My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark - 137 - Gloogle

Episode Date: September 6, 2018

Karen and Georgia cover the murder of BBC reporter Jill Dando and the Andrews’ Family ‘Hauntings.’ See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is exactly right. We at Wondery live, breathe, and downright obsess over true crime. And now we're launching the ultimate true crime fan experience, Exhibit C. Join now by following Wondery, Exhibit C, on Facebook and listen to true crime on Wondery and Amazon Music. Exhibit C, it's truly criminal. Hello. Welcome here.

This is my favorite murder. The podcast. Where? Come on. I don't want to do it anymore. We talk about murder and true crime and it's in comedy. Finish her sentences. And that's it.

There's no fucking puns. No, there's no frills. Oh, you're going to stop doing puns? Absolutely not. Oh, okay. I just mean that this moment. At the opening. Oh, right.

Right. Oh, we're going to clear the opening. Opening. Get real professional about it. No place for puns. It's no place for half sentences that the other person finishes. You know, quirky shit. This is not.

Business. This is a business podcast. This is supposed to be a crime podcast. Yeah. But also comedy. Yeah. Your sister told you to listen to it. She's been telling you forever.

You don't need to open it. You don't listen. You never listen to her. And you don't like puns. She knows that. So we're not going to do that in the beginning. No. They were catering all this to you.

Yeah. Bitchy bitchy bitchy. Ashley. Bitcherman. Ashley Bitcherman. Oh my God. I went to college with Ashley Bitcherman and it sounds like she's not nice, but she's one of the nicest girls on our dorm floor.

I feel so bad for her. You know, like you think she would have changed it at some point. You know what she did? She tried to do that thing. We're like, it's Bitcherman. And it's like, Ashley, it's not Bitcherman and everyone knows it. Right. And even if it is, it doesn't matter because we're going to say Bitcherman.

We don't care that it's Austrian. Like it's Bitcherman. No one believes that you live in that castle from the poster. Ashley with two E's. It's Ashley Bitcherman. The N is silent. Bitcherman. Bitcherman.

Listen, Ashley. This is the part of the podcast. Look, Bitcherman. Look, Bitcherman. This is the part of the podcast that we started just last week. We're going to read you some of the names of the subgroups from the Facebook page since we shut down the main Facebook page. Everyone's looking for a place to belong.

We get that. We understand. Why not be very specific about it? That's right. That's what everyone, it seems, according to the list Stephen has printed up for us, everyone's gotten real specific. Or join a few and then find the friends in common in those groups and those are your new best friends.

Yes. You start a Venn diagram group of the combination of things. Say for example. Some of your choices. For example, say that you're in the Facebook group Fear and Murder in Las Vegas. The Las Vegas Murderinos. Nice. That's a good one.

Or how about SSDJPS, stay sexy, don't join a Pyramids game. Oh, that's fun. And incredibly specific. Yeah, I want to read stories of people in Pyramids games. So it must be people that did it and then they're warning everybody else like this is what you need to keep an eye out for. Here's how it happened. Yeah.

Super into Pyramids games. Yeah. Personally. How about, and then you're also into, say you're really into HDTV. Yes. For me, for example. And so you're also on my favorite open concept kitchen. Love it.

What about the Nailedorinos? They just love nails. Fingernails. Oh, like fingernails. Fingers and faces, but just the fingers. And also you love the TV show, 30 Rocks. So you're in the 30 Rockerinos. Sure.

It goes. How about who do I have to kill to get a date? It's a singles murderino page. That's cute. What about my favorite sensory deprivation tank? Listen, we're getting specific now. Is that real? I swear to God, it's right there.

That's amazing. Yes. Well, then how about my favorite vegans? Great. I mean. I'm going vegan next week. Are you really scared of it? What's the plan?

What's the idea? One of those like, I don't know. I'm just trying to be healthy. Okay. How about murderinos working in veterinary medicine in some capacity, whether you're a tech receptionist, vet, kennel, help, whatever. That's the whole name of it. So catchy.

So catchy. How about my favorite Ashley? Right. That's the thing, right? And the, yeah. And you can't, I was like, so Stephen, is it just all girls name Ashley or people name Ashley or what's the actual, and he's like, I don't know. I have to join in.

I'm not named Ashley. So I don't know. We think it's just Ashley, Ashley. Can I end it by reading you this quick little note that we got in our email. It's called swing arenas. That's right. No, that's wrong. Karen, Georgia, Stephen, pets, after listening about the granny swing in your last mini-sode

and the MFM subgroups in Facebook in your most recent full episode. No, I love it. Go ahead. It's great. Please say it's swing dancing. I thought I might as well let you guys know that while there isn't a public Facebook group, because swingers have their own websites to better protect privacy, there is definitely a swing arena subgroup of well swingers.

Swinging is big where I'm from. Utah. Mormons get real bored. Wow. And while it keeps, and while it's kept mostly hush hush, when you do get into the community, you meet some pretty interesting characters. Yeah, I bet. And not only are many of Utah's politicians and lawyer swingers, but many murderinos are

too. I'm not involved in the swinging community anymore, but I have friends that are. And once they saw a recent Instagram post of mine about loving your show, I laughed my ass off when they told me about a recent swing arena meetup night. I didn't think I need to explain what happens. I don't think I need to explain how. Let's just say it's not like paint night. So even though it's definitely a little weird and a little taboo, just thought you guys

would like to know how far your reach goes. Thank you guys for everything you do Monday and Tuesday mornings. Nope. Monday and Thursday mornings are my favorite days of the week now. Thanks to your show. SSDGMA. I love it. Do you?

Tell me everything. Did you ever see that swingers documentary? I think people get ideas in their head about like, I'm watching a movie and therefore when we talk about swingers, it's going to be movie bodies and movie people and it's truly like if you walk through Costco and everybody and the detergent aisle started fucking. That's what it looks like. It's weird.

There might be one good-looking person in the detergent aisle, but most of them. But then they're in them in around seven other greased up bodies and I think it takes away from the allure and the attractiveness. Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, sorry, I just look. No judgments. Do whatever you want.

I think she's talked about no kink shaming and bloody blue, but this documentary that I saw, I think it's called American Something and truly these documentarians are so genius because they just, they really captured the minutia. So there's like, there's a table of casseroles that are out. No. Yeah. Hot dishes. Hot dish.

Swinger party. Before hand and they laid down that tarp. Stephen Schoen. Stephen found. Stephen wants Karen to get the name right. Is it, is it American swing? It might be. No, no, no.

It's the lifestyle. Okay. It's the lifestyle from 1999 and. Oh, 1999. Yeah. A banner year for swingers. I just remember watching it on HBO's Real Sex. A banner year for swingers.

You're right. That's like when the real sex thing where people started going, oh, other people are into this too. Yeah. Maybe I shouldn't be. Yeah. I just think it's like, you, I, the first thing you go to is like a 50 shades kind of like Christian gray is waiting for me and then the world of taboo sex.

But I think it's, I don't know. Well, how would I know? Whatever I think it is. I just based it on the documentary I saw and then it's just like, it's like retirees in the OC in a house. It's like same with nudist colonies where it's just like, no, you don't see lots of like Pert titties. You see like lots of balls, lots of old man balls.

People who are like, yeah, I don't give a fuck. Yeah. Yeah. So God bless. Yeah. That's a lot. So what? That's it.

I guess we have to start making shirts. Swing arenas. No. Pert titties. Welcome. I shamed you into it. I brought you down to my Catholic shame area. Thank you.

It's comfy here. What do you got? Oh, I wanted to say that in the fan cult this month, our live show episode that we're doing exclusively for the fan cult that we put up is from last year. It's from Detroit. Yeah. I won. Karen, you did the parrot murder.

Right. Guy. Yeah. And I did the Robeson family cabin murders. Mm hmm. And that's up there. It was a great show. Yeah.

It was a really fun show. And yeah. So check that out. Yeah. And then the fan cult, there's all these perks and we're basically trying to figure out what are the things that people have asked us for that they really want because of course on social media, we hear all the time of like, where's the show I went to and why are you always screwing me over?

And it's like, we just can't always post like live shows or like, you know, we save those and we put them up when we need to go on vacation or whatever. And so we can't, we have so many live shows and we've toured so much that we like try to piece them out. And then it's like, oh, well, people really want that. Yeah. So if we want to get extra and get into this little fan cult, then that's where we're going to start posting things.

That's right. And we're also about to leave on our fucking tour, a fall tour, so we'll be posting videos from backstage. Yeah. Every week we're posting unboxing videos of get like amazing gifts that people have been giving us. So yeah. We're going to, and there's much more stuff planned for the fan cult too.

Like when we just did our mini-sode that we did in conjunction with the movie Searching. And then the searching people gave us, Sony gave us a bunch of free tickets to searching for the fan cult members. So there's tons of perks and they're building by the day. By the minute. I guess I thought I didn't have anything, but I realized it's a really, I just want to pitch you pyramid scheme style about joining the fan cult. The fan cult was a pyramid scheme.

That would be great. It's a food pyramid scheme though. And we're just getting everyone fat. It's all about wheat bread, just like the benefits of wheat bread. And I'm pitching my veganism food pyramid scheme. Right. And I'm pitching all pro gluten. I'm just like guys, the new diet is to overstuff yourself with gluten.

Do it. It's about inflammation. Just targeted inflammation. The beauty of targeted inflammation. You don't need fillers. You just need to eat gluten. That's right. Swell it up.

That's a quickie. Should we start? I know. I usually have so many other things to talk about. Because usually we take like a, we've been like taking a week off in between, so there's so much going on. I mean, I guess I could do a corrections corner about my SARS guard and SCARS guard, you know, confusion a couple weeks ago I had, but everyone knows that by now.

