Mum's The Word! The Parenting Podcast - CAMILLA KERSLAKE: Why I Believe In Consequence Parenting

Episode Date: March 24, 2025

In this heartfelt episode of Mum's The Word, Kelsey Parker sits down with the BRIT-nominated opera singer, Camilla Kerslake.The two mums chat about their personal experiences, from having a home birth to navigating life as a mum in the public eye.Camilla opens up about her marriage to rugby star Chris Robshaw, sharing the ups and downs of balancing family life with the demands of their careers.Plus, the conversation delves into her firm belief in consequence parenting, and how it shapes her approach to raising her sons.It’s an inspiring and honest conversation you won’t want to miss!-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------This episode of Mum’s The Word is in partnership with FatFace their Mother’s Day The Hours That Make Us campaign.Remember to share your own "Hours" of motherhood on social media using #HeresToHerCheck out @FatFace on socials to see more of the campaign and shop the new season collection at fatface.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome back to Mums the Word. I'm your host, Kelsey Parker, and today I'm joined by Camilla Kerslake, she's Brit nominated English Kiwi opera singer, who was the first signing to Gary Barlow's Universal label, Future Records. She has released two studio albums with Universal, her self-titled debut followed by Moments. She has given numerous performances of the national anthem at sporting events across the UK, including Twickenham, Wembley, Old Trafford and the Millennium Stadium. In February 2022, frustrated at the lack of access many young people had to the myriad of benefits music and sports can bring

she and husband England and Harlequin rugby star Chris Robshaw started the Curse Lake Robshaw Foundation. To date the charity has helped hundreds of children and in 2025 will be expanding to hopefully empower many more. We chat about her parenting journey, bringing up two boys and what it's like to have a famous husband who's away a lot. So grab a cuppa, get comfy and let's jump into a brand new episode of Mum's the Word. This episode of Mum's the Word is in partnership with Fatface, their Mother's Day, The Hours That Make Us campaign. So today I have been styled by Fatface their Mother's Day the Hours That Make Us campaign. So today I have

been styled by Fatface. I am obsessed with my outfit. It hides my bump nicely but also it's just so comfy and I just think that when you are a mum and you get in dress in the morning you want something simple you want something that you can throw on look nice look cool but also you're ultimately comfortable. One of fat faces hours that makes us is happy hour and no not the one at the bar so guys i want to talk about my motherhood and happy moments and i just think you get pleasure in each day of being a mum and when your children do something, I mean, I spoke about it a few weeks ago when Aurelia won the highest score

in the whole of the dance competition. I was so proud of her and I think as a mum, you get so nervous when they do anything. And I remember back thinking, my mum used to be so on edge when I was gonna do a dance show or anything but I understand it now because you just want your children to do so well so that was a really really happy moment but also Bodie at school he's doing so well and he has had his like third certificate of the term and all the other kids keep coming out to me like,

Bode's got another certificate! So yeah, I'm just so proud of my children and yeah they just make me happy most days. So another one of Fat Face's hours is the hardest hour. So I think me personally the most challenging and toughest times of motherhood, I've actually had quite a few tough times. I had to bring a child into this world and go through labour with a husband who'd just been diagnosed with cancer. That was a really tough time and I got through it but also I just think for me the tough moments is when I have to be mum and dad and to have Tom back to give his input yeah I guess for me that has been tough I think your kids

frustrate you I think children are frustrating because there's always a saying that has stuck with me. You can't put a wise head on young shoulders and sometimes you just want your children to be a little bit more grown up and understand what you're trying to tell them. But I just think there's so much joy in being a parent so it outweighs them frustrating moments. But I think also being a mum is the hardest job you'll ever do. So be kind to yourself because it is tough. We're all trying to get through each day but being a mum is the toughest job. So remember to share your own hours of motherhood on social media using the hashtag here's to

her. Check out at fatface on socials to see more of the campaign and shop the new season collection at fatface.com just like I'm wearing right now. So Camilla thank you for joining me today. I've given you a bit of an introduction do you want to introduce yourself? No. Introduce yourself now. That is so awkward. We like to make you feel a little bit awkward on this podcast. Fantastic right. My name is Camilla and I am an opera singer and I'm a mum of two boys. Two boys? I know, boy mum.

A boy mum, are you a boy mum? I don't know, is there like, I'll be honest, I really wanted girls. And I've got two boys. I just wanted just one, I think most people want one of each, don't they? And then, you know, I have had two boys and it has really made me sort of like,

reevaluate what it means to be a boy mum and what it means to bring boys into this world because I think you know when you have girls and it shouldn't be the way it is but it is the way it is you teach them to protect themselves and all that kind of stuff but with boys you know you have to teach them to sort of become the kind of men that women don't need to be protected from you know so it does really feel like... Do you feel like you're under a lot of pressure now? I don't feel pressure, I feel a responsibility.

And like, I guess the reason I specifically wanted girls is because I am, you know, such a feminist and I really believe in equality across the board for absolutely everything. And I just thought, you know, wouldn't it be fantastic if someone who was like raised the way that I am and who's sort of like, I'm not educated, don't get me wrong, I don't have a degree or anything,

but I've educated myself. Wouldn't it be great if I was then able to impart that wisdom onto more women in the world? And that's not how it's worked out. And like my boys are wonderful and amazing. And I guess what I'm going to have to do is just raise, you know, boys who like share all their values and, you know, are like proud of their masculinity and like revel in it. But, you know, in a really healthy, like nurturing, loving loving way that's what I'm trying to do anyway. I love it and how old are the boys? She's golden this is to come. Yeah like well you know I'm jumping the gun slightly as always but uh one is three Wilding's three and Hunter is he was seven months last week

oh I know. So you've got Hunter and Wilding. Where did you get Wilding from? Okay, so again, from the Epsom Derby. So he's named after Emeline Wilding Davison. She was a suffragette. She tried to pin a rosette to the King's horse at the Epsom Derby and she passed away. She was trying to get the vote for women. And actually, you know, her, you know, it was the ultimate sacrifice, but it did get, you know, attention globally. And it, you know, probably was one of the biggest things in the movement.

So we were gonna call a girl, I think it was gonna be Celia or Celine Wilding. And then when we found out it was a boy, he was actually gonna be Teddy, because I just thought it was such a sweet name, like Theo, Teddy, whatever. But when he came out, listen, I'm gonna say this first, none of my friends had babies.

