MORNING KOMBAT WITH LUKE THOMAS AND BRIAN CAMPBELL - Jon Anik on Colby Covington Situation, Calling Fights And Brian Stann | Morning Kombat RSD

Episode Date: April 14, 2023

Room Service Diaries is Back! Luke Thomas and Brian Campbell sit down with Jon Anik discusses what has changed in the UFC over the past 10 years, The Colby Covington Situation, Who he would like to call fights with and much more! Morning Kombat is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Stitcher and wherever else you listen to podcasts.     For more Combat Sports coverage subscribe here: youtube.com/MorningKombat   Follow our hosts on Twitter: @BCampbellCBS, @lthomasnews, @MorningKombat    For Morning Kombat gear visit:morning kombat.store   Follow our hosts on Instagram: @BrianCampbell, @lukethomasnews, @MorningKombat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I wouldn't say this is the healthiest option CBS could have gave me in my liver, but you know, I'm fighting the good fight. I'm trying to be a team player, right? That guy is whoever that guy is. Wow, look at this guy. Hey, don't let me interrupt your lunch. Could he be more Florida at this point? I just got destroyed by the sun a couple of days ago. You know what's unbelievable is you used to be called Chost, Chubby Host,

but you have really worked to avoid the... We're the same age and you have really worked to avoid this. You know what I'm saying? I fluctuate a lot, though. Like, after a pay-per-view, I'll probably put on like eight pounds. Really? You know who doesn't fluctuate a lot? DC.

Well, he isn't necessarily the face of the UFC, but as far as I'm concerned, he is definitely the voice. He joins us now for a special edition of Room Service Diaries. Luke Thomas, Brian Campbell, and our guest, John Anik. Hi, John. Let's go, South Florida. It's great to be here with you boys. Dateline, Fort Lauderdale. I wanted to say that. I really wanted to say that. It's been a long time coming. It's great to be here with you boys. Dateline, Fort Lauderdale. Wanted to say that. Really wanted to say that.

It's been a long time coming. It's great to have you boys here. I know some travel trials and tribulations, but it's great to be here. Well, I'm an idiot, John, as you well know. So that tends to be the problem. How are you doing these days, John? Doing great. You know, it's nice to have a home game. You know, we all often sort of wondered when Miami would happen. It's been 20 years and felt like Jorge Gamebred-Mosvidal was going to be a part of some equation to get us to Miami and rip off the band-aid. I remember hearing for years there was an issue in terms of doing pay-per-views in the state of Florida. I remember the last show

so maybe people don't know about this and I don't even blame the guys for doing it. In fact they were very right at the last time they came here there's a video afterwards of Joe Rogan talking to Jeremy Horn being like that Miami crowd's not that great. But I think it tells you a lot about the fortunes changing of both Miami, MMA and UFC that they can come back now. It's a sellout or pretty close to what I think anyway. And yeah, Miami has certainly grown up as a combat sports destination, dare I say, right? It's very exciting. Now, with respect to the entire Sunshine State in which I reside,

this is not Hollywood. This is not Fort Lauderdale, Tampa, Jacksonville. This is Miami. This is the 305. You need the right title fight. Back in the day, they used to say, got to get Anderson Silva to fight there. If you want LeBron James to show up when he was playing for the Heat, it's the right main event.

And I have told my daughter, who's 11 years old and attending her first UFC pay-per-view, if you can make it to the moment at which Jorge Gamebred Masvidal shows up at the tunnel and walks out, it will be worth your while probably around midnight Eastern, I'm hoping. That could be like lightning striking her at the right time. Because, look, that in-arena UFC experience or elite boxing, we always talk about that for years behind the scenes when we work together at ESPN. There's nothing like it, right? The 10 minutes before the main event introductions, that whole feeling is just like bottled drugs and i'm

looking for the store that sells that apparently that's in the arena but uh i hope she catches a bit of that you are a a boston guy and we see that come out in your commentary and i like that when you mix in the little bit of that but you have adjusted your life here to south florida in what ways is john attic aick a stereotypical Florida man? Well, I go to bed really early. I eat dinner at five o'clock. I take advantage of a lot of early bird specials when I do go out to dinner with my wife, however infrequently. But I have adjusted to the life down here. As I told you guys off the air, you go to CVS, maybe takes a little bit longer to get a pack of gum, right? Average age, maybe a little bit older. But there was an adjustment period, certainly when I left Las Vegas, reluctantly by the way my wife wanted to move back east coming down here in 2015

and just felt like i was in a retirement community every time i tried to do anything but that has changed it feels a little bit younger i mean colby covington revealed my hometown to the world so not far from here west boca raton doors are unlocked but i love it i love the humidity more than the dry heat i love running outside and um yeah I think I'm going to be down here for the duration. Well, look, that seems like a natural segue, right? Yeah. So what happened with that with Colby? It was a little weird. Yeah, a little bit. And I think you can argue he crossed the line, but I never felt particularly threatened. More so I felt the support from Jorge Masvidal and Jamal Hill and a lot of other athletes. And I certainly appreciate that. You know,

I don't know that you need to inject anybody's kids into the equation, and there will come a point in time on Snapchat or somewhere else where my 11-year-old daughter is going to come across that clip, and there will be some explaining to do. But by and large, Colby and I are good. We have addressed it privately. You did speak to him. We did, yeah. I mean, we didn't talk. We messaged each other. And, yeah, you know, it's interesting, right? Because I've tried not to lean into it, right? I mean, I just leaned into it a little bit there, but for me, ultimately,

there were two parts of that navigation when he said what he said. First of all, what did I say that has upset the high profile professional athlete? I got to figure that out first. Sometimes it doesn't take much. It doesn't take much. Right. But did I say something? Did I analytically go a little bit too far with my editorialization of the welterweight championship pecking order right so once i realized that it seems like his beef is really just that i gave bilal muhammad a platform and i didn't really say anything that sensational then you can address what he had said and if i'm being honest like it was colby in character for me when i first saw the clip i thought nothing of it and then my phone got pretty noisy and I thought more of it as the day went on here's my question did did anyone from

UFC front office call you about it no really no so they must have took it in the same way that you did it's not that I listen it was not that when I saw it I thought he was going to run up on you I I didn't think that especially considering what had just happened to him or allegedly whatever that whole situation is at its current stage. But I just thought, that's brazen. And do we really want to live in a world where that kind of line crossing is acceptable for people who are not actually fighting? It makes me a little uncomfortable, if I can be honest. Yeah, and what was the angle going to be promotionally if he was going to maybe go at Bilal Muhammad?

You know, I know he's alleged racism, but I think he saw me as somebody who... Facilitated a rival or something? Perhaps, and then also saw me as someone that maybe the masses might get behind a little bit if he said something really outrageous. Because you're a babyface and he's a heel. That's how it works. I mean, basically Endeavor didn't have to buy WWE for us to understand how that works. Right, exactly. So certainly this was the first time that I can recall that it felt very WWE to me as a UFC play-by-play guy. But again, like I could totally lean into it, like the jokes between me and my twin brothers, you know, have my daughter show up at UFC 287. Like, you know, Colby said that my dad might not be here. Yeah, I mean, there's so many different things.

See, I've had people threaten me in the industry. They weren't joking, though. You know what I'm saying? Like, you've never received threats before? I guess I got a death threat from Lemoore, California, the first night I worked for the UFC. But, yeah, I mean, certainly I've been more off-put by maybe some of Colby's cronies who are like,

you know, you don't have to worry about him, but now maybe it's me, you know? But if Masvidal, or I mean, there have been high profile athletes that have taken issue with what I have said, and I try to bury the hatchet and either stand by what I've said or apologize, but there's not a show that goes by that someone is not upset with something. Fighter, coach, you know, right? So it's the world which we live in. And I think we have to be in a spot as somewhat public figures in this category that like we can't predict what it will be you can praise a guy and they can take it as as as an

insult you can do that so at the same regard i always say look use it for fuel for you i'm not looking to be your best friend anyway use it for fuel but it's rare that it escalates to this wwe level so yeah so that i mean that certainly had to feel extra weird but but at the same time it's like it's not that abnormal, the idea of a fighter taking something either out of context or trying to frame it to their own sort of like, remember Jordan in the last dance? Yeah, I took that personally.

