MORNING KOMBAT WITH LUKE THOMAS AND BRIAN CAMPBELL - Boxing Hardcores: Where Does Zepeda-Baranchyk Rank This Century?

Episode Date: October 7, 2020

Brian Campbell welcomes Rafe Bartholomew to break down last Saturday's 140-pound slugfest between Jose Zepeda and Ivan Baranchyk which featured eight knockdowns over five rounds and a spectacular knockout win. The guys debate where the fight belongs historically this century and why the backstory of both combined to author such an emotional and dramatic classic. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

oh yeah like boxing you can't kill us yeah you really can't fix us either we back baby the boxing hardcores under the morning combat flag it's the brian campbell the voice in your face right now on this video and the new york times best-selling author rafe bartholomew author by the way of a new and revived Respect Box newsletter. Can't wait to check out as well. Rafe, look, we've been doing boxing podcasting from the beginning, brother. Whether it's the ropes on Grantland, the ropes cast on Snapchat, the ITC, the SOC on CBS Sports. Now, hey, Morning Combat, we here, baby.

We back. We said we'd be back we're back morning combat you are next my friend yes thank you thank you very much uh what can you expect from this ridiculousness as well okay all right we are two hard men and like the title says you are the boxing hardcore you're not regular, Rich. You're fans who keep track of the sport week to week. Some of the names I've mentioned, I'm guessing many of you have never heard. I have heard of two of them, though. Thank you, Richie Dwyer. Sean Zepeda at 140 pounds and Ivan Baranchik. OK, you know, we heard it. We responded in a big way.

A big, big gift to people, Rafe. That's what we're here to break down today. Hey, great timing and the changeover of the shows and maybe not just the fight of the year, the fight of our lifetime just broke out. Rafe, this is what the people come to see. This is what our hardcores come to see, come to hear your reaction to what was not necessarily a surprise

that'd be a good fight but i don't think we were expecting uh you know uh ward burton here or uh or goddy ward or something how did you respond to what happened on saturday night i well i at first brian i'm not sure i was responsive at all i think fainted. Of course, there is really only one legitimate response. And that is in the voice of the late, great Emmanuel Stewart. Oh, my God. Look at this. Oh, my God. I mean, the eight knockdowns, especially and reminiscent of some of those great Manny Stewart HBO boxing calls when Ortiz Berto won. They're trading knockdowns, eventually trading knockouts within seconds of each other in that second round. And again, in the fifth round when it ended, oh, my God.

For the hardcore, for the action maniacs, come on, man. It doesn't get any better than that it doesn't get any better and i saw flashes of prince not seen versus kevin kelly in this fight i saw flashes of burto ortiz with that second round and the fifth round like you mentioned where it's just the swings of momentum and dropping each other i guess the point i want to do on this is celebrate right a lot of people celebrate top ring celebrate the plus for once celebrate evan corn the pr man of the stars and celebrate these two warriors for giving us you know a bit unexpected taste of brilliance although coming in we were excited we didn't do a preview part of this we're in

transition but we knew it would be a fun fight but what i loved most about getting this big gift to people right here was that not just that it was like a reminder of what box can give you when we suffer through this this broken sport but i love seeing the bat phone go off what do we call this thing not everybody has the red phone in their office that goes nuts but did you see on twitter all those former box fans reformed ones mma skinhead reporters people that aren't even fun when a great fight happens it's like a dog whistle we we get it out there we let people know and it was like we got the family back together for this night you feel that i've man i did i feel it you know i was feeling it brian and it was it was nice

i hope even that this this back call continues going out the way that it did way back in the day with other great fights like it did for you know castillo corrales one where it was a you know it's a showtime fight it wasn't there was almost pre-internet or definitely pre-big twitter and just the people were saying yo you got to go back and watch this to the point that even noted boxing fanatic not really my former boss bill simmons was, I remember reading about it in a Simmons column back in the day. So, and I think this has a chance to have that life. It really does. But I don't care about everybody's life that I just, yeah.

