MORNING KOMBAT WITH LUKE THOMAS AND BRIAN CAMPBELL - Benavidez Stops Andrade | Jermall Charlo | PFL Recap | Katie Taylor | Morning Kombat Ep 520

Episode Date: November 27, 2023

On Episode 520 of Morning Kombat Luke Thomas and Brian Campbell react to a solid weekend of fights. The guys start by breaking down David Benavidez vs. Demetrius Andrade. What, specifically, did Benavidez prove with this performance? How bad for boxing would it be if Benavidez vs. Canelo isn’t made in 2024? The boys also break down the PFL 2023 Championship. How do the guys grade the show? Who stood out? As always we close Monday's with Dm's from Donks and HYSTS. (00:12:30) - Benavidez vs. Andrade (00:43:40) - Benavidez vs. Canelo (01:02:30) - PFL Season Finale (01:20:00) - Rest of PFL 10 (01:27:30) - Katie Taylor (01:39:30) - Dm's from Donks (01:51:00) - HYSTS  Morning Kombat is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts and wherever else you listen to podcasts.     For more Combat Sports coverage subscribe here: youtube.com/MorningKombat   Follow our hosts on Twitter: @BCampbellCBS, @lthomasnews, @MorningKombat    For Morning Kombat gear visit:morning kombat.store   Follow our hosts on Instagram: @BrianCampbell, @lukethomasnews, @MorningKombat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, it's a Monday. Raise your hand if you tried to make Dremel, Dremel Charlo cry. It's just, it's just one of us who did that. It's just one of us. Hi, everybody. Can't wait for 9-11, Luke. No, in all seriousness, it was a fun, you know what? It was a fun combat sports weekend.

We had a lot of little adventures. We have to talk about them. So hi, everyone. a fun combat sports weekend we had a lot of little adventures we have to talk about them so hi everyone welcome on this 27th of november 2023 for a post thanksgiving post pfl post katie taylor post david benavidez weekend my name is luke thomas i'm merely one half of your hosting duo i join you from the capital of astatis and needles right here in washington dc joined by the man with the plan did i i'm teasing we obviously did a very good job. By the way, on last-minute notice to go out there to Las Vegas, it's Brian Campbell, the King of Connecticut.

What's up, BC? Thank you, Luke. Less than 24 hours notice, but man, when the bat phone rings and they want you, Luke, you drop the world to get there, and I did. Wow, honor to be part of the last Showtime Boxing pay-per-view. Awesome that the card like exceeded expectations produced some great storylines to talk about but uh i want to also give you a big shout outs luke you went to the pfl on friday we have a lot to talk to about that you produced the reaction video and in my absence you and steven breadman edwards on that

fantastic two fight showtime pay-per-view countdown card delivered a lot of people talking about that by the way ringside the chemistry between the two of you uh really excited about that and glad you were able to pick that up luke thanks man we missed you we missed you did you see what we put in your place at the studio instead of yeah it's not columbia i really enjoyed that one a lot uh no luke this is great i mean to see the mexican monster have that type of performance that moment we'll get into that but you know the spoils of the job man the rush it's weird i always say calling fights being a commentator is like you know you know what i'm talking about it's like

the the real drug in this profession doing the the Jim Gray thing is a little bit different. It's like there's NFL field goal kicker vibes. They don't need you for most of the show, but when they do, you got to step up, you got to bring it. So real fun, really enjoyed it. But yeah, you mentioned it, dude. How big was that Katie Taylor fight in that moment? Holy shit bags, right?

How big was the PFL championship? I watched it back. I really enjoyed it. Turns out, Luke, turns out I enjoyed it a lot. So there we go. There we go. All right. What time was your flight home yesterday?

11 a.m. Vegas time. I stepped back in my house about 10.45 p.m. last night. That's fucking brutal. Jesus. Yeah. Yeah. I took a 6 a.m flight saturday morning to vegas as soon as i arrived i checked into hotel went directly to the arena and did that you know four hour wait that we do in full makeup as we just sit around and uh rehearse and wait for the uh inevitable start of the card but uh yeah we're so worth it luke so worth it love it this is what we

do this is why we lift them weights in the offseason, right? That's right. That's exactly right. So we had a great time in studio. Thanks, of course, to the Malka crew who spent part of their Thanksgiving weekend to come in studio. It was fun. Breadman delivered. I mean, I was just teeing him up.

Dude, when he left, that's like one of those guys, man. I don't know what else he's into. I mean, he's really into his like his son plays basketball he was showing me like how you know he was playing some tournament so he loves his kids or whatever but short of loving his kids and i guess he's married i don't know and then boxing i don't i think that's his life dude like he is a boxing guy to the fucking bone i mean he's brilliant first of all he's just brilliant as a as a trainer as a mind but you're right his the way he breaks down the sport the way he's sort of

ahead of the curve on so much yeah that's his life that's his passion luke that's the spirit he brought to the conversations with you but did you talk violent pornography with him at all that's the real question you know i've done two shows with him i feel like you got to get to three to start talking about you know spitting in other people's mouths and stuff okay all right that see that i didn't want that i didn't i did not support that comment thank you all right so let's get to this so we of course are going to have to talk about the biggest fight of the weekend which was in fact david benavidez we'll talk about pfl i was there there is a short reaction video i kind of put up sort of giving my sense of everything that i saw on friday night

here back in dc and then we'll talk some kat some Katie Taylor as well thumbs up if you're watching on YouTube hit the subscribe button it's free doesn't cost you nothing and of course you can see the socials all down here below you can give us a follow on your favorite little outlet there wherever it may be um BC I am I need to blow my nose so why don't you tell the folks about the amazing and I should say dwindling merch opportunity that they have at MorningCombat.store. Look, MorningCombat is not going out of business, but MorningCombat.store, in honor of Cyber Monday, is going out for business. We're trying to get rid of all the old stuff lingering. So here's the deal, folks.

You want to go to MorningCombat.store right now? We can give you 20% off. There's a code on the site. But if you want the real discounts, the members-only deep dive inner discounts, right, where we turn the elbow at the end, if you know what I'm talking about. I don't know if that's legal to say out loud. There is a prompt on the front page of MorningCombat.store to enter your email address, join our club. You don't need to give your your bank account info you won't be declared a lord or a laird after but you'll get

access to incredible savings why because we've got new lines of merchandise coming in for the new year for the holiday season we had to get rid of the old if there's things you always wanted i mean look this is how i shop when i go on the u UFC merch site, I wait for that $4.99 deal three years later after that fighter's been cut by the organization, because that's when the t-shirts really matter to me. If that's the same with you, go to morningcombat.store right now.

Luke, they got bomber jackets, they got average Joe art, they got everything you want with a good discount off, so check that out. Sign up today. We love you. When I checked in at the PFL on Friday, I wasn't expecting this. They gave

me some merch. I'm going to give it away except for this hat and I'll tell you why in a minute. They gave me this hat. Can you see? Can you see PFL World Championship? Here's why I'm going to... They gave me a shirt too. I'm definitely going to give the shirt away. I don't mean to be rude to the very nice people, but I can't accept gifts,

but I will treat this one like memorabilia because it's got DC 23 on the back. Okay. Just accept it, dude. It's different when they're like, Hey, we want coverage so badly. We'll pay for your airfare and your hotel to come,

you know, influence for us. No, that's one thing. Them giving you merch, dude, accept that. That for us. No, that's one thing. Them giving you merch? Dude, accept that. That's one of the spoils of the job.

Do you take the free coffee and the media buffet? No, no, I have a box with stuff that promoters have tried to give me over the years. I don't wear it or use it, but I kind of collect it. So I'm going to put that in the collection. I'll give away the shirt. I can't tell with that dress shirt whether you came here directly from a job interview or a wake, Luke. Which one was it? I did an interview with NPR this morning. tell with that dress shirt whether you came here directly from a job interview or a wake, Luke. Which one was it? I did an interview with NPR this morning. How about that?

Oh, nice. Yes. What did you talk? Cage fighting? No, I meant job interview. No, I'm teasing. I'm teasing. I'm teasing.

I'm teasing. They wanted to know about the PFL and Bellator merger. They wanted to know what that meant. So, yeah. So, I don't know when that interview will be out. Luke Thomas, npr's finest i love to hear that shit npr is not far from where i live it's just down the street on north capital it's not far so yeah um anyway neither here nor there who cares about any of that uh bc

let's see we got the merch in i would plug showtime but hey who's you know i mean what are we doing december 16th one the one last ride be there in minneapolis yes and they finally announced that on the car. David Murrell Jr. is going to be taking on Agbeko. Is that the gentleman he's fighting? Yes, Senna Agbeko. He's a veteran of these parts. Showbox just last year as well.

He'll be on there. But how about that Chris Colbert-Reyo Valenzuela rematch on that triple header there? Can't miss that. Yeah, should be fun. And by the way, I don't know if we're going to call the prelims for that. I certainly hope, because if we do, that'll be the last one looks like holiday paychecks baby okay let's let's do that let's get some let's get some all right with that out of the way let's get this party started if we can here topic number one let's start with the biggest

fight of the weekend it was on pay-per-view well i guess he's not the mexican monster anymore because he wants to represent all of his identities and where he comes from but he is the monster at 168 make no mistake about it David Benavidez pummeling Demetrius Andrade who many questions about what he was doing to get ready for this fight which I do want to ask you about BC but let's start here he polishes him off his corner stops the fight Andrade's corner after the sixth round he does not walk out for the seventh which i thought was a good stoppage by them they saved that guy absolutely unnecessary punishment so here's my question to ubc since you were there

tell me not just in general terms tell me specifically what did David Benavidez prove to you with this win uh let's leap to it let's let's jump right to what he really proved here he proved to me that he could beat Canelo Alvarez and that's wild that's the biggest fight you can make in boxing I'm sure it's going to be a big part of what we're going to talk about right now we've all wanted this fight but why did this fight prove that to me because Andrade is not easy to look good against. And if you are going to have success against Andrade and really who has in his 15 year career, which has been a frustrating career, but he has always showed you that elite ability to have that much success in that short of time period shows you this, that Benavidez is right.

What he told me in the post-fight interview, people label him a lot of things, flat-footed, not quick enough, gets hit too often. And I don't think a lot of these are even remotely true. Statistically, he's in the top four, according to CompuBox, in terms of defensive, in terms of, you know, the least amount of times being hit by average per round. Andrade, Shakur Stevenson, guys like that are ahead of him. So to be able to be a warrior a menacing monster as we call him and to still be defensively responsible to still flash incredible

hand speed in those combinations and to batter walk down and essentially take the fight out of a former u.s olympian a guy who's been unbeaten over 15 years, a champion in two weight divisions. And anyone can say what they want about Andrade, okay? He came in there to win. You may not have loved his strategy. He won, in my opinion, two of the first three rounds. Some people I talked to even gave him all three. But the point was he came to fight and he came to win.

And Benavidez still walked him down, walked through him and got his corner to throw in the towel. I don't want to hear any slander about Andrade because maybe people didn't follow his career. He is a elite world-class fighter who had a specific preparation and game plan and came here to win. And Benavidez adjusted to it and quickly cut right through that so when I'm talking about what could be next for this really guy that's on the verge of breakout commercial stardom with that Mexican-American audience behind him on the verge by the way after this calendar year now of knocking

on the door in categories like fighter of the year maybe even pound for pound voting after this performance he has showed me Luke that it wouldn't just be a great fight against Canelo Alvarez because of the all Mexico factor. Although let's be fair, like we're talking about, uh, Benavidez born in Arizona represents Ecuador's grandmother. Like he represents a lot of different things here, but that fight is huge alone on the reputations in the fighting styles. But this performance right here really told me that Benavidez is actually better than I thought he was in a lot of these little categories. Now that we know the stamina is elite 12 round stamina. We saw that in the Caleb Plant fight.

We saw that again here in terms of the condition he came in. Now that you know the focus is lethal. Luke, his ability to put on power shots in short bursts that are clean, fast, accurate. And the fact that he's mounting that pressure on you as the fight goes on, who can stand that heat and stand in that kitchen? We're really right now talking about the potential of who? It's Canelo. And then after that, it's the guys at 175 pounds. It's Betterbeave. It's Beavol. Yeah, I'm being serious here. And this is what Benavidez wants to do.

He has shown me that from a craft standpoint, his skills are right there with his pressure, with his chin, with his machismo. Luke, he's the real deal, the complete package. And I'm proud to see him get to this point after some personal pitfalls along the way. I can't hear a goddamn thing. Oh, here we go. Now I got you back. Now I got you back.

Sorry about that. I didn't hear like the last like 30 seconds of that. So I apologize. No problem. BC, what was the most impressive thing about him that you saw sitting ringside? Because before we weren't ringside for the Caleb Plant fight, what was different about this one, if anything? Just how accurate his power shots are.

How he is so much more calculated than people realize. That there is a method to so much of what he does. And when he starts to put it on you, when he starts to make that early read adjustment and start walking forward, it's not just flurries here, flurries there to back you up, Luke. There's a pinpoint method. There's a sniper quality, despite the fact that he's a big, heavy, strong guy that walks you down and puts that mental pressure on you.

His actual skill set and ability has evolved quickly. And that's why I started that conversation the way I did, Luke. Technically, he is now at another level and that's really why I believe he's in a conversation to have a great shot at beating one of the greatest fighters we have ever seen come through here in Canelo it's not due to the size the youth the volume it's due to that the accuracy and the fact that this guy has an IQ up here again better than I thought he was maybe even a year ago you know what I don't know if you heard the broadcast at any point BC but Al Bernstein on

the broadcast it's something that I thought really accurately portrayed what the task is if you want to beat David Benavidez he was like either you have to box because you look at the first two three rounds and Caleb Plant like first five rounds so, they were able to stick and move. That's basically the idea. They were sticking, moving, turning David Benavidez, forcing him to cover up, not really getting much going. If you can do that for 12 rounds, you can win. But you have to do it almost without issue for 12 rounds.

