NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - AFC Hierarchy Report

Episode Date: June 23, 2017

A room filled with some heroes – Dan Hanzus, Colleen Wolfe, & Gregg Rosenthal – recap all the latest news from around the NFL including Derek Carr's record breaking contract and the Chiefs decision to part ways with GM John Dorsey. The heroes then welcome ATN voice over artist Alex Fragola on the podcast to field a few twitter questions. Conor Orr also joins Around the NFL for another edition of Orr you Kidding Me?!Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the NFL podcast has an open tab at Huckapooz. Welcome back to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hanzas and I am joined by a room filled with some heroes to my left. Colleen Wolf to my right, Greg Rosenthal. What's up, people? Yeah. Get ready for this show.

I've had a lot of coffee. Yeah, Colleen does have an interesting energy here today. There's a little bit of buzz to her. She's doing the live updates for NFL Network today, which means you've been up for a long time. I've been up since five. You're just on live television. You're just on live television.

You literally ripped the handle off the door while you were on their way to the bathroom. You pack a lot of strength into that small frame of yours, Colleen. And you've left us trapped in here now. I know. At least we have water. That's good. And Sully. And Sully, we must feast on you if it comes to it.

Oh, dear. Like the movie alive. Oh, dear. This is the Thursday edition of the round the NFL podcast. And we are excited to have Connie with us. And we have, as I mentioned on Twitter, if you follow on Twitter. And damn it, you should. A little later today, one of the voices,

The behind-the-scenes voices of the Around the NFL podcast, Frags, is going to join us. And also, we'll have another. That question's huge. We'll have another satellite hero joining in via the telephone at the end of the show. A lot to get to. I'm very excited about today's show. And also tonight is the commissioners awards party, the 10th annual even. Another company function.

Another company function with an open bar, which is good. Best part of this time of year. Colleen, you and I are going. We are. I promise videos. What was Greg's exact reaction? I said, Greg, do you want to come? Who cares?

I didn't say that. Why should I go, though? Who will be there? I didn't say that. You're putting words in it. First of all, I got to bring Alice to her last swim class. Okay, good dad. If you're already back on the other side of town,

are you going to drive back just for the second half of the thing? Where is this event? Marina del Rey. And you live. Okay, Santa Monica. But not that far. I think what I said was there's going to be a lot of people there. Right.

That's the point. Yeah, that's scary. What does that mean? Just like a large, I don't like large groupings of people where you're expected to. That's why there's a bar. Socialize. Have a couple drinks. Let loose.

We'll have some fun together. All right. Come join us. Yeah? I don't believe them. I'm in. This is like the time where the NFL Network 10th anniversary party where we went and Greg didn't go and it was a chance to bond with Greg. He was kind of newer at the company, and he just no-showed that event.

And we're like, what's going on with this guy? And here we are, five years later. And you should know by now. Same story. We need you, Greg. We want you on that wall. We need you on that wall. Come.

Please come, Greg. All right. They can be uncomfortable. Beer pressure. It's strong. Okay. So that's today's show. So before we get into anything else, so there is some actual news.

Legitimate news. It's a newsy day. Kind of a. good slash bad day to be the news lady today. I know. This is my first day doing news updates. Oh, wow. Claybon sits there all week, you know, picking his nose. Waiting. Yeah, reading a Stephen Segal book that I got him. And then here comes Connie Fox and all of a sudden the world blows up. Sully, let's hit some news. Sully, are you going to the party? No.

Oh, why not? You're the life of the party. You're a life of the party guy. Yeah, I'm not feeling it. It's my Friday night. No, I'm okay. So what does Sully do on his Friday night? I have no plans right now, but I'm not going to the party.

So you're skipping out on the party. It's your Friday night. There's free open bar and you have no plans. Yeah. I'm with Greg. Not, not, I see you guys all day, every day. Oh, damn. No, I'm just kidding.

I'm just, I'm just not going. All right. Hey, hey, hey, hey, calm down. I'll see you guys at Hanano's afterwards. All right. Yeah, let's move on and start with the biggest news of the day. The contract that we have neatly avoided throughout this spring is now a done deal between Derek Carr and the Raiders.

On Thursday, the two sides agreed to a five-year, $125 million extension, $40 million fully guaranteed, $70 million in total guarantees. Someone can explain that to me. I don't know, but I know it's a whole mess of money for Derek Carr and his great, great, great, great, great grandchildren. 12 and a half million signing bonus. This is all according to Rapsheet. The deal puts Carr over Colts quarterback Andrew Lucky is now the highest paid player in the league in terms of average money per year. And this is all happening because Derrick Carr played like an MVP last year in his.

And, you know, that's not even trying to get on Derek Carr's good side. that's strictly based on his production where he led the Raiders to the precipice of the AFC West title before breaking his leg on Christmas Eve. But he's 26. Really is an excellent young quarterback. And Greg, what does this tell you about the landscape of the NFL

that Derrickard got this deal at this time? Well, they had no choice. This is such an awkward season for the Oakland Raiders. Arguably the most awkward season in the history of the NFL that any teams tried to have. They've been building up to it for about 15 years to have a good team like this. They haven't had a homegrown quarterback to call their own since Kenny Stabler, who left town about 12 years before Derek Carr was born.

And right when this is happening, they announced they're leaving for Las Vegas. So to have your best player in a contract situation hanging over the team, like that wasn't an option. And I think this was an easy contract to do because I think general managers like Reggie McKenzie and owners, I think they all understand that quarterbacks are underpaid that this is not that much money for Derek Carr, that he's worth more than this. Yeah, I mean, they had to do it. It was just a matter of when it was going to get done. So it was inevitable.

And now it sets the market for guys like Matthew Stafford and Kirk Cousins who, I mean, if I'm Kurt Cousins, if he hits the free agent market, I mean, he could be making $30 million and like playing with the 49ers. Yeah, it opens up to a whole array of. questions about who's worth this type of money. And Greg, you wrote a column like a good NFL.com worker bee talking about why all these people like the first take type shows and everybody that's going to waste entire segments, A blocks, B blocks talking about is this guy worth the money? Your opinion is, of course he is just like almost every guy that can throw the ball in this league should be paid like this.