You think I care? You think I care about that guy, right? I don't care about Matisse's life. I don't care about his people. I don't care about his family. I don't care about them. Thank you for this little piece of art you once gave me as a gift here i know how to show love to my people all right get get you up morning bird call

how does that go over on the youth soccer fields of Connecticut, Brian? Is that more popular than the Gypsy King hat? Yeah, so, you know, I did, you know, you have gifted me at times in my life. I've got the Tyson Fury Gypsy King hat. I used to get a little weird looks from the soccer parents in the stubby Connecticut town here. But shout out to the Burbs here. But, no, I can't wear this in public, but I wear it now. Shout out to Angel.

Oh, we wanted to shout out this fight. The whole point of this is we want to pour some water on its balls. We want to let it know, you know, how good it is. Let me put some water on your ball. And I want to sort of frame that. Really, how good is this fight? Because, you know, you get the no-brainer fight of the year. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no-brainer, okay?

You get the no-brainer fight of the decade. Well, look, we're 10 months in, so yeah i think so uh i really want to find out in today's show is this legitimately in the pantheon of best fight of the century is it of the ilk of the gaudy ward one corrales castillo one for real morales one and three i mean you know pacquiao marquez four timmy bradley ruslan provodnikov is it of that ilk i want to uh undress it i want to inspect it i want to feel it i want to understand it i want to get your take on it we we've got it we heard a tip that this fight was good i have a group of analysts who receive the tip they review the tip uh they analyze the tip information and determine what type of tip it is now when you're when you're analyzing the tip, they review the tip, they analyze the tip information and determine what type of tip it is. Now, when you're analyzing the tip, as your experience will tell you,

Rafe, you do have to be careful. I mean, don't tease the bag or you'll get the mess, but you've had a lot of time to hang out with this tip in your hands the last couple of, all right, where are we going here? What are we doing here? Rafe, how do you begin to say and compare and contrast exactly where this fight belongs uh honestly brian i don't know that we have to decide where exactly it belongs it does it need to be ranked well i i think the proper ranking is just above provodnikov versus bradley but it has to you have to rank it below the Barrera-Morales trilogy. No, Brian, I think we can love this for what it is and say, yeah,

it definitely deserves to be mentioned in the same breath with those fights. And, yes, it's also a different fight from those fights, but still one worth celebrating, loving, breaking down. And one thing I'll tell you that sticks out to me about it immediately was that surprise factor. Not surprise, oh, wow, this is good. But surprise as, oh, this is great in a way that I didn't expect it to be. And we've been doing Sean Zepata since the beginning we went there and saw his coming out party when he pushed jose ramirez except in the the campbell household where he won that fight even and we've been in

we knew that baranchik was just a wild man out there we knew that this looked like a really high level good junior welterweight fight a great style match. But I didn't expect it to play out like this. I didn't think that Chon Cepeda, talk about showing me something, showing the world something. I didn't think he had the power or the work rate to keep Baranchuk off of him. And boy, is there egg on my face, as our guy Richie Dwyer would say. I like Mikey Garcia a lot, but can I bring in Sean Zepeda and Ivan Baranchuk to share this? Got to give Mikey the Ball Sack of the Year award for taking that fight,

because they got to be this big to jump out two weight classes. Balls of the Year, Mikey Garcia. Balls of the Year, Sean Zepeda. Balls of the Year, Ivan Baranchuk. Every time he would get knocked down, to try to almost like he was a dog covering up the poo in the corner like no that didn't happen right hey kenny bayless i'm back baby let me get me back in there even as his body face mind heart soul was slowly deteriorating from each knockdown but really i think the core of what made this fight great was because sean zapata

the crafty stuff like the the sexy sergio sort of mold uh good looking dude very crafty beautiful boxer counter puncher we didn't think we had he had this in him i don't think he knew he had this in i don't think anybody did but baranchik such a wild man that belarusian uh destroyer that he brought it out of him to have a counter puncher who maybe doesn't throw a lot fall down 10-7 in the first round knowing that this is your path back to a world title fight. I watched Jose Ramirez and Jose Zepeda with you in Fresno, ringside in 2019, okay? Hey, that wasn't a draw in the Dwyer household.