Or you have to hurt David Benavidez. But here's what we are discovering, BC. People can't do that for 12 rounds discovering BC people can't do that for 12 rounds Caleb Plant didn't do that for 12 rounds although he he did go the distance which by the way in retrospect looks pretty goddamn good if I can be honest with you he took a beating late though let's be fair he took a Caleb Plant showed all the heart and took a beating late in that fight but I'm saying he delayed the onset of David Benavidez longer and then lasted longer albeit the end of that fight was a torrential downpour.

And then the other thing is, who has hurt David Benavidez? That's an elite opponent that you would count. I mean, I'm not familiar with the entire catalog that he's got, but I don't really— I'll tell you what. When he won the title the first time against Ronald Gavriel, he got dropped in the 12th round, and that's a big reason why they ended up having a rematch. But that's like a 21-year-old David Benavidez who didn't have the stamina didn't have the same dedication luke we remember him with the cocaine uh popping of a test we remember him missing weight during the pandemic who he is now when it's all ratcheted and dialed it up dude it's a different conversation

he's a different fighter this is different than a year ago year and a half ago when we're like man he's gonna make fun fights with everybody now i'm saying right now he might already be one of the top 10 pound for pound best in the world he's showing us that what else would you need to say after this calendar year what he did to these two difficult individuals he didn't like the reason why i'm so excited here luke it's not imagine if he did to andre what he did to plant withstand put pressure withstand put pressure slowly break down eventually just dominate torrential downpour as you said that normally happens in rounds eight nine ten eleven twelve he got andre out of there in four

five and six a guy that nobody looks good against like what else are we supposed to say right now beyond this guy's freaking great and when he says into the mic i'm going to be great at this i'm going to be remembered as a legend i'm starting to believe him and i don't think that's hyperbole in the moment this isn't saying i love you after a one night stand luke this is a guy who has completely evolved into the full potential of what's capable right now in his late 20s in this early physical prime okay, a couple things to unpack from this based on what you're saying. Breadman told me something interesting on Saturday night,

and I had asked him if you looked at just, even Al Bernstein's keys to victory for Benavidez were don't go square. He goes square with a lot of guys, right? He's not bladed. He's square, which makes you a much more hittable target. There's much more target being presented. But i asked breadman about that and breadman was like yeah right but see here's the deal partly number one he's going square so he can cut you off

and as he begins to cut you off right because it presents more lateral movement opportunities that makes the problem more difficult but more to the point he kind of covers and then returns fire right so even though he goes square and he's technically more hittable, you don't really notice it in the numbers. He doesn't get bombed on because he has pretty good defense. And more to the point, dude, once he begins to find any little opening in what you have, he rips it to pieces. He bombards right through it.

And so who cares if he goes square? That's basically what Breadman's point was. Who cares if he goes square is basically what bread man's point was who cares if he goes square if you a can't really hurt him and b that just brings him closer to you for him to do what he wants to do he's a very very unique guy with a dude he's one of these classic examples of the best fighters break all the rules of boxing you're not supposed to go square you're not supposed to do a lot i mean just walk into a guy like that you're not supposed to do these things but it facilitates his dramatic offense and guys can't crumble i'm so glad you said something remember the caleb plant fight went the full distance it was a beat down at the end but it was you know

it was tough for him a little bit early or at least it was slow going for him early dude Demetrius Andre didn't get his ass kicked for six rounds he got his ass kicked for like two and a half three that's it maybe even a round and a half Luke he got knocked down by that right hand at round four I do think what changed was early in round four there was a body shot that I think officially changed the direction of the fight. But if you really think about it, he got knocked down in round four halfway through. The fight ends at the end of the sixth. This was only really a round and a half. But the beatdown was like incredibly efficient. Yeah.

Like disastrous. It was just like, holy shit. This has turned into the bully in the hallway just taking out the star football player in ways that we didn't imagine. It was like, holy crap. I mean, I don't know what the appropriate metaphor would be. You know, wasn't it Nazeem Richardson who said, you know, swim without getting wet as your task? I don't really feel like it that way, but I just feel like when David Benavidez is moving downhill on you, it's like trying to hide from the rain and there's no shelter.

You just can't. It's just really not possible unless you've got dramatic pop. And Demetrius Andrade had good combinations and caught him a couple times moving in, and it just did nothing. By the way, BC, there were times early in this fight where he caught David Benavidez clean with an overhand, and it turned his head, and it did nothing to deter him. It did nothing to police him or change his game plan or discipline him. It didn't work at all. We keep talking about his offense.

One, he doesn't get hit nearly as much as you might imagine. Two, BC, we always talk about what's one of the great things that Canelo has. Among many other things, Canelo has a rock chin. I mean a fire hydrant chin. I got news for you. I don't know if it's as good as Canelo has, among many other things, Canelo has a rock chin. I mean, a fire hydrant chin. I got news for you. I don't know if it's as good as Canelo's. I don't know where it stands. But would you not agree?

David Benavidez, from what we have seen, has showed us a ridiculous chin to this point. Look, it is. So I want to take everything, all the excitement you just said about his chin, everything I said about how his technique is growing so fast, everything we said about his chin, everything I said about how his technique is growing so fast, everything we said about his defensive numbers, how he's in front of you and is daring you to hit him, yet he's so busy and is so responsible with his head movement that

you can't. And if you do try to land clean and load up, you're going to get countered by flurries. There was a comparison I felt coming out as I was stepping out of the ring on Saturday night after this fight that I didn't even think I was going to share today because it's hard to make. So the comparison here is Gennady Golovkin. And the reason why I don't want to make that is because really what made Golovkin so special is the fact that he had a 350 amateur fight career as a foundation for when he turned pro. So when he turned pro with this insane power and he's coming on the scene 10 years ago on HBO and blowing our minds and we couldn't wait for him to finally step up and fight an elite fighter

he is walking these dudes down yes with the power and the ridiculous chin but it's the technique and the foundation only because David Benavidez has raised his own craft and skill level and this is where I give his dad Jose Benavidez senior credit in ways that I don't think enough people are. He has evolved, meaning David, hugely. I mean, even the older brother, Jose Jr., in a loss to Jamal Charlo, which we'll talk about, seemed to really evolve his game too. I'm getting Golovkin vibes. In my favorite Golovkin story, when we were all questioning whether what we saw was for real, and you have to remember, when Golovkin's knocking out one middleweight after another even credible names like Matthew Macklin but still yet was

not getting the codos the Sergio Martinez is the really big names to truly prove himself I was one of the first that tossed him a top 10 pound for pound vote we're all like is it time is it too early I'm not sure I remember when Golovkin fought Curtis Stevens at the theater at Madison Square Garden I believe believe it was 2014, maybe 2013. I covered that live. Golovkin was building a fan base within the boxing, Twitter, and media space that I hadn't seen before. Like, he was everyone's favorite fighter right away, but they were all trying to make sure that they were right. Is he really for real? I'm not saying Curtis Stevens is a, is a world beater. He's a very quality fighter. Golovkin rolled through him though, cuts through him like knife and butter. People remember the Curtis Stevens face when he got

knocked down and he went like, Oh crap, that power is for real. But later that night, Luke, I went to Jimmy's corner. A lot of people know what the boxing hardcourts in time square, that dot, that great dive bar, the late Jimmy Glenn, the great, you know, trainer, cut man, worked with so many stars. It was the owner. Little hole in the wall bar. I walk in there post-fight. It's crowded. Jim Lampley of HBO is walking out as I walk in. We're in this tiny thing where you're mouth to mouth. You're basically, you know, tip to tip with everybody. And he's walking past. I go, Jim,im he's for real meaning golovkin straight off that knockout of curtis stevens i go tell me jim he's for real he and then this is a call back to a conversation jim and i had after the macklin knockout at the mohegan sun where i thought

i'm sorry at foxwoods where i said jim i think he's for real and jim was like uh i want to say yes i'm not sure jim stopped and turned to me and goes, he has the finest craft of any destroyer I have ever seen. You're goddamn right. He's for real. And then Jim wearing this elegant trench coat turned his back as his scarf flew around his head and he walked out into the cold New York night in almost theatrical ways. I remember in that moment going, everything we see with our

eyes, it's actually truthful because this guy has it all. Luke, David Benavidez does not have the exact same path or institutionalized amateur background of 358 fights to get to this point. But the same realization I had that night after Triple G knocked out Curtis Stevens is what I saw here on Saturday. The idea that for all we love of Benavidez is hulking manner, badass machismo, downhill style. He's the very real deal in the key

areas. The craft, the demeanor, the IQ that we weren't sure. The discipline that we weren't sure. Luke, I'm sure now. I'm sure this guy can go in there and defeat one of the all-time greats in undisputed super middleweight champion canelo alvarez i i would have always given him a good shot given the youth the size and all that i'm convinced now he can and will win this fight i didn't think i'd get here right now i didn't think i'd get here

off this performance but he cut through andrade like he was fighting a C-rate fighter, Luke, who I'm going to tell you right now, I watched a lot of the preparation. I watched his game plan closely when he stepped in there on Saturday. Andrade bulked up. He came to win. He was smart. He was crowding Benavidez. He was exploding in certain sequences. And as you said, landing flush, only nothing mattered. Nothing happened because of that. Benavidez just turned and cut through him even faster than I thought was possible. And he did it with such efficiency that, I don't know, Luke, we may have to readjust. This guy's coming on, meaning he could be not only a commercial breakthrough pay-per-view star, and now this is two pay-per-view main events in this one calendar year for him,

but I wasn't really sure he could become, critically, a pound-for-pound performer. What are you going to say now? What are you going to say now after this performance? Well, didn't, I mean, to play devil's advocate, BC, I mean, I am convinced by your argument, but even Benavidez himself, who I do think on some level he was being humble, but he does not strike me as a false humility guy especially even he said he wasn't sure he was pound for pound right now

I mean what about that that means that he's evolving so quick in my mind that he wants to make sure he is ironing out all of his potential areas of mistake that's exactly where I want him to be you're telling me now I'm willing to throw him all the flowers and he's like, hold on, let me earn it one more time first. Yeah, look, I mean, here's the deal. You and I were around when he missed weight that time, mid-pandemic for his title fight. We were interviewing him before and after during that stretch.

I wasn't really sure he had it all together. We now, you know, we saw him lose his title twice. I actually asked him a dick question. You can watch the interview I did, the pre-fight one on Morning Combat. I ended the interview, a lot of buildup, like, okay, final question. Here we go. I felt bad after I asked it. I basically said, look, if you go out there and beat Andrade in your second straight pay-per-view main event, I'm sure you're going to call out Canelo afterwards. I'm sure the world's going to be banging the drum for that fight. Are you sure you are really ready for this? And what was I really trying to ask him? Yeah, about the weight

and the discipline and the mentality, but really about the overall life discipline. Are you ready for the stardom, the millions, everything that's going to come your way? Can you not only still be that guy, can you be even better? Can you keep evolving? This is why I'm excited because what he showed me there on Saturday, Luke, was that he did exactly that. He did evolve and grow through all of this. So it's kind of a dick question in the moment to a big starfighter entering such an important fight. But we had those questions.

I no longer have those concerns. That he, every single camp that he's going to come in there, build up that gas tank. Do you realize how freaking dangerous he is when he has that gas tank to lean on? It's like it's so frightening what he can do when he's really in shape, dialed in, has the right game plan, like what he's capable of for a man that size in this weight class, which we'll get to in just a second because that may not last forever, is remarkable. BC, I do want to push the conversation a little bit forward. Let me challenge you on one thing. Far be it for me to do so, but I do think it's worth at least having a bit of this conversation. I have seen a number of boxing observers say, look, we're not saying Demetrius Andrade was bad.

That's really not what we're arguing. But what they will say and what they will tell you is there was an argument floating around for years prior to this contest that Andrade was avoided, which was true. But he was avoided not merely because he wasn't necessarily a big box office draw, but because people were really sort of afraid of his talent. And there were people who were like, well, that argument doesn't really hold a lot of sway. Now, I know this is hindsight looking back, but what they're trying to say is there were also people at that time who were like, well, that argument doesn't really hold a lot of sway. Now, I know this is hindsight looking back, but what they're trying to say is there were also people at that time who were saying, fine, he was skilled, he was this, he was that. But during that time, he had never proven much with any kind of A-level opponent to make anyone think he was next-level scary.

That was just what, like, essentially Andre boosters wanted you to believe what is the truth of his actual ability such as we can say after saturday night like most debates like this the truth is somewhere in the middle so does does the performance ultimately after 15 years of waiting for this was it was he almost set up to fail just in that regard after, to be fair, a mismanaged career in which he had really been waiting for this big moment right there. Does it bring down some level of the idea because of that key truth that you said? We haven't seen him against A-level fighters. We really haven't, okay? We've seen him against some good fighters, Martirosyan, Sulechki, I mean, a couple others, you know what I mean? But it has been frustrating. Do you want to bring down the idea that this guy is top 10 pound for pound level right now?

Or that he's, you know, whatever. Yeah, you have to mark him down to a certain degree. He didn't get up off his stool after round six in the biggest fight of his life in the first true A-level thing. But it would be, in my opinion, somewhat disingenuous on the same level if somebody was like, well, how good was Guillermo Rigondel? Because I saw him that time against Lomachenko when he moved up two weight divisions and then quit halfway through the fight when it wasn't going his way.

Doesn't that prove when he finally steps up to the super elite? Rigondel had gold medals, though. He did have gold medals. He did have a victory over Hall of Famer Nonito Donair at the peak of Donair's pound-for-pound prime. But what I'm saying is- Demetrius had none of these things. Okay, okay.

