Morning Joe - Videos of deadly shooting refute government account

Episode Date: January 26, 2026

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People have had enough. This is the third shooting now in less than three weeks. The Minneapolis Police Department went the entire year last year, recovering about 900 guns from the street, arresting hundreds and hundreds of violent offenders, and we didn't shoot anyone. And now this is the second American citizen that's been killed. It's the third shooting within three weeks. People have been speaking out, saying that this was going to happen again. And I think everyone is kind of. kind of waiting for folks on both sides to come together and just figure this thing out. The Minneapolis Police Chief speaking to CBS yesterday morning after another deadly shooting in the city by federal officers. So we're going to be covering the many angles to this story, including the video evidence that does not match up with the statements from the Trump administration. Any of this statement. We'll bring you a breakdown of all of that. Plus, we'll go through President Trump's comments to the Wall Street Journal as the paper pressed

the president on whether agents acted appropriately. And the shootings in Minnesota are having a ripple effect in Washington, D.C. Democrats say they will block a government funding package that includes more money for the Department of Homeland Security, setting up another possible shutdown. Well, Amik, as we saw last week, and I suspect the numbers this week will be even more horrific. The numbers of Americans approving of ISIS actions plummeted even last week after the first killing of Renee Good. You had people in the low 30s approving and in the 60s, mid-60s disapproving. Those numbers obviously going in the opposite direction. So yeah, For sure.

It's hard to believe that with 63% of Americans disapproving of ICE, and only 36% approving, the shooting this weekend that many people were describing as an execution-style shooting. The second. The second, it's, again, Republicans have to do something here. The White House has to do something here. There are some signs that show they might be doing that. With us, we have the co-host of our 9 a.m. hour, staff writer at the Atlantic, Jonathan Lemire, and MS now senior national security reporter David Rhodes.

So, bipartisan calls for a full investigation after federal agents shot and killed Alex Pretti, an ICU nurse who was filming Border Patrol agents on his phone in Minneapolis on Saturday. The White House continues to blame the 37-year-old victim for being the aggressor in this case. But numerous eyewitness videos are contradicting directly the government's version of what happened. So we're going to go through play-by-play, what happened, and a warning. The video may be extremely difficult to watch. In this solemn hour, we run to our honor and our gratitude. This is Alex Pretti, reading,

final honors to a veteran who passed away at the Minneapolis VA hospital where he worked. And this is the moment the 37-year-old was killed by ICE agents near the corner of East 26th Street and Nicolet Avenue in Minneapolis, just over one mile away from where Renee Good was killed by ice earlier this month. The White House's response to the killings of both Good and Preddy are striking. As with Renee Good, federal officials quickly and wrongly labeled Preddy a domestic terrorist saying Prattie was brandishing a gun and was trying to murder federal agents. In an outrageous personal attack on the dead victim, Stephen Miller called the VA employee a would-be assassin who tried to murder federal law enforcement. President Trump weighed in quickly, posting Prattie's

weapon and redirecting blame to Mayor Jacob Fry and Governor Tim Walts. Meanwhile, DHS Secretary Christine Ome and Border Patrol commander Greg Bovino falsely accused Alex Prattie of being the aggressor against five ICE agents who in the video are seen pulling Prattie to the ground, seemingly disarming him and then fatally shooting him with at least nine gunshots heard. The ICU nurse whose parents described how ICE's cruel treatment of migrants upset their son is now the second U.S. citizen to be shot at point-blank range in Minneapolis. Some saying execution style by federal agents. Video analysis from multiple angles of the Preti shooting show what happened.

Preti getting pushed by an ICE agent while holding his phone. Coming to the aid of a woman shoved to the ground by ice, being sprayed in the face with chemical agents, pinned to the ground by five ice agents constantly holding up his right hand, his gun taken away from him, and then a series of shots from point-blank range, killing the veterans aid. After the videos proved the administration's version of events was a lie, Trump White House officials then appeared on Sunday news shows, changing their excuse for killing Pretty, claiming that the mere presence of a gun on the victim justified his killing.

