NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Around the AFC with Wess

Episode Date: August 31, 2020

A bunker filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Gregg Rosenthal, Chris Wesseling and Marc Sessler give you three minutes on every team in the AFC. Plus, the guys discuss the Yannick Ngakoue trade.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. The Around the NFL podcast. May Joe Judge run laps. Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hansis, coming to you from a virtual room filled with heroes. Mark Sessler, Greg Rosenthal, and Chris Wessling.

What's up, boys? Hey, Dan. How you feeling? West Mondays. Mondays with West. Best day of the week. I felt better, but getting through it, getting through it. I think only two more weeks of chemo, but now we're talking about doing clinical trials,

which is like experimental treatment after those two weeks are up because the back pain is still there and that leads me to believe the cancer is still going to be there when they run the scans at the end of these two weeks. So just taking a day by day.

All right. He came back for a big Monday, Wes. Yeah, this is a big one. You know, in fact, it kind of informs how we want to build out our lead-up to week one because there's a lot of fun stuff we go through on this show as we approach week one.

And it's getting there. It's a week from Thursday, the start of the season. 10 days, 10 days right now. It just doesn't. Totally surreal to me. I feel like if we say it, then it'll become real, but it still doesn't really be real. It's not real in this house. I can tell you that.

No, it's chaos at all times and the season hasn't started yet. It's, uh, my body clock is telling me it's like June 9th. And so I, things are very odd internally. The difference, though, between now and like a month ago when, when camp, in quotes, was in theory starting. and now camps are basically over already. It was like, we barely knew we had you. Is that there's no doubt that the season is starting.

At least, you know, in my, like, that was a real doubt four or five weeks ago. It's like, wow, how is this all going to work? Like, I don't know exactly how it's going to work, but they're playing that game. It's going to be 16,000 people apparently in the crowd. And like, I don't have much doubt anymore because the COVID-19 list is so sparse that the football is happening. I just can't quite believe it's in a week and a half and that it feels like there's been no buildup. This is a blind spot for Greg because he fails to realize that like the moon is going to crash into the Indian Ocean four days from now. So just let's not get too cocky here.

As my mother has said to me many times, don't spit in the sky. Let's just hope we get there. Things are going in the right direction. And yes, Mondays, knowing that we have Wes, we want to do our best stuff and one of our favorite segments we do every year around. this is around the NFL podcast around the AFC in 48 minutes. We'll hit the NFC later this week, but we got West locked and loaded as our number four to hit it. So we're going to go through each team in the four divisions,

and everybody gets three minutes. No complaining in the mentions about your team not getting enough. But we still get complaints, as it turns out, West, because people then complain, oh, those bozos went down some wormhole, and they talked about my team for 30. seconds and talked about, I don't know, Drew Locke's grandmother that was on Twitter for the other two and a half minutes. We're always going to get like pinged on something. Well, that's, that goes with the territory, but I maintain, I've always said, hey, put the blame on your team,

not us. Your team should be a lot more interesting. And then we'd find lots of things to talk about for three minutes. Cast the blame at your team like a critical thinking fan. There he is. I love it. Just dropping the hammer in a big spot, as strong as ever. All right. So we're going to go through it all. And I don't think we should even waste time. You know, there's some big news that happened in the league.

And we'll fold that into the AFC South Talk. But let's get going. Let's start in the AFC East. And oh, before we do, I just want to welcome in Arjuna, Rangopal. He's filling in for Ricky Hollywood, who's got something cooking that I don't want to talk about yet on the podcast. But she's out for a reason that's very kind of fun and interesting. and potentially embarrassing for her. So there's a lot of things in play.

Maybe great glory for Ricky comes out of this. Maybe something horrific that changes the trajectory of her life forever. That's a little easier to you. But Arjuna is filling in for Ricky, and we just want to apologize as a podcast to get thrown into the fire for the first time and be doing a around the AFC in 48 minutes. That's a lot of responsibility on your plate, man. And I'm sorry.

That's okay. I'm used to it. You know, having worked with Arjohn, June, if you just, it doesn't really matter what's going, what's, what's, what's flying around. I mean, he's nice to come. Yeah, that was a real, uh, that was a real, uh, that was a real no pressure, no diamonds response from Arjuna and I'm good. I'm ready.