But what I'm saying is you can do that after the fact. I want to go with the proof in the fight. I think there's two ways to look at Andrade's performance in this fight. One is that he came out there, looked good for a couple rounds, and then when the heat got turned up, he couldn't recover. But, Luke, he was looking very good in those rounds. And here's why I don't penalize him not continuing after round six how many times do we see guys come in there against Canelo for

example and we know their only chance outside of lack landing that one big money punch is to throw a perfect game and perfectly outbox him in ways that probably aren't realistic and as soon after about a round and a half that we realize that they're knocking out box him and they sure don't have the firepower. These guys go into survival mode and Canelo for his fact, you know, to his credit tends to catch up with them before the final round and get them out of there. Benavidez has tried and done that a lot too, but Luke Andrade came to win. Like he was, in in fact he was the first

three and a half rounds he was putting on a posture that showed you a detailed game plan he had rebuilt his body through through uh conti victor conti and snack and i know there's always sniffers sniffs of pd use when you got victor conti involved but he came in there in his third division up a weight class up two weight classes really from his actual best weight and tried his best to bully the bully, to out physical him, to basically create smaller sequences to work in by holding Benavidez a lot, by exploding with combinations and trying to hold him again. I really actually thought it was a brilliant, smart game plan. It was daring and he got paid for the price for getting clipped in the round four and really never recovered and got his ass beat in those final round

and a half. So are we going to sit here and say, okay, well, he never actually beat an A guy and look what he did against the only A guy. That means he's trash. No. Is the truth closer to the middle to some degree, but I've been following this game a long time. I've seen every one of Demetrius Andrade's fights for as frustrating as he is.

And he is, he's high risk, low reward. People don't want to fight him. They thought his personality was corny. He was mismanaged. He made missteps himself. He signed with Roc Nation at that time that kind of put him in limbo. There was nowhere to go there. He got, you know, decent money for facing nobodies at times, but his talent shown through that there was something there. I like the fact that he came out in a very tough challenge as an underdog, but went against the grain and tried to win the damn fight and had a little bit of success along the way no i'm not going to sit here and shit on him now he brought it yeah maybe after the fight he was a little too excuse heavy about this being his third division wanted to clear you know clear his name didn't love that i'll give him the grounds to do that after getting stopped that's fine

but no i'm not going to sit here and downgrade him or try to say this win isn't what it actually was. This guy was 32-0 with 19 KOs, a former U.S. Olympian. He was a medal favorite who didn't come through, by the way, but was of that ilk. And as a pro, he's won titles in two divisions, and people have avoided him for a reason. He was on the same channel when DAZN launched with Canelo, Golovkin, Danny Jacobs, and was in a trash talk war at the time with both Charlo brothers and couldn't get any of them in the ring, especially all those guys that were on the same network as him. Luke, that has to show you something in there that everybody looked at the risk reward potential

and then were like, I could get in a trap. I could, I could end up in a trap. You want to argue that maybe Andrade in hindsight now should have done the let's hold the ball and have everybody boo him to try his only way of beating okay fine I like that he went after him used his offensive skills and tried to win the fight I'm not going to downgrade him no I will say this I mean I'm not enough to I I'm not in a position to make enough of a judgment here one way or the other but the thing that does strike me here bc is that by the time he faced an egg an a-level guy right on pay-per-view he was 35 years old granted undefeated but he's 35 years old but he wasn't demetrius andrade has been in the trenches in the sense that he's been in boxing a long time

and through the amateurs and through the Olympic system and you name it, three weight classes. In that sense, BC, I'm not saying he hasn't paid his dues or that he's not skillful. I think all those things are true. But the first time he was going to face a towering figure who was going to put him in a dogfight, he waited until he was 35 years old in his third weight class.

He didn't have any subsequent experience i know he's had some split decisions previously but i mean the kind of fight that are the kind of lessons you have to learn to take into a david benavidez fight he never had it's from what i can tell tell me if i'm wrong he never had the kind of opponent who really threatened him forced him taught him what it would be like to go against this guy. So I didn't know that his boxing style here that I saw looked bad. He looked fluid and crisp early. But he just seemed to me, in as much as a 35-year-old man with 32 professional wins in boxing could be,

I don't know what the right word is, somewhat unprepared. Not that he didn't do his homework. Not that he's not fought all these fights. But for this guy, there should have been a series of gradients below this in a similar way that got him used to it. He would have wanted to, Luke. It's not like he didn't try to. He went to the Canelo press conference.

What I'm saying is, why didn't he last as long as Caleb Plant? For a variety of reasons. There are different stances. There are different fighters. There are different stances. There are different fighters. There are different natural weights. I'll tell you right now. I was just going to say, part of it was, I just don't think he had the requisite experience.

Whoever's fault it was, he did not have the requisite experience to take into Saturday. His career has been mismanaged, and I will tell you some of it is his fault. And that's fair. When he signed with Roc Nation, that's how he lost the Charlo fight, correct? Yes. And also, he had the Billy Joe Saunders fight locked up until sanders pull saunders pulled out so he's you know he's come close he's tried he i mean look when he

went to that canelo press conference after the billy joe saunders won and called canelo out and got embarrassed in that viral video video of shut the fuck up shut the fuck up who are you like that whole thing i'll give him credit too that's the the Antonio Tarver going to the Roy Jones press conference and saying, hey, what do I have to do? Do I have to piss on your lawn like it's Clubber Lang against Balboa in the third Rocky movie? I applaud that. If you want to sit here and say his career was mismanaged enough

that when this moment came, he wasn't fully ready. I don't know, Luke, because look, you say, okay, well, why did Plant go the distance Plant was trying to box more from the outside but I think ultimately by the time the halfway point of that fight got to that point even though we respect Plant's chin his will and all

that we didn't think there was a chance to win in that second half it was basically is Canelo going to stop him or not I actually like the fact again I'll re-echo it that Andrade came to win and was willing to risk taking the damage in order to try to slow down tie up Benavidez land big shots surprise him a little bit tie him up again and go back and watch the first three rounds there was success in that so I think the fact that Benavidez

was so quickly able to flip that around and then efficiently and violently get him out of there I think the story here is that so far above well maybe Boo Boo wasn't that dude no Boo Boo's mismanaged but this guy's freaking skilled and if you say oh well he only beat this guy by split decision whatever I don't think you can get truly motivated to be at your best until there's that danger across from you. Andrade took his swing. It didn't happen. I don't really know where he goes from here at 35

because he's still that risk reward scenario, but I'll give him a lot of credit. He did wait till this day, finally 15 years in to have his big moment. I thought he was in great shape. I liked his game plan. He came, he took a big swing. It is what it is.

The last thing I'll say, boy, I got to tell you, this was a very entertaining Demetrius Andrade fight, right? I mean, he made it that way. So are you going to do you want to? So I'm going to ask you honestly. Would you give him credit for that? The style contrast helped facilitate that, obviously,

because David Benavidez was going to march into you. But I felt like for as long as he could, he tried to deliver. I won't say, you know, I'm going to meet you in the middle. We're going to play rock'em, sock'em. But he tried to be as offensive as I've. I mean, I'm not a Demetrius Andrade scholar, but as much as I've seen his fights, this was him really kind of bringing as much offense as I've ever seen. He fought out.

He tried to fight out of trouble in round four and five, Luke. And it didn't go well for him, but he was trading on even terms to some degree. some degrees just he was getting hit with bigger bombs but yeah i like again i like a lot i was actually randomly at his post-fight party at the house of blues luke as i caught a caught a drink afterwards and uh there was all smiles i i think they were happy to finally have their big day there was a camera crew following him but i don't think there was a lot of remorse i think they came in there and put their best foot forward. But, you know, I saw a lot of hate online. It is what it is.

It's boxing Twitter, Luke. But again, I don't think you can come out of this with anything but elevating Benavidez, elevating his future star potential, and most importantly, Luke, his potential in fighting Canelo Alvarez. That was the story after the fight, rightfully so. Luke, is this the biggest fight you can make in boxing? Because everyone from Jimmy Lennon Jr. to Al Bernstein afterwards, we were all debating that. Usyk Fury might be historically more,

but is this the biggest fight you can make in the sport? Let's talk about it. Topic number two. So that's the thing that's on everyone's mind here. BC, let me just ask the question as I've written it. Let me ask it the opposite way rather than how big would it be is it one of the biggest fights in boxing easily easily easily easily and I went on and on about this on that little post fight show that I did on Saturday

night so let me ask it the opposite way how bad for boxing would it be if Benavidez and Canelo is not made in 2024 oh really really bad really bad. If you want to debate, because the early plans, again, that we had heard, the ESPN Deportes report out of Mexico was that Canelo and PBC were hoping that Canelo could fight Munguia in the spring and they want to fight Benavidez and always have and want to do it next fall. And I haven't seen Canelo's exact quote, but I think overnight he did speak online about Benavidez and was, you know, I don't think here's the thing. Canelo's never acted like he isn't going to fight Benavidez, in my opinion. The real question has always been the timing of it.

And is he waiting? And I think this is different than when Canelo straight up waited out Triple G a year and a half to two full years, I think, to let him get a little bit older. But here's the thing on Canelo. He's been so fan friendly, like like membership has its privileges. If you are in the rare spot that like Pacquiao, Floyd and then Canelo is where you are number one pound for pound. Introducing the new McSpicy from McDonald's. It looks like a regular chicken sandwich, but it's actually a spicy chicken sandwich.

McSpicy. Consider yourself warned. Limited time only. I participate in McDonald's in Canada. And number one is the biggest star at the same time, right? People can abuse that power. They can use it to their advantage. Outside of waiting Triple G out, Canelo's been great. Yes, there was the drug test failure for Tainted Beef that you can always debate. And yes, he knocked out Archie Solis' teeth on the sidewalk in Guadalajara over a girl. No one wants to talk about that many years later. Oh yeah, and also Canelo kind of got out of his original promotional deal under sketchy concerns and went to Golden Boy and there was a lawsuit. Separate from that, Canelo always gives you at the end more more than you deserve he's still trying to fight B-Ball two and three times when we're like dude just handle your business here so I don't think he's waiting Benavidez out because it wouldn't be a good idea because Benavidez is getting better but I do think Canelo understands

business and does understand that Benavidez is coming on at a level that okay if you let this kid keep winning in separate fights this fight is only going to be even bigger and maybe maybe the wily sly veteran and Canelo is going well if he loses along the way that's on him right because I'm here but yeah if this fight doesn't happen at all it's a major fail because the reputation Canelo has put out with the privileges he has that he's for the sport, that he's trying everything he can to show you that he's aiming to be one of the greatest of all time, that he's aiming, whether he'll say it or not, to surpass Chavez Sr. as the Mexican icon. Well, if he avoided this fight in ways that just scream that he's ducking and luke any more any more waiting out

i'm sorry you're gonna get full-time ducking comments because and like i'm almost want canelo to come out and be like yeah the plan is next fall so look so everybody let's just get there okay so let me let me ask this because this is the thing i just we need to know who the players are so what david benavidez said was here's what he wants for 2024, which by the way, if he gets this, I might shit my pants. Yes. It was Canelo, Betterbeef, and Bivol. I was like, holy fucking shit.

I want to see all three of those, probably something in that order. But let me ask this. You mentioned, I think if Canelo doesn't end up fighting Benavidez, the ducking comments will be in full effect. I agree. And frankly, they probably should be. However, we're not there yet so let's see who else could it even possibly be right for either of these guys to fight so here's my opinion on this if Benavidez had come out and looked a little bit more human let's say Andrade had stung up the fight and Benavidez got the

decision but it was one of those where no one looks good, nobody wins. That's totally different from where we are now, where Benavidez went in there and fought a guy that nobody wants to fight and forced him to quit on his stool halfway through the fight. That is the spectacular breakthrough next level victory where it changes the equation. So outside of Canelo getting a fight he's not going to get next which is a Terrence Crawford unique multi-division crossover fight why because Spence and Crawford are contractually obligated to rematch outside of something like that which is sort of a one-off super fight type of pass because of the way Benavidez took care of Andrade I'm here to tell you that if Canelo does not fight him in May Cinco de Mayo even if hiselo does not fight him in May, Cinco de Mayo, even if his

intentions are to fight him in September for Mexican Independence Day weekend, you're going to hear nothing but you're ducking him and it's going to be hard to defend. Why? Because Canelo is the undisputed champion in this division. Benavidez has had a world title twice, lost it on his own accord, but he's the interim champion. He's been the mandatory. And now in the same calendar year he beat up badly

caleb plant and just did this to andrade when nobody looks good against andrade you have to do this in may so who else could it be i guess it could be munguia if you're just trying to buy time and make the benavides fight bigger but all we're going to be talking about during that build is benavides so the time is now may cinco de mayo canelo versus benavidez and while it won't have the same exact history that usic versus fury will in february for the first ever four belt one face one name heavyweight champion of this modern era canelo versus benavidez is bigger it's sexier it is more and you want to know why at the end of the day? It's not just because it's got boxing's best, most loyal, aggressive, amazing fan base and Mexican-Americans and the Mexican fan base behind it.

Sure, that helps. And it's not just the idea that these two fighting styles are so fun. It's the fact that Benavidez can win. And I actually want to see the early odds to see how much the odds makers think because these performances have shown me that as great as Canelo still is and he just showed us against Jermel Charlo he just did how great he still is fully healthy at age 32 this guy's bigger younger just as hungry has a skill set that is now leveling up to canelo levels okay canelo he's meaner and bigger than that luke the heroes the pros the mike tyson's the marco antonio

barreras we talked about this the one man wall marquez's they have all already declared this is our guy this is the chosen one. He might go in there and walk down and walk through Canelo Alvarez. And if he does, Luke, he will become overnight the biggest star in the sport. Really? Really? And we have to be ready for that. And it makes that conversation I had on this show with Jim Lampley a week ago about, well, what if Benavidez keeps rising and one day tries to become a heavyweight champion?

It's so early on that conversation that it's almost laughable. But this man is showing us that he does have the skill, the heart, the mindset and a lot of other key intangibles to chase greatness as aggressively as he wants to you can't get any of that other stuff though unless you go through Canelo first this is the biggest fight you can make in this entire sport and I don't know who wins and that is enough right there I think to not only make this a crossover fight across the world of sports but I think this will cross over into cultures we don't even expect this will be a where where were you type of collision because it's not two old guys finally cashing that lottery ticket. It's a true crossroads of one of the greatest of all time who still has it against this young monster who looks like he's ready to take over this entire sport.

But Luke, the key of this is one year ago i would not have believed benavides was actually that great but he's showing us i'm in i'm ready tyson's in barrera's in marquez is in are you coming with me luke this is this is the movement right now el bandera rojas as it used to be called whatever that means luke it's the monster time, okay? Get ready. You got to play that one back for me. That was great. El bandeja roja, the red flag. The red flag is what that means, yeah.

