NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - 2022 NFL Head Coach Hot Butt Rankings

Episode Date: August 12, 2022

A room filled with some heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, Gregg Rosenthal give their 2022 Head Coach Hot Butt Rankings as we descend upon pre-season games (11:35). We dive into all of the head coaches in danger of being removed, and categorize them by first (12:00), second (27:05), and third (38:42) degree burns. Note: timecodes approximateNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. I'm Marcus Grant. And I'm Michael Florio, and together we host the NFL fantasy football podcast. Ready to dominate your fantasy league this season? Then you need the NFL fantasy football podcast, your ultimate source for player news, draft tips, and winning strategies. Whether you're a rookie manager or a fantasy vet,

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Didn't kill their wife. I didn't kill my wife. It's the cadence of it. From the Chris Wessling podcast. podcast studio, it's around the NFL. Devoid of context, that's a really strange way to open a show. I'm Dan Hansis in a studio filled with some heroes. Greg Rosenthal, Mark Sessler, both innocent of any spouse homicide as well.

So we're off to a great start. So far. Or at least when it comes to Mark that we know of. What does that mean? Well, there's previous lives. Just set up Mark like a bowling pin. There's children. Presuppose.

There's children. I thought we saw one the other week, one of your lost. daughters or whatever so who knows what could have happened i've been open about my my other daughter she's out there and she just wants a hug how was your wife's birthday by the way what did i say about my wife mark that's all that that's all that you the takeaway from the birthday celebration was that she survived it was excellent um the wine and cheese is it wrong of me to ask that feels that was very nice the wine and cheese excellent she was very happy with that we went out to a restaurant We went to the beach and watched the sunset.

It was very nice. Did our names come up during your time together? Greg or Marks. Not a single time. Sometimes you've got to disconnect. We've been in the studio a lot. You seem weirdly bothered by it, as if, like, you have special feelings for...

As if Mark's, like, wondering if... Emily was like, I wonder what Mark's doing right now. Kind of. My wife! All right. All right, it is another aspect. episode of around the NFL. Thank you to everybody. We're churning out the content. We hope you're enjoying it. We got another great show coming up today. It's our annual check-in on hot

butts. And I feel like I don't have to give this disclaimer. But some in the football industry get a little uncomfortable even talking about job security as if to talk about it on a program like this is to celebrate it or to not see the human side of the game. We see all that. We got it we are above the tree tops we're just this show is about the reality that six to eight head coaches will lose their jobs uh in the first week of january or second week of january that's just the way it is greggie and we're going to talk about which coaches are in the most danger of having that fate well i think some people also are just uncomfortable with with the word butts and then also the sound drops that that you play of what

it's like for a man's butt to be hot, but... I think that's an apt point by Greg. Well, it is, it's a audio, you know, medium. And I think one of the things the audience I think enjoys about the show is we kind of take them inside the game. Right. But like, do we need to get a new actor, set of actors every year to, you know, make these sound drops?

I think that's unnecessary. Well, listen, that's a fair criticism, but the show is what the show is. I love that an acting gig allowed someone to actually come up with that sound at beginning with. I mean, that's probably a lower level actor. You got to bring the whole oven in. It's a whole thing. Yeah, it's a tough situation. But, yes, we'll get into that.

Before we do, by the way, how are we? We had Mina Kimes on the show this week. There was a lot of buzz on social media about the photo she posted. Mark, I know you were particularly upset about it. Where are you at emotionally after? She did put up, I don't think Mina did it on purpose, although in a follow-up tweet after you, I think she did do it on, she made a choice.

She made a choice on what she thought was a better look for her and then kind of threw you to the wolves a little bit with your blinking shot. All I have to say is that I have done that same thing in group photos where I look for the best version of me. And it's like, if someone else has to get sent down the river a little bit, you got it's a tough move, but you got to do it. So I get where she, I'm not upset with her choice. I'm upset that the photo was given to her as an option to begin with by our producer. Because Sean Kelly has been, you're an extremely talented, good attitude, driven individual.

Sean's sitting in today for Justin Graver. He is for Grave. I don't understand the thought process how that got past your filter unless there was something malicious on your end. Sean doesn't have a malicious bone in his body. Kelly. He doesn't. Not that I could detect. No malicious bone in the body.

What exactly happened was I was asked to send all the photos that I had taken professionally, as you'd seen on the Instagram. Put up the photo in the studio. Put up the phone. Yeah, you'll see it. It's going to go up. Okay. It's really nice. I can't right now because I put the camera on me while I'm talking.

Yeah, obviously. Well, I have some of doing that. But no, it's up. And there was three photos taken, and one of them just happened to have Mark's eyes closed. And I had sent all three photos out to Greg and Justin. And they had sent over to Mina. You asked me for a photo. So now Greg's involved.

So the filter went, it went not throwing Greg under the bus. That's not what I'm trying to do. But, no, this is a good investigation so far. No, that just, that was a little nugget that we need to add to our investigation. This is very important. and I sent the photos out, and they were given to me to me to by Greg. This is a Watergate level disaster. Well, first of all, why is it so important to you, Mark?

The sad thing is when we saw this, we knew this is going to ruin Mark's week. This is going to be. Well, he said as much. I mean, a big focus. I will say it turned funny at some point to me. But the process, now that I'm hearing about the faulty process, that to me stands out as a problematic. I'm at Menchies. We're at a little post-beach camp frozen year.

yogurt. Mina asked for the pictures. I asked Justin and Sean for the pictures. They send them, copy, paste. There you go. I didn't. It's not like I'm... You didn't examine the photos yourself.

I'm not like, you, no one would notice unless you actually like, you know, make, you know, make it closer, focus in on Mark's face or whatever. They all look the same from far away. God forbid we be detailed. And I think the other thing was Mark had everything else buttoned up. If you look at the photo and you could check it out on Mina's social, you have the, you have the cool uncle pose with your arms crossed, confidence. Everything's there.

