My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark - 125 - Bedside Astrologer!

Episode Date: June 14, 2018

Karen and Georgia cover the survival story of Scott Johnston and Sean Farmer and the Glamour Girl Slayer.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is exactly right. We at Wondery live, breathe, and downright obsess over true crime. And now we're launching the ultimate true crime fan experience, Exhibit C. Join now by following Wondery, Exhibit C, on Facebook and listen to true crime on Wondery and Amazon Music. See, it's truly criminal. And welcome. Hello and welcome to My Favorite Murder, your true crime podcast for when you're feeling spicy.

Or sultry. Or salty. Or, you know, synonymous with sexual feelings. It had to be an S. Let's go over. Let's take it straight into the gutter at the top so we can come back out and go to heaven at the end. This is like, you know how Cosmo will have like the sex episode. Oh, and it's the thickest magazine you've ever seen filled with garbage.

This isn't that. I used to like the Cosmo pull out bedside astrologer where you could pretend that you could read a little waste of paper pamphlet about your sign. And that was going to tell you what kind of dudes you're going to have sex with in the following year. And I remember reading it like I had to read it and I felt like it would be that it was somehow like a vision board. Like if I focus on this enough, this might happen to me where it's like. What does it mean? Someone I already I've already met my Mr. Right.

Exactly. Who could it be? I wonder if it is that guy. Scan your brain for every single person you've met. I'm going to read you your sex horoscope right now. Really? All right. Let's hear it.

Sure. We can always edit it out if it's stupid. I feel like this. Okay. Let's just stay up top for all those people that drive around with their kids listening because they think it's kind of funny. This is going to be our triple X rated show today. It's summertime. It's hot outside.

Okay. Monthly sex scope for tourists. You ready for this? Mm-hmm. Tourist woman. Mm-hmm. Karen. Yeah.

This is for June of 2018. So you better get on this because it's halfway over. Yeah. I'm not going to. Okay. Okay. Seduction blossoms on hot summer nights, Karen. Really?

It says your name in it. It's weird. Beginning as early as the first week in June. Is that true? That's my private business. Okay. That's when a grand water trine. A water truck?

So closely by a quarter of a moon on June 6th, what could ignite a long, sexy, and overdue discussion? No. Yes. It says that. I swear to God. I don't want to have a discussion. You approach a confusing.

Let's get to now. A cranky Mars retrograde starting on June 26th contributes to the relationship altercations that arise, Karen. It's not you being a fucking crazy bitch. It's fucking Mars. It's this Mars trine that I can't get away from. It's not that you ate, you didn't have enough protein and you screamed at him about his fucking car being disgusting.

It's not that I went through his phone when he was in the bathroom at all. I found something not that incriminating, but. It's Mars for fuck's sake. It's Mars. A full moon in Capricorn, blah, blah, blah, Neptune is in here, Saturn is in here. To the moon and wildly painting the whole day in rose-colored hues today, it's difficult to decipher whether it's real love or just old-fashioned lust. So there you go.

Well, it's not always the way. I mean. I mean, it is not the great human puzzle. Is this person that you're hitting up at 1.34 a.m. trying to swing by their house? Is that love? Isn't it? Is that what lovers do? How can one know other than reading their daily sex horoscope?

One would never know. Or their private texts. Or their private texts. I love the idea. It's not like I'm not the kind of person that wouldn't read people's private texts. But I'm a hundred percent for it. I just want to go ahead and say. Are you for it?

A hundred percent. Getting up into people's business like that? Like read, read your person's shit. Okay, but here's what I would find. This addendum. If you're going to be so brave and strong as to bust in and read your person's shit, when you find out shit that destroys your heart and life and soul, you don't get to say anything because you fucking did it.

You did it to yourself. Yes, you do. Why are they doing shit that's going to destroy your heart, life and soul? And at least you found out about it before they kept doing it. Yeah, but you don't have a leg to stand on once you have been the crazy person that reads private information. So you find out they're cheating on you, you shouldn't have read their texts. Well, if there's like, I'm saying, the thing I've made up in my mind is you're doing this

cold. You're having a great relationship and you're like, oh, we just went to the bathroom, I'm just going to poke around. Okay. But what do you find? Innocently. Then you find, what I'm saying is, if you find something bad in that, you have to know going in that's a more than 50 percent possibility.

Is this a relationship podcast now? I don't know. I have so many thoughts. If it is, it's the worst. Right? I guess I'm just saying, I don't think so because I think everyone's a liar though. Everyone lies. You can't, if you get, you have to go and know when you're going to find something you're

not happy with. Yeah. But know that like, at what point, you know, you can be, you can tell them, I don't know. Clearly I fucking have read Vince's texts and I didn't like. We all have. Fuckings was like, what's up? I read your fucking texts. But I mean, isn't there something that in whatever the argument then becomes because all arguments

become, here's my list of everything I've done right versus here's the list of everything you've done right or wrong, whatever, right? I'm thinking of like, cheating. I feel like it kicks the legs out from under you where then he's like, well, yeah, because you're this crazy bitch. That's why I cheat on you. I don't think it's crazy. Oh no.

I'm just saying. Well, you wouldn't want a data person that would say something like that anyway. But I'm just saying, I feel like the move itself is such a big move. As someone who has a lot of paranoia and anxiety about relationships and being played a fool. I just want to make sure that the person that they're portraying themselves as is correct. So if I do a fucking quick scroll of your ex-girlfriend's name and your Gmail and nothing comes up, I'll put the phone away.

Great. But like, I think due diligence, I think your due diligence is good. Like at any point in a relationship, X would have looked at my phone and been like, and looked for something. He wouldn't have found anything. True. Because I wouldn't do anything to compromise my integrity. But that's a good flip because if you do that, if a guy did that to you, he would be a weird

controlling monster. No. I'd just be like, are you not, like, am I doing something in a relationship that makes you think that something's not right? Because let's just fucking talk about it. Got it. But if you say that, and the guy's like, no, like, you know, then it would be like. So you're saying your searching isn't random or just for fun.

It's because you have your suspicions or something came up. Right. Got it. But I was more talking about, I was actually thinking of the time that I was in my friend, my grammar school friend Connie's room, and I found her diary. I was like laying weird on her bed and I looked and her diary was there. So I just pulled it out and started reading it. And she walked in.

We were never friends again. She walked in and was like, that's my diary. And then I was like, oh, well, it's just here. I wanted to read it. I want to know what your private thoughts are. And then I just was like, oh, yeah, that's the kind of thing. Or like I've, uh, one time I opened a family friend's nightstand because the adults weren't home.

Never do that. And yeah. What did you find? I found proof of people having an affair. And I was like, I was 10. Jesus. And it was, I couldn't tell anybody. What was the proof?

Pictures. Yeah. You saw naked pictures. They weren't naked. No, it was just, it was more actually romantic. But I didn't, I told my sister like two years ago. It was that big of a like, I went like, oh, shit. And then I was like, why do I do shit like this?

I don't want to know this. Well, I think it's different with your friends and family than with your like, the person you're like, planning to spend their life with, you know. No, that's true. Well, you're now very specifically thinking of like, I'm not attacking you for you, you, whatever happened. It feels like it. Can I look at your phone and make sure you're not attacking me?

I feel like I'm being attacked right now. I just think you can really open up a can worms that you never, like you think you know what you're going to find and then you fucking are like, wait a second, he ships human beings across state lines and you're like, I have to go into hiding. I agree. This has been the zodiac sex calendar. Let's talk about the staircase because everyone wants to see, oh my God, case. That's, I mean, Twitter.

I'm going to say this. I never don't like the obscure ones that are like randos where they're like, hold on, somebody just said, did you see the fear of 13, which is a documentary. I love that. Yeah. I love when it's random. Yeah. Because I don't really follow the like, you know, Dateline specials and the ABC specials

and stuff like that. So those ones I like. Also, what I love is when Josh Megwitz retweets like, this is going to be a good episode for date, for Dateline. Oh, did he do that? I follow him on Twitter. I do too. He retweets the best shit.

He's great. He's so funny and cool. Like he's someone I want to hang out with in real life. He has that hilarious thing where they, I think it's the NBC stories, like they haven't, they're not carrying the Dateline products and he was like pretending to be mad. They don't carry his cut out. Oh my God. He's so delightful.

We should have him hang out with us. We should. We should make him. We should force him. Okay. But the staircase did have some extra episodes that were new that I haven't watched because first of all, it's not, it's made by the same people who made what seems to me a very fucking biased documentary, so I'm not going to find anything earth-shattering and new,

but I get it. When it's from the same people. Yeah. But then again, maybe it will convince me that maybe he's innocent. So I should watch it just as due diligence. I feel like my thing is, yeah, we've, we've kind of been submerged. Submerged. Submerged.

It's just such a weird word, but we've been in that documentary and in that story for a long time. And by the way, episode 100, our 100th episode, we just, that's the only murder we discuss and I'm on Adderall and I apologize. I can now admit how many episodes out are we 15, 115, 125. So 25 episodes out, Karen. I'm just like, I'm, you okay, Karen's hyperventilating. Oh shit.

I just, she broke her mic, ladies and gentlemen, I just want to say I'm, I get really, I get really passionate and I interrupt Karen for the whole thing. I had a lot of shame afterwards. You did. I felt bad for you afterwards cause you, you, shame ease and I just want to say, don't do drugs. I, I am, I have ADD I'm prescribed Adderall, but after that I went back to my psychiatrist and it was like, it's not working for me anymore.

She gave me something else. But that was also that combination of us being crazy excited and breaking format, which isn't an easy thing to do, sharing a murder and then talking about it, agree, which was like, that's, that was the perfect example of what I'm normally like when I have a conversation about true crime with someone is I yell at them, they don't believe me. And I love, you know, I love yelling, but I'm sorry, cause that made me laugh so hard just because I, first of all, I love that you just said that and you were that honest. And secondly, I love, I feel like we just have different, um, you know, like I say,

like when something happens to me, I won't be able to talk about this for four days because I can't process. I don't know what happens real time. I have to wait for a later like, oh shit. Yeah. And I think yours is three months. You're just like, can I don't want to, I don't want to write this second, but like I'll be able to go thereafter because I want to make up for it before I admit that it was, you

know, I want to prove that that's not going to, like episode three or one or three if I had said that it would have been like, you need to go take care of that. And it's like, let me take care of this. Sure. You know what I mean? Yes. It's, you're saying, I admit I did this and it's no longer a problem. I need to rectify it.