Oh, okay. I was wrong about that. Did you know that? Mm-hmm. Yo, yeah. Oh, I'm right there on the Twitter all the time, as it comes in. I haven't been on Twitter in like, like a few weeks now. Oh, we miss you a lot.

Thank you. Yeah. We talk about it a lot. As long as you miss me, I'm not coming back. Okay. That's perfect. All right. Let's you forget me.

Yeah. There's, I mean, it's pretty. What are you going to say? Are you going to be mean? What are you going to say? No, not to you. I was about to say something about Twitter, but I said Pritter. Then I just started going like, is this where it ends?

Is this where, is this the part where my brain slides out of my ear and it's all over? I was actually trying to think of, I was trying to think of something I watched on TV, like I'm excited because once again, it's center night. No, it's over. Oh, no, wait. That's, sorry. I'm thinking of a different show. Have you been binging lots of stuff?

No, yeah. I was thinking of, what's the one with Amy Adams? Oh, a Sharp object. Yeah, that ended. Thank you for letting me know that there's like, there's something in the end credits, which I didn't realize. I would love to talk about the people who made that decision, to talk to them about that decision, because it's odd that they buried a key element of the plot in the end

credits. Well, what I like, what I read, when I read a bunch of shit about it, what someone theorized basically is that the whole show is from like Amy Adams perspective, her character's perspective. So they can't put this end part that's from this, from Amma's perspective. So they like put it in there because it's suddenly like, we're out of Amy Adams character's world. Okay. We're suddenly in this crazy other world.

That makes sense, except for how many people that just, the second the show's over, you don't, most people don't get through the first page of credits and it's like, often you're on to the next thing. I missed it. You told me about it. I was like, holy shit. I forgot about that. And someone told me again the next night about it was like, oh my God, that's right.

And then I watched it. That's right, maybe that's what they were thinking is the excitement of word of mouth. Yeah. Yeah. So just know that like, you know, 30 seconds into the end credits after the very last scene, which is like my favorite scene of the whole show, both of those girls, those women's faces deserve fucking Amy is just so good. Look on their faces.

It's so good. Then there's just this like little, you know, there's a key snippet. It's so good. It's crucial. And yet it's buried. Very interesting. Yeah. Oh, but that was a good show.

Yeah. I don't think we talked about it that much because we watched it at different times. Yeah. And I think it was good as a whole. Right. Well, you know, episode by episode, you know what it is I felt for me. My friend Jason, I talked about a lot on the show, but I've known him since we worked at the gap together in San Francisco when we were 20.

And he started it after me and he was in the pot. He was in the first episode and he was just like, why is everyone talking about the show? I don't know and whatever. And I said, I said, I understand you get through the pilot and you'll, and you will understand you don't like it because you had alcoholics in your family. And then he got through it and he was like, oh my God, that's exactly what it was. He was starting to get anxious because of all the drinking and what it felt like there was a build and there's so much guilt going on.

There's so much bad vibes and bad family shit and drinking issues that if you were familiar with them at all, you just go like, I can't do this. And problems that are like buried by their alcoholism. And actually I was saying to you last week or like the other day that like, I've stopped drinking as much and it hit me that maybe it's because of that show. Sure. The fucking vodka in a smart water bottle, like every time, warm daytime or Evian, like the minute I saw it, I could taste it when she would swig it.

And I could just kept looking at her being like, oh my God, you'd be so much less puffy. Stop it. Well, and the thing of, I felt like there was a lack, a tiny, tiny lack of realism in that if you drank all day around seven, something really fucked up would have happened where I kept waiting for like, okay, this is the part where she's going to hit a kid on a bike or something. Because everyone's driving drunk. Everyone's driving drunk and everyone's talking all the time, drunk.

So it's like there should be more fighting. There would be like open hand face slaps and stuff, like what's happening. Lots more whispering. Lots more whispering. So many more secrets. So many more secrets. So many more secrets. There were secrets, but like the secrets would be told.

Here's the thing. There would be no secrets in town. The first time I love that shirt is a long sleeve. I love it. Anyhow, can I tell you something? Remember high school? I like... Spoiler alert.

Spoiler alert. Oh, shit. No, it's not a spoiler, but it would be very, yeah, it just made me be like, well, I'm clearly not as good of an alcoholic as these people are, so I should just stop drinking as much. So I've stopped drinking as much. So I would actually like to thank that show for that. Good.

Back to it. Keep coming back. It really works. No, but I totally get it because it is, it's a real mirror, you know, the part that got me and she kept going to the same store with the same guy buying, where there is a part of that. I remember doing that in San Francisco. It would be the same guy and I'd be like, cigarettes, beer, cigarettes, beer, and I became

very indignant about it, where it's like, I'm fucking doing it and you can't keep me from doing it. He doesn't want you to stop doing it. He's making money off you. Yeah. But he's still looking at you with pity in his eyes. Well, wouldn't you like sometimes, wouldn't you go to a different store every day, like for three days?

Not in a tiny town. Oh, yeah. Not in a fucking, wherever they were, Missouri. Yeah. Or wherever they were. Oh, man. It did make me happy to be from fucking, bless it all, Orange County for the first time in my life.

Bless it all. Oh, man. I was like, thank God, I'm not from Wingap. Also, though, when that cop first shows up, I was just like, dude, not, oh, I'm saying the hottest cop in America shows up to, but he's from Kansas City. I know he's like out of state cop, but still it's like, so they send, this is their expert from Kansas City who happens to be like, Captain HotBod, get out of here. I mean, that's TV.

He did. He was like, get me out of here. He was like, I need to get out of here. Oh, she's crazy. Yeah. So I did. Spoiler alert. Yeah.

It's so far past. Yeah. But there was a couple of great, like them talking in the bar was like, that's the upside of alcoholism where you're, God damn, I miss just like. You're clever and you're quick. Oh, and you love yourself and you're just kind of like, get onto this train. Everything's kind of sexy and messy, a little slutty and sexy, make out in front of the bar.

Get up on that fucking pool table. Get on it. What am I talking about? Wait, no, I am into swinging now that, you know, now that we've talked through this, I am so into swinging in a bar from a pool table fucking chandelier with some locals. That's not what they meant, Karen. Just like, oh, it's not about swings. Oh, then I like it.

It's not about swinging from a chandelier. It's about love. It's about winging. True love. Okay. The greatest, Amy Adams, first of all, is one of the greatest actresses. She is so gorgeous. She played a Disney princess realistically.

Like you can't scratch her and I think she's one of those people that gets ignored because she's so good. I'd just like to cite that. Patricia Clarkson is unbelievable. She was so good in this that I hated her. I hated her. I'll hate her forever because she was so good at this. Hated her and I hated that kitchen.

Any time they went near that kitchen, there's lots of things that's so realistic of walking by a doorway and someone like, well, it looks like you're a back home and they're like in the doorway like, fuck, they caught me in the doorway. The sound of the fucking screen door smacking clothes when you came home in the morning kind of thing. Oh, I had one of those. Great show. Good job, everybody.

Great job, everyone. So, yeah, we did have stuff to talk about. Ashley, we thought we had nothing to talk about, but look at us. We had so much to talk about. I also have been watching a show called Your Worst Nightmare, which does tie in to mine this week, but it's an ID channel show that just like, you know, one of the many, they figured out all the different ways to categorize true crime. So it's like crazy women, mean women, black widows, whatever, there's all those.

But this one is Your Worst Nightmare and it's really perfect because it's basically that theme of what's the creepiest way a true crime murder could happen. That's just what I need. Yeah. Really good to watch alone at night when the wind's blowing. Great. I did that to myself one night where I was like, what am I doing? Does the wind blow here?

Oh, there was an earthquake. Probably not. But there was. Maybe it was just the bad vibes blowing around. There's a cat in the tree. It's shaking the tree outside. Something made one noise and then I went, what am I doing? What am I doing?

Well, Vince was out of town over the weekend, so I was like, well, this is going to get ugly. I think we're going to have fun, Georgia, and yeah, I watched the new It with a SARS Guard. A SARS Guard or a SCARS? One of them, I don't care. The, yes, the clown is a SCARS Guard. Stephen, the clown.

He's the hot one from Castle Rock. What? Was he not related to Peter, SCARS Guard? The one in It is Bill SCARS Guard. Right. Who's also a. Yeah. I was like, how would I, how I would say, SARS Guard when I'm shit things.

So I, I can't help you. Anytime you run into any of those men, you can be like, hi, SCARS Guard, and it'll be right as long as you do the drunk voice. And then their security will take you away from them. I like the idea that they travel in packs, no matter if they're related or not. If it's a SARS or SCARS Guard, they're together, they're in one black SUV. It's weird in their yearbook. They didn't even go to high school together, but they're next to each other in the yearbook.

They didn't even go to high school in the same high school. No. Same year. Nothing. Different countries doesn't matter. And there are senior quotes to say this guy. I'm not a SCARS Guard. I'm a SARS Guard.

That's not me, motherfucker. Ow. Okay. I think I go first this week. Yes. That's right. I've got the official nod from Steven. Steven, silent as a mouse over there.

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Okay, so last week with Boys on the Tracks, I, it was so much fun with the conspiracy theory elements of it that I love so much. So I put into Google, Google, Google, what if I had like 99 cents for a brand Google called Google? Sponsored by Olmer's Glue, Google, we'll help you look stuff up. We don't really know that much. We're sorry your fingers are stuck on the keyboard now. Stop eating that glue, Georgia.