The only thing you had to do at that point was not blink. And it makes me think of Chris Wessling, our late-grade friend, who blinked in every picture until, weirdly, he met Lakeisha. And so maybe there's a connection to Wes. Maybe his spirit was in the photo. Oh, if that's the case, then I am going to look at it differently. I do remember blinking, actually, during one of Sean's shots thinking, like, that sucked.

I hope they don't use that one. It is funny, though, because we send out these, you know, photos or pictures from our podcast all the time on the around the NFL pod, you know, Twitter feed. And that's great. A lot of people follow that. But because Mina was on the show, not only did the NFL network with 4.6 million

followers retweet it. We never get a retweet for a bit of a blogger. But the NFL main account with 30 million followers also retweeted it. I mean, I think the employer is telling me what they think of my overall. I think it also tells us, you know, Mina was being a little modest about, oh, I only get spotted in

sports bars NFL network everyone very thirsty to get the Mina photo out there to the mass masses but I guess that's good look for us as well Mina came on our show great guest as always great guest informative personable the whole thing um all right before we get into our study of coaches on the hot seat the ones with the hot butts buttocks that are very warm and sometimes sizzling and outright melting. Again, that's just the way it is, Greg. I think this is what Greg is referring to that maybe some portion of the listening audience.

You seem to really enjoy it. I'm still struggling with the whole idea that we have to make it four categories, not five. My mind is racing with some of these guys. Let's just touch on, we'll get to Todd Bowles later in the conversation, a first year head coach with the Bucks, but he is going to be without his quarterback, Tom Brady, for a period of time to, the way Bowles put it,

to deal with some personal things. The Brady absence was discussed in advance, and the idea is that he'll return after next week's preseason game against the Titans on August 20th. Here's what Bulls said to the media. Tom has been excused today. He will be taken anywhere. He'll be back sometime around after Tennessee. He's going to deal with some personal things. This is something we talked about before training camp started.

We allotted this time because he wanted to get in and get chemistry with the guys and go through two weeks of training camp, knowing he wasn't going to play the first two. games. He didn't want to take away reps from Blaine and Kyle and as well as Griff as far as going into these next two games and it's something he needs to handle. Oh my God, Todd Bulls. We trust him. We talked about it. It was like it was scheduled way before training camp and he will not be here until after Tennessee. It's not a lot of variance to his vocal cadence. When asked if the issue was health related, Bulls said it's a personal issue, that's all I can tell you. He also added when asked if it would impact the commitment. to the team going forward.

Bull said, per hour conversation, I am not worried. No, but Mark, Greg, wasn't worried before the show. So let's check in with his favorite player. I wasn't worried. I just said it's unprecedented, right? I mean, in our time doing this podcast, and from what I can think, there isn't a player that leaves training camp for this long.

It's going to be at least about nine or ten days, maybe longer. Context-wise, Brady himself is unprecedented. Right, absolutely. So everything's kind of different. The only reason why I wanted to make sure it got into the show was just the question to Bowles about his level of confidence that he'll be ready and that he's going to play week one. And Bulls said there's always going to be some doubt, but he has a pretty high level of confidence that Brady will start the season opening. Just those words being thrown out there. There's no point in speculating what this is or why.

That sounds like coach speak to me. just to be safe. He's adding that, you know, back end. But I see what you're saying. I don't think so. I think if he knew for sure the day that Tom Brady was coming back, he would say that. And whatever it is, obviously, you hope everything is okay.

But just the fact that he said a pretty high level of confidence, and there's always going to be some doubt. It's just something to monitor. I would note that our friend Ian Rapidport on NFL Network said stressed, in quotes, Tom Brady is fine, calling it more of a personal family issue. So I think the, you know, you know, there's always some doubt that if it is a family issue, it could be his extended family, his, we don't know,

that it's a situation that is, you know, in midstream. And you hope he'd be fine to come back then. But there's a chance. I don't think it's Tom Brady sitting at home wondering if he wants to play football still. All right. So there it is. That's the greatest player of all time. And that's the update on him.

I think we'll see him in a couple weeks. He'll be ready. He's not on the hot butt rankings. never has been. Maybe not since his Michigan days, you know. I mean, yeah, 2001 season, certainly. There were a lot of Patriots reporters wanting to bring Bledsoe back for those playoff games.

You know who else's hot was butt? Forget about Brady, the kid back then. Bill Belchick, once upon the time, had a hot seat in New England before that 2001 season. He had proven nothing as a head coach at that point. And he had not proven anything. He was coming off a bad season in New England with a, you know, not a great roster. And then they had patience. He did beat Bill Parcells in the playoffs as the Browns coach.

He did prove something that's. Well, I'm talking about as Patriots. For sure. The 5 and 11 and then they started 1 and 3. Right. But now he's untouchable. And forever will be untouchable, I would imagine, until he decides to retire.

But that just goes to show you this exercise that, yeah, sometimes these teams would be better off having patience. But that's not really how our league operates. So we're going to go through. we're going to go through all the 32 coaches here and we're going to put them in categories for the hot butt rankings 22 safe

first degree burns other buttocks second degree it's getting a little you know it's a little touch and go put it that way and then third degree which is danger danger danger this is not a good situation

and we're going back to Sean Kelly filling in for grave digger did a nice job showing us last year's results he sent us a note with last year's results for third degree burns last year for instance all three of us had zach taylor and you may say oh idiots dummies they went to the super bowl well he needed to prove it last year i have no problem that he was on that list of that place now i think you'll understand probably where he's going to be for all three of us although i won't speak for everybody he's off the list this year but otherwise we all had Matt Nagy also and Greg wisely had Vic Fangio also on third degree burns and he got

taken out as well. So to get in that category, you are in deep trouble and we'll see who else has someone in that category in 2020. I really appreciate the enthusiasm Sean has for his job, the energy that he did this without being asked, especially because it makes me look good. You know, I was the only one that had Joe Judge there in the second degree too so that that was nice Dan and I did have Zimmer in there so we both on that but I was like Mark on the tennis court and you guys were like my kids that was now no it was a nice performance by you in 21 although it's not supposed to be predictive so that actually defeats I'm going against my own point that's true that's true it's not really predictive Zach Taylor really did have third degree burns last year we're trying

to explain like where things are right now not telling you what so you're right that a little predictive like i thought if joe judge has a bad season he's gonna he's gonna be in big time how did we not how did we not have vic fangio uh on a hotter seat dan i that i had him as a first degree as you did uh i don't know looking back i'm not sure why it was a long time ago i can't remember i can't get inside my uh thought process on that one 2222 so do you want to um do you want to go through go through like the safe list maybe i'll read my Safe list here, and then you guys tell me if you guys all have the same goods. We'll build up to third degree? Okay.