No one who wants to be peaceful shows up at a protest with a firearm that is loaded with two full magazines. You cannot bring a firearm loaded with multiple magazines to any sort of protest that you want. It's that simple. You don't have that right to break the law. He brought a gun. Have you ever gone to a protest, Jonathan? I mean, we do have a second amendment in this country that. Jonathan, have you ever gone to a protest? I've been to a protest. what, I didn't bring a gun. I brought a billboard. The Trump administration's attack on the legal possession of a firearm was quickly called out by Democratic lawmakers and criticized by gun rights

organizations. It comes as Attorney General Pam Bondi pushes Minnesota officials to share records on Medicaid and food stamp recipients, along with voter rolls in what one state official calls, quote, apparent ransom to end the ICE occupation. The governor of Minnesota, Tim Walsh, expressed resolve, demanded accountability, and urged peaceful protest. And we believe that Donald Trump needs to pull these 3,000 untrained agents out of Minnesota before they kill another person, and we're up here telling another story of a Minnesotan just trying to live their life without the interference. I, I ask you not to stand by idly, speak out, share what you're seeing, and urge others to put

politics aside. And a Trump-appointed federal judge ordered that federal officials must not destroy evidence connected to the killing. This, as ICE operations are still being carried out across the country. As this growing an unprecedented clash between state and federal officials plays out, the words of Alex Preti's final honors at the Minneapolis-V-V-Irude-Rash. VA tragically match his own sacrifice all too well. Today we remember that freedom is not free.

In an exclusive interview with the Wall Street Journal, President Trump declined to say whether the federal officer who shot and killed Alex Pretty over the weekend had acted appropriately. The reporting reads in part, quote, pressed further. The president said, we're looking, we're reviewing everything and will come out with a determination. Trump also signaled a willingness to eventually withdraw immigration enforcement officials from the Minneapolis area. At some point, we will leave. We've done. They've done a phenomenal job, he said.

Trump didn't offer a time frame for when agents might depart. Also from the Wall Street Journal, the paper's editorial board says it's time for ice to pause in Minneapolis. And the editorial board of Rupert Murdoch's Wall Street Journal writes this. The Trump administration spin on this simply isn't believable. Stephen Miller, the political architect of a mass deportation policy, called Alex Prattie a domestic terrorist. He was a nurse without a criminal record. To hear the art at gun rights advocates of the Trump administration claim he had malicious intentions because he carried a concealed weapon is bizarre. The agents may say they felt threatened, but it's worth noting the comments over the week.

by police around the country who say that this is not how they conduct law enforcement. This is backfiring against Republicans. Miller's mass deportation methods are turning immigration and issue Donald Trump owned in 24 into one of his biggest political liabilities for Republicans in 26. Americans don't want law enforcement shooting people in the streets. or arresting five-year-old boys. Joining us now is Gil Kierlikowski. He's a retired commissioner of customs and border protection.

He also served as chief of police, both in Buffalo, New York and Seattle. Thank you for coming back on the show with us, again, under horrible circumstances. I'd like to start by asking what we see from multiple angles on the video, this struggle that happens before Alex Pretty is shot seemingly by nine shots that were heard, do you see any procedures, law enforcement basic law enforcement procedures that were followed or not followed? Well, you do see a few problems. When you go to a protest and you want to observe, you want to record, you want to voice how you feel about it. When Alex unfortunately kind of intervened when that woman was pushed down, and I'm not condoning what that agent did, it's probably better not to engage. The other part is, of course, he had a concealed weapons permit.

DHS has been condemning the fact that he had a gun, but remember DHS didn't say anything when right-wing protesters brought guns to Charlottesville, one of them bringing the gun out and shooting into the ground. So having disarmed him, but the shots were almost immediately after the gun was taken from him. So I think there's still more to see. I'm skeptical of whatever this investigation is, though, and they haven't really defined that. You know, we had a general who was on before the Russian war began, and he noticed the Russian tanks going through villages and talked about how undisciplined they looked. Now, this was at a time when everybody said, oh, the Russians are going to take.

take Keev in three days. The general turned to his wife, he said, look at them. They can't even do the basics. These people are going to. When you see five, six, seven guys bumbling around over one protest or not taking him to the ground, I'm just curious what level of unprofessionalism and lack of training do you see in all of these, all of these agents? And not just in this case, but across America. Well, first, border patrol agents work almost uniformly by themselves or maybe with somebody else. And they work in these rural areas. They don't work in cities, regardless of what Commander Bovino said.

They are trained to work in cities. They don't understand the urban environment. Well, now you're putting them all together in teams, in groups. And this isn't anything that they've been trained for. I've called it a rag-tag group as they march out to rock music and start shooting pepper balls at people and the indiscriminate use of tear gas. So, yes, you're right. You've got six people on top of one person.

You would think that that person could be contained. And I think that Chief O'era, when he talked about the number of violent felons and the guns that they've seized, which would have been true when I was chief in Minneapolis or the committee. missionary in Buffalo, they make arrests with people with guns all the time. And quite often, most often, they don't have to shoot someone. You know, John Lemire, I looked at these six, seven, eight officers bumbling around, pushing people, slipping in the snow. And it's not hard to draw a very quick contrast with NYPD. One officer, two officers would take somebody to the ground. and put cuffs on them.