Opera singers and people in the media, as you know, tend to have their babies late, right? Sort of like late 30s. I think I got pregnant at 30, which isn't that young, but it's young for my world. No one had kids. I didn't know what they looked like when they come out. And I had him and he was like purple

and he looked like a mixture of sort of a lizard and a little gorilla and he looked really angry. And I was like, oh my God, I can't call this child Teddy. So, and then he was just nameless for about four days and in the end my husband was just like Why don't we just call him wilding and we did and that is an unusual name and I guess that he's never gonna meet Well, he's never gonna meet another wilding curse like Rob Shaw. That's for sure. No, but I quite like it like don't get me wrong He's probably gonna hate me when he's a teenager and wish his name was like Jack or something But I'm do you shorten it to So there's no shortening. No you

There's no shortening right now but he started to call me and my husband mum and dad and so when he calls us mum and dad we call him wild and he gets annoyed about that but I was having lunch with a very posh friend the other day Oh yes. So posh I mean literally Aristotle and posh and I said his name and they were like oh don't you know as soon as he gets to school everyone's gonna call him ding So maybe if he goes to posh school, they'll call him ding, but I'm not sure how I feel about that

Ding I don't know we need to come up with a good. Yeah. No posh people are weird. Yeah I'll take it back Cuz you can't like even W. I don't know. He's not W No, he's not like I feel like if he was a W You have to be like a photographer or like a writer or you know something really like educated and he's not gonna be there mine They've they've shortened already. So I've got a Raleigh. She's right. That's kind of body is bow But those are really cute. I wanted a bow for the second one for hunter. I wanted bow I said bow, but then I thought he's a body too. Yeah, that's really nice

But then I thought like again what if he comes out like an angry gorilla lizard and he's a bowdy too. Yeah, that's really nice. But then I thought like, again, what if he comes out like an angry gorilla lizard and he's called Bow, which means beautiful. Like what kind of... Don't you think a lot of babies do come out and they're not the best looking? So now that I know that, but I didn't know it the first time. They're all like squashed up and they've been inside you and they're like... I know. They're like so furious that they're out in the world.

Actually, do you know what? My second one, when he was born, he was sort of really cute from the get go. Oh, you're a loony. You're a living! It could not have been more different from the first one where I was like oh my goodness but no no. But do you think it might have been you and your trauma that you've gone through? No no honestly. Of like giving birth to the first and you're like oh what is this? No honestly you know like mums always have that thing where they look back on their newborn babies and they're like oh I thought it was the most beautiful thing in the world. No I knew he wasn't.

Like I knew I look back with photos and I'm like but like don't get me wrong he's gorgeous now like he's like he's really really cute now but honestly there was I would say for the first year I was like oh no. What's so funny with Aurelia is she was four-sept out. Oh she have a funny head. No and all the midwives will come around to see her and they were like so they're saying four-sept delivery this child has not got one mark on her and I was like cool. She's not got one mark on her She's like angel sin. I don't know about that now. So how many marks did you have on you though? Oh How let's talk births? Okay, how were they? Do you know what they went exactly as I like wanted? But but look I'm a bit of a hippie at heart you know I mean like I believe that like pregnancy as long as you don't have any

like medical issues or all that kind of stuff it's not a medical emergency I don't think it should be treated as such it is like a natural thing and if you can don't get me wrong however you as a as a individual a human wants to give birth that's the right way in my opinion. You know what I mean? Whatever you choose, that is correct for you and your child. But for me, I didn't feel like it was anything that needed any medical intervention or anything, so I was just going to do it completely my own way, right? I've been doing yoga since I was like 25. I've been singing opera since I was like 14, right? So breath control-wise, we're sort of at the top of the pile, you know, like opera singing. How know like how was your breathing perfect it didn't go out the window no absolutely not because

whenever it did the pain was horrendous but like breathing properly was the only way it was the only way I was ever gonna ever gonna like be able to get through that at all I gotta get through this literally literally like thanks to me but um yeah, the first time, like, a couple of times when it was getting really bad, I sort of stopped breathing or I'd get distracted or whatever, you know, when you're trying to get in the car and all that kind of stuff. I would like miss it. But then when I'd miss it, I noticed immediately how much more painful the contractions were. So like the breathing, like... It's like yoga though, because I've actually just gone back to exercise. I was just saying this before we started recording that I'm the only person that has a year off

and then decides to go back when they are pregnant. So I went back to yoga at the weekend and it is that breathing through the pain. Like breathing to the stretch. I guess the biggest stretch is your vagina. Literally but also stuff like I did loads of pregnancy yoga and I just didn't know, there were so many things I didn't know, like did you know that your jaw is connected to your lady garden?

So like if you're one of them people that always has a tight jaw, which is me. If you've got a tight vagina then. I mean, it's like a fucking vice. Honestly, okay, I know I'm not supposed to swear on your podcast, but I shit you not. My active labor was three minutes with Hunter. Really?

I got him out in one contraction. Like it's breathing. It's yoga. I lifted a lot of weight under the supervision of a PT, but I did exactly the same as you. I got pregnant. I was so busy before I got pregnant. Well, not before. Until about 20 weeks, I did three operas back to back. So I was on my feet all day, rehearsing eight hours, singing like the hardest rep known to man. Literally. I was singing Queen of the Night for the Magic Flute. I think that's the best thing though to keep it busy busy busy a lot I agree to a point but like that I think the weight training I think the yoga and I think all that like singing Definitely meant that I was like primed like primary price. So basically what you're saying to me is that I need to Start singing opera. Yeah

I mean if you're not a singer, then I think yoga is 100% the way to go. However, I would say what we were just saying about the work thing, I was singing for the Royal Opera House five days before I gave birth. And it's the Royal Opera House. You don't say no to the Royal Opera House or you might never get asked again. You go. Literally. Five days before. Exactly. And don't get me wrong, I grew up in a council house It's like less than 5% of the opera world is working class, right? So I've got to be there representing at all times

I feel like me and you are very similar that you take every opportunity You have to I am so on that like literally I'm forgetting that I'm pregnant right now It's like I'm taking 100% every opportunity doing everything I can until this baby falls out of me because it's going to fall out. No you're gonna push it out in three minutes. But I tell you what though if it wasn't the Opera House I definitely wouldn't have done it. I feel like from about 34 weeks being in front of like huge crowds and being surrounded by people you don't know oh no all your hormones are like no no no no. Everyone wants to touch the bump. Go hide in your cage. how did you feel about people touching the bump i really don't mind like i

really didn't mind so i had i was pregnant with my first so wilding i was it was locked down surprise too much uh too much uh rose and making our own fun but um you know rested Netflix and chill literally just not even Netflix babes but But what else do we have to do? But so for a lot of that, obviously no one could touch me. And then we went to America where they didn't give a hoot about lockdown, like honestly, I was trying to like, you know, I was, what's it called? I forgot what it's called, sheltering or whatever. Isolate.

Well, yeah, because I didn't want to get COVID when I was pregnant, which I did. Well, I think it's mental just to get the COVID thing. I love steering off. One of my friends, little ones, has been taught about COVID in school, like how we locked down everything. It's history. It's history. It's history.

What the? Oh no, it's awful. Oh God, we're old. We're like, we're moms. We are moms. We are moms. Like, when did that happen? Who are we?

But yeah, no, so, and then the other half of my pregnancy, I was in America, in California, and over there, they just don't care. I mean, you know, no, so and then the other half my pregnancy I was in America in California and over there they just don't care I mean, you know, like they're really friendly and really nice But like you just be like the supermarket car park and somebody laged man and walk over just grab your tummy He's like, wow, you're beautiful. I'm like I do love America for that I love the way they are when you're going to shops and they go above and beyond for you here You walk into the shop and they're like, oh you actually want to buy something from my shop like do you know what I mean? Have you been to New York? They treat you like a piece of poo over there?

