My Mom's Basement - EPISODE 130 - SHAWN MICHAELS & MICK FOLEY

Episode Date: May 31, 2021

Today’s holiday edition of the show features interviews with WWE Hall of Famers Shawn Michaels and Mick Foley in promotion of their A&E Biographies - available on demand now. 3Chi: Use code MMB at checkout to receive 5% off at 3Chi.com BetterHelp: Go to BetterHelp.com/ROBBIE for 10% off your first month Magic Spoon: Use code ROBBIE at MagicSpoon.com/ROBBIE for $5 off Subscribe to My Mom's Basement on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIeZ96PqdsJYQ7DFLRx6MHw My Mom's Basement Merchandise: https://store.barstoolsports.com/collections/my-moms-basement Intro Music: “Basement Noise” by All Time Low Apple Music: https://music.apple.com/us/album/basement-noise/1499013757?i=1499013968 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/track/3Aq9W9BBCjsFOQqcYyO6IA?si=d9d0f74cf54a48deYou can find every episode of this show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or YouTube. Prime Members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. For more, visit barstool.link/mymomsbasement

Hey My Mom's Basement listeners, you can find our episodes on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube, and Prime members in the basement, noise in the basement. Just stupid boys making basement noise in the basement. Yeah, yeah. Hello and welcome to My Mom's Basement presented by Barstool Sports and 3Chi. I am your host, Robbie Fox. And today we are bringing you a special Memorial Day weekend edition of the show. A Memorial Day edition of the show. Shout out to all the veterans out there.

If we've got any veterans listening to the show, thank you for your service. I appreciate it tremendously. And we appreciate that this holiday is about you. Today we are going to do not a best of, but kind of like a best of. It is going to be interviews with Shawn Michaels and Mick Foley. Now, you may not have heard these. If you haven't heard these, why aren't you subscribed to the My Mom's Basement YouTube page? They've been there for a week. No, I'm just kidding with you. But they really have

been there for a week. So if you subscribe to the YouTube page, you may get interviews a little sooner now. So just be on the lookout for that. Before we get into it, let me tell you guys about 3Chi as I do each and every week. 3Chi is the industry leader in Delta-8 THC products. These are federally legal THC products, all formulated by a biochemist made in the USA, USA Grown Hemp. And that's what is legal about it. It's not derived from marijuana.

It's derived from hemp plants. But it'll still get you high. You got to use it responsibly. It'll give you a nice buzz. It's a more functional alternative to marijuana, We like to say it's an amazing buzz, a great body feel, but a clear head, less anxiety, less paranoia. They kind of load that stuff up with CBD, but remember it is psychoactive as well. So use it responsibly. Like I said, you got to be 21 or older to purchase. If you are 21 or older, man, you got to get this stuff. Go to 3chi.com right now. That's

the number three, chi.com. You can get vapes, gummies, cereal treats, brownies, cookies, tinctures, oils. You can make your own edibles with the oils. They've got every product you could possibly want. Use the promo code MMB at checkout and you will receive 5% off your order. Again, that's 3chi.com, promo code MMB. All right, let's get into the first of our two interviews, this one with Shawn Michaels. Welcome back to my mom's basement, ladies and gentlemen. I am here with the Heartbreak Kid, Mr. WrestleMania himself, Shawn Michaels. He's got a new biography on A&E coming this Sunday at 8. I can't wait for this because Shawn, your documentary that came out now over a decade ago, Heartbreak and Triumph is one of my favorite documentaries that the WWE

has ever produced. I feel like that is a big strength of the company too, in telling these stories, telling the stories of their legends. And I wanted to know, is it weird for you to watch this stuff about yourself because you lived it all or is it fun is it do you do you like watching that stuff uh so yes it is weird for me yeah so yeah i um especially now um so i've really grown away from again stuff like wanting to the desire to be on tv uh has gone the opposite direction for me now. And so, especially when I look back now, I have nothing in common with the person that I was back then. And so it really is, it's very strange. It helps now, the first one, you know, heartbreak and triumph that you're speaking of, it was not too long after, again, at least,

you know, getting married and having a child and this, the very beginning of a new life for me. And so it felt a little bit, I didn't, you know, you don't know what the future holds. It was fun. It was exciting, but there was still so much more ahead of me. Now we're talking, you know, many, many, you know, a decade or so later. And now I'm able to see everything in the rearview mirror. I've seen our, you know, our children grow. I've seen my life continue to grow and get better. My, you know, my relationships, relationships my marriage my children's for those relationships to be strengthened and emboldened just and even from a life in wrestling to been able to

complete what I started there were a lot more question marks back when Heartbreak and Triumph came out and now many of those questions have been answered. And so, like I said, there's, is a piece now that, as we say in my little world, a piece that surpasses any understanding. Because again, I now have the ability to feel like I've crossed the finish line and I'm very happy with that finish. I think you should be as well. I mean, your retirement is, I think, the greatest in wrestling history. And the only one that I would say holds a candle to it