And that would be it. They would be restrained. They might go to jail, but they would be alive. Here, you know, and we've been hearing it, Jonathan, throughout the weekend. Police chiefs from all, look at that guy, just beating him on the ground. Police chiefs from across America absolutely outraged and how unprofessional, undisciplined, and how dangerous these, these marauders going through the, city are. Yeah, there were tactics. They were questioned by police commissioners revolving the

death about Renee Good and how that went down. The officer standing in front of the car, escalatory in nature, and certainly what we saw again over the weekend there on that frozen street corner, that, yes, these are border patrol agents, ice agents who don't have the experience like an NYPD or another urban police force in terms of crowd control, managing urban environments, you know, try to de-escalate. And, Commissioner, that's what I wanted to go back to you on. I mean, there's so much to be questioned about how they handled Mr. Prattie's last moments.

But even what led up to that, there seems to be we hear from local residents and officials, this sort of culture of confrontation being brought to these streets by the ICE agents and their border patrol agents with, first of all, their targets, migrants who may or may not, you know, deserve to be deported, who may or may not have committed any sort of crime, but also bystanders, those who are simply watching, they're doing their duty as Americans, they feel to document what they're seeing, holding up their, bravely, holding up their contact from agents in terms of the pepper spray, shoving that woman, and then when they even they have Mr. Prady to the ground repeatedly pummeling him even before drawing their guns.

Well, well-trained police officers would not engage that way. You don't turn. to pepper spray and other less lethal weapons. First, you tell a person, don't interfere, if you continue to attempt to interfere, I'm going to arrest you. And what we're seeing is that when they do make arrests, which seem to be few and far between, the courts are not buying it. The juries are not bind it. So they immediately turn to using tear gas, pepperball, soft nose rounds, etc. the kinds of things that no well-trained, well-led police department would ever do. All right. Retired Commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, Gil Kralikowski.

Thank you very much for your insight. Also seeing some real conservative voices across the political landscape come out speaking out against this, because if you're a small government conservative, a mask marauding around shooting Americans, not exactly your idea of small government conservatism, certainly not mine. But here we have in Minneapolis two killings in the past week or so. And many yesterday talking about these killings being execution style, both at point-blank range. this shooting the New York Times verifying this was an actual

this was a frame from video and execution style here it certainly looks that way when he's unarmed he noticed he constantly kept his right hand free either had the phone in his right hand or he was lifting his right hand

showing that he was, he did not have a weapon in his hand. And yet here he is, and he shot perhaps up to nine times, ice officers just standing over him afterwards reportedly from eyewitnesses, not administering CPR, but instead counting the number of bullet holes they had put in him. David, we've talked about how this could happen. We've talked about how untrained these officers are, how they are out of their environment, and also how they have been given orders to be aggressive and act in ways that are horrifying police departments across America.

I'm curious, your reaction to what we saw to Minneapolis. And again, a second shooting at point-blank range. Rene Good shot at point-blank range from the side window when the officer was not in any danger whatsoever, shot through her brain, exited the other side of her skull when he was on the side, then swore at her after he literally blew her brains out. And now here you have a VA nurse held down and shot repeatedly in what many people say looks like execution style. I believe that President Trump faces the most important domestic policy decision of his second term right now. Is this going to be the Donald Trump administration or the Stephen Miller administration? It is Stephen Miller who has pushed these incredibly aggressive tactics.

tactics across the country. Yesterday, Stephen Miller called Alex Preti, an assassin, Christy Noem, who Miller backs, called him a domestic terrorist. There's an opportunity for President Trump to say, you know, look, a tragic mistake happened here. One of the things that happens, it's clear that this one agent takes the gun away from Preddy and someone shouts, gun, gun, gun. And it looks like this Border Patrol agent who fires the first shot maybe thinks the gun is still there. He hasn't realized that another agent has removed it. And then you're right, nine rounds at least are fired at Preti when he is unarmed. And it's terrible tactics. I spoke to two former FBI agents. One of them has been at protests where militia members have long guns, assault rifles.

And there's ways you handle this situation that don't lead to this. They both agreed that these ICE agents or Border Patrol agents initiated this confrontation, and this was completely avoidable. And the key question here is the tone of the president himself. I think, you know, as the midterms approach, you see more and more Republicans breaking with Stephen Miller. This is not pursuing the word. It is about confrontation. what looks best online or on cable TV, owning the libs. And I just think it's an enormous moment and an opportunity for...