And you keep us in line, Arjuna. And if anybody goes over the three minutes, uh, we have those, we have a ton of, we actually bought way too many tranquilizer dots, uh, darts when we were, uh, putting the bangles into the bangle sanctuary. So if you want to offload those, just fire them right into Greg's carotid artery. Okay, sounds safe. There, go ahead, do a target. You can do a little target practice right here before we get going.

Oh, you've been practicing with that weapon there. Yeah. That's right on Greg up. Got water on Greg's face. All right, once Greg comes to, we're going to get going because he's starting us off. in the AFC East. Let's do it right now, Arjuna, around the AFC in 48 minutes, we begin with the New England Patriots. Go, Greg. We have talked so much about Cam Newton and the quarterback situation and the offense in general that I think we've done a disservice to the problems on the

rest of the Patriots roster. And I think Bill Belchuk can figure things out because he's Bill Belichick as the season goes on. But even if Prime Tom Brady was there, I think you look at the rest of this team. And you see more holes than you've seen in a little while at tight end. They're really counting on these two rookie tight ends, Devon Asiase, who got hurt in camp, Dalton King. We'll see. Their entire pass rush is really built on is Chase Winovich got to somehow break out. Maybe he will. He's had a good camp. Dietrich Wye is a guy who's been there forever. They kind of like right now. They're counting on two rookies at inside linebacker, Anfrey Jennings and Josh Uche. You look at their right tackle as a guy who's barely

started or played in the league. And I just think, other than the secondary, other than cornerback, you have more question marks outside of just quarterback and just the lack of speed at wide receiver than you've had in a while. Belichick had turned the roster over a couple times, especially every 10 years. It was similar in 2010, and a lot of young players played a lot better than anyone expected, and they were competitive. I think they could do it again. But I think we've maybe undersold how difficult a coaching job this is going to be, including on defense, for Belichick, his two sons and like two other guys. I mean, they have less coaches on that staff than any defensive staff in the league.

That's a fact. There's a lot of Belichick, not a lot of other coaches. That's it. That's it. Well, I don't know if you might be overselling the defense. You're going to have a hard time getting me to be too concerned about that side of the ball. but when I'm reading that Gunner Olshevsky is the number two receiver. A lot of that.

In training camp, that's a problem. Like, what, as a Patriots fan, what are your thoughts on Nikiel Harry at this moment? He's been super up and down in camp. They say some great days, some bad days. That sounds familiar. Similar to him last year, he has to stay healthy. I mean, I'm honestly more hoping that Muhammad Sunniu shows up as like a 90% of what Mohammed Sunniu used to be because that seems more realistic.

and Harry is just contributing. But the defense I am concerned about, because defensive tackles another position where they were going to have Bo Allen start. He's gone. It's a bunch of guys, and they always figure out a way, and I think they will because Belichick's a good coach,

but I think just talent-wise, it's less than they've been in a while. Yeah, I feel like the best coach in the history of the NFL is, you know, he's not saying much, but he's pretty amped up to kick people's asses. And I got two other words for you. It's called Ernie Adams,

and he's hidden away in his, little laboratory and like they could wheel out the lollipop kids at wide receiver and still they're going to be fine i i i don't even think this is zigging when others are sagging i see new england as a playoff team i just i trust them to adjust during the weirdest year in football history as well as anyone hmm gregg rosenthal well done mark sessler buffalo bills you know i pretty blindly adore the bills and i realize that and i think it's based on some uh some absurdities such as like, I just like Western and upstate New York and the trees and the farms up there. And, you know, we sat down with Sean McDermott. He was really nice to us.

And that's all it takes. Like, I'm on Love Island with the bills. But there's a lot to like. I love how they've rebuilt the entire offense in just a couple off seasons. I mean, I think this is one of the better, more reliable, wide receiving cores in the AFC. You've added someone that can be a legit deep threat in digs. And it's up to Josh Allen to improve, you know, his drastically horrific deep ball throwing skills. But I think that, you know, he's going to help. Diggs is going to help a lot. I love their backfield right now with Devin Singletary and Zach Moss. I can't wait to see what Zach Moss does. This might be a top three defense. So, you know, I do think, though, in the AFC, you have to be a better coach than Bill Belichick over the course of the season to win that

division. I just have that much respect for the Patriots. But I think that Sean McDermott, here's my question for you. I think, you know, I get, I know I get fascinated with these guys and you probably think I'm a bit of a rube on that front, but I think this is one of the AFC's next great coaches. Am I overrating what Sean McDermott, the Sean McDermott factor can mean for Buffalo in the weird AFC East? He's proven himself over the past two years, certainly three years, that he's a guy that's a long-term answer. That's why he got an extension. I do disagree with the notion that to to beat the Patriots, you have to be a better head coach than Bill Belichick, because that's just not going to happen.

