NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - AFC South Rising, Dotson Traded and Nick Wesseling

Episode Date: August 23, 2024

The AFC South is suddenly one of the most fascinating divisions in football, so Gregg Rosenthal talks with two experts about the Texans and Jaguars. Before the deep dive, Nick Wesseling joins the show to help break down the two Thursday night preseason games starting with the Colts at the Bengals (0:40) and followed by the Bears at the Chiefs (12:33). Gregg and Nick also run through the news including Jahan Dotson being traded to the Eagles (14:15) and Justin Herbert being back at practice (20:39). After the break, former Texan Seth Payne joins the show for a deep dive on the Texans (22:55) and John Shipley of Jaguars on SI joins the show to do the same with the Jaguars (45:25). Note: time codes approximate. NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the 6th, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else.

It's everything you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sunday. don't miss it listen to the move the sticks podcast on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts you get your podcasts welcome to NFL daily where we're just a bunch of sickos staying up on a Thursday night to watch the last week of the preseason bengals colts and there's no one I would want to talk about a Bengals game with more than Nick Wesleyan, who's the one who's really staying up late there. Look a little tired, but he's ready to go. Let's go, Nick.

Woohoo. Yeah, I don't know what we learn out of these preseason games. What I learned is Anthony Richardson, hyped up pretty well for obvious reasons. He's got all the physical tools and looks amazing. but he missed a couple of bunnies and that's against a third team, Bengals defense. So we'll see what happens.

Obviously, you're not going to show too much in the preseason. I don't think we really learned too much about things, but he's got to tighten some things up if he's going to lead this Colts teams to the playoffs this year.

No, I love that, Nick, you just jumped right into it. I was thinking to do a news first, but I brought up the game, you're talking game, let's talk the game. And yes, I just saw Bengals on the schedule, primetime game,

and I thought, what would make me happy, what would make our listeners happy, what would make us more happy than to just hear from Nick Wessling, of course, and the visage, it's looking good, you look healthy, you look happy, it's always great to hear from you. My favorite Wessling in Cincinnati, you know, Phil's the old, you know, Phil's in Columbus, so I'm not counting him and the other brothers, you know, I don't really hear from them as much, so you're in the top spot, Nick. they're fine. You know, it feels okay, but you're right. He doesn't live in Cincinnati. He doesn't

count. Yeah, I mean, you said I look healthy. I'm definitely not missing any meals. So we're feeling good here. We'll see what happens with this football season. Obviously, I know you want me on because Wesleying Brothers equal ratings. So you got to go grab those while you can. No doubt. Yeah, of course, all the fans and listening, back from the around the NFL days of Chris. If you're watching on our our YouTube show, I mean, I have to admit, and it still happens to me, Nick,

when your face pops up on screen and it's just like, oh, the likeness is there. So that's not the only reason why I love you, but it is an extra bonus of why I love you. All right, let's just talk Colts Bengelston. Because, yeah, Richardson and the Colts played their starters for the first quarter and a half. And we saw it all with Richardson, I thought, in that first drive that he had, he goes right down the field, scores a touchdown.

It's one of those preseason nights where if they just took them out after one drive, everyone would be like, oh, that's great. Like he is looking ready to go, MVP, like sleeper, here we go, because he showed some pocket movement. I disagreed with Kirk Herb Street. I disagreed with him a few times in this show. We'll get to that. But one of the times was, you know, he was saying Richardson asked the show he's a good decision maker. And to me, that's one of his good strength. I think he gets through his reeds.

He makes good decisions. But he had a couple misses. He had a pick six on what I think was a miscommunication, but it was a couple of miscommunications. And ultimately, they had five drives, and that was the only score. So that's not really what you want when you're going up against the Bengals third string defense

or whatever they had out there. That touchdown was easy. Again, you said third string. The safety started to be one. He came across to like his second. or third read his eyes start on one side of the field and he goes back give the guy a little credit it wasn't within six yards of him i could have made that throw come on man um i might not have been able to make that subtle movement he made to the left to get there but i was sure uh he looked you know

he put it on on the guy on the guy on the guy jogged in for the touchdown the play right before that though he had a guy wide open in the end zone over through him missed him went off the fingertips. So it's one of those things where it gets a little tighter in the regular season against a real safety there instead of a third stringer. So we'll see what happens. I'm excited for Anthony Richardson. I don't want to take anything away. I'm curious to see, but let's not pretend like that was a world beating drive there. He was fine. It was a good drive. All I mean is he got through his reads. Like he went one to two to three pretty quick. So that was good. The limited amount last year we saw, I thought that was one of his strengths, too.

He was very quick through his accuracy issues and fumble issues, but, you know, he looked great when he was playing. It's just a reminder how little we know of this dude. I think there's almost an artificial expectation, and I'm part of it. I'm excited for him because he only had two completed games last year, and then he had two more where he didn't complete it. And on average, those games, which I went back and watched, had so many good moments that you just immediately, immediately project forward, like, oh, that's who that guy is. But it was like three games at the NFL level. And he barely played at college, and he was supposed to be one of the most raw prospects.

So they're a mystery box. They're a team I'm excited about. This is an AFC South themed show. I don't know if you know this, Nick. I have Seth Payne, former Houston Texan, who I really like, who's down there as an analyst, who's on the show. He's going to be talking Texans. And then John Shipley, who's, I think, one of the best. writers out there talking Jaguars because I'm into this division it's not really about the Titans

I mean as the last place team goes like I could watch the Titans love us is kind of fun but it's these three teams with these quarterbacks I just feel like this division has never had any juice and right now I wanted to just have a show where we talked about their juice because we saw on the rest of the field Jonathan Taylor think he's set up for a nice year 80 Mitchell he out snaps Alec Pierce tonight a good looking rookie and a lot of good players on their defense too Lyatu Latu had a sack in this game. He was my favorite defensive pass rusher in this draft. So I think this Colts team could contend if Richardson is good enough.

What do you think about the AFC South? Do you worry they're coming for the AFC North Crown as a best division? Well, I don't think that's a danger this year, but there is a lot of reason to get excited. There's still a lot of question marks with all four of these teams, I think. I mean, obviously the Texans look a little better than the other two. you mentioned the Titans. I'm a little bit excited to see what they have. See if they have any juice this year, the Titans.

I always thought they were well coached until the very end of last year when they kind of fell apart. So we'll see if the new coaching staff can get in there and do some things. And I don't really want to focus on them. I want to focus on the Jaguars. I'm sorry, the Jaguars. Yes. Make sure I say it without the Midwest accent there. but they looked like they were going to be good

and then they just kind of came out and last year and we're average the entire year looked really bad in some games, looked pretty good in some games. They're not getting talked about much this year and I'm excited that they still have a lot of playmakers. I mean, we know Trevor Lawrence. What is he?

Is he a top quarterback? Can he be a top eight guy? I think he's got the tools that we haven't seen it quite yet though. He's been more in that 10 to 12 range for the most part of his career. And he shows flashes, but we'll see what happens. Their defense should be decent. And how many points can they score? We'll wait and see. Yeah, it's a fun division.

And we'll get into all that later in the show. The last thing on the Colts that I want to get into it with Herb Street, you know, because he's listening. He really respects me a lot. He should. He, I know the preseason these games are long, and I wouldn't even notice if he said that if someone didn't clip it and send it out on Twitter.

But he spent a part of the third quarter speculating, well, you know, they know what they have in Joe Flacco, you just wonder, and I was sensing some Richardson doubt from Herbstree. It was usually very positive. So I don't mind him having a little criticism. He said, you know, what if Richardson struggles?