Watching this, as we have been saying on this show now for months, Donald Trump should declare victory at the southern border. He can even have a series. And then he should concentrate on what he said he was going to concentrate on doing, getting the worst of the worst. How many times have I said they're never going to reach Joe Biden's number of deportations

throughout the term because not in the street, it all backfires, the Wall Street Journal says, on Republicans. And Republicans know it too. That's why a few are actually having the courage to speak out against this,

what looks like, an execution-style killing. And you bring up Christy Noem, and we had Besson, and Bovino, all taken to the airwaves. And repeating many times an immediate conclusion. Right. Without an investigation, a conclusion that was repeated many, many, many times on Fox News that this man was Alex Prattie was brandishing a gun and sought to inflict maximum damage on ice.

And to conclude immediately like that, I think is the biggest problem here, defaming the victim. You wonder what state and civil charges or opportunities might come out of that action, but even more it leads to a bigger issue. This is the second time that has happened in just a few weeks in Minneapolis, a U.S. citizen shot dead, point-blank range, and DHS and Border Patrol immediately blaming the victim and calling that person a domestic terrorist. And the kill shots in both cases, the kill shots taken at point-blank, range after the victim was after the agents were in no danger whatsoever.

Here is a guy on his knees, his left hand on the ground to stop from falling, his right hand, which again, he constantly showed throughout this entire time holding the phone in his hand. His legal open carry weapon taken away from him. Taken away from him. And so this was their justification. This is their justification, as they said, he charged the officers. Go back to the picture.

And I'm just curious, does he look like he's charging the officers? Now, it doesn't look like he's charging the officers there. He doesn't look like he's charging the officers anywhere. And they claim that he was a domestic terrorist that wanted to slaughter law enforcement officers. No, he was actually killed for being a good Samaritan. And that's what the Wall Street Journal said. That's what our expert just said. He got involved.

He was killed because you're Good Samaritan. But here's the second part of the story for Republicans to chew on and so-called conservatives. People who may have used to have been conservative, but are conservative no longer for them to chew on. After the White House was called out in their lies, you then had administration officials going on Sunday shows going, yeah, well, okay, maybe all those things. we said before were lies. Maybe they weren't true, but show the picture. But this is what he deserves because he was carrying a gun. Scott Bessent, the Treasury Secretary, said that. You had Christine Nome saying that. You had the director of the FBI saying that, getting pushback from Maria Bardo. This, after we have spent the past five, six years, watch,

MAGA supporters marched to state capitals across America with AR-15 strapped across their chest, marching across Capitol grounds and actually inside the Capitol buildings. Imagine if one of those citizens had been shot dead because, well, because Gretchen Whitmer used the same standard that Scott Besson, and the FBI director and Christy Nome said they should have used that if you bring a gun to a protest, you deserve to be shot. That's basically what was said. You justified killing somebody if they bring a gun that's legally registered to a protest. That's how twisted it's gotten in this administration. All right. So coming up, we're going to get the big picture from fascism and autocracy expert and Applebaum. also Barbara McQuaid on all the investigations or lack thereof, federal, state, civil, local.

We'll be right back. Welcome back. Several conservative media outlets are reporting about inner turmoil within the Department of Homeland Security over the tactics ICE agents are using. Conservative commentator Eric Erickson posted on social media, citing multiple conservative news organizations that Secretary of Homeland Security, Christy Noem, has essentially marginalized White House Borders Tsar, Tom Holman, and the head of Border Patrol for prioritizing deportations of criminals and gang members. That's because Erickson contends that Nome and DHS senior advisor, Corey Lewandowski, wanted broad public roundups. Without prioritizing undocumented immigrants, quote, they have bypassed Homan and the head of border patrol

and elevated Greg Bovino because they want the public confrontations and displays. And those public confrontations and displays, as the Wall Street Journal editorial page says, hurting Republicans, and as a poll show, their approach hurting Donald Trump standing in the polls. And the conservative Washington Examiner Report, CHS and ICE have been under intense pressure

from the White House since last January to amp up arrests and deportations, of illegal immigrants, including in a tense showdown last May when White House Deputy Chief of Staff for Policy Stephen Miller eviscerated ICE officials in Washington for not hitting Trump's goal of 3,000 arrests per day. It's just not going to happen. It's not going to happen because, well, for the reason that we've been saying for six months, nine months now, and yet they continue trying, they continue putting their hand on the hot stove. They continue having the president's numbers plummet. And in the process,

