Murdaugh Murders Podcast - TSP #89 - ‘I’m a survivor’: Lawyer Behind Explosive Lawsuit Accusing JP Miller Of Rape Has No Fear + Pastor Disaster In Court This Week

Episode Date: February 27, 2025

Investigative journalists — Mandy Matney and Liz Farrell — broke major news this past Tuesday with the announcement that Myrtle Beach pastor JP Miller has been accused of raping a 15-year-old girl at his father’s church, Cathedral Baptist Church (formerly All Nations Church), in 1998 and again sexually assaulting her in 2023.  The lawsuit was filed by Jane Doe No. 1 against John-Paul Miller, Reginald Wayne Miller, and their churches, including Solid Rock Ministries. Mandy and Liz share details of the lawsuit while connecting the dots on what was happening in JP’s life at the time.  Plus, they sit for an interview with Rock Hill attorney Randy Hood of McGowan, Hood, Felder and Phillips law firm, who is representing Jane, to learn more about Jane’s case and what the world of litigating institutional child sexual abuse looks like. Hood is no stranger to suing churches on behalf of sexual assault victims. He also represents clients in the case against Morningstar Fellowship Church in Fort Mill, South Carolina.  On Tuesday, Mandy and Liz also broke the very important news that attorney Mark Tinsley from the Murdaugh Murders trial — aka Zero Dark Tinsley and Tiger Tinsley — is also representing Jane in her case against the Millers.  Also on the show, JP Miller appeared in Magistrate Court on Wednesday for a hearing related to seven of his cases against protesters and … well, he did a terrible job, as expected… The premium extended episode includes a play-by-play featuring the most pertinent highlights.  Special thanks to Ben from Artistic Eye Productions based in Summerville, SC for covering the Magistrate Court Proceedings  Let's dive in... 🥽🦈  Episode Resources Liz Farrell’s Breaking News FB Post - Feb 20, 2025 Mica Francis Case Overview “Pastors JP Miller and Wayne Miller Accused Of Sexual Abuse Targeting Minors In New Lawsuit” - Liz Farrell, Feb 25, 205 Referenced Episodes: TSP 50, 51, 53, 57, 59, 60 and 64 Study by Dr. Abel Harlow Check out our LUNASHARK Merch 👚👕 Support LUNASHARK as a FOIA Around and Find Out Sponsor 🦈 Premium Resources JP Miller’s Magistrate Court Filings Melissa Mancari’s Motion to Dismiss Defamation Lawsuit - Feb 14, 2025 Jane Doe’s Lawsuit Against JP Miller - Feb 25, 2025 JP Miller’s ABHAN 1998 Docs JP Miller’s Pardon Application - 2021 and Certificate of Pardon - 2022 Stay Tuned, Stay Pesky and Stay in the Sunlight...☀️ If you are in crisis, please call, text or chat with the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline at 988, or contact the Crisis Text Line by texting TALK to 741741. Premium Members also get access to ad-free listening, searchable case files, written articles with documents, case photos, episode videos and exclusive live experiences with our hosts on lunasharkmedia.com all in one place. CLICK HERE to learn more: https://bit.ly/3BdUtOE. Check out our LUNASHARK Merch 👕 What We're Buying... Chewy - chewy.com/mandy - Chewy has everything you need to keep your pet happy and healthy. And right now you can save $20 on your first order and get free shipping by going to chewy.com/mandy. Here's a link to some of our favorite things: https://amzn.to/4cJ0eVn *** ALERT: If you ever notice audio errors in the pod, email [e-mail] and we'll send fun merch to the first listener that finds something that needs to be adjusted! *** For current & accurate updates: bsky.app/profile/mandy-matney.com | bsky.app/profile/elizfarrell.com TrueSunlight.com facebook.com/TrueSunlightPodcast/ Instagram.com/TrueSunlightPod Twitter.com/mandymatney Twitter.com/elizfarrell youtube.com/@LunaSharkMedia tiktok.com/@lunasharkmedia Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When I look back at my younger self, I remember the feeling of being bullied and disrespected. I remember hating that feeling. And I remember the day that I resolved to never let it happen again. When I founded Bland Richter with my partner Ronnie Richter, we committed to build a firm that demanded respect and that would fight the powerful on behalf of clients who felt powerless. We stand tall against the largest law firms in the state, the country, and the entire world, and we've remained true to the commitment

not to be pushed around. Tenacious representation, proven results. We are Bland-Richter. Learn more about what we do and who we are by visiting bland-richter.com. That's B-L-A-N-D-R-I-C-H-T-E-R.com. I don't know why some people are continuing to support JP Miller. Still, after not only all of the alleged abuse of Micah that has been exposed since her death, but especially after a woman filed an explosive lawsuit this week accusing JP Miller of raping her when she was 15 in 1998, despite this, more than 40 people showed up

to support JP in court this week. And that motivates us to turn up the sunlight on JP and his churchy business supporters and to turn up the volume in support of Micah's army fighting for justice. My name is Mandyi Matney. This is True Sunlight, a podcast exposing crime and corruption previously known as the Murdoch Murders Podcast.

True Sunlight is a Lunar Shark production written with journalist Liz Farrell. Okay, so I know that I say this week has been wild, often. But let me just give y'all an overview of the chaos that the Luna Shark team has covered in the last week. On Thursday, David and I drove up to Charleston to cover Hilton head attorney Peter Strauss's sentencing in federal court. Yes, y'all. Peter Strauss, convicted of hiding millions of dollars of client funds from the federal government, is still an attorney in South Carolina.

The South Carolina bar only has them listed as suspended, which is insane. I urge attorneys in South Carolina to make noise about this, because it's your law license that the bar continues to devalue every single time that they fail to take swift and serious action with certain rich attorneys who break the law. Peter was sentenced to nine months in federal prison. In this week's Cup of Justice, we discussed all of the absurd things that happen in court, and we talked about why we think the feds continue to keep cameras out of federal courtrooms. Hint, it's because it's a joke.

Also on Thursday, Liz Farrell and Beth Braden covered breaking news out of Myrtle Beach Magistrate Court involving JP, a suspicious TikToker, and alleged bribery. We'll talk about that one in a minute. Then on Tuesday, Liz broke one of the most important stories in the entire Micah Francis case. The lawsuit accusing JP Miller of raping a 15-year-old in 1998 and assaulting the same woman in 2023.

That lawsuit could be an absolute game changer, and we will talk about that in a minute. Then on Wednesday, we sent our new talented videographer Ben Huff to Myrtle Beach to cover the restraining order hearings for three of the protesters where JP lost in an embarrassing and epic way. More on that also in a minute. But I say all this to gently remind y'all that this work would not be possible without the thousands of Lunashark Premium members supporting us every month and our hundreds of thousands of listeners across the globe who support our amazing sponsors and in turn

support us. I need to say this again, journalism is broken and the majority of good reporters are largely underpaid and underfunded. We could not and would not do this dangerous, emotionally exhausting, and difficult work if it wasn't for the financial support that we get from members and our sponsors. I want to change the way that the world consumes media, and we are doing our part by shining a light on these important stories.

The journalism you hear on this podcast is costly and extensive, and we hope if you can that you will choose to support our show by signing up for Lunashark Premium today. And thank you to our first official FOIA around and find out sponsor, the first anonymous donor who we will call Stephanie, reached out to us recently with kudos and an idea to fund our FOIA efforts with a sizable annual sponsorship so that we are less inclined to quit our pursuit of the truth when met with hefty charges for documents or challenged by county record keepers that are more persuaded by legal action than their legal obligation to follow the law.

