotiations down the road. And as you say, no one trusts Iran to have serious nuclear negotiations down the road. So let's get into some of the details. It does appear the United States and Iran have reached a tentative agreement in the three-month long. war. But MS now sources tell us that President Trump has not signed off yet, that the president does agree to this draft memorandum. The sources say it would extend the ceasefire for 60 days

and then kick off a new round of talks on Iran's nuclear program. American sources add, during the extension of the truce, shipping through the Strait of Hormuz would be unrestricted. Iran would have to remove all mines from the straight within 30 days. The U.S. naval blockade would be lifted in proportion to the restoration of commercial shipping, and the U.S. would issue some sanctions waivers to allow Iran to sell oil. The nuclear issue, though, as we just said, would remain unresolved. Sources tell MS. Now the first sticking point to be negotiated would be the disposal of Iran's highly enriched uranium and the country's enrichment program. The sources add the possible deal would also end the war between Israel and Iran-backed Hezbollah in Lebanon,

where thousands of people have been killed and forcibly displaced by Israeli bombardment. Vice President J.D. Vance asked yesterday about where all of this stands now. Well, I think it's hard to say exactly when or if the president is going to sign the MOU. We're going back and forth on a couple of language points. I do think that we've made a lot of progress here, it's very clear that I think the Iranians, they want to deal. And they want to open the streets of Hormuz. We want them to open the streets of Hormuz. There are a couple of issues on the nuclear.

stuff, the highly enriched stockpile and also the question of enrichment. So, you know, we're going back and forth with them. We do think they're negotiating at least so far in good faith and we're making to progress. Hopefully we'll continue to make progress. The president will be in a position where he can endorse the agreement. But obviously, that's still TBD. I can't guarantee that we're going to get there. But right now, I feel pretty good about it. Well, you know, actually, the vice president there sounding all of the concerns and suggestions that maybe it'll work, maybe it won't work, that certainly is better than what we've heard in the past from the president saying, oh, we have a deal and the Iranians are scared.

Right now, Richard, it seems like just about every other thing that we've been promised on deals that end up falling apart. And again, the biggest problem here is that it's relying on the good, good faith of the Revolutionary Guard. That has not worked well for the United States over the past six months and certainly hasn't worked well for the United States over the past 47 years. What do you think of this proposed possible deal? Do you think it may stick? I think there's two separate questions, Joe, which you're getting at.

One is the ability to get to a deal. And then there's the ability to keep the deal for it to stay in place. Let's just take one thing with the straight, because that's been front-loaded here for obvious reasons. So just say you get some kind of a deal. And then Iran says, well, this country can't use it for this or that reason. Or just imagine Israel in six months decides to do something new against Lebanon. And the Iranians announce that any country that trades with Israel won't be able to use the straight. So the idea that this is going to once and for all have this straight go back to the status quo before that existed in February,

you'd have to be a trusting man to believe that. So I think that, again, even if we can get it open, the idea that it would be as it was and stay open, I just don't see that. And then on everything else, the nuclear is far more questions than it answers. I don't see anybody talking about Joe, what might be the most important element of a nuclear deal, whatever the terms. What about the inspectors? What is going to be their power? What are going to be their rights? And then lastly, there's everything else.

I don't know about you, but I don't hear people talking about Iranian support for proxies or their drone force. their ballistic missile force. So again, this is anything but, if you will, a comprehensive deal. It's almost a statement of intentions more than anything else. Not even a statement of intentions. It's a statement of hopes. I think we all want it. I think Americans want this over. There's so many people that are suffering right now. It's costing a lot of people $100 just to fill up a tank of gas. it's costing groceries, more fertilizer more. This is pretty devastating economically, so we hope this works out.

I've got to say, Jonathan, though no other president would enter into a cease deal like this. This is so much weaker than what even Barack Obama was talking about. A deal that Donald Trump just has eviscerated for years, but they had, again, the top experts, just hammering through the details of a nuclear deal for months. building up to it for years. And here, we're just sort of winging it and hoping that the Iranians are going to behave in good faith. I just don't know how this would work in the end. And I can't see how the president would even accept this still.

Because at the end of the day, what's he walking away with? He's walking away with a nuclear Iran. There are a thousand times he said Iran can't have nuclear weapons. And talk to anybody that's dealt with Iran before. And what will they tell you? that, you know, you kind of, you give them an inch, they'll take a mile, and they won't give up their nuclear weapons. Why would they hear? Yeah, this agreement is so weak. The fact that the president is even considering it suggests how desperate he is to simply move on from all things Iran.

And let's be clear, more than I think, this is simply an extension of the ceasefire. This isn't really a deal. It is an MOU. And yes, it theoretically would open up the Strait of Hormuz. That would be the one significant piece. And the one thing that would be a win, let's say, for. Americans. But even that has lots of caveats. Let's see if it stays open. Iran has shown they have the ability to menace that straight at any time, including in this past week, we have seen spasms of violence along that key waterway. But everything else, at least in this MOU, is pro-T-Ran. The nuke stuff is kicked down the road. As Richard said, there's nothing about the proxies. Certainly there hasn't been any sort of regime change. In fact, the hardliners are more emboldened

now. And I'm told within the White House of President Trump does have some misgivings. He's not committed just yet to fully signing this. He did hear from all those GOP hawks over the last few days, the Ted Cruz, Lindsey Graham, even Roger Wicker and the like saying, look, you can't take a deal like this. We know, of course, Benjamin Netanyahu doesn't want him to. But Trump is, you know, confident, I'm told, and his ability to sell any sort of deal as a win. And Mika, we know that he's very good. It's a superpower of President Trump to sort of assert his own reality, to convince his supporters, don't believe your eyes, believe what I'm telling you. But this, it's going to be tested anew here because it is, this is so far from what he pledged what happened at the beginning