Well, think about what would Derek Carr in another world where teams actually allow quarterbacks to hit free agency, what would he get from the Browns or the Jets or the Texas, whatever team it's going to be? Now, seriously, like, how much money do you think he would get if he was on the open market? I think if the Jets had a chance to get Derek Carr next year. And they don't even have to give up anything in a trade. You're just signing as a free agent.

Open up your pocketbook. I think he would command probably something in the range of $35 million a year, maybe. It's insane. It's so crazy. But it's finally starting to make sense because our years, we take. talked on this podcast for years how quarterbacks were getting paid less than top sluggers in baseball or NBA stars. Now that money's starting to get where it should be. Right. And think about them, even compared to other players. So Olivia Vernon's getting 17 a year. That's only 30% less

than Derek Carr. Nick Perry, who I like a lot as a pass wrestler, has signed basically the same amount of years as car for about half as much money. How many Nick Perry's would it take in a trade for you to give up Derek Carr? Like eight? Yeah. Like, you know, and he's making half. The answer is nine and three-quarter Nick Perrys. Right, there's no answer.

There's, you know, complications with cloning and morality and all those sorts of things. And this is all not even mentioning the fact that there's a salary cap. Now, what if there wasn't a salary cap? What if the NFL, America's greatest game, wasn't run essentially like, you know, communism, Socialism. Bro, these colors don't run. I don't like you talking about football like that is America's sport. It's one of the reasons why the NFL is good.

They share their profits. They cap worker wages. The franchise tag limits the movement. Like if these guys actually could get like the rest of the world, they're capitalists like what they earn. I don't know. I think it'd be worth $50, $70 million a year. I don't know.

These are billion dollar companies. I would be interested to see how the deal is structured to because I'm sure it's going to be backloaded just so they can get deals done with their guys like Gabe Jackson on the offensive line. He has a deal coming up and Khalil Mack too. But also, not to mention that Nevada has no sales tax. It is backloaded. I mean, they usually are, but I feel like it might be even more so because that's going to save him so much money. California is like 13.3 state tax.

They did delay a lot of the guarantees until later in the contract so that he could get. And unlike a lot of NFL contracts, when you sign these young quarterback, franchise quarterback, I mean, he's actually going to get through most of it. He'll end up signing a new deal for even more with a year or two left. This is what they do. This is both tells you the explosion of the league and the money involved, but also, you know, the story of inflation, which Colleen will get to when she anchors the inflation podcast later this summer. But once upon a time, back in 1996, the New York Jets signed Neil O'Donnell to a

Top of the market five-year $25 million deal. Now we're at $5 for $1.25 million. And I will also add that the $5 for $25 curse, does it carry to $5 for $1.25? Is it even worse? What will be for our great leader, Derek Carr? I don't know. I hope nothing. Wow.

For new listeners, you have a theory that $5 for $25 million is a cursed contract. I want you to go through every sport in the last 20 years, 25 years, starting when Danny Tartable, signed a five-year, $25 million deal with the Yankees in 1992. O'Donnell with the Jets. Who was that center for the Vikings, Sullivan, about five years ago? What a bad deal. That was five for $25 will get you every time. But five for $1.25?

Maybe it's different. I think you're fine. Yeah. Congrats to, you know, the car family. It's been a big year for him. I mean, he gets on the around the NFL podcast. And then this. Right there at the top of the list, too.

Two great things. I mean, this is a guy who started his career 0 in 10 in terms of the Raiders were 0 in 10. Yeah, there were some doubts in this room. I was wrong in my evaluation. I think if you think about Carr, I think he's a very, he combines being, he's very careful. Like he's composed and careful, doesn't take too many mistakes. But then he combines that with he's like athletic enough that when stuff gets crazy, he can improvise and just kind of make it happen because he's that athletic. It's a nice combination.

And I do like, it's one of the top jock, like fellow jocks bit exchanges on social media after a big deal. And we actually got to see it between the Carr brothers. Oh, yeah. Our friend David reached out to our friend Derek and said, hey, bro, lunch is on you next time. Can you imagine like your little brother gets a $125 million contract? Well, you know, I would say I'd feel bad for David Carr, but he's doing well and he's doing very well at NFL Network. And that guy, and I reached out to Sydney about this privately last Friday, David got a haircut. He did?

And now he's better looking, which is not, that is not cool. David Carr was already a fantastic looking guy. And then he gets a haircut. It's a little less, a little less juice going on up top. The part changed a little bit. Oh. And now we're in uncharted territory. Hair expert, Dan Hansis, chiming in.

I mean, because now he's nailed the hair and now the roof is off. The first time that John saw him, he was like, he, like, came running over to me and was like, that's the most handsome man I've ever seen in my life. Who are you talking about? Let's move on. We should move on. I can't just keep talking about another man that I work with like this. I mean, it's fine. You should talk to him tonight at the party.

Well, you've done it every show this week. You also made Patrick Claibon visibly uncomfortable with your long, you know, he can deal with that too. About how good looking he was. Another handsome guy. Yeah, I only have so much mercy upon nine and a halfs. General of my own gender. Mark, Chris, and I, we've never heard any of these problems from you. All right, moving on.

