MORNING KOMBAT WITH LUKE THOMAS AND BRIAN CAMPBELL - Paul Defeats Diaz | UFC Nashville Recap | Cory Sandhagen | PFL | ONE FN 13 | Ep 474

Episode Date: August 7, 2023

On Episode 474 of Morning Kombat Luke Thomas is Joined by Shakiel Mahjouri to recap the weekend of fights. The guys start out with Jake Paul's win over Nate Diaz. What, if anything, did we learn from this bout? They also break down UFC Nashville. Cory Sandhagen got the job done against Rob Font, but did he really punch his ticket to a title shot? Did Tatiana Suarez prove she's all the way back? The guys also recap discuss PFL and One before Dm's from Donks. (6:00) - Jake Paul vs. Nate Diaz (37:00) - Cory Sandhagen (54:00) - Tatiana Suarez (69:10) - Rest of UFC Nashville (75:00) - PFL & One Fight Night 13 Recap (96:00) - Dm's from Donks Morning Kombat is available for free on the Audacy app as well as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Stitcher and wherever else you listen to podcasts.     For more Combat Sports coverage subscribe here: youtube.com/MorningKombat   Follow our hosts on Twitter: @BCampbellCBS, @lthomasnews, @MorningKombat    For Morning Kombat gear visit:morning kombat.store   Follow our hosts on Instagram: @BrianCampbell, @lukethomasnews, @MorningKombat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Introducing the new McSpicy from McDonald's. It looks like a regular chicken sandwich, but it's actually a spicy chicken sandwich. McSpicy. Consider yourself warned. Limited time only at participating McDonald's in Canada. Reveille, reveille, dogs. Look at us now, tip to tip. This is our life. This is our passion.

That's the spirit we bring to this show. I'm Luke Thomas. I'm Brian Campbell. This is Morning Combat. Hey, lucky number seven. That's what's going on here. Hi, everyone, on this seventh day of August 2023. My name is Luke Thomas, and welcome to my crooked-ass shot that I've got.

And this is my fault. Damn it. I'm going to have to fix this in just a second. Hi, everyone. Welcome. It's Morning Combat on this seventh of August 2023. My name is Luke Thomas. I am one half of your hosting duo.

I join you from the capital, the status of needles, right here in Washington, D.C., with one of several Canadian correspondents that we have, but this one is a member of the CBS family. It was my birthday, and no one sang me, I got none of that, but here he is. It's Shaq Majorey. Hi, Shaq. How are you?

I'm doing well, Luke. I just want to say for the birthday wishes, as a child of divorce, I understand it's hard to see your two dads in this case separated but i got my pro wrestling t on i had a sausage mcmuffin for breakfast because it was too early for a gas station hot dog i'm ready to bring that bte i'm gonna do my best to fill in for brian campbell well the the secret to uh bc is that he doesn't have any of those things

except the black liver but um but if you ate the sausage McMuffin, you're well on your way. We actually have a lot to get to today, believe it or not, because we are coming off of a fairly busy combat sports weekend. So Paul Diaz was on Saturday, and that went, I think, about as expected. We'll talk about that. UFC Nashville did not really go as expected for, I think, the audience, maybe, depending on your perspective there as well. And, of course, we had some other pieces of the MMA landscape as well.

PFL won championship, had a show on Friday night. We'll get to all of that, plus your questions for DMs from Donks and more. So thumbs up if you're watching here on YouTube. Hey, give us a subscription. It's free. It doesn't cost you a thing, and we appreciate that when you do. You can see all the socials there below for morning combat as well as shack and myself you can see everything there from twitter and instagram and everything else uh on top of it

shack are you on tiktok you know what uh my wife is very active on tiktok my clips aren't clicking like yours man i'm trying to post there i'm not getting any traction i'm gonna keep trying to figure it out but we're closing in at 25 000 on youtube so that's really been my focus the shout out to everyone for making that happen dude i had one so like the thing about tiktok is i had one clip go super mega viral where with just one clip i added i think like 50 or 60 000 followers on tiktok But the problem is I haven't been able to replicate that kind of content to keep those people up. So like nothing else I posts gets any of that similar kind of traction. So it's been a little bit of a weird run, but I will say this, your ability to go

viral on TikTok is legit. Like when people like Instagram, it's very hard to go viral. It's not that hard on TikTok. You can, you can, is is it is it shameful that i'm probably like half your age and you probably have a far better grasp on this tiktok sphere than i know because i'm sad and desperate that's the difference you know what i'm saying i'm like just hanging on for relevancy the best i can so that would that's what would separate us in this account uh did you have a good weekend by chance did you do anything of note out there in where you're in the Vancouver area, right? Yes, sir. Me and my friends do an annual cabin trip every year, ninth annual one.

So went up there, got some R&R, drank a little bit too much. But, you know, the last time we did the show was coming off my bachelor party in Las Vegas. And I didn't realize what a toll not sleeping for three nights took on me until right when we went on the air so i made sure to get the extra large coffee today i'm ready i'm feeling good bro you gotta be caffeinated i always tell people high energy it looks it looks simple until you're out there doing it and then it's a lot harder right uh let's remind everyone showtime.com is the label that pays showtime.com 30-day free trial if you'd like it you, you can keep it. If not, you may bounce. Of course, MorningCombat.store for all of the merch. And again, BC has been kind of teasing that there's a fairly big announcement coming.

There probably is. I don't have one for you today, but stay tuned. We got something in the works for you there, finally. And then last but not least, to reach the show, MorningCombat at gmail.com for the producers therein. All right there, Shaq. If you're ready to get going, I am ready as well. Good to go?

Let's rock. Let's do it. So let's start with topic number one, which is going to be the biggest fight of the weekend. Didn't say best. Didn't say most relevant. Just biggest. Of course, that's going to be Jake Paul defeating Nathan Nate Diaz via unanimous decision over on DAZN pay-per-view slash ESPN plus pay-per-view, whatever, on pay-per-view. It was a fight that was carried by the DAZN broadcast team.

And Shaq, I'll say this. It went kind of how I thought it would. I missed it in real time, but then I tweeted folks being like, what did you get from it? And most folks thought they got what they had expected. And then I went back and I watched it, and sure enough, that was my takeaway. So let me ask you this. What, if anything, did we learn about either competitor or anything related to this from this bout? You know, you talked a lot with Brian in advance of the card, and I kind of felt the same way on the exit.

We need something new to sort of revitalize what this whole Jake Paul boxing experience is, right? I think there's a morbid curiosity that makes it compelling, whether that's Jake Paul's fighting a UFC fighter in Ben Askren, and then it's the escalation to a UFC champion and Tyron Woodley. Then you've got Anderson Silva, who's of a similar size and has pro boxing experience. The Nate Diaz fight felt like a big cash in on name value and something where fans maybe were there more to support and encourage Nate getting that big payday than anything. But it was really like a sidestep or probably even a step back in terms of competitiveness based on size, experience, age, all these factors. I think we're getting a little lethargic about this whole experience, right? We were in this at the beginning to see

what Jake Paul could accomplish. We know where his level is at now. We were there to see Jake Paul get knocked out. I don't think anyone expected Nate Diaz to lend that one hitter quitter. So I think this was really more a celebration as an MMA fan of enjoying that Nate Diaz is sort of anti-establishment spirit in the UFC, getting

that exit, getting his big payday. But I feel like this juice has pretty much been squeezed out of Jake Paul versus MMA fighter unless we somehow get like Conor McGregor and the UFC to agree to do a crossover. I think you got to start going back into that sort of like celebrity influencer direction. The KSI is the Tommy Fury's. I think that audience is still more interested than the general combat sports fan is. I think I would largely agree with that, but I'm going to take something of a slightly more positive tone. Not to say your tone is negative, but I just mean this. Having covered... So let me ask you, Shaq, have you ever been to any Jake Paul fight live in attendance?

Cannot say I have. I mean, you know, you're not missing a whole lot. But it was... I mean, it was really revelatory, right? So, for example, I was there for both Woodley fights and then the Silva fight. And the Silva fight was like, this was really on display, where it was just nothing but MMA fans in the audience. Like, they were showing crowd shots of David Benavidez,

who has a fight apparently coming up, according to recent reports, against Demetrius Andrade. And the crowd didn't even bump. And we were in Arizona, which is where he's from and then they showed like Sugar Sean O'Malley who of course is obviously got a big name but the crowd like it was it was this big thing you know so um I I it it imparted some wisdom about like what makes this all work what he's trying to do but here's what I think is what the the takeaway for me from all of this.

Basically, basically, both sides got what they wanted out of this. Yeah. Right? So, Dick, to your point, let's start with that one, the Nate Diaz side. What did Nate Diaz want? Nate Diaz, I mean, yes, he wanted the win and he didn't get the win. Okay. Like, he fell short there. But he was doing that fake guillotine thing, which, of course, is the choke,

which is not not going to be legal in any kind of boxing contest as a sort of a way to signal to the audience like hey you know if this was a different fight you guys know what would be up here and i think the crowd bought into it they really liked it as well but it was principally about was getting the money that's what this was about this was about getting money and according to John Nash, who spoke to the manager of Nate Diaz, he is going to pocket somewhere between $15 and $20 million for this effort. Vastly more than he ever got for the second Conor McGregor fight. Like a huge amount.

So I think fans were happy to see him get a little bit of freedom. Happy to carve his own path and get a huge payday. Mission accomplished. Mission accomplished. The MMA fans, and in particular the Nate Diaz fans, I don't think they really look at this like some kind of disreputable loss. On the other hand, for Jake Paul, what did he get out of this? Well, he was coming off of the Tommy Fury fight, which, you know, cards on the table, I thought he was

going to win and he didn't. And he needed to get right. He needed a big name to get right, to get back in the winning track, to then set up whatever subsequent opportunity he was going to get. Obviously, he got a big payday from this as well, Shaq. But my point being is, Jake Paul needed a little bit of redemption against a known name. Mission accomplished. Mission accomplished. I feel like both guys needed something from this particular moment in time and shack both of them got it what am i missing here no i think you're right on the money here it was

it is all of these i mean our business transactions but it was very clear what both guys needed out of this and they got it you know this is the bounce back jake paul needed to get the next big fight imagine had he lost. He had already said that he, for a split second, pondered retirement after the Tommy Fury night, just kind of that evening and the day after. And he sort of used it as motivation to press forward. But if Jake Paul goes in there and loses against the smaller, older, less pro-boxing experienced opponent, what do you really give him? I mean, you could still turn around

and do that KSI fight no matter what, which is, I think, the direction we're heading. But he needed this, right? This was completely, I think, going to fall off the rails if he suffered two consecutive defeats, first against a semi-legitimate pro-boxer and then against a UFC fighter with no pro-boxing experience.

And like I said, dude, I'm just happy to see Nate get money. That guy is such an, him and his brother are both like these MMA folk heroes. I feel like we've really gotten a good stretch of luck with that guy, especially after how he was kind of getting cornered into that Hamzat Shemaya fight in his last UFC appearance. Hamzat misses Wade at the final moment when he gets around and fights Tony Ferguson like you want to see some of MMA's good guys win from time to time and I feel like the last year has been just a victory lap after victory lap for Nate Diaz yeah that's probably pretty fair uh ultimately so it leads me to actually

let me before I get to the second part of this question grade the fight for me did you enjoy the fight give me like a abcdf grade where are you on this one i'll give it a b like there was you know like i mentioned when we first got into this jake paul experience i think everyone was hoping to see the guy land flat on his back or face first into the canvas. That doesn't appear like it's going to happen anytime soon based on the people that he's being matched with. But especially after that scare earlier where Nate Diaz almost took a tumble out of the ring off the knockdown, to see him just sort of have his moments, win a round here or there, sort of take the cardio edge and land a lot of body shots.

And just generally have fun with it. Turning his back. Snatching that rear naked choke. Going for a single leg takedown. It was competitive enough. And I think the MMA fans' expectations are now sort of tapered enough. Where you could kind of just take it for what it is. Be happy that Nate didn't get seriously hurt in there.

I'll give it a solid b you know it went how i expected it to go it didn't go as badly as it could have yeah i mean it wasn't spence crawford right we could say that very very easily about that one i'd probably give it if i'm giving it a grade as just a fight you know you got to grade it on a curve for what it is um you know i'm somewhere in the C plus B minus territory, which is like, it was fine, right? It was fine. You know, it was kind of funny, actually.

