National Park After Dark - The Bravest Little Dog in Alaska: Glacier Bay National Park

Episode Date: April 6, 2026

In the summer of 1880, John Muir set out to explore the icy wilderness of what is now Glacier Bay National Park. Traveling by canoe with a missionary and Tlingit guides, he reluctantly allowed a small black dog named Stickeen to join the expedition. At first, Muir dismissed the dog as a useless companion. However, when a violent storm trapped the two of them on Brady Glacier, surrounded by deep crevasses and failing daylight, Stickeen revealed a courage Muir could not ignore, forever reshaping how he understood the minds of animals. WE WERE NOMINATED FOR A WEBBY! VOTE FOR US HERE BY APRIL 16TH! For a full list of our sources, visit npadpodcast.com/episodes For the latest NPAD updates, group travel details, merch and more, follow us on npadpodcast.com and our socials: Instagram: @‌nationalparkafterdarkTikTok: @‌nationalparkafterdark Support the show by becoming an Outsider and receive ad free listening, bonus content and more on Patreon or Apple Podcasts. Want to see our faces? Catch full episodes on our YouTube Page! Thank you to this week’s partners! PAKA: Head to pakaapparel.com to grab your hoodie IQBAR: Text PARK to 64000 to get 20% off all IQBAR products, plus FREE shipping. Message and data rates may apply. Bellesa: EVERYONE who signs up wins a FREE Rose suction toy with their order at https://www.bboutique.co/vibe/nationalparkafterdark-podcast Kachava: Go to https://kachava.com and use code NPAD for 15% off your first order. 3 Day Blinds: For their buy 1 get 1 50% off deal, head to http://3DayBlinds.com/NPAD Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Plan your Scottish escape today at Expedia.com slash Visit Scotland. It's mind-boggling to think of all the non-human heroes that have faced death-defying odds and survived, all without any human there to witness their courage or record their story. For instance, think of the Mama Puma of Patagonia, chasing down a wild Guanaco, just trying to bring home a meal for her young. Risking her life, hooves kicking at her head, leaping on her praise back, and hanging on like a Bronco rider, only to fail way more often than she succeeds. Or the male chimpanzee who must summon the courage to fight a brutal alpha who's terrorizing his tribe so he can take the crown and rule. Or the Queen Mirat, who must make the hard decision to lead her flock across dangerous lands in search of food in new territory. These are real-life dramas of animals outside the purview of human sight. Maybe it makes us feel nervous to grant animals such depths of consciousness.

We prefer to think of animals as unfeeling and unaware, perhaps because it's not. if we recognize their inner lives, it means acknowledging we too are animals just like them. These were some of the confusing realizations that the famous mountaineer John Muir faced on one of his excursions into the Alaska Wilderness to the remote frozen lands that would become Glacier Bay National Park. This was back in the late 1800s. The animal that inspired these thoughts wasn't an apex predator though, or a wild animal at all. It was a cute little black terrier named Stekeen who made the puzzling decision to join him on his trek up the side of a massive glacier. And when the two of them ended up trapped in a web of terrifying crevasses, Mir witnessed how

much courage the little dog mustard to finish the journey. One little scrappy pup would end up teaching Muir an important lesson about the minds of animals. Welcome to National Park After Dark. Hello everyone and welcome back to National Park After Dark. My name is Danielle. And I'm Cassie. And we're talking about animals today. Yeah. I felt like I had to do a redemption animal story because my last one that featured dogs was abandoned in the Arctic and a lot of them died. And I felt really bad about that.

So I guess, spoiler alert, this is not a death story about a dog. Actually, the exact opposite. This is more of a dedication to the dogs who make our adventures better. Amazing. I'm glad you're doing that. because yeah I think every single dog died in the other one. Yeah, they did. Yeah.

Well, I'm glad we're pivoting because we need some happiness around these parts. And it's been quite a while since we've done an animal-centered episode in this way. Because I think your other one that you did like five years ago, the Amazing Animals episode. I loved that episode. It feels like it's kind of the same vibe because everyone, other animal episode we've done, it's like, and then this animal killed five million people. Yeah. And that's it. I loved that episode. That was so, I remember I did it because I was like, we talk about too much doom and gloom. It was like episode 10. How about these cool animals?

Little did we know. How far? 300 and whatever episode this is. I think this is 65. I think this is 365. One year. Yeah. You could listen to our podcast. every day for a whole year. Wow. You could. You could hear us every day and hearing you story. I actually did the I did the Iditarod National Historic Trail and that was about dogs in a nice way with Togo and Balto. Yeah. I mean, it wasn't fully nice. Yeah, but like. All right. It was actually pretty horrific because wasn't Togo like abused and sent all over the country after? Yeah, we don't talk about that. You can re-listen to it if you want to hear more about that. But I would have. I didn't call it happy.

Okay. Well, then tell me something happy. Like, shit. All right. Well, we're actually going to be diving into a story about John Muir, which is this. This is also, I think, maybe the first time Mirror has popped onto our podcast, which is really funny, considering we have a year of podcasts episodes worth. Never mentioned the guy. Never talked about him even once.

The father of national, or what is it? Is he the father of national parks? that like Theodore Roosevelt's title. I think it's him. I think it's him too. Yeah. Yeah. And I guess if you're listening and you're like, yeah, I know John Muir and that's kind of

the extent of it, I will happily give some refreshers on what exactly he did. So first, he started the Sierra Club back in 1892 and he served as its president for 22 years. He also went camping in Yosemite with president, Theodore Roosevelt, in 1903 and convinced him to start the National Park Service, which of course was the first of its kind in the entire world, and then the entire world followed Sue. America's greatest idea. John Muir was behind. During this trip with President Theodore Roosevelt, the two men backpacked into Yosemite's Glacier Point and slept under the stars. And later, Mir said of the trip, camping with the president was a remarkable experience. I fairly fell in love with him. And that feeling was mutual.

the president remembered Mier fondly for the rest of his life. So in a roundabout way, if it wasn't for John Muir, there also wouldn't be a National Park After Dark podcast because national parks might not exist. That's true. I'm hesitant to say anything because I know he's a complicated figure. Yes, he is. He's very controversial and I will get into that for sure because I think we should recognize that. But first, let's go into a little bit about his background.

