NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - 25 Players in 25 Years: Brian Baldinger on Nos. 15-12

Episode Date: July 7, 2025

Gregg Rosenthal is joined by NFL Network's Brian Baldinger to reveal numbers 15 through 12 of NFL Daily's Top 25 Players of the Last 25 Years. Gregg and Brian kick of this tier of players by talking about Pro Football Hall-of-Famer LaDainian Tomlinson at number 15 (0:50), followed by former Panthers LB Luke Kuechly at number 14 (10:20), Pro Football Hall-of-Famer Calvin Johnson at number 13 (22:10), and Pro Football Hall-of-Famer Joe Thomas at number 12 (32:13). Note: time codes approximate.  Don't miss any of NFL Daily's Top 25 Players of the Last 25 Years where Gregg is joined by ESPN's Mina Kimes and Bill Barnwell, Yahoo! Sports' Nate Tice, NFL Network's Steve Wyche and Brian Baldinger and broadcasting legend Kevin Harlan to break down the best NFL players since the turn of the century.NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Welcome to episode three of NFL Daily's 25 players in 25 years. Yes, we are talking about the. best players of this century. And there is no one I would rather talk to than Brian Baldinger of NFL Network. Baldi, you've been covering the league this whole time. I'm going back and watching some of the highlights. You're on the Fox calls for some of these guys. And

of course, you've been with us at the network. So a great perspective that I know you'll give. And I had to get you on a show where there will be an offensive lineman. No spoilers yet. But there will be an offensive lineman on this one. All right. Well, well, well done. You can't have a list without a few offensive linemen on. I know that. Let's just get right to it. We're not starting with the lineman, but we are starting with someone that I loved watching when I was starting my career out. Number 15, Ladanian Tomlinson. And the handoff to Tomlinson, left side, and he will gallop into the end zone. Charger fans are witnesses to history.

The kid from Rosebud, Texas. You're done good. I want to thank you for allowing us to witness your greatness. Wow, what a player, what a person. Who do we want to be? Y'all want to be champs or y'all want to be choked? From the left hash on second and four, a little pitch back to L.T. He's looking to throw towards the end zone.

Gates. Got it! Cutdown! That's why you're the greatest. That's why you're the greatest. Ladadian Tomlinson, one of the best to ever do. do it. He could run. He could catch and heck, you get him on the move. He could throw a little bit right there to Antonio Gates. Just an incredible career. There was a six-year stretch, Baldi,

where he goes three first-team all pros and three second team all pros mixed in there. And during that stretch, he played the running back position about as high a level as I've ever seen anyone play it. Well, you know, we've all got a chance to work with him, Greg. So we know what kind of personally. So you got to factor that in, too, because just, you know, the person, the quality of the person, the teammate, all that. But to give the, the God given talent, I mean, there's so many flashback memories. I, I remember Greg doing the senior bowl his year coming out of TCU. And I remember, um, we were going to practice and I'm doing the game for TNT. I'm walking down to practice with all the guys. And the first person I see is number five. It's Ladania Thompson.

I'll never forget it. Like, he just moved differently than everybody. So that, that was my first memory visually of watching L.T. Then I remember, you know, Marty Schottenheimer was his coach for a while with the Chargers. And I remember, you know, back when veteran players, even star players, used to play in the preseason grade, I'll never forget. Like, the first play of the game of a Chargers preseason game, they flipped it to LT.

And, you know, it was a touchback. You get the ball to 20-yard line. he goes 80 yards off right side. Like literally 80 yards. Nobody touches him. He lays the ball on the ground. Marty Schottonheimer waves him over to the sideline and says, you're done. Not just done for the day, but you're done for preseason.

80 yards, one play. We've seen enough. Let's get ready for the season. You know, I mean, he's had a year we had 100 catches in a season. You mentioned, you know, those first seven or eight years, Greg, he averaged 400 touches a year. like you you give any back in this league over the last 25 years 400 touches they were done the next year Jamal Anderson Sean Alexander deuce McAllister you go through the list of guys um 400 touches it like it really really breaks a running back LT just thrived on that volume of work that he got

especially in those first eight years right so so the stats are crazy and his first nine seasons he scores 19 more touchdowns than any player in NFL history. And so that's the meat of a guy's career. And even if you look at the whole career, touchdowns per game, only Jim Brown goes better than him. And you're absolutely right about saying that he did it year after year after year. I have to point it out because I was in the industry at the time.

He's got to be the fantasy football goat. I actually went and checked some stats. And he had to be like of this era, if you're given points per reception, he has the most fantasy points per reception of any of these running backs by so much. It's ridiculous because you're absolutely right. Like usually you have a season like that MVP season he had. You mentioned what a great person he was.