Yeah, but I've done a lot more with Tom. We did a lot of time in LA. Yeah. Yeah, and I just loved LA I really don't like LA actually I can't bear it To go together me and Camilla is now done. We're never going to go to San Diego Oh, yeah, all the nice weather you get all the amazing food, but it's really chill There's like no one with like running around with like the fake tan and the like turkey teeth like telling you about the manuscript that they I don't care. I don't get you know That's what I love about America because I love going out and I love meeting people and I this is what I loved about LA But you come back you come back with like eight cards of like things that are relevant

and the stories people tell you, obviously that is why I'm doing a podcast because I love talking to people and I love hearing people's stories and you can't get away from that in LA. No, but I feel like I love a genuine story and I feel like in LA everyone has a polished PR pitch. I love that. Do you? That's so funny. Pitch to me now. Oh that's fantastic. No I love that. You're never going to get the pitch back from me. It's like, oh I like what you're saying. You are who you are. You come from your council house and so what was you doing in San Diego? So my husband was offered to play rugby over there and

Do you know what it was so so nice for us because like I mean I've been working since I was a teenager My husband's working since I was 17 I mean like Tom and I were signed to the same management and we were like 19. Really? Yeah Yeah, we were both signed to maximum management like we used to hang out How have I not met you before I think think we have, but I don't think we were sober, ever. Like ever. That is so rude. But, you know, we've both been working since we were teenagers and, you know, like, you

can't, like, captain the national rugby team for, like, four years and play for, like, seven or whatever without getting, you know, recognised everywhere you go. And don't get me wrong, like, 95% of people are really sweet and really respectful. But at the same time, you know, like being observed and being like watched and all that kind of stuff, it definitely sort of changes how you interact with the world. And also there's just so many calls on your time.

Whereas in California, no one had any clue who either of us were. And it was so nice. There was no calls on our time. Like he would go to rugby, he would do his training, and then he would come home. And we've never had that. Like I get for most people that that, you know, is a fairly normal state of affairs. You do your job, you finish your job, you come home. But like, you know what it's like, you know,

I have a rehearsal in the day and then, you know, I have to go to an award show at night and like sing because actually that pays, you know, three times what doing an opera does, you know? And then my husband's got a dinner that he has to speak to the next night and he's been working all day, and that kind of thing. So it was so nice, I literally felt a decade of stress

just sort of leave both of our bodies. And there was something really incredible about that coastline. Did you get to see much of the California coastline? Well, I actually did a trip, it's actually before Tom got ill, we went for my stepdad's 50th birthday and we drove from like San Fran all the way to Vegas, we ended up. Nice.

So that was wicked because I loved all the seaside towns and that. So we lived in one of those quintessential perfect California seaside towns. And they are that. They're just, I mean don't get me wrong, it's like Mayfairair on see and was that moochie round in their lululemon like we had a flat a two-bed flat about a mile inland from the ocean like no ocean view or anything and the rent of that was as much as our like four bed townhouse in London. Have you watched Selling Sunset? Okay we're not talking Selling Sunset but yeah no it was wild but it was really it was it was such a great reset.

Such a great reset. Sometimes you need that. I think we did. I really think we did. And also it revitalized us to come back. We came back and I was just like, right, let's go. And then all of last season I was with the English National and the Royal Opera. I mean, those are two of the best houses in the world. And I always feel like, you know when you're self-employed,

you're just constantly having to self-motivate, self-motivate, self-motivate. It's so hard. Me and Georgia talk about it all the time. It's so hard. And to juggle with being a mom. A mom. And self-employed.

And paying the bills. Literally. And then having the mom guilt. Oh yeah. Of someone then looking after your child because you need your children to be looked after because you've got them. Exactly, exactly. Like we were talking just before we went live, live, about how I'm like

trying to give up breastfeeding because like, oh, I've got quite a bad ADHD anyway, like a lot of people do these days, but a lot of people have been diagnosed these days, right? And like, it's just like having to feed every three hours or like I would be at rehearsal I was at rehearsal for a concert. I was doing at Christmas And obviously, you know, you you never know how long things are gonna take You never know like what aria is gonna take longer or what the strings are gonna have an issue with this or like the whole You know, I mean you never know and like you can try and time it like to the cows come home But you know what the titties got to be pumped when the titties got to be pumped. There's a

Literally, so I'd be like do you look Like and and i'm just it's just too much it's just too much and i've already got like and I know from this like People are probably gonna be like, oh no, you should be better for two years But like I can't I don't have anything more like in me like I ate so well I exercised so much like, you know, like my body was a temple and all of that but you know what I just want to be able to go out on a Friday night and have like some nice days with my friends and and not like worry not think oh god I've got get home when I'm really drunk and pump and dump and then I got a pump and dump in the morning I don't want to accidentally

pollute my child with Lady A like I've just... I very much doubt that you would actually do that though. I mean it's top I mean? It's top, top, top quality advice. I won't give my advice on the pump and dump. I feel you on that, but one of my best friends is a midwife actually and there's a lot of fun things I ran by her. Very few hard noses, interestingly, but a few real hard noses. But apparently the alcohol thing is a mobility issue. As long as you can like, maneuver them, apparently it's alright. Don't take my word for that. Don't take my's all right. Don't take my word for that. Don't take my word for that.

Don't take your word for that. So going back, because obviously I really wanted to ask you this question. How did you get into opera singing? I could just sort of do it. Like growing up, like neither of my parents were into classical music. I really didn't hear much at all.

So what made you get into it? I could just do it. I could just, honestly, I could just do it. So I think growing up, like my mum, she said when she was pregnant, she was absolutely obsessed with Phantom of the Opera. Like obsessed with Phantom of the Opera. And don't get me wrong, it's a banging musical. Like highly recommend.

Very dramatic, quite sexy. I love it. Indeed. Yeah, I've never done the show though. Not great. I was meant to do it and then my mum got ill and then that was sort of it, you know what I mean? And I think it came from there. You know, then like don't I want to be a pop star like everyone wants to be a pop star when they're a teenager but became very clear like quite quickly that

you know while a million girls could sing pop not many girls could sing opera and I I can actually sing the highest note ever written for the human voice. Can you? Yeah. Do it now. Oh my listen to me I'm dying. Yeah, do it now. Oh my listen to me. I'm dying My post first postpartum period started yesterday

I've got the sweats in your chair your studio is gonna stink like No, I don't even know Please That's not even it I need a piano I'm not that kind of musician. Here we go, I'll get one out. That is amazing though. Yeah, it's just like one of those things that's like partly physiological, like partly I was born that way, but partly I've just worked really, really, really, really hard. So you didn't go to a college and train?

