National Park After Dark - Broken Promises, Broken Hearts: Nez Perce National Historical Park

Episode Date: November 17, 2025

In June of 1877, 800 people were faced with an impossible choice - leave their home or be forcibly removed from it. What resulted was a 126 day 1,500 mile journey across four states by a band of Nez Perce who were attempting to escape forced relocation. They were relentlessly and violently pursued by the U.S. Army, eluding and fighting them for months through mountain ranges and within Yellowstone National Park before ultimately being forced into a corner just 40 miles from Canada - and freedom.For a full list of our sources, visit http://npadpodcast.com/episodesFor the latest NPAD updates, group travel details, merch and more, follow us on npadpodcast.com and our socials at:Instagram: @‌nationalparkafterdarkTikTok: @‌nationalparkafterdarkSupport the show by becoming an Outsider and receive ad free listening, bonus content and more on Patreon or Apple Podcasts. Want to see our faces? Catch full episodes on our YouTube Page!Thank you to the week’s partners!IQBAR: Text PARK to 64000 to get 20% off all IQBAR products and free shipping.Smalls: For a limited time, get 60% off your first order, plus free shipping, when you head to Smalls.com/NPAD.Rocket Money: Use our link to get started saving.Hello Fresh: Use our link to get up to 10 FREE meals and free breakfast for life. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Close your eyes. Focus. Listen to work getting done with Monday.com. Relax. As AI does the manual work, while your teams are aligned on a single source of truth. Feel the sensation of an AI work platform, so flexible and intuitive, it feels like it was built just for you. Notice you're limitless.

Limitless. Now open your eyes. Go to Monday.com. Start for free and finally. Breathe. Expedia and Visit Scotland invite you to come step into centuries of history that await in Scotland. Castle steeped in legend, walk along cobblestone streets. Come share the warmth of stories passed down through generations. This is a place with a past that is fully present today and all yours to explore.

Plan your Scottish escape today at Expedia.com slash Visit Scotland. In 1805, the Nez Perse people had gathered in Weipipa, Prairie, a wide meadow nestled into the foothills of the Bitterroot Mountains of Idaho. The Nez Perce people, or the Nemeepoo, in their language, were born from these lands. Since time and memorial, they had come here to gather food, graze their animals, and live as they always had. But in the fall of 1805, they encountered something new, a party of men, some white, and one black. The men had fur on their faces, and some of the Nes-Persse wondered if they were descended from dogs. But they quickly befriended these strange men, who called themselves Louis and Clark, and welcomed them into their camp, shared food, knowledge, and laughter, taught them to carve canoes,

drew them a map, and offered to watch over their equipment. In his journal, Clark even noted that the Nes-Perses' purse showed greater acts of hospitality than we have witnessed from any other nation or tribe since we passed the wrong. Rocky Mountains. When the group of explorers were ready to move on, the NesPers clasped hands with them saying that for all time, the Nes-Pers and white people would be friends. The Nes-Pers had tried to honor that promise, but the men who followed in the footsteps of Lewis and Clark did not return the favor. Mountain men, missionaries, prospectors, and soldiers came to the region, at first in a trickle, and then in a flood. Some were friendly, but many were not. They claimed land, made promises

broke their word and made threats. Tensions rose and rose for decades before erupting in violence. An outcome all but a few had hoped to avoid. And now, 70 years after their meeting with Lewis and Clark, the Nez Perse once again found themselves in the Weip Prairie, but this time they were faced with an impossible choice. Should they return to their homelands, stand their ground, or leave their home far behind,

and enter into the unknown? The military was in violent pursuit and closing in fast. With tears in their eyes, they took a final look at the prairie and chose to run. Welcome to National Park After Dark. Hello, everybody. I'm Cassie. And I'm Danielle. And welcome to our show. Welcome to National Park After Dark.

Today we have an indigenous-based story. And actually, when you were reading that intro, I realized how few times we've spoken about Lewis and Clark. I don't recall a single time. I know. Really? Yeah. I guess you're right. Yeah.

Let's ignore them for a little while. For years. We've been doing this for almost five years. Well, we're going to continue doing it. That was it. Lewis and Clark are... I know this isn't about them, but when you said their name, I was like, huh, we've never told that story, even though it's very...

I mean, it's ingrained in us in childhood, I guess. in elementary school from like third grade to like seventh. So yeah, maybe we'll circle back, but now is not the time because like you said, we are going to be focusing on an indigenous story today. And that is in honor of Indigenous History Month for the last two weeks of the month. We are going to be each sharing an indigenous based story. And this one is a topic that I have heard commemorated in different things and trails and parks that we'll get to.

But I don't know the story in its entirety. So I'm really excited to share it with you because, well, and I say excited in quotations, because this is among probably the heaviest. One of the heaviest topics we've discussed before. It's not super dark and morbid in the sense of sensational, scary, dark, creepy that we kind of lean towards sometimes. But it's a pretty emotionally heavy chapter in history and we're going to talk about it. But before we do, really quick note, because this story is actually quite long and I want to get to it. But we wanted to announce that we have our store open right now. Yeah.

We restocked a few of our favorites from the past few years and we put it back in our shop. So if you have been wanting some merch and haven't gotten some yet or you want some new stuff that you could have bought before but didn't. It is not a shop. Yeah. So it's there if you want it. Okay, that's it for housekeeping, I think. Perfect. Well, I'm excited to hear this story because you've told me little tidbits here and there. And this is something that I'm not super familiar with either. So I'm ready. Awesome. Okay. Well, like I said, this episode is going to be historically and emotionally heavy. There isn't really much space for levity throughout this. So I think that I'm going to say this now, so you have time to maybe think about it in the back of your mind. I think we need to do a pallet clothe. cleanser at the end. Okay. So maybe just something that you, something nice that happened to you recently or something you're looking forward to. I saw, and it's too late for this right now, because

we're already recording. But I saw some people mention about the palate cleansers, because we've mentioned it in a past episode, a few in the past. And some people said that we should put at the end of our episodes, we should do a little bit of a Q&A from our Patreon members where we answer their questions. Shoot, too late for now. Too late for this one. But if you like that idea, outsiders, please let us know. Okay. Yeah. And we'll implement it another day. Duly noted. And we will totally do that. Or I'll shoot. Or I can shoot our outsiders a message right now and be like, we're recording and we're going to answer your questions. Let us know it. Yeah, let me do that. Yeah, good idea. They're so nice. They'll totally. You guys will totally come through.

Not elevator music. But, you know, like, busy signal. Do do do not that though because Is that Who wants to be a millionaire? No, that's like Do do do do Like the real remember when the lights go down? Yeah, but when they're thinking and they're like

Do do do do do do That's Jeopardy, I think. That makes sense. Do you know that my favorite game show, I guess? Is it? Well, yeah, it's probably a game show. But one that I was always hooked on was I say my favorite.

I can't even think of the name of it. But the one with the cases that were just randomly numbered, and you had to pick a case and it had a dollar amount. Yes. And some of them, like one would have like a million dollars, and then the other one would have like one dollar. But yet the whole point was to not pick the high value ones. And then the banker would call and offer you a deal.

Oh, who want? What is it called? I don't know. You're like my favorite show. What is the favorite show? All time. Okay. Hold on. More elevator music, please.

Oh my God, deal or no deal. Yes. And it didn't even load. My internet didn't even load yet. It just came to you? It just came to me. Yeah. Wow.

Yeah. I think I liked it so much because it truly did feel if it was rigged. I'm not sure. Don't ruin it for me. But it truly did feel as if it was just anyone could get a shot. It wasn't based on your knowledge or experience in any sort of thing. It was just kind of a crap. you, you know. Yeah. Yeah, that was nice that you could go in and it was like, I have a chance.