is Ric Flair's, which you were also involved in. So you were involved in, I think, two of the greatest retirements in wrestling and WrestleMania history. Now that you're a coach at NXT and you're, I assume, are you at your office down at the Performance Center right now? Yeah, we have TV today. So yeah, I am here at work. I love that. I feel like I got the inside

scoop. I'm like in the, you know, the bowels of the arena right now with Shawn Michaels. Do you ever watch your own stuff back when, like from a coaching capacity of being like, let me watch that and maybe I could impart this on someone else? Or is it completely what you remember from the business? Like, what is your coaching style like in NXT? So when I was coaching on a much more regular basis, I did find, because I've never watched my stuff with people. I was very uncomfortable doing that. When I did it, it would be, I do it

one time. It would usually be right after whatever pay-per-view or raw, whatever the case may be, or WrestleMania. I'd have them burn me at that time, you know, a DVD and then, and I'd go home, I'd watch it once, I'd take my notes mentally, and then that would be it. I just wasn't, I wasn't one of those guys that poured over his stuff a lot because I always thought this business was evolving and growing and moving and always pressing forward. But I did have to get over that when I started coaching a number of guys that now grew up with me and some of my matches were um there were lessons in there there were things

and also when I found that I was able to connect with them on a mental and an emotional level um both professionally and personally by letting them understand where I was at in that match and the stuff I went through I think that was one of the aside from the x's and o's that I was able to I don't know sometimes connect for them I think what connected most with them was where I was at personally and emotionally going into these matches and where you come out of them again always always striving for more striving for perfection understand that there were always nerves and expectations and to deal with that and to convince them that there was never a thought

that they had in their mind that I didn't have. And I always wanted them to at least know that there was somebody that was affirming everything that they were going through. This business is hard enough just in the physical sense. The other, the mental and emotional stuff is, can also be difficult. And that was something that I wanted to make sure that I helped them with as well, you know? And so I guess that's one of the things I, I probably got a lot closer to a lot of these guys and I think they expected it first. But now being on the other side,

I think we all appreciate it a little bit more, but I guess a long winded way to answer your question. Yeah, we did. But at the same time, not, not a lot of them, because I always felt it was better to watch their stuff and everything that I did was what once was, you know what what I mean and I wanted them to focus on continuing to press forward to grow and evolve in this line of work because to me that's what drives this business and drives success absolutely but I think they even have in NXT the same mentality that a lot of you guys had back then and we want to steal the show we want to go out there and we

don't care who's in the main event if I'm in the opening match I want to make sure that they remember me and that's one of the things the fans love the most about NXT every takeover truly feels like every single person that steps through the curtain wants to make that their night wants to make it so they steal the show I wanted to know as their coach do you have anyone down there that you say they really remind me of like a young Shawn Michaels whether it comes from a mentality or a wrestling standpoint well so i i think there have been a number of guys and people have commented on on it here and there i mean there are sure some senses and i apologize i'm getting other messages no it's fine i'm sure it's much more important than this i'm sure it's a triple h you know um but so i think the easy one obviously for everybody is adam cole um and

adam cole is is one of those people that we have similarities not just physical but also there are things you know he has that attribute that you say well adam cole just has it you can't define what that is but he's got a mixture of all of it and he's just good and he's consistent all the time but then you have guys like a Johnny Gargano who to me I think in the ring is far more uh he can do more more well-rounded than I ever was um but he has the mentality that he's going to go out there if Johnny's on the show your work's going to be cut out for you it's just that simple you know and he's not going to give you any breathing room and and that's what I so we we are there are a number of guys Tommaso's the same way but a completely different style um a lot of times Tommaso and I because he's a little bit more rougher around the edges than

everybody else but he and I connect on on a mental level because I understand sort of his and I and I'd never want people to misunderstand this but his is more an aggressive passion like mine was when I was younger but I absolutely understand that and I appreciate that so again honestly there are so many different attributes of so many guys that I can connect with. Because as I said, I try to let them know that there isn't anything mentally or emotionally that they're going to go through that I haven't thought about. And I do, I want them to know that it's okay. You know what I mean? Nothing, it doesn't make you weird, doesn't make you insecure, doesn't make you anything. I will be honest with you about it and say that I did have it.