So I did a bit of contemporary music college. But to be honest, like, this is like one of the real barriers to working-class singers in opera is the cost of training. Like, the most elite institutions in the world you would think like MIT or Harvard or Cambridge or Oxford or whatever, it's not. It's the Royal College and the Royal Academy of Music. It's just so bad. Like, and then the thing is you think, oh scholarships and all that kind of stuff, but actually if you can't afford lessons how are you gonna get a scholarship scholarship and it's something

the charity that my husband and I have started the curtsy robshell foundation it's something that we're really really trying to address because you know there is a lot of will within the colleges to address this but like how you know you've got to get kids at like sort of 14 to get them and and it's important to get them with the right teacher, because you know, you can't be taking a kid like me and giving them to someone who went to Eton, because like, as if I would have listened to someone like that when I was 14. No, it's gotta be someone they can relate to

and someone who understands them. So yeah, that's something we're trying to, I don't wanna say fix, but we're trying to enable within the foundation, is getting kids to the right teacher so that sort of by the time they are 18, they are in a really great position to get a scholarship. It's really difficult we were talking about it actually talking about with my best friend Kelsey she loves to mention on this podcast she might as well come and do it with me. We were talking about it actually on the way today this morning

because we both went to Italia Conti and when we went to audition for colleges, her mum, like Kelsey's from a council state in Mitcham, and her mum was like, you'll just have to look for a normal college because we can't afford. So she'd been at the full-time education. She said, we can't afford for you to be there anymore. You are gonna have to go and find a different option. And it was actually our headmaster that pulled Kelsey in

and said, I think you need to audition. I think you need to audition for a full scholarship. Yeah. Let's go from there and Kelsey did actually get a full scholarship and managed to go to Italia Conti but that's only because she had the right people behind her. Which is amazing and I love that her parents were in a position to sort of, to make that happen for her. You know, like they knew they got her into Italia Conti, all that kind of stuff. Like I think we're really keen to sort of work with that happen for her. You know, like they knew they got her into a talia conti, all that kind of stuff. Like, I think we're really keen to sort of work with institutions like that or like the Brit school stuff,

you know, because there's so few options for like working class people in the arts now. I think in the seventies, it was like sort of like 16.7% working class. And I think in the arts overall, it's now like 6.7. It's really, really bad. It's gotten much, much worse. I don't know if you noticed as well in the media industry you know like all the journalists all the tv presenters all the singers

like even like people i don't know it's like who seem like they're the working class they're not like they're not like so many people are privately educated like like most people and like i just don't think it's good for the art form you know if only one type of person is telling stories you don't get any like realism in it, like particularly in opera, like when I first sort of started, because I actually got a record deal when I was about, I think I was 19 and you know, I did crossover and they were really keen for me not to properly train in opera, really, really keen, just because it does change your voice, I think personally for the better, but you know, they wanted me to sort of sing and look like an angel, but keep my mouth

shut, which obviously I was not very good at. But I can't imagine you to sort of sing and look like an angel but keep my mouth shut which obviously I was not Very good at but I don't need to be good at that one I know I had to finishing school and act like I had to start seeing my tears and everything and you know what? It wasn't genuine and that must have come across. It's just it's not who I am Let me sing how I want to sing so when I was sort of in my late 20s I was like, you know what? I'm gonna start training. I took semi sabbatical I did some bits and bobs of work, not a lot, and I really, really focused on my opera. I've lost my train of thought because I have a six month old

who woke up every hour. Baby Brain is an actual thing. But how did you actually get signed to a record label? Oh, I'm just relentless. But what did you do? So you know what, you said earlier about how people like you and I take every opportunity. We do because we have to because opportunities don't really come to people like us.

They come to, you know, Hugo and Fenella kind of, do you know what I mean? But I found out where Gary Barlow was working because I actually had a friend who worked for a management company. What sort of friend? A uni friend. She was doing the same course as I was before I dropped out. She had said that he was specifically looking for a classical singer. She was like, hi.

I was like, oh, hey. So I basically took him a demo until he listened to it. He finally listened to it. I think he called me on a Friday. I met him on the Monday and he signed me there. That's incredible. It's like fairy tales. Do you feel like things have changed though now

that you have TikTok and different platforms? Is there more opportunities? Is there less opportunity? Do you feel people can have five minutes on them platforms? Like I would love to know what you thought of that. Okay, so I think it's both amazing and a bit crap So I think I love that it's just a great leveler like I love that you see these like kids doing their dances to this song and

Then in like a month's time, it's number one on radio one. Like I love that. It's not six Men in a room in their 30s Choosing what teenagers are to listen to now. I love that it's democratic again. It's what it was like in the 60s when the Beatles were huge and all that stuff. Like Harry Styles said, who was to say that teenage girls shouldn't be tastemakers because look at all the people they've made.

I love that. Don't get me wrong, I know that record labels pay huge TikTokers to use tracks and all that kind of stuff. But like, if you look at people like Ray and all that kind of stuff, there was a lot of really genuine, genuine stuff. And I love the fact that, you're like Sam Ryder and all those people.

I love the fact that it is completely possible now to do it all by yourself. Yeah, I mean, Sam Ryder. He's, yeah, what a legend. But also I just, you know, like I'm making a record at the moment and we are talking to a couple of majors, but you know the difference between now and 10 years ago is

You're not hungry for the major. I don't even know if I need them Like how what difference is it going to make to me? You know, you get a really great team you get a good publicist It's not like it was you know, like in you know, when tom and I first started working when you had to be singing on Strictly Come Dancing. They don't even have a live band anymore like where where you know you had to be doing X-Factor and all that kind of stuff you know it's so different now and I love, I love, love, love that it's a great leveler and I love, love, love that you can you really genuinely can be self-made but what is not ideal is the fact that I'm not sure what the percentage is of like I don't know what you get per sort of TikTok that uses

your music but it's absolutely minuscule. It's like, it's not enough to live on. Like unless you're sort of like, like a Tay-Tay Swift or something, you're, you're not seeing a lot of money for your work. And I think also, obviously the songwriting and that world is just, yeah, I'm not really sure. Yeah, yeah. I definitely, definitely hear what you're saying about that. The good thing about classical is it's place at the moment. Yeah, yeah, I definitely hear what you're saying about that. The good thing about classical is it's all out of copyright. So sort of, you know, if I was to do a version of any song that was out of copyright, you know,

I would get the money for that. But at the same time, it would be a really small amount because no one sells physical records anymore. Like, when I think about like, I think I sold like 50,000 physical copies of an album, like off the bat in like the first couple of weeks with my first record. And like, they were actually not that thrilled about that. They were like, oh, it's okay.

But now, can you imagine selling 50,000 physical copies of a CD, you know, like with a, you remember you used to get the jacket out and you used to look at all the pictures and sometimes it would have the lyrics in. You feel so upset for kids that they're never gonna experience that. That was once, you know what,

when all like the digital music sort of started coming in and now I'm showing my age. I remember being really sad because I remember getting like, when I was really young, which was like single figures, I can remember getting like, you know, like the Spice Girls. Spice Girls, I knew you were gonna say Spice Girls. Yeah, and stuff like that. And I think it was more the obsession. Like I was obsessed by the Spice Girls I had everything I've watched over and Spice World what I used

to get and especially I've always loved music and love to dance and love to perform and my daughter is so similar to me and she would love that now but like getting out learning the words I know the words for so many songs because we've put them in our memory. Yeah. But no, but they're all obsessed with like, all these online people and like, they want to be like influences and they want to be, what is a Twitch streamer? Like, because my godson said, I was like, oh, what do you want to be when you grow up, Bailey?

He's like, oh, a Twitch streamer. I was like, what is that? I know. Had to ask his mum, apparently it's, they play a game and they film themselves playing the game. But it's my brothers who are younger, people know that, listen to this, I've got younger brothers, and they are always on the hustle now because they watch all the time that you can like, like you can earn money in crypto, you can do this, you can do that.