He won the Walter Payton Man of the Year and the MVP in the same season. And he expect some sort of fall off the next year. And then it's just like, nope, I'll just go for another 2,000 yards from scrimmage. He did that three different times. So it was the consistency and the complete game that he had. There's no question. about it. And, you know, just the way that they used them. And, and then you've got to talk about how he played in the postseason, whether with the Chargers or the Jets. He played very well

the postseason. Even after all that, that stuff isn't even mentioned when you just look at the regular season stats. But, you know, I just think that he had this, you know, I think all of the very great athletes have a different level of stamina than everybody else. Like I've played my share Hall of Fame players, and they just didn't get fatigued. And, you know, to see a guy like LT, you know, we can talk about all the stats. We can all read him, Greg, and he's worthy of all of those. But then, you know, he didn't miss games, and he came back to next week, and he didn't get tired out there, you know, in September, out there in San Diego, whatever the temperature was.

All of those kind of things mixed in as well. And then, like, look, he was the focal point of the offense. okay, if you want to stop a running back, go stop him. Well, everybody had a hard time, even if that was the focal point of stopping him because the way that he was built was a big part of his success. I mean, the size of his body from the waist down, it's enormous. Like he could handle the punishment. But then at the same time, he was built, you know, almost like an offensive guard

from the waist down on a 5'10 frame. But then he had incredible elusiveness and ability to, stop and start and make people miss. Like that was the other part. He could truck you, but he basically made you miss and then he outran you. I love that you brought that up in sort of how you first saw him move at TCU. Because I do think of the contact balance. Like he was very tough to get on the ground.

And I found a quote while researching this from Marshall Falk, who I would put right there, maybe even a little above LT. And the reason he's not on this list, we're cutting it off at 2000. some of his best years were before 2000 and otherwise he would be on this list. Ledanyan Tomlinson, by the way, is the highest running back on this list. But what Falk said that was so interesting to me was Ladenian can do everything that I do just as well. But the difference is if you want to give him the ball on the inside,

on a goal line situation, just to run over someone, he's even a little better than me at doing that. And look, Marshall Falk believes in his greatness because he, He was one of the greatest players of all time. So for him to say that about Ladani and Tomlinton, who was a big play waiting to happen when he got in the open field and was so not crafty, but so precise as a receiver, for him to say that, yeah, he had all that,

but he had a little more even with the power game. That really speaks volumes to me. What's interesting, Greg, is I remember, you know, his signature move at the goal line was to leap over everybody. And he learned that, and he watched Walter Payton, you know. So Walter Payton is the one that went up and over. He would protect the ball. He would go backwards over.

And like I remember one day we were doing, you know, something out in Culver City on his leap. And we had like these high pit, like these high jump pits out there for him to kind of emulate it, the whole thing. But his thing was, you know, a lot of guys are afraid to do that, dive over a pile at the goal line because he gets the ball knocked out. Well, he strapped the ball to his chest,

the way Walter Payton did. And, you know, that year when he scored 31 touchdowns, I forget the number, Greg, of runs that were, or touchdowns were from two yards in. But he literally could take off every bit from the three-yard line and go over the top to score. Yeah, and obviously a very smart player. But everyone on this list, it's funny,

because you could basically say this about, you're not going to get this far unless you're an incredibly hard worker and incredibly intelligent. But he had that feel of, man, he would get on the defender's so quickly. He would eat up that open space, and then when he would get in the space, he could make you move and make you miss in tight quarter. So Lorenzo Neal spoke about that, his longtime fullback that they don't really play football, Baldy, like they did back with Marty

Schottenheimer and those Chargers teams. Lo Neal never cared. He never care if he ever cared to bowl one time in a season. He was the eyes of LT, so many great backs in the history of this game. But, you know, that run with him. I mean, there's still best. friends, as you can imagine. But I mean, that run of those two guys, you know, eye formation, you know, lead back, all that kind of stuff that we all kind of, you know, went through. We all, I mean, I played a number of those type of systems. You know, we don't see much of that anymore, unfortunately. Yeah, the, the Chargers, that, that team and A.J. Smith had put together and with Marty, and then even after Marty, one of the great teams that didn't get over the top,

like Ladanian Tomlinson would do at the goal line. Didn't quite break through because of some of those Patriots teams. I'm glad he had that time with the Jets. He really enjoyed it. Said that was one of the best moves he ever made in his career, really enjoyed the back half of his career with the Jets. So salute to him. He was a tough man to take down.

One of the few players, I guess, historically, that I could imagine actually being able to tackle Ladanian Tomlinson in the open field is our next player. Number 14. Luke Keekeley. And it's intercepted, picked off 10, 5, right side, A.J. Klein, takes it to the house for a touchdown. That's Lou Kinkley that's there. That's a little Kikley. Very quiet.

Goes on to the field, flips a switch, lunatic. Hey, let's go. I'm all over him. Hey, we've got to go now, Chuck. Ain't nobody know you. Third and three, and here they come. It's Kikley, who gets the Manning back at the nine. Favorite blitz, sending these linebackers up inside, and Luke Keekley, just so fast.