Yeah, it never happened. These guys, you know, it's true. Like these fighters like to do what they do and you know this intimately well, they live and die in their own minds. And if somehow someone crosses that, their mindset kind of turns them in a weird direction at times i have established a lot of goodwill with colby as i try to do with every

single goddamn athlete on this roster and i think that helped when maybe he saw some of me putting over balal muhammad i think that helped me navigate it with him but what i wrote to colby was i just need to know that i still have your respect enough to do my job because i don't need him to go to the fighter meeting, but I need him to allow me to call the fight. Yeah, fair enough. So you have been calling Fights for the UFC how long now? January of 2012, so about 11 plus years in.

11 years in, what would you say you, what have you learned the most? What's been the biggest kind of revelation to you about this entire process 11 years in? Well, certainly the evolution of mixed martial arts is crazy that you can go five six years not talking about calf kicks at all and then you have something like that that effectively changes the sport and it becomes a huge part of so many strategies and training camps so certainly mixed martial arts evolution just as a fan but just to see the television deals to go from Fox, which laid the foundation for this ESPN deal,

Brian Campbell and I were in the bowels of Building 4 in Bristol, Connecticut, fighting for combat sports in 2005, 2006, 2007. And so to see ESPN get a deal and to see the domestic footprint has been very special. But a lot of it's been a whirlwind, right? Going through the global pandemic, the whole Fight Island thing, ballooning to 15 fight cards and how that sort of affects our preparation with 30 athletes per card. I'm trying to embrace and enjoy the journey,

but I don't know that I'm effectively finding that balance in terms of the ultimate professional fulfillment versus the grind. All right, here's the thing that happens on the road a lot, okay? Luke Thomas will try to hang out with me. Yes, I'll text you, hey, you want to get dinner, and you'll respond, drop dead. No, that won't happen. But in good faith, he'll try to hang out with me. But, you know, I've become a little bit of a loner on the road for mental health safety. And I think we all sometimes fall in that rhythm of, I just got to get through the job and get there. But people know now that you're a student of this job

and that you've got the gigantic card system, but I remember seeing that in the beginning, back when you got a couple of tryouts calling boxing for ESPN and you developed that. Your commitment to the grind seems to be a huge part of who you are. But every time he'll ask me to hang out, I'm thinking, I've got X amount of hours left

before we gotta do this fight this weekend. I always have you ringing in the back of my mind. I ran into you UFC 200-something, New York, New York, and Vegas, and I was like, John, we should get breakfast or get a drink later, and you go, it's an open book text on Saturday night. All right? Might as well show up with

some goddamn notes. Brian Stan would always say that. And, like, with the intensity of, like, hey, bro, I love you, but I've got X amount of hours left and I'm going to maximize those preparing to go and deliver this job. That's not natural across the board, even at this level, dude.

It's a sickness that you've plugged in. I think so much of my anxiety is in the preparation. When I get a text from your producer, Mikey Mormyle, about doing this on Tuesday, I get anxiety thinking about what are these three hours going to mean for the rest of my week? I love you guys. I prioritize this. I've been wanting to sit down with you guys for a long time, but these shows are just an absolute monster, and it's the devil that I know,

but it's the only way that I know how to approach this job. And I don't say this out of humility, but oftentimes in my life, I feel like maybe whatever I've lacked, either in terms of my recall or my historical framework for MMA or talent, I can fucking bridge that gap with hard work. And I try to impart that as you guys do on our children. So my system, however antiquated, handwriting, everything hasn't failed me yet, but I have no anxiety. When I show up to call a Conor McGregor pay-per-view I'm good but the anxiety I have when I wake up on Friday and I'm on a treadmill at 6 a.m knowing that I'm sending the scripts at 1 32 a.m those 12 Fridays before pay-per-views are probably going

to send me to an early so let's talk about this so we have I'm not sure when this will air but it'll probably air after Saturday's fight so walk me through UFC 287 from the Saturday backwards. When does the process start? And obviously, if you've got big name fighters like Gilbert or Jorge, you've got a bevy of file stuff on them. But walk me through a prep for a pay-per-view. When does it start? What does it look like?

What do you do? He's getting nervous. I like this. He's getting anxious. Well, when I'm not in a back-to-back, it's a totally different navigation. If I have a UFC fight night the week before a pay-per-view, then everything gets compressed. In this particular case, you did not.

I do not. So the voiceovers for a lot of the stuff you hear in Arena starts about 10 days out. Our great researcher, Tom Gerbacy, will write those combo features you see in the Arena. I take those, rewrite them in my own words, and then I lay those to tape. I lay a lot of things to tape, the opening billboards, closing billboards, so that's a part of the process. I grab my old notes from the fighter library

probably about eight, nine days out and just start attacking fighters. I don't even deal with show formatics or anything like that until 90% of my actual fighter prep is done. By the time I get to Wednesday or Thursday fighter meeting, I have to be completely prepared as far as I'm concerned for that fighter when I get to the fighter meeting. There might be some film study after the fact, but much of my prep isn't necessarily rooted in film study. But I have to know which fights have been canceled,

right? What the last six months have held. You don't want Eric Anders coming in there and saying, dude, I've been with Fight Ready for six training camps camps right right so that's why a lot of my prep happens early and then uh yeah thursday friday it's just a lot of writing copy locker room bumps coming up next we try to maximize every single second of television so a lot of what we find out in the fighter meeting i'll try to put into a locker room bump writing my pay-per-view open. It's a beast. Jesus, that does sound like a lot. And for a fight night being there, how would it change? Well, fight night is just, we have commercials instead of me. And thank you all for dealing with me reading promos over the years, right? But I try to read them as expeditiously as possible to get back to the content. Because in this sport, you know, my producers, Lappy and Zach,

they'll say, hey, you know, can you squeeze in a UFC store here? And it's like, I fucking think so, but maybe not. Okay, so then the question goes, who did you learn from to do the process the way you do it? And I'm going to guess that a lot of that is you just figuring out, what do I know, what do I not know, what do I need? But did you get any tips, anything you saw in the industry that you borrowed from?

No, I mean, certainly when I called high-level football games, need but did you get any tips anything you saw in the industry that you borrowed from no i mean certainly when i called high level football games i would search out the best guys and try to mimic their football chart with all the players because i didn't know how to make a football chart but when i called my first fight for espn doing boxing i started doing these cards the same way i didn't really know what to do i was calling fights involving these little known Filipino fighters in the Philippines for ESPN3.com. And so we didn't necessarily have a bio, so I'm on BoxRec.com and I started doing these

whatever five by eight index cards. Then I got the call to do Bellator season one in 09 and I just used my index card system. So in terms of my process, very little. Sean McDonough was my play-by-play inspiration because he was very much no-nonsense, but... And a Boston guy. That's right. And there was always a comedic undertone that I appreciated, his sort of dry

wit. But yeah, in terms of my process and my system, which by the way, none of the other play-by-play guys employ, I developed that myself just out of necessity when I got a gig and probably wasn't ready to get the gig. Jesus. To what extent did working, because every time I've talked to you, you've always kind of been really impacted by working with Brian Stan. How did your, I wonder, like, do you feel like that was so impactful that that shaped

you into what you got to at this point? Oh, yeah. I mean, I wasn't working as hard as my analyst, right? And that is never where you want to at this point? Oh yeah, I mean I wasn't working as hard as my analyst, right? And that is never where you want to be, right? The non-professional athlete not working as hard as the guy who's got the WEC championship. He's the greatest leader I've ever known. He's just a tremendous man who has had a profound impact on me and if he were to come call in and offer me a job at any point in time, I would leave. What is my dream job? To go work for that man. I think the dream scenario would be that in some distant time