What then? Will the temptation be to go with Joe Flacco, you know what you got there, and you have a ready-made roster ready to win. I was like, what do you know that you have? He's played 10 games the last three years, and they've been up and down. Even the Cleveland thing was fun,

but like, let's not get carried away. In no world, like they would put me on Amazon for Thursday night football in the booth with Al over Kirk, Curve Street, before they would replace a healthy Anthony Richardson with Joe Flacco. I will, I don't know what I will do, Nick Wesley. I will drive to your house in Cincinnati,

if they replace Kirk Herbst, I mean, if they replace Anthony Richardson with Joe Flacco if he's healthy this year, that is not happening. That's not happening. No, I mean, Flacco, great career, you know, good run last year. He does it. I mean, he's my age or your age or something. He can't play anymore. I mean, he can still get in there and be a spot starter if you needed someone in an emergency and be efficient. And if you give him times, he can time to throw. He can still pick passes. But, yeah, that's not going to be a thing. I don't know if Richardson gets hurt, it's fun. You bring him in.

That's the whole point. He can fill in. He showed he can do that, but there's no chance. Wait, how, I always forget that because Chris Wesleyan, five years older than me, to the day, born on the same birthday. I always took a little pride in that, that that was cool. Wait, right, are you younger than me or are you older than me? No, I'm older than you.

I'm about to be, I'm 46. I'll be 47 in a month. Okay. So Bengals, look, they, they did. didn't play germane burton who's their third round pick until the very end there was a little conversation from the broadcast that he had been falling asleep in meetings that was news to me so that explained maybe why they won't play him a certain sort of maturity and a trust level maybe with joe burrow whether he's in the right spot but then every game they always put him against these

fourth stringers and he has lit up like one thing i've learned from the preseason there is not a third stringer in the NFL that is any match for germane burton he's just mossing them play after play it's amazing. Yeah, I mean, that catchy made over a third string safety of all things, too, it wasn't even a corner. I don't know. Like, you heard a lot about this in college. I wasn't sure

if Herb Street was saying it was happening now, or if it happened to college. I wasn't sure what that was. I hadn't heard anything in Cincinnati about that, so I don't know, but he's had problems with all the coaching staff he had in college, and now it looks like maybe he is

in the good graces of the Bengals coaching staff. We'll see, obviously, he's got the physical tools. He looks great in preseason. But he's not going to crack that top three. I think Yose Vos has that third receiver position locked up. Love Yos Chavez. I mean, heck, it might be their number one receiver to start the year. If Jamar Chase doesn't end this Holden,

this Holden's taken a little while considering, I mean, he's got that fifth year option on his contract. The Bengals aren't going to, I don't think they're going to, pay him. So this is one that's a little a little diceier than most where I could see it going up to the very end and I could actually see in this case

him skipping a game. I never predict that. Iyuk will be back. Trent Williams will be back. C.D. Lamb will be back. I actually think in this case because he because he's just going to be so annoyed that they won't even do anything that he actually might skip a game or two. It's at least possible with Jamar Chase. Yeah.

No one seemed worried about it until today. I hadn't heard anyone really talking about it much. They just assumed something would get done. They'd give him a little bumper. He would just go away and go back to practice just to, you know, I don't know what it was all about. You're right. I don't think he's going to get much if he gets anything. I don't, he's only going to sign if it's like the big Justin Jefferson type contract. And I just think they don't want to pay him this early because that's just what they, they just don't want to do it yet. And Jefferson didn't get that money until he was a year older. You know, he is a year older.

So we'll see that it's just been a weird quiet situation. The other preseason game tonight was Chiefs, Bears, backups of plenty. So not much to talk about there. Cadarious Tony, McColl Hardman are in this game heavily, which shows like they might not be a lock for this roster, which is interesting just because, you know, Hardman had that Super Bowl winning catch and Cadarious Tony's former first round pick. So we'll see if either of them, at least one of them will make the team.

But the story of the preseason has been Carson Steele of the, Chiefs who every game he plays, he has a ridiculous highlight run. Here it is. Give him the football again. Here he goes. Carson Steele break and tackles with the stiff off. Stiffhorn. It's 10 to 5. Is he in? If you're watching on YouTube, like, I love that we have the, that we're able to show the highlights and stuff. Like, he's doing this every week. He's like the next Mike Alstatt. I hate to just compare him to like another white fullback, but he's a white fullback. What was the, oh, a few years back,

what was the guy from Cleveland that had that run of like six or seven games? Peyton Hillis. He was a tailback technically. He was a bigger one and looked kind of similar in his running style there. He got on the cover of Madden,

which was like one of the more racist things that's ever happened in my lifetime. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That was funny. Congratulations, you had a great year. What are you doing on the cover of Madden? I don't know.

I don't know either. All right, we, look, I've been having so much fun. I'm taking longer than I expected. But we are going to do some news because there was some significant news. I was going to start the show with this because it was a big of a surprise. And if you're a listener to NFL Daily, it might not have been as big a surprise. Eric, let's do some news. All right.

John Dotson going from the commanders with a fifth round pick to the Eagles. for a third round pick. The Eagles also sent to seventh in this deal. So the commanders pick up a pick swap up to the third and two seventh for their first round pick from a couple years ago. Obviously, it's a different regime there in Washington with Ron Rivera out the building.

They did not seem to have any use for Jahan Dotson. Your reaction, Nick, to this trade. And I'm saying it's not a surprise if you listen to this show, because I was just saying it did not sound like they were a fan of him and someone was going to give up a decent pick I thought for Jahan Dotson and they weren't going to cut him or anything. And they got decent value.

It's telling they traded him in the division, though. They do not think this kid can play. Yeah, I think it was drafted 16 overall just a couple of years ago. It was supposed to be a great compliment to McLaren and it just never really clicked for him. He was injured his rookie year and then came back and really didn't do anything his second year, they have to be massively disappointed by this

because he looked like a good prospect coming out and he would at least be a borderline number one, if not an absolute number one there. And it just never really panned out. Seemed like he got open a lot when he was a rookie and couldn't get the ball delivered on time. And then last year, he just didn't seem like the same guy. You know, I kind of thought he had way more production as a rookie

until today when I went and checked. he had 35 catches for 523 yards but he did have seven touchdowns and that's why i think i remember it because he had a couple big plays down the field and he was he's a smaller guy that tries to like win at the catch point like make those crazy catches with guys all over him that's a hard life to live as a smaller guy but he's shown he can get open you hit the nail on the head he can run routes at the NFL level if he just has a free release. And so in Philly, is there, what, their fifth receiving option? You have A.J. Brown. You have Devontas Smith.