But what the bills have in their favor is a huge talent gap between them and the Patriots. And that's kind of my feeling on it. You mentioned the Patriots, Mark, that you haven't ticketed for the playoffs just because they're the Patriots and it's Bill Belichick and Ernie Adams. But I can't get past the fact that the bills are just so much more talented. And then when you factor in the fact that they have a young rising head coach, I'm not ready to put them in like the upper echelon yet, but a guy that's really got them going to the right direction

and an entire organization that's going in the right direction. I think this is the heavy favorite to be a playoff team coming out of the division. I'm so impressed with Brandon Bean in their front office. And that started after they made the playoffs. And they said the next off season, we're not a playoff team. We're rebuilding. We're in salary cap hell. So they didn't rush things.

They went about it the right way. And every year, look at how they've built that. offense around Josh Allen to the point his rookie year he had that very little around him maybe the worst wide receiver core in the NFL and then this year who's got I mean how many teams you can probably count on one hand better wide receiver core step on big school beasley john brown and their rookie fourth rounder gabriel davis is getting a lot of love in training camp as well and then you get you had Zach Moss to devon singletary at running back I just I just really love the way they've built this off around Josh Allen little Tyler croft love too they got them all

every right. No excuses for Josh Allen. Zero. True. Those chimes are for the people that complained about the air horn. We listen. New York Jets. Adam Gase might be coaching for his career in 2020. His reputation as one of the league's bright young coaching minds

was damaged in Miami, pretty much obliterated in the past 20 months since he took the Jets job. And he got ripped by Jamal Adams on his way out the door. Lev Bell couldn't wait to put him on blast on Twitter over the hamstring practice thing last week and it's just telling.

And given the injuries, illnesses, and roster deficiencies last year, I thought it was a bit lazy for everyone to say, oh, the Jets weren't good last year because Adam Gates is the head coach and that's why they're offense stuck. There were a lot of reasons why they stunk, and Gase had a role in it,

but he's not the only reason. However, I don't think there will be any excuses for Gase if Sam Darnold and Company can't take the next step in 2012. And, oh, by the way, this is still a limited roster. Gase still doesn't have a lot to work with. So my question is, is there any way Gace gets out of this alive? And forget about just holding on to the Jets job, because maybe that's just doomed. But where he becomes one of those guys that goes from hot shot offense coordinator, head coach,

and then all of a sudden he's like, where is Adam Gase? Is he even the league right now? Is that in play if this year goes sideways? Well, I think him maybe never being a play caller again, you know, forget head coach, if things go sideways, is absolutely. in play because, you know, when you fail in New York, like the whole world knows about it. And he doesn't seem the trend of the coaches like your Sean McVeigh's and others who relate to today's players. And you just watch Hard Knocks and see that Sean McVeigh is so much more than just a brilliant play caller.

He creates a culture. And Adam Gase does that in reverse. You know, and I'm at the point where the Jets jokes just aren't even funny. They're bleak. And I can't think of a quarterback outside of Sam Darnold who's been put into a first-round quarterback who's been put into a worse situation over his career. I mean, it's just like, come on. The only way they save it is Sam Darnold making a huge leap and Gase may be taking the credit for it.

I think Gase can get jobs because he seems to have so many friends in the media in front office and people believe in them. I mean, that's why we heard he was so great for year after year. It's amazing he got this job so quick. I don't think he'll get another head coaching job if this doesn't go well. I think they were set up for a decline anyways because I think this division's bad. I just, I think the schedule is so easy. last year, and the talent is so poor on defense for the Jets.

And yeah, Greg Williams can coach him up, but he needs Quinn and Williams to show up. He needs Marcus May, who everyone says looks amazing in camp, took Jamal Adams' role, to be kind of an all-pro type of guy. They haven't had much of a pass-russian camp. They're saying, okay, well, that's a good sign for the offensive line. Like, we'll see. On paper, I think- Don't say it, Greg, don't say it.

