My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark - 188 - The You & Me Of This Group

Episode Date: September 19, 2019

Karen and Georgia cover the Dyatlov Pass mystery and Linda Hazzard.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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And welcome. To my favorite murder. Um, this is a, uh, podcast. That's it. The end. That's Georgia Hardstar. That's Karen Kilgarov. We're here to talk to you about many things, true client, climb one of them.

Free climbing. Uh-huh. One of them. Don't do it. We're like, hey, go to half dome. Yeah. Don't use ropes. Don't do true crime.

Please. Get up on a, get up on a rock that has almost no footholds and just climb with your fingertips. No free climbing. No true climbing here. Period. None of it. Period. This is all new.

Yeah. This is where we mostly talk about recycling paper. Oh. Yeah. Come on guys. Everyone's talking about recycling plastics. Can't use a straw. This and that.

Hey. How about paper? How about, let's talk about it. Let's talk about paper. Let's get into a deep dive. Now my friend just sent me a picture. Okay. And I don't know if it was his actual view or if he found it online, but it made me

laugh so hard because it's taken from an aisle seat in a plane, one seat behind a lady who is in the aisle of in front of and diagonally across. And that woman is working on a hoop stitch and she's embroidering eat a bag of dick. Look at this. The lady of my dreams. So it's my friend, Davis Kandari sent this to me who I've known since I was 18 years old. And he is the most fun to, you met him when you were in San Francisco.

He's hilarious. She's holding it up for the world to see and it's beautifully and floral. Isn't it perfect? Eat a bag of dick. It's really well done. She has a blue streak in her hair. So she's a friend of ours. She's, yes.

She absolutely looks like a librarian slash professional knitter slash derby doll murdering her. Yes. For sure. Hi. We respect you. We support you. This is the world I want to live in.

Let us know if it's you. Please. We got to know. Oh, it's my favorite. Bless your heart. And thanks, Dave, for always keeping me up to date on what's going on in the world. I love that when, I love that you're the kind of person, and this is the kind of person I strive to be, that when someone sees the term eat a bag of dicks, they think to send

it to you first. You know who's going to like this? Who? Kandari. Yeah, that too. But you know why? Because I remember a time not so long ago when that's the kind of thing you had to hide in your bag.

Because some weird mid-level businessman would get up all in your shit if you were doing something like that on Southwest. He'd get the vapors and be like, put his, the back of his palm to his forehead. Oh, and his other hand down on his dockers. How dare you? Why I never. Not anymore, friend. Now you can eat a bag of dicks in public.

Now you can just go ahead and eat a bag of dicks about it. Welcome moms and grandmas. New listeners? Yes, this is what it's like. Guys, it really is not appropriate. And that's the fun part. That's what we like. Um, what have you got going on?

Announcements. Announcements. Announcements. This is a really fun announcement. Okay, yes. You want to do the fun one first? Absolutely. Okay, before all you skip or skip.

Yeah. Actually skip because this isn't for you. Yeah, that's right. You didn't earn it. You don't get this. Okay. Do you think that there's going to be a time, probably sometime in the near future, where we're going to say the whole podcast together at the same time?

I do think that. Yes, oh my God, it already happened. We're close, we're close. So you guys know about my favorite weekend. It's our Santa Barbara Murderino Meetup Weekend in Santa Barbara. We are debuting the official logo for the weekend. It's so fucking cool. It's going to be on merch.

You can go to myfavoriteweekend.com to check it out and we have a special announcement to make. This is very exciting. There's going to be a contest so that you can win two tickets for you and your lucky friend of our choosing to come and be at my favorite weekend with us. That's right. Yes. And there's going to be live shows.

We're doing live shows, murder squads doing live shows, per castes doing live shows. All of your friends from the Exactly Right Network are going to be there. To be announced ones too that are really exciting. That's right. And secret guests that are going to be very exciting. Yeah. And there's going to be like all kinds of little fun things going on around Santa Barbara. They're going to hate us by the time we're done.

We're going to be embroidering Eda Bag of Dicks all over Santa Barbara the weekend of November 1st. We're going to be yarning little sweaters to put on traffic meters that say Eda Bag of Dicks. It's going to be a cute little project. I'd actually like if someone would embroider a picture of the woman sitting on her airplane seat embroidering Eda Bag of Dicks. Why not?

Let's go meta. Let's go to the inception. Please. Of Dicks. Okay. Guess what? What? Okay.

So, Santa Barbara from November 11th through the 3rd? No. First through the 3rd. What did I say? 11th through the 3rd would be backwards time. That's right. Which could be the new podcast. I'm doing great.

Everything's fine. Okay. You do it. Well, so we know that that kind of a weekend isn't within everyone's purview of being able to afford or wouldn't immediately buy because, you know, it's 2019. You don't know what's going down and that's why we are giving away to one lucky murder Reno and their luckiest friend. Of our choosing.

Of our choosing. We get to pick your friend. It's a contest where we're giving away tickets to come and spend my favorite weekend with us. Yeah. Travel's not included. You have to get yourself to and from Santa Barbara. But once you get there.

Yeah. You can stay on our couch in our hotel room too. Not mine. Okay. Well, instead. How about we give you a two night stay at the Hilton Santa Barbara Beachfront Resort instead? How about that?

How about admission to the Arlington Theater on November 1st for our mini sew taping and on the second for our full episode taping with special guests and openers? How about two level two reserves? I don't know what that means. Seats. Yeah. Two good seats. Really good seats.

How about an invitation to the opening night cocktail reception that includes hors d'oeuvres. My favorite thing. And beverages. My other favorite thing. My parents by Karen and Georgia. Who? What? You have a mission to the per cast taping at the Arlington exclusive official.

My favorite weekend merch. And of course, we're going to be doing a meet and greet and you're going to get a signed poster and you got to be at the meet and greet. It's really kind of comprehensive contest because we want somebody that maybe couldn't go otherwise to be there with us because we're not our latest. Yeah. We want you to come. We want you to win the contest.

Are you feeling lucky, punk? Come and try to win this. We would love to see you there. We're so excited for this weekend. We really think it's going to turn out to be really fun. Go to my favorite weekend.com for all the information or and then go to the news site on our regular website, my favorite murder.com, there's the news and it'll show you how to do that.

How to enter this contest? Yes. Yeah. What more exciting business do we have? I mean, I don't want to say it because I wanted to save it for my fucking hooray, but it's at the top. It's just staring at me at the top of my paper. Okay.

It's the Count Chocula season. Is that true? It's Count Chocula season and that's my fucking hooray. I'm going to say I have to think of a new one now. They bring it back for Halloween. They bring, remember, Boo-Berry? Yeah. Yeah.

What's the other one? Frankenberry. Frankenberry. Steven's got to know this. He's a millennial. Boo-Berry. Steven, Count Chocula. Boo-Berry.

Okay. Those two are gross, but I didn't know how good this fucking Count Chocula situation was until my stoner husband. You were summed down for you? Yeah. See, I was always a Boo-Berry fan. What? I don't like chocolate in my cereal.

Berry flavored cereal? Hell yeah, girl. Oh my God. You start with tricks. You move up to Lucky Charms. Never did. Oh, Lucky Charms are good. Boo-Berry's kind of fruity.

Is it? Yeah. Okay. Fruity pebbles? No. Hey. Ew. You like cocoa pebbles?

Yes. Steven? Steven? You got them all correct. All right. I got them in 1974 called Fruit Brute and it was a werewolf. Oh. Poor werewolf.

What happened to him? Before even my time. Fruit Brute? Fruit Brute. Oh, wait. And there's also fruity yummy mummy, which is discontinued in 87. No, I don't remember that. Can I see that mummy?

I want yummy mummy back. I really love mummies. I think they're the funniest part of Halloween. We've got to start a campaign to bring yummy mummy back. Yummy mummy, baby. Look at that. It actually looks kind of familiar. Oh, yeah.

Maybe they redid it and, you know, whatever. Fruity yummy mummy. Oh, well, if we're going to talk about this, which I like that we are, and could talk about all cereals forever, because I do have this problem with corn pops. I can't buy them because I will eat the entire box. I just keep doing the balance of a little more milk, a little more cereal, until it's three days later and I've gained 20 pounds. But Stephen pulled a prank on all of us.

Did you hear about this? No. So on the... You want to talk about that, Stephen? Stephen turned red. Well, it was when you did that amazing read of the haunted house, like, let's play a game. I basically just, like, clipped that part out and put it back at the end of the mini-soad. Very end of the mini-soad.

So it's Georgia talking? Yeah. Oh, okay. It's her, let's play a game. Let's play a game. Yeah, that is basically a hidden track at the end of the mini-soad. And everybody thinks it's me on Twitter because I've gotten, oh, I don't know, 25 tweets with people describing where they were, what happened.

And of course, the morning it starts. So it happens later when it's, like, quiet and... It's at the end after Elvis gets his cookie. Oh, that's another thing I want to talk about, yes. So it's basically, like, no one's expecting it and suddenly you come in whispering, let's play a game. Stephen and Marie. Marie.

Ray. So everyone's going, I'm driving my car and I blow, blow, blow. There's so much, Karen. And I'm like, I don't know what's going on right now. That's hilarious. And I, but Stephen, I love the spirit of it. Let's start doing stuff like that for Halloween. We're all about it.

You just have to tell us what's happening on our own show first. No, don't tell us. I want other people to be like, you know what just happened on your show? You just, I just crashed my car because of what you did that you don't know you did it. I like that. I like that other people have to tell us and be like, guess what it is. It was really funny because the first tweet I read, the guy seemed mad. And of course it's Twitter.

So I'm always expecting people to be mad. And you know what? I'm just here to tell you it. We were like, okay. What did I do? And then as I read it, I'm like, okay. And they're like, thanks for that hidden track. I spilled coffee all over myself and blow, blow, whatever.

And I'm like, yeah, I don't know what any of this is. I'm like, maybe he's got the wrong podcast. Well, I was on the tweet. I was on the thread that you guys were writing when you were like, Stephen, did you put something into the end of the, like Stephen, there's a hidden track. What's going on? He's like, oh yeah, I did. Sorry.

And you go, no, I love it. Can you just tell me next time? It's hilarious. I thought you were mad at him at first. No, no, no. But I was like, I'll let me be in on the joke. I mean, I don't want to be in on it. I don't want to know, Stephen.