Murr was actually an immigrant to the United States. He was born in Scotland and his family moved to Wisconsin when he was 11 years old. At a young age, he fell in love with nature and started studying the plants and animals he saw in the Scottish Highlands. In college, he took botany and chemistry and geology, but never enough of any of them to earn a proper degree. For years, he worked odd jobs, once at a wagon wheel factory, another time at a sawmill slash rake factory. But he also had a deep love of adventure. venture. One time he walked a thousand miles from Kentucky to Florida simply because he wanted to spend more time in nature. He chose this route by going, quote, the wildest, leafiest, and least trodden way I could find. After that, he wrote a book about his journey called A Thousand Mile Walk to the Gulf. When he got to Florida, he caught a boat to Cuba and sailed to Panama where he caught another ride up the coast of California, and there he stayed put and California became his home. When he was there, He made it a priority to be close to nature. In the Sierra's, he built a cabin with Yosemite Creek running through the inside so he could fall asleep to the sound of water moving.

Ooh, I love that, John. The first white noise machine. I feel that so much. And that's where he wrote his most famous book, First Summer in the Sierra. Eventually, he married a California woman named Louisa Strenzel and became the father of two daughters, Wanda and Helen. He stayed put for a while, helping his father-in-law. run an orchard, but Muir was not the kind of person to settle down to domestic life, and soon his eyes were wandering towards more adventures. His next adventures led him to Alaska, where he was

deeply drawn to learning about the glaciers. He ended up returning seven times to the Great Polar North between 1879 and 1899. He would catalog over 300 glaciers and formulate a very new theory about these massive slabs of how these ice worked. He proposed that they weren't just blocks of ice, but they were actually living, moving, and shaping the geology deep underneath them. At the time, this concept was scoffed at and Muir was ridiculed as an amateur, but we know this idea now as fundamental to glaciology. Yeah, it's like that is what a glacier is. Yeah, they move.

His Alaska trips took him deeper and deeper into the Arctic wilderness. History likes to remember Muir as the first Euro-American to visit what's now Glacier Bay National Park, but Muir actually couldn't have made these trips without the indigenous clinket guides who, unlike him, weren't just visiting these fjords and rivers. They lived and hunted on them and had for thousands of years. Unfortunately, it wasn't just historians that misremembered Muir's relationship to this national park, but even Muir himself. And his writings about his expeditions, he often doesn't name the clinket guides or give them credit for keeping him alive. So I think that this is a good moment to pause and address the fact that John Muir is a very controversial person in history.

John Muir is widely celebrated for helping inspire the modern conservation movement and for advocating for the protection of wild landscapes that later became part of the National Park system. However, his legacy has become increasingly debated in recent years. Some historians and scholars have criticized Muir's writings for reflecting racist and derogical. attitudes towards indigenous peoples and black Americans, particularly in some of his early journals and essays. His vision of wilderness also promoted the idea that nature was most valuable when it was untouched by humans, a perspective that often ignored or erased the long histories of indigenous stewardship on those same lands. While Mir's work played a major role in preserving many iconic landscapes, the way he framed wilderness and the people connected to it has led to

ongoing discussions about how his legacy should be understood today. And I guess that's really just a long-winded way to say that he was extremely racist. And that's very much reflected in his writings and his history. And it hasn't been until the more recent years that people have decided to look at both sides of that. Like, yes, he contributed to conservation. Yes, he is a major part of why the National Park Service exists. However, he had extremely racial prejudice and also he really disliked indigenous people who for every single national park you ever go to, those are their original lands. And they stewarded them for thousands of years prior to them being part of the National Park Service. I mean, it's a very similar story with his bud, Theodore Roosevelt. And we saw that really,

I think come to the forefront during COVID. Because remember his statue was being like torn down in New York. Do you remember that? I think I touched upon this a little bit in my River of Doubt episodes just to preface the same type of acknowledgement. You know, like we're about to talk about him and in a way that I don't want to come off. I don't, I didn't want it to come off as glorifying him. But yes, we were giving him recognition for all the good things he did for the National Park Service. Of course, he's referred to as the conservation president for a reason, but also let's talk about some of the not so great things about him. So same same type of thing, I think. Yeah, exactly. And I mean, he did have a lot of contributions to the National Park Service, but he went about it in a way

that would not be accepted today, thankfully. And it's important to recognize that even in the story, The story only happened because he had guides that were indigenous to the area and knew where to take him. And he could have never experienced literally anything that happens in the story without them. And still, he doesn't really recognize them. He just omits them completely from the story. Yeah, pretty much. Okay. Not completely, but very largely, yeah.

Okay. So we'll keep that all in mind. As we venture to what's now, Glacier Bay National Park. This park is 3.3 million acres of truly remote wilderness in Alaska. The bay has experienced at least four major glacial advances and retreats across history. This is a land where tidewater glaciers meet mountain peaks soaring up three miles above sea level. And true to the name of the park, it is filled with glaciers, with 50 of them having names, but there are a total of at least 1,045 glaciers in the park.

Even now, today? Yeah. Wow. And I will say this park, although it does have a ton of glaciers, it also has some of the highest records and recordings of glacial retreat in the world. So it's being hit really hard with climate change. The most well-known and most impressive is Marjorie Glacier, an active tidewater glacier that thousands of tourists come by cruise ship every year to view a calving into the ocean. Unfortunately, Marjorie is advancing 12 to 14 feet per day thanks to rapid global. warming. These days, though, there is sadly no mention of how climate crisis is affecting the park on the federal government's website, even though that is a major part of what is going. It's a place where you can witness climate change firsthand. I mean, 12 to 14 a day is nuts. Staggering, yeah. You know, that's a change you can watch unfold right in front of you instead of having to have like a time. I just imagine like those time lapse cameras that create that

footage over years and then you can see the change there, but that's something you can witness for yourself. Yeah. One thing that I've thought has been really incredible on our own personal adventures has been when we were in Kenai Fjords and we visit the glaciers over there. And on the way, when you're doing the hike to the glacier, I forget, do you remember the name of it? No, but even when you drive in, it's on the road to the visitors. There are markers for the year and where the glacier used to be in the Harding Ice Field. Oh, yeah, that hike was, that was, that's the trip we did two times in a row. And so we went up to the, we did that hike back to back pretty much.

Yeah, and it's a tough hike. It's tough. It is tough. But when you're going in, there are all of these signs that show you how far that this glacier has retreated over years. And it's really incredible to see because they also have historic photos and you're standing. in front of it. And it looks massive. Of course, it's a glacier and you can see that it's taking up a lot of the landscape. But then when you look at the photos and you can compare from the photo you're

looking at and the glacier in front of you, it really sinks in of how far these glaciers have retreated. And this park in particular is experiencing some of the largest recorded glacial retreats in history. Yeah. And it's just interesting to know. that they're removing signage about climate change in a park that is dubbed after glaciers. Yeah. You know, it's just like, come on. And this park was specifically preserved because of the glaciers and studying them retreating. Yeah, but we don't talk about the glaciers anymore.