And now it was maybe the biggest gap in the NFL from two to three before at wide receiver. They had a guy, Britain Covey and Wilson, a rookie, who was taking snaps. And like, it was just a chasm. So now Dotson fills into that position. And mostly you'll be in the slot. But I say fifth option because they're going to throw it to Dallas Goddard. They're going to throw it to Sequin Barclay. And so then I think, okay, as a role player, he's not getting that press coverage. He can run some routes. And more than anything, he's a good backup because I did think they were in big trouble. They're such a offensive team. If Brown or Devont de Smith, who have both been really durable, ever got hurt, that just was a

really thin room. So I, it's a rare trade I like for both teams because I think Dotson is probably better than he showed. It sounded to me, Nick, just reading the reports and reading between the lines with the coaches, like the effort might have not been. Like, either he was in his own head and not confident or just like, it wasn't with the program, because whenever they brought up their receivers, they would always just say how the other guys were trying so hard and they finished every route and blah, blah, blah, and they were kind of leaving him out of that equation. Yeah, obviously we're not on the inside there, but it seems there's something amiss there. he's just he's too talented to give up on this early if you know especially when you do it now you're

right a different regime different coaching staff maybe they they looked at him and said nope cut our losses it's what it looks like right and they and to give it to philadelphia i kind of like that that's a that's a that's a djaf type of move it's like we just want the best pick possible like yeah he might be fine there like we're not worried about that we're worried about 2025 frankly like that that's what they're worried about they're getting picks they're rebuilding and they're doing it around their young quarterback. So I like it fine for both teams. We'll see if Dotson, it wasn't the only move, by the way the commanders made today. Cade York, the kind of busty Browns kicker from a couple of years ago. They got taken high in the draft. They traded a conditional pick for him and

cut Rowley Patterson. So they have their kicker. I'm going to roll through just two quick contracts, and then we'll mention Justin Herber at the end, Nick. A.J. Terrell got a contract from the Falcons, a little more than $21 million a year. They had to me do the top 50 free agents of 2025 on the site. It's the last thing I write before the season starts. The only thing I write in training camp. And I'm realizing I write it at a stupid time because they always sign these guys like a week or two later before the season started. But AJ Terrell was number six. Like he's probably a top 15 to 20 cornerback in league, maybe even top 10. And so that was good business. And then they also gave money in Kansas City to their center, Creed Humphrey,

by far now the highest paid center in the NFL. I had him number four. on my top 50 list. And that's, that's big news for the chiefs because they have a couple offensive linemen that were coming up. Now they can use the other, the franchise tag on the other one. And they've done a great job protecting Patrick Mahomes. How sick of you, sick of the chiefs are you on a scale of one to ten? As a Bengals, non-fan, although you are a fan, and just as a football fan, are you getting sick of him? I love watching the Chiefs play. I love watching the chiefs play. I mean, my wife's in the other room and she can hear me say this, but she would say argue they always get all the calls, and maybe that's true to a certain extent,

but I think you make your own luck in the NFL when you're making good plays, you're going to get more calls. So, yeah, I've got no problems with the Chiefs. I love watching them. I just feel like the fatigue is there, and I forget that you pretend that you have absolutely no emotional attachment to the Bengals. I've told you I'm a casual fan of the Bengals. It's not, I don't, I don't, you know, rude against him.

Don't you love your family? I mean, I'm not a Rams fan, but I want my daughter to be happy, so I'm happy. Yeah, maybe it's the same. Maybe it's the same. I told you I'm happy when they do well. Okay. That's good. Yeah, I'm just feeling Chiefs fatigue all around the country, definitely in my house.

That's for sure. Everyone used to love, by everyone, I mean, you know, my family members who watch a lot of football. They used to love the Chiefs, and now they're just kind of like, all right, enough of the Chiefs. Finally, the team that I thought would be their main rival was Justin Herbert and the Bengals, the Chargers, rather. I'll never forget, you know, the last season we had with Chris, we watched the Chiefs Chargers game actually at Chris's house. And Lakeisha's mom was hanging out and came over. And she loved that Chiefs Chargers matchup and she was going crazy. That was a fun memory. And they always played them tight, but they always find a way to lose in the end. And

now they're not even playing them tight anymore. I bring up all that just to say that Justin Herbert was back at practice. And according to Daniel Popper at the athletic, it was one of the best practices he's ever seen Justin Herbert play quarterbacking at the highest level. It's a rare training camp report like that that actually influences me because I was so freaked out about this foot injury. I thought their season might be done before it started. Maybe you'll get hurt again. But hearing that, that makes me happy as someone that wants to see some fun football by the Chargers. Well, let's hope so. Yeah, I mean, the league's better when he's playing well because he's an exciting quarterback doesn't mind throwing the ball

downfield and into tight windows. So it's fun to watch the Chargers play when he's playing well. So let's hope it's good. And I mean, I don't know how many opportunities he'll get to throw on a tight windows this year. But what do you mean? I mean, there'll probably all be tight windows, unfortunately. Yeah, you're just saying they're going to run the ball and they're going to be in trouble. Yeah, Chris, you know, Chris was a true believer in Herbert. He enjoyed watching him those couple years. And I think I think you would have been surprised how the next few have gone. Not that Herbert's played poorly, but just that it's really, he hasn't gotten any better and the team around him's gotten worse. Facts. I don't have anything to add to that.

That was perfect. I appreciate you. What you said today, everything was perfect too, Nick. And it's always good to see you. I got to check the schedule. See when the Bengals are on in prime time and get you on for those shows. But I like your analysis any old night. So we should have you back before then, even then. Anytime, Greg. All right. That was Nick, we're going to take a quick break, and I'll be back with Seth Payne. We'll talk some Texans after the break. What's up, everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here.

And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game from Scouting Reports and player development to team-building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week, we study the tape. Talk to decision makers and share the insights you won't find anywhere else. It's the kind of conversation that connects the dots, from college football prospects to the NFL stars of tomorrow.

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radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts hey this is matt jones i'm drew franklin and this is nfl cover zero we're just here to try to give you an NFL perspective a little bit different did you see the colts pretzel that was my other big takeaway from that what was that oh my we think NFL coverage should be informative and entertaining. And twice a week, that is exactly what you're going to get. Listen to NFL Cover Zero with Matt Jones and Drew Franklin on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL.

Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Back on NFL Daily. So, you know, one thing I'm excited about with this show, We're going to cover every team, but we do have the space here with Daley to really get into certain teams I find fascinating in a given moment of time. And that's why I'm excited about this kind of AFC South focus show.

We talk Colts already. I'm digging the AFC South this year, and they're young quarterback. So we're kind of running out of time. Season's about to start. And so I wanted to set the table for what's at stake this season in this division. That's been an afterthought.

Frankly, for most of the time I've been at the NFL, but now you have a division with four young quarterbacks, three of them top five picks, all of them extremely talented. Let's be real, like one of them, C.J. Stroud is above the rest, and one of these teams, to me, just in terms of being the team of the moment,

is above the rest. And that's the Houston Texans. And that's why I'm excited to have on former Houston Texan, Seth Payne, co-host of the Payne and Pendergast on Sports Radio, 610 in Houston show. And a man

before I even let you speak, Seth, I'm going to just, you know, so the listeners know on YouTube just what they're kind of dealing with, your trim and fit now. But this is what Seth Payne looked like as a rookie in the NFL. I believe that's a rookie. That was Jaguars.

Man, I saw it. That's so much creatine. Oh, my God. I really suggest anyone check it out. It's, I get, you got to, I don't know if you want this. If I were you, I would want this being the first thing that comes up when you Google the name, Seth Payne, because this is pretty much it right here. Yeah, that's, I'm happily married. So I'm, the scaring off women doesn't bother me at all.

I'll gladly use. That's not what I looked like when I met my wife. Yeah, that was probably my rookie year. So, yeah, that's, that's different. Yeah, Randy, yeah, okay, I was going to say, I'm going to feel intimidated and uncomfortable if you leave it up any, any longer. But, yeah, Seth now is down there doing awesome work. One of my favorite voices out there on any team. And you just came right off the field.

Actually, I'll just start there. You had a joint practice. Those are always, to me, the most interesting days of the offseason, Texans and Rams. Any takeaways just from today while you were there? Okay. So they were practicing the Rams, which is cool. Matt Stafford practiced. And I'll say the Texans defense has looked good throughout camp.