Here's the thing that really stood out to me about it all. Like, obviously Jake is better. And, you know, was Nate even taking it seriously, right? Where he's like turning and walking to the crowd and like chatting with them. And then, you know, going for the guillotine, as you indicated, the single leg and just a bunch of other stuff.

You're like, you couldn't even tell if he was really taking it all that seriously. In fact, it didn't seem like he was. Again, this was really principally about just getting a payday, and he got it, and I'm happy for him. It's been long overdue that he should have been making paydays like this, so I'm happy for Nate Diaz on this Monday morning. But the thing that really stood out to me was, and this kind of leads me to the next place,

Nate surged a little bit later. Obviously, he got dropped in round five. He got viciously beat on, basically, in the first round, but he survived. It looked like he had a bit of a comeback maybe happening in the fourth, then gets dropped in the fifth, and then the rounds kind of lingered. And then by the, I would say, the ninth or the tenth,

maybe even early as the eighth, you begin to see him really put some pressure on Jake. And to your point, take a couple of rounds. So it's something of a moral victory in that sense. But here's the part that really stands out to me because it leads into the next question. Now, so I've covered Jake Paul again. The two Woodley fights and then the Silva fight. fight um what stood out to me was going into the silva fight i had picked silva to win because i thought he was trying to bite off more than he could chew jake paul and i thought it was a bridge

too far then he came out much improved in that fight and to to his credit i'll say this for jake paul he's dropped everyone he's ever faced right and? And that includes Tommy Fury, and that includes Nate Diaz in his last two contests. But the level of progress to me, while noticeable, has somewhat diminished. And I won't say stalled, but there's not been a substantial amount of progress, in my view, since the Silva fight. And for example, he just could not keep Nate off of him.

In close, when Nate can work those combos over the top and like you know everything is nice and in tight yeah there was some uppercuts that Jake was able to land but in general that's going to be Nate's kind of fighting for sure you saw that and to me like the ring craft the jab the things that you would really need to maintain distance and do the kind of game you would want against a accomplished boxer if he even ever gets there I just didn't see a lot of evidence of that. So let me pitch this question to you as follows. We'll talk about Nate in just a second, but where does the Jake Paul experience go from here?

We're both agreeing that getting right by beating Nate Diaz is valuable, but what does it lead to next? It has to be either the winner or the loser of the ksi tommy fury fight that's happening this later this year i can't off the top of my head name an mma free agent that's going to come anywhere close to what nate bs had to offer monetarily also if you look at the pay-per-view buys for his recent fights you know the first Tyron Woodley fight did well. Second one dipped a lot, if memory serves. And the Anderson Silva one didn't do very well.

And then you had a huge uptick for the Tommy Fury fight. I do believe that when you go to, you know, you mentioned going to a lot of these shows, you are the Jake Paul superfan in attendance for every single fight, Luke. Sure, I believe you that the MMA crowd is populating the arena that night, but I'm not convinced there's enough MMA fans making pay-per-view purchases. And you always talk about a morning combat, that the mainstream audience is the one you really need to sort of push ticket sales, drive pay-per-view buys. I think that market that's sort of interested in the YouTube

crossovers and stuff like that is probably bigger than the general combat sports fans' appetite to buy these fights. So Jake Paul, KSI, they don't like each other. Logan Paul is obviously Jake's brother, business partners with KSI. There's a lot of juice to squeeze there. If Tommy Fury wants to do the rematch, it was a split decision fight. Like you mentioned, Jake got the knockdown. So there is something you can kind of sell there. Got the knockdown. And I don't know if you're aware of this.

I may have brought it up to you last time, right? But in December, there's this YouTuber, Ludwig, and he had basically, I don't know if you're aware of this, it's chess boxing. So it's alternating rounds of boxing and chess. It's the dumbest thing on earth but that thing got like three million streams over 300 000 concurrent viewers i think the youtube sort of like gen z audience is the one you really need if you're trying to get big pay-per-view numbers across here so i'm mostly in agreement with that i think you're right i mean i think

it's either going to be ksiSI or Tommy Fury next for him because that's just an enormous audience. You haven't heard this, or maybe you did, but Scott Christo, he runs a good boxing site called Bad Left Hook. He gets shit from MMA. Excuse me, he gets shit from boxing fans. They're like, hey, why are you covering these Jack Paul fights? And he's like, well, if you cared as much about Emmanuel Navarrete

taking on Valdez or whatever I wouldn't have to cover these but you don't so this is how he pays the bills but the point being is for us Jake Paul picked a fight with MMA and it worked for a while especially when he flatlined you're right that the second Woodley fight didn't do that great necessarily but he flatlined him and that highlight like wow was huge and so then Silva was supposed to come along and then be the savior and it didn't work so now between Askren which you know he never really took seriously as a significant striking threat and then Silva Woodley and now Nate Diaz it's pretty clear that any aging veteran who's even capable of taking these fights is

probably not going to beat him and but the other part is here Shaq is he's not putting these guys away either yeah he's dropped everyone but he didn't put him away and so I feel like the rivalry between Jake Paul and MMA which has fueled a lot of these fights that is sort of slowly going away to your point I feel like if Jake pivots to boxing where you have other real boxing opponents or the YouTube boxing thing, KSI, whoever else is available in that genre, I don't know enough of the names,

then that seems to me something he could potentially do. They're both competitive and they're big enough fights. But how much longer can Jake bait the MMA audience into watching him fight against guys he should beat? Now, I wonder about this. I don't know if the UFC would allow it, but let's assume that they would. What kind of pay-per-view buys does Jake Paul versus Jorge Masvidal do? Ooh.

That's interesting. You see, I wish I knew how many pay-per-view buys this one did because I would really put things into context uh it would certainly do more than the Anderson Silva fight which if memory serves correctly was hovering something around like 300 000 I think two to three hundred thousand for sure this would do at least half a million I think that's undoubtable Tommy Fury did I think roughly I was looking at some reports earlier today like 850 000 i don't know i don't think it eclipses a million at this rate but i could see it doing in the 5 to 750 category maybe even 8 900 yeah i'm getting a lot of numbers clearly i'm not that familiar yeah no i mean i think it would do well i mean they're friends or at least they have appeared to be friends at times i don't really know what the current status of that

relationship is or whether jorge has the contractual leeway to pursue something like that. So I just don't know. But I guess the point I'm trying to make is, yes, there might be some names like that, but no one's bringing that up. He's not even bringing that up. No one seems to be chasing. And if so, that's not there. I know that he was having the back and forth with Conor McGregor,

but again, Conor's under contract with UFC, so that's just not going to happen really anytime soon my point is that rivalry with UFC appears to be all right sorry not with UFC well somewhat with UFC too actually like here's the funny part about it dude Dana White did the UFC Nashville thing I don't even know if he did the post fight presser I'm assuming he I know I know he was there did anyone even ask him about Jake Paul I mean I'm sure there must have been one or two questions, but it wasn't even a big thing, right? So we're going to probably get to it with the next topic a little bit. I was on vacation, so I didn't see the Post-Spy Presser,

but I saw reports that Dana White actually left during round four of Corey Sanhagen. I saw that as well. So I'm not sure if he ever made it back. Yeah, so maybe he didn't. I don't know in the end. But okay, so let me ask this then. Let's turn the conversation over to Nate Diaz. It is my belief and it sounds like it is yours that this this loss didn't really cost him i mean it doesn't look great losing uh but none of his fans who

really like him for who he is i think are going to hold this against him. So A, can I get you to comment on that, whether you agree? And then B, all right, let's set this up. Based on what he said and based on everything that worked here, what is next for Nate Diaz? Yeah, I don't think his stock dropped at all. I think fans knew what they were getting into with this one. It sounds like his intentions are to go back to the UFC. I know him and Dana White sort of have a contentious relationship when it comes to negotiating,

but they seem to sort of like each other on a personal level. Dana had nothing but nice things to say about Nate Diaz on the way out. Nate Diaz really propped up the UFC in his post-fight speech after beating Tony Ferguson. He's probably headed back there. Now, maybe there is enough drive after this huge payday that he might look at doing some other sort of boxing crossovers, if there's names, because we know that the high end of boxing pays a lot more than the high end of UFC and MMA overall.

It's possible. I know we've been kind of talking about Nate and Jake running it back um in MMA I imagine that cannot happen in the UFC because Jake Paul is signed with MMA I wonder if Nate has sort of an allegiance to the UFC that's going to prevent him or sort of deter him from going to PFL but I know it's silly but I think there's enough intrigue as to, you know, how someone like Nate Diaz can sort of bridge the boxing experience and the size and the strength and the age in a sport like MMA, where he has a much more well-rounded skill set. If I'm the one making the decision, think diaz versus paul and mma is

sort of the direction we could go or else i think they'd head it back to the ufc and hopefully they can just kind of give them some like fun legend versus legend fights yeah i gotta tell you i don't get the paul versus diaz and mma thing like first of all let me just say this i'm not even i mean okay well texas exists so this is debatable. But it would at least be questionable to me about whether or not you could even get this sanctioned by a commission. Right? So you're talking about a guy who's got vast MMA experience versus a guy who's got none. Right?

And, you know, yes, he's got combative athletic experience and some, like, valuable ones. You know, going the distance with Anderson Silva is valuable. That's not nothing. But you get what I'm saying. We're just talking about a guy who's got no combative experience in any of the other things in any measurable way beyond whatever he did in high school. It just doesn't really prepare you for a guy like Nate Diaz. I don't even know if they would sanction that. Moreover, even if they did, even if they did sanction it, is there any doubt about how this would go you kind of thought well Jake's gonna win in boxing

maybe Nate can sneak one out late and again he had a moral victory in the end kind of surging there a little bit towards the end but in MMA it's like dude this is a done deal like there's just almost nothing that Jake Paul could do to make that fight competitive at all. So I don't really get that. I mean, here's where I'm at on this one, Shaq. I think if you're Nate Diaz, who's not too far from 40 at this point, you have to ask yourself, how many big fights are out there? How many big fights do I have left? Right?

How many big fights do I have left? Jorge's gone, so there's no BMF rematch. You would think the Conor fight would be available. That's something you could do. I don't think they'd do the Leon Edwards fight, but one never knows. I mean, again, that seems deeply unlikely. But, you know, there's just, if you're actually asking which fights are available to Nate where you could get a shit ton of money, the Paul one in MMA, should he decide to go that

direction, does exist. But I just don't know if you could really sell the audience on it in a big way. Whereas with the Connor fight, even if the UFC took a bigger cut, you just know that's a guaranteed bonanza. It's a guaranteed bonanza. And if you've got a finite time left in the sport,

why would you waste it doing things of questionable value? Yeah. I think if there's legitimate interest in booking Nate Diaz versus Conor McGregor, I shouldn't even say interest, if there's a legitimate path to doing it because we've been talking about Conor McGregor fighting all year and we're no closer to it happening now

than when we were when UFC first announced Conor McGregor versus Michael Chandler. So I've kind of checked out of Conor. You know, I'll believe it when I see it. I look forward to it. But if you're Nate, I think you kind of have to ask yourself, or at least you have to talk to the UFC and being like, is Conor going to fight again?

Can you make any promises to me that Conor McGregor will fight in this time frame? You will book him against me. If so, that's the direction to go. I do think you might be underestimating the interest in Paul versus Diaz in MMA. And I say that after going on this little retreat with my friends that I talked to you about earlier today. The casual sort of consumer of these Jake Paul fights, they don't know a lick about combat sports, right? The reason it's worked is because they hear multi-time MMA champion Ben Askren. He must be Jake Paul. UFC champion Tyron Woodley. He must be Jake Paul.

I think the caveat of putting it into MMA, when I was watching this Jake Paul fight, I had people walking up to me who don't consume combat sports at all. Like, oh, that's Jake Paul. They know Jake Paul. They don't know Nate Diaz. And they asked, well, shouldn't the UFC guy be beating the brakes off of Jake Paul? This consumer that this sort of genre is targeting isn't the majority shareholder that's interested in this. I don't think knows a ton about MMA.

And considering the fact that Jake Paul won in boxing, saying, you know, here's this guy who's been whooping on UFC fighters and MMA fighters in boxing, now Jake is going to try and do it in their own sport. There's probably enough of a sort of sideshow interest in it. And if you're a fan who's been waiting to see Jake Paul get slept, wouldn't you want to see Nate Diaz choke him out? Like, isn't this the perfect opportunity

to finally make good on all of that time you've invested, fight after fight, going to bed disappointed, waking up depressed that your heroes are all getting whooped by Jake Paul, the YouTuber in a boxing ring? This is your chance for redemption. So I think there's a casual audience who doesn't really know what's going on.