that he's back with the UFC in some capacity, either as a broadcaster or as an executive, and I'm going to go work for that guy. That's the end game for me, is to somehow have Bryan Stan back in my life in a professional capacity. Can you give the fans a sense of like his level of detail and prep oh well i remember i showed up for a dinner one time without my notes and we would

break bread together for the entire week and that is not necessarily the reality with me and my broadcast partners right now which i kind of bemoan the fact but i remember not showing up with my notes and he's got a whole binder on he was the guy who started he laid the foundation for the fighter meetings essentially which weren't happening you know he and i were cold calling fighters i would do like the main card guys right they would come sign a poster and i'd get four or five minutes with them and stands like oh yeah i talked to all 28 fighters we'll have other guys other analysts who have people who they pay and they'll reach out to guys prelim fighters and i have no problem with that by the way some people have suggested that i start to do that and there

might come a time where i lean on some help a little bit brian stan would call every single fighter on the entire fight card i mean just he he approached it like he you know i don't necessarily agree with the parental advice that is the way you do anything is the way you do everything right i love when frank meir says that's not necessarily true right so it's sort of a bastardized version of aristotle but yeah but for brian stan work hard play hard doesn't even begin to describe it i just think he he knows only one way and so yes he was a huge influence on me as ryan rossilla was on the radio side but just i learned a lot of my work ethic and how best to prepare from him.

I always tell people, sorry, I always tell people like, dude, y'all forget he went to the Naval Academy and graduated at the top of his class in the Naval Academy. Yeah, he's a brute, because he can play the levels, but don't forget, Brian Stanton's smart and driven in sort of unique ways. He's missed a little bit, yeah? Oh, there's no doubt about it. I don't know that anybody can fill the void, honestly. And

candidly, I feel the same about Dan Hardy, if I'm being completely truthful. I just think he has huge value. We just saw him in London. We did a podcast with him, basically. We did a live show. He was our main guest. He was salt of the earth. Yeah, he's great. But yeah, I mean, as much as I have a kinship with Kenny Flory and one of my best friends in the world, we host a podcast together. Kenny and I weren't going out to every single meal together. So when Brian Stan sort of left me at the altar, when I felt like we were really developing something, it was very, very difficult for me. Because just when people started to hashtag Stanek, the dude went on to greener pastures.

Stan, that's a T-shirt waiting to happen here, all right? Guy fucking left me at the altar. Hashtag Stanek, wow. But hey here. Guy fucking left me at the altar. Stanek, wow. But hey, thank him for your freedom just the same. Look, obviously you and I go way back to ESPN, so I've watched your rise years behind, but could not be more proud of you. I know the man underneath

there, the work ethic, so when I hear you explain your maniacal approach to it, I'm like, I know that. I get that. But I get to call a little bit of this game, too. The work I've done in Showtime and we call undercard fights together, and especially when you're cage side or rink side. We're fans at the end of the day. It's a drug

unlike anything else to be part of the soundtrack of that happening. There are many little moments where I still geek out like a whatever, you know, 12-year-old, 6-year-old and I'm like, that was fucking awesome and I got to do that. What are those elements of your job today that you, that you are just like, inject me. This is exactly what I want to be doing and where I want to do it. When a champion breaks through for the first time and becomes a UFC champion. And there have been so

many different instances, even recently on Behovich, Clover, Teixeira, when Rosnabi Yunus back in the day, knocked out Ioana Young, Jacek Leon Edwards, on and on it goes. Brandon Moreno, Alexa Grasso. Those are the moments that I live for. When non-champions, massive underdogs or otherwise come through. That feeling, that moment. That's what it's all about. And I think

the exhalation for me happens when I get back to my hotel room and there hasn't been any major disaster nor fire that we need to put out and people are relatively happy with the broadcast but candidly as soon as Leon Edwards head kicks Kamaru Usman and we cap it I'm getting traffic right Joe Silva the great hall of fame matchmaker would always try to talk to me about joy and you've got your dream job man don't forget to have fun and it's like yeah bro but like there's too much shit going on for me to think about fun but I really try to embrace those moments as best I can. And Joe Rogan certainly adds the levity that

I think brings out the best in me. What would you say is the point of the broadcast from your perspective in terms of your role? Do you see your role as informative? Do you see your role as like, what is the viewer supposed to get out of the John Anik experience in your mind? Well, mixed martial arts is an interesting navigation for a play-by-play guy. We're not calling football where roles are clearly assigned, right? I mean, if I'm calling a football game and there's a first and ten, I got all this real estate. And then once the play happens, it happens. And then the analyst has all this real estate, right?

I have got to manage egos and a three-man broadcast booth and a lot of different things. But at the height of my mind, humanizing the greatest athletes in the world, giving people a reason to care. So sometimes if I lean more biographical than arm bar, it's because I feel like that's what, when I'm watching film, I'm not getting from a play-by-play guy and I want more of. But also, I'm thinking about family and friends watching these fights, not necessarily the average mixed martial arts fan, right? So they want to hear themselves be put over. Coaches are a particularly sensitive lot, right? But family and friends, right? I'm providing the historical soundtrack for the moments of their professional life. So when Jan Bohovic becomes the champion, I don't just want to say something that's canned. Now, I don't know what

I'm going to say, but I bring up that instance because we said Poland, your guy got it done. And I feel like that call, however simplistic, is going to withstand the test of time. So really humanizing the athletes, providing the biographical stuff that I know they and their families appreciate, and then making sure that those championship calls fucking mean something. Because we've never had a perfect one. Even when Michael Chandler knocked out Dan Hooker, I think at his UFC debut, he didn't stick the landing, and I'm ready to say, sticks the landing, kind of fucking suck the landing,

but he didn't stick the landing, you know? Never had a perfect show, never will, but those championship calls, I'm particularly focused on. Okay, here's what I love about that because I've always been in love with the call, any sport, right across the board. You know, and I love the guys, I shout out people that I love,

like Amore Ranallo or even a Todd Grisham, who I love can go zero to 60 in that moment and deliver it. Sometimes that's theatrics in raw emotion, but I like that you talk about the responsibility of, I used to think about it when I was a high school football reporter. I used to think, you know, there's maybe a thousand people coming to this game,

but there might be 40,000 people the next morning reading that story going, oh, I wanna see who won. I have the responsibility of doing it the justice, focusing on the right things. I love that you say that about the moment in the big call, because you can't plan it, but these things become all-time catchphrases. They become t-shirts. They become reference points. So there is a responsibility, right, in that? It's not just, oh, that's a clever new three word phrase. I haven't used that before. Let me write it down just in case. Right, exactly.

And I also think you need to be true to yourself. Like, Maul Ranallo was an influence on me, particularly when it came to his energy. You guys see me, like I'm a sneaky lunatic off camera, right, I have this maybe polished television persona. I'm fucking out of my skull piece half the time, right, in real life. So I think a lot of our fans, they certainly see that on the Anakin Florian podcast. They see some of

that energy on our broadcast. But I'm glad you mentioned Todd Grisham too, right, because he didn't have a lot of UFC opportunities, right? But Justin Gaethje, Michael Johnson is a call that will withstand the test of time. That's his ultimate highlight right there. It's still, it's still. Do you have calls in any sport that stand the test of time for you? Yes and no. Again, my recall isn't great, but a lot of those Boston championships breaking through for the first... I got it.

This Redskins fan over here. Hey, commanders. If only Luke Thomas could have seen me driving home from Sullivan Stadium in 1983 and my grandfather wants to listen to the whole postgame show when it's Dan Marino and the Dolphins 41, Patriots 7. We put in the time.