of the war. And the U.S., and this president would look remarkably weak in the Middle East and around the world. And am I right? We haven't heard from Iran on exactly where they stand on this. That's correct. Some reporting they're considering it too, but we don't know of that. Factor. Let's bring in former national security advisor under President Biden, Jake Sullivan. Jake, thanks for coming on. Three months in, what would it realistically take for a deal to hold? And what do you make of what we've heard so far about this one? Well, first, thanks for having me. I think Joe's absolutely right. This is the umpteenth. time we've heard we're very close to a deal. But every time we hear this, the terms get a little better

for Iran. So I think the important thing is to step back and look at where we were before this started. The Strait of Hormuz was open. Iran's leadership, its regime, was under enormous pressure at home. And there was a nuclear deal on the table that was stronger than what is on the table now. Then we started this war. Gas prices went up. Americans died. The straight closed. And the end of this looks like Iran is going to maintain at least de facto control of the straight with the ability to shut it down when it wants. The Iranian Revolutionary Guard hardliners are in charge of the country, as you just heard. And there's some reporting that suggests that even to get any nuclear concessions,

which are still speculative, the United States is going to have to promise Iran upwards of $300 billion in investment in Iran. I remember when Barack Obama was attacked for a 1.7 billion. billion payment. And now we're talking about $300 billion. So the net of all of this, I think, is a huge strategic setback for the United States, a significant gain for Iran. But the reason I think President Trump is looking at taking this deal is what's his alternative? He does not have a good alternative. He tried to bomb Iran. He tried to blockade Iran. He tried to bully Iran. And he is stuck. So this may be the best of the very bad outcomes available to him. And it just shows you

what a misbegotten war this was from the beginning. Jake, you were obviously one of the architects of the JCPOA, the 2015 Iran deal in the Obama administration, which has been criticized by Republicans for more than a decade now. I'm just curious, and you touched on it briefly there, if you can give us a little bit of a side by side of what you all had in place and what is on the table right now, what's that comparison look like? Well, if they actually are able to negotiate a nuclear agreement based on this MOU, and you guys have been right that that remains very much open to question. But if they are,

some of the elements will look very similar to the JCPOA, a cap on enrichment for a certain period of time, the disposition of some part of the stockpile. Under the Biden or the Obama administration, the stockpile was reduced by 97 percent, and it was taken out of the country and downblended so that Iran couldn't have it at all. Right now, we're talking about. about much of that stockpile remaining in the country. And then there is the essential question that Richard Haas put on the table, inspectors. The Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action

had 150 plus pages of meticulous requirements for monitoring and verification of every commitment Iran made, inspectors all over the country, and this deal does not have that. Yeah, you know, Richard, we're talking about, again, a president who is being asked, agree to a deal that I think will continue to have Republicans in his own party. And I think most everybody that's concerned about the future of this country, deeply, deeply concerned just because

he wants to get a deal. You actually, if you, you have, I know you've been talking to people in the Trump administration. I have over last administration and this administration. And I have for during the Biden administration. And they all talked about. The mistakes that the Biden administration made, taking their foot off the gas as far as it goes as with sanctions. Oh, they've rebuilt their terrorism networks because Biden wasn't tough enough on clamping down on the sanctions. But we're going to be different. Well, we're talking right now instead of a $1.4 billion, I don't know, pallets in cash or whatever, we're talking about a $300 billion windfall that the Iranians are going to make out of this.

this war. Think about that. A $300 billion slush fund that Donald Trump would be giving terrorists and everybody in the terror networks, $300 billion. So you'd have a slush fund for terrorists. You'd have a slush fund for Hamas. You'd have a slush fund for Hezbollah. You'd have a slush fund for Iran. It's just like the slush fund for cop beaters. In the January 6th, cop beaters relief fund, they're talking.

about doing. I don't see how Donald Trump gives $300 billion to the Iranians just because he started a war that he couldn't finish. But again, I think as Jay correctly said, what are his choices at this point, Joe? The deal you can get the Iranians to accept, or what? You're not going to get regime change. You're not going to get Iranian capitulation. So just say he does what the finish the job gang wants them to do. It's a slogan, not a strategy. So what? He resumes bombing against what? The only meaningful targets we haven't really gone after is the Iranian energy infrastructure. Kind of a problem, though. If we do that, guess what Iran's going to do? They're going to go after the energy infrastructure every one of its neighbors. And as bad as this crisis is, that would make

this look like a tea party. Because then you would see the long-term destruction of 20 percent, or even more of the world's oil and gas capabilities. So, you know, what is Donald Trump going to do? I think also, Joe, a lot of this returns the question. I mean, you know, what you and Jake think about this is, you know, we had a moment. The president keeps saying we can't allow Iran to get a nuclear weapon. Okay, everybody agrees on that. But we had an enormous opportunity both to lock that in and to bring about regime change after June.

That was when Iran was out of its weakest after the Israeli and American strikes. And rather than taking advantage of that and trying to press diplomatically and turn up the economic heat, we ultimately move towards this war. So you keep coming back to that. We are going to end up. The only question I have is how much worse off are we now than we were before this war began? Donald Trump's going to have to spin it. He's going to say we're better off. But quite honestly, no one who has an ounce of objectivity is going to agree with him.