I'll text Karen separately. Yes, exactly. Just get the clearance because, you know, who knows the one day that you're like, you know, it'd be great if I snuck up behind someone with a knife in my hand. I'm like, Stephen, no, let me be there to tell you, no, it's a bad idea. Speaking of hilarious. It's great. Speaking of Elvis.

Really kicked off squad gourd season really nicely. Squad gourd season. Did you see that song? I need to get them credit. Someone who works at Trader Joe's, who are all our friends, put up a squad gourd, what's it called, sign in there. Like one of their chalkboard things? Yes.

Because gourds are on sale? Can you say it who it is, Stephen? It's Molly K. Bales. She posted a photo of, it's the squad gourds above the pumpkins and squashes. It's like one of those circular squash displays and it says squad gourds. And we love you, Molly K. Bales. Thank you so much. Trader Joe's is like family to us.

That's so exciting. I mean, for real, because Stephen just branded Trader Joe's before we started taping, I have a Trader Joe's bean and cheese burrito balancing me out right now. What kind did you get? I got the Italian wrap. Oh. Yeah. Gross.

We had a moment. We had a whole moment because I was like, Stephen's like, do you want anything from Trader Joe's? And then I immediately in my mind start shopping through that appetizer section that I have lived off of sometimes. And I'm like, no, just get me a burrito. Yeah. Let's just be reasonable about it. Let's balance it out.

Let's balance some things out. But still, bean and cheese burrito, can't spit at that. You really can't. I mean, you shouldn't. That's gross. Don't spit at it? Don't. No, no, I won't.

But I do like to spit on my food before I eat it. It's like claiming it. It tenderizes it. You've got to get those enzymes to mush up your food. And chew every bite 40 times. Okay. Speaking of food and Elvis, I wanted to make it clear because I've actually had a couple of questions about this on Instagram.

So every single week when Elvis meows at the end of the show, it's brand new. We don't reap, even though we're not recording in our house, my house anymore, our house that we live in together. Yeah. I like to think of it as my house too. I get a new Elvis, Stephen texts me at like 10 p.m. and is like, can I get an Elvis? And I'm like, yeah. And then I wait for hours and he's like, hey, sorry to bug you, can I get an Elvis?

I'm like, yes, yes, yes. So there's a new Elvis every time. I just want everyone to know you're not being fucking cheated. I would never do such a thing. So sorry, people were like inquiring, like, is that the same Elvis as last week? Or I miss Elvis's new meow every week, but it is new every week. Yeah. Like literally, maybe there was one week where I was off.

Oh, I see. So people are assuming because we're not in your house that they're being served up some old Elvis. Yes. Yes. No. And I just want to go ahead and set the record straight right now about my cat. Really quick corrections corner and I'm so disappointed and I'm so sorry to tell everyone this.

It's not Sprankers and there's no exclamation mark in it either. It's actually Sprakers, New York. Sprakers, New York. So I just threw an N in there and had the time of my life. So yeah, something took place in Sprankers. Yeah. Sprankers. Well, our heart belongs in Sprankers.

I mean, yeah, if you're not named Sprankers, you've made a mistake and let's get out there on that town sign and spray paint an N. Let's become mayor of that town, change the fucking name, put an exclamation mark at the end of it. Did you get a direct message about how you did that wrong? I think I got a couple of comments. Oh yeah. Yeah.

Which is fine. Yeah. I like Sprankers better. I love Sprankers. Sprankers. Yeah, they don't care. But you know where they do listen is in the sprained ankle capital, Sprankers. I mean, that's why I really, I love it.

I am the mayor already. Okay. Yeah. Succession. We're both catching up. Succession. There's a great Colin Colkin fucking that you're missing out on. Kieran Colkin?

Kieran, what did I say? Colin Colkin. Great. I mean, that's the fifth brother. There's a storyline that it's perverted and I fucking love it so much. Oh, I can't wait. I'm gleeful about it. Okay.

I love him. I love him as a performer. I love that character on that show. He's so good. He's very dynamic and fun to watch. Oh my God. And I, that's the kind of person I want to be in a room with all the time. Yeah.

He's such a dick. The shit disturber that will say things to your face. I think I'm like the episode before. Okay. My problem is I bought that weighted blanket because I bought Georgia a weighted blanket for her birthday and then of course I was like, well, then I should have one too. If Georgia's going to get one, you're like my big sister, if Georgia's going to get one, then I want to literally, literally, I have a lot of issues left over from being

five, but I also was like, I've always loved that moment at the dentist where they put it on you. Oh yeah. They put the lead blanket on you to take your X-rays and so when I was getting it for you, I was like, I was like, oh, this will make her feel good. And if she has anxiety or whatever, I'm like, I have all that shit. Yeah. You're like, wait a minute.

I need it too. Yeah. Exactly. I have it too. I'm sick too, mom, but I put that thing on. I start watching TV in 11 minutes into any show. I'm out like a light. It's crazy.

I really like it. I'm going to save that for something around that for my real backends. I'm going to write. Yes. Okay. Looking for a better cooking routine? With meal planning, shopping, and prepping handled, Hello Fresh has you covered. Hello Fresh makes home cooking easy and affordable so you can stay on track and on budget in the

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slash murder20 and use code murder20. Goodbye. What makes a person a murderer? Are they born to kill or are they made to kill? I'm Candice DeLong and on my new podcast Killer Psyche Daily, I share a quick 10-minute rundown every weekday on the motivations and behaviors of the criminal masterminds, psychopaths, and cold-blooded killers you hear about in the news. I have decades of experience as a psychiatric nurse, FBI agent, and criminal profiler.

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Well, the problem is that last night, yesterday I spent all day working on my murder, I almost finished the whole story. I got into bed at like 11.30, went to like read it, thank you, read it for this heads up. I've done it before, it turns out. I went to like, I put intent girl Reddit to get some more information. That was early days. I was episode 31, that was Lulu, the Lulu lemon murder that you did.

Oh yeah. Yeah. Episode 31. So, and it was everything that I, even like the dough network, it was about that too, which I was like, I'm going to add that into the story, it's going to be great. I don't fucking did, intent girl and the dough network. What's wrong with me as she sips a fucking can of white wine? You know what it is?

Before you pick the story you want to do, like you sit there and kind of go, what interests me right now? It's compelling for me to sit here and write about and read about for a full day. So it makes sense, because if you've already liked it, you still like it. I mean, it still interests you. But during it, I was like, where did I read it? I realized it was the book, the skeleton crew, but I was like, I know I write about this in some book or something, and it was just turned out that I had done all the research

for it. Right. What the fuck? Okay. This is how we learn and grow. That's right. Are you first or am I first? I think it's you, right?

Yeah, from either the prodigal son or the Irving show. Oh, yeah. Double time. Double first. So when I thought of this one this morning, I googled the name of it, and then my favorite murder and nothing came up. Great. So still, we don't know if that means anything.

I mean, you know what I realized? And it only works for mine, but I'll ask Jay, I'll be like, I want to do this one. We've done it. I could just go through my own documents and search my favorite murder file, at least from my own. Yeah, I guess so. Yeah, I think some of mine are gone, but if you go, there's a Wikipedia with all the episodes, so I just do control F and look for it, and it's not there.

Oh, good to know. So I'm counting on you guys, Wikipedia. Like we have for this whole podcast, Wikipedia and Reddit. Thank you. And Wikifeet. Thank you. Wikifeet, most importantly, thank you. Murder and Murderpedia.

Murderpediafeet. Murderpediafeet. Thank you. Okay. Bucket. I'm doing the Diet Love Pass. Oh, we've never done that. No.

Amazing. Okay. Amazing. Diet Love. Why do you have even a pause about this one? I don't know. And did you look up the pronunciation? Yes, it's great.

Great. Diet Love. Because I've been making it up the pronunciation in my head every time I look at it. Until today, it was the Diet Love Pass in my mind. Yes, me too. It's not. Is that because we did it already? No, no, no.

We did the Diet Love Pass. We happened in the Diet Love Pass. So here we go. Yes. And there's so many. The reason I'm nervous about this one is because there's literally 60 over 60 versions of what happened. Yes.

Of people speculating. Right? And so there's so many articles. There's so much to look at. The ones I got the most from were Wikipedia, AllThat'sInteresting.com, a YouTube video by someone called Let Me Know. It's L-E-M-M-I-N-O, DietLovePass.com, which has like fucking crazy, all the photographs, all the info.

I like that the idea that the pass bought themselves a web page. They're like, you know, and I'm getting a lot of heat and I should be the one that's getting the attention. I have something to say about my pass. No, I don't want.net, I want.com. And then I took a little walk-in, listened to the Stuff You Should Know podcast about it. So.

Hi, Chuck. Hi, Chuck. All right. Here's the basics, the facts that we do know. Okay. In January of 1959, a group consisting of two women and eight men, they're from the USSR, they form a hiking and skiing expedition to reach the peak of Or-to-Tun Mountain. I'm going to get every fucking name and place wrong on this, everyone.

I mean, it is Russia. Yeah. So. Yes, my family's from there. But no. Look, they're not, they left there. And they didn't speak it anyways. They didn't bring any pronunciation books with them.

Also there's the Soviet Union, Russia, the USSR. There's all the versions. We understand historians are going to be offended if we say the wrong version. That's right. I've actually been to Russia. That's right. I'll add that in. I'll sprinkle it in during your story.

I wish you would. Do you, though? I do. So it's the Or-to-Tun, it's a mountain in the northern Urals and the Soviet Union. So out of the 10 people who were going to go on this fucking expedition, nine of them wouldn't survive. Someone survived? Well.

Oh. Here we go. Okay. The leader of the group was named Igor Dyatlov. So that's why they named it. It's his past. It's his past. Got it.

After this incident, obviously. He's 23 years old. He's a really, really brilliant radio engineering student at the Ural Polytechnical Institute. He's supposed to be, like, well-liked. Everyone wants to go on his hikes. Like, he is the dude. Like, pick me. You know, like.

Oh my God. I love Igor. Yeah. Igor. Igor. Igor. Igor. And there's a shit ton of photographs from this.