I think there's probably an MMA audience who wants to see Jake Paul finally lose. And the fight would at least, I think, be more interesting than, let's say, Randy Couture versus James Toney back in the day, where you have an all-american wrestler just take the guy down right away sleep him i think nate diaz traditionally you know he shoots like one takedown per fight that's not he's not gonna try and go out there and immediately double like jake paul he's gonna try and make it fun i think at least aesthetically it'd be more pleasing than some of the other boxing mma crossovers we've seen in mma yeah i guess i guess i mean you're definitely right that the typical consumer for this is just not really a

fight fan right they're just people who are sort of pop culture fans and this is how they're assigning their time with it is to watch stuff like this i buy that completely at the same time it's like i don't know i don't know it's i i uh it's okay to be sad luke it's not even i'm not even sad about the only thing that kind of stands out to me about this is you could be right about this fight in mma i don't i don't know if they're doing the pfl 10 million guarantee again if the whole goal of this one was to get a payday why would it change for the next one i understand that argument too i do i i would want to see what commission sanctions it and under what rules but yeah that could be a real stumble.

Yeah, I mean, but Texas is like, you know, they don't give a shit. They'll just sanction just about anything. So, you know, you couldn't do it in probably New York, right? You couldn't do it there. You couldn't do it in California. But could you do it in Texas or Florida? Maybe. maybe the thing I'll say about it all like to kind of wrap up here a little bit is over time I've kind of wondered like what damage would it do to the sport for MMA guys to keep getting

clobbered by Jake Paul because it keeps it keeps happening you know and in the end like didn't they take this all that seriously no is he a 185 fighter no you know is he a boxer no but with the like with Woodley it it was like, okay, well he was an all American wrestler, but it wasn't really a striker. Right. So it really kind of limits what you can say about him and Askren, you know, he had just retired or whatever. Like this was completely a separate situation. Obviously Askren was an esteemed athlete in his own world and wrestling during his time. But you know, Silva was a striker and didn't just have finishes with his legs. He had finishes with his hands as well.

And Nate, most of his finishes either with submissions or with his hands at the same time. Like, it's his best prowess. And here he is getting thoroughly outboxed. Now, I know what the truth is, which is that MMA boxing is just radically different than regular boxing. But that doesn't matter to the average consumer to the average consumer do you worry that there is some kind of cost to be paid for watching mma fighters getting beat up by a guy who couldn't beat tommy fury i think that was the initial fear when this all started happening like i'm not exaggerating i remember watching the ben askren knockout i remember watching the second tyron woodley

knockout loss. And I went to bed and I woke up feeling as bad as I did when I was binging Breaking Bad. It was just demoralizing to see this happen to the sport that I love. But UFC's continuing to sell out arenas. We're about a month away from UFC 293. There's no main event announced as far as I'm aware.

The UFC brand is very strong. People are turning out for these shows. I'm not super worried about it. I think the fans who know know and the fans who are tuning into this and they're not regular or even semi-regular consumers of MMA or boxing. I don't think they really care. I think they're here for the cultural experience of it. I don't know what evidence there is since this Jake Paul experiment started to now to show me that the impression of MMA has drastically changed. And please, for the love of God, no Nick Diaz versus Jake Paul.

I can't see that happen to my guy. Yeah, he was there saying he was looking to fight one of the Paul brothers. I don't know if that's... guy. Yeah, he was there saying he was looking to fight one of the Paul brothers. I don't know if that's... That seems like that could happen, right? Yeah, I mean, it's... We kind of ignored it throughout this topic. That's probably the easiest fight to make if you want to make it next.

He is of a similar size to Jake Paul, so that's nice. But, man, do you have any confidence after that absolute drubbing he took from Robbie Lawler? And it wasn't just the fight. It was the condition in which he came in. It was the retirement late in the fight. He did not look like he wanted to be there, and that's not who you want to match up with a young, heavy hitter in Jake

Paul. Logan Paul is probably certainly the worst boxer of the two Paul brothers. If anything anything i would maybe consider pairing that one up but at least but the problem there is logan paul is also bigger than nick ds we kind of go through this whole size age thing all over again but in no world am i ready to see nick ds gets left by jake paul yeah i mean i'd say this about nick ds right like so in theory what you would like about his chances i don't't know about the Logan Paul or Jake Paul thing.

I don't know how that would go to your point. But in theory, in theory with Nick Diaz, you'd get a bigger guy who is a crisper combination puncher than Nate. I think that is pretty fair to say. He is a more accurate combination puncher. And to your point, it looked like he didn't want to be there against Robbie Lawler. I spoke to folks who kind of know Nick, and they were saying exactly that. Like he didn't want to be there. He wasnler. I spoke to folks who kind of know Nick, and they were saying exactly that. Like, he didn't want to be there. He wasn't ready for it.

He had not properly trained, and there were apparently some circumstances that explained it. They are confident that the next time out you'll get a different version. I hope that that's true. I guess we'll have to see in the end. But to answer the question that I asked you, Shaq, which is, like, do I worry about the cost? Here's what I'll say about this I cannot detect any evidence that these guys losing in the way that they are to Jake Paul has had a real effect on MMA I can't see it I can't prove it I'm not even saying that it is real but the accumulative weight of it does

make me a little bit nervous I guess is the way I would put it so I'm not here to ring any alarm bells I'm not saying the sky is falling again what would be the tangible real world evidence that you could point to that says like people's faith or interest in mma as a legitimate sport or sport of intrigue has diminished by virtue of anyone's participation in jake paul's boxing bouts and i don't see any i don't see any nevertheless it's just a continuously bad look for the sport and i i don't love that i guess i don't love that even if it ends up being innocuous or explained away yeah uh it doesn't feel good i'm able to as someone who has a vetted interest in mma and the careers of these mma

fighters i'm able to sort of like balance the scales, knowing that at least these guys are making far and away the biggest paydays of careers of their careers that helps me sleep at night. Do I love it? No. Do I think it has a tangible impact on the perception of MMA? I haven't seen the evidence yet to convince me of that but listen man if Nate's really making you know in the tens of millions 20s of millions whatever it is that's enough for me that's more than enough for me fair enough all right let's move to topic number two let's get to the UFC show oh anyway by the way anyone else who wanted to shout out on the Paul Diaz Amanda Serrano like beat up Heather Hardy I will say uh Ason silve appears to continue he has continued what i would

consider his run as a prospect of note he's got a long way to go he looks pretty good he's the but he was the most legit well serrano was the most legitimate boxer on that card but on the men's side it would certainly be him uh shadesha green continues to look pretty good anything else to say to you about that card i think you hit it hit the nail on the head man I was covering WWE SummerSlam that night Who won SummerSlam? Like Logan Paul? Are you talking Logan Paul? I don't even know, I don't know who wins SummerSlam

He actually had to fly from Detroit to Dallas to make it to the end of the Jake Paul thing Logan Paul won, you know what nefarious means but let's not do this man, I already know people are like if there's one thing I can offer you MK in Brian's absence is even less pro wrestling talk so I'm ready to give it back not let's not do this man i already know people are like if there's one thing i can offer you mk in brian's absence is even less pro wrestling talk so i'm ready to get it all right fair enough let's go to topic number two we switch down to ufc nashville boy the fans were not happy about

the main event which i guess i understand i do but not completely okay so cory sanhagen gets the job done with a route of rob faunt but it wasn't really on the feet, at least not very much. I think 19 minutes, something like that, of control time was ultimately awarded to Corey Sanhagen. Now, we end up finding out that he tore his tricep in round one. There's a video of him kind of showing his tricep, and it looks, or I should say his elbow, rather. It looks just like an absolute disaster. It looks like he got stung by a bee and or had staff and or you name it. So he ended up having to wrestle basically the entire time and he got the job done.

The question is this. He stayed on the card. He accepted a short notice opponent, a quality short notice opponent, and he got the job done, albeit in not the most dynamic fashion. So the question is this for you, young Shaq, did this performance seal his, what do you want to say, quest or did it punch his ticket to a title shot at 135 pounds? I hope so. Now there is a caveat to that and that caveat being what is the outcome of al jermaine

sterling versus sean o'malley right if sean o'malley wins is sterling compelled for a rematch like we've seen aljo talk for a while now about moving up i'd still be sort of willing to put marab devolish philly ahead of cory sanhagen in the pecking order. The problem is, does the UFC really want, you know, wrestling machine Marav to be UFC champion and just spend the next who knows how many years just swarming on people and keeping them down on the mat and shooting takedowns? I just don't know if that's a direction they want to go.

If you look at the top 10, the only person I can think of that the UFC might sort of do a favor to is Chito Vera if he beats Pedro Munoz and if Sean O'Malley is the champ. If they really want to fight Corey Sanhagen, you know, Dana White apparently walked out of that fight in round four. That's the only fight other than Rob and Corey that I could even fathom the UFC making because Chido does have that win over Sean O'Malley. But I think it should be Corey Sanhagen, if not Murab. I don't know how you hold this fight against him. The guy towards Trostup in round one, we know that he's generally a very exciting fighter. We've seen the head kick knockouts. We've seen the roundhouse kicks. We've seen the flying knees. Corey Sanhagen can put on a good fight. He did tell me that the UFC had promised him a title shot if he had beat Umar Nurmagomedov.

I don't know if that changes once Umar falls out of the fight. I do think that the UFC generally, when they tell a fighter either publicly or privately, you're getting the title shot next. They're good at it to a fault. I mean, that's why we're you know potentially getting leon edwards versus colby cuffington next i believe the ufc when they put it out there that you are getting the title shot next i'm inclined to believe it is dana white leaving is it a bad omen that dana white left during the fight yes is he gonna pull a luke thomas and not answer texts until he needs

something it's possible but i really hope that rob or cory gets that title shot next i don't mind the shade this is a show where you can air this you can air the grievances we do that here it's totally fair game so i appreciate it let me ask you this before i give you my run on this we understand dana white making decisions that seem very dana white do you give me your judgment call on him walking out on round four? Like what, how does that make you feel? I'm not thrilled about it as you know,

I know you're a Corey fan. I'm a Corey fan. He has a very cerebral game. He generally has a very exciting style, but I mean, who knows, right? I mean,

maybe Dana had to get to a business meeting or had a blackjack game that he didn't want to miss like there's i don't want to sit here and assume the worst but it didn't make me happy to you know it if you're cory sanhagen that probably doesn't give you a ton of confidence that everything is as on track as you may have believed it was well by the way for folks who didn't see he posted on instagram this morning that he's gonna go get surgery for his tricep this week um so not for a while though yeah yeah so i don't know what the timetable is going to look like in the event that you get some kind of resolution

at ufc 292 with the bantamweight title let Let me just say this. It's like, you know, I get that if you pay good money to go see a fight and the fight ends up being, you know, a top control kind of grappling fest that this is ultimately not, you know, what you had hoped for. I really and truly understand that. They lost one half of their main event. The other guy stays on and then badly injures himself in the first round.

Now, again, how much do people know that? I don't know. But nevertheless, stays on the card and then takes on a late notice replacement. Like, even if no injury had happened, Shaq, there's this issue. Like, we constantly see it. Like, Jon Jones against Ovin St. Preux. You can get someone very talented. If they're having to fight someone else on short notice, it's going to make them reserved in many, many, many, many cases. In many cases, they're

like, okay, I'll take this fight, but because I'm adding now a new layer of risk, not necessarily worse, but a new layer of risk, it makes them more risk averse in general. You add the injury to that and I just find the booing to be, I understand it. I've been around the fight game long enough to get it, but I'll just never like it. I'll never like booing a guy who did the crowd a favor by staying on the, and did himself a favor too, but stayed on the card to keep it together. Took on a difficult fighter in Rob Font, got the win. And then his, his reward for it,

on my Twitter feed, he was getting murdered and in the audience getting booed for it as a result. I absolutely hate that. But to answer the question that I gave you, which is does it punch his ticket to a title shot, again, we don't really know what the circumstances are in terms of what Dana White's enthusiasm is for the bout. But I'll say this, the only way he gets a title shot

is if it ends up being convenient for the UFC to give him one. Short of that, I don't think he gets one. So we're in a situation where afterwards, Aljamain Sterling, who was in attendance, was tweeting, like, don't ever accuse me of being boring. Here comes Henry Cejudo, who had his own injury woes, by the way, and had to pull out of his fight with Merab so that he could heal.