Yeah. Exactly. You don't need to have an intervention with me. I cleaned up my own mess. Right. Please don't worry about that. Exactly. I love it.

I, you know what? Full respect to that honesty. But I'll always talk about my failings and faults because what else is there to talk about? It's the most interesting thing to talk about. Uh, also, I think the thing with Adderall, well, my thing is just, I don't understand the Adderall high specifically, but having been a speed addict, I recognize the intensity and I don't mind it. I love it because, but the only thing with that was it started to feel like a facts argument,

which is my least favorite part about true crime obsession is, you know, the thing I get the worst wrong, which is like, I'm not paying attention to the dates, the seasons, the months, the years. I'm going, they had a knife in their fucking eye or whatever, or like, I'm obsessed on the detail experience, experiential detail as opposed to, you know, I'm not a cop. I'm not recording it. For me, and what upset me, and it probably still would, but I just wouldn't scream at you about it, is that we, the conclusion that was kind of like, to me, it's like, we watched

the same thing, how did you not come to this conclusion? You're my friend, like, and it's just like, but I need to let people have opinions. And also what I was saying wasn't necessarily like my, like, in my hard opinion. I was like, yeah, but what if this, but it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. I apologize for that. Thank you, Georgia. So go listen to episode 100.

That was staircase. And then in episode 200, this time, Karen will be on Adderall. Can I? Just for the show, just for an example. I love it. I mean, I had a friend tell me when right as my speed era ended and I stopped doing it. She was like, oh yeah, I, I don't think you noticed, but I was not friends with you for

two years. I could not be around you. I was like, I didn't notice. Oh, yeah. You didn't notice? I didn't notice anything. I was talking and smoking, like all day, I slept for two hours a night. It was rough stuff.

And it was, it's not fun to talk or for the experience of being around me is the only interaction can be, did you see this thing? I hated it. You're wrong. Whatever you say is wrong. You could hate it and just be hating it wrong. I couldn't let anybody off the hook for anything. People drive me crazy.

Who do that when you're like agreeing with them and they don't, yeah, whatever. Okay. Because you know what it is that habit when people go, no, but, and they're not listening to the point you're making. They just need to possess their opinion independently of it. It's like you could never understand what their opinion is. It's like they're closer to it than you are. Yeah.

Yeah. Fine. Good. Get it all the way up in there. I don't need it. God bless you for it. Good bless you. My cats don't talk back.

That's why we have pets. That's why we have pets. And drugs. Coffee. Well, wait, I wanted to ask Steven. This is, you're not in the middle of something, are you? Are we in the middle of something? Always.

No. No. Oh, we're just staircase. We're just explaining why we're not jumping on this staircase bandwagon, but we love, I didn't mean to be so harsh in the beginning. We love that people are this excited. Totally. It's super fucking cool.

Well, by next week, we'll watch, we'll have watched the new ones. By next week, we'll book club the staircase series. We'll have a browse the new ones, I should have said. We'll browse them. We'll get mad at certain people we'll be able to talk about. I'll do my nails. My nails will look great. I'm going to wear a tweed suit.

I'll dress like a North Carolina lawyer. An owl? Oh. I will wear a full owl suit. What if we dress Elvis up as an owl? Oh my God. Yeah. Steven, start the costume now.

Steven, sew it. Steven, you just got back from Europe because you tell the people what you did in Europe. Well, I never thought I would do this in my life, but I knew. You didn't? Because I was not surprised in any fucking way when you told me. I just never thought I would be somebody to, basically, I really wanted to see the new Jurassic Park movie early. Of course, because.

You have a podcast about Jurassic Park. Have you ever said that on this podcast? I don't think so. Please do. See Jurassic right? Everyone just shares their Jurassic Park stories. I love it. It's my favorite movie.

It's nice. And you have 15 podcasts. Yes. They're all about a different animal. Yeah. Oh, one animal at a time. But no, I just like the idea of traveling to go see something I like. Totally.

And so, because it came out early because of the World Cup, so they're like, Universal is like, we don't want to compete with the World Cup because people aren't going to go to the movies. So yeah, I flew to London to see the Jurassic, Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom early. So. And that's part, that's number three part. Well, it's the fifth Jurassic Park in the second Jurassic World. Okay.

Yeah. No. Okay. But it's good, right? I loved it. Yeah. Yeah. I've seen it three times now.

That's true. To see this new one. You said that to us. Yeah. Did I? Yeah. Yeah. To you.

Yeah. I mean, I think you have a good time either way. Okay. It reminded me of like pants labyrinth. You don't need to know shit so long. I know. Come on. Pants labyrinth was great.

Yeah. It reminded me of like pants labyrinth. Okay. It has more of like a gothic fairy tale vibe. Oh, that's great. You mean a lot of cool people there? Yeah. It was like, there were some other people that flew out and I saw with my friend Katie

and then I saw with my friends Tom and this guy, Clayton, really nice guy. Nice. I love it. I remember when you were saying, think of London stories. Well, the funniest part about the whole thing was I made this plan like two months ahead to go see it. And then the day before I leave, somebody was like, Hey, do you want to see it in LA? There's an early press screening.

I was like, okay. You couldn't say no because that's like fancy. Yeah. Well, I was like, yes, it's important. Well, I was like, oh, I'm sorry, I have tickets to see it in London. I don't want to see it in like, never, never. Yeah. But I mean, I still had a great time.

I love like, I just drank a lot of beer, saw museums because also what if you're playing it crashed on the way to London and you never got to see Jurassic World. That's true. I didn't think about that. Never wait to see a wonderful film with dinosaurs. Let's ask them, welcome home. Yeah. Thank you.

Do you feel jet lag? Yeah. Even like all over the map, but it's fine. That's the best. Yeah. Yeah. Take an Adderall. Yeah.

Yeah. Take an Adderall and fight with people about T-Rexes. Well, we'll just take different drugs and see how like different experiments. Yeah. I think it's a great idea. All right. Well, welcome home, Steven. Hi.

It's a good idea to make your own fun like that and like if it's important to you, it's important. So you fucking fly wherever you want to go see a movie that you like. You saw Jurassic, right? Yeah. Never mind. Cut that out. Don't cut that out.

Wait. What is it? I don't get it. His podcast called See Jurassic, right? Right. So we went and saw Jurassic, right? Correctly. Oh, correctly.

Got it. It's a mountain goat song, by the way. Oh. It's a reference to, yeah. See America, right? See Jurassic, right? Yeah. Wow.

That's deep. I always, I was always like, I guess I don't care enough about Jurassic Park to understand what Steve, the title of Steven's podcast means. I never even thought twice about it because there's so many weird podcast names and it's just like, uh-huh. Sure. We'll find out later. Yeah.

All right. Let's, ladies and gentlemen, do you have anything else? Yes. Just this one. From our live show in Salt Lake City, when I talked about the Salt Lake City Library shooter and talked very thoroughly about the true crime show that I saw about the case and I talked very much about the reenactor, Michael B. Woods, who played the shooter and was great.

Yeah. Somebody sent us a message saying that Michael B. Woods won, just a couple nights ago, he won a Chicago theater award called the Jeff Award. Oh my God, Jeff for, which is the funniest name of all time. It's just like a picture of a guy or like a sculpture of a guy in Dockers. What thumbs up? Thumbs up. Like Jeff's super supportive of your acting.

The trophy's a beer coosie, the photo of Jeff on it. Yes. So it's a very prestigious theater award. Sure. I was like, fuck you girls. It's important. Yeah. Fuck my humongous.

Well, here's the thing though. The Chicago theater scene is humongous. It's like on par with New York, it's obviously trying to compete with that there's tons of great acting, obviously Steppenwolf, and there's so much good theater in Chicago that this is, it doesn't matter what the award is because the idea that he got picked as best principal performer is the... And a reenactment? Award.

No, he played fucking Serino. Holy shit. And that's what he won the award? DeBerge. DeBerge. Good for him. No, Serino Rosenfeld. It's this play about...

I love watching our little rising stars that we randomly pick out in the podcast. I know. We're picking, we are picking stars. We're hit makers. We're like, Michael B. Woods, we're seeing... What about Cameron from fucking Mindhunter, who's having a great year? He's blowing up. He's going to be in the next Jurassic Park movie.

That's a lie, Steven. Don't get excited. Well... Is this over? Is this podcast over? Oh, you know what we have to talk about? That we did that podcast, the movie podcast. Movie crash.

Buck, who you guys know from Stuff You Should Know, who's a fucking really awesome, nice dude. Yeah. He has a... Legendary podcast. Legendary podcast, the network, everything. He had us as guests on his movie podcast called Movie Crush. And the movie he picked for us to talk about was fucking Silence of the Lambs.

It's the best because it's basically this podcast is like they just, you take the one movie that the people love, whoever the guests are, and then you just like go over and over and over it. And we've done that for fucking hours. I had so many questions for you guys too because I thought you'd know. It went on. There were things that came out that we were like, oh wait, who was that? Not realizing that I kind of didn't know something or I'm like, oh.

Because that movie's so good because you pick up new things every time you watch it. I rewatched it when I got home that night. It's just incredible. It was so good. Only I'm really mad at myself because on the episode when we were talking about the autopsy scene and she talks about the nails, I said that Clary Starling says it looks like city to me. And the fucking line is it looks like town to me.

The word is town. It's such a better word. I was so mad I misquoted it. It sounded good. So I just like to, yeah. So go watch that. It's called Movie Crush. I mean, listen to it.

It's a podcast. Listen to it. Goodbye. It's a podcast and it's out tomorrow, right? Yeah. So Friday. Yeah. Yeah.

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And I'm Brooke. And we're the hosts of Wondery's podcast, Even the Rich, where we bring you absolutely true and absolutely shocking stories about the most famous families and biggest celebrities the world has ever seen. Our newest series is all about the incomparable diva, Whitney Houston. Whitney's voice defined a generation and even after her death, her talent remains unmatched, but her incredible success hit a deeply private pain. In our series, Whitney Houston, Destiny of a Diva, we'll tell you how she hid her true

self to make everyone around her happy and how the pressure to be all things to all people led her down a dark path. Follow Even the Rich wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen ad free on the Amazon Music or Wondery app. Can you hear the crow calling, tossed salad and scrambled eggs? Okay. So this is a really fun combo case where it started with a listener named Kate Butler who tweeted at us.