Everyone was taking pictures. And it's not, and it's like, 1959, but these are like good photos. And it's these young kids that are having this adventure and they're having so much fun and you can see him there. Yeah, he's cute. Beautiful Russians. Beautiful Russians. With their cheekbones.

That's right. The most of the other hikers were fellow students at the university with him. Everyone in the group was an experienced hiker and hiker and also, like, they're doing cross-country skiing. So I'm just calling them hikers because they're going up a mountain. But they're snow involved. Yeah. Yes.

Oh, it's like fucking middle of winter. Snowy mountains. I'd be like, Igor, listen, I like your idea and I like your spirit. Let's save it for June. Exactly. It's beautiful in June. They're all experienced with ski tour experience as well. And upon completing this trip, they are so good that they would be receiving a certificate

that awarded them the highest, like, level of ski or hiker person available. From the Olympics? No. But like a signed certificate that's like, yes, you can go to these. You know what I mean? Like you and I, and we're like, I want to go to this mountain. We'd have to have this certificate showing that we've actually gotten off our asses. Because people are like, no, no.

Stay away. Exactly. They're like, it's like black diamond skiing of hiking. Yes. It's like gold star, gold star. Got it. Okay. So they knew what they were doing.

The route that they're taking to reach the peak was estimated as a category three. Like that's how fucking hard it is, which is the most difficult. And that's especially at the time of year because it was all snowy and shit. It's January. It's about to be February. Cut to me on a category one, wheezing and going back to my car. Uh-huh. Yeah.

Well, so the group of 10 headed off on their trek on January 27th. But one day into their trip, one of the members, they had like just gotten to these cabins. They had to take like a train and a fucking cart and a fucking horse and all this shit to get like, and they stay at night at these cabins. Two mules carrying eight people. That's right. So the one of the members, the guy who survives, Yuri Yudin, he is like, oh, shucks everyone. I have this crazy knee and joint pain.

I think he had arthritis. So I can't continue to hike. I'm staying behind. Oh. So that's why he survived. Oh. So he wasn't technically really in the group. Exactly.

Where the shit went down. So he's the you and me of this group. Or like, gosh, it's warm in here. You guys, we got to keep this fire stoked. Yeah. I'm going, that'll be my job. That's my job. I'll see you guys in a minute.

But the remaining group of nine continued on to the trek. So from here, and they also kept really great diaries as well as the photographs. So the photos and diaries are the, that are later found are all there is that can track the group's route. So they can use these to track them. On January 31st, the group arrived at the edge of a highland area, and they began to prepare for climbing. And they left behind some surplus food and equipment.

So like for when they come back down. The following day, February 1st, they start to move through the pass. And it seems like they were planning to get over the pass and make camp like near the summit the next night on the opposite side. But they are, there's a snowstorm and there's decreased visibility. And it looks like they accidentally went west when they were expecting to go north. So they got stuck. They realized they were way behind.

And so they were already on this crazy slope. And so when they got there, they decided for some reason to set up camp there, rather than move almost a mile downhill to this is like forested area. And it's not heavy, but there's trees and shit, so they can kind of get some shelter. But it's a mile away. So they probably didn't want to backtrack and they probably didn't want to go downhill. And then also it's possible that they want to just like have the experience of sleeping on a slope as well and like get all those brownie points or whatever the fuck, you know,

Russian brownie points. Vodka points. This mountain is translated to dead mountain in the indigenous language of the Mancey people of the region. So that's fucking foreshadowing. Before they had left, Dyatlov had said that he would send a telegram back to the sports club that they were a part of as soon as the group returned to that village where good old Yuri had stayed behind during the soup.

But they were supposed to be back no later than February 12th, but it was possible it was going to take longer. So no one really worried when the 12th passed and there was no messages and no one back home freaked out. But by the 20th, the families of the hikers were like, what's fucking going on? This isn't good. I hate that old fashioned time issue where there's no direct way to communicate. And it's like, you know, if you're somewhere, people won't realize things for weeks and

weeks. In any story that fills me with anxiety. There's a lot. Yeah, because it's not just like they had to go make a phone call to find them. If you have to wait and wait and you can't find them, you have to go fucking hike up that hill and look for them. That's a big trek for these hardcore hikers. So their families are freaking out.

They probably can't go looking for them. So they talk the head of the institute into sending out some volunteer students and teachers to search for the hikers. They do that. And there's photographs of all of this, too, of when they reach the camp. They've volunteers found the campsite on February 26th. So at this point, they had last written in their diary on the first, I believe. So it's February 26th at this point.

They get to the camp and they're like, something is very wrong. They found the groups abandoned and badly damaged tent covered in a thin coat of snow. But the hikers' belongings and equipment are all still at the campsite. They're orderly. It doesn't seem like anything had happened. The hikers had just left them there and there are nine sets of footprints walking away from the campsite. And so everyone is screaming right now, doesn't know this, it's an avalanche.

But they put their skis in a circle around the tent and they're all still standing up exactly the way they left them. So I don't know. I feel like an avalanche would be pretty clearly easy to identify because it's all the snow coming down. Right. I feel like you wouldn't even find the tent. Right.

Who knows? We'll get to the theories. Okay. One of the students who found the campsite said that, quote, the tent was half torn down and covered with snow. It was empty and all the groups' belongings and shoes had been left behind. And the weirdest of all is that the tent had been sliced open with a knife from the inside. It had a couple cuts on it and the searchers were like, what the fuck?

So at the side of the fucked up tent. And it was sliced open right next to the zipper. And the zipper was broken. Oh, wait. This whole thing because it was broken zipper. The side of the fucked up tent, there's so much information. So once this happened, of course, it's the Soviet Union. They put this into secret fucking files and don't let it come out into the 90s.

So a lot of this is speculation. Maybe some of the facts aren't even right that we know of. Eight or nine sets of footprints are found leaving the tent and they look like the footprints and they can tell that whoever left are only wearing socks or a single shoe or barefoot and by the footprints, it looks like they're walking away, not running. And to me, this is the most fucked up part where like there's like a couple of things in it that any theory you go with, these little pieces don't fit and them walking away doesn't fit to me.

No. You know? Yep. I mean, in your socks, in the snow. With no other footprints, so it's not, you can't say someone like attacked them. Yeah. It's just like you went to have a wander for no reason. Without your shoes.

Yeah. In the snow. No. So the searchers followed the footprints and it led back down towards that foresty area that they hadn't wanted to go to. It's the woods nearby and almost a mile to the northeast and at the forest edge under a large cedar tree, the searchers found the remains of a small fire and there they also found the first of the two bodies.

Yuri Krivonnischenko, Krivonnischenko, thank you, who's 23 and another Yuri Doroschenko, 21. They're both shoeless and dressed only in like their undergarments and you can see fucking photos of this online and the temperatures are under, like, would have been under 25 or below 30 on the night of their death. So why did they walk out in their fucking underwear? Right. There's branches on a nearby tree that are broken all the way up to about 16 feet high.

So suggesting maybe that one of the hikers had climbed up to look around and see, like, where things had, you know, where his fucking people were or whatever, or we're trying to hide from someone up there on the tree. Yeah. That's creepy, right? Yes. Okay. So between the forest and the camp, they find three more bodies.

So it looked like that they were trying to walk back towards the camp away from the forest. Those bodies were that of Dyatlov, Zenita Komogorva, who's 24, and Restam Slobodan, who's 23. And so they had fallen in such a way that seemed that they were walking back towards the camp, so, like, forward towards the camp. And they had a little bit more clothes on than the other two, but not much and definitely not enough to be on the cold. So, and this was a mile away from the tent, so, like, it wasn't like they were running to take a piss, you know?

Yeah, yeah. It's far. Yeah. So while the circumstances were weird, the cause of death was for all five hikers had been hypothermia. So it wasn't that odd, but not, they didn't know why they walked out of their tent. Their bodies showed no indication of severe damage and it was just hypothermia. And then it isn't until the other four bodies are found two months later that the story gets

even weirder. I'm sorry, but I love this. When I first found the story, I almost cried from, like, this is the kind of thing I want to read for the rest of my life. It also feels like the kind of thing that whether it's American hidden top secret files or Russian or any other country, like, there must be a million stories like this that we just don't know about, that it's like X file stuff where they show up and go, okay, lock this whole thing down and we're not talking about this.

Whether it's military or fucking aliens or some kind of, you know, anything. The Yeti. The Yeti. Which I will hold on to and argue with you in this entire episode. I have it at the very end so we can start fighting that. Okay, good. Because I barely, I barely talk about it. I'm sorry.

So you'll have to tell everyone the details. Oh, really become a Yeti truth, I'm right at the end. A Yeti truth. Oh my, shirts for sure. I mean, I'm just saying, 16 feet up in a tree, how are you up there? Make Yeti's shoulders. Make Yeti, great again. Okay, so the rest of the bodies are found.

They're finally found on May 4th. So this is the beginning of February they had gone missing. And they're found May 4th under 13 feet of snow in a ravine, almost 250 feet further into the woods from where the others were found. So it's almost like these two guys were like, we're staying put here and we'll light a fire and climb a tree for some fucking reason. These three were like, we're going to walk back to the tent and these other four were like, we're going deeper into the forest.

So like, why did they split up? I mean, just off the top, more scared goes further into the forest. The other brave ones are like, you know what, this is fine, let's go get our shoes. Then they leave the people that are still near the fire, hear something and go up into the tree to see what happened. And then they, how do they die? Yeti. Okay.

But, but I wonder if like for mountain climbers and for hikers and shit splitting up is a no-no. Yeah, but so is walking in the snow with no shoes on. They are enough. Right? It's a Yeti. It's a Yeti. I mean, it seems like, did they get dose with acid? Was there some?

Okay. I won't do it. Well, no, no, let's talk about it because there is a theory and I didn't really talk about it much that the local tribe, the indigenous tribe, do have the mushrooms that they like to fuck around with. And one of the things that they do is hang them from like socks from a tree. So did they fucking climb a tree and eat those mushrooms and go absolutely apeshit and cut themselves out of the fucking tent?

Yeah, because like they are college students. So they're, they could be there to party a little bit. Yeah, but they're like engineer students. Do you know engineers party the hardest? They'll like make a radio that drugs you. Actually, that's an, okay, we're not doing that. No, why? Yes.

