MTracey podcast - Live from DC at the Epstein Files bonanza

Episode Date: November 18, 2025

I went to Epstein Press Conference, Part Two today in front of the US Capitol. Some initial thoughts. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.mtracey.net/subscribe

There we go. It's the United States Capitol. Wow. Wow. Josh Howley's... A lot of people dressed very professionally who are coming to and fro. Wow. Josh Howley might be in there.

People like Elizabeth Warren. Yeah, I just saw Mark Kelly. He showed up to one of the subsidiary Epstein press conferences. Uh-huh. Mark Kelly showed up and what did he say? Did he look solemn? Yeah, well, he said that John Foon. must act.

I mean, I could hardly imagine anybody more serious than Marjorie Taylor Green who I also happened to I had the honor of gazing upon. Oh, that's so hot. Yeah, how was she looking? You know, I really wasn't looking at her from that standpoint, I have to say, especially in the context of a sexual abuse

theme. Yes, yes, you want to avoid that, yes. That's important. So tell me, just tell us what was going on and tell us what you did and what happened. Yeah, so they had a press conference in the very same location as the one in September, hosted by the same three

Schmuck members of Congress. Okay. Thomas Maddie, Rottana, and Marjorie Taylor Green. Brokeana at least is like amenable to talking. Like I had a pretty extensive discussion with him afterwards.

And, you know, he took my questions, which are not the easiest. So let's say, you know, lawable enough. But, you know, the thing that was amazing, to me was

Rokana in conjunction with one of the quote survivors who was of course there, Haley Robson declared that there were

no questions allowed to be asked to the survivors. So we're not what's nominally called a press conference. And they're saying

the press is hereby forbidden to ask questions of the So last time they did allow questions? Last time

they didn't expressly forbidden. And you started talking, and that's why this time they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they're, they, they, they did it right. I was sitting right. Uh, I think she then decided that, like, a change of clans was needed and that they hadn't declared a prohibition on any questions to the survivors. So I, but I mean, of course, I tried to do it anyway. Uh, they, they, they have no authority to somehow restrict me from attempting to, you know, pose questions. But it was strange because I was sitting right in front of the video and still

photographers. And so I was like they were like all like demanding that I literally sit on the ground because if I stood up, I'll be blocking their, um, their view. And so I was in so like an awkward position. So I didn't actually, I wasn't able to ask a question of the press conference itself, right? But I spoke to Massey and Kana afterwards and, you know, Marge was sworn because she's a hero now, of course. So the media loves her all of a sudden.

That's funny. It's like the Epstein files stalk Trump and then you stalk the Epstein crowd. It's like this thing where it's like you're harassing the president. You're harassing the harassers of the president. It's kind of like this hierarchy. I disavow that I'm doing any harassment.

And so Massey, last time he didn't want to talk to you. Did he talk to you this time? Did he talk to you this time? I didn't seem to disguise this time in a false mustache. I mean maybe I don't I don't know that he like immediately recognized me on the fly necessarily Last time he seemed to be very familiar he's like this guy Yeah because I had interact you know I interacted him with him somewhat before But in the moment like he did ask my question answer my questions on like hey whatever happened to when the survivors announced two months ago

At the prior press conference that they were going to create their own list of Sex tract traffickers and hand it over to you and then you were going to read it out on the floor of the House of Representatives under the protections of the speech and debate clause. And he's like, well, I did read one name in the Judiciary Committee. I mean, he read the name Jess Staley, who was an executive of JP Morgan,

which is a name that's already been like in a company, it's been in litigation for years, but he says, oh, but there are 19 more. Mm-hmm. And his explanation was that, oh, somehow it's no longer the job of the survivors to provide the names, even though they were proactively offering and pleading for them to take the names that they were going to assemble last time, but they decided to, like, I guess,

not pursue that. So I asked Massey, like, does the fact that the names never were given to you make you in any way question the veracity of the accusations? And he said, absolutely not. Do you ask him, do you ask him why he believes in the accusations in the first part? like does this make you question but why have any believe in any of the veracity of that

why have any give them any credibility at all does he answer that? You should have asked him that follow up I only got one name with him because he was also swarmed and then Kana did you talk to Donna?

