Muscle for Life with Mike Matthews - How Legion Coaching Helped Cassandra Lose 25 Pounds & 6% Body Fat In Just 90 Days

Episode Date: January 31, 2018

In this episode I interview Cassandra, who recently completed my 90 day coaching service. As you will hear, she had some pretty outstanding results. She lost about 25 pounds and 6% body fat while gaining strength on her key lifts in just 90 days. In this interview, she is going to share a bit of her back story. She is going to share with us what she had done previously and where it got her, what worked, what didn’t work, and how she found her way to me, my work, and my coaching service. She is also going to share some of the things she learned along the way. As with anything, you go in with a plan, but then you have to adjust. You have to adapt to what actually happens and what actually works and what doesn’t. In her case, she was running into a lot of morning hunger, so she talked with her coach to find the optimal meal timing, meal sizing, and meal composition. Specifically, she talks about how she ate her carbs throughout the day to stave off the hunger and ultimately stick to the plan and get the results she wanted. 4:48 - What were your results after our coaching program? 8:21 - How much weight did you lose? 9:17 - What led to your weight gain and how did you begin your fitness journey? 15:53 - How did you overcome your embarrassment of going to the gym? 26:14 - What were some of the obstacles you had during our coaching program? 26:41 - What was your meal plan? 40:51 - What are your goals after our coaching program? Want to get my best advice on how to gain muscle and strength and lose fat faster? Sign up for my free newsletter! Click here: https://www.muscleforlife.com/signup/

It just became this thing now where I don't dread any day. I mean, I know that I'm going to work at the gym, but it's not, oh God, I have to do this or oh God, I have to do that. If you're to that point, you can tell your coach and they immediately just essentially take that workout out or they can reprogram it or redistribute it in a way that makes it a little bit nicer for you. Hey, Mike here and welcome to another episode of the podcast. In this episode, I interview Cassandra, who recently completed my 90-day transformation coaching service,

and as you'll hear about, had some pretty outstanding results. She lost about 25 pounds and 6% body fat and gained strength on her key lifts in just 90 days. And as usual in these interviews, she's going to share with us a bit of her backstory. She's going to share with us what she had done previously and where it got her, what worked, what didn't work, how she found her way to me and my work, which is kind of a cool story. In the interview, I pull up an email from her from February 1st, 2014. Thanks Google. And that's when she first reached out to me. And now she's graduating from the Transformation Coaching Service, which is pretty cool. But yeah, so she's going to explain how she found me in my work and eventually how she found a way to the coaching program and how that experience went. And she's going to share with us some of the things that she learned along the way, because

as with anything, you go in with a plan, but then ultimately you have to adjust and you have to But then ultimately you have to adjust and you have to adapt to what actually happens and what things actually work out and what don't. So for example, in her case, she was running into a lot of morning hunger. And so she had to work with her coach to figure out the optimal meal timing and also the optimal meal sizing and the optimal setup in terms of meal composition as well. In particular, how she ate her carbs throughout the day to stave off that hunger and ultimately stick to the plan and get the results that you want. This is where I would normally plug a sponsor to pay the bills,

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Yeah, absolutely. So let's start with the results first. So just because they're impressive. So in 90 days, what happened? So I want to say what I thought was really cool is I immediately noticed results. I lost nine pounds in the first week, which actually freaked me out at first. And so it kind of took the coach a little bit of handholding with me. And I think that's one of the things I really liked about it was if I began to get nervous or concerned,

they're like, no, no, you don't understand. You're all carved up right now, right? Exactly. Yeah. You need to cut back on this. And so it was also a clear example to me, I think, of how far out of alignment my diet was. First of all, I felt better. I started sleeping better, probably within about, I think, two weeks or so. So that's what really motivated me to keep at it. And so even when those food cravings hit or whatever, I just essentially would power through and be like, you know what? You want to see that scale drop. You want to see it happen. You want to make it happen.

You probably also found it easier to deal with hunger and cravings with more sleep and better sleep. Oh, 100%. And then, true, I actually had really tasty food on my meal plan. Sure. So, I mean, that helps a ton. And then second would be I sort of always had what my cheat meal would be in mind. So I had that reward. And so it was the idea of you're going to have to get there,

but it was one of those things, focus, go for a walk, do something else. It's like the midnight munchies hit or something. It wasn't anything where I was sitting there white knuckling it. Yeah. And that's actually a very simple, but workable strategy is take your mind off of the food. I mean, that's the famous marshmallow experiment, right? With the kids that, have you heard of that? So the kids that could resist the marshmallows, uh, ended up, you know, basically doing better in life. Basically the kids that had more willpower, more self-control grew up for the most part, got better educations and were making more money and blah, blah, blah. Um, but the

strategy, even the little kids use that, that were able to resist the temptations of the marshmallows was that they just distracted themselves. They would just like start playing with their chair or just doing things and they would, you know, turn away from the marshmallows and do something else. And that was part of it is no matter what, or I had something else that I would do in mind, I'd start reading a book or anyway. Yeah, that's smart. It's almost like a, and again, there's even research on this. It's if this, then I'm going to do that. You know what I mean? Just having that little plan in mind can make a difference when it comes down to the moment where you're like, okay, so if I'm feeling a bit hungry,