Radio waves. Okay. Okay. The three of them had more clothes on than the other hikers, including some of the clothing that belonged to their dead friends, meaning that possibly they died first and they took their clothes from them. And so they knew their friends were fucking dead. How horrible is that?

Let's go deeper into the forest. And getting away from that area. That's right. So their body, there were more questions once their bodies were examined. Three of the hikers had fatal injuries, including Nikolai Thibabriganolis, Nikolai, I apologize. He was 23. He had suffered significant skull damage that had led to his death. So he had been hit in the head with something, Ludmila Dubinina, who was 20 and Semyon Zolotaryov,

who was 38. Not bad, right? No, pretty good. Doing my best. Yeah, you are. You have major chest fractures. And the weird thing about these wounds that they had is there was no surface wounds. So it's not like someone took a hatchet or whatever.

It's like compression. Yeah. And then it was said that they could only be caused by immense force comparable to that of a car crash. Or bigfoot. Or Russian bigfoot. Or like, you know, I wonder if like if you butted someone with a gun that probably tears skin, right?

I mean, I don't know. I don't know if they would be bruising. But. Stephen, stand up. It's terrible. Stephen climbed this trail. So we're sending Stephen. This is the other contest.

One lucky listener is going with Stephen to the top of the Diet Love Pass to work some theories out. Yeah. So yeah. So it's comparable to that of a car accident. So it's like blunt force trauma. Yeah. And how?

Out in the middle of nowhere. Well, they're in a ravine. So it's possible they fell, but no one wants to believe that. Okay. The most gruesome part of the Diet Love Pass incident is for poor Da Benina. She's missing her tongue, her eyes, part of her lips, as well as facial tissue and a fragment of her skull bone. And she had extensive skin maceration on her hands.

So yeah, go ahead. Defensive bone? I don't know. Nobody knows. It's like most people think that an animal, a scavenger came and took those things, but why didn't they take them from the other people, too? Yeah. And also why didn't they take other, because usually scavengers take soft tissue, all those

things, but more. They don't stop at just a couple things. There's also possibility that she was in the, they had fallen into the ravine and she was in the water. And so the water washed that away, possibly. I want to believe the weird ship, but there's like explanations on either side for all of them. And I don't want to ignore them.

But yeti. But yeti? And yeti. They also found the body of Alexander Kolvatov, who was 24 in the same location, but he didn't have the severe trauma. So, and actually none of the bodies aside from Dubinina had any external wounds associated with bone fractures, as if they'd been subjected to a high level pressure instead of a violent attack.

That's weird. It could be described with falling, but I like this other theory that I'll get to. There was initial speculation, originally they were like, maybe the Mansi people had gotten pissed that they were on their land and attacked them, but you know, people hiked and camped there all the time and the Mansi people were not, they were peaceful, so that was discounted. In fact, all attacked by humans was ruled out because the hikers' footprints were the only ones that were there, right?

In the end, it was reported that six of the group members died of hypothermia and three of fatal injuries. The victims had died six to eight hours after their last meal, so they were probably sleeping in the middle of the night. And at the time, the verdict was that the group members had all died because of, and this is what they ended it with, compelling natural force. That's what they called it. What's that?

Let's close the fucking files tonight. Compelling natural force like a hurricane? Yeah. Yeah. What is... Or avalanche. I think that's what they're insinuating. I see.

So, the inquest was closed in May of 1959, like right when they found the four others, and the files were sent to a secret archive. Where? Night night. I don't... In the USSR. Good luck finding them. And what else is in there?

Oh, my God. Can you imagine? Come on. But the thing about that is, it's like, oh, it sounds so sinister and spooky, but like, it was the Soviet Union, no files were allowed to be out. So it wasn't until the 90s that they got the files out. So the theories, exclamation mark, I wrote. Avalanche.

Obviously, an avalanche is the first explanation that would pop into my head. And I want to fucking believe that because I love it being like, no, but it's not what you think it is. It's just a simple thing. Perhaps they thought they heard one coming or thought they heard one coming and cut themselves out of the tent and headed as they were out to the tree line, but then why would they be walking? You know?

Yes. Not running. I guess you can. And also, why would you cut yourself out of a tent? Right. If you're walking somewhere and you have the calmness to walk somewhere, why would you... See, this is why I... Have the lack of calm of cutting yourself out of a zippable tent.

See, to me, it's like, if they're wrong about the footprints and someone just misread that, then that explains a lot of shit and it could be more likely to be any of these things. But also, and this could just, and probably as pure ignorance on my part, how are we talking about the detail of footprints during or after or within an avalanche? Right. Because wouldn't that all be wiped away? Well, maybe the avalanche had already happened and then they cut themselves out and got out. Oh.

Maybe the tent had collapsed. Yeah. Okay. But that makes sense. Yes. But all the skis, and you can see in a photo, are standing straight up exactly where they're replaced. These strong, super strong skis.

The strongest skis. The strongest Russian skis. That's right. Russian skis. Oh, no. Siberian Russian skis. Russian skis. Yeah.

The other thing about the cut that I like, the cut in the tent, is that maybe they thought someone was watching them. And so they didn't want to unzip their fucking tent and be like, yo, why are you watching us? Okay. Instead, they cut a hole to be like, peeky boo. Was the cut hole on the opposite side of the entrance? I don't know.

It was on the, it was like on the side of the tent, I believe, and you can see photos of the tent on the website. Yeah. If you just go to dietlawpass.com, you can see all those photos. But there are a few points of evidence that contradict the avalanche theory. The location had no signs of any avalanche having taken place, and an avalanche would have left certain patterns of debris, distributed all over the place, they're not there, and it would have caused more serious injuries and different injuries on the bodies.

Then over a hundred expeditions to the region have been there since and they've been there before and none of them ever reported conditions that would create an avalanche, especially in February, like maybe later when the snow's melting and shit, but not in February. Also they were all experienced skiers and experienced hikers and experienced in this type of terrain. So it's really unlikely that they would have set up a camp, you know, they would have known about avalanche things. Risk.

Thank you. So blah. And then the footprints, of course. Okay. I'm not feeling the avalanche theory. It's the most obvious one and it's like the simple one. It answers the compression injuries, which are the scariest because they're the most mysterious.

Yeah. So it's like going, here's this clear natural occurrence, right? So you've got your scientists, they're like, it's clearly this, but then I know. Especially when only four of the bodies have that injury. Like that's weird too, that that's nine of them and they all kind of had different issues. The next one is the catabatic, catabotic wind, all right. Okay. In 2019, a Swedish Russian expedition was made to the site and the investigators proposed

that a violent catabatic wind is the explanation. The winds are a rare wind rush that rushes down elevated slopes at hurricane speeds and can be extremely violent and was implicated in a similar case in Sweden where eight hikers died in 1978 after the aftermath of this kind of wind. And the topography of these locations are similar to that expedition. So it's like these hurricane-like winds that fucking sweep down the mountain. Isn't that just the Lord? Isn't everything just the Lord?

Isn't everything at the end of the day. Hallelujah. That's tambourine time. Yeah. I mean, God, it's just like, but what other place, I would just like to read other things about that thing happening to other people aside from one other time because- Right, but it did kill people. And it would explain, okay, it would have explained why they had to get out of the tent and couldn't

unzip it and had to, and then also walking slowly, they're walking against the wind. Oh. Right? I just thought of that. Yeah. Oh, that is good. I'm fucking smart. Also, when they're later stuck in a box, what if this is death by my, sorry, very disrespectful.

This whole thing, though, is tensing me up real good because it feels like they went out into an area that they thought they knew to do the thing they knew and then something X-Files style happened to them. And it's just like, so it's like these photos of them going on like the beginning of a hike. They're these like, they're having fun. They're posing. They're all adorable, like young people who are, you know, stirring their lives out and just doing this fun adventure.

And then like you look at these photos, of course, which is what I always do and be like, you're gonna die. Yeah. It's so sad. And in a weird, mysterious way. Yeah. And everyone's gonna talk about you for the next fucking, how many years is that? Quite sometimes.

Many years. 70? Oh, and the other weird thing was there was a flashlight left on, turned on, on top of the tent. So maybe they left it there so that they could find their way back when they needed to. Then maybe that's why he climbed that tree to like look for the flashlight. Where's the light? Maybe you couldn't see it.

Okay. The next one is Infrasound. I like this one. So this is popularized by Donnie Iker's 2013 book about this called the Dead Mountain. It's called Dead Mountain. And that is the wind going around. There's a wind that's called Caraman Vortex Street. Don't ask me.

Caraman Street is an avenue? Yes. Okay. So it's a repeating pattern of swirling vortices. Vortices, sure. Yeah. Yeah. A great word.

Yeah. Caused by a process known as a vortex shedding. So it's basically this little, I think the last podcast on the left called it Tiny Tornadoes. Okay. It's this rare weather phenomenon that can produce infrasound, which is vibrations in the air, which are too low for humans to hear, but they're capable of inducing panic attacks in humans. So think of when you get really close to like a box fan and it's like, oh yeah.

Hear it all weird. It's like that, but times, but the Lord did it. Okay. You know what I mean? It's coming from every direction. That's right. And it's whipping up your, yeah, like there's something in your central nervous system freaks the fuck out and you have these panic attacks and freak out.

Yeah. And so that's why you would get out and run. That makes sense. Or walk. Yeah. It's something bad's about to happen. You've got to go. Right.

And that because of their panic, the hikers left their tent by whatever means necessary, cutting open and flood down the slope. But by the time they were further down the hill, they would have been out of the infrasound's path. They would have regained their composure and they would have tried to go back. But the darkness wouldn't have allowed them to. So the traumatic injuries suffered by the three victims that were the other victims in the ravine was the result.

He says of them stumbling over the ledge of the ravine and the darkness and landing on the rocks at the bottom. Would that cause like a lot of cuts and shit? I guess one of them did have that. You would think. Yeah. Yeah. Who knows?

That's awful. So basically a thing that no one's really familiar with happens is natural phenomenon that makes everyone just freak out and run. And then. Or walk. Because it has to be walk. Oh right. I know.

Troubling. Okay. So I did a military test and I wrote, it goes all the way to the top of the USSR. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. So there's another hiking group camping about 30 miles from the diet law of team on the same night as the incident.

