NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - 25 Players in 25 Years: Steve Wyche on Nos. 20-16

Episode Date: July 2, 2025

Gregg Rosenthal is joined by NFL Network Chief National Reporter Steve Wyche to reveal numbers 20 through 16 of NFL Daily's Top 25 Players of the Last 25 Years. The duo starts with Cleveland Browns DE Myles Garrett (0:52) at number 20. Then, Wyche and Rosenthal pay respects to one of the best offensive guards in football history, longtime Dallas Cowboy Zack Martin (12:26), at number 19. Martin is followed by Pro Football Hall of Famer Julius Peppers (21:50) -- the fourth most prolific sack artist in NFL history -- at number 18. For Peppers, the duo takes a look back at an incredible two-play sequence that exemplifies the type of freak athlete Pep was over his 17 year career. The last non-QB to win MVP, running back Adrian Peterson (31:58), comes in at number 17. Wyche shares a classic story of the first time he met Peterson, and other anecdotes about his incredible rushing career. Future Hall of Fame Quarterback Drew Brees (44:06) rounds out this tier of players at number 16. With Brees being another player Wyche covered extensively in the NFC South, the veteran reporter shares story after story about the greatest player in New Orleans Saints history. Don't miss any of NFL Daily's Top 25 Players of the Last 25 Years where Gregg is joined by ESPN's Mina Kimes and Bill Barnwell, Yahoo! Sports' Nate Tice, NFL Network's Steve Wyche and Brian Baldinger and broadcasting legend Kevin Harlan to break down the best NFL players since the turn of the century.NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the 6th, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else.

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Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Welcome to NFL Daily's top 25 players of the last 25 years. I'm Greg Rosenthal here in the Chris Wesley. podcast studio, alongside one of my favorite people to talk ball with the man, Steve Weish, who has been covering this league nonstop for the last couple of decades, mostly here at NFL Network. Are you ready to count down from numbers 20 to number 16 on this list?

I am. This is such an amazing concept. You know, when you talk about like impactful players, whatever in this list you came up with, stylistically. I mean, the fact that you pulled this off, I think is great. Well, don't get ahead of ourselves. here. We've got to make it great, but no, we had a great first episode with Meena Kimes. I'm looking forward to talking these five players today. Let's get going.

Number 20, Miles Garrett. Burrow to throw, here comes Garrett. There it is. Miles Garrett. Welcome to the 100 Club. He takes down Joe Burrow, 100 career sacks for the future Hall of Famer.

But yeah, you know, I wanted to, you know, making known that I'm, you know, I'm the guy, I'm number one, you know, as defender. That was a statement I was intended to make, and I think I made. He's got to try it from 60. It's blocked. Ball loose, fight for Denzo Ward picks it up. Ward running across the Indianapolis, 30. That was Miles Garrett that blocked that field goal.

Jumped right over. He jumped right over the center. Oh, man. He went Superman, no contact. They do uniquely that maybe other teams don't. I mean, that maybe why you're off the trouble the way that you'll have. We have Miles Garrett. That's different from everybody else.

Under pressure from Miles, ball out. Fight forward to the end zone. Miles got home again. Who's got it? Browns do touchdown. Miles Garrett is single-handedly taking over this game. Miles Garrett, number 20 on the list. You heard the voices of many people there,

but some of our friends, Patrick Claibon, with a great voiceover, of course, but also Andrew Siciliano. You heard Joe Burrow talking about what's the difference between facing them and other teams. Yeah, here's the difference. It's Miles Freaking Garrett. I'll get into all the accomplishments of why he is on this list.

You might notice if you're listening. The back end of the list is heavily weighted towards some of these current players. It's going to get different soon. But I just realized Garrett already has the resume of an all-time great. Oh, yeah. I mean, there's so many different ways we can go here. But first off, the fact he has 102 sacks at eight seasons.

I don't think people understand how hard it is to get a sack, especially when you're like the guy on the defense, when people are double teaming you, you saw some chips on the play right there. Oh, yeah. It blew right through him. Plus he's 6-4-275, right? He's built like a sleek defensive tackle.

By comparison, T.J. Watt is 6-4-250. So this is a massive human being, doing some of the things athletically that he does, but the way that Cleveland also, especially Jim Schwartz, who's come in the last couple of years, and moved him around, that's helped him. Because he's got 60 sacks the past four years. But here's the biggest part which shows his dominance.

Right. Like, he does not play on a team that gets 20-point leads and is forcing the other team to throw the ball 45 times a game. His team is usually trailing. He's had two winning seasons and played on an 0-16 team. Right? So his team is usually trailing. So his opportunities to get to the quarterback are probably far less than some other great pass rushers like a Dwight Freeney, someone like that, whose team stake leads all the time.

Like when you talk about impactful greatness, this is a dude who is winning regardless of circumstance. Yeah, I think of the players that are going to be on this list, who have been on this list, including Garrett, who have done it in the toughest of situations. I think you have to be that much better, not only as a player to get the, attention from the national media to get those all pros, but also to stay strong as a man, as a player, to continue to chase greatness. And yeah, just to go over some of the accomplishments off the top, four first team all pros and two second team all pros in seven years. He had that defensive player of the year award from a couple years ago where he was just taking over game. But he has two other seasons where he was in the top five.

Only two players in NFL history have had more consecutive 10-sac seasons. Those two players are Hall of Famers, Reggie White and John Randall. And that number is still growing. Miles Garrett, I think, is going to continue getting those numbers. I don't know if, I mean, man, if he hasn't peaked, that's something else. But he and T.J. Watt, who we also hit in the first show with, Meena, they were a little mind-blowing for me to realize like, okay, they are still playing, but actually, if you look at their resumes and stack them up against some other

Hall of Famers, they are already among the all-time grade. So I felt like it would not be doing a service to Miles Garrett to just diminish him just because he's in the middle of his career. No, you can't do that. This is going to continue to grow. It's going to be a first ballot, Hall of Fame type guy. Like seven straight seasons with double-digit sack. on the teams he's played on, remember, an 0-N-16 team,

that is insane. He's very good against the run. You saw him block that kick right there. Remember the last couple of years? He started moving him over the center a little bit. He is still one of the best athletes in the NFL at that size. Again, it is just, there's nothing you can really do except try to go away from him. He knows it, and he still makes plays.