Big news in Kansas City, a huge shake up there. First, we heard that Andy Reid got an extension, which, you know, was notable, obviously, but not surprising or stunning. But then we got the word that John Dorsey, the general manager of the team, will part ways of the team effective immediately, which kind of through the football cognizcenti for a loop, including one Greg Rosenthal, Greg. On a lot of levels, you know there's got to be something cooking behind the scenes

because this doesn't make sense. The chiefs are the prime model of having a front office getting it right, building a team the right way, and now you get rid of the guy that ostensibly was at the top of the pyramid. It is stunning because I think I've said on this podcast, And Reed, I think I've had the textbook example of coming into an organization that was in bad shape in a lot of ways and immediately flipping it, having a vision of these are the types of players we're going to go for. This is how we're going to coach, syncing up, and they immediately flipped their record. I believe they were 21 and 43 in the few years before they got there, and they're almost exactly flipped in the four years after three playoff spots, and they're drafting well.

everyone likes working there like it was believed to be a good relationship and then you get this statement out of nowhere from the chairman of the chiefs Clark Hunt at Dorsey's gone yeah these two they've never finished lower than second place together and as soon as I saw this news it was almost like so Andy Reid is signing this extension and staying and Dorsey's out like I mean is that Reed being like you can keep me but he's got to go like I wonder if They just keep everything under wraps? It was almost like the organization, perhaps, knowing that Dorsey leaving would lead to a mess of questions about the entire regime. And maybe we extended Reed just so you know, there's nothing crazy, crazy happening, but we're moving on from the GM. Well, the state, I think we'll learn more when, you know, our NFL network insider Ian Rappport chimes in. I think there will be more of a backstory. So this is in motion.

But I do think you can learn from the state. It means on the golf course right now. You can learn from the statement that the Hunt family released, Clark specifically. He said, I notified John, we would not be extending his contract beyond the 2017 season. After consideration, we felt like it was in his best interest and the best interests of the team to part ways now. So something, usually coach and GM gets their contracts at the same time. They want to be a line. Right.

Whenever this contract negotiation started with Dorsey, you would think the plan, expectation was he was going to be there because they have let Dorsey make all the moves this off season they let him shuffle much of his personnel staff he he let go of some people so there's Chris Ballard's gone that was their number two guy right Chris Ballard left because he got a better job they wouldn't so you would think this is all taking it by surprise but the fact that they mentioned his contract and you know to be square we talked with someone downstairs somebody You know, a little off the record. A little bit.

I didn't have three sources on it, so I was going to stay quiet. Greg has a different policy. No, I would have said the same thing that it seems like the contract and whether that's money or power or whatever it is that that began a disagreement. And who knows? Maybe Dorsey didn't play it well. And the Hunt family said, all right, see you. Who knows? Wow.

These things can happen in contracts, emotions, you know. how well is this your contract's coming up Colleen want to talk about that that's that's right that's on the that's on the inflation pod well done well done

yeah that roster has been constructed extremely well and now without your number one guy your number two guy they better trust their number three guy they shuffled the thing is they shuffled out there are a lot of the guys

that would be the three four five like key guys in that personnel staff so it's they're starting over at a very strange time I can't remember GM ever being fired at this time of year. It's a weird move for sure. It's a weird move for a team that's been doing so well. And we're going to find out more. Once, all of our insiders get off the golf course.

There's multiple. These guys are like Trump-level golf work. That doesn't include you, though. No, no, no, no. Listen, we're here. Let me tell you something about where I grew up. Where I grew up. I mean, in my cold town, there was no room for golf courses.

What did you do for fun there? Barely any trees. How'd you relax? I'll tell you how we relaxed. When we got out of that shoot and we could still breathe, that's the most relaxing breath you'll take. That shoot. Oh, my God.

So you are now, in this fantasy land you have, you are now working the coal mine out, kid. I got out. And anybody that. You just cracked open a beer. Yeah, anybody that. What's the name of the town again? The Pearl River, New York, the town of friendly people.

Anybody, that's how we got the name, the town of friendly people. Anybody that got out, you were as friendly as can be, because you were alive. You're just happy. Drink it in the air. All right. I'm glad you're here, Dan. I'm glad to be here. And I can't wait to see you tonight, Colleen.

Yeah. Craig, you know, maybe I'll see you. Maybe I won't. Let's move on and talk a little. Let's get on the throne of ease. Oh, boy. David Harris was dumped by the Jets earlier this month

he was a Jets lifer since 2017 10 years started every game was really the lifeblood of that defense in the middle their play caller and all that and now he lands with of course the New England Patriots who if you threw the years

if you followed the Jets Patriots quote unquote rivalry you knew that Belichick had a very high level of respect for Harris and the way he played the game. And now there's talk that he, Colleen, is going to be a starter potentially in New England. And it feels like David Harris might end up getting a ring out of all this. Of course he will. And how about that?

I know. This is a nightmare for you. But that's how these things happen, especially with the Patriots. And look at what they've done this offseason. Just the guys that they've picked up from within the division. division. David Harris just happened. And then you have Mike Gillisley and Stefan Gilmore from the Bills. They're just poaching everybody from the division and they're going to they're going to win another ring. I'm sorry. Well, a couple of things. First of all, they didn't really poach David

Harris from the Jets. Sure. The Jets moved on from David Harris. But, and I got a ton of tweets immediately upon this newsbreaking, including what was the one, Greg, that it invoked both of us. I wish I wish you could, I wish I could pay to see the text exchange between Dan and Greg right now after this. Like everybody thought I was going to wake up see Twitter and just be like ripping out my hair and anger. No, David Harris, and maybe this is kind of part of why he was underappreciated as a jet.

He just went about his work. He wasn't, you know, a change-the-game type player. He was just like a really steady guy. Consistent. Yeah, consistent. Smart. You know, a guy that never missed the practice and led the right way. And that's part of the reason I thought they should have held on to him just because

you could do it. By the way, you could tear it down like the Jets are doing and do a full rebuild. And I get it. And I get it Woody wants to save money. But you should keep some of these guys in the building to, like, teach the young guys how to play the game and show them a path. Eric Decker and David Harris were two guys that were exactly the type of veterans that you look for. But sometimes the owner wants to save money because this is a plaything. And I think I am not upset that David Harris sign of the Patriots.

I'm really not. The Revis once stung a little bit. Absolutely, because he was the most famous jet of my lifetime. But Harrison, I'm happy for him. I'd much rather than him sign with the Jets and the Jaguars or something. Good luck to you. And that's not, I didn't, there was no text exchange. And I think Harris, if all goes well, will be that veteran guy that they pick up,

kind of searching for the ring like a junior say hour or stuff. But let's not get carried away. The money tells part of the story, two years. is 5 million, 1.25 guaranteed. So that tells me he's on the team this year. He's getting paid like a, not a real starter, but kind of like a rotational type of guy. He'll help out.