The group said that at night they saw strange orange orbs floating in the sky in the area. And some suggest could have been a distant explosion. Okay. So there's like a lot of different facets to this. It's possible that the diet law of team accidentally stumbled into a USSR testing ground where a concussive weapon or perhaps a parachute mine exercise was taking place. And so I read all about parachute mines and World War II, they were these mines that instead of dropping to the ground and exploding and therefore the buildings around it would have

cushioned the explosion, they exploded in the air so they could take over the fuck they could take a better chunk of this shit out. Oh. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. It's really terrible. Also the, well I saw a special on, I think the news or say like Nightline or something

about those concussive sound guns that stop people in their tracks because it's like you can't, the force of the sound way, the force of the sound controls people. I think that's it. That's insane. Yeah. And that's super real. That's like, that was the thing of like how to control crowds and stuff. Yeah.

Like during the Cold War and these are fucking weaponized things that people are making. That they need to test. Yeah. That they're doing it and they would do it out in the middle of nowhere. In the middle of nowhere. Yeah. Right? Yeah.

So this theory alleges that the hikers were woken by a loud explosion and ran out of their tent in a panic without shoes or clothing or anything like that. And then some members froze to death attempting to run from it or walk from it. And others were then injured fatally by the subsequent parachute mind concussion. So that's how those people got those deep wounds. And it would make sense the walking in that one because if it's the sound one, it stops you from like being able to, your senses get scrambled basically. Moving and walking as hard, yeah, exactly.

I think it's that one. Yeah. Something like that, some military testing. Which is why they wanted to keep it secret so bad because basically they're like, oops, we killed nine people because we were testing our screwed up weird shit and we don't want to get blamed for it. Exactly. There are records of parachute minds being tested in the Soviet military in the area around

the time the hikers were there as well. And parachute minds can cause injuries similar to those experienced by the hikers, heavy internal damage with comparably less internal trauma. External trauma. Sorry. External, yeah. And because they detonate in the air, those sightings of the glowing orbs are falling from the sky make sense.

Okay. And one of the last photos in the role of one of the hikers doesn't make any sense and it's the spookiest thing you've ever seen. It just looks like, and there's a couple other ones that, so, oh, okay. One of the hikers who ran off with not a lot of clothing on, died with a camera around his neck. So they left behind their shoes, they left behind a knife, left behind all their shit, but he took a fucking camera.

Okay. And on that role, they're all overexposed and you can't really see what they are because of the damage to the camera, but some people think that they can see, think that it looks like he's pointing the photo to the sky, taking photos of flashes in the sky. And there's one other camera that has at the very end some weird photo that looks like a flash in the sky if you want to look at it like that. Okay. Okay.

That's very interesting. Isn't it? Yes. So maybe one of them walked out and they're like, you guys come out, you have to see this, they all walk out, then it turns out to be this thing. Yeah. Right? Yeah.

The person that goes out with the camera is kind of calm because it's like, ooh, what's this? Yeah. And then all hell breaks loose. Exactly. So, and it also was like, maybe they walked out of their tent just to look at what it was and then they had to take off for the tree line. Right.

So that's why they didn't have the clothes on. Or shoes, yes. And it's like, when they sleep in their clothes, am I just, I mean, maybe it's like, maybe they shed them. Yeah. Who knows? I don't know. It's, or if they're all in one tent and it's like nine people in a tent, that's going to

create a heat that then they don't need to sleep in their clothes. Well, also on that note, there was a homemade stove in the tent with them. Oh no. And the YouTube video, the YouTube guy that I found called, let me know, he thinks that there was a fire in the tent. And there was actually a photo from like the day before of one of the guys who like jokingly put on this burnt up jacket. So maybe there had been a fire in the tent previously from the stove.

And then it caught on fire again. Or and some of the, some of them had burn marks on them as well. Well, because also if it's like a kerosene stove, they could have been maybe gassed a little bit. Right. Like gotten high off of some weird kerosene leak or some, I don't know. Carbon monoxide poisoning. I guess something that would do that to you.

I don't know if they're stove. Also the two words together, homemade stove, don't exactly make me feel great. In a fucking canvas tent with all these people in clothing and shit. Small space, homemade stove. Absolutely. Who wants marshmallows? Get away. You want marshmallows?

No. The last photo taken is weird. So some people also think that it's a UFO. Like it looks like a glowing orb in the sky. And in fact, the Nancy hunters, the local hunters had drawn pictures of flying spheres, you know, around their fucking had drawn pictures of flying spheres and shit. So of course, these UFOs could just be part of the Soviet space program or rocket and subsequently something happened to them.

So it doesn't have to be an alien, but I think it's aliens. Could be. Yeah. So there's a theory of radiological weapons and yeti's, but I don't buy it. What's the theory? Come on. I don't know that there's yeti's. And there's one creepy photo that looks like, okay, to me, who doesn't believe in the shit.

It's a guy, one of them walked off the path to pee and as far away and it's just his shadow. Looks like a fucking yeti. Yeah. Is it white? No. It's like all in dark clothes. It also could look like a hunter coming after like, like stalking them and they got one photo of it.

Oh, Stephen has it. Stephen. Oh. I mean, that's classic Bigfoot action right there. It's like a Bigfoot stance. It looks very Bigfoot-y, but you're right. It could also be a guy in a snowsuit. Yeah.

Oh yeah. Absolutely. Because the picture above is a guy in a snowsuit and it's basically a blurry version of that picture. Right. The photos themselves are just the creepy, like it adds a creepy element. Now she's scrolling. Yeah.

Sorry. No, you're right. It's so horrifying. What do you think? Do you see the last one? The sphere one? No. Let me see.

Topper, but ooh. Oh. Vortex. Vortex pictures. Oh, there's your sphere. Got it. I mean, this is rabbit hole territory. Yes, it is.

Like, good luck, everyone. And I'm sorry. Well, and also, now I'm looking at it, there's graphs of how, like, avalanches work and the shapes of what things end up, oh my God. There are graphs. There are PowerPoint presentations. There are fucking 100,000 videos that you can find that explain whatever that wants to be explained.

Yeah. And in February 2019, it was announced, what, sorry, but there's just, there's a picture of one of the Native people. I'm trying to find what their name is. The Nancy. The Nancy people. And she's holding what looks like a cartoon mushroom, red cap with white dots on it. And she's wearing a red shirt with white dots on it.

They dress like it. It's like a symbolic thing when they go mushroom hunting to dress. Totally. Yeah. That's, yeah. So they could have just, like, taken drugs and freaked out in the tent and, like, I freaked out on drugs before and I was, like, at my own home. So it's, like, bleeding into a kind of Midsommar territory of, like, being just out in nature

and on drugs and then what happens? This is why we always tell you, stay at home. Stay in the city, in an apartment. There's so much good, like, Friday night television. Yeah. Stay at home and then near the phone so you can call 911 on yourself and go to jail. When you freak out on drugs. In February 2019, it was announced that the Russian authorities were reopening the investigation.

So this past February. Oh, my God. I know. But they're only allowing for three possible explanations to be considered an avalanche, a, quote, snow slab avalanche or a hurricane, which hurricane makes sense, too. The possibility of a crime has been completely discounted. And as I said, there's over 60 known versions and theories of what transpired that night, but it still remains a mystery.

Wow. And that is the mysterious Diet Law of Pass. Amazing. Ugh. I'm, like, a little bit worked up right now. Oh, my God. Because. I feel a little sweaty.

I know. It's like, I don't like, I don't like the idea that all those people died and nobody knows why and, and nobody, like, because here's the thing. I feel like those scientific theories, it's a vortices, it's, you know, a hurricane. It's this tiny tornadoes. Yeah. Like, I feel like, well, then if, if you love your scientific theory so much, prove it to be true or not true.

Yeah. That's the way science works. Yeah. But it's been so many years and no one's done that. And the idea that the government, this government could be hiding shit and know what happens. Yeah. Happened. And then let's go all the way into my cryptozoology area where we don't know what's in the mountains.

We don't know what's in, we don't, we haven't been out there long enough or far enough. And if the native people are like, we draw pictures of these things, they have been out there. And that's just another name for a snow gorilla. And nothing, and another word for nothing left to lose. That's right. Snow gorilla. Is that right?

That's kind of what they are, right? Yeah. They think so. No, I think you're right on. That was great. Thank you. Who was? Next week I'm doing a fucking easy one because that doesn't have Russian names in it.

I mean, those pronunciations were, they were tough, but I feel like we're not on, we're not in Russia yet, so we're not going to get a ton of shit. And I did the Roman arms and no one gave me shit, so as far as I know. I feel like the Russians aren't really like that, you know what I mean? Who like listen to podcasts? Yeah, there are like people who are of Russian descent, they're like big pictures, they're like, yeah, there's more going on in the world. I have to calm down a little bit because I just want to know that's what all those shows

and things and theories and I just want to know the truth and the answer. Do you know, I was thinking today that like, I kind of don't, but it's so boring. I mean, oftentimes it is. But I feel like in those ones where they don't put it to bed, when it is boring and they figure it out, they just release it, no one pays attention and it goes away. But in those ones where they don't or this like, I remember when I first read about this and it was like, this is proof that aliens came down and zapped everybody and all this weird shit that it's like, no, a lot of, you know, then it was like, oh, well, then we

all learn that when you have hypothermia, you get really hot and you take your clothes off and go out into the elements and you end up dying because you don't actually have an internal system anymore. You fall down a ravine and that's why I think, what if they already, we already do know the answer and it's avalanche, but we will never accept it. No matter what, everyone's going to be like, well, that does improve why they did this or why they did that. But it's like a fucking, it's a, it's an investigation report from the fucking 1959.

Yeah, but I feel like the point, the simple point of all of those skis were up and around and like that would have, avalanches, when I go to the dentist, this, this thing that's basically like a screensaver that just plays and it's like all different things in nature and I've watched it so many times and one of them is an avalanche and it makes me laugh every time because I'm like, I don't think this should be on, like it's nice to watch a guy climb a huge redwood tree. Is it the avalanche where like it's behind a skier? No.

See those? Then I would have a panic attack. I see those and I'm like, this isn't fun for anyone, including the skier. Except for that skier. You know, they're skier who drop, they drop into it, like they're like extreme skiers, I believe. Stephen's nodding his head, yes. Right?