Yeah, let's build to that spot. Okay, I think that's more... Get hot or don't get colder. So this is safe. This is, hey, it's the summer. It's August. You're going to sit by the pool. You're going to pour yourself a glass of cold, ice cold lemonade.

Life's good. That was kind of gross. Oh, that was awful. Did that get your misophonia going? I cannot do that. If that's happening again in this episode, I'll check you later. Well, that triggered the misophonia. Big time.

I mean, him saying if that happens again, I'm out of here. That was just asking you to hit it again, Mike. Which part really bothered you? It's the swallowing. That sounds nice. No, it's the swallowing and then the business after. What, the human enjoying himself and feeling relaxed? I want them to enjoy themselves.

The bird was very nice. The security was there? It was the, you were hearing their throat process. I don't think I'm going to have any, but we'll see. Let's see. This is who I have is safe personally. John Harbaugh. Stop me whenever, you know, Sean McDermott, Matt Eberfluse,

Zach Taylor, Nathaniel Hackett, Matt LaFleur, Doug Peterson, Andy Reed, Sean McVeigh, Kevin O'Connell, Bill Belichick, Brian Dable, Mike Tomlin, Kyle Shanahan, Mike Frable. Does everyone, do we have the same safe or does anybody have one of those figures in a different category? I have two of them in separate places. Very interesting. Without saying where they are, who are the two names? Mike McDaniel, which I really, I had him safe up until the 11th hour of this process, and then I had a strange vibration.

And Kyle Shanahan. And I have Kyle Shanahan in a completely separate category that's not part of our exercise that I can explain. lane later. Okay, so he's not in first, second, or third degree? I don't see him as like a hot butt because he's not a great coach. I just sense a Shanahan-esque chaos down the road. Well, when I had an extra section, he was in one above, but now I combined. And to me, Shanahan is safe because if something's going to happen there, if they had a disappointing season, I truly believe John Lynch will be gone. And Kyle Shanahan is essentially John Lynch's boss and that he could survive.

How I do this exercise is like, all right, let's get pretty close to worst case scenario. What's their heat level going to be? And I think Kyle Shanahan, even in a worst case scenario, is safe. Can I explain then where, do I'm just explain it quickly? I have it in my own category called I Smell Chaos. And I think it's going to be the rare thing where if things go poorly

and if there is issues inside the house, that Kyle Shanahan will hopscotch to another job. That's what I'm predicting. So within your realm, though, where would that fall? Would it fall on first, second, or third degree? In between safe and first? Because I think it's, Kyle Shanahan deciding to leave.

Not they think he's not a good enough court. He's a renegade. That's not a hot button. Then if you why, do I think he's unsafe today? He would be in the safe category. But I'm telling you, I'm predicting something weird happens. He's safe to you, but something could happen and he could leave. So I struggled with this one, but one of your names I did have in the first degree category.

And there aren't many one and done's in NFL history. So putting Nathaniel Hackett there feels harsh. But there's a new owner. And just that alone and the high expectations, I just put them in first degree. New owners come in. They like to have their own guys. And I'm sure George Payton and Nathaniel Hackett feel great. Their roster looks great.

Russell's there. Russell Wilson, you know, not always happy with his offensive coaches over the year. If for some reason they go 6 and 11 and Russell Wilson doesn't play very well and there's a new owner, then I would think he would be in some trouble. I like that. And that sound you heard, first degree is

you're getting into a car in a very hot summer day and it's a little sticky. You know, especially wearing shorts or something, it is not the most comfortable thing, but it's also not anything to be alarmed about. It's pretty normal, everyday occurrences. Sure. Also, you said so many names.

I think I had one or two that were in my safe that weren't in your, like, Lovie. Did you say Lovie Smith? I did not say Lovie Smith. I ultimately don't think they would go one and done two times in a row. It's a weird team. That they just sort of see a little longer, but maybe I'm wrong. Yeah, well, we'll get to that.

Do you want, what's the best way to do this? Should I just go through my first degree or do you want to go through your first degree? You're going to remember how we did it last year. Let me go through my first degree. Yeah. And then you guys, again, we'll talk about it. So first degree, again, it's getting a little sticky in the car in August. Kind of gross, but you just power through it.

Put the AC up. If you're lucky, leather seats, first of all, is a problem. But if you're lucky and you have air conditioning in your seats, that's a nice thing. Very sticky. Anyway, I got Cliff Kingsbury coming off the contract extension, but you want to talk about chaos. I don't know what's going on in Arizona. And one thing that I thought about, Greg, you were talking about what you think about worst case scenario. I also think about the teams that have high expectations or a certain level of expectations

If things crater, ownership could be like, oh, my God, what are we doing here? And we've already seen this is the same team that fired a coach, one and done, before Cliff Kingsbury. Also, drafted a quarterback in the first round in the top 10 picks two years in a row. Could Cliff get fired one year into an extension? Probably not, but I haven't been at first degree. Also, Arthur Smith, Kevin Stefansky, Dan Campbell, Josh McDaniels, Brandon Staley, Dennis Allen, Nick Siriani, Todd Bowles in my first degree. Many of those were in my safe when I combined it down. Ultimately, I only had about 10 coaches in any sort of trouble, first, second, or third degree.