Sacatú bandera. All right, BC, let me ask this. If for whatever reason that they don't make the Canelo fight, which would be a travesty, Benavidez is just going to move to 175 permanently, right? Like, I actually wonder, 26 years old, I know he's making 168, but he's huge for 68. I don't know how much time he's got left in this weight class at all, Canelo or otherwise. Am I right or wrong about that?

It does, it looked like he made the weight fine. It looked like he struggled a bit with the Caleb Plant weight, but looked great in the fight, so it didn't matter, right? Does that play a major factor? Yes, but also available opponents. So you're asking me to potentially posit a world in which this fight doesn't happen next year, and it could be a number of reasons. Let's say Canelo gets injured, or let's say he does outright duck, or let's say he says, yeah, let's do it next year, but the year after in Mexico, I mean, there could be a lot of scenarios here, right? Whatever. I do think there's enough star power to keep him around at 68, even with his open ambitions of wanting better be even be all because those fights are not as easy to make because the opponents are on other networks. Those fights aren't as big commercially.

What if he gets a chance to fight a completely reborn Jamal Charlo? If Jamal Charlo gets there, Jamal look pretty reborn on Saturday, but there's some caveats to that. I would rather see Jamal first against like a Caleb plan or something, but could the possibilities of a David Morrell fight a Jamal Charlo fight. Could though, could that keep him around and keep the interest of everybody enough? I don't know, Luke. I really don't. I really don't. It maybe depends if Jamal can quickly elevate himself even more,

but it would come down to what can happen. A better BF and B-ball fight just aren't as easy to make, although I love the ambition. I hope he can get there. It would be easier, though, to fight some of these other names in-house. Yeah, I mean, I got to tell you, I thought we have to move on to the PFL stuff, but I kind of thought I wouldn't hate a Jamal Charlo fight with Benavidez, but I'm not craving it in any kind of way.

You know what I mean? It's fine. It's fine, but it's not the fight that we need to see for either of those guys. No, I'm with you. I'm with you on that card. Also, before we move on to PFL, just last thing on this card. And we have there's so much we could say. Dude, Subrio Matias.

Oh, five guys. I've never seen anything like this. And again, I'm not a boxing historian. Maybe there is someone who says no Moschenko. Really? That's the comparison, right? Dude. Okay.

Yeah, exactly. Right, guys. Five fighters in a row he has faced. And this dude he faced over the weekend, this Uzbek hammer, Ergachev, is, you know, an absolute, was undefeated, a dynamite puncher. He came out jacked throwing bombs, Ergachev, and they were all landing, right? It was just bombs away. It's the fifth guy in a row who has quit on the stool fighting him.

The fifth one in a row. a dude these guys taste his power they're like nah fuck this i got other things i can be doing with my life than doing that dude he is unbelievable is he not he's ready to make the leap we never talk about him luke but if you really look at the ride he's been on over the last two years puerto rico needs a huge face needs a huge action star yeah there's some young names on the rise some of the recent potentials didn't come together i mean felix verdejo unfortunately is on his way to prison luke uh after that murder conviction so like we never got that next big star he's quietly kind of becoming that so here's the deal he's like 31 and oh with like 31 knockouts right is that is that where

we're at right now i'll double check i'll double check i'm sorry he has one loss to petros ananian which he avenged by knockout in the rematch so luke he's knocked out every single person he's faced but i think even more than that this division 140 pounds has just refilled on such an alarming rate because of all those big names at 135. Ryan Garcia, Devin Haney, who are now moving up. And you've got Pro Gray, Teofimo there. You've got Josh Taylor. You've got so many names. Jose Ramirez.

That you look at this guy, he's knocked out everyone that he's faced. And he fights in such a... How do you want to describe his style, Luke? Here's what matias does he doesn't square up like irresponsibly he squares up at an angle he stands in front of you he basically lets you for a round and a half throw every punch in your arsenal he'll take it clean on the chin within his guard and then the second he feels like you're starting to slow down he goes full on downhill with powerful combinations until you quit that's the script that's what happens when you fight uh subriel matias so the

fact that after the fight he's like hey gervonta teo all of you rolly i'm here i got a belt come come get me dude we are going to make firefights, Luke, with these guys. Puerto Rico needs a star like this. This kind of happened accidentally, and I'm here for it. Just listen to this. Malik Hawkins, who's one of the teammates of, in fact, Gervonta Davis, quit before the seventh round, essentially, at the end of the seventh with an eye injury.

Batir Zan-Jukambayev, after eight rounds, said, no, thank you. As you mentioned, Petros Ananian, he stopped him after the ninth round. Jeremias Ponce, after the fifth round. And then Joe Jahan. Dude, Ponce landed bombs on Matias early. Ponce came out just firing on him, too. Dude, this guy's chin is sick, right? He's absurd. He's absurd.

Folks, you're asking, asking like who's someone to pay attention to that might be doing some big fun shit down the line subriel matias this dude out of puerto rico keep an eye on him he is only as it stands today 31 years of age he's got some time to make some big fights i think he's gonna and he is electric these guys want no fucking parts of what he has to offer so keep an eye on him luke we gotta exit but we can't we gotta mention jamal charlo i gotta get your thoughts on this um dude i'm split on jamal charlo i'm split on the one hand i was expecting him to be a bit of a disaster missing weight the whole nine yards two and a half years listen he landed anything and everything he wanted

he put shots together in combination he was fluid with his movement he was at times when he needed to be patient but also active he didn't look bad but the fact that he couldn't knock a guy down or finish a guy who is by no means a natural 168 or 160 i mean i realized it was at 66 because that's where he missed weight so he's closer to 68 but it's supposed to be 63 but he's not a 63 year he's not a 60 yearer. He's not a 60-er. He was a 154 against Garcia. I thought he was a little bit too big and slow for that weight class. Obviously, he's fought as low as 140. The fact that Charlo couldn't put him away is a little bit of an eye-opener to me.

But short of that, I thought I didn't see much of concern. Yeah, I mean, I do want to add that Benavidez has only been stopped by Terrence Crawford in the last round of that fight. And he took insane punishment. I mean, he had a he came in with a warrior spirit. I mean, look, it's hard to say. Like, Jose Benavidez might have actually fought the best fight of his career in terms of having to step up to a higher level. But he paid such a huge tax.

He didn't move his head and he was just absorbing monstrous shots. So I know that kind of plays into maybe charlo not looking superhuman but when you consider the turmoil that was in his life the two and a half years and then the added weight issues that got everybody calling him a lot of bad names adding on to it he looks sharp timing wise luke like he looked like he's not that far away from really being back but i gotta ask you about the post fight interview we joked around and yeah he seemed on the verge of tears he seemed like he's still going through a lot of it were you i see a lot of split reaction

online people that are scared by his his answers to my questions and then mixed with people who are like look he's still going through it but when he God's got me, when he showed you and he bit down on his lip, you can see the lion in there coming through, Luke. I know this is a touchy subject because he's going through some very real stuff, but did you feel confident that the ring is where he should be moving forward? I think that structure can bring him some peace, if that's what you mean. Again, he didn't look like shit there's just no you cannot look at what he did and be like oh my god he looks so bad you can be

like did you get the result that was widely expected no what does that mean and we're trying to figure that out but he physically looked the part um and then when you ask him about it yeah he's still going through it dude he's still's clearly still wrestling with a lot. I think steady as she goes. I'm glad he got a fight that was a bit more doable for him. I would not recommend jumping into the deep. Like a David Benavidez next would be probably a real bad idea. I don't think he's ready for that kind of smoke yet. Do you think he should go to 160 where Carlos Adamas has been overdue?

I mean overdue on getting his shot at the title. Or do you think he should go to 68 and fight Caleb Plant in maybe even a pay-per-view fight? What am I saying? Yeah, you got to make the Plant fight next. You got to make the Plant fight next. Because of the story. But the thing is, this is my question, though.

Some people, I didn't know what I was going to get when I interviewed him. Because, you know, Charles knows the wild cards a lot of times. They can be combative out of nowhere. He can hang up on you when you call him. Yeah, he was very reserved. Now obviously it was it was a heavy reserve because he's fighting through the interview and i give him a lot of credit for doing it but it would it be the right thing to then turn and go into the type of like blood feud where we're constantly showing video of caleb plant slapping him you know what i mean like there's a lot of like that that fight that they had came directly after charlo watched his ex-wife and his twin brother's girl fight in front of like hundreds

of people in the parking lot like there's a lot of emotions going through that i don't know what i mean he's dude he's in the rebuilding process you know and then he took a big step i think on saturday an important one and perhaps the most important one but it's not done it's not done so i think he needs to be very careful about his matchmaking right now um this was a good one for him but there's work to be done for sure that's where i'm that's fair that's all right let's get to some mma because i was there on friday night but i haven't had a chance to talk to you about it so let's let's talk big picture with pfl their pfl had their lat their latest season finale on friday crowned a bunch of new champions crowned a bunch of millionaires bc before we talk about the actual Talk big picture with PFL. Their PFL had their latest season finale on Friday,

crowned a bunch of new champions, crowned a bunch of millionaires. BC, before we talk about the actual fights themselves, give me a grade for their show, and then based on what they showed you at this event, what your hopes are for 2024. Give me a sense. All right, I'll give you a B+, all things considered, on the show. And look, with all the hype with them and with Kayla Harrison coming back, some of this was like patchwork bandaid here to try to make this a pay-per-view card.

We can argue to the death of whether it should have been. It probably shouldn't have been. It's probably they didn't. They probably didn't expect to do a ton of traffic with that. But here's the deal. I really liked the broadcast. And even though they were limited by the suspensions, which watered down their tournaments,

the fights largely delivered. But I kind of liked, look, they have a reason right now to flaunt. We don't know if the new model will work. And I think I was more optimistic. You were more maybe realistic, pessimistic. There's a debate to be had whether this is the right attempt. But I think we all realize they're in. They're all in and they're going for it. you gotta flex you gotta peacock a little and say

this is what we're gonna do we got Bellator now so in that regard from the broadcast I love the the Bellator champions cam in the bottom corner now you know connecting with Wiz Khalifa what does that do for the broadcast maybe it does more in categories I'm not you know with in terms of of aiming at certain audiences on social media and stuff. But I didn't even hate Jake Paul coming on because Jake Paul's kind of becoming like a Dana White for them in some regard. And I think they're playing into that with that.

They did a play on Dana's, if you know, you know, whatever the heck that video is that he does, Luke. They were kind of, you know, playing off of that in a way. I think knowing what they're coming back with next year, knowing that we are going to see Bellator champions against PFL champions, which is interesting, and I like the face-offs they did, it really gave me an optimistic, excited tease toward the future. I don't know what the change in networks is going to mean for their broadcast team,

and I know they had said when Don Davis talked with Ariel that they wanted separate broadcast teams, maybe even separate network deals for the PFL tournament and pay-per-view format and then the Bellator champion series format. I also don't know if that works or maybe they try that for a year and then just go,

we're going to combine it all and put our best foot forward. Either way, Luke, I'm going to go B plus here. It wasn't a card full of world beaters, but we had interesting stories to find out. In Kasonga and I was, you know, literally homeless and living in his car and the transition between UFC and PFL. Like they, the one thing that they do really well, I think BKFC right now in combat sports is among the best at doing this is really just taking a storyline, even if it's simple and just like really telling it. I like some of that.

You know, yeah, there's a lot of numbers on your screen. They can't talk without mentioning the smart cage and the Celsius post fight interview. They're playing to their sponsors. They're playing to their gimmicks. We all get it. But I'm going to give them a chance to fail spectacularly. I'm going to stay optimistic here. I want competition in this space.

I want free agency to explode. I want fighters to have more rights. I want competition in this space. I want free agency to explode. I want fighters to have more rights. I want there to be more to talk about. I want this to be exciting. I like a lot of what PFL Inc. is trying to do for 2024. And if this pay-per-view was a commercial to that, I'm interested. I'm interested. I mean, Kayla's calling out Cyborg. Larissa Pacheco is calling out cyborg in her own way afterwards like i'm kind of starting to get this when i saw jason jackson and mogul med mogul med karamov face off i went from being like man too bad that's not you know uh um what's his name amasov to going oh shit i think i really want to see this fight now like look yeah i'm gonna i'm

gonna play the optimism here they kind of did it for me i expected to to want to hate on things and i enjoyed it i enjoyed let me tell you what i didn't like and you tell me if i'm being too harsh you share the same sentiment where you're at on it basically so number one like the jake paul thing with wiz khalifa they had ryan bader skype in for a time i didn't like it i didn't like it I get that there might they were trying to here's the problem you have a broadcast and then what they were trying to do

was have like a Manning cast not the goofiness of it but then mix the two together no I don't like that you've got Dan Hardy on there you've got Couture you've got all those guys up there

use them use them in the correct way we don't need to bring in these other folks if you want them on there do it with a separate broadcast which by the way they correct way. We don't need to bring in these other folks. If you want them on there, do it with a separate broadcast, which, by the way, they could do. They just don't, okay? So that's one.

Two, the lack of elbows. Don Davis was asked about this at the post-fight press. He was like, why don't you guys allow elbows? And he was like, well, we could for the finale, but we haven't for the season, and it just seems like we want to have continuity, you know, because that's the way we've done it. I'm like, guy, you only don't have elbows in the season

because of what it might affect getting to the finale. Once you get to the finale, who gives a fuck? And you had Derek Brunson in mount. You had Denis Goldsov in mount. Now, I think Brunson would have won regardless, but, dude, Denis Goldsov is probably fucking bitter today because he had Henne Fajita in mount and couldn't do shit with it i mean not shit but he couldn't do what a fuller array of tools would have allowed him to do because the rules limited him and this

idea you're going to have continuity you know grubaka hitman on twitter bc was like listen you're selling a violence product you've got one making gloves and Muay Thai smaller to facilitate action, and you've got PFL going the opposite direction to make action a little bit more difficult. If you're selling a violence product, my guy, sell a violence product. Bring the elbows back for the finale, no? Yeah, yeah. So I think it's a fail that this rule was put in to begin with, although I get the spirit of it. You don't want – I mean, these tournaments will be worthless if people

are dropping out at a level where the original matchups never made any sense. You know, like, I mean, it almost felt like that for the Strikeforce heavyweight tournament that Cormier won. You know, there were moments where you're like, oh, now Overeem's out too and Fedor lost, and what the hell is this going to look like? And you

have enough of that in the unpredictability of a tournament. So, yeah, they should have done it for the finale. Now protecting it just because, well, they didn't prepare for it. That's a short-term fail right there. I think you got to have that in there. I think it should stay uniform across the board. I mean, look, would you be okay with sticking to the regular season no elbows format?