I'm, you've already decided, you know, I'm going to read a book or do this or do that. That puts you in a better position than if you had never really thought about it. And now you're in the moment and you're hungry and you're trying to decide, all right, what am I going to do about this? By the end of the program though, it wasn't that difficult for me. So it was essentially, you have to get into the groove, right? It's that initial sort of thing. But once I started seeing the results, it actually was not hard for me at all because it would be, hey, guess what? You know what? You're already 30 days in. Why would you start to wreck it now? Second would just be, you check the box at the end of the day, did I adhere to your meal plan or didn't you? And you have to explain why. And if

it's just, I'm a weak human being, I don't think that's a great excuse going forward. So that was another huge motivator for me. But it was, first of all, you know, essentially started losing the weight, slept better, overall health. I used to have cystic acne actually that went away. So there were a couple other markers for health that were bizarre that I don't know if there's science behind to explain, but those were some of them. Also just when I felt better in the gym too, because I wasn't bogged down by so much, if that makes any sense, it was a little bit more like, Oh, guess what? I can fricking lift this. Yeah. yeah. And just so everybody knows, how much weight did you lose? Oh, dear. By the end, I think, geez, I had come a total of 180. And by the time I exited, I was down to 153, 154.

Yeah, it's amazing. Yeah. And like I said, I mean, some of it was the water weight, some other stuff. But I think that's actually something that you just you don't think about at the time. You just begin to feel lost. And so that was part of the reason why I went to the coaching program. I'd actually started probably about three years ago or so, losing weight. I started off at 218 pounds. That was another reason why I needed essentially a little bit of help to get me over a hump, essentially with the coaching program. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. And in terms of body fat percentage, I have here that

you dropped your body fat percentage about 6%. So then that's fantastic. I thought so. And it was one of those things of once it just started and everything clicked into place and it just became simpler for me. Totally. And 6% absolute, obviously, for a man listening, not relative. So it went from about 28% to about 22%. Let's now start at the beginning. So before you found me or my work and ultimately the coaching service, so you were 180 pounds. You had over a few years had lost maybe 30 pounds, 20, 30 pounds. Let's even go, I mean, I'm just curious, what's your origin story? How did, what was it that got you to your heaviest? And then

what did you do from there to get down to the 180s or so? What worked? What didn't work? What was that experience like? Well, Mike, back in my day, no, but in all seriousness, I joined the Navy because when I graduated from high school, I couldn't afford college. So I joined the Navy and I picked up the really horrible habit of smoking in the Navy. I was probably up to about a pack a day habit or so. And by the time I left the Navy, for some reason that everything I did, as long as I didn't smoke, would be healthy. And I can't explain this rationalization looking back, but I ballooned from probably about 155 pounds to my 218 in a small matter of time. It was actually kind of scary. And I had carried that weight for a while. And it was one of those, I really, I would start a diet and I'd stop it because it would be those crash diet or it would be one that I didn't want. It was something that

I read online. I'm like, oh, I can do that. Rather than sort of understanding that you really have to pay attention to what you're eating, what's going on in sort of your body. If you don't like turkey breast, don't try and put turkey breast on your diet. It's not going to work exactly for you. Yeah. So I'd start and stop, start and stop. I ran for a while, but I eventually jacked up my foot, needed surgery. So that didn't turn out real well for me. I knew that I could lift weights, but I didn't know how to do it properly. So I typically wind up with an injury and then you take time off. And then before you know it, you're not back in the gym.

So it was a series of starts and stops. How I found you is kind of a funny story. You popped up in my Amazon feed because I like to buy cookbooks. And it was the Shredded Chef version 1.0. Oh, so this is back in the day. Oh, yes. Yeah. So I had hovered around in your periphery.

I may have been what could be called cyber stalking you for a period of time. And I want to apologize on that. Forgiven, forgiven. I was every one of your email address lists. I love the fact that you sent out recipes for free. All of your articles I'd read and I'd devour, but I started off with a shredded chef. And then from there, Amazon said, well, if you like this, then you'll like Thinner, Leaner, Stronger. So I read that and it was sort of like, oh, this makes perfect sense to me now. This explains a lot of why I'd start and stop in the gym. I didn't have proper form. I didn't really do my research on how to do a chest day, how to do an arms day, why I never saw those results. So then the year one challenge popped up and the year one challenge involved a barbell back squat, which I'd never done before. I was still pretty

heavy at that time. I think I'd started to lose some weight, but it wasn't really coming off like I wanted it to. And I wrote to you. I was trying to find the email actually before we started the podcast just so I could read it back. I can't explain how you wrote back to me in that email or what you said precisely, but it was essentially just get in the gym, right? It doesn't matter that you don't know how to squat right now. You gym, right? It doesn't matter that you don't know how to squat right now. You can learn that. It doesn't matter that maybe you don't have a squat rack available. You can do a leg press. If you can't do a leg press, do some dumbbell squats, do this. But it was just, and it kind of clicked into me that what I really needed to do was get

serious in the gym and get serious about my diet. So I continued on with the year one challenge for women and I completed that. And once I did that, I was sort of looking for my next challenge, so to speak. And was that in the period when you had lost, did you lose weight during that period or were you focusing more on the exercise and on the diet? That was when I first really started to melt away at the pounds. So I'd hover down, I'd maybe go down to 202 pounds, but I'd balloon back up shortly. I think it was probably about two years ago or so I did the year one challenge. And that's when I went down from 218 to 180. I started doing some other stuff.