Luke Keekley, he reminds me of Peyton Manning, a guy that is totally prepared, that is going to know what's going to happen before it takes place because he has studied so much. On second down, Romo looking to throw, has time, zings it, and it's intercepted at the 38-yard line. Keekley has it. He's going to go into the house. It's the second pick six of the game for the Carolina Panthers. Luke Kinkley, he was a problem. And Baldy, I know you're joining this series midway through, but I wanted to let you know. I wasn't thinking about guys who accumulated stats over a long stretch.

I wanted to pick the guys who I thought were the absolute greatest at what they did, when they did it at their very best. And to me, Luke Kikley defines that. It's not going to take him off this list to me that he retired when he was 28 years old, because every single day he was on the field in the NFL, he was one of maybe the best linebacker off ball that I've ever seen at what he did. Well, let me just put it in a nutshell for you, Greg. Like if you didn't block Luke Keekly, he made every tackle.

It was just that simple. Like he literally took the right angle, diagnosed the play. It was as if he stood in the offensive huddle, heard the play call, heard the quarterback explain the play to all 10 other players, and then he went and defended the play. That's literally how it looked. I remember, I mean, his last year in Carolina, I remember his final game he didn't play in his final game of the season.

It was against the Saints, I'll never forget. And I was an ounce in the game, and I saw him. And I wasn't sure if he was playing, not playing. But, you know, he had the injuries. And, you know, certainly they curtailed his career. But all I wanted, I had a show called Film Sessions that NFL Films produced. And all I wanted was Luke to come into the film room with me and explain the game.

Because when you sit down with them, I don't know that anybody can explain the game better than Luke quickly. And what he sees, what he studied, how he immersed himself in it, what he gleaned from it. I mean, there's an old saying at linebackers, two old sayings that are always true to a great linebacker. One, if you know the formation, you know the play.

So he knew the formation. He basically knew the play. And then it's always slow to you know, so that you can prevent the cutback the reverses and some of the other things. But, I mean, he was very difficult to fool. And he was very difficult to block. I mean, if you're a guard trying to cut him off on the backside, I mean, you didn't have

any chance. So then he ruined your run game. And so then you had to figure out, well, how are we going to move him? How are we going to block him? Like, do we go straight at him? Because he was 245 pounds. He knew how to take on a block, a lead block from a fullback or a guard. So he knew how to take it on and shed it, you know, and he was very good at that part of

as well. Yeah, in a way, he almost like broke the game because I love that having that Tony Dungey clip in there. By the way, our producers, Eric Roberts, Chris Bobona, just killing it. And Chris has the biggest smile on his face listening to Utah Ball. So to keep it up, Baudy, it's awesome. But he was such, I mean, he wasn't like a lightweight guy, but you know, under 240 pounds. That's the only reason why he didn't go even higher in the draft. And some people I remember at the time were surprised they took Keekly that high. They said, why would you take Luke Keakley that high when you have John Beeson, who was a fantastic player at middle linebacker, and you had Thomas Davis who had an awesome career, like an all-time Carolina Panther on the

weak side. And they just knew this guy was too good. And Beeson made the mistake of he got injured during his rookie year. Kikley's on the outside, and they put him on the inside. And he never moved. His entire career, Baldi, every single year, he was either a first team all pro, a second Team All-Pro or the defensive rookie of the year. Because, yeah, that first season, he got defensive rookie of the year. And then next season, he gets defensive player of the year. That was 2013. I don't even think that was his best year.

The best year I thought was when they went to the Super Bowl. And you heard the call at the very beginning of him making that pick six in the NFC championship game of him sacking Peyton Manning in the Super Bowl. I know they didn't win it, but it wasn't because of that defense. That defense led by Luke Keekely, to me, was an all-time defense that just happened to go against another all-time defense in that Super Bowl against the Broncos? Well, I mean, I think they were 15 and 1 that year. Cam was the MVP.

I mean, had a fantastic season. But I remember going to training camp. I think it was that year. And they trained at Wofford College, okay, in South Carolina. So, you know, it's a, you know, it's a 100-degree day out there. But they've got a, Ron Rivera's got a pretty significant offense, defense, scrimmage lined up for it. So I couldn't wait.

I'm out there. and watching practice. I mean, to watch Keekley go at it with Cam, you would have thought it was Sunday. Like, it was game day the way that they went out of. Like, it just, there was something about the competitive fire of that practice that I've never forgotten. And Keekley drove it on defense.

He was, and when you saw, you know, guys talking about him flipping a switch, you know, game day. And that's true because you get them, you know, an hour after practice. And he was back to me and it's just very reserved, very thoughtful, insightful. individual but on the field the emotions ran hot but you know damn game day was the test that you study all week you do all this film study you take all these notes um you and then sunday was the test like let's go do something about let's go you know let's go shut this run game down but it's way

more than that i mean his ability to read route combinations to know what's going on behind him um you know in the passing game and to get into those passing lanes um he might be as good But, you know, I mean, there's Ray Lewis. There's a bunch of guys. But, I mean, he might be as good as anybody from that department of understanding the passing game from the inside linebacker spot as we've seen. Yeah, I'm glad you said that because, look, he led the league and tackles while he was in the league. By far, he was the leader whose second tackles for loss while he was in the league. But his play in coverage, how he could adapt to how the NFL was changing was so awesome.