Okay. It's for kindergartners only. Google. Google, let's see here. Okay. So I looked up like what, like more murders with conspiracy theories and I got a fucking got hip to this one that I've actually wanted to do not because of this, but like I then found out it had these like conspiracy angles.

So there's one I've wanted to do at the end or gonna get into the conspiracy town. Beautiful. But in the meantime, this is the murder of British broadcaster and newsreader beloved Jill Dando. Okay. All right. Never heard of it. Okay.

Great. I hadn't heard of it. The other tell it was like some like late night eat, you know, 10 shocking famous people murders. Right. And this is one of them. Okay. So let me tell you about Jill.

Would you? Jill Dando was born on November 9th, 1961 in West Super Mar, Somerset. That's the place. She was smart, well liked and is even voted head girl at her sixth warm college. Okay. She's popular and sweet and lovely. Got it. Let me give you an image of what she looked like as an adult just so you haven't like

in your head what she was like. She was like a cross between. So she becomes a journalist. I'll tell you all about it. But so you have it in your head. She's a cross between like Diane Sawyer and Lady Diana. Okay. She's a lovely, pretty blonde, British, smart, kind-faced news anchor.

But anyways, let's go back at 17. She got her first job as a trainee reporter for the local weekly newspaper, the Western Mercury, where her father and brother worked because she'd always wanted to be a journalist. She studied journalism at South Glamorgan Institute of Higher Education in Cardiff. After five years as a print journalist, she started to work for the BBC. She becomes a news reader, which is just what we call it. Newscaster. For BBC Radio Devon in 1985.

She transfers to BBC Southwest. She presented a regional news program with an E at the end of it. And then in early 1988, she moved from regional to national television in London to present BBC's breakfast news. So she becomes like the morning anchor, essentially. Got it. And so she's like, her fucking star is rising, you know, and she's like in it. With her new job, she moves to London and she quickly becomes a household name in the

BBC national news, you know, operation. Sure. Her warmth and professionalism endeared her to millions. She's best known for hit shows like Holiday, where she fucking just goes on holidays. Smart. Dude, take that job and give it to me. And also a show called Antiques Inspector, which I'm like, also I want that job. How cool is that?

This is before the roadshow starts, where you have to look through it. I think it's essentially Antiques Roadshow, but like original. So she's inspecting shit. Did you just make that up? No, I swear. I think that's what the show is like. And then in 1995, she's because you basically just said it's just Antiques, but she inspects shit.

Well, it's like Antiques Roadshow. I could have told you that. I could have gleaned that from the top. Based on what? Oh, oh, I didn't even. I thought she was like Inspector Morris, you know, and she's, I get it. No, yeah. And then in 1995, she's hired us.

So there's a show called Crime Watch that's been on since 1984. It's this huge show. I think it's kind of like how we had the current affair. It's like the like, you know, nightly news of like current crime profiles and shit. Dateline. Dateline. A dateline? Yeah.

Yeah, but like, yes, dateline-y current affair type of thing. Okay. So when it starts in 1984, by 1995, when she gets hired for it, she's only the second co-presenter of the series. So like, it's a big fucking deal to get this job. Got it. She, it reconstructs major unsolved crimes in order to get new leads from the public to self, to help solve them.

So almost like a fancier or like a more official unsolved mystery. Yeah. Yeah. Like, but like a newsy time. Got it. So she's fucking household name now huge. And there's, there is something about her and you should just like watch a clip online where her face, her eyes are just so kind.

She has this beautiful, bright, open smile. She's kind of self-effacing, is that right? Self-deprecating. Like she just seems like a really kind, but very intelligent person. Someone that like, if you get stuck, let's say you get stuck in an elevator with on an earth, in an earthquake, you'd be like, this chick's got this taken care of. Like she just seems to embody this competence, but it's, you know, kindness too. Got it.

She seems like a good person and everyone fucking says she is. So 1997, she's awarded the BBC personality of the year. Okay. So she's big time. Then in 1997, in December, she's set up on a blind date by a mutual friend with a dude named Alan Farthing that they fall in love. He, and I think this is how the friend knew him, is a gynecologist. Okay.

That's awkward that your friend is like, you've got to meet my gynecologist. True. You know what I mean? Yeah. She's a nice guy that are very free and liberal with their bodies. Yeah. And you know what? There's some people that are gynecologists.

That's right. Thank God. Otherwise. There's all types of people make up this world. You know, swingers, gynecologists. Yes. That's the whole range of the two. And then friends.

I just love the idea that you just described this woman who seems so ideal in every way. She still has to get set up on blind dates. Yes. Isn't that always the way? Yeah. And she was like, they're like, she dated this person, dated that person. And of course, it's like in the papers, like in the, you know, what are they, tabloids? Like she's dating Jill Dandos, dating this guy, dating that guy.

And so she's still just like, I can't find anyone, you know, and she's like 37 at this point and still has to be fucking set up. Yeah. Which is like, guys, that's just how it goes. It's okay. She put her career first. Yeah. And it works out.

Sure. Good for her. Alan, he seems like a nice guy. They fall in love and they announced their engage in January of 1999. Nice. Everything's going great for her. She's 37. She's at the pinnacle of her career.

She's one of the most high profile TV presenters in the country. And her life seemed to be on this great track when out of the blue, she's murdered. Okay. Here we go. So I know it sucks. On April 26th, 1999, it's a rare day off for Jill. She wakes up at Alan's house. She doesn't live there officially.

Her house is on the market, but she stays most nights with Alan. And he lives in Chiswick, which is in London. And she left around seven or eight to run some errands. She fills up her gas tank. She goes to the market. And of course, in London, there's CCTV footage everywhere so they can kind of track where she goes. And then she heads back to her house around 1130 in the morning to grab some crap, parks

her car on the street, which I'm sure I was thinking about, like even when you're a fucking famous newscaster, you don't have parking in London. That's just how life is. They just don't have it. It sucks. And then she walks towards her front door of her little Victorian terrorist home. So it's essentially just like a block of these cute British houses. It's like this little two-story Victorian era with a little gate at the front, a tiny

little front patio yard kind of thing. So 15 minutes later, a passing neighbor named Helen Doble, who was on, she was friendly with Jill. She saw Jill's car was there. So she's walking by Jill's house and she looks over to be like, what's up? How are you? Whatever. So she looks over and into Jill's yard as she's passing by and notices that up at the

walkway by the door, Jill is slumped against her door frame and Helen sees blood pooling around her. And Helen notices so much blood that initially she thought Jill had been stabbed and based on what she could see, which wasn't too far up the walkway, she concludes that Jill's already dead. Whoa. So she must be into fucking true crime because she's like, I don't want to disturb the crime scene.

Yep. So the gate is closed, which she knows is weird. And so she doesn't go in. She calls emergency services right away, lets them know what's going on, lets them know who the victim is. Police arrive at the scene soon after and Jill's body is airlifted to the hospital. So it's determined that Jill, so she had walked up her walkway and reaches into her bag to grab her house keys when at that moment someone approaches her from behind, forces her to

her knees and shot a single bullet at her left temple just behind her ear, execution style and broad fucking daylight. It's 1130 in the morning and this like, you know, busy neighborhood. Execution style shoots one of the most famous newscasters in London or England, excuse me. She's, Jill Dan is officially pronounced dead at 103 PM. So forensic investigators swept the scene for evidence, they didn't find anything except for a single bullet casing. It was the type that came from a rare nine millimeter semi-automatic browning pistol

and due to the strange nature of the casing, it had like some scratches and some weird stuff on it. Investigators thought the killer had like fucked with the gun to make it different somehow and, but the gun was never found and that they had made the gun, altered the gun specifically for that murder. So whatever, what followed is one of the largest and most expensive police investigations ever to take place in Britain. So Jill Dan does neighbor Richard Hughes.

So they had no forensic evidence at all. The only thing they can do is get eyewitness evidence. They for testimony, they see the neighbor Richard Hughes described how he, so he had heard a woman scream, but he said that it sounded more like the woman had been surprised, not scared. He said, it looked at his bedroom window and saw a man between 30 and 40 years old and an average height moving briskly towards Fullham Palace Road. And CCTV footage shows a speeding blue Range Rover right after the murder and a similar

car scene parked illegally on Jill Street that morning. There's also a photo of a well-dressed man sweating at a bus stop on his cell phone near the murder scene shortly after the shooting as well. But outside of these sightings, which are so random and might have nothing to fucking do with the murder, police aren't able to find any other reliable eyewitness accounts. So Jill's death, of course, sends shockwaves through the nation. She had been dubbed British TV's Golden Girl. And so her high-profile murder, which seemed to them, to them at that point, execution

style populated the papers for months. The police named her the search for her killer operation Oxboro, and it was the Metropolitan Police's largest criminal investigation since the Yorkshire Ripper, which you had done, right? And that was in the 80s. I don't think I did that. Did you? I don't know.

Let's see. Da-da-da, led by Chief Inspector Hamish Campbell, Hamish Campbell. So no murder weapon, no motive, no eyewitnesses, police, of course, face mounting pressure, and over the course of the inquiry, over 2,000 people were named as Jill Danda's killer from anonymous tip lines. Within six months of her death, more than 2,500 people had been spoken to, and police had taken more than 1,000 statements. Investigators even used her own show, Crime Watch, to try to get information on her murder.

Wow. I know. Which produced hundreds of phone calls, but none that produced any helpful leads. So police meticulously looked at 191 CCTV videos, only to find that no one followed Jill that day. So they looked at every place she had gone to. They looked at her when she got home. No one followed her up the walkway.