No, we're not better off now. America was probably seen at the zenith of its power post-World War II, probably after the invasion of Venezuela. And yes, it seemed like we were out of control and we were this and we were that. But I guarantee you China and Russia and our enemies, people who consider the United States our enemies, feared us at that point. He overreached, like so many other people overreached, just like George W. Bush overreached out. after 9-11 going into Iraq, going into Iran. Every day we're in there. Every day we consider horrible deals makes Donald Trump look weaker.

It makes the United States look weaker by extension. And Jake Sullivan, I am sorry, but even as a 15-year-old, I saw a quote. I think it was an old Yiddish proverb that stayed with me by a whole. life and it said, I don't know what date it was, but it said, no matter how far you are down a path, if it is the wrong path, turn around. And I feel like that on this deal. You know, when people say, what are your options? Well, your options are to get off the path through a really bad deal. No deal, Jake. No deal is better than a really bad. bad deal that gives Iran $300 billion to fund their terror networks?

When you say no deal is better than a bad deal? Well, at the end of the day, you have to, again, look at what President Trump's options are, because if he walks away from the table, says, we're not going to have a deal. The straight remains closed. Gas prices go above $5. The U.S. is back at war. And as Richard just laid out, then the option for the U.S. is to escalate militarily in Iran, which will lead Iran to escalate militarily.

across the Gulf, which will take us deeper into this war and so on and so on. So sometimes what you have to do is make a tactical move here, swallow what is a very poor framework, and then try to reposition and build back from the position you're in now to something stronger down the road. We cannot accept just one piece of paper a framework deal like this as the long-term solution to the Iranian nuclear program. We have to do better than that. But it may just, just be that the path to doing better than that begins by getting into a 60-day negotiation and then trying to marshal the kinds of pressure required to actually get to a real agreement. This is just a devil's problem, but it is a problem of Donald Trump's making because he did not have to start

this war. There was a better path forward, as Richard just laid out. He chose to start this war. So now he's just going to have to figure out whether if he takes this deal, how he's going to try to build back in a stronger way going forward. Former National Security Advisor, Jake Sullivan, thank you very much. And you can listen to Jake on his Vox Media podcast, The Long Game. Time now for a quick look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. Former Attorney General Pam Bondi is set to give closed-door testimony this morning over her handling of the federal government's investigation into convicted sex offender

Jeffrey Epstein and his former girlfriend and co-conspirator. Galane Maxwell. The committee voted in March to subpoena Bondi, with lawmakers telling the AG she possessed valuable insight into the agency's release of the files. Lawmakers say they'll ask Bondi about what decisions prosecutors made about investigating Epstein's associates, how the DOJ handled the congressional mandate to release files, and whether the president was involved in the process at all. A powerful blue origin. The rocket exploded on the launch pad last night in Florida. It happened during the engine firing test and created a massive fireball that appeared to engulf the launch site.

Blue Rocket, Blue Origin founder and billionaire Jeff Bezos said in a social media post, all personnel are accounted for and safe, adding it's too early to know what caused the explosion. The rocket had been set to carry 48 satellites into space. This marks a setback for Blue Origin, which NASA recently awarded a $188 million contract to deliver lunar terrain vehicles. And a stunning meltdown yesterday amid the Paris heat wave at the French Open. One game from winning his second round contest in straight sets, world number one, Yonick's center lost 18 points in a row and wasted two chances. to serve for the match before falling in five sets against his 56th ranked opponent from Argentina. Sinner battled cramps due to the heat, later saying he struggled with dizziness and fatigue during the match,

which was played in temperatures that reached 90 degrees. His loss leaves Novak Djokovic as the only men's player left in the draw, who has previously claimed a grand slam title. Oh, heartbreak, Joe. Yeah. Oh, it really is heartbreak in Willie. I mean, he was one game away from winning. I mean, and just overcome by heat exhaustion.

It was crazy. Number one player in the world, number one seat at the French Open, heavily favored to win the French Oven and get the career Grand Slam, putting himself in the annals of tennis history. He's up 636251 in the third set, which means he's a minute or 90 seconds away from moving past this early-round match and getting on. And then the heat gets to him. He starts cramping. You saw some of those images. He really looked sick. He had to take a break and go get some fluids and lost 18 points in a row.

18 points in a row. He clearly was not well. Maybe he shouldn't have continued arguably because he got kind of smoked in those last two sets. But just a stunning, stunning loss. One other sports note, the Spurs win at home last night in game six of the Western Conference finals beating Oklahoma City. So now, guys, we get at game seven tomorrow night. Spurs, Oklahoma City Thunder, two best teams in the NBA all season, playing to move to the finals to play the Knicks tomorrow night. Okay. That should be a classic.

Still ahead on Morning, Joe. There is growing scrutiny over the Trump administration's immigration crackdown as protests erupt over inhumane conditions inside ICE detention centers across the country. We'll bring in a reporter who's been investigating water quality at a facility in Texas. And as we go to break, a quick look at the Travelers forecast this morning from Acqueweathers, Bernie Rayno. Bernie, how's it looking?

It is a feel-good Friday from New York City, Philadelphia, Washington, D.C., back toward Chicago with sunshine. But your exclusive vacuum weather forecast calls for a couple of showers late today, Portland and Boston with the soaking rain tonight. Spotty thunderstorm, Central Gulf Coast states toward Florida, dry in Charlotte, warm in Dallas, your acuether travel forecast delays in Atlanta, Miami, but we're good along the East Coast. To help you make the best decisions and be more in the know, download the ACUweather app today. So I wrote something for our newsletter, the T, that I thought I would bring here because I think it

really crystallizes everything that is going on with these so-called detention centers. Rosalba Rose Chiaramonte came from Italy when she was three years old. She lived in America for over half a century. Rose raised a Marine who was awarded two Purple Hearts. She raised three other children and became the primary caretaker for her husband, a disabled Gulf War vet, a family of service to this country. Last month, immigration and customs enforcement, called Rose and her family in for what they believed was just a routine green card appointment.