And he's out there saying, oh my God, these guys are the most boring people on earth. And when you're in a situation like that, it's going to be real tough. Like the UFC, they're pretty good for the most part, Francis and Jon Jones notwithstanding. But in general, they're pretty good about putting on the fights that people want to pay money to see,

at least historically they have been. But if the fans aren't clamoring for Corey Sandhagen to get a title shot even if we can understand and many fans will as well this was just an unfortunate series of circumstances that led to a you know a less than interesting main event doesn't matter it doesn't matter that doesn't really it doesn't help you like ultimately what matters are the results did you win yes did Yes. Did you win spectacularly? Yes or no? Those are the only questions that ever really come into mind here. They're not going to give him a title. I'm a little surprised by the way to hear you talk about Murab because I get that Murab has also had bouts where the fans weren't pleased. The Jose Aldo fight chief among them. But I do think there's a lot of interest in Marab. I do think he is surging. I do think he is getting better. To me, if Sandhagen had beaten Umar Nurmagomedov, yeah, they would have leapfrogged Marab.

But now Marab is in the sweepstakes unless Aljo wins and stays in the division. So if Aljo is gone, I don't see any way Marab doesn't get a title shot. And I hope he does. He is the most deserving contender, so don't miss I'm not trying to, you know, I'm not here picketing against Murab. In fact,

I would champion him as the one who should get it. I just can't help but wonder, like, what is going through the matchmaker's minds imagining a world where Murab Davalishvili is champion. We love to see these fighters from Georgia making a stamp in the UFC,

but the country's got a very small, if not enthusiastic population. We're not that far removed from the Jose Aldo fight that Dana White just absolutely crapped all over. I just want to know what happens. I want to see a world where Sean O'Malley... I'd be interested in a circumstance where Sean O'Malley beats Aljo.

The UFC has possibly their number one pay-per-view champion attraction that they could have right now for the mainstream audience. Would they be compelled or would they be excited to risk that against someone like Marav who could just drown him?

I just don't know. I feel like Marav isn't best situated. He deserves it. But I don't know if long-term he's best for business for that division. And I hope that's not what keeps him at bay. I mean, they gave John Fitch a title shot. He got whooped by GSP when that happened. But they gave him one.

Here's my point to you. Like, okay, you don't have to give him the title shot next. You could give it to Sanhagen, or maybe they do an immediate rematch. That's the other part too, right? What if Sterling and O'Malley ends up in some kind of crazy controversy? They might run that one back. But I guess what I'm asking you is, how do you deny Murab? I guess, what's your argument?

That they're going to just keep feeding him top contenders until one of them beats him and then they can just forget about him no i think they'll give him the title shot i just don't know that if it's really what they want i don't know that they're thrilled that marab is in the position that he's in right now but i'm certainly convinced after the outcome of this fight if aljo is removed from the picture it it's got to be Marab, and there's just no one you could give him to, unless for some reason, like you said, scheduling doesn't work out. I think Corey or Chito, if Chito beats Pedro

Munoz, are probably in the mix, but it should be. It should 100% be Marab. I'll say this, too, about Corey Sanhagen. This is the unfortunate part. I mean, he stayed on. He did what he was supposed to. He gets his win or show in his win money, even though it's not a real thing, but he gets both parts of his purse, let's say, right? So all that part is great. He stayed active. That part is great. But the problem with this win for him is that it wasn't a showcase win. And that was always going

to be difficult against a guy like Umar Nurmagomedov or even Rob Font. Those, those are not easy guys to beat, but because he was injured and because he kind of had to resort to like a B or C order of his game and heavily rely upon it he didn't get to showcase the kind of improvement I think he's been working on for a really long time if Murab and I don't know what's exactly going to be next for him either but if he has to take another fight between now and then he's like just absolutely shines he's going to move ahead in the pecking order immediately. Or what about this, Jack? Why not, if Sanhagen can get back to competition relatively quickly,

and again, I don't know how possible that is, but let's just assume for the sake of argument, why not a Sanhagen and Merab number one contender fight? Could you do that? And that's the fight that Sanhagen had been calling for from the get-go. And I applaud him for it because there are not many people who would... Maybe now that Murab's number one contender, there's a bit more of an appetite. But let's be honest, nobody wants to deal with what Murab the Machine has to offer.

I love it. I'm fine with it. The only thing that concerns me about that fight is we don't have a lot of contenders right now who have a legitimate case for a bantamweight title shot and i'm not always in favor of killing them off so you know pedro muñoz dominic cruz song you dong could get closer rob fonts out of it chito vera could get closer he order yawns on a really tough uh series of losses henry so hudo is coming off a loss and is injured there just aren't a ton of contenders and i'd like to make sure that there's enough to keep the division going but if the timing works out rob versus cory sounds like a great fight to me that probably gives enough time for cheetah or song you don't want to sort of work their way up

so so long as it's not going to hold up the division long term yes I'm totally okay with Rob versus Corey if it makes sense yeah fair enough and also we didn't talk about this at all but we should Rob Font so we had that great win over Adrian Yanez he used to take this fight he was supposed to fight Song Yedong that fight fell apart they moved him to this one again he didn't look exactly bad there were several times he was able to get back to his feet he had a Kimura sweep I think at one point as well he didn't look exactly bad there were several times he was able to get back to his feet he had a kimura sweep i think at one point as well he didn't look bad he just looked a little bit behind and somewhat overwhelmed by the grappling game of cory sanhagen what should

be next i think for 36 year old rob font yeah i i don't want to hold this loss against him a ton you know we spent so much of this segment talking about how Corey took on a new challenge, how Corey took on that risk. Rob Fon did the exact same thing. He was scheduled to fight in front of his home state crowd in Massachusetts. I think Song Yedong got injured. I'm not quite sure off the top of my head, but he was supposed to be on that card, at least initially. He agreed to end his training camp early, take on an even higher-ranked guy, right?

I mean, Song Yedong, as of Sunday, I don't know what it is now, was number eight in the division. Corey Sanhagen's number four. So he took a big leap up on short notice. I don't want to condemn him too much for it. I do sometimes wonder if things like this are sort of in the fighters best interest because we just saw Rob Font bounce back tremendously against Adrian Yanez. It was a chance for him to really start building for himself. That was a huge

win for a guy who's been struggling lately. And now we're back to Rob font on a one and three run probably I I forget whether or not uh he should be how he should be treated by matchmakers I think it's his in his best interest to kind of take another step back in competition and just get some rhythm going because we know that bantamweight is just an absolute gauntlet of some of the best fighters we have in the sport i feel like he's still a step behind from the very elite depending on how you know i don't have his win-loss record off the top of my head so i don't know who he's beaten who he hasn't beat but dominic cruz pedro munio someone in that range or maybe someone just bubbling in the top 15 would make sense but i don't think i want to see him fight another top five guy right now.

Yeah, top five I wouldn't say, but you could run the, again, assuming, here's the good news for Rob Font, he did lose, but he did the UFC a solid, which they tend to like, right? I mean, it doesn't always work out for you, but it can, we should put it that way. He's currently sitting at seven, Chito Vera's sitting at six, I know Vera has the fight with Munoz Song Yedong sitting at eight if they're if the calendar works out you could run that one back or how about this one Shaq Rob Font sitting at seven Dominic Cruz sitting at nine Cruz is not retired you could run that one back that'd be an interesting

fight as well right yeah yeah and Rob Font doesn't possess I mean Adrian Yanez fight aside. Traditionally, he is sort of a three to five round fighter. He likes to work off of that jab. He's not always looking in there to kick your head off the way someone like Chido Vera is. So I feel a little bit better about Dominic Cruz taking that fight. But that Chido Vera loss was so vicious. Dominic is getting up there in age. I think it's clear that he's not going to make another run for that title. The Rob Font one is a good one,

and if Dominic Cruz loses that in terrible fashion, we might have to reevaluate where Dominic is, but I think the Song and Dong fight and the Dominic Cruz fights are for sure the most compelling and reasonable among the top ten. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of ways you could go. I don't think a Yanyes rematch makes sense. By the way, he's fighting Jonathan Martinez anyway, so who cares?

Which is a dope fight. Which is a sick fight. Yeah, I mean, I would never complain about it. I'm just pointing out. Let me just read the names below Rob Font and tell me, again, these guys are all paired in different directions, but just tell me which one would be a bad fight. Song Yedong, Dominic Cruz And tell me, again, these guys are all paired in different directions, but just tell me which one would be a bad fight. Song Yedong, Dominic Cruz, Pedro Munoz, Umar Nurmagomedov, Ricky Simone, Jonathan Martinez, Adrian Yanez, and Chris Gutierrez.

Literally, literally any one of those. Again, I know that they're all paired in different directions or whatever, but were they all available, any one of them would be good. Any one of them. So not too worried about Rob Font. I think the UFC will probably take care of him, given that he took care of them would be good. Any one of them. So not too worried about Rob Fon. I think the UFC will probably take care of him given that he took care of them. All right, now let's move this forward a little bit. Let's go to topic number three, if we can here for the show, which was the co-main event for UFC Nashville. Tatiana Suarez gets back to action, scoring a submission victory,

I believe in the second round, over former champion Jessica Andrade. And before that, had looked pretty good, basically, the entire time. So Shaq, did Tatiana Suarez prove she is not just back, but all the way back? Tatiana Suarez has never been off. The only thing that has given her any trouble in her MMA career are injuries right like it's hard to explain I can't help but imagine that if you're a newer fan to MMA because we know that the MMA fan has a relatively short life cycle you've probably been hearing murmurs about this Tatiana Suarez girl, but you probably don't know why,

right? She had, you know, this, she only came back recently from a three-year layoff, even before that consistency wasn't great because she's off dealing with all these injuries that she's been suffering through. But the people who saw her coming up in the Ultimate Fighter know how good she is. And even though Alexa Grosso wasn't the Alexa Grosso that we've seen today, this is her third win over a UFC champion in what, like nine fights? A former or future UFC champion? Tatiana Suarez is the real deal, right? She's beat Alexa Grosso, Jessica Andrade, Carla Esparza, Montella De La Rosa. She can do it in two divisions. Tatiana is sublime, has always had world champion written over her and still has

world champion over her written all over her i don't know that i want to see a title fight next oh it feels like we're finally getting the consistency that she needs and there were a couple of things that sort of troubled me in the jessica and raj fight that we can break down if you'd like but she's the real deal, dude. All right, so there's a couple things you said that were interesting. Tell me what troubled you. So one of the things, there's two things that really stuck out to me.

Obviously, I don't have quite your level of analysis, but I'll do my best. I've been watching Liv Thomas for a while. Okay, let's see what you got. She had a really great understanding of her range, right? She was either all the way on the outside, using her kicks, staying away from Jessica Andrade's punching power, or she was right up in the clinch where she could use her strength. Like she didn't give Jessica Andrade a lot of room to operate.

And her instincts are amazing. Her ability to switch between threatening submissions, clinching, takedowns, or striking without giving up position is really good. Like, you'll see fighters so determined to get the takedown that they won't open up with their knees or their elbows. But Tatiana has such a great instinct and understanding for her position and how to maintain control while kind of moving back and forth between striking and wrestling. The one thing that gave me a little bit of hesitancy is when Jessica started to open up with her strikes and push forward and be a little bit more active, there was some reaching. I feel like she's still a little bit uncomfortable when the pressure gets put on her until she gets back

into a advantageous position. So I can't help but wonder if you were to pair her up with someone like Zhang Weili next, who is just as powerful as Jessica Andrade, but has a more well-rounded skill set, is dialed in better. Stop sitting on your AeroPlan points

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Book at AirCanada.com. Conditions apply. I wonder if there are... I wonder if the pressure, the forward pressure on the offense might get to Tatiana a bit. I'd like to see her just get a bit more comfortable. And I think that will come with time because when the fight is going her way, she looks unbeatable.