And truth be told, all the guys that say they didn't are lying. So it's just important that they know that. Did you have someone like that in your career when you were young that could stand there and say, hey, Sean, like I've been there for that or no? No. Yeah. No, that was the thing. It was a very different time. You didn't you didn't

show that you didn't show a chink in your armor there were no dents there was a you know a tough very in control veneer and i'll go back and um i know it's sort of a whatever a controversial group but the click that's why we all gravitated together because we could be open and honest with each other and those guys um again we did it was a real friendship that's again that's why it still lasts today that's why there's never been any professional jealousy or any of that kind of stuff within the group because it was a it was an honest uh and open about about the things that you're going like is this weird to anybody or is it just weird to me and they're like you're not so but you didn't get a lot of that back in and again it sounds like the

old time or stuff back in my day it was they they there was it was a much more tougher more bravado type atmosphere and heaven forbid you didn't feel that way all the time 24 7 and so uh like i said it was just something that that's what brought us together back then and i think that's what helps me at least and even hunter now uh you know and all of us here at you know at you know at the performance center down here in orlando we all connect on that level and that's why the culture here is so positive um that's why again you never you don't hear a lot of people not wanting to be with nxt for any bad reasons uh it's always them reluctantly moving on so to speak they're happy about it but at the same time

uh nobody complains about being here no some people want to come back look at finn pallor right he's like let me back in pounding on the performance center door um i wanted to ask you about what you enjoy doing as a coach now i don't know if you may have just answered that by saying you like talking to the performers about the mentality and really the emotional part of wrestling but if i'm saying sean michaels you've got a day at the performance center i want you to go coach this big group of talent would you rather sit down and do psychology with them and talk about putting together a match If I'm saying, Sean Michaels, you've got a day at the Performance Center. I want you to go coach this big group of talent. Would you rather sit down and do psychology with them and talk about putting together a match?

Would you rather get in the ring and say, hey, show me something, and I'll sort of tweak things here and there? Or would you rather sit down with them and do promo class? Like, what does Sean Michaels enjoy doing as a coach? So when I was coaching on a regular basis, one of the things I found is that I didn't set an agenda. And much like when I went with my matches, I just went into every one of my matches with a very open mind, believe it or not. Because I knew my strengths was always adjusting and adapting sort of on the fly and in the moment and so I never wanted to sort of set anything in place for fear that you might be teaching someone the wrong way the wrong thing each one of the our people learn a different way have different attributes so I never like to have

a blanket sort of uh I don't know one size fits fits all, you know, mentality to it. And so it would, we would, that's what it was with sort of, you know, when you made it to Sean's class, so to speak, we, it was all over the place because we were just, you know, we, you know, I was getting to have such really complete and sound performers that now it was just about you know picking apart these little areas and all of them were different and all of them were different for each individual and so we just you know it was spending a lot of time um on that guy and whatever it might be and then moving to this person and it could be a whole, you know, different ball of wax, but everybody else in there,

we always felt like was always picking up something because it either filled a gap you didn't, you know, have filled or an answer to, you know, at least a question that, you know, you didn't know you had. Now we see you sitting next to Triple H for the actual takeover events for the NXT events we see some backstage footage sometimes whether it be like WWE 24 or any of the documentaries and my favorite stuff in the world is you and Triple H after a match like shaking each other like that was so awesome I can't believe it and just seeing that like you guys are still fans is amazing for us like you guys can still get excited over the same stuff that we do so when you

were back with Triple H in those vans with the click could you ever imagine that the two of you would be in this kind of position I know you always talked about hey we'll run the business one day but like now looking back do you go oh there was some hints of that or is this just a crazy journey so that was something you were saying out of you know just sort of uh immature bravado you know you know what i mean um i i don't i certainly never not no not like this i mean and that's the thing is because and that's why we're back there jumping around because well i what i that's also another thing that brought us all together is that we were all, we all realized that this was, you know, a great living, you know, just a fantastic way of working with your buddies, tearing down the house,

traveling the world. And now we're here, you know, we're still wrestling fans. We still love every aspect of it, but now we're watching other people have their success and have their moments. It is easily the easily the best part about this job is now beginning to watch, again, the Johnny Gargano's, the Adam Cole's. And regardless of whether they watch me or not, now understanding. And when you get to know all these people, their various dreams and desires and passions and you're able to watch them fulfill that and watch the again the joy and just the satisfaction on their face and to know that you were a little part of that is absolutely the greatest thing in the world and again it's it's

it's no different than again when my son graduated and you know again it's it's it's it's at least helping someone you know and giving them the foundation to to to make their life what they want it to be and that's the most satisfying thing in the world to me and we get to do it here uh you know on a regular basis and it's and it is it's hard not to get excited about it because again i still enjoy this this stuff and as you say i'm still a wrestling fan and I'm never growing out of that and I've been fortunate enough to never have to grow up a day in my life and uh you know it's hard not to be giddy about that on a regular basis I'm so excited about that I hope you you and Triple H especially stick around just the two of you together forever in

wrestling and you know you guys will make great stuff together I've got an actual match of yours that I would love to ask you about and it's the match with mankind at war games or mind games I'm sorry it's it's an all-time classic and it for a long time felt like almost a hidden gem but then the network era comes around and everyone is like man this is the match like people were not even paying attention to this back then they should have been what do you remember about that match now well so again just so in the moment even that so Mick and I is Mick is one of the few guys that everybody else you at least had a couple you had a number of times or at least a couple times on the road working with each other

and and almost always crossed paths Mick and I really didn't and it was just one of those really abstract out of the blue matches that was just sort of set in there and again it was he had a different style um clearly than anybody else. The champion, and you got to figure out how you can adapt to that. But he's also really he's in a storyline. This was sort of a holding place for kind of both of us as we were on treks to different stories. And so it was just really that odd placement.