The signing immediately reminded me of was the Jets, the Patriots, signing one of Bill Belichick's all-time favorite Jets, which was Sean Ellis. And I don't think anyone really remembers Sean Ellis' one year with the Patriots. He was just there. He was a guy on the team. and that was that. That's how, that's how, it's more likely how these things go. He got that contract solely because out of nowhere he played like a defensive end version of LT

in that playoff game, the Jet Speed, the Patriots at Foxborough all those years ago now. But yeah, so it could be Ellis. He could be another Jets example, Victor Green, another top 50 all-time jet on there, according to their list, went to the Pats in the early 2000s. I think he got a ring with the Pats. There was a memorable, his first game back in the Mettelands. He had to pick six of any test. So good luck to David Harris.

Everyone thinks that I'm like freaking out at all times. I'm trusting the process right now. Whoa. Hashtag trust the process. And I'm thinking bigger things. A certain guy playing in USC. I'm not a lot to talk about them. But I'm thinking big picture.

And that starts at the 2 and 14. All right. It's going to be a tough year. That's what's happening in the news. Good news chatter. Yeah. It's been a great day. I'm looking at your rundown right now,

and there's an amazing picture of frags on there. Oh, yeah. I like to put in the rundown I send out to the team. I like to add a picture. Sometimes it's a picture of Colleen. I'll do a Google search. Which if the league ever audited my Google searches, they would think it was me being creepy.

But it's really just, I like to get an image in there. I'll have fun. Research. Well, they could find many. I mean, they could find evidence of you being creepy. This just wouldn't happen to be it. I'm sure. I think you should speak for yourself in that one, sir.

Put it that way, and I'll leave it there. Elevate your underwear game because you're a creep. Speaking it creepy. To the next level with Miondi's. What is Miondi's? Just seriously saw Feel Good Undies delivered right to your door. Somebody actually tweeted at me. yesterday and gave me crap for reading the Miandis read too quickly.

Hey, put some more effort into your Miandi's name. Don't mail this in, Dan. Really chew the fat. What's wrong with you? Chew the scenery. Of all the things you could tweet at somebody. That gravy train's going to end. Yeah.

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Go into your playback on your iPhone or your Android and play it at half speed. Oh, yeah. Good idea. really dig in enjoy yourself maybe he was listening on two timespeed maybe he was listening on to time speed maybe all right so let's move on now so the raiders have their quarterback and we never stressed about it in this room it was a major story until the deal happened but you knew it was going to happen but here's the good thing is that they got the deal done this will not hang over them and it won't be a distraction. To me, it doesn't make the Raiders a bigger threat in 2017.

That's a nice little thing, though. You take care of your quarterback and you move forward. So why don't we check in, and we'll call this the AFC Hierarchy Update. Oh, wow. Great title. It's not bad. Sounds official. Hierarchy. Is that said Stone? What's that? We're going to workshop this one?

Yeah, you think it needs work? Spice it up a little bit? I don't know. Why don't you get back to end of the show? show an updated title that maybe we can use in the episode Reco. It's homework. Possibly.

Now you're on the spot. Now I'm on the spot. Yeah, in a big spot. Anyway, so let's break it down. We're trying to figure out, basically this is an exercise, Colleen, who can beat the damn Patriots. I mean, let's figure this out.

And so that's where I'm going to, I'll start it this way. And Greg is probably going to disagree because Greg always pretends like the Patriots aren't as good as they are. But I'm putting the Patriots in their own class still. I'm putting them at number one and they're just sitting there.

They got the trophies. They got the best quarterback and the best coach. And they had it, as everyone loves to tell you, had an amazing offseason on top of it. Now they got David Harris, a warrior in the middle of their defense. Patriots only got better. So to me, their own class in this hierarchy, Greg, agree or disagree?

I don't agree. Oh, come on, man. Why don't you agree? You're living in a fantasy world, man. Wake up. Because it's football. Football, single elimination, one game, this or that, and the reason I don't totally agree.

Okay, they're the favorites. Yes, they would be the team you would put first. Absolutely. But the Pittsburgh Steelers this season, I think, are the best Pittsburgh Steelers team Mike Tomlin's ever had. That includes, you know, some that have been favored to make Super Bowls, one that won a Super Bowl as a lower seed. This Steelers team has a defense,

a little Making the Leap preview that might be on Making the Leap. coming up. Uh-oh. Making leaves back. Making the leaves back. I thought it was going to, it was like one of those sitcoms that the ratings keep dwindling. Yeah. And they somehow it keeps coming back, but eventually there's just a shrug and they just say it's over.

Well, you know, like the last thing they do with those are it changes formats and it's like a half season. That's kind of what this is like. And it's only going to be like five making the leaps and they're a little different. Oh, that's good. But one of them is going to be the Steelers defense. We're down to five? down to just five from 40

well 40 was the first year that was over ambitious because you that's a lot of and you're the only one writing it that's true that's a lot of pressure on you Greg if you only go five you almost have to go at least four out of five to be respected in this the football cognizanti people don't remember people are we remember they're still listening to this podcast after we ranked

Cordare L Patterson number one number one he is a good kickoff guy the Steelers okay the defense This is what they've been waiting for for a while. And then the offense, among the best offensive lines in the league, and you have Rathosberger, Brown, and Bell, all together still at the height of their powers at the same time. I think you put this team in almost any other season,

and they're better than the consensus Super Bowl favorites going into a season. So that's why I don't see why the Patriots and the Steelers are on two totally crazy different planes. Colleen, am I crazy for countering with Ben Rathlisberger's never. beating the Patriots in the playoffs? I know. Doesn't that matter? It's sort of an issue. They've only played a few times though.

But I feel like there's always something that's like, you know, they have like a key injury. He's injured. It's always something with the Steelers to make the excuse why they didn't beat the Patriots this year. Last year was Levy on Bell. They haven't really met up against Patriots too often in the Rathosberger era. And things are always trends until they change. You know what I mean? And they're good enough, I think, to beat anyone.