Yeah. Me. Me. Okay. Let's get serious now. For real. So yes. Okay. You got the Q&A prompt. Yep. I sent it. I'll check it at the end. Perfect. Hopefully people answer. Otherwise, at the end of this, so I'm going to be like, no one has any questions. No, I'll have to make one up. I can't. We can't let that slide. Yeah. Okay, so after that introduction, you have a bit of background on what exactly has culminated up until this point to get where we are for the rest of this story, which is going to be covering the NESPERS flight of 1877, in which 800 men, women, and children fled nearly 1,500 miles, outsmarting multiple military commanders in their pursuit of freedom. a route that would take them from their homeland in Oregon and Idaho through the heart of Yellowstone towards Canada and into an uncertain future. It's a multifaceted story of strength, tragedy, and ultimately the cost of America's westward expansion. But how did we get here? What brought

the Nez Perce people to the Bitterroot Mountains where they were faced with this impossible choice? In the 1800s, the experience of the Nez Perse mirrored that of many different indigenous groups across the continent. Throughout their traditional lands, which span modern day Oregon, Washington, Idaho, and Montana, traders arrived who were happy to charge Native people for goods, but never paid them for land. Ranchers moved in and set up fences, claiming to own territory the NesPers had used for millennia. And missionaries also entered the scene intent on converting Native peoples to Christianity and assimilating them into American society. And I think one of the parts of the story that I find, particularly compelling is it gives a little bit more insight into what I thought I knew about this period of time

because my initial understanding was what I would call pretty generalized, almost like a blanket understanding that there was this dark chapter of residential boarding schools. Children were stripped of their identity, culture, heritage, and forced to assimilate into this new way of life and, you know, indoctrinated against their will, essentially. And while that is overwhelmingly true, and I'm sure we will get to covering a story specifically touching upon that entire thing, the whole boarding schools and stuff, because it is actually recommended quite a lot from listeners. Yeah, I see a lot. Yeah, the National Park Service preserves a lot of those sites. So while that is all overwhelmingly true, there is another person.

to this, because for many Nez Perse, Christianity was actually quite appealing. To caucus, a Nez Perce leader, was one of those people who found it appealing. After meeting with a white man named Reverend Spalding, he became a student of the Bible, sharing his teachings with his own people in their own language. These teachings, the worship of one creator, above all, heaven and hell, etc., etc., religious jargon and things. They were not accepted readily by everyone, but many Nez Perce, adopted Christianity, Tukakis was baptized, given the Christian name of Joseph, and in 1840, gave the same

name to his newborn son. So I'm going to try and differentiate the Joseph's here with Tukakis as I'm going to refer to him by his non-Christian name, and then Joseph, the son as Joseph. Okay, just to make it easier to follow. Yeah, because I don't want to be like the older Joseph and the younger, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, totally. Joseph would grow up to play a very important role in the flight of 1877. But as a kid, he was raised sort of straddling these two worlds. He grew up playing with settler kids in the white town of Lapway, as his dad learned at the missionary. And he would travel with his family across the land, learning the old ways of the Nez Perce. So in many ways, he embodied these two competing forces that was kind of taking hold

at this point in time, this new and old clash of ways of life. And that rift would grow wild. wider and wider with each passing year. By the time Joseph was 15, the governor of the Washington Territory, Isaac Stevens, met with the Nespers to discuss a treaty. He made lavish promises, money, livestock, supplies, and that he would protect their land from white settlement. If only, they would go and move on to a reservation. The treaty was a subject of great discussion for the as per se. It was something that really needed to be discussed and debated and dissected. But for Tukakis, his native Wallawa Valley was entirely included within the boundaries of this new proposed reservation. So to him, this agreement served as a way to safeguard that and safeguard that piece of

their ancestral homelands. And he looked at it in that way instead of this restraint on his people. With this line of thinking, he signed the treaty on behalf of his Wallawa band. However, in the years following this treaty, Stephen's promises were nowhere to be seen. Surprise, surprise. Goods and supplies never came. Hospitals and schools were never built. The promise that their land would be protected from white settlement was not acknowledged by homesteaders or enforced by the government. So as a result, a steady stream of ranchers were starting to settle down in the lands that had been promised to the Nes purse.

This betrayal led many in the tribe to distrust the U.S. government, of course, and disappointed and his trust completely shattered. Tukakis tore up his Bible, which is, you know, a big deal. He had not only converted to Christianity himself, but he was spreading the word and trying to get others on board. And this move completely broke his heart. So when Stevens returned soon after, intent on negotiating a smaller reservation, the Nez Perce were split. Many of the bands who had adopted Christianity, since they had the missionaries had first arrived, believed in the government's promises. But many others did not, especially given the recent unfolding of events. Clearly, they didn't hold up their end of the deal. In council, it was decided

that each band could decide for itself. And the non-treaty bands who refused would not have to follow the terms of the new treaty. And Joseph's father, Tukakis, was among the non-treaty chiefs, marking the boundary of the Wallawa, the land of his people, with rock cairns. Sensing the weight of leadership that his son would soon face as he grew into adulthood, Tukakis asked his son to make him a promise. Stop your ears whenever you are asked to sign a treaty selling your home. This country holds your father's body. Never sell the bones of your father and mother. Tukakis died in 1871, leaving Joseph in charge of the Wallawa people. But while Tukakis didn't sign the second treaty, in the eyes of the U.S. government, there was no distinction between the treaty and non-treaty bans. So that was a

decision that was made amongst the NESPERS, but the U.S. government didn't recognize that or understand or honor that at all. So they essentially accepted that any NesPers chief could speak for them all. They had no care that they had differing opinions. So as a result, according to this latest treaty, the Willawa Valley no longer belonged to Joseph's band. And his His people belonged on a reservation. Facing growing efforts from the government to remove them, Joseph worked tirelessly as a chief to keep his promise to his father, even as more white people settled onto their land and his people suffered greater injustices. Missionaries were creating new laws and using violence to enforce them. Ranchers castrated Nesperse horses that they found near their herds.

An Indian agent who was given $10,000 to build a school on the reservation, pocketed the cash, fled, and was never. seen again. At the heart of all of this was an uneven application of the law. Ken Nurburn, author of a very lengthy 500-page book called Chief Joseph. There's always a book. This one is a hefty one, yeah. It's titled Chief Joseph and the Flight of the Nez Perce. He put it this way. When a lawless white man killed or raped or stole from an Indian, the Indian had no recourse. But when an Indian committed a crime against a white, retribution was swift, often directed against any Indian who happened to be nearby. And a prime example of this is when one of Joseph's closest friends was killed by a whiskey trader. And that man bragged about killing this indigenous man all around town.

He made a show of it. He was not quiet about it. Boasted about it. And yet he walked free and faced no punishment at all. They just didn't care because he was white and it was an indigenous person. Yep. Outraged, some Nez Perth demanded that he be killed, exacting justice in the way of their people, kind of like an eye for an eye type of thing.

But Joseph, desiring peace and understanding, invited the military to negotiate the situation. He told them, my friend was an honorable man and the white man who killed him was known to be a troublemaker. There's no need for war, but justice needs to be done. His eloquence, reasonable demeanor, and lawyer-like precision had stunned the government officials. To some white men, this strengthened his reputation as a commanding, well-spoken, an honorable person. They kind of looked at him with newfound respect, especially given the circumstances and his calmish demeanor and just very even keeled. But to others, it suggested that he could be a dangerous enemy. While Joseph's presence and wit gained him respect amongst some, it was not enough to save his Willawa Valley.

In 1877, the government issued Joseph and the other non-treaty bans and ultimatum, relocate to the reservation in 30 days, or we'll escort you there by force. Joseph wanted to honor the promise that he made to his dad to protect and remain in their native valley, yet he also had an obligation as a chief to his people to keep them safe. So after a lot of consideration, reluctantly, they packed up and prepared to move. But before they could arrive, everything changed. To the south, an old Nes-Persman named Eagle Robe was killed by a white settler. As he lay dying, he made his son promise that he would not seek vengeance. But that was not a promise his son could keep, because his son had had enough. Joseph had wrestled with a promise made to a father and chose to protect his people.

But now, as he reluctantly moved to the reservation, he got news of violence. Multiple men and even children lay dead along the Salmon River, many more than just the man who had killed Eagle Robe. And while no one had endorsed this action, everyone would ultimately have to live with the consequences. So are you tracking essentially the son of Eagle Robe sought justice by killing a ton of white settlers? Yeah. Okay. After the violence at Salmon River, rather than continuing on, to the reservation, the non-treaty Nez Perse regrouped at Weip Prairie, deciding whether to stay

or whether to flee. To buy them some time, Joseph sent word to the pursuing army commander, General Howard, that he wished to discuss a surrender. And he sent word through a Christian Nesperse messenger claiming that he would meet Howard on the reservation to discuss terms. And after Howard received word of this, he excitedly turned around and he retreated to meet with Joseph, but Joseph never came. Joseph's reputation among white leaders led reporters to call the group Joseph's Indians, but he was not the leader of the whole Nes purse people. In fact, if he had been, they might have stayed. His view was that if they could protect the women and children, he would rather die in his homeland than live in exile. But as we mentioned before, this was a tribe of

many different bands, each with their own chief and ideas about where to go next and what's decisions to make, join the treaty or not. He kind of had like a subgroup of his people. Yeah, there were many. Yeah. Many different subgroups, but to the outside world and people who didn't understand that or didn't care to understand that, they were basically- Everyone thought and believed the same exact thing.