While Stephanie remains anonymous, she will be entitled to a variety of benefits, like several personal video phone calls with yours truly thanking her for her support and giving her behind-the-scenes updates on cases. I am also excited to thank Stephanie in person soon. You will start to see documents with Stephanie's chosen phrase, empowering victims' voices through FOIA. But that could also say your company's slogan or name if you choose to sponsor us, too. We will also begin adding shout-outs of Stephanie's chosen charitable designees, St. Jude's Children's Hospital and Amy Poehler's Smart Girls on the show feeds, on social media, and on websites.

And Stephanie continues to enjoy all of the benefits as a Soak Up the Sun member. If you want to help us FOIA around and find out, head over to lunasharkmedia.com slash support and scroll to the corporate sponsorship section. Or email goals at lunasharkmedia.com to learn more. And for all Premium members, we are excited to see Jeff, Stephanie, Grace, Beth, and others for our pesky picks discussion of Aaron Lee Carr's groundbreaking documentary, I Love You Now Die, The Commonwealth vs. Michelle Carter. Join Premium to hang out with Liz and me at 7 p.m. tonight.

That's Thursday, February 27th. Or if you can't make it, we will share that conversation on the Premium feed shortly after the recording. Told you that was a lot. Okay, Liz, let's dive in. This week on Cup of Justice, we talked about the dramatic moment that happened last Thursday in Myrtle Beach Magister Court when Judge Christopher Arrakis held a status conference

with some of the defendants, i.e. the protesters. The people Myrtle Beach pastor J.P. Miller is suing for invasion of privacy, some of whom already had restraining orders issued against them by this same judge at JP's request and based on little to no evidence as far as we can see. The judge handed out packets of paper that turned out to be photocopies of texts and emails, exchange between JP and a TikToker named True Crime Rhee and Melissa Mancari. Melissa is the woman whom JP was suing in a $6 million defamation case, which he filed last fall after Melissa publicly disclosed that in February, 2024,

JP had called the law firm where she worked at the time and said he wanted a lawyer who could destroy his wife. That case was dropped last week, which is interesting timing because the texts and emails handed out to the defendants appear to show JP and True Crime Re trying to broker a deal with Melissa and compel her to testify against the protesters in exchange for dropping her case. Instead, Melissa went to the police and to the judge to report this.

According to a source with knowledge of the situation as the packets were being handed out, JP appeared to be caught off guard as if he still thought Melissa was set to testify against the protesters, and that was why he dropped the case. The messages from JP and True Crime Re appeared to be carefully worded to say that they just wanted Melissa, who had only attended one protest and did not witness the behaviors JP outlined in the lawsuits,

to go on the stand and quote, Tell the truth. JP provided Melissa with the truth that he wanted her to attest to, and no, the judge did nothing about this. After that happened, Melissa told us that JP had texted her a single word, Touche, which if this weren't what it looked like, then I don't think the word touche would apply there, right? Also to our understanding, surprise surprise, Murrell Beach Police Department doesn't seem to know how to investigate this.

As in, they either don't care enough to try or they are truly incapable because, hello, get warrants for phone and email records. Simple. Or refer to the FBI. On Tuesday, sources told us JP, who just got hit with the biggest lawsuit of his whole life, which we'll talk about again in a minute, was offering to settle with the protesters on his terms. And he threatened them with having a hundred witnesses show up to testify on his terms, and he threatened them with having a hundred witnesses show up

to testify on his behalf. And that brings us to Wednesday, episode day, yay. When seven defendants were to appear in Magistrate Court for a restraining order hearing, Lunashark Media sent Ben Huff of Artistic Eye Productions in Somerville, South Carolina, to the courthouse to take photos, videos, and notes of what went down. And he told us just how badly J.P. Miller failed at his first real attempt of playing lawyer.

Now, 100 people did not show up on J.P.'s behalf Wednesday, but several sources confirmed that around 40 people did. We have photos of those people on my Instagram account up on JP's behalf Wednesday. But several sources confirm that around 40 people did. We have photos of those people on my Instagram and Facebook pages and we are working on identifying them so we can have a proper list to warn the public about the people in Myrtle Beach actively enabling JP Miller right now. Stay tuned for that. So this hearing, where JP apparently made the attorney in My Cousin Vinny look like a legal genius,

well it ended early Wednesday afternoon with a big L for old JP. Judge Arrakis told JP that he had not met his burden of proof. He told JP that the protesters were simply exercising their First Amendment rights, and he dismissed three of JP's motions for restraining orders. But the civil cases against the protesters still stand, and he postponed the three other cases that were scheduled to be heard on Wednesday. And what was JP's response to this? Oh, he said, I'll just keep filing more lawsuits. Meaning, he threatened the judge with what appears to be an admission that he plans to

abuse the legal system and burden everyone with more expensive nonsense that wastes everyone's time and money, and causes all sorts of unneeded stress." What did the judge say to that? We're told he said nothing. And guess what? Our 605 request form to film this proceeding was denied by Judge Arrakis. So I guess we will never know for sure. All of this, once again, shows how delusional JP is. Because once again, when he is asked

to produce evidence of the outrageous claims he is making about something or someone, he produces everything but the evidence of the things that he is saying. And the only people who don't seem to mind are the Myrtle Beach and Horry County police departments." And you know what? J.P. wants the protesters gone because he thinks it is what's stopping people from coming to his church and from him making money. But if the protesters stopped this week, I still don't think any more people would want to go to J.P. Miller's church. He is forgetting the part where we all know too much." Anyway, this was a really big week in the Justice for Micah world, and it went beyond

J.P.'s chaotic and amateur performance in Mad District Court on Wednesday. Which, we have to wonder if part of that showboating was done to create a distraction from the bigger news of the week. The explosive lawsuit alleging sexual abuse filed against JP Miller, Wayne Miller, and their churchy businesses. We will talk more about that after a short break. And we'll be right back. Are you ready to jumpstart your health? Lumen can help.

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death has meant for John Paul Miller, the man she was trying to escape. The man she said groomed her from the age of 15 and emotionally, spiritually, and mentally abused her up until the day she died in April 2024. Obviously, JP denies doing any of that. Since Micah's death, JP's churchy business kingdom, where he appears to control everything and call the shots, where people over the years have feared his wrath and retaliation and have put up with his chaos, has continued to crumble. For 10 months, every week has brought a new bizarre low with it for JP Miller.

And immediately after we began reporting on Micah's death and the investigation, we saw just how treacherous the terrain was that she was living in. There's the police records of JP stalking and harassing Micah during the last months of her life, the slew of disturbing but revealing 911 calls in which Micah tries to make police understand what is happening to her.

There's JP's relationship with Susie Skinner and Susie Skinner's husband's strange and tragic death. There's the sex offender who was employed by the church at the time of Micah's death. There's Trisha Ross and her criminal history and her deviously blind loyalty to JP. There's the church's real estate transactions and finances and business affiliations and flight plans to the plane they owned.