I wouldn't have said her last name except for it's in her Twitter handle. So she must not give a shit. And Kate wrote, hey, you guys should do the Appalachian Trail Killer. And then it rattled around in my head and I was like, something went dang, like that's a good one that I've definitely heard of before and read about. But then I was like, as the days progressed, I was like, I don't feel like doing any work because I have like real summertime fever right now or like that's what your sex horoscope said about you too.

It's actually, you actually have a VD. Yeah, exactly, see a doctor, your summertime fever is called gonorrhea. No, but I just don't can't sit like, you know, we've been, we've been sitting and writing and working on a bunch of shit for so consistently long, I can't sit in that chair anymore. So I was like, I love it. There's a work chair. That's all you do is there's a whole part of the table I avoid when I'm procrastinating, which is always.

But I remembered, so I was like, I'm doing it, I survived this week. And I was just trying to sit and think of like when I think of that title, which my favorite ones, which ones ding up in my head. And there's one that I've always loved. And you know, we always joke that on I survived, it's always two women who tell you the most harrowing like rape and attempted murder story that they survived. It's so incredible. And then there's a guy that's like, I tipped my snowmobile over and thought I was never

going to get back up and you're like, I'm going to fucking kill you. And then it dinged into my head. That is not always the case. And there is one episode that I've always loved. And the two guys that tell their survival story are straight out of fucking central casting because it takes place on the Appalachian in the Appalachian Mountains. And they're two guys from Virginia. And one of them is, so I'll say this, this is an episode of I Survived starring Sean

and Scott. Sean and Scott. Sean and Scott. And it's also, I got additional information from an article that was from the Washington Post written by a writer named Will Haygood. And the title of it is Lonely, Dark and Deep. And it was written on July 9th, 2008. It's a great, great article about this event.

So we'll just get into it. Let's do it. Tell me everything. Okay. It's May 6th, 2008. So 10 years ago, 10 years and a month ago, basically, a decade ago, also known as a decade ago. Do you know that 10 years is called a decade?

I didn't know that. No, no, no. I didn't know that. There are all kinds of word lessons that you can learn from me if you pay attention. Okay. So they, they're going on a fishing trip together to a place called Dismal Creek, Virginia. Perfect. Go there.

You should absolutely fucking go there. No. You know how we love I Survived, or I should say, the thing I love the most about I Survived is how beautifully it's like, they use B-roll, sometimes in true crime shows, as we all know, the B-roll and the voiceover can be the most salacious, disgusting thing of all time where they just keep cutting to like a half-naked woman screaming and it just goes on forever and you're like, what the fuck are you guys even doing with this? That's why I Survived is so good.

The B-roll they use is it'll be like July 6th, 2008. And then it's this gorgeous creek. It's just where they were. And they just keep showing you film of now here's their campfire. Here's the campfire blown out. Here's where they're camping. So this area is gorgeous. So it's almost like the screen saver.

Exactly. Like showing you a mountaineer thing, but meanwhile. And it makes it so much scarier because it's just putting you in that place, but it's not filling you in with a bunch of drama. It's not showing you blood dropping and all this bullshit. Exactly. Because that's how these horrible things happen is you're standing there looking at this beautiful lake like these guys did.

No, ominous music starts playing, and you're fucking, it's just not. And then of course, the thing that is my very favorite thing where at the end, as they tell some horrible turn of like, then I turned and looked down the hallway and there was a man standing there. When they cut to this, the next story, the transition sound is a man exhaling, but it's very subtle. But if you watch it, you'll see it goes, it's the creepiest noise. What have you heard?

Okay. It's so perfectly done. And down or lay, we're, we're, we're Debbie Downers, the mayor of this small city. It's Dismal Creek, Virginia. They've got these two guys, Scott Johnston, who I went to high school with a guy named Scott Johnston and Sean Farmer. And they have been going to this area since they were little boys and a lot of it sounds like from this, from the story I read and stuff that obviously it's the Appalachian

Mountains and it's this amazing wilderness and people go there all the time. And obviously the Appalachian Trail starts a little bit north of where this area is and goes, I didn't know it goes all the way up to Maine. It's like basically West Virginia. I'm just pointing to the ceiling. I don't know anything. Did you know that Maine is in the ceiling? I love it there.

Okay. So these two guys, they're like, we're going to go fishing at Dismal Creek this weekend. Scott gets there first and he goes and fishes by himself. And Sean's going to show up in the afternoon apparently. I'm filling this in a little bit. I like to think that Sean had an office job, he could not get away. Boss was a dick. Right.

Whereas Scott might be a woodworker and he makes shit on his own. He's like, I can go up to Dismal Creek any fucking time I want. So he's there fishing, trout fishing in the morning and catches a bunch of fish. He's driving back to the campsite and he sees this old guy come up an embankment from the creek or river. Like climb up to the street road. Yes. And he's really gaunt and he's kind of scary looking, but he's got like a new camouflage

hunting jacket on. So he doesn't look like, as Scott says in I Survived, he's like, it doesn't look like a bum. But he looks gaunt and like he hasn't eaten in a while and like he's been out in the woods for a while. And he has a dog with him that's so starving it's stomach is bloated. So he stops the truck and he's about to say, like, hey, what's going on? Are you okay?

Whatever. And the guy comes over and immediately he just starts talking about, I've been trying to fish all morning. There's no fish in that creek. And so Scott said opens his, I pictured it as a wicker basket. I don't know what it actually was. He's fucking yogi bear. You know, like one of those fishing baskets you wear in your hip.

He opens up his wicker, beautiful wicker basket with his initials engraved into the top. He fucking sewed himself. Yes. He made himself. He's a woodworker. He's a woodworker that also likes to work in reeds. He'll try out a reed and make a basket.

Absolutely. He's a man of the earth. Yeah. Okay. So he opens the basket, shows him, he's like, look at all his trout eye caught. And then he gives the guy a couple cause he feels bad for him. And the guy says, thank you and these seems happy. And then he, the guy asks, are you guys staying nearby here?

And Scott's like, oh yeah, we're, we're staying at that campsite right over there. No. Uh-huh. And the old man's like, oh, oh, I'm staying at the one that's just kind of right past it. Maybe I'll swing by and, and like visit you guys later. And so Scott's like, sure, come by real polite. These are like beautiful Southern boys that are real polite.

And so he, and then, so Scott goes, um, he stops to collect firewood. So in the meantime, uh, Sean, his friend, who's an office worker, look, he loves his job. It means a lot to him to be able to work for the government. Yeah. I don't know what he does. Um, he actually, I would say this, uh, Scott looks like he could be played by Tim Blake Nelson.

Is that that actor that was in, uh, Oh, Brother, We're Art, though, the, that guy is exactly it's that guy. Oh, I love him. And then the Sean character, I think should be played by our comedian friend, John Gemberling. That's exactly what he looks like. He's got like a beard and a round face and real, real low key. Okay. So Sean rolls up to the campsite and he sees there's this old gaunt guy there and he's

a little bit weirded out. He gets out of the truck and the gaunt guy is like, Oh, I met Scott earlier and he invited me to come by. Immediately Sean's comfortable because he's like, Oh, you know, Scott, they already hung out. Everything's fine. So when Scott comes back from collecting firewood, he sees that his friend Sean has showed up and the gaunt man's there.

They're talking, they built a fire, chilled out. Everything's cool. As they all talk, then Scott's like, well, we're about to bar, you know, we're about to throw some hamburgers on the grill and cook up these trout. Do you want to stay and eat dinner with us? And the old guy's like, sure, it sounds good. And he said, they wouldn't thought nothing of it, totally normal older man, but he said he also said he looked a little bit like he, he looked frail, like he might be an alcoholic

or like a little sick somehow. But other than that, he, he commented on just how new the clothes looked like that his hunting boots were expensive. So he didn't, you know, he didn't think like this was just some stranger straggler. So they eat dinner, everything's normal. And right as it starts to get dark, it's like the sun has gone down and it's getting dark. Because he, the guy wasn't leaving and they kept thinking, well, you're kind of an older guy and you have to get to your campsite.

You'd think you would leave when the sun was still up, but he doesn't. Finally, the guy stands up and he's like, all right, then, come on, here we go to the dog. And as he does that, he walks behind both Scott and Sean. And in, in, I survived Sean's the one that says it and he's like, then all of a sudden my head was ringing. Uh huh. He hears a big boom and his, his left ear is ringing like crazy.

And what's happened is, and from Scott's perspective, um, the old straggler that they just gave a shit ton of trout and hamburgers to just turned and walked over, pulls out a 22, a tiny gun. He said he didn't even, he couldn't see the gun. He just saw the man extend his arm and shoot Sean in the face. What the fuck? Right, right here on the left side of his face. Like cheekbone.

So, yes. So, so you, you watch somebody shoot your friend in the head, you think that person is dead. Yeah. So Scott jumps up and fucking runs. He immediately in his mind said, he said that he immediately thought there's, when he set up the tent, he remembered there being like this, this, um, little in bank band area behind it with a cedar, group of cedar trees or whatever.

He was like, Oh, there's a place I can take shelter. So he just takes off in the dark into the woods and he doesn't know if the guy's chasing him, he doesn't know what's happening, but, and he doesn't know that the guy then shoots him in the back. He doesn't feel it and he doesn't realize it. He, the guy shot him actually in the nape of the neck. Oh my God. So what happens is when Scott finally stops running and he's standing there trying to

figure out what happened and what if, if Sean's still alive or whatever, he, as his heart beats, the bullet wound is spurting six inches of blood as with every heartbeat behind him. Well, like I think he was making it seem like it was a little bit on the side, but basically like the bullet came through this way. So what, you know, from what I put together, so because he basically took his finger and stuck it in the bullet hole to stop the blood flow. Oh my God. So he's just holding his, his right index finger in his own neck to keep the blood from coming

out. Now meanwhile, strangely and miraculously, Sean gets shot in the head and isn't dead. He stands up and Sean also is six foot four, three hundred and twenty five pounds. So he's not, I mean, a man is holding a gun on him and stuff, but he does turn face the guy, what the fuck's going on. And they're about 10 feet away at this point. The man shoots him again in the chest. He still doesn't go down.