To me, Siriani, he's going to be fine, even if they did poorly. I think they have a real belief in Brandon Staley in Los Angeles that would protect him. I also don't think they want to pay coaching contracts like two years into it. So they seem like a team I think that would avoid that. Iber flus, did you say him? He was in your safe category. Arthur Smith I also have in my safe because I just, even though there's a chance

they might have the number one overall pick, I just feel like they made a purposeful rebuild here and are just going to see it through. Okay. Well, I'll quickly tell you who's in my first degree. I have Pete Carroll. That could be also just Pete Carroll decides to walk away, but I think that there's a little bit of tumult there

if this season were a total disaster. and he hasn't come up yet, so I'm with you that there's something there. Brandon Staley, just based on the fact that you have like the Michael Jordan of quarterbacks on your roster and things go poorly. The Michael Jordan of quarterback? Well, I think it's like there's so much optimism, hope around the Chargers that if they floundered, he would be blamed. So that's the moment, Sean, that you want to put on the social post, just a big, like, picture of Mark, ideally the one from yesterday with his eyes closed. And then it just says, Justin Herbert is the Michael. Jordan of quarter.

Stay away from me on the social media. I was already writing it down too. I was like Michael, Jordan, Justin Herbert, that's a drug. Dominique Wilkins, maybe. I don't know. Jordan's pretty high praise. I mean, at least at this point, it's a little nice. So Pete Carroll, Brandon Stilly,

Mike McDaniel, just based on the dolphins being weird, based on the fact that a year from now, there will be no outrage if they went after Sean Payton again. It's going to be a different scene. If it didn't go well. I think Mike McDaniel is going to do well, though. Frank Reich, just be, I, and when we did our slogans, mine for them was good but not great part seven.

Is the owner going to be down for part eight if things were really milk toast there? Lovie Smith, just because that's a weird organization. Arthur Smith, if things went terribly in Atlanta, Dennis Allen. Dennis Allen is... So Cliff is later on. Yeah. Similar, we have some names that I have higher up.

I had that Dennis Allen there too. To me, he's a really interesting first degree guy. All three of us. Because he's a first time head coach with the Saints. And normally you would think there's like this. long leash, but he kept everyone. And it just feels like a continuation of the Sean Payton era, whereas you might not get the same consideration that everyone gets.

Now, I think Dennis Allen is almost a proxy for this entire organization that is all trying to keep collecting paychecks, and I include Mickey Loomis there. I include that entire coaching staff that's been there forever, the personnel group, which has done a great job, to be fair. They've all been there together, and I think they all want to keep collecting those paychecks from the Benson's together. So there's not a lot of indication Gail Benson would actually pull the plug after one year, but there's high expectations, and I think Dennis Allen could go out.

I also have Stefansky in my first degree. It'd be so weird depending on what happens with Watson to change coaches, but either way, you just can't look at the history of Jimmy Haslam and put him anyway. You just can't put him anywhere else after a pretty disappointing 2021. And then I put Robert Sala here as well. I guess we'll mention they did sign Dwayne Brown. So on paper, the offensive line looks pretty good. The defensive line looks pretty good.

The roster looks better. I think Joe Douglas and Sala will be fine. But worst-case scenario, they win four games again. They're in danger. They're going to be in some heat. I move Sala from first back up to safe just because I don't think that he's the issue at all there. I think they love him. Right.

First to me is kind of like we don't think it's going to happen, but if it goes really south, it wouldn't be a shock. and 14, he would be in grave danger, I think, and just knowing the Jets' history of the last 10 years, it could happen, but it also seems like their defense plays well. He's a defensive coach. They'd struggled on defense last year. The roster looks much better. I think it's a good-looking defensive roster. If they're a better-than-average defense, he should be fine. If they're a bad defensive team again, that ends up being in. That reflects poorly on him. If Joe Douglas were swept out and another GM was brought in powerful and wanted to make changes, that gets ugly. If about Dan Campbell, I had him in first degree.

I had him safe now. Safe. That's a real rebuild. I mean. Yeah, I'm just... How did they only win three games? I have this memory that they were in every game. I mean, they were.

I think they started 0 and 10 or 11. Yeah, they got better and better. I only have them there because there are so many amazing vibes around the Lions that you do forget that they won only three games. And if with higher expectations, what if they cratered again? And he put together back-to-back three win seasons? Would ownership be cool at that? Would the Dan Campbell vibe potentially wear,

off first degree means i'm not too concerned about it but i think they'd give the third year that's generally the idea that you get three years and then after three if you haven't made the playoffs after three you generally are fired i mean that's it's almost like an NFL rule but i put him similar to lovey where it's like if you win five or six games everyone's going to be okay with that that's at least my my view of it and uh i had seriani there only because gregg their expectations are pretty high and if for whatever reason things went to hell maybe he would be on the chopping block, but if you're at first three, I think you're safe. I don't know if you miss Wednesday's show, but that was my number two overall pick

over Eagles nine and a half. Yes. Go to the bank, lock it up. The rainmaker arrived early. I don't know. Wait, where was the rainmaker on Wednesday, Greg? It's a, you've got to build your brand. I don't want my brand to be putting other people's money at stake that I'm not allowed to

do it. We've already gone down that road. And what if I told you? you're on a TV show that does exactly that on NFL. NFL game debut. We'll be back this year, Friday afternoons. But doesn't that kind of negate what you were just saying? Sure.

I don't think Greg struggles to build his brand. I mean, there was some, like, negativity in that statement. No, I don't think that's a weakness of yours. I don't know. I don't like this at all. Let's take a break and we'll get to second degree in earnest. What's up, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game from scouting reports and player development to team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week, we study the tape, talk to decision makers and share the insights you won't find anywhere else.

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All right, welcome back again. This is not a celebration of, I can't wait for this person to get fired. This is just reality. A place where Titans fans don't live, for example. But here, we stay in reality. Like for Dan, it's a little bit of a celebration. For Mark and I think we're normal. But this is sort of...