That wasn't a Ramirez win either, as you so eloquently mentioned. A lot of people, you know, like Evan Korn, they watched it too. They said, I'm sorry, Ramirez won it. But I'm going to tell you, it could be a robbery. It was still an effective robbery, okay? It was a robbery in some ways, all right? It did exist. We both know it did exist. I don't know what you're talking about.

Seriously. You can say you don't know what I'm talking about, but I'm seriously saying it. But what we didn't know existed was that if you poke the bear, if you play with the bag, you know, if you challenge Jose Zepeda, the Mexican-American from Southern California, to be the man, then you better be prepared to beat the man.

You can't beat the meat unless you are the man. Actually, no. I think it has to be your cow. It has to be your bull. Got it. But you get what I'm saying. Sean Zepeda responding in the way he did. Because, Brant, we've got tape of him.

We've got history. Not just history. I mean, he went 12 rounds with Josh Taylor, who many people rank as the number one guy in this division, and pushed him. Yeah, he got knocked down. But you kind of don't expect someone. I mean, you've got a lot of guys right let's look at the entire man oh we've seen that man we've seen him on video in brawls uh b sample bloke down there in oklahoma with george tadnawipo was ringside for barantic

ramos we hadn't seen sean chan chani disc j, Sean Jose Zepeda do that, have to do that. And his willingness to do that not only made this a great fight, which I'm going to try to pause history's timeline and find a crevice and just jam that thing in right into that crevice and tell you exactly where this fight belongs. But yet. We wouldn't be in this conversation if he wasn't willing and this fight wouldn't be in this conversation if it didn't have the keyword character rave and you know i go on that run a lot where it's like you know it's kind of like adult films like you know you tell me rio salvarado one's gonna bang they came into the bang they banged i didn't feel much right i you know it's fun but i didn't have this emotional connection of god he having

no business getting up from that body shot against ward in round nine right i felt that emotional connection in this fight because the paid is fighting out of his typical character uh baranchuk just willing to die in there i you hate to use the word you get what i'm saying and you just there were dramatic swings when you have the dramatic swings of, of, of momentum. Okay. You need the fight to be good. You need it to be action. You need to be a certain high level of skill.

And this fight has that you need prestige. And although not a title fight, it's a legitimate number one contender in a deep division for, you know, legitimate champions. So, so it matters. But if you don't have the dramatic swing of, of emotion and momentum, you don't have this level of fight. This is why I think it is of that ilk we can you know we can pick and play operation and figure out you know is it better than timmy against provodnikov i'm not sure like you said but we're here because we got to see them i mean every time you thought i thought branchik was going to knock him out in round five and then

he got knocked out so the fact that you've got that kind of, I mean, it, it messes with you. That's why the bat phone rings and it's Pavlov's dog and you're hearing the bell and you're this, this disgusting sport, right? This, this woman of the night boxing, man, when that, when this, when the, when the taste is good, right? I'm not talking about the sweet Puntang. When the taste is good, you, you just forget all the sins and you come running after that taste. They were they were they were selling us again.

And I said I tested I taste. I don't know where I am or where I'm going. Right. Save me off this island. Well, Brian, I think what you're saying is you're in the corner right now of morning combat. OK, there's no rules on this show. Please, we're firemen. Take me away. Yeah, you we firemen, Brian. You're in the corner like Brandon Rios saying, me gusto. And I'm like, I know you effing love it, man.

I know you effing love this. And, of course, that's what you should. What I didn't see coming with this fight and what I really loved, the character that developed within it, was Jose Zepeda. I knew he was that good of a counter puncher, but, and, but we didn't, I didn't expect the way that their styles meshed the way that Baranchuk's all out, just barrage and how he's, even though he's a pretty sloppy, I mean, his attack is not the most like polished,

but there's so much aggression. He's athletic, too, and quick and explosive and got and has power. And Zepeda for his technique, for his timing, for all of his strengths, doesn't have the greatest legs. He's not going to be able to stay away from a guy like Baranchuk and he realized that real after getting put down a couple times realized he had to sit down and figure out a way to create angles and catch Baranchuk coming in and man because of that those the ball sack of the year that he showed to to stand up in those early couple of rounds he found those angles found that counter found that way you notice as the fight went on the first big left hook that uh that baranchik landed on him in the first round

tim bradley is going oh oh with the lead with the lead looping that's like a game punch and and baranchik got caught bad with it early then he figured it out he started timing it seeing it coming expecting it and he would do that this is the fight the punch that ended the fight basically and he landed several times and knocked i got at least one other knockdown with he would do a little drop step with his back foot right and and almost come square almost the way you see manny do it sometimes when he launches that left but and it would create an angle where he could throw his left hand almost in a hook way after shifting and just catch him right on the chin over and over again.