They made a lot of offseason additions. and it looks like it might be paying off. You never know until you get to the regular season. But the defense looked good. The offense looked weak at offensive line. I think C.J. Stroud looks great, throwing to Stefan Diggs and Tank Dell and Nico Collins. Like, that's been a lot of fun to watch.

But the offensive line is a bit of a work in progress, and the Rams defensive line had their way with them a bunch of times. So in the quest to be the San Francisco 49ers, that means elite passing offense and elite. rushing offense. I feel like they're a long ways off from the elite rushing offense part right now. Because of the O line. Yeah. And so Tunsell's back out there, right? And on paper, they have a good tackle combo. I guess the question is in the interior. And yeah, I don't want to, I wasn't planning to start negative. But if you asked me to be like, what could be the problem for this Houston,

Texans? I guess that's it. I hadn't really thought about it. But that that doesn't come together. because, yeah, you look at the numbers, and they were one of the worst running teams in the entire NFL last year. Right, yeah, no, and that's, trust me, like, we've had a whole offseason of fun and frivolity, and it's been really cool to watch all of this come together. Like, CJ Stroud is the real deal. I try to step away and take off my homer glasses as much as possible, but he's the real deal. And, you know, Stefan Diggs, his history is the first two years he's anywhere. Everything's awesome, so I'm not worried about it.

They got him on a one-year contract, so I don't, like, I don't foresee. any issues on that side of things. I think the defense is going to be very good rushing the passer. I just, like all offseason long as I listen to people outside of Houston, gush and heat praise. And like, I'm talking, you know, like the hardcore film watchers and everything, heat praise on the Texans. I did feel like they were whistling past the run game issue a little too easily. And I'm, I like Joe Mixing. I'm glad he's here. I, you know, I don't think he's going to be you know set records or anything like that but the the whole operation the blocking of the offensive line and the tight ends and a fullback whose name will be determined

later apparently right now it's it needs to get better if they want to be genuinely elite because they weren't that good in the red zone last year and so far in the preseason it hasn't looked so great either yeah and it's interesting too because the rams are young up front but they they could be they could be pretty good better than people think and that's interesting these join practice is I feel like, especially if you had a bad one previously, it's all the Rams have been doing is having Jordan practice. And they always come out for the next one all fired up. But that, that's good to think about. How did Mixen look, by the way? Because I was, he was on my radar that he missed so much of camp early. And he's been a guy that at the beginning of each

of the last two seasons, I'm like, oh, Joe Mixon's back. And I love Joe Mixen just as a runner, just his style of running. And then he was someone like, if you watched him from week one and then it was week eight. It just wasn't like, I don't know if his body was breaking down, but he just wasn't the same guy by the middle of the last couple seasons. I think with Mixin, for one, yeah, there's, because he was gone for, he practiced the first day, my radio co-host, Sean Pendergast, so I'm kind of rubbing his quad after that practice just as he was talking to a family member or something.

And then, yeah, his soft tissue injury was gone for a couple weeks. It's noticeably different when he's on the field versus other running backs. He's just, you know how he is. He's way bigger when you see him in person than you expect. Like, he's a big, fast athletic dude. He looks like Joe Mixon. And I think he'll be just fine. It's just to get the absolute most out of him.

The thing I'm curious about in the difference between being in Cincinnati and being here is that in Cincinnati, they had kind of transitioned into being a team that was in shotgun all the time. And Joe Mixon is at his best when he's QB under center. He's seven yards deep in the backfield and he can just hit it. this offense will do that a lot. So as long as the offensive line can get in sync, I think he's going to be just fine. I just want to be able to maximize it. One little interesting part of that too was with the Rams in town. I was talking to Jordan Roderick, who covers them for the athletic. She's all over NFL Daily too. Here we go. Yeah, I love it. I mean, I was so excited. I fanboid over

because I love that play collars podcast. And like Cam Acres is with the Texans right now. So So Cam Acres comes to the Texans after his second Achilles tendon tear. And when they first signed him, I was like, oh, don't pay attention. He just had his second Achilles tendon tear. It's just an experiment. The first day he was out there, like, oh, wow, I never would have thought that guy had a second Achilles tendon tear nine months ago. So I was talking to Jordan about it, you know, and one of the things with Cam Acres

was that the Rams transitioned away from being an outside zone running team. And it's not quite the same fit for Cam Acres. whereas the Texans are an outside zone running team and Cam Acres might be a better fit with the Texans but also at the same time we're watching Damian Pierce in the preseason game so far averaged one yard per carry on seven carries it's just it's not it's not feeling good for Damien right now

and I think Cam might end up if he's healthy et cetera et cetera like he might actually end up being a much better option than I gave them credit for when they signed him that's funny that camp in the preseason is so long and I'm doing this show daily, that it's long enough for narratives to turn in on themselves by the end of it, because I was all excited about, oh, like, Damien Pierce, maybe this is the comeback season. He did show something his rookie year. All right, let's get to the fun.

Let's get to the reason why you were right. You said the people nationally, I don't know if you're including me in that, like the film watchers, am a part of the cool group? No, I mean, I would take it. I mean, I am high on the Texans. How can you not be? They are the team, to me, of the moment. Like, they are the, I thought they should have been in that. kickoff game, it's crazy to say a game between Lamar Jackson and Patrick Mahomes would be

maybe more interesting with the Texans. But I guess when I think of the kickoff game, I like the idea of the champ versus like some new challenger. And the Texans are that team. And they feel more real than even the Lions felt at this time a year ago when they were that team and they delivered on it because of Stroud. And you've gotten to see, you know, this kid from from day one and the maturation, and obviously he's got more than enough weapons around him this year and kind of how he manages that as a leader, I think is interesting, but also just how you think he manages that and develops as a quarterback, because we've seen so many times quarterbacks really develop so much between one and two.

And if you think about that with Stroud, that's just going to be insane. Just kind of give me your impressions being around him in this team for a year plus now. The really cool thing about Stroud last year was you could kind of, you could see the stages of development. So the first game versus the Ravens, they come out and Bobby Slowick, and Bobby Slovak has basically said this much himself, did that classic first time coordinator thing where they tried to do all the good stuff all at once. And it was just a little bit of overload. You know, they had multiple guys in motion and everything while they're playing with three best. backup offensive linemen. And it was a little too much. And then over the first, the course of those first two games against the Ravens and the Colts, CJ took 11 sacks in those two games. And then

all of a sudden, CJ didn't get sacked for several games in a row after that. Like he figured out, all right, I got to get rid of the ball sometimes. You know, you saw him really steadily learn what he couldn't, couldn't get away with in terms of interceptions. I think sometimes people look at his completion percentage, which wasn't sky high last year, and they think of that as like, oh, maybe he wasn't as accurate as he thought he was, as we thought he was. No, he was super accurate. He was very mature in terms of throwing the ball away, or throwing passes that were either going to be caught or incomplete, but not interceptions. So, like, the ball, and some of his incompletion percentage is actually due to his accuracy and his ability to throw to a safe

place. So his, you know, only throwing five interceptions on the year. was something that developed over time. And his ability to start to, I think, understand and feel the pass rush was really cool. And it's one thing that they talked about they're working on this training camp is just the efficient pocket movement, you know, taking one step instead of three,

you know, just moving in the pocket instead of scrambling. And I think he's taken a step in that regard. So it's kind of like, it's all this stuff that you hope your quarterback develops by year three so you can make a decision on whether or not to give him that quarterback extension. I feel like he kind of fast forwarded through a lot of those processes last year. And I honestly, I tried to, I sought out every Kurt Warner, Dan Orlovsky, J.T. O'Sullivan,

every former quarterback that breaks down film, just looking for guys to point out where maybe it wasn't actually that good. And like, they're just, they're universally blown away by how quickly he moved through that part of it. So that's a really cool thing. And yet at the same time, I think he remains very humble about it. I know he talked a lot of smack on podcasts in the offseason, but he's like he's still got it. He's got the appropriate size chip on his shoulder, you know?