they're now killing Americans in the streets. Let's bring in right now staff writer at the Atlantic, Ann, Applebaum. And let me just open up with just a broad question about your reaction, your response, your fears about what we've seen in Minneapolis over the weekend. I think the really important word to use here is impunity. In other words, the Trump administration appears to have given these masked thugs who are now in the streets of so many American cities a sense that they can do whatever they want and no one can stop them. In other words, they are already now living in a lawless world. They aren't bound by any rules. They aren't bound by any regulations. They don't owe any explanations to anybody. When they kill someone or

when they beat someone up, they have the administration immediately backing them up and supporting them. And that is a, you know, that you have people living outside of the law and able to commit crimes outside the law, that is a classic piece of authoritarianism. That's what you have in societies where there's no rule of law. There are no courts or where the courts are politicized. And the fact that the administration has allowed that to happen seemingly, deliberately means that they have other goals with this deployment of people. Yeah, Robert George wrote this last night. The DHS's decision to whitewash the Renee Good killing, leading to the resignation of an FBI agent trying to investigate the incident, directly led to the killing of Alex Preti.

Ice agents believed there would be no consequences for using extreme force against protesters and ordinary citizens realized that increased video scrutiny was their main line of defense against violent occupation. That's just what you said. They are acting with impunity. And as Robert George says, they're acting with impunity because they saw an officer out of danger fired two shots into the head of an American citizen a few weeks ago. And the DHS immediately lied about the killing, covered it up, and refused to investigate it. And so, of course, if the ICE agency, that agent can kill an American citizen, why can't they? And we saw the answer this weekend, didn't we?

We did. And that, of course, that awareness of impunity is exactly what makes everyone feel afraid. I saw some testimony. Maybe you saw it to publish in the last day of a woman who had been a witness to the Alex Pretty murder. describing how she saw it, and then she left her house because she was afraid that witnesses were being arrested. In other words, you now have this spreading sensation that if those offices are above the law, then anyone can be targeted. And that is what creates fear, a kind of terror, whatever word it is that you want to use. And that feeling is how you get people to, more people to disobey the law.

It's how you get people to stay home during elections. It's how you get people to become not citizens, but passive subjects of regime. This, again, is something we know from the past. So to Anne's point and to her expertise on autocracy and how it happens, this impunity that she's talking about, these, as some would call execution-style killings, or at the very least at point-blank range, when both victims had their hands out, they're the eye of the storm. They're getting the attention because it is so gruesome and so shocking what has happened.

But across the country, you have many cases happening every day of children being traumatized, even detained, even arrested, families being violently separated, U.S. citizens getting caught up and detained, cars being broken into rights being violated right and left by, again, pointing to what Anne calls sort of an overall agency to act with impunity. A feeling of impunity, and what that does is terrorize those that are seeing this unfold in their communities, in their neighborhoods, on their streets, on suburban streets. in America in 2026, this is what's happening. Show the picture.

This is happening in suburban streets in America in 2026. And that fear that they can act with that impunity and that the White House, Cristinone, and others will immediately lie for them and say things that they know are lies, that the American people know are lies. That not only sends a chilling message to the protesters, but also, as you say, and it sounds like Russia to me, you know much better because you've spent time there, but you commented about this yesterday. America in 2026, we're to place where a witness to that kind of slaughter is afraid to return

to the safety of her home because she believes the same ICE agents will come round her up and imprison her so she will not be able to testify against the ICE agent. No, and the same fear, thanks to social media, thanks to television, thanks to modern communications, the same fear affects people who aren't in Minneapolis, who are in other parts of the country, who have jobs in the federal government, who wonder whether they're allowed to question officialdom. I believe the same kind of fear affects Republican officials. So why doesn't Congress speak out?

Why doesn't Congress say obvious things, you know, that the talk of Greenland last week was crazy or that obviously government officials are lying. about the victims of ICE. Why don't they say anything? Because they're afraid. Maybe they're physically afraid. They're afraid of mobs at their homes in their constituencies.

Maybe they're also mentally affected by the vision of ice impunity. And that, remember, this is what is supposed to happen. When you use, when you create spectacles of violence, when you dehumanize the victims, blame the victims, when you celebrate the aggression of people who are acting lawlessly, the point of doing that is to make very broad circles of people afraid in order to give you more control to make sure that you are in charge of

what happens next politically. It's profoundly un-American. It's never happened before at the level of the federal government, at least not at this scale. And it's really important that all Americans are aware of it, understand what's happening, and mentally prepare themselves to fight back. Yeah, to the point of it being un-American, Alex Preddy was practicing his first and second Amendment rights when he was killed. And there was some pushback from the NRA. There was some pushback from some Republicans. President Trump last night, you know, not fully defending the officer,