Climate change isn't real. We don't need to talk about that. Just enjoy what we have, okay? Just enjoy it while you have it, because. Because in 20 years. And you don't need to understand it. You don't need to know anything about it. Just kidding.

That's why we're here. The federal government doesn't silence us. I mean, I'm sure they could if they really want to. Now I'm frightened, but it's okay. But we're not under regulations to not talk about. We're not under the fight club rules, okay? We can talk about fight club if we want to talk about fight club. Yeah, because we're not a part of fight club.

We just really like fight club. Yeah, we just know about it. Okay. Anyway. Anyway, Marjorie Glacier is retreating 12 to 14 feet per day, which is what got us into this. So the part of the park that we're actually going to today is known as Taylor Bay, and it's a remote area in the far south of the park where Brady Glacier is at. And if you are ever visiting there, you can look up at Brady Glacier and you can imagine the adventure that John Muir and a little dog named Stakeen. had while they traveled across the ice. It was on Muir's second trip to Alaska in 1880 when his

path intersected with Steakin. In his children's book called Stakein, A Story of a Dog, Meir tells the story. And this is actually a fun fact before we fully dive into this episode, is I have this book and it was sitting on my bookshelf for the entirety of that I've lived with Al, which has been six years now, and I have never noticed it even one time. And I was just looking at my bookshelf the other day. And I saw this and I was like, wait a second, what is the story? And it's super short. I mean, it's a kid's book.

Yeah, it is a kid's book, allegedly. It's 81 pages. And this is like 1880s children's book because I don't know any children's book that looks like this. But it does have illustrations in it. And here's one of sticking cross over an ice bridge. It's very text-heavy is what you're trying to describe for a kid's book. Yeah. It's so text-heavy.

But I found it and I thought it was super interesting. And if people are interested in actually reading this book themselves, you can read it. Or the National Park Service actually has an audiobook version of this where they have someone read it. National Park Service, reach out to us. I will voice an audiobook for you. Wow. I might, depending on how long it is. You have a better voice for it because you're more soft-spoken and soothing.

Yeah, but if this book isn't soft-spoken-esque or soothing, if you're telling it might not fit the thread. Just saying, we kind of like said that you can't control us and we mean that, but we would still like to voice an audio book for you. Yeah. I mean, we still love the National Park Service. Hire us. Just saying, we're your girls. Like, just, yeah, you know where to find us. Yeah.

Right. And, yeah. And that's also a call out for anyone who's also involved with Is It Cake, because Cassie really wants to be on Is It Cake. I love that you just threw that out there. We need to start planting it more. Yeah. If anyone's listening and you are a producer for Isick Cake, it would be my dream come true.

And she's not even just saying that. Like, it's not a bit. I could cry right now just at the thought of me being on Is It Cake. You don't even have to air it. I just want to be on it. I just want to experience it. Okay, sorry, Eric. Back to Stakeen.

We haven't even met Stakeen yet. We keep alluding to him, but... So good, so good, so good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom Rack stores now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince, Sam Edelman, Frame, and Free People. Join the Nordie Club to unlock exclusive discounts,

shop new arrivals first, and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free. Great brands, great prices. That's why you rack. Girl, winter is so last season. And now Springs got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders.

That perfect hang on the patio sundress. Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from your couch. done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear up on that envelope. It's time for a little in-person spring treat. It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. Anyway, John Muir wrote a children's book about the story that I'm about to tell.

So in it, he hired a Klingit guide, but he never tells the reader this guide's name or any descriptions of the man. He actually just refers to him as Joe the Hunter, which I think just kind of gives you an idea of how much he just was not acknowledging the indigenous guides here. This guide took Muir to Fort Rangel to pick up a missionary for his travel companion, Reverend S. H. Young, which I'll say he did say his name in the whole book. And when Mr. Young climbed into their canoe, he brought a little dog with him who jumped into the boat to and promptly curled himself up amongst their gear. Mure was appalled by the sight of a little dog on their voyage

and told the reverend absolutely not a small dog could not go with them. And he even said, such a little helpless creature will only be in the way. Okay. Well, I don't like that. I don't trust him automatically. Yeah. How do you trust a guy who doesn't like dogs? You don't.

Small dogs. I love small dogs. But Mr. Young launched into a sales pitch for the dog telling Mir how amazing he was and how the dog could, quote, endure cold and hunger like a bear, swim like a sea of, and was wondrously wise and cunning. Young explained that the dog had originally been given to his wife by an Irish prospector in Sitka, Alaska. When the couple later arrived in Fort Rangel, the local clinket people quickly embraced the little dog and began calling him Stikine. The name refers to the Stikine River and the Stikine Clinket people who live along it. The word is generally understood

to describe the river itself, often translated as Great River or Muddy River, a reference to the glacial sediment that colors its waters. Young thought that this name was fitting for him, so he kept it. And coincidentally enough, it was a Stickeen guide that Mier had actually hired to lead him up Stevens' passage and into what would someday be named Taylor Bay to the foot of Brady Glacier. At first, Mure wasn't impressed with the little dog at all. He described Stikine as worthless, a toy dog, even sluggish and helpless. In Mure's mind, this was not the kind of animal you brought along on a reference. expedition through the wild coast of Alaska. But despite his skepticism, there were a few things about Stekeen that caught his attention. The dog moved with what Muir called a fox-like grace

and his shaggy coat seemed perfectly built for the cold, damp weather of the north. Muir especially loved the dog's tail. He later wrote that Stekeen's fine tale was about as airy and shady as a squirrels. Which I guess is a nice description maybe. Yeah, but he just called him worthless. I know. He's like, you're worthless, but you're kind of cute. I don't know. I'm cautiously optimistic about what's about to happen. Yeah. I don't like anyone who talks down about little dogs can do anything except for some things.

Still, Mure couldn't quite place what kind of dog he was looking at. He thought some sort of terrier mix and he didn't spend much more time thinking about it. But indigenous communities of the Pacific Northwest had long. kept several kinds of dogs beyond the well-known sled dogs and huskies. Small, terrier-like dogs were common companions and skilled hunting partners. Rather than pulling sleds, these dogs were trained to drive animals like elk, mountain goats, and river otters towards hunters, or push them into the water where they could be taken more easily.