Under Joseph's leadership, essentially, yeah. But among the other chiefs of these different bands was a man named Chief Looking Glass, who argued that they should flee. Shortly after the violence at the Salmon River, Looking Glass's village was attacked by soldiers who had burned their lodges and trampled their crops. He believed their people should head east to Montana and search out their allies, the crow. And while the group did consist of many different bands, they did agree that for this journey, they should sort of act as one unified group. And for that, they recognized Looking Glass as their trail leader. So they looked to him and appointed him as the decision maker and guide.

And so they started moving east to Montana and to their allies. So good. So good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom rack stores now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince, Sam Edelman, frame and free people. Join the Nordy Club to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for, free. Great brands, great prices. That's why you rack. Making the journey were 800 men, women, children, and elders, over a thousand horses and any supplies that they could take with them. To distance themselves from their pursuers, even with such a large group, they took advantage

of river crossings, something their people had done many, many, many different times. They had a ton of experience with, and luckily, the U.S. Army did not. The Nes purse knew where to cross, and how to build boats to carry goods. But the pursuing army needed to fasten a rope on the opposing shore and drag themselves across. When the rope snapped or they picked the wrong place on the river to attempt a crossing, which was not uncommon and happened frequently, soldiers and horses would drown and their ammunition would get ruined. Joseph, for his part, was not serving as a military leader,

but he did manage the camp. He kept track of and cared for their horses and ensured supplies were being evenly distributed amongst everyone, the children, the elderly, the sick, etc. And it is one thing to know where you're heading. I mean, this is a big journey in and of itself. They've done many times. I mean, this area, they know, like the back of their hand, their people have been utilizing roots in and around this area for thousands of years. But to get a group of that size across the Rockies is a huge feat. I know. When you were talking about it, I was just imagining in a way smaller scale. and not under such stress that they're in. But I was picturing our group trips where we have had

30 people on. And it's a challenge just because terrain, people have different needs, people have different abilities. And to take, and you think with 30 people, it can be a challenge, not that it hasn't been super fun and great. And that was under circumstances where we're out there having fun. And then you take this group of people who are fleeing, a pursuing military, group that is coming after them. And you have over 800 people that are crossing. And a lot of them are children. They're not adults. And you have to feed them. And then you have horses and you have camp. And it's just I can't even, I really can't imagine the magnitude of how difficult a journey like that would be. Absolutely. And it's so funny that you say that and make that comparison because

my mind went to the same place. Really? Yeah. It's like it's the only thing I can compare to because I have nothing in my personal life that could even compare to that. So it's just like this small little corner where I'm like, wow, that was a challenge. Wow. Wow. How are they doing this? And but like you said, this is something that their people have been doing for a very, very long time. But still. But still, there are challenges. Yeah. And along the way, the Nes person countered groups of white settlers. And each time, the chiefs assured them that they meant them no harm. They were just passing in peace, just as they had always done. Because remember, at the beginning of when the first and only mention of Lewis and Clark on this podcast,

that was of a rather friendly relationship that they had with them. And that was 70 years prior. And since then they had made different encounters with white settlers and different groups. And they had made that promise. We're just, we're going to be peaceful and friends, you know. And I'm not trying to paint all the indigenous groups is, you know, super friendly and nice to white settlers. That's not the case. I'm very well aware of that. But in this particular circumstance, nor should it be. Yes. But in this particular circumstance, they truly did try to integrate themselves to be able to live amongst each other. Yeah. I have read Empire of the Summer Moon. And if you have not, I definitely recommend it. It is extremely brutal on both sides.

And very eye-opening. Anyway, so another book recommendation. If you don't want to read a 500-page book. This one's 300 pages. This one's just 495. Yeah, no, it's really good. Anyway, okay. So they're trying to pass in peace and do their best to not ruffle any feathers

and just kind of fly under the radar. But the white settlers had heard about the violence at Salmon River, and they were really scared. newspapers had been reporting on the actions and movements of quote unquote Joseph's Indians, while incorrecting attributing Joseph as the sole chief and leader of this entire group. And of course, as newspapers have always done, embellishing many different details along the way. Coverage of the Nez Perce retreat would soon attract nationwide attention. But looking glass was intent on keeping the peace. He promised that there would be no killing and no sealing.

they had goods to trade and then they would be on their way. And he meant it. Looking Glass carefully watched over the entire group ensuring nobody spoke out of turn or raised their hand. Of particular concern were the young warriors, the men and boys who'd gotten themselves into this mess in the first place. Many of the young warriors had wished to stay and fight and resented this entire retreat. They were totally against this decision. They were pissed. They had had enough. But Looking Glass did his best to keep them and their tempers in check. And with these efforts, peace was kept for a time. They traded for food and supplies and even invited some of the settlers to join them at their campsites and campfires and they would share food and drink and then move on their way. Moving 12 to 15 miles a day. Let that

sink in for a second. 800 people. There's no way. What did we do in a day with 30 people, tops? I mean, we did do one that was like 20 miles. We weren't carrying camp. Oh, no, we were not. We are not. but we did do like 20 miles. It was a rough. We've never carried. It was a rough day. Yeah. I mean, that's like, that's like through hiking.

AT hikers do like usually like 10, 14 miles a day and they're carrying their camp, but not in groups of 800 people. That's just. They're not carrying a thousand horses. No one's doing that. But, you know, the horses weren't walking. You know, but. To carry your entire lives with you.

Right. 12 to 14 miles a day. That's incredible. Oh, through the Rocky Mountains, too. This isn't just like a flat, nice trail. This is rough terrain. Yeah. So averaging about 12 to 15 miles a day, trading with settlers as they went.

The group was making some steady progress. Some thought that the pace was too slow, but did feel some relief as they had seen. Too slow. Well, because they're being pursued. Oh, right, right. So they're scared. Still, I'm like 12 to 50. That's fair. I'm like, what do you mean slow? That's good. That's good. You guys are doing great. Yeah. So they just thought that out of fear of being caught up with. No, that totally makes sense. But, you know, they kind of, their worries were a little assuaged when there was no sign of the military that they had seen up until that point. And in just a few weeks of traveling across rugged mountain terrain. they made it to Montana.

Looking Glass, who set their pace, was confident that leaving Idaho meant leaving war behind. They were no longer in their traditional territory, and the army commander pursuing them, General Howard, was in charge of Idaho, not Montana. So in his mind, in Looking Glass's mind, the people of Montana didn't have a problem with them. Like, no beef here. We're good. They were still searching to find their allies, the crow, but for now, they thought it was safe. to take a pause in a well-deserved rest. Upon arriving in a valley known to the settlers as Big Hole, they set up camp.

They erected a lodge for the sick and a maternity lodge for newborns. And actually Joseph and his wife, Springtime, had just welcomed a new baby girl into the world. Young men stayed up late playing games and had fires into the night, a welcome rest after weeks of hard travel. Looking Glass had believed that escaping Idaho meant escaping the military, but he was wrong. The U.S. military was not about to let the killing at Salmon River go, because to them they had a score to settle, and it wasn't just about that one incident. Just one year prior, the United States had been humiliated at the Battle of the Little Big Horn. George Armstrong Custer, representing the U.S. Army, had been defeated by the Lakota Sioux and their chief, Sitting Bull. And to make matters worse, the Sioux had escaped after the battle into Canada, where they remained out of reach of the U.S. forces.

The Ness purse now possibly fleeing in that exact direction could pose a genuine threat if they joined up with Sitting Bull and the Sioux. I love what you just mentioned to this fact because I just want to let listeners know. Keep that information in your pocket for next week's episode because we're going to circle back to that exact moment. Really? For just a really brief moment in the episode. But yeah. Oh, it's all coming together. This was planned.

This was planned. Yeah. I'm like, wait a second. And I talk about this exact same thing, too. So keep that in your brains. Okay. Now I'm excited because I know very little about your story next week. So yay.

Well, so that's on the military's mind. You know, that could be a problem for them if they joined forces. But perhaps most of all, the NesPers provided the army with an opportunity to save face. Since Custer's defeat, Congress had been criticizing the military and threatening their funding. and defeating the Nez Perce now could redeem them for their loss at the Little Bighorn. Right. Because of this, the Army never relented in their pursuit of the Nez Perce and had begun sending telegrams ahead of their party to request additional support, which is why, in the dead

of night, 100 soldiers and volunteers who had marched south from Montana amassed around the Nez Perce camp. At the break of dawn, shots rang out. Army soldiers stormed the camp, lighting tepees on fire. and shooting at anyone that moved. They fired low into the tipies to kill anyone still asleep or hiding on the ground, including women, children, and elders. Half-dressed and caught completely off-guard, the Nes-Persfought back fiercely with anything that they could.