I actually have a clip. Let's play when he had two interceptions against Rome. in back-to-back plays. The second one is just amazing. Second and 13, Romo. He's intercepted by Kekley. Kekley inside the 20 to the 10 and to the end zone for another Panther defensive touchdown.

It's a defense that forced five turnovers against the Redskins. Thinking right up when they left off Sunday, first down throw. And it's Kikli right back with another one. Can you believe it back-to-back plays? Yeah, if you're watching on YouTube, you could see Luke Keeckley, what do they call, running the pole, you know, sticking with Jason Witten, a tight end running up the seam and catching a pass over his shoulder.

And if you're looking at the time, Baldy, it's the exact same time that ends one play, 236 left in the second quarter, and the exact same time that starts the next play. And Luke Kikley's just ending the game for the Carolina Panthers. Well, there was a Tampa 2 defense. The safeties are widening. and he's got, you know, number three down the seam. It happens to be Whitten. And, you know, Romo had a great relationship with Witten.

And most middle linebackers, I mean, you pick a great one. Brian Erlacker, a lot of guys are running that defense. But, you know, but for him to get his head around and to see them, but most guys don't get their head around. They play the play blind. They run the ball. If it's being thrown, they're looking at the eyes of the receiver, and then they're defending it when the receiver goes to play.

But he got his head around. and then got his eyes on the ball before he took it away. That shows you the level of coordination and athletic ability that it took because not many guys can make that play. No. And yeah, like I mentioned, he got that defensive player of the year early in his career. 2013, actually, when it wasn't, there wasn't like an obvious pick and I think everyone just looked around.

He was like, Luke Kigley is the best, like, defensive player in the league right now, even though he wasn't getting like sacks or any, like a ton of sacks, although he wasn't like a sneaky good blitzer when they asked him to do that. as well. I remember, Greg, Carolina went out to play the 49ers. Kyle Shanahan had gotten to San Francisco. He's running his offense with all the pre-snap motions and shifts and all that.

And they ran the ball down Carolina's throat. And so it was eye-opening. It was what it was. And because there was like three or four plays where they didn't block Kekley and he didn't make the play. And they literally took him out of the play with the motions and the shifts. And so I broke it all down. And so it's like Monday, I break it down.

I actually posted it, right? And how good San Francisco was in the motions and how they moved Kekly. And so I get a call on Tuesday, and I don't recognize the number, but it's Ron Rivera. And he's like, you know, Baldy, I don't usually watch your stuff, but my wife does. And I think her name is Judy, but I might be wrong. But anyways, he goes, my wife was watching it. She showed it to me. And she said, you should take a look at this, you know, Ron.

So Ron watches it, and he's like, he's like, he's starting to pick my brain because Kinkley never gets moved like that. Like that, he's looking at it like Ron himself, a linebacker. He's looking at it through linebacker's eyes. And he's now picking my brain, what did you see that we didn't see? Like, how did they, what, because he's like any coach, like how do we make sure this to prevent this from ever happening again? It was so rare that literally, Ron, it was forced to pick up the phone and call me,

to ask me what I what I saw in the game. Oh, that's an amazing story. And it's true, like seeing that would just absolutely stun you. And it's a credit to Kyle Shanion because I love what Tony Dungey said that he was like a quarterback. I think he combined the physical ability because, I mean, let's not sleep on. He was just a physical beast. I mean, he had all the speed and the power when he was tackling that you would ever want. He had 24 tackles in a single game.

And Panthers coaches swear it should have been 26 because that was the record at the They said, we got him down for 26, but they had them for 24. It became such a thing, Baldi. I don't know if you remember watching these games. Whenever anyone would make a tackle for the Panthers, the crowd would just go, Luke, but it wasn't even Luke. It was just, sometimes it was Thomas Davis. Sometimes it was just like, pick your other white guy.

It was just like they just assumed Luke Kekly made a tackle every single time. Yeah, well, I mean, it was easily done, although, you know, him and Thomas Davis, there was a pretty significant competition. Yes. About getting to that tackle and claiming that tackle. So there was a race to the ball. What are the best duos of my lifetime? And yeah, all these players, of course, the very best of the best, as Baldi is.

Let's take a quick break. We will be back with number 13. Back on NFL Daily's. top 25 players of the last 25 years. This is a man who initially was in my top 10. I moved him up. I moved him down. No matter where you put him,

you got to recognize he has the best nickname of anyone in the top 25. Number 13, Calvin Johnson. The left, looking deep, throw into the end zone, wants Calvin, well covered. He goes up, he makes the catch. Are you kidding me? Oh, Megatronin did it again.