I know. I know. I just, I lived through the 20-year era of Boston just dominating everything, and I'm a little tired of it. Well, and I'm sitting here right now. The Boston Bruins and the Boston Celtics are essentially favored to win the title. We don't feel particularly good about being frontrunners like that, So, yeah, you know what? Hey, fuck you, John. Get out. John, even if you can't reference the ones that drive you, the, you know, do

you believe in miracles? Those ones that just stand the test of time. You've been lucky to be a part of a couple and the Leon Edwards fifth round head kick, high kick, whatever you want to call it against Usman. I mean, timing helped you. Commitment to telling the story the right way helped you. But even you couldn't imagine that it's that perfect, man. Like that, you're never going to see that highlight ever without your voice attached to it. Never. Well, thank you, man. I would say probably the greatest moment of 11 plus years working for the UFC was when I saw Leon Edwards three months after that. And he just walked up to me and he just said he's not cut from that cloth and gave me a hug, you know, and I referenced sort of those moments, a guy breaking

through and effectively changing his or her life forever in that moment. So, yeah, we got lucky there. And we talked a little bit about this off camera, but there was a narrative about the sort of moral victory and it got brought up one more time. And I just felt like in the nature of balance, I needed to bring it back a little bit and better to be lucky than good. But I had a nice conversation about that very call with Dana White in London, which really was heartwarming for me and my family.

So yeah, man, you know, I got lucky on that one to be sure. But as far as cap stoning the fights themselves, right? I really try not to have too many things in my head. When Demetrius Johnson was competing, I would always get in my own head, like immortality, how am I going to properly lay this out because this guy is just so great and he's chasing Anderson Silva and everything else, and that's really the only time

I've thought about words or phrases. I really try to keep that out of it. I make sure I know how to pronounce Tijuana and Columbia. It's tough. Barranquilla. That's acceptable. That's the best I. Barranquilla. That's acceptable. That was the best I've ever done, right? That's acceptable.

That's acceptable, yes. I'll allow it this time. By the way, I was going to say, one of my favorite ones is, we can cut this out, we don't have to keep it, but Steve Buckhands in D.C. with the dagger call.

Do you remember those? Dagger! Yeah, those were all one of my favorites. It's no Thug Rose, right? Thug Rose is a pretty good one. I wonder, like, do you, could you go to a MMA or boxing fight as a fan at this point?

He talks about sitting cage side. So I've sat cage side, but only for like my local amateur fights or something like that. I've actually never sat like super, well, I guess press row, but I'm in my laptop half the time. It's a little different. Now on your free time, could you ever see yourself be like, like oh go to a fight and then having seats that are good but probably relative to what you've been at rather ordinary it's almost like kind of i won't say ruin the experience for you but it's changed it for sure it has but i watch the monitor 80 percent of the time do you really yeah tell me what the reason is why the monitor is superior for you well it's not for me i mean when francis and gana used to fight i would watch francis in the cage because right you gotta just take advantage of that personal experience but no i'm trying to call out the angle that you're seeing at home so i really have to watch the monitor but you have the greatest seat in the world so oftentimes we

will cheat that and there's some nights where i just say fuck it i'm gonna watch the octagon action and just deal with the consequences but oftentimes that's not the angle that is being shown at home. So, uh, do your, do your, uh, fellow broadcast partners, do they mostly watch the monitor or do they watch the action? I think Daniel is aligned with me, but probably more of 50, 50 ratio Rogan watches the octagon and that's fine, you know, because I think we all provide different angles. If that is, uh, if we're all looking at different things, really not unlike the judges. But yeah, I mean, I had a chance to go to Karate Combat

a few days ago in Miami, but just don't have the time. It's not that I don't have the energy nor the desire. If my kids were older and out of the picture, certainly I would carve out a Saturday night and, you know, embrace the fans and everything that comes with it. But yeah, man, I'm sick of watching the monitor. I do wonder what the experience would be like to sit home and watch a UFC pay-per-view

because I used to really enjoy that experience and haven't had it in six or seven years. Yeah, you've been busy. I mean, you know, you've been pretty. I grew up back in the days when everyone would get together at parties. And obviously they still do, but that initial era had all changed. And now I just watch fights in my office. Like, that's just how it goes. Somebody's been to as many fights and been as intimately connected with calling them.

You know, I get geeked up just to talk about that. The moment, the feelings. Has there been a fight yet? Not necessarily what's the best fight you've been at. And, man, Izzy versus Gastelum, man, that was just... Oh, God, yeah! But, Cage, shelf that one. What I'm asking you is what moment has felt the biggest

when it's, they're about to touch gloves, when it's round one, here we go, and you're just like, you know, because there are different levels, you know, and if it's Habib Conner, it might be, because that was in contention. But what is that moment that you're like, it doesn't get any bigger than this?

Well, when fights have heat and friction on them, right? Usman Covington, too. I mean, we're like shaking because we're just fans. And oftentimes I say there are 13 Super Bowls a year, even if my team's not in the Super Bowl. The NFL Super Bowl and the 12 UFC pay-per-views. There's nothing quite like it. When Rose Namajunas knocked out Ioana, I oftentimes will come back to that moment because I still believe Ioana, the future Hall of Famer, is the greatest strawweight I've ever seen. So I'm not sure that I've ever been that stunned

in that moment, but close second, what Max Holloway did against Calvin Cater on ABC, historically the most statistically great and statistically significant performance in UFC history. None of those records in terms of thrown strikes, landed strikes will ever be duplicated. I was shook backstage with Max, just sheer excitement as an MMA fan

to get a chance to talk to him. I was doing like Facebook quick hits. So I got to go interview him in the back. And I was, I've never been more blown away by a singular performance than Max Holloway on Virtuoso. That night, for sure. I can't believe that speaking of UFC 236, that you called that of course, right?

In Atlanta? Yes. Yes. Unbelievable. We're sitting that close. I was front row of the media. We watched Gastelum out of Sonny, and it's great. And then you got to call Max versus Dustin.

And in any other year, that may have been the fight of the year, and no one ever talks about that. It's like, you know, you're always wondering as a fan, how are they going to top that? Do you ever wonder that in the announce booth? How are we going to top that fight? Does it just happen? Adrenaline is a really powerful thing.

And over an eight-hour broadcast, this is my chief responsibility is to allow the analysts to shine, right? To my right are higher profile individuals that deserve more microphone time. And I'm there to set them up and make them shine. So there are going to be times over an eight-hour broadcast where maybe I'll sense that the energy is ebb and flow. And I need to give more here and give a little bit less there. But, yeah, man, actually that night was pretty crazy because it's like how much more can you give? Like you saw my reaction when you just brought up that fight. That's one of the greatest fights that I've ever called.

And Gastelum still, I don't think gets the credit for for what he accomplished he felt like a champion that night whether members of my staff disagree about that or the future of his career after that he fought like a champion that night brandon thank you very much uh who decides the pairings craig borsari zach candido but i do think that i can tell you guys now that it seems like there is a motivation to domestically have me, Joe, and DC do the pay-per-views. Yeah, that seems like the, unless Joe won't travel or something, that seems like the setup. And Joe was going to come to London, but he just had an issue with the date. We did get him to commit on the air to do that Leon Edwards, Kamaru Usman rematch, but he wasn't able to make

it. But I do think there's a commitment to develop some synergy and chemistry there. You know, at times I've bemoaned the fact that I don't have a more Joe Buck, Troy Aikman relationship with my broadcast partners, right? I mean, we couldn't be closer in terms of the text threads and going to dinner with Rogan in Miami. Everything's fine like that. But during fight week, I'd like to be hanging out with those guys all the time.

And our schedules don't always allow that. You want me to be your Brian Stanton? Is that what you want don't always allow that. You want me to be your Brian Stan? Our schedules allow that. Is that what you want? Our schedules allow that. You want me to be your Brian Stan? As a former Marine, I can be your Brian Stan, bitch. Let me just put that to you very clearly.

I will say this. Listen, the job you do is a great one. It is a highly coveted one. You know we think the world of you. I think you're the greatest of all time and I know you don't like hearing that, but to echo your point, you know? So we're talking about, we see you're the greatest of all time. And I know you don't like hearing that, but to echo your point, you know. So we're talking about, we see you in some ways as a peer, but also as definitely an inspiration and more.