There's Micah's medical records and text messages and stern emails from JP. There's Wayne's history in Florence and his failed attempt at becoming as big as Jimmy Swigert. There's Wayne's arrests, his divorces, his questionable ministry in Pakistan and his guilty plea to federal charges related to his Bible college, where he was accused of making international students work for little to no pay. There's the looming presence of Charles Randall and questions about his role in JP's and Wayne's lives. There's the strange and dubious loans

Wayne allegedly gave to Evelyn Califf, the elderly former member and employee of Wayne's church. There's the stack of Solid Rock's calls to police, including one to report that a man came into the church to ask for some water. There's the protesters. There's the dozens of frivolous lawsuits, there's the Spider-Man costume, the DeLorean, JP's relationships with content creators in efforts to seize the narrative. The videos of JP threatening Micah were him writhing on the ground and talking in a Minnie Mouse voice about wanting to go see Jesus. There's the FBI raid, the new church businesses, the legal documents, the affidavits, and JP's first divorce.

There's JP's arrest after an altercation with a protester. There's JP's call to an emergency dispatcher talking about blondes in sweaters and not wearing makeup. There's JP's perverse and inappropriate sermons. His book. His interviews with News Nation and on TikTok. There's his manipulative phone call with DJ Bramette, the young man who went to the beach with Micah.

There's the notary stamps and paper trails and questions about probate court and powers of attorney. There's the Francis family's lawsuit, the Francis family's settlement. There's the time JP thought a woman was chasing him with a gun who turned out to be a man who dresses up as Jesus and had no gun. There's the wedding and the strange and controlling early days of JP's marriage to Micah.

There's the litany of court records. And then there are the rape accusations. Everything I just listed, all that information which isn't even close to everything that's happened or been revealed about JP Miller and his father over the past 10 months, was our crash course on JP.P. Miller. It was an education. It was Miller Family 101. And that education was necessary, I think. It prepared us for this week. Us being me, you, Mandy, the Lunashark team, other media, social media, content creators, pockets of Myrtle Beach, and the general quick to judge public.

It prepared all of us so that when the day came that JP Miller and Wayne Miller were formally accused of engaging in and covering up child sex abuse at their churches, all of us would immediately understand the dynamics at play and see clearly what was in front of us. We are now in Miller Family grad school and class was in session this Tuesday morning when Rock Hill attorney Randy Hood on

behalf of his client Jane Doe number one filed the first lawsuit against JP, JP's father Wayne and their churches, accusing them of using the churches to target minors for sex abuse. According to the lawsuit, on July 19, 1998, Jane, who was just 15 years old at the time, was visiting her grandparents in Myrtle Beach and attended Sunday services with them at Cathedral Baptist Church, which used to be called All Nations Church and was later called Solid Rock Ministries. Jane spent summers in Myrtle Beach with her grandparents who, according to the lawsuit, were her support system.

Quote, the summers she spent with them were among the happiest times of her childhood. When it was time for Sunday school, Jane's grandparents went to two different classes. Jane initially followed her grandmother to her classroom, but then changed her mind and decided she wanted to go with her grandfather. So Jane went into the church building to find him. Classes had already begun though, so all the doors were shut, and Jane didn't know which room he was in, so she decided that, instead of opening doors and interrupting classes,

she would go wait in the main church sanctuary. That's where she encountered J.P JP Miller, the preacher's son, who was employed by the church as its worship leader at the time. JP was 19 years old, and according to the lawsuit, he had a pattern of misconduct and reckless behavior known to his father, church leadership and church members. He had also had a child out of wedlock,

a boy who was around 21 months at the time, and he was in the middle of trying to resolve custody arrangements with Linda Hardy, his former girlfriend and the mother of his baby. We'll talk more about this in a future episode, but I want to point out that Linda's lawyer at the time was Patricia Ferguson. It's a name that has come up in our research a lot in connection to Wayne Miller and his churchy businesses, including in 1996 when the Millers were represented by Patricia in a real estate dispute, and then again in 2000 when she represented Cathedral Baptist Church in a lawsuit.

So why would Linna be using an attorney linked to Wayne, right? We have a theory. Let's rewind a little first. We've told you before that in February 1998, just five months before JP is accused of raping Jane, JP was arrested and charged with assault and battery of a high and aggravated nature. At that time, there does not appear to have been a custody agreement in place for JP and Lena. According to court records, documents had been filed in 1997, but no action had been

taken by both parties and they let the case lapse. But one month after JP's arrest, Linna was filing again for a formal custody agreement. Now that could have been for the obvious reason, right? JP had just been arrested for an act of violence. Let's talk about that arrest. Again, we told you before about this, but I'll do a quick recap because we've discovered a bit of new and highly relevant information.

So on February 8, 1998, there was extreme flooding in Myrtle Beach and residents of the Bridge Creek neighborhood were outside helping each other put out sandbags to protect their homes. The main roadway, Bridge Creek Drive, was closed by authorities. As the neighbors were putting out sandbags, at around 3.45 p.m., JP drove past them at a high rate of speed in a silver pickup, with black tape covering the license to conceal his identity, according to court documents. This was a problem because, well, one, the road was closed, but two, JP had been there

earlier in a different pickup, trying to drive down that closed road, and residents yelled at him and told him to leave. So he left, but then he came back. JP, quote, again began to speed to harass the people attempting to save their homes, according to a lawsuit filed against JP later that year. At this time, a woman named Jennifer Garland was walking on the road and told JP to slow down. Instead, JP accelerated his truck and ran into Jennifer and then drove with her on the

hood of his truck for about 100 yards. He was then stopped by a witness and Jennifer was able to roll off the hood. According to a police report from the time, JP braked the truck suddenly so that Jennifer fell off. Now, before, we just thought this was a random neighborhood in Myrtle Beach in his pardon hearing, because yes, JP was pardoned for this crime in May, 2022, for that he was a convicted felon. JP claimed he had no idea who the woman was

and that he didn't even remember that he had this charge on his record until recently. And yes, he played up his role as pastor and holy healer to get pardoned, which of course the board was wowed by that and here we are. But turns out this wasn't a random neighborhood. It was the neighborhood he had to drive through to get to Linna's house. The closed road he was speeding on was the road to where his former girlfriend lived at the time. So like I said, a month after this, Lena filed for a formal custody agreement. Now let's talk about our theory on why she was using one of Wayne's apparent go-to attorneys

throughout the years, because it's going to be important context when we start to see how JP and Wayne responded to this lawsuit. And by the way, remember our episode on Evelyn Califf, the elderly widowed church member and former employee of Wayne's church who, Wayne says, shook out five large loans from the church over the course of seven weeks in 2016 and 17? And whose waterfront home Wayne seemed intent on getting a piece of? Well, in 2017, when Evelyn was in her 80s and reportedly displaying signs of dementia, Evelyn gave durable power of attorney to Patricia

Ferguson. So yeah, lots to talk about there in the future in terms of how Wayne and JP operate when it comes to the legal system. Okay, that brings us into the church sanctuary in July 1998. I think we all have a nice picture of who J.P. Miller was in that moment. A spoiled, entitled, violent pastor's son who worked at his father's church. On that day, 15-year-old Jane Doe sat down in the sanctuary and watched as J.P. played piano and another person played the drums. And this is important, okay? J.P., again, the pastor's son, was in charge of the music at the drums. And this is important, okay? JP, again, the pastor's son,

was in charge of the music at the church. It's hard for me to say this next point without throwing up in my mouth, but understandably, at the time JP was seen as cool and essentially a rock star in that church community, ew. The reason I say that this is important is because too often, when a civil complaint or even a criminal complaint is filed in a sexual assault case, one of

the first things people do when reading the allegations is subconsciously put themselves in one of the roles. Which is natural, because it's how we process dangerous situations, right? We learn about a new dangerous situation someone went through and the dynamics at play when we assess them. This is why the true crime genre exists. This is why Dateline is so popular. We as women in particular,

watch because on some level, we are learning how to protect ourselves, some of us. Others are there to judge the victims so that they can go on Facebook and make stupid and unhelpful comments about them, which we've seen. And oh, let's not forget about the men. There are the ones who understand. There are the ones who are willing to try and understand. And then there are the ones who can only see themselves in the alleged abuser role, whether they're conscious of that or not.