And, man, it was a thing of beauty. But he had to be able to survive, you know, walk through fire. He had to be a fireman, like Teddy would say, to get to the point of landing that shot and winning the fight. Inside that big scrotum is huge, huge textiles. Yes.

He's got real big balls. They both did, okay, at the end of the day. So, if you didn't know that, that is the third member of our broadcast team, the soundboard. So, hello. Hello, soundboard. Can you speak to us? Hi, my boxing fans. Hi, it was nice.

I like you, SNA. You know, this is very nice. I like you. I like sex. It's nice. But the heart they showed and the craft. Look, this wasn't, you know, it was knock'em, sock'em robots, rock'em, sock'em in the sense that they're falling wasn't you know it was knock them sock them robots rock them

sock them in the sense that they're falling left and right but look they retained a fair level of of technique and trade and and i and i like in some sense that you know when you have great fights like this as long as the the heart is willing and it's equal on both they're both willing to be the same level of badass then the guy with the better craft a lot of times you know is going to win as long as the power differential isn't too wide and that ended up being i think zapata was a bigger puncher than he even realized i mean look you know my favorite um you know we're gonna talk about the broadcast team in a second because i thought they nailed that for that i thought bernardo osuna and tim bradley had a great night at the fights

and i want to share audio with that but your boy kriegs mark kriegel your guy my guy all right a lover of father and sons he loves my daddy i know that you know this wasn't just that we're good friends we're saying this wasn't just a post-fight interview when you get mark kriegel on there it's not just you know how about the third round with that hook right no mark kriegel wants to get inside the relationship you know your heart your fears your dark shadows as it may be if it will and i think ultimately you do understand what this sport brings though folks welcome to boxing some of the rooms have shadows right and mark creagle got he got inside of that he better have him get inside on him i loved what zapata talked about the the belief in himself and how that changes and how he had to enter a new level.

Be honest with me as best you can. Yes, sir. You doubted yourself at times going into this fight, did you not? All the time. To be honest, it happens to me all the time in every fight. I doubt myself too much. I'm a fighter that only had 16 amateur fights. You know, not a lot of experience in amateur.

So I'm always doubting myself in this fight. Yeah, it was tough. Yeah. I mean, people aren't that real. Like, when you hear that and you frame that, and it adds to the overall character of this fight, that's why you're able to elevate it above others fights that may even be better or more prestigious but did you get that feeling like you know zapata may have just been forced to empty the tank of what's in him and he didn't

realize it was as good as gold he didn't know i knew i'm jose zapata super fan number 99 over here but i'm not sure he knew so to re-watch him kind of go through that journey of sitting down looking up and going you know oh shit i gotta i gotta figure this out and oh that tanks pretty deep like there's a romanticism and that sort of coming of age in the moment and i think it only adds to to what you love about this fight and love about these type of stories and ultimately love about this game. Like this is why boxing, this is why when we get that injection, we rub it on the gums a little bit. We keep going back.

We can't quit this thing because this specific drug is just different than the NBA or the NFL, no matter what those storylines are. I mean, thank God Brancic was okay in the end. And I love when, when, you know, Lou DiBella and the other guy, Tony, what's the guy? The Oklahoma co-promoter. Tony. I saw his name in the tweet, but I don't know that man.

I'm talking to this man like I'm talking to this man, Brian. I don't know that man. With some middle American Tony Holden. Tony Holden, thank you. Thank you. I have a fight with a Thailand guy. Thailand guy, thank you. To see that Baranchik was okay,

you're obviously like, thank God. And to hear that they sort of had a Rocky II moment where they sat next to each other in the hospital bed, the two fighters, their beds were pulled together and everyone was out of the room and they had like a campeon brothers for life. God, you love that in the end.