I added a little bit more cardio into my routine. I really like to walk. So the long state steady cardio, which isn't necessarily, it's not like absolutely verboten. At the same time, it's like you don't need to do it, but I enjoyed it. So I went ahead and did it anyway. I mean, walking, walking is a great, and I think in terms of cardio, sure. If you want to maximize fat loss for the time, then you want to do high intensity stuff. Um, but if you don't want to do high intensity, I mean, I recommend people, I say, then go to the other end of the spectrum and just, just work in a few hours of walking every week. I mean, you burn depending on your body weight and how quickly you're walking.

But if you walk like with a purpose, you're going to burn anywhere from three to 400 calories an hour. I mean, that, that adds up. And it was just sort of part of the, for some reason, what you said in that email clicked for me, which was, you just have to start doing it, right? It doesn't necessarily matter that you're doing low intensity cardio. If that's all you can do for whatever reason, if you're injured or just do it, right? I was looking back at the year one challenge and I went ahead and got a meal plan and that really helped accelerate my fat loss. And then what I loved about the meal plan people was I could write back to them and say, Hey, I really don't like this. I'm not quite sure what you mean by that. So with that, the shredded chef, I continued on my own for a few more months.

And then I saw essentially that some spots in your coaching program had opened up and it was, okay, so now I really want to get serious, right? So my goal is to be below 20% body fat, right? But I needed a little help to get me past that edge. I essentially, I hired my own cheering squad, really, in a way, because there's someone in the background, no matter what, going, you can do it, you got this. So in that way, it was so uplifting to know that if I could write back if I had a question or if I had a concern, but also even then there's that little bit of encouragement that says, don't worry about this, you got this. You went at 10 pounds in your squat this week, that's freaking awesome. When it starts to get dark or when you're worried, oh, crap, I'm not losing the fat that I want to.

There's always someone essentially to help you there. Yeah. You know, funny, just this interjection. So I found your email here. So the first email was February 1st, 2014. Oh, shit. Okay. So.

Yeah. So you're asking, you're initially, you said your gym doesn't have a squat rack. Do you have any alternatives? And then I was like, how about a Smith machine? And yeah, then we ended up talking about, you know, goblet squats are good. Dumbbell lunges, pistol squats. Yeah. So the key is just that you get going and that's funny. So it's actually, so you guys maintain files. You're tracking me. I knew it. I blame Google. But actually, so it kind of goes back to, I was so embarrassed to get in the gym because I was so fat. I didn't want to go to my work gym

because I was embarrassed. I actually wanted to ask you about that because that's something that, you know, I've dealt with just can emailing, mostly emailing and social media with people from the beginning, usually women, not usually guys. And so, no, that's a very common thing. And because many women are hypersensitive about how they look for whatever reason, in some cases, you wouldn't think it looking at the person. If you say, if someone was very, very overweight, you go, yeah, I understand it'd be uncomfortable, but I've seen it with quite a few women that sure, they have some fat to lose if they want to be at 20% body fat. They have some work to do, but not at the point where you'd think that they would be reluctant to even go in the gym.

How did you deal with that? Because, you know, you started with just Thin or Lean or Stronger and that program. Did you just get in there and tough it out? And then how did it meet your expectations? So if you thought, if you were kind of embarrassed in the beginning, and then and then how did it meet your expectations so if you thought if you were kind of embarrassed in the beginning and then what so i worked out in the homeowners association gym which is sort of like a basic hotel gym for a little while but then after i started reading thinner leaner stronger and i realized that you're really not going to make great weightlifting results without barbell work and there's no room for that in my homeowners association gym so i

just said you know what, just do it, right? No matter what, everyone is typically embarrassed about something in the gym. And more often than not, I find that you think more about yourself than other people do. Yeah, it's very true. You probably spend some time in a gym and then you realize, right, that people don't even see anybody. All they see is themselves. And and like they don't even look you're lucky if you get eye contact from anybody that's that's unusual i know then you're like is he a creep or is he asking me a question i can't yeah yeah well even then there's this guy in our gym who routinely before every set yells out come on let's go get some yeah you got this every time. To himself? Yes. That's great. You can just kind of ride on the pep talks. And so that was like, all right then, you know what? Everyone in here

has their own thing. So I just thought that was great. I'm like, you know what, dude? I appreciate that. You're going to be you in the gym and you're not going to worry about me. Yeah. I had somebody in a gym that I used to go to in Florida that would come and wear the same clothes every day. I'm assuming he cleaned them, but he would do these mostly body weight stuff and kind of like body weight circuits. And he would be running around and talking to himself and like pointing at himself in the mirror and pointing up to the sky, like pointing up to God and stuff. And every day he would show up and for 20 minutes, he would basically be on this like cocaine high running around the gym, doing all kinds of crap,

talking to himself. So, you know, I was like, hey man, it was kind of funny. But at the same time, I would say the same thing to people working out. I'm like, I kind of like that he doesn't care. You know, I don't think he's crazy. I think he knows that he looks pretty ridiculous. But this is his thing. And that's it. That's what he does. And that's what I realized.

It's everyone is sort of doing their own thing in the gym. And even other guys, right, who love to look at their biceps when, you know, they're doing bicep curls. And you're like, okay, go ahead, do it. I get it. Your biceps are getting huge. That's, it's lovely. They're beautiful. They're doing bicep curls and you're like, okay, go ahead, do it. I get it. Your biceps are getting huge. That's, it's lovely. They're beautiful. They're beautiful biceps.

Your value as a man is increasing right now. I understand. Yes. Please excuse me. I'm going to go blab some gold water on my face real fast and then get back to my bed. And that's it. You just have to realize. And then second would be, you know what?