The ones who automatically see a fellow man getting victimized by an accusation, a fellow man having his power taken away from him by a woman. Those men and the women who are there to judge are the worst, so let's get back to those of us who get it and know that there is no roadmap

when it comes to the aftermath of rape. We can see the nuance, the power differential, the fear, the real and perceived pressure to keep silent, to not rock the boat. We can understand the desire to forget the incident altogether. And we know how to regard the messy, imperfect, and highly personal decisions one makes to survive

in the moment and beyond. The things rape victims do just to get through it and make it better, whether it's reporting the incident to police or smiling at the abuser afterwards in the hopes it helps her escape without further danger. We know that the body can take over and go into self-protection mode. We know that traumas can be buried deep and triggered later.

Whether we've experienced this ourselves or not, we understand it. And in cases where the alleged abuser is in a persistent position of power, when it is someone the rape victim is going to have to interact with again, we can see why a rape victim might choose to keep the peace and take the abuser's cues on how to interact with him further. Especially if the accused is someone prone

to coercively controlling those around him. We know the challenges victims are up against. All of that said, we think about what a child goes through in that same set of circumstances." At this time, JP was seen as appealing to young women who looked up to him. On that day, in the music sanctuary of the church, JP began to engage Jane in conversation. According to the lawsuit, at some point she stepped away to use the restroom.

When she came out, JP was standing near Wayne's office door and he called out Jane's name and asked her about a mutual friend's absence from the church. According to the lawsuit, I'll have David read the rest directly from the complaint. Without warning, JPM forced plaintiff inside his father's office, shutting the door behind him. JPM immediately became aggressive, physically overpowering plaintiff and forcing her against the wall. Despite plaintiff's struggles and verbal pleas for him to stop, JPM ignored her and forcibly moved her out of the office, down the hallway, and to a door that led outside to a grassy side yard of the church where JPM's truck was parked. JPM then forced Jane Doe number one into his truck, and that is where he raped

her. At the time of the assault, the plaintiff was a virgin. Plaintiff was terrified, physically overpowered and left defenseless against JPM's assault. JPM, an adult man in a position of authority within the church, took full advantage of plaintiff's youth, inexperience, and vulnerability to commit this heinous act. Following the sexual assault, plaintiff remained silent about what had occurred with JPM and was overcome by shock, shame, and fear. In the following months, plaintiff exhibited clear signs of trauma, including severe depression, social withdrawal from family and friends, declining academic performance,

and emotional distress and self-doubt. So after our breaking news alerts about this lawsuit being filed Tuesday, we saw a number of comments online asking why this isn't considered statutory rape. So let me answer that. First, this is a civil lawsuit and not a criminal charge. At least not yet. But let's talk about it anyway. Statutory rape is sexual intercourse with a minor when both parties have consented. And I put that word in quotes because the age of consent in South Carolina is 16, meaning

someone younger than 16 does not have the ability to consent. But if that person does willingly have sex with someone older than 16, then the statutory rape law could apply. In South Carolina, when someone is being charged in a statutory rape, however, that person gets charged with criminal sexual conduct with a minor. There are three levels to that and they are all felonies. A statutory rape offense would likely be the lesser

of the three offenses, depending on the circumstances. So, reminder, Jane was 15, not of the three offenses, depending on the circumstances. So, reminder, Jane was 15, not of the age of consent, and JP was older than 16. He was 19. But, and this is the only part that matters here, Jane did not consent. So, the so-called statutory rape law would not apply. That said, we saw a TikTok ally of JP's rush to his defense and post an AI definition of the quote Romeo and Juliet law in New Jersey. This is a woman who seems to be in competition to do the most for JP in terms of minimizing his behavior and oversimplifying information to support his claims. That said, she's offensive. And so is that post.

A Romeo and Juliet law is a protection put in place for young couples who are close in age and are having consensual sex. An example of that would be, say you were 15 and a half and your boyfriend just turned 17. And your parents didn't want you dating your boyfriend so they call the police on him when they discover that you're sexually active with him. Again, consent, in so far as it applies,

is in play. But beyond that, South Carolina does not have that protection. So stop being a gross person, Miss JPTikToker. At the time JP allegedly raped Jane in July of 1998, the lawsuit asserts that the church and its leadership, and JP's father, were aware of concerns about JP's behavior with young teenagers at the church starting as early as the year before that and that they knew JP was allegedly engaging in sexual misconduct. And worse, the lawsuit points out that the church was built by Wayne, a man who had a history of sexual abuse allegations in his past. The lawsuit refers to Wayne as the proverbial fox guarding the hen house. What's interesting and satisfying about this lawsuit is that it talks in great length about

the churchy business, which you know we love to talk about. And the lawsuit also points out the biggest elephant in the room, the one JP and Wayne point to when they are asserting their power and away from when they are minimizing it. The churches are extensions of both men's egos and every matter involving the church was decided by them without oversight. Here's David with more on that.

Though RWM was in control, there were other leaders of the church who could have intervened to protect miners at the church. They did not. They ceded complete control to RWM who allowed his son, JPM, to have free reign over the church and the miners at the church. This church was JPM's sexual playground. Leadership at the church, including RWM, should have undertaken something to protect the miners at the church from JPM and any other predator, including RWM.

They did not. After JP is alleged to have raped Jane, Jane did not fully comprehend what had happened to her or the extent of the harm it was causing her, according to the lawsuit. Quote, the trauma was deeply buried and for decades, she had no conscious recollection of the assault. In other words, Jane paved over the memory of her rape, and it wasn't until 2023 when it all came flooding back

to her after she ran into JP in Myrtle Beach. In 2023, according to court records and other documents and source recollections, JP was separated from Micah on and off. It's the year he had his lawyer draw up a postnuptial agreement, giving him all the power and giving Micah virtually none. It's the year that Micah escaped to Kansas only to come back to Myrtle Beach at JP's

disgusting urging because church members were asking where his wife was, only for Micah to then once again be rejected by JP, who wanted to explore being single, again according to our previous reporting. At that time, the church was thriving. J.P. had built it back up from the 2015 scandal when Micah and him were caught having an affair. J.P. was moving quickly on plans for expansion. According to the lawsuit, when J.P. saw Jane, who was with a friend of hers, he leaned into her as if to hug her. But instead, he allegedly, quote, shoved his hand down her pants, touching her genitals without consent.

Jane immediately recoiled. According to the lawsuit, she tried to brush it off and move his hand because she didn't think that her friend had seen it happen, and she was scared of what would happen. 30 minutes later, according to the lawsuit, Jane Doe got into a heated argument with JP about his use of the title pastor and his use of scripture to justify sexual misconduct, which again, is an important factor to keep with you.

