NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Andrew Luck Retires; Succession of Power in the AFC

Episode Date: August 27, 2019

A room filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Chris Wesseling , Gregg Rosenthal and Marc Sessler bring you their reactions on the historic Andrew Luck retirement and what it means for the Indianapolis Colts. The heroes also spin through their preseason week 3 takeaways (26:42) and discuss how the end of the Andrew Luck Era in Indy shifts the balance of power in the AFC. (40:20)Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hello. This certainly isn't how I envision this or plan this. But I am going to retire. This is not an easy decision. Honestly, it's the hardest decision on my life. But it is the right decision for me. For the last four years or so, I've been in this.

cycle of injury pain rehab injury pain rehab and it's been unceasing and relenting unrelenting both in season both and off season and i felt stuck in it and the only way i see out is to to no longer play football it's it's taken my joy of this game away uh and In one of the more shocking happenings in one of the more shocking happenings in the NFL's recent history, Andrew Luck announces his retirement from the NFL, the cult superstar quarterback announcing that injuries have taken the love from the game for him. So a man who's turning 30 years old on September 12th met with Colts owner Jim Ursaid earlier Saturday to explain his decision. And this is Dan Hansis of the Around the NFL podcast presented by Sirius XM. I'm joined by Mark Sessler, Chris Wessling, and Greg Rosenthal. And boys, this is an absolute bombshell that changes the complexion of the Colts, obviously, but the AFC.

and Wes luck nobody knew this was coming this we were at patrick claybond's shrimp oil in fact in the middle of a cornhole game and everyone was just dumbfounded and you could say the same thing about everyone else connected to football andrew luck done at age 29 in the NFL when you're recording the show what 36 hours later you're reacting to so much more than just the news you're reacting to the reaction you're reacting to what you should have seen for three years considering the comments he's made and just looking during the research on what he said over the last few years this is every bit as much of a mental health issue as a as a pain issue as a physical issue as jim ursay said in 2017 it's about the four-inch field between

andrew luck's ears and ursay took a lot of crap for that from people who didn't know what they were talking about and soon they did from the outside looking in but in luck's own words he is referred to the dark place, not a fun world to live in, scared to my core, a low point, miserable SOB, I withdrew, my life was empty, I have shame, I don't know about my worth as a human, I'm weathered and less naive, and then at the press conference he said, this is the only way I see out of it, and out of it is the severe depression and identity crisis that he's been going through for three years. And he said that already a weight had been lifted. And even though the press conference was obviously difficult, that the last week was difficult for him, he told Frank Reich and

Erse and Chris Ballard early in the week. So they knew this was coming. And I think if I'm a Colts fan, that makes me think that it's a little more final. You know, it wasn't something he woke up one day. It was really about a week and a half or almost two-week process over when he really decided. And that's, he knew when he went out and practiced before the last Colts game. And looked pretty good, by the way. Moved pretty well. And had video footage of that. And enjoyed it that that was probably going to be his last time. And that's why he took the moment to enjoy it. I mean, there's a lot to talk about. But first, it's just that, the press conference alone alone was just impressive. I don't know. It was like a really unique sports

moment that it was hard not to admire Andrew Luck watching that. There was a very 2019 feel to the whole thing because the Colts are playing a preseason game against the Bears in their building. Lux's on the sideline and his original plan is to tell his teammates after the game in the locker room that he'll be retiring

but during the game Adam Schefter of ESPN breaks it on Twitter which creates a whole weird situation in both, if you watch the telecast, the announcers for the Colts team, they don't know what to do with that information. They show luck down at the field. Obviously, he's smiling,

seems to be good spirits. The players, I guess, don't even know. And we'll get to the crowd reaction in a little bit. But luck then comes out, and yes, I agree. He really was, it was clear that this wasn't a rash decision, even though it was something that he said didn't even cross his mind until the last week or two. He seemed marked to be a guy that was at peace where he is.

I thought Peter King put it well that he noted, and Wes, you touched on this too with all the comments that he had made over the months and years, that for 42 of the past 47 months, Andrew Luck had either played or not played or rehabbed in varying intensities of pain. And how many people, you know, commenting on this situation can speak to that in their own life? It's a totally different situation, and it starts as a physical thing. It becomes a mental thing. and if you look at the National Football League, and, you know, some of the reaction,

and of course, you know, he got booted at the stadium. Everyone is catching up in real time to their own emotions is what they're seeing, and suddenly you're watching your franchise quarterback off the field and leaving for good, and it's just completely surreal. But Andrew Luck was talked about by King as someone that when he first comprehended a couple weeks ago,

even the idea of retirement versus, they mentioned IR boomerang, or just let's wait and see, that when that concept came to his mind, that he started to grow comfort with that, that it became the way out. And no matter what privilege or job you've been given or situation in life that everyone else might want,

if you're losing and dying and falling apart inside of it, you need to find a way out. And I think the NFL is, you know, it is the tip of a needle on the tip of a needle in the human and earth experience. I mean, it has been around, for a fraction of a second, if you look at our universe and everything, this is someone who has the choice to do what he wants with the rest of his life. He mentioned his wife over and over.

I think that is probably one person that sat with him through all of this in the different segments of their relationship to where they are now and knew where he was and his family supported him. And anyone wanting to critique or this or that, it's kind of like, this is a personal decision. It has nothing to do with anyone else who's ever retired in the NFL before. It has nothing to do with anyone else who will retire. It has nothing to do with football at some point. And it's crazy, though, because everything you say is really well said. And yet Luck even mentioned in the press conference, and Frank Reich certainly did,

that Luck said many times last November, December, he's never had more fun playing the game of football, that it gave him a joy he never had before, that he thought coming to work in Frank Reich's awesome, and he shouldn't even be allowed to have that much fun. Those were the five months out of the 47 when he wasn't in this team. And, you know, he played the Pro Bowl, and they kept mentioning that. And I think that goes to Wes's point to start, that it's more than just the physical.