You don't get that in other sports because it's not legitimately life or death and this one did into into and i don't know man there was just that and i guess that's my long-winded way of saying i think if a an mma fan right that was just like hey you got to see this fight right boxing's going nuts over it they'll like it but i don't know if they'll fully hear jimmy and understand it under the guise of what we deal with all the time in boxing. We don't always get this, but yet this is the heart of what the sport really is. And when they do that, when they just pour it out like that, I mean, this was fight was important. Yes. You know,

it was maybe the last path back to a title fight in this division and their prime, although boxing's full of shit. So titles fall out of the sky at any time but barantic fought like it was life or death rave like legit like this was his chance to make it big and if he didn't cash in on that chance it was over it was it was some rocky movie ish sorry there was some there was a there's a special sprinkled sauce or flavor packet in here that just sort of made this fight feel different than your normal two guys are going to come together and they're going to bang well i think the special sauce brian was the style matchup the effort the knockdowns the action this was not i don't think as much as i i hear i i hear i do hear jimmy i know where you're from. I don't think we as the boxing hardcore need to shut the slam,

the door shut on fans from other sports saying, yo, no, no, no, no. You don't get this. Like we get this. You don't feel this. Like we feel this. Maybe that's true. Maybe that's the case, but also it, you don't all you need. That's the, that is what is beautiful about boxing. You could show this to Mrs. Campbell. You could show this to either of the Campbell boys. You could show this to Mrs. Campbell. You could show this to either of the Campbell boys. You could show this to Angel Garcia on your hat. I don't care who you could show this to, to your, you know, your, your big mama, who all them need you to do this. If not for yourself,

then for your abuela, do it for your granddaddy, do it for your big mama, do it for your pop. Do it, Brian, show it it to them i don't care what walk of life they come from whether they've ever seen professional boxing at any level before in their lives they will they'll love it they will feel it it's human boxing is for grown folks not this boxing this is some boxing sir sergi i call it uh yeah he is for grown folks because he gets into all kinds of adult matters but this is just beautiful blood and guts competition it is yeah there's some violence in it but uh you know that that could be a reality check even for the young folks like you can go through this you can be tried like that in your own life in some way

and bring out your own ball sack of the year whether you wouldn't no matter what gender you identify as you could have a ball sack of the year brian right but but you know we we could see good fights any day of the week we could we could see adult movies any day of the week you know you're gonna get it but there's i do i thank you i mean thank you at least somebody seven times i don't want to get you i mean what kind of day is this it's a hard one day for me okay all right uh where was i going with that the fact that these two men were able to act as teddy would say act like fighters act in a beautiful way you're You're right. It may end up being universal in the language of love and how people interpret it because at the end of the day,

everybody kind of wants the same thing out of the sport, right? Right? I have beautiful guys. You know? I want guys. And how beautiful these guys acted in this sense is what made this fight next level extra special. You also need a soundtrack, though, right?

Every great movie, every great fight, you need a soundtrack. Are you crushing your bills? Defeating your monthly payments? Sounds like you're at the top of your financial game. Rise to it with the BMO Eclipse Rise Visa Card. The credit card that rewards your good financial habits earn points for paying your credit card bill in full and on time every month level up from bill payer to reward slayer terms and conditions apply i love bernardo and tim bradley

they brought it okay you know bernardo wasn't jim lampley out there right but but he he went zero to 60 when he needed to uh you know there was the callback of the old school call your friends at home which you know if you don't remember that that was uh round four of mickey ward against uh emmanuel burton augustus in the as you know what do they call it the thriller in hampton teddy called it uh you remember that anybody watching this by your home in between between rounds, call your friends up. You're seeing something that you don't see too often. Please. I mean, really, you're feeling something that you don't feel too often, right?