It is so hard. like in college i played the same position as this guy 60 pounds lighter but it is so hard to get a sack in the NFL when think about quarterback's dropping back 400 times a season and getting sacked 32 times over like that's a hard thing to do and he's getting double digit seven years in a row yeah and he's also you know he he racks it up since he's entered the league third and tackles for lost second in quarterback hits so it's not even just the sacks which are just outrageous. He's the first ever player, by the way, to have 14 or more for four straight years. So it's the consistency. I love what you said about the weight. It is crazy. He actually

weighs more 275 than what Aaron Donald said he was playing at at the end of his career. And two of the all-time greats, obviously, but a guy who when he came out, Miles Garrett, and I went back to check some of the coverage at the time was just a no-brainer, number one overall pick because you look at them. And yes, all these players on this list have a discipline and a work ethic and an intelligence. But a lot of them also are just incredible athletic specimens. And I do think of Miles Garrett. Oh, he's one of one. Towards the very, very top of that where if like you are creating a football player in a lab, it is Miles Garrett.

It's just, it's kind of a ridiculous person to be next to. You've been around him. I've been around. Okay, let's hear it. First of his arms are like 30 inches big, but we see the videos of him, he's got like 80 pound dumbbells in each hand doing 36 inch pliometric jumps.

Well, that's him jumping over the center. So that field goal block that he had a couple years ago, that colds game was. Why does he have to hold this by shoulder fall off? But it's funny when you talk about him coming out, because I remember getting a couple phone calls. and Don Blackman, the former Patriots linebacker, long-time NFL coach, father of our Tiffany Blackman, our former colleague Tiffany Blackman,

he called me one day. He was just down to Texas A&M scouting. He's like, Steve, this guy is going to completely change things in the NFL. You know, I heard from several other people, Don Blackman, who was a heck of a player and a longtime great coach himself, the way he raved about Miles Garrett, you're like, no way he's going to live up to this hype. And again, playing that position, registering the number of sacks he has

on a team that plays with no leads. Stunning. He is that great. He's the youngest player to get to 100 sacks. He's been on PFF's first team All-Pro five straight years. And I actually find PFF's rankings interesting, if only because they're not as consistent as the All-Pers, because it's just in theory on their numbers. And yet the numbers even have him first each and every season.

That quote we heard from Garrett was from a game this last season. And I don't think of 20, 24. as Garrett's best season, still was one of the very best players and came in third in defensive player of the year. But, you know, it wasn't like his very best. But that was a game against the Steelers in T.J. Watt. And he shows up and he says, I want to be known as the best edge rusher. So he shows up. He has eight pressures, three sacks, a force fumble and something else on Thursday night football. Snow globe game. Because it was a big game. And that does make me think like, man, imagine if he was playing in more big games. Because when he's had to get up,

he's gotten up for him. I mean, imagine if he played on a team like the Bengals, right, that could score 38 points in a game or teams are chasing them or something like that. The numbers would just, when you look at the great pass rushers, even guys going back as far as Deacon Jones and they didn't record sacks, he played with Roman Gabriel, you know, quarterback who's an MVP team to score points that way. So, you know, he's one of those like as great as he is.

It's almost like a what if. And you have to think about a former Cleveland Brown and Joe Thomas, played 11 seasons. never went to the playoffs. He's only been to the playoffs twice, Miles Garrett. Well, Joe Thomas has a chance to be on this list. I'm not doing any, I'm not doing any spoilers early, but the Browns, I will say,

have over-indexed on all-time great players. And you mentioned the 0-16 for listeners who might not be aware. Yeah, that was Garrett's rookie season. His only year he didn't have double-digit sack. But also, like, what a welcome to the NFL moment. Poor Garrett, poor Deshaun Kaiser going out there. Oh. You know, not winning a single game.

And, you know, it's interesting. That draft, he goes number one overall, is a terrible top five in hindsight. Yes. Mitchell Trubesky, two, Solomon Thomas, three, Leonard Fournet, four, Corey Davis, five. I have never once heard anyone say that the Browns made a mistake for drafting Miles Garrett in a draft that had Patrick Mahomes. You always give the grief to the 49ers, for instance, who. needed a quarterback that year and the bears especially who took mitchell triskey but no one ever says well how come the browns didn't take but patrick because like you took miles garrett and ultimately like

that you have to be pretty great for no one to ever bring that up you know what browns fans are loving you right now because that's one of the few times when they're like wow they didn't make a mistake right but now you could say they did but no one no one knew uh who Patrick mahomes was going to be there was a little story and i i know you're intimately involved with the hall of fame i'll leave you with this on Miles Garrett. He was there with his teammates in the preseason a few years ago, I think playing the Hall of Fame game.

And they all went and did a tour. Right, when Joe Thomas went in. And everyone said afterwards, it was like being a kid in a candy store. It was amazing, except for Miles Garrett. And Miles Garrett stayed on the bus all by himself while the team toured the Hall of Fame because he said, I'm not going in there

until my bust is going in. That's what I'm talking about. I heard Steve Smith did the same thing That's that's built different That's someone with like a certain sort of confidence And I think it is really cool That Garrett is going to be a brown And if it's not for his whole career

It's going to be for the next handful of years Two and he's already like I said The youngest player to reach 100 sacks He's been a league a long time He came in at 21 But he basically is It's going to seem like his whole career is with the Browns Hopefully the whole

And he's made a lot of money from the Cleveland Browns as well Yes did not take a discount on that salary. Know you're worth people. Miles Garrett definitely knows it now because he's number 20 on our list. All right, let's move to our next guy. Number 19, Zach Martin. Zach Martin, I always like to watch his film because he's been doing it for a long time and he's such a technical player, like his technique and his effort, make him stand out. Just his past set, he always seems like he's in a right position.