Speaking of brand, hot butts is sort of your brand. So I think there's a joy that it's hot butts day. My joy. It's like, you know, it's like, oh, the football season's almost here. There's a bounce in your step. The joy that I have lit on fire. Is the joy that I have by doing this podcast and talking to you guys and sharing these conversations with a grand audience.

Same, bro. Now, I am not celebrating these men being in grave danger. Their butts are on fire. I understand that. Second degree. It's getting gross. It's getting a little bit painful. It's like bacon in a frying pan.

Another issue for Mark who doesn't like meat products. I like the sound effect. This is calming to me. All right. You changed it up this year. Mixing it out. The sound effect. I love it.

Mixing it up. But now imagine this is a buttox. Still ruins it for you, doesn't it? I mean, that would be more troubling, yes. Well, it's a pig's buttocks in the other reality of it, but that's fine. Hit it again. Here we go. So I have Lovie Smith in second degree just because I don't trust the direction of the Houston Texans after poor David Cully.

Where is David Cully? Honestly, where is he? Making millions on the beach right now? That's the other thing. It's like these guys, they get canned, they're still getting paid a ton of money for the next three or four years. And I know it's Davis Mills hype season on some level, but, you know, and the roster maybe isn't as bad. And I think somebody else bang me over for the Texans. Mark, and I was going to do about it too, yeah.

But what if they suck? And Levy Smith is not a flashy name brand, and maybe someone catches their eye. You know the gift of the guy walking with his girlfriend and the other girl, the more attractive woman walking in the other direction. I know that. Well, they're... I can see that happening to the Texans.

I mean, there's pretty strong speculation, and there was reporting that they were going to hire Josh McCown, that the McNair family is in love with Josh McCown, and that the timing of the Brian. Flores lawsuit might have partially impacted

their decision to not hire judgment. How about that? That said, I put him safe because I am projecting a little bit

because I do think they'll win six games and then I think it'll be fine and I didn't find it to be I like Lovie Smith. We interviewed him at the combine.

He was a cool guy. I don't think there's a lot of sizzle to the hire and I feel like they would move if they felt like the organization

wasn't taking positive steps. I hear you, but I do think there is similar to Doug Peterson in Jacksonville, there is a feeling amongst the players and the people covering that team that's like, hey, we've got someone who knows how to be a head coach here.

Unfortunately, that's a reflection on David Cully, who seemed like a nice guy, but generally the players this year, you look at Lovie Smith, that's a legend in the game. It's a little different. It starts to say more about your organization if you have two one and done coaches. I think there's going to be hesitancy to be paying

both of those guys if you're the ownership. It's been done before. In fact, it's been done in the ATN era. I was looking at one of done coaches in the ATN era. In 2013, Rob Chedinsky with the Browns, 2016. Chip Kelly with the Niners, 2017, Jimmy Tamsula with the Niners, 2018, Steve Wilkes with the Cardinals, 2019, Freddie Kitchens with the Brown. How many of these guys did we interview? Are we behind this?

Well, you know what it is. When we went to that owner's meeting, it's like we get the first time head coaches. And it's like, then they're like a little more choosy as they get. It's like we got McVeigh. Well, we also got Andy Reid. Remember we got McVie? That's true. John Harbaugh?

He's just a mensch. We got McVeigh the first time we went to Rams Camp. Not getting them right now. No, we're not. 2020. The offer mentioned missing in action, but a millionaire, David Cully. Wow, almost every season. And David and Urban Meyer didn't even make it a full one.

He lasted 13 games before going back into whatever hole he was living in. All right. Now, it was just not good. that was a little strong he's a human too i get it but it was not a good look that was an epic meltdown of disasters i don't think any of those men's like um you know their their livelihoods in mind when he took that job just didn't seem like a good human vibe there and you're right he is a human but at least i think that could be debated like i think it's it's up for a discuss so second degree i have lovey i have frank rike for the reasons uh that mark said that you know listen

last year was a cataclysmic situation for the cults, the way that season ended. And somebody's head had a role, so it was the quarterback. If the season goes poorly again, they're probably going to come for the coach. And that's Frank Wright. Mike McDaniel, I have second degree for chaos theory reasons. Whoa. All right. I do.

First time head coach and second degree. Yes, I have it. They said it wouldn't be done. Two reasons why. Chaos theory behind the scenes with the dolphins. And also, listen, we all like that he's a different cat and he comes at the game differently and he connects with players perhaps differently.

But maybe what if that doesn't work? I'm not totally sold that the brand is going to play here. I hope it does because he seems like a breath of fresh air. But I need to see it work. And, you know, the fact that he doesn't have a quarterback, I totally believe in is an issue as well. So McDaniel, I have solid second degree just because I think this is such an important year,

both for Sala and Joe Douglas to show progress in the organization Woody Johnson is back from his UK ambassador thing and I imagine as he gets older if they have another dreadful season and the playoffless drought stretches to another year something could happen. I followed the team too long.

Woody leaving the UK has matched up pretty, you know, one on one with a lot of troubles for the UK just politically and everything. I'm just saying things have gone south since they miss Woody's leader. I mean, also, undoubtedly. Things haven't gotten like,

I would say great since he came back here either. It's a, it's just we're all just empires on the decline. I got Pete Carroll in second degree.

I had him first degree last year. Second degree this year. It's a slow process getting there. Ron Rivera I have in second degree and finally Zaddy, Mike McCarthy, who I really thought about the highest level. But ultimately, you know, I think second

degree. where he belongs. What do you guys think? Right. Yeah. I disagree with you there. I have them in third degree. I guess we'll just, at least for me, we'll go. You have Michael Garvey? I have Rivera and Zaddy in third degree.