And again, and it really was, as you said, for a long time, it was just this hidden gem placement and that and again and it really was as you said for a long time it was just this hidden gem that was so fantastic but it was such an entity unto itself that i think people brushed past it and and yeah and so again it was it was just really the process um and mick really not thinking outside the box for him, it was really, he knew his character. He knew it really well. And the things he wanted to do put my character in a place where he just hadn't been. And I don't think any of us really knew at the time, but it was so vital for me to have at that time. Yeah.

Couldn't have been more perfect for me so again it was it really it's two guys adapting and adjusting to one another um on a very i don't know very even very level uh basis both guys this job can be very easy really at its core um but usually you only have that with your best friends because there's always some form of other emotion getting in the way um and mick is one of those people that never hung around didn't know again professionally uh you know you know casually all that it's fine easy you don't mean it but it's you know you still were in separate part you know separate parts of the dress room he didn't really run with anybody i don't think and yeah and so again but still when you get together there's a chemistry there that you go like huh

who to thunk it you know it's just again where those opposites attract, and then you create something that even in and of itself just sits totally alone by itself, but stands out in a really good way. And so it's really just an odd pairing, but in a fantastic way. And I think that's why it'll always be special because there's no storyline to it. There's no follow-up to it. And I really do.

I think it's one of those matches I get even now, especially in Tunisia where you go, but then that ended in disqualification, you know, heaven forbid you do those now. I mean, you couldn't do that without people just the internet, right? Yeah. Well, and again again and look and i understand it because it may not play the same now so that was that's what even made it special for that moment in time it was absolutely one of those perfect things that just sits there and and had you done

more with it that might have messed it up or might have ruined the specialness of it. So, again, it was just so many combinations. You know, when they say, like, when the stars align and everything. That was one of those moments. And, again, and thankfully, over time, people have really come to appreciate that match for what I think it really was. Absolutely. If you're listening to this or watching this interview and you haven't seen this match, it's a must watch gone peacock right now. Do what, you know, if you're working, forget your work, go watch Shawn Michaels versus mankind.

Sean, this has been an absolute pleasure for me. I've been a fan my whole life. I was you for Halloween when I was eight years old and I got in trouble for laying the socket just like everyone else did. So this has been awesome. Thank you so much for the time. I really appreciate and everyone check out sean leggo's biography this sunday yeah that's very nice and again i i i absolutely do appreciate that and uh i'm a silly you know whatever sentimental old man now so that it is that that stuff means a lot to me and i appreciate you giving us the time there's a little robbie fox laying socket, of course, you know.

Moving another generation successfully. I'm thrilled about it. All right. I want to thank Sean for joining the show. That was obviously a dream interview for me. If you listen to this show or even from the top rope, you know that Sean Michaels is number two on my all-time list, only behind Daniel Bryan and was number one on my all-time list forever. He's basically like, it's like 1A and 1 only behind Daniel Bryan and was number one on my all-time list forever.

He's basically like it's like 1A and 1B Daniel Bryan and Shawn Michaels but let's get serious for a second. The last year has been hard on a lot of people and that's why we're doing something new and partnering with our friends at BetterHelp for online therapy. I think there's a misunderstanding of what therapy is for a lot of people like especially as a guy who went to therapy for a really really long time like in-person therapy. I would tell people it really does help and they therapy is for a lot of people. Like, especially as a guy who went to therapy for a really, really long time, like in-person therapy, I would tell people it really does help. And they would be like, ah, it's too intimidating. And I would tell them like, it really doesn't have to be though. And that's basically what BetterHelp is all about. Therapy can be whatever you want it to be.

It doesn't have to be sitting around talking about your feelings. You can just talk about like whatever you want. Maybe just venting about work stuff is helpful for you. Maybe just venting about, you know, whatever you got going on in your life to someone else, someone that's unrelated to it is helpful for you. With BetterHelp, you can do that. There's no shame in struggling. You don't even have to see people in person. They have online therapy.

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So join the millions who are already seeing what therapy is really about. It's always a good time to invest in yourself because you are your greatest asset. This podcast is sponsored by BetterHelp and our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com slash Robbie. That's betterhelp.com B-E-T-T-E-R-H-E-L-P.com slash Robbie, R-O-B-B-I-E. And before we get into this interview with Mick Foley, which was really tremendous, like I even asked him about the mind games match that I asked Sean about.