I'm- what? John Abraham. Go ahead. On paper, I think this is one of the two or three words. rosters in the league. I think the dolphins are another one in this division. That's what, and I don't think the bills and Patriots necessarily rack up wins either. I think nine wins could win this division. I think I'm ready for a blowback against leaders who sow discord, chaos, and negativity.

And Adam Gates is one of those. The Miami Dolphins, Chris Wesley. Well, I'm catching up on the Dolphins news. and a couple of things stood out to me. Preston Williams, who tore his ACL and the second half of last season and was arguably their best skill position player as a rookie before tearing that ACL

seems to be doing really well in camp and coming back strong. That's something to keep an eye on, but I've been surprised by, and I guess my question to you guys, is how big of a surprise is that the camp battle is not Tua versus Fitzpatrick, it's Tua versus Joss Rosen for the number two job.

I am surprised. Maybe we shouldn't be because Tua is coming off a major injury in the shortened time. But they didn't make it any effort at giving Tua first team reps. And now Ryan Fitzpatrick missed some time. His mother unfortunately passed away, but he's back with the team now. He's going to be starting. The Tua practice reports have been pretty up and down. I don't think he's wowed anyone.

He's going to be the backup. He'll be the guy to replace Fitzpatrick at some point. But it doesn't sound like he was particularly close. And I think they know it's a tough spot, especially early in this season with this offensive line. I know they have a lot of new players, so hopefully the line is better, but it was maybe the worst line in the league last year, totally new group. I think the defense is professional, though. I think the defense is a lot more talented than it was a year ago, especially in the secondary. Yeah, I think they put a lot of money into the defense, and they had to.

I mean, their inability to rush the passer and protect their own passer was a death knell. and I think the Brian Flores did a great job down the stretch. But it almost puts, you don't want to be overly optimistic about the dolphins because of what we saw down at the end of the year knocking off New England and stuff. I mean, to me, I look at the offensive roster, and there's some parts there, but it's one of the weirder offensive rosters around. Right. It's just really strange.

Parker has been out of practice, Devante Parker. And so it's like, you look at that receiver core and, ooh, pretty thin. Flores is in a very tough situation. and, look, Ryan Fitzpatrick, let's start there. I mean, how many times has the Ryan Fitzpatrick gone well in year two? And I know he was awesome last year. As Marcus pointed out many times, he let the team in rushing, in addition to passing and just being a guy that you just love to root for.

But it usually doesn't get so good after that. So to me, it becomes just this like internal battle in the organization about Tua and whether they can make the right decision with him, both health-wise and for the good of the franchise. I think that's the big storyline to take out. out of their season. Winning five games to me would be an accomplishment to match that. I feel, and I don't think Dolphins fans feel that way,

but just the way last season fell, I think they got a little lucky with the schedule, again, you know, with the AFC East, that if they can repeat that, that's good. You just want to know that Tua is okay and a promising, and that Flores continues being a promising young coach. I think that's fair, and it's down to quarterback. Fitzpatrick, like Dan said, does not have a record of doing it two months in a row, much less two years in a row.

And then two is probably not ready to come in and be a stud just yet. Zero. We close the book on the AFC East. Well done. Very disciplined, boys. Let's move now to the AFC North. And Chris, start us off again, this time with the Ravens. You look at this team and record-setting offense last year,

but I think what a lot of people failed to see about the Ravens is also one of the youngest offenses in the NFL. Look at their skill position players and everything's been the last three drafts. they're so deep now especially maybe the deepest backfield in the NFL their wide receiver a position that in that franchise's history has given them all kinds of problems is now probably a position of strength guys like rookies like devon de verne and jk daubbins and even james prosh who's been getting some love in the in the training camp how much of an impact do you see those guys having considering the depth they have at those positions not much i mean dobbins might be the everyone says he looks great in camp i'm having a hard time not getting really excited about him yeah and i was excited that's one guy our our friend spice rack uh was huge on thinking he's like the next my brother phil was big on him and and he needed it because this was the most run heavy team since the tim tibo broncos and lamar jackson had three times the rushing value compared to any other quarterback in the league according to football outside is that sustainable i think so but you got to put

some new twists on it. You know, I think you have to, you want to throw the ball a little more, you want to use your receivers a little more, and you hope the defense is good from the start of the season on, because the defense really came on strong late for the Ravens, not so much in the playoffs, but on paper, they should be pretty good. Like, it should be a balancing. They shouldn't have to be the best rushing team in the league to be one of the top two AFC teams. I mean, I did our picks for NFL.com, and, you know, last year I picked the Browns to go to the Super Bowl, and that acid trip wore off and I am picking the Ravens this time around