It was the accumulation of the years that came before that and certainly the last six months now. And the reality of what's the, I know he is doing it for himself. And he said that, but I do think there's part of Andrew Luck that is thinking a little bit about the team, too. What is the best thing for the team in the terms of how I feel right now that I think the best thing for this team is for me to step away, to be decisive about it, not to have this whole thing, you know, hanging over them? Press conference was beautiful, but I just wanted to note the irony of a guy walking away, leaving his teammates two weeks before the season starts, and yet it was one of the most beautiful high watermarks in team sports to see the love that he expressed and shares with his teammates. and that's what team sports is. And that's when you see the bozos on Twitter that we're looking for hot takes,

calling luck selfish or a millennial I saw one horrible take. Like this guy obviously had a strong bond with the team and it is the injuries and you kind of forgot about it because the shoulder injury kind of was the big injury of his career and then this most recent injury which became a big news item. But there's been a lot. I mean he's missed he missed 26 games including the entire. 2017 season because of the shoulder injury,

which he first hurt in week three early in the 2015 season. So that tells you how much and how long he fought through with that shoulder. He's also had kidney injuries, a rib injury, and now this lower leg injury, which he also said in the press conference, everybody thinks, oh, he's retired now. No, like now as a human being, he has to figure out how to get his leg right because it has really cut into his quality of life, not just as a player, but it's just someone that, you know, walks around day to day like the rest of us.

I was reading Bruce Arian's book today and was reminded that his father, Oliver, walked away from football immediately after he got his five years in in a pension. And he emphasized to Andrew over and over again growing up that life has a lot more fruits to offer outside of football. This was something drilled into Andrew Luck while he was growing up. And, you know, I saw a video of Zach Ertz talking about the retirement,

played at Stanford with Andrew Luck, He said they would be playing all the hype for the Heisman up on the TV. And Andrew Luck would get up, go turn the TV off and say, this is a team sport. I mean, that's just, he's always had a different perspective on football than most players have. I mean, his dad also, like, in a speech that was shown in the last couple of days, always stresses to the student athletes, you know, get what you can out of your education and this sport. Don't worry about what you need to give to the college. And I do think that is reflective in what a thoughtful guy, Andrew Luck is.

But it's also, it's such an interesting dichotomy because he is probably the best quarterback to enter the league since 2012, you know, or since this deck. I mean, I think he was kind of the guy. We've been waiting for this quarterback, you know, hierarchy to turn over. And it never does. It's been, you know, Brady and Breeze. And, you know, we lost Peyton Manning, but Rathasberger's been near the top this whole time. But I would say since we've been doing this podcast in Mohamed. is going to pass him certainly he won an MVP and these new guys are going to get there but

you know in the last six seven years there's no one that's come in and had the combination of physical gifts and production and excitement as andrew luck he he is this really unique mind in the way he looks at things but he also was like you know right there among the guys for the next generation and that's what makes it but i i think sometimes when you look at the football lifers and it's often it's failed failed players who become coaches who love the game so much that once they have a position, they'll never leave. There's people that cover the game that are football lifers that are going to be there until they're 88 and they pass off the earth. They're 98 or 100, Nate. Hopefully it's the latter. But I mean, this reminds me

a little bit more of someone like Jim Brown when he walked away. Now, it's very different because Jim Brown retired from the Browns at age 30, but he was in London on the set of the dirty dozen where he was being paid twice his annual salary to be in a film for a couple months. Luke also is able to retire because financially that's not a situation. I don't think any of that has to do with it. It's closer to what Jim Brown said was that he was no longer stimulated. He had achieved everything he wanted to do. And has Andrew Luck achieved everything? I don't think so. Not from a team perspective, not from a cult's perspective. But I do think that Andrew Luck is not just because you're a quarterback who's physically talented in the best since 2012. That does not

mean that mentally football is going to do it all for you. And I think he is someone that is very different than the athlete robot that is plugged in for as long as their body will take them and beyond. I just think he has other things in life. It's so tone-deaf how Jim Urse mentioned the amount of money luck is passing on. Like Erse was dumped. There was a couple funny Jim Mercy moments. Some instructive and some just, I couldn't believe he was starting to make the push almost publicly for luck to unretire already in that press conference. And one of them was like, you know, he was like dumbfounded that luck could pass up in his words half a billion dollars. And I was like, doing the math.

I was like half a billion. Yeah, but he's saying what's on everyone else's mind. Yeah, no, I get it. Yeah. I guess. But that seems to me to be missing why Andrew Luck is doing that. And Reich, you know, Frank Reich and Chris Ballard certainly seemed surprised by it. But your favorite type of frog?

They said they had no idea that this would have happened. But they also seemed to understand luck a little more as a person. Is he a Hall of Famer? No. No. So he gives that up as well. Well, there was a list of first overall quarterback picks, and he is, I think, fourth on that list of the quickest to retire. I would say this story has yet to be written.

The comeback has yet to be written. I think he reminds me, and the start of their careers are so totally polar opposite. He reminds me of Kurt Warner quite a bit. And Kurt Warner had that lull in the middle of his career. after he washed out with the Giants, before he landed with the Cardinals, he had to figure some things out for himself. And Kurt Warner's a guy who also retired because of his body. Right.

When the Colts made it obvious, they're not going to go after any of his money. That's great of them to do. I'm not surprised either. But I thought the same thing, not that we're trying to predict anything that happens, just that it's like life. It's life. Of course his story's not over. you know, there's a chance that he could revisit it in a year or two when he is feeling of

different mind or not. You know, like, who knows? But there's, it's, it's silly to kind of say anything with too much finale. See, I don't go back to the Hall of Fame thing. I'm not certain he's not a hall of famer. Wasn't he one of the, for a period of seven or eight seasons, one of the very best quarterbacks in football? I mean, seven or eight seasons brings us to 2020. Not, not consistent enough. I think he was a top five quarterback about three times. And and with the short season if he was like MVP or top one or two quarterbacks

for a bunch of the I mean we're split in great moments splitting hairs incredible playoff game against the Chiefs which is the game that I always think of that was kind of the day luck went full superstar mode

I just think yeah to me he's a bubble guy and maybe he just didn't play long enough and maybe the team didn't have enough success we're going to get into by the way what this means

for the rest of the AFC a little bit later. But let's now take a quick moment to look at what does this mean for the 2019 Colts? And we'll start with the head coach Frank Reich, who at a press conference Monday, shared his thoughts about where the team goes now without Andrew Luck. But also, let me assure Colts fans of this, this team is not done climbing. In fact, we're just getting ready. We're just getting started and we can't wait. Just feel like Chris and his staff have done an unbelievable job of a

assembling a team of players at this locker room is special. There is a character quality and a passion for this game and for this city and what the horseshoe represents that is special. And we believe that our players will rise to that challenge and that occasion. We're ready for the journey ahead. We believe we have the formula of what it takes to have a successful journey. We got the right makeup. We got the right locker room.