I think the world for them now is anything is possible. I love that. I love that. Like, you know, I've always been a sort of like times change role with them sort of individual, you know, and it's a whole new world. And you know, it's a bit scary for sort of people of a certain age and all that kind of stuff. You know, we're not teenagers anymore. It's my nanny goes, you're always on your phone. You're always on, I'm like, Nan, my whole job is on my phone. I really would love to get off it I might buy a laptop, but I'm just terrible at using actual technology My son says to me and I love him for it goes mommy put down your phone. Okay Yeah, but he's so hard but like my whole life. Yeah, I work everything is on that phone

I have the terror like I didn't upgrade my phone for like a year after I should have I had that I had the new phone Didn't up Oh, yeah, cuz you think I'm gonna lose everything I sign into your banking sign into this I just don't make it easy for us. Oh, we really really don't but like do you know what? I actually I've just got back from Egypt and When we were there I had no I'd say I had about maybe 20 minutes of Wi-Fi a day Fantastic. I loved it. Did you feel great?

I feel fantastic. Like my brain feels so empty, which obviously is not necessarily a good thing, but it is a good thing when you're carrying the weight of the world. Like there's so much messed up stuff going on right now. And you know what? There's nothing I can do about it.

There is absolutely nothing I can do about it. So like what I've been doing, like I've got my book over there that me mum gave me, lovely, but on the way in, you know, I used to do emails and stuff, but on the way in, like on the train, I read my book and I've started turning my mobile data off. So, you know, here I'm here for work, like, you know, I didn't get a chance

because the baby woke up every hour on the hour from 12.30, cheers guys. She's really not grudging the baby. Cheers Hunter, love you. She's really not grudging the baby. I feel fantastic, anyway. and she's coming up period. and the first or second day of my first postpartum period whoop whoop I'm living the dream anyway so pleased to be here. so glad you came. yeah yeah yeah. don't take it out of me. I'm having a great

time. well I think I'm just gonna keep doing that and you know and there's never gonna be anything so urgent I think it was so urgent they could call me on the phone. My phone still works. You know what I mean? I'll reply to my emails when I get home, but like I loved it I really love not being on my phone And I know that makes me sound like old and all that kind of stuff But otherwise, you know you get a whatsapp through and it's a work thing and just reply to it immediately You don't need to I don't need to and I think that's what I'm gonna do need to and I think that's what I'm going to do. That's what I'm just going to do. Do you have an insatiable fascination with the paranormal? Are you ready to dive head

first into the eerie realms of the unexplained? Brace yourself for the supernatural world is about to reveal all of its secrets on the Paranormal Activity Podcast. And who better to guide you through this hair-raising journey than myself, Yvette Fielding, renowned paranormal investigator. Every episode of Paranormal Activity takes you on an unforgettable adventure into the unknown. I share my own encounters, chilling experiences and exclusive insights into the world of the paranormal. But that's not all. The true heart of this podcast lies in the stories, evidence and questions shared by our devoted listeners. Like you, whether you're a seasoned paranormal enthusiast or just starting to dip your toes into the waters of the supernatural,

Paranormal Activity with me, Yvette Fielding, is your ultimate destination. Will you dare to join me? ultimate destination. Will you dare to join me? Listen to Paranormal Activity with me, Yvette Fielding, wherever you get your podcasts from. As you all know, this episode of Mums the Word is in partnership with Fatface, their Mother's Day, The Hours That Makes Us campaign. Another one of Fat Face's hours is the Fearless Hour and I think for me I have had to be fearless, really strong, really hold myself together in the hardest of times and I feel like I've overcome so much of being a mum and stepping up for my kids because I think us as a family we had the biggest obstacles in our way so yeah motherhood for me hasn't been that

easy but I was fearless and I think a lot of people look at me for that because I was so fearless as a mum. I think clothes can really make you feel confident like today me in my fat face dress I feel great I look great I'm really gonna big myself up which we should as a mum. As mums we should big ourselves up. I'm wearing fat face and I feel fantastic but I do think clothes can give you confidence like if you wake up in the morning and you bang a tracksuit on and you scruff your hair on your head you're probably not going to have the best day but if you wake up you put a nice dress on like today do your hair do your makeup it's gonna be a good day so another one of fat faces

hours is the finest hour or the not so finest. I have so many funny memories to share with you about my children. I mean I really feel like a Aurelia is the gift that keeps on giving. I often have the moment where I'm just stood there thinking, oh my god, what's she going to say? What's she going to say? What's she going to do? A standout one for me, which I think I have shared before, is when she threw up on the plane on holiday. She literally sicced over me orange juice and Doritos.

That was not my finest hour. I had to sit on the plane. Aurelia got dressed into a lovely new outfit because there was someone behind us that gave her clothes. Not Mummy. I had to sit there in a soaking wet jumpsuit that she had thrown up all down me. And I remember the air stewards and stewardesses coming over having to clean her seat and probably just looking like, oh this kid, I was thinking this kid too. So guys make sure you have travel bands. That is another mum hack and mum rule there. Travel sickness bands and you know what guys I think not everything has to be perfect and if you don't laugh

you'll cry so yeah not everything is going to be perfect in life especially when you have kids because something especially with mine something will always happen unexpected always prepare for the worst. That's what I say. Remember guys to share your own hours of motherhood on social media using the hashtag here's to her. Check out at fatface on socials to see more of the campaign and shop the new season collection at fatface.com

just like I'm wearing right now. I got into the habit of just being on my phone constantly before I met my partner now, and he has done me the world of good because I actually, in the evenings, not turn my phone off, but put it to one side and we watch TV and watch series. He actually can't believe that I've not

probably completed a series in my whole entire life. But I'm. He actually can't believe that I've not probably completed a series in my whole entire life. But I'm like. I can't believe that. But I get bored, I'm probably borderline ADHD. So I'll start something and then be like, oh I will continue watching that. Start something new, not continue. So, and then if I'm working, then I'm like,

oh I need to be fully focused on what is ahead of me. Yeah, I hear that. So now I'm actually completing series. I don't know what's happened to me. What are you watching? Do you know what I've actually started watching? We was watching the Bear Grylls. Which one? You know he's just done that new TV show where they were going to the Bear Pit. You should do it. I feel like you'd be great. No. You would be great. My husband should do it. He did that SES show last year dislocated his shoulder. That is like. In the fighting, he put it back in, carried on

fighting. He'd be too good for the burgers. Dislocated it again and then he got disqualified. They all actually injure themselves so bad in that SAS because Pete Wicks broke his ribs when he jumped out the plane or something, didn't he? So he came back and did it again the year that my husband was in it. So funny, like, so like you would expect, you know, rugby player, like he is like the quintessential alpha male but in the good way not in the gross way I don't know I always like so his his best friends on that thing were Pete Wicks and Bobby Norris and like it always shocks people when I say that I'm like it's just the kind of people he likes like I think I think his job was so like macho

for so long he just he loves women he loves gays like he just likes people with like a chill energy but I do feel like rugby mentality is completely different yeah and gentlemen playing a thugs game when he did the shows though yeah with Tom he done quite a few reality TV shows and I remember him doing the jump and everyone put money on Tom winning but when it came to it, Ben Cohen beat Tom, but I said sort of like Tom came third, I think. Ben threw himself down the jump. Ben didn't know in his head whether he was landing that jump or not, but his sports mentality

was like, I'm doing it. I'm firing myself on this jump and it doesn't matter. It's conditioning, isn't it? It's mental conditioning. Also, they're so used to pain in a way that like we now know because we're mothers but like previously you know like in rugby, in the internationals the hits are like getting hit by a Volkswagen at 25 mile an hour. They are used to pain. But it's that mindset they've got.