No one followed her. There wasn't the same person at all the locations she had been to. So police then scrutinized her fans, looking for someone with an unhealthy interest in her. But out of the 4,000 of her fans that they looked into, they found 150 who seemed to have an unhealthy interest in her, and this had only found 150. I'm like, that's fucking too many of people that have an unhealthy interest in someone. They discovered one fan was running her BT account, which I think is a British telecommunications

account, so like her phone account, which meant that they could look into Jill's phone calls and phone numbers. And they also found somebody who had 150 pictures of her on his computer. And then one guy who tried to take over her utility bills. But none of these people they thought showed that their interest was more than a fantasy or a fixation. The utility bills things a bit odd. It is weird.

I don't know really what that like, they were trying to pay them or they were trying to like get access to them. Yeah, I don't know what. Yeah. We'll see when she's home. Well, to know when her lights are on and when she's home and not home, maybe. I don't know. Or just maybe it's just a random like crazy concept.

Like someone's out of it that they're just, that it only makes sense to them. It could be that kind of thing. To me, and I'm sure this was weird to them too, is that like, if she's just stopping by to pick some stuff up, then they don't know when she's going to be home. Right. In my mind, my first thought would be like, well, this is like an intruder who got caught or like a guy who was trying to be a peeping Tom who randomly got caught because he didn't know she wasn't home or wouldn't, you know, would be coming home randomly or didn't think

she'd be coming on all was going to break in. Who knows, right? Yeah. So about a month in the investigation, the police come across a name that piqued their arrest. It's a guy who lived half a mile from Jill's house. His name was Barry George and he had emerged as a suspect because he had been agitated on the day of the crime when discussing his problems with his GP and his housing association.

So like a couple people were like, he came in that day and he was acting fucking weird and you know, called him in. So police look into him and they find that in 1983 he had pled guilty to attempting to rape a woman and there was a note in his file that he had been arrested on the grounds of the Royal Palaces where Prince Charles and Princess Diana were living. Whoa. And when he was arrested, it was because he looked suspicious because he was wearing camo and he had a length of rope and a knife tied around his shoulders, which sounds fucking

suspicious. Yeah. I mean, that's beyond suspicious and aggressive. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. It's not even hidden or anything. No.

Wow. So one of the aliases under the name Barry Bulsara, he claimed that he was the cousin of Queen Singer Freddie Mercury and he was obsessed with Freddie Mercury. He got convicted for several offenses under some of these other aliases he had used. So that meant that like when the detectives looked into this guy, Barry George, they didn't realize that this other guy, Barry Bulsara, had issues too. So they didn't put it together at first, who he was. It's so weird that there was a time where you could have like a fake identity and get

prosecuted under a fake identity and they don't find out. Totally. That's, yeah, that's some 80s shit right there. That's 99 though. Oh, I thought it was. Yeah. Well, I guess that was in the 80s, but yeah, I mean, who knows if that's what happens though. So I don't think so.

I have those computers. I know. But what if they're not like, what if you have legit docs that show who you are and you get a different one every time? But how would you get those? I don't know. I don't know either. Let's send Steven to the DMV, see if we can get him to get a fake ID and set up a whole

PO box. It just feels like that's the place where fake IDs and like fake identities should stop is at the police department. That's where all that should be uncovered. Lots of stuff should stop there. One would hope. One would cross their fingers tightly. So, so he's known in the area for wandering around the streets.

He's kind of like a like a known like weirdo. Local taxi firm had also called the police right after the shooting to say that they were concerned about a man who kept coming in and he seemed to be constructing an alibi being like, I was here, right? Or like, give me a ride. I was here. Oh. Police then found that he had a history of following and photographing women when they searched

his house. They found a bunch of and what's it called with the film roles. Film develop. Uh-huh. They tallyed that he was, he had been stalking over 480 women at the time. Whoa. So just like taking photos of women and like just stalking. That's so many.

That's so many. And like, of course, at the time there weren't stalking laws. It's not, it's not how it is today should have been how it was 50 years ago. So we're still behind. Yeah. But at that time there was none, you know. Right. And at that point, if you're stalking 480 women, how can they tell, doesn't it just

seem like you're taking pictures of women? Yeah. It's like, but I mean, that's how intense it must have been. Totally. I mean, who knows. Yeah, it's crazy. And the inquiry also revealed that he had an interest in firearms, not that he owned any, but that he was like a fucking gun.

He remind, you know, the movie, I mean, the TV show Spaced, Simon Pegg, it's like one of my favorite, absolute favorite shows, but his best friend, Simon Pegg's best friend in it. Yeah. If you watch that, it's who that reminds me of, but not a nice guy. That guy's a lovely angel. That's his name. Okay.

So. It's the guy that's in all the Simon Pegg movies, right? Yeah. Yeah. What's his, I love. Okay. Stephen, we'll get it. Stephen.

Nick Frost. Nick Frost. Thank you. Oh my God. Sorry, Nick Frost. Nick Frost in Spaced, but a creep. Nick Frost also has a really awesome, like futuristic outer space show that's hilarious that has the tall girl that we've talked about.

Now it's, we're just like naming random, trying to describe British actors. It's not, it's not a good road to go down. That's your favorite hobby though. It is. Okay. So over a year after Jill's murder, when they finally put it together that this is the same guy, police are confident that they had strong enough evidence to arrest Barry George and they get a warrant to search his house.

They find his flat is stacked to the ceilings with newspapers. He's like a hoarder. So to some people, it's like, yeah, he had some like newspapers with Jill Danda's death in them. I'm like, oh my God, why did he have that and but others are like, well, he just fucking didn't get rid of newspapers. Yeah. He kept all the papers.

Right. So it didn't seem like, you know, people like us were like, he didn't do it. It's like, well, you know, but there, but there wasn't any evidence of him having an obsession with Jill. There was no creepy murder shrines and all this shit. The neighbor right next to who lived next door, who had heard the screaming and looked out the window and read across the street who had both seen someone departing from the gate, neither of them are able to ID Barry in a lineup.

In fact, they each picked a different person for the ID, which is not good. Right. No, it's great for Barry. It's great for Barry. However, forensics finally get a breakthrough. So they had gone through his house, they had collected all this shit. They had taken it from his house to a photography studio to photograph the evidence, which is weird.

That's not what they usually do. Like they didn't have a police photographer on the scene there. They had taken it out to a different location, which I think now we know is chain of evidence. That's an easy way to just contaminate, to discredit, for the defense to discredit and to bunk it. So they get a breakthrough. They had found a very small amount of firearm discharge in the pocket of a coat that they had taken into custody.

And it was the coat that Barry George himself said that he was wearing the day of the murder. So they take that coat in, they get it forensically fucking whatever. They find this little bit of firearm discharge. It was a half of one thousandth of an inch that they found. Okay. That's hardly any. So the chemical composition matched out of the bullet that killed Gildando. But they also find a single fiber on the crime scene that matched a pair of trousers that

Barry George owned as well. So with this information alone, they're like, great. And on May 29th, 2000, Barry George was formally charged with the murder. So the trial became one of the most controversial cases in British criminal history. Of course, Barry George pleads not guilty. It's hard. It's hard, you know? With those two first names.

I mean, yeah. And one of them is kind of my name, and I just want to say it first. He pleads not guilty, of course. He's accompanied by a psychiatrist during the trial to help him follow the case because he suffers from serious epilepsy. And he had. She just pointed at me. You know.

You're kind. She's one of you. Well, I thought maybe you could attest to how hard it is to follow your own trial. I've had a terrible time about at least four different times. Out of ten. True or false. Okay. And he had difficulties concentrating because it's found later that his IQ is in the mid-seventies.

Same. So, what if I pointed at you and I said that same thing? In the seventies. So, you know how that is. So, like, he had, he definitely had ADHD. It's possible that he had Asperger's, but his IQ is also really low, and he suffered from epilepsy, so he had all these issues, making it hard for him to kind of understand what was going on.

And that's why they wouldn't let him testify is because he would have incriminated himself probably because he didn't understand the severity of the circumstances. Right? Hold for a large plane. Regarding this flimsy forensics evidence, you know, the defense argues that the jacket, so the jacket had been removed from its protective bag, had been placed upon a work surface in the photographer. Fuck.

Photographic studio. And the photographic studio, this is all I could find about it, that it housed ammunition. What? Yeah. So, you're like, don't take it there. Yeah, that's just the odd combination. So maybe it was just like, it was like, maybe perhaps it was the studio that they used for evidence to photograph it there, but that means that ammunition would have come in and

out of it. Right. If it's a police photography studio or whatever. Exactly. Which is why the hell do you have that? Which is why you don't do it there. You do it. Yeah.

So, items found at the crime scene, such as the bullet and cartridge, as well as Jill Dando's front door, which is where the bullet hit after passing through her head, were photographed in the studio. So, the bullet and everything was photographed there. Then they brought the jacket and they're like, oh, look, we found it. And then they found one one-thousandth of a person, yeah. But inside a pocket, which is weird, too, right? But so, it was probably on the Q-tip or whatever the fuck they use.

Yeah. I mean, like, it's highly contaminated, like, that's just crazy. It's like, should be thrown out. The evidence should be thrown out immediately, which I think the defense tried to do. And, you know, I think that there was such fervor over getting this case solved that it was. One of those. Highest profile.

Right. That it could be. It was one of those, you motherfuckers, better catch this guy. This is insane. This is a beloved person, you know, so they went with what they had. The search team who recovered the jacket had not worn forensic clothing while searching George's flat. One of the officers who was present who had handled the jacket had handled ammunition

while wearing the same clothing that he had on then. So, he probably put his fucking hand in the pocket, you know. Right. Yeah. But, guess what? He was found guilty. That's right. On July 2nd, 2001, he sentenced to life in prison.