Chris talked a lot about that this morning with the team, about what it takes to get in that locker room. We have the talent. This is a very talented football team in all three phases. And now Jacoby Brissette, our own Jake Briscuit, takes over as the starting quarterback of the Indianapolis Colts. Slides me off a piece of that, Jake Brisk. Was all of that done just simply to appease our soundbite

and bring it back into focus? Was that why all of this is happening? It's a good job. We dug that sound drop out last week. We found that thing in mothballs. It thought it was over. I mean, here it is. Because you did call for that drop being like,

hey, we might be needing this a lot. We might have to. Strange energy. We might have to refresh it and vary it up a little bit because Brisket is going to be on a lot of primetime games and he's going to be part of our life this year. If they hang in contention. Do we think the Colts are still a playoff team with Jake Brisket? I think that that division is now completely.

wide open and almost every team has a 25% chance to win the division, whereas before it was clear that the Colts had the best roster and the best quarterback in the division. Greg, I thought you wrote like on Saturday night a good piece about where Jacoby Percette lands now compared to where he landed the first time around and that this is such a different team and they've got such a strong coach and GM link. And I, I, you know, we've made our picks and the editor, I picked the cults on Friday, the editor of our DM original content person came and said, do you want to change the cults now that this all happened? I thought about it. I'm like, the AFC Central or the AFC South is so murky. And it's so bizarre to me. And I don't believe, there's such,

so many things I don't believe about the other teams in that division. I said, keep the cults. I don't think, yeah. And I write the power rankings now for NFL.com. And the idea that the cult should now be dropped like way to the bottom of the league. No, I think really when you think about them, I think it does obviously drop them. Andrew Luck is a much better quarterback than the guy that's replacing him, even though we all like Jake Brescott in this room. But I think they have a fighting chance. West doesn't. Oh, you don't like Brescott at all?

I am allowing for the fact that players can improve, especially when they're surrounded by better coaching and better players. And Chris Ballard's comments on Jake Briscuit to Ther recently suggests that not only is he better mechanically and he cleaned all that up, he's a more accurate passer and a better decision maker, especially when it comes to taking that boatload of sacks he took the last Tommy quarter. Right. He took so many and that team was rough and he was a second year player joining a Rob Chudinsky offense where now he's with Frank Reich and he's in the second year which I think is really important. And I do think this is where organizationally the Colts have been really

impressive since Ballard got there and that's what's key. Like Reich just seems like the man who's ready for this challenge in terms of scheme and in terms of leadership. Chris Ballard and the team that he built seems like he's kind of the man for this challenge. And he talked about it Saturday. He was kind of the first one to turn the page. You know, Reich was understandably really emotional at that press conference. That was his Dick Vermeal moment. Kind of staring off into space on Saturday.

When Reich first interviewed for the job, he didn't mention Andrew Luck once. And this was at a time where Luck's future was uncertain. Nobody knew when or if he would ever play again. Reich never brought up his name in the job interview. And so Ballard already had turned the page and say, look, we got a good line. We got a good offensive line. We've got a good defensive line.

We've got a really young talented defense. We've got T.Y. Hilton, you know, who back and forth, Andrew Luck and him talking about that they're best friends. And to a man, everyone on that team, including Luck, who went out of his way to say how much he learned from Jacoby Brissette, that he almost made it sound like he looks up to Jacobi Brissette a little bit with the leadership that Jacoby Brissette has. He is, I don't know if he's got the talent, but I think it's almost unquestion. Everyone that's been around him believes that he's kind of meant to lead an NFL team.

We do have Chris Ballard talking about it on Saturday night. I think you hear what Andrew said. Jacoby Beset is a rare, rare leader. He is. He's a rare human being, man. That locker room loves Jacoby Perci. And he went on about it. Jacoby Perciette is in the league or was drafted as early as the third round

because Bill Parcells convinced Bill Belichet. that I don't know if this guy is going to be great or not, but he's like one of the most impressive humans I've ever been around that he compared him to Curtis Martin and Willie McGinnis as a type of guy who's going to bring a locker room together and it's just like going to be a good guy to have on your team. So he's now been able to develop under Frank Reich and I think he's fun to watch play

because his great throws are really great. Yeah, they ask you. You know what I mean? He's got a lot of upside and I think it'll be a fun team to watch even without luck. They asked Preset today after all this, you know, it leveled out, what is it that you need to actually improve and be better? And he just said, Jacoby Brissette. I just need to be me.

I kind of like this guy. And I know that we want to get into all the analytics and stuff all the time as the season goes on and the cults have this or that. But the one thing about the, there's a narrative quality to football every year. You see it. And certain events change the trajectory of teams. And this could have been the thing where, you know, on some teams and some coaching staffs in the way that the front office might have panicked, you pulled the plug on the drain in the water goes out. This is the opposite here. I think this team is rallying around this, and I don't

really look at another team in the AFC South and say, that team, their makeup strikes me as so much more complete than the cults. The opposite. The one question, no one has asked yet, and I'll do it because someone has to ask it. Wes, how are you doing? Everyone has, some people have asked this. It hits home for me. Like, not, the P-scale thing, like Andrew Luck, he reached a point where he's willing to do anything to keep the monster at bay. That's what I think about Andrew Luck and what he's dealing with mentally, psychologically. He's just, you're talking about a person who was one of the toughest people to step foot on an NFL field, and now that toughness has been sort of usurped by,

I don't want to have to do that again. I'll do anything not to have to go through that experience again. So it hits, it bothers me psychologically. You know who it doesn't bother? They asked Bill Belichick about all this today. You know what he said? About Andrew Luck? He said, he's a good player. I didn't see that, but I don't really follow them. The Patriots actually sent out a clarification. That was lost in translation a little bit. Okay. Even I'm going to let Bell check off the hook there. On paper, that was about as unnecessary of a Bill Belichick-esque comment as we needed this morning. No, I think he was referring. No, we're going to let Bill slide on that one. You are. I mean, it's, it's going to take a little bit for them to get over.