If somehow he does get caught, he's always recovering. He's in a good base. Anybody doubted a nickel of Zach Martin's worth. He's saying he's costly kicking, kicking ass, and that's just what he does. Zach Martin, who's been one of the best in the NFL for a long time. Knows all the tricks of the trade, savvy, and got technique to go with it. That's a tough combination. Zach Martin comes up huge on this play. Football is such an amazing sport

because we can go through who are the best players these last 25 years and we can have Miles Garrett who to me in terms of pure athleticism strength and speed that's what you think about

when football players is number one of who I would think of and then the very next guy on this list is a guy in Zach Martin who we don't even know a play to pick

as like his highlight tape because he's an interior offensive lineman who they said quote unquote wasn't athletic enough to play at left tackle, they move him inside

to guard. And when I looked at his resume, Steve, I just had a hard time not putting him on this list somewhat as a representative for guards and interior offensive lineman, but also just because he is that good. He's a great player.

I mean, when I saw his name on there, I mean, I don't know if you have a committee, if you did this single-handedly. I did it by myself. Bro, like this is a stroke of genius, a guard who could be a first bout hall of famer. I mean, guards usually have to wait. Great guys like Will Shields and waited for years.

And maybe Zach ends up doing that after retiring this past March. But it's funny when you think of Zach Martin and all this greatness and this and that. What's the first thing that people talk about? They link him with Johnny Mansell. Right? Because remember in that draft in 2014, people

were connecting Johnny Mansell because of the flash. Jerry Jones said a lot of positive stuff about him, a Texas guy going there, and they needed a quarterback. And so they're okay, they're taking Johnny Mansell, Johnny football, right here, and they draft Zach Martin. And you talk about, it's like the amusement park ride where you're spinning and then the floor drops out. Everybody was like, what?

Zach Martin when they could have had Johnny Mansell. This might go down is the best pick that they've had in the past 25 years in the draft. And the fact that it was such a surprise and they get such a great player. I mean, seven first team all pros, nine pro bowls and he played about 11 years. Mm-hmm. You know, I mean, that is, like, we're talking, I keep saying, you know how hard that is,

especially in today's game, over the past five years when defenses have been like, we've got the singular great edge rushers. Like we talked about with Miles Garrett. Now we're blitzing guys up the A-gaps, right? That's what the guards have to do. They have to eat that, right? When linebackers, Fred, guys, Fred Warner and whatnot are coming with two or three yard, full speed, and he just locks them up.

And so we can talk about all the Dallas is a strong running game with Ezekiel Elliott, the protection for Dak Prescott. When you look at a guy who did so much and absolutely made them look like the smartest people in the world for drafting him over Johnny Man's, I don't know Johnny had something to do with that, but what a

brilliant stroke by the Cowboys. Okay, I'm so glad you brought that up because I would have forgotten it. The funny thing is, you want to give Jerry Jones credit, right? Okay, they did take Zach Martin. Jerry Jones actually got on the podium after the Zach Martin pick and said,

we could have taken Manzell and that would have paved the way in terms of the attention that we're getting, the box office, our relevance. He literally used the word relevance for the next decade. But we took this other guy. He had to be convinced into taking Zach Martin. He really wanted Johnny Mansell

and is obviously one of the best decisions the front office ever made and they got Jerry Jones, even though they got the pick right, don't say that you wanted Mandel because the other guy could turn into a Hall of Fame so you mentioned the first team all-proes

nine in 11 years total seven first teams he basically was an all-pro every single year he was healthy healthy right the only two years that he didn't make it were his age

30 season in 2020 first time really he ever got injured before that he essentially almost didn't miss a snap missed a couple one game I believe, from injury in 2018. So he was always out there. In that entire time, the seven first team, all pros,

he had exactly seven holding calls. I mean, if that, that's the thing. I went through, and I did not have Martin on my initial list, and I went through everything in some of his numbers, and then some of the things I read from different offensive line analysts who know the position even better to meet, really believe that the gap between Mark, and the next best guard of his era

was maybe bigger than the gap at any position between any players. So that's hard to disagree with that. I mean, it's really hard to disagree with that. He's one of the most dominant. We can talk about interior, whatever.

He's one of the most dominant linemen over the past 30 or so years for what he did. Because again, the game has changed. You got all the A gap action, right? You've got the Aaron Donalds and guys that the defensive tackles who are making big money now,

a lot more than guards. You know, that's where they recel. And nobody beat him. But the seven holding calls, there was always this great stat. Like, I forget, you know, what is the, oh, the Cowboys, they have seven first downs on that drive. Oh, that ties just as many holding calls as Zach Martin. Right. It is career. And only 21 total penalty. So that includes false starts and any, anything else. And if you compare that, and it's not totally fair, but if you compare that to other all-time greats on the offensive line and tackles, interior, he really did stand out. And they say, you know, everything I read about

him is, is his footwork, it's his technique. And I think with all offensive line, it's the ability to stay so mentally engaged and so smart that you can do it each and every single snap without making anything. Well, the fact you think you call on holding is, right, is the brilliance of technique. Because, you know, it's all inside hand controller to leverage a guy this way or that way. So you're grabbing, right? Cloth control is what they call. You're in here, grab. being to, and the fact he never got caught, man, he stayed in here. You know how strong you have to be? Whether it's upper body or you're squatting

and you've got this type of technique. Like this dude, when I saw him on it, I was like, Greg Rosenthal was that guy. Okay. Well, offensive rookie of the year, his first year, he got a number of votes, which is really saying something because he's a guard. You just don't see those guys get

offensive. He was first team all pro as a rookie because he came in and if you'll remember that 2014 Cowboy season was Tony Romo's best season. He got MVP votes. Their offense went to a whole another level. I think it was DeMarco Murray won the rushing title. It is not a coincidence that Martin comes in. They get two more rushing titles, by the way, with Martin there, with Ezekiel Elliott. So Romo, I read some things that he said about Martin. He said he's the only

player he's ever seen that when he came on to the team as a rookie, I mean, he was like, not only the best player at his position, but he was maybe the best player on the offense when he joined the team. And that's saying something for a guy who was third an MVP voting that year and DeMarco Murray's winning everything. So he came in just absolutely no weaknesses. And we had to give him some love. And I have to admit, though, he's the only interior offensive lineman that's going to be on this list. Good for you. So I apologize. If any people are curious out there, Just guys that we, because I like to give a little bit of a shout out, guys who did did not make the list. And we'll do this sometimes when we hit a position.