Their fists, rocks, sticks, and eventually rifles. They returned fire through the frantic, smoke-filled camp, but many fell to the soldiers' bullets. In the midst of it all, a young girl broke away from her mother and walked back to her teepee to retrieve her doll. Mistaking the sound of flying bullets for bees, she swatted around her head the entire way, before luckily making it back to safety where her mother hid. The NesPers were ultimately able to fend off this attack, but the once clear waters of the nearby creek ran red with blood. It was later reported that the troops killed 89 NesPers that day, conveniently left out the fact that at least 50 of those were women, children, and the elderly. The NesPerser's bearers. The NesPers

buried their dead and tried to regroup. But stunned by the tremendous loss, they chose to elect to follow a new trail leader, a man named Poker Joe. Joe's time in Montana gave him knowledge of the region, and his half-white heritage gave him an edge. It gave him a knowledge of English and the U.S. Army strategy. Now he's trail leader, and his first point of order was picking up the pace. Clearly, they had been completely caught off guard, and they couldn't have anticipated that the attack came from the other direction. They had no idea that the army pursuing them called in for reinforcements, but still, that was enough.

He wanted to get everyone going. They rose at first light and ate cold breakfasts to avoid campfire smoke, which would give away their position. Each day, they marched nonstop till mid-morning, took a short break, and then marched again late into the night. This speed helped the Nes-Pers distance themselves from the soldiers, but the break neck pace, fear of discovery and lack of rest took a big toll on the group. Their journey proved too painful for many of the wounded and too demanding for some of the elderly, with some of them

begging to be left behind. And while painful, it was deemed necessary for the safety of the entire group. Left with meager rations and a blanket, many were left behind on the side of the trail, knowing full well that the pursuing army would kill them as soon as they were discovered. Winter is so last season. And now spring's got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders. That perfect hang on the patio sundress.

Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from your couch. Done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear up on that envelope. It's time for a little in-person spring treat. It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. After many days of hard travel, tired and grief-stricken, the Nes-Pers marched into Yellowstone. For many Nes-Pers, the goal of this retreat was to join with the Crow people.

After siding with the crow in an earlier war against the Sioux, the crow had promised the Nes-Pers a lasting friendship. If they could just find them, their allies, they could recover from their losses and take a break from running and, you know, have some backup and reinforcement. Chief Looking Glass, no longer leading the people, volunteered to go ahead to meet up with the pro and promised to return soon, but it wasn't the crow that they first met upon arriving in Yellowstone. The Nez Perce had long traveled through what is now Yellowstone to hunt Buffalo and knew the area really well, but they did not know much about the area's newfound status as a park. Just five years earlier

in 1872, Yellowstone had become the nation's first national park. And though it was still rugged and completely underdeveloped comparatively to today, visitors had already begun making the journey into this new thing called a national park. And that summer, nine visitors had set up camp along the path of the NesPers. Seven men and two women dancing and playing music around a campfire. NesPers scouts encountered the campers first, led by young warriors. Since their losses at Big Hole, men like these, some who were just boys, essentially, I mean, somewhere as young as 16 years old, had grown unruly.

They were quote unquote unruly, especially compared to, what the chiefs were trying to sustain. Well, I'm sure they're really angry, too. So angry. I mean, they're kids and they've watched their people get murdered and they've had to flee their land. And you're also, I mean, when you're a teenager, you're just kind of angry anyway. But then to have all of that on top of it. Absolutely.

And, you know, as we discussed a little bit beforehand, the chiefs were struggling to control their tempers and hostility toward the white people that they encountered. These young men were stealing supplies and burning down white settler homes that they encountered along the way. And, you know, meanwhile, the older chiefs are like, oh, like, we're just peacefully passing through. We don't want trouble. And then meanwhile, they're causing trouble. They're causing trouble. And they're like, God, damn it. Like, you know, so it's kind of this back and forth type of thing. But to the warriors, they believe they were just settling a score. Upon finding the tourists, the scouts began to search through their supplies for

anything that they could use or destroy, but one of the male campers tried to stop them. In response, a warrior shot him and began beating him. Throughout all this commotion, all but three of the campers were able to escape the warriors, and the remaining were taken to the Nez Per's camp. These are tourists, some of the first tourists to Yellowstone National Park. Yeah. And this is what's unfolding. America's greatest idea. Right. Like advertised everywhere, come see this beautiful landscape.

And unbeknownst to you, you're kind of in the middle of a battle zone because you have these huge conflicts that are happening. That are still unfolding in the midst of, yeah, it's just such an, it's really an interesting. Like in the Venn diagram, I think of what we, you know, when we reflect back on the history of national parks and the present day national parks, this frame, this point in time is just that overlap in that Venn diagram that we don't talk about much. You know, we don't cover a lot of stories that happen in this particular timeframe that have this type of overlap of elements going on. So it's just so interesting and kind of unbelievable to try and imagine. To picture, to picture this happening in Yellowstone. Yeah. And yeah, to tort, I don't know. Yeah, it's just, it's wild.

Well, okay, so some of them are abducted and taken to camp. Yeah. And Joseph is outraged at this. Their people had been forced from their homelands because, you know, in his mind at this point, he views this action as this is the entire reason we're in this circumstance in the first place. And of course, there's so much more to that. And that's not even like a percentage. Right.

Yeah. Exactly. Because of warriors who he believed confused killing. with protecting. Joseph personally, as a result, sheltered the remaining tourists, welcomed them into his camp and shared food with them. He handed one of the women, actually, who was still clearly very upset. She had just seen someone get shot and beaten and they're abducted into this camp and, you know, she's freaking out. Joseph gives her an infant to hold in hopes that it would calm her down and communicate his good intentions and kind of be like, I come in peace type of thing. Like,

Yeah. Please, it's okay. I'm so sorry. Please, no one do that to me. Here's this baby. It's like, please don't hand me a baby under any circumstance. It's like that's doing the opposite. I'm even more upset now. Like, I'm nervous. Like, I would just, my thought would be like I'd be holding this baby and I'd be like, I just don't have any knowledge about babies. So I'd be like, am I holding its head right? Like, am I going to hurt its skull that's not fully developed? Like, what if it just like flopped over like its neck while I'm supposed to?

to be holding it. That would be, just don't do it. It's too much pressure for me to hold your child's life in my hands when they can't, if they can't hold their head up on their own yet, please do not hand me your baby. It's so. It's too much pressure. I can't handle it. I kind of think about it similarly as, you know, when you're walking through security going through TSA, you're like, do I have cocaine on me? Do I have a kilo of cocaine in my pocket right now? It's like that when I hold a baby. I'm like, am I going to drop it? Am I going to drop this baby? It's like I've never held on to something so hard in my life. I'm like, don't squeeze it and suffocate it, but also like, you're not going to, you're not going anywhere. Well, I'm always like, am I going to sporadically

just drop this thing? Yeah. Is it going to slip through my arms? The same thing is, I know I don't have a kilo of Coke. I know I'm not going to just sporadically drop this. But what if? Think, but what if? These are the questions. You have to ask you. It's just too much. It's just too much pressure. Long story short, no baby's own. I don't want to, I don't want anything to do with it other than, I like looking at them. Yeah, I think babies are really cute and I think they're fun to talk to. But I just, they're too fragile for me to, don't trust me with your baby.

From a distance. From a distance. Yeah, I want to wave and make cute little noises at them, but like, please. COVID protocol, six feet. Yeah. Okay. So he's doing all this trying to smooth. things over, but the young warriors were not on Joseph's wavelength at all. And they continued to

shout threats and just be really intimidating. So now she's being threatened with a baby in her hands. While holding, whilst holding. See, that's even worse. That's worse. Now I would really be like, there's so much going on now. If I drop this baby in this moment, now I'm really, really done for. Done for yeah. Well, to the young men who are a. upset still and shouting threats at them. You know, in their minds, their women and children hadn't been spared at Big Hole. And, you know, so why the hell are we being nice? So there's that part of it.

But also, their other concern were, hey, anybody that we leave alive and spare, essentially, are going to tell soldiers exactly where we are and how to find us. We can't let them go. Like, damage is done. But Joseph and the other chiefs provided the campers with shelter, clothes, and supplies, and helped them escape. Poker Joe gave them horses and personally led them away while making a plea. When you find others, please tell them that the Nes purse want no more fighting. But as all of this was unfolding in Yellowstone, the military was getting close.