So maybe when I get a gigantic red face and I cringe my face because I'm doing a real heavy deadlift, maybe I look a little ridiculous, but you know what? That's okay. Because at the end of the day, the result is worth it. So once I began to really see those results, I'm like, you know what? That's okay. I can be a little bit embarrassed for a little while. It's actually probably a good thing. I agree, actually. I think it is a good thing to do things that are just outside of your comfort zone that are embarrassing. I mean, I recently, when I was in Florida, I started playing hockey again. I grew up playing hockey, but I hadn't skated in a while and it was embarrassing.

I was terrible. You know what I mean? But it was the same thing where like, I didn't care because one, I mean, I was like, I want to pick this back up and get good at it. But two, I think there's value in it. It's humbling. It's humbling. I think there's value in it. After you see, you're like, okay, you know what? No big deal. People laugh or whatever. But at the same time, people walk by me now and they're like, hey, wait a second. Was that just you doing deadlifts? I went, yeah, that workout is gangster. And that compliment alone, that's right. Damn straight.

I'm a badass. That's great. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, that's also a very common, uh, experience, especially with women where again, like not so sure going in. And then after a few months, people are one, they're surprised that you're squatting, you're deadlifting, you're overhead pressing, like that's real weightlifting. And then two, when they start seeing results, inevitably, then, you know, not only compliments, but in many cases, people will start asking, like, what are you doing? Because they'll see over the course of a few months, you know, your body changing week after week. And they want that too. But then when they hear it's a diet and exercise, they're like, oh, oh, that. Oh, yeah, that. But then when they hear it's a diet and exercise, they're like, Oh, Oh, Oh, that. Oh,

yeah, no, I should, I should definitely get in the gym more. I should. Yeah. Good point. I mean, I mean, in the gym, I don't know if you had that, but a lot of times like you become, if you're in, if you're in a routine where you're going to the same gym, same time every day, you start seeing the same people. And then they start seeing, I mean, in your case in 90 days, it's pretty, pretty dramatic change in your body. And then it goes the other way around. We're not, you're not embarrassed to be there. You're like, you know, one of the examples of someone who's really kicking ass. So, you know, I've started probably three other women with Inner Leaner Stronger. That's awesome. And I think, first of all, so let's just say you're a little scared of the coaching program, which I wasn't because I kind of had watched your brand for a while. So I knew it

wasn't going to be something where there's judgment or something like, you know what, you missed your reps this week. You have failed as a human being. You know that? It wasn't anything like that. Quit now. Quit, quit, quit. I knew it. I knew you couldn't do it. But first start with an Eleanor Stronger and get a meal plan. And when you start to see those results, you will see the value in the other part of it. Because with the coaching, although, yeah, you look at it, it is an investment. It's an investment though in your whole life, right? These are knowledge skills that will last you your entire lifetime. I will always have that meal plan. I will always have this workout program.

And more importantly, you understand how they work. So now you're never going to be baffled again on like, why did you gain X number of pounds over the holiday? Or why can't you just get rid of those last few numbers of pounds? Like it does kind of always come back to the fundamentals. Sure. There can be some extenuating circumstances and, you know, as you get older, certain things change a little bit here and there, but you know, you also never now be baffled as to, you know, what's going on with your body composition. And that's it is you're like, okay, I get it. It was just great to be able to talk to someone too.

Is this normal? Does this happen to everyone? It's like, yeah, sometimes that happens. But it was great. And so Roger, he was my coach, was fantastic throughout the whole thing. It was one of those things where I'm like, sometimes I feel like I may have bought a friend online.

Roger's that kind of guy too. He's just such a nice guy. I know. I could never be mad at him no matter. And I would cuss him out via email all the time. He's like, God damn it, Roger. I thought I told you not to increase my weight. And he'd just roll with it. He'd be like, I knew you could do it. I'm not worried about it. But it was just this great sort of relationship that I know even if six years from now I could email Roger or a Muscle for Life coach and say, hey, I'm a whole coaching client. Can you just provide some advice?

Yeah. I mean, you could email me directly. I could, but I know you're a very busy man. You'd get back to me, but I'd feel bad because you've got – You might have to wait a few days, but you'll get a reply. On your to-do list is respond to email. It's just I think of the books, the diet, the product launches. I'm like, oh, he's busy.

Yeah, I'm busy, but it's always something I give time to every day just because I mean, it's a good business practice, but it's also enjoyable. It's like, it's nice to be able to connect with people because a lot of my day to day work is really just me in my head writing stuff. You know what I mean? These days, it's a lot of that or even other business stuff that I'm interacting with the same one or two people here in the office most. And that's fine. But it's also nice to just be able to hear from people, especially because it's always positive. Either they have questions and I can help or they're just reporting. Rarely ever do I get any sort of – even I'd say the negative things maybe are some constructive criticisms, which

are useful. I'm always open to ways that I can make my stuff better because I've done a number. I'm actually going to be starting soon another round of updates to Thinner Leaner Stronger and Bigger Leaner Stronger. Not so much in the programs. I like the programming where it's at. I might tweak a couple of things, but I want to see if I can make them a little bit shorter. And I want to, in the case of Thinner Lean You're Stronger, I have a list of things based mostly on people's feedback, where people just brought up things. I was like, oh, that's a good point. I didn't think of that. I want to talk a little bit more about some female-only stuff and some questions that I've been asked now many times. That's a lot of the updates that I've done. So take the Shred Chef. So now it's gone through two full rounds of revision.