ICE agents then arrested Rose and sent her husband on a four-hour chase to find paperwork, paperwork they already had. By the time the disabled vet got back, his wife was gone. It is just another example of why anyone who tells you, ICE is only taking the worst of the worst is a liar. The Trump administration now mostly seizes the mothers and fathers, sisters and brothers, teachers, friends, doctors, people who fight our wars, build our economies, and fill our churches. In fact, the Cato Institute estimates that only a fraction of those that Trump administration now throws into internment camps have actually committed violent crimes. 73% 73% have no convictions. Rose is currently jailed,

300 miles from her home, and ICE denies her the diabetic medication that she needs to stay healthy, so she is getting sicker by the day. The wife and mom is one of roughly 60,000 people thrown into, once again, internment camps where most members of Congress are blocked from inspecting facilities so they can't uncover the ugly truth of what happens inside them.

One member of Congress who did get inside described what he found. Maggots in the food. A woman waiting over a month for medical treatment. A man with colon cancer receiving no care. Then there is the Associated Press investigation uncovering how 10 detainees. died by suicide since President Donald Trump's second term began. In a normal year, ICE records no deaths or perhaps one. An interned young man spent his final days sick and isolated, slipping handwritten notes under his cell door, begging to hear his mother's voice on a phone. A guard

collected the note and walked away. Within an hour, the internment camp victim, dead. And if it could not get worse, these gulags have turned into grotesque money-making machines for the well-connected private contractors get paid for filling beds, whether those souls trapped inside have committed a crime or not, and whether they are American citizens or not. Not that any of that matters. The U.S. Constitution guarantees due process for every person on American soil, and that is ignored daily by Trump's internment goons. Some mothers get sick, husbands slowly die, and sons trapped in hopeless despair take their own lives. This is happening in Trump's America, and it's all being rubber-stamped by Republican politicians

who still have the gall to call themselves pro-life. Just think about that sick. All right, so joining us now, Noticiera Enemus, Univision reporter, Lydia Tarasas. Lydia, I've been following your coverage. I love that you jump to Instagram, if you're not on the air, just to keep everybody on top of what is exactly happening inside one internment camp, or they call it detention center, immigration detention center. This one's in Dilley, Texas. And a lot of the conditions inside are being described as more disturbing than ever, including water that they say tasted, quote, rotten and smelled like a drain and sometimes tasted like seawater, resulting in a lot of medical side effects, diarrhea, vomiting. What else did you hear? And by the way, I understand you're hearing directly from children.

Mika, good morning. Thanks for having me. these statements do come directly from children who have been detained in Dilley. This is a family detention center where there have been upwards of 1,600 people, one third of them being children detained there in just one day. And one of the main complaints that we hear from families, including children, from lawyers, and also from political leaders about this detention center, is water quality, water that is making them sick.

This is water that is also, you know, guards are telling mothers that they need to make their baby's formula with this water that has been under scrutiny for months at this point. We have an investigative piece at Anamason Division that will be airing this Sunday where we will talk about what we found after looking into water quality in the Dilly Detention Center. But what I can tell you is that there are inconsistencies with how the water at this detention center is being examined. And we have received plenty of misleading information, which is extremely concerning, especially in a detention center. I repeat where a third of the detainees are children and water is just such a basic human need.

So you've also, in your reporting, been talking to family members, families in distress, families broken apart, families on hold as people being held for many months. What are some of the cases that really stand out to you? And when people ask for help, like, for example, if a woman needs to breastfeed her infant, what? What are they up against trying to get inside Dilley and trying to help the people that are in severe stress and medical danger? We also found that there seems to be a lack of medical attention in this detention center. And we actually, it's something that, you know, Congress members have talked about in the last few months. In terms of the children, you know, there are these cases that you previously were talking about the type of people that are being detained. in these facilities, right?

And for example, you know, we cover these two very mainstream cases. One of them is David Anil, a nine-year-old boy who he just wanted to be released so he could go to this felony. We're talking about a child who has been living in the United States for almost three years.

He has a life established here. And like so many families in Dilley, him and his parents were, they were detained during a reunion. immigration check-in for their immigration case. Then we also see these brothers. They are musicians. They're mariachi's.

And, you know, they have such musical talent that they have been to our nation's capital. And they were also in a routine check-in with their parents, were taken, they were detained, and they were in Dilley, you know, for a few weeks. Now, what we're hearing from moms, and I think this is very concerning, because, several mothers tell us that they had been breastfeeding at some point, but, you know, with the lack of water, lack of nutrition, eventually they stopped producing breast milk. So they are turning to formula in the facility. And we understand for babies, for infants, you know, water is very important. Clean water is very important. So they are being told by

staff in the facility, this facility is handled by the private company. CoreC Civic that they need to buy the water if they don't want to use the water from the facility. And we do have to remember that these bottles of water, they have, you know, they cost about $30 for a 12-pack. And for some families, this is extremely expensive because they already didn't have resources. And it's, you know, we understand that in this case, Corp Civic, from the detention center in Dilley, they are making about $180 per night per bed. And they have a capacity of 2,400 beds in this facility in Dilley.