If JP was engaging in sexual misconduct to the degree that this lawsuit says he was, how was JP able to stave off criminal charges or lawsuits before this one? Right? People allegedly knew about what was happening at the church, right? What's a more powerful tool of inspiration to churchgoers than a pastor sharing scripture? On the darker side, what's a more powerful tool of coercion and control and persuasion and minimization? What is a more powerful threat to a believer's salvation than a carefully chosen and strategically shared verse of scripture.

According to the lawsuit, JP had to answer to Jane's anger over his title of pastor and of scripture to justify his alleged sexual misconduct. He allegedly said, quote, "...no man is without sin and temptation. God understands that. Jane was left reeling from this encounter with JP, according to the lawsuit, and she began experiencing a quote, long delayed spiral of self-doubt and depression. In the memories of what happened to her in 1998, the details her body tried to protect her from reliving re-emerged.

After Micah was found dead in a North Carolina swamp with a gunshot wound to her head, and after Micah's death was declared a suicide, and after all of the details of Micah's life with JP began spilling out, Jane was crushed by the burden of guilt that had came with the thought that had she spoken up sooner, Jane might have been able to prevent further harm to others. The lawsuit says, quote, The guilt and shame experienced by Jane Doe One for not reporting the second assault at the time of the occurrence of the first assault after memories came flooding back was another insult to the plaintiff's emotional psyche.

Powerful words from attorney Randy Hood, who you will hear from after a short break. And we'll be right back. After the lawsuit was filed Tuesday and making its way around the internet, we sat down with Jane's attorney, Randy Hood, who is one of the go-to attorneys in South Carolina when it comes to litigating cases involving institutional sexual abuse of children. Yes, y'all. Finally, we got to hear from another powerhouse attorney whose name didn't come up a hundred times

during the Murdoch investigation, or at all. How refreshing. Randy's experience in complex sexual abuse litigation is impressive. Let's just say he's not afraid of going up against powerful institutions, including the South Carolina Baptist Convention, to shine a bright light on the things churches want to keep in the dark.

We could spend an entire episode on the cases he's handled, and we just might. Currently, one of them is against Morning Star Fellowship Church in Fort Mills, South Carolina, where a former police officer named Erickson Lee had volunteered to be a youth leader. Lee, who is 26, is now serving nine years in prison for hosting parties with alcohol for at least four young male church members who he then sexually assaulted. Lee capitalized on the trust given to his position

of authority at the church to get parents to allow the teens to go on so-called camping trips with him. Randy represents a number of the plaintiffs in assuming the church leadership, including the former head ofewing the church leadership, including the former head of security for the church, who is Lee's father, for turning a blind eye to that behavior. Are you sensing the experience here?

Randy knows the ins and outs of churches run by churchy business bros, and he knows where to look for the cockroaches when they scatter. In addition to Randy's experience getting justice for victims of child sex abuse, we were impressed with him as a human being and a man who just gets it. We found ourselves hanging on to every word of his interview and we want you all to listen carefully as this man explains the prevalence of abuse in our society and what each one of us can do to help support victims of abuse. To start off, we asked the number one question that was on our minds. How is Jane Doe doing? It was hours after news of her lawsuit had broken

and it had made its way to thousands of people across the internet. First, she is doing good. I spoke to her about one o'clock and she has seen some things that were posted that were not necessarily upsetting but just re-traumatizing. That's going to happen. It's always, I think, a shock to most people who are involved because there seems to be a certain amount of interest when there's a crime involved. And there's the, there's when you have sex abuse and you couple it with a crime, a horrific injury, it always causes a lot of pain. It isn't just re-traumatizing to her, it's re-traumatizing to anyone who is a survivor and anybody who has gone through this.

And what people don't understand or realize is one out of four women, one out of six men, have been sexually harassed, assaulted, abused, had some type of sexual misconduct conducted with them. And that's a lot of people, a lot. You walk into a room of 100 people and think about it, 20 of them will have gone through some type of sexual misconduct, not them, but perpetrated on them. And when something like this happens and it's in the news, it's re-traumatizing for those people. But it's also, there's a measure of justice or a measure

of comeuppance or a measure of something that there's going to be something. We're going to get some answers. And there's something that's going to get rectified, this long standing, and has been going on for too long. And there need to be some answers. And that's any case, that isn't just this case,

that's any case involving sexual abuse. Speaking of measures of justice, one of the biggest questions we have gotten from our listeners since the news broke Tuesday, why has JP Miller not been arrested for the crime that's being alleged in the civil complaint? Before Randy answers that question, I would like to take a moment to remind you all of the uphill battle women in Myrtle Beach and Horry County particularly have when reporting

a powerful man like JP Miller. We have documented this power of favoritism toward JP and skepticism toward Micah in numerous incidents leading up to her death, but particularly in episodes 50, 51, 57, 59, 60, and 64. Please take a listen to those. I would like to gently remind people on social media who are quick to judge Jane or any woman for seeking justice in civil court before filing criminal charges to understand that the criminal charges route, especially in Myrtle Beach and especially with J.P. Miller, would be exponentially more difficult

for her to achieve any justice at all. Here is Randy with more about that. First of all, I'm gonna talk about it generally and then I'm gonna apply it to this specific case. The first thing that I tell most of the people that I represent is there's gonna come a point in time where law enforcement's gonna get involved. Law enforcement needs to be involved.

If there's been a crime that's been committed, someone needs to answer for that crime. And the problem is, and this is a horrible statistic, 90% of all sexual assaults don't get prosecuted. The overwhelming majority never ever get prosecuted. They're hard, I think, for prosecutors. There's a number of different reasons why that happens, but at the end of the day, it becomes very difficult, especially when there's something where there's a lot of time that

goes by. And in this particular case, the initial assault happened in 1998. And so that was 27 years ago. And things change and people's memories fade and all kinds of things happen. But at the end of the day, we allege that a crime happened. And so, you know, I think that's part of what anyone wants to see is to be some type of answer for what occurred from a criminal standpoint in addition to a civil standpoint. In this particular case, I know that there have been people that

have reached out to law enforcement. I know that there's law enforcement involved with the defendant on other matters, or it's my understanding that that is the case. And at the end of the day, this is something that is going to be attacked on two fronts. And I only represent her for the civil side. At the end of the day, this is something that is going to be attacked on two fronts. And I only represent her for the civil side. Obviously, I have people that I know who practice criminal law and who can give her advice on that in that realm.

I can give her advice in that realm. But at the end of the day, that's going to be her decision about when to do that, because it's hard enough as it is. And in regard to the second part of your question about the statute of limitations, that's always an issue with any kind of criminal law. But it's also an issue in a civil lawsuit as well. We've also seen several comments wondering how the statute of limitations factors in here, given that the incidents cited were in 1998 and 2023. So we asked Randy to explain. To help you, there are two things to consider here. There's a civil statute of limitations,

which in this case would be three years from the time that you became aware of the injury or should have been aware of the injury. And then there's the criminal statute of limitations, which Randy talked about as well. Here's where it gets really, really complex. And this is what happened in the civil side. Until 2001, in the 90s, and it was only recognized in 97, but in the 90s, up until 2001, there

was a discovery rule and there was an exception for repressed memory. When you knew that something had happened and had caused you type of damage and it's a high hurdle that you have to meet. But in 2001, they changed the law. And after they changed the law, if you were a victim of child sexual abuse, you had until the age of 27. And even if you didn't do it by the age of 27, you had until you yourself understood that what they did to you caused you a problem.