And the majority of that work was driven by constructive criticism. So it's all around just a positive experience to spend time emailing with people, DMing. Although I really need to get a Bluetooth keyboard or something. DMing pisses me off. There's a point because the typoing on my phone actually starts to enrage me, but, uh, but it's like, that's not even close to what I'm talking about. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. That, yeah, that shit. Hey, quickly, before we carry on, if you are liking my podcast, would you please help spread the word about it? Because no amount of marketing or advertising gimmicks can match the power of word of mouth. So if you are enjoying this episode and

you think of someone else who might enjoy it as well, please do tell them about it. It really helps me. And if you are going to post about it on social media, definitely tag me so I can say thank you. You can find me on Instagram at Muscle for Life Fitness, Twitter at Muscle for Life, and Facebook at Muscle for Life Fitness. So I want to ask you over this 90 day period, what were some of the adjustments? What were some of the hurdles, some of the obstacles that was there anything that you had to work around or that didn't quite go as planned that you had to then adjust for? One of those in particular, and it was my own sort of lazy, lazy fault. At the beginning, I don't think I really took the time to customize my meal plan like I wanted. So if I remember correctly, we had to go through a couple different iterations before it was something that I was really happy with.

Out of curiosity, how did that kind of come together for you in the end? What did your meal plan look like just generally? So part of it is my schedule is a bit skewed. So I have to get up at 3.45 in the morning. Nice. Oh, it's great. It's great. But anyway, so I can essentially live up to my family obligations, you know, walk the dog, get all that stuff together. And I can hit the gym before I head to work because that was something that was stymie me. If I did it at the end of my day, I either inherently dreaded my workout or I had no energy to do it because I was fasted. And that's one of the, one of the reasons why even I prefer like, sure. If I didn't have a lot of work to do, and if I was just like one of those kind of like, I just live in the gym kind of guys, I probably would work out in

the afternoon because you just tend to be strongest. So these guys do, but I work out first thing in the morning for the same reason, because ultimately I have a bit more energy first thing in the morning than last thing after, you know, doing everything I need to do. And I think it's a nice way to start the day, huh? I feel like it gives me purpose, if that makes any sense. Like, no matter what, I still did something of value today. Totally. So it's like, yeah, check in the block, done, did that. And you know, there's even research I saw recently on that your, essentially your mood

in the morning, and this is one of those things, I guess, you don't really need science to tell it to you because it's obvious and you kind of just experience it yourself, but that your mood in the morning basically kind of sets the tone for the entire day. So, you know, you get that benefit too, where not only do you have that psychological, okay, I did something with purpose today and I moved a little bit closer to a goal that matters to me. That of course just makes you feel good. But then you also have the physiological high of, you know, endorphins and other chemicals that are released when you exercise that just make you feel good. It's a fantastic too. For some reason, it's like, yeah, you know what,

even if I know I'm going to have a bad day or whatever, it's like at least bench pressing is a fantastic stress reliever. So let's just say I know I'm going to have a bad day or whatever. It's like, oh, that's right. Here we go. Watch this. That too was fantastic. But because of that, because I'm working out so early in the day, working out fast, it became easier, right? Because I just woke up, don't eat anything. But my morning hunger was actually pretty significant, where even if I ate, I think I was eating egg whites, some toast and a shake throughout the morning, I was still incredibly hungry. So I would write back saying, hey, can you please help me out here? How can we either space this out or redistribute my calories in a way so I'm not, my stomach isn't growling in the middle of a morning meeting or something.

And how did you figure that out? How did that get worked out? Some of it just got to be timing. So I would for sure eat my or drink my shake right after I worked out just to make sure I got some nutrients in my body, just make sure I sort of leveled out my blood sugar to just the basics. Then I would space out sort of a smaller snack in the meantime. And then in some cases, I would eat my lunch a little bit earlier. And I for some reason didn't get as hungry in the afternoon. But it took a little bit of tinkering with the timing as well as where the carbs essentially came into it. Because if I ate all of my food, I found out earlier in the day, it just made me super hungry. So spacing it out and spacing out the delivery of carbs for some reason worked better for me.

Yeah, that's great. And that's ultimately how it goes for most people. I mean, you can start with a one size fits all. This kind of tends to work, but almost always there's, if you, you know, sure, you could have just stuck to it and toughed it out, but why if you don't need to? And some people do best with your type of setup. And then some people do best with eating, you know, larger meals earlier in the day and just having them taper down. Some people till they're around and there's not really, at least as far as I know, that it can't be really predicted by research that you can do or anything. It's kind of just you got to get into it.

You have, yes, some simple little levers you can pull in terms of meal composition, meal timing, meal size. But ultimately, you got to kind of get into it and just see what works. If you get it right the first time, cool, you got lucky. But if not, yeah, you just keep on tinkering until you hit your sweet spot. Yeah, that's all it took was it's just essentially flow of communication, right? That I was really hungry today. I wasn't hungry today. Hey, can we shift this? And then in some cases too, I asked for a bigger meal at dinner. So with a smaller lunch, essentially, because I eat relatively early so I could go to bed early. Hey, can I eat more food at dinner? So that way I don't

get the munchies after dinner because that was another problem I was having too. So, and like, I wanted like a few treats, like, can I have a sweet treat after dinner that feels dessert-like, if that makes any sense. And what did that, what did that turn out to be for you? It turned out to be a flip yogurt, believe it or not, just the real easy flip yogurt. I pull off the shelf and if I wanted it, then I had it. And there were some nights where I'm like, you know what? I don't need it right now. But it was nice to know that it was super easy, right? I could get a chocolate fix. I could get a peanut butter fix, both of which are, oh, they're so delicious, but they're also my death balls when it comes to my dieting. Yeah. I like chocolate and peanut butter too.