Oh my God. I'm fucking terrifying. So when the man, so after he got shot in the chest, that's when he, the man turned away from him, got distracted, shot Scott in the neck. So that's when Sean runs over to his Jeep and jumps inside and his, of course, his driver's side windows down. No, roll up your windows, everyone. The, like in movies, well, especially when modern cars where you have to have the key

in to roll the window up or whatever, but like member old movies where you're trying to roll the crank really fast while like a bad person's coming, their arm is coming through the window. Yeah. That whole like window car scenario, getting in the car when you're being chased. That whole scenario drives me crazy. It's crazy making. And it's that thing where sometimes I try to practice it.

Like if I'm just letting myself into my front door, I'll be like, right now you have to do this in three seconds. Someone's walking up and I can never fucking do it. I do that too. Because my new car, like if you have the key on you and you walk to your car, it unlocks all the doors. So I'll see how quickly I can lock while I have to know by my brain where the locking mechanism is.

So before I'm sitting down, the doors are all locked in case someone's trying to get in on the other side or following me. It's like not a very safe feature, Toyota. Toyota, can we talk this through because I feel like you need to think about garage, underground garages. And the paranoid women, paranoid women, and I don't know, just, it would just be great to talk to you. Safety.

Okay. So. Let's get this into the driver's seat, fucking scrambling, right? Scrambling for his keys or whatever. The fucking gaunt man comes up over. His hand goes into the driver's window. Sean literally like blocks it with his hand and he hears the trigger pull and no shot. The guys run out of ammunition.

He's already shot six times or however, I shouldn't say that, however many's in a 22, which I certainly don't know. Probably. Oh yeah. 22 tiny bullets. Okay. So miraculously doesn't go off. So then he's like, he fucking takes off.

He in the car. Yes. He guns it and does the thing where he leans down below the windshield and fucking drives away so the guy can't shoot him again. Like he's not up. Yeah. Which I fucking love. That's like straight out of a movie.

Yeah. Now over in the, in the hauler where he took cover, Scott is like, watches his friend peel away and he immediately goes, I'm, I have like a pretty critical wound here. I have to get help. And if I don't run to the road to meet him to like basically cut off my friends, I'm going to get stuck up on this mountain. So he just starts fucking taking off through the woods, which is incredibly dense under brush and all that shit.

And it's dark. So he has to like beat his way with his finger in his neck. Every time when his heart rate goes higher, the fucking blood is gushing more. Well, no, it's not gushing with the finger in there. So he's like, that's a temporary solution. Oh my God. So he, and he fucking makes it. He makes it to the cutoff.

So when it's the crazy, and it's also these two guys tell it, you know, that thing we're like, and I won't say it's a say, not necessarily Southern thing, but like, I know a couple of people who are from West Virginia, and it's kind of that thing where it's like everything's real low key. Just the facts. They're not like, it's not like Brooklyn where you're like, Hey, this guy came over here and gestures and shit. It's all like real sedate.

You can see these guys telling the story over beers at a bar, but they don't want to like over dramatize it and make themselves seem like show offs. Yeah, exactly. They're the exact opposite of that where they're just like, yeah, it was crazy. Yeah. It's the best. And yeah, they're now in a Mel Gibson movie level insane situation. So drives away without looking gets down and the road to, so you have to think about the

Appalachian Mountains, they're at a campsite. So they're not even near a road. Right now they have to get on a dirt road to drive down a couple of miles to the main road that's actually paved. So, so Sean comes around the corner in the Jeep, Scott's standing there covered in blood and standing there. He's like skids up, Scott jumps in and they gun it. And this part of I survived, Scott goes, and I mean, you know, I was just really worried

because like, I couldn't even believe he's driving because he was shot in the head. And it's like, yeah, yeah, he probably shouldn't have been the driver. And the weird thing is then, so they're going 40 miles an hour down a road. They said that they would normally drive 20 miles an hour down because not only is it dirt and really narrow, it's a mountain road where every turn has a drop off on the side like a 30 foot drop off. So they're gunning it down this mountain. And at one point they, he, Scott has to tell Sean to break because they're going so fast

on this turn because Scott can't actually really see that well. He's losing his vision in his right eye. And they, they come around, he's like, break, break, break, and they skid out and they go up and they said they're, the tire went six inch, they were six inches away from the edge of the embankment. But then they're like, but you got to go like straighten it out. And so they did that the second time it happened, this basically the same thing where they took a turn way too fast, because they think, because Scott's truck with the keys in it are back

at the campsite. So they're like the guy, a hundred percent got into that truck and is chasing us. There's no way he's going to let us get away. So they're like, we have to go top speed also. We have to go top speed because all of the blood is leaving both of our bodies at one time into this Jeep. So the second time they do that, they go up onto an embankment, they turn too fast, go up onto this embankment, almost roll the Jeep, like just barely don't roll the Jeep and they

kick up a bunch of rocks and break the windshield. And so that's when Scott goes, okay, you work the gas and the break and I'm going to steer because you can't fucking see. And you like, I'll tell you when to gas and break so we can get down this road. Oh, because on that second spin out, it was because Sean had blacked out because he had a bullet in his fucking head. Oh my God. Okay.

So they're like, we have to get down this mountain road. So he finally gets to the main road. So it was like a mile or two on the dirt road, then they get to the main road. The main road, it's five miles. And once they get down the mountain on the main road, it's 40 miles to a hospital. Oh, that's too far. It's so far. You guys don't go that far away from hospitals, please.

I mean, that's the thing about camping. There was no cell service up there at all. You can't use your phone on that mountain. So it was, of course, like the worst thing that could happen when you're that far away. So they know they're on like a clock where they're already in the red zone. So they race down, they finally get to the main road and they race down and when they get to the bottom, like, you know, to where there's actually houses, the first house they see, the lights are on.

And so Scott yells, stop the car. They're going to help us. And Sean, like almost blind, just stops the car in the middle of the road and puts it in park and Scott jumps out and runs to the, he has lost all the blood. He jumps out, runs, bangs on the door. All right. Let me catch up to myself here. So I just want everyone listening to know that Karen is just telling the story.

She's not reading anything. And it's like really fun to watch. Well, because I've seen this one. The other stories in this episode of I Survived, it's season three, episode seven. And the other stories are a really terrible, but it's another one of those women that tells her rape survival story with this amazing look on her face and these bright eyes. And it was a thing where she was in her twenties, they moved into an apartment and her father's like, I don't like that there's no bars on the window because you're on the first floor.

I'm coming over to Marta, put them in and that night, yeah. And then this other story is this guy who got attacked by a bear and his dog Ladybug helped save him. It's good girl. Season three, episode seven is like peak I survived. It's incredible. Everybody survives. Okay.

Wait, what? Spoiler alert. Spoiler alert. Karen, what the? Get that out, Stephen. Every single fucking person, I don't think Ladybug survived though. Stop. I shouldn't just drop that out there because I'm not positive.

Okay. But I think it was. Well, now they have to watch. Yeah, exactly. You tell us a fucking Ladybug survived. I don't think she does. Ladybug. So the house that they stop in front of, this is my favorite, is a woman named Melissa Miller

and her 20 year old son, Randy, our home, thank fucking God. And of course, she here sees someone banging on the door, hears someone banging on the door as opposed to seeing it, then goes to the front door and looks out, it's two dudes covered in blood and a car covered in blood. So she's like, I don't want to get involved in this. They got clearly got into a fight and blah, blah, blah. Then she looks out and recognizes Sean. No.

Because her friend dated him a couple of years ago. No. Yes. So she's like, wait, what is this? And then Scott's like, this guy just attacked us, you have to call 911, we need medical help immediately. So Melissa Miller calls 911 and they have to wait 20 minutes. No, don't wait that long.

Because they're so fucking far out of the middle of nowhere. At one point they were waiting so long, so they got Sean out of the Jeep. She sat Scott down on the porch, sits Sean down on the porch, they start to get towels. They're holding pressure on all the wounds and just and giving them water and helping them, talking to them. At one point Scott has Melissa call his mom because he's afraid it's the last time he has a chance to talk to her and he tells his mommy's fine and don't worry. And then, so finally the cops come.

At one point Melissa Miller calls 911 back and goes, where y'all at? Where y'all at? Because we can't wait very much longer. When the cops show up, the cops get there before the ambulance and the cops ask Scott for a description. And as Scott is describing the gaunt man that attacked them, Melissa Miller's father and Randy's grandfather lives in the house. He hears the description and he says to Randy, he knows all about who this person is because

there was a man named Randall Lee Smith who lived in the nearby town of Parisburg. But it's like the fruit pear, not Paris, Paris, France, but Parisburg. And I'm probably pronouncing it wrong. He tells his grandson to run down to Trent's grocery store and go grab that picture of Randall Lee Smith that had been up because Randall Lee Smith had disappeared from Parisburg six weeks prior. So there's a picture up of like, have you seen this man? So he's like, go get that picture.

So Randy has to run down, the store is closed, but luckily it's some tiny town where there, he goes to the owner's house and is like, we got an emergency, open the store, grabs the picture, runs back to the house. And as Scott is being loaded into the ambulance that's finally there, he holds up the picture and Scott goes, I am 100% sure that is the man that shot us. Oh my God. And it's this man, Randall Lee Smith. And so they put out an APB for Randall Lee Smith.

When then two Medevac helicopters land and they put, Scott thinks that because obviously Sean's been shot in the head, he's way worse off than him. So he's so worried about him. But they get put in two separate helicopters and when Scott is in a helicopter, he overhears the EMT or whoever, the person working there, like, I don't think he's going to make it to the hospital. And then he hears her say, yeah, he's, he's lost too much blood and I no longer have a pulse and he realizes she's talking about him and he realizes he can't feel his body.

So he's like, oh, I just, I thought I was dead in the helicopter, like I thought I was already dead. Oh my God. Okay. So meanwhile, police, oh, by the way, we might as well just skip to this part. Well, no, we'll say this part. So the police know about Randall Lee Smith because in 1981, he had befriended two hitchhikers on at the Wapiti shelter, which was on in the exact same area, it was one mile away from

the campsite where Sean and Scott were. And he befriended them. They hung out exactly the same way where they had like shared shared a meal or whatever. And then it wasn't clear if he like slept in their campsite or if he said goodbye. But he in the middle of the night, there were two 27 year old social workers and his name was Robert Mountford Jr. and her name was Susan Ramsey. And he shot Robert Mountford in the head. And then he and Susan Ramsey got into this fight where she fought him off and he ends

up stabbing her 12 over 12 times with a long nail. Oh my God. It was just hideous and horrible. Their bodies don't get found for weeks. So they it took them a while to find him. But he ends up getting arrested for these murders. He is convicted of second degree murder because they plea bargain. No.