and I don't think they are going to be 14 and 2 because that just doesn't happen two years in a row. But, you know, they were not the same team at the end of last year when Mark Andrews got injured and when Mark Ingram got injured. They just really weren't the same crew. And I think that the Dobbins pick, he's the kind of guy that might,

maybe it's not early on to answer your question, Chris, but I could see Dobbins becoming the guy down the stretch and, you know, changing everything for Baltimore. I love that they have, it tells me we're not going to try to be that different than we were last year. That is what we want to do. And we're going to, you know that's what we're going to do. And it's going to be us versus you.

I love that they signed Cleas Campbell. I think Markingham was the best free agent signing of a year ago in the NFL. And Cleas Campbell will have a huge impact on that defense, which is improved. And I really just don't see a big weakness on this team other than maybe depth at wide receiver. I don't love, I wanted them to get a manual sales. or someone at wide up. Back to Jackson and running the football.

In his first two seasons, this from ESPN, he has 265 design runs, 159 more than any other quarterback. Josh Allen, second with 106. That still doesn't feel sustainable to me in the long term. I know he's been durable so far, but that's be careful. This is your franchise now, right? Agreed.

Sustainable for one more year. Do it. Take that away, and what do you have? The Pittsburgh Steelers. Has the sense of urgency in Pittsburgh ever been higher in the Tomlin era than right now? Or should it be? Big Ben, 38 years old. We know his whole situation.

The Patriots, we know they're not special anymore. So you don't have to worry about them anymore being the fly in the ointment. The roster is loaded with free agents, many of whom could be playing elsewhere with the uncertainty around the salary cap right now. championship roster great skill pieces on both sides of the ball the defense could be the best in the league put big ben and back in for Rudolph and duck Hodges and that could be a huge upgrade is it now or never for the black and gold I think so because Ben either is going to make it through and still be Ben I guess then it wouldn't be not you know then then you think okay maybe you have one more year but how many more can you count on I think they've had one of the

most positive training camps of any team, not just because they haven't had any major injuries, but Rathusberger's made it through, and everyone there is saying his arm looks good. I know there were some reports early. He's like short-arming things or whatever, but he's out there every day. He's practicing. They say he's throwing the ball well, and he's getting through this. Will it last when he's getting tackled? I don't know, but I think it was a fair question to even wonder how it was going to look

in August, and he's throwing fine against air. They have to be fired up to have him on the field at the same time of this defense. which it took a long time to come together, but there's a lot of great players on this defense at every level. I think it's, you know, we forget that they were eight and five a year ago with an absolute nightmare roster. And I think that there are a little bit of a revenge to our team.

And we cited them correctly as maybe one being overlooked a little bit. I mean, the next factor is, is Juju Smith-Schuster going to be who he was two years ago? Is Antonio Brown correct in saying that he's not a true number one? I think he was in a terrible situation a year ago. I mean, I would also look as. He was hurt too. He was banged up. Yeah, I mean, it was not a good, it's not shocking why he wasn't himself.

I think this is also possibly Big Ben's last year in Pittsburgh. I honestly have this returning vision of him being Gruden's quarterback with the Raiders next year for one year. So I think the urgency is there in that like this isn't, you know, it's now or never for Pittsburgh 100%. Yeah, I see them as the favorite in the division. I really do. Go ahead.

Over Baltimore. more. Yep, I do. I disagree with that, but I think they'll be right there, you know, very close. Juju is still younger than some of the guys who were drafted this year. I mean, he's still developing. He still got room to grow. And a guy that Greg has liked for the past few months, Chase Claypool is getting all kinds of positive pub coming out of camp, which is so interesting watching draft season and seeing like the Bob McGinn article where he's like graded as a tight end because they don't think he can stay a wide receiver. And now he's blowing the doors off a training camp.

Well, who knew that he's a monster that looks like a tight end actually can be good for a wide receiver in the red zone. Makes sense to me. 1.0. Play ball. All right, Sessler. Make it count, the Cleveland Browns. All right.