but at the same time, posting on truth social, blaming squarely Democrats, he says, for creating the chaos that led to these two deaths. The Atlantics and Applebaum, and thank you so much. So Minnesota officials say they have been barred from investigating how federal agents shot and killed Alex Pretti Saturday morning. While the state's Bureau of Criminal Apprehension normally leads investigations into police shootings, Minnesota leaders say federal officials prevented access to the evidence despite the state obtaining a signed judicial warrant. Late Saturday, a federal judge issued a temporary restraining order barring the government from quote, destroying or altering evidence related to the fatal shooting,

but local leadership remained locked out, lacking facts like the identity of the agents who shot Prettie. The superintendent of Minnesota's Bureau of Criminal Apprehension tells MS Now that without cooperation, it would be difficult to conduct a thorough investigation. DHS did not immediately respond to MS Now's request for comment. The State Bureau was also blocked from investigating the January 7th killing of Renee Good by an ICE officer after the FBI said the investigation would be led by federal officials.

Joining us now, former U.S. Attorney MS. Now legal analyst Barbara McQuade. Barbara, thank you so much for joining us this morning. For him of its first moments, we know the police in Minneapolis say that the agents at the scene, the ICE agents, the DHS agents, those Border Patrol agents, tried to push Minneapolis police out of the crime scene Saturday, out of the shooting scene. They refuse to go. But certainly right now we are seeing local officials being blocked. So please start by reminding viewers how this should happen and how this decision by the feds very well could hamper the investigation.

Yeah, this protocol is absolutely unheard of what we are seeing here. Typically, both governments are separate sovereigns, and they respect the sovereignty. sovereignty of each other. Ordinarily, cases are investigated in parallel with the idea that each of those sovereigns has the right to investigate and maybe prosecute that case separately. And we often see that. In fact, it is usually the case that the state is deferred to to go first, the idea that one of its citizens has lost their lives. The state has a strong interest in pursuing that case. And so typically, the investigations are done in parallel. And there's a very good reason for that, Jonathan. It's because each of those jurisdictions has different laws and different elements. So different things they have to

prove. So it's not good enough for the state just to get the Fed's evidence. They're looking, if they're looking at all, to pursue civil rights violations, which have certain elements. In the state, it's more likely to be a murder or manslaughter case. And they have different questions. You know, there's a reason the television show was called the First 48. And that's because evidence, is most important when it is fresh. Getting the names of bystanders, for example, is essential so that they can be questioned. Maybe they know the names of these officers. Maybe they can still retain the physical evidence like an autopsy report or ballistics reports or any body camera footage they were wearing. But what they can't ever get is the names, identities, and evidence

from witnesses who are there who have now scattered to the wind. And so this is a bizarre violation of protocol. I also want to add how rich it is that the Trump administration is arguing today in court that its separate sovereignty must be respected so that it can keep ice in this jurisdiction when it is at the same time disrespecting the sovereignty of Minnesota to investigate this very case. Barbara, it's David Rode. You mentioned some of the evidence it sounds like could be crucial, the ballistic evidence, the body camera. Is there other evidence that you would want the state officials to get access to, and can the state of Minnesota, can they go to federal court and try to get some of this evidence? Is there a way the judiciary could play a role here?

Yes, to some extent, David, but it's just so unusual to have to go to court to get these things. I can think of shootings that occurred in my district when I was serving as you as attorney. We would immediately get on the phone with state officials talking to them about first, how can we support you? because we want you to have the opportunity to go first here. We will coordinate. We will make sure we each have equal access to these things. Now, if there is a resistance to that, yes, I think that the state has a right to this under its 10th Amendment rights of policing. In fact, most policing duties, there is case law that says are the quintessential state function.

And so I imagine they can get that. But as I said, some of this evidence is likely already gone. the opportunity to question witnesses who are there on the scene when the Bureau of Investigation showed up and said, we're here. They were pushed away from the scene and not allowed to do some of those things. So, yes, they can recoup some of the evidence, but they'll never have all of it. All right. So, Barb, let me ask you this, though. So let's take this out of a governmental setting.