It's not a Johnny Mansell size chip on his shoulder. It's just the right size of chip to keep attention to keep him focused. Yeah, I could see that. He just seems like a guy you would want to hang out with. I mean, he's a guy that I think that makes you feel things. He makes me feel at watching him. And you mentioned the pocket movement. I mean, to me, I'm sure he could get better at that,

but just his natural feel, that's tough to teach. And it reminds me a little bit of some of the greats I've enjoyed watching. And just the style of quarterback I like, whether it's a Brady or a Rivers or a Gino even, like on a lower level. But he just, he reminds you of those guys. And that he just obviously doesn't seem like one of those guys in terms of how he carries himself. he does seem like a guy

and you can speak to all these weapons here that I think would be uniquely suited for a second year player to kind of handle and understand to keep everyone happy because look at by the end of last year it was just Nico Collins as like a big time playmaker

now it's Dell healthy again looking good Stefan Diggs is there Nico Collins and then they're deep I expect them and we don't need to get into who this will be but they have the best like wide receiver six and seven in the league they have Noah Brown and Robert Woods and Xavier Hutchinson who's a good young player

and who am I forgetting METCHI? Like someone's going to get treated here. Robert METCHIT started taken off yeah in the last couple weeks. Someone's going to get traded here and I don't even need to, it does it for our purposes it's not that big a deal

because they have so many stars. Like how do you see him just like as a guy that's to me going to be one of the faces of the league and certainly the face of Houston sports for the next 10 plus years? I think the the pairing of him and Bobby Sloick has been really good in terms of just the X's and O side of things.

I think the pairing of Dimeco Ryan's and C.J. Stroud and their personalities and their commitment to kind of doing things a certain way, I think that's where it could be really, really good. And you've got a defensive-minded head coach. So at some point, Bobby Slowick's probably going to get hired a way to be a head coach somewhere. You're going to have to replace that offensive coordinator.

I think the biggest thing that I noticed about C.J. from the X's and O's is, and I'll credit Ryan Day and the staff at Ohio State for a lot of this, he takes the leadership part of it very seriously, and it's not just some stuff that he's read in a book. Like he talks all the time, and, you know, you see in his actions, he really wants to form personal relationships with everybody on the team and really get to know them so that they trust each other and that everybody, you know, is moving in the same direction. And with that, you know, we saw him in training camp this year really start to take on more of that actual captain of the ship mentality. You know, he's correcting guys.

He's calling him up when the practice isn't going well. And he's doing all that. But it doesn't, it feels very, very natural because he took his time in building to that. And I think he feels more comfortable and he feels like this is, last time this year, he still didn't know if he was going to be the starting quarterback. where obviously this year, he's the starting quarterback. Right, and it's going to be fun. That's such a fun week one game, them in the Colts. You mentioned D'Amico, and he just won another award from last year.

I don't even know what this. It was some sort of coachy award, and he... Pro Football Writers' Association or something or other, yeah. And he did do a great job because one thing I thought he did a good job was he took players that just weren't as good under other coaches, whether they were on the Texans or whether they came in, guys like Blake Cashman, Christian Harris, and various players, and he made them better.

And, like, that's... Belichick always said, like, that was all you got to do. It's, like, if you can just show someone how to improve, they're going to love you and trust you. And obviously, he's a great leader, and everyone likes him as a person, but you also need that part of it. Now, it seems like he has a better roster.

It feels like Daniel Hunter is an upgrade from Gernard. They tried to upgrade a little bit at linebacker. They drafted Camarie Lasseter, just feels like they're more talented. I've heard people who've come in and out of Houston this month and people that have seen a lot of training camps and everyone's just like, wow, this team is so talented. There's so many good players everywhere.

As a former defensive lineman, just give me where you're most excited, you're most impressed, your most surprised out of this camp. All right, good. You mentioned a couple of the big names. Daniel Hunter, man, I'm guilty of this, like of not having really appreciated just like how, freakishly good he is in a lot of ways, or just what a physical freak he is. That dude's a freak.

And it's cool and fun to watch him work with Will Anderson. Camari Lasseter is understandably, I think, flying under the radar in a lot of ways outside of Houston. He's had a really good camp. And he's, you know, he's got, you know, you talk about teaching somebody to swim by throwing him in the pond. He is out there from day one going against Stefan Diggs, Nico Collins, Tank Dell. and he's battled them.

Like, he's battled them. And today at practice against the Rams, it's like every time I looked over to the defensive side of the field, he was breaking up a Matt Stafford pass. It was, like, he's doing really, really well. So as in the regular, you know, you've got to do it in the regular season,

but that looks really good. El Shire is probably an under-heralded signing because I don't think El Shire, the linebacker, he's not going to be an all-pro or anything likely, but he's, he's D'Amico Ryan's in a lot of way. Like, in terms of, because I played my last year in the NFL was D'emiko's rookie year.

And D'Amico was this guy that came onto the team. And, you know, by midway through his rookie season, we're calling him cap for captain. Wow. Because that's like just, and you try to explain it to people. And people talk so much about culture and that it just becomes white noise because every coach comes in and says they're going to establish the culture. And then usually they make an exception here.

They don't really follow the motivational poster there. Like, it's just, this is just who D'Amico is. He's one of the rarest individuals I've met in football. And it's hard to describe and explain sometimes until you see it. And it's really cool this year. I think you start to see, I think the team's taken on his personality. And that part of it, like, I'm as jaded and as cynical as the rest when it comes to talk about that stuff for all the reasons I just mentioned. But D'Amico's just different.

What made he jaded, just seeing a few different coaches that weren't at Domingo's level as a player? There's been a lot of change. I got to say, I was kind of on the why let Dick Kisario pick another head coach. Who knows if he even really was the one that picked Domeco Ryan's, but credit to the Texans, because the Broncos wanted him, and he chose the Texans, and that changed everything, and ultimately they've been proven right

because Casario's had a lot of good players brought in, too. You know what? Part of it is, man, I mean, there was a lot of dysfunction. in the organization for a couple years. And part of it, I don't want to get too deepened up all of this, but if you look at the chiefs when they first transferred ownership after I'm blanking on his name passed away, there was like a little bit of turmoil for a little bit.

And I think after Bob McNair passed away and Cal, his son took over, there were a lot of different voices and a lot of different people kind of grabbing power. And it was an ugly situation. So, like, there was only so much David Culley or Lovie Smith was going to be able to do. They fixed some of that, and they righted the ship in a lot of regards. And the thing about Casario was, you know, Casario took the job.

You know, and without getting the timeline exactly nailed down, basically Casario took the job. And then Deshaun Watson requested a trade. Yes. And then all of the allegations came out against Deshawn Watson. And meanwhile, there was a salary cap mess because Bill O'Brien and Jack Easterby went a hog wild, spending like they, spending like hillbillies who just won the lottery. And so, like, Casario had to clean that up. And I did think that, you know, Casario, he was very impressed with D'Amico on the call.