It was like Rokana and Nassie and Arjury-Tellek Greener like they're the biggest celebrities in Congress now because they did something that only has a 4% success rate which was get a bill to the floor using the discharge petition mechanism.

Uh-huh. Sorry, I'm just composing a tweet to tell people how exciting it is you are talking to congressmen. Okay, just send it out. I mean, there might be one that walks by now. What, a congressman or a survivor? Both, maybe. Congressman survivor, Nancy Bois. Two and one.

So I attempted to once again, so the weepy, did you watch the press conference by any chance? No, I've seen nothing. No. Okay, so, of course, the brother and... I saw that one-minute clip of the, yeah, the brother saying she went to Mar-a-Lago. Oh, it was so emotional and everybody was weeping. That's so funny, she went to Mar-a-Lago. Like, she went to Mar-a-Lago. I went to Mar-a-Lago, and then was shot to older men interested in younger women.

Like, of all the jobs, like it's TGI Fridays. Yeah. I was trafficked for Mar-a-Lago. that's the name I was looking for a I was looking for a whole song. I need to make a country western song with that lyric.

But I tried to ask the brother. Okay, so the brother managed to You asked them during the press conference like you raised your head or you saw them afterwards. Afterwards. Right.

Because they weren't taking questions during the press conference. It was too traumatic to ask him questions in the press conference. As though the brother himself was a victim of sexual abuse because I'm not aware of happening.

But he managed to of course throwing a plug for Virginia Robert's who phrase posthumous book we're told during the press conference and they taught and so she unveiled revealed that her father and the father's

friend also abused her I don't know has anybody even made a sleight the sleigh's effort to corroborate or to determine whether or is the brother or is he would be his father too this one I believe is the full brother and there's another half brother right and the reason that they're

interest to me is because they're engaged in an act of probate dispute in Australia over her estate, which is many, many, many millions of dollars, right? Is the alleged abuser on one of these sides? Is he involved in this? I don't think he was involved. I don't think the father was that wouldn't have been involved. But the, but, and the debate's growing even larger now because the proceeds from the profits from this book.

So I go up to, I go up to the brother, right? Just afterwards. And when he's like sort of, uh, meandering or like going somewhere. And I try to ask him, hey, can you give us any update on your probate dispute in Australia? And they clearly recognize me, meaning the brother and his wife and his handlers. They all have their own handlers of the amazing PR handlers. They have like armies of PR handlers. Remember, it's a cash cow.

They have plenty of money to give to PR consultants. And they're all whispering and like murmuring amongst them. No way we're answering a question to this person. Can you please leave when they call over their private security? like to claim that I'm following them or something. I just ask them a bunch of times. Can you please give us an update

on your probate dispute in Australia over Virginia's estate and like they just won't answer. What do you? Nor will nor will my minion in Australia nor will any of the Australian authorities

give him any records on the probate dispute or virtually anything else related to Virginia. Robert Rufray, with the exception of the police report I got for her fake bus crash, shortly before her reported death. So they didn't say anything new. They didn't do anything interesting. They didn't take questions.

They just sat there and said, were victims, released the Epstein file? That was basically all of us. The members of Congress themselves took a few questions, but they said, all we can do with the survivors is politely listening to their stories. Uh-huh. And they did introduce, and they seemed to introduce, I mean, there were one or two survivors, I think, who claimed that this was the first time they had made any public statements. Oh, really? I went up to one of them, and I just said, excuse me, can you clarify how old you were at the time that you claim you were victimized by Epstein? And then her hand also, you know, threw a fit and said, no, no question.

Oh, my God. I literally just asked a factual How old? You know why? No, I'll be 30, yeah. He was probably 23.