Well, I think we've talked about this team a lot, and we know the offensive talent is there. And I've been watching, they've been putting these two hour-long camp practices on YouTube every day. I've been tape-dogging this stuff, Wes, okay? And here's my big concern. That's commitment. I don't see.

here's my this is a legit concern i'm not trying to be freaked out about it i don't see in these practices a drop off from baker mayfield to case keenam i know that case keenum is is comfortable in this defansky system and baker has had to learn a lot a third system in three years i don't like that it's not easy i give mayfield credit for getting his body right he has been all focused on football um but here's my issue and this is a little bit more of an esoteric browns issue we can get into the other stuff. This whole Baker being silent and Baker, you know, just quietly working, Baker Mayfield is like that cocky cowboy who you love or hate based on your own POV. And the NFL quarterbacks are a different deal. I don't really want a quieter Baker Mayfield. I want him to be

who he is. And I don't think the Browns maximize who they are if he is muted or overly humbled in that position where he's still coming off of last year's disaster. And you can tell me, have I've fallen down another one of these sort of Brown's mental wormholes, or is there something to the fact that, look, if you're, if you want to be the quiet leader, be it. But if you're Baker Mayfield, your soul is something entirely different, be who you are. And don't apologize for it. That goes for everything, everybody in life, but mostly for quarterbacks.

You have to be genuine. You have to be true to yourself. And we're not going to have answers to Baker Mayfield in August. We're not going to know until October or November how he's, one. But the best sports stories are about overcoming adversity. And after what last season was for him, this is overcoming adversity. He's got to show that there's more fiber to him than what he showed last year, that he's got some willpower because the personality he's putting out there, you got to put out more effort than you put out last year. He played incredibly well as a

rookie, ran his mouth that summer leading up to last year, played poorly, and it looked bad. So now he's moving in silence. If he plays well in September, he'll be talking again. I think I don't buy it. I don't buy the moving and silence thing. I think he's doing it because he's smart and people told him to be this way right now.

But we know who he is by now. He's a charismatic guy. He's a cocky kid and I expect that to come out. I'm already cringing by everyone like applying like if he does bad, it's because he was quiet. If he does well, it's because he was quiet. And it's like,

no, he was, I think he was humbled by defenses. You know, he was hummed. He is a gamer. You know, I hate that phrase, but he created a lot after the snap without exactly knowing what he was seen as a rookie. And he was awesome. I think he still threw the ball pretty well at times last year. He just made a lot of bad mistakes.

And he realized he needs, as Wes said, he needs to get in the playbook more. He needs to, like, learn what he doesn't know more. Go ahead, Mark. You got three seconds. Two words, Harrison Bryant, Future Star. This guy is going to be awesome. A lot of two tight end sets. Hit me with that dart gun.

It's like I want it. Give it to me. Give it to him. Go on. The carotid artery. All right. Moving on, closing out the division, Wes. I mean, Greg, excuse me, the Cincinnati Bengals.

Let's head to the sanctuary. It is so strange to be coming off a off season where we have talked about the Bengals a ton as a fun team. One thing to keep an eye on, Joe Mixon hasn't been practicing for more than a week because of, quote, unquote, migraines might have. have a contract coming before the season. I think that ends up, it sounds like it's going to be handled perfectly well, like Melvin Ingram's situation, but keep an eye out for that. I think they've had a really good camp because AJ Green is healthy again. T. Higgins is out there.

And they are the team that had three receivers on the field more than almost any team other than Arizona last year with these trashy receivers. Now you've got a nice group. Jonah Williams has looked good at left tackle during camp. Joe Burrow is out there making team statements on social justice. in front of 50 veterans and they tell him to be the guy to lead him. Like, I love that

that he's already kind of impressed the people around him. Are you, now that we're right here, Wes, are you feeling it? Are you getting back into the Bengals? Come on home. I'm back home, Chris Wesleying. I'm not coming home, but this might be the most encouraged I've been for Bengals fans

since the 80s. Yeah. I mean, Joe Burrow, to me, I've been saying this all along, the natural leadership qualities are there. And then to see Jay Morrison, who writes for the athletic in Cincinnati, said he was easily the MVP of training camp. Your rookie quarterback drafted number one overall. I mean, sure, it's only August.

Take it with a grain of salt. But if you're a Bengals fan, nothing is putting a bouncing your step like Joe Burrow, like actually putting forth on the field in training camp that he is that guy. Yeah, I feel like it came out of central casting as like the perfect quarterback. I mean, he's smoking cigars in the locker room. He's got awesome hair. And Zach Taylor on NFL.com is my, doing those picks again. He's my coach of the year, dude, because they're going to go 2 and 14 last year.