That's going to be the last time we have that position. Steve Hutchinson was tough to leave off. Five first team all pros was all the all 2000s. I mean, yeah, a lot of Hall of Famers are getting left off. Alan Fanica, Jari Evans are also not on this list. And neither is Jason Kelsey, different position. But that was a tough one too. So I wanted, Martin is kind of representing them all.

man, that's a big flag he's planted right here by you. I mean, the Jason Kelsey won too because he has six first team all pros, but just the way people talked about him,

there's a guy Mike Gettings who runs a pro scouting service called Pro Scout that the NFL uses. He was the scout I was referring to that said the only gap he thought in his entire career that was similar at another position was how they used to talk about

Dwight Stevenson at center back in the day, that he would put Zach Martin right there with the greatest guards of all time. So, Zach Martin, number 19, let's move on to our next guy on the list. Number 18, Julius Peppers. Hit him moving away. Pumpfrey, he's hit off the ball as close,

and Julius Peppers had it. So long Peppers. Oh, man, oh man. You know who hit him, it was Fields. Number 58, came in and just brunched Michael Vick. There isn't a man on this field that's going to catch Julius Pepper's. Look at the athletic ability of him. He just one hands the ball and goodbye.

Give me my respect, well, I'm going to take it. How you want it? How are you on it? How are you on it? He has two distinct sides to his personality. There's Julius laid back, chill, nonchalant. And then there's the football player they call PEP, explosive, disruptive, relentless. We can get into so much with Julius Peppers.

But let's start with the first play that we heard there. That was Mike Patrick and Paul McGuire, both great broadcasters with ESPN. Rest in Peace. Mike Patrick recently passed away. and that interception return where Peppers, you know, picks it up one-handed and then runs at that size for the touchdown. To me, exemplifies just how he was an athlete that is just rare in every possible way. Yeah, I think I actually covered that game when I was covering the Atlanta. Wow.

And the tackle that he beat, Todd Weiner was like a really good player. He was Michael Vicks blindside tackle. And it's funny, two years ago, you know, I do the Dornock, the Hall of Fame crew. And two years ago, and Bruce Smith was knocking on a. his door. We're going through the whole process. I kept saying to myself like, man, you know, Julius Peppers is a first ballot Hall of Famer. And then you don't realize he's got the fourth most sacks of all time, right, 159 and a half. Because what you just mentioned, everyone thinks of Julius Peppers because you play basketball in North Carolina as an athlete, right? You don't

look at him like the same way, you know, we talked about Miles Garrett or Lawrence Taylor or Deacon Jones, like is that badass edge rusher who's just taking names and putting bodies to ground right you're looking at him as a super athlete who got his way done but then you just look at the fact 11 interceptions four of them return for touchdown now when you're when you're six eight okay you know part of that but i mean it's it's it's two all decade teams right this guy played for 18 that's what did it that's what did it steve that's what helped push him on this list when i saw that he was second team hall of fame all decade in the two thousand for the Hall of Fame.

And actually, first team from Pro Football Reference. They do their own list. And I thought that was an interesting other voice to listen to in the 2000s. And then he's also on the Hall of Fame all 2010s and second team for the pro football reference all 2010s. That was what did it. Because I'm not, I'm trying not to overreward longevity. I want to be about like greatness.

Right. But he did have that high level greatness. And the longevity put it over the top from. But he wasn't a compiler, right? A lot of people are like, oh, Frank Gore's got these great numbers, but he was a compiler because he played for so long. Pep was still giving you double-digit sacks in years 14, 15. Playing for the Bears, playing for the Packers.

He was still putting up big numbers. And, you know, unlike Miles Garrett, and he played on some really good Panthers teams. He played in Super Bowls, right? He really affected things. But in covering that division, when I worked in Atlanta from 2005 to 2008, like the Panthers were the team. There's always the Panthers and the Falcons,

and everyone's trying to out-athlete each other. Right, you know, the Panthers got Thomas Davis because he was a hybrid safety linebacker who could spy Michael Vic. He's a guy who could run with Michael Vic. And then to see Julius Pepper's like there's no body on the offensive line. There's no running back or whatever

that could handle him, whether it be power, whether it be finesse. And because Pep didn't say much, we weren't talking a little smack on that video clip, but Pep's a real quiet guy. You know, he never, you never were just like man he took over a game and you're just saying he made a spectacular play here and there

but he never took over a game so you're wondering like is he really that guy and then you go back and think about like oh yeah he really was what was I watching right and it kind of accumulated slowly because he won defensive rookie of the year he was thought he was the number two overall pick

in the draft and viewed as you know a generational type of athlete I actually think him and Garrett have a lot of similarity in terms of coming out of the draft and there was a sense in Carolina, could he be even more? But three first-team all-pros, three second-team all-pros, and like you mentioned, those are sprinkled over a number of years, only player ever with 100 sacks and 10 interceptions.

And one thing that strikes me is he got to the end of these contracts. That says a lot. Seven years with the Panthers, and then he signs a record-breaking at the time defensive contract for the Bears. Ends up four years with the Bears. Lasted a while there. He did get cut by the Bears. Then he gets a three-year, big contract from the Packers at 34 years old.