Meaning if you go to a psychiatrist and you say, hey, I've got all these problems, or you go to a counselor and I've got all these problems, but you don't tell them about the sex abuse. And so they don't connect the two, or you just tell them about the sex abuse, but you don't tell them about the problems you've had all your time, then you haven't connected them. It's only when someone says, okay, Ms. Smith, these are issues that have been caused.

And I think that this assault, which happened long ago, is the cause of all of these problems. And that's when you're gonna know, because we're just laypeople. We're not medical people. We're not counseling people. We're not professionals. And so at the end of the day, it becomes

critical about when they actually became aware that what happened to them caused their injuries. I told you, this man knows his stuff. Speaking of knowing his stuff, we were impressed after reading the lawsuit for the first time and noticing how much space he dedicated to explaining repressed memories to the public so that the public can better understand

Jane Doe's situation. Trauma response is the buzzword. In people who have undergone some type of sexual trauma or abuse trauma will usually have something called a trauma response. And a trauma response means that each person is unique. It's just like everybody's fingerprint is different. Everybody's reaction to an assault is going to be different. Some people may bury it, some people may scream cry and

and cause a ruckus, a much needed and necessary ruckus. And it just depends on everybody and how they react. But most people have a tendency to have shame, fear, and guilt. Shame, fear, and guilt. Those three things can cause you to react very differently than someone who has had a car accident and they've got a broken arm and they go to the hospital. It's immediate. Someone who suffers a sexual trauma, one, it's usually in secret. It isn't something where, you know,

you're not just going out and you're not driving down the road and something like this happens. This is something that's usually in secret. A lot of times with children, it's a grooming process where someone over a period of time, months and even years, gets someone's trust and they get them to engage in things that they know they shouldn't be doing but they trust that person. They trust that they're not hurting them until they do and when they do, that's when they wake up. But that doesn't mean they're going to react

at that time. It may be decades. And I'm not talking about 10 years. It may be 20 years, 30 years, 40 years, 50 years, 60 years. There are some cases in the Catholic Church where people didn't come forward. And it happened before 10, and they didn't come out until 70 or 80. There was a 70-year period.

And people are like, well, how can that happen? Well, it's because our body has its own, not necessarily healing, but trauma protective system. And it protects us. And if we can't handle something, we bury it. That's what happens. And it's not something that is rare. It's not something that's outside the norm. This is something that is a normal, a recognized normal trauma response. And everybody is different.

The three of us on this podcast, we're all different. We're all going to react differently. And I've had clients that came out and immediately told, and I've had clients that waited many decades before they told. And it all depends on the person. It also causes other things. It can cause addiction, whether that's sexual addiction, whether that's pornography addiction, whether that's alcohol addiction,

whether that's drug addiction, whether it's gambling addiction, it can cause addictive issues. I mean, there's this gamut of things that can occur to someone who is a victim of sexual trauma. And it can cause them to react in a number of different ways that don't make sense to the person on the street. They think, well, if you get hurt, you go to the hospital. You get hurt, you go to the counselor.

Doesn't work that way. And it's recognized, and the literature recognizes. And the authorities in this space recognize that sexual trauma and trauma response is very different than every other type of response to any other type of trauma. Now this next part is important. Remember earlier how we talked about that rock star persona JP might have had with the young church members in 1998 and beyond. Randy talked about how that plays into the child sex abuse cases he sees at churches. Randy Johnson, Ph.D. First, most pastors are charismatic. They have to be able to speak to

people. They have to get in front of people and they have to talk to them. And they have to feel confident in that aspect. Most, some men, not all men, but some men feel very confident with whether they're straight or gay with their preferred sexuality. They're confident in speaking to someone of their preferred sex and feel very confident in that manner. What happens is you have someone who has a natural, I'm going to call it a natural because being a man being attracted to a child is just to me is not natural. When you have these unnatural predilections and then you know you act on them, that's criminal. But what happens when you're in a church, a church is a place where people come

because they trust. They trust the pastor. He comes to them in times of need. He comes to them in the hospital. He comes to them when someone of need. He comes to them in the hospital. He comes to them when someone passes away. He does their funeral. He preaches to them about their faith. These are all very, very personal things that you don't necessarily share with people. You're letting someone into your home or someone like that. You trust that person. You want to trust that person. They're giving you, and some people, if you're a believer, they're giving, they're helping you with your salvation. And they're teaching you about things that, for those of us who are believers, that you're going to live an everlasting life. And they're your conduit to it. And the church you go to is the conduit to it.

And so, you know, this is a, this is a, it is a ripe area for abuse. The church, especially churches that have a popular messaging, attract a lot of people and they can be people that from all ends of the spectrum. And when you have a lot of people and they can be people that from all ends of the spectrum and when you have a lot of people I mean it's just a numbers game think about it if one out of ten men are attracted to somebody under the age of 16 well you get a hundred men in there and you've got ten of them that are probably have you know bad thoughts but when you're the head and people trust and people think you're gonna to do the right thing,

they're willing to overlook things. They're willing to give you the benefit of the doubt when somebody else wouldn't get the benefit of a doubt. I know of a church in the upstate of South Carolina in the York County area where a pastor, and it's well, it's been in the news, where he basically was convicted of child sexual abuse and did time, and then came to lead a church that became a very popular, only verge of mega church. And the elders knew about it, but nobody else knew about it. And then it was found out. And then they thought they could contain it. But once the public became aware of it,

then the cat's out of the bag and nobody's going to trust. And church and our going to church and belief in our ministers, once the trust is gone, it's all gone. And the house comes crumbling down. But charismatic people, if they have these thought processes about children or people under the age of 16 or even 16, 16, 17, I mean somebody's 28 shouldn't be with somebody 17 years old. So you know when you have somebody that has these thought processes and they're acting on them, and they're

the head of a church or a youth pastor that everybody loves, bad things happen. Every case I have, every case I have involving a church has to do with someone who was trusted. When somebody first said something about it, people were like, oh, no, no, no, he couldn't do that until it was recognized that he did. But it's never a she, it's always a he in churches.

And it's epidemic. It is not where it's like, oh, one out of 100 churches, no, it's happening, it's happening and it's epidemic. And the internet and social media and the exposure that we have as a society has now started bringing light to these very dark situations. And these things are becoming discovered on a daily basis

that things have happened, bad things have happened. And this time, it is time for things to become rectified. And if somebody's doing this type of thing, somebody needs to speak out whether that's going to the police, whether it's going to a parent, whether that's going to a leader. But think about it, in this case, if you went to the leader, that's the fox guard in the hen house. Doesn't do you any good. guarding the hen house doesn't do you any good. The Fox guarding the hen house is one of the truest things you can say about JP and Wayne in our opinions.

That said, this next part of our conversation with Randy had us both horrified because I'm just going to say it plainly. Neither of us can understand how any person would put more faith into a church leader than their own children, who they are responsible for protecting. Or any child. Believe children and engage your brains. Oh, he's so nice and a man of God, he would never do that. Sexual predators can only catch their prey when you don't see them as a threat. Always default to protecting children and shame on those who don't. I've got cases, case after case after after case where they went to their parents and the

parents were like no no I've got a case right now I'm not lying to you I've got a case right now where a 75 year old man was touching a six-year-old girl inappropriately two nine-year-old kids told their parents, and their parents said, no, that couldn't happen. We don't believe it. The kids, nine-year-old kids, took it upon themselves to take cell phones because they were so concerned about this child.