Jacoby Preset seemed pretty broken up about a Reich scene. I mean, this is someone. He told Preset on Friday, too, by the way. Yeah. They didn't find, they didn't all find out at that, like, on the sideline during that game. Aaron Rogers was angry. He was on a radio show today. He didn't like the way some people reacted. He didn't like, oh, that's the one other thing I wanted to play. Can we play, Ricky, luck was asked about getting booed off the field at Lucas Oil Stadium after the news broke after the preseason game. Yeah, I'd be lying if I didn't say I heard the reaction. Yeah, it hurt. I'll be honest, chap. It hurt. That sucked. And I think you hear it in Lux's voice. It's such an emotional time for him. It took him by surprise. And a lot of people were piling on Colts fans.

And I get it. It wasn't a good look. You should not have been booing your franchise player. He didn't double cross you or anything like that. But that is, it was a shocking, shocking thing to happen. And as a fan of any fan to all of a sudden have this guy who's the center of your sports universe yanked out, I think there's a lot of, sometimes you don't express yourself the right way. I don't think there was actual anger toward him, but more just anger toward what just happened. Our Super Bowl windows are, our Super Bowl dreams are out the window.

My favorite player is gone. And I think luck caught heat from that more than. then actual, this guy's a bum. I don't want to look at him anymore. I mean, I also think the experience of being home and on your couch and processing information over Twitter, gathering information, watching it slowly, versus when you're in stadium, it's the fourth quarter. These guys have seven or eight beers in them. You just find out this guy walking out the field. Before Luck spoke, there were a lot of people that weren't as generous towards Luck. And when he spoke, you got an understanding of what was happening. It sounded like he was just

saying, I'm out. Then when you learned what his words, it's like, I have a completely different feeling towards Andrew Luck. I got some text from people that thought, what is this guy doing? Not plugged in journalist types, but just regular fans. Like, it's ridiculous that anyone booed, it's stupid. It's just kind of, it's just sort of obvious that enough with the performative, you know, tis-tisking to make yourself look good. That part, to me, is just as annoying. Like, well, no, like, everyone agrees that that is not what you would want to see in that sad, but like, You don't need 4,000 people saying, hey, look at me, I'm going to say this is bad, too. It's like, it's obvious.

We all know. We all agree. You don't need to do that. You make a good point. In general, this Andrew Luck bombshell is one of the more performative moments in recent Twitter history. Everyone had takes and they were all going. It was all ratcheted up to 11. Boeing's weird anyway.

You don't do it alone. You need the courage of other people behind you in order to do it. So it's weird to me. But it's also, we have this national obsession with football. And it's a natural outgrowth, just as Lux's decision was a natural outgrowth. When you are a fanatic, when you have an obsession, you do things like boo that don't make any logical sense. All right. So we're going to get back to this topic about the cults and what Andrew Lux's retirement means to the rest of the AFC.

But before we do that, there was other things that happened in the NFL this weekend, believe it or not. So it is week three of the preseason. We hit several of the games on our Friday podcast. Why don't we just swing around the room for a few minutes here and throw out some big takeaways? I'll start off with one just because it connects with the Houston Texans who are now in a – well, they already were in a dogfight to win that division, but it changed a lot with Lux's disappearance now.

The Texans lose there starting running back Lamar Miller to what is a torn ACL. So he blows out his knee on the – his first carry of a preseason game and you see him carted off with the towel over his head and you know a lot of calls Greg a lot of calls out there that the preseason needs to be changed and and I don't know if that's necessarily the first thing that comes to a lot of people's minds but I think one thing with Miller and we're going to get into the ramifications of it for the Texans but the one thing for me is the game is so fast and the guys are so strong that I do think they need to just lessen the number of preseason games.

This stuff is just going to keep happening. The players have changed. The schedule, I think, has to reflect that at some point, hopefully after that's CBA. Yeah, I agree. And yet, I just think if players are playing football, they're going to get hurt. So many players are going to get hurt week one. Maybe not more than if they had played in the preseason, but a ton of them. You know, like, so it's terrible when that happens too.

And they'll probably reduce it down to two to three games. this is one of those injuries that you reduce you take away a guy who's played a million snaps and a million touches and yet i don't really feel any different about the texans i think duke johnson is up for a one a role in a backfield and they probably need to go find who their one b is they you know they have some rookies they like on draft son j a jai you right we thought we thought they did al michael's uh reported they did um al micha michael's did he said on the sunday night telecast that's where i got mine They signed a JHA. And it didn't happen. I thought so, too. It has not happened yet. Come on, Al. Signed.

Maybe it will. Or maybe they will sign someone. But if it's someone like that, I think that backfield will be fine. It's not where I'm worried about. I mean, what did they give up to the Browns? Well, so, I mean, it was a fourth that could max out at a third. And it sounds like they're going to get a third if he played. But you know what?

Maybe they overpaid, but it's worth every dime or however you want to say it. Because where would they be if they didn't have Duke Johnson on the chart. Bill O'Brien, the general manager. or slash coach genius. Name a worse offensive line backfield combination than the Houston, Texas. Yeah, but the backfield to me is fine. Why?

It can be average. Because they have a third downback? I think Duke Johnson, I've always believed this, has the ability to be a top. The Browns didn't think he had that ability. Right, but the dolphins didn't think Lamar Miller had that ability either, and no one thought he was a three-down back before they got there.

And I think he's a much better. I think he's a much, that's true. Dan did. What? You believe from Lamar. I did a Lamar Miller making a way, too. I did a Duke Johnson making the leap, so someone's got to win on here. Even more that he can be a prime.