Hey, um. Right? Right? What does it mean when fighting gets you wrecked? I mean, look, it happened. It did exist. So we got that, and then Tim just dips into the playbook. Tim just dips into the teddy you know

so it had the soundtrack. It had the moments. And damn near on that finish, I think we got a double Raygasm out of Osuna. Do you agree? Do you believe that? I was pretty much up there with one. But it made a lot more sense than when we get the double Raygasm on an FS1 broadcast with our guys Ray Flores and Ray Mancini. Ray Flores and Ray Mancini were paired up,

and they both have heart and passion. They bring it in this game. But when you paired their orgasmic powers on the call of a knockdown, it produced a moment. It wasn't Emmanuel Stewart. Oh, my God. It was more like clean up on aisle this announce table. Right hook upstairs.

Edwards shakes his head. There's a straight left. Down goes Edwards. And a body straight left. And this one is over. Kennedy for knockout of the year. All right. We got that from Bo Suna. And, you know, I want you to score this. One to ten, right?

On the call scale. But he gave it to us. Have a heart. Oh! Ben's out. He spins the leg. And this fight is done. What a knockout from Jose Soprano. pretty damn good right maybe not really brilliant but the the emotion was there and he just he nailed the timing he did not i mean i remember watching that when he when baranchik went down when that knee bent george grove style after he got knocked out by a peach

of a right hand by carl frotch in front of 80k at wembley you know it is a shame that this could not take take place in front of 80k at wembley but you knew the attendance right there that is i heard once or twice that it that it was that much right right i want to twash it for it if you don't mind in my last fight before before i knocked out george groves at wembley stadium in front of 80,000 fans and that george groves knockout was the the last time i can remember seeing one of those dramatic your your leg folds under you, your knee may never respond again, sorry campeon type knockouts. But anyway, look, that punch landed and Bernardo was on it.

I was there, you know, eyes rolling back in my head going, you know, like having my own single wraithgasm. And no, Bernardo was strictly a pro the statutory rave where are we going with this uh no everybody was of age my friend okay all right the consent was there thank you i don't know what you're talking about they brought it they even had some fun moments between them you okay with this conversation you want action you want action-packed fights at 140 welcome to top rank boxing on ESPN baby we got all the 40s not the kind that you drink

I love it Tim's like I don't drink my friend I don't drink that was racist please don't do that but shout out Posuna Tim Bradley yeah it would have been bad like oh it's something Bernardo just goes like a little too he's like hey yeah what, yeah, what's your, what do you prefer? St. Ives or old E? Like, talk to me. Talk to me, Tim. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Please, please.

No, no, no racial stereotypes there. Thank you. All right. I know the only way we're allowed to profile is Texas because it is different. Texas, but Texas, you know, the beef's different. The beef's different. It's got a different taste to them. It's big guys. All different. The beef's different. It's got a different taste to them. It's big guys.

All right. So the fight matters. Chone, you know, I mean, look, he's not going to get Ramirez next. Jose Ramirez has got to do the four-belt thing with Josh Taylor. We can't wait. All right? This is what we're talking about. This ain't even Bud Crawford against who?

Who's that guy he did the four-belts against? We're talking about julius and dongo look i'll you know shout out to bud for the accomplishment and the ability to market it that way in espn but like you know we're like and dongo has two belts bro you know look at me max i have you how did you how even in this day and age how they let you have two belts josh taylor unbeaten jose ramirez unbeaten all four titles like that's that's legit so zapata not going to get that now but he did get the biggest win of his career the win that maybe proved to himself that like he does know this game he can do that on that level and hopefully

like some paydays and some stardom from what we got here i don't think we should expect this out as a pay to moving forward per se. He's maybe a little bit too skilled to do this branch. He bangs bro. Right. That's just what it is. That's where it goes. But I mean,

we're going to remember their names now tied to this fight, which is back to where this fight belongs and what it really means. I don't think it's one that we're going to stop talking about. Like, was it better than even that 2016 potpourri we got of like Bandido against Salido? Remember that one? We got Provodnikov against, I mean, we got, you know,

they all have- 2013 Provodnikov-Bradley. No, no, no. The one where Provodnikov fought- Oh, you're talking about Matisse. Yeah. No, he fought Matisse. Like, what I'm saying is-

Look, man, don't go back and watch Provodnikov versus John Molina. You ain't going to be happy back and watch Provodnikov versus John Molina. You ain't going to be happy watching that. Provodnikov-Bradley was special, but I'm talking about 2016. We go, okay, those are good fights, but we're not thinking all-time great, right? We're not thinking this century's best. You know, tell me if I'm going too crazy at the moment. I think this is right below the true upper elites of Gotti Ward 1, Corrales Castillo one, Marquez, Pacquiao four, all those ones I mentioned at the time.