I love the Steelers. You know who else I like. Wait, but before we go on, so you're, hold that thought, Connie. You're going to honestly say if we're making a hierarchy. Yeah. You want to go 1A, 1B? You're not going to even put the Pats in their own team? I'm going to give Pats the respect of number one, and they're in the same tier as the Steelers.

And those are the two. Just those two? Okay. Well, because here's how I would separate those two from the rest of the league. I would be stunned if those teams are not in the playoffs. No one else would stun me. me if they aren't in the playoffs. I mean, the Steelers?

Is that the team you're going to talk about? Well, I got a, I got a, the Raiders are great, but I can, I think you can find ways to see how good that division is and things could go a little wrong for them, like they went right for them last year. And yeah, I could, to me, the Steelers, if they don't make the playoffs this year, like, that's, oh, is Mike Tomlin in trouble? That's a big, that's a huge disappointment. They're too good.

Well, it's very top heavy, Colleen, because you got, all right, if we're going to, I'll go along with you, Greg, be grudgingly. If you want to put the Steelers in that tier with the Patriots, actually I won't. No, we can disagree. Patriots go in their own tier. Patriots in their own tier. And then the next tier should be Steelers two.

And I feel like it has to be Raiders three, right? Yeah, that's exactly what I would do too. But I don't know if there's anybody else that belongs in that tier. I think it's very top-heavy still this conference. I think so because after that it's like, the chiefs. Like they, I don't want to put them in, and though their team does look good and their offense is great.

Nobody has a better record in the last 18 months than the Chiefs. And this is the whole thing with the Chiefs. They're always disrespected. But there's a reason for that is that they're not, I don't think, quite at this level. And I'm not ready to,

I don't want to put them in that tier. I would put them at the top of Tier 3. Yeah. So if Tier 1 is you're the cream of the crop, rise to the top, never trust the pig because the pig is a cop. Okay. Anybody?

Anybody remember? Oh, yeah. Wait, Sally, do you know? Nope. I don't. You don't? No. You're just a kid.

Greg? I'm like, listen. Is that Onyx? No. I'm like listening to the side of my head. It's the same era as Onyx. It is House of Pain. Yeah.

Up around. Pathetic that I just did that. And I don't feel that way about the armed forces or the local police at all. Okay. I'm just saying that is more an everlast thing. The old Zusser is all about the local police and the federal. Yeah, because that really wouldn't fit in with your whole salt to the earth coal mining. I got a lot of state troopers in my family thing.

There you go. Yeah. Do you have a PBA card? I don't. What? I know. I had one for a little, but it expired. They expired.

But that's why you have to go to different weddings, funerals, anymore. Do you know, do you have a PBA card? I did way back in the day. I'm not sure how I came upon it, but it's been a while. Interesting. It's a very nice move to get a PBA card. Get you out of a lot of tickets.

It's the police benevolent? Yeah, Benevolent Association, something like that. Here's the thing, why the Raiders don't belong with the Steelers. Okay. They had a bad defense last year. And they made some moves to make you think that they're going to be better, but they haven't had a great defense. It's an uneven team.

I think the Steelers have the potential to be a very good defense, be a little more balanced, along with their great offense. Corners are a little... Like on paper, it mostly looks pretty good. You got Cleo Mac, you got Bruce Irvin. You've made some upgrades in the secondary. We'll see if Conley appears he's not going to be arrested at this point. And he could be a big...

Good, great. That's where we are. Like on paper, they should be a little better. Ken Norton Jr. has been under fire since he's been there. They have really not had a good defense the last few years. And they won a lot of close games. Derek Carr is the all-time leader. in his first three seasons of game-winning comebacks,

but it's because they're behind in a lot of those games. You know, it's a lot of comeback. That's fair. I'll counter there, though, that the biggest tragedy of the 2016 season was the Derrick Carr leg injury because... Christmas Eve. Christmas Eve, they were...

That robbed the entire all football fans of a great AFC playoffs, and I think the Raiders could have went toe to toe and even beaten the Patriots if that game was played in the black hole, which it could have been, or at the very least, they were going to get a home game and a buy if they just would have finished out the schedule

the way everyone anticipated. So I think they were already almost at the Patriots level by the end of the last season. So I think that, and I'm granting that they're below the pads, but I don't see a huge drop-off. The Steelers are prone to funks. If you want to base this off last year, that's true.

Ben Rutherberg went through stretches where he looked like a very average quarterback. He looked every bit at 36-year-old quarterback at times. and he has trouble staying healthy and I don't know. I think they're in the same category. Now, let's go to the sleepers stage. Who's the number one sleeper? Greg, get us going here.

And if we're looking at the Pats as number one, who could knock off, who could shock the Pats on Division weekend in Foxborough? And it would be shocking to everyone, but not, it would be stunning, but not shocking. I put shock ahead of stun. Well, the three teams, you're talking sleepers. What if it's the Chargers?

That's one of the teams I would throw in there. Bill Rivers going to Foxborough and getting his revenge? I think the talent on that team is good enough that they could get it done. And that's another reason why I don't put the Raiders there. Because I just look at the AFC West, and I think this is the most fascinating division in football. It's the best division in football. So much could happen. Like the AFC goes through that division, and so you never know when a division's that good.

But I would say the teams that stick out to me, you say sleepers, the Titans, who we spoke a lot about last show, the Chargers. And as the off-season's worn on, I'm feeling a Bengals resurgence. And I'm not giving up on them being in the mix. I can see that happening. This is such a big year for Andy Dalton coming back at full health,

having a much better supporting cast this year. He has a real chance to put a stamp on himself as being a guy never to be talked about with the Dalton line ever again, which is hard when it's actually your name. And I'm very excited. That is one of the things once we get closer to season, we talk about the things we're most looking forward to,

is for me seeing how Cincinnati and Andy Dalton, one year moved from a very heartbreaking, devastating playoff loss. And then, you know, Tyler, Iford, getting hurt in the Pro Bowl of all things, and then getting pilfered and free agency. I want to see what they're like now that they're kind of... They had a lot of losses on that offensive line. Big losses, too. Yeah, their season kind of comes down to their two young tackles.