Jeez. So there's an incentive to fill it with people. And also think about these routine check-ins. Now people who want to stay in this country and make sure they go through their process to do all the right thing, they're going to be in a position where their destiny is deportation or detention. in one of these internment camps because they will be too afraid to show up for their routine check-ins. The new reporting is part of a special broadcast airing this Sunday at 7pm Eastern Noticero on Enemas Univision reporter Lydia Tarazas. Thank you very much for your reporting. Come back soon

and tell us more. We appreciate it. And we're going to have more ahead on the fallout from the Trump administration's immigration crackdown. Senator Cory Booker will join us. to talk about the ongoing protest at a New Jersey ice facility. Plus, there are new questions over a multimillion-dollar Pentagon-backed deal with a company tied to Donald Trump Jr. The reporter behind that new ProPublica investigation joins us straight ahead with the details. Morning Joe is back in a moment. The White House intervened in a deal to provide a $620 million loan to Vulcan elements.

That's a rare earth startup linked to Donald. Trump Jr.'s venture capital firm. A new investigation from ProPublica found that White House advisor Peter Navarro, a friend of Trump Juniors, initiated the loan from the Pentagon. The White House even requested Pentagon staff move at a rapid pace working around the clock to get the deal done. The loan was a major windfall for Vulcan investors as the company's valuation went from around $200 million near the time Trump Jr.'s firm 1789 capital first invested, to around $2 billion once the deal was announced. The loan came through the office of Strategic Capital,

which has been charged with funding private companies to help the United States become less reliant on China for military resources and materials. When asked about the deal, Trump Jr. spokesperson said, the president's son does not discuss companies he has invested in and did not speak with Navarro about Vulcan. In 1789, Capital said,

it played no role in Vulcan getting that massive loan. Joining us now is the ProPublica reporter behind that investigation, Pulitzer Prize winning journalist Robert Federici. Robert, thanks so much for being with us. So help us understand exactly, I gave the broad strokes there, about how this was initiated, how Peter Navarro came to understand that Vulcan needed the $620 million loan and how he was able to push it through the Pentagon at a pace very unusual. for that bureaucracy. Yeah, thank you for having me. So first, just a quick bit of context.

The idea behind the entire campaign at the Pentagon here is that China controls critical mineral supply chains that are crucial to building all sorts of products that the Defense Department relies on. So our biggest competitor has essentially a kill switch on. you know, the equipment, missiles, drones, all sorts of products that need rare earth minerals. So the money here is intended to fund companies that will rest back control of that supply chain to U.S. hands. Vulcan Elements is a rare earth company.

And last year, Trump Jr.'s venture capital firm invested in that company. Then three months later, the Pentagon announced that it was going to be entering into this massive record-setting, $620 million agreement with that company in which they lent them that money based on certain conditions. This was incredible news for this company and its investors. in the months that followed, estimates of its valuation increased tenfold in a very short period of time. And of course, that means that was good news for 1789 Capital, which is Don Jr.'s venture capital firm, which had just invested. So, Robert, let's take a step back here and just put this into further context about business ties that the Trump family, in particular the Trump's sons, the way they've been able to

profit off of their father's time. in office. I mean, it is, there seems to be a real through line from day one of this inauguration, far more so than Trump's first term, where every possible opportunity, the family is looking to make money. And it seems like there is very little guardrails in order to stop them. Yeah, there have been multiple examples of the Trump administration taking actions that then financially benefit companies that the Trump family,

hold stakes in or have positions at. This is actually the first time that a government contract that has gone to one of these companies from a federal agency, that it's been traced back directly to the White House. So in this case, based on our reporting, we learned that Peter Navarro, who is a top aide to the president, initiated this deal. And and asked the Defense Department to make this deal. Of the dozens upon dozens of companies that the Pentagon was considering for this kind of investment at the time,

this company, which the president's son's firm had just invested in, was the only one that a top advisor to the president initiated a deal for. Richard Hosh, I have a question for you. Are we talking about laws here, or are we talking about norms? So what is the larger legal question?

Are these things that, quote, unquote, shouldn't happen under tradition, or is this, or are actually legal issues here that arise? How should we understand this? So there are, you know, strict ethics rules in place for federal employees. In this case, you know, the person who has the indirect financial stake in this company, Don Jr. is not a federal employee. So there would have to be some real other factors at play to start talking about a violation of the law. The experts I talked to said essentially that you want this kind of process to be purely merit-based.

And if it's not, if a company is being selected for reasons other than its merit, which we're trying to understand if that was the case, here, that could be a major waste of taxpayer dollars, especially when we're talking about a $620 million loan. The new piece is available to read online now. Polar Surprise winning reporter at ProPublica, Robert Federici. Thank you very much for coming on and sharing it with us this morning. And still ahead on Morning Joe, several music artists promoted by the White House as performers for a Trump-backed event celebrating America's two. 250th birthday are dropping out and publicly distancing themselves from it. We'll explain why.

Coming up on Morning Joan. Our Secretary of Health and the Humane Society, RFK Jr., I guess he liked the feedback he got from picking up a pair of snakes at Dr. Raz's house this week. So yesterday, miraculously, he found another snake. Hold on, guys. I'll be back at the fly. I got Cheryl to bring the pillow down, buddy.

Oh, Cheryl's long gone, buddy. Took the pillow. She's on the way to her mother's house, screaming into it. What is with him and the snakes? Is that where he gets the oil he pushes? Why is every person in this government the craziest neighbor you ever had on the block?