Touchdown Detroit Lions. There were three Bengals draped on him, and Calvin went up and hauled it in. Fifty yards in a score. Now around, four yards away is Johnson's staffing first. There it is, Megatrive, into the record books. The single season, all-time, NFL receiving yardage record. I have never met a humbler, harder-working,

for King's team. Outstanding a player than you are. For sure, I go. Calvin Johnson, aka Megatron, a guy where if you just are adding up the all-pros, you know, three first-team all-pros, one second. Maybe not as much as some of the other guys atop this list. But when I thought about greatness, kind of like Kikli, even though the career was shorter, what could you possibly do with this man? 6-5-239 pounds and ran a 4-3-3-3.

to me, he's the definition of one-in-one. So I could have put him any lower than this. What do you remember most about Calvin Johnson's career, Baldi? Well, I mean, just the uniqueness of what you described. We've never seen a guy that size, weight, 40-time, leaping ability. We've never seen a guy with that many, that many identifiable features, okay? And then the passion for the game, the hands, everything that goes with it. So that's the first thing.

He led the league, if I'm not mistaken here, Greg, he has led the league in, I mean, he had over 200 targets in season, you know, when he caught 122 passes, led the league in targets, receptions. He's led the league in yards, obviously, almost 2,000, led the league in touchdowns. He led to the league in every department at one point or another, one year or another. But, I mean, he just compacted, you know, I mean, he retired at age 30. and, you know, he did all this before basically age 30. But I remember his rookie year, and I don't know if I guess. I was announcing a game for Fox, and there was that Lincoln Financial Field, and he went up for a ball. This is the only time he was ever, I ever saw him injured.

He went up for a ball. I don't know who the corner was, Sidney Brown. I'm not sure who it was. Shelton Brown maybe, but regardless, he goes up for the ball, and, I mean, he came down right on his back. And, I mean, he just laid there. And I think he only played like 10 games that year. But I don't know how many times while he was laying down. We showed the highlight.

There wasn't a single person on the planet that could have gone up as high as he went up to go get that ball. And unfortunately, when you're that big and you could jump that high, sometimes those falls hurt. They kind of took a pounding on him. But, you know, his ability, just like the play against Cincinnati and your B-roll right there, I mean, just to outjump three defenders right there to get the ball. there's a lot of those catches throughout his career where literally you could just throw it up and let him go get it and he could have taken that moniker, you know, always, never, never covered. You could just call Megatron that.

Yeah, he, it's just like there was nothing you could do with it. And you mentioned that injury and it did slow him down his rookie year. But for the most part in his career, he was durable. He missed a couple games here and there towards the back end. But by the end, you know, he basically was playing every game, every single. season and he went out on top. That does mean something to me. I'm not going to knock a guy that he didn't have his 30s when he was the second youngest Hall of Fame player ever when he's racking up yards, play after play. You mentioned that there were plays that he could just make

that no one else could. And yeah, he's jumping over guys in triple coverage. Let's actually watch another play. This is going to be against the Green Bay Packers in 2015. Looking for Megatron, and it's a touchdown, right over Sam Shields. How about the jump, gets the left toe in? Yeah, watch what he does to get that left foot down, holding on to the football. Yeah, you got that other hand back on it. That would have been, look at him, control it by the nose. That's incredible, because he just, he made other NFL players just look like regular mortals.

like he was an adult playing with a bunch of kids. He's Megatron. He's Megatron. He's from another planet, right? I mean, he literally was. And so great nickname. It's a great talent. You know, like the other Hall of Famer,

walking Hall of Famer and Barry Sanders. I mean, their careers were short. But in those compressed period of time, 10 for Barry, nine for Calvin, they were the best player at their positions. And it was hard to argue that. And so over that period of time,

that was the most lethal receiver in the game. And look, I mean, Randy Moss was, you know, was that guy. But, you know, Randy wasn't 6'5, 2.30, you know, 240. You know, he was certainly a freak athlete in his own right. But I thought, you know, Calvin Johnson's ability to take a five-yard shallow cross and turn it into a touchdown or a long run afterwards. And that stride of his was just, you know, there's something graceful. You know, it's like watching Secretary at run. You know, there's just something graceful about the athlete that he was and how smooth and easy he made everything look. Yeah, that's a great, it's a great comp for him because I don't know what else it would be,

but at that size, yeah, it was just kind of a beautiful thing to watch. And those three straight first team all pros, and he had a second one in there too, was actually towards the back end of his career. And you mentioned the record breaking season, but I'll spell it out. It was 19164 yards, still the all-time record for receiving yards in a single season. and he had 122 catches that season. And he just made things that felt a little impossible feel possible. So Baldi, it wasn't even in that season that he had his 329-yard game against the Cowboys.