I don't know. I just feel you're right. It takes away. If you're suddenly at the bottom of a mount, which is normally a death sentence, right, especially against certain opponents, that does matter. That does matter. Dude, for folks who don't remember, Strikeforce also didn't allow elbows in those scenarios. And then when the UFC bought it, I could be getting this wrong,

but I believe it was Gilbert Melendez versus Shinya Aoki, and he was allowed to use elbows in that one, and he set that fucking guy on fire when he was allowed to have elbows. It changed the game dramatically. And I'm going to bring up another point, dude. Kayla Harrison has been a great success, I think, in many ways for PFL,

but I am not in any way convinced that she has maximized her potential part of the reason is dude she's limited on the fucking ground she doesn't have access to all the weapons that she would when she achieves these like crazy dominant positions you want to see kayla be a megastar have her start polishing off some of these ladies with with more brutal ground and pound you know she's not fighting scrubs dude she's fighting other very uh experienced talented fighters they know what they're in for many of them have fought in rule sets all their lives where elbows were allowed this isn't the first time it's so i wonder i wonder because they

received such backlash for the decision of that natan schult fight where the guys didn't go after each other and then both were pulled out of the playoffs and it looked like that they manipulated it to potentially put a more marketable all action guy in there. Maybe they're trying to cling toward the, well, we said it wouldn't be a part of it, so we're going to stick to it. But they do have to iron out any of these short-term fails that can affect long-term consumership or interest. Yeah, you got to figure that out now and quickly. And Luke, I want to quickly just go back to the whole debate about their format. I'm going to be optimistic, like I said, and give them

a chance to prove that they can do this and have something for everybody in terms of free agents coming in. Do you want to go the twice a year and fun fight route or do you want to go the tournament or do you want to just chase titles in Bellator or whatever? I get what you you're saying your fear of having too many brands too much confusion but do you think it's also time to completely drop the regular season and playoff format that they're just that there just isn't enough of uh well that's unique that pulls in the casuals they understand team sports like should we just get past that i mean what how good right now would pfl look if they said, we effed up, we're going to launch next year, not with two brands,

not with two styles, not with tournament formats, with titles and an open season where we want to be a competitor to the UFC, we're doing it the traditional way. How good is their roster right now if they did that in your eyes? Yeah, I mean, I think that we've kind of discussed this a little bit. My view is that if they wanted to do tournaments, they certainly could, but it would be more of the Bellator model where, like, we're going to have a Grand Prix, we're going to pick one weight class at a time.

It's going to be that way. I think that's a great way to do it, and it could really differentiate their product because now look how much other resources they've brought in, all the other fighters that they've brought in. So they really, really can do that. But, like, I've been saying it all this time. Guys time guys what has to this point what show of hands out there and of course we can't see them but raise your hand if you've ever been to a pfl event i've been to one and it was only because it was a 15 minute uber from my house right i mean people have not been

to this what has this format done for them it has differentiated them and it has on occasion produced some, to your point, the Impika Sanghanai story, PFL does really, really well at telling these human interest stories, these hard luck stories of people who come up. They can still do that. They can absolutely still do that. But making that the centerpiece of what you do does fuck all for your future. It will not allow you to compete with the UFC, and I'm not even sure it's going to allow you to make money. To this point, they haven't turned a profit. So this is my whole point.

It's a valuable way to differentiate the product, but leaning so far into it that you now are hampering yourselves, I just don't get that. Yeah, I can definitely welcome more of that pessimism when you look at the big picture of it. And, I mean, look, if they can get two revenue streams in terms of broadcast deals, one for the Bellator series, welcome more of that pessimism when you look at the big picture of it and i mean i get it look if they can get two revenue streams in terms of broadcast deals one for the bellator series one for the pfl and the in the pfl one is huge and obviously now you have the pay-per-view element

like if that justifies it on a financial decision okay but yeah well we got to see it we got to see what it looks like because i don't know like he's right on the standpoint of can you get a lot of star fighters to agree to this season style where you're going to get ground up? No. No, you can't, Luke. What real A-side is going to want to do that? Right. You know what I mean? So you're right.

The Bellator short season model with the big prize of a million dollars at the end is the way to go. It really is. With the title through the tournament, you know, in that kind of a way, one weight class at a time. The one thing that they're doing wrong with the double brand thing is that you're watering down the impact of your own championship because you may have multiple fighters on your roster who want to do the Bellator or pay-per-view side of it

that are better than your champions, right? So unless there is an idea at the end of the year that your champions would have one-off fights against the people on the on the other side of your roster is that enough luke to i don't i don't know now you're getting pro wrestling complicated here we are okay some other things that i did not like but i do want to get to things that i liked as well last thing i did not like and and I do, I was fucking hilarious. There was some bozo on Twitter who retweeted me when I had made this point. And he was, he quote tweeted me.

He was like, you know, this guy has a lot of terrible takes. This might be the worst one. Here was the terrible take that he said I had, which was that, um, the dude, the main card, just the main card. Okay. Was about five hours, five fucking hours for a main card okay was about five hours five fucking hours for a main card you have to be completely divorced from the way in which sports programming is going on television to think that is a good idea yeah it's a disaster of an idea and everyone around me was groaning and fucking hated it and it was terrible i'm like by the way that's not my worst take i've definitely had worse

takes than that one but i told that guy i was like if that's my worst take. I've definitely had worse takes than that one. But I told that guy, I was like, if that's my worst take, dude, I'm fucking king of the mountain right now. Because that is an unimpeachable truth. They have got, I get that if you split it. And by the way, I understand that MMA, there's been like New Year's Eve events in Japan. I remember watching all these pride events where there'd be intermissions and it would go nine hours and it'd be this all night marathon. I get that. I understand there's a quirky side to the sport that does lean into that, but that's really not what we are doing here.

American football can get away with it because it's the most popular sport that we have in this country. And even then, dude, they don't go five fucking hours. They go three and a half. American baseball is now sub three. Soccer matches, 45 minute halves with a 20 minute half in between

with extra stoppage time on occasion. Like everyone is moving to a more sleek and streamlined version of their product, and BFL just puts this... Do you ever buy a Samsung phone, and you've got all this Bixby bloatware on there? That's what it feels like when you watch BFL. It's like, there's a lot of good stuff here.

I like this, I like this, I like this. Why is there all this extra shit that we don't need on this card? And by the way, getting back to the previous point, BC, if they had a more streamlined and minimized tournament schedule, you don't have this problem to fucking begin with. You don't have any of these problems. You know what? I might come around on that. I'm really starting to, that might be the biggest fail. Really? The idea that when you have two quarterbacks, you have none. When you have too many belts, you don't have real champions. And if you don't have real champions, then are you only in the one-off

let's attract eyeballs big pay-per-view business right and if you are and you do have ingano and jake paul and those type of people then that's fine and i know they're trying to be everything to everyone luke yes with this aggressive model i'm going again i'm going to give them a chance to execute it but yeah maybe they go one year and yeah, the real deal is to put all of our power together and come after people. With that said, Luke. Hold on. I do have some good things. I do have some good things.

Yeah. How about what you think about input? His song and a saying Francis. I already feel like he's over his head fighting at light heavyweight, even though he's now a millionaire and a champion. Jason Jackson, who's his teammate at kill cliff who's the belt or 170 guy now granted he's a big he's a big welterweight so okay but he walks into the cage and he's like towering over in because i'm gonna die so how and i get what they were talking about in the broadcast that his his leg muscles are so profound his foundation and base makes him you know uh

makes his makes his ability to fight at these higher weights but he said he wants to fight francis and gano luke he said it this is the guy that joaquin buckley did the highlight reel run up the the stairs and spin around and crash through the ladder on him um i was like but then when i hear his story dude he was living in his car like last year bro living in his car this is what i mean so here's that's such dedication yeah here's here's the good part about what pfo can do in the right hands and you've seen it multiple times friday was a reminder but it ain't the first time their ability to take a real human interest story in mma and make these guys people you want to cheer for, they excel at that. They're really, really good.

The tournament facilitates that, but the shoulder programming that they put around it is also quite excellent. I really feel like they're very good at that. Okay, that's one thing. The second thing I think that I did like from this broadcast, BC, I did like the Bellator integration a lot. A lot. They may have gone to it a bit too

much at times and kept too many guys in the cage and blah blah blah but in general when jesus pinedo won and they brought in pitbull i was like dude that fight's gonna rule and then when dude when magomed karamov won and they brought in jason jackson dude that's the best welterweight fight you can make outside of the ufc. Period. That's the best one. That might be better than most welterweight fights you can make inside the UFC. That fight rules. And there was a bunch of them all down the line. Them setting up the PFL versus Bellator champs contest down the road,

two thumbs up from me. I fucking loved it. What about you? A hundred percent. And the depth that they have right now in these heavier women's divisions is incredible. I want to see Cyborg, Kayla, and Pacheco, you know, fight each other in a round robin. I do. I want to find out who's superior among them.

They have the world's best depth right now at 145. I don't know if we're considering Kayla a 145 fighter or not, or if that's only for one-offs but yeah there's there's there is stuff to like i mean look magomed karimov i know this is his second time winning the pfl uh season championship there dude he looked like he is ready to take over the world and he looks mean too he's he's fucking awesome he's a very good fighter and remember this, this was a rematch. We had talked about it. If you watch the first fight, you'll see shades of who Megamed Karimov is in that one. I believe he won the first one. I can't keep it all straight anymore. But he had to wrestle him predominantly to get it done.

Dude, this time he was bullying him with his strikes, hit him with a body shot, followed him up along the fence line. Like, Sadamusi had his hands way more full than i thought he was going to and then he finished him off by jumping that guillotine which was brutally set in to begin with dude he's fucking great what a great opportunity that's gonna i know people have have uh memed this on on x but it's right when you have a double magomed in your name you better bring it luke yeah freaking brings it um kasong and i what a great win over josh silveira there for what the light heavyweight title and so let's get into that so topic number four let's just get into some of the individual performances bc you kind of indicated

i'll spit it right back to you there were some great standouts the card was a little bit too long everything we've kind of discussed but for topic number four bc let me just ask the question this way for you for the fights themselves who stood out to you with a great winning performance at PFL well I have to say Mpukasanga once we went deeper into his story as we said and then really his performance there against Josh Silvera a capable guy for sure who I think has a very bright future for the light heavyweight championship he gets a 50-45 and all three scorecards i was hugely impressed at what this says about what he's truly made of and and you know for him to have the

perspective to say the ufc firing me was the greatest thing that ever happened to me and the way that they ran that promo and you just like damn damn and his parents and everything great but there's more how about henning for her at fajita at heavyweight there against dennis goitsov with that second round knockout luke i'm not saying this is the right answer or that fajita is well known enough that i'm like let's make the engano fight right now this should be the first opponent but i wouldn't hate it if henan fajita as pfl heavyweight champion somehow ended up being francis and gato's first opponent because he's 6'7 from Brazil. He's had already some highlight finishes. He's a crazy athlete who can backflip after every win. And this was a fun finish that he had right here. And he brings interesting

physical possibilities to a potential Ngannou matchup. Now that you have Francis Fajita and Ryan Bader and Vadim Nemkov, by the way, who has said in this past year that he wants to move up to heavyweight full time, at least there's something there, Luke, okay? Is Overeem on line one? What are we doing here? He's losing elections in Holland, apparently. I thought that Fajita, his punching power is unforgiving,

but between him and Kasangani, here's the thing, dude, Kasangani's improvement is outrageous, it's like so much better, but he's still got a little bit of polishing left to do, I think that's why he and Silvera couldn't quite get one up over on the other. Fajita is also unpolished, but so dangerous as a puncher that it, I'm not gonna

say it doesn't matter, but it often is forgiving for him as a consequence. I want to highlight some other folks. We already mentioned Magomed Karimov. Dude, how about Jesus Pinedo? His fight was on the prelims, and it did get stopped a little bit early, but he was on the way to winning. His story about a guy who basically got thrown to the wolves

or tried to bite on or take on too much before he was ready, and here he is, by the way, losing previously to Braga, now beating him, but other guys along the way in this who were supposed to be the ones who were going to win. He blows past them. One of the most successful Peruvian fighters of all time. Maybe the most successful, I think, in terms of MMA fighters of a Peruvian background.

I guess Kenny Florian would be more, but did he ever make a million dollars fighting in UFC? I seriously doubt that he did. You know what I mean? So we're talking about a guy who for a country, how important is Chito Vera to Ecuador? Very. How important is X for whatever Y country?

How important is Jesus Pinedo for Peruvian MMA? I suspect he will be a big leading figure for them. This is a huge, huge win. He looks great doing it, even if stoppage wasn't his fault anyway. And he was on the way to polishing the guy off. He just got a little early. He looked great doing it, even if stoppage wasn't his fault anyway. And he was on the way to polishing the guy off. He just, you know, got a little early. Yeah.

He looked great. And then last but not least, dude, main event. Some folks didn't like this fight. I actually thought that both guys had a lot to offer. And there was a, dude, hold on. Go back real quick. Go back real quick to the face-off with Pinedo and Pitbull, if you can. Dude, look at that.

Yeah. Look at that. Dude, that fight is going to bang when they make that fight. I love that. Let's go. Let's go. Yes, exactly. That fight looks sick.