But there were moments where she looked a little uncomfortable reaching, shooting a little sloppy, but sort of overcoming that with her understanding of the wrestling positions. I just wonder what someone like Zhang Weili would do to her if she can't have a cup one, just one more fight, just one more fight to really tie the whole package together. Yeah, I don't think the one more fight idea is crazy at all. In fact, I think I would probably agree with that. But I have been, I didn't know what to make of Tatiana Suarez's absence for three years. one more fight idea is crazy at all in fact i think i would probably agree with that but i have been i i didn't know what to make of tatiana suarez's absence for three years and dude three

years is a long time and it wasn't supposed to be three years she got injured during the rehab which then just lengthened everything else afterwards you're just like dude that's a lot of time now in one sense time was on her side because even after losing that she's still just 32 years old so that's pretty remarkable and to your point there was a couple things that i saw that i didn't love either like for example the takedown that she got that ultimately led to the submission was almost an accident like she was a it was a bit of a scramble and she like goes for like a john smith low single uh and then pushes her over and then cuts the corner with her rear end all the way to the other back side.

That's a sick way to, what I'm saying is, that's a sick scramble, but she had to preserve something that almost went sideways. It wasn't like she was like, I'm going to execute on this and then fully see it through from beginning to end. She had to make an adaptation on the fly, and it worked. So that adaptation is great, but for example, when you go to see like shoot on Jessica Andrade on the fence, she got stuffed relatively easily. And in fact, you'll recall in the Nina Ansaroff, now Nina Nunes fight, that was another problem that she had faced there as well. So there do remain some questions. So for the reasons that you raise, I would be okay with her getting another fight. And currently she's ranked at straw weight,

just at 10. Now I think she's going to take a big jump up because Andrade is sitting at 5. But dude, I got to say, there was a lot that I liked about that fight too. A lot. You mentioned how she managed range. You're totally right. Those front kicks up the middle, right, to push her back, keep her on the end of the range where Suarez could be comfortable. She could stick and move.

I'm sure her cardio is really great. And then she was throwing those high kicks to the same side to get that power hand of Andrade to stay up. Because if it didn't, she was obviously going to let that thing go. So she forced Andrade more than normal to holster her big power punch. And I think that had an effect as well. So that was great. Also, dude, two submissions in a row, two guillotines in a row, I believe.

If I'm not mistaken. But this one was so nice. This was such a good one where she goes to hit it, rolls through so she could take top position. Andrade kind of gets out to the side so she has to recapture it, stays with it. And did you notice how far she's able to grab where she's able to grab her middle finger on the other person on their opponent's armpit all the way through so dude that's when you know you've got a nice deep uh front headlock series when you can go all the way and you're grabbing their armpit with your middle finger you can if you can because then you can pull them to you so the whole thing actually ends up having a bit of an effect there she was able to do that and then at the end the guillotine choke was was so amazing to me was it was in, but because she had driven her shoulder and her elbow so deep,

it ended up just becoming like a fist here. And then she pulls on her glove and just finishes it off right at the top. Like she was able to just switch last minute. Like, dude, I'll say this. Her scrambling ability from either the takedown or switching up the subs or working through position is as good as it ever was maybe even better now that she can weave in these submissions and like she'll go to her back it's not quite like a sacrifice throw but like you know if that doesn't work now you're

underneath Jessica Andrade who's got heavy ass ground and pound I mean there's a lot of ways this could go wrong the confidence that she has to go for those the willingness and then the expertise to pull that off when it didn't go right the first time, primo to me. But I think what you honed in on is the right sort of consideration. There's so many things that I'm really glad to see about her, and not just that she can stay active and compete, but I will say that there's a little bit of polish, maybe. Just a little bit more polish, to your point, where she could, with one more fight, and by the way, if you've been off for a long time,

I don't consider that a loss, but three wins in a calendar year, if she can get that, that's a good audition for a title shot, right? That's a really, three, I feel like, is the magic number. But the point I wanted to make is the one you kind of echoed. I share it as well. Just a little bit more polish, just a little bit more. Three, I feel like, is the magic number. But the point I wanted to make is the one you kind of echoed. I share it as well. Just a little bit more polish.

Just a little bit more. What I want to see is the takedown that she attempts from the start. I want to see that fully executed. The plan that she has from the get-go, I want to see that fully executed. It is awesome that she is back. It is super awesome that she can scramble that well. What happens if you don't have to scramble? Can you on the a game that's what i want to see and i think if we get that we'll get a lot of answers we're looking for agreed uh at the risk of possibly killing off

the contender we kind of touched on with morab and corey i think yon zhao non versus tatiana suarez would be the perfect litmus test for both women. Tell me why. And at that point, there is no doubt to which one of them should fight the winner of Zhang Weili versus Amanda Leung. I thought Yan Xiaonan was going to get the title shot after her last one. I know. Me too. Okay, so she has losses to Marina Rodriguez, who's a very different fighter, and then Carla Esparza, also a very different fighter.

And the Esparza loss was back in 2021. She has another loss all the way back in 2010. Doesn't really count for our current purposes. And then, of course, she has the win over Jessica Andrade as well as Mackenzie Dern, the two fights. That's not a bad fight. Tell me how that one goes, you think. I think I'd lean towards Tatiana.

Man, one thing that really stuck out to me is I think I'd lean towards Tatiana man one thing that really stuck out to me is both Jessica and Tatiana fought at strawweight and women's flyweight but dude Tatiana had such a height and reach advantage in that fight and I'm not entirely

convinced that Jan Janan has the scrambling and the takedown defenses or the one shot power I know she stopped on Draj but in general to put forth a far better effort than Jessica has I do think it'll be more closely contested I would lean towards Tatiana and it's kind of a shame I think had Rosanama Yunus stated women's straw weight there would be more flexibility for what you do with Tatiana next. But I just don't see if you're trying to move her up the rankings. I think it's basically Janjao and Honor boss at this point,

unless you give one of them the immediate title fight and maybe pair the loser of Zhang Weili versus Amanda Lemos with the other. All right. Here's how absolutely bat shit crazy things are for Jessica Andrade, okay? So in 2021, she beats Cynthia Calvillo. Then she beats Amanda Lemos in 2022. She was supposed to fight Manofia Rowe. It got canceled.

So January 21st of this year, she fights Lauren Murphy, who I have great respect for. I think she's a very talented fighter. And Andrade beat her up pretty thoroughly, is a very easy way to say that. So you're like, damn, Andrade is still on top of it. And then since then, so this was her fourth fight already in 2023, she loses to Erin Blanchfield, Jan Schaunan, and Tatiana Suarez. Now Shaq, anybody who knows anything about MMA is going to be like, well, okay, Erin Blanchfield might be the next big thing in women's MMA, probably going to be a champion. Jan Schaunan might be a champion.

And Tatiana Suarez might end up being a champion. She's not losing to chumps. But three losses, three stoppages after starting the year strong. She's 31 years of age. Is it time to hit the panic button on jessica andrage or not yet i want to preface this by saying that i will never sort of trying to deter a fighter from making money and when you have been as active as jessica andrage and as much of a soldier for the ufc as she has been

i'm sure that the dollars are adding up for her in a way where you know we're not talking conor mcgregor money but in a way that she can sort of sustain herself and and hopefully put some money away in the bank but if we're talking about what is best for your professional mma career and your status in these two divisions i think jessica has been her own worst enemy someone needs to tell her in her camp to slow down like i appreciate that she entered this tatiana fight more patient and more mindful and not just trying to like blitz from the go but this is her third loss in six months it's her second time filling in on short notice while jumping between two different weight classes. It's just too much too quickly. How can she possibly make the meaningful adjustments she needs to learn from these losses to admittedly potential future world champions

when she's fighting so frequently, mostly on short notice. If we're talking about Jessica Andrade, the competitor, she and her camp are right now I think humbly doing herself a disservice yeah I would agree with that I think that slowing down do not take another fight this year right you had four fights this year which by the way is even hard to get in UFC and of course to your point for example the Blanchfield fight she took on short notice and you know again it's she's not losing to chumps but she's getting stopped in all of them that's not great and I would, but she's getting stopped in all of them. That's not great. And I would just say at 31 years of age, the thing that stands out to me about her

game, Shaq, is that there needs to be a little bit more development. She's always been super strong and a big puncher, and that will carry you far. Look at how much she has done with that. And of course, she has more skills than that, obviously. I'm saying these are the things that stand out to us. Remember, she was strong at bantamweight. She's probably strong as an ox at 115 pounds. But that's not enough. What's enough is refinement of skill.

If you've got these four fights this year, I don't know what her financial picture looks like. But to the extent possible, taking a step back, targeting first quarter of 2024, and saying, I'm going to really focus on developing my game so that I can maximize my opportunities while you still have a little bit of your prime potentially left, that is much more important than just taking a fight where you might win, you might lose, they are tough, whatever. You can't afford to do this anymore. You cannot afford to just give opportunities away like this when you're 31 years of age. Not over the hill, but this is the time in your career when you're supposed to be having the best results. This is the time in your career where you're supposed to be maximizing your

financial opportunities. I just don't feel like she's doing that. Yeah, it's a very live by the sword, die by the sword approach. Like it's not just that she has knockout power. We saw that submission and she snatched on Amanda Lemos. She has great offensive finishing skills, but the defense isn't quite up to snuff, nor are the setups. Like, it feels like if Andrade doesn't catch you with something, if she doesn't overwhelm you in some way, she tried to be a lot more reserved in the first round, and she only really started finding anything resembling success

when she started really applying forward pressure at the end of round one against Tatiana and she tried to do the same thing on round two so it feels like again she took this fight so soon that she had the understanding of hey I need to slow things down and set things up but I don't think she has the reps in the gym to execute that at a very high level yet we need to see her flesh out not just only her defense but how she sets up and works towards finding the best shots and the best submission opportunities not just relying on what she knows she can accomplish in the fire all right fair enough let's go to topic number four it's our last kind of conversation

about this card and it's a really basic and easy question we do this with bc so we'll do it with you as well topic four which is all right for any reasons good or bad who else shack stood out to you at ufc nashville on saturday yeah uh i'll just fire off a few that i want to give a shout out to before sort of highlighting a couple. Cody Durden versus Jake Hadley. That was an amazing fight. Hadley had to overcome a lot in the weight cut. I don't know how those guys didn't get a fight of the night bonus.

Tyler Phillips is now 5-1 in the UFC. Only losses of majority decision. Ludovic Klein looked really great. He's undefeated in his last four. There's two I want to really sort of highlight, though. First is Diego Lopez. He lost on the Contenders Series and eventually made that very, very short notice debut. It was like a week or something against Movstar Evlovev. He won one round on two of the judges' scorecards, nearly submitted the number 10 ranked featherweight as a debutant on short notice and from that moment i was like man i gotta see what this guy can do next to turn around and basically snap poor gavin tucker's arm

off in like a minute and a half this guy has a ton of upside and it's so much fun that we're starting to sort of see this re-emergence of high-level submission specialists in MMA. He's already attempted like seven submissions in two fights, nearly tapped Movsar, taps Thou Tucker. I feel like it's been very wrestling and striking dominated these last few years in the UFC, and I'm glad we're seeing some of these jiu-jitsu guys start to figure it out. I echo the Diego Lopez one.

Gavin Tucker, a really great fighter out of your neck of the woods on the other side of the country, but nevertheless, a proud Canadian, but a very talented guy as well. And yes, Diego Lopez weaponizes aggressive jiu-jitsu. There's just no two ways about it. He takes risks. I mean, a flying arm bar and the way that he set that, or a flying triangle, I should say, rather,

and the way that he set this up, like, dude, that's risky. Because if it doesn't go well, there's all kinds of problems that could emerge, but he sticks with it. He believes in his jiu-jitsu. He is always attacking with it. You have to love that. But I'm going to give a shout-out to some other folks here. Dustin Jacoby stopping Kennedy and Zetsuku in the first round,

about a minute and 23 seconds in, with just good counterboxing, basically, good counterstriking off of the pressure he was facing with a guy with an enormous reach advantage as well. And you can see from these, obviously he was getting tagged a little bit, but he gets the job done. That stood out to me pretty great. Tanner Bosser, another fellow Canadian,

he got back into the winning ways, this time at 205 pounds. So that was good for him to see. Kyler Phillips, I think still has some things to work on but to me looks like a prospect that really can do special things if he could i just think he has to spend more time in the gym because everything i see from him like damn this kid's athletic damn this kid's good doesn't quite have that next you know put him away kind of gear to it yet but there's so many things he does

really, really, really well. He's still very young. I'm excited to see more from him. The one I have to give a shout out to has got to be Billy Quarantillo. This was an awesome fight for him against Damon Jackson. Close contest. He wins via unanimous decision, although Damon Jackson thought he got it. And this was off of that terrible Edson Barboza loss where he got viciously KO'd in the first.