They took the cell phones, and they filmed him and caught him. Nine-year-old children, because nobody else would believe that it was happening. That's what happens in a church, because you want to believe. You want to believe this person that you've gone to church with for 10 years would never do something like that.

Unfortunately, when someone has these bad thoughts or these terrible actions, they're going to hide it from you. They don't come out and say, hey, I'm a child molester. I'm a predator. They work in secret. That's what grooming is all about. And we'll be right back.

So you know we love calling Solid Rock a churchy business any chance we get because from where we said that is what it is. Sure there are missions and programs and there's worship and inspirational messaging but at the very end of the day, JP and Wayne are running a business, one that comes with little oversight when it comes to how the money is being spent and how the business is being run. Jane's lawsuit included many paragraphs about this. JP and Wayne are the church and the church is JP and Wayne. And that is not how it's supposed to be.

Think about it this way. They knew that Wayne Miller in 1989 was doing bad things. Bad things with a lot of people. Bad things. It was not something that wasn't well known. Florence is only an hour from Myrtle Beach. It wasn't something that anybody didn't know about and this man creates a second church with a college or school or whatever he wants to call it because I know he was handing out honorary degrees or doctorates like

they were candy. He became Dr. Miller and they allowed this man to create a church and in their bylaws, their bylaws, they were the authority. It wasn't run by a board of elders or elders or deacons. They were the church. Them, the ultimate authority, everything goes through them. They make the decisions. And so if you have an issue and you go to the person who's doing the abusing, what good does it do?

And because of the things that we've talked about with trust and not wanting to rock the boat and people not wanting to believe that people are bad people, then what happens is people have a tendency to then say, nah, I'm not going to get involved. And then a year goes by, five years goes by, 10 years goes by, and now we're 27 years into this thing.

We talked to Randy about the importance of people speaking up when they see red flags or when they know of abuse that may be happening or that has happened. There's this perception that speaking up is like putting yourself at the bottom of Mount Everest and being compelled to make that dangerous climb up to the top by yourself. And this isn't to say speaking up isn't hard

or that there won't be challenges. But Randy has also shown us that there's support. And it can also be as simple as just doing it. I was contacted a week ago, a week ago, and I put it together in a week. It can be done and you have to put time aside and you don't sleep a lot for three or four days. But it don't take a lot for somebody to say, hey, this is wrong. Something needs to be done.

And you get yourself up off of your ass, and you do something about it. I'm not talking about the victim. I'm talking about the people that are watching it. I'm talking about the people that know. I'm talking about anybody at any church or school or sports organization anywhere who sees something that doesn't make sense involving a child.

Well, could somebody get falsely accused? They could. And it could be innocent. And that's terrible. It's unfortunate. It's terrible. I can't even imagine. But if you save 99 kids and there's

one person that gets hurt, unfortunately, the 99 kids went out. You have to stand up and you have to become known and you have to say something. But if you say something to the lead church pastor and he does nothing and you say something to the police and they do nothing, what do you do? That's where you come in. That's where people on social media and podcasters and in TikTok and Insta and Facebook and people who have followers and they begin to spread the message because there is strength

in numbers and when there's enough people causing a hue and cry, what's going on? Why is this happening? Why hasn't something been done? Eventually someone's going to say a hue and cry, what's going on? Why is this happening? Why hasn't something been done? Eventually, someone's going to say, oh, well, we better do something because otherwise they're ready to run us out of town. You got to have people that are willing to stand up and take action and address the inequities that are going on in our society and all sorts of things.

But in this case, with this particular matter, think about it. It's been 27 years. People have known about this. People knew about it in 1998 and they knew before 1998. They've known about Wayne Miller since 1989. That was just the television broadcast on WPD. There may have been a lot of kinds of stuff being sold to other people and to the police. I don't know. But when they do a five-part series in 1989 on someone on a local station, that's crazy. That wasn't done. That was a, I mean, that's like the documentary for the news station in 1989.

This, this should have never occurred, shouldn't have ever been allowed to have, if he had a church, I don't know who would be going to it with all of the bad stuff that was going on. And he, you know, I know he faced stuff in 2014 where he had to face criminal charges finally. You know, at the end of the day, what it really requires are people that are willing to say, no, this is unacceptable. This cannot happen. This cannot happen. Too many years have passed. We have talked a lot about that WPDE series that was powerful enough to chase Wayne Miller out of Florence and crush all of his big dreams of glory land. Which was seriously straight out of the Righteous Gemstones. Listen more about that in episode 53.

It's unbelievable. G.P. Miller's mother talked a lot about this series, accusing Wayne of sexually inappropriate behavior with students in her divorce documents and how it pretty much sent their marriage spiraling, as I would imagine. But Randy made a great point here. Documentaries really weren't a thing in the 80s. It's incredibly unusual that a local news station dedicated so many resources

to exposing Wayne Miller way back then. Remember, Wayne filed a multi-million dollar lawsuit against the station to scare them into silence, but he soon dropped it, like father, like son. We hope that someone somewhere has tapes of this series that will come to light during this lawsuit. Considering that there were multiple alleged victims who were able to speak out in the 80s

when church sexual abuse was rarely talked about and rarely exposed, how many were there really? How many people have been silent about this for decades? I think that there's any case I ever get into, there's no telling where it's going to lead. One, you're looking for justice and you never want this to happen to another person ever again. You bring a light to a dark situation, but you're also looking for compensation for the injuries that you've suffered. And if there's no insurance, you obviously want to look, okay, are there other entities that were controlling the actions or were there other entities that were benefiting financially from this particular church?

Were there people that were benefiting? Were there people that knew about this and didn't do anything? Like you said, there are people that protect him. In the night, the 2023, I don't have a problem with everything from the 2023 case because there's no set your limitations problems. But the 1998 case, obviously with 27 years passing, then you're talking about a situation where you don't know who the witnesses were and you don't know who was working there.

And so uncovering all of those things, it's a very different matter than it is if it was something that was recent. And so, but that's where discovery comes in. And that's where we have a very robust set of discovery in any case, in any case. And so we will absolutely and what I've always told people, and I'm not saying it is in this case, but in most cases, follow the money. Follow the money.

And you're gonna find the people that are usually involved or responsible. We asked Randy about the possibility of other victims coming forward, considering how numerous studies have shown that sexual abusers, and again, these are allegations right now when it comes to the Millers, usually have multiple victims. And particularly when it comes to someone who is in a position of power, like J.P. Miller and Wayne Miller were for most of their lives.

I have been retained by someone else and there are different people that have called and we will go through them. And obviously I have to look at it. Do I think this happened? Did this happen? Can this person provide me with something to make sure that I'm not just filing something

that didn't really happen? And it's very difficult with people who have sexual trauma because their memory may not be the best, or even if it is, it's sometimes it's halting. And so, you know, I had to feel very comfortable that this had really happened. And I did. And we went after it. And we will vet each person that calls or contacts us. And I think, though, in every case I've ever been involved with a church, there's always more than one. Always, always, always. The average offender does not get caught until they've offended the 60th time. That means there's probably a

lot of people out there. The thing is, the allegations of widespread sexual abuse at Solid Rock and Cathedral Baptist Church are not unique at all. So what is it about religious men too often being exposed as sexual abusers? One study by Dr. Abel Harlow found that 93% of sexual offenders describe themselves as religious. Why is that? And what is it about these religious leaders in particular that makes them seem to think that they can get away with this? Because they've got what they call their flock, their leaders over them and they have power over them. There's this thing in the sexual abuse community, what usually happens is there's an imbalance of power.