Okay. And then lastly, Olivier Aubin-Marseille. Now, again, this fight was a little bit of his sort of signature kind of ride you and be boring a little bit at times. But if you just look at the individual skill level they showed, it was great. He looks like he's retired now. Clay Collar was beating up his leg and rib-roasting him. It wasn't enough. OAM kind of won two tournaments back-to-back.

So $2 million he's made. He wants to call it a day. Remember, his last loss, BC, 2019 to Armin Saryukian. He went undefeated in the PFL. He is proof of concept of the kind of thing that they have built to this point and it did wonders for his career i salute him for a job well done look at how poorly leveled and balanced the pay structure is across mma that these fighters who you know had a had a decent run at ufc but it didn't work out come here and this quickly now it's not easy to do what they

did they're in the meat grinder and you know he he went like nine and oh, or 10 and oh, since joining this brand, but you can make so much money in a short period that I, they were talking about Ray Cooper that who had a great fight on this card as well, had that same thing lately, where it's just like, you're, you've never had access to this. You feel like you won. You actually could step away and start the pivot into the rest of your life where you don't need it anymore luke and that's that's a different mindset than the one that is let me keep up my game to a certain level so i can keep doing this late into my late 30s and just you know keep that paycheck coming um it's refreshing to see people play the system to their favor play

free agency to their favor get reborn all that we that. We got to talk Kayla, Luke. I understand that Aspen Ladd, especially size-wise, was going to be outgunned. Certainly skill-wise. Although there were moments that she put up a fighting effort. Kayla, I'm so impressed, dude. I was impressed just with the pre-fight package about how she rebuilt herself mentally after the devastating loss to pacheco then they can't make the cyborg fight she wasn't in the tournament she didn't even know if she's gonna be fighting this year and now suddenly that the company is like doubled itself and is going to

be big and she's just grateful to be here she also came back with a vengeance luke i know it wasn't like the clean sheet and stoppage she probably would have wanted, but she came back jacked as shit and had a, you know, resolved mindset to go with that. That I, damn, dude, like this is what champions do. We're going to talk about Katie Taylor. That's what she real champions do. Also, what Kayla did is what real champions do. And it was great to see her back. Lad gave her a little bit of trouble at various parts.

It's just that she was able to overcome it. And again, I think if you give someone like that elbows, dude, she's going to start cutting right through these people, literally and figuratively. It's just it limits what she can do. So I agree. There's a lot of standout performances from this card. You could pick your favorites.

And Blom Brunson, dude. Blom Brunson took some bombs from Ray Cooper. Yeah, got a little hairy there early, huh? But he worked it out. He worked it out. Yeah, they had a fun-ass fight. He called out Jake Paul afterwards. I mean, what are we doing here, Luke?

Come on. Well, I mean, listen. My man's trying to get paid with the time he has left. I get it. I totally understand. And by the way, I thought, and I'll say this about the PFL staff. You see, they were very friendly. They were very accommodating.

They were helpful. Did you ask to speak to Smart Cage, yes or no uh i joked about it they didn't seem to feel like that was a great idea so i didn't get an opportunity to go interview in fact they sat me in a van down by the river i had they sat me as far away as they possibly could have um you know there wasn't a whole lot of media there. There was only two media rows and I was in the second of the two rows. The media who I think had paid to, or rather who had been

paid to be there got better seating, which you know, you can understand, I suppose, on some level, but neither here nor there. It doesn't really matter. Did Mike Bone get handsy at all, Luke? That's what we really want to know. No, he got better seating. He got better seating than I did. But you know, he also was doing more interviewing than than I was I was coming to just sort of check out the scene so it was it was fine that end all right last but not least topic number five BC

let's get to this one Katie Taylor gets revenge defeats Chantel Cameron via decision on Saturday in front of a very very lively Irish crowd BC simple question for you. I will say commentary was just insanely biased for her, number one. Oh, yeah. It was nauseating to listen to. By the way, what is this thing in combat sports now where if you don't like Katie Taylor, you're Osama bin Laden? Oh, yeah. Sorry. No, it became overnight that if you don't think she's the greatest female fighter of all time and you don't think this was the fight of the year, then you're a terrorist or something like that.

Yeah, you're an absolute terrorist, you know, box cutter, LT in BC apparently. I think she's great. I think it was a great fight. And by the way, she fought a much, much better fight this time. Yes. The things that I hated about BC commentary was just so, my God. Okay, how'd you score it? First and foremost, how did you score the 10?

See, they're still going 10 rounds, two-minute rounds, so it changes a lot. But how'd you score it first and foremost how did you score the 10 see they're still going 10 rounds two minute rounds so it changes a lot but how'd you score it i think well okay no knockdown right there should have been a knockdown in round one and by the way if there is a knockdown around one you probably get a very different result well no sorry it though i checked out the judge's scorecards it's still a split decision win for Taylor even if that because the only judge that gave that round to Katie was the judge who scored it so wide like you know 8 rounds to 2

for Katie that judge sucked by the way I mean dude first of all she lost that round even without the knockdown but okay whatever it doesn't matter I had a 96-94 I think something like that yeah what about you for taylor yes i think i had it that way maybe maybe i i forgot i took my notes but i don't have them

here in front of me so what did you have frustrating that we're still in this at this level and this fight was so huge the crowd was amazing and this is a storybook moment this is an incredible moment but it sucks that it's this old format because it does make it really hard to figure out in some of these two-minute rounds when they're both just firing. And this did have fight of the year caliber elements to it. No question about it.

Maybe it helps that there's no slam dunk fight of the year, especially on the men's side this year that you're reaching to. There's a few that were pretty damn good, but no one that you're like, oh yeah, it's definitely that one. But it's hard because in one way, I think 6'4 Cameron is the scorecard I like best. But there were two rounds in there I could just as easily flip and go 6'4 Taylor.

In the end, Luke, I don't have a problem with Taylor winning. This is what made this such an incredible moment. She's 37 years old and she's been through wars and been through close fights like crazy and just had her first defeat, you know, up a weight class. And she got kind of handled the first time, even though she rallied in a lot of those rounds and kept the scores close for her to do this i mean this is the exact answer to what champions are made of what she did right there but the two minute round format you know it's kind of which way did you lean she was fighting with a you know as close as you can get to home with like a home field advantage that one judge had it eight rounds to

two for her which i just think is disrespectful but i'm okay with her winning it because the story of the fight was her and her comeback and there's ed sheeran there and how you know she dug even deeper than she normally does and got in even better shape and was able to sustain more long sequences of punches and was able to pick up her output and wasn't handled by Cameron's jab and the way she was in the first fight wasn't out physical either. Like there were a lot of parts of this that were incredible from Katie Taylor, but I'm not a hundred percent sure she won and she all, and Cameron also got robbed of that knockdown in the round one, which was clear in my opinion, even though their legs did,

did collide there. It seemed to be a clear stiff jab that backed her up and put her down. And I just didn't like on top of it, Luke, this, that automatically she's the greatest of all time now. She's of that ilk. Yes. She is in this discussion. Yes. She's right now the reigning undisputed four belt champion at 135 and 140 and has an opportunity either through a trilogy against Cameron or a much-needed rematch against seven division champion Amanda Serrano to make you know the biggest fight next for her like the of her career I mean she's already been in the most important fights of this modern women's boxing era but we can't forget what Clarissa Shields has done and is doing right now and I think sometimes it's the romance of the Taylor story and how special she is and the way she's built and the connection she has with Ireland and, of course, winning the gold medal. And she's in some really close fights.

But here's the difference if I'm going to compare head-on to her in the quote, as bad of a nickname as that is because it's just awkward to say. Shields won two gold medals in the Olympics. She unified super middleweight titles in, like, her fourth pro fight, then unified middleweight titles two fights later then took on unbeaten Christina Hammer in a really big fight for four belts at middleweight and dominated that then went down to 54 and became the undisputed champion then moved back up and had that big fight with Savannah Marshall who was probably the most dangerous fighter at that moment. Either of them is faced just from the knockout threat alone and won that fight in a great

fight. And at the same time is juggling an MMA career for what that's worth and trying to be great in that category. I think Shields is just not as likable to some people. I think she's also won her fights more dominantly that sometimes it becomes like a Floyd and Manny thing where we can maybe underrate what Floyd has accomplished because it looks easier and it doesn't look like he's taxed as much. Whereas Pacquiao, when we see the whirling dervish, you know, fighting through against Cotto and everyone else. And we're like,

man, this is unbelievable. It is unbelievable. But sometimes that can blur your judgment there. I don't think there's a debate in the Manny versus Floyd debate, even though it's close. Yeah, it helped that they fought each other. But I think Clarissa Shields still has that Luke. That doesn't take away with what Katie accomplished on Saturday. Let's just not go like too far because Luke, I followed Katie's career and I love everything about who she is,

but I thought she lost the first Delphine Pursune fight. I also thought she lost the Amanda Serrano fight, and I thought she lost the first Cameron fight. Well, she did lose the first Cameron fight, right? You know, and I'm fine with her winning this one because she made the changes that only, only the all-time greats do at age 37. She did look much better this time.

The Katie Taylor story is almost impeccable. It's amazing. Only the all-time greats do at age 37. She did look much better this time. The Katie Taylor story is almost impeccable. It's amazing. But look, we do have to frame it properly, especially Crusher Shields is 28 years old and constantly trying to make the biggest fight possible against anybody at any weight class that she can physically get to. You know what I'm saying? Like Serrano too, don don't forget has won titles in seven

divisions and hopefully she'll get a second chance at taylor in a fight that needs to happen um those three are right up there leila ali as well you know a few and wolf but but i don't think it's clear-cut right now just because of the romance of the situation last question on this do you think that they're going to make the serrano rematch in 2024 and they both have expressed interest in doing three minute rounds uh for 12 rounds which serrano did in her last contest do you think it will happen under those conditions i think it needs to i think it needs to happen first even before a camera and trilogy i get that there's high level of romance tied into the idea of taylor fighting at croak park it was at dublin luke the the uh the famous stadium that connor wanted to

fight in and and i'm and i i won't you know sure let's do that but let's do that for your final fight of your career potentially against cameron in that trilogy um i think the amanda serrano fight especially before serrano just one day looks old and she wasn't an absolute war two fights ago against eric i think it was erica cruz was it it was you, she was bloodied up and everything. Let's make that now. I think that's more pressing and more important to the pound for pound number one debate at this moment, along with Shields, obviously,

but these two can't fight Shields because the difference in weight is too much. So I'd love to see that next. And then how about you go out against Cameron? Because I don't know how much more, Luke, there is to accomplish. She has, Katie, tried to fight everyone she could, it seems. I don't think there's anyone left that you're like oh well not until she fights that person right right it's only fight that person again you know what i mean yeah yeah all right

there it is there's our top five bc uh let's remind everyone though bc that we know that listen when we're flying around we're trying to do our best when we're on the road we're trying to do our best but day to day week to week we are trying to make we're trying to do our best. When we're on the road, we're trying to do our best. But day to day, week to week, we are trying to make a turn, trying to make a focus on our health. And we're trying to get some of those weights, as you call them, in the off season or during the regular season, BC. And, of course, FitBod can help with that, right? You need something to keep you on the straight and narrow,

plan your workouts, help you plan plan for goals help you to stay on path fitbots got you covered bro i mean here's the deal luke our motivations can come and go especially at our age in our 40s but like knowledge is really power and i think sometimes it's really the lack of knowledge that separates us from playing out our fitness goals and dreams and what i love about the fitbot app is it's literally like having a coach in the palm of your hand. It adapts to my changes, to my updates in weight, the amount that I'm entering in and the reps and the weight that I'm doing. It also is able to adjust to the workout space that I have, whether I have a gym membership or I don't, whether I just have free weights lying around. FitBot can almost kind of be that coach in the moment that puts together the workout, can adapt

the workout to my own changes and when you're constantly changing for the better and reacting to how your body is, that's when the real gains come. Look, I'm not always smart enough to figure all that stuff out, but I know in my pocket I have somebody who is and that's Fitbod, baby. Yeah, and also I mentioned this, when

you are traveling, you can take this with you, right? Not just on your phone, I mean, but I mean like you can take it with you to plan at whatever gym you're going to be and you can change whatever equipment you have it can change not where not merely what you're doing that day of course it'll plan it out for you but if your circumstances change it will follow you there as well and BC the thing I always tell folks about it I tell it all the time the worst thing you can do is not train, but short of that is just showing up to the gym and be like, what am I going to do today? Oh, I'm just going to diddle with this and diddle with that. You're not going to get shit done doing that. It's really not a very effective

way. You need a plan. You need a plan. You need a plan of action. You need it written out. You need to know how long it's going to be and what you're going to do. And that can be daunting for people, except in cases like Fitbod, who can do all of that stuff for you from the equipment to the day to the body part to the goal. It's got the whole plan written out. All you got to do is just show up and give your best. I mean, this tracks your muscle fatigue. This helps you have a well balanced recovery plan to how hard you work, varying your intensity and volume, and just knowing you in some cases better than you know yourself. You hit a certain plateau,

you don't know what to do next. FitBot is constantly rearranging your workouts, adding newness to the space and helping keeping you motivated by keeping track of your achievements and personal best along with you. So Luke, I want our audience to download FitBot today to get a headstart on all those fitness resolutions that are right around the corner.

Get 25% off your subscription right now. Get the three free personalized workouts when you go to FitBod.me slash combat. Luke, tell it to them. Yeah, 25% off and free personalized workouts at FitBod.me slash combat. Combat with AK. All right, BC. workouts at fitbod.me slash combat combat with ak all right bc now it's time for the donks to ask us questions it's time for dms from the diggity donks let's do it all right bc from matt consid conside dine considine hi family After this weekend, the fight I really want to see is Charlo versus Plant, especially the Plant after Plant slapped the daylight out of him. How do you think that goes, BCNLT?

I think Plant would outbox the F out of him for the early rounds. It could easily pull out a decision win. I think Plant's experience against Killers is second to none. What do you think? I like that fight a lot. I really do. I even like it next. I do. I did have those same questions. Did you want to throw Charlo right away into this, the second to none what do you think i like that fight a lot i really do i even like it next i i do

uh i did have those same questions did you want to throw charlo right away into this which would be a hell of a build because of the history between them but i don't really know what's going to happen here because yeah caleb plant could frustrate outbox and low and the key here is lower the output of charlo by landing clean, crisp counter shots. And even though we don't look at Plant as a power puncher, let's not forget the way he took Durrell out with that beautiful two-pilo, two-punch combination there. He can sting you. He can be dangerous.