He ends up serving 15 years in jail for two innocent people's murder. Yeah. 15 fucking years. 15 years in jail. And then he gets paroled and he goes he moves to Parisburg. He works odd jobs for about a decade kind of kicks around. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm still stuck on this.

No, I know. And he then starts to run out of money and he just collects up his shit and goes up into the mountains. And so that was six weeks before Scott ran into him on that trail is when he disappeared from Parisburg. And when those pictures went up of him of have you seen this man? We don't know where he is. Which also means that for six weeks he was fucking around in those mountains and no one

knows what he was doing or who he was doing it where to get those clothes from clearly he stole them. That's right. Oh. So. Okay. So when they finally did find him an arrest him, which was almost immediate because he was driving Scott's truck and they the truck passes trying to zoom down that road when

the cops are going up. He sees the cops and almost immediately drives up under embankment and flips the truck over and the police officer that went up to check him. He was inside the upside down truck and he said they're the coldest eyes I've ever seen. And so they get him out. They arrest him. Randall Lee Smith tells the police that he had to shoot Scott and Sean in self-defense that that's why that happened.

Right. Four days after he's arrested, he dies of natural causes in jail. What? Yeah. What natural causes? Being an old murderer, having a terrible life and rotting from the inside spiritually. Oh my God. These are not confirmed.

This is not the coroner's report. Please remember. But okay. So here's the part that's mind blowing to me. So Sean, who has been shot in the head and the fucking chest, the bullet that went into his chest, he says there was so much muscle mass on his chest, it just pushed the bullet over so it didn't puncture anything critical. That's the sexiest thing I've ever heard in my life.

It's pretty awesome. This guy has that cut. He does have this like, I want to hear him tell 20 more stories. He has that like real, like good, the good, good old boy feel to him. But you know, the bullet that went into his head that was shot so close that he had gunpowder burns on his cheek, it just went in and went into his nasal passages and kind of ricocheted around a little bit. It just clonked around and just clonked around and didn't come back out or I mean, I don't

know. I guess they went in and took it out, but like, it didn't give him any brain damage or any. It just fucked up that one side of his face. Now I'm just picturing him using a netty pot and a fucking bullet coming out of his nostril. He just, he can't get it out of there. He keeps rinsing his nose and like, but I mean, that is, he was basically in like recovery in the recovery room at 4am that morning for being shot in the head and chest.

That's why also why I love I survived because you, these people are like, so then I got shot in the head and you're like, you, the person talking, I love this. Okay, I like that. It's very like, it's very X men, like how did you do this? Are you special? Yeah. Are you different from us? Okay, so then the next morning Scott's out of surgery, so he can take his finger out

of his neck. They sew that whole up. He actually has scars. So it looked like there was entrance, like his, his neck was pretty, pretty ripped up. You know, they're shot fucking multiple times close range. It's so crazy. And one of his family members shows up at the hospital and holds up a newspaper that says the AT killer strikes again.

So immediately they, they know that Randall Lee, Randall Lee Smith, who is the man that killed these two people in 1981. It's the fucking same guy with the same kind of gun or the same gun in the one mile away from where he did it. He did it again. Jesus. Yeah, one would have thought maybe one would have thought he would have been fine after 15 years of prison and he, they could have just let him go and he'd never do it again.

Right. But no, tricked everyone. And it turns out that this is one of those times where that, that isn't what happened. Yeah. Basically. So did he kill anyone else? We know like, well, there's only, they said, I read a thing that said there's only eight reported murders, like known murders on the Appalachian Trail.

So that's six additional ones that I'm not sure what they're referencing, but there's all kinds of missing people that went, they went for a walk up in these mountains or whatever that they, they are not accounted for. So it's so creepy when Randall Lee, this is kind of the creepy reveal in his possession when he was arrested, the police found six pairs of eyeglasses, bloody clothes, women's underwear, 20 knives, a hatchet, satanic and Wiccan literature, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. Yeah.

Well, with the rest of the stuff and the fact that he's a murderer, it doesn't bode well. It doesn't bode well. It does not bode. So anyway, that the idea that in just six weeks, these are the, this is the amount of like trophy style stuff that he has in his possession is horrifying, which means there's probably a bunch of cold cases or, or missing people that might be able to get matched with that. I wonder whose dog it was because maybe he stole the dog too.

Oh. Who, who, the dog? I mean, what happened to the dog? The dog? What if the Scott and Sean brought the dog home and kept him? You, I'm telling you, if you're an eye survive producer and you didn't fold that shit right in, then it didn't happen. Those people know what they're doing.

I know. Um, but here, let's, let's just say this, the dog ran off in fear, but then just ate trout for the rest of his life. His coat got real shiny. Did he become friends with a bear? And a raccoon. He fell in with a group of raccoons and bears, raccoons, raccoons and bears. How about our prescient visionary, um, abilities where, where yesterday, that big drama that

was happening was, did you see the baby raccoon that scaled the 23 story building? I did, but I couldn't look at it till the end. He made it. I saw that he made it, but I tweeted something like, well, I'm just can't read this because I'm so scared for him. I missed the entire thing. Oh, good. I wasn't, I was busy or whatever.

He climbed it. He made it. And there was a pose of him on the fucking belt on the side when he was all stretching out. Yeah. Because he was scared. He's scared. I would, I mean, I would hate to climb a 23 story building like a raccoon.

That's what you have to. No. I love it also that they, to lure him to the roof, they put cat food up there. Yeah. Everybody wants some cat food. Scott and Sean say they still go fishing at Dismal Creek. They've done it all their lives. It's the safest fucking place for them now.

Exactly. And probably they probably, I would, if I was either of them, be like, yeah, I'm kind of invincible. I've been shot in the motherfucking head. Shoot me. I dare you. And handled it. Yeah.

And this is Sean at the very end in that good old boy way goes, other than a few scars, we're fine. Jesus. Everyone else at the end of I survived is like, I survived because my family and God was watching me personally. And he's just like, yeah, we're fine. It's almost like we don't want to talk about it. It's like, it's too late, you're on a TV show.

You have to talk about it. Wow. And that is that triple crossover. Isn't that amazing that it's like the I survived I wanted to do Kate's suggestion, all wrapped up in this beautiful. Yes. Storytelling bow. Now you go.

It was Italian kiss. Was it Italian kiss level? It was. It was this beautiful Italian kiss. I love it. I love it. Okay. All right, Karen, this is, this is the glamour girl Slayer.

And this is the story of, you know, when you see like those lists that are like five photos of murder victims, right? The like the last photos ever taken of murder victims. I hate those. And it's the, it's the like black and white older photo of a woman, a beautiful woman tied up and she's like posing, you know, scared and tied up. You've seen that. Is she posing or is it real?

Well, that's the thing is you can't tell. Okay. But you know, it's like. So it's from the 50s, 60s. Yeah. 50s. You've seen the photo. It's like, this is, this is the story of that.

Okay. Awesome. It's, there's a lot of those. I've seen that photo a lot. And so I'm finally doing the story. Here we go. Okay. And 1956, a beautiful 19 year old blonde woman named Judy Ann Dahl was going through this

crazy hardcore custody battle in 1958, which has got to suck even more. Did women have rights then? I don't know. She's going through. Do we have them now? Do men have rights over their kids? Like that's even, you know, like. Yeah.

Did they even want them? Right. So she's going through a battle. Her ex-husband over their 14 month old daughter, she needs to make money to hire this lawyer to fight the battle and so she would take modeling jobs a lot. So a man named Johnny Glenn called and he offered her $50, which is a lot then to pose for the cover of a pulp novel. And she was like, fuck yeah, I need this money.

Totally. So back then though, modeling and modeling agencies weren't, it wasn't what it is today. All over downtown LA, these little businesses were cropping up and they were small, small modeling studios that they had their own female models inside and they would pose for a price and they would do it either clothed or nude. So these dudes who would claim to be modeling photographers could come in, pay $20, do a photo session with a naked model and leave with nudes, you know, nude photos. But for more money, they would be given a girl's, a model's phone number and he would

call, they would make arrangements to meet either at his studio, which is like if he had one, or at her house a lot of the time. So essentially this is a little bit of, there's a bit of sex work maybe that could be involved. It doesn't sound like it. From what I can tell that wasn't, that wasn't what was going on. Just pervs. Yeah. Just pervs wanting naked photos of women and they couldn't get it in other places, you

know what I mean? True. It's like hard to get something like that. You go out to the forest and find an old mag that someone threw. Right. Well, I think also like there were legit ones who, if you, there were a lot of pinup magazine stuff and like there were true crime magazines that would have these photos. So you could take them and send them in and maybe you'd make some money with the photos.

So maybe some of them were trying to be legit. In this story, there's no nefarious, like there's no sex work going on or anything like that. It's all just purely modeling. Okay. I feel like maybe that, like a lady in her brown panties went way further back then. Absolutely. Than these days where it's like, oh yeah, that's what's on every street corner.

Well, think of Betty Page, like she's the one who got famous from it and she, you know, took her clothes off and did these cheesecake photos tied up. So I think this was just on a smaller scale. And hers was like, it looked like it was her idea. Yeah. That was the kind of big revolution about Betty Page. Yeah. Betty Page was having a great fucking time and it wasn't like, someone made me do this.

Yeah. Yeah. So the woman got paid the photos and the photographers got their dirty photos. So that's, and everyone is happy. Right. So that's how Hollywood was built. When the photographer that had called Judy came to pick her up, he met Judy's roommate, Betty.

And Betty thought it was strange that he said he wanted to pick up, to pick her up, to pick up Judy and take her to do some, sorry, he was going to do pinup pics, but then he told her to get a street outfit, like a normal clothes. So Betty thought that was weird. But he, but this guy offered her his phone number of his, his portrait studio. So she was like, okay, this is fine. Yeah. So Judy left with her, with him.

Wow. Yeah. So Betty starts to worry when Judy didn't come home from the photo session when she said she would, so she calls the phone number that this guy, Johnny had left with her. But the number isn't for a photo studio. It's for a machine shop and no one there had heard of a guy named Johnny Glenn. So Betty calls the cops and APB is put out for Johnny. And Betty describes him as a small, bespectacled man.