Wow, that's right. Duke and Lamar both make it. We've had two Lamar Miller making the leaps and a Duke Johnson making leaps. Someone's got to get it going on. Well, I stand by at Lamar. He's flashed, but he never really put it all together. That is what it is. Their bigger problem is that another former Brown Rodrick Johnson,

a fifth round pick in 2017 is their starting left tackle, that their center looked terrible when they came back, that they had another injury on their offensive light. I mean, that's their problem. Wes, give us a takeaway from week three of the preseason. Well, I sort of looked at this like these teams are flashing at me right now, and I feel much better about them exiting August than I did entering August. The Pittsburgh Steelers, Minnesota Vikings, and Dallas Cowboys,

even without Zeke Elliott. I don't know why nobody's talking about Michael Gallup, who looks like a transformed wide receiver to me. He looks phenomenal. The Vikings, Dalvin Cook looks like he's about to have a Pro Bowl, all-pro type of season. That offense is perfect for him, and I love the Earth Smith pick. They just seem very confident. And the Steelers, everything they did this offseason seems to be working.

Every single thing seems to be working. Everyone they signed from the CFL, the AAF, undrafted free agents, first rounders, sixth rounders. Guys, they picked off, like, late-wave free agency. Everybody's playing well for them. Some of their old draft picks, too, like Cameron. Artie Burns, that they say is playing better. I mean, the one thing on the Vikings, let me ask you this, West, because I watched that game, and I realize it's, you know, it's the preseason,

but in Dalvin Cook looked fresh, he looked great. Their first four drives, seven yards, two yards, negative two yards, 14 yards. Kirk Cousins started like three for 14. I know I'm not allowed to ever be concerned until September, but he looked, he just looked a little off to me, though. I mean, we've got, what, five years of Kirk Cousins? You're allowed. In regular NFL?

We tend to agree. him, but five years of Kirk Cousins is an up-and-down journey. He had two really, for what it's worth, for the preseason, he also looked very sharp. I would say the same thing about... The first two games. The same thing about Marcus Mariotta. Like, I would rather go back and study their regular season tape than look at...

Well, I would, too. I'm not saying based it off of one game, but part of it is also your offense being in sync. And if we love the cowboys and certain players and everything on looking in sync, it's like, when a player looks bad, does that have any meaning or no meaning? I mean, I put some meetings. It's a Rorschach text. Depends on the context and the quarterback. It's all about what you want to stand for and say matters, I guess.

Mark, how about you? I'll tell you something I do think matters because we just talked about a player who's exiting the league and yes, the offensive line in Indianapolis was stellar last year, but half the reason Andrew Luck got into the situation he was in was because an offensive line left him brutalized over and over and was unfixed for way too long due to the previous general manager. and I am very concerned and this game feels like 70 years ago

but Friday night when I watched Baker Mayfield running for his life and trying to do everything to bounce off rushers because Cleveland's left tackle right guard and right tackle should not be starting for anyone right now and they, if you want to talk about all they've done this off-season

I would say this. If you're John Dorsey and you want to put the cherry on top versus trying to fix tires two weeks from now on the car that's broken down by the side of the road, you have got to find a way, and it's an impossible ask at this point, to get one of these, to get a Trent Williams, to get someone in there, because I would look at Greg Williams right now who gave up a ton of issue. He gave up pressures, he gave up sacks in that game.

He had two penalties. Greg Robinson. Greg Robinson has always gotten these penalties, and they have Eric Cush starting at right guard, and they have got Chris Hubbard, old mother's son, starting at right tackle. I don't like any of it. It gives me a cent.

I know some brown sense are saying it's going to be, fine in me? You know what? Just turn me on in September. I shouldn't even be watching this stuff because apparently I'm too concerned about these things, but I have bad energy vibing off of that game. The biggest thing that could go wrong for the Browns, it's, you could say at about 31 other teams, is your star quarterback can't get hurt. And if you can't protect him, and he plays swashbuckler, he's like a kid out there. Yeah, it's a playground to him. But no, but for real, like Mayfield is a guy he's going to be running around. He's going to always keep his eyes up the field. He's always looking for the big play. And it is a dangerous kind of

scenario the way he plays and the way that team blocks. So your fears are understood. I mean, they had a flood of people not on the field. All the receivers, Nick Chubb wasn't there, Najoku. I get it. But that didn't change what I saw line versus line. Well, you don't even need to watch the game to know that Dorsey is hugely disappointed with his worst draft pick that he's made since he's been there, Austin Corbett. The first pick of the second round, you trade away Kevin Zitler Because you feel like, here's one of my highest draft picks I've taken since I got to Cleveland. Let's plug them in. People watching the team on a day-to-day basis said he wouldn't make the team if they were just based on his actual play.

And he's now getting replaced by a journeyman. So that's one slot where they kind of assumed he's going to take over for Zitler. And that's one big trouble spot now. How about you, Greg? Oh, man. I mean, do we want to talk Daniel Jones? Or was that Friday or Thursday? We talked Daniel Jones on Thursday, on Friday, I believe, yes.

he looked good again He still looks good He still looks great I take nothing out of that Case Keenham has announced the starter other than as a Dwayne Haskins fan that I'm happy for it

because they open with the Eagles and they have the Bears week three on Monday night football and I feel like if you're going to throw Haskins out there just wait until after that Bears game totally with you on that will he be ready when he gets in whenever he does

made some plays too made some plays too made some place I thought it was Jimmy Garapolo we've done a good job on this podcast A lot of people have been pulling the skies falling routine around Garapolo and the five interceptions in practice

and then what he didn't do last week in the preseason which was throw for a yard last Monday night against the Broncos but don't put too much into it but yes good he got back on track in Kansas City against the chiefs and I will say this shout out to the fans

at Arrowhead Stadium. If you guys watch the first couple of drives, that place is going nuts. January 15th. It was playoff atmosphere. It was unbelievable. And you know what? It couldn't be a better test again for Jimmy G.

Who had to sit with that for a week, that horrible performance. And he ends up bouncing back. He goes 14 to 20, 188, throws a touchdown, leads a team on three scoring drives, totaling 13 points. A gorgeous touch pass on the touchdown.

Matt Brita, who I think he's going to do a lot for them this year. Love him. But, you know, I just think in general expectations have changed so much from August to August around this team. This was a nice performance to remind you, no, he's not going to fall off the earth. Is he going to be Tom Brady part two?