They were named, valued, and treated as a part of the community, even though they didn't usually live inside the home. Whether Stakein descended from one of these indigenous hunting dogs is impossible to know, because Muir never really inquired more about it, but the little dog who had climbed into the canoe at Fort Rangel may have had far deeper roots in the region than Mir ever realized. At first, he thought of Stikine as strangely aloof and reclusive. He seemed to sleep a lot and was not particularly curious. But soon enough, Mier began to notice some interesting behaviors. As soon as there was any discussion of making land on the riverbank, Stikine would perk up. He wouldn't wait for them

to reach the shore, he'd just belly flop right into the freezing cold glacier water and swim himself to land. He was always the first one out of the canoe and the last one to get back in. In fact, he would disappear as soon as it was time to pack up and go, almost as a protest of wanting to stay longer. They tried leaving without him to teach him a lesson, but he'd just swim out in the icy cold water to the boat and they'd have to lift him up, dripping wet into the canoe by the scruff of his neck. This was not the behavior Muir expected from a cute little toy dog of the kind he'd met back in American cities. And Muir was genuinely surprised to see that Stakein also loved hunting with the clinket guides for ducks and seals. He's like, these aren't like the dogs and sweaters

I've met in California. Yeah. Yeah. I'm envisioning Toto, kind of. Yeah. You guys kind of, if you can kind of see my book, he does look like Toto a little bit. But look at that squirrel tail. He does have a squirrel to him. He's so cute. He is cute. Yeah, he's just vibing. He likes to have doors. One night after the group had landed along the river, they noticed something unusual.

The water seemed to glow in the dark. Thousands of salmon were pushing upstream, their bodies stirring the water so thickly that the river shimmered with a faint natural light. Curious, Mir and their guide decided to take the canoe back out and run a nearby rapid through the glowing current. But they left Stakein behind. As the canoe surged through the rushing water, the backs of the salmon flashed all around them in the moonlight. But then, Muir noticed something else moving through the river behind them, a dark streak cutting through the current like some sort of strange creature racing after the boat. And lo and behold, it was stickeen. Running a river rapid.

It's like, wait for me. Like, wait, this looks like fun. You forgot me. Probably by accident. For sure, by accident, because obviously I would love them. Yeah. Like, excuse me. This little dog had thrown himself into the river and was swimming hard through the rapids to keep up with them.

Muir later wrote that Stakein seemed to prefer his company above anyone else's on the expedition, often abandoning Reverend Young and the Klingit guides to follow him wherever he went, including obviously through river rapids. They always gravitate towards the one that doesn't want him. Yeah. Yeah, it's so, I feel like it's so typical for a little dog. to like warm their way into a guy's heart that didn't like them. Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah. It's like before you know it, we're going to be best buds. Yeah. My dad is like the most wholesome person ever because hi dad, if you're listening to this because I know he listens to the podcast. But he's like six foot four and he has a chihuahua that he loves so much and they'll wear matching sweaters sometimes. And it's so cute.

Taco? Yeah. Yeah. I meant Taco years ago. He's still thriving. Taco. He is cute. He is really cute. I'm absolutely floored that you do not have a small dog. Me too.

Me too. I really am so surprised by that because it feels like it's been years in the making. And like when you got Ember, I wasn't super surprised that you got her because. I need a hiking friend. You need like a hiking companion and I know Tucker's around, but obviously he's a bit older and his abilities have shifted over time. So I'm like, okay, that makes sense. You know, you just got the house and the mountains and you just need like another adventure bud. But then surely I thought.

Another one was coming. Yeah. And I do, I do really want a small dog. And this isn't, this has been my thought process behind not getting a small dog. And now this story obviously proves that I'm wrong. But my thought process behind not getting a small dog is because it's kind of rough. Where I am in the mountains, we get so much snow in the wintertime where I have to dig out places for Tucker to even walk. And Amber, she gets through it fine.

She doesn't care if it's over her head. She just hops and she's fine. But I've kind of been like, well, in the winter, what is the small dog going to do up here? Not much. And then there's also a lot of wildlife around here. So I've been nervous about that. But then this story was Tekeen. I mean, he's in, with grizzlies and going.

Maybe I just need a little terrier. Yeah, see, I think of like, I just remember my first time in Costa Rica and Panama. And when I went there, there were so many street dogs. And they were all little mutts, like little maybe 25 pounds. or less. Yeah. I'm talking. And they were like just running that place.

Yeah, they just live their own lives. And every once in a while, people would be like, oh, yeah, like one of them got got by a snake or something like that. But for the most part, they're super adaptable. And I just think that we have this preconceived notion of small dogs are incapable of holding their own when it comes to not personality wise because we know they're fresh. But just like in the elements and things like that. And I think that couldn't be farther from the truth in certain situations.

But I think if you got some sort of terrier mix or my, I'm not. Like I understand your fears for like a chit-suitzoo. A Paris Hilton Chihuahua type of thing. My dream. I really want a shitsu. I want a shih Tzu. I want a shih Tzu so bad. But that's what I mean is could a Shih Tzu handle it up here?

I don't know. Maybe. What were shih Tzu's ever? originally bred for. I don't know. That's a really good question. Let's see. I'll look.

Probably a hunter. Really? No, I don't think so. For some reason, I feel like it was like, I have royalty in my mind. Shih Tzu's were bred for sweaters. What? To wear them. Not to be them.

Oh, sicko. What is wrong with you? Okay. The way you said that, I was like, what? Okay, let's see. All right, here we go. This is an AI overview, so let's take it with a grain of self. Yeah.

Okay. Jeans. We're going to love. Okay. It's all coming together while you want a shih Tzu now. Okay. Shih Tzu's were bred specifically to be affectionate companion dogs and lap warmers for Chinese royalty and Tibetan monks designed to bring joy and sit on silk cushions. They also served as tiny alert alarm systems and palaces to bark at intruders.

Their name means lying. dog as they were bred to resemble sacred small lions, bred to be pampered pets for Chinese emperors and empresses during the Ming and Quing dynasties, kept in palaces to warn of unexpected visitors. They were considered holy, yada, yeah. So basically their little... My dream dog. Yeah. Okay. We don't need to know anything more about shit. One day, I'll have one. I hope. They would make, if you got like a little girl, you could put a and her little hair. We would wear matching outfits.

I just think of them and all the like, you know, all the crusty thing, gunk that they get all over their face. Yeah, we'd have to have an established groomer for sure. Yeah. All right. Well, Stakeen was nothing like that. Stakeen did not say a groomer. He's not bred for laps.