That's my daily little, I have some dark chocolate every day. Oh yes. I, since I'm, I'm back to cutting right now after the holidays, as you can imagine, I look, it happens to everyone. And that's, well, that's also something though that makes it easier to enjoy, right? Cause you can just go and you can be like, all right, I'm willing to put on, you know, when you factor in water and glycogen, you're like, eh, I'm willing to put on X number of pounds, you know, over the holidays. And you just kind of go and do your thing. And then you don't, you're not, you don't, you're not feeling guilty while you're eating and you're just keeping an eye on it. And even if you go a little bit over, it still doesn't matter though. Cause you're like, oh, okay.

So now I extended my cut by two weeks. Big deal. Yeah. I think it just, it just makes it so much more enjoyable to overeat intentionally. And then, cause you know exactly what you're going to do after. For me too, it was like, okay, you know what? All right. So that's this right now. One of my friends just invited me to a Superbowl party. And I said, you know what? No, thank you. Because I knew I couldn't resist the sweet treats, but I also knew that going into it. Right. So I knew at Christmas time, it's like, okay, this means no football parties. This means nothing like you're not going to go to any bowl games. You're not going to do this because what happens? You, you can't help it. Right. When you're surrounded by a buffet of pizza, no one has

an iron will, but they're like, I won't have any pizza. I'm just enjoying these carrot sticks. Thank you. And some, some ice cubes too. Thank you. I'm just going to, no, no, I love, I love ice water. It's delicious. So that's on, that was, that was figuring out your, your meal timing and sizing and so forth. Was there anything else along the way that got in the way or that you had to kind of maneuver over or around? So there weren't any major changes to my workout. There were a few times where I said, hey, can I actually start off a little bit lighter than 50% on my first warm-up set? And they said, sure, not a problem.

Go ahead and do that. And for me, it just, particularly with the barbell back squats and the deadlift, I start out maybe about 10 pounds or so below what is the 50% mark. Because for me, it just reinforces the muscle memory and the form. So that was a small little tinker thing to the check sheet or to the Google form that you fill out. I hate, hate Bulgarian splits. I don't know what we did to the Bulgarian people. I'm concerned, though, because those split Bulgarian people. I'm concerned though, because those split squats are horrible. They're my nemesis. And so I asked, Hey,

can we take those out? That also kind of just highlights another point of, and this, this applies equally to dieting is everybody's heard the saying, the best diet is one you can stick to. And that's, that's true. I mean, obviously it needs to be within the there, there are boundaries. It needs to be like the, uh, there, there are boundaries. Um, it needs to be like, if it doesn't account for energy balance or macronutrient balance at all, and then it's not so exciting, but so long as a diet has the fundamentals there, uh, as you kind of have learned, the best diet is when you can stick to, you know, you have your calories where they need to be and you play with macros, you figure that out, you figure everything else out to make it

yours. But the same thing could be said for workout programs. That's a good example of if you just hate an exercise, then there's no reason to continue doing it. There's no single exercise that is so universally important that you have to do it no matter what. If you wanted to say one that approaches maybe like, if you can only do one exercise period, I guess you look at it that way, probably be the deadlift, right? If you just, if you, for in terms of whole body benefits, but even that, if you can't deadlift or you don't want to deadlift, it doesn't matter. There are other options and you can break that movement up into a couple movements and still do just fine. So, you know, in many ways, the best workout program is going to be the one that you

can stick to and the one that you're going to enjoy. It's not like, oh, you can grit your teeth and show up to the gym every day because that's not the goal. As you've said, the goal now is this is a lifestyle for the rest of your life. And if you're going to make a lifestyle, you got to enjoy it. You got to enjoy your diet. That means you have to look forward to every meal every day and you can't be overly hungry. You can't be struggling with cravings. And then on the workouts, yeah, you should be looking forward to your workout. Some days you may, you know, it's not gonna, it's not always perfect, but on the whole, it should not be that you're showing up to do a bunch of exercises that you hate and you're doing them even in rep ranges

that you hate. You know what I mean? It's a programming if you don't like, because for one reason or another, I think that's true. Even if it's not 100% optimal, yeah, you could say that a strength training program without deadlifting is not optimal. But if you can't or really don't want to deadlift, you can still make it work. And if that means it's going to be a lot more enjoyable, then that's worth making the change. Oh, 100% because even now, I'm actually, I have Bulgarian split squats back into my routine because it's just, okay, if you're dreading that, right. And that was what was happening was I'd wake up in the morning and be like, Oh God, I got to do some split squats today. Or I think at one point too, I was doing within the same day, like I think I had split squats, goblet squats and some

other stuff. And I'm like, can we just break this up a little bit? And so it just became this thing now where I don't dread any day. I mean, I know that I'm going to work at the gym, but it's not a, oh God, I have to do this or, oh God, I have to do that. If you're to that point, you can tell your coach and they immediately just essentially take that workout out, or they can reprogram it or redistribute it in a way that makes it a little bit nicer for you, which I think happened with goblet squats, bullfaring and squid squats. And I think I was doing barbell lunges all in the same workout. And that just got to be just, I was like,

I don't want to be at the point where I can't walk up and down stairs for two days. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. So then you can move some of that, you know, volume to another day. Or instead of the lunges, you could do lying leg curls, which obviously are just less difficult, but still give you a good hamstring workout and so forth. Yeah. And right now I'm actually doing Romanian deadlifts.