That game had 14 catches. And that to me was symbolic of what that era was like for the Lions. They won that game 31 to 30. So all these catches that he's making, they needed every single one of those 329 yards because the defense usually was, wasn't there for them, and he had Matthew Stafford helping him out along the way. So it's not like he was in a bad spot. The organization let him down a little bit, but he did everything that he could absolutely

do to lift them up. No question about it. No question. I mean, there was not, I mean, I remember Matt Millen was there as, you know, the general manager. And, you know, they went through some quirky head coaches and all that. I mean, he survived all of that. And he was like, look, if you wanted to defend Detroit, you had to defend Calvin Johnson.

And so that's what the game plan was for defense. How do we not take Calvin Johnson out? How do we slow? How do we like at least limit him and try to contain him? Because we know he's going to get catches. And we know he's going to make some big catches. And he's going to force all kinds of pass interference calls and all that stuff. You know, but how do we take care of everybody else?

Because we know he's probably going to get most of his. Right. There's this famous screenshot of, I forget who it was, whether it was the Packers, just putting three guys on them in the red zone. They just were like, you can do whatever you want. Like, even before the snap, putting three guys on him before the snap,

that you're not going to score on us. How did you think he was, like, as a route runner and as a technician? Like, was there a part of his game that you thought was underrated in terms of that? But, or was it more just he physically just kind of overwhelmed everyone? I think he physically, just overwhelmed people. I mean, there's better

route runners than Calvin Johnson, but that's okay. When you have that kind of size and you can still come out of your brakes the way he came out of his brakes, you know, I mean, when you can still move like that, it doesn't really matter if you can turn guys around because ultimately there was always separation

because of his size and his leaping ability. And you know, some guys have to be great rot runners because, you know, they don't have the gifted size that Calvin had or that Randy Moss had. And so, you know, he just by lining up wherever they put him because they moved him everywhere. But just by lining up, you know, he had people in their back pedal, you know, before the ball was

snapped because the last thing you wanted was to get beat deep by Calvin Johnson. You'd give them a lot of stuff underneath, maybe try to tackle the catch. But you didn't want to be on the highlight reel on Sunday night or Monday morning with Calvin Johnson, you know, going over the top of you. Yeah. And some of it to me is just these, it's not just the numbers, but just the, the physical feats that few people could do. He has the most career games of 200 plus receiving yards. The only one that ties him is Lance Allworth.

So it's almost like a different generation of players. Calvin Johnson just felt like he came from another planet. And yeah, maybe not as many all pros as like Antonio Brown, who's not on this list or T.O. who we've already done on this list. But when he was at his absolute best, He also has a consecutive 100-yard game streak that no one else has. To me, he's one of one. He's Calvin Johnson.

And yes, he is number 13 on the list. Our last guy we will talk about with you today. Baldi is coming up next. Number 12, Joe Thomas. With the third pick in the 2007 NFL draft, the Cleveland Browns select left tackle Joe Thomas, Wisconsin. 10,363. That's how many consecutive snaps I had during my career.

That number 10,363 is special to me in a lot of ways. And not just because it's an NFL record, but because it shows that I was there for my brothers, 10,363 times in a row. Being an offensive lineman is all about being a servant and showing up for everybody else. Loyalty, consistency, doing something bigger than yourself, showing up for the man next to you.

Those are the values that I learned at an early age. And those are the values that I took on to the football field. Joe Thomas with one of the most handsome busts there in the Hall of Fame. They did a great job with that one. The hairs on point. And a player who won an all pro eight times, six times first team, Another two-time second team was the all-2010s all-decade team for the Hall of Fame and for pro football reference.

And that snap streak, Baldi, I think, helps define him. Not just that he stayed on the field, but that the repetitiveness, and you can explain this as an offensive lineman, to be excellent and so similar snap after snap and the discipline that takes, what impresses you the most about Joe Thomas? Well, before I get to the question. One of my great regrets in life is I was offered an opportunity that the shot you have of Joe there on the boat. That's where he went draft day. He went fishing with his dad.

And they offered me a chance to be with Joe on the boat fishing draft day with Joe. And they didn't know he was going to be a top 10 pick. We didn't know which number or whatever. He was a third pick. But like I could have been there with Joe. You got to be there. Baldi, where were you, what were you doing? You know, I mean, fishing just isn't one of my high priorities, Greg.

Like, I don't know, like it could be really boring if the fish aren't jumping in a boat. You're just like swimming with sharks, Baldy? You got to eat more action? So anyways, I passed up that opportunity. I regretted it. All the things that Joe said speaks to a brotherhood that really offensive linemen understand the good ones and the great offensive lines as a group. they all understand how important that number was because on a lot of those teams they were a bad team and they were amongst the worst teams for much of Joe's career and it would have been very easy

to say okay you know this this elbow is popping out of his joint right now I can take the Sunday off or I could go back to for my brotherhood like it's he'll never tell you how many injuries he played through or played with in order to keep that streak alive that's number one but the consistency see is what everybody strives. That's what repetition is all about. So that when you, it's, you know, you want to have that muscle memory so that regardless of who you're playing against, you're going to, your technique is going to be the same. Play in and play out.