Yeah it's the mindset. But you have to be relentless or you don't make it right. So I mean it's not really fair. It's like you know when they put like they should pussycat doll or like a West End star on strictly Come on. So I mean I shouldn't say that I'm friends with one of them But do you know I mean the jump was a bad was someone said to me about doing strictly I'll be with Georgia. She was like, oh would you do strictly? Oh, that's not fair. You've danced I said me dancing at the age of 18 to me dancing now with a prolapse and Everything else in the saggy tits is completely different.

I probably wouldn't be able to get my leg up or be lifted. I feel like you'd probably still be a lot better than someone like me. Literally, as we were talking about before we started recording, I danced, I got my groove on for the first time since I'd had the six month old properly at the weekend. oh my lower back is killing me Britney Spears my law man honestly I can't do any of my signature moves there was no there was no slap drops like my

mum was in the room but she loves it like I just was you having a party at home lol no we were on a boat we were doing a Nile cruise. Oh! Yeah, it was so fun. It was so fun. It was a work trip, but I highly recommend. Highly, highly recommend. The karma carnet was brilliant. But yeah, I can't do any of my moves. I'm sure it would probably be a good... You know, like, I feel like you need a fitness goal.

I always need a goal. If I have nothing to work towards, I'm like... You know? Well, my goal at the moment is to just get this baby out. To be fair, sure. Sure. Like, I hear that. That is a pretty important goal right there

So going back to we touched on the boys and about Emotions indeed do you feel is important to teach your boys to be emotional? I feel like it's really important to teach all kids that their emotions are completely valid and The more they can like express them in like healthy ways the better. You know like when I think about like our parents generation and sort of like you know they were raised by people that sort of lived through the war when they were like really young and all that kind of stuff and when I think about sort of all the things that you know like I think I've only seen my mom cry like twice and once was when her dad died and once was when like she was diagnosed with cancer and all that kind of stuff.

And I don't know, I just feel like if you are not afraid of them, if you know that having them is like completely fine, but also there are like appropriate and inappropriate ways of dealing with it, you know? So I'm like... Sometimes we can do too much talking with our kids and this all emotional led parenting. They're animals at the end of the day, you know, it's our job to tame them. And so like... And it's however way, like I just find it so hard, especially with, Aurelia is so different to Bodie.

Yeah. Aurelia, I can just tell, and she will listen to me and she's like, okay, she will push the boundaries, she's a boundary pusher. And I do want her to be a bit like that anyway because it's good for a girl to push A boundary you don't want her to be like a follower. Yeah, a hundred percent So I'm a bit like when she does go against me. I'm like But I want her to have that about her when they use your language against you and you're like, oh That's a really well put together argument and you don't know what to say

Bojie at the moment, honestly. He's four. He's four. Yeah. I think he's going through a lot with what's going on with me. Yeah. But the emotional blackmail and. So I haven't got that yet.

I haven't got that. You right. And it's, and boys are worse than girls. Oh no, so much worse. You know, like you go to like an NCT class and all, like after everyone's had their babies and every, all the girls are facing out, chat facing out chat chat chat and all the boys are facing in mummy mummy mummy I've really noticed that yeah really noticed that and me and

my friends say to each other we can't be them boy mums we can't be them boy mums we can't be them boy mums like I cannot be the boy mum was like I can't be that person the worst no see like my biggest fear, and this was, I think, one of the main reasons I wanted girls was that, you know, your husband's your husband totally finds a wife. And so what am I going to wreck my body and, you know, like get three hours sleep last night and, and then, you know, like spend a fortune on them and then they get married and piss off. I'm sorry, no, but at the same time I do not want to be the mother-in-law who's like, I'm not pressing a little edge, I'm taking my boy away from me. No, you can't

be like that. So my plan is to give them as banging self-esteem as humanly possible, which I'm already working on. And then just hope, hope and pray that they make really good choices. Because I would love to have two daughters from my son's wives, you know, or you know, husbands, you know, we don't mind. But at the same time, like I want to be emotionally and physically the place that they want to

come back to. I want to have an open house where their friends are like that's what I had growing up you know like my friends were always welcome and my partners were always welcome and you know there has been a partner or two that my parents did not like and I wish they told me in like more certain terms because I'm a very definite person. Yeah I'm dealing with that. Yeah and so I really did with that. Why did no one tell me? So like no but my parents would tell me in a gentle way because they are gentle people like they'd be like oh I really don't like how you speak to each other. But my mum's brutal when I was in it she didn't say anything and then now I'm out of it she's

like now telling me I'm like but why didn't you just she said we tried to tell you Kelsey but you're argumentative. I'm like true. That's what I mean and I feel like you know what we were saying before about how when someone's in it it's really hard to tell them and until they've experienced it you can't really. Yeah. You could I just don't think you can but like that there's a couple of there's a boyfriend in particular I wish my mum would be like he's awful and you're- Just break up with him now. And when you're together you're awful he makes you the worst person like That would be my biggest piece of advice to young people looking for a partner is, yeah, the passion, the excitement,

and all that is really, really great. But when you're looking for a long-term partner, and I'm not talking about people who just wanna shag around. Shag around, you're young. Live your life, baby. Have fun. Live your life.

But if you're looking for a partner, remember that that partner is gonna be your children's parent if children is something that you want. And the exciting, crazy person who does this and that and the other and like you have passionate arguments with and great makeups, that that's not going to be a good dad. That that's just long and the short of it is not. And I'm not saying that you can't find a partner who's like really great and really solid. And then the sexist crap because that's definitely not what I've ended up with you know what I mean you can have both but you can have

you can have both and you will have both but um that would be my thing just remember when you're dating that you're dating your future children's parent as well you know what I'm so lucky with now I've obviously got two sets of in-laws yeah but I have been so lucky with my in-laws but that's probably because of you as well I mean, it's I just say it how it is as well And I won't but you can say it how is it with kindness you don't have to be one of those people Oh, yeah, I just say it like it is me Have you noticed people who say that I always say 20 things and they always say things that no one needs here

No one cares about your opinion Barry like do you know what you can say it like it is in a really kind way be like Oh, you know, well, it seems to me like maybe this is the situation. You don't have to be like, oh, what I'm doing, do you know what I mean? It's so true. Just definitely say it as you, like, be honest. But I've always told their parents or their mums what their sons are up to.

I think you have to be honest with them. Like, give me a for example. For example. I need a for example. I can't give you one. No, I need one! Well, even with Will's mum, I will say what he's done. If something I'm not happy about. Oh yeah, no, I do that with Chris's mum all the time.

Sometimes I'm like, oh, cause you know he's done this and she's just like, oh, like, I don't know if his ex-girlfriends have ever done that before, but I'm like, I just say what I think so I'm like oh I'm upset about Will carrying on in a certain way with Tom's mum I hear that oh you never guess what he's done now no but I think that's they don't tell their mums no no they don't boys don't tell them anything oh boy mum but so I would I would do stuff like that but like the thing is I

feel like they're not just your in-laws. You've given them grandchildren, right? So it's a different relationship. And I feel like it's completely valid. And actually it fosters a real closeness. So with my mother-in-law, Chris, he's away a lot doing rugby punditry and all that kind of stuff.