But you cannot do that job without being killed for it half the time, and sometimes it's unfair, sometimes it's fair. What criticism do you hate? What criticism about the, not just you, I mean the broadcast in general that you're involved in, because some of that you have obviously no control over. What criticism do you just cannot stand, but what criticism have you learned from?

I think there's more actually constructive criticism than there is just hate for no reason. So certainly my biggest navigation was that custody battle thing where I had two fighters, Andre Yule and Chris Gutierrez, and they were fighting each other. And for both of those fighters, both of them have a son that is not in their life for one reason or another. And I tried to, in the moment, create some connective tissue,

and custody battle was probably poor phrasing. And as I've said publicly, not a day goes by where somebody isn't bringing up the custody battle to me on social. So that has been frustrating for me because, as I said to you guys earlier, my intention is always to put these guys forward and shine the best possible light on them. And for Chris Gutierrez, who has since become a dear friend of mine, right, like when he wins that fight, he's crying with Joe Rogan because he can't see his son. So I know that I was doing the right thing to bring up his son. I just didn't do it in the right way. And sometimes I get frustrated that now I have to live with that essentially every day.

But my skin is a lot thicker than it was certainly when I started. I try to stay in my lane. I try to sort of adopt the less is more mantra. You know, Pat Summer all back in the day. Touchdown Titans, right? Just back in the day, touchdown Titans, right? Just inflect the right way. It's all you need. Bruce Connell, our late pay-per-view producer would always impart upon me less is more. When in doubt, lay out, don't be afraid to pause. You think people want to hear me talking about Kimora sweeps? Do they? On occasion. Right. And

I, you know, and I, you know, I know what a fucking hip escape is, but generally speaking, right? I want to stay in my lane. I want to, you know, but again, if there are moments where it allows me a bunch of real estate to do play by play, I'm absolutely going to do it. Still the one, the one that always gets me is that you guys have a particular favorite in each, each fight, right. That one, I have a little bit of, I'm like, dude, they couldn't possibly coordinate that if they tried. Oh my gosh. Yeah. And obviously public public perception sometimes can be fueled by the broadcast there's never any sort of agenda and i think there are interpersonal relationships yes there of course is overlap in that sense but what i mean is is there a concerted effort from anik

and his fellow broadcasters to make the crowd or the audience viewing like one fighter more than another that to me has always seemed ludicrous and yet itpresent. Maybe there's nothing you can do about that. Like, it just seems like there's always going to be that kind of thing. You know, I felt a little bit validated when Israel Adesanya fought Jan Bohovic and Kenny Florian said to me, hey, for what it's worth, I know you guys are getting fucking destroyed. I thought Adesanya won the fight, right? So that was the fight in which Joe DiCi and I, I think, absorbed the most criticism because a lot of people felt like Jan Bohovich won that fight

and maybe our call suggested that that fight was a little bit closer than what the masses felt. But I'd say the most constructive stuff for me is just all the scoring stuff, right? Because there are a lot of people who have a very keen eye for this stuff and you guys know the evolution with the scoring and the criteria and dominance, damage, duration,

everything else. Or the de-evolution if you really wanna be. Well, no, I want to well no i mean it's more confusing than it's then it's not and there are a lot of issues too that we could get into behind the scenes i mean there's a two hour conversation here in terms of criteria and judging and everything else but i find a lot of that valuable and that's something that has been an evolution for me in terms of learning that stuff and trying to help my broadcast partners with some of that stuff because you know I even still get rounds wrong like there are scoring experts that I defer to online and Macy Barber recently fought Andrea Lee and again another learning experience for me. Five minutes is a long time in that regard and the system's different how you interpret the rules but knowing

you a long time sports betting is now a monster thing everywhere. Even on UFC broadcasts, you're actually updating during the middle of a fight that the odds have shifted and this guy is now the favorite, even though it looks like he's taking more damage. You were so ahead of the game on being into not only sports betting, maybe in a more degenerate time, but into the idea that it could be mainstream in terms of analysis. Back in the day at ESPN, I remember telling you, I've been like, I don't think you can say that on the air,

that there's a line and that there's betting. What do you make now, having come from that and having always been keen to the lines and the betting of it, that it's so mainstream that you're actually addressing, hey guys, we got another big bet for 10,000 on Adesanya to win tonight. So it's so in my vernacular. It is so second nature to me. Gambling, jargon, prohibitive favorite, all of that stuff is my world and has been since I was at Gettysburg College illegally betting on one of those websites and placing $10 three-team baseball parlays. I've been doing this stuff every day since I was a very little boy. My grandfather's sneaking us into casinos. Gambling is genetic, it runs in my blood. So certainly to see the embrace, however long it took,

was particularly satisfying and fulfilling in some part because I feel like I can talk about, I can take three bong hits, drink eight beers, and I can talk gambling, UFC, like it's nothing, right? Because that stuff is much more in my wheelhouse than mixed martial arts. Sounds like my prep. Well, no, it's like I'm not some lifelong martial artist, but what I am is a lifelong sports bettor. Sure. So yes, it's been absolutely unbelievable. When I retire, I'm going to bet on these fights like crazy. I'm going to lose money. I don't think I would do well if I was contractually allowed to bet on these fights, but it's been great.

And I will say for the record, when Colby Covington came at me, my local bookie in South Florida was ready to go. He was ready to throw down. He was ready. He was good to go. You mentioned this, like what, what is your, or do you have a five or 10 year plan? I know you recently resigned with the organization. What is the, you were you were a free agent for a hot second almost, right? For a second, right? Or maybe getting close to it or something. You had a contract renewal, but I guess I'm wondering what is this next phase for you in your mind going to look like? Well, my 11-year-old daughter says she wants to go to Florida Atlantic and live at home. So that seems very cost efficient. So that could change things, right? But

depends. I don't know, man. Like I'm wondering aloud to you, am I supposed to put three kids through college or they just going to do career training? I don't really know how much money I need to out before a lot of these guys. A hundred nights. At the end of this contract, it'll be a hundred nights a year on the road for 15 straight years. And I feel like then my eldest daughter entering high school maybe deserves to have a little bit more normalcy. Now there's a whole other argument to this. And there's a lot of people who sacrifice a lot more than I do, spend a lot more time away from their families than I do. But I was that homesick camper. Like every time I leave my house, I get emotional now. And I get perpetually more emotional as I get older. So pictures of the dogs get texted by the wife. I start tearing up, you know, you just, you.

So to think that I'll be doing internationals in 10 years, I just don't, I don't see me leaving the U.S. regularly, you know, five, 10 years down the line. But I have my dream job and just trying to sort of navigate that work-life balance you know if I never call an NFL football game I think I would feel just about to ask you a little bit uh unsettled with that you know like feet up in retirement but I'm not blind to the fact that I haven't called any sort of major football game in eight years and uh you know I

kind of I hitched myself to this wagon knowing that, you know, I might not get that opportunity. So that was interesting. So, like, one of the big differences from our perspective on the outside is that I think it's fair to say that UFC's profile with ESPN has certainly grown significantly. But, of course, the Fox deal, I remember how big a deal that was, and it really was. But one of the interesting things was it seemed like Fox Sports would let you guys experiment a little bit more. I know that Mike Goldberg obviously got a chance to call. But even sideline reporting, Megan Olivi got to do some stuff and I think still does. You got a chance to go and moonlight.

I think Brian Stant. There was just a lot of cross-pollination. ESPN seems like a little bit more siloed off, for better or for worse. I wonder, do you still have some designs? Or maybe in the back of your mind, man, it would be kind of cool to call X or Y or Z. So when Craig Borsari my chief boss at the UFC let me call the last college football game in 2015 he said one time only sort of thinking that so I don't know that I would even go back bark back up that tree necessarily unless it was an NFL

opportunity. I also wasn't the number one guy for the UFC when I was afforded that opportunity. So I don't know how I would handle an opportunity, but I love football. You know, I grew up a Patriot season ticket holder from a very young age and that's the biggest sport in my family. So the NFL, I think will always have some pull for me, but I don't know. I think I'm pretty good. You know, there were a lot of people when I left ESPN in 2011 who said, you know, it took you a long time to get to ESPN and now you're just going to leave for this mixed martial arts opportunity. You know, what would have happened had I stayed at ESPN? Would I get myriad football opportunities? I really don't

know. Could I get a college football game right now? I've got a lot of play-by-play guys that are contractually given a lot of games, right? Could I get a game? Maybe. We'll see what Craig Borsari thinks about that. Bro, who has Joe Buck and Troy? They got the cushiest gig in broadcasting, right? Because they're a pair. So when you sign them, you need to sign both, which means they have double the leverage.