No matter what happens on the play. Like you just flush it, you go to the next play, you do a consistently great job, and you string together 70 great plays during the course of a game. And that's the goal of every offense alignment. You could have 69 plays, but the one play where you give up the quarterback sack or the quarterback hit or a hold on a big play, that's all you think about the whole night into the next day is that one bad play. And I think Joe took that just sitting down in the film room with him and watching him talk through techniques. You think you know the game. You think you understand the game like a lot of us do.

And we work at it. We all work at it. But when Joe explains the game to you, it goes to another level now. And things that you might just take for granted, the set, the hands, the hand placement, you know, in the run block, the aiming point. All these things that kind of just sort of looked like they run together, they never just ran together to Joe. There was ultimately a purpose and a reason behind everything he did on the field, even though so much. much of the game is kind of random and kind of just, okay, let's just play the play. Like, you can't control it. But so much of it was what happened during practice to prepare for those moments. Yeah, there's something, too, about a guy who comes into the league, they actually have some

success right off the bat with Derek Anderson, that team that went 10 and 6. And then after that, it's just brutal. It's an incompetently run franchise who happened to make an absolutely great pick at number three. That was a great draft, and they made the right choice there with Joe Thomas, but just made mistake after mistake, and it got worse and worse. And to show up, Baldi, and you've been in a lot of different NFL locker room, some great ones. I'm sure you were into bad ones. I don't know, but like speak to, I guess, what it meant for a guy like Joe Thomas to be there

for everyone that came through that organization over the 10 years that he's there and have it as an example of how to how to do something the right way, no matter how much they're blowing it from above in terms of how they're running the team. Yeah, I've looked at Greg. I played on 1 in 15 Indianapolis cold season, miserable.

But I try to do what Joe did. What happens with a guy like Joe is it's very easy when you're 1 in 10 and you're just playing out the street. It's very easy to cut every single thing short all week long. Practice, treatment, lifting, you know, extra studying. It's very easy to cut all that stuff short. Or when the wheels fall off during the game to just start looking at the clock.

And I think Joe just never did any of that. I think Joe prepared exactly the same as if they, instead of being 3 and 13, they were 13 and 3 and they're going to the play. I don't think the preparation ever changed. And so if you're a teammate of Joe, a young Joe Plotoneal, you know, some of these guys that came through Cleveland, you know, with Joe, like, at least you got to see what a real pro looks like and what it's supposed to look like. And maybe that, maybe that guy that might shut it down or not go at it quite as hard.

And watching Joe, maybe that makes you want to emulate him even that much more. I love that you mentioned that because Thomas's legacy to me was a part of my thought. He's the highest offensive linemen on this list. And you could pick a lot of players. There's so many great players. But Betonio, I'm forgetting about who else was there that was really great. I'll think of it in a second. But it also struck me.

Miles Garrett's talked about it. He's on this list. He's at the back end. And he's a guy whose first season was Owen 16. And he saw what Joe Thomas was doing in that season. and as an example. So that's in terms of the way he played in Cleveland. But do you think he's had an impact Joe Thomas that is as a technician to the players

and the position that came after him? Oh, no question. No question. When I did a film study with him, we went back, you know, he was a shot putter in high school. And, you know, his kickstart was basically what a shot putter does. And he just basically took the physics of throwing a shot puttut. Both hands were braced on the inside knee, his right knee, his left foot was back,

and it was just like we did in NFL films where we basically shot him shooting a shot put and then dropping back to, you know, I saw, you know, one of the clips that he had was against, you know, Terrell Suggs was one of the great pass rushers and one of the great matchups during his tenure as the left tackle, going against Suggs, you know, twice a year. So there was a carryover from shot putting to what he developed as a left tackle. But, I mean, Lane Johnson has copied him that same start that Lane has and his strive to be as consistent with that start. He did that.

Jason Peters learned that from there, Jordan Milada now in Philadelphia. They've all basically watched Joe Thomas and they copy it. And that's just a couple guys. I'm just around those guys more frequently in Philadelphia. you. So I know how hard they studied him. But I would tell anybody that if you wanted, because I, you know, you get ready for the draft. Greg, you start watching these kids and studying them. Like I did Joe Thomas coming out of Wisconsin. But, you know, what you're looking for at any level is consistency. And so what I'll say to if a young tackle asks me what I think, I go, man, your set has to be more

consistent. Like it's, you're changing up all the time. You're laying. You're not hitting the right mark. like you could literally put a blindfold on Joe Thomas and he would be able to hit that mark his hands, his punch, where his hands landed, what the mark, what the aiming point was. Like he rarely ever missed. And that was a big part in the past game. In the run game, it's interesting, like he had this thing, Greg,

where if he was on the ground, nobody was allowed to pick him up off the ground. Like he couldn't get up off the ground. He had to, off his back. So he had to roll over on. to his stomach and then push him stuff up off the ground. But you'll go and see it. Like he talked about it and joking like he would never let anybody pick him up off the ground. You know like guys are just helping a guy up like that. Come up off. Go along. You're diving at somebody's legs and you're

cutting them, whatever. Like he that was one of his little pet peeves. Like nobody's picking me up off the ground. I'm getting myself up off the ground. That's amazing. And yeah, to me he's the ultimate example of a guy who he's talked about it for offensive linemen. He had to eat so much. And he was, he, he focused so much on his career, his study habits of all the past rushers and studying everything was amazing. But he talked about how much he had to eat and that it was, it was unnatural for him. And he was, he's the, he's the guy who the second his career ended, suddenly three months later, he lost like 50 pounds and he looks like a totally different, amazing, crazy human being?