I do believe that it was going to be Casario's choice on making that hire. A lot of people were skeptical that D'Amico would want to come here or that the McNair's would want DeMico because, you know, Demico had sued them for the field conditions a few years back. There was that side of it. And then the Texans did not have good PR at the time. I just, I knew from the beginning that DeMico and Casario were going to get along great because they're both, they've got much different personalities, but they're both very focused on ignoring extraneous BS and just caring about the thing. Like the Pain and Pender Gas podcast, like them. Yeah, yeah, like any of the, yeah, the stupid media or just even like old school coaching BS, you know, like there, Casario's not trying to be Bill Belichick.

Casario is just very much his own guy. And I think he pulled, he pulled some really good things from New England, but he also understands that every organization is different. And you don't want to go the way of some of those other like head coaches have gone from out of New England. Yeah, that's, I, not, maybe you guys do do a podcast, but maybe they make it into a podcast. But that's four hours on the radio every morning. I cannot talk anything about suddenly going daily when you're doing four hours daily. One of my favorites, Seth Payne, let's fly another pick of Seth Payne up here before we go. Just to let the listeners know what they're dealing with.

Be impressed, everybody. I mean, I'm impressed. I'm impressed. Great career in the NFL and great career as a guy in the media, one of my favorites. And look, he lucked out. One of his former teammates becomes the local head coach. That's perfect. That can't be bad for business.

That's got to be great. Thank you for everything. This team, to me, they are like, they are the team right now. The Houston, Texas. Amazing to think where they were, where they are. But we'll get you back on later in the season to see how they're doing. Awesome, man. I'm sorry I was negative.

They just got to get the run game going. No, you weren't negative at all. I'm into it. Next after the break, we're going to have John Shipley talking Jaguars right after this. What's up, everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game from scouting reports and player development

to team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week, we study the tape, talk to decision makers, and share the insights you won't find anywhere else. It's the kind of conversation that connects the dots, from college football prospects to the NFL stars of tomorrow. We break down the draft, analyze matches. and evaluate how teams put it all together on game day. Plus, we dig in the coaching strategies, roster construction, and the trends that shape the league year after year. Whether you're a die-hard fan

or just love understanding the game on a deeper level, we give you the full picture. If you want insight that goes beyond the box score, this podcast is for you. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Six podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, this is Matt Jones. Now, I'm Drew Franklin. And this is NFL Cover Zero. We're just here to try to give you an NFL perspective a little bit different. Did you see the Colts Pretzel? That was my other big takeaway from that game. What was that? Oh, my.

We think NFL coverage should be informative and entertaining. And twice a week, that is exactly what you're going to get. Listen to NFL Cover Zero with Matt Jones and Drew Franklin on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Very excited for my next guest, John Shipley, who writes for SI.com about the Jaguars.

He co-hosts the Jaguars on SI.com podcast with Gus Logue, who's also excellent. And sounds a little too much like John Shipley at first. I want you to work on that for me, John. Like, I have to figure out who's who. Well, we can get into what a good job you do, John. But I just want to start this way. You analyze this team from a very considered, intelligent, I would say, unemotional perspective.

But what if I told you, there's just something about this Jaguars team. Like, I don't know what to do with. They're just there. Like, they're not that great at any one thing, but they're not that bad at anyone thing. So I start just asking you, like, what are the Jaguars? Yeah, they're not. Honestly, this is my six year covering them. It's been like that, probably like five out of six years.

Like last year was the only year I've been around them where there were really expectations. And it definitely feels like how they finished last year. Like they were the biggest collapse in football last year. You know, start eight and three, lose five year last six games. They lost the last five games Trevor Lawrence started. They probably lose their last six that they don't play, you know, Bryce Young and a merry bunch in Carolina in week 17. So definitely feels like a lot of the feelings around Jackson's.

are rooted in how bad last year ended. And it's all to blame them. They've gone 9 and 8 the past two years. They just kind of feel like, you know, like if 9 and 8 was a football team, it kind of feels like the Jacksonville Jaguars as an organization right now. Like you said, not one of the worst teams,

but nobody, I think, even locally, expecting them to, like, threaten, like, the Kansas City Chiefs or Baltimore Ravens or anything like that. Which is crazy because if you think about the trajectory of this theme, you know, they get Trevor Lawrence as hyped up a, quarterback prospect as there's been since Andrew Luck. And then

they have the end of the 22 season. They play the Chiefs pretty tough in Kansas City. Like it felt like the start of something. And then the end of last year you mentioned it. And I know Jaguars fans are probably sensitive about this. I guess this is the upside. Like if that was the Giants who had the end of the last season, like that

just would have been something the entire NFL and the media is talking about you know, for the entire off season and everything. But instead it's the Jaguars. And I look at this roster and I actually think there's more reasons for optimism than there has been, including going into last year. I was pretty down on the Jaguars going into last year, just that they, you know, that they couldn't necessarily keep it up.

And they're interesting to me because they risk getting passed, you know, not just by the Texans and their young QB, but possibly the Colts and their young QB. So I kind of want to go back to Trevor because to me that the clear reason that might not be true that the Jaguars could win this division is just like, well, what if our QB? is the transcendent QV? What if, you know, in his fourth year, he takes everything he's learned and the new weapons around him.

And, like, he's the best quarterback in the division. They have a chance to win this division. Kind of where are you at just with Trevor and his development and everything that's led him here? Yeah, it honestly, like, it's a pretty good micro-aism

of, like, just how NFL media and fans, I think, consume the sport. It's more like, what have you done for me lately? You know, like Anthony Richardson's the new shiny Tory in Indianapolis. CJ Shroud, you know, he's pretty much on every top 10 quarterback list. You can think of a shot con, you know, met with local media a couple months ago.

And he more or less was like, it feels like deja vu with how the Texans are being talked about. Same way the Jaguars and Trevor Lawrence being talked about a year earlier. But, you know, somebody new, somebody fresh comes in and does what people expect you to do. They're going to jump you. So I think when I watched, you know, Trevor Lawrence, you know, him and CJ Stratt last year, I think it was week 11 in Houston when the Jaguars beat them. It was like, if it wasn't, you know, the Jacksonville Jaguars and. If it wasn't like an AFC South battle, I feel like a lot of more people would have came away from that game thinking like we just saw two like long time, 10 year franchise quarterbacks like you get out for four quarters and then awesome back and forth.

I think Trevor and C.J. I'd probably lump them like in the same tier. And I think inside the building, you know, the Jaguars, the issues that they have were Trevor Lawrence are less about like, you know, him missing open receivers, his decision making. It's more about asking him to like tone it down a little bit and what he's trying to do and understand. stand that, hey, you're the franchise quarterback. Some of these things you're doing, you know, maybe you did at Clemson, you can't do it because you have, you know, legitimately like hundreds of jobs. They're relying on you and your health. It goes back to the Tampa Good Day game. I think

they played on Christmas Eve last year. They get completely destroyed second half of the game. I think it was like late third quarter. They're down by like 20 plus points and Trevor scrambles out of the pocket and he lows his shoulder against a defensive back while he's going out of bounds. Ends up getting a shoulder sprain. Isn't a hundred percent

healthy against Tennessee Titans two weeks later. Those are the kind of things, I think, internally, they want Trevor to improve at, just that protecting yourself, having them more, you know, I guess situational and self-awareness. But I think, you know, the Jaguar struggles last year. I think very little of it had to do with Trevor Lawrence playing bad football. That makes sense. You know, sometimes he definitely pushed the envelope too much, especially with, you know,

ball security, trying to be Superman on every play. I think a lot of reasons that they were eating three to begin with was with Trevor. And going into this year, you know, if you asked me to list of top 10 concerns I have for the Jaguars, I'm not sure Trevor's, you know, even on the list. So he's definitely, you know, it's kind of a weird dynamic with him because he hasn't met those expectations people set for him. But the expectations people set for him was like to be like Hall of Fame player basically, you know, after three or four years. And he's not there yet. But I certainly think he's a quarterback that you win because of and not in spite of.