And the search for her goes on. What they couldn't know yet was that Judy had already become the first victim of Harvey Murray Glatman, AKA the glamour girl slayer. I know that name. Okay. Yes. You've seen photos of him. He looks like a hipster, like a, like a Brooklyn hipster trying to look like a Brooklyn hipster,

like squirrely big ears stick out the side of his head. You know, hipsters have big ears. He's just like gross. I think there was an episode of a crime to remember about this. Oh, I bet. Cause I just got a really specific picture of Harvey Glatman in my head where I'm like, that's an actor. Yeah.

Okay. Harvey Murray Glatman was born on December 10th, 1927 in the Bronx and he was raised in Denver, Colorado. Those are two different very different locales. It must have been a real adjustment. Absolutely. Growing up in the thirties and forties, Harvey's parents began to notice that their kid had antisocial behaviors and sadomasochistic sexual tendencies from an early age.

That's gotta be fun. Yeah. One time his parents found him. Okay. So, picture, you have a four year old kid and you walk in on him and he has a string tied around his penis and the loose end of the string is shot in a drawer and he's leaning backwards so that the string pulls his penis taut and your kid's four and you just walked in on him doing that.

And you're like, who taught you this? Yeah. Harvey, what are you doing? Harvey, honey. Harvey, honey. What the fuck? Do you want some tang? Jesus Christ.

It's insanely disturbing. Slightly less disturbing was when I was like five and my dad walked into mine and my sister's room and I was playing, our great aunts had given us a stack of 45s that we used to listen to all the time. It was this weird music from the sixties and seventies. And I was standing in the room lip syncing to the Peggy Lee song, Is That All There Is? Have you heard that fucking song? The creepiest song in the world.

The creepiest song in the world and I'm a five-year-old saying they're going, Is That All There Is? Is that all there is to a fire? Is that all there is? I would be like, let's burn the house down. Seriously, I would run screaming. Yeah. Okay, so when he's 12.

No brag, no brag by the way. I knew the words to that song when I was five. You're a hipster from Brooklyn. My ears are sticking all the way out right now. So when he's 12 years old, grows up from four years old, his parents noticed that he had a red swollen neck and they're like, what'd you do? And he's like, well, I was in the bathtub. I placed a rope around my neck and I ran it through the tub drain and then I pulled it

tight against his neck, against his neck, achieving some kind of sexual pleasure from this act, he said later. Oh, that he's doing the choke yourself out? Yeah. Wow. At age 12. So you put yourself in the addicts until you're achieved orgasm. Hang in self where?

In the attic. In the attic. In the attic? And you know, I don't know which one it is now. It's C. It's attic. Did I say addict? You did.

Fuck. I love it. It's the weirdest. I don't know how that happened. It's amazing. I don't. Yeah. This is like the, this podcast the past two years is the most I've ever said that word.

I've said it maybe twice in my life before this. So why? Like I didn't have one. I'm from Irvine, we don't have those. This is right. They don't exist. Oh, California. How do we pronounce basement?

We don't have those either. This podcast is all about like, I've never known what an abject failure I am about facts. I thought I was pretty together and it simply isn't true and it just gets proven week after week. Facts and opinions and just attitudes. Attitude about life. Anyways, let's talk about murder. Let's talk about a 12 year old child hanging himself in the attic for sexual gratification.

Yes. His mom is like, we're going to the doctor, takes him to a physician and the doctor was like, of course, he'll grow out of it, which is probably true in a lot of cases, right? Like the kids grow out of it or they don't, or they find, you know, they do it and they don't murder people. I just feel like the difference is he was like hanging himself. Yeah. I think if somebody was masturbating a ton, they'd just be like, look, it's just, you

know, a phase or whatever. The hanging part is what you're bothered by. It's pretty intense. Nowadays, that would be problematic. Yeah. And back of days as well. Back of days. Harvey would later say that quote, I guess I was just kind of fascinated by rope.

So it was the rope. I loved hemp. In school, Harvey did well academically, but was painfully shy when other kids, especially girls, which is like, who's not, and he was taunted with the nicknames weasel and chipmunk due to his looks. You can imagine what he looked like as I just made fun of him earlier. He committed his first sex offenses while he was a teenager and he would, when he would break into women's apartments, tied them up and sexually assault them as a teenager.

He would also force his victims to pose for photographs so he could keep them as mementos. And the look of this kid is so, it doesn't make sense with what his offenses are because even as a high school student, he must have been even skinnier. He's this scrawny little nerd. I know that like, so you wouldn't have expected this. Right exactly. Based on just the way he looked. The strength, the bravery.

Right. The kind of boldness. Yeah. But I was also thinking of like, what, can you cast him like, who, because you know who I'm thinking of and I can't remember his last name. I've got Jay that's in like, this is the end and what's his fucking name? Jay Berischal. Thank you.

Wow. You know who that guy is? No. He's very lanky and he's like long and skinny. Student, can you show her a picture of him because I couldn't have Harvey Glatman because I couldn't, I couldn't cast him. Let's get him cast. So I need you to cast him please.

Let's cast Glat. Let's cast Glat. Oh, that's him. Oh, wow. Okay. Well, this is. So what does he look like? We're in a Buscemi area.

Oh, absolutely, Buscemi. But then also this picture, this is, I'm going to, he looks a little bit like Andrew Garfield's like, maybe less attractive older brother in this picture I'm looking at right now. The guy that played like Spider-Man and he was in that army movie about how he wouldn't shoot anybody and he still went to World War II, which is kind of amazing and a true story. He also looks like Fisher Stevens, which if you're from the 80s like me, he was a big thing. He was, uh, I think he was married to Michelle Pfeiffer, he's a character actor.

I think the Steve Buscemi type is a young Steve Buscemi because he was only 30 when those pictures were taken. So. And he also looks a little bit like the actor, oh, what the fuck is his last name? Go to Instagram. Instagram is my favorite murder. We're going to put up 15 actors and then we'll all vote on who is the most. I was, I also want to get Scoot McNary into this because he's on Halt and Catch Fire.

Okay. He's in some cool independent movies. He's a really good actor and no bragging, I'm sorry, I'm super delaying this. But uh, me and Bridger went to dinner the other night and it was a little bit crowded around the host to stand when we walked in and we didn't have a reservation. So I immediately got tense and then I looked over and the guy that was waiting for the hostess to seat him was staring at her so intently. I thought he was like being mean to her.

So then I started staring at him really intently and then he turned and looked at me and it was Scoot McNary and then I was just staring weirdly at Scoot McNary and then he smiled at me and then I was like, what are you doing? Move your eyes away from his face and I couldn't because he's really good looking. Okay. Thank you. No, thank you for letting me. Wait, where'd you go to dinner?

Adderall town. Did you have an Adderall over medium for dinner? A couple of coffee. Okay. Anyway. I'm no stranger. I'm like, can I stop you for the 90th time and tell you something that in no way will help your story?

I don't care. Okay. That's what this podcast was going to be called originally. Listen. Look and listen. In school, he did well. I already told you that. And he would take photos of them.

When Harvey was 18 and still in high school, he was arrested after he tied up one of his classmates at gunpoint and sexually assaulted her. So instead of graduating high school, he went to fucking jail in Denver, but he continued to rob and sexually assault women for years, often being arrested and serving short stints in prison. Of course, he was seen as an impulsive offender fueled by lust and a rage for the women he assaulted. Uh, while he was on bail awaiting trial, he kidnapped and molested another woman before

releasing her. And that got him eight months in prison kind of a, please sit down and think about this for a little while. Yeah. Let's give you three squares. You'll fill out a little bit so you're straight and you can work out so you're stronger next time you go out. You can get some bad ideas from the people around you and then get out there, buddy.

After Harvey decided to, he, after that, he is like, fuck this shit, I'm going to New York. He goes with his mom to New York in 1946. Seltzland women, Seltzland women grows bolder. It's one of those obvious escalation stories and more violent in New York. He's eventually arrested for a series of muggings and sentenced to from five to 10 years in sing-sing. Whoa.

I know. Prison psychiatrist diagnosed him as a psychopath. Yeah. But he was a model prisoner. And so in 1956, they're like, get out of here, you nut. You psychopath. Get out. Get out of here.

In 1957, he moved to Los Angeles. He, you know what? That's what all the psychopaths do. Yeah. We're all here. We've got so many of us. It's fun. He gets a job as a television repair man to support himself.

Positive. You're going to say like a television producer. Yeah. That's right on the money. You know, he's our agent. You work with him? And, okay, but he also starts back up his fucking love of photography and he starts trolling modeling agencies posing as a professional photographer.

This has, this is like Alcala, Ronnie Alcala before Ronnie Alcala wasn't Ronnie Alcala. Yeah. That's right. And he's not. Ronnie Alcala, like when you see that clip of him on the dating game, it's so disturbing because he looks like, he looks like the creepiest troll of all the seventies. Yeah. But he did have kind of fine features or like patrician, kind of manly features.

One would say like, he's not a bad looking person. Yeah. And he has, you can tell he probably had like a swirly kind of a game going. Yeah. But remember, the chick met him backstage and she was like, I'm not going out with him. Because she thought of psycho. Oh, that's right. So clearly he couldn't fucking do it.

Yeah. Because comparatively, at least he would have like the first five minutes of the game going, whereas Glatman, no, you're not, you're looking at that and you're like, what's this teenager doing? Yeah. Right. Yeah. The day, so we go back now to his first murder victim, Julie, Judy and Dahl.

The day he picks her up, he had obtained her number through a modeling agency, of course, and he brings her back to his apartment, which he says is his photo studio and they're going to do a pinup shoot. And he ties her up and gag, gags her, which she goes along with because he says that's part of it. So he has that fucking ploy. And then so there's some photos of her, I've always looked at those photos and I do the thing where I look deep in the person's eye to be like, did you know anything?

You know, I tried to study it. Yeah. And then the first photos that she's like that tied up fully clothed in her like, you know, normal clothing. And it doesn't look like she realizes, I don't think anything had happened yet that he had attacked her, but then after taking those photos, he holds her at gunpoint and then he repeatedly rapes her and takes photos of her and makes her pose the whole time. And this was the first time.

So it's said that this is the first time his assault had escalated to rape. And I read in a couple of places that that's where he lost virginity, but only in a couple places. So I don't know if that's true. Okay. But could you know that unless he said it? He blabbed later. Oh, okay.

So it's possible he said that. Whoa, that's weird. Isn't that weird? Of all that sexual stuff going on since he was four years old, and this is when he loses his virginity. Yeah. That's intense. And then what kind of hatred must he have if he like has to think, so he's a fucking

horrible person. It's not good. There's photos of her, Judy, during the whole ordeal both before and after she comes to the realization that he's this monster. After the rape and assault, Harvey drives Judy out to a secluded location in the Mojave desert, which is outside of Los Angeles. Not good. Where he strangles her to death with a piece of rope and buries her out in the desert.