So also every now and then too, hey, can we change this up? Can we do this? Can we do that? It was a little bit like a puzzle essentially is how I look at my workout now and then what fits into it. Yeah, it's a good way of looking at it. I mean, again, it's like figuring out for you. It's your puzzle. And so you just look at like, okay, I have the basic pieces here. I just need to make sure that it shapes evenly. And that's actually one of the things that Thinnily or

Stronger is great at, right? Because it kind of tells you that. And same with the year one challenge, because you lay it out there so easily. Okay, I'm going to do essentially, was it like segment two from the year one challenge now? So that was one of the reasons why I liked it so much was I could repeat it if I needed to. Yeah. And that was, that was intentional when I was designing is I wanted people to work through, I wanted women to be able to work through different types of workout configurations where you're still getting everything done that you need to get done, but different exercises. And so then once you've gone through the entire program, you have now experience with pretty much all the

major exercises that you can choose from. And then you're in a really good place to create your own routines and to do your own programming. Because it's one thing to read about exercises, especially if you're just looking at them in terms of effectiveness, that's just an objective measure. There's also, how are you going to do with them? How much are you going to enjoy them? How are you going to feel, you know, doing them? Some people, certain exercises cause aches and pains. Okay. So that's not for you. So yeah, that was part of what I wanted people to achieve from, from that is to walk away with a lot of now weightlifting experience that they can use to, to customize their routine and make their puzzle. Yeah. And it, for me also, I, I mean, I saw such significant results. It wasn't just newbie

gains. It was also, I was very timid with the weights that I'd put on. So even like, I think with the coaching program, I think I still went up at least 20 pounds, I think in my deadlift and some other significant weightlifting milestones. And it's the same thing, right? It's, you can still make the gains when you're cutting. What I liked about your program, everything is laid out so simply. Okay, that's fine. So I look online. That's how I do that. Okay, focus on the muscle memory.

Focus on this. Line up a few things. I'm still horrible with my squat form, but I'm working on it, Mike. And that's what matters. Yeah, squatting. I mean, I remember that back before I knew what I was doing. I'd actually, I had actually gotten up to four Oh five for like these pathetic quarter, probably quarter squats, maybe one third.

I don't even know. I don't even know if they counted as, as half squats. And so, you know, this was many years ago. And then when I was like starting to educate myself and, uh,

first starting with the big barbell movements, I was like, Oh, range of motion. Okay. And if I remember correctly, I went down to like no more than 205. I think 185 for sets of 10. That's how.

Yeah. And I actually, at first, I remember trying. I remember how much I had on the bar. It was too much. This was the first time I was like doing a proper squat and got stuck. And there were no, it was, there were no no bars or anything i had to like throw the weight off me yeah so then from there i learned the importance of uh of range of motion and still no matter what i do for a couple sets at least which is the bar just to essentially

get into the motion again of squatting every time i do it because I found when I didn't do that, I would start to cheat like a quarter squat. And maybe I'm like, huh, this is strange. You have to go back to the fundamentalization every time. Yeah. And that'll come, the more you do it, the less you have to think about it. Eventually, then you'll really be able to just focus on moving the weight and not also trying to make sure that your form stays tight. Oh, well, it's just one of those, no matter what, it's like, I know it can be better. I know it can be better.

It's not A plus squat form. Okay, that was a good rep. I did that one, but the next one, ah, damn. Yeah, totally. So where do you go from here? What are your goals? You said you're cutting after the holidays. Do you want to ride it down to the 20% range

or what do you want to do now? So yeah, no matter what, below 20%, I'm going to see how I look just aesthetically. I still have a little bit of tummy fat at the end. So I cut out all alcohol, all fast food, and I made my own cheat meals, which actually you can eat a lot more food if you make your own food. That's just for the cheat meals anyway. A lot of people want to eat out or they order pizza. My recommendation is do all that stuff yourself and you'd be surprised the offset, like you could eat more food and that felt more rewarding to me. Because you get to control the really high calorie stuff, the butter, the cream, the oil.

Yeah. Especially with something like I love to bake, I love to cook. And so I would make my own chocolate chip cookies and I would parcel it out, right? But the smell of chocolate chip cookies, all that stuff became part of that sort of ritual that made it more rewarding and almost feeling more indulgent, more luxurious. Yeah, that makes sense. So anyway, uh, so that was just something that I did, but no matter what, it was like the foreplay. It's like, and then you got to, you got to, you got to anticipate. Oh, hello, Mr. Hershey. How are you? He's going to take a couple of chips. Yeah. So no matter what second would be, I've got, well, I have three major weightlifting goals. So first, I'd like to do a one for one ratio from weight to squat. So that would be about 150 pounds or so. Right now I'm on the cusp of 145 and really nailing that for my squat.

Second would be for deadlift. I want to get up to 250 pounds by this year. I'm at 220 now. Impressive. That's strong. Well, yeah, but my squat isn't still where I want it to be. But years ago, I'd hurt my back and I was afraid to squat. And anyway, it took me a little while before I'm like, you know what? You got this. Don't worry about it.