So, for years after his conviction, though, people campaigned for Barry George's freedom because they felt like he had been taken advantage of due to his mental illness and his mental capacities. Yeah. Because if you pull back a little bit, it really does seem like, oh, they just got the irritating guy that was overtly mentally ill walking around the street. Yeah. Who did sexually assault?

Like, you can't argue that. Like, he did. He has a bad past. He has issues, but it's like so convenient, totally, that that's the guy. And listen, maybe it fucking was him, but you can't take someone to court based on this stuff, you know? Well, just, you know, from my professional stances, having done 100 of these and just knowing how they all go, it's not enough evidence.

It's not. That's not a, that's not the solid case where you're like, we've got the guy. And to that point, if you have an IQ of 70 and you have all of these fucking mental health issues, you don't commit the perfect crime. You can't commit the perfect crime. That's a great point. You don't run from the scene without any blood on you. You don't know to use a silencer.

You don't know how to shoot someone so that blood doesn't get on you. You don't avoid CCTV footage and, you know, you don't not talk to someone about it. Cause like, apparently he would just, he talks a lot and would tell people about his obsession with celebrities and we tell everyone like, this is who I'm obsessed with this day. No one ever remembered him talking about Jill. He just didn't, it didn't make sense for him. Right. Maybe it was a fucking insane stalker fan, but it doesn't sound like him.

Right. So, neat ways. Okay. Eight years after a sentencing and numerous turned down appeals, George has finally granted a second trial when it came out, the gun trace obtained from his coat was discredited as a reliable source of evidence, which is like the stuff we have now too, where it's like blood splatter, evidence doesn't fit and doesn't make sense. One one thousandth of anything shouldn't count, shouldn't count.

Absolutely not. So the, oh, and the coat, it had been a year since he, since the murder, and he had had it dry clean and worn it since then too. When they found that, when they took the coat into custody. Okay. Yeah. So it wasn't him. Yeah.

Okay. So he's acquitted on November 2000, November 2007, despite he, he's trying to claim 500,000 pounds in compensation for his wrongful conviction, but it's been turned down by, then home secretary, Kenneth Clark, who ruled that he was not quote, in not innocent enough, and that the conviction was not so unfair as to be considered a miscarriage of justice. So you got acquitted, but they're like, yeah, but not hard enough. I mean, it's, this is truly an either or situation you're innocent or guilty. And then like a new law was passed around that time that was like, well, if you want

to get compensation, you have to prove your innocence. Wow. Yeah. Which is like, what? That's mind boggling. It makes sense though, because it's like, they don't want to be paying out people. I mean, they want to, they want to be paying people who it's, they've been wrongfully convicted. And it's been proven like by DNA or something that they're innocent.

Yeah. But he just got off because the, I see what you're saying. I mean, yeah, it's, it's not like they were like, you didn't do it. They were like, the evidence show doesn't show that you did it beyond a reasonable doubt. Yeah. I mean, that's it. It's a weird gray area. It's almost like they won't give it to him until they, until someone else gets,

Yeah. That it's proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that it's like, it's like a shadow of a, of a assurance that he did do it is what got him in there in the first place. So right. It says, you know, shadow shouldn't be involved. It's just shadowy. It's super shadowy. A lot of shadowy figures.

Hey, let's talk about some of them. Okay. Let's go to theories. So there's a bunch of theories about. There's like six strong ones, but there's about, of course, a ton. I was assuming to a podcast that has a lot of them that you can listen to about it. It's the podcast is called unseen and, but I'm just going to go over two little ones and then my favorite one.

Okay. So after he's acquitted, there are about 52,000 documents from his, from Barry George's legal team that are made public and some of which helped the public create new theories that they felt the police overlooked in their quest to pin it on George. So the first one that I found interesting is that the IRA was involved, the Irish Republic Army, Republican Army, that they chose Jill Dando as a target because there were links with the police through her show, Crime Watch. And they actually, a letter was found in those documents of a dude who was in prison who

admitted to killing with a, with a bunch of people that they killed her for the IRA. And it's just kind of nutty. Bullshit. Yeah. I don't believe it. As a member of Shane Fenn, I'd like to say that's bullshitting. Just kidding. Just kidding.

But of course, then at the time there was already peace talks going on. So the government knew about it, but didn't want them, didn't want to like pin it on the IRA because then the peace talks would have blown up. Yes. Blah, blah, blah. You know, it's. It also just seems a bit far away. It's just like, oh, we're going to, if we assassinate this newscaster, these things

will happen. Or it's like, that's, it doesn't, that doesn't directly track in any way. Well, way to get to mine that's similar, but it does directly track. The other one was that in 2014, a former colleague of Jill's came forward and said that Jill was trying to expose a VIP pedophile ring just months before her death and the pedophile ring had named high profile celebrities. That thing, those pedophile rings in England have been proven to be real. Well, it's that one dude who was like the BBC presenter guy.

Yes, Jimmy Somerville, who's the creepiest of creeps. That's right. So they think it was like, that's like, that's. Related to that. Yeah. I don't think so because I don't know what, I don't think she would have had information that could have been like, could have been silenced by killing her. I don't think she, you know, she was the presenter and she was a journalist, but there were,

you know, teams. She was a newspaper investigative journalist that, yeah, you know what I mean, like. It wouldn't have stopped at her, right. Maybe it would have sent a message, but I don't think that it would have sent a big enough message for everyone to be like, nevermind. You know what I mean? Because it ended up coming out anyways. So, but it's interesting.

Yeah. All right. So here's the one I like the most and this is conspiracy theory time. So in 2012, a story came out about the widow of a renowned Serbian journalist named Slavko Korovizha. So this dude Slavko, he had been murdered during the Kosovo war in an almost identical circumstances to Joe just 15 days before Joe. So the widow came forward to say that she's convinced that Jill Dando was shot by a hitman

acting on orders given from the same person who had ordered her husband's hit, Serbian dictator Slobola Milosevic. Whoa. Okay. This fucking shit goes deep and I'm like now really, really wanting to look into the Kosovo war because it's bananas. So this, so this guy, Slavko Korovizha, he was a critic of the Serbian, the Serb regime and he was this big journalist owned a newspaper and he had been shot dead outside their home

in Belgrade. Both victims were high profile journalists, Jill and this guy, both were returning home when they were approached from behind, forced to the ground and shot in the head at close range. Whoa. 15 fucking days apart. So why would Jill be targeted by the Serbian regime? You ask Karen.

That's a great question. Thanks. Well, just weeks before her death, Jill had fronted a TV appeal for Kosovo and Albanian refugees being driven out of their home by militias back by the Yugoslavian president. So she does this kind of like, you know, heart to heart news program being like we need to help these poor refugees showing footage of what's going on, explaining what's happening, really anti-Serb and apparently it enraged the Serbian paramilitaries, which is like fine. I've had a lot of fucking news like news reporters were doing that.

It's not like they wanted to get her specifically for saying that it wouldn't have done anything. But at that point, NATO had gotten involved in the war in Kosovo and on April 23rd, 1999 had bombed a state-owned TV station in Belgrade and fucking NATO did this. They killed 16 workers at this news station, including a makeup artist and an electrician. It was all just like, you know, regular workers there. At the time it was NATO's first offensive action against a sovereign nation in its 50-year history. Wow.

And the British broadcast, the BBC reported that the station was targeted because of its role in Belgrade's propaganda campaign, so they said it was fucking justified because this was a propaganda machine, so they killed the makeup artist and the fucking cameraman and the electrician and shit. So 15 days later, Jills killed. So the day after Jills' murder, an unidentified man called the BBC, and he had an accent, he told the operator, because your government, this is a quote, because your government, and in particular, your prime minister Blair, murdered, butchered 17 innocent young people.

He butchered, we butcher back the first one you had yesterday, the day after Jills fucking murdered. Whoa. The chief inspector, Hamish Campbell, who led the manhunt, said that the theory was only considered, quote, for a short while, but instead police focused their attention on George. Oh, dude. I know.

So that, like, that, to me, is, it makes sense. It's this fucking international crazy conspiracy that they're like, you killed, you bombed this fucking, you know, news station, we're going to kill, and they threatened other specific newscasters at BBC that nothing ever happened, but they got a couple different phone calls from it. Can I add to something? Please. Just as I make it up?

Please. Always. Always. The local eccentric bounced this over to MI5, and that's why no one else got murdered, that they probably had things in place, but it went full on deep covers, CIA, British style, which is MI5. The police might not even know, like the local police who are the chief inspector, maybe him, but not the rest, might not even know that, like, the MI5 was like, let's make it

look like this, this dude Barry George, this local fucking weirdo who's also, like, been arrested and charged with rape, let's make it look like he did it. Let's put, you know, a fucking gun particle in his pocket. So the police and the people who are arresting him might not even know about it. It's not like everyone's behind this. Right. Because this does, it's so high level, like, spy shit, yeah, that's crazy. And then if you, if MI5 comes out and they're like, this is what happened, then you're

going to fucking war, then it's going to be war, right? Nobody wants, well, everyone wants war in the government, but nobody, like they're trying to prevent the, like, larger and larger action, right? Yeah, right. Yeah. So maybe they like behind closed doors, you know, put a fucking quash on this whole thing. Somehow. And we're like, we don't need to take this any further.