So there's a nice little connection in this podcast. I got to tell you about our friends at Magic Spoon. I've told you about them before, but this cereal is the best in the game right now. From the box design, to the taste, to the new flavor options and everything, to the, I mean, you can make your own custom bundle, which I've told you about before. This cereal is zero grams of sugar, 14 grams of protein, and only four net grams of carbs in each serving. So only 140 calories a serving as well. Keto friendly, gluten-free, grain-free, soy-free, low carb, GMO free. Basically everyone in the world could eat this. I mean, knock on wood, like I don't want to say that, and then you eat this and you're somehow allergic to it.

But it sounds like it's free of everything you could possibly be allergic to. You build your own box too. They've got flavors from cocoa to fruity to frosted to peanut butter, blueberry, cinnamon. I feel like we're watching the explosion of Magic Spoon as they're sponsoring this podcast as well. The flavor options just keep exploding. They keep adding more, I assume, because they're having a lot of success with the cereal as is. It's delicious cereal. If you go to magicspoon.com right now slash Robbie, you can grab a custom bundle of cereal and try it today. And be sure to use our promo code Robbie, R-O-B-B-I-E at checkout

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back with Mick Foley. He's got an A&E biography coming up. We've been talking about these for weeks now. We've had some guests on the show talking about their A&E biographies. We've got some upcoming guests about them, and I have been loving these. As a WWE fan and a documentary fan myself, I feel like they've been crushing these week in and week out. Mick, let me just start by asking you, how are you? Are you itching to get back on the stage now that I saw you're all vaccinated and it seems the world is starting to open back up? Oh, it sure is. Yeah, I do. I head back out on, I do a comic convention in August to be my first personal appearance in many, many months. And then I do hit the road in uh september doing the the one-man shows that were canceled so

people want to check out dates in uh let me see iowa illinois indiana michigan wisconsin they can go to realmickfoley.com uh thanks for the opening i wasn't i wasn't even intending on talking about that but it will be nice to be out there. I mean, I went from flying like 120,000 miles just on Delta in one year to flying twice. So I don't believe I'll ever resume that schedule because I have enjoyed being home more often, but yeah, it will be nice to get back out there and see people. Absolutely. I would recommend anyone in those States buy tickets if you're, if you're able to because i've been to your one-man show more than once now and i really recommend it i think for a

wrestling fan it's so perfect it's it's it's difficult to make people understand hopefully they do after that you know the special air the 20 years of hell special oh it's a wrestling show it's you know i made a mistake by saying, you know, stand-up comedy. I mean, I'm standing up. Some of the stuff I say is funny, but it is a spoken word tour. And, you know, you try to do, I try to do what we did in wrestling,

which is take people on a little bit of a ride so that when they leave, you know, my goal is that they have a huge smile on their face when they leave. So whether that's a matter of, you know they my goal is that they have a huge smile on their face when they leave so whether that's a matter of you know laughing wincing you know hearing something surprisingly emotional uh it's whatever whatever makes sure they have a great time while they're there and i am telling you if you buy tickets to mix comedy show you will have a great time so let's talk about this biography you've got coming up do you enjoy watching stuff like this you're watching back your own career because as someone

that like does a podcast myself i don't even like watching back my own interviews i don't like hearing back my own voice so how does that land for someone like you i'm usually that way um very critical of my own stuff i don't like to watch my own matches back. I've never watched a match that I commentated. But I will say that I was really happy with the documentary WWE did seven or eight years ago for all mankind. And that was one of the reasons where I was a little hesitant when I was approached by A&E. I was like, hasn't my story been told? And the director, Thomas Odefelt,

really convinced me that he had a new take on it. And when I went to do the Stone Cold sessions with Stone Cold Steve Walston, he was really, as we say in our trade, putting it over. And because he was going to be talking to me about it, I said, okay okay I'll watch the first 20 minutes and I was really really impressed um I remember when I was watching Steve's autobiography his biography rather not autobiography his biography time seemed to be flying and that's

the way I felt when I was watching mine I did a great great job and I can't wait to experience the rest of it when it airs live on Sunday. Me either. I felt the same way with Shawn Michaels. They made a great WWE documentary on his whole career. It's one of my favorites.