He plays through the end of that contract and played very well. He, you know, I asked Ross Tucker about him who went up against him, you know, just on text and everything. And he said he thinks he's the most athletic player he ever played against. And actually, it was Peppers or it was either Ross's first game or I think Pepper's first game that he says he put Ross on the ground and literally jumped over him. So that's the type of thing that he did. I want to talk about a two-play sequence in this was back in 2004, just sort of as an example of how great Peppers was and what kind of player he was if younger fans maybe don't have an idea. It was a two-play sequence against the Broncos. And if you have a chance, we are doing this show on YouTube as well. So everyone

check that out. But there's a run at the one-yard line where Jake Plummer is going to the edge and he absolutely has the angle on Julius Peppers. This is an athletic player and Peppers somehow runs him down. This is at the end of a 10 play drive. The very next play after Pepper's in theory is winded, backs up in coverage. I challenge a cornerback to have that good coverage and he goes over 100 yards and he does not make it to the very end. The piano falls on his back. I think it's 103 yards, but he only gets to the three yard line. But those two plays, in a row. He said he was sucking wind before that play even started because he had just run down Plummer and then he ends up having this long interception return and that to me is kind of an example

of what kind of freaky was. And for people again who don't realize this, Jake Plummer was a hell of an athlete. He's a dude who used to run all the time. He was on the move and for PEP just to chase him down like that and then make this play. I mean, that's absolutely fantastic now. The linebacker who's trying to get the plumber should have turned around and picked off the guy so Pep could have got to the house

but still here's nothing 52 force fumbles so you think about that he had 11 picks and 52 force fumbles right that's an opportunity for 63 changed

possessions that is a that is the ultimate difference maker regardless of who he's playing for that's why he's able to play in Super Bowl and do some of the great things that he did

I think of players on this list they got to stand out to me and Peppers he just felt like he was a player from the future. You could, you know, he was drafted now 20 years ago. And if he was, you know, more than that, right, 23 years ago.

Right. If you dropped him in the 2025 class, he would still be the number one pick, number two pick. Yeah, first your second pick. You know what I mean? He was from the future as great as he looks on these clips, you know, now just comparing him to what was going on back then. one thing underrated about him, maybe his motor. He missed four games as a rookie.

After that, only two more his entire career. And if you look at the percentage of snaps, he was on the field. He didn't come off. He's like he did not come off the field. So he was a guy who made it onto my list late. I had some tough decisions. He went in over. I love that.

He went in over Vaughn Miller. If I did this list again, like he might be on it next time. I had a hard time leaving Von Miller off. But he is over. Von Miller. He is over Jason Taylor and some more of the great pass record. We talk about a pass wrestler from the future. Like, can you imagine he played in Dom Capers 34 where they played that hard, edge setting, defensive. If he was able to play like a wide nine, like the stuff solid does and the stuff

that Vic Fangio does, how he could get one-on-one matchups, his numbers would be bigger than they are now. Absolutely. So Julius Pepper's on the list. And yeah, if you're thinking about edge players, by the way. Michael Strayhan was a really tough guy to leave off because a lot of the great part of his career was in the 90s. So the 25-year cutoff hurt Michael Strahan, although he was pretty awesome. Yes, he was. In the 2000s. He had a very

strong case, so it's very tough to pick these guys, but I think Julius will do us proud. All right, we'll be back after this with the next two players. Hey, this is Matt Jones. Now I'm Drew Franklin, and this, is NFL cover zero.

We're just here to try to give you an NFL perspective a little bit different. Did you see the Colts Pretzel? That was my other big takeaway from that game. What was that? Oh, my. We think NFL coverage should be informative and entertaining. And twice a week, that is exactly what you're going to get. Listen NFL Cover Zero with Matt Jones and Drew Franklin on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Toyota, the Instagram. official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. What's up, everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game from Scouting Reports and Player Development to team-building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices

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Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Back on NFL Daily, talking about the best 25 players of the last 25 years, Steve and you suggested we should do a show on the omissions. I don't want to make people mad, though. Maybe after people... Oh, like this list. Any list is going to make people mad about who's not on.

Well, yeah, they won't know until we get to the end, although I'm spoiling it a little bit. We might have to do a follow-up with some reaction, maybe a mailback. If anyone thinks that I got anything really wrong. I don't think unless people are crazy, there's going to be any arguments about the next guy on our list. Number 17, Adrian Peterson. This is perhaps one of the greatest single-hand.

and runs, I've seen. Adrian Peterson just refused to go down. Handoff on third down. He runs to a first down. He sprints to the far side across the 50. He breaks a tackle, and Adrian Peterson is loose. He has scored. A 65-yard touchdown. Best running back of this generation would be Adrian Peterson. With the mindset I had, you know, and then the guy that I have up front, you know, I know anything is possible. That's why I continue to do the things, you know, working hard in the practice. Just the slightest of openings, and Peterson goes all the way. I like to refer to Adrian Peterson as an animal.

I mean, the guy is just relentless. He doesn't stop. Adrian Peterson came into the NFL as one of the best college runners. in history out of oklahoma in day one in the NFL he was one of if not the best running backs in the NFL for first team all pros a few more seconds uh the last non quarterback to win the MVP back in 2012 i'll let you go with you like your first your first memory instinct any anything covering this guy well look my first thing is the first time my dumb ass shook his hand, right? So you always heard like, oh, when Agent Peterson shakes your hand, he's going to break it.

He broke it. I was like, what did I do, man? Like, what did I do? So every time I say, we're fist bumping. I mean, that thing is real. And, you know, you hear about guys who are real strong in the weight room. I don't know what he did in the weight room, but he's got what I call pipe bending shrink. Like, he could just take a freaking engine block out with his bare hands.

He's so strong. And then you couple that with the speed and the vision, because the Vikings made no bones about what they were going to do with him in the backfield. they're giving him the ball, he's going to run it, try and stop me with you can. Now he had a really good offensive line in front of him, but there were still guys who were able to try to get to him, and either he shook them, knocked them over. It was amazing. Like I tell people one thing that blew my mind, it blows my mind about Agent Peterson was he played for as long as he did, because after a year or two, people realized how strong he

was, they would load up on him. I mean, I saw him take some shots that would knock people out. He just ran right through them, got up. And you know what? It just deflated. I forget it was a game in the Metrodome against somebody. And a DB hit him as hard as I've seen a player ever get hit. And he just shook it off.