Yeah. And Jill fucking Dando was the person who got sacrificed for it. Right. So that sucks. As of now, the police maintain their belief that Jill was killed by a crazed and obsessed stalker, maybe someone she was familiar with, and they're still kind of going in that angle, but they're not, it's not like, it doesn't seem like it's an active investigation at the moment.

Right. And almost, it's been almost 20 years since her death, but Jill Dando's case remains opened and unsolved. I bet so many British people are like, I remember that day type of thing. That's just so shocking. I mean, we would. I think it's, it was like similar to when Princess Diana died. It's just this like, well, this person doesn't, is this lovely person who represents this,

you know, like this, who we are and what we care about and, and is, has a senseless death and someone needs to fucking pay for this or someone needs to kind of justice for this. It's just really awful. So, you know, you, when you said none of the CCTV footage showed anybody, like that's highly suspicious because, like you said, if the, if it was the eccentric wandering around and being the way he always was, you would have seen him walk up, walk down, be in the neighborhood, do something, not, he wouldn't be, you know, like shadowy figure that just disappears.

Yeah. Whereas if it was some kind of spy shit, you know, well, there's like that weird Land Rover, which everyone knows fucking shady people drive Land Rovers, especially in LA, especially in LA. And then they, yeah, it's just this weird, like, it makes so much more sense. It's a professional hit. It's like someone who has been trained. Come in, come out.

And the thing that everyone who's, who saw this person who may or may not have been the killer who also like was seen on closed caption is that he looked, he looked, uh, well to do and normal. Yep. He looked well to do. Yes. Which is the perfect cover. Right.

He looked like a person. Yes. He looked like a spastic local fucking weirdo. No, you look like a rich guy. Yeah. And everyone's like, well, it can't be the guy in the, in the ranger over that guy. There's a normal guy. Yeah.

Yeah. He's a guy. Right. Wow. And there's like more shit about this killer and that killer. And it's just a written Kosovo and it's just like fucking bananas. Crazy. Yeah.

Wow. So that's the murder of fucking Jill Dando. Wow. Yeah. She won a pillow. Do you have some over there? Do you need more? No, no, I'm fine.

I just can't stop. No, I'm good. I'm getting pillows. Okay. So for, for mine this week, and I told you a couple of days ago, I was like, I'm so excited for my story this week. Yeah. I love that.

And, uh, I'd never heard of this and I never, I mean, not even like an inkling because, and I can't believe that because it has everything I love. It has a combination of, and when obviously we say love, we mean things I'm most horrified by. It's attraction repulsion. Look it up in a psychology. Consonation. Yes.

Um, but the only reason I know about it is because, uh, a lovely murder Reno on Twitter, uh, at Santina Lynn 33, they sent it to me and basically said, I think you would like this. And I hit the link and was just like, man, you're right. Shit. Man, you're right. Um, so I'm going to mislead a little bit and not say the actual title of what I had originally and we're just going to call this the Andrews family haunting.

Oh my God. I love it. I love it. I love it. Yes. I'm here for this. It's, it's such a tragic story. It's like there's just nothing but tragedy in every direction and it is that kind of like

it, the swirling thing of when children are abused, when people are left alone, when I like all, just all those things kind of coming together in one terrible tragedy, the kind of thing where you're like, well, I don't believe in ghosts, but if there's ever going to be one, these are the circumstances that are going to create. That's right. This sense. Okay. Okay.

Let's do it. So it is the fall of 1986 and, um, we're in a suburb outside of Boston mass, uh, and it's called Pepero. So I'm just going to pronounce it Pepero and we'll see what happens. Great. So it's the Andrews family. It's the father Brian and then his two daughters, Annie, who's 15 and Jessica, who's eight. And they have just lost their mother from cancer.

It's obviously the, a terrible loss. The family is grieving. It's a really hard time for them. Their father is a really hard worker. He's a bus driver and he's working to keep the family together. But you know, it, what a terrible time to lose your mom and, um, and just really also as everybody knows, so many people have been affected by cancer. It's just the saddest, you know, watching somebody get cancer, be diagnosed with it.

And then, you know, the eventual sickness or whatever, um, I feel like so many people, the only good thing is so many advances have been made in cancer and some, it's so different than it was in the eighties when it would just immediately be a death sentence. But it's, it's a ravaging, terrible disease. And so many people know, know that and experienced it. So Brian is just trying to keep his teenage daughter and his eight year old daughter together and okay, but they spent tons of time alone at the house because, you know, he has to work so much and they hang out, they watch TV together, you know.

So in the middle of all this kind of sad sadness and, and this is also now it's 86. So we have to go back before the internet, we go back before texting, we go back before everything. And this is all about the phone. This is when the ringing phone had the potential of everything, of the year, your golden teenage years coming through that phone line. What could it be? That's what it was all about.

So one night the phone rings and Annie picks it up and it's a boy on the other end of the line and he introduces himself, um, he says his name is Danny and then he got her phone number from a mutual friend of theirs at her school and she's the older one, she's 15. And the boy says that he saw her and he asked their friend for her phone number. He explains it goes through a different school. He describes himself, he's athletic and he's tall, he's blonde, you know, I don't know if he said he was good looking, but that's just the idea that she got that he was, you know, basically like captain of football team style dude at a different school who's interested

in her. Of course you're 15. It's like what you are waiting for and living for a 15 year old girl. So if I can babysit her club novel, it fully is yes, um, but over the phone. So she's thrilled, they chat on the phone for, you know, like into the night or whatever and have great conversations. And that happens a couple of times and finally he asks her on a date and he asked her to the fair and she says yes.

And so the big day arrives, the doorbell rings, she runs downstairs, opens the door, standing there is a short, non athletic, dark haired, very acne covered boy who introduces himself as Danny. And of course she's immediately, she's disappointed. She's trying not to act like she is. She's trying to be nice. She feels like she still has to go on this date with him, even though she's like, this is so weird.

And so she goes and the date lasts one hour, uh, because almost immediately she's getting weird vibes from this kid. And as they're having their, you know, having their get to know you conversation and at one point she explains that her mother's recently died from cancer and suddenly he perks up and he starts asking her all these questions and she's just kind of like, what the fuck? And he's like, like overly curious about her mother dying of cancer to the point where he's like, how did, tell me how you felt this, the moment you, you, uh, found out she was dead.

This feels like a fucking, uh, what's it called, urban legend so far. Yes. It has all those things where you're just like, Oh, a great thing. Oh no, it's the worst version of this thing that I thought it was supposed to be. And it's like, it's an 80s version of catfishing, um, and she's 15 so she doesn't know how to assert herself. She doesn't know how to go. Hey, fuck you, dude.

You sold me a bill of goods. Yeah. I think you are. I'm not comfortable. Goodbye. Yeah. But in that hour, suddenly he's saying, um, he's asking her to describe how her mom suffered all this stuff.

And finally, um, she's, she's like, yeah, this is super weird, like goodbye and walks away. Um, oh, that was after he made a joke about her mom dying of cancer. Oh my God. I was like, never talk to me again, don't call me anymore, huh? And leaves. Good girl. So she's back at home and back to kind of like sad life with her and her sister kind

of being like latch-key-ish, um, so they're spending lots of time home alone. They miss their mom. So one night they decide they're going to do a seance to try to see if they can contact their mom. They go up into the attic, they do all the things they think you're supposed to do to have a seance, light a candle, they're doing some chanting, whatever. Their dad opens the door. He comes home from work, opens the door, they end it.

But they had been starting to get this weird feeling and they thought it was like really working or whatever. And then the dad walks in and is like, what are you two doing? You know, whatever. Get out of that. Get out of the attic. No candles. No candles in this house.

Sure. And I'd like to say. Candles on the attic. No. The dad's worried about his daughters. Obviously, they're really suffering through the loss of their mom. He doesn't really know what to do and he's kind of weirded out by that behavior. So shortly after they have a seance, they start hearing tapping and knocking in the

house when they're home by themselves. And at first, you know, freaks them out. They try to go see where it's coming from. They can't find it. It goes away. And that it's like this recurring thing and gets louder, gets more insistent. And at one point it's just constant, like one night it's there and there's just constant tapping.

No. Light the house on fire and leave. Right. No, no, no, no, no. Yeah. No. So they're like, fuck we, this is bad. Yeah.

And like, this is not good. Also, it's a thing like I was saying before, like you're home alone. I mean, I'm like so old and when I'm home alone, you hear one noise and you're like, you want to run out into the street. Totally. That's kind of why I love living in apartment buildings because it's like you can just blame it on anything else. Yes.

And there's so many people right nearby. There's 30 people right now. Yeah. Once I live in a house someday, I'm not going to be happy. Yeah. That's right. It's very difficult. It seems so hard.

So then they start noticing that things are moving when, so they put something down in one room and they come back in it somewhere else. Like pieces of furniture, cats, they put their cat down in one place and they're like, it's not sleeping. Where is it? Not there anymore. My dad one time that they poured some fiddle-faddle in a bowl to take in to watch TV with them. When they went back in to the kitchen later to get it, it was gone.

The bowl was gone. The whole thing was gone. They couldn't find it. Remember fiddle-faddle? Fiddle-faddle. But I prefer a poppycock. I wonder if we should do a blind taste test. Well, because I think fiddle-faddle.

One of them, fiddle-faddle is like peanuts, right? And then poppycock has like almonds. There's so different. I don't know. What about crackerjacks? Crackerjacks are for old people. Well, then call me old. I just called myself old and now I'm like trying to throw that shit on other people.

That's how it works. That's how insecurity works, everybody. Okay. Shit's going crazy. Shit's going crazy. The doorbell rings one night, they open the door and no one's there. So they're like, fuck, what is happening? We opened a portal.