And so when he's away for a full weekend, don't get me wrong, I know I've only got two kids, but if I have them on my own from Friday to Monday, I Monday I'm like well have I had two one was enough um you know especially like when one is ill or like oh you know what I mean like both of them are ill and you can't put either of them down and you've got so much work to do and you've done about you've done about one thing that you're meant to do the house as a tip Chris got home the other day I hadn't showered in three days he was like why haven't you showered in three days I was like because your children won't nap and I can't put them to bed Chris how did you smell after

that I mean I think he could tell and I think that's why I mentioned it but uh anyway we move but no I would do that like so you know Chris will text his mom and be like oh do you mind popping around Camilla's gonna be on her own for like a few days and she'll she'll message me she'll be like oh he's leaving you again and I'll be like he's'll be like, oh, he's leaving you again. And I'll be like, he's leaving me again, Pat. And yesterday he said that I didn't look nice in my pregnancy dress and she'll be like, Chris. Like so, she's very much on my side. But I love a mother-in-law that's on the side.

But you have to be because she has three boys. She has three boys. But I think like my mum and Chris do gang up on me a little bit as well. And I think it's great. You know, like I'm so into that whole like soup of family and like family of choice and all that kind of thing. Like I get the boy mum thing, but I'm going to make such like soup of family and like family of choice and all that kind of thing like I get the boy mum thing but I'm gonna make such an effort, such an effort with my children in law. How do you cope with Chris being away a lot?

It's much better here than it was in America because obviously like an away game here with rugby you know the furthest you're gonna go is like Exeter or maybe like Newcastle but in America you know they're like in Seattle or they're in New York you know they're like hours and hours away on a plane. It's quite far. Yeah I mean it's lucky and it's unlucky. Chris dislocated his shoulder like about two or three weeks. Even their shoulder? Mate, mate. After he got rehabbed after the SAS I said to him I was like this is the last time I'm rehabbing you because by that point in our relationship he must have had about eight operations and God knows how many injuries I was like, I'm not doing this again I'm not doing it again. We're not doing this

No No but um and I was actually really lucky that he dislocated it when he did because he would have been in Seattle when I went into labor and It would have been the middle of the night and I had no family Everything happens for a reason right? Like I mean and there was my labor. I I Everything happens for a reason. Right. I mean, there was my labor.

I listened to the people, the few people I knew he'd had babies and they were like, oh, you know, my water broke and then I just went back to sleep and then the next day I went to the pub and had lunch and I went for a walk. No, every two minutes, I think it was every five minutes for half an hour, then it was every two minutes for eight hours. Every two minutes. There was no way I could have driven myself to the hospital. An ambulance ride in America is like 10 grand. When I tell you that no one laid a hand on

me until that baby was physically exiting my body. Because I didn't need it. Like my body did it. My breathing did it. Right? I wasn't setting foot in a hospital because over there they will do whatever they can to charge you more. They'll give you an episiotomy you don't need. They'll just schedule you a c-section because they've got a golf game. Like private healthcare is wild and we cannot let it happen in this country. We cannot let the NHS be privatised because I've had both and I can tell you it cost £10,000 to have my first son. All they had to do was stitch me up a bit at the end and it wasn't even a bad one. It was like a second degree, like a minor second degree. They didn't touch touch me they didn't touch me once except to stitch me up ten grand

and we had good insurance right I think the problem in this country though with the NHS is it's great for certain things oh yeah long-term illnesses for sure not great and it don't be wrong it does need a complete overhaul fully I fully hear that like I had a home birth I wanted a home birth I had a home birth in the water it was perfect it was I mean don't be wrong it was also horrendous you have that through the NHS yes I wasn't going private I paid taxes you know I mean like absolutely not but yeah I'm just in such a catch-22 at the moment with how I feel about everything god this is like therapy for me guys

lol I need to make the decision of what I'm gonna do and what path I'm gonna take. Yeah well you can ask me anything you want about home birth. My mum had a home birth. Well it's you know statistically. And that was 20 years ago. Statistically if you've already had kids with no complications it's the safest place to do it and I can't I cannot recommend it highly enough I'm really really right but guys please brave me to have a home birth the only thing I would say is because of like short staffing I had to go in the next day for the baby's is it nipper test or you know where they do the baby's bits and bobs and I shouldn't have had to do that that also should have been at home

because you know that those first sort of five days you're not supposed to really get out leave your bedroom I was just sort of like waddling around I had a friend that did seven days in the bed seven days on the bed seven days around the bed I haven't heard the seven I've heard the five and I did it with my five five five I think it is but I did it no my friend you might be right it might be five days in the bed five days around the bed I think it's something like that. I like I'm a real hippie with that But I did it in California because you can with your first can you do it with your second?

Can you fuck like because your toddler's like mommy mommy mommy and obviously you don't want to You know, the whole world has just been rocked and like don't get me wrong He's dealing with it so so well, but you do feel so guilty This is why I don't really like parenting without Chris or like on my own because I don't feel that I give each child because they're such different ages as well I don't feel like I give I can give either of them enough you know like my like Hunter my my seven month old he's such a love bug he just wants to be held he wants to be held all the time and like he's sitting really well and all that

kind of stuff I've seen him roll twice and I should be worried about that and I feel like with your first one you're like oh no he's not reaching his milestones but with your second one you're like well you rarely meet an adult that can't roll it's just like you know I can't you know put him down and have him screaming and then my toddler's like mommy make him stop screaming and then I'm like I know but he needs it was tummy timer. He's never gonna learn how to roll or crawl and It's just like that would be my issue is the fact that you know sometimes you just need to hand the baby to someone so you can make yourself a cup of coffee or have a shower and

It's it's totally fine. It's more doses if I'm not working that is my problem with Bodi because Not that can't put him down. he Tom died when he was 18 months I gave him everything I have been I have over given it Bridget Jones talks about it when it's just you yeah you give them I was my man dad so I've given them so much of me yeah that now they just expect me me me yeah at three o'clock in the morning me mommy I I wanna cuddle. I'm like mommy need to sit. I have no idea how you manage that.

That's absolutely incredible. But at the same time, like probably won't be a bad thing. Like for him to like have to share. And for some reason. No, and I'm so happy now that Will's there and now Will has taken the, no obviously I don't wanna say the role of dad. Role model.

Role model. So he now backs me because I've never had the backing. You've got Chris as the backing basically, so you can go, Chris, take the baby. I've never had the backing because Tom was too ill as well. He couldn't really pick Bodie uploads and whatever. So now I've got Will that backs me. I think Bodhi is a bit like, hang on a second. Do you think he likes it or no? Oh, he absolutely adores Will and he'll listen to him. I love that. So he needed that like, male role model

in his. They're going to love the baby so much. It's going to break your heart. Honestly, like, do you know what it is? It's when you hear, and you probably wouldn't have got this with the older two because they were so close in age, but like, I hear Wilding speaking to Hunter the way we speak to him. It's just adorable. Also makes me feel very good about myself. But you know, like, I'm a brilliant parent. I'm like, well done me. Contrary to all evidence, I am an excellent mother. But you know, where he'll be like, you know you hear him on the monitor when the baby's like crying and stuff and he'll be like, what you doing buddy?