He is a hardy terrier. And right now, his story, he's in a relaxing glaciated landscapes, yeah. And of course at this point, Mir has noticed that Stekeen is pretty hearty. He also noticed he didn't mind bad weather and he was hiking wherever John Muir would go. Mears' mind was beginning to change from seeing him as a worthless toy dog. In fact, he began to recognize that Stekeen made a perfect companion for a mountaineer like himself. The dog even started following him straight up onto glaciers themselves. One time, Meir saw bloody prints on the ice and realized that the jagged glacial ice had cut his poor little pop. pause. Stikine didn't complain or cry about his injuries, but Mier stopped and rigged together what he called some moccasins out of his handkerchief.

Oh, so all of a sudden, here it goes. You're creating shoes for him. And that's how it all begins. Yeah, that's how they get you. They pulled out your heartstrings and you see they need a little help and make them shoes. Stikine was so uncomplaining about his injuries and fearless in their adventures that Meir wondered if he even had real feelings or awareness. Stikine didn't demand petting and affection like most dogs he'd met prior to this, which he found

odd. Muir even compares Stakein to the Greek philosopher Diahani's in his book, who is known for rejecting comfort and choosing a simple life close to nature. Stakein was making Muir reevaluate dogs how they felt their personalities, and in Stakein, he was seeing more and more similarities between a dog and himself. I too do that. You remind me of my favorite Greek, I thought, what is it? Philosopher.

You two have the same mind. What a freaking weirdo, John Muir. It was a different time. You couldn't scroll. You just read a lot of literature. Well, not only, I'm not even saying that. I'm just saying like for him to look at a dog that has a different personality than the other dogs he's encountered. And he's like, what is this?

Does he feel? A Greek philosopher? Is this? Could this be a Greek philosopher? Man discovers dog has feelings. It's like, oh my God. Like anyone who's been around a dog for like 30 seconds knows they have feelings. Yeah, but okay, let's make it a big thing. I'm sure it's about to be all about John Muir and his revelation.

Amazing discovery. Yeah. Yeah. Please tell me more about this. They traveled north through Stevens Passage, a long channel bordered by steep forested mountains and glaciers, then explored remote glacial fjords, where ice-carb valleys stretched deep into the mainland. From there, they paddled into the icy strait, a much wider and more exposed waterway, before continuing into cross-sound or the inside passage opens out towards the Gulf of Alaska.

Their goal was to reach the Fairweather Range, a remote stretch of coastal mountains packed with massive glaciers and sprawling ice fields. As they traveled farther west, they rounded Vancouver Point, where the landscape began to feel more exposed. Towering ice cliffs rose in the distance and storms moved through the mountains with little warning, giving the coastline a more ominous edge. Eventually, they entered a broad, quiet inlet that had not yet been formally mapped, a place we now know as Taylor Bay. Surrounded by steep mountains and glacial ice, they chose a sheltered spot in a dense spruce grove to make camp. While their guides set off into the mountains to hunt for goats, Muir, Reverend Young, and Stakein stayed behind to explore the shoreline before nightfall. Almost immediately, Muir noticed signs that the glacier was active and advancing.

Trees had been torn apart, pushed over, or partially buried, clear evidence of the force of moving ice. The scene fascinated him. He knew there was more to learn here, and by the time they returned to camp, he had already decided to come back the next day to explore it more. The next morning, Muir woke early and immediately saw that the weather had turned. Wind tore through the inlet and rain swept sideways across the landscape. It was the kind of storm that would have kept most people in their tents, but Muir wasn't most people. He believed storms revealed something essential about the natural world, writing that some of nature's greatest lessons could only be found in its harshest conditions. So instead of waiting it out, he grabbed a piece of bread and slipped quietly out of camp,

hoping to get onto the glacier before the others stirred. Also, we know this now as not preparing or planning very well at all. Like this handful of bread should do. In a raging storm. Yeah. Great, perfect conditions. He assumed Reverend Young, the guide, and especially Stakein, would stay behind. But he was wrong.

He had only gone a short distance when he heard movement behind him. Stakeen came trotting through the wind, already soaked, and ready for an adventure. Mier tried to send him back, sternly yelling at him over the sounds of the storm. Now, Stakeen, what has gotten into your queer noodle now? You must be daft. The wild day has nothing for you. Is what he said. Okay, didn't he just make him moccasants?

Yeah, we thought you liked him, Mir. Yeah, don't call him a noodle brain. What did you say? Because I called him a queer noodle, but I think that's... A queer noodle. Yeah. how you would say noodle brain now because I don't think you would word it that way now. But yeah.

And daft means like dumb. Stupid, yeah. Okay. Another, I have a pro and con list going on mentally for John Muir and the cons are rising. Let me just say the tallies in the con side are stacking up. Well, Stikian did not care about being called daft or anything else. And he wasn't known for being obedient. He had a strong independent streak and seemed as thrilled by the bad weather as Mir was.

He refused to go back to camp and so Mir gave up and let him tag along. He gave him a bit of his bread and off they went to explore the big glacier. But he had no idea what they were about to get into. Once it was all said and done, it would be one of the scariest days of both of their lives. The wind was blowing so hard they couldn't safely climb out onto the ice without risking being knocked off balance. Instead, they climbed up among the trees along the edge where they could take shelter and watch the storm unfold. Once the wind east slightly, they began moving along the eastern edge of the glacier. After about three miles, Meir stepped out onto the ice, using his axe to cut foot holds and make a path when needed.

Rain was still coming down steadily, and he kept a close eye on the clouds, watching for any sign that they might turn to snow. After a time, the sky began to open just enough and the glacier stretched. out ahead of them like a wide, smooth plain, almost like an ice prairie seemingly free of crevasses. With that, they pushed farther west. But when they reached the far side, the landscape changed completely. The glacier was fractured with crevices. Huh? No. Nope. Gotcha. It was not. The glacier was fractured with crevasses. Deep near vertical cracks formed as the ice shifted and moved. Is this quick question? Is this how we got into the whole debacle?

in the first place. It's just a mispronunciation. Maybe. I think so. I'm not trying to redeem ourselves, but no, crevice is a real word. And I think, no, we had a whole conversation of what's the difference between crevice and cross and we decided there wasn't one. Oh. We don't revisit this. Okay. I move on. I for a second, I was like, could we have just, it was just a simple. No. Miss. Okay. No. No, it sure wasn't. Okay. No. It's fine. We've, we know now. I like when people find our podcast for the first time, and that comes up and they're like, oh, just so you know, there's, it'll be a really nice comment and be like, hi, just so you know the difference between crevice and crevas is this. It's like, oh, I hope you stay long enough for this journey because we figure it out. Especially when those comments come from present day. It's like, just so you know, that's been, it's been five years. We've grown. We've evolved. We know. Like, hey, girlie, just so you know, it's also been five years. And we understand. But imagine if we didn't, it would be nice to be like, actually after five years, I feel like you should just leave it. If we have been super embarrassing, if you told us after five years of us doing this.