Everyone knows them. Everyone hates every football commentator, but at the same time love them. Like people kill Tony Romo, but they love know, they love him at the same time. Pat McAfee's got a pretty good tour. He's got a pretty fucking good deal. But that's the goal, right? To get to a pair that you're a package deal, you're the top slot for all broadcasts.

He's already taken with Brian Stan. I understand. I mean, in other sports, that's got to be the peak, right? Sure. And I also think, too, I work for a promoter. I don't work for the network the ufc still controls the entire live production right so and we're opening up the uh the closet here a little bit but if i was the lead voice of the ufc and espn controlled that production i'd probably make more money okay fair enough right um? Yeah, probably. I'm not saying I would be even 150th

of Joe Buck's stratosphere, but if ESPN pays for the rights to the UFC and then they want me, it's the UFC that wants me to be the number one guy right now. It's not necessarily ESPN. But if ESPN wanted me to be the lead play-by-play voice, you know. Do you feel like, you know, there's been times as a sports fan, there's been like commentators, and I'm like, okay, if that guy's calling or even that girl, if they're calling that fight or that event or that sport, I'll watch. But then if it's someone else, like a lot of times you'll get

your local commentators and it'll be a national game, it's like ugh, I don't want to hear that. The Gus Johnson effect. You'd follow people if they were your guy. Yeah. Do you feel like with the UFC, because the fan turnover is significant. It is. So do you feel like you could be that kind of person for MMA fans? Do you feel like with the UFC, because the fan turnover is significant. It is. So do you feel like you could be that kind of person for MMA fans? Do you feel like you're already that person? I hope so.

I never would have been comfortable even answering that question a few years ago. You know, I think things have changed a lot for me over the last several years. And part of that, candidly, is Joe Rogan putting me over and being so supportive publicly of me. And that's sort of, of I think helping my public approval rating but we're there for 25 plus shows a year the athletes are there for like 1.7 on average right two three fights a year so yeah I mean I take that very seriously and uh ultimately when I hear praise from guys like you that I hold in such high regard it's like at the end of the day you know I'm just a normal dude trying to be as listenable as possible over eight hours. And I'm judged on every utterance.

And in particular with Luke, right, your mixed martial arts acumen is so far elevated compared to mine. Right. And even someone like you might be judging my every utterance. Right. And so the fact that I actually don't, I don't have to worry about you. That's the difference. But yes, I mean, certainly when fans come up to me and say like that was so arrogant you're like I would if you were worse no no what I'm saying is I have such extraordinary trust I don't ever have to worry that he's not going to fulfill that that's what I mean but no I mean I never thought fans would come up to me or write to me like hey it just feels different when you're not there and uh that is the ultimate compliment because ultimately we're trying not to get in the way more than be great you know well I know you wouldn't be here right now if it wasn't for

a little engine that could back in like 2008 at ESPN where getting mixed martial arts to be talked about on digital television or even print was almost still like prostitution or something right or pornography you know it was one of those things but MMA Live happened at ESPN when you and I used to sit next to each other. And the offshoots of that are pretty amazing. You know, the late Anthony Mormile, his son Mike, he's my producer here at CBS Sports, and I love that. Karen Portley, who hired us here, is the other brains behind that. Zach Candido, a name you mentioned, is now producing at the highest level.

Molly Karam, Rashad Evans' broadcasting career got kicked off there. Kenny Florian, shout out to Franklin McNeil, right? F-max. How about Gareth Davies just got shut down by Conor Benn at a big fight. There you go. There you go. In the U.K. I could sing the old theme song here that that fan sent in about, you know,

anecdote, text, and drive, and I get fired up. But looking back on that, man, that got to the level of TV. Granted, at 2 a.m., but that got to the level of TV on ESPN, and suddenly you're at a desk overlooking the arena at a time at ESPN when that was basically impossible. You're not here in this seat in the Octagon without that show. Correct me if I'm wrong. Did you guys not cover the weigh-ins for St. Pierre Penn 2?

It was on ESPN. Do you not remember this? No, vaguely. Was this like UFC 94 or something? Something like that, and I believe, I remember my, I was at the girlfriend I had at the time was watching. I was like, well, this? No, vaguely. Was this like UFC 94 or something? Something like that. And I remember the girlfriend I had at the time was watching. I was like, well, this is now officially big time. Yeah.

Oh, OK. You said, did you guys not? Yes, we did. I thought you were saying that maybe we missed something. No, no, no. I think that was the moment that crystallized. Yes. So UFC 93 and 94, the first two shows that we actually took the show on the road.

So yes, a huge point in time. And my memory isn't great, but I remember a lot of those early conversations as we were fighting for mixed martial arts when nobody gave a hoot. And candidly, Stuart Scott was the guy who probably should have been hosting MMA Live, but it was a digital property on ESPN.com.

And the only reason I got an audition was because I hosted the Mouthpiece Boxing Radio Show. So I was some guy under the digital media banner who had anything resembling a combat sports back up. Literally, if you were a guy sitting there and you had the potential that you could get plugged in it was amazing right I mean I was a researcher on that show just because like you're saying oh that's a fight guy you're working on the show so again it was Brian Kenny Stuart Scott and me essentially if memory serves as the only guys under that roof who had anything resembling a combat sports background so I got the chance to do MMA live and certainly the rest is history. And yeah, there are a lot of people still, you know, making an imprint in the

mixed martial arts world. But yeah, man, just back then. And we're still fighting battles at ESPN. So let's be clear, right? Like there's still kind of what kind of battles? Well, certainly when we were at Fox, we're a major cornerstone of everything they're doing. And that is the case at ESPN. But there are a lot of other – There's competition. There's competition, exactly, during football season and otherwise. And so, yeah, we want as much as possible. You know, we want to, with respect – I can't bang on hockey.

Everybody gets upset when I talk about hockey. But we want that four slot in the mainstream top four. And we think hockey is – I don't think hockey is there anymore. Soccer has taken that. Hockey has a global following that gets me in trouble when I start to talk about hockey. But no, I just feel like the UFC domestically has never been in a better place, but we still have to fight at ESPN. Introducing the new McSpicy from McDonald's.

It looks like a regular chicken sandwich, but it's actually a spicy chicken sandwich. McSpicy. Consider yourself warned. Limited time only at participating McDonald's in Canada. You know, when we do some national appearances for them, you know, maybe the angle at which they're attacking a John Jones fight isn't maybe the angle that I would like them to be attacking it from. I want to go back to the Rogan thing. How did you develop a relationship with him? Because that's got to be weird, right? Because when you began to work with him, he was already a very famous celebrity, and his celebrity has actually only grown over time.

How did you approach trying to be a friend or a colleague? Because it can be weird for folks who've never – when there's someone really famous you have to work with, you almost become subservient in a way unnecessarily, but it can happen. So how did you forge a friendship with him that made it all work? It's a great question and it is a tricky navigation. The first time I worked with Joe Rogan, UFC 155 in 2012 on three days notice, right?