Yeah, I agree with that. but I'm also part of the problem because, you know, if I'm ranking the quarterbacks, we did that going into this year. It's like Stroud to me right off the bat, and maybe I'm just getting too excited because to see a rookie do that. Like I do put him up in that, like, has a chance to be top five or six this year and, like, was close to that already. And Trevor is obviously good quarterback.

He's obviously above what we used to call the Dalton line of like he is a franchise quarterback. There's no question about that. I think it's just the range of outcomes of what his career can be is. multiple time pro bowler or I think it's unfair to say like one of the greatest quarterbacks ever but a couple tiers higher so you watch them every day and I do want to stay on Trevor just one more question because like what what do we not like know about him like first of all how's he looked in practice in camp and then just sort of like a little bit behind the scenes of how he's kind of developed into this role of being like the most important guy in an

entire franchise yeah for sure I think so he does definitely had a slower start to training camp this year. Kind of the M.O. with Trevor Lawrence in training camp the last couple of years has been he starts out red hot and it's shredding the defense. And then as the defense catches up, you know, normally slows down a little bit. It's kind of the reverse this year. And they went from practicing against Mike Caldwell scheme where the corners are, you know, practically 10 yards off the ball. There's, you know, easier windows or quick throws, stuff like that to, you know, Ryan Nielsen scheme where receivers are getting pressed at a line of scrimmage,

seeing a lot too high coverage. And you could tell it was a big adjustment for passing offense like through the first i want to say four or five practices i think he had four or five picks he threw two picks to andrew wingard in one practice and you know winger's a good like special teams player but he shouldn't be picking off you know you start quarterback twice in one practice and then but after that it really seems like he settled into a groove i'd say the last probably like two or three weeks is as consistent as i've seen you know trevor lawrence in training camp practices i feel like skill room they have around him kind of fits his skill set a little bit better than the last couple years.

Like Calvin Ridley is by far the best receiver he's ever had, but just looking at the whole room together. You know, he's never really had a pure deep threat like he has in BTJ. You know, Gabe Davis is a bigger body than Zay Jones, a little bit better over the middle. They're not asking Marvin Jones to run vertical routes at like age 33 anymore.

So things are a little bit better around him. I think behind the scenes and even during practice, I think you're seeing him kind of take the reins more and be more vocal. they had joint practices against Tampa Bay Bucking Neers last week and I had him I think he was like

sacked like they weren't taking them to the ground but it would have been a clear sack like six different times in team drills and by the end of it you could see him getting you know visibly frustrated and you know telling the offensive line more or less like you know this isn't acceptable whereas I think two years ago he's probably

just silently you know walking back to the huddle and in his mind he's probably thinking you know like what the heck's going on but I think now you're seeing him kind of demonstrate that you know, on field leadership a little bit more. So you said Calvin really is the best receiver he's ever had, which is a failure, I think, for three, you know, three years of a young quarterback when you think. Not that Calvin really is a bad receiver.

He's a good starting receiver, but I tend to think he's maybe just like a smidge overrated, maybe wasn't as consistent as you would want and maybe not in the right place, whether that's coaching, whatever was going on last year. It's been interesting to hear you and Gus talk about it. And yeah, I tell people, like the way, the way to learn about teams is listen to Good Team podcast. And like I said, the Jaguars on SI podcast is one of the best out there. I just, I learn a lot from it.

One of the things I've learned this preseason, you guys talking about how they're using Gabe Davis, maybe a little differently than you expected as, you know, instead of just this vertical guy, which maybe wasn't the perfect fit in Buffalo, he's doing more of the intermediate routes and getting open and he's over the middle. And then you have my guy, Brian Timis Jr., who I'm very excited about because I'm a very basic NFL draft scout where I just saw the way he moved and I was like, this has to translate. Not just like, I know he runs fast, but more of the way he just like glides and can

stop and start and just I just thought it was rare movement. I was like there's the floor of what I think he could be as a pro is pretty high because it's just going to translate. And it sounds like that's been translating lately. So you have those two guys. You have Evan Ingram who's coming off a monster year. You have a great, maybe not great running back, but it's certainly above average running back in ETN,

who I think is a little misunderstood. And I was like, this is a good group. I think it's better than it's been before. Just I guess just make me feel great about my Brian Thomas Jr. evaluation. I guess let's start there. No, I mean, really throughout training camp, I honestly, I'm not sure if I've seen like a single,

like here deep ball thrown to Gabe Davis. Like it certainly does not look like he's being used like he was in Buffalo. And I think in Jacksonville, you're going to see Brian Thomas kind of in the role. Gabe Davis wasn't in Buffalo where they're just giving him, you know, the vertical passing game and saying, you know, you're the guy is going to get behind defenses. They definitely started off a bit slow, I think, in training camp, which you probably expect, you know, rookies, they're doing a lot of thinking, you know, the first week of training camp. But ever since like two practices before the first preseason game, when he called,

that great, you know, one-handed cradle catch against the chiefs, you know, he's really turned it on. He's, Ronald Darby was locking him up, like, easily during the first week of camp. Since then, you know, he has a couple scores over Darby. It looks like he's somebody who, you know, no matter who you put in front of him, he's able to get behind the defense. And the Jaguars have drawn up some good concepts to get him behind the defense. He had one play against Tampa Bay where, you know, he kind of did a little, like, stop and go route, you know, from the slot. And You know, a guy with like legit four three speed, you know, running vertical routes out of the slot, it's not going to be easy to defend. So he's easily, I'd say, the best deep threat Trevor Lawrence is at in his career.

And Trevor Lawrence, like, he's kind of been neutered, I think, like especially last year in the scheme, you know, kind of almost Alex Smith, like West Coast style where he's getting the ball and immediately throwing it. You know, Evan Ingram has an average, it felt like he had an adot of like one yard at times last year. Well, they're just trying to immediately get the ball out of his hands. But Trevor Lawrence, I think, wants to play a vertical game. And Brian Thomas gives him a weapon. He hasn't had. Like, he played with DJ Chark for like a tip of coffee in 2021. But I've seen more out of Thomas in training camp as a deep threat than, you know,

I saw out of chart back then. So I definitely think he's going to be heavily utilized. And I think I agree with you. I think he's more than just the one trick pony. You know, he has the whole athletic skill set. Like he can be, in my opinion, like as time goes on, a pretty good route running. I mean, he ran a great route against Tampa Bay, that little comeback on the Savon.

You're already seen teams respect to speed. And it definitely feels like LSU asked him to run like two routes pretty much. He's like learning everything now that he has the physical ability to grow into more than that. So I think this year he's going to have like a defined role as, you know, a field treacher and a guy that do try to get the ball into his hands. But, you know, moving forward like long term, I definitely think he has, you know, big big potential in. I had some people yelling at me online yesterday for sharing it.