Really, really, it's just not the best people. It is time and time again, the worst, the strangest, the most bizarre. And I wish you would just go to taming snakes for good, because you look at, again, going after MRNA vaccines and everything else. It actually, right now, we have extraordinary breakthroughs that are happening without the help of HHS, advances in pancreatic cancer vaccines. in several other areas that really, again, we're turning the corner, possibly something remarkable for Americans.

And instead of having the Department of HHS and the federal government helping, they're actually pushing back against the type of personalized vaccines that could save and are actually saving people's lives who have pancreatic cancer, which have really long been seen as a death sentence. But more than that, just actively working to slash R&D research and development at the greatest universities across the globe, simply because they're trying to make some point that nobody even understands. They continue to be at war with the very universities that have been the engine drivers of the American century for research and development, for creating this sort of thing. things that have put us ahead of the rest of the world. And it just, at some point, somebody in the Republican Party on Capitol Hill, they need to wake up and demand more and demand better of this administration. Yeah. I mean, I wish RFK Jr. was just quirky and we could just laugh at him.

And, oh, he tames snakes, which, by the way, I have no problem with him taming snake. It's the least troubling thing he's done with animals, if you remember his past. But what's actually troubling is what you just laid out there, Joe, is that he is a guy who, let's just say again, was voted for and confirmed by Republicans, although Senator Cassidy, who's on his way out lived to regret it and was critical of him, but only after the vote. And is a guy who's standing in the way of, as you say, Joe, extraordinary progress. That development for pancreatic cancer is an MRNA vaccine. I mean, that's what that is. And so he may be now when he goes to these hearings trying to say the right thing that, yes, people should. go get their flu vaccine or do all these things, but he's actually working actively against them.

And as you say, he's effectively a content creator. He's a wacko podcaster who reads an outlier study about vaccines causing autism. And it was able to sort of wave him off as a nutcase in the past. But now he is making policy. He is preventing progress. He is stopping money from going to the places that are curing diseases and moving us forward. And, you know, we can giggle about. his snakes and everything else, but unfortunately, what he's doing is deadly serious, Mika. Yeah. At two minutes past the top of our second hour, we'll move from the HHS Secretary to the Homeland Security Secretary, Mark Wayne Mullen, who is threatening to pull customs and border protection agents who process international passengers and cargo at Newark Liberty International Airport.

This comes amid ongoing protests outside of an ice. Detention Center in Newark, New Jersey. Mullen argues local police have not been assisting federal immigration officials with entering and exiting the facility and warned yesterday that he could reassign airport customs officials to help ICE agents. When we have situations what's happening in New Jersey right now, when we have to prioritize where we put federal employees because local law enforcement won't help protect their streets, not federal streets, city streets, and keep them from barricading and causing harm to our employees,

then we have to decide where we're going to prioritize our federal employees. So we're not going to halt the flights, but we're saying is we just won't be able to process them because we don't have officers there. We're going to have to pull out our Custom and Border Patrol officers that process these flights and put them in these facilities to help protect our employees coming out of work. And if things don't change, we're going to have to make this step pretty quick. You know, Jonathan Amir, the stupidity, I mean, it makes your teeth hurt, the stupidity. He's saying, what we're going to do is we're going to destroy more global commerce. What we're going to do is make flying on airplanes even less safe.

What we're going to do is we're going to try to disrupt operations at one of the of America's most important international airports, all to help what, hold people that haven't committed crimes inside subhuman conditions in internment camps? So you're talking about 21st century commerce being undermined, all to make a point about like medieval, medieval things taking place at internment camps that Americans don't want. You look at Donald Trump's approval ratings. When did they start really collapsing? The war didn't help.

But you look at what happened at Minneapolis. You looked at the fact that U.S. citizens were gunned down in American streets. You look at the fact that ICE officers abused people. ICE officers clearly not trained for the work they were being asked to do and abused that power. And young people, children being scooped up off the streets when they came home from school and thrown into internment camps being treated much worse than the Japanese were treated in their internment camps if you read history. And again, the lies, the constant lies being. told by administration officials who were saying, oh, we're only getting the worst of the worst. No, they aren't. Cato, funded by the Koch brothers, Cato now has that number down at about 5%.

Only 5% of the people who are being scooped up and thrown into internment camps have actually committed a violent crime. And yet, to go after Rose, people like Rose, who raised as Mika said earlier in the show, to grab her, snatch her, disappear her, take her 300 miles from home. This mother of a U.S. Marine who was awarded two Purple Hearts, the wife of a Gulf War hero,

a disabled vet that she's a primary caretaker of. That's who Mark Wayne, Holland wants, he wants to actually go after them more and totally screw up international commerce. I mean, it really, it is really bizarre how backward these people are. And they are focusing on all the wrong things, which may be why the president has his lowest approval rating. Well, the lowest approval rating of any president, according to Gallup, since Richard Nixon in the midst of, Watergate. Maybe he should get people in place that actually focus on the right things instead of these bizarre things, like shutting down or disrupting flights at Newark. It's just crazy.

Yeah, this airport plan, and I forget where I saw it, so I can't give credit, but someone said, oh, it's like you saw the economic paralysis that came from the Strait of Hormuz closing and said, oh, let's bring that home. Let's do some of that here. Because it would have such impact beyond these handful of blue cities, these sanctuary cities, the DHS wants to punish. Travel executives have warned the government about that. Others in the industry have. Even some Republicans have quietly expressed some reservations. Like, look, this pain is not going to be limited to the handful of cities and states you

want it to be. We're going to feel it around the country and beyond. So perhaps, Mika, they'll be talked out of this particular idea. But it's pulling back the curtain on a priority that's reemerging. It's very clear. We've been saying this for a few weeks now. We've heard it from Tom Holman. We've heard it now from Secretary Markway Mullin that the deportation program is about to rant back up.