It's amazing. This is amazing. I did get one person, R-N-O, look her up, you'll find this funny. R-I-N-A. And last name,

O-H, she's an Asian woman, right? Oh, wow. Is that new as this the first Asian survivor? She sued Virginia Roberts McFray For defaming her So there's always like these interest Survivor disputes

Uh huh She's a chef She's an artist writer and chef And she was gonna speak She looked like she was like Waiting to speak But then they kind of like shunted her aside Or something so she didn't speak

But I talked to her afterwards And She was 21 when she first encountered Epstein and then she says she buried her trauma until 2019 when Epstein was arrested and of course like the settlement funds became available

or when there was like a prospect of the settlement funds becoming available and I was asking her again did you apply for any of the settlement funds and first she didn't want to answer but I got her to admit that she got settlement money from the J.P. Morgan settlement and also the Epstein estate settlement

and I said how much? And she's like oh I'm sorry I'm not going to tell you that. It's like, hang on, this public interest, why is it such a big secret? And what does she say? She said, just as she wasn't telling it. I mean, he was nice enough. At least she answered the questions, but, yeah, I mean, if you watch the press conference footage, she's like standing behind.

And it's just like. Yeah. So there's a business insider article from 2022. It says, a New York City artist says Jeffrey Epstein and Elaine Maxwell, Maxwell shopped her around to men at Marlago. Other victims saw her as one of their enablers. So here's their article. A friend introduced Rina O. to Jeffrey Epstein in the summer of 2000 when she was 21 and tried to start a career in New York City.

I had recently broken up with my long-term boyfriend and was very upset, Othel's insider. I think I may have said, maybe I should date a rich guy. She went up in an empty, Jeffrey. O met Fstees a few days later for appointment in his Manhattan home. She says she brought along her art portfolio because she heard he was a collector. He impressed he and blah, blah, blah. O says Epsis sexually abused her, accuser, J, described regularly being called Feph's home,

take part of sex to her, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay. Anyway, I mean, the point is, she's also been accused by others, quote, survivors of having been a trafficker herself. Uh-huh. They accused her trying to get money from the competition, yeah. As was, as was Haley Robson, who was also here,

she was like the ringleader. She's the one of, I'm pretty sure spotted me, and that led to them to declared no question policy. But afterwards, I asked Roe Conner, like, did you know that this main woman who's like the ringleader of Epstein Survivors, Inc., running the show essentially behalf of the survivors, Haley Robson, did you know that she had an arrest warrant issued for her when she was an adult on the ground that she had recruited other girls allegedly and also told them to lie about their ages? I wrote about this in the compact article on the trafficking racket. And of course, Rokane had no idea about that. Like, they thought he's very incurious. It seems like he's, I was learning new things.

you and then never learning things from me somehow and he's never updates he just continues he's doing it so he's like oh well that's a good point Michael he's just like

I asked Rokana I'm like okay so because he when he spoke at the press conference and by the way my battery is running low so I might drop out okay

I asked him he said the press conference we basically have to purge the Epstein class right so the old guard yeah this was Rokana yeah so he was talking

like it was a reference to Larry Summers I think yeah poor Larry But I asked them, okay, and the Rokan was like, we can't name any built. No building should ever be named after anyone in the EFstein class. They should all be, you know, disgraced.

They should never receive any honor. So I asked him, okay, so because Noam Chomsky was found in these recent batch of emails. Yeah. To have, you know, communicated regularly with Epstein, to have visited him on several occasions to have, and to have sit and say that he evaluated Epstein as a friend, should Noam Chomsky, like the most cited academic on earth, should he, receive no honors ever again because he emailed with Jeffrey Epstein and they just don't having a great answer. Look, there's some Orthodox cleric walking by. I wonder what they're

Orthodox clerics. Oh, maybe they're going to a Gord Bermuda. No, that's not fair. I shouldn't make fun of all religious people. And I even asked about Larry Summers, okay, like, what did Larry Summers actually do? Email Jeffrey Epstein? Like, that's his crime? Yeah. Well, did you read the article to Harvard Cripsen? I didn't read the full article I read the statement he gave Well the article's very funny He's like Jeffrey I think she likes

It's like Larry Somer was using his brain power He's like she sends me this paper I shouldn't respond too quickly right And then Epstein's like man you know It's like kind of heartwarming He's like choking for like Matt Scholar just told me today That that woman that he was like I guess trying to date

Or whatever and asking for advice on She was like a tenured professor Yeah she was like 36 yeah But he was Yeah, but in academia, I think she was like, was she like, was she like his graduate, but he was some supervisory position.