He's an extreme ski watcher. Stephen, Stephen and I are super X games, extreme people. I'm about to tell you the story of Dr. Linda Hazard and the Starvation Heights. Do you know this one? Yes, I started reading the book. Oh, the book is so good. Yeah. Okay, good fucking pick.

Well, and here's why I was excited. Because I've read the book Starvation Heights by Greg Olsen, which is one of my main sources. When I realized that I actually have read the book and yet I haven't done it, it was like a miracle. I love that. It was like a gift from God. I was like, wait, I know this one. I love it and I hate it at the same time because I'm like, damn it, why didn't I fucking do

that one? I know. It's good. I love this book Starvation Heights by Greg to G's Olsen with an E. You have to read it because this story, I can't get into all the details of the experiences of the people who went to Starvation Heights. It's so nuts. It's so nuts and it has everything.

This story has everything because she's basically a cult leader, but then it also is like weird eating disorder issues and weird kind of, I have these problems and I'm going to decide this will solve everything and I'll commit to it even past the point where it's okay. Or I'm so wealthy that I have nothing else to do with my money and time and so I'm going to go trust these people to fix me. For real. And it's old timey too. So it's like.

All the good stuff. Yeah. Okay, we'll get into it. Let's do it. So read the book Starvation Heights by Greg Olsen. Also, Jay found a great article that's from Smithsonian Magazine. It was written by Best Lovejoy and it's from 2014. It's called The Doctor Who Starved Her Patience Today.

So we'll start. This is early 1911. During their stay at the Empress Hotel in Victoria, British Columbia, Canada, sisters Dorothea and Claire Williamson see an advertisement for Dr. Linda Hazard's self-published book Fasting for the Cure of Disease and they're very intrigued. These sisters are wealthy British orphans who are in their 30s and they've inherited their father's massive estate. And they're also, some might say hypochondriacs, Dorothea complains of swollen glands and

rheumatic pains while Claire has been diagnosed with a dropped uterus. Oh, don't look it up. It's not very nice. So I wouldn't call her a hypochondriac if that was really what was happening to her. But basically, they're people who don't feel healthy and they're looking for answers. And they've been doing it for a while and they'd already adopted several, for the time, alternative health regimens like not eating red meat and not wearing corsets. So their family thought they were crazy.

Like corsets, why you have a dropped uterus probably. Right? Oh. I wouldn't feel good either. Okay. No, it's horrible. So this wellness trend, like you're saying, it was very popular for the leisure class and for rich people, turn of the century America.

Whether it was taking the waters at a spa built around a natural spring. Kalanik. That was like a big, oh, got a moth. Oh yeah, that's good luck. Put this in a box. Oh, you almost got it. Put it in a box. Oh.

Kill it. No, no, it's good luck. What are you doing here? Where did you come from? Could I use your phone, please? Hello. My name's Ned. I'm a moth.

Okay. Spa built around natural spring lenders or checking into Dr. Kellogg's Battle Creek Sanatorium where corn flakes were invented. Rich people were very willing to spend money on getting well and there was no shortage of magnetic hucksters who would claim to hold the cure that ails them. So this was a big thing because there was no laws set up in turn of the century America. So you could basically be like, hey, I just put this oil together and it's castor oil with some lead in it and that's going to cure your acne.

And a touch of heroin just for fun. Right? And all they had to do apparently was they had to trademark the shape of the bottle so that you could tell one from the other. This is why we're going mud larking when we're in fucking England. We're going to find those fucking bottles. Yeah. And then we'll know for which, where everything's from.

Yeah. Because we're smart. Yeah. And we'll look it up. But essentially this was very common practice and kind of anybody who had the gumption to be like, this will cure you. Now some places do, like there, you know, those natural springs where it's like, there's copper in the water and now my arthritis is gone.

Not eating a lot of red meat is good, bran is good for you. Bran's good. Apparently corn flakes are good. The occasional enema. Apps of fucking tibley. Not the daily. No, no, no. Okay.

So this was common and it's, according to the Smithsonian, according to the Smithsonian article, the practice of fasting experienced a revival in the late 19th century because it was from ancient times. So it's like, you know, old philosophers would be like, yeah, just stop eating for a while and it'll set you right. Oh, you mean intermittent fasting? Yeah. That's all popular today.

That's all the rage today. But you know, and there's a, there's a truth to it. Like clean out your system, get rid of your toxins, detox, ease up on dairy and red meat and all the things and you will feel better. But there was in the late 19th century, a doctor named Edward Dewey wrote a book called The True Science of Living in which he said that quote, every disease that afflicts mankind develops from more or less habitual eating in excess of the supply of gastric, oh, and in excess of the supply of gastric juices.

So basically he was selling the idea that it all has to do with that and that so basically fasting was the solution to everything. So Dr. Linda Hazard, who had no formal medical degree, but she somehow because there was a, there was this weird loophole in the law in Washington state where if you had, they grandfathered in all these people that had, so she was, she had a degree as a fasting specialist given to her by the state of Washington. And then this loophole started where that basically meant she had a medical degree. Even though she had no for true formal training, like didn't graduate from a medical school.

So in 1908, she write, Linda Hazard writes this book called Fasting for the Cure of Disease and in it she writes quote, appetite is craving, hunger is desire, craving is never satisfied, but desire is relieved when want is supplied, which is also my favorite Depeche Mode lyric. It's so true. Old school jokes. That's good. Essentially Linda Hazard's theory of detoxing through fasting. It isn't new, but it very much appeals to the Williamson sisters as this could be the

cure for, because they've tried tons of other stuff and also they read about the Institute of Natural Therapeutics, which is Dr. Hazard's Institute, her sanatorium in Olala, Washington. And so they believe it to be a relaxing sanctuary in the wilderness. And so in February of 1911, the Williamson sisters traveled to Seattle for a consultation with Dr. Hazard. When they arrived, Dr. Hazard interviews the sisters and then breaks the news to them that the Institute in Olala is still being built. So she says, you definitely need to start this regimen.

It's going to fix everything, but you can't go to Olala right now. You need to get an apartment here in Seattle and Capitol Hill and start coming to my office and start the treatments and then we'll eventually transfer you up to the Institute in the forest. Sometimes too much money is too much money. I mean, and also just the idea that they were just at the most beautiful hotel in British Columbia and then they're like, oh, let's go diet in Seattle and then this insanely tragic horrible thing starts happening to them. And that is basically, oh, and this is another piece, a terrible piece of the puzzle, Dorothea

and Claire don't tell their family that they're going to do this because the family is already really critical of their homeopathic remedies and their unorthodox approach to their health. So the family is already going, stop spending money on this shit and you're being crazy. So they're like, oh, we're just going to go do this and they'll just think we're traveling. So that's a red flag that you need to pay attention to yourself if you don't want to tell your friends and family about what you're about to do. That's a problem, but figure out somebody to tell because somebody needs to know where you are.

So even if you're being a super weirdo and you're like, I decided what's going to cure me is I'm going to shoot up heroin five times a day. Write a note to your best friend from junior high and just be like, hey, can you keep this on the books just in case? Here's my dealer's number. Yeah, it's important. So Linda Hazard puts the Williamson sisters on her fasting program, which consists of a cup of broth made from canned tomatoes twice a day and hours long enema sessions in bathtubs

that are covered with canvas that hold them upright in case they faint. What? Hours long. Hours long. And enemas with, I think it said 12 to 13 quarts of water. Like insane. Oh my God. Very unhealthy, very bad for you.

That sounds exhausting. Horrifying. And also then, so what? They're sitting in bathtubs filled with shit and then covered like saran wrap style on top. Horrifying. Jesus. They're also given, Dr. Hazard gives them stomach massages that are so rough.

They're more like beatings. And as she basically pounds on their abdomen, she yells, eliminate, eliminate, eliminate. So it's all a bit abusive. It sounds like a, what's it called when they try to get rid of the Satan inside of you? What's it called? An exorcism. Yeah. Yes.

It's a shit exorcism. It is. And also it's the kind of thing where when someone is like, I'm a doctor. I have the answer. We're going to start doing this. Apparently Dr. Hazard was very controlling and domineering, but very convincing to the point where there's some people who thought that she was involved with the occult because she, they thought she could like hypnotize people into doing her program and not quitting

her program. Yeah. But I think in reality. Occult leaders, like they're just good at that shit. Yeah. They're psychopaths. Yeah. So they're, it's like, I think she, she wants the best for me.

And she seems like so passionate about. And she knows what's best. Yeah. What's more comforting than the person that's like, come this way, I have the answer. Everybody wants that. Those people are lying to you. And here's how you know they're lying to you because during the beating sessions and during the shitting sessions, Dr. Hazard would make small talk and basically got all the

information about the Williamson sisters wealth and all the assets they held. And eventually Dr. Hazard offers to store their valuables, jewelry and property deeds in her personal space, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, in her office. Yeah. But the sisters trust Dr. Hazard and as that process goes along, they really feel like they're being cured, which like in all the times that I've done my no sugar, no flower dieting and all the super extreme dieting, I think lots of people have this experience. There is a, what they call the pink cloud phase where you go through it and you, when

you don't have all that stuff in your system and you are losing the weight and you're getting clean, you do get like a weird natural high off of it. Yeah. And if the right person comes along to basically sphengali you in that time, you get hooked on it because then you're like, I've solved all my problems, right? All I need to do is only drink canned tomato soup. And it's working quote unquote, like it's, yeah, yeah, um, it's made of soup, bro. Ew.

Yeah. So let's talk about Dr. quote unquote Linda Hazard. Okay. I'm saying quote unquote both time. So Linda Laura Burfield is born to Montgomery and Susanna Burfield in Carver, Minnesota. On December 18th, 1867, she's one of eight children in 1885. She's 18. She gets married and has two children 14 years later in 1898, she abandons her family and

moves to Minneapolis to pursue a career in medicine as an osteopathic nurse. So right when her children are young teens, wow, she's like, I don't know. I think I've changed my mind and moves away to be a nurse. Thanks Linda. Okay. So in 1902, a patient of Linda passes away in her care. The coroner determines that the patient's death is caused by starvation and that coroner tries to get Linda prosecuted, but Linda isn't a licensed doctor.