So when they tell their dad these stories, the dad's like, so they want my attention. I'm not around enough. I'm not there for them. Yes, but also it's haunted. Yes. Both are true. But as we know in every horror movie, the parents never believe the kids until like, again, all the curtains are on fire and then turn into an old nun or whatever.

Oh, by the way, the nun's coming out this weekend, everybody. We've got to go watch it. Let's all go together. Okay. Let's all go in a big bus. Yeah. Okay. So one night, again, home alone watching movie, they haven't heard the knocking for a while.

They start to hear it again. This time it's in the basement. So Annie picks up a knife and she's like, come on, we have to go check. And of course, Jessica's like, no, no, we can't go down. They go down into the basement and there is a message written on the wall in what looks like blood and it says, I am in your room. Come find me. The girls read it, they scream, they run out, they go to the neighbor's house.

They're freaking out. Good. No, no, no, no, no. The neighbor's called the dad at work. He comes home. The police come. They all meet at the house. They go, the dad and the cop go downstairs into the basement and they're standing there.

They look, they touch the wall, it's ketchup. Okay. So then he's like, my daughters did this. Oh, no, I was like, great, but someone still wrote it. He's like, the ketchup, he's just like, this is like a child prank. They're like trying to get my attention and pretend like they're so scared to be home by themselves because they want me to be home with them. And this is so embarrassing.

He apologizes to the cops and he tells the girls, you guys are going to have to go to therapy. Yeah. Oh, I'm like, ask me about therapy. I'm like, good, great. But also. They actually do need to be in therapy. Yeah.

Good things are happening. They're dead on the right track. Yes. But also he needs to listen to them. And he also tells, he's like, do not do this again. This is not, this is serious, like I'm pissed at it. So they're so frustrated because they're so scared to be home and they know what's happening to them and they can't get anybody to believe them.

Dude. Okay. So a few weeks later, they're home alone, the knocking starts again. Now it's super intense and now it's upstairs. And so they go upstairs and they go into the bedroom and across the wall in the bedroom in the red. And I'm back, come and find me. So they scream and they freak out.

They run out of the house. They run to the neighbors. The neighbor calls the dad again. But this time when the dad comes home, he's, he finds the girls are standing outside. They're crying and holding each other and shaking. And the neighbor goes, they've been like this since they got to my house. This isn't fake. Yeah.

Whatever's going on. Some things really going on in that house. Yeah. Like the neighbors now on their side. Yeah. Because these girls are just shaken. So the dad, Brian goes up into the house and he's like, I'm, although check it out. He goes up into the house and this is now also this, this story does have several versions

of these details, but they all end up in the back in the same place. But these versions, I'm, I'm right now going by the ID channel show, your worst nightmare season two, episode one, a bump in the night. He goes upstairs and he, as he walks through the house, every TV is on. Things are so disheveled that he knows his daughters didn't like wreck the house before they left. He's starting to go, something really is happening in this house and he's like starting to get really freaked out.

He walks upstairs and he sees in the girl's room that, that it's written on the wall. But then he turns around and there's a picture of Annie with a knife stuck in it, stuck to the wall. And he's like, oh my God. And then he hears a noise down the hallway. He goes down into his bedroom and someone is standing there wearing his wife's wedding gown and a wig and turns around. It's Danny LaPlante, the boy that Annie went on the date with.

His face is painted in like warrior makeup. Oh my God. And he's holding a hatchet. Holy fuck. The dad fucking, of course, like stumbles backwards. Yeah. Danny comes at him, he runs out of the house, shuts the door, screams, get them inside the house, call the cops.

The cops immediately come and they're just, and he's standing out in the street and like no one comes out of the house. And so he's like standing there waiting because he knows it's his 15 year old kid. He's not big. Yeah. So he's, but he's like kind of ready. But this guy's fucking batch it. Yeah.

He batch it and he's got a hatchet. Batch it and hatch it. Batch it, hatch it, wearing a wedding dress. So the cops go into the house to get him. Oh, hey. And they don't find anybody in the house and they're searching all around. And they're like, this is weird because they know no one came out. And then they look and it on the story is like all over our, there's this happened in

different places, but basically they see, they notice that there is a bookcase that's slightly out from the wall. Is this a hiding in the wall story? It sure is, Georgia. No. They pull it open. No. And there is a tunnel system.

No. Throughout the walls of the house. Fuck. And Danny LaPlante has been living inside of the walls of this house since they went on this date. Danny, you creeper. And not only is there writing on these walls and there's the girl's clothing that's been slowly disappearing that he's been jerking off onto.

Ew. That's all inside the walls and there's beer. He's glued pennies to the wall. There's all kinds of weird shit that shows he's been in there for so long, but on top of all of that, there are little peepholes so that he could walk anywhere in the house and see the girls in any room that they were in. Ew. Ew.

Okay. What the fuck? Yes. So some versions of the story are that Danny tied the whole family up and then Jessica got away and called the cops and then everyone got away and then the cops came and then they moved back in and then later, it was like that where I'm like, it doesn't even seem realistic. I'm on this, I'm on board with this one so far.

Yeah. I'm ID channel style. They have researchers. Yeah. They know what they're doing. That's right. So it turns out, so Danny LaPlante, this 15 year old boy, very disturbed, has had a horrible life, terribly abused, physically, emotionally, sexually by his father and had a terrible

time in school, was always made fun of because of his parents because of his acne. He was disheveled. He was very weird and creepy. Just had terrible time. He had learning disabilities. He had, you know, everything stacked against him. When he was an adolescent at one point, they sent him to a psychiatrist to help him, the psychiatrist molest.

No. No. Yeah. Right. Oh God. Well, nothing is justifying, but obviously there's, the underlying psychological problems were there. That's awful.

It's really terrible. He is taken to a psychiatric hospital when he's finally arrested. And they evaluate him before they send him to juvenile hall. And they then decide, the authorities decide he's going to be tried as an adult and moved into real jail, but because of that, instead of like juvenile hall, if he's tried like an adult, then he can have bail. So his mother, his mother is able to come up with the $100, oh, no, I'm sorry, $10,000. Wow.

When I looked at this the first time, I was like, that's crazy, but you know, it was the 80s, I guess it's $100 back then is equal to $100 because I put a period, I put a period instead of a comma. Sorry, everybody. $10,000 bail. Okay. So he was bailed out and he's given a December court date. Oh no.

Of course, the Andrews family is like, we got, we're moving and they relocate on December. So it takes two years for his court case to come up. On December 1st, 1987, before the trial, he's still out before he's prosecuted for the crime of being the creepiest person in America. Secondly, to remember the Spider-Man of Denver, where the guy basically did the same thing, but almost less creepy on that one because he was just came down from the ceiling. Yeah. And he was just living there because he had nowhere else to go and the couple didn't

know. But okay, so Danny on December 1st, 1987, leaves his mom's house and what they eventually learned is that he'd stolen guns from a neighbor because before this thing at the Andrews house, he had been breaking into homes and robbing people, but then he also would just break into homes and move stuff around and fuck with people. So he was very into like fucking with people's minds and invading privacy and that was like an obsession of his already. Sounds like such a Stephen King character.

Yeah. Yeah. Really disturbed. Yeah. He was the opposite of any kind of help and abuses, piled on abuses, but then just deeply disturbed persons. Yeah. So he goes, he leaves his mom's house and he goes out into the woods, which apparently

some people say he knew the woods like the back of his hands. He could live out there as long as he wanted. So he hikes through the woods for a mile and then the first house he comes to belongs to a family called the Gustafsons. And it is the mom is 33 year old Priscilla, the husband's named Andrew and the children are Abigail who's seven and William who's five. So they, Priscilla comes home one day with the kids and there's it's speculated because no one's sure positive, but they think he could either have been surprised in the middle

of robbing the house. He just was there to rob it or he had a plan all along and he was in their hiding. The one thing that does support the fact that he had a plan was that there were ties found that he had bound the family, which would have meant he had preplanned it in some way because what he basically kills the family, he shoots Priscilla and then he takes each child to a different bathroom and drowns them in the bathtub, terrible. Yep. And then he disappears into the woods again.

So they find at the scene, the police find 22 caliber gun casing and it matches the gun that that Danny stole, the 22 that he had stolen. And for 48 hours, they can't find him. People are searching the woods. What is this, 88 or something? This is 87. It's December of 1987. So they actually get like a task force together, like cops from surrounding counties and dogs

and shit. There's a whole search. Then they get a tip that Danny's hiding at an old lumber yard. What's fucking creepier than that? So all these cops descend on this thing and they find him in a shed and when they pull him out, he's laughing and he continues to laugh throughout his entire arrest. He just won't stop laughing the entire time. He's booked, he's stripped.

That's when they discovered he has a loaded gun hidden in his crotch. Oh my God. Yeah. Yes. Gross. He, now this time he's sentenced, he's sentenced to three consecutive life sentences because Massachusetts doesn't have the death penalty and that's in court. And everyone starts hearing about his terrible childhood.

But as we, many people say, we've been told a ton of times and we all know lots of people have had terrible childhoods and they do not kill people. So obviously there's the extra special something in Danny's brain that was off. We also know this because he, when he went to jail, never expressed remorse for anything ever. He became a Wiccan in jail, then he filed a lawsuit against the state of Massachusetts because they weren't giving him access to dragons, blood, black opium or honeysuckle. Wiccans are like, can you leave us out of this, please?

Literally, that's the next time that the Wiccan community was like, he is not one of us. Shut up. That's not what we're about. That is like, like he has nothing to do with us. None of us have ever heard of this guy. Jesus. Like we reject him entirely. Not Jesus.