Who gives his shit? I don't care, but I think he might have had some supervisory position. Yeah, you'd think the president, you'd think Larry Summers could get any, you know, president of Harvard could get, Asian women. Oh,

he needs to have some of his. Um, poor Summers, man, poor Larry, I guess he was married. I mean, there's another congressman I spoke to, I can't remember, I can't pronounce his name or remember his name exactly. He's a freshman.

He's from Virginia. He's got an Indian last name. He's a Democrat. He was here. And I just asked, I asked him about, okay, so Rokana said that we like need to get rid of this Epstein class. How do we determine who is sufficiently culpable as a member of the Epstein class that they need to be banished from society? And he's like, oh, people who commit, it's like all the people who committed crimes should be banished. I'm like, okay, but committed a crime.

He's like, you know what? That's a good question. Yeah, that is a good question. He didn't have an answer to it. Yeah. They just rattle off these like vague accusations of like ramping criminality and like they're never asked to. Yeah. Not that the journalist asks any good questions. It's all about it's either what is your reaction to Trump and or some like pointless procedural question about like what is the Senate going to do that has no like long like that.

have no I have no laughter value as a question I know you told me some people tell you like

you're kind of waking them up on the Epstein question are there any journalists were coming to and being like

oh I decided to start investigating this too like are anyone doing that or just changing their mind

and really you know I get I get questions I get private messages from people

sometimes along those lines but do they ever do they ever say I'm going to Australia to look into

this Virginia is oh one more thing. This woman Gravalia who is the Congresswoman who was sworn in when the government reopened.

Is she related to the other, the fat guy who was left? Yeah, she's his daughter. She inherited her father's seat. Okay, all right. Good. Who died in office earlier in the year. And I was asking her about this provision in this Epstein legislation that says that certain files can

continue to be concealed by the government if Pam Bondi deems that they have some bearing or like somehow jeopardized national defense or from the policy? I'm like, what's the point of that,

what's the purpose of this legislation, of that provision? She's like, oh, I don't really know. You know what's funny? And she was sworn in as like the one who was like going to be triumphantly striding into the Congress

so that could the final election. The New York Times he can't answer to the text of the legislation. The New York Times made an interesting point which is like now that there's opening investigations, Trump is like, investigate all the Democrats and the Epstein files,

like now there's an excuse and they can just not release anything. It's a fact that Trump has called for investigations. Yeah, Trump has called for investigations they're going to investigate and then nothing will work about.

They're investigating Bill Clinton again, so that means they can't release any of them. They might have, because of the accusation of him and Trump, they might accidentally get to Trump, but they'll have to cut it off at that point. Oh, bad. This is amazing.

Michael Tracy. I'm just constantly. basically gaslit. You should just publish a, you should do a self-published book. I'm not going to self-publishing book. Have you been looking for publishers? I haven't been actively seeking one,

but if anybody out there... You should be. All of the publishers who are surely listening to this, this would sell a lot of books. It's not that hard to find a publisher. You'll find somebody for this. And you're a man of your prominence and stature. Oh, yeah.