So I've been on the payroll for a year and Mike Goldberg couldn't do the show. So they call me on Christmas Eve, told me I'm getting called up to the big leagues. I was probably stoned. I was probably freaking out, right? But from moment one, he embraced me and pushed out a very nice tweet after the fact,

and then we got a chance to do a fight night together in 2013, but you're right, his celebrity obviously paled back then compared to what it is today, but he's just the real article, he's just such a genuine guy, and I know that that sounds trite, but it's very easy to sort of break down that A-list wall when he's just Joe Rogan, fucking comedian pothead,

talking about coffee. We talk about the UFC. Like people always wanna know what we talk about. Like most of the time we talk about fighting, right? I'm having issues with my podcast studio, so when I see him in Miami, that's like first order of business, what do I do? But for the most part, he's just a super, super guy

and has embraced me to such an extent. And I will say too about Joe, and it's crazy to me that he's he's just a super super guy and has embraced me to such an extent and I will say too about Joe and it's crazy to me that he's never speaks to where MMA isn't the fact that he's never been nominated for a national Emmy he's an elite sports analyst in every part of the job and he has never been acknowledged and that frustrates me at least domestically but he went from being in a two-man booth his whole career and then all of a sudden it's like oh by the way we're letting your play-by-play guy go here's John Anik and we're also gonna stick an athlete on the other side and he didn't blink didn't

bat an eye and I will say humbly I think he's never had more fun doing this job and I think he would admit that to you if he was here and that's our focus is to keep him doing it because everything feels elevated and more dynamic when he's there and i want to make sure that he's still having fun i agree i like his presence there but at the ufc pickup games you're like oh i got rogan i'm posting him up right yeah you dunk on rogan a lot right like the shack gif who is the shack gif where he dunks on the guy and then pushes him oh that was chris dudley chris dudley had to throw the ball out of yeah you're like i'm taking rogan to the post right there no no he makes rogan height jokes that's a thing he does.

He'll make him on half. How many inches do you think I got on Joe? I think you got at least five. I've seen them both in person, maybe three. You're a point guard by nature. I don't know if Joe's got a handle. You know, he's got other careers. He's doing well there in that regard. Might dress like a busboy at this level, but that's fine.

Who among us has it? At a recent Showtime Benavidez versus Plant event. I am that right now, for sure. Who dresses you? Mark Russell. I have a local guy in South Florida. He is outstanding. And I will say, it's so much more about the tailoring and the fit than it is anything else.

Okay, so how does this work? Because I've seen certain television shows where they dress you. Does the UFC give you a stipend? How does it work? It's just totally out of pocket from you. No, so it's been evolutionary. David August, who does Conor McGregor suits did my suits for a while Mark Russell I got connected with him I believe through Gilbert Doreen yo burns who also connected me with my trainers right here at the Institute of Human Performance

Outstanding fucking lettuce on Gilbert burns right now But to me it's just about the fit this dude knows how to fit my body sort of a little bit awkward right long legs I'm kind of barrel chested, right? I don't know if that's the right word, but I'm a little bit thick in the chest. So he's a masterful tailor and a really good dude. The UFC gives him a stipend every year. And, you know, I do trot out a new suit for most pay-per-views, but I never thought of that. Well, that's only because Mark Russell doesn't want me wearing like the same stuff for me it's like I actually approached DC and Joe and I was like dude let's just go black tie for all pay-per-views keep it simple and Joe said he would do it

just that he would do it yeah I think DC is the the bigger issue you can put him in the footlocker sweater put him a sweater with the UFC logo that doesn't work for him right you know you gotta say you can put him in the Foot Locker. Put him in a sweater. Put him in a sweater with the UFC logo. That'd actually work for him, right? You could put him in the Foot Locker thing he wore at WWE. They did not do him any favors with that ref shirt. You know what I'm talking about. When DC filled in. They did not do him any favors. I try not to bang on DC, though.

He's having fun, bro. He's just having... He has set himself up for such a few... Dude, I literally have had conversations with people, not like bullshit people in the industry who have told me like, I think that there's a good chance Cormier could eventually be the face of the UFC. And that's not crazy at all to say. He can do whatever he wants, right?

He could do Good Morning America. He could do movies. He doesn't necessarily want to act. He's turned down a lot of acting opportunities. But I mean, when Israel Adesanya says the world is his oyster after fighting, he ain't wrong. And for DC, he can really do anything in the space. I just think for him and for a lot of us, it's about crystallizing what you want to do and what you don't want to do. Because when I got to ESPN and I got a chance to host on ESPN News, it crystallized for me that I don't want to be a sports center anchor. I don't

want to be doing highlights in a cold studio in Bristol, Connecticut. I want to be doing live events. And if you can crystallize not just what you want to do, but what you don't want to do, I think that can really help. And if you can get someone in your career, like the role John played for me at a certain point, that kicked me in the ass and said that not only you could be, you should be doing this.

Can I take 30 seconds just to say that Brian Campbell was this encyclopedic boxing mind who was sitting in an editor's cubicle. With adult braces for a year, too. He did have braces. And I'm hosting this boxing radio show, and he's this tremendous asset to me. And as our relationship evolved, I'm thinking, dude, how is this dude not on air?

And the cream rises. I needed that, so you believe in me, and the famous story, you're like, I got Bernard Hopkins coming in, and he's my favorite fighter of all time, but you want to interview him? And I didn't take you up on the offer, but those moments matter. So the fact that you

saw something in me and you cared, it's part of why I'm here. I think he just felt bad for you because you were doing whippets in the parking lot. You know, in high school, the Arby's and whatever. This guy literally told me a story, Jay. He told me a story. He's like, dude, this is real. It happened one time. I was in the back of an Arby's doing whippets with my friend. I mean, I don't know if that was a made-for-television story, Jay. He told me a story. He's like, dude, this is real. It happened one time. I was in the back of an Arby's doing

whippets with my friend. I mean, I don't know if that was a made-for-television story, but you know, it could happen. We can cut this part out. It's fine. We can edit it. I just want to say, I was like, you've come a long way. Yeah, but I also added in, you got to get the jamocha shake with the beef and cheddar, which is a perfect transition, because what I know about the John that I used to hang out with every night

in Bristol was, you're not the chost, you're not the chubby host, and you kept that together and i appreciate that but you love yourself a good fast food binge an aggressive fat like a 13 fast food like you at taco bell that time where you're like 74 a taco bell tonight well 74 is a little high yeah yeah so brian knew me at a time in my life where four days a week i was commuting from watertown massachusetts to bristol connecticut 90 minutes each way but i was doing three hours four days a week I was commuting from Watertown, Massachusetts to Bristol, Connecticut. How far is that? 90 minutes each way. But I was doing three hours, four days a week, and we were on that McDonald's train hard. But now the McDonald's order has evolved a little bit, right?

You've got to go with the food modification so that they make it fresh, right? Yes, that's the key. I've always gotten my Big Mac, no cheese, but now we go fucking hamburger, no mustard. You're getting a fresh hamburger. All the other ones that have been sitting there have mustard. I did not know this hack. And there are certainly people in front of you that are going to be clogging up the line anyway, so it's not always me.

What's the most South Florida thing about you now? Gosh, man. See, it's the pop culture questions. Do you have like five guns on you or something? No, I am not a gun owner, but Michael Bisping and I don't like to admit that on camera. Why? Because the whole audience was on the Jan Jan six steps with Pat Millitz. We can probably edit that part out too, but yeah. All right. There you go. Okay. The most South Florida thing about me would just have to be just, I never thought I'd be like that beachy guy, like going

to the beach. I do. Yeah. And I'm 20 minutes from the beach, but, uh, it's, it's a great thing. So yeah, that, and just the whole early nature of my life i'm not really as much of a sports fan anymore because it's 5 30 a.m wake up and usually 9 30 p.m why did you get up at 5 30 well one of my kids you know my son today 4 45 a.m decides that he wants to walk into my room and start his day thanks hunter are we calling him bino is that yeah oh bino yeah you know like i mean did you you did time with bino cook at espn right yeah may he rest in peace the great bino cook but yes the h man hunto hunto bean bino yes uh love that i don't mean to bring a dire note to our fun fast food talk but i was john and this is serious recently diagnosed with a non-alcoholic fatty liver disease