I only have three names there and you can probably guess the third. To me, like I said, no coach comes back for a fourth season if they haven't made the playoffs. It's almost a rule. It has happened. There was one recently, but it's very rare. now technically Ron Rivera did make the playoffs this first year but they won seven games by the way not technically I think they won the division and hung in a playoff game

you can't say it didn't happen they went seven and nine so I think this is a team and I am projecting a little bit that could be in major trouble this year and if you go 7 to 9 7 and 9 4 and 13 or 5 and 12 the record to me matters more than you made that playoff run the first time around and I think Rivera would be gone. So to me, he's third degree because I think they need to win this year

and I think he's in a brutal situation. I have Ron Rivera in third also, but I do think he's different than some of the other people that we put in third before because he's brought stability to a really shaky organization during a turbulent time.

That said, if they wind up being the worst team in football, the floor falls out. My second, real quick, Kevin Stefansky, I just think that this season has the chance to ooze a lot of darkness and it might be

I think you're Kevin Stefansky, this went from being a really positive experience. You were coach of the year to you were overseeing something that you don't want to talk about every day. And yes, maybe you have a better quarterback on the field. But this was not Kevin Stefansky's issue. There's a lot of pressure on everyone in there. I feel like there's anxiety. And I could just sense that season turning really ugly. And it's an awkward time to talk about it, but there's a strong chance he'll have an inferior quarterback on the field the whole season.

Well, absolutely. I also love Cliff Kingsbury. I just put him in second because for what you mentioned, Dan, but I take it up. up a degree just because I don't care. I also don't care at all if a coach signed a new contract. I think most of these owners don't give any care about that at all. There's 80 guys floating out there. They don't like to throw away money, though.

They don't want to throw it away. But this season, if they really flatlined, I think Cliff Kingsbury's entire kind of program and what he's built around in the offense and the way it's faded the last couple of years, is this just a bad year. I think he'd be a scapegoat. I would think things would have to, and I have them in first degree, so I hear you, but I would think you would take like a meltdown for Kingsbury to go. Well, that's what I'm saying. If there was a meltdown.

But do you think that's what happens? I think it's possible. Like say the last five games of last season for the Cardinals. Right. Extend that over a season. That was a meltdown. They had one game where they sort of represented themselves. Oh, that playoff game was an atrocity.

Other than that win against the Cowboys, they would have lost five straight to lose the season. I think it was five a six. Maybe it was four or five, but either way, and they weren't competitive. That's why I have him in second degree, just like Mark here. He has signed through 2026 or else he would have been in third degree. Like if it wasn't for that contract, I would just put him in third degree. What was he signed through before the contract was signed? 22 maybe?

I think just this year. Oh, okay. So it was, so okay, I get it, but you can totally extend him one year. Like that's been done many times. You can totally extend them two years. Why do they extend them five years? Well, that kind of speaks to the point that they're probably not going to fire. to give him that's so much guaranteed money it's not under the salary cap but they have to pay him through

2027 i would but imagine it would take something gnarly imagine this you play the afc west which is going to be a problem and let's say you go one and three against the afc west which is not more let's totally feasible and then you're outcoached in three of four games against Kyle shanahan and sean mcvay the cardinals have no identity at that point if that happens that's a disaster i'm talking about if Like everything that you think about Cliff Kingsbury goes wrong. I think if they go 7 and 10 and it's a bad 7 and 10 and it's not injury-related. I think it would have been in offense. 5 and 12, 4 and 13.

You don't have DeAndre Hopkins for the first part of the season. That is going to cost them a lot. But I'm just saying if things went bad and you win six games and it's an unappealing six games or seven games out the door. I'm with you, Mark. That's why he would have been third degree for me if not for the contract because they've committed to Kyler Murray. And these two guys clearly have some issues. I mean, Kyler Murray and the organization clearly had some issues. When things got ugly, and that's when you learn about who's really tight,

they split apart. And the organization decided to keep them all together and get everyone paid. But it didn't feel like on the field, Kyler and Kingsbury were kind of like in sync. And then off the field, I think there was questions whether they're in sync. So to me, if they're 7 and 10, but they have a mediocre offense, I think he could be gone. So I have him second degree. I have Pete Carroll, I agree with you, second degree. I think they'll do fine, but the ownership situation there is just hanging.

At some point, it really looks like Jody Allen will sell the team. It's probably not in the next year, but it might be in the next year. And that kind of hangs over it. And then I have Frank Reich in the second degree. And this is where I would hire Frank Reich as one of my top six, seven coaches in the entire league as a play caller. but I feel like you have to be second degree if it's playoffs or you lose your job and I think he's absolutely at that point

if they didn't make the playoffs they're going to fire Frank Reich he all but said that to mercy which takes us to third degree which nobody wants to be and according to the chart last year

listen Zach Taylor survived that you can you can Nagy did not all three of us I just had Nagy and he did not. So here is third degree, and on my list, it's just the one man. It's the guy who's in a darker place than anyone else. It's Matt Rule.

Well, he's obviously on ours. Yeah. Doesn't mean he has no chip. Oh, there he is. It's back. Oof. But you could have just used the old sound clip. You didn't have to bring that man back in.

It's like you enjoy it, Dan. No, that's just what. it's like to be sitting on a seat that's literally on fire that's all i like it better than the swallowing of water it was lemonade lemonade ice cold uh yeah so rule obviously has had a very little success here um with the panthers and there's been you know he did impress mark that was a nice little feather it feels like a long time ago uh it was it was before he had coached and i mean i think that they, you know, you want to go season after season without finding a quarterback, you're going to sink in these rankings.

And he, you know, so where is he out? I'm trying to see through two seasons. He's 10 and 23, fired his offensive coordinator in the middle of last season. And, you know, he said some things in the press that have been put a target on his back a little bit. And now he's, you know, deciding between two former, you know, first round picks who were jettisoned by their previous teams. so maybe Baker Mayfield saves his job, but I'm not as high in that possibility where we are right now. I think Rule is just in a lot of trouble.