General Howard was still approaching from the south and another regiment was closing in from the north. While the Nez Perce were waiting for looking glass to return from his meeting with the Crow, the army prepared to lay a trap. Colonel Sturgis, commanding forces north of Yellowstone, was planning to set a blockade to trap the Nez Perce, which would allow General Howard to catch up from behind. Sturgis knew that there were only two canyons that the Nez Perce could use to escape from Yellowstone. Having read exaggerated reports on the Nez Perce warriors, he didn't want to risk splitting his forces

to block both of those potential entrances, but he sent scouts south to watch their movements in hopes that he could see which canyon they decided to enter, and then he, in response, would move his forces to cut them off. But the NesPers anticipated this move from the colonel, and Poker Joe came up with a brilliant plan to trick them. The people first marched towards the Southern Canyon, which would be easier to do.

travel, kind of like the easier pick of the two. Then Joe had the warriors ride horses in massive circles at the mouth of the canyon, dragging branches on the ground to create a huge massive footprints and kick up this big dust cloud and like all this commotion. Just draw attentioning over to that area. And seeing this cloud of dust and hearing the commotion and all of that, Sturgis moved all of his troops into position, just as he had planned to do. But while the warriors and their horses got Sturgis's attention, the majority of the people in the group turned northward, escaping instead through the second canyon. And while this route was much more difficult to navigate and it was considerably more steep and difficult, their plan worked to

perfection. Sturgis waited at the mouth of the wrong canyon and cherry on top, General Howard fell for the dust trail as well, meeting a thoroughly confused Sturgis at the other end, which is just a moment. I really wholeheartedly wish I was a fly on that canyon wall to see these two militant groups coming from both ends up. And they see their fight. And they see each other. Like, like, hello?

Like, looking up, like, where did everyone go? Yeah. The Nez Perce, meanwhile, had escaped making their way out of the mountains and onto the great planes. After this daring escape, they regrouped with Looking Glass, who had ventured ahead to meet with the Crow, the group that had promised to be their allies, and who the Nespers hoped would come to their aid. But the crow had found themselves in a very similar position that the Nes Perce did. They were faced with mounting pressures from white settlement. They were fearful of angering the military, and they were intent on keeping the peace by whatever means necessary. And some among the

crow had actually even joined the U.S. military to work as scouts, interpreters, and even as fighters. So long story short, the crow couldn't risk their own safety by aiding the Nes purse. So that was, that option was kind of out. With the military on their heels and their closest allies turning their backs on them, they only had one option remaining, escape north into Canada. The days were growing short and cold, and despite the relative ease of traveling across the great planes, the people were now running low on supplies. Tensions were high. The young warriors rated white supply caches against the wishes of the elders and arguments broke out over the pace that Poker Joe was now forcing. Chief Looking Glass argued that the elders and children were, they were

exhausted. You know, they've been at this for so long and they've been through so much and the people are tired, you know. And he also made the argument that, hey, we, we tricked us. We did it. Howard and his men are far behind at this point. And Canada was only a couple days away, a couple easy days. Comparatively, they had just gone through the Rockies and now they're on the Great Plains. And it's just a couple days away. So essentially, he's advocating that they slow down, slow their pace, allow everyone to rest. And in this way, it would also give the women in the group time to sew new warmer clothing and get people ready for the temperatures that were dropping. It's getting later in the season. They're going forward. farther north. So the group gathered to consider these points and consider what the best next move would be. And ultimately, they agreed that they would slow down, once again, electing Looking Glass as trail leader. With Looking Glass and control, they made camp in a wind-sheltered hollow near the hills known as Bears' Paw, just 40 miles from the Canadian border. And Poker Joe accepted this decision. He was outnumbered and out-ruled with that. But he offered a warning. You can take control, but I think we will all be caught and killed. Oof, that is a warning. Yeah. It's like you can do it, but we're all going to die. He had set a difficult pace, but he was right to be concerned. On September 30th, much like they had at Big Hole, U.S. forces ambushed the Nez Perse at Bear's Paw. Led by a man named Colonel Miles,

the forces had caught wind of the Nes purse from their station about 150 miles to the east of their location at Bear's Paw. And Miles had his sights set because he had a goal of earning a general star and he would do it at any cost. So as a result, he drove his troops relentlessly. They marched from five or six in the morning, sometimes well past midnight for nearly two weeks straight, all in an effort to cut off the Nes purse before they. reached Canada and safety. So on September 30th, the colonel and his men did just that. They surrounded the Nesperse camp and fired down from surrounding hills, catching the group completely off guard. And to cut off their means of escape, soldiers rode screaming through the Nesperse horseherds scattering

their only means of an escape. At least 20 were killed during the initial attack, including Joseph's brother and Poker Joe. And unlike at Big Hole, the Nespers were not able to repel these forces, so instead they dug in for another brutal attack. They dug shelter holes to protect themselves from bullets and held out hope that Chief Sitting Bull would come down from Canada to rescue them. So close to the border, they had sent runners ahead to call for help. And despite the portrayal of the crow, Chief Looking Glass believed that the Sioux would answer the call. Throughout freezing temperatures and sporadic gunfire, they anxiously scanned the horizon in desperate hope for backup.

Eventually, looking glass saw what he believed could be the Sioux in the distance and rose from his cover to get a better look, only to be shot right through the head, falling dead in his shelter hole. It became clear to many of the Nes purse that the Sioux were not coming. And to make matters worse, Colonel Miles received reinforcements. General Howard, who had been on their trail for months, had finally caught up. For five days, they held out with little food and watched their loved ones fall to bullet wounds while children suffered from frostbite. It was now clear to Joseph that hope of Anez Perce victory had come to an end.

Even those who still wished to escape could see that without any horses. The children, and especially the elderly, stood no chance at all to flee through the snow. And if you have heard, I'm actually going to pause here really quick. So have you heard any of this story before? No. Okay. You might know this one portion of the story because it's pretty, I think this interaction here is pretty well known. But I am the same.

I knew little to nothing about this entire story, except for some names, of course, Sitting Bull, Chief Joseph. Like I've recognized those names. but this one point in the story I think a lot of people may recognize. And it's what he did next, what Joseph did next. Under a flag of truce, Joseph walked to meet Colonel Miles, and in full view of both armies, extended his hand as a sign of peace, saying, hear me, my chiefs, I am tired, my heart is sick and sad.

From where the sun now stands, I will fight no more forever. And Miles was ready to accept Joseph's surrender, but Joseph was adamant that this is, you know, not a surrender. It's a negotiation to end the bloodshed. His people would give up their weapons if they must, but Joseph insisted they must be also insured safe passage to their homeland after winter. Miles, surprise, surprise was not interested in any sort of negotiation. Yet, over time, just as before with others who had interactions with Joseph really grew to admire him

and the NezPers people as a whole. He had read reports on each time the band had outsmarted or repelled the U.S. Army, perhaps picturing as the newspapers claimed, this massive group of warriors and these bloodthirsty people. Yet the group that he was looking at right in front of him were families and children and elderly and there was newborn babies and people that were treating captives with kindness and they had dignity after defeat and they just carried themselves so well. And it was not at all what the newspapers were depicting them to be. And not who they thought that they were fighting.

They just went in and ambushed what they thought were a bunch of warriors come to find its elderly and women and children for the most part. He found Joseph to be an honorable man and promised him that his people could return to their homelands after the winter. Welcoming the survivors into their camp, they shared supplies and planned to move move to a nearby fort for a few months to wait out the weather. Joseph and the Nez Perse, God bless him, were confident in this promise, but like many promises before, it would not be kept.

Admittedly, it was not Miles' fault. He genuinely wished the best for the Nez Perce and worked to return them to their homeland, but it was not his promise to make. You know, like, he could say yes and I want that for you. Sure. We'll do it. but he's not in command. He's not the end-all be-all of say.

The head of the army, General Sherman, wanted the Nes-Persse out of their hands and out of the headlines. Like the General Sherman tree? Oh, yeah, probably. Oh, probably. Oh, that you needs a new name. We'll do some research. We'll do some backup research,

but I would get it. I would almost bet a lot of money. That, yeah, because he was the U.S. General of the Army. Yeah. General, sure. Yes. I'm going to say yes. Please double check me.

But yeah, I do want to say that. Elevator music. To honor Union Army General William, Tecumseh Sherman. When did he? 1879. Or wait, the German tree was named in 1879. Well, this is taking place in 1877, so. Yeah, it's got to be.