I didn't say to quote, but, you know, Pete Priscoe, a longtime Jaguar's guy. He said he thinks he may be a Jamar Chase, Justin Jefferson type. So I'm not going to go that for it, but it just shows you like the kind of momentum that he has right now. That he's beating defensive backs badly enough that, you know, it went from people being definitely concerned during the first week of training camp to now. He's going to he's getting these crazy, you know, comparisons. Yeah, I love Pete. I love anyone who's overcome his lack of height like myself to have such a great career. He's right about the same.

Although he's much stronger, to be fair. But Pete goes big with his predictions. I wouldn't even go that big. And I loved Thomas. I thought the Colts should have taken him. And were those back-to-back picks? Those were like my two favorite players in the draft Latu. And Thomas, no, they weren't back-to-back picks.

So I liked both picks. I was cool with the Colts taking Latu, but I'm going to be kind of tracking those two guys over the next few years. And, yeah, fantasy, like, fantasy implications. I'm not even that high on him. It's not about, like, his numbers this year. It's about that he's going to help this offense. He's going to have some production, certainly, and I think long-term.

He reminds me of D.K. Metcalf, not at all in playing style. But just in that, I think, yeah, he's limited coming out, but guys can get better when football is the only thing they're doing, and they're getting NFL coaching, and I think he has the skill set to do it. and he has just such obvious physical skills. And that's where I get the DK Metcalf part. It was like, that's going to translate on some level, and then they'll get better and better.

So I'm excited for that. You mentioned Peterson and kind of the short offense. You know, Doug Peterson's an interesting guy. He's a little off the radar nationally, too. Obviously, like a Super Bowl champion. Last year was weird. He's someone who elicits strong reactions actually from other people in the league. Some people think he's great.

And other people are like, is Doug Peterson overrated? Like, where are we at with Doug? Peterson and the Jaguars experience right now. He came in and obviously I think overall you'd have to give him like a B grade. He's done a pretty good job. But just where are you at? What's he like?

He's been a little off the radar compared to when he was so much part of like the national discourse. Yeah, no, I think like, like I said, the Jaguars are like the team embodiment of a 9-88 record. Doug Peterson's probably like the head coach and tournament of like a non-8 record like now. Like he's definitely a solid coach, I think. but I don't think anybody's disagreeing,

seeing him off like top 10 lists or anything like that. He's definitely done some good things in Jacksonville. Like he's raised absolutely the floor of the team. Raising the ceiling, getting them over the hump, I think is, you know, the next biggest question.

But he's definitely came in, and especially that first year, you know, coached Obermeyer, like there legitimately had to be a lot of like healing done. There were a lot of people, especially inside the locker room who their confidence was kind of fried by just getting,

you know, completely onslaughted by urban. Remire. I know if at least, you know, one player who, you know, after an Urban Meyer tirade was legit, like, left to tears. And I'm like, these are men. So they obviously had to build, he had to build a confidence back up. I think last year, you know, he probably had to try to navigate, you know, them reading too much into their own press clippings. And he himself said that they had an issue of that last year. That was probably a failure on his part. I think he's a solid, you know, coach. But there definitely is some questions, you know, in terms of what he's doing,

in terms of how he's operating a team, especially at play caller. Like me personally, I don't think it's that big of a deal if Doug Peterson's not the press play caller and press Taylor is because Doug Peterson's still putting the offense together, you know, every week in meetings.

Doug Peterson's hearing every play call. You know, he's ultimately, it's ultimately his offense. But some people absolutely do care. And that includes Jabr's owner Shot Khan, who more or less has said, like I want Doug to call plays this year,

but it's up to him. That's, I think, would be the one concerning thing about Doug Peterson and Jackson, Like, Les Taylor's legitimately probably the reason he got fired in Philadelphia, you know, just his loyalty to Press Taylor. And then he's running it back again in Jacksonville. And it kind of feels like, you know, a, you know, groundhog-based scenario where it's like, you know, you already did this. Why go through this a second time? So while it might not be that big of a deal, you know, in reality, it's definitely a big deal to the most important person in the franchise.

So I'm interested to see who's calling plays this year. If Press Taylor calls plays and they miss the playoffs, I think it could get interesting for Doug. I really do, which is kind of wild because, I mean, you know, winning 18 games in his first two, he's won more games in two seasons than Gus Bradley won like four and a half. So it's definitely an interesting dynamic watching moving forward. Yeah, Gus Bradley, that was, that was kind of the era where, yeah, it's why I want to do a show focusing on the AFC South right now, because that was the era where you got the Jags, Titans, TNF game like during the World Series.

Like, oh, we know what you're doing NFL. like you're kind of sneaking in the bad TNF game like during the World Series and like that's all you saw of the AFC South all year on prime time I we don't have a ton of time left but you guys were really drinking the the Ryan Nielsen Kool-Aid you guys were having a conversation about like hey what do we do if Ryan Nielsen gets hired as a head coach I was like it's may is he that impressive in the offseason and then just along with that I guess like give me give me anyone on the defensive side just maybe that people don't don't know as much about, but it's surprise you or look good.

You just cut your eye between Nielsen and the defense this preseason. No, I think the big thing with Nielsen is that guy, guys being used more to their strengths. You know, mainly Josh Hines Allen and Trayvon Walker. Mike Tongan had a great quote about the Jaguars defense last year. He's like, they run a three, four, but their outside linebackers are like defense events. And I'm like, yeah, that's the entire problem. You know, like Trayvon Walker, he is best with his hand in and dirt moving forward,

not dropping in the coverage. So you're seeing more of that from Ryan Nielsen, a lot more detailed work, especially with the defensive line, different, I think just brand of football. And I think that's what has got a lot of people, you know, excited. Change makes people excited. So that's probably a big thing of it, you know, him and my Caldwell scheme. It's a complete 180. In terms of players that, you know, people should probably watch for, you know, I think that the staff has been really high on second round pick, Mason Smith.

You know, he missed a ton of time at LSU. That was a pick that was pretty blasted because he didn't really do much in college and they took him top 50. you know, he's really impressed. He might even, you know, leap Roy Robinson Harris on the depth chart as Eric Armstead's backup. And then Antonio Johnson at safety, a fifth round pick last year. He's going to start this year. They really liked his blitzing ability and his ability to work, you know, as a strong safety last year. And he seems like a good compliment to Andre Sisko in the back end.

I think with more snaps with him, he could be a guy that kind of surprises people. Yeah, that's a fun safety group. Cisco is another guy. You know, I know you guys talk about us having a potential breakout year can be a play. Playmaker, and it's one of those where Nielsen can get creative. And he was impressive with the Falcons last year. They didn't have great talent. Ultimately, their production was, it depended on what numbers you looked at, but it wasn't

like amazing. But again, he was creative and it was fun, and you hope that the safeties can kind of make up for what to me is a little lack of depth behind Tyson Campbell at cornerback. I think this team's more interesting this year than the last few years. I don't know if they're going to be good or not, but I do like that this division, is so watchable. I'm going to be into all the AFC South games, especially Jaguars, Titans, and Colts.

And I'm going to stay into listening to you, John, and Gus. Got to give Gus a shout out here on the podcast. And thanks for stopping by. I appreciate you, man. Thanks, man. As always, thanks for all the support. No worries, John. Really does a great job.

And yeah, that's it for this week. This has been a fun week. Man, next week, we're going to do the same recap of the preseason games, but it might be more team notes with Nick Shook. That comes out on Monday nights because a lot of backups playing. And then we get into some of our predictions, and it's really the last week of the offseason.

We are almost to 2024. Until then, see you next time. Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the 6, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building for a lot Coaching Trends and how front offices construct winning rosters.

We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else. It's everything you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sunday. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Sticks podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.