Well, that happens to a lot of guys. You can go one or two ways. You either lose the weight or you gain it. But most of the guys that lose it like he did, they lose it quickly because all the things that, you know, trying to cram 10, 12,000 calories into your body, like you got so tired of doing it and making sure that otherwise the weight, especially in training camp,

where you're hearing two days back in those days, you know, the weight would fall off if you didn't cram 10,000, calories. So the first thing you do is, man, thank God I don't have to overeat anymore. And so just the fact that you're not just doubling 12,000 calories into your body on a daily basis, your weight just naturally starts to go back to where it should be normally. So it happens to a lot of guys. And I didn't think Joe was going to be any different than those guys. So only six players in the history of the NFL made the pro bowl, by the way, each of their first 10 seasons. It's a wild list. It's Aaron Donald, Joe Thomas, Barry Sand,

Sanders, Lawrence Taylor, and then we're going way back to Mel Renfro and Merlin Olson back in the 60s. So that's a hell of a list to be on. And so is this one. I felt a little out of my depth with the offensive lineman. So I hope I did you guys proud. I got Walter Jones at the back end of the list. I have Zach Martin because I thought we needed to get an interior guy. And he, in terms of him compared to other guards, felt so ahead of the game. So he's in there around 17, so many other great players could have made the list, whether it's Tyron Smith, they thought about Trent Williams, your guy, Lane Johnson. They all would have been worthy, too. So I hope I did your position proud, Baldi, and that you're okay with my selections.

Yeah, I'm okay with it. Yeah, I'm more than fine with it. I mean, you know, there is, you know, one particular left tackle in Baltimore, Greg, that you might want to consider. I know he's drafted. I know he's drafted in 96, so I don't know if that qualified. you know, the fact that, you know, he spent the early part of his years before the 25 year cutoff right there. Jonathan Ogden had such an amazing career

even after 2000 that he did get strong consideration. And if you were counting him from 96 on, he would probably be first. I would give him to you. But he is someone who came into the league. He was so good right off the bat. Like maybe the best part of his career

was his first five, six years, although he was something. It helped me take the easy way out, Baldi, sometimes when they had such great years before 2000, because it was painful. It was like picking between children here to knock these guys off. So that helped me take Ogden off because I was like, let's give it to the guys who were almost entirely in this century. The one thing, Greg, about Joe, and what you mentioned about the consecutive streak of, you know, pro bowl's form and that rare, you know, that list that you mentioned of six or five other guys. you know, I'm not saying that the voting is always, you know, popularity contest, but it's kind of easy just, you know, who's the best left tackle on the best team?

Like you kind of go in that direction sometimes. And, you know, you're old 16. You're really going to put the left tackle on an own 16 team in the Pro Bowl. A lot of players wouldn't vote like that. But that's the respect that he garnered. Even we know that the team and the organization was poor for long stretches of his career. yet the attention that he still received consistency that he played at

is still a sign of great respect from his peers and from the fans that vote and the coaches and personnel people that all involved with voting. Yep, and I tried to put a little more weight on the all pros, and he dominated with that. And actually, PFF, which, you know, it's not perfect, but it's interesting

because they're certainly not caring about what the record is or anything like that. And two of their best four seasons, of all time just by their total score from a tackle. Two of their best four seasons ever. Any player, any season were by Joe Thomas, just shutting people down in a great division, by the way, for pass rushers. So I feel good about them. We're about halfway through this list. It's going to be tough to top you, Baldi. I would just like to spin the dial and just hear like press a button and hear Baldi stories on all 25 of these guys. you know, you sort of accumulate this stuff over years. But, you know, a lot of these things that just get triggered by the conversation, Greg. So I'm happy that you invited me in.

Got a chance to talk about, you know, four of these great players. Many of the players I've studied, you know, week in, week out on film. So they're pretty, still pretty fresh in the memory bank. Appreciate Brian Baldinger. And, yeah, he'll be all over the airwaves for NFL Network and his podcasts in the upcoming season.

Our next episode will be our fourth edition of NFL Daily's top 25 players in the last 25 years. We're going to be joined by Yahoo Sports NFL analyst, Nate Tice. There might be a certain player that he was a ball boy for coming up on that episode. We'll see you then. Hey, everybody, Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks.

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