And maybe they say it won't, maybe it won't lead to the violence that we saw Minneapolis, but it's coming that they think, because it's for this president, when things are bad. And as Joe just said, his polling, really bad. His reflexes always go back to what he thinks is his best issue, which is immigration and the promises he made to deport millions of people, even though so many Americans say, wait, this has gone way too. And just to reinforce some of the other facts here, they're not just being scooped up off the street or having their cars broken into or their doors pushed in and other laws broken as these people are being pulled into custody. Rose showed up at her immigration hearing. So now you have story after story after story of people showing up at their immigration meetings, at their hearings, at their, they get a form, they're trying to go through the process. They may be close to the process. but the rules get changed.

So actually, you thought you could stay, but you can't. And that's happening to many different categories of people who are here and want to have legal status or in the process of getting legal status. They show up for their hearings. They show up because they want to follow the rules. They show up because they want to be here legally. And they're almost there. And they've spent so much money and so much time.

and they've saved all their papers, and they've tried to do everything right, and they show up, and they get nabbed like criminals, like the worst of the worst, and put in concentration camps here in America. And now the protests that have taken place outside Delaney Hall, just one of many, detention center, they call it,

for a full week now in New Jersey, amid reports of hunger strikes by detainees, some of whom have described rotten, food, a lack of air conditioning, and being denied medical care. Joining us now, Democratic Senator Cory Booker of New Jersey, and you got into Delaney. So take it from me because I'm getting emotional. What did you say? First of all, to not be emotional, the dignity of our nation, any pretense of nobility within our country is under assault right now. This is our taxpayer money. These are our officials conducting immigration policy that is levels of deep cruelty that should be unacceptable to all Americans.

It's going on in Newark. It's going on in Texas. It's going on around our country. And understand this, that that facility, now that they're begging for city support, when the city said there is health and safety concerns, that you need it to get a certificate of occupancy, they said none of that. they bullied their way in. It's a billion dollar contract, a billion dollars of our taxpayer money to a for-profit company as corporations all throughout this process from the geo group, transportation companies, subcontractors. This is a money trained for Trump campaign contributors, all as the assault human dignity in a way that all of us should be offended, outraged, and outspoken.

Should care. Silence in this is complicity. And what's going on is an affront to who we say we are. Our values. Willie. So, Senator Booker, you are the rare public official who was granted access to one of these facilities. You got to look inside Delaney Hall. Presumably, they had some time. They knew you were coming. We've heard other reporters say that the prisoners in these facilities have said things got cleaned up quickly before dignitaries like yourself would come in. But tell us what you saw, because so few people actually have been granted access to the inside of these places. So Congress and SBI, New York, your congressman and I spy were in there. And the horrifying things when they granted us ability to meet

with people alone, where the guards were not there, were chilling. When we met with the women who circled around to support each other, a woman who was recently postpartum, ripped away from her American child and her other American children, no criminal convictions, and talked about just the pain of that separation. Another woman who came in pregnant and had to be a woman who came in pregnant and had a miscarriage and was denied appropriate mental care. Another woman who came in who was pregnant, who told horrific stories of the treatment that she was enduring. We have a situation going on in Newark and again, around the country,

where we have what amounts to internment camps of people who are ripped away from their American families, American children, American grandchildren even, who have done nothing wrong, who are trying to comply with our immigration rules, to try to navigate the complicated processes showing up for immigration hearings, but they were torn away from their families, from our neighborhoods. And so this is a moral test for our country. We cannot allow this to go on. All of us have to begin to point out this cruelty and this assault on not just the dignity and humanity of the people being held, but this is cheapening and demeaning the humanity and the dignity of our nation.

So, Senator, we have gone over repeatedly about President Trump's original promise. that would just be the worst of the worst. And that's clearly not the case. Speak to a little more, if you will, about the people you did encounter in their lives in the United States for years, if not decades. And also, their fears of where they may be heading next, including in some cases to countries where they've never been.

Well, this is why I'm working on many fronts, including trying to help many of them to get lawyers so they can get legal protection so they can't be transferred out of New Jersey away from their families. they can't be transferred to other crueller detention facilities or pushed out of the country. When I had a 19-year-old child, a young teenager, rather, come to me with an American accent, he had as thick of a New Jersey accent as I have, if not more so, decorated athlete in our state,

telling me about him now going, being pushed back to a country, he doesn't even know, barely speaks the language. It highlights the cruelty of what they're trying to do. And this is the thing that they told us, the retaliations for trying to go on a hunger strike, the threats that they'll be brought up with criminal charges, all of them want to stay in the only country many of them know or the country they've been in for years, if not decades. They want to return to their families. And so it's a cruel retaliation that's going on. They're frankly threatening them for trying to do what we would do in a situation with that is protest, hunger strike, work with their lawyers. And so we've got to

decide as a country, how long are we going to allow this to go on? Because this immigration cruelty that we're seeing, it's not just what we saw on the streets of Minneapolis. We're seeing it in detention facilities all around where they're hoping people will look away, all while hundreds of millions of dollars are being made in for-profit prisons off of the backs of human beings. They are profiting from pain. So, Senator, I want, if we can go into that a little bit more, Oh, I'm sorry, Mika. If we can go into that a little bit more, Senator. So we have a system here that now is driven by Stephen Miller and has been driven by Stephen Miller where there are quotas.