It's him. Yeah, it's got to be. Okay, well, I'm going to share a little bit more of information on this man, and now we can all look at this beautiful, amazing tree a little differently, maybe. At least what its name is not going to hold anything against the tree itself, but. No, the tree is amazing. Okay. So General Sherman, the person, wanted the Nes purse out of their hands and out of the headlines, and he also wanted to make an example of them so that no other tribes would dare deny government orders in the future and ever try and

go against the U.S. military. So he ordered the Nes-Pers be shipped east, closer to quote-unquote civilization where they would be cheaper to care for and farther from their home. Miles argued with Sherman over this decision and made the case that Joseph and his people should be allowed to return, but he was unsuccessful. In the next eight months, the Nes-Pers were sent thousands of miles away through a series of military outposts, by river to a fort in North Dakota, by train to fort in Kansas, and finally to a reservation in Oklahoma

that they were told was their new permanent home. Ready to soundtrack your summer? With Red Bull Summer All Day Play, you choose a playlist that fits your summer vibe the best. Are you a festival fanatic, a deep end DJ, a road dog, or a trail mixer?

Just add a song to your chosen playlist and put your summer on track. Red Bull Summer All Day Play. Red Bull gives you wings. Visit Red Bull.com slash bright summer ahead to learn more. See you this summer. Now farther than ever from home, the Nes purse were faced with horrid conditions on this reservation, suffering from illnesses and near famine. But Joseph refused to accept this new reservation, or the broken promises that the government had made once again. Ultimately, he decided that if he was going to affect change in the government, he couldn't do it from a whole. Oklahoma. So he set off to Washington, D.C. Unbeknownst to Joseph, throughout the flight of 1877,

embellished accounts of the Nez Perce retreat had become headline news and national newspapers. He had no idea, but of course, everyone's talking about it. Articles painted him as a master military strategist, a quote-unquote red Napoleon. After their defeat at Bears' paw, they spoke of him, or newspapers and the media, spoke of him as this heroic symbol of resistance, like a George Washington of his people. They also criticized the U.S. military for their expensive failings and questionable decision-making. The New York Times called the whole endeavor, a quote, War Witch on our part was in its origin and motive nothing short of a gigantic blunder and a crime. And while these articles were often wildly embellished,

public sympathies shifted in favor of the Nez Perse. And Joseph himself, held considerable presence in the public mind. When Joseph boarded a train, first to St. Louis and then to D.C., he planned to make his case to the government in person. And yet, as he and fellow chief Yellow Bull, who was with him, traveled in full regalia, they attracted a lot of attention. Speaking through their interpreter, they fielded questions aboard the train, and upon arriving at a hotel dining room, were absolutely inundated with curious people. People had never seen an indigenous person before.

And now all of a sudden there's two and full regalia in your hotel lobby. You know, they are super interested and of course I've read all about him and everything that was going on. So I guess a celebrity just walked in. Right. Exactly. And they're all eager to see this, the what the papers were calling, quote unquote, the most famous Indian in America. And before long, he was addressing a packed room sharing the plight of his people. Among the crowd was a local reporter who accurately recorded Joseph's speech and the lengthy ovation that he received when he was done.

And to Joseph, this reporter's notebook was a complete surprise because for years his words had been distorted by unreliable government officials. Twisted, turned, things were omitted or added. So this was a welcome surprise. So now he came to understand that so long as a reporter was in the room, any speech he gave. could reach all of white America, a fact that he would use to his advantage in the years to come. On January 17th in Lincoln Hall in Washington, D.C., standing before a crowd of citizens, congressmen, and cabinet members, Joseph spoke for an hour, telling the story of his people, the broken promises that forced them from their homes, and the 1,500-mile journey that they

had taken in pursuit of freedom. He spoke of their current confinement in Oklahoma, and their desire to return, to their home. He invoked the religious teachings his father once took from the Bible and begged the government to offer his people more than just words, saying, quote, good words will not give me back my children, will not give my people good health and stop them from dying, will not get my people a home where they can live in peace. I am tired of talk that comes to nothing. The speech was a huge success, and to the audience who had never seen an indigenous person before, Joseph was every bit the noble leader that they had read about. The speech earned them an audience with President Rutherford B. Hayes the following day and was soon published in a widely read journal cementing his reputation. But this speech alone would not end

their exile. While he won hearts and minds, Joseph faced stern opposition. For one, Western senators lobbied relentlessly against his return. But on the other side of the coin, he found several allies. Presbyterian Church, moved by the advocacy of Christian NezPers' members, joined the voices in favor to return the NezPers to their homelands. And as Joseph continued to make trips to Washington, some of his trips were funded by his friend, Colonel Miles, who had since moved up in the military. In 1881, Miles had landed General Howard's old job as the commander of forces in the Pacific Northwest. And from that new position, he lobbied for the Nez Perce's return. He cited the lack of evidence against Joseph's people in the case of the Salmon River killings, and his supervisors basically told him to shut up and stay in your lane.

This isn't your decision to make. But Colonel Miles remains steadfast, saying, quote, I still adhere to my opinion that to banish a village of people, many of them innocent, is not in accordance with any law or just rule. And therefore, I recommend that the portion of the tribe not charged, with crime be allowed to return to their reservation. In the face of mounting public and internal pressure, Congress authorized the return of the Nes-Pers to their territory in July of 1884, seven years after the outbreak of war.

So General Miles, or Colonel Miles came back. He came through on his word. Yeah. I mean, he started off bad, you know, he did some bad things. But his mind was changed. Yeah, his heart was one. And he did do a lot of good for, for them. The offer was to return to the Lapway reservation in Nes-Persse territory. The same reservation Joseph had once tried to move on to before the Salmon River attack. So we're kind of circling all the way back to the beginning in that general area that they were on their way to before the Salmon River incident happened and everything went to shit. But there was a problem. There were still warrants out for a number of Nez Perce in Idaho,

including Joseph himself. Joseph's use of his reputation to bring people to his side also served to turn some further against him. Vocal white settlers didn't bother to veil threats about the vigilante justice that they would enact on him if they would return there.

See what happens to you. So while he's winning over a lot of people, the settlers in and around the location that they want to go to are still hold violence are going to enact violence on them, you know, so there's that. So again, they talk a lot about what is to be done. What are we going to do next? And what are people feeling? And do they feel safe doing this or not? And in the end, 118 people chose to return to the reservation at Lappway.

And the remaining 150 people, including Joseph, accepted invitations to the Calville Reservation in northern Washington. Joseph was wary that this agreement would relinquents. Joseph was wary that this agreement would relinquish his right to the Wallowa and didn't wish to continue living in exile, but once again, decided to put his people first. Joseph's life's mission had been to keep the promise he made to his father, a promise he would fight to keep for the rest of his life. As the years went on, Joseph continued to tell the story of the Nez Perce, their connection to the Willawa and their rightful claim to return. He spoke again in D.C. at the Seattle Theater and to President Theodore Roosevelt. He spoke before a University of Washington football game, and even once had the chance to make his case to the white settlers

of the Wallowa. And while he still drew large crowds, the reception of his words began to shift. At best, he began to evoke a sort of nostalgia for a time long gone. At worst, he was met with ridicule. The settlers in particular mocked him as antiquated and delusional. And so, despite his efforts, there was never any serious thought given to his return to the Willowah. Here's another quote from the book I mentioned earlier in the episode. The author says, the American people, like the American government, were happy to lionize him as a symbol of the nation's exotic frontier past, but they had no interest in seeing him as a person with a legitimate legal dispute in the present. And truth is, there is so much more to the story that could ever fit in one episode.

I mean, I wouldn't be shocked if there's an entire podcast dedicated to this flight in this chapter in history. And of course, if you want to know more, there's that 500-page book. But because it's kind of our thing in this podcast, the story, of course, is tied to a national park aside from that period of time in Yellowstone. Yep. Okay. The Nez Perse National Historical Park consists of 38 places of importance to the history and culture of the Nez Perce throughout Washington, Oregon, Idaho, and Montana, and the Nez Perce. historic trail, a network of sites along the exact route that they took in 1877, including Big Hole and Bear Paw Battlefields and, of course, Yellowstone National Park. You can also

visit the Wallawa Valley and the grave of Joseph's father. The grave of Old Chief Joseph is located at the Old Chief Joseph Gravesite, a National Park Service site at the northern end of the Wallawa Lake near Joseph, Oregon. His original burial site was desecrated, and his remains were moved to its current location in 1926 at the request of community leaders, but is now protected by the National Park Service. As for Joseph, he lived the rest of his life on the Calville Reservation, where he died in 1904 and was later buried. He received a quarter page article in the New York Times, going over his life and all his accomplishments and everything that happened with the flight of 1877. But his doctor may well have said it best.