So she can't be held legally responsible. Holy shit. So after the patient dies, the family comes to claim the body and discovers that expensive rings that that patient had are missing from the body. And when they ask about the rings, Linda doesn't give a straight answer. And it's suspicious, but they never push it any further, which is another sign that she's a psychopath because clearly she's convinced them or made them feel like they can't ask questions or it's not their place or something.

The whole thing like even calling yourself a doctor just gives people, they feel like you're superior. It's status. And you trust them more. Yes. It's status and power. And I'm sure if she became a nurse, she was around doctors and knew how to mimic that kind of behavior of, you know, like, dispassionate, judgmental, I'm smarter than you, I know better

than you. So you love doctors? I... Yeah, it's like that one doctor you just did. You did. It's my... It's my guy. Yeah.

The 17-year-old doctor. You love him. The New Life, New Hope. I was just telling my friend about that story. I'm like, I've ever heard about the 18-year-old that opened his own medical clinic. And then I bored her about when she could have just listened to the episode herself. Okay. So two years later, after all that happens and she gets away scot-free with killing somebody,

in 1904, she meets and marries a West Point graduate named Samuel Christmas Hazard. Yes. It sounds like a fun name, but this guy's no good. He was on a promising military career track, but it ended after he was caught embezzling army funds. So two psychopaths meet each other and they're like, gling, gling, gling, let's kill the world. Psychopaths meet cute.

Yeah. I love you. I love you. Let's kill everybody. Okay. So Sam has a reputation for being a drunk, a lecture, and a swindler. And Linda's like, me too. And he's been married twice before, and by the time he marries Linda, his third wife,

he's only gotten divorced from one of his two previous wives. So he ends up getting arrested for bigamy and is found guilty and he has to serve a two-year prison sentence for it. So in 1906, he's released from prison and he and Linda moved to a 40-acre property in Olala, Washington for a fresh start. This will be the property and the place that eventually will become Starvation Heights. And that's what the locals call it. That's not...

She called it Wilderness Heights Sanatorium, I believe. Starvation Heights has a ring to it though. Starvation Heights is what the locals called it and apparently the kids in Olala were scared to go up there, but then when they would, like people, they would dare each other or something, they would get up there and then watch the people who are staying there wander around and fall down because they couldn't even walk across the grounds because they were so... Oh my God.

They were starving so terribly. Okay. So Linda, because she's been grandfathered in with her fasting expert medical license that now counts as a medical license, she takes the ferry to Seattle every day for work and then she finally achieves her dream of building her own sanatorium. So in 1908, she writes the book Fasting for the Cure of Disease and that book promotes the idea that fasting can cure any disease, including cancer. So people all around the country start coming to take this cure, basically, and to start

doing her system so that they can be cured of the disease they have. So it's a special kind of psychopath that's taking advantage of the already sick. Really? Hidious. So one such traveler was a woman named Daisy Haglund. She was the daughter of wealthy Norwegian immigrants and she sought out Linda's guidance for healthier living in early 1908. Linda directs Daisy to fast for 50 days, which you can't do.

You can't do it. No. It shrinks your brain. The impact on your body is terrible after even a short amount of time of starving yourself. 50 days, it's like almost no one can survive it. So on February 26, 1908, at the end of her 50-day fast, Daisy dies of starvation at 38 years old, leaving behind a three-year-old son named Ivar. She would be the first person in Washington to die under Linda's care and there will be

many more. Oh my God. So people would later describe Linda Hazard as domineering, controlling, and hypnotic and they believed she dabbled in the occult and basically gained her power from the devil because they couldn't explain why people would basically continue to do this system where they were being beaten and given enemas daily and being starved. It just didn't, no one could really explain it. And paying her for it.

And paying her for it while she was draining them and stealing from them, draining their bank accounts and stealing from them. She sounds a lot like H.H. Holmes, almost. Yes, that's true. Yeah, but it's, what's weird is like that thing and maybe it's that it's the women psychopaths, that thing of pretending you're a caretaker when you're actually the opposite. That's especially creepy. And it's like the patient's choice to be there.

So it's good gaslighting material. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, you wanted this, you're paying me, it's my system. And in the book, I remember there was all these things where she would say, when people would say like, this is too hard or I really, I have terrible headaches or when they would complain, she would then basically yell at them about how they were weak and spoiled and they needed to finally do something good for themselves.

Oh my God. Like she'd really always use them against themselves in the worst way. So another patient under Linda's care, Ida Wilcox, dies in 1908. In 1909, two more deaths follow, Blanche B. Tindall and Viola Heaton. And in 1910, Maude Whitney, Frank Southerd, C.A. Harrison, Ivan Flux, and yeah, they all died in 1910. And then Earl Edward Erdman dies in 1911. And Linda Hazard had, there's so many people that already died under her care and newspaper

reporters started talking about it. There was a headline that said, woman MD kills another patient. So like people were aware, but there was no, there was no open investigation or anything like actively happening. So Earl Erdman's death prompts the Seattle Daily Times to write an article about Dr. Hazard and the headline read, woman MD kills another patient. Holy shit. Yeah.

Then still in 1911, a former legislator and a magazine publisher named Louis Ellsworth Raider goes to Dr. Hazard and to take the fasting cure. But because of his high social status in Seattle, the general public is paying very close attention to the fact that Raider is fasting. And they all see how he's withering away because of the fasting. So the authorities are called to investigate the doctor. But when they talk to Raider, he refuses to testify against her or take help from anyone in any way and he tells everyone the fasting is helping him.

Eventually, he dies too. He is almost six feet tall and he weighs under a hundred pounds at the time of his death. Are you fucking kidding me? Yes. They literally just starved to death under her care. Oh my God. So at this point, 10 people have died on Dr. Hazard's watch. All of them from starvation after being prompted to fast for 50 days.

This is her plan and it's killing everyone, basically everyone that does it. Stick into it. Right. There are a couple people that don't die from it and they are such vocal advocates that they're, you know, it is the balance that she's using to kind of cover all this. But I mean, people are dropping dead. Okay. So all of these people are found by the coroner to have died from starvation.

And in some of the cases, because it's Dr. Hazard, did the autopsy. Oh, wait, what? She will do the autopsy and she will say that the cause of death is something like cirrhosis of the liver. And so she always finds that it was something that it was a preexisting condition, basically, and that the starving was the fasting, I'm sorry, was curing it, but then it just took over. Yeah, it was too late.

Shit. Yeah. Basically, she really is using that doctor thing to get away with so much crazy shit. I mean, how does she even know how to do a fucking autopsy if she's a starvation doctor? Well, if she studied to be a nurse, she must know a little something. You know, it's just enough to cover. So as I said, despite the death toll, Linda's medical theories have a cult following, I think underline the word cult.

And Linda's personality is so domineering that few people ever dared to question her methods or disobey her orders. Seattle's health director at the time has called to put a stop to Linda Hazard's dangerous medical practice, but because Dr. Hazard has her license to practice and because her patients willingly seek this cure, there's nothing that they can do about it officially until April of 1911. So at this point, Dorothy and Claire Williamson have been on their starvation diet for two months.

They're both gaunt and delirious from fasting. And this is when Dr. Hazard has her lawyer get a signature from Claire amending her will and it grants Dr. Hazard 25 pounds a year to be paid and full control over Claire's body if she passes away. Very odd thing to amend someone else's will to say. So and meanwhile, the sisters are absolutely suffering and they're starving. They've lost tons of weight. They're delirious.

They can't really, they can't defend themselves from Dr. Hazard when she comes over to come on. It's more treatments. They can't do anything about it. Yeah. They're weak at that point. Yeah. And but they're, they're trying to protest.

And this is when the Dr. Hazard says, oh, now the sanitarium and alala is all ready for you and we're going to take a trip down there. So they decide to do that. Alala is, is about on Google Maps. It was in a little over an hour southwest of Seattle. Okay. But I bet it would take longer back then. And at this point, both sisters weigh about 70 pounds.

Holy shit. And the pictures are very disturbing. If you look up the pictures, there's pictures, there's pictures, there's photos and it honestly looks like weird like mannequins that people have dressed up for Halloween. They're so gaunt and frightening looking. It's really horrible. They look like they're dead basically. So although the sisters have kept the entire endeavor a secret from the family, like I

told you, they knew that the situation was starting to get dire. So on April 30th, they sent a cable to their childhood nurse named Margaret Conway in Australia, asking her to come to Olala and help them. And the message was so odd and like jumbled and weird that Margaret Conway realizes something terrible is going on and she immediately buys a ticket to Seattle to help find the sisters. It's going to take like two weeks. It's going to take more than that. It takes, the journey from Sydney to Seattle takes a full month.

She arrives on June 1st, 1911 and Sam Hazard meets her at the station and brings her to Linda's office. And that's when he breaks the news that Claire Williamson has died. So Margaret doesn't understand what's going on. Then Sam takes her to Olala to the sanatorium to see Dorothea. And when she arrives there, she is beyond shocked at what she's looking at. Dorothea is a shell of her former self. She's starved.

She's delirious. And she's living in this weird shack on the property. So this idea that they had and it really goes into it and start the book, Starvation of Heights, they really go into the description of how they keep it and what they're doing, but they basically would keep the patients away from each other. So everyone's kind of being starved, but they're separate. So no one can get together and then go, you go get the sheriff or whatever. Or even like look at someone else and be like, that person doesn't like well.

Yeah. Exactly. Like if that's what they're doing, this is what I'm doing. This isn't good. Yeah. Yeah. And they're all related to reflect and they're all under Dr. Hazard's control. So when she does find Dorothea, Dorothea weighs 50 pounds.

So it's, I mean. That sounds impossible. And yeah, it's horrifying. It's the reason Claire died. And imagine being this nurse, this nanny, I mean, she must have been in her 60s or 70s. She shows up to think, oh, they're doing some weird diet. And she basically comes to find one of the sisters is dead and the other one is almost a corpse.

Oh my God. Plus this sanitarium that she's come to visit. The other patients start coming up to her and going, please help us get out of here. It is a fucking nightmare. It's a nightmare. Someone needs to make this as a horror movie because Margaret's such a badass. So here's the thing, like you were talking about before, she's from the servant class. So when she tries to take Dorothea out of there, the hazards say, no, absolutely you

can't. We're her doctor. She's signed over all control to us. You don't have any control. And they basically show her paperwork that says we have legal guardianship over her. And these are her signatures and this is what she wants and basically get out of here. So she's afraid to fight with them or confront them in the moment, but she decides, she realizes that the sisters have an uncle named John Herbert in Portland, Oregon.