If you have a proper stretch routine that I do at least once a day, all that other stuff, it's a little bit like I think you don't want to squat and you're making an excuse for yourself right now. You said it, not me. I don't know what you're talking about. One thing to keep in mind also, though, is if for your back, anybody listening that might have any back issues with squatting, front squats are more back friendly. As you've mentioned front squats a couple of times, so you probably know that. Yeah. The front squats also, for some reason I feel wobbly. I don't know why I don't feel stable. And it's just one of those things. It's an awkward, I mean, it's an awkward

exercise. It definitely takes some getting used to. And it's a little bit like, um, you're almost like in a mummy position because you've got your, the bars crossed and you're sort of, anyway, it's, it is definitely something that you're like, okay, you know what, just, just work through it and take the time to get it right. Um, rather than just get, get, get it over with. Yeah. Yeah. And eventually then it becomes, uh, the movement itself becomes more familiar, but also you, you eventually stop feeling the bar on your shoulders. You know, the discomfort for whatever reason, just kind of goes away and regardless of the weight. So it's just kind of a matter of going, you know, cause discomfort for whatever reason just kind of goes away and regardless of the weight. So it's just kind of a matter of going, you know, cause it is kind of strange though. Cause you can be back squatting for a while and then you go to front squat and you

feel like a newbie again, you feel it's uncomfortable and you feel weak and you feel wobbly. Um, so you just kind of go through that process again, as if you were learning a squat for the first time, basically. It was just, I'm like, okay, so how does this go? And then it feels very strange when, at least for me, my forearms don't necessarily allow me to hold onto the bar really well. So it's a platform and I know that, but it's still sort of a weird grip for me. The third goal that I have is my overhead press. I'd like to be able to get up to a hundred pounds for overhead press, which I, from what I understand is a lofty goal, but that's not going to stop me from trying to get at it right now. I'm about 85 pounds. And press, which I, from what I understand is a lofty goal, but that's not going

to stop me from trying to get at it. Right now I'm about 85 pounds. And so I think I can do it. You're close. I can do it. So those are sort of my weightlifting goals, no matter what. I actually, the continuation, I went ahead and went with the continuation program just because I essentially really wanted to keep up my relationship with Roger and have a couple, a little bit more, a few more months with him just to talk things out. And then gradually sort of, I'm taking the training wheels off. So I had a couple of suggestions. I'm like, Hey, Roger, I want to do this. I want to go ahead and do that. How do you feel about that? So Roger would be like, Oh, that's fantastic. That's great.

That's a bad idea. And then so gradually I become more the owner sort of say of my fitness plan overall. And then at which point I will sadly eventually have to say goodbye to my coach. But that will be a sad day. But that's sort of what I'm looking at right now. So it's essentially those are my fitness goals. That's great. Love it. All right.

Well, those are all the questions that I had for you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate the opportunity. Yeah, I know. Thank you for taking the time. Keep kicking ass. You're doing great. So I have to be 100% honest.

I thought Roger just sort of said that, that my results were impressive. And I was like, Oh, Roger, you say that to all the girls rather than it wasn't until I heard from Matt and I heard from some other people. And then all of a sudden this huge surprise came when I saw me in an email and I'm like, Oh, I actually guessed that I did make some progress. I'm a case study. That's fantastic. But that was like the first real boost that I got. That was a huge boost to me. That's great. Yeah, that's great. I mean, I'm that's I'm serious in those emails. I'm like, hey, it could be you in the next email. Like these are all that's where these emails come from is people like you. If nothing else, that gives me

the motivation to continue on. So I really appreciate that. Absolutely. Yeah. Thank you again. And I look forward to seeing your continued progress. Thank you very much. Now, before we wrap up, I just want to quickly say, if you, Mr. or Mrs. Listener are currently struggling to get the body that you really want, if you are struggling to lose fat, gain muscle, do them both at the same time, whatever it might be. And if you want some one-on-one personalized help, and if you want guaranteed results, you either get results and you're either thrilled with those results or you

get your money back, then you definitely need to check out my one-on-one coaching service. Go to muscleforlife.com slash coaching, and you can learn all about it. This is a popular service in high demand. There's usually a wait list. So if this sounds interesting at all to you, I recommend going right now to mustforlife.com slash coaching, checking it out and scheduling your free consultation call. So we can see if you qualify for the program and if it is right for you. Hey there, it is Mike again. I hope you enjoyed this episode and found it interesting and helpful. And if you did, and don't mind doing me a favor and want to help me make this the most popular

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myself and i'm always looking for constructive feedback so please do reach out all right that's it thanks again for listening to this episode and i hope to hear from you soon and lastly this episode is brought to you by me seriously though i'm not big on promoting stuff that I don't personally use and believe in, and reduces fatigue without the unwanted side effects that you probably experience with many other pre-workouts or the dreaded post-workout crash. post-workout crash. It's also naturally sweetened and flavored and contains no artificial food dyes, fillers, or other unnecessary junk. And all of that is why Pulse has over 3,100 reviews on Amazon with a four and a half star average and another 500 plus reviews on my website, also with a four and a half star average. So if you want to feel focused, tireless, and powerful in your workouts, and if you want to say goodbye to the pre-workout jitters, upset stomachs, and crashes for good, then you want to head over to www.legionathletics.com and pick up a bottle of Pulse today. And if you're not sure which flavor

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