Let's just say law enforcement officers had as much video as they have of this killing, of this shooting. And let's say they had as many of the statements as we've seen come out over the past few days. And let's say, along with all of the multiple angles of the video and all of the multiple statements made, you also have the people who took all the videos and who would be more than willing to testify, most likely, if they felt safe to do so without retribution from ICE agents. would that be, would that not be enough in most instances to begin criminal proceedings or a criminal investigation against somebody that fired into this gentleman's back four times or so while he was on the ground? Maybe more. Maybe more. I think there's, I think there's sufficient evidence to

initiate an investigation most certainly. I think there's probably even probable cause from which a charge could be filed. However, it's so important to invest. investigators and prosecutors to have all of the evidence. I want to know the conversations between Mr. Preddy and the agents. I want to know the conversations between the agents and themselves. The legal standards in cases where law enforcement officers are using force give a great deal of benefit of the doubt to the officers. And although probable cause is established, prosecutors are ethically precluded from bringing a case, unless they've been. believe they have evidence sufficient to obtain and sustain a conviction. That means guilt beyond a

reasonable doubt. And so it requires proof that the agents acted deliberately, or in the case of perhaps a manslaughter, recklessly. It's essential to prove to the jury what was said in those conversations. And perhaps, unfortunately, for the bystander who is involved in these kinds of things, it requires a level of mental state, willfulness, intentionality, or at least recklessness. Just making a mistake is usually not enough. And so when we hear the shout of gun, even though we know from the video after the fact, the gun was taken away if an officer on the scene believed that he still had a gun that may cast it in a different light. And so to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, I think it's essential to know the conversations that were occurring there

through body cams, through interviews of the agents themselves, and interviews of all of the bystanders. The victim's phone. Yeah. Yeah. There are a lot of witnesses. Former U.S. Attorney and MS Now legal analyst, Barbara McQuaid, thank you very much. An MS now senior national security reporter, David Rode, thank you as well. And coming up on Morning Joe, the growing unrest in Minnesota could lead to another government shutdown.

We'll explain why. And as we go to break, a look at the travelers' forecast this morning from Acuethers, Bernie, Bernie, where do things stand with the major winter storm that's impacting much of the country? Yeah, quite a storm this past weekend, Mika. Today we're digging out, bundle up as well. Look how cold it is. We're in the teens and 20s. Some leftover snow in Boston and Portland.

Still some slippery travel. Plenty of people without power across the southeast and south-century of the United States. and unfortunately it's a cold dry day. Gusty winds as well. Head to Miami to escape the cold. Doing any traveling, there are going to be major delays in many of the airports here this morning in the northeast as we dig out from the storm.

Things improved this afternoon. For expert insights in superior accuracy, don't forget to download the free Acu Weather app. While the Vince in Minneapolis were unfolding yesterday, tragically, the NFL continued playing football, two of the biggest games of the year. Let's bring in right now. Host of Pablo Tori finds out MS now contributor to Pablo Tori,

and Pablo will be talking in a bit about how this tragedy touched in the NBA. But let's first talk about the NFL. And of course, of course, a team that probably didn't make our computer rankings once the entire year. Now it looks like it may be, in fact, the dominant team going into the Super Bowl. Talk about the Seahawks and how. a lot of football fans maybe can name two or three players on the team, and yet you watch him and they seem extraordinarily complete. Yeah, the name I want to start with is San Darnold,

because the last time I had to be in Minneapolis, he was the Vikings quarterback. This was last season now, and he becomes a free agent. The Vikings don't resign him, and here he becomes the pilot of, yeah, it turns out the best team in the NFC. And this is not totally surprising insofar as their playoff run has been incredible, and they beat, of course, Matt Stafford and a pedigreed Rams team, which we've praised significantly more than I would admit on this program.

But Sam Darnold, Joe, he's also familiar to New Yorkers. This was the guy who was most famous for being caught on a live mic, on a hot mic, on the sidelines as a Jets quarterback saying, I'm seeing ghosts out there. And now he is this guy who is haunting would be Super Bowl champions. It's a remarkable middle class, relatively speaking, middle class, quarterback who doesn't make the most money about half, you know, 14th most in the NFL is what he was making. And here he is a success story playing in the Super Bowl, which is mind-blown. Yeah. I mean, the question is, why do the Vikings get rid of a quarterback who had, what,

a 13-and-2 record? I don't know. 14 wins last year. Yep. 14 wins last year, and he's still not good enough for the Vikings who were just subpar this year. And now, look, he's just turned around and he's done the same thing with the Seahawks. Let's go to Mile High Stadium, if it's still called that, Jonathan Amir. And, of course, we all know, Pablo will tell you, I'll tell you. Regardless, regardless of what happens, we know the Patriots are going to win the Super Bowl. If they don't win going away, well, it's been all for naught for the Cinderella story.