You'd find somebody to publish a book. somebody, a friend of mine, Chris Arnotti, I don't know if you know him. I know of him, yeah. Okay, he's in England right now, and he said like a random person came up to him and said, tell Michael Tracy that you just walk past

the pizza express in Woking. He'll know the Epstein reference. And Chris Arnoy's like, what? He had no clue with the things I was saying. Then he texted me, I'm like, okay, I know. Because Prince Andrews says that he never had sexed to Virginia Robertson-Crewfrey, because on that date that he was alleged to have sex with her,

he instead was at the Pizza Express in Woking, which is a neighborhood of London. Okay. And Chris Hernandez had to walk past it, like some random person I guess told him to tell me that he had gone past this pizza express and I would know the reference, which I did. But I guess I'm prominent enough for random people on the street in London

to be telling Pristernard Nottie to tell me that there was like a bit of like Epstein trivia. Is he doing one of his walking things or he's just walking everywhere? Yeah. He's been doing it again in England. He's crazy. He goes to amazing places like, you know, Tajikistan and like all kinds of things. Yeah, I listened to him on Tyler Cowan.

Looks like, looks like a man who's looking for something. They should make it. This is like a kind of intellectual forest gop. It's kind of interesting, the whole project. He doesn't need to do much video. Like, he should be doing videos of this stuff. I don't think he would want to do video. I think he prefers to write probably, which I support.

He doesn't have a photo book, yeah. This arena O thing, man, this is just Oh, and also like somebody, one of the survivors at the press conference, like implicitly denounced Megan Kelly For saying, Children cannot

Yeah, yeah, yeah. What do they say? Do they say it's pedophilia at any age, Mrs. A person with a big, she said like a person with a big profile when you're 14, you can't be a pedophile.

Maybe she was talking about me. Maybe it wasn't Megan Kelly. I was also, I'm pretty sure it was Megan Kelly. There was somebody. There was somebody. who was like tweeting out like a detransitioner. They were like Megan Kelly, Richard Fanania.

It's amazing is that some of the four, like, you know, so look, I've always granted that there are some, and Epstein himself granted, actually in the files that came out a few days ago in the House Oversight Committee, there was a statement that Epstein himself drafted, which the first time I've ever seen this. I think it was with a PR consultant. Basically, he wanted to give his side of the story in a statement, which he hadn't done. And it never got put out. But even in there, like he acknowledges that,

although it was always consensual and there was very like almost never he says like full sex some of the girls that could come to the house were under under the age of 18 what does he confess to? Some of them would have been here. Some of them probably would have been here today

and so they hold up like photos of themselves like when they were younger, right? And what's amazing to me is that I'm almost positive at least some of the, at least one or two of them were recruited, but this other woman who was here, Haley, who's also just as much as a survivor now. Not just recruited, but told

to lie about their ages. Yeah. So, Eftstein would let them into the house. Yeah. It's just amazing. The, what does he admit to?

Does he admit to getting massages from like under 18? Read the, read the statement. Well, you're here. Tell me. You read it. So you tell me.

Does he admit to getting massages? I think he does. God, I think he says that, you know, he says that he was basically a John who was patronizing prostitutes. Mm-hmm. but that there was never any,

there was rarely, he downplays like how frequent there would have been any actual sexual contact. He's just like massages and he like checking off. What was he doing? Yeah, pretty much. That's pretty much what he's, I mean,

I'll send you the statement. It's pretty interesting to read because like you never really hear him from his own perspective describing what he did. Yeah. Is it grammatical? His emails. There's some errors. Yeah, yeah.

It felt like the, like, the, like, your email garbled talk. how do you not have he says like the government he says like the government tried to I mean everybody says it was a sweetheart deal right he loathed Acosta he let he fired Dershowitz

yeah he thought he should have got an even better deal right because he was like the government was threatening that could possibly charge me with some kind of trafficking offense meanwhile I never left my house yeah it was all just these girls and women who came to my house but like he acknowledges

that some of them were under underage and he says that you know them lying or misrepresenting their age in Florida has no defense because of the statutory you know it's a statutory offense right and you know it's just worth reading not because you know you need to condone everything about Epstein but it just puts it much more

perspective I mean it's this is like you know years and years and years of this stuff it's dominating US and British politics Australian politics to some extent and like it was like it's this sorry like in the grand scheme of it just a real it should be it's pretty minor Okay.