So she goes and gets the uncle and is like, you got to get up here and you got to get these guys out of here. So John Herbert comes to get Dorothea out of the hazards clutches, but they still refuse to let her go unless they're compensated for getting her out of the sanitarium. So the uncle barters with the hazards, ultimately paying a little less than $2,000 to save his niece. Oh my God, which in today's money? Would be...

Oh, why? I don't know. Stephen, will you look it up? $2,000 in 1911. Sorry. No, I didn't. I should have done it. I'm going to guess.

I'm going to guess $140,000. 140. What are you going to guess? 2,000? I'm going to guess $17,000. Wait, what was your guess again? George's is $60,000 minus $17,000. $54,000 and $12.21.

Oh, thank you. He has to pay 50 grand to get his niece out of these lunatics. So they get her out. She lives, thank God. And later in 1911, when Dorothea is safely back with her family, the Williamsons use their clout with notable British politicians to take legal action against Dr. Linda Hazard. The British Vice-Counsel of Tacoma tries to get the county to prosecute Linda, but they refuse saying they can't afford to press charges.

They're all in her pocket, you know. If she's stealing from all these rich people, she's paying people off. And they do say it goes into it more, but when she would... They would have... she sometimes buried bodies on the property, but she also sometimes sent them to a funeral home, and they said the funeral home was in cahoots with her. For sure. Basically, and they said sometimes she would just go and dump the bodies off a cliff. No.

Yeah. Dorothea, however, pays the appropriate fees to make it happen, because she's like, I don't care, this is happening. So Dr. Linda Hazard is arrested for the murder of Claire Williamson in August of 1911. So Linda defends herself in court by saying that regular doctors were just jealous of her intelligence and her success with naturopathic treatments. I didn't realize what a vintage excuse that was. They're jealous of me.

Through the ages. Yeah. You're just jealous. And she also insists upon taking the stand to testify on her own behalf. Don't do it. Like classic psychopath. But her lawyer says, you can't, you will ruin this for yourself. But Dorothea Williamson testifies against Dr. Hazard.

So she gets up and tells the whole story. Throughout the trial, there's an overwhelming amount of evidence against Dr. Hazard, including written records of her quote unquote treatments, the testimony from Dorothea about the horrible conditions that she and all the other patients were kept in, and a paper trail showing how Linda routinely got delirious patients to sign over their wealth and belongings to her. In 1912, Linda Hazard is found guilty of manslaughter. She serves two years in prison and then is freed. Fucking shit.

Yeah. She gets a pardon from the governor. No. Which is more to my theory that she was paying everybody off, but who knows. And then she and her husband, Sam, moved to New Zealand to start over, because apparently she had a big following in New Zealand. So she went to where her quote unquote supporters were. And when she gets to New Zealand, she picks up right where she left off and offering treatment

to patients and calling herself everything from a physician to a dietician to an osteopath. But the health officials in New Zealand immediately crack down on Linda. Her medical licenses stripped, had been stripped after her trial. So her medical practices in New Zealand are found unlawful. So once this starts happening in New Zealand, she heads back to Olala. She has saved up enough money from the people she swindled in New Zealand and she opens a new sanitarium, her dream sanitarium, a bigger one. And even though she's forbidden from practicing medicine, she markets the new one, the new

sanitarium as a school of health. So in 1927, she writes a second book called Scientific Fasting, The Ancient and Modern Key to Health. She won't get off it. She will not fucking leave it alone. And it garners even more fans for her. And she continues to treat patients and starve them without calling herself a doctor until 1935 when her sanitarium burns to the ground.

What? Yeah. Like in my mind, it's a bunch of rebellious fucking patients that are like, fuck this shit. Yeah. The people who lived were just like, they went, they had some pancakes, they were like, we need to fucking get this lady out of here. The exact number of Linda's victims is still unknown, but there were definitely at least

12 and it is believed up to 40 deaths attributed to her fasting regime. Only in 1938, Linda becomes ill herself, so she begins her own fasting treatment. And on June 24th, 1938, Linda Hazard dies of starvation. No. Yes. And this is just a fun trivia fact to end on an up note. Daisy Hagland, who was her first victim in the state of Washington, her three-year-old son that I told you about, Ivar, he would go on to open, what is still to this day,

a huge chain of seafood restaurants in the Seattle area, one called, and I've actually talked about this before, I think for some reason when we were in Seattle, one of them, they're all named different things, and it's Ivar's Lobster, Ivar's whatever. Oh my God. And my favorite one is Ivar's Acres of Clams. We have to go next time we're in Seattle. Absolutely. Even though you hate seafood.

Even though I hate seafood, I absolutely want to go to Ivar's Acres of Clams. You can get a burger. I'm sure they have a burger on the kids menu. Right. And that is the super insane story of Dr. Linda Hazard's Starvation Heights Sanitary. Great job. Isn't that nuts? That is nuts.

I'm glad you did that. Me too. That's a good one. Shit. Yeah. Read that book. I swear that Starvation Heights book is fascinating. I started it.

That's so creepy. Really gross stuff about the place itself. Yeah. Fuck that man. Great job. Thank you. Fucking hooray? Yeah.

You ready for fucking hooray? Let's do it. Okay. What's my second one? Oh yeah. You used your first one. I did. Do you want to go first?

You want me to go first? I'll go first if you want me to. Sure. Well I have two. We've actually had a little bit of a conversation I think about this, but the first one is the comic strip The Farside is coming back. No. Gary Larson is restarting The Farside.

Yay. And it got announced, I think it was either over the weekend or it was a couple days ago and I got so excited because my family is all about The Farside. I didn't know that. Yeah. I love it. It's one of my dad's favorite things and what he used to do and this was all growing up, my dad would read the paper, usually the San Francisco Chronicle and The Farside would

be in there and he would make you look at it and read it and then you go, is he nuts or what? He's a nut. Oh my god. He loves Gary Larson so much and was so excited when I texted him and I go, dad, The Farside is coming back and then I sent them the link to the article and he immediately wrote back, what app is that going to be on? And I wrote, dad, wherever it is, I will figure out how to get it and I will hook you up.

You will have it on the daily. Don't worry. I love it. That's exciting. I know. I'm very excited. I'm happy for you. And the kind of to go hand in hand with that, I just went and I went and saw the movie Hustlers,

the JLo movie Hustlers. Everybody's got to see it. It is hilarious and great and a true story which you've got to love but Jennifer, as a almost 50-year-old woman watching JLo, a 50-year-old woman, pulled down like a motherfucker to Fiona Apple. No, are you serious? It starts this movie off, we were just like, whoa. Which song?

It's amazing. I've been a bad, bad girl. I knew it. That's so good. It's so good and it's just like there's something, oh and also, aside from JLo, who of course is like a miracle, Cardi B, every moment she is on the screen is beyond delightful and I wish she was in the entire movie. I love it.

She should have been in the entire movie. I don't know why they didn't put her in the entire movie. I just watched her talk, which I do on Instagram. Yeah, it's great. There's one part they just, I feel like they added it in because it's just her yelling at the doorman. If you haven't seen Hustlers and it had a huge opening for basically being a movie that's all women, go see it because it's a real good time.

Okay. I need to go see it. But I've been busy because I got myself and my bad back a very large, very ugly massage chair. Oh, yes. It's just one of those fucking eyesores. I put it in the downstairs. It's your airport massage chair?

It's totally, oh my God, what airport were we at where I went and got in the, they had massaged like gross, greasy massage chairs at this airport night and like you put quarters in and I just went over and fucking did it because I love massage chairs so much. And that was the airport where we were flying, God, I wish I could remember. I think of Arizona. It was a big one. It was a main one. Arizona.

Yeah, that would make sense. And you sat in these massage chairs that were facing people walking toward the gate. So anyone who saw you that listened to the podcast would be like, hi, and you'd go, you're being in your massage chair, hi, Karen's right over there, but it was like literally six in the morning. It wasn't even just people who saw, recognized me. If I saw them wearing a murdering shirt, I'd be like, hi, I was just like having the time of my life.

You were high on your legs massaged and then people would walk up and I'd like have my earbuds in like barely awake and be like, hi, sorry, Georgia, tell me to, Georgia, send us your way. Well, I'd say hi and hug them and go go say hi to Karen because I was so happy. So I got one of those zero gravity fucking massagey, big, huge, ugly chairs and I have been using it every night with your fucking weighted blanket on top of me and usually Mimi on top of that. And it is just heaven.

It is so lovely and I know I've talked like this about my bathtub, but I feel the same way about my massage chair and I'm just so happy. It just brings me joy. And the weighted blanket is like a fucking bonus, so thank you. Yeah, it's my pleasure. The weighted blanket, like the science behind the weighted blanket is so fascinating because it's like a hurricane dog jacket. It is.

It's like it's hugging you. It's Temple Grandin style if you're in the cowhugger and it works. It like makes me feel not freaked out. It's so nice. Like it's got you. It's got you down. I got you, girl. Don't worry.

Do I need to get a big ugly massage chair? Oh, you have a second bedroom. Get it. It's a big ugly one where you put your legs in and it squeezes and shit and it just makes so much noise and the cats are afraid of it, except for me. It's so lovely. It's so, it's so ugly. Oh, I love that.

It's so hideous. That's such a good splurge. Yeah. And it wasn't like the top of the line. It was like a cheapy one. You got to use one out of the Arizona airport. That's right. I found my favorite.

Wash those grease stains off. And it was great. I had eight. There were so many pretzels being eaten in that. Come on. Now they're your pretzels. That's right. I'm going to earn them.

Thank you. I love it. That's awesome. Yay. Well, thanks for listening, friends. Yeah. Thanks for listening. And if you want to sign up for the contest that you might be able to win tickets to the

My Favorite Weekend Fan Weekend in Santa Barbara, we would love to see you there. Yeah. It would be so fun. My favorite weekend.com or my favoritemurder.com, whatever you're feeling. And stay sexy. And don't get murdered. Goodbye. Goodbye.

Elvis? Want cookie? Oh, there's my cookie. Where is it? I don't know.