Comes back, fights like an absolute dog against Damon Jackson. Shouts to Damon Jackson. He fought hard as well. Both guys really laid it on the line. But to get flatlined like that and then come back out and fight, not recklessly, but aggressively, bravely, is really, really commendable. Tough, tough fight.

Good win. Way to get back on the winning track. If win. Way to get back on the winning track. If you're going to get back on the winning track, you do it against a quality opponent with the right kind of competitive spirit. And we got that from Billy Quarantillo. Great win. Luke, you know,

I know we're all about the dead wrongs here, and I have to take these because they come so few and far between for me. I mean, listen, my picks are worse than BC's. He's crushing me at CBSSports.com pay-per-view picks. But I told you, Edson Barboza's got something for Billy Q the last time we talked, and you didn't believe me. So I'm going to take the win the one time I can get it.

I will say this, though. I will say this. We do that OK Bet thing on Fridays. Now, BC did well this past week. He did 4-1, but your boy went 5-0. 5-0, baby. Congratulations. I suck at this stuff.

Can I give one more shout-out real quick? Please. Yeah, Carlston Harris. Look, he was losing basically every minute of that fight against Jeremiah Wells. He even got a 10-8 from one of the judges in round one. He lost 10-8. But much like me and the tech difficulties on this show, if you just keep trying, one of these days you're going to get the dub.

He was so terribly outclassed, but you got to love the determination to overcome. He got whooped on for 10 minutes. It was like something like nine minutes and 36 seconds of control time across those two rounds. But he comes back, anaconda choke, second time in the UFC. He's put someone to sleep with that choke he's four and one three stoppages only losses to shafqat rahmanov did this fight give me a ton of confidence and what he has to offer the absolute elite no but we got to take these moments and celebrate someone who isn't deterred after a you know dealing with so much adversity he came back strong man so shout out to carlson harris and i know that jeremiah wells is going to come back better for it yeah jeremiah wells still have a high opinion

of him like he's still shot out of a cannon and uh every time he fights um but you're right dude now the rock monoff fight i've covered that one in detail because i did some tape study on rock monoff he was never really in that one but okay rock monoff is rock monoff he's maybe he's going to be a title holder in this weight class and to your point he beat Impa Kasanganai, Jared Gooden, Jeremiah Wells and Christian Aguilera before that dude he's turning in an all-right run and by the way 36 like time is time is of the essence if you're gonna do something in the sport this is the time and he's out there getting after you gotta love that from him and just these

guys who just don't quit you know when they get beat on and whooped and like he was to your point what dimension of the game was he winning before he ultimately turned it around he just wasn't but you make one mistake against a veteran guy like that and that's that's all it takes no doubt about it um all right let's go to our fifth and final topic here with some of the other MMA results. Now, I mentioned Impa Kasangani, Shaq, and that's so important. How about from PFL, whatever number this was over the weekend, PFL 4 or 7, excuse me, PFL 7, the playoffs. Impa Kasangani gets a win over Martine Hamlet.

He stops him at 224 in round number one. So they had their 145 tournament on Friday as well as their 205 tournament to decide who goes into the playoffs for the finals. And Impa Kasanganai gets it done, Shaq. Let me remind everyone what had happened. So he had lost to Joaquin Buckley. I don't know if the boys have it in the back.

You guys remember that KO that Joaquin Buckley had I don't know if the boys have it in the back. You guys remember that KO that Joaquin Buckley had in the UFC where the guy caught his kick and then he jumped in the air and spun around and then knocked the other guy out? Well, that was Impa Kasanganai. He viciously, viciously KO'd him. And this was all the way back in 2020 of, let's see, that was October of 2020, long time ago. He actually won after that in the UFC. He also lost to Carlston Harris, by the way. He lost to him via ground strikes. And then he got bounced from UFC thereafter.

He has not lost since then. He beat Jared Gooden. He beat Osama El Saidi. I don't know who that is from the PFL Challenger card. So the PFL had these cards on Fubo TV. He fought on that to basically like earn a spot, comes in, beats Corey Hendricks, beats Tim Caron or Caron,

and then beats Martine Hamlet, who was one of the guys that PFL sort of spotlighted as potentially the future of the organization. I just want to point this out. I want to pitch it to you, Shaq. This is kind of to an extent what MMA stories are all about you'll see a lot of guys take bad losses or bad moments in their career but if they're young

enough you really have to be careful about how much negative you say about it because they can really turn things around later to that point Kasang and I only 29 years of age so he was fighting in the UFC when he had a handful of fights quite literally a handful of fights he wasn't ready and now he looks so much better you gotta feel great for impakasanga and i dude i mean one million dollars will go a long way to washing the bad taste of that joaquin buckley knock i mean even kanye west made a song about it right so you gotta love it um what i find actually interesting you know a lot of times people we talk about weight cutting in the sport and trying to sort of mitigate the size

advantage of these other guys have you've seen with like anthony rumble johnson the late great like sometimes when you go up in weight you fill out it works better for you he primarily fought as a middleweight he's gone as low as Walter weight but it's a light heavy weight that he's finding so much success to the point where his only three career knockouts have all come since he left the UFC like we're seeing Impa really improve is he taking on you know a lower level of competition most likely but we know that the ufc is a pressure cooker it's a hard place for these young guys to get steady momentum i'm so happy for him and dude not only is he a knockout machine at this rate but he's a smart

guy he's got something like three degrees that's three more than i have. You didn't go to college? I have like four more than Brian has. No college for you, Shaq? I've had like a diploma. I got like a broadcast journalism diploma. Oh, all right. Right on. I failed grade 12 math. I'm here to work, man.

I'm not here to learn. I learn on the job. Fair enough. Either way, I completely share your assessment. And it back to like you know you it's it's a little bit of a Goldilocks thing sometimes now in the case of someone like Jared Cannoneer where he was heavyweight then light heavyweight and then middleweight you were like okay well this was just about loss but some guys it dude to your point about Rumble Johnson I remember when Rumble Johnson was fighting the Charlie Brenneman's of the world. I was at that fight. It was here in DC. Like Skeletor. Right, right. And it was like, dude, what are you doing to get down there? So

everyone has to find exactly the right place for them to get the right results and the right stuff. And I want to say like, you know, is he fighting a lower level of competition than what he was up against in the UFC? I don't think it's that much lower to be honest with you. Like based, he wasn't fighting the very best in the UFC. No, he's not fighting the very best just yet in PFL. But you get the idea. We've seen some of these guys. Who was the guy?

He lost to OAM. Shane Burgos. Shane Burgos beat some good fighters in UFC and then comes over and kind of struggling a little bit in PFL to this point, at least to beat the better guys there. So what I would say is it's probably fairly commensurate fairly commensurate i would say some of that joaquin buckley is a better guy than what he's fought to this point but you're right it's about developing your skill set it's about finding the right weight class and it's about this too shack do not rush to

the ufc it is very easy for me to say that because I don't have the financial pressures that these guys have. And I understand, ah, I'll go to the UFC. I'll figure it out once I get there. Some guys can do that. Some ladies can do that. That's true. Most cannot, including a lot of good fighters. It is not easy to go to the UFC, win a couple fights. Now you're starting to escalate your career a little bit, and then stick around if you have not worked on the rest of your game, and if you don't even know what the right weight class is. Anthony Johnson got away with it for a long time because he was just such a dominant striker and power puncher. It didn't really matter so much early,

but it obviously mattered a little bit later. So love this story for him, and he is, I want to point this out out one fight away from becoming a millionaire he has a fight with josh silveira who was on this card shack the son of conan silveira and he got a stoppage as well i don't know what the odds are going to be in this fight but impakasanga and i has some pretty good experience to lean on that should be fun also on this card of note was let's see you had jesus pinedo defeating bubba jenkins in the 145 tournament jesus pinedo here's another guy only 27 years old loses uh to uh gabrielle alves braga who i'll come back to in just a second for

the beginning of this tournament he goes into into PFL one for the season, loses, then beats Brendan Lockton, the previous champion in the first round, and then follows up with previous finalist, NCAA champion wrestler, Bubba Jenkins, back to back stoppage wins over back to back, either champions or finalists in the tournament,

27 years old, now finding himself after losing to the John McDessie's of the world when he probably wasn't ready to be fighting in the tournament, 27 years old, now finding himself after losing to the John McDessies of the world when he probably wasn't ready to be fighting in the UFC. Yeah, that was actually the one I wanted to highlight too. And for as big of a celebration as this is, it's also sort of the good and bad of the PFL system. Because what I find has happened repeatedly with the PFL's playoffs is you'll see an unlikely success story emerge. Brendan Laughlin was that last year in a sense.

Now he gets knocked out, loses all of his momentum to Jesus Pinedo, and Pocasagone is going to the finals. There are really interesting stories to tell about how these guys have gone from sort of hard times or obscurity to beating the very best of their contemporaries in the PFL, working their way to a million dollars. But there's nowhere for that story to go afterwards. I hope with the sort of super league that they're making, because inevitably what keeps happening is these champions come back for the next season. They get knocked out by the next guy that the PFL hasn't built up and we just repeat the cycle it's like very short doses of oxytocin I'd love for the PFL to figure out a way to take these guys who are success stories for them and started marketing

them into fights outside of the playoff season obviously these guys are all going to want to compete in this million dollar tournament but I'm just feeling this carousel cycle of these stories coming up and this opportunity to build up these guys, and then it all washes away the next time the playoffs come around. Yeah, so this is the exact problem that we're almost in the 10-year. I mean, so 10 years ago, right, because Scott Coker took over in 2014 for Bellator. So we're almost 10 years, so 10 years, we're 2023. So 10 years ago, Bjorn Rebny was running into this exact same problem.

You had guys who had won or advanced in tournaments like Patricio Pitbull or more commonly Michael Chandler at the time, and he created a division where there was like a pool of people, and that pool would be the ones who fought in tournaments. But if you ever won it or you were a finalist, you could move on because they kept running into the exact same problem. Dude, if you fight guys in a tournament, when they say it's who's the best on that night, they mean it. They mean it. That doesn't mean that the guy who wins is ultimately the better fighter.

It could just mean that night they weren't as injured. The other guy was. The other guy had some kind of sickness. The other guy was. The other guy had some kind of sickness. The other guy didn't. And that's true in matchmaking for the matchmaker model, but it's pronounced into the tournament system. PFL is running into the exact same problem. And then Scott Coker comes in, Shaq, and says, all right, we're going to do away with this tournament.

It's like, we might do tournaments, you know, but we're not going to do them like this. And I have to say, Shaq, we've been hearing this. PFL might be buying Bellator stuff, which I can tell you is, it's not a done deal as I understand it, but it's almost certainly going to happen, it seems like. I got to tell you, I like, I almost said Strikeforce. I like Bellator's Grand Prix model over the continuous, you know,

cycle of tournaments that PFL does by a factor of eight billion i much prefer the grand prix model pick one weight class for one thing at a time that seems so much better does it not so much better you know the reason i think that the playoff model works in traditional sports is because they're such forget the scale for a second, you are leaning on your hometown team, whether that's the actual city you are from or the city that you sort of adopt. For the most part, a few fighters like Nate Diaz,

maybe Conor McGregor for certainly, are those exceptions, these cult of personalities that fans sort of really fall behind, or a fighter from a market that doesn't have a lot of representation. You know know you'll see a lot of fans gravitate around that but when you have a global sport like MMA where there's so many fighters coming from different parts of the world it's very hard to get so in it's hard it's almost impossible to get invested in enough of these fighters that you'll want to turn out for the playoff format of the PFL just to see those guys compete.