Like, okay, that's, you know, all day. That's my name, all day. You're going to be feeling it. And that DB was like, man, you know, that dude just walked through my right hand, basically. And the fact that he just did all of that was exemplified in 2012, Rosie. When he comes off the torn ACL at the, end. Christmas Eve of 2011 comes back the next year and Leslie

Freyer's coaching the Vikings and rushes for almost 2,100 yards. Right? They gave him the ball 348 times off of a torn ACL and he put up 2,000 yards running the ball. Like he's that special. He had over 1,000 yards like at the end of his career

when he was playing for Washington. Right. And he's on this list because of those first you know, seven years when he did not leave the field. And we remember him leading the NFL and rushing coming off that

torn ACL. That 2012 season that you mentioned, that was the year he won the MVP. That was the year he goes for 2,097 rushing yards, still the second most ever. 2300 yards from scrimmage. And of all the guys on this

that I've gone back and watched some of the highlights. I think he put the biggest smile on my face. It's just like watching this dude gallop in the open field. Some people are just born to do something, and this man was born to run a football, and you could see the joy that he played with. He obviously played with a toughness, but I just felt like running hard is a skill,

and running backs can only do it for so long. you only have maybe so many times you're going to get hit. If there was a metric for running hard, to me, he's my all-time leader in running hard per carry because every single carry of his career, he brought that juice. And that's why despite all the injuries that slowed him down in the back half of his career,

he still played until he was 36 because he still was helping a team out by just running that hard. Well, I mean, remember the season when he kept on fumbling the ball because he was trying to get the extra yard? That was the thing. He was always trying to get the extra guys are punching out. It comes back to the next year and doesn't put the ball on the ground. I mean, it goes to show you how much it meant to him.

Here's something people don't think about when they talk about Adrian Peterson. When you go back when he played those games at the old Metro Dome, the turf on that field was like that long. It was a slow track. This is your definition of a... For our listeners, about what? Three or four inches? About two and a half, three inches long. It was long, like, uncut grass for three weeks.

The fast turf, like today's field turf is maybe a centimeter off the foundation with those rubber pellets in there. If he had played on some of that shorter turf where he could actually dig in tougher and deliver blows and play a little fast, I don't know if his career would have been as long. I don't know. But the physicality he was able to play with, I always, the first time I went to the Metroome, I was like, why would you have this long of turf with a running back like Agent Peterson? I would replace this stuff and get on a fast track and it was just for years

he played on that type of turf and still put up unbelievable numbers. Yeah, his first really seven seasons in the NFL, he had one minor injury about six years in that caused him to miss about four games, but he's putting up 1,700 yards on the ground, 1,300,200,

and then the big 2000 he, as just like a pure runner, you're giving the ball, he was not known for his like blocking ability. He had a lot of big receptions actually per catch because if you just got him on a little swing or anything, like he would take it to the house a lot of times. I saw a lot of those on his highlights, but he was not

as complete a back maybe as a Marshall Falk or Ladanian Tomlinson. For instance, even that first year where he didn't get All-Pro, it was actually Brian Westbrook in his best season. All right. The first team All-Pro had like 2300 yards. But in just terms of running the ball, lateral ability, shifting gear, like what stands out to you watching him? The vision and the power.

Yeah. I mean, I'm telling you, you saw some of the highlights. Because, you know, as big and strong as he was, like his waist, he probably had like a 28-inch waist. Right? So guys who'd come in to take big shots at him, there wasn't a ton in the midsection to hit. He ran kind of straight up.

He wasn't necessarily always bone guys with the shoulders when he ran. So he was dipping. Like, he could shake a guy. The great running backs could shake a guy in the phone booth, the proverbial phone, but he was that guy, but then there was just so much heat and strength behind it, you're like, okay, do I hit him in a thigh, which is the strongest muscle group of his body, and he's going to, you know, concuss me, or what am I doing here? So he was frustrating

to play, play against, and when I think about, I mean, think about the 2012 season, too, Christian Ponder was his quarterback. Oh, man. His leading receiver was Percy Harvin, like the Brett Farby. My God. My God. Barber was gone, right? You know, that, that brief stint. Wow. And that's a good call that He had the 2,097 yards with Ponder as his quarterback. I mean, do you see why he got the ball as many times as he did? And they only won 10 games. They had to win their final four games that season to get into the playoffs.

And they lose in the wild card. But, I mean, with that dude did, like, he's going to be the last running back to go into the Hall of Fame. He's eligible in 27. He'll be the last running back to go in until Derek Henry, probably. Maybe Marchand, maybe. But when you think about the way football has changed, he is the last. big bell cow until you get to Derek Henry. It's great. It's a great call. Now, I am hoping that the voters consider my guy Frank Gore

overtime. I'm not saying that he's going to get in day one because he to me was a truly excellent player. But you're right. I did not put those guys on this list. I did think about Derek Henry. He would be the running back right now who would have a chance. Certainly Gore, you know, CMC. There's been some. great backs, but Peterson's different. And the fact on a bunch of bad teams, he did make the NFC championship game with Brett Favre as you mentioned. They made the playoffs a couple times in that 08-09 window, but he did not have a chance to have a lot of playoff success. And yet everyone knew he was that dude. I'm going to throw to an old colleague of ours, a guy I used

to enjoy working with on an outfit called, what was it called NFL Plus back in the day? This is Ike Taylor being interviewed for the NFL 100 series. Does he make it? Heck, y'all, he make it. The man can sit off for two years, he's going to make it. He got to make the top 100. Nightmare. He's Jason.

Freda Kruger. Like, when you talk about the Minnesota Vikings when Adrian Peterson player, we have to stop this guy. That was just funny to me that, He made the top one to one in a year that he didn't play. This is enough players just voted for him anyways. That's respect.

Ike is the absolute. Yes, he is. I enjoy watching him play so much that why not? Let's actually throw it back to his time in Washington. Not what people think of with Adrian Peterson, but him ripping off. And when I went through his greatest plays, so many of them are 40 to 70 yarders.

This guy was a drive in one point. play. He was a big play machine. It's Peterson. Still going. Adrian Peterson inside of 20. The 10 touchdown. 64 yards.

I just like that he was still getting it. That was like year 12. At the end of his career. And I'm telling you, man, the load he took and the shots he took, if you were on the field, And you watch some of the shots he took before he was coming through the whole line of scrimmage. He took some licks and just, I know the other dude's worse off than me. It was an amazing combination of a slasher.