Maybe not. But I think the Niners are still in a pretty good spot of quarterback. Well, unless these games don't matter at all, I'm being told. No, I mean. I don't think they, I took almost nothing away from any of these weekends. I think that's a good job. Why are you upset about that? Because, no, I'm just, I just, it's like, I don't.

when you have... Why are we watching any of these games? You have 70-something regular season games about a quarterback that's different than Michael Gallup. But why are we... You can pick a... I think certain individual performances and just how people look health-wise.

You know, I think... I get that. I'm just saying... The global quarterback or offensive play is tough, I think, in the preseason. And I'll just throw one more quick one out there. Drew Brees looked just like Drew Brees in his one series against the Jets.

Him and Michael Thomas. I think they're going to go ham again. I think... Every ball is Michael. Thomas is. He's going to go get it. Yeah, he's a badass and I think the Saints, as much as there was reason for concern down the stretch, I'm now

on the boat of, you look up the stats and Breeze will once again be Breeze and the Saints are going to be A-O-K. The Breeze thing I think has been weirdly talked about and I think Bill Barnwell wrote a great piece in terms of like his potential decline, but I do wonder if he had the

you know, sometimes we just overate the end of the season because it was the last time we saw. I thought Drew Breeze had the best season of his career, year through 13 weeks. And this is like an upper tier Hall of Famer through 12 weeks. I thought he was right there. I had an MVP watch and the QB Index.

I had him ahead of Patrick Mahomes through 12 weeks. So like those 12 weeks count too. It was just last season. And so yeah, maybe it won't be that good. Don't act like there wasn't legitimate concern. He wasn't able to make throws he was making earlier in the year. Absolutely. But I just don't think that's like a final answer.

Sure. It's a part of a larger picture that the 12 weeks counted, the first 12 weeks counted to. Anybody else have something real quick before we move on? One thing with a Jets game, and this is a ref issue, is there was Demerio Davis hopscotched over, like, a Jets lineman, and, like, tapped San Darnold to the ground, and he did a little stage roll, and they called it roughing the passer. That was a good call. Well, all right. Okay, fair enough, Dan's off the merchandise.

Then later in the game, a defensive tackle comes out of nowhere and nails Darnold on the run from behind and, like, buries them into the ground. No call. Terrible call. it's just like I mean the announcers pointed out it's like the New York announcers Dan pointed this out the Jets announcers pointing this out massively inconsistent

real quick on the Bengals we have pointed to their problems drafting the first round the guy they drafted last year in the first round Billy Price got beaten out for the starting center job by Trey Hopkins a journeyman well not to mention their first round

that is amazing and their first round pick from three years ago now John Ross got beat out by undrafted free agent rookie Damien Willis, who is so under the radar and is now starting in the AJ Greenspot and has looked great, that he was on the team

that was featured on Last Chance You. You know, I'm a big fan. And like people trying to say like, oh, this is, you know, quite a success story. He was so under the radar, they never showed him in that season of Last Chance You. He was just like some guy in the background. And now he's starting in the NFL.

How about that? Oh, yeah, by the way, I got to take an L. We had this, a lot of people hitting on me up on Twitter. Oh, right, right. Me and Wes had a friendly, just disagreement about Maurice Harris's potential production on the Patriots. He was wave injured over the weekend, and I'm taking a big fat L. But, I mean, in your defense, Josh Gordon kind of get lit off the hook real quick and real easy. He got dropped up the spaceship.

In West's defense, though, I think Wes was kind of hitting on the, hey, buddy, you might be getting a little over-excited about the first three-day of nod and padded practices. And I think he had a good point. I was a little over-excited about the start of the season. It's more than I've watched him play, and you want your receivers to be able to make plays. Okay. All right.

Let's spin forward. And, yeah, everybody loves Succession. It's the show on HBO. By the way, the best theme song. One of the shows, you never fast-forward the intro. It's like a great classical music meets hip-hop. And now listen to the drum part, this best part. Anyway

Love it It's a show about power Who has it, who wants it Power that's real Power that's imagined And let's talk about Succession The Plan and the AFC

Now that Andrew Luck Has exited stage left Okay So let's go around the room Here Let me start I'll start in the AFC South Okay boys

And you know The old Zuster loves the Texans Like that's one of those things About the old Zucer everybody talks about that guy loves the Houston Texas and I kind of do but here's my point

so I thought the Texans are going to win the division anyone what are you laughing at I don't know just a lot of Usain the old deuceer I enjoyed it I thought it was really funny

I just imagine all the people just talking amongst themselves like I love the Texans hey you hear what the old deucer said again he loves those dinner tables across the country discussing this anyway I like the Texans chances to win the division again this year

and you know it only my feelings are stronger now here's my one thought now um mike lombardi where is lombardy now he's always bouncing around what what what what does he work for i'm not aware at the moment does anybody don't know that's good is it the ringer no no it's not he's definitely a regular for brent musburger's Vegas oh really yes i see him doing any stuff on yeah anyway uh lambarty put it out there that clowny a trade is imminent it could happen in 24 to 48 hours well as of this taping that hasn't happened and i think are pushing up against that 48-hour barrier.

My point is, if you're the Texans and you were thinking about trading Clowny, halt, halt, okay? Keep the guy in the building. Unless you could spin Clowny for someone that helps your team right now, and that is perhaps offensive line help, but good luck finding that at this stage of the game. Put your best team out there week one, because the window just got opened up a little bit more for you to make a run in 2019. Andrew Luck's not playing anymore.

Well, someone's talking because I, I think our insiders have all but said they've been hearing similar things that this thing could happen any minute. Interestingly, Lombardy believed that they were looking for a wide receiver, which is just about the last position. That blew my mind. Now, I get it. You shouldn't be trading clowning anything for a running back.

It's like, no, you can figure out running back. But our left tackle is a little different. Yeah, Daniel Jeremiah suggested Clowny for Tyreek Hill. Just threw it out there as a floated it. I mean, okay. Their own wide receivers are talking about how this wide receiver core is so much deeper than it was last year. And like the fringe wide receivers probably don't have a chance to make it this year, whereas they would have made it last year? Are there concerns about Fuller's knee?