Just let us live. Yeah. There's a girl, if she's listening, it's cool. But I don't know if she is anymore. But there's at Chaska's veterinary hospital, one of the receptionists, her name's Madison. I'm with, I go to that hospital all the time, just because he's. gets like librella and we're just in there frequently and so me and this girl Madison have kind of just like we know each other now she's always like ah jask's mom hey and then turns out she also

goes to one of the Pilates studios I go to so sometimes we'll like work out together at least in the same vicinity and like a week or two ago I walk in and I set up my mat and she was next to me And she's like, oh, I just started listening to your podcast. And she knew it existed for since like I started going there. But she was hesitant to start listening because she thought it was going to be scary. And you know me. I'm like, I'm not going to advocate for ourselves. I'm like, yeah, okay.

I get it. I'm not like, no, really, you should try. I'm like, heard you. It's fine. Like you don't have to listen. And but she did. She's like, yeah, I started listening. And I'm like, oh, which one?

And she said like, I don't know, something crazy, like episode three or something. I'm like, girl, come on. It's like you have 300 plus episodes to choose from. And you pick our worst audio. And you do that. But I guess you got to start somewhere. I don't know. She's like, I listened.

She didn't really have much follow-up information. Well, we have our answer. But yeah, Madison, I don't know. if you make it this far. You're still stuck back in 2022. But we hope you find us here eventually and see our growth. Ready to soundtrack your summer? With Red Bull Summer All Day Play,

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The Love Hypothesis, Sterling Point, and more. Slow burns, second chances, chemistry you can feel through the screen. Your next obsession is waiting. Watch only on Prime. Anyway, we're getting on so many sight tangents. Today is crazy. So anyway, he's found a crevasse.

Some of them are staggeringly deep. And Mirro looked over the edge of one and estimated it dropped nearly a thousand feet, like standing atop a hundred-story building. Others stretched wider and wider, some nearly 30 feet across. Mier moved carefully, choosing his steps and making control jumps where he had to. But Stakein did the opposite. The little dog rushed ahead, leaping the gaps without hesitation. He would run straight to the edge and spring across landing lightly every time.

Watching him made Meir uneasy. The crossings were dangerous enough on their own, but Stakein's confidence only made it more unsettling. Mier wondered if the dog didn't fully understand the danger, describing it as kind of a dullness of perception, as though his courage came without any sense of self-preservation. As they moved across the glacier, Muir spoke to him, urging him to be more careful, though he had no idea whether Stakein understood him. He estimated the glacier was about seven miles wide. They followed it as it curved around a massive point of land and jutted out into the bay and discovered a new branch of the glacier. Here, the ice gave way to chaos. The glacier dropped sharply,

splintering into what Mir called an ice cascade, a violent spill of ice that resembled a frozen waterfall. Massive blocks tilted and leaned against one another, split by deep shadowed crevasses, the whole formation appearing unstable as if it could break loose at any moment. He badly wanted to follow this new branch all the way out to the sea, but he knew there wasn't enough daylight for that kind of detour. So he turned around to go back towards camp. But that's when things started to get really dangerous. They quickly found themselves in a tangled maze of crevasses. And then the snow arrived, exactly what Meir had been watching for and was worried about. Soon, the two were moving through a full blizzard and near whiteout conditions. They were leaping across wide cracks through the

falling snow, but making almost no progress. Time and time again, they were forced to double back when they reached gaps too wide to cross. Mier would stop, cut footholds with his axe to steady himself then launch himself across these. The danger was intense, but it energized him, made him feel alert and alive, and Stakein seemed to feel it too. Still, the pace was painfully slow. Muir began to wonder if they would be forced to spend the night out on the glacier until daylight returned and they could find their way back to camp.

Stakein, he realized, would likely have endured that without hesitation. But they were soaked, cold, and hungry, so they kept moving. The snowfall thickened until Muir could no longer see far. enough ahead to judge a safe route. Before long, they came to a deep crevasse that stretched out in front of them in a long, unbroken line disappearing into the storm. They followed it, searching for a place to cross. Eventually, Muir spotted a section that might work, but the jump was scarier than the other. And even if he made it, there was no guarantee they wouldn't be forced to turn back again. He stopped to consider his options. They could retreat towards the forest on the

west side, build a fire, and weighed out the night. But looking at the terrain, he realized the eastern side was now just as close. So he made the decision. Mure jumped. Sticky and followed without hesitation, clearing the gap as if it were nothing. Mure hoped they were past the worst of the crevasses, but they had no such luck. Almost immediately, they came face to face with the most terrifying fishery yet. He searched for another way across, but quickly realized the crack connected with the one they had just crossed exactly what he had feared. As far as he could see, it stretched on without end, opening 40 to 50 feet wide in places as wide as a good-sized river, and it was clearly impossible to cross. They were stranded on a narrow island of ice, completely surrounded by deep impassable crevasses,

and their options were limited. They could try to jump back the way they had come, but that meant leaping from a lower position to a higher one, far more dangerous than before. Or they could attempt what Muir called a sliver bridge, a thin strip of ice spanning the crevasse near its center. These bridges form when a crevasse widens, but a narrow seam of ice remains intact,

like a piece of wood splitting but not fully breaking apart. Even in the best conditions, crossing one would be a number. like walking a balance beam over a massive drop. But this one looked old and unstable, worn down, and fragile. And reaching it would be worse. To get there, they would have to climb down a nearly vertical wall of ice, cross the narrow bridge, and then climb up another steep wall on the other side. All of it in driving snow, soaked through, shivering, running on almost no food, and with night closing in fast. So he started chopping out a kind of ladder down off the cliff to reach the sliver bridge. To do it, he had to create a

hollow spot where his knee could rest, then go backwards down the wall, leaning over to chop another hollow where he could turn and place his heel. This is how Muir made his way down to the crossing. Each foothold had to be precisely carved, otherwise he could slip and fall to his death. Each one had to be sturdy enough that it would hold him while he chiseled yet another one. Stikine followed Mier down the footholds without hesitation, carefully making his way towards this liver bridge. But when they reached it, everything changed. The little dog put his head past Mere's shoulder and looked down into the abyss. Then he turned and looked straight at him. For the first time that entire long punishing day, Stikine hesitated. He led out a low whimper of protest