Marquez, Vasquez three, maybe. Yeah. And even even, you know, even the recent one of or somewhat recent one of Provodnikov. And I love that one. And Bradley in there. Like, I think that one's better, too. Yeah. But I don't think we should drop this into that other forgotten category like I was there for Bandito Vargas against Mayura that's an insanely great fight and there was character in that but I don't know if we love those two characters or they got the crossover attention on that level not that we look back at that as just that was a great fight for that year but I don't think we look at that as you know what I

mean like i think i can i think let me let me try and translate this for our audience brian what you're saying is that those fights which are legitimately great fights whether it's salido vargas vargas miura uh you know basically for like like francisco vargas had that run where he would just in how many just incredible fights those were great fights in almost a way we're more used to seeing, right? It's a war of attrition. Two guys who are coming forward, like you mentioned earlier, a Rios Alvarado trilogy type event where you know these are high-level fighters

who are just all action, except for that third time Alvarado came out after hanging out in the hotel fight week. But anyway. I got two cards for you, Mike. Fish scales, right? Yeah, these are those fights. The shadow boxing legend, Mile High Mike. Yeah, these fights are these classic wars of attrition where you sort of expect it coming in. They rise to the occasion.

They often even exceed expectations because they're so good. The action is so consistent and thrilling throughout, but there's something way, way different about seeing two guys knocky that, that kind, those not that number of knockdowns is unique is it doesn't or unique. No, but it's very rare, exceed exceedingly rare and it's special when it happens and it heightens the drama and nine it should have been nine that one might have been my favorite knockdown how did he how did he manage from the other side of him to to loop under like

that that left in there and catch him on the chin it was like uh brock lesnar frank mirror rematch in ufc where you're on the ground and you're behind someone and you're punching up from behind i mean kenny bayless missed that i thought he had a hell of a fight overall but that's essentially nine knockdowns in five rounds that alone might give it the character to separate it from that 2016 run of those hbo wars at the small weight classes or 2015 before that as well. I don't think though it exceeds those five, six or seven that I mentioned, but I do think it's there. So that puts it at the back end of the top 10 this century. You okay with that? I'm more than okay with that. I think they should be okay. We should all be okay with that. What would we be talking about

this fight? Like we talk about those two French guys remember that sam sack shepard against my act of nonchalance that uh dan rayfield was telling everybody to watch from 2006 and it is amazing it's probably your seventh or eighth best fight of this of this century will well i think that depends on what happens with their careers unfortunately like really being remembered like that has to do with longevity has to do with being in more fights that people remember probably it means that sabeta has to go on and and and get a title at 140 that's not fair but shamsha shamsha core we remember that dude for one fight porn salon no no the the one from france in 06 the fight of the year you know what i'm talking about i do but i didn't i don't remember you can't say his name i don't remember his name i just remember it yes it happened but other than that it did exist it's

not it's not legendary in our brains in the same way that ain't fair but it's true all right look you know what they could i mean the the obvious counterpoint here is the goddie ward trilogy but god i mean these are those guys were famous in their own rights huge draws in their own rights even if they're this is sort of the level we're talking about or all right so do you think this is going to be more of a Ward Burton in in history where you're like amazing fight but I don't go out of my way to always put it in the top five the top ten there right I think it's I look I would expect it to be pretty safe in the top 10 just because of how good it is on its own but is it something is it going to be on the tip of our

tongue right after you know pacquiao marquez or or you know barbara morales one or two one or three is it gonna is it gonna live like that i think unfortunately it has to do with the achievements and the fame of the fighters. That ain't right, necessarily, but fair ain't got nothing to do with it. The hardcores will remember. I hope you remember it. Maybe, look, you mentioned earlier that Josh Taylor and Jose Ramirez have some business they want to take care of at the top of the division. That probably means there's time for a rematch. I know you don't want to rush into it Corrales Castillo style but

at the same time sometimes this trilogy's become magic you know it could go either way would you would you be upset Brian if they had another fight and it didn't blossom in nearly the same way would you feel that it cheapens the first one it's not going no it doesn't necessarily cheapen the first one do you remember delvin rodriguez uh pavel wolak the first one was great solid hematoma second one delvin used his jab and made it not as much fun just like you know no one talks about that burrow morales too was kind of a dud right ward god he wore two outside around three was a big time dud from your expectation level. I don't even though Zepeda is Mexican-American and he found out he's a man in there.