Like he was the slasher and not afraid to take contact and get that extra two or three yards through contact like they teach you. But also, when he was in the open field on so many of these big plays, his footwork, just the way he would set guys up in those feet. just suddenly start moving really quick when he's about to make a cut, it just froze defenders and then he gets past them and you're not going to catch it. He's a throwback. I mean, he's a 70s

running back. He's a Franco Harris guy. Franco didn't have a speed, but Earl Campbell type of guy. I mean, he would have fit so well in that era. All right. Our next guy would have fit in absolutely any era. I have to admit, I feel

bad. And this is true for a lot of these guys, coming up. We're getting to the real meat of this list. I feel bad for not having them higher. Number 16, Drew Breeze. Breeze is under Senate. The snap, the spin, the fake handoff, dropped back, seven, goes a soft passing the end zone, back pedaling catch. Touchdown. It's grabbed by Hill. That's it. That's the record. True Breeze is thrown for more touchdown passes than any quarterback in professional football history. Drew Breeze is all around, all around quarterback, you know, Anytime you think of Drew Breeze, you think about the records he had broken.

Drops back, looks to the far sideline, wide open, Treycloth Smith. And Trey Klan Smith is going to go to the end zone. Drew Breeze has done it. You have just witnessed history in New Orleans. Drew Breeze is the NFL's all-time leading passer. Thomas in the backfield. Here's the throw to Shockey and it's a touchdown. Jeremy Shockey in the slot to the right.

The Saints are back in the end zone on a two. Yard touchdown strike. He'd make it happen. You make it happen, maybe. Yeah, Drew make it happen. A record setter in so many categories. The leader in passing yards, so many times. Set the passing yards record.

Set the touchdown mark at one point in his career. A guy who now is second all time in passing yards and touchdowns. to Tom Brady, but a guy who was as consistent as anyone could possibly be, but also had some of the highest of highs. One of those touchdown calls you heard there was a go-ahead touchdown to Jeremy Shockey with under six minutes to go in the Super Bowl. Everyone remembers Tracy Porter, but it took Drew Breeze driving down the field and making it happen to go take that lead.

Well, I mean, his competitiveness, you know, we hear this about all the great ones was unmatched and it's not just on the field or training the stories you hear talking to our old colleague chase daniel who backed up drew bridge for years like the preparation he had in meetings and the way he would see the field and see the game and then was in so in tune with sean peyton as a play caller was like next level like everybody who came from playing behind drew breeze says they learned how to prepare now so when they would go to their next team they could train younger guys on how to study for meetings. But, you know, here's a really a couple cool things about Drew Brees, okay?

Other than Marcus Colston, Jeremy Shockey, Jimmy Graham, until Michael Thomas came at the end of his group, like, who were his receivers? It was a revolving door of receivers, right? But here's a great story that James Winston told me why Drew Brees was so good, because the one stat you didn't talk about that we finally started talking about because Drew Breeze, completion percentage. So, Jamie said they were playing a game. They were down two scores with like four minutes left.

So what's James is thinking? We've got to take shots here. He's on the sideline. Breeze is playing. And Breeze is methodically seven yards here, nine yards here. So they end up scoring a touchdown, but there's only like a minute and a half left on the clock.

So Breeze is, so he's like, man, why aren't you taking shots? What are we doing? What are the plays we're calling? He's like, hey, hey, protect the ball. You play with any offense. you move the ball down the field. We see you got in the end zone.

We got a defense that can take the ball away. We'll get another chance to get back in there. They get another chance. They didn't win the game. But where so many quarterbacks are thinking, okay, you know, adrenaline's pumping. We got to go do this. Breeze is like, this is how we do things here.

This is what works. This is why, James, you're throwing 30 picks a season, and I'm throwing nine. And it's just, you know, I covered so many Saints game during the Breeze era. And just seeing him, I'm 6-2, right? He's about my height. maybe a little shorter, maybe. He's not as small as you think.

People try to diminish his size. But what Sean Payton did with him because of his size helped teams build their offensive lines a certain way and open the door for shorter quarterbacks, the twos of the world, the bakers of the world. And that's built them guard to guard, right? You talked about Jari Evans, one of the best guards of the ear and some of these interior alignment. So now you've got a pocket and you've got to sell like Toronto Armstead and some of these

other guys here to handle the one-on-one stuff. But more and more teams these days, because of Drew Breeze and the way the success he had, stepping up into the pocket, build their teams, guard, center, guard to create throwing lanes for their shorter quarterback. So I love what you said about the completion percentage, which is a stat that I thought at some points

could get a little overrated. But I think in Breeze's case, and he finished his career, five straight years over 70%. He was setting the record, like there were three straight years where he had like 72, 74, 74%, just numbers that you've never seen before. The reason why it mattered so much because not just because he was making the right football play

and throwing to the open receiver was that it was setting up, despite his reputation, one of the most efficient deep ball throwers in the history of the NFL. If you go back and you look through his greatest plays and some of the most important plays of his career, and I went and did that this week,

You know how many of them are to Devery Henderson and Robert Meacham and Brandon Cooks? I would say plus 40. Like so many. And you want to know why that is because you're playing zone against Drew Breese and he's pick, pick, pick, pick you apart. 8, 9, 11, 8, 9, 11. And then suddenly you get caught sleeping and there goes Brandon Cooks for 89. And you know like how perfectly each one of those passes. were. He did not have the arm

of Favre or Rogers or anything like that, but his timing made up for it and turned him into I think the most underrated deep ball thrower ever because it was such a huge part of his game. And even volume-wise, they threw a lot of deep balls, even late in his

career, and they hit him because it was one part of his excellence setting up another part. And look, part of it was the play, again, I must have covered, I could pay state taxes in Louisiana. I've covered so many Saints games in the breeze era, look they had one of the best green games

you know with Reggie Bush and then Pierre Thomas right so they used the screen game as to run game we know how much they love the tight ends in the red zone I mean even Benjamin Watson they got a 13 touchdown catch season

Shockey was great with them Jimmy Graham I mean so they utilized a lot of things to set up the deep throws but the one thing about Breeze too you always see he had this kind of motion where he when he would throw it it was almost like you know

the Greek God type was he was leaning back Like, man, how does he see? And he just trust his preparation so much and his practice rep's so much because he's got this odd thing. If we go back and look at his highlights, you'll see some of those throws, but so much of it is built on the preparation.