For an organization that has an owner of David Tepper, which we've heard time and time again, he's a guy that, like, wants results and wants to be relevant. Well, guess what? If they don't make a playoff run or win, like, at least eight games, I think one of the first things he does. It's like one of those things if Rule lasted the season, he would be the one like immediately is announced.

as soon as the season's over type vibe. And he's the guy that signed the seven or eight year contract when he was hired, which threw a lot of people off. And there was such high hopes. And I never understood that in the first place. It was partly because of the Jets that he just, there was two teams that really wanted him, and that's when you get.

But that wasn't exactly what it was. Like the rule wanted to pick his own coaching staff and the Jets had reservations, so they pulled out. I just mean there was a bidding. The agent got them thinking there was a bit. wedding war yeah they got a lot of commitment they got got that's what they got well and like matt rule and uh tepper when they first met had like a fish boil together at rule's house and

they just they got along like uh very swimmingly was it a shrimp oil shrimp or some sort of seafood i've read this interview sounds gross i read this interview on the athletic something like that clams or shrimp or something and it was with it was with joe person always in the dark just guessing what the humans are eating a fish boil it was from the the sea. I mean, fish boils are great. That sounds like something that would absolutely, I mean, a shrimp boil that sounds like a, it was celebratory. I totally take it back.

Fish boil is a culinary tradition in areas of Wisconsin and along the coastal upper great lakes. I'm going to look up while you discuss. With large Scandinavian pop. Oh, you were saying there was, oh, yeah, there's fish boys. It does sound kind of gross, a fish, a fish boil to me. Shrimp boil, excellent. So, Ruel had this interview with Joe Persson and the athletic. and I think it was intended to kind of show the human side of where he's at.

Like there was a lot of talk about his family, what he did on vacation, different restaurants. He's on a diet right now. If you've seen Matt Rule, he's lost a lot of weight. He's only, he said, eating eggs, meat, and vegetables, and no sugar. I mean, eating zero sugar just seems that's a toughie. That's, I could, I could, no dairy, no sugar. That doesn't sound fun. And there's just a lot of like, what's he binge watching?

And just a lot of like this stuff. I think to kind of humanize to the point of this exercise, like this guy's in a tough situation. But these are the types of interviews that happen in these types of situations. And I felt bad listening to him because ultimately he was very defensive talking about how he wants to be in Charlotte long term. That he essentially knows what the conversation is, that he loves the area, that his kids are in these great schools. that I don't want to be going back to college. People think he's just going to end up going back to college. Like, this is what we've done.

I think we've done a great job. We've built up this level of players and teams go in cycles, and that cycle came to an end. We've weathered the storm, and I feel like we're in the process, and it's going to show. And it's just sort of this, he's trying to convince himself. Because otherwise, it's freaking miserable. I mean, it is sad to have this thing hanging over your head

and your kids are going to school, and you've got to be worried about that. And I think he knows he's the guy. In Vegas, he is the odd-dog favorite to be that. He's the guy to be fired first. There's always one guy. And that's why I kept the list of just him a third degree because there's always that one guy, it seems like.

And nobody wants to be that guy. And it's probably a huge weight off of your shoulders once you finally do get fired because it seems like a tough place to live. I guess I do do some projection because the reason I didn't put McDaniel on my list at all, Adam's safe was like, I think two is going to be better. And if he makes two a bet. I believe in Mike McDaniel, so I didn't put him there. And I do have a feeling with that defense the way it is in Baker-Mayfield

and the schedule that they have, I just think they'll be better. I think they might be competitive. And I have them third degree, but I don't have them all by himself. That's all right. You like Tua and you think they'll do well together. But for this exercise, doesn't it, shouldn't it be at least, you know, taking into account that the owner met with. like Tom Brady to try to sell a Sean Payton as my head coach,

Tom Brady as my part owner slash maybe quarterback. Like, doesn't that feel like a possibility? You only gave me four categories, Dad. I had five before before he was in a little different. Met with Sean Watson as well. I mean, he's constantly seeking to upgrade coaching quarterback. He's a first year head coach. And the owner, you know, what we know about him and what's come out.

Like, I'm just saying you have him in the same category as Bill Belichette. That's why I need another category. First degree. I need another category. The car, it's warm. So even though I just gave a rule, by the waste of love, I put in McCarthy and Rivera there, partly because of projection too, especially with Rivera, that I think he's in a tough spot.

And I think McCarthy, like our buddy Frank Reich, is in a playoffs or else. And I think that's just a tough spot to be. And to me, I feel like the Colts and the Cowboys are both more likely than not to make the playoffs. And then they would be fine. But if they don't, I would think both of those. coaches would be fired, and I have a little less faith in McCarthy, so he's third degree. I have the same three people as you, Rivera, McCarthy, and rule. And I think McCarthy could make the playoffs and lose a playoff game if it was in ignoble

fashion the way that last year's unfolded. He could be gone then. And, of course, it becomes annoying to always talk about this, but the Sean Payton thing sits out there as a weighty pressure on Mike McCarthy. I almost thought of putting the chargers in first degree just because Sean Payton's associate told the Miami Herald that the three teams he wants the coaches. the Chargers, the Dolphins, and the Cowboys. That's what I'm saying about the upgrade.

An associate of Sean Payton told the Miami Herald in the dog days of July that the three teams he had circled were the Chargers, the Dolphins. And Mike McDaniel's totally safe to you. Well, now, okay, you guys have convinced me. Put him in first degree. You're right.

Okay, you got me. Just first. I'm in first. That's crazy. He's still a first year head coach. But I got it. It is crazy. But everything that's half.

happening Miami, kind of crazy. That's all. Plus I put Dennis Ow in there and hack it for that. Okay, you convince me. I can be convinced. I'm not inflexible. By the way, I did reach out to Matt Rule on this, and we actually got him on record. Someone help me. I'm still alive, only I'm very spadly burned. So that's all I got.