I don't think he he should or will fight like this again, you know, for this long sustained. If they did it again, I don't think he's going down 10-7 is what I'm saying. I think that being the slicker puncher, he's a little bit more selective, shows a little bit more defense in the end and probably wins it without it having to go to uh you know eight mile island level here but uh thank you to these two guys thank you that this happened that this reminder that that you and i and the other boxing hard cores not talking about regular fans you know we circled this on the calendar we knew we didn't tell you we weren't telling you this was going to be corrales castillo which that was a fight where a lot of us ahead of it were like, you know, this one, you know, just, I mean,

I think Pacquiao Morales won was like a few weeks before that or a month before that. And I had the same kind of like, this one's going to be special. We didn't say that about Baranchuk Zepeda, but for quarantine seasons, we said, you may not know these guys, but this is gonna be really good. You know, this has potential to be really good. I don't think Zepeda is going to do that again. I think Brancic only knows how. So I don't want to see this rematch yet.

I'd rather see it when they both are coming off of losses from attempting to move up. And it just seems to be the nice attraction fight of the moment. Just my two cents. I know Rougarou left the 140 window to go over to PBC. Oh, he's still at 140. He's still at 140. He's going to be on the undercard of Tank and Leo.

Halloween night, by the way, inside the Alamo Dome on Showtime Pay-Per-View. But who else? If you're telling Zepeda, we do want you to fight one more time before getting that WBC mandatory. Who else at 140? Anybody else? Oh. Well, God.

He's probably available on Wednesday night. I would stay away from Victor Pastol. He's still a pain in the butt. That wouldn't be a fun fight anyway. God, it's tough. Look, if I were his manager, I'd probably advise him to wait for tough. He probably, look, if I were his manager, I'd probably advise him to

wait for the big fight because if they, look, they're going to make that fight between Ramirez and Josh Taylor. The winner is probably going to vacate all four belts, go up to 147 to get big money either against Terrence Crawford or who knows where. And that means that Zepeda probably by waiting gets a shot at the WBC belt and doesn't have to beat either of those guys, which is a smart thing to do. If that means waiting, you know, he could wait, what, six months to a year for that? Unfortunately, look, I want to see I would see it. I want to see these guys back as soon as they're ready. But that may be how this plays out, Brian.

That's how this podcast out brian uh that's how this podcast played out uh rafe thank you for joining me um if you're new to the mk boxing hardcores it's like the ecw of the regular morning combat family right it's a little edgy i'm like the sandman of this show yeah yeah you're drinking uh yeah people don't realize that you have urinated at that table while recording a podcast in the past now with the video it's going to be harder but what are you in a supply closet in the back of detroit right where are you brian this is this is the room i work in uh i have not set up my cool background for being a youtuber like you guys have but at least brian i did hang up a towel

to kill the glare coming in from that window behind me you know you got to respect that this is my clothes right here and i've got um a bookshelf full of uh canned beans and uh as well as some uh the difference between drago and rocky four with the professional steroids and machines and your you know your balboa out there on the snowy farm. I'm drinking like, like powdered crush out of a, out of a soda stream can bottle. That's the liquid crack for Rafe Bartholomew. Follow him at Rafe bugs. Read his work right now at the bet. Your us bets.com.

M I M I bets.com. The boxing fans may want to check out the revived respect box newsletter, which the soon to debut ring city usa crew is going to put out uh or they're sponsoring so i'm out there and we're gonna f around on this mk window uh you know we got a big fight next week uh loma chanko lopez you're probably gonna hear from us yeah i don't know how often you know we're not gonna always be there when your call we'll probably never be on time but this has been mk boxing hardcores for rape bugs it's your boy bc we out