It just doesn't really strike the same chords that team-based sports do. So I like there's things I really like about from like objectively forget. Emotional investment, business mind, like I actually think there's some really cool things about the playoff system. I like how it encourages finishes earlier in the fight, but it's not going to convert pay-per-view. It's not going to convert viewership or buys at a rate that you need it to in a sport

that's primarily driven by name value, rivalries, and things of that nature. So I love the grand prix it always feels special you know you're always getting the very best in that division so you can kind of stomach when the person that the promotion may have wanted to win loses there's too many variables the pfl playoff season for them to really take that next step i'm all in favor of them adopting a grand prix approach should that purchase the Bellator go through and then of course as I mentioned Jesus Pinedo who we were just spotlighting

so he now moves to the finals to take on Gabriel Alves Braga the gentleman who beat him to start the tournament so he's going to get a chance at redemption so if he ends up beating Lachlan Jenkins and then the guy who beat him to start the tournament to win a million dollars at 27 years of age to your point that's great but then you get him into the to start the tournament to win a million dollars at 27 years of age. To your point, that's great. But then you get him into the next season's tournament and he'll just get washed. There's a good chance he gets washed doing that. It's just the Bellator Bjorn Rebney experience

plus what I've seen from PFL tells me the tournament system as they have structured it is where underdogs go to thrive, which is cool for a little while, but then you realize it stops being cool when you need names, you can promote that people can count on. All right. Also,

also how about one fight night 13? Did you see the Boucher versus rug rug or rug rug? I don't know how you say it. They pronounced it rug rug, the rug rug fight, just a terrible fight in every way. If we can be honest, terrible fight in every way. Perfect. Heavy be honest. Terrible fight in every way.

Perfect heavyweight MMA. Here's my takeaway from it. Tell me if I'm off. Now I watched Boucher compete as a jujitsu guy during his prime in Gi jujitsu. I watched him beat Adolfo Vieira, you know, endless absolute meetings that those guys had. And you name it. And he was a force to be reckoned with. I had thought going into this fight that Boucher shot was raw,

but good enough now to even like, you know, maybe be the top 10 UFC heavyweight. If he got the right kind of matchup, I'd go to through this fight. And I'm like, yeah, that's not true at all. He looked like a BJJ guy and not in the best way ever.

There were times he was able to get takedowns. There were times he was even able to get mount. And he could not hold position. Boucher absolutely not ready for primetime at all. No, no. And it's, you know, far be it for me to tell any pro athlete what to do. I mean, I am a scrub in my day-to-day life. I am microscopic when it comes to these MMA fighters.

But every time I talk to Mackenzie Dern, I always kind of try to like poke and prod at it. Like what would serve you better in MMA as a Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu practitioner? Elite striking or elite wrestling? I've always been of the mindset that a lot of the guys that make the transition from jujitsu and women who make the transition from jujitsu to mma overestimate how much they need to improve their striking and underestimate how much they

have to show up the wrestling because these aren't the wild wild west days of mma all fighters have a great base and they have enough takedown defense to stop anything but really advanced wrestling for the most part and your striking is never gonna sort of reach the level of some of your mma contemporaries who have striked from the beginning but if you can bridge that gap with just enough good wrestling to get those takedowns you can really start employing your jiu-jitsu. In this case, I think, you know, Rubek obviously has a tremendous wrestling background.

He's super strong, right? Like, there was no doubt in my mind that he might be able to sort of Derek Lewis his way out of some situations. I was surprised that Buchecha couldn't make better use of his top control and the submission attempts he threw up but these guys need to get better at their takedowns they need to get better at their top control for MMA and until they unless they do Jiu Jitsu is going to have a tough time

sort of breaking through solely in the MMA space yeah I mean the rule is you got to have two right you got to have two things you got to have two things you either can have wrestling or striking striking or jiu-jitsu jiu-jitsu and wrestling or you can say you know if you're Sambo obviously uh you know submissions whatever you got to have two of them but if you got just one you know yeah you'll beat some guys especially if that one thing you have you're very good at but if you don't have the rest of them like it's not going to go well for you I will say his name is Omar Kane, Rougarouk. He is, I mean, he's

physically probably a nightmare to deal with. I completely understand. He obviously has a background in Senegalese wrestling, which is where he was kind of discovered. He's a force to be reckoned with, and it would be cool to see him, I don't think he can beat Anatoly Malikin in one, but it'd be cool to see him

get a title shot, because I think maybe he's earned it at this point. But in the case of Boucher, it's like, dude, it's just not going to go well for you if you can get mount and can't keep it. It's not going to go well for you if you can get back and can't keep it. It's not going to go well for you if you can get the takedown and then can't hold it. It's not going to go well for you if you're going to resort to pulling guard, which he did a number of times in this fight.'re like oh well charles olivera pulls guard yeah

but like think about it dude when charles olivera pulls guard he's immediately going for like leg entanglements which forces guys to like oh they have to resist they have to get away like there's you know you've seen guardians of the galaxy right yes sir right like you know how groot when his when his like branches grow and he's like you know fighting some foe they always kind of weave in and around like that's what charles olivera's legs are are he's groot where they just come in and out of nowhere and all of a sudden you're trapped in this dude's you know uh uh attacks that's different that you if you can do that yeah you can get away with pulling guard you can get away with that kind of stuff and

but charles olivera can also wrestle charles guard. You can get away with that kind of stuff. But Charles Oliveira can also wrestle. Charles Oliveira can also strike. You see what I mean? Like these, all of those things complement each other. There's just too much missing with Boucher for him to go very far with this. So we'll see what happens next. Also on this card, I don't know if anything stands out to you, Shaq. If it does, I'll give you first chance here.

That was the one I wanted to point out. Anything else from the one anything stands out to you, Shaq. If it does, I'll give you first chance here. That was the one I wanted to point out. Anything else from the one card stand out to you? No, but I'll give you a story to sort of make up for it. Have you seen the newest Guardians of the Galaxy movie? I just saw it, actually, yes. Okay, good. So I'll try and avoid spoilers, but there's a lot of Rocket Raccoon in there.

I had a friend who was crying at the end of the movie. Shout out to Natalie. And I'm like, yeah, that was pretty emotional. Well, is it? And she goes, no. There used to be raccoons that lived in my wall, and they'd shriek at me at night, and they'd chase me home from school every morning.

So I just lived a nightmarish experience the last three hours, reliving all of my childhood trauma. And so, hey, if you got whooped on by raccoons all your life, do not see Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3. So, in other words, you're friends with the high evolutionary. Is that right? She's a schoolteacher. Give her a break.

All right. Not high evolutionary, but certainly sympathetic to him. I don't want to get into too much of the kickboxing results. Chingiz Al-Azhar beating Moret Gregorian. This was a great fight, but I'm not a huge kickboxing guy. I don't know enough to give you intelligent commentary. Maiku Musumechi makes, I won't say short work, but reasonably easy work of Jared Brooks,

who was their strawweight male champion. Tywin Chai breaking the arm of Daveed Curia. I'm sure you saw that one. That was brutal. John Lineker, I mean, rescuing a fight from the jaws of defeat at 1546 of round three. Can you believe that? The power of John Lineker saving him again.

And by the way, this fight was at 145. I mean, you want to talk about this fellow's power carrying. Good God. Amazing that he's able to get some of these results that he was able to get. Also, the guy he's fighting jaewon kim goes by the fighting god as his nickname not a very powerful god i have to say if you're a god you should be doing a little bit better than this that's just sort of what is the worst nickname in mma that you can think of the worst i don't know the worst i ever saw was a boxer whose nickname uh oh our

producer saying beast in 25.8. Yeah, but we had Corey Anderson on the show and he's great. So I don't want to slander him. But there was one I heard in boxing. I went to a, what was his name? He was on the contender. Tommy something.

He was local to the DC area. He was a guy on one of his cards whose nickname was Cut Up From The Butt Up. That was actually his name. up from the butt up. You can believe that. That's sick. I don't know what you're talking about. I've never heard.

You never even heard a nickname like that. Right. I mean, he was all, he was jacked up or whatever, but like, you know, cut up from the butt up. I was like,

all right, well that's, that's a little more information than I needed. You know what I'm saying? Can I give you a, can I give you a journeyman, Ron H2O Waterman? more information than i needed you know what i'm saying can i give you uh can i give you journeyman ron h20 waterman so ron waterman actually was a sort of like a port and heavyweight for his era um he was limited but he fought fate or did he not or he fought no he fought um who did ron fight

that was the big fight uh crow cop he did fight crow cop yes he was part of that earlier i don't think he was hammer house but he was part of those early big strong wrestling top heavy mark coleman types mark kerr types in the era so he had a name for a while but yeah he ended up kind of just like you know not not becoming a ufc champion but uh yeah, Ron Waterman was kind of a big deal back in the day. All right. That is it for our top five. Let's now go to our part of the show where the fans get to ask us questions. It's time for DMs from dogs. Let's get it. Hee haw, hee haw.

You've got male viewers and a male bag. All right. Let's do this one here. Because I pull up the questions from my producer who he did send them to me and now I seemingly cannot find them. Although I think they're here. Yes, I've got them. Okay. Number one from fit man, seven 20. I believe that's right. Here we go. Please help me. I don't get the Nate Diaz love. Oh, he's three and eight in his last eight years or something to that extent. Let's verify that. Has been

a notorious excuse maker when he does lose, i.e. whenever guys don't fight under his terms. Why does he have such a cult-like following? Answer the question in good faith. I don't want to insult him because it is a, I don't know if it's a good question, but it's a good exercise

to think about. Explain Nate Diaz's popularity, given he doesn't exactly go out there and give you a GSP-like winning record. No, sorry, Fitman. You must not be very fun at parties. How could you not love Nate Diaz? Okay, here's the thing, right? There are very few fighters in the UFC that can sort of pave their own way to success on their terms. No one has leverage on the UFC, but Nate Diaz is very much an example of someone carving their own path. You might not be aware of this if you're a newer MMA fan, but Nick Diaz was always the popular Diaz brother, right? He's the one who fought GSP. He's the one who fought for interim world title against Carlos Condit. He was a Strikeforce champion. Nate Diaz was always sort of the little brother.

And when he came back and he beat Michael Johnson, he went right for Conor McGregor. And the thing that is so much fun about Nate Diaz is ever since the emergence of Conor McGregor, we've seen a lot of, you know, people will call them Conor clones fighters who don't know how to sort of crank their own personal personality up to 11. So they try and sort of do a poor man's impression of this sort of cocky, arrogant, bombastic guy.

Nate Diaz is smarter than he lets on. He has a very particular charisma and sure him and the UFC have a pretty good relationship but he's like the closest thing you're gonna come aside from Francis even Francis Ngannou doesn't quite have the same sort of spirit there is a sort of rebellious anti-establishment spirit that the Diaz brothers have and it's so endearing and it's so unique and it feels so authentic so when he fights Conor McGregor when he makes the BMF title belt and when he goes off to fight Jake Paul these are all things that Nate Diaz has done on his own terms

and it's something that almost no other fighter could get away with yeah I mean listen I can understand how you can watch the Diaz and jake paul interaction like last week's press conference was gross you know um and there's a lot of stuff that i don't necessarily love that he does but what you really have to understand is the nate diaz story is the anti-hero story where a guy who was not pegged necessarily for stardom nick kind of was because nick was getting wins really early in the ufc's run like stopping robbie lawler and then he goes over to pride and gets the tech and origami stuff like there was you know nick had done some pretty impressive things and nate was kind of always the little brother to your point but eventually

nate began to carve his own path and began to rebel against the authority and not just rebel like just for the sake of rebelling but for like a purpose driven. Like they would bring up things like, hey, like we are entitled to more. This should not be this way. They would kind of highlight the unfairness of the system while being this avatar for the cause against it.

And not all the time did it work, but a lot of times it did. You know, people love their brash in-face attitude, losing to Benson Henderson, but giving Henderson the finger the entire time for a title fight, like that kind of a thing. And what ultimately ended up happening was, and this is true for Nick as well, but also Nate, the criticisms they had of the business structure in MMA ended up being very prescient and true.

And a lot of the things that they were doing, which were kind of mocked or either ignored early about working with boxers, about running triathlons and whatnot. And about like these guys, they had smoked a lot of weed, but they were really healthy. And they like didn't, you know, they're both vegan and stuff like that. They were kind of a little bit ahead of their time, at least on some of those considerations. And so you ended up getting this unusual source of wisdom

from the guy who's not exactly the class clown, but the class rebel. And you're like, wow, man, there's been a lot more going on here than I think the public ever really fully recognized. And then it just built and built and built and built and built into this big thing. And now, yeah, do Nick and Nate work great as heroes?

That's a debate. But I think they work very well as anti-heroes, and that's how they made their name, and it worked in an industry that's controlled heavily by a dominant brand. They are Stone Cold Steve Austin, if you need. I'll give myself one WWE reference here. And also, for the dead wrongs, he's four and three in the last eight years. Yeah, exactly.