And then they made the A&E biography and I was a little skeptical going in. Like, it feels like they told this story. It was perfect. It was one of my favorite documentaries they made. And then you watch the A&E one and you see some footage you've never seen you see some interviews that are new some new perspectives on it and they really did it's it's not a retelling it's a different it's a different telling of the story and you could even see that with the Ultimate Warrior one that just aired we saw footage of like Vince

giving Warrior notes mid-promo stuff that even mid big ultimate warrior fan, I've never seen before. So I think A&E is crushing. Yeah, me too. One of the things that we did, seven directors working on eight projects. So I think one of the directors tackled two of them. So it's not that cookie cutter feel that you know the old bios i always enjoyed them but it's like going to the uh a local bookstore and seeing images of america where every town has their own book and they're all in the same template it's a fill in the blanks type of thing so exactly i believe you know every every one of these biographies has been uh been distinct and uh you know i know ours my i got the

feeling mine is even something as simple as my director asking me to write out the alphabet uh you know um uppercase and lowercase capitals what's the opposite capital you're lowercase i think that's fine all right either people know what i mean and so i wrote them out and then i see them on the screen like wow that looks great like handwriting handwriting yeah yeah uh so i'm really impressed uh with everything i've seen um i know the savage uh documentary had its critics because i think they may have you can argue they went off track a little bit and that really the bubba the love sponge and hulk's real life rivalry with randy probably shouldn't have been as prominent in the documentary but that was a story he told

and uh you know my my uh my director uh told me he had a great editor who really added to the process, who was a big fan. And I think that helps. And so Steve loved it. I know A&E and WWE are really happy. And I hope people will tune in, even if they think they know the story. I think so, too. So I spoke with Shawn Michaels just last week, and we were talking about his biography coming up. And one of the main matches that I wanted to ask Shawn about was the Mind Games match that you had with him.

And I looked into this a little bit, and I realized that Jim Ross considers this the match that did the most for Shawn Michaels' career. He says this was a defining turning point in Shawn's career. I wanted to ask you, did it feel big in the moment when you and Sean were done with that mind games match, which is now a legendary almost hidden gem, which like I feel like all the hardcores are like, oh my God, you got to see this incredible match. Did it feel like, wow, we did something special out there? Did that come throughout the years? It definitely did feel like we had done something special. You know, I had that, wow, that post-match glow. And once in a while, I'll reach out to one of the current superstars and ask them if they could sleep after that match or if they just relived every moment of it.

And they were like, how did you know? I was like, hey, I've been there a few times. So that was one of those nights. I was really happy that a few years back, Edge and Christian did an anatomy of a match on their podcast with me and Sean, and that we both remembered it almost move for move, because there are a lot of matches that you just don't remember. I think because from a psychological or mental standpoint, you tend to remember the things that went really well, the things that went really

bad, and then everything else is kind of lost in the middle. You know, it's just a vague memory. And so I'm so glad that that one stood out as something that we both remembered as going really well. When you look back at your full career, then your entire journey throughout ECW, throughout Japan, throughout WWE, what are the memories that make you laugh the hardest when you go back and you're like, I can't even think about that without bursting out laughing? Well, some of the stuff, the interactions I did with Rock, not just on screen or not just televised shows, but the non-televised, the house shows, some of the fun we had doing that.

At about that time when Rock was, no, this is when Rock was a bad guy, before the Rock and Sock Connection, a series of four-way, it was me, Rock, Kane, Austin, they were four-way matches. And some of the interplay, you know, just had me holding back tears you know it was so ridiculously funny i won't explain the content of what made them so funny out of respect for the rocks career there was some great times and uh i know it doesn't sound you know people don't tend to think of my tna days as being you know that first year, I think I did some really good stuff, but some of the stuff we were allowed to get away with on house shows, just as well, you know,

what you might term as shenanigans. For example, you know, there's that fiery comeback that some wrestling fans might know where the baby face, the good guy for the uninitiated, like, yeah, hit the ground, it goes, come on, come on, you know, and then they would commence their comeback. But when I would hit the ring, I wouldn't just go, come on, come on. It would last like two minutes, you know. And my goal was to make Jeremy Borash laugh. And on a few different occasions, I would look over at him at the announce table,

not the announce table, but ringside table, and there'd be tears streaming down his face. And we would remark on how sometimes the matches would be, I'd be the enforcer and the Tommy Dreamer and the Dudleys, some guys have done these ultra hardcore matches in ECW. And here we are in front of a live crowd, just having the time of our lives being as silly as possible. So, you know, for all the, you know, I think, well, Nick Gage, you know,

there was that documentary, Nick, Nick only has one year. He has that hard. Yeah. For a lot of us, there's a yin to the yang and the harder core you have been and that is part of you there is another side of you that wants to entertain people in a much different way it's the dude love in you right the dude love yeah down on dude i guess this is an awkward segue or maybe a smooth segue into my cameo videos but oh

man do i love portraying dude love on those cameo videos so i've kind of reinvented him as the guy who thinks far more highly of his own career than he has any right to constantly bragging about the two things he did which is uh is getting down and do the 23 skidoo, knock me, love dance, and teaming up with Texas, his own homegrown chrome dome, Stone Cold Steve Austin. Like those are his two claims to fame.