They reject him entirely. The Wiccans are about the fucking earth man and dragons blood and dragons blood. Then he, he goes through appeal after appeal of all these years where he's just like, don't care. Fuck you, whatever. And finally on his last appeal, he came and he was like, I realize what I've done. I know what's wrong. I have nothing but remorse.

I'm so sorry for all the pain I cause liar, liar, liar, his, his final appeal is denied. So he's never getting out of jail. And of course, when was that in 20 something, it's 2016. Holy shit. It's like recently, right? His final appeal is denied and Andrew Gustafson, who lost his entire fucking family. And of course, after that, his, he died in 2014. His second wife, luckily he, I mean, he did remarry, which is lovely.

But his second wife testified at the re-sentencing that Andrew's life, of course, was ruined because of this crime. He suffered endlessly with depression. He went bankrupt. Like his life, of course, fell apart because it was so terrible. And they say, I don't know if this is verified that on Andrew's deathbed when he died in 2014, he said, make sure they never let him out of jail. And Danny's third appeal was like his final appeal was denied in a way they're like, well,

at least that Andrew got a little bit of justice in that. And that is the horrifying fucking story of Danny LaPlante. What in the actual fuck? And also, how have I never heard that story before? Dude, I think I'd heard the beginning part and I was like, and I was like, okay, like this isn't going to be a murder story. This is like, you know, this like weird and like, is it provable? I don't know.

But it's like, cool. Not cool. But you know. And then it just took a turn. And that was horrible. And on the television show, You're a Worst Nightmare, the way they shot it was so good where he's standing there, like Brian goes into that bedroom and is like suddenly looking like someone's in a wedding dress, like how confusing and disorienting that would be.

And then it's just like a teenage boy who basically is like, it looks like Braveheart. It's like the top half of his head is is all black across the eyes and forehead. And then the bottom is white. And he has like a weird strip of red on his lips. Like it's so creepy and the hatchet, it's just like, oh, this is not a haunting. This is a nightmare. This is a true fucking nightmare. You're awake.

So crazy. I want to see a photo of this dude. Oh, I have one right here for you. Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God. Yeah. To be honest, he just looks like all the disturbed serial killer, yeah, teen boys that you've

ever seen. Oh, he's got he's definitely got a Richard Ramirez feel to him. He definitely does. Dark dark. Oh, man. Yeah. Really bad. Definitely like the area of the heavy metal parking lot where you're like, you don't want

to go. That's right. No. Yeah. Don't smoke that guy's pot. No. It absolutely will have angel dust in it. And then you'll be totally fucked and free on and you're fucking suddenly wake up.

Oh my God. I'm free. I remember free on. Well, shit, dude. I know. Right. Insane. Good job.

Oh, thanks so much. My my fucking arrays that I got to hang out with both of my nephews over the weekend separately and I got to hang out with the eight year old nephew Micah alone. Like we just got to like hang out and walk around and talk and eat and like it just was this nice. It was such a different person around a bunch of people because he gets so excited and hyperactive and shit. Not like, but.

Like a kid. Like a kid. Yeah. But this time it was just nice to talk to him and stuff. And then my little baby, I don't know if he of course is the angelist of them all and so it just made me feel like a good aunt. Nice. Nice.

Also it's so good to, it's such a brain change because we're never around. I feel like in that kind of life and lifestyle that we have, it's just like you're just never around kids. No. It's not really lifestyle, it's not even like slightly juvenile lifestyle. No. You never get it. And it's so important because like they're not sarcastic, they're not fucking riffing

all the time or trying to like put on a thing. Totally. You don't have to like keep up a conversation and ask them about dumb shit. Nope. It's just real connected. Like connected stuff. All he did was like, tell me about things he's excited about. Like movies and this movie and this other movie and this character in this movie and

like just like talk at me, it was like nice. Yes. It was cool and I was just like, well, what did that guy do? It was just kind of, it was fun. That's awesome. Yeah. Well, then I guess I will do my, I did a lot of, so I started back up a writing job. So backup.

Backup. Oh, you started backup. I thought you meant like a backup to the podcast. Baskets is not a backup writing job. Gotta have a safety net. And it's just like the one of the best TV shows on television. It's my version of getting an accounting degree when I want to be an actor. It resumed.

So knowing that life was going to get much more dense and difficult, I just did absolutely nothing for like four days in a row. Yeah. It was really nice and I mean, not like I needed it, but it was, I was almost like just milking the end of it before I'm like, well, it's nice when you do it cause you know, there's a, there's a thing to do it for when it's not just like, I'm not going to do anything today. It's like, I have to catch up.

Yes. Cause I'm about to start some crazy shit. Yeah. Like I'm in it. Now I'm, I'm, I've turned back into like a banker, you know what I mean? Yeah. I can't pretend I'm like a hippie already person. It's like, so I just wanted my last couple of days of it.

So I was binge watching all kinds of crazy shit and there's a series, there's an old BBC series called Tom Jones that is, it's based on the story. It's really well done. There's some great actors, but it's clearly from the nineties. It's old. Um, but that was very satisfying. But then I, um, on Labor Day tweeted, um, a GIF where I said, um, Labor Day weekend in your forties.

And then it was a GIF of a guy that was making a face and just slowly closing a door like horrified face and someone replied to that and was like, Oh my God, I love the misfits. And I assumed it was the band. And I'm like, wait, what? That guy's from the misfits. And so when I look it up, it's a British series that is so fucking good and funny. And I watched, um, I mean, there's a ton of, I think there might be five seasons or more. I watched the first three.

It was, it's super, it's like dirty. I kept thinking, what channel would this be on because it can't be on just normal TV in England, but they're so fucking liberal about sex. They don't give a shit. And then there's like late night shit and early night shit. Yeah. But this is like, um, young people who all got arrested for something and they have to go do like, it's basically community service.

I love it. But then while they're doing community service, a weird cloud passes over and like this odd storm starts and then everyone changes and suddenly people have special powers. And it's like all these like narrow-dwell kids that have the powers. Oh my God. It is so good. It sounds awesome. It's so funny and interesting and luckily a bunch of murderinos knew what that gift

was and what the show was. And they're like, we love that. You love the misfits. And I was just like, what the fuck is going on? So you're getting credit for this badass thing. And now you're like, no, you can actually give me credit for it. Yeah. Now you know.

Now you have credit. I didn't deserve credit on Labor Day, but I've now earned it because now I'm a humongous fan. It's a really good show. And it's old. It's like in the UK right now are like, oh, oh, really? It's like, you know, you know, we take a while to catch up. People are, it's, it would be like if a British podcast was like, you've got to watch Dawson's

Creek. It's amazing. But anyway, yeah, I'm going to watch it while I don't drink. It's another one of my things. Just start watching everything. I'm going to do it. Yeah. Um, Rad, should we have a challenge for this week?

This weekend coming up? Sure. I actually did, I didn't go to a yoga class, but I rented or I bought a yoga, a Kundalini yoga video that I did half of. It's actually Kundalini yoga is interesting because it's not crazy hard poses physically. It's like odd things that are duration, like you have to do weird things with your arms for four minutes that you're like all of a sudden breathe all crazy. Yes.

Okay. It's like effective, like it really works if you do it. So I'm giving myself, I'm like build up to it because it's actually hard to do and do as much as you can and then just keep on doing it. So that's supposed to be, they want you to do in that a 40 day yoga challenge where you do it every day. So I might try to do that just because I just want to build as much as you can. I need to practice.

I need to practice and I need a morning routine. I love that. All right. Well, I'm going to try to go one time this week. Because I haven't been and I just need, in fact, I need someone to answer to. Yeah. Good idea. Rod, let's do it everyone.

Because we keep getting tweets about people going and about people being like, I went to mine. So we're not giving up on this. No. Like we definitely, I definitely want to continue practicing doing it. I have a quick shout out to the Halifax murderinos. They did a themed yoga class for charity. Nice.

Halifax Nova Scotia? Yeah. They said howdy. Wednesday, August 22nd, our small but mighty group of Halifax murderinos from Nova Scotia took your suggestion. I only went to yoga, but it seemed the whole damn class around it. They told me the different kinds of poses they did and we raised over $100 for the Kristen Johnston legacy beer, beer, Suri Kristen, a yoga teacher herself was stabbed to death

by her former partner in 2016. She touched many lives here in Halifax and beyond. And we couldn't think of a better reason to gather as a community and practice yoga than to honor Kristen's memory and uphold her legacy. Wow, that's great. Stay sexy. Do murderino yoga. Dara pronounced like Sarah.

Nice. So that's amazing. Let's all do that. I love that. Also Nova Scotia, I mean that is a tiny area where one of my favorite giantises is from Anna Swan, the giantess of Nova Scotia. She was like eight feet tall. She was humongous.

Good for her. Good for her. I love her. You love giants. I really do love giants. Well, you guys have been giants for listening to this episode. Wow. Especially you, Allison, Bittorino, Ashley, I'm sorry, Ashley.

Ashley Bitterman. She is it. Is it Bitterman? Bitterman. Ashley Bitterman. Allison Bittorino. It's like, I finally got my shout out. Allison Bittorino is like, my life hasn't been hard at all.

Bittorino is so much different than Bitterman. Bitterman is like, oh, what a drag. I was just, that was really insulting. I apologize. To fake people. To fake people. Both of you. So sorry, fake people.

Don't have your feelings for fake people. But thank you for listening. And stay sexy. And don't get murdered. Goodbye. Goodbye. Elvis, you want a cookie? Want a cookie for your birthday?

Yeah.