So there you go. All right. From Strike.mx, Shaq, do you really believe that Aljo would vacate the Bantamweight title? He's 34 years old, and this is his prime earning in the sport. He'd probably lose hundreds of thousands at least per fight if he vacates the belt and move to a division where the champ is the pound for pound best fighter in the sport we'll see but even Kane didn't do this for DC what well DC went to fucking 205 I mean you know I'm not sure what that means it it would be an insane thing to do just saying that

DC went down as opposed to Kane willingly vacating a title so that DC could Yeah, I know, but they kind of, I mean, the whole point was DC was willing to do that because Kane welcomed him into the gym and Kane couldn't go up to any other But where else can Kane go? And Kane can't make 205, so DC had a choice

to make about what to do there. Here's what I'll say about this. I understand the spirit of the question, Shaq, because he's right. Do you really like his chances against Volkanovski? Hard to say, but I would favor Volkanovski at this point. I don't think that's all that crazy. But it really just depends on what they're going to do with Murab. And when I say they, I mean the team, the Saralongo team. Dude, it's a tight team. I've seen tight teams hold the line when John Fitch and Josh Koschek were there, but none of those guys ever had the title. And here you have a case where a guy has it.

What do you think is going to happen? Let's say he wins at UFC 292, and let me up the ante a little bit. Let's say he wins dominantly, which is to say gets the back, chokes him out, all done. What really is Aljamain Sterling going to do? If the UFC promises Marab Davalishvili the next title shot, I do think Aljo moves up in weight. You mentioned tight-knit camps. We have a lot of super gyms these days. These big amalgamations of coaches and sponsored gyms

and multiple world champions. There may not be another camp currently in mma that has that sort of close-knit familial bond that the long go sarah camp has i mean they just those guys love each other they adore each other and i do believe aljo when he says i i think it would genuinely make aljo happy to see himav Davalishvili become world champion. You talk to anyone in that camp and they have such a deep, profound respect for Marav moving to the States and putting in the work he's done to get himself into this position. Also, dude, this will... Valjo's fought like three times in 13 months for the

world title. He keeps saying his body is banged up. I don't take him to be a deceitful or untruthful person. He did not want to take this fight at 292. He felt pressured into it by the UFC. He says the weight cuts are getting harder. He says his body has a really tough time sort of regulating itself after the weight cuts. And he's got injuries.

He's got lingering injuries that he's got to deal with. I really don't think he wants to be at this weight class anymore. I think it's going to only get harder for him as he moves up in age. And never, I mean, I do this thing with UFC fighters where I get them to sort of re-rank divisions based on how they see it. Rob Fon put himself at number one. So never doubt

the self-confidence of these elite fighters if aljo i am confident aljo believes that he's got something in the can for volkanovsky whether that's true or not will remain remains to be seen but i have no doubt that he has the self-belief to move up in weight fair enough i guess we'll have to see it is interesting it. It is interesting. All right. From Patrick Klang. I think that's how you pronounce it. What happens first? The Roadhouse movie goes straight to video or Conor McGregor enters the testing pool? Boy, he was busy on Twitter last night, was he not?

I saw him going after Nate Diaz, going after Jake Paul. Jake Paul kind of biting him back a little bit, none of which was interesting. He called him, I don't even want to repeat what he called him. I don't think you can, or I don't know what the words, he called him a, what would you call it? A white version of a racial slur, sort of something like that. Listen, man, I told you I'm going to try and be the best BC that I can be today. I draw the line at the karate chops.

Yes. Yes. Thank you. Don't get us fired on BC's vacation best BC that I can be today. I draw the line at the karate chops. Yes. Yes. Thank you. Don't get us fired on BC's vacation day. That would really be bad. But in all seriousness, listen, the Roadhouse movie is not going to go straight to video because Jake Gyllenhaal's in it. So we'll see a major release.

But I got to tell you, dude, someone said this on Twitter. I forgot who it was. It was a really interesting point because I don't follow a ton of fans on Twitter. I follow some. I follow the it was. And it was a really interesting point because I don't follow a ton of fans on Twitter. I follow some. I follow the super fans. And I think it was one of the super fans who was saying, I get why Conor's doing this. Because he hasn't given his fans anything to cheer about in a long time. He's got to get up on here and cause conflict, score as minimal points as he can.

Because if not for this this what else is there but the reality is like dude like he it's true like what has he given his fans a reason to be happy about in any recent amount of time i don't know what the answer is no i don't think in terms of fandom in terms of people supporting or actively rooting for conor McGregor, I think his stock is as low as it's been since he won his first world title against Jose Aldo. Does that mean that people aren't going to tune in when he does eventually

fight? Absolutely not. We're all going to watch. We're going to watch because it will have an impact in the lightweight title picture. We will watch because there is a morbid curiosity. We'll watch because you either love or hate Conor and want to see the outcome of that fight. With that

said, I wouldn't be surprised if the Roadhouse movie goes to video first. Okay, here's a legitimate question. Who has... Who gets booked in the... Ignore Tyson Fury versus Francis Ngannou for one second. Do we see Tyson Fury in a legitimate world heavyweight

title fight before or after Conor McGregor fights in the UFC before before because he's going to fight Francis at the end of October and I think he'll be unscathed from that

relatively speaking. And then he can fight Usyk either at the end of the year, which is unlikely, or first quarter of 2024. I'll say Tyson Fury. Yeah. That's a guess. He might fuck around too, but we'll see. From BC's Burner account, kickboxer dad. Oh no, this can't bc because it's about uh

it's about kickboxing why have we never seen a real tie fighter like science i super like a rod tang switch over to mma and become successful tie fighters are so good at kickboxing but you never see them transition to mma the funny thing is you have seen tie fighters and again kickboxing is not my strong suit but you have seen tie fighters switch over to boxing and win world titles. That has happened. But the reality is this. There are some camps in Thailand, a.k.a. Thailand. Bang Tao is in Thailand now.

The Hickman brothers are out there. You can get some real good MMA training. And they have Loma Lukbunmi. They're asking about Thai fighters switching. There's one. I think he's asking about the like, the bigger name male fighters. Why haven't they switched? And I'm just going to guess it's a function of what the economics of it are.

Plus, dude, like, getting good at wrestling fucking sucks, and it's hard. And if you're already world class in another sport, and the economics don't really make sense to switch, why would you? You know what i mean is there a combat sport on earth that has made you more grateful for being on this end of the spectrum covering it than muay thai like sometimes you're like man wouldn't it be cool to be a boxer or an mma fighter but i watch those muay thai highlights and i'm like no not not this guy what do you mean i don't think i understand the question it's brutal man like the well dude also like the ties so many the ties start cave heads in do the ties start professional

boxing in their single digits uh there was a documentary on kids fighting uh it's unfortunate but there was a documentary on this and they were doing some brain scans of like you know kids who fighting muay thai for three years let's say they're 10 or 11 years old, something like that. And they already had signs of brain bleeding, you know, at 10 or 11. Now they retire much younger, they retire, I think in their early 20s or so or mid 20s, something like that. Maybe some can go longer. But, you know, these are people who are fighting in many cases for survival, they are fighting for desperate economic need. the very very very very best ones end up making a fair amount of money and doing really well but you're right

like it's a brutal sport it starts really young it ends really young it's not you know it's not anything built for longevity that's that's a fucking fact um it's just that the pipeline that recruits and you know develops this talent just has nothing to do with wrestling. So you'd have to find some other kind of thing. I don't know what the word is there. I did see that they announced Rod Tang vs. Superlek for the one flyweight Muay Thai world title. They did. When is that supposed to be?

October? September 22nd on my birthday. September 22nd. How old are you going to be? 28. 28. You're doing pretty well. I didn't get to turn full time How old are you going to be? 28. 28. 28. You're doing pretty well. I didn't get to turn full-time into MMA work. I mean, I've been covering it before, but I didn't get to go full-time until I was 31.

Different era, bro. Different era. All right. Last but not least, from Jonathan Todarian. Todarian? I don't know how you say it. if you could introduce one new rule into MMA what would it be Shaq what do you think so there's a few directions you can go with this I think the most obvious one is that 12 to 6 elbow it's nonsense there's such a small margin for error

that it kind of complicates things you have them throw one strike and you kind of have the referee being like no turn your wrist this way turn your wrist that way um it's i didn't we even see it with herb dean and someone recently where they were like having a back and forth and herb dean was coaching the guy on how to throw elbows midfights that it'd be legal it's silly um i know we've had updates in knees to a grounded opponent where you have to have both hands on the floor. And now that's kind of helped with the gamification of the hands up and down. But I'd kind of like to see the I just like to see them permit knees to a grounded opponent. I think it would clean up a lot of mess.

I'm bloodthirsty, so I like soccer kicks, but I understand if that might be a stretch too far for some people. Here's a funny one, though. Did you know that technically speaking, the use of abusive language is not allowed during an MMA competition? Yes, yes. Yes, so to Herb Dean's point in 2016, quote, I mean, we're watching people kick each other's faces in, but we can't say F you every now and then.

I know, it's weird. Two rules, very easily. Knees to the head of a grounded opponent, I would change. Now, not in every case but like certainly like if someone's back is on the ground i don't want them getting kneed but if they shoot and then they get stuffed and now they're underneath yes it should be open season on them i think that should change also dude listen i don't think that the leadership of one does a great job for themselves in the media and that by that i mean Chachri Sityatong just says a bunch of dumb shit all the time.

And so I don't think that's great. But dude, I like the one product. I think that the one product is very good. And one of the things that I like that they did that they pulled from Pride is the card system. The yellow and the red card system. I love this.

I think this is great. I don't love the idea necessarily of taking the purse. That's not my favorite part. But the ability to warn or to inflict a point deduction without necessarily having... Sometimes you need to restart the action, but sometimes you don't. And the ability to just whip that out and show it to them, I actually really, really like that. I think it's a good thing. I like one's rule set in general.

But I think the red and the yellow card system is actually one of my favorite. Also, you'll see certain promotions do this jungle fight, I think, in Brazil had experimented with this. If someone misses weight and it's egregious enough, they start with a point missing before they even begin the first round.

So they're already at a 10-9 for round one. Not if they get a win and the first round doesn't matter, but if it goes to the judges, they get a point deducted before it even happens. I like that rule as well. That's a good one. All right. Well, I believe that is it. That is the show for today, everybody.

Shaq, why don't you plug your stuff, tell the folks where they can get more of you, and then they can get text messages from you they can also ignore. You know what I'm saying? Yes, sir. Listen, I'm here for it uh youtube is the place to be please listen luke as long as you answer me when i'm trying to get a contact info for someone pretty good about that content for our shared sorry i said i'm pretty good about that i feel like most of the time all right i'll check i'm going to start pinging you and see all right all right uh first of all thank you so much for letting me come here i've literally used to submit questions for your live blog back live chat back in the mma fighting days so this is

still a little surreal for me but i'll stop it there i know you don't like compliments i don't um youtube.com at shack mma that's the one I'm pouring all my time into like I said we're just about on the verge of 25,000 subs every week you're going to see interviews with main event co-main event or main card fighters uh we got a new ranking series that's really popping off we just had Corey Sanhagen restructure the division he's got a great mind for that it's sort of a chance to have your own fun with the rankings learn a bit about how these fighters sort of assess and analyze each other uh twitter at shack underscore foo and that's all i got for you man check out the written stuff at cbs

sports.com yeah it's great work so cbs sports.com for more of the as he indicated the written stuff and then all the other but one more time put the graphic up for the socials if you'd be so kind uh and then let me remind everyone, if you're still around, hey, vote for us, World MMA Awards. I don't know if we still have the graphic. If we do, let's get that on the screen. You can go to worldmmawards.com and you can vote for Morning Combat

for best MMA programming. The odds makers say we have the worst chance of winning even though we're back-to-back champions, which sounds about right for MK, actually. That's about where we should be. So give us a vote there, worldmmawards.com. All right? All right. Well, that is it for us today.

Showtime.com is the label that pays. Showtime.com, 30-day free trial. If you'd like it, you can keep it. If not, you can bounce. And then, of course, you can go to morningcombat.store for everything else. And then, last but not least, morningcombat at gmail.com. That is Shaquille Majority. I am Luke Thomas.

Brian Campbell is back next week. We are done for the day. And until next time, may all of your gains be loyal.