He can also be daring. It is that same daring nature of Caleb Plant that if Jermall Charlo raises his game to another level after this comeback win, which he even admitted afterwards, like he said, I think the quote was from the press conference. If I was rusty, but y'all didn't realize or recognize that if his timing is there and his his power and speed, Luke are going to be able to catch plan at times. I think that's such an interesting fight because it's going to be can plant take that and win enough rounds to get to the finish line against him. Luke plant has that dog in him so if charlo shows any weakness whether it's gas tank whether it's anything plant could fill that and score a huge win but i just love the plan is willing to face all these guys in his time in his era hey win or lose dude he's bringing

he's bringing it that's my guy caleb he had a bodyguard with him by the way luke on saturday he was walking around the ringside area probably wise probably wise i i just feel like um charlo could give away rounds that plant could steal um in addition to just outboxing him so like if that one went the distance i'd favor plant but the harder puncher of the two is for sure charlo i think well after saturday i'm not sure but i thought so before that uh all right question number two from flannels and jits is the time now for kayla versus cyborg well don davis tells us that it's going to be pacheco versus cyborg which is not a bad fight under any circumstances but they're doing it because it's champion versus champion um i guess that makes sense bc but it's

not the fight that anybody really i'm not saying anybody but it's not the fight that anybody really i'm not saying anybody wants it's not the fight that's been demanded all this time how about that i i actually like this decision because it stretches out the rivalry a bit by giving us a fight that meritocrical merit yes exactly yes meritocrically lu, is the better fight. Why? Because Pacheco is not only the women's featherweight champion this season, she won the women's lightweight championship last year in her trilogy bout with that big upset of Kayla. So if you got to do champion versus champion, it would be an insult to not have this fight first while waiting to do a Kayla versus Cyborg fight. And now the good news is that no matter who wins,

Pacheco versus Cyborg, Kayla versus the winner of them is now an even bigger fight. So this is smart. This is good promoting. I'm in. I'm in. It could be. It could be.

Dude, Pacheco's really good, Luke. She's really good. She might win. If she can get Cyborg into a brawl, she might win. I don't disagree. I don't disagree. All right, from Ev Harkness. No one's talking about it, but that will be the last call for Al Morrow and Abner with both BCs.

That's not necessarily true. I mean, we don't know what's going to happen, but wherever PBC goes, they could just... I know it's a Showtime crew, but they could request that the crew stays together. We'll see. But the question is... well, you never know. It depends what network and how much of a say they have. I'm just saying it's not a guarantee that that's the last call. That's all I'm saying.

Any favorite calls or favorite Showtime boxing moments to share? BC, what about you? Oh, yes. I mean, look, 37 years. And you have to remember, while they have great rivalry and a respectful rivalry with hbo over those years um there were moments when showtime raised their level to to look eye to eye with hbo and compete at such a high level as much as i always talk about 2013 when al hayman and floyd mayweather two years before the launch of the pbc took their roster from hbo to showtime

and really created one of the most fruitful years for fandom. And, and you know, that I can remember, uh, let's talk about the nineties when Tyson came out of jail and Don King brought him to Showtime and suddenly, you know,

the biggest fights of our high school youth, them, you know, of, of the Tyson Holyfield series. And I mean, just that whole Tyson comeback was a journey. It was a reality show journey

Showtime right there also Big Chavez senior fights who can forget the Pernell Whitaker showdown for pound for pound ship but Luke in closer modern memory just the all action classics I mean Corrales Castillo won like it really might be the greatest fight of all time

wasn't that in the arena you were in on Saturday, Mandalay Bay. Yup. May 7th, 2005. And, uh,

it really might be the greatest fight of all time. And then you've got the, the Vasquez Marquez trilogy, although I forgot about those two. Yes. Yup. And, and,

and, you know, and you have the Floyd Mayweather pay-per-view run his last six fights there, which then you add on top of that, the Conor McGregor fight. I mean, Showtime pay-per-view was the standard in this sport and, and,

you know, and, and, and have had the last few years with the PBC, even with the PBC, having multiple networks have sort of kept that reputation that when the big fight goes down, it's Showtime.

So I love this crew. I also love hall of famer, Steve Albertbert who was such a big part of that on that crew back in the day with bobby chez in the fight dr ferdy pacheco you know i got to work with barry tompkins one of my heroes on showbox roald marquez one of my brothers in this game but that moro crew that we've seen you know predominantly first with paulie malinaggi and now with abner morris um with al bernstein there as the rock luke and jimmy lennon and Jim Gray.

I mean, that's to a lot of people, that's the crew that that was the soundtrack to their lives, you know, just like Lampley and Merchant War for my younger lives. I don't know if there's a signature Moro call on this Showtime run. I just think of the moments. I mean, look at I mean, Mayweather versus Canelo, Mayweather versus Pacquiao and Mayweather versus McGregor are three of the biggest fights in the history of combat sports. You know, statistically might, you know, might be three of the biggest five. Right. But like it. There was Showtime had a big part in that, you know, all access and all that, and really making that feel special

across all sports. I don't have much to add to that. Question number four from Joel Wachton. There have been rumors of both a Holloway versus Aljamain Sterling fight at featherweight and a Holloway versus Gaethje fight at lightweight for the BMF. Which would you prefer of either? I mean, listen, up a weight class for a belt, whatever you want to say about that belt,

Holloway versus Gaethje is just murder on skates. I mean, that's just going to be insane, right? I wouldn't hate Holloway versus Sterling at all, but it's a very different kind of fight. So I love both, but I also say this too, BC, Holloway versus Gaethje would be bad for both of their healths, but Gaethje's probably closer to the end than Holloway. I would really worry about what that might do to Holloway.

Yeah, I don't want that yet for Holloway. I mean, I don't want that at all because it's guaranteed violence, but really all of the lightweight crossover BMF slash potential pay-per-view co-main options for Holloway if we're talking about Chandler and Gaethje and all those guys like they're all violently dangerous which that's the part that sucks but dude him against Aljo is like stylistically like an insanely great pound for pound matchup it's still Aljo still in my pound for pound top 10 and I don't think that's crazy Luke I haven't made a top 10 in so long I can't say but I do respect I do think I mean at 45 you

know max is hard to beat but he's such a backpacker one never knows right it could be interesting so yeah but either of those are fine they're just really different last but not least BC it's a decent question MT Booble asks worst name ever who is on the Mount Rushmore, I think they mean of Bellator. Yeah, my script's a little bit different. But yes. Well, for sure, Patricio Pitbull, right? Patricio Pitbull is a guarantee in my eyes. Michael Chandler has to be a guarantee.

Two. Okay. Three, do you think Eddie Alvarez makes it? Donna, 5,000. Eddie Alvarez? Eddie Alvarez you could probably put on there as well. Okay, if you're going to put Eddie, then do you have to put A.J. McKee as the fourth? Or does that go to Chris Cyborg?

Or what do you think? What about the Ben Askrens? What about Douglas Lima? What about Pat Curran? Pat Curran did some fucking damage. Respect to Pat Curran did some fucking respect to pat curran yeah respect to pat curran a part of that old school guard i mean joe warren luke was fun to watch too back in the day warren did some fucking maniac shit the whole time too man yeah he did uh shout out there as well um yeah okay okay pitbull chandler dude ryan Bader was a double champ yeah I know but I don't think

he eclipses Pitbull Chandler Eddie Alvarez and McKee in Cyborg could just as easily be on there I'll tell you I'll tell you who it is I'll tell you who it is I'll tell you who it is it's it's uh it's Pitbull it's Eddie it's Chand, and it's motherfucking Kimbo Slice. Kimbo Slice, dog. Kimbo Slice. Kimbo Slice, the most popular fighter in Bellator history. I went to his events. He blew the fucking roof off the place

any time he came in there. Goddamn elder statesman of the whole thing. I'm not saying he's one of the best talents they've ever had, but if Bellator ever had success in any kind of real big way, it was off the back of Kimbo Slice. What about Fador? The missing link here is Fador. Did Fador do enough in Bellator?

Dude, they got geriatric Fador. Let's be honest. They got geriatric Fador in Bellator. We did. We did. But he also fought on CBS in a retirement fight. He also made a – did he not? No, he did.

Did he main event Bellator at MSG? What was the main event there? Was that Chael versus Bondonderlay 3 or something? I think it might have been. He fought Mitrione at the Bellator NYC. I don't know if it was the main event. Okay, that was the co-main. That was the co-main, yeah.

All right. As you can see, the Mount Rushmore is not nearly as difficult to figure out as the one for UFC. Oh, Bjorn. Sorry. Baby Bjorn, Luke, on there too. Dude, you know what I was looking up the other day? I forgot that they did this. Do you remember when Dana called Bjorn Rebney Bjork?

Do you remember this? Yes, I do. He kept calling him Bjork. I was looking up old stuff because I was trying to find something, and it was like, Dana calls Bjork Rebney. I was like, all right, I forgot about that. Okay, BC. Dude, MMA Twitter was the most toxic place ever in like 2010 11 12 remember oh i think it's worse now

you do you know it's much worse now yeah i don't know i mean it's always been bad it's just worse now all right bc let's see your yeah all right so i've tried to put a couple pieces of feces together in the airport yesterday it was a busy travel day i hope it's not an excuse but i did scour the globe for all the show you're not setting me up for success here let's light it on fire old man thomas hate shit this is called have you seen it all right all right fl championships in the nation's capital pick of the the night from Jedi Goodman on this screen grab, Luke. What do we got going on here, right? So she was trying to do a triangle, and then I believe her name is pronounced Moknatkina,

stands out of it. But what you'll notice is that Pacheco, you're supposed to underhook with her, in this particular case, her right arm. She should have underhooked the left leg of Moknakina, but she doesn't. So instead of doing... You remember? Dude, this is how fucking strong Rampage is. Rampage was in the same scenario and then picked up Arona over his head and then bombed him down.

You know how fucking strong you have to be to do something like that? That's insane. Yeah. So you get a clear sense of what a beast prime rampage was yeah uh let's go to pacheco on this high kick luke uh we had the jake paul split screen going on the madden cast catches it in trips yep yep and then we had a exchange on the ground um luke muck how do you say this mo can tink she's a dog she yeah she's pretty good she went the distance with kayla too people forget that she's got through that knee bar she went for pretty crafty

yeah nice high kick there from pacheco she's really good shout out to larissa it was good to see her get the second she's the first two division pfl champion in history uh let's go to bellator welterweight champ the ass kicking machine jicking machine, Jason Jackson. Like I said, Luke, I went from being like, we're really going to do this face-off to being like, oh, we really need to do this face-off. Luke, this fight's going to be bananas. Yeah, dude, I'm telling you. This is one of the best welterweight fights you can make in the sport. Certainly the best one outside of the UFC. This was a home run to me.

When they were doing stuff like this, I fucking loved this. Magomed Karamov is the man. He has won that twice, the PFL season championship. Jason Jackson just took out Amisov in very manly style. We're going to listen in here on Kayla Harrison's post-fight call-out.

...acquired Bellator. I heard there's a girl in Bellator who thinks she's a bad bitch. Well, why don't we find out? Luke, do you think she was talking about Angerfist Arlene Blanco? I don't think she was talking about her, but one never knows. Yeah. One never knows. All right.

Yeah. So the cyborg call out is real. And how about this fun sequence from Blonde Brunson and Ray Cooper? This fight was a war. Well, look at this, Luke. Yeah. This is where he goes. Yeah.

He tree tops him. But then old Ray's got big power, tries to shuck him by, nearly gets it done. But Brunson, he's a veteran, so he worked it out. Ray had huge moments of landing bombs, but then Brunson was full mount for half the fight too, right? Yeah, dude, if you look at the scoring totals in terms of punches landed, it was like 150 to 15 or something, some absurd stat. Luke, there was another showcase amateur fight of biagio ali walsh

grandson of the greatest who cares about this shit can i be honest with you well he's in the red shorts there this i think this is a six straight knockout he has scored here on like the amateur level um he's kind of a badass luke your thoughts you're done with this i'm not i'm not i'm not mad at the guy it's fine but he's an amateur you It's like, dude, turn pro, and let's move this along. Let's get Mickey Gall up in the pool. This guy was the grandson of the neighbor of Muhammad Ali's favorite delivery guy. It's like, I mean, what are we doing? He's actually the grandson, okay, Luke?

I know, but what I'm saying is we've made that point. We've established it. That's why you should watch. Now can you fight? Would you be interested in him fighting his brother, boxer Nico Ali Walsh, in an Ali versus Ali family fest? No, that's not. No, I'm not looking for Ali versus Ali violence.

Okay. Hey, Showtime pay-per-view was in Las Vegas, Luke. Check out this sequence between Benavidez and Andre. This is what I'm talking about. This was in round five in round five andre dude fighting trying to fight his way out of trouble he stood in there with him dude he was physical man he did he tried that was a round five was a bad round for uh andre in general uh and dude look at look at benavidez using his head as a post to push andre back i mean he's guys got skills in so many different areas that folks just fail to recognize dude david benavidez is his dude david benavidez for me is must-see

boxing he's all right well we have established that subriel matias of puerto rico the 140 pound champion also is must see here's a little sequence of him walking ergoshev down who he would make quit on his stool the fifth consecutive opponent luke he just gets in your face and squares up and then is like go ahead throw go again and it doesn't look like you're like oh he you know he doesn't have that tank davis one shot hit or quitter which first of all he does but second of all dude fifth guy and i dude this guy or ergoshev his his nickname bc is descendant of tamerlane tamerlane was a 14th century turkic mongol leader who like had this vast empire and was more than just a conqueror did a lot for ultimately what became uzbek culture this guy

was undefeated coming here called himself the descendant of Tamerlane, was a known heavy is a animal. The crazy part is Matias was willing to take all of his clean shots for a round and a half. He was not throwing back. He was just coming in, getting popped, popped, and then he's like, all right, all right. The guy's a menace inside of there. Luke, this was your call on the undercard.