Let's not forget. This was a dude. People thought his career was over when he left the chargers and he had a debilitating super damaged shoulder to where when he went on free agent visits with the dolphins, when Nick Sabin was coaching them, and the saints, the dolphins are like,

yeah, we don't think he's going to be able to last because of that shoulder goes to the Saints in 2006 after they return from San Antonio because of Hurricane Katrina and just starts dialing it up. I am so glad you mentioned the San Diego years because his entry into the NFL was really bumpy. He did not play as a rookie. I think Doug Flutie was playing. Doug Flutie was playing. And, you know, he was a early second round pick. because of the size probably.

He was six feet. You're saying he's looking at you. I'd eyes listed at six feet. I don't know. He's a little taller. Maybe in cleats me. Maybe it was because he, you know,

he also compared to some of the quarterbacks relatively slight. I remember, you know, I've walked by him and stuff. He just, in a different setting, he looks like a normal guy. Most of these guys don't look like normal guys.

No. So he comes in his second year after not playing as a rookie. And he's okay. It's up and down. But he's showing promise. The next year, he gets benched in the middle of the year. They are two and nine. He is struggling. He has more interceptions than touchdowns. Doesn't totally get along with his head coach.

There's like, there's kind of like conversation of like, does he have a good attitude? Like stuff like this. And now knowing his history, like he was a competitor and that team was terrible. And he was put in a tough spot. Benched. The draft Philip Rivers in the next draft. Philip Rivers is going to start over him. And Breeze's career is in a really tough place until Breeze, until Rivers holds out a training camp, very chargers-esque, contract negotiations. They can't agree to a contract. Breeze comes out the next year and he wins comeback player of the year. He is awesome in training camp. He is awesome in the season. He does not let Rivers get on the field. And he ends up, you know, starting another year.

in front of Rivers, also playing well. But as you mentioned, hurts his shoulder at the very end of it. And that sets up the free agency where he wanted to play with Miami. They didn't want him. And he ends up changing, you know, a city forever. And that's... He could run for governor right now. He would win 100% of the votes.

I don't know if any one player has had a bigger impact on their city than Drew Brees. You might be right. Had on New Orleans. You might be right. he is worshipped, he is held in that high of regard. And when we think about the primaries, Greg, you know, you're in New Orleans a lot. You're a Tulane grad. That guy, what he did for that city, the way he embraced that city, especially coming post-Katrina, when he showed up there with Sean Peyton is a tandem in 06.

Right. So that's their first season and is easily his best season as a pro up until that point. He gets all pro first team in that season. People don't remember. there were not really high expectations. They go 10 and 6. They win a playoff game. They get to the NFC championship game that year and get turned back.

And Breeze, you suddenly realize this marriage between him and Peyton, how he started winning from the neck up and Lance Moore and just that whole team. One of my favorites, Reggie Bush. Deuce McAllister. I mean, it's just so fun to watch those teams. So I mentioned, I mentioned the, that's his all pro team. and he could be higher on this list. I didn't want it to be all quarterbacks at the top.

It could be. You know, there are a number of quarterbacks ago. Hold up real quick. He said that was his all-pro season. Yes. His only all-pro season. And that's what's tough about Breeze evaluating him this way.

He had some of the best seasons ever that didn't win MVP. And he did win second team all-pro four different times. And it's to Manning twice. Manning, Brady, and Rob. It's to Mahomes and, right, it's to some of the greatest players of all time. And his 2011 season, and I would argue at 2009, because I actually was writing a column for ABCSports.com at the time,

I thought Drew Brees should have been the MVP that season in the regular season over Peyton Manning. So while it doesn't look as great that he only gets one first team, all pro, two of those seasons, man, he had a strong argument for it. Rogers had a crazy 2011 season. Manning was great in 09. I would have picked Breeze. But Saints fans will tell you, like he could easily have three MVP. So I'm not going to kill him that he was like the second best player in the NFL in those seasons.

Here's a validation. He's up to go to Canton next year. Well, yes. There's no. He's going in. Well, yeah, he's one of those guys.

You don't even have to make an argument. So don't come after me. I'm not coming after you. I'm just saying. I'm talking about the list of it. I love the dude. I'm just kind of like, isn't it crazy that he was this great, that he's one of the leading pastors of all time.

And they made the pro or the all-pro team once. Because again, he played in, look at the era. He talked about Manning, Brady, Rogers, Mahomes, some of the great quarterbacks. And he only was able to make it one time. And yet he won, you know, it's crazy. He actually won two offensive players of the year. So that you would think is like a higher honor.

But in those years where he, two of those years where he came in second for MVP, they kind of gave him the consolation prize because he, had such an incredible year and he ends up winning an offensive player of the year. He won comeback player of the year, but it was not in the year that he's coming back from that horrible shoulder surgery. It's from getting benched. It was from being bad in San Diego. He actually won comeback player of the year in San Diego. So I struggled. At first, I had Lamar Jackson over him. He was in our first episode in between 21 and 25, Lamar Jackson, because his highs have been so, so high. The MVP's multiple. And then when

I looked at it though, I was like, man, Drew Breeze's highs are pretty. You're not going to get freaking. You're not going to get an argument for that. Okay. Okay. I'm just like, they are amazing leading the league and passing so many times. One of the best to ever do it. Steve Weiss is one of the best

to ever do it. I'm glad you came in for this. I'm so glad you asked me to do this when you told me the project. You know how I was like, this is great and you pulled it off so far. Well done. We've, we've just getting going here. Our next episode, we will tackle players 15 through 12. That is going to be a lot of fun. We'll see you next time.

Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the 6th, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters.

We study the tape. Talk to decision. makers and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else. It's everything you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sunday. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Sticks podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Marcus Grant. And I'm Michael Fulrio, and together we host the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast.

Ready to dominate your fantasy league this season? Then you need the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast. your ultimate source for player news, draft tips, and winning strategies. Whether you're a rookie manager or a fantasy vet. We've got the insight to help you crush your opponents. Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL.

Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. This is an IHeart podcast.