that's true and what my doctor essentially said was, you know, I can see you've you've eaten out of fast food and gas stations for most of your life. And I'm like, it was the way I was raised. So, you know, there is a limit to how much. What was his reputation at ESPN? Not your impression, his reputation. Whimsical. That's a nice way of saying stupid. I mean, it's a nice way of saying head trauma. You know, we clicked right away. But I do think that that I was able to break down his wall maybe more quickly than others. And I would also say that there was a lot of frustration in him that I saw at that point in time because he this is what his future should have been. And it seemed at that point in time

like when I left ESPN I you know I I don't know I would have bet on him but I was trying to bet on him getting the opportunity and when you get hired as an editor it's just hard to hard to change roles yeah that's why I was talking about Laura Sanko too like she started like backstage or side but whatever the MMA equivalent is of sideline reporting I'm like to convince the producers that you can not only you shouldn't do that but that you should in fact be calling the fights in the booth that's almost impossible to do almost impossible right right and thank goodness she's been able to do it because in terms of providing the why and the how

and explaining the grappling in particular she's giving you exactly what an analyst is supposed to be giving you so I look forward to working with her. But yes, it's hard. And again, crystallizing what you don't like to do and don't want to do. And for her, I think that was as important as anything else, right? She might have been able to do both,

but she didn't want to be that reporter and made it known. If your kids, sorry, the last one for me on this one. If your kids wanted to do what you do, would you encourage it knowing how hard it's been for you? I would. I think my eldest daughter sort of, you know, she has read a teleprompter at this point in her educative quest. And I do think that at some point in time that she would probably entertain going into the television world. I don't know that they would necessarily go into sports, but I think that news or television would appeal to them.

And, you know, they're still very much in their formative years and not really understanding what they want to do. But they are a little bit enamored with, like, fame, you know. They like when daddy gets recognized. Just not by Colby Covington. I mean, maybe you should have, being a South Florida guy, you could have advised Colby that the pivot was to go the DeSantis way ahead of 24. That was the pivot.

But to close on that full circle, you've said great things to us on and off camera about your many broadcast partners, a lot of them great UFC champions who have made that transition. Is there anyone that's an active fighter? Whether or not you think they're made for broadcasting or not, but you're like, that personality or getting to know them a little, I love to call a fight with them. Because I always wonder, what would Conor McGregor look like in an actual fight calling? Someone of that level of fame. You ever come across a fighter? You're like, I may see them one day on the booth. There are a lot of guys.

Now, there are certainly guys who are doing it right now. Michael Kies and Anthony Smith are the first two that come to mind. What I love about Anthony Smith is that he's critical and he don't give a rip who he offends. Because at the core, not my job, but the analysts, and not telling the guys anything they don't know, but you need to be critical. And I think Michael Bisping and Anthony Smith

are probably our most unabashed, fearless, critical analysts, and I give them a lot of credit for that. Michael Chiesa is just a natural, just fucking eats fight film, so certainly for him, I think, as a guy who's called fights before, deserves to get an opportunity. But the dark horse for me, a guy with a little bit higher a profile who is making his debut in Miami, Dustin Poirier,

because as he's gotten more comfortable in his own skin, he is just more liberated as a speaker and really doesn't care. Even if you look at the way he handled the post-fight stuff with Michael Chandler, kind of still going at him. So I do think Dustin, if he finds his voice, could really excel and be a critical voice for us. But there's so many talented people. You know, I do think Dustin, if he finds his voice, could really excel and be a critical voice for us. But there's so many talented people. You know, I even think Dean Thomas as a coach could migrate and just move forward and be with us. I don't see any reason he couldn't have a hot mic the whole time. But I try to stay in my own lane and not produce.

Do you watch, whether accidentally or on purpose, other MMA or other boxing broadcasts, any other combat sports broadcasts that you watch? I do, but minimally at this point in time. I watch the PFL to support my guy Kenny Florian for sure. And I try to support the other play-by-play guys. You know, I acknowledged Sean O'Connell recently when I thought he had a particularly good championship call. What a great revelation he turned out to be, right?

Like, unbelievable. So, yes, I mean, I do watch the PFL for my guy Kenny Florian. And I like this version of Ken Flo, right? Born 1976, get a little hostile at this stage of his life. We like the more or my guy Kenny Florian. And I like this version of Ken Flo, right? Born 1976, get a little hostile at this stage of his life. We like the more ornery Kenny Florian. Yeah, he's got a little edge to him on his PFL broadcast, right? All of a sudden, you start staring down the barrel of 50,

and it's, you know. You're like, who the fuck am I trying to? Right. I mean, we're washed. We were in our mid-40s. But you know, career-wise, we're doing all right. You're lucky, what you are. John Aniket has been an extreme

pleasure. South Florida's finest. But, you know, the voice of the sport we cover, and I wish you many more fast food windows and a safe amount of... I mean, it's like, I'm going to go to McDonald's on my way home. I do have one more. So, like, if you look at the role

of what you do, in MMA there's no one above you. Who's the most high-profile MMA combat sport or MMA? Play-by-play guy. It's you so then I ask just everyone thinks just getting to that role is the achievement But of course living it as a different thing So I guess I would ask it this way. What do you want to do? Like what do you still want to achieve? What are the things that you've not done? Is it just the perfecting the task the G Giro dreams of sushi bit, or is there another level of something you haven't quite reached? I have internal goals, I think, as far as the

broadcast is concerned, right? I have an identical twin who looks and sounds like me and is my foremost critic, so he and I chew up my broadcast pretty good. Like, we're not satisfied necessarily with these shows, time in and time out. I still think my pay-per. Like we're not satisfied necessarily with these shows time in and time out. I still think my pay-per-view opens could be better. So there's a lot of skill development that goes on. And when I'm watching film and listening to the other UFC play-by-play guys and trying to sort of figure out maybe things that they do well or don't do well that I can pick up on, you know, as far as my life is concerned, I think I do have an aspiration to teach a little bit. You know, I taught at the Connecticut School of Broadcasting for a time. So I feel like that could be sort of

where I could really give back to try to teach broadcast journalism. And I got a chance to guest teach a class at UNC Charlotte recently and really enjoyed that. But yeah, I mean, I don't know. I always feel like I'm being chased and I always feel like I have to earn this seat. And I treat every fight night like a pay-per-view and i'm doing a deep dive on steve garcia every single time whether it's his fifth ufc fighter's 15th and uh part of that is that my memory isn't great and i need to go back and do that deep dive but um yeah man i don't know man like i'm trying to i'm trying to beat the guys who are trying to come up and take my job and i approach every show that way i really do well shout out to your brother jason annick for the success he's had on the Remember the Podcast.

Yeah, Remember the Show. Remember the Show. Excuse me. I misremembered the name of the show there with Balaam. It was the one job you had. Yeah. I did the same thing recently to Steven Jackson. I was like, your new show, Fight Camp, it's great.

He's like, yeah, Fight Towns. Fight Towns is even better. And there we go. But is that a dream, too, you and your brother one day doing something? So we host an NFL podcast called Annex Squared. And, yes, I mean, the dream is to take that thing five days a week and do, like, a five-day-a-week sports show with my twin brother. Wow.

And then, you know, I have internal goals. Like, you guys got a lot more hardware than I do, right? So, you know, like, maybe, you know, win an award at some point in time would be cool. Hey, we've done that a few times. A lot of times. We have rigged the vote. Stop,

stop, stop the steal. A lot of hardware. I need, you know. Annex out there tweeting, stop the steal. You know,

we have very aggressive fans, John, and that's a good thing until they eventually, uh, commandeer your organs in a dark tub in an empty building somewhere in Chicago. But seeing you guys do that live show, like, was just so cool.

It was fun, man. The next time we do that, make sure if you're around, you're a guest on that. Yeah, we'd love to have you on next time. Because you are a fan favorite, John Anik. We appreciate that. I would double-egg Colby if that was a serious threat, but it wasn't. It's just fun and games, okay? So back off, people.

Hey, man, thanks for making time for us. I appreciate you guys. Can't wait to hear the call on Saturday, as we do every Saturday. Thank you, guys. It means a lot. John Anik. No more sleeps. It's over.

Thank you.