I'm giving them a little bit of just looking at the entirety of the last four or five years, giving them credit for that and giving the thought that this is still a pretty young team with some premier talent. So I think it just wouldn't surprise me if they kind of bounce back to that 11 and 5 in the mixed level. Because I could hear in my ear right now, Chris Wessling yelling at his mobile device. I will speak on behalf of Wessling right now and say that if we're trying to talk ourselves into the idea of Andy Dalton and the Bengals going to Foxborough in a road game and winning in the playoffs,

a team that hasn't won a playoff game in the entire tenure of Marvin Lewis. Okay, it's a bit of a pipe dream. I'll put that more shocking. It's a slipper. The sleeper. Yeah. The sleeper. That's a deep sleeper.

That is some of the major narcolepsy issue. But don't you like the chargers? I like the charges. I think they're saucy. And maybe, and now throw in the Titans. We should move on. but I think the Titans are the one, the AFC Salty. So my vote doesn't count?

What do you mean? Your vote doesn't count. The Bengals didn't matter? Oh, no, I'm disagreeing with you, but I... That's a lower tier. I recognize. So the Ravens don't make that list for you. The dolphins don't make that group for you.

They're out of the sleeper tier for me. I'm with you guys. And are you okay with Tennessee being in the sleeper tier? Oh, yeah. I'm all in. Oh, you are the deciding vote, Colleen. Is Cincinnati in the sleeper tier? No.

Never liked you anyways. That's why he's not going to the commissioner award party. That's it right there. All right. And everyone else we didn't talk about, good luck in 2018. All right. Here we go. That was fun.

I want to do another. Oh, there's no tears below that? That's it. It's over. Why should we talk? Can we do an extended version of that on another pod? Well, NFC we could do. I didn't even think about it.

What about the poor cheese? They kind of forgot all about them. We all forgot about them. Yeah, they definitely. They're in there somewhere. They're in the sleeper one at least. Should we put them at the top of the sleepers? I thought there was more, you know, coming.

I don't actually, you know what? I have to say, I think it would be unfair to put them even in the sleeper, considering they were the number two seed last year. I'd put them at the bottom of the tier below the path. Maybe they're in their own tier. The Chiefs tier, the Alex Smith tier? The Chief's tier, yeah. That seems fair.

And then it's right above sleepers. I'll tell you John Dorsey maybe he's not putting them in that tier. He said, so long. Dorsey. history or maybe he just got fired all right let's move on it's time to welcome into the studio oh my goodness for the first time yeah she's got to have nerves you have to think she has a lot of nerves right now

she's coming to this studio but she's the type she's not going to show it no no no she won't she's cool under pressure hyper chill we were at a company event this week where we were implored to have a little more swag we were implored to have a little more swagger what as a company dan heard this right Maybe I missed it. I don't know if that was quite the message, but I know what you're talking to.

I could be getting into some trouble here. Frags told you to do this. A shadowy league figure said, we got to get, you know, got to get your swagger back. And my point is, Frags has had that swagger the whole time. Alexandra Fragola, known popularly as Frags, joins us on the around the NFL podcast of the first time. Welcome Frags. Thank you very much for having me. All right.

Now, you listen. You listen to the show. If you listen to the show, you know that voice right away. Let's, Sully, let's scroll through some greatest hits of Frags here on the Around the NFL podcast. She is our chief voiceover talent, not paid, not compensated yet. Definitely not compensated. But here's some of her greatest hits. Magnifico.

Great one. I would say that's almost like your stairway to heaven. Yeah. If you had to have, if you were in the, around the, NFL podcast Hall of Fame like that's your plaque it's like the bust do you speak Spanish that's your boss yeah I speak Italian that's not Spanish or Italian it's kind of no I know but there was like that um like the role let's hear one more time yeah yeah frags here yeah there's nothing worse than the sound of your own voice uh well not when

it's frags so this must be fun I imagine that but then you had my voice that would be right I love let's hear some other hits it's NFL Network's great I like to consider it, like how Elton John had Bernie Toppin. I'm the Bernie Toppin. I was writing the lyrics, and then Fraggs is the one who brings it to life. That's the relationship. Is that fair to say, Frags? Well, the process goes like this.

Hanses sends me a weird email, and he asks me to read something. And then I come in here and I read it or he reads it in a really good voice. And I'm like, just use that. And then I snort like four or five times giggling. And then I finally record it once in like 10 seconds and we're done. And that's how the magic is made. It usually takes a couple takes, but it's never longer than a couple of minutes. We knock it out.

We do. All right. Let's hear some more. That's not easy. That's good. Ladies and gentlemen, for one night only, sashi. Take us through that process. That created.

Oh, my God. That one was tough because it was like, do you go? like Bob Barker and really ham it up, or are you a little more, you know, like lounge singery? You're very into the lounge singer voice, so usually that's my go-tip, Dan. Do we have anything else? Does he ever tell you to kind of...

Ooh, it slides me off a piece of that Jake Briskey. That's exactly what I just said. I was going to say, does Dan ever kind of after the first day, creepily, be like, why don't you, uh, you know, sex it up a little bit? Oh. I mean, he doesn't necessarily say that, but, you know, it's implied, obviously. This is a very sexy podcast. I think what I do, I think we did one recently.

It might even been this one. That question's huge. That one. That one was interesting. Yeah, that was maybe towing the line a little bit. There was a more recent one that we couldn't remember, and people are going to tweet us about it after the show, where I asked you to turn up the sultry to 8.5. that was yeah and neither of us can think of which one that one was it's unfortunate the huge one was just top notch because i just got an email with like huge but said 45 different ways

because you have some like buddies that are listeners to the show right yes and good men that was how i first like really learned of the podcast when you guys were just up and comers on those streets yeah i was like sitting across from frags and she wasn't even aware of what we're doing up here The magic. That's nothing special to you. That's just me in general all the time. All right. So we're going to do a little exercise called Ask Frags Anything.