How historic is Prince Andrew Like being stripped of his crown? Has that like ever happened In the history of British monarchy? Like what is there precedence for this? Um, yeah, they mean they're happy so Uh oh,

Michael, are you gone? Michael, it looks like Michael is frozen. If people, can people still see me? If you can still see me, please, uh, please, uh, indicate. Someone make a comment if you can still see me. Yeah, Michael is gone. on. Okay. So that was fun. Let's see here. Should I continue? Yes, Michael was gone. Okay. So anyways, that was fun. The Epstein stuff is pretty crazy. Yeah, what else is there to say? I'll take a question or two if people want to ask a question. Well, since I've got you all here, Josie got shocked by Hassan Pike Green. He said for those who joined us late, he said his phone was running out.

Yes, we still agree with an age before we should have them like, sure, we're sure, Deepak Kumar Singh. Yes, it's like people don't want, like what I'm arguing on Twitter these last few days is the fact that people, you know, I'm not saying it shouldn't be an age of consent, I'm saying that it's kind of ridiculous to make people have to lie and say like men are not attracted. And some of them go further than that. They don't even say under 18. A lot of men are on Twitter being like, I'm always attracted to

women within two, three years. Whatever, if that's what you prefer, I don't care. But to prefer that like, you'd just say that like, you know, it's the natural thing is to be attracted to women within two years of your age. It's just not based on science. Maybe you've socialized yourself to like that way. So whatever. You shouldn't have to lie about these things.

And it's always like a kind of slippery slope. It's like the people who want to say you should be attracted to anyone under 18 are also the ones who will say like 19 and 20 is like too young, any age gap. You're at the point where like you're just banning large kinds of human relationships. So we can't lie. We can't just we can't be dishonest about men and

women and what they find attractive to one other. So this is a hill to die. I don't care what Roxandra says. I love Roxandra, but yeah, you can't, you can't say something this absurd of like a man can't be attracted to girls under the age of consent, whatever the law happens to be in your particular

jurisdiction. How long can Trump continue to fight off this Epstein thing? The House Republicans drop him might be must be so it looks like from when i'm gathering they're going to pass something um it's going to go to the senate but it's going to be watered down and there's going to be like you know there's going to be uh uh exceptions for things related to investigations as i told michael there's investigations going on right now because uh trump told them to investigate bill clinton just to investigate all the democrats that are anyone that i've seen files so that gives them plenty of excuses not to release stuff

um and now the doj is like completely you know the executive branch in general is completely under Trump's control. So they'll probably pass the law. Trump will sign it. And then we'll fight over kind of what's being held or what's not held. So it's kind of an indeterminate outcome where you don't release everything, but it just continues to be a thing. If this goes into 2024, and so it's going to continue into 2024,

and it's going to be a major split between, you know, it's going to be like the thing they attack vans on. People are positioning themselves to potentially attack vans in 2008. So if Ben and runs and if some of these other people run, this could be an angle to us. He's part of the cover-up or whatever. He's part of the administration.

And so, yeah, I think this will go. It's kind of, you know, the fact that this is going to be like the 2028 issue for Republicans. It's just a sad commentary on where the party is. Every single thing in Republican, like, you know, you have, you know, you have populace, you have the party. You have, like, people who are demagogues and you have, like, you know, but it's like combined with, like, Wongs and like grownups and people who know something about what's going on and have some brains. And the Republican Party is not, like the people with the brains are just not, you know, they've been

chased out a long time ago. And all you have is like, you know, ideological racist, like people who just want as little immigration as possible and will fight on that issue. That's like a real issue. And then you have like conspiracy theorists and you have just racist and conspiracy theories. So it's like every attack will advance on the Trump from now on will be immigration. Marjorie Taylor Green has become a liberal darling, but it's like doing both these things, which are both kind of from the right. She's attacking Trump on H-1B visas, weirdly also like criticizing him for mass deportations. Marjorie Jailer Green only wants low-skilled immigration. A lot of people just want high-skilled immigration.