Maybe. Something personal, I almost feel, is popping up with Clowny and Texans. It's like they don't have, they've kept it under the radar, but there's been a couple little articles where Clowney's work ethic was questioned. And that set off some alarms for me. Isn't that magnified when the coach becomes the front office person too? There's no back and forth on how to deal with that. Who else wants to throw? The balance of power shifting in the AFC by the moment, Greg.

Well, how about the succession up the quarterback hierarchy of Jacoby Brissette of making a stake? And I know that's not the balance of power. I think the Colts, I'm going to pick them to win the division, too. I don't feel like they're an overwhelming favorite. You guys are in your feelings. I am a little bit. Honestly, I just watched Ballard. I wanted Ballard and right.

I watched that and I was like, I like, I want to root for these guys. And I'm a big Jacoby Brissette fan, so why not? And I do think they have a lot of things in their organization and their debt are to like. And I do like a guy in Jacoby Brissette who's very close to luck having the chance to make whatever he's going to make out of his career. This is his chance. This is his chance to climb the ladder and whether his future is with the cults or not. Who knows? Maybe Andrew Luck comes back someday or whatever. He's going to be a free agent after this year. This is a chance for him to kind of make his mark.

And I wrote after his first season, I remember in the last, you know, QB index roundup of the year, you know, we'll see what happens with Preset's career. But he's a guy that just looks like he's going to be in the league 12 to 14 years. I just don't know if that's going to be as like a meaningful starter or, you know, as a backup journey. How long has he been in a list? This is this is fifth or sixth year. And I think he's just going to be one of those guys. And now is his chance to become like a, you know, above average starter. I think he can do it.

What worries me about the Texans, I would give slight advantage to the Titans and Colts in this division. What worries me about the Texans is I can look at three or four areas of their team and say, among the worst in the NFL. The offensive line, the backfield, the second. secondary. These are all bad, bad positions for this team. And they play last year, the easiest schedule in the league. This year, the hardest schedule in the league. But I was starting to see the AFC as Chief Steelers, Patriots, Colts. Me too. Before the luck news. And now I see it as chief Patriot Steelers. And then it doesn't really matter who wins the South. We never know. Quickly dispensed. Yes, that's what I see.

I think they have, I always give any, I mean, I give, they have a chance to make the Super Bowl with Brissette. Why not? I mean, crazier things have happened. Super Bowl now? Sure, Nick Full. I mean, Joe Flacco won a Super Bowl. Nick Foles won a Super Bowl. As they said, it's a team game.

A lot of things are going to have to come together as a team. I don't totally rule them out. And if you're talking narratives, I mean, how sweet would it be for the Colts to go to, like, Foxborough in the playoffs or whatever from their vantage point? Hey, Josh McDaniels, thanks for turning us down. Thanks for sending us Jacoby Brissette for Philip Dorset. Thanks for beating our brains in for about a decade. We're going to take your crown. Well, let's see how that goes.

I'm just saying that would be from their vantage point in delightful. Les, how have things changed in the AFC? How have they changed? Tell me your thoughts. Well, yeah, I kind of just did that I don't see the AFC South winner as a real threat wants the playoff start. And I still see, just like we have. entered last year, Chief Stealers Patriots. Those were the three teams entering 2018 that we thought

were the class of that conference, and I still think that's the case. How about you, Sessler? I think if you look at the show in succession, you've got a lot of, even though they're all in a family, a lot of these people, are very close allies. They're each islands, psychological islands, trying to figure out where they stand as chess pieces, and they're all battling each other. So from the- Should have started with Mark. Well, just because the way each of these teams are so, you know, Belichick's saying he doesn't see anything beyond the complex. And if you're one of these fringy wildcard teams, if you're the bills, the jets, the Broncos even, you and you want to convince yourself that power has changed and there's

a slot opening up or at least becoming the door is opening for you, this was a positive development in the terms of your chances this season. The one, you know, these shows also always thrive and they're entertaining because there must be the person in the midst who is the ultra stooge. You know, he thinks that he or she thinks that they're going to rise to power, but the viewer can tell that will not be the case.

The Kendall? Yes, in this case, I think the Tom character in Succession is probably being sort of toyed with. And that, to me, would be the Bengals. And I don't mean to always harp on them, but it is. I feel like, well, you know what? They catch a burner here? I just feel like they are, well, all these other,

you were talking about, Succession is about high octane, power media conglomerates, while the Bengals are, to me, still very content to run a little mom and pop corner store selling, you know, Chinese noodles and $4 wine. And they are perfectly content to roll. I don't know how the Bengals get hit on this. I'll tell you why, because we are talking about power and we're talking about people that are striving for power and doing everything they can and staying up to date. And I see these other team, I see the Jets as a team that has advanced themselves massively from last season to this.

Succession has happened in seasons. The NFL happens in seasons. The Jets are a totally different character in season two. The Bengals have not changed at all. How many wins for the Bengals this year? Wait, what? Six or seven. That's generous, I think, at this point.

That's a tough one. Six or seven in that position. But only because I don't think that six wins is that tough. How does this change, though, since Andrew Luck retired? No, my point is that the Stoge is always the Stoge. But you see why I'm surprised the Bengals are catching fire here. Wait, what is it? The $4.00 noodle.

The $4 wine and the Chinese noodles? They're just paying rent doing it a year ago and they'll just pay rent again. What I'm saying is that there are these fringy AFC teams that have changed and are evolving. But I'm just panning the camera over to the stooge that did not change the season 1 to 602. I was with you. That's not my central point. The first half of your point I was 100% in. In fact, I was going to mention it.

Teams like the Jets, Bancos, Titans, Bengals, your Browns, perhaps. Whoever doesn't win the division in the AFC North. So it could be the Steelers of the Ravens, right? I'm sorry, the Browns are going to go $15. No, I have expressed my concerns. But my feeling is there's probably one playoff team coming out of the South now, whereas I thought personally there would be two. So someone is going to benefit from that.

Yeah, that's a good call. And the AFC West has a very easy schedule on paper, partly because they get to play each other. When we're putting in our picks with our bosses, I'm putting in three from the north. I was doing that before now. I had the Steelers, Ravens, and Browns all getting in, which happened, what, three years ago, except it was the Bengals.