He then takes the rope that he had used to bind her and strangle her with him and he uses it later. Judy's skeletal remains are discovered later in December, but she wouldn't be identified until months later. Seven months after he kills Judy, he finds his next victim. He actually met Shirley Ann Bridgeford, a 24 year old divorcee and mother of two through a Lonely Hearts ad, again using a fake name. So it's one of those like, it's fucking Craigslist.

Like, do you want to meet up and go on a date where Craigslist existed? Yeah. And then it had that also the innocence of like late fifties, early sixties or whatever words like, you write a letter and then in your mind, you know, some man who also has a lonely heart. Yeah, even the name Lonely Hearts, it's like we're sad and alone and innocent and sweet almost where it's just like, oh, here come the pervs. Harvey picks up Shirley under the pretense of taking her to a dance.

But once they're in the car, he's like, Hey, can we not go dancing and instead can we take a long drive in the country and we will get dinner along the way. And she's just like, okay. So they drove. No, I know the answer is no. And they end up in the foothills of the Valle Ceto Mountains near Anza State Park. Don't know what that is. And you are a lifelong Southern California nerf.

Yeah. I'm going to guess they changed the name. Yeah, they did. To help you over. Yeah. It's now called what, you know, the San Gabriel Mountains. Yes. Actually, I think.

Yeah. At that point, he forces her to undress. He ties her up and photographs her. So I think this is one of, there's a couple of photos of a woman on a picnic blanket in her clothes again, tied up. And I think that in these photos, you can tell that she knows like in her eyes, you can see this like worry across her forehead. She's gagged and bound and it's really horrifying and awful.

I mean, I just would like to, as the person who doesn't look at these pictures, I would just like to say sometimes when you look at those pictures, they do not leave your mind. Uh-huh. That's why I don't sleep at night. I know, but I mean, like, you're telling me this like, oh, really, because I just forget about him. I just don't, don't look too many of those. It's so upsetting.

Oh my God. It's too late. It's so upsetting. I know. It's so late. Okay. I look at all of those and I can't stop. I know.

And then I can't sleep and I have anxiety. Yeah. And I love it. Okay. In a weird way. Yeah. Well, you know, you know exactly what's going to happen. Yeah.

And I feel like it makes me understand the crime a little more like, you know, that photo, there's nothing going on in it. You would think it's just a normal, like a bound pinup photo from the fifties, right? Yes. Well, and it's that thing of like looking at, looking for the difference. Yeah. The difference of when a person is like, okay, here's your dumb thing. Yeah.

Oh, I'm scared. Yeah. Oh, and then the difference of that of, holy fuck, I mean, she just has this like a cross her forehead, this worry across her forehead that is horrifying. Yeah. Okay. Then he takes her to the same desert where he had taken Judy and strangles her with the same rope.

He uses the same rope and takes it home with him. And he leaves her body unburied in the desert. So Harvey found his next victim, Ruth Mercado, who's 24 again through the modeling agency. And when he arrives at her place for a planned photo shoot, she's like, you know what? I have a headache. Get out of here. This isn't going to happen. Oh, good.

No. And he leaves, but he returns to her house a couple of hours later and breaks in and again, repeat repeatedly rapes her at gunpoint throughout the night. It's possible that he even made her sit next to him and watch his favorite sitcom with her. Oh, man. Like he's just a psychopath in the morning. He forces her to walk to his car and then he drives her to the desert where he photographs her tied up forcing her to pose.

And then he kills her again in the same manner with the same fucking rope. Wow. I know. That's horrible. Harvey later stated she was the one I really liked. So I told her we were going out to a deserted spot where we wouldn't be bothered while I took more pictures. He later said we drove out to the Escondida district and spent most of the day out in

the desert. So I took a lot more pictures and tried and tried to figure out how to keep from killing her, but I couldn't come up with an answer. Yeah, because you're a fucking psychopath. Yeah. And also I hate when I hate hearing from the killers because like him going like, she's the one I like the most. Yeah.

He gives a fuck. Yeah. You fucking, whatever. No, 100%. You're right. I don't care which one you like. It doesn't. Yeah.

It's not, your preferences are not interesting. Right. I like her better person because he somehow didn't want to kill her. You liking her or not liking her, she still went through hell because of you being a psychopath. Totally. So she's reported missing on July 27th, 1958 by her landlords four days after she left for a photo shoot with an unknown man. So his next, so his next potential victim is 28-year-old Lorraine Weigel.

Weigel had just registered with the modeling agency when she was contacted by Harvey for her first photo shoot. Okay. So after the appointment was scheduled for them to meet up, Lorraine got a call from the owner of the modeling agency who was a woman and she was like, look, this dude just came in here. He needs a model. I gave him your number, but I just want to let you know he's, be careful with this loser.

She says, quote, be careful with this loser. She got a fucking bad vibe from him. Yes. She's not a professional and is rather creepy. You know what I mean? Yes. So she warns her. Yes.

That's all you got to do. Yeah. Just call a little gal up and just be like, I don't get a great feeling, so just so you know. Yeah. But she needs the money and so she decides, you know what, I can deal with this creepy guy. So on October 27th, 1958, Lorraine is picked up by Harvey and isn't worried at all until

he starts driving in the opposite direction of where they were supposed to be going. He gets on the fucking Santa Ana freeway and starts going south towards Orange County. There's no photo shoots need to happen in Orange County. Nothing good happens down there. Clearly. It's Disneyland. And even that. So he starts driving crazy and erratic and she's like, where are we going?

This isn't the right direction. Slow down. And she says that he wouldn't look at her or even answer her questions. So after they drove for awhile, Lorraine wouldn't stop berating him. And he suddenly pulls over to the side of the freeway off ramp and he pulls a gun on her and then tries to tie her up. But Lorraine is like, fuck no, she grabs the gun by the muzzle and starts to fucking wrestle with him.

Yes. He tries to convince her that if she let go of the gun, he wouldn't kill her. But she was like, fuck you bullshit. This isn't you're an idiot. They fight over the gun. The gun goes off and it passes through Lorraine's skirt, grazing her thigh. Whoa. Yeah.

But she's still fucking struggling. And at that point, she fucking goes down and bites his hand and he lets go of the gun. She fucking tumbles out of the car. He's like grabbing at her sweater, trying to get her. She holds the gun on him until the cops show up. Yes. It's fucking right. It's like a citizen's arrest.

Absolutely. So higher-up patrolman Tom Mulligan later testified that he had quote, he had a lunatic stare. I'll never forget that wild look he had in his eyes. Wow. Police arrested him. Arrest Harvey. Can I just say how beautiful did Tom Mulligan look when he pulled up and Lorraine is standing

there with this guy at gunpoint? Yeah. She's just like, thank fucking God. There's some bad news. But okay. Oh, shoot. Well, here's the thing. I was going to say this.

Instead of being celebrated for her courage and this and he gets taken in and he admits to these three murders, Lorraine is dismissed from her job as a result of the notoriety and reports circulated that she'd known that Harvey was an ex-con when she accepted the modeling job. Oh. So they fucking victim blamed the shit out of the fucking hero of our story. Sure they did. Of course they did.

Let's give Lorraine Weigl some fucking props. V-I-G-L. V-I-G-I-L. Oh. Weigl? Weigl. Or Vigil? Vigil.

It's a vigilante. Vigil. Oh my God. V-I-G-I-L. Vigil. I mean. Shit. I feel like a dick percent.

No. I mean, who knows? Yeah. I think you're right. We never know the correct pronunciation. It's wrong. No matter what. That's amazing.

Like she, yeah. That is the good part. I think that we are evolving. That story's changing. Yes. We're changing it. It's taken 500 years. Okay.

So police arrest Harvey and after hours of interrogation he admits to the three previous murders. He eventually leads police to the toolbox in his apartment that contains pictures of hundreds of women that he had assaulted, including his three murder victims. So after he had murdered the three women, he had tied them up and put them in various poses and taken photos of them. Oh, they're dead bodies. Yeah.

So the police were even like. You didn't look at those, did you? There aren't any. You can't find them. No, no, no. I didn't. But I would have. Oh.

I know. I know. I'm like, if I'm going to talk about these women who went through this horrible shit, I feel like I should fucking witness it. You know? Maybe. That's just my feeling. Grade the impact.

Okay. Just keep your eye on the impact. You're right. Thank you. As my therapist, you. I appreciate that. As the least qualified therapist on the planet. Listen to every word I say.

That's right. No, you're right though. Thank you for saying that. Okay. Photos. All right. So, he takes the cops to the sites and they find the bodies and he tells investigators that he.

Okay. So, he becomes known in the media as the lonely hearts killer and the glamour girl slayer. When he's put on trial for his crimes, he pleads guilty and repeatedly asks to get the death penalty. Whoa. And even attempts to stop the automatic appeal given after he does, in fact, get the death penalty. Wow.

He's like, kill me. Shit. I know. Which makes me wonder like psychologically what was going on in his head. Yeah. Because it's all, there's a little bit of, I mean, he also admitted to everything, brought them to all the bodies, like gave everybody closure, kind of like shut the whole scenario down.

It's almost like. I'm totally aware that the, it's almost like it was, he wanted to kill that person who murdered all those women too. He wanted to kill that guy too. Yeah. You know. Yeah. That makes sense.

And he, on September 17th, 19th, I just had a brain, I think it's called a stroke. On December 17th, 1996, Judge John A. He wicker found Harvey Glatman, who's now only, he's 31 at this point. Whoa. Finds him guilty in the murders of Shirley Bridgeford and Ruth Mercado. He sentenced to death. And on September 18th, 1959, he goes to San Quentin's infamous green room. Did you know that was what it was called?

I didn't know that's what it was called, where he's put to death by inhaling cyanide. Shit. And later, once this is coined, he's recognized as one of the nation's first serial killers. Yeah. And even like using the same rope is like very like storybook serial killer. And he's keeping a memento, which is the photographs. Yeah. Like that was this thing to relive it over and over again.

They talk about it in the, you know, what, what's the detective who. Nine hundred? Yeah. They talk about in the books and stuff that they write. Cause he's, yeah, he's, he's early, perfect example. Yeah. So any of those books you read, this guy's talked about. So it's possible that Harvey is responsible for another murder.