Are you okay? What's all this noise? And then you like hear him tickling him and like you hear the baby giggling and all that kind of stuff. Sometimes like, sometimes he loves him a bit, like too much, you know, like when you stroke a dog too hard and his eyes go white, like that kind of thing.

But- We spoke about this at the weekend because we said, you mustn't pick the baby up. Oh no that unless mommy says that you can pick the baby up but it's Aurelia she's going to think she's the mum. I was about to say good luck with that I mean like Wilde like I don't often leave the baby on his own because like I said he really hates to be put down but you like Wilde wants to carry him all the time even though wait for this when he was six I haven't weighed him recently but when he was six months old, he weighed 26 pounds. That is the same as an 11 and a half month old, yeah?

He weighed six pounds when he come out. Thank you, baby Jesus. Thank you, baby Jesus, my vagina's very grateful. But honestly, and I was just like, you just turned around, like, you know, they play games and it's so sweet like You sort of set them up with things and they have to observe them, but then they start fighting I know I don't know if they will because I feel like the age gap is so big you still fight

Do you really I had five years between me and me and my old brother and we used to play fight Would you like fisticuffs fight? Oh, yeah, but would he like he wouldn't obviously Would he like take you out? But if I gave it it'd be like put me in my place a little bit They have to don't know I feel like you definitely deserved it, but I did Know but I kind of love that as well. There's nothing wrong with that You know, there's like that's you know, this like sanitized super gentle parenting I believe in like consequence parenting where you get them to Understand that and explore their emotions and all that kind of stuff

But you know actions have consequences kind of thing like the other that's life exactly like the other day I was this is a great example I always use this example so Wilding was he was being quite energetic and all that kind of stuff and I was like listen you Need to stop because you're gonna knock your juice over just like be calm or let me move your juice He wouldn't let me move his juice. You know what? what they're like he wouldn't get a different cup with a straw he wanted this big big boy cup anyway flingity flangity arms I was like wild and calm yourself didn't knock his cup over juice everywhere right and I'm not gonna shout at him for juice because that's not who I am I was just

like oh no let's clean it up we cleaned it up together there's no way I was cleaning it up without him and no more juice that's it he was like can I have another juice I was like no because there's no more juice there was more juice but that's not the point the point is you've knocked the juice. That's it. He was like can I have another juice? I was like no because there's no more juice. There was more juice but that's not the point. The point is you've knocked the juice over there's no more juice it's finished. Exactly but he was sad and I gave him a cuddle and I was like listen it's really sad when you want juice and you can't have juice but there's no more juice left. Like you know that that's my idea of gentle parenting. So I just think as well you say you've spilt the drink over. I explain everything mine probably I'm over

Share or maybe and I've talked about I'm like you have done that. I told you how many times you've done it. That's it It's definitely exactly so like I definitely believe in yeah Like being fine with giving him a cuddle because he's sad It's fine to be sad if you want juice like don't can be wrong if it was lady a I'd be devastated But if there was no more there'd be no more more and you know I'm not going to the shop. Like that's too much effort. But yeah, so that's the kind of parenting that I believe in.

It's okay to be upset, it's all right to get sad about things but at the same time, I'm not like, oh, you know we said when you don't judge other people's parenting, you obviously do. But I'm not gonna say anything. There's a couple that I really like that we spend quite a lot of time with and I think they're fantastic parents,

really, really great parents. But like their son would drop something and be like, pick that up. And the mum would just pick it up. And I was just like, what? And so again, I wasn't gonna say anything, but like he's about six months older than Wilding. And then Wilding would drop something and say, see the older boy do it boy do and then say mommy pick that up. I'd be like absolutely not

That's not how the world works. You dropped it you pick it up Don't get me wrong. Like if he's dropped something in it's an accident He doesn't know how to do it But if he's literally dropped something he's sitting in a chair and I'm sitting in a chair I was just like no you pick it up if you want it how you gentle parent that I'd just be like no Absolutely not like I'll help you do things all that kind of stuff But did you say anything to have you said anything to her? No, but she noticed and she stopped doing it

She's saying what a sec well. This is what I mean I think you don't have to read someone you can just point out but in a way well I just did that and then she saw my my child who was because obviously as well most of the time he wouldn't ask you Just get up and get himself and that's not to say if he needed help with something He would always ask if he needed help and he always chances his arm you know what boys are like he's like what children exactly he's like yeah mommy do I'm like no mommy's not doing it you do it like especially men now you just don't want them to grow into that like a burdensome man that's a burden for their

wife you know I mean who doesn't do anything exactly no you don't want that you want to raise like useful intelligent sensitive like members of society but I definitely took no. But I think it's a trap that you've fallen into isn't it? Because you don't, like our minds don't adjust as quickly as theirs do like and you don't realise that actually they're completely capable of doing that kind of thing now. And I quite often see it in other people. I cherry pick what I like from other people's parenting. I do it all the time. And also I think you have to sit back and look at your parenting. I know sometimes I can just do things for the easy option. Oh yeah. So they get you dressed in the morning. I said to a radio, I'm like, do you think the other

year one kids can not dress themselves? Like you're so lazy, it's just lazy. Why are you not dressing yourself in the morning? But then also part of me is just like, let's just get it done. Let's just get you dressed and I can make breakfast and then we're out the door. Oh no, see my husband's like that. So so like and I hear you don't when I was pregnant oh the amount of like YouTube in bed he would watch but you know what it turned him into a bit of a prick. No we don't do it with so I've no but we've never did it we never did it before but like it's easy parenting but I don't my kids tiredness don't have to doa anymore they do not go on YouTube they do not have the iPads no they turn into a

Demon exactly but so as soon as the baby was born and you will instantly feel better I know that you know that as soon as that in 19 weeks You will feel so much better regardless of your birth as soon as the baby's out you'll feel better And then I just well actually we got we just got Netflix on our phone He started watching Netflix, but even that we don, we try not to let him watch too much TV. Well, I was letting him have it in the mornings for an easy life, because I wanted sleep, so I was letting them, they were in their beds.

Then they were actually starting to wake up to have their iPads, and I was like, what am I doing? Banned the iPads, they're literally under the bed. The only time they're coming out is if we get on an airplane and they need them for entertainment. They are not having them. Fully, I think that was one of the best sort of, because you know, it's never too late.

Yeah, just because you've done something that you're not necessarily pleased with, it doesn't mean you can't change it. Like their brains are plastic. Yeah, they can be like formed and reformed and all that kind of stuff. But that was a big mistake that we made, but I was just excited. But you learn by your mistakes. But anyway, we could literally talk forever. Oh no.

But as well. I have got a rapid heart. Oh, wow. Thank you so much. Oh that was really fun. Guys that's a wrap on another episode of Mum's The Word. Thank you so much for joining us today as we were joined by the amazing Camilla Kerslake and don't forget to leave us a review follow us on socials at at mum's the word and subscribe to our YouTube channel just search mum's the word until next time I'm Kelsey Parker and this is mum's the word and we'll be back with another episode same time same place next week