They have set up unrealistic quotas that I'm sure you've talked to the White House about. I've talked to the White House about saying you're never going to reach these numbers. And if you try to reach these numbers, people are going to. end up dead in the streets of Minneapolis like they have been. It doesn't work. But they still have these unrealistic quotas that make them do subhuman things to souls that are here in America, that as Scalia said, have constitutional rights. They are protected by the Constitution if they are in America. And so that's one side of the equation. And I really am so glad you brought up the other side of the equation. So you have these quotas that throw people into

detention centers, and then you have the well-connected that are actually turning these detention centers, these internment camps, into money-making machines. And every day they keep a poor soul inside these internment camps, they make more money. So they don't care if they have citizens there or whether they have immigrants there. They don't care whether that person is committed a crime or not. once they get them, all they're looking at is counting the number of heads, the number of beds, and the number of bucks that they're making off of this corrupt system. And let's add to this. This is an assault on the economic strength of our nation.

Because when you rip people from their families, away from their children, away from our neighborhoods, away from our jobs, remember, immigration is a net gain. This is why the Cato Institute is saying over and over again, Donald Trump is doing deep economic harm to our country by not allowing people who are doing everything they can to comply with the rules. You're throwing them out. And so here you have a president giving a master's class and how do you tank a national economy, your chaotic tariffs, your disastrous war abroad. Everything he's doing, assaulting all of the above energy strategies, threatening our airport, which this region, as you know, 20% of the U.S. economy, he's talking about, let's do more things to cripple the U.S. economy and drive prices up for everybody. So that's the economic crisis. But I want to continue

to point, as you point to Stephen Miller, to what the moral crisis is. Remember, these are folks who are immigrants from what he calls shithole countries. But look at what he's doing in South Africa, with Afrikaners, arranging flights, calling for them to come in, that we're going to rescue these white people from South Africa, while I call other nations shithole countries. He is using race as a sword to try to divide our nation and reduce the truth that we are a great multicultural society. The assaults on so-called DEI, as he says we're at merit-based economy, but fires qualified African-Americans while doing what, allowing his children to loot, smash and grab, grift and grab resources. This is a corrupt administration that's getting rich as we all get poorer,

but also morally bankrupt as well, hurting the dignity and the ideals of this nation. We are in a crisis, both moral and economic, and Americans are feeling it, and it's going to go on. And Meek and I were saying this off camera until Republicans who know better stop being silent, start showing some courage. Cato Institute, and you mentioned one Supreme Court justice, can't be the only ones speaking out against the assaults on due process and our principles. When I hear an Alabama speaker of the House say things like, oh, now we've got the Voting Rights Amendment, next we're going after the 14th Amendment, which is equal protection, which is the fundamental principles of our freedom. And so this is a moral test, and it's our economic pain. and more people have to speak up because this will continue until we as a people reject it completely. And it's not just about an election in November.

It's got to be now because what I saw in Delaney Hall, the suffering of people that are unjustly incarcerated in these internment camps who are no threat to our communities who are being taken away from families, often American families, has to stop now. Delaney Hall has to be closed now. This nightmare must end now. You know, Senator, I know there are extremists and there are idiots that literally want to take us back to 1865 and make the same argument the Confederate states made to Lincoln that they didn't want to get back into the union unless they could vote against the 13th and 14th amendments, 1865. And they're re-arguing that right now. I don't want to talk about those idiots. I want to talk, and those racists and those bigots. I want to talk instead about friends that I have known, that I knew when I was in Congress,

people that you are working with right now, good men, good women in their private lives. I want to ask you, what did those Republican, your Senate brethren and sisters think about an internment camp system that will haunt this country, just like Japanese internment camps, haunted the soul and the conscience of this country for 85 years. We have been apologizing for Japanese internment camps for 85 years. Do they not think that the very things that were said about Japanese internment camps will be said about them, will be said about their party, will be said about their president. What do you say to them? How can they be encouraged to step forward and do what is clearly, this isn't a close call morally,

but clearly do the right thing for not only these people, but for the United States Constitution and the guarantees that Scalia talked about when he was alive that he said extended to immigrants here in America. Or even your alleged Christian faith, how can there be such a constipation of compassion, a poverty, of empathy, that from the dictates of your faith to the laws in the Constitution, that you were willing to so violate your values and any shred of moral decency, that our country proclaims. Well, what do you get from them?

Do they not care? Do they not care? There is a reckoning coming. There is a reckoning coming. I talk to Clyburn. You want to talk about a man who has such moral authority in Congress from both sides of the aisle, who they tried in vain through the bullying of Donald Trump to eviscerate his congressional district. And he said to me right now, what he's seeing in South Carolina is his source of hope.

record turnouts, record early voting that breaks not just presidential years, but even the highest turnout. There is a reckoning coming in this country where we will try, I hope, over the coming months leading into November, to reclaim our moral high ground. Because we were being dragged into the quicksand of such an offensive lack of moral character, of decency, of courage. Humanity. And so I will just say this to end. If you're watching this program and just feeling angry, but that anger and that powerlessness does not lend to action to doing something. We are here not because of people who are offices, but because of average Americans in times

of moral crisis showed moral courage and did more in the cause of their country. This is not a time for silence. I'm talking to groups in New Jersey from the ACLU to make the road who are doing the hard of fighting for the legal rights of people. There are groups you can turn to and help. that need help right now because there are people right now who are suffering in our name with our taxpayer dollars and your silence is complicity in that. Please do something more in the cause of the country. Democratic Senator Cory Booker of New Jersey. Thank you very much. I really appreciate it.

It's good to have you on this morning.