And he relives them every day. I've really, I feel like almost, you know, the movie Clerks, I watched as a child and I was like, all right, this is okay. And then I got a job in concession stand at a movie theater. And I was like, okay, I get this movie. This is hysterical. And Dude Love, I felt

the same way as a kid. I was like, yeah, I like Dude Love, but like really Cactus Jack and Mankind are my guys. And then I grew up and I became a bit of a stoner. And now I'm like, oh, Dude Love was so underrated. He was the best. If you could relive any one night from your career, which night would you pick? I assume it wouldn't be a night like getting thrown off the hell in a cell. No, no. Although that obviously, you know,

we, you know, we made quite an impression that night. Great night, but maybe one night you do once, right? That's the one and done. And you're like,

all right, I'm good with that. My favorite thing to do in wrestling is the Daffy duck bump. I might be a showing my age here but there was literally a contest of looney tunes between daffy duck and one of the other characters daffy finally tops it you know and i think bugs or whoever's competitor has to concede and as daffy's uh ascending to the heavens playing a harp. His reply is, I know, I know, but I can only do it once. So that was my Daffy duck bump, the one I can only do once.

I think if I had to relive any moment, it would be that night when I defeated Dwayne for the WWE title the first time. That was really a great time and so unexpected. Not only the result but also the way it made me feel because I'd never based my success on being a champion. I just honestly didn't see that in the cards but when it happened it was incredible. And was that moment like a I've made it moment or like you said you didn't base your success on being a champion.

So did you feel that way already? And then that was icing on the cake. Yeah, I did. I felt like I'd been a success. But then that victory and the subsequent ratings. That helps. That show themselves. Yeah, really took me to the next level,

especially within the business, you know, the way people thought of me within the business. So that was a great night. That's one I would like to live over. Do you also like looking back that it happened on Monday night raw? I know the ratings thing is obviously a big, like boost nowadays, but just the fact that title matches used to be a little more common on raw as a fan i loved that yeah i i was always you know i have an affinity for raw uh i think i went eight or

nine years without appearing on the smackdown show so that when i did come back i was almost uh predominantly i was almost exclusively on raw and even though i did commentate on smackdown i always felt like a raw guy so there was always something about appearing on that show all right now I've got a few tweets of yours that I kind of want a little more context into not too long ago we saw a big exploding ring uh mishap in wrestling I would call it and you tweeted about a mishap that you had in 1995 in Japan. Something similar took place to you. I wanted to know if you remember a little more about that night. Like what happened with the exploding ring mishap that Mick Foley had?

Yeah, FMW had done an exploding ring on two different occasions. And my goodness, it was, you know, really convincing for someone to live through it, continue a wrestling match. And there was, I think on both occasions, there was that dramatic scene where the opponent would be covering his opponent, you know, covering his opponent that night. And, you know, there was a feeling of mutual respect because of what they'd gone through. So that's what Terry Funk and I are expecting. Although in this kitchen, i bailed out of the ring to leave terry alone you know the japanese fans and they announced they count down in english

i never figured out why yeah the ring count i always thought that was strange too and then everyone covered their ears and we witnessed what appeared to be four roman candles one in each corner going just every who'd been expected this phenomenal explosion stands up and he like lifts his hands out like you can't really see the like as if to say that's it and then i climb in and the words terry says to me is we better get them back and at that point the injuries started piling up. You know, we were calling stuff on the fly, and it resulted in 14 stitches, almost a loss of my left ear. Oh, my God.

I had 40. Yeah, that would have been crazy, right? They would have looked like just two small ears, though. This one doesn't look all that bad, right? No, the one was supposed to look like um and i had a 42 stitches and six different body parts so um you know with the wire really did a number to us on us so i did feel for those guys um when things did not go their way. Sometimes things are out of your control. And I know people will look back on that and panic,

even though the guys did everything possible to make it memorable during the part of the match that they had control over. All right. Another one of your tweets. This one I was so fascinated in. Your last ever appearance in Japan. You said you came in in a wheelchair and left in a wheelchair but in that appearance you completed the match you had a match against

kawada right am i getting that right what do you remember about that i'd torn a ligament it was crazy because i trained like crazy uh to to work with uh randy at Backlash in 2004. And I'd lost 60 pounds and had what I thought and still think is the best match of my career. Incredible street fight. Yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. Must have been one of those, you know, the straw that breaks the camel back type of things

because I didn't do anything. I was just watching my children play. We're using a Fisher Price water table a couple of days after that match. And I went to get up and I couldn't stand. So the ligament that I've been holding on, you know, by a thread, you know, giving way. And I told my agent, Barry Bloom, that I couldn't walk. He called me back a couple days later and said, how are you feeling?