This one's a cold case in April, on April 8th, 1954, two, this is the way before this, the first murder, um, two University of Colorado students hiking near Boulder Falls found the body of a naked and beaten young woman along the banks of the, of the Boulder Creek. She became known as Boulder Jane Doe until 55 years later in fucking 2009. When this woman, a 25 year old woman named Michelle Fowler, who's clearly a fucking murder, you know, is like, wants to do some sleuthing on her. What would have been her great aunt's disappearance? She disappeared when she was a teenager.

She had done all this, like she didn't even live in Boulder. She was just like doing all this web sleuth and like put these things together and she, uh, her, send in some DNA and it turns out that Jane Doe was her long lost missing great aunt. Wow. Dorothy Gay Howard, known as Dot. Wow. Oh, Dotty.

Um, and they exhumed the body, they did DNA testing. She was 18 years old when she was reported missing from Phoenix, Arizona and a theory based on circumstantial evidence is that Harvey Glatman, who was in Colorado at the time, who, there's some circumstantial stuff like that, the car he was driving leads to her being, uh, it may be one of his first murder victims. Wow. But there's, I haven't found any information updating it. And that is the story of the glamour girl slayer.

That was great. Thank you. Uh, God, that guy's, I mean, Steve fucking Buscemi, stop it. Poor Steve Buscemi. Oh, yeah. I mean, like he gets looped into all this stuff anytime somebody has like. And he's a listener, so he's probably really upset right now. You imagine Steve Buscemi listening to this podcast?

Oh, I would get so nervous. I know me too. Um, because you know why Steve Buscemi is the shit? He started as a fireman. What? Yeah. He was a fireman before he got started getting acting parts. Are you kidding me?

Yeah. It was a, he was a, he was a New York City fireman and on 9 11, the firehouse he used to work in was one of the ones that lost a bunch of firefighters. And he did all this volunteer work and went down and like went, I mean, he's Steve Buscemi's the fucking shit aside from being one of the best actors ever in one of the best movies Fargo. Like he also boardwalk empire. Oh, so good.

The best. So good. I love him. Love him. Um, and on, on the Steve Buscemi note, let's do fucking hooray. Okay. Great. Actually I need a second.

What's the fucking fucking hooray of Steve Buscemi? Obviously. If you haven't seen him in ghost world. Yeah. Please. My fucking hooray is the like enormous that of nacho cheese that you brought to my birthday party last weekend. And I just want to thank you for it.

It was just the funniest fucking thing you brought Karen brought a crock pot, like a family size crock pot filled to the fucking brim of nacho cheese. You plugged it in and it was, and I appreciate you holding core and you just like, it was fun. Thank you for doing that. And then later, and then we left it out for like two days, Vincent and I. And I was like, well, we should just leave it in here and give it to Karen full. Yeah.

But then we ended up having like, it was so, and it was still so full that Vincent and I had to like, had a team up to, to dump it out. And I, I didn't really think about this, but so, so I said to Georgia, you know, like, tell me what I can bring. And like in the forceful friend way where you're like, delegate, delegate to me. Yeah. Instead of being like, no, we're shopping. I'll get everything.

I was like, no, come on. There's got to be some stuff. And then she started throwing out dips. Dips. And I was like, yeah. Okay. Dips. You know, you want some limped onion dip.

Oh, and you did. And it was amazing. Yeah. Made a couple of those. Like homemade nacho, like queso basically. And I was looking at recipes and I was doing this, that and the other thing. And when I went to go shop, I was worried about if I put something together, what if I had this big vat of something that tastes like shit.

So I was really concerned because I never tested out like my own queso recipe. Yeah. Especially when you have to make, you have to like triple the recipe because it's so big and stuff. That's scary. Yeah. And what makes me a bad cook is I kind of give up in the middle often where I'm like, this sucks.

And then just whatever. When I was shopping at smart and final, I looked up in the like, where I was in the like Hispanic foods section and I look up at the top shelf and there is a can of nacho cheese sauce that is as big as my head. And I was just like, problem solved. I'm going to have this thing done in 20 minutes. I got two cans of rotel diced, spiced tomatoes. Oh my God.

And I pulled down that plastic cheese sauce that they serve. I kept saying it. They serve it at the roller skating rink. Yeah. And dump it. So that everyone loves at a party. It's so delicious. It is.

It's like, it's easy to eat. It seems like it's made of plastic. It's very like, you shouldn't be doing it. It's really orange. It was bright orange. And people, the fun part was, and this is what I always have to do because, A, I can't be out in the sun. So like, it was a pool party, Georgia's whole area was, it was like, there's tons of

young, beautiful people all around the pool. And I was like, what's that, a pool house with air conditioning? Goodbye. And I noped out of the patio area and then plugged in that cheese sauce on the counter and pretended that I needed to stand next to it for the, for the next three hours. Oh my God. But then we had a great time because someone started playing the drinking game asshole, which is like a card game that Joe DeRosa taught us.

We start playing it and at some point about an hour in, fucking Cara Clank walks in and she's a comic friend of ours. She is one of my favorite people and one of the funniest fucking people. She's a good person to have a party. She is perfection. She starts like in telling everybody what the actual rules are. She's like, you can just like grabbing cards out of people's hands and be like, you need to go over there like managing shit, but also hilarious.

She has that camp vibe too, where she's like, it's like good times. Your camp friend. Yes. Managed good times. So then it kicked it up to like the next higher level of like, then it got real loud in there. It was really fun. Well, thank you for making that and supporting me on my birthday.

Happy birthday again. Happy birthday parties are scary and thank you for doing that. Well, I love that you were like, so, um, you're like, it starts at two and I don't know. It was like you were really tiptoeing and I'm like, Oh dude, I'm being there. I'm going to be there at 1.30. That's the whole idea. I think the best is having early friends. You have to have early friends.

It's so important in one's life to have early friends. Have friends that yeah, have friends will come and stake out the bench that you want with you. Yes. We'll be there and like, okay, well, yeah, we'll go to that restaurant. We'll eat lunch there and then we'll just take over the back end. It's like people that are going to like basically like three to five man team your Lizzie and I did it for you.

The birth for your birthday. Exactly. So we have to, do you know when Lizzie's birthday is? Sometime. Yeah. I think it's in November. Okay. Good.

Because now we have to do it for her. All right. What's your fucking array? But also when I pulled up, I pulled that crock pot out and I was like, if you can take this, I will park my car and then bring the rest of the bags myself. And she's like, okay. Yeah. And then I handed her a 90 pound crock pot filled with like the most typical over nacho

cheese. Yeah. It was like a tidal wave of cheese. It was good. It was great. We should have poured in the pool and gone swimming. It was the first day of like summertime feelings though, and I was just like, I am going to be miserable this summer.

People, I don't have a pool by the way. It's an apartment building that has a pool in the fucking, Georgia's indoor pool dome with a slide and a life that I own and it was a million dollars. She owns and operates her own pool. Mine was, is just TV shows because I did watch some crime based TV shows, but God damn one of my faves, Marcella or on the show, they often call her Marcella, but I won't say it that way. Season two of Marcella is on Netflix.

It is better. I believe better than season one and way darker. My friend Molly Davis texted me and was like, she's, I think she texted me right after, you know how midnight puts things, I mean, Netflix put things up at midnight. So she texts me like, you better be watching this. It was like one of those texts of, I hope you're watching this because it's crazy. And then I just binged it all day long. Oh my God.

I love it. And her sweaters, the thing I always talked about for season one was like she, there's one scene where she has a maroon sweater on that like broke my heart for some reason. It's like the best sweater I'd ever seen. The sweaters just come fast and loose in this season. Sweaters. It's like they knew how good they were last time. Also she wears a lot of pants as floods, so she'll have a big pair of like Oxford wing

tips on or one or the other or both. And then, and then like no socks and then her pants start like, it's the cutest look. And then I'm like, I love that look. And then it's like, I always love the look of a girl who's, she's probably four foot eight. Oh yeah. It's like little, little wavy girls can dress like old men and pull it off and it looks great.

Yeah. That's for them. Yeah. Good luck with that. I stay in the pool house. And then the other one is there's, there's a series on stars called CB strike that's also British, that's great and amazing. And I, I'm only two episodes in, but I love it.

Can I suggest a show too? I just remember there's a show called succession. I think it's on HBO. It's on HBO. Oh, okay. Cause I looked for that on like Apple TV and Netflix and I couldn't find it. It's, it's HBO. Okay.

I think you can get it on. I don't know. It's on HBO. But Cullen Culkin, Macaulay Culkin's little brother. Oh, yes. Cullen, I think is new. Yes. I think that doesn't sound right.

I think Cullen Culkin. No, no one would do that. There's a couple younger brothers. He plays the real good actor one. Yeah. He plays the best douchebag. He slaps his sister in the face. It's essentially, it's so fucking good.

It's almost like a VPOR really, really dark. Shit. So it's this family, the patriarch is this fucking rich asshole, his own company. All his kids are trying to get control of the company. Which one is it? Cullen Culkin. Cullen Culkin. I knew Cullen Culkin wasn't a fucking, Cullen, he is so good.

He was the Scott Pilgrim's gay roommate in that movie and he was so excellent in that part. Yeah. It's a real succession. It's a fucking great show. I don't know. The girl who plays the sister is fucking excellent too. Succession.

I have to watch that. It's really fucking fun. You'll like it. Very good. It's like rich people too. Yeah. So it's like this how they live. Sorry.

I love it. I stood on your. No, you did not. Okay. I almost think we might need to pull our show recommendations out of fucking hooray and it's going to make it harder. Yeah. And just haven't be like, just do, do, yeah, we'll talk about it.

I mean, we're going to do something. Be more spiritual. Yeah. I don't know. Thankful. Okay. We'll do it. But sometimes I'm just a, I'm just a straight up hermit and I haven't left the house so

I can only be thankful for TV shows. I'm thankful for Elvis sitting next to me right now. And the way he was looking at me when I was telling my story just now, did you see it? Yeah. He was riveted. He was just looking at my face like, bitch, where's my cookie? Bitch. You're long past the line.

Yeah. All right. Thanks for listening, you guys. Um, do, you know, do stuff. Be good. Be good. Thanks for your support. We love you.

We do. Stay sexy. And don't get murdered. Goodbye. Elvis. Want cookie? Whoa. You didn't even let me finish.

Want cookie? Ah. Good boy. Okay.