what Mier described as clearly as if he were saying, surely you're not going to that awful place. Yeah, because that's how you, surely you are not, it's, there's the Greek mythologer, or whatever, what, did I just say mythologer? Philosopher. I almost said Greek mythology, but combined it. That's Stakein. All this time, Muir had seemed skeptical about whether an animal was really aware or emotional, but now he recognized for the first time that Stakein was an unfeeling all this time. He was actually really brave. And now his bravery had seen, its limit, just like Muir's own courage was flagging. Something in that moment shifted. The dog's expression, the sound of his voice, it was so familiar, so human and its fear that Muir found himself

speaking to him as if they were facing it together. He tried to steady him, telling him they would make it across, though it would not be easy. And if they slipped, he had a grimly, at least they would have a fine resting place in the marine below. And of course, those weren't really comforting words to Stakein, whether he understood them or not. It didn't do anything to comfort him to know that if they died, they'd have a nice grape. Sikine turned away and searched for another route, but there was none. Meanwhile, Mure stepped out onto the narrow strip of ice, moving slowly, never daring to look back. Behind him, Stakeen cried out. When Mier reached the far side, the dog's protests

only grew louder. He called back to him, first gently, then more firmly, trying to convince him that the path was safe and that he had cut it smooth with his axe. He's like, no, look, it's safe. I did it. I imagine him talking in like a high-pitched voice. Like, no, no, come on, it's okay. Look, I did this for you. You can cross.

I would like to imagine him like that, but I can't. Yeah. Not after the way he's been speaking to himself thus far. Yeah. Stikine would pause as if listening, as if weighing the decision, and then break back into desperate howling. Mier inched his way across the bounds beam of the bridge, never daring to look back at the little dog crying in agony behind him. But once he was on the other side, Stikine yelled even harder. Mier started calling to him that it was now the dog's turn to cross the abyss.

He tried using a consoling tone, telling him how he'd cleared it with his axe, making it smooth and easy to traverse. Stikine would pause for a moment, seeming to consider these words, then resume his howling. Then Meir would try a stern voice. The whole time, Meir watched the dog on the other side of the bridge. Everything in Stikine's face and body language was just like a human being working up the courage to do something that felt impossible. But it took Stikine so long to manage the feet that Muir thought for sure he was going to have to leave him behind. He even tried pretending to leave, climbing away from him at a sight while the dog howled and pleaded to wait for him. Then Muir came back and called the dog one last time. Stakein became calm, visibly took a deep breath in, then crouched down

on his belly and started scooching across the Ites Bridge. He never lifted his feet, but just dragged himself across inch by inch. Eventually, he reached the other side this way and Mure was up on the cliff above, reaching down his hands to him. But Stakein didn't budge. He steadied himself and looked up, studying all the chinks and footholds Muir had made for him, and then in one fluid motion, Stakein went springing up the cliff. He rushed past Muir and was safe at the top. Well done, well done, little brave boy, a mirror shouted as Stakeen reached the top and the two were finally reunited. He tried to grab him to study him, maybe even to hold him for a moment, but Stakein was far too overwhelmed for that. The little dog was shaking all over,

bursting with energy and relief. He tore off. into wild loops around Muir, then threw himself onto the ice, rolling and twisting, only to spring back up and race off again. It's like, John Muir, I can, if I could please, just tell you really quickly, that's called the Zoomis. If you've never heard, John Muir, these are the zoomies that dogs get when they're very excited. A revelation.

Yeah. In dog behavior. Mirr had never seen such a sudden shift from pure terror to complete. unrestrained joy. For weeks, Stakeen had seemed reserved, almost stoic, but now that composure was gone. He barked, ran, spun, and leapt as if he couldn't contain, but he had just survived. He had faced the possibility of death and made it across, and now with the danger

behind him, he seemed to feel every bit of what it meant to still be alive. Yeah, he's like, don't ever make me do that again. And I wrote after that, it was like the best Zumi's ever. Yeah. The best Sumis of his life. Especially that he noted that this wasn't something he did before. You know, some dogs just get really excited and they get the

Zumis kind of often. It seems like Stikine wasn't like that. So this was a big moment. Truly a celebration. Yeah. But after the celebration, he realizes again that the night's closing in and they still really needed to get off the glacier. So Muir began making his way down with

Stickeen still darting around his heels energized and seemingly restored after the crossing. The crevasses they encountered on the descent no longer felt as threatening, not after what they had just survived. Only when darkness fully settled over them did Steakin finally calm, falling back into his usual steady fox light trot. Before long, the ice gave way to Rocky Moraine and then to dents brush and trees as they pushed their way through the undergrowth. Then they saw it, the glow of their campfire ahead. They could smell the smoke before they reached it, and with it came the weight of everything they just endured. Muir felt his knees begin to shake with exhaustion. It was around 10 o'clock when they finally stumbled

into camp. While they had been gone, Reverend Young had been visited by Hoonah Clinket hunters traveling through the area who shared porpoise meat and wild strawberries. Mure and Stakein were both starving. They ate quickly, then collapsed into bed. But sleep that night did not come easily. Stakein twitched and stirred beside him, letting out small sounds as if he was still caught in the crossing glacier. Muir lay awake, replaying it all, the narrow bridge, the drop below, the slow, careful steps, over and over the same moment returned, refusing to let either of them fully rest. After surviving the blizzard on the glacier together, Muir and Stakein were inseparable for the rest of the expedition. Stakeen would only eat what Muir would feed him and slept pressed against him in the canoe.

It wasn't until many years after their adventure that Muir wrote down his story. He told it so many times to Wanda and Helen, his daughters, and they loved it so much that they insisted he write it into a children's book. But even looking back after such a long time, Muir recognized that Stakein had changed how he viewed the shared mortality of all beings. He wrote, through Stakein as through a window, I have ever since been looking with deeper sympathy into all my fellow mortals. Oh, wow. Stikine, good job. Just being you and changing how somebody thinking, that's just so crazy to me that someone had to learn that. I feel like it's something that you're just, it's just you're born with. I don't know. You just know. I don't know. That's just so strange to me. The sentiment of a dog changing the way you view the world is something that we've seen a lot through history and through people. You know, you see people befriend animals. or give a lot of credit to dogs who save their lives emotionally. I mean, emotional support dogs that are for people.

You have, there's so many ways that dogs have changed the perspective of people and to see that written down in a story and to hear him say, you know, this changed the whole way I not only look at dogs, but of all living beings. It's like, it's so beautiful that a little dog could do that to someone who didn't. I mean, I feel like I was born with those feelings. So I'm glad he got there eventually. I think it's nice that a dog was the facilitator behind that. Someone had to do it, I guess. Stekeen's like, okay, let's catch up.