She just wants, she just doesn't like the policy of going after low-skilled immigration. And then, yeah, this is the ban on the wing of the party. So this is like the populism. The populism is going to be leading all into that. DeSantis is doing this weird thing where he's like the most anti-immigration. and also, like, cutting property taxes for boomers. So it's like, you know, it's funny because Trump attacked DeSantis for being, for his position on entitlements because DeSantis was once, like, a Tea Party Republican at that time. You actually cared about cutting spending.

So DeSantis, like, might have said some things or supported some things that involved reducing social security and Medicare payments, and Trump attacked him for it. But now DeSantis is probably going to be like the old people's candidate in 2028. It's probably good politics in Florida. These people are snakes. You look at DeSantis, you're like, oh, he really wanted to fight Wokeness. It was like, no. Wokeness was the thing at the time that got him political power. Now the thing at the time was like being King of Florida,

which means appealing to old people who are homeowners in many cases. And then also like a playing to like anti-immigrant sentiment, right? So even it has nothing to do with Kib before, just like France went from like an establishment guy, you know, giving TED talks on Hillbilly Ellogy and these people who don't take responsibility for their lives to being this populist who fights on behalf of the poor working class

that is their champion. Right. It's just they do the people who survive in politics make these shifts. And it's particularly bad on the Republican side because it shifts so quickly. It's like, oh, now we're all about cutting spending. Oh, now we don't care about that. Now we're all about immigration.

Now we're all about conspiracy theories. Now we're about the war on terror. Now we're about not fighting wars anymore. It's just kind of like it's just this avalanche that goes from, It's like it is not this amelage. It's like this wave that goes back and forth, right? It's kind of this weird thing

where you don't have like an ideology that's actually grounding these people. You can go in these weird directions based on what goes viral and what like pops up in the culture. So, yeah, that's where we are. What's your read on Ruby? It seems to me less conspiracy pill.

More trade conservative, but still willing to praise Trump in this. It could be a potential boring person at some point. Yeah, like I would consider it a good outcome if, well, Rubio kind of sucks. I mean, he's kind of, he's hanging out with, like, Warren Cassidy's people, which is terrible. You know, I don't know.

I think he's probably, from what I can tell, he's still closer to the 2010 Republican Party than he, than a lot of people, a lot of them, JD vans, a lot of the potential alternatives. Still in the O'Connan foreign policy, it seems to me. So, yeah, well, you know,

he'd be an interesting, he'd be an interesting person. He's kind of like, they know, like, the populace know, Vance is one of them in the way Rubio is not. Rubio entitlement spending. Let's see if Ruby, I'm like almost a one-issue voter on Social Security and Medicare. Like, I think Vance is the worst on those issues among Republicans. So Rubio at least has a history before entitlements. You know, I don't know if like what he's, if he's changed in the last five, ten years.

Yeah. So Rubio, yeah, so Rubio said a lot of stuff like this around 2010. And it's funny, it became more true. Like, nothing changed about the facts, but the Republican Party became so stupid. Like, they weren't connected to facts anymore. So they all said, we're going to cut foreign aid, and they were going to save spending. When it was like, now we're coming upon the crisis that they were talking about, they saw the crisis, like 15 years ago of entitlement spending, and it's by like 233, you know,

it's going to run out. So they saw it like in a generational thing. But now that we get closer, because the party's gotten stupider and less connected to facts, now they say we just have to expel all the immigrants and we'll save the we'll balance the federal budget just kind of stupidity

and so I don't know where Ruby is I don't know if he still understands what he knew 15 years ago or he doesn't anymore but yeah okay let's see it's 930 okay let me see if Michael texted me and gave me an update oh Michael's phone died

so he probably is not texting oh Bahamud bin Salman is in America That's pretty amazing. That was pretty unthinkable after he sliced up Jamal Khashoggi. Yeah, it's amazing that story and kind of where MBS was going and kind of like, you know, it was kind of being, seems like kind of a rogue figure at that point. Anyways, okay, I've got stuff to do. Good talking to everyone.

I mean, I'll post this, I guess, later, Michael Tracy and I's conversation and this part two, and yeah, we'll talk to you soon.