But let's, it's like if the amazing Mets of 69 lost in four games, didn't start out well for the Patriots, so did it, Jonathan. No, the Jason, of course, Jared Stidham, the backup quarterback for the Denver Broncos, pressed into duty, his first start of the year, came out strong through a touchdown a few minutes into the game, 7-0. Denver, Drake May and the Pats offense looked very shaky, but that's the biggest play of the game right here. Stidham, just a terrible decision to try to throw away that ball. It's a backwards pass. It's a fumble. The Patriots do punch it in a few minutes later for their one score of the game that Drake made keeper. And then the weather deteriorated. It deteriorated rapidly. And we, We got a blizzard in the second half. Patriots kick a field goal, Pablo, and that's it. 10-7 is our final, as we're going to keep watching the highlights. As prophecy. It's amazing how the weather changed from the first of the second half. Neither team could do anything Pat's win.

And despite what you and Joe have been saying, most people out there say this Patriot team, fraudulent. They don't belong to be there. The strength of schedule all year long was soft. You know, they took advantage of injuries, including Bo Nix yesterday. They shouldn't be in the Super Bowl. And they are, Pablo, underdogs. in Seattle. I will say, though, they did beat through the top five defenses.

Oh, sure. He's got a shot. The defenses that they played are impeccable. And Joe, look, I just expect there to be banners and fanfare and, you know, trumpets, literal trumpets on set for when this inevitably happens and John Amir is christened, yet again, a Super Bowl champion. Can we see the Malcolm Butler play? Yeah, you know, the thing is, Pablo, you know, I just, I want to go back to a decision that was made during the game early on by Sean Peyton. And I always sound like such an old man, because I am an old man, when I say to my son, kick the field goal, put the points on the word. I always say it.

I always say, if you're in the first, second or third quarter, and you can get three points and you're still in the game, kick the field goal. Sean Payton didn't do it yesterday when he could have done it yesterday. And it made a huge difference. I don't understand. They always say, well, if you look at the metrics, if you look at it, no, no. kick the field goal, Pablo. I love aggressiveness, but sometimes coaches play hero ball as well.

And that is Sean Payton saying, I'm going to win this. And he is now somebody we can rightfully blame for not winning this. Yeah. All right. It's the top of the hour. The NBA was also impacted by Saturday's deadly shooting in Minneapolis with a scheduled game between the Golden State Warriors and Minnesota postponed in the aftermath. Here is some of the reaction from inside the NBA analyst

and basketball Hall of Famer Charles Barkley on Saturday afternoon, followed by Warriors coach, Steve Kerr, ahead of Sunday's rescheduled tip-off. Going back to, I think her name is Renee Good. And today, man, it's just sad, man. It's scary. It's sad. And I don't know how, you know, it's going to end bad

it's already in it badly twice and somebody's got to step up and be adults because man two people have died for no reason and it's just sad my concern as an

American we're not perfect you know we never have been perfect but I think our ideals have been in the right place for a long time, our values. And, you know, I think no matter what side of the aisle you stand on, I think remembering the values that come with the Constitution, that come with citizenship, the values of

looking after each other are so important right now, just because of the extremism that we can feel from all over the place. People are so angry. Pablo, all sports this weekend, including those two NFL games, frankly, felt pretty small. Yes. Compared to what else is happening, what happened in Minneapolis, the questions our country faces. We applaud those two men, Barclay and Kerr, who have always been outspoken, who are not afraid to say what they think. It is interesting to feel like that the sports world does seem to be acknowledging what happened here, delivering a needed response.

Yeah, if you just fell asleep after 2020, you wake up today and you're like, oh, okay, sports is, we're talking about politics, as they did. But in the intervening time period, sports has been pretty hermetically sealed. It's been remarkable. Like, we watch sports grow to the depths that they have and the scope that they have. But the athletes, particularly, have been pretty silent during the second Trump administration. The Epstein Files didn't wake it up. Venezuela didn't wake it up. Terrorists didn't wake it up.

I don't know if these guys could name Stephen Miller. They recognize them in a lineup, frankly. But the video and the story of this, it teaches us that if anything, sports has been a weather vein, not for the most politically conscious people, but for people who don't necessarily even want to have to deal with what Steve Kerr actively and accurately called extremism, which is, this all feels beyond the pale. And in that regard, I think this is just another vector of conversation of millions of people who are going to have to confront something that they would like to keep to the side. Yeah. And you know, um, great point. Great point.

Charles Barkley at the top of this hour playing that clip. Maybe people inside the political bubble don't understand, but people outside the political bubble do. Charles Barkley speaking to this has far more impact than any politician wearing a congressional pen. And it breaks through, and this is broken through to voters on all sides of the political spectrum. MS now contributor to parliamentary. We thank you so much. Thank you.