The listeners helped us out with this. But before we do that, if you don't mind Frags, we're going to get our New Jersey correspondent, Connor Oar, on the line. Would you like to sit in for a little, or are you kidding me? Of course. You mean the mayor of Indy, Connor O'R? Why do you call him that? This is interesting.

he knows everything about Indy. When I was at the Combine, he was like the guru of Indy. He knows all the good restaurants. He loves Indy. I hope he's listening right now. All the tunnels, like the secret.

Oh, everything. You don't have to go outside. He can correct me, but I believe he's spoken about relocating to Indy. He likes it so much. Wow. In another world, Larry, he just could pull that off. I believe the story is when he was looking for a job.

Are you on, Connor? I've made it. Yeah, I'm here. Hey, buddy. Would you mind telling us one? more time the story of when you were job hunting and you were trying to pitch your wife on moving to Indianapolis?

It was Cincinnati. Oh, Cincinnati, that's right. I told her that the main perk was that Indianapolis was only like an hour and a half away. So you could spend many a magical day and night there. Frags is in the studio, Connor, and she was marveling to us

about your almost encyclopedic knowledge of the city of Indianapolis. One of America's great mid-tier cities, but nobody knows it better than you uh yeah i think you know out of all the things in the world is probably not the most useful thing to be an encyclopedic expert about but it gets to be where i need to go um all right so connor uh every once in a while new listeners to the show should understand this that Connor is a he's a he's a low-key guy but sometimes Connor needs to get something off

his chest and if he doesn't he just might blow he's that type of situation so what we do here on the around the NFL podcast we provide Connor that platform with a segment that we call are you kidding me I just want to know why I haven't been approached about this one yeah I was thinking the same thing we could talk about it after the show and I should I should mention because contractually we're obligated to do so that Connor you are on the me undies underpants hotline right now So creepy. Wow, that's an honor. That's something that I never thought what happened.

So what's grinding your gears, Conner? So I was reading some letters to the editor from Sports Illustrated the other day, and this guy for probably the hundredth time, but every person thinks that they've come up with this idea for the first time. You know what we need to do to fix football is put in relegation, like English soccer, because it's so refined, and it'll do it, shut up. You know, this is just the stupidest idea,

and I'm sick of hearing about it. Football ain't football? Get it through your thick skull. Yeah, why does that annoy you so much, Connor? Well, there's two things. First of all, you can tell who this guy is. He's like, you know, the craft beer guy with the tech job who listens to the dirty projectors,

and he's like, wow, no one's ever thought of this while I play FIFA. Let me email Peter King. But, you know, okay, so let's turn football into a league where they've had four different champions since 1995. That's exactly what we want to do over here. Parody is not as great as you may think it is. Oh, it's the other way around. Never mind.

Four different champions since Cheryl Crowe won the Grammy for Best New Artics. Wow. Oh, my God. So is this, Connor, a shot? not just at the idea, but at soccer itself? I think it's fine, but, like, just don't make your thing, my thing. Like, this is our thing, and it's over here, and then you got your thing over there, and they're both good.

So why, you know, oh, let's make a hamburger pizza. No, like, let's keep it the way it's supposed to be. What's your favorite shell crow song? Mine's my favorite mistake. What is yours, by the way, Connor? I would say, oh, that's a good one. I want to soak up the sun. Ooh, a little late period crow.

Right, yeah, like Lance Armstrong, period, crow. All right, so what do you, like, what do you say to that guy? What is the way to give him some constructive criticism about his ability to criticize football? Okay, so, like, so you're going to, like, just relegate, you know, you're going to relegate, you're going to relegate. the Browns and like eight other teams and then just a quarter of football is just that we'll see you next year you know I think it's just a terrible idea and it works for them over there but I would say if you have an idea like just run it by like three other people first just keep it to yourself greatest idea ever and then calling someone and just

you know spouting off it's about forming your own board of bad ideas Anything else you have to add there, Connor? Are you kidding me? I think you made very fair points there. I think that's something that comes up a lot now, and it's, you know, enough with the relegation. I thought you were even going to go hard at the entire letters to the editor industry. Oh, wow.

Maybe get rid of those. I think it's a fine way to connect. It's just, you know, and there are plenty of people who make some valid points. I think we need to hear from everybody, but just not that guy. I do like to hear from that guy. I have noticed that Conner's, or are you kidding me, have gone from clearly kind of off the top of his head to a little bit scripted, but scripted in a way that it just, it is, the quality is increasing with every episode, and I appreciate that. Do you want to get a, do you want to get a plug in on your, your secondary podcast? Oh, Mark Sessler and I, the Heat and Light podcast, taping episode four on Monday.

Who is heat and who is light? I think that's for everybody to decide, you know? I think that's part of the beauty of it. We try not to define anything, but just sort of let you dictate your own experience. Can we get a little taste of what was on the last episode, like a little teaser? Yeah, the last episode we kind of dug into. some ghosts where it was really sort of the central focus

of it hauntings and sort of some of the demons that emerged from from the Sharon Tate murders in California not surprising on Mark's secondary podcast you guys talked about the Sharon Tate murders this is stunning all right

one day secret government villages in mountains it's a real thing tune in all right make sure check it out and also I mean if you're going to be listening to these other podcasts episode three of the throwback pot is up. This week we focus on Pinkerton. Anybody?

Any Pinkerton fans in the room? No. A little deep dive. A little weezer follow up. Yeah, I'm out on this one. What are you going to do? All right. Thank you, Connor.

Thank you, guys. See, Connor. A little esoteric weezer talk. What are you going to do? That sounds great. That's okay. All right. So, now it's time.

Frag is still with us. How was your first, or are you kidding me, experience? It lived up to the hype. Like, it's, you know, I only met Conner once in person, and it was far exceeded my expectations. Oh, we went to the Nikki Blaine cigar bar. We did. Oh.

My hair smelled like cigar for like six weeks. Oh, my God. Yeah. Like, I immediately had to take a shower after leaving that place. All right. So, here we go. Let's go through some questions. Chris Law, who, of course, used to work here, and now he works over on the Rich Eisen Show.