And I said, I'm not too good. He said, can you walk? I said, no. And he said, Bill Goldberg just got hurt. He can't make his event for Monster in Japan. And Bill had this phenomenal contract. And I realized I could make Bill Goldberg money which was more money than I'd made in my uh 15 weeks in Japan combined a lot more uh and I said to Barry I said I might not be able to walk but I'll be in that ring did I I went to LA and I won't say who the doctor was but he didn't even tell me he was giving me a cortisone injection all I felt was a needle what was that and um so i could i could walk but i was in intense pain and i couldn't walk well so i did come in on a wheelchair when i left it was with a wheelchair i spent that night throwing up in a you know in a toilet uh because i got a concussion um you know the kick to the head is nothing that is uh do you remember the match at all was it a

good match with like it was good it wasn't great you know i mean i could i couldn't move too well i mean you see clips of it it looked like a great match but it was short by classic japanese standards it's what monster wanted it's about 10 minutes and uh you know i couldn't move that well so i did take a pounding it was pretty it was okay nothing to be embarrassed of but nothing like the match i had with randy orton and clearly it was a sellout it was me doing something for a big time i would just love to see you doing the the full goldberg entrance now hearing that story mick foley pound on the door you know maybe dude love comes out he goes back in then you come back out oh yes man yeah yeah i just i was strictly a money-making enterprise that time listen i respect it i respect the hell out of it um another person

that i spoke to last week that brought you up was Drew McIntyre we talked about his book that he has coming out and obviously you were a big factor in his career you were a big advocate for him when he was not in the WWE you wrote the forward for his book I believe you did the virtual signings for his book I wanted to ask you when Drew McIntyre got released from the WWE, he had been, you know, Vince McMahon's chosen one. He had been three MB, but it seemed like you saw more in him than that. What was that? And why do you think you saw more in Drew McIntyre? Well, I didn't see more in Drew until he showed me more.

It was when he first came to the Indies that then you realized, okay. Specifically insane championship wrestling out of Scotland. Yeah. I didn't think Drew was ready for that huge push when he got it. I did think three-man band was really humorous and was a great lower card act. I remember wearing a 3MB final tour shirt. I was sad when they were let go because i really enjoyed those guys but i thought this is what he this is where he should be on the card and then he reached out to me

and he said he had something he'd like me to watch he apologized ahead of time for the language uh you know i'm pretty well known for not using the rough stuff i do i dropped one f-bomb at my one-man shows at the end of the show and if i can get a standing ovation for that one bad word then you know we know we were part of something special thing and the first thing i did was text triple h and i don't text him very often i don't badger them as much in the way of talent you know unless something really catches my eye. And I said, you need to keep your eye on this guy. He's almost like a different human being. And I guess he did keep his eye on him. And just the progress he made was incredible.

Sometimes you just need that incentive and there's that flip switching moment from which everything else uh you did uh changes nothing will ever be the same and that was that moment for drew and you got to be part of an incredible moment with him in icw where grado beat him for the title and you got to run in for it and like i might re-watch that once a month on youtube just for the pop you know it was great yeah i didn't i forgot that the ring was on a platform so that when i pulled i fell off the platform you know that's yeah yeah like me just that sudden six inch and 12 inch drop but it looked really good you know and then what what an atmosphere that was to be there edible right yeah right? Yeah. Like a prayer, the Madonna song.

I always made, I think he wasn't allowed to use it. I always maintained if Madonna herself had seen that entrance, it's something she would have proved. And that was really amazing. That was the largest British promotion, you know, British run promotion wrestling show in decades and then they topped it the next year yeah i mean grado was the one that got me into icw in the first place because i think vice made the documentary on him or you know they had him in the icw documentary itself so when he won the title that was like at the biggest show that felt like almost a daniel bryan moment for me and that like this is the ICW version or a Mankind moment even it was incredible yeah I was so glad to be part of it I'd given Grado

a flannel shirt and he wore it for years he might still be wearing it to this day I'm not sure shout out Grado he's about to become a father I just saw he uh he announced that good for him all right I've got one final question for you If you can own one piece of wrestling memorabilia that you don't already own, what is it? Do you have a pick or are you like, bro, I'm sick of wrestling memorabilia. I got it all over my house. I always wanted Bruiser Brody's boots. That's a great one. Would have been cool.

Yeah. But I think that's about it. That's the only I don't have any memorabilia of my own uh showcased in my house but i would find a spot for those brody boots what about movie memorabilia if you could pick one piece of movie memorabilia we had cm punk on the show recently and he answered he wanted the door from the black maria and texas chainsacre, the big 18-wheeler? Well, let me think. Something of myself is my 20-year-old, the big horror buff.

So maybe I could find him something similar to that. Let me think. Let me think. Man, I have a replica of the Shamrock Meats robe that Rocky balboa wore in the original rocky so having the original that would be something special another great answer mick foley full of great answers today all right mick this has been a pleasure i cannot wait for your a and e biography and shout out may 25th the day we're recording this we're only seven months till christmas there you go i celebrate halfway to christ, just so you know.

So think of me next month. I'll be living up with the Foley's. I'll be thinking of you June 25th. Everyone send Mick a nice tweet. Be like, happy half Christmas. Is that what you call it? Half Christmas? Sounds good.

Happy half Christmas. Thanks a lot.