Chief Joseph died of a broken heart. And that is my story in the flight of the Nes-Persse in 1877. Well, thank you for shedding light on what feels like should be more commonly known. But it's something that I never, I truly had never heard this story before. And I just kind of now think of that region a little bit differently, I guess, especially how you painted Yellowstone. It's never really, I've never heard that story of tourists and indigenous people clashing while there were battles with settlers going on at the same time.

So I think I kind of view things a little bit differently now. And it shed a lot of light on something that I didn't know a lot about. Yeah. And I'm glad you say that because, you know, when we were planning out our stories to honor Indigenous History Month, of course, the Trail of Tears is one of the first stories that I almost reached for and that we've talked about doing before. And not that it's unworthy, but I think of all of the indigenous stories that we hear, a lot of us are familiar with the Trail of Tears or at least somewhat understanding of that event and everything that led up to it. But, you know, this is something that's very similar. And, you know, I think we all have a grasp on the themes of this story of the broken promises and indigenous people being forced off their lands and onto reservations and this, that and the other thing. But I think this story perfectly illustrates just the position that they were in of like, where do I turn? Where am I? How like, you know, I just pictured this between a rock and a hard plate to put it very lightly. and to dumb it down, you know, just really stuck in this impossible situation where you can't

win. You're being unfairly treated. And having nowhere to turn, being pursued with nowhere to go, I mean, you're crossing states hundreds of miles and still you're being tracked down. And from everything, this whole story, it was just people trying to live with their families and trying to live on the land that they've lived in for generations and they were killed for it. Yeah. So that and then, you know, when they couldn't have that, they're like, okay, I guess we'll go on to this reservation you're talking about. And then they try and do that.

And then it changes again, okay, you can't go to that reservation. You're actually going to Oklahoma, someplace called Oklahoma. You know, they've never even heard of that. And it's just like one thing after another. No shade to Oklahoma. but if you live in Idaho, Montana, Wyoming area, and that is where your people have been for generations, and then you go to Oklahoma,

it is a totally different world. I mean, the landscape is so different, the vegetation's so different, the weather is so different. I mean, your people have been living and surviving off of these lands and to just throw you in this landscape that you've never been in before. And then on top of that, you know, which is a whole other piece of,

this giant puzzle of it's not just you. It's other indigenous bands and tribes and nations that are just being shoved in this parcel of land with you that you either you may not know, or you may have been enemies with or, you know, whatnot. And now it's like, you know, just because your indigenous doesn't mean that you're all this all kumbaya, let's sing around to fire. Everything's good, you know. And then of course, we see up and today, reservations are the poorest areas and the most difficult area in the United States. You know, and you mentioned, too, where they were promised schools would be built in infrastructure. None of it ever happened. And it's the same. I mean, a lot of these reservations, which we've

found in stories, is they, the U.S. government would say, here, yep, you can have this piece of land. But then as soon as they found that that land had value, they would push them somewhere else. So eventually a lot of... Killer's the Flower Moon? Yeah. Oh, Sage Nation. Hello? Yeah.

It's just like a lot of these people were pushed onto these nearly inhabitable lands or places that they just were not familiar with and were deemed invaluable. A lot of them are super remote, you know, not a lot of resources. And like you said, there's some of the poorest, today there's some of the poorest places around the United States. And they were set up to fail. Yeah. You know? There was, I mean, the U.S. government set them up and then said, yeah, we'll give you stuff.

And then they took them from all of their resources, everything that they knew how to survive with. And then the U.S. government was like, we'll take care of like what you need. And then just left them there and gave them nothing. Right. Yeah. This episode is brought to you by Prime. Obsession is in session. And this summer, Prime originals have everything you want.

Steamy romances, irresistible love stories, and the. book to screen favorites you've already read twice. Off campus, L, every year after, the love hypothesis, Sterling Point and more. Slow burns, second chances, chemistry you can feel through the screen. Your next obsession is waiting. Watch only on Prime. Yeah, so, you know, we could go on and on about all that and all the injustices and stuff, but I think this story kind of speaks for itself with that. And just a reminder of, you know, what indigenous people have gone through throughout history and still face today. And, you know, their presence is needed. And they're the best stewards of our lands.

And they're still here and fighting for their rights to a lot of the same land. So. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that this is another story where it's like, yeah, we're painting U.S. history not in a great light. but that's because this is the history. It's not something that is being made up on our end or anything to be like, let's show how bad the U.S. is.

That's not it at all at all. It's just it's the history of America and how we came here and how the people who are here before us and the people who are still here, which I think is amazing, given everything that they have been through and essentially they have tried to be eradicated from this land. They're still here. They still have the stories that. culture is still here. It should be honored, not shoved away, and it should be bringing their history and their plight should be brought more into sight for people to learn and know and live. I mean,

now we're all here. You know, it's like now we have to live amongst each other and figure it out. We might as well embrace all the history that's here for what it is and move forward from there. Yeah. Just recognize it for what it is. And it's such a good point because I think I know what you're referring to, but we got a couple, like not a couple. Yeah, a couple. It wasn't a lot. But a couple of comments after the Mount Rushmore episode we did. And, you know, people basically saying like, sorry you hate your country so much. And it's like we don't. We actually love our country. And that's why we want to tell its history and its entirety and truthfully. And sorry, it's upsetting that this. Sorry, we get upset learning about stuff, the fucked up things that have happened in history. Like, I'm sorry that this is upsetting that a group of people were treated this way. Yes, it hurts my soul to hear those things. But it's important to share the stories. And that's why we, that's why we do this whole thing, you know? So, yeah, let's have our palate cleanser. Yes. So we're in luck because I'm like, oh, shoot. No, my phone was like, I saw it in the corner of my eye through here, just like blowing up. So where did you post it, by the way? I just put it on our Patreon. So if you're not on Patreon, I mean, you're not familiar, Patreon. has a chat box where we can kind of chat with you directly, where you can chat with us

directly. So I basically sent a direct message to all of our Patreon members and just said, we're recording an episode right now. What questions would you like to answer? Yay. And we have a lot of them. So I guess we can go through. Let's go through.

How long have we been recording? I can't tell the time. Time flies when you're. We'll do a handful of them and we'll come back and do some more later. Okay. Okay. Oh, this is fun because I don't know what's coming. Yeah.

Becca asked any funny slash unexpected things that happened on Cassie's wedding day. Yeah. It fucking, the heavens opened like I've never seen before. Oh, my. I, okay. No exaggeration. Say rain on your wedding day. Good luck.

It's good luck. Well, you got luck for the rest of your lifetime because. I sure do. That there was like actual legit like your phone alarm alert for severe weather, take shelter. Power lines were down. The sky is opened and I've never, I haven't seen rain and wind like that since probably. Remember Hurricane Sandy that came through? I'm not even kidding.

And for context, my venue was on top of the mountain. All outside. All outside. I had planned everything outside and this storm came through. My ceremony was at 4 p.m. It ripped through at exactly. It was like 3.45 when it. It just ripped through. It hammered through. The saving grace with it is that it was a passing storm. But it was wild out. It was downpouring. There was thunder. There was lightning. People were driving up. So my venue, it was like a mile. long dirt road up a steep hill to get to the top of this place. And people who were driving from pretty far away said they saw power lines down. They couldn't see out their windshield trying to get to the ceremony because the rains were coming down so hard. And I was so set on getting married outside. So we actually just switched things around a little bit. And I did my cocktail hour first. And I came out for the cocktail hour and came and hung out with everybody because I could see people through a window, like all talking and having fun. And I was like, people can't have fun at my wedding

without me. So I like ran out still. I had my wedding dress on and everyone saw me before the ceremony, which was fun and fine. And I just hung out for my whole cocktail hour. And then the skies cleared and we had a rain free ceremony and it was beautiful. Yeah. But it was shocking. It was shocking. It was shocking. So yeah, that would be my answer to that. Great. Um, Let's go to the next thing. Kelsey asked, is my dog a cute travel buddy and put the cutest dog. Yes. I believe you. I forget the, it's the same. What's the type of dog that is the target dog? Oh, a bull terrier. A bull terrier. It's a picture of bull terrier. It's really, really cute. Let's see. Jessica asked, weirdest slash funniest thing that's ever happened on an NPAD trip.