He asks a question. many people have wondered about frags as we begin ask frags anything why what is frags hiding from the twitter world hashtag locked account you don't see locked accounts too often on twitter anymore why are you locked i don't really know i think i locked it when i was like 22 and i was scared i was going to get fired if i retweeted like complex magazine articles and since i still do that i just kind of left it locked, but I mean, if there's demand for it, I could definitely unlock it. All right. Next up, when, now you're going to get a lot of listeners.

I did. I shout out to the like 20 people who added me after your. Fragles. Fragles rocks. Fragles rocks, yeah. Fragles rocks. So you approve them. Same on the IG.

You let them in. Yeah. Well, I mean, I trust the people that you trust. Hmm. Who can we trust them? So if they turn out to be, eh, that's kind of on you guys. That's a reflection of the ATN podcast. Pressure.

Pressure. Moving on, when Matt Money Smith gets too famous, and he's almost there now that he's the voice of the Chargers, will you take over the money drops? This honestly had never crossed my mind, and I love the idea. Matt Money Smith does our intros for our show. Would you potentially be willing to replace Matt Money?

I mean, we'd have to do some negotiations. I'd have to talk to Jeff Birchfield, my manager slash representation. I mean, with all due respect. You know, compensation would have to be there. Compensation could easily be like a slice of pizza once a month. Okay. So, like, I'm not, it's, you know.

With our budget. Yeah. I mean, with all due respect, Frags, you know I'm a big fan of you. But this is like asking Jimmy Garoppolo about taking Tom Brady's job when Tom Brady's still in his prime. They're called money drops. I mean, you also started the conversation by saying we needed more swagger. And what's more swaggerific than demanding money to do something?

or in this case pizza. I think that's fair. This one is, ties back to Greg had a squabble with Miko Grimes. Do you hashtag stand with Miko or roll with the double G? Where do you go with this? G, double G, he's 60% G, which the first time I heard that was mind blowing. Not that I want beef with Miko because Miko, like, clearly knows what she's doing. She's not first ready like this.

So you're kind of backing down for Miko But also supporting Greg I'm right or die for Greg I mean Greg's awesome So Thanks Frank Very good Let's see what else

Ooh this is a good one This will be fun Did you practice like I asked you to? You didn't tell me to practice You just sent it to me This is what you're doing This one was some Gabriel Martins Why did you turn down the voice role

On the movie Her Her is one of my favorite movies The last 15 years I've never seen it Oh yeah I haven't seen it either Jackowin Phoenix. Yeah, this is when he was doing

his weird performance art. Now, this is post. No, that was after that. Yeah, this is a great movie. I'm with you. One of my five or six favorite movies in the last 10 years. Okay.

Absolutely. Here is one of my, one of the more well-known dialogue scenes from that film in which Scarlet-O-Hansson plays a disembodied robot, basically, in a future world. And Jacowin, is that he pronounced it? Joaquin Phoenix

I like Jocko. Wait, was that real? Falls in love. I was like, I don't know who's talking about. I have no idea what this person is. I thought this was like so weird around the NFL thing that I just do. There's a lot of bits. Joaquin Phoenix, let's listen to this.

It's terrible thought. Are these feelings even real? Or are they just programming? And that idea really hurts. And then I get angry at myself for even having pain. Oh, what a sad trick? You feel real to me, Smith. Thank you, Theodore.

That means a lot to me. All right. So this is for that listener who wanted to know why Frags turned it down. We're going to now reenact that role. Frags, get us going. There's absolutely no way I make it through this. You can do it. Frags, you're professional.

You've proven it in the studio. Now is the time with the lights up. I am Theodore. You are Samantha. Go. This is so weird. I want you to be Samantha. Yeah.

Let's do it. I had this terrible thought. like are these feelings even real or are they just programming and the idea really hurts and then i get angry at myself for even having pain what a sad trick you feel real to me samantha thank you theodore it means a lot to me there we go that's amazing now that is probably the weirdest thing i've ever done for you that answers some other questions people add uh that was see that i you could have played that role. Joe Hanson wasn't even in the movie.

It was just her voice. I heard you make a lot of money doing that. You should do that. You should do that. Yeah. Maybe you do need an agent. Joe Hanson was a last minute replacement. They did the whole movie with someone else's voice and then took her out.

Joe Hanson. Wow. Carried that movie. Oh, I like more. With the background knowledge on that one. That was a big her fan. That was Greg, you and I both are big fans of that movie. You guys, ladies.

Yeah. Check out her. I bet you like it. Okay. And the final question. uh, is as follows. Fraggs, who is John Gonzalez? John Ronald Gonzalez born March 12th, 1977, is an American sports writer who's

married to NFL media broadcaster, Colleen Wolf, John, whose Pisces resides in Los Angeles with his wife and two dogs. That, never mind. We have the answer. Yeah, I actually like looked that up because I was like, what's happening? And my first thought was like, that's Colleen's husband, right? And then there was all this stuff that was like around the NFL podcast. Who does Colleen Wolf date? And I was like, oh my God, this is a rabbit.

hole. I didn't even though I was going down. You have a lot of fans out there. I love that you Googled it. Oh, yeah. Because I was like, it had all these likes. Who is John Gonzalez? I had all these likes.

I was curious. It's a rabbit hole. A lot of people have been going into it. It's a question America is asking. And it's kind of slowly driving John insane. We get it in different languages now, too. All right. Fraggs.

You came in here and you showed the world that you could do it with the lights off and the lights on, this podcast. So a very good job. When are the lights off? No, when we do it, these lights overhead. Don't read into it. I'm not. I'm just asking.

That's terrible, Colleen. You know what? That's not a way to end. This marks the first and last time I'm all up here on this. And it wasn't my fault. All right. Okay. Thank you, Frags.

Thank you for having me. And keep up the good work. And one day we will pay you. I will hold my breath from that one. Wow. Really? No. Colleen's like,

What about me? Yeah. We'll work all this out. Greg is handling all this. He's the money man. We're going to form a female union in here. Is that a Jewish crack? That's a great idea.

Come on, Dan. That was not a Jewish crack. We need to get out of here now. Things are splintering. This is Dan Hansa signing off for Fragles Rock. Connie Fox, the boss, and Sully behind the glass.

Until Monday. This is an I-heart podcast.