You're a winding preamble about the serious nature of this is crumbling. You're giggling while that was. playing also really goes against the original point, you know. A former guest of the around the NFL podcast or broadcast. I think it was on the network. Where Greg threw us under the bus, remember that? I lose track of how many times. Teddy, oh, yeah, I said you guys weren't a believer.

You could see his face, like his face just, you know, sucking on a lemon. You know, I was forever, like, in his corner rule, he's a New Yorker. And I asked him, Hamptons or Jersey Shore. And without even a hesitation, he said Jersey Shore. sure and I was like, all right, this is a dude. I want him to be successful. I did too. But I also, as a journalist, if I get a quote,

I'm going to play it on the show, that's all. That's it. He follows me on Twitter, so I'm like, I'm rooting for him hard. There you go. That would add for me as well if he did. I don't think he follows me on Twitter. I don't know.

Head coaches are, are they on Twitter typically? He is. I don't think he's active. He's not like, you know, throwing a ton of stuff out there. He follows you? Yeah. Nice pop.

You follow him? No. No, I do, of course. Of course I do. You followed him first? I don't recall how that went down. I'm going to throw a rule of follow and just see what happens. Same. He hasn't tweeted.

He hasn't tweeted since 2021. As I said, not an active participant, but monitoring. We're going to do this, Dan. We're going to take this show in under an hour. It's been a while. It is. How does it feel? It feels good.

It almost feels like I got a little time here to give James White, a shout-out to one of the greatest Patriots of all time, took that mantle from Kevin Falk as the third down back, and, of course, the legendary performance in the Super Bowl. Just happy retirement. It's too bad. A hip injury ended his career. Do you have a clip?

That's all. We do have some analysis. If you were real James White fan. From Mark Sessler after the Super Bowl that day. He's a top ten analyst. We have some good analysis from Mark. Sessie? Yeah, top 10 analysts.

You ready for this? I couldn't get a handle on what they were trying to do. I did not believe in the James White experiment out of the gate. And the Patriots kind of proved all that wash of negativity that was on Twitter about what they were doing. They proved it wrong. What's up with my voice there? It's like two in the morning after the Super Bowl.

I asked Sean to get a few clips. Maybe West would be involved. A few clips. No, just like give me some options from that day, if there's anything fun. And you know what? But my takeaway was we were all weirdly low energy, considering it was the greatest comeback of all time. But I think it was late, and that was probably deep in the show. But maybe, like, if you listen a little longer, you get a little West Easter egg at the end.

But none of them really popped. James White also, and I think he was that game, of course, against the 28 to 3, they don't obviously come back without what he did. I think 14 catches in that game. He was dominant. And also caused me, and I've mentioned this before, I had written my game story, you know, midway through the third quarter. And then James White starts going crazy along with Tom Brady. And it's just like paragraph by paragraph like the Polaroid and Back to the Future is just like having to be erased bit by bit. So I, you know, all the pre-writes on 283 were lost.

Little rough. I love James White. There's sort of like a cool like take like Damacheck had it too. And I like it's like they should have given James White an MVP that day. 14 catches like, no, I'm going to give it to the quarterback who led the greatest comeback. of all time. As much as I love to him. Another link to the Patriots glory years going away.

That's what the Patriots fans are going to enjoy. He'll be in the Patriots Hall of Fame. Into the wind. But that play is weirdly underrated. An incredible goal line run from a third down back who was tackled originally at the four-yard line by Dion Jones and someone else. And he makes the cut, bounces off two guys and then powers through. And I don't think anyone thinks of it as a great play because it's like,

was inevitable then. I think a ton of people think of it as a great play. It was one of the greatest goal line runs in NFL history. Which one that won the game? The one that won the game. Oh, they were gassed.

See, that's what I'm saying, but he broke three tackles. He barreled through a third down back. Do you remember the way the Falcons are playing defense? I'm just saying you never know as to Seahawks. Well, they were spiritually broken at that point. They were good. I agree with you on that.

I take nothing away from James White, but there have been many more impressive runs in football history. It was a, literally it won the Super Bowl. So that alone. Oh, the circumstances. That alone puts it. Oh, we're still under an hour. No.

Okay. By James Wayne. Just great job. No, no, you are. You got nine minutes. I know. All right. Good week of shows.

Thank you to everybody for listening. Next week, starting with Monday, we'll have a full rundown of all the preseason action in week one. I care so little about the preseason. I want to be at the show. So. We're going to have Patrick Claibon in. We tape this before the couple games on Thursday,

but we want a nice clean all the preseason games in one on Monday. Get to watch that Patriots offense tonight. So if you want an in-depth breakdown of all the action in week one of the preseason, all the superstars in the sandbox that is the NFL on the sideline watching the game, make sure you tune in to our one. I'm like actively telling people not to listen to Monday's show now. A weird move. A weird move that Dan is like rooting against.

ends of the show that he won't be a part of. Dan is also suddenly assigning Mark and Greg a ton of weekend work if we're going to be watching every single preseason. I would think if we're, if we are presenting Monday's show as an in-depth look at the first week of the preseason. I mean, that's not all we're going to do. I think there's got to be some game pass involved.

They think there's going to have to be a lot at Mark for you, a lot of NFL network because they do play a lot of the preseason games. I'm game for it. NFL plus. Yeah, I want to see some of these guys. That's great. These guys. That's good.

So hear the enthusiasm in the boys' voices. that is what you're going to get with Patrick Claibon. And I'll see you on Wednesday. Thank you to everybody again. Thank you to Sean Kelly. Good job, buddy. Not an easy gig, but he just stepped right in. Thank you.

Until Monday. Everybody have a great weekend. And remember, heed the call. I'm Marcus Grant. And I'm Michael Flawio, and together we host the NFL fantasy football podcast. Ready to dominate your fantasy league this season? Then you need the NFL fantasy football podcast, your ultimate source for player news, draft tips, and winning strategies. Whether you're a rookie manager or a fantasy vet, we've got the insight to help you crush your opponents.

Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Hey, everybody, Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Six, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else.

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