You had a really fun two-fight card. How about Vito Melneicki Jr. getting the first round finish here. Let's listen in. Salazar firing back wildly, but they are scoring. Oh, and another right hand! Sits Salazar down! Vito

Melnicki, first round stoppage! What an emphatic, authoritative win. If I do say so myself, you were saying it off the go. He looked sharp. He looked physical. Great accuracy. Great shot selection.

Got the job. Luke, that was against a Freddie Roach-trained fighter. And that looked like it was going to be an interesting matchup. And dude, Vito just started landing bombs on him. Dude, that guy had like 30 pro fights. I think it was like 25 and 5. Freddie Roach trained. The odds were not that close, but close enough.

And everyone I talked to, you know, in preparing for that call was like, that one should go the distance. Milnicki Jr. polished him off inside the first. I couldn't believe it. Great. Same high school, by the way, is Jake Von Amsterdam there in New Jersey. Same one.

I mean, yeah, you know. All right. Oh, look, check out this bathroom wallpaper. Would this motivate you or make you self-conscious? I'd be on my phone anyway. All right. Well, Luke, we found the latest addition to the sticker you've added to your truck on the back window here, Luke. Let's check it out. I mean, it's directed right to the point, right, Luke?

Listen, in five words, you could not sum up my worldview better than no lives matter. Fuck everybody. Yeah, that's about right. There it is. All right. Hey, regional MMA time, Luke, where, as you know, anything can happen. Here's Cage Titans. I want you to listen to the crowd pop that this guy gets on cage titan 62 all right well his ball's hot, too.

I mean. Look, that was like a 1980s pro wrestling pop. I wish you heard it. Like, you don't hear MMA crowds like that. By the way, I don't follow pro wrestling, but it was all over the timeline, I think, on Saturday night. Yes. I guess CM Punk made some big-ass news, something like that. Yeah, Survivor Series.

He went back to WWE or something? Yeah, he came back after 10 years. It was like the last remaining what-if, hell freezes over type of moment. And I guess Triple H didn't tell anyone in the company that he was doing it, and they had CM Punk come in like five minutes before, just walk right backstage, walk to the entrance to the arena, and then do it. So it's one of those special pro wrestling moments but it didn't really move me luke i'm not a hater i just never was a

cm punk guy you know i acknowledge the big moments but you know i i watch real fights now luke you know i've i mean i with much respect to my past i watch real fights now dude you're a juggalo shut the fuck up all right hey let's stay on the regional scene luke we had a near fatality here let's watch this finish oh god what the fuck yeah dude anything can happen on the regional level luke that guy just got a running start and he got dude i cannot recommend going to regional fights more for two good reasons there's vicious knockouts yeah vicious yeah so one number one is support your local promoter because they're the ones who are gonna you know whoever the next person is to get to the big show

is going to go through them and two dude if you want to see a range of human experiences that you basically can't see anywhere else regional mma has got you covered we got more for you let's go to the next regional mma highlight here luke watch this kick they got kicks down down there on the uh oh shit wow we're watching the peephole cam luke wow yeah right yeah this is the illegal cam that the promoter installed to just look at people's asses i guess i don't know the girls gone illegal cam that the promoter installed to just look at people's asses, I guess. I don't know. The Girls Gone Wild cam that Jason Aaron is definitely the production.

I saw him on Saturday night. He showed up. No way. No way. Yeah. He showed up. Here's the best part. He showed up, and then we did the broadcast,

and I was hoping to talk to him afterwards. I was like, where's Jay? And they're like, oh, he left. I'm like, fucking Jay. He's not hanging around. Luke, check out this MMA security here that they got here. I don't know what country this is. where's jay and they're like oh he left i'm like fucking jay he's not hanging around uh luke check out this mma security here that they got here i don't know what country this is things get physical is this russia luke look at that wow guys chill is that a sambo toss luke

dude that's just a big old gorilla man throwing somebody around type throw. I mean, I don't know what that was. And, Luke, I'm told that the audience can hear the sound on these clips, even if we can't. But also they said J. Aaron left five minutes. Left five minutes into the broadcast. Yeah. And here's, Luke, you won't be able to hear this,

but let's listen in to this weigh-in moment from this regional fighter what do you say i would that say that he's got that dog in him luke i think he was barking that was weird that was oh he was barking okay all right luke let's go to uh the cat luke you ever pull someone's flag and it got awkward in a game of football no flag football yeah i think this is capturing a little bit more than the flag where i come from luke right you know what i'm saying here wow that's a little yeah i saw that too did you luke yeah oh boy you know what and i was gonna say this. You know what? And I was going to say this. You know what? My initial thought was this is going to be more of a concerned with coed flag football. But it turns out not. Turns out. No, no, no. A near oil change right on the field there, Luke. Wow. Okay. That's great. Hey, let's go to the Little Wayne concert. Luke, you ever wonder about those ladies who come to the concert only to go home with the presenter? You know what I'm saying?

I mean, I'm aware of them. I've not thought much about. Okay. All right. This is somebody's substitute teacher, and this is sad. Did you see the back door on that, Luke? What's going on here? What do you want to say, BC? She had already feathered a nest, let's say.

You know what I'm saying? Luke, she comes there to do one thing. Dude, look at Big Bertha in the heels. By the way, hold on, hold on, hold on. One more time, show it. One more time, show it. Pay attention to what is on her right shoe. What is that?

I don't know. I don't know what's happening. I think the FCC are shutting us down. Let's go to the next. You know what? I think that's some dick sneeze material. You know what I'm saying? Luke, the FCC are shutting us down. Let's go to the next. You know what? I think that's some Dick's knees material. You know what I'm saying? Luke,

we haven't seen some hippie stoners in a while. Try some gymnastics in real life, right? God. Oh, you fucking idiot. You fucking. Bees are white.

I can't believe it. I, it seems so out of character. Luke, you know what? White people are really good at taking something gross and turning it into art let's watch this next guy puke i mean that's you know luke what is art are we are it is our art you know what i'm saying? Wow. All right. Yeah. Let's go over to this.

Hold on one more time. Look at how his body is like mannequin like as he pivots. You know what I mean? He's a natural performer. Look, he has a wow. This guy. Yeah, that's incredible. All right.

Look, this is a Halloween leftover. I'd like you to meet the gingerbread man. I hope this guy dies in a... That's an aggressive dad joke from that young fella right there, but I liked it. Hey, by popular demand, Luke, more hot dog shit in this segment. Here we go. Luke, would you do this to people you don't like who come over for house parties my toxic trait is turning hot dog water into ice cubes oh that is filthy oh that is filthy that is real gross wow that's i think you can get arrested for that actually that's a hate crime

that's a hate crime where i come from this next fellow is known as the Glizzy Grandmaster. Would you attempt his monster dog here? Watch this. Why are his glasses orange and yellow? Yeah, mob bosses. They come right from the shooting range, Luke. Okay, so there's like 75 hot dogs, ham, queso, more mustard, tomatoes. Dude, is he, listen, would I eat that?

I don't know. How long have I been in prison before I get offered that? I almost peed my pants on that comment. Wow, all right. Luke, the next video I'm told is a McDonald's meal hack. Luke, is this ingenuity or is this just gluttony? What do you think? So they've got a burrito with fries, nuggets, and everything.

Oh, holy shit. Oh, wow, dude. That guy might be the roadie. Two cheeseburgers, nuggets, fries, ranch, ketchup, cheese. Luke, is that guy a dying fetus roadie, you think, right there? First of all, that's the guitarist. That's the guitarist. Okay, BC, can I be honest with you for just a moment?

Yeah. I would try this. I would try this. You'd have to say, in terms of low-rent, redneck-created food, that's top shelf right there. The last thing you should ever do in this country is look the other way on redneck ingenuity. Redneck ingenuity makes this country go round,

my friend. Luke, do you have any trouble ever feeding tuki vegetables? Sure, of course. Alright, maybe you should try this, Luke. This'll scare us straight, right? Dude, what the fuck? Where would you even buy

something like this? Hell, I think. It could be on the gift shop of hell yes uh look your favorite part it's time to rate that tat speaking of comfort food how about this grilled cheese inspired tattoo um i mean it's it's well done right I mean it's lame but the cheese is not that great but in general it's well done but I'm not one of these people it's like you I've got one tattoo when my arm is open I got another one when it closes I I hate gimmicks wow all right it's a gimmicky tattoo you know uh Luke what about uh you remember that producer we work with who has the Kobe tat on his back that guy just loves Kobe you know what i mean hashtag girl yeah yeah how about this next guy has that same love

for his airness what do you think about this jordan back tat is this the dude who plays for the raiders who max crosby yeah i don't i don't know but that's incredibly done so yeah so this is an exceptional tattoo this is a lot of time spent doing it uh i think it's uh i think it's ugly but it's a it's a really really well done back piece the only thing missing bc are his butt cheeks i need to see those looks like i'm gonna need to inspect your man cubes for a second here just for, you know, just for stylistic art purposes here. If you just cough once, it'll help the process, right? Yeah.

Wow. Okay. Hey, Luke, PSAs, remember those commercials, don't do drugs? They were a lot different when we were kids. Let's watch an updated one. Hey, guys. Everyone's been asking me to make this video about what to do with your friends that doesn't involve alcohol. So number one, we were kids. Let's watch an updated one. Hey, guys. Everyone's been asking me to make this video about what to do with your friends

that doesn't involve alcohol. So, number one, we got drugs. I think that cuts right to the point, right? Look, right? The drugs win. The drugs war where you come from. Also, alcohol is a drug, but I get the point. All right.

Let's go to this backflip. We have great success on this show with uh caucasians backflipping dude ko yes i don't understand these guys who are just like you know what i'm interested in is uh paralysis paralysis it's something i've never had. I'd really like to explore. We've never tried it in this fraternity. See, Luke, that's what happens when you join these organized gangs. None of us ever got paralyzed, BC. Oh, that wasn't part of the initiation, Luke?

No, no, no. Other horrendous things might have been. Paralysis was mercifully off the list how many margaritas would it take you to share with us the the full induction process to running for your frat i don't even know if i remember it all to be perfectly honest with you but probably three is the answer oh so one live show is all it'll take all right i can show you the secret handshake if you want to see it we had a secret handshake okay i would like to try that on like in the studio arehake if you want to see it. We had a secret handshake. Okay, I would like to try that in the studio. Are we going next week to the studio maybe? Yeah, that's right. Luke, what about this?

This is a Columbus, Ohio street, like downtown. How genius is this man turning one of those scooters that you can pick up on the corner into an easy chair mobile? Bro, I see this all over. Not quite like this, like latin america well some guy will have like you know a barely powered fucking scooter and they'll be moving like 15 70 inch tvs on that bitch and you're like how the fuck are you balancing that my man they do again just figuring it out bro love it that's great one more for you luke does this video uh turn you on at all?

Taste the honey sauce. Taste the goodness of the biscuit with the honey sauce. Don't get that honey sauce on me. I don't like the way it tastes with my chicken wings. Taste the biscuit. Taste the goodness of the biscuit. Taste the butter spread. Taste the goodness of the biscuit with the butter spread.

To get your butter spread. You show me videos like this and then you wonder why I like to clown the whites. It's like, well, you know why. Look, would you taste the biscuit? Look, I mean. Can you imagine the sounds that those two make when they're banging? Okay, that's where I have to go. Just the absolute worst.

Time out. Time out. All right, that's the shit of the week. I hope you saw it there. Wow, what a show, Luke. We gave it to them today. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We didn't have any UFC, but we gave it to them just the same.

I believe UFC returns this weekend, although the pay-per-view won't be to the 16th. What's the main event this weekend off the top of your head? I don't know. I don't remember. Yeah. So you can dare use. That's December 2nd? Shit balls.

Isn't it? Oh, is that? Yeah, yeah, because Song Gutierrez is December 9th. I thought that was. Wow, dare uses this weekend. That's the Austin card, right? That's a decent car bobby green jalen turner yeah figueredo font oh sean brady gastelum puna look this thing bangs

right it does it does bang it does bang they got misha on the prelims dude whenever they whenever they do the uh the the fight nights outside of the organization or outside of the Apex, they're always better, obviously. There you go. Thanks to everyone who tuned in for all of our stuff over the weekend. BC, anybody you want to thank? Anything you want to say? I just want to thank all the donks

who reached out and watched all of our stuff. Like you said, watched you and Breadman Edwards and of our stuff like you said watched uh you and bread man edwards and that great countdown lead in watched me and uh get a chance to fill in for jim gray there it was the final pay-per-view and showtime's great history and i was very happy luke and honored to be a part of it um i can't wait to see where the pbc is headed next year it's not going to stop luke boxing is still going to be is still going to be banging we just don't know where where where are they going to bang luke i don't We just don't know where. Where are they going to bang, Luke?

I don't know. We don't know. People ask me that all the time, and I'm like, I have no earthly idea how to answer that. Call us, though. We're available, Luke. Call us. Yeah, exactly. Call us.

Okay, BC. Let's remind everyone you can get the merch. The merch, the merch, the merch. Some of it's going to be gone at midnight tonight. You've got to get in there for Cyber Monday, morningcombat.store. If you want it, what's on the site now, you've got to go get it now because it's going to be gone. So just keep that in mind. Let's see, BC.

We'll be back Wednesday. Any interviews you want to plug? Yeah, I got that one with Brandon Royval coming out this week. That is tremendous, Luke. And then I'm also sitting down with, well, I'll be sitting, but I'll be talking to Regis Progray later today too. So very excited about that Devin Haney fight coming up. That's going to be some fun business.

I think that's the December 9th as well. Okay, very good. So we'll have more coverage for you for everything on the week ahead. Thank you guys so much for tuning in. Thanks to Malka. Thanks to Showtime. Thanks to CBS Sports. Thanks to everyone involved.

That's Brian Campbell. I'm Luke Thomas. We'll see you guys on Wednesday. And until then, may all of your gains be loyal.