Okay, I'm going to be so honest. I have a really hard time recalling individual trips and details about trips. So this is going to take me a moment. I have mine. What is it? Front and center of my brain. Okay, so we were in Madagascar and we were on rickshaws going down. Oh, okay. Yes. It's all coming back to me. It's all coming back. So we were on rickshaws, which are the, you don't know what a rickshaws is. Google it because I don't know if my description is going to be fully accurate. But it's basically a carriage that you sit in that is pulled by another person. Sometimes they're pulled by animals. Not in this case. They were other people. And they get paid for this and everything. And they were, it's

an actual form of transportation in Madagascar. So we were doing that. And we were going down this little cobblestone road and suddenly we hear yelling and screaming. happening in front of us. And I look up and I see a Zibu. And a Zibu is basically the biggest bull you've ever seen that has a huge camel's hump on the back of it. These things are massive. Yeah. And I see this thing charging. It's on the loose. It's escaped. It's charging. It's charging down this cobblestone road that is one lane wide coming straight at us. Also, everybody

is on their individual rickshund. So there's what, like 15 to 20 of us, all like Mario carting around. On these individual rickshaws. Yeah, it's a cluster block to be in the entire road. Like if this bowl hit us, it would be like bowling. Yeah, pins would be flying. Yeah. And so I look, I see this Zibu coming down, the guy kindling my rickshaw, he sees it drops me and runs. It just drops me and runs. So I jump out and I follow him into

somebody's yard and he's hiding behind a fence. And I was like, excuse me? Oh my God. Did you? Well, everyone else's rickshaw people turned and like ran them to the sides of the road so the bull could like, so the Zibu could run through. But mine just like left me there to Yeah, and the aftermath of this.

So it's chaos. Everyone is going crazy because it's not just us. We're in a crowded city center. There's people with their shops everywhere and people hustling and bustling around. Yeah, we were not the only ones around. So whatever, everybody scatters. And the escaped Zibu still has almost like a halter with a lead on it that it's dragging. Somehow someone wrangles it, ties the thing.

around a, it looks like a telephone pole type of, like, but I think it's just like a pole. Yeah. And he's climbed. The guy has climbed the pole. And this thing is freaking out. It's pissed off. And they're trying to wrangle it. It's a whole thing.

We end up getting on our rickshaws and just moving right along. Like nothing ever happened. Yep. Made our day, honestly. We had stories all day. Somebody has a really funny video of that whole thing unfold. Do you? Yeah.

You do. It's not me filming. And the person who was filming was, so I was in the very front and the person who was filming was in the very back. So they get everyone else, but they don't get me dropped. So you don't get to see that part in the video, but you do get to see everyone scattering and like laughing and running. You're going to have to, you know you're going to have to post that.

I'll have to, yeah, I'll have to post it for sure. I guess my, hold on, wait, I have an answer. It's not quite as long. It'll be short. But you just, when you said Madagascar, I'm like, what else happened to me around that time? And I was like, oh, yeah. Our trip to South Africa happened immediately prior to that. And the one thing that's, it's not funny, then it's kind of funny now.

But we had plans to go to a really nice winery. It's still not funny now, but you're laughing. So we had plans to go to a very nice winery. It was on the itinerary for the beginning of it for the year prior. Everyone's stoked. They have really cute outfits and, you know, take pictures, have a nice wine. Our plan was not only to visit it, but we were having a tasting and it was a whole event. And this winery was massive.

And it was from the 1600s. It's in wine country. Yeah. This is like the thing you do here. Beautiful, amazing. Yep. So everyone's prepared and all that. And long story short, we had conflicts.

with our guide, which was the only time. I mean, we have run well over 15 trips, never had any sort of issue. Everyone we work with is usually very lovely. This one we butted heads with a little bit. And he switched things up on us, unbeknownst to us in the entire group. And essentially, long story short, we went shark cage diving in the morning. And where they throw chum on you. We got into the cage and the operators of that particular company used chum and they didn't just throw it out on a line. They poured it over the side of the boat directly onto the cage, which we were inside of. And, okay, part of the experience, it's fine. What was not fine is we were not given time to prepare for the winery, which we were not supposed to do.

do directly after said cage diving. We went from chum waters directly. Directly to the winery. Those poor staff. I can't even imagine what this group of people smelled like, looked like. We looked like, I looked like a drowned rats, but we smelled like fish. I was like I hope no one was really looking forward to this because I hope you guys weren't waiting your entire trip to do this portion. Anyway, okay, one last one last one. We'll do one more. We have so many.

Okay. So we'll add some of these later. Let's see. There's so many. Elevator music. If you had to re-record one episode, what would it be and why? Oh, honey. Episodes 1 through 48.

Easy. Yeah. I second that. Our audio was crazy. Our audio is crazy. crazy on all of them. Yeah. But our hearts were in it. Our hearts were in it. Yeah. And they still are. But yeah, that is a good question. I'm not sure if there's like one that really stands out to me as far as wanting to re-record because I do everything in my power to never listen back to

anything we say ever. But for a while, you know, for years, we edited our own if you couldn't tell. If you can't tell what you probably. can never know um we we would switch off editing and things like that so unfortunately i did have to listen back to it which is so funny because listening back or reflecting back we never edited really anything for content wise you know we would edit try and make the audio maybe sound a little better because we legit. Yeah, we kind of just left everything in. Yeah. And we still kind of do. You know, when we talk to other people in the biz, you know, now that we're in the biz and just kind of getting a lay of the land of how other shows and things operate. When we hear the level of

production that they have going into everything, we're a little taking a back. Oh, you guys go through and make timestamped edits. And we edit out the best to our ability. mispronunciations and stumbles and if we clearly butcher something and we recognize it in the moment. But other than that, we've, yeah, there's not like a, there's no like a formula of what stays in. It's just kind of like, we're here, we're telling a story. This is what you get. But thankfully for you guys and for us, we have some fabulous editors that make sure that our content sounds way better than when you first heard it. But if I could re-record an episode, I would re-record Night of the Grizzlies.

Really? Why? Not because I want to change it or anything. I would want it to go exactly the same way. It's just I would want to relive that experience again, I think, because when we recorded it originally, I don't think I understood the impact it would have on our audience. And I would love to just like redo it again just so I could relive that story knowing how much it was going to impact.

everybody. But not that I want to change it. I don't want to re-record it because I don't like it or anything like that. It's just kind of like when you read a book for the first time and you're like, I wish I could reread that for the first time again. That's kind of how I feel about Night of the Grizzlies. See, I think that if I was on your end of that, because obviously you were behind those two episodes. I don't know if I would want to do that knowing having that knowledge because then I feel like I would feel so much pressure because that is one of the most popular. episodes that we've ever done and to know the weight of that. I know.

I just went into it. You, wow, my gun's blazing. You're like, yeah, pure. This is what happened. Yeah. Episode like, what was it? 17 and 18. Yep.

Yep. To this day, whenever we're like, which episode traumatized you the most? Night of the Grizzlies. I actually put it on one of the platforms that you can listen to our podcast on has a feature that it's on Spotify. there's a feature that if you go to our page and you go to About, there's our About Us. And then there's a section that says episodes to start or where to start for somebody that's just coming across your show. And I put Night of the Grizzlies on there.

Oh, cool. I didn't even know that was a feature on Spotify. Yeah. So, yeah, it's highlighted. And I'm glad you told it as is. And it is what it is because it's genuine. and it's also early days type of style. Not that I think we've changed much, but people do write in and say,

It's just nostalgic a bit. Yeah, people do write in and say, you know, like, I've loved to watch, you know, you guys grow and evolve in the show. And I think we have grown and evolved. But at the same time, I think we've stayed really true to how we started and haven't really changed up much when it comes to the delivery and what we like to cover. and I love that. Yeah, me too.

Yeah. Cool. I think that this is a fun way to end. And outsiders, we liked answering your question. Thank you for answering the call so short notice because I asked it at the beginning of this episode and you guys literally blew us up. So we will do this more on episodes. We'll answer your questions at the end because it's fun.

But yeah, I guess we'll see you all next week then. Yeah, in the meantime, enjoy the view. But watch you're back. Bye, everyone. Bye. Thank you for joining us again this week. If you love National Park After Dark and want to hear exclusive bonus stories, join us on Patreon or Apple subscriptions.

Patreon subscribers have access to our National Park After Dark book club, live streams, discord, and much more. If you prefer to watch our episodes, video episodes are now available on YouTube. If you're enjoying the show, please take a moment to rate, review, and subscribe on your favorite listening platform. And to follow along with all our adventures, you can find us on Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, and X at National. Park after dark. You're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind. Here's a helpful fact you may not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with Progressives save over $900 on average. Pop over to Progressive.com, answer some questions, and you'll get a

quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by. In fact, 99% of their auto customers earn at least one discount. Visit Progressive.com and see if you can enjoy a little cash back. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. National average 12-month savings of $946 by new customers surveyed who saved with Progressive between June 2024 and May 2025. Potential savings will vary. Ambition comes in all shapes and sizes. At First Citizens Bank, we roll with your goals because we're built for what you're building.

Fit for your ambition for Citizens Bank.