And I think luck being out makes that more likely. I need to watch Succession. Got to get in, dude. You'd love Succession. I mean, it's got Brian Cox in it, who is one of my favorite sort of, like, character actors. Logan Roth. Oh, you will like this.

I mean, the scene he has an adaptation where he yells at the crowd when someone asks like, well, what about a screenplay that reflects like real life a little more and he just like goes off on the guy is one of my favorite scenes. I love when people act out scenes from movies. It's always, it never fails.

All right, before we say goodbye, there's someone else here. I believe there he is. The long time, head honcho over on NFL Fantasy Way, Michael Fabiano is joining us. Mike, how are you, by the way? I'm good, man.

I'm feeling good. Feeling good, both because fantasy football season is in full swing and our beloved Yankees just took two or three from the doyers. Yeah, we sent a little message there. And I was there. I was in attendance. Stress on little.

It must be nice. NFL Fantasy live podcast, by the way, a live show at the Yard House and Marina Del Rey tonight at 8 p.m. So if you catch this, happen to be in the area, go over there because that's your chance to get Michael Fabiano's autograph, I imagine. Nobody wants that.

How does it feel to be sitting in the Mark Sessler Memorial chair where he was for the Fantasy Corner a week ago? Is that right? Yeah. You didn't know that? What did you do to deserve that? It's sort of more closely what I didn't do. I think that's how I got there to begin with.

Right. Fabs, what's going on on the fantasy way? Because, you know, I got to keep it real here. So my league of record, we've run it through NFL dot com for several years, and people are always burying on me. It's like, oh, come on, why isn't your fantasy client better? Why isn't it the app better? Well, guess what?

Things have changed, haven't they? Yeah, the app is all new. It's the best app we've had. Some people might say that's not saying much, but I can promise you right now. The app is going to be one of, if not the best, for fantasy football players in 2019 and moving forward. There are some very cool features, some of which I can't even mention yet. Whoa.

but I can promise that people who are into, let's say, watching film will be very pleased. Christopher. It is going to be kick ass, sign up now, download it, check it out. It's going to be very personalized. You may even see my ugly mug on there from time to time. So that actually might be a reason for people not to download it. So forget I just said that. But check it out.

It's a huge improvement And we've had a lot of great people Who have worked very hard I think that's a response to the fans People were like What do you want out of your fantasy app They're just like more headshots of Fabs That is untrue

That has been a prominent part of NFL.com Is Fabs front and center New headshot this year Same one Have you been talking to Ben Liebenberg Not you know Benny Leaves are director of photography He's very big on headshots

When did you start with the NFL? I haven't oh man This is actually my 20th year in the industry. Whoa. Well, you're a Hall of Famer. This is my 13th year with the NFL. Wow.

Yeah, dude. It's been a long, fun ride. You know that yard house used to be my old stomping grounds. I used to live right across the street in temporary housing. All right. Watch the Heat and Spurs playoff. That means that I'll see you and your lovely wife there later. I can't speak for her, but I'm going to, I'll be there.

Absolutely. Hey, listen, I will say one thing because I don't get a chance to be on this podcast very often. And that's not, I'm not having fun. Yes. I'm so proud of you guys for what you've done and what you've accomplished. I've rooted for all for you. And I'm so just over the moon that you guys have become this big. You're kicking ass, taking names.

I love seeing you on TV. It makes me feel so good when people that I like who are genuinely good, hardworking people who know their stuff succeed. And I couldn't be happier for you guys. Thanks, Labs. You know, we... Thank you, Mike. Thank you.

We, Mark and I both started here in 2010. You're literally, you and maybe rank are the only guys that we've been here the whole time with. It's been a while. It's very nice of you to say, dude. You've obviously done really well for you. I've seen you guys grow and develop and, you know, become more than just writers. You're truly talent. And every time I see anything about you guys on Twitter, I try to, I try to retweet.

I just, I'm very happy. that might have gotten you a second appearance we will discuss well that was the whole point of that whole diatribe was to get on here again at some point before a super bowl all right there you go mike thank you so much and yeah mike he he's the big man at nflare fantasy he's got and also got that expert league one with ricky holiday holiday rick hollywood yeah rick cottage fantasy football so so our friend erika here you know you um drafted andrew luck didn't you i did and i have T. Yelton, too, so I got to, yeah, I'm not... So I'm not in league one, because I have

250 other leagues, and I'm like, I just can't do another one, but I drafted for Candice Patton. Who plays the Flash. And by the way, her team is the odds-on favorite to win the whole... Oh, yeah. Connected the dots. Damn. If you lose to a shadow fabs, that's an

embarrassing. One of the... She picked... He picked for her. Sure, but she's going to have to run the team or whatever. You can't let... No, no, I'm not running the team. I just drafted. Don't go expert come in there and win anyways. It's a problem. Pick it to win the league. That and $12 will get you a beer in L.A.

Wes, one of the dudes picked Albert Wilson in the fourth round. That's incredible. So at this point, I'm thinking, oh man, this is, this is going to be fun. This is going to be fun to do this draft. That guy, like, fall off a bird and they set up a sidewalk I don't even know.

Who was the guy? Do you remember who it was? It was the comedian? Yeah. Should we like out him like that? You're going to have to tune in and find out. Ricky Holiday, you could put the blame on me for Andrew luck. Yeah.

I appreciate it. That was, and you have Kreme Hunt on your team too. Yeah, we can, we can, you know what? We can wrap this up down. 2020 may be a good season for you. Yeah. Wow. Right.

Rick Halliday, taking a lot of. Rick Halliday, getting buried in a big spot. Michael Fabiano, he's senior fantasy analysts, NFL media. Follow him at Michael underscore Fabiano on Twitter. And yes, if you are in the area, he'll be at the yardhouse at Marina del Rey. Tonight, 8 p.m. Live podcast. Thanks guys.

Bye, Mikey. All right, let's get out of here, Ricky. Holiday. We'll be back Wednesday. Stan Hans is signing off for a quiet storm. The mailman, the old boss, Ricky Holiday, and Micah Fabiano behind the glass. Till Wednesday.

This is an I-heart podcast.