If you're alive, you are worth something. Yeah, I don't know. It's just, okay. I mean, yeah, I agree. Glad we got there, but it was a journal. Yeah, he's a full grown adult. Me are embarrassing. But okay.

Imagine just moving through the world, not thinking, I don't know. And I know people, like, I am very aware that people hold different, I mean, especially when we travel, you know, like going to different places throughout the world where different cultures hold different feelings about animals and like how they're treated or viewed or whatever. Like I very much understand that that is a very real thing. I'm not just saying this as a blanket statement. It's just... They're wrong.

They're wrong. Yeah. Thank you. Here I am trying to be like a media trained. But you're right. That's how I feel. So there it is. Those are my feelings.

You don't think animals have feelings. You're wrong. Period. And I don't want the anthropomorphism community to come after me either. Because you're also wrong. Don't even get. We can't we start it. Just kidding.

There's a time and place for that and I understand that. But you can't in all seriousness truly approach me and say that you don't think a dog experiences sadness or anxiety. Or happiness or anxiety or yeah, or love. It's such a narrow minded way of thinking about the world to me to think that it's like you're putting yourself. at the center of the universe of like, yeah, well, we can't ascribe human emotions onto other things. It's like we're only one of a bazillion fucking species out there who's to say. And we are animals just to clarify. Yeah, it's just, I don't know.

It gets me riled up because it's like we're by saying that and by holding that argument about anthropomorphism and things like that, it's basically saying we have ownership over all emotions. So we'll see if other animals can live up to that, but we're just not sure. And I think that's bullshit. And that's science. Thanks for coming to our TED Talk. National Park Service, you know how to reach us. If you agree with our views.

We want our scientific background. Yeah. I have a biology degree. So, and very much like John Muir in the beginning when you were like, he, said you said something about he did like a bunch of classes and stuff but then never fully did a degree yeah yeah and all of these different subjects yeah yeah so i have a bio degree but the only reason i have a bachelor of arts and not a BS a bachelor of science is because i refused to do organic chemistry which is so rare refused it was the only class that differentiated that and so instead

of doing the Bachelor of Science, I elected to do a Bachelor of Arts in Biology and Environmental Science Minor. Mm-hmm. Because I'm like, I'm not fucking doing organic chemistry, man. You can't make you do that. Chemistry is hard. Yeah. But you know, your best friend, Amy, was my chemistry partner.

Yeah, it's so funny. Such a small world. Before I knew you existed, synchronicities. And she's so smart. She's so smart, yeah. She used to, like, tutor me in high school. She carried me through that. And she's a doctor now.

Yeah. Yeah. And as she should be, because I watched her in chemistry class and she was great. She was incredible. She didn't. And I'm sure this is how she got through college too. But she, I would be studying my ass off for tests and things. And she was like, oh yeah, I just paid attention in class and read the chapter.

Never would look at it again. What? Like it's hard? But she just, yeah. She just understands things so well. And for the first, once you explain something to her once, she just understands it. And that's. It feels like sort of how photographic memory works, only not visual.

Yeah. There must be another term for it. I wouldn't know. She listens to this podcast. So if you're listening. Oh, hi, Amy. One of the greatest things you can compliment her on is her brain. And that's what she appreciates the most.

So. Well, I sure appreciated it in Keene State, 2000, whatever 11 or whatever that was. Thanks, girl. Well, before we close out the story, I will go into what happened to Stakeen after, because it's a mystery of what happened to him after that trip into Glacier Bay. Muir headed back to California and never saw him again. He wrote to Mr. Young anxiously asking about his canine friend, but Mr. Young wrote back to say that Stakein had been stolen away by Taurus who left on a steamer from Fort Rangel. Muir ends his book by saying in his mind, Stakeen would always be a mortal.

But doesn't that seem odd since what made Stakeen so astonishing to Mir in that courageous moment on the ice bridge was the fact of Stakein's mortality? It was their shared fear of death and their identical joy at survival that had so amazed him. So maybe it's even better to think of Stakeen as a globe-trotting adventurer, and when he got on that steamer, it was off to yet another incredible journey into the great wild world. And that's my story of John Muir and Stakein. Oh, Stikine.

I hope he went off and lived his best life somewhere. I can totally see. At first, when you said he was stolen, it's like, yeah, I was startled. But then I was like, people were just like, oh, you're a cute little dog. You're coming home with me. So you need a home, don't you? Get over here. Get in this sweater.

Get on this ship and I'll bring you back to. a nice comfy home somewhere, hopefully. To live out the rest of your days and comfort. You deserve it. Well, thanks so much. I think that was a great redemption dog story. Thank you. Yeah.

Much happier. Yeah. And still on glaciers. We are on a glacier kick. Last week I did Duncan story. Yeah. Carvasses are part of our vocabulary now. Yeah.

I need a shirt. It says, ask me about crevasses. Yeah. New March idea. I like it. Ask me about, yeah, ask me about my crevap. No, that sounds. Or maybe, I mean.

Ask me about my crevasse. Yeah. At least don't. I'm sorry. I'm like, I don't know what's happening to be. I'm so giggly right now. Great. I don't even think we need a pallet cleanser because we've been yapping.

Yeah. All right. Well, thanks everyone for joining. Hope you enjoyed learning about sticking. And we'd love to hear about knowing comments and stuff like that. Like, you're an adventure dog, buddy, that you don't think is a daft noodle or whatever, that you understand is brave and sweet and lovely and has feelings. Yeah, tell us about your dogs. Yeah.

Or cats. Adventure cats are welcome to. Adventure animals, if any kind, it's cool. Yeah, for sure. Because they all have feelings. And you don't need a crevoss survival to know that. Yeah. And I won't hear any arguments against it of our stance.

Yeah. Well, on that note. So you have your homework. Yep. Tell us about your adventure animals and tell everyone you know that Cassie wants to be on as a cake. And get that going. That would be great. And we'll see you next week.

In the meantime, enjoy the view. But watch you're back. Bye, guys. Bye. Thanks for joining us for another episode. We hope you learned something new and have another location to put on your list. If you want more MPAD content, make sure to follow along with our adventures on all socials at National Park After Dark. For more stories just like this one, with the added bonus of exclusive content, you can join us on Patreon or Apple subscriptions.

If you prefer to watch our episodes, head over to our YouTube channel. And if you're enjoying the show, please take a moment to rate, review, and subscribe on your favorite listening platform. You're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind. Here's a helpful fact you may not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with Progressives save over $900 on average. Pop over to Progressive.com, answer some questions, and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by. In fact, 99% of their auto customers earn at least one discount.

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