That's why you've seen, you know, women until the Me Too movement, you didn't see a lot of movement in, I mean, you didn't see a lot of traction. But after the Me Too movement, the imbalance of power between men and women in the workplace and in sexual harassment, it became a thing. It became well known and people started to believe, wow, look at all these people coming out and saying this, because it was true. But nobody ever wanted to say anything because there's an imbalance of power. When there's an imbalance of power, abuse occurs. If you have an abusive person, it doesn't happen if, I mean, you know, there's always going to be an imbalance of power between a teacher and a student or a professor and a student or a boss and their subordinate or a pastor in his church. There's always going to be that a coach in his little league team. There's always going to be that, a coach in his little league team.

There's always going to be an imbalance of power. The people who abuse that imbalance of power are the people that we're talking about. And those people cause harm to vast amounts of people. Think about folks that thought this man or any pastor was a savior. And they gave him their hard-earned money, not just tithing, not just 10%, but they were giving him

a lot more than that. And then one day to find out he's a wolf in sheep's clothing. And that's horrible. It's unfortunate. But we've seen it over and over and over. It is what it is. And we always, and because, and here's where it gets a little wonky. The basic tenet of the Christian faith is forgiveness. It's forgiveness. And we should forgive.

We should. People deserve a second chance. When you give someone a second chance who's going to abuse that second chance, then you're asking for trouble. And there are certain people to me, if you've sexually abused a child, if you've harmed a child, you don't get a second chance. It's just like if you know a pits killed, killed a kid, you can put that that pit with your baby. I'm not saying anything about pits, because I know some pits are some of the most lovely dogs out there. But but if if are you going to put that pit with your baby. I'm not saying anything about pits because I know some pits are some of the most lovely dogs out there.

But if you're going to put a dog that is bitten, a hard to cut kid, you're going to put them around your kid? No, you're not going to do that. You know, but people will do it with a pastor over and over and over and over and over. They will forgive, forgive, forgive, forgive, forgive. And I just don't have an answer for that. It's almost a cultish type situation. It really is very cultish to me.

Then we asked Randy perhaps the most important question of all. We asked him his why, why he decided to take on this case. His answer left us speechless, and we applaud him for his courage. Mark contacted me and asked if I would be involved. I do sex abuse cases, and I do that in medical malpractice, which is a bizarre mix, but it's what I do,

because I came from a medical malpractice background. I've done it since the beginning. And then about 10 years, I started doing sex abuse cases and started doing them heavily and have been very successful at it. But at the end of the day, I'm a survivor. And there was a point where I accepted certain things. And I've never publicly acknowledged that. My people around me know, everybody knows, the people that love me and care about me and my law firm knows, but I'm a survivor. And I think that when you're a survivor, honestly, I made enough money to where

about 10 years ago, I was like, I got a chip on my shoulder. So let's go start taking some people out. And so there's that part. And to be frank with you, the people that I represent, the people that I take care of or try to take care of, are the most gracious, incredible people, because what they've been through is the most horrific things that anybody could ever imagine. If you think about your child going through that, it would just destroy you. But every one of them have been through it. They've come out the other side and they're strong enough to fight about it.

And when we're through, every single time, I've changed people's lives as a lot of lawyers, not me, a bunch of lawyers, changed people's lives because we recovered X amount of dollars and we were able to give them financial independence. And they're gracious and they're very nice and kind and sweet and respectful. But the people that I represent in the sex abuse realm are the most kind-hearted, the most kind-hearted folks and they're willing to help. They're empathetic. It changes something inside of you. There's a bad things happen to everybody. Everybody's got stuff.

Every one of us have stuff. There's nobody that's not touched by stuff, but these people are incredible and they need folks that are willing to stand up and fight and have the money to fight, have the emotional intelligence to be able to fight, have the wherewithal to fight, have no fear, and understand process and the process of what you have to have and have a team behind you that is willing to go to the mat. Absolutely willing to go to the mat. Absolutely willing to go to the mat. There is nobody or anybody, there's nobody that we're afraid of.

I mean, we might lose. Nobody says you're gonna win every time, but there's just no fear, you know? And not this case, this has not happened in this case. I'm telling you right, this is not about this case. But one of the things that isn't isn't one of the side effects of doing this is you get threats. I'll get threats from somebody in this and not from JP. JP won't threaten me. Um, because I don't think he would do that because if you do that, you're going to get in trouble.

But there will be people that will threaten me because I'm doing this. I know I'm going to get threats from somebody. I get threats in every case. In most of the cases I'm involved in, there's a threat coming from somewhere. And it's just part of what you do because you got somebody that's close to them and those people aren't even, I don't even want to say they're terrible people or bad people, they're people that still believe the person didn't do anything wrong and you're trying to ruin their life.

And once again, it's the apologist. That apologist behavior is what allows someone to continue to offend. No more apologies. You all know how I feel about enablers of evil. They too have blood on their hands. If you ever find yourself trying to minimize allegations of abuse against someone, especially without knowing all or any of the facts. I want you to remember Randy Hood's words. They should burn in all of our ears. Because guess what?

Bad guys rely on good people to help them hide their true colors. I have one more little piece of breaking news to share this week before we go. Later on Tuesday, after Jane Doe's case had been filed and announced, and news was spreading like wildfire, we got word that Jane just doesn't have Randy and his law firm behind her. She also has Mark Tensley, also known as Zero Dark Tensley, aka Tiger Tensley. Most of y'all know who Mark is and his important role in getting Elick Murdoch behind prison bars for life. And if you don't know him, search for his day one testimony during Elick's trial. You won't be disappointed.

So, if you know Mark Tensley, then you know that JP Miller, Wayne Miller, and their churchy businesses are in big, big trouble. Stay tuned, stay pesky, and stay in the sunlight. True Sunlight is a Lunashark production created by me, Mandy Matney. Co-hosted and reported by journalist Liz Farrell. Research support provided by Beth Brayden. Audio production support provided by Jamie Hoffman and Sam Berlin. Case file management provided by Jamie Hoffman and Sam Berlin. Case file management provided by Kate Thomas. Learn more about our mission and membership at lunasharkmedia.com.

Interruptions provided by Luna and Joe Pesky. Hey there, EB here, your faithful Cup of Justice co-host. I am so excited to tell you about my new book, Anything But Blank. In this memoir, I share stories about my childhood, marked by bullying, my father's job loss, and the indomitable spirit that propelled me into the law and ultimately international recognition during the Alex Murdoch murder trial. I believe in certain life principles that have helped me and helped others achieve success.

From the power of organization and a sense of urgency to the importance of truth, leadership and resilience. With vivid recollection from challenges and triumphs framing each chapter, success isn't about luck, it's earned through skill and hard work. Please visit TheErikBland.com to learn more about the book, Anything But Bland, is the manifesto for those seeking triumph over adversity and a guide for anyone aspiring to reach their full potential.