I think they're going to go 9 and 7. They're going to wax the Browns in week two. I've already texted you with those fears. I think the Bengals are going to be super fun. I'm not kidding. I think they're going to be this awesome story this year. And as much as I don't love that, I'm really happy for Bengals fans because it has been a dark winner for decades. I don't want to take us off topic,

but if you have the Bengals as one of the fun stories in the NFL and the Ravens as like a Super Bowl team and the Steelers right there, you must not be very high in your Browns. No, I think they're the fourth place team because I think they were as affected by anyone by injuries in camp and also an impossible transition, a tough ask.

Other teams in that division are steady, steady, steady. The Eagles would like to have a word to you on those injuries. Well, they're up there. You lost like an outside linebacker. It was like, okay. Let's get back to the sanctuary. Yeah, let's give the, let's give the Bengals defense a little attention because they were terrible last year.

But I think they do have some extra. And they're going to be terrible again. Dunlap was good. If Gino Atkins can be a little more like Gino-Ackons. They're on the back nine of their career. We can't expect improvement. That's fair. Dunlap at the end of last year was as good as he's ever played the last five or six years.

Just saying. Good guy. All right. before we close out the AFC South, let's pause here, Arjuna, to break down the big news coming out of Jacksonville this weekend. And then we'll dovetail right into West setting up that team for three minutes. But yes, the big news, the Jaguars traded franchise tag defensive Venniak and Gokwe to the Vikings for a 2021 second round pick and a conditional 2022 fifth round pick of the Vikings announced Monday in Gakway. And this one, this blew my mind. And I've seen

a lot in football and guys unhappy about contracts and unhappy with their team. But I've never seen a guy take a pay cut like this. And Gakwe has agreed to a one-year, $12 million deal with the Vikings. Instead of playing out the franchise tender of close to $18 million with the Jaguars, that's what it took to get the trade done. The Vikings had limited cap space. Let's start with Ingakway. Greg, your thoughts on the deal.

Did they promise him that they're going to pay him a specific amount under the table? Vikings, I mean, to make this trade? I don't know. Because you're right. And I wouldn't shock me. No one would ever be able to find out about it. They said they're confident they can re-sign them. They can't do that right now because of the rules having to do with franchise tags. Because to take a $6 million pay cut just because you won out of Jacksonville so much is fascinating.

I mean, he certainly did not like that organization. It's an awesome trade for the Vikings, I think, because his speed plays well. I love him on the indoor track opposite the Neal Hunter. I mean, I really think it solves one of the big question marks for the Vikings this year. Yeah, I think also the other thing about Ngaukwe is despite the clashing with the Jaguars, everyone sort of says this guy works hard and he's not a problem at all. It's the opposite. And if you want to look back a year ago, it was Jalen Ramsey who went, you know,

the trades or the Rams did not require him signing a new contract right away. He also wanted to get out of it so bad that it was just like there was a culture issue. And I can't remember a more dead, you know, like floating dead duck coach in the NFL in the NFL than Doug Marone right now. I mean, it's like what on earth would Doug Marone have to do? I mean, they'll probably keep them anyways. But I mean, how many rebuilding jobs is David Caldwell going to oversee at this point? I mean, we all see the numbers of the first rounders that have not gotten to second contracts and gotten out of there and produced elsewhere or just been, you know, bus. I just, I, what's going on here?

The loyalty to these guys is surprising to me. It reminds me of the 90s Bengals where David Caldwell is going to rebuild for what, the third time? I mean, and what's he done with his high draft picks so far? You got guys scratching at the walls to get out of there. That's not healthy. They have one winning season since 2008. Caldwell got there in 2013. Shot Khan got there in 2011.

I mean, they took the longest victory lap ever for that one winning season. And we signed Bordels and didn't draft, you know, some of the better passers we've seen in decades. So the other move, Leonard Fournett has been cut loose. The Jaguars tried and tried and tried to move the former number four overall pick in 2017 on a trade. Doug Morone told the media that as much on Monday saying they could not find anything. Sixth round pick, seventh round pick. There was just no market for Leonard Fournett. Well, listen, I know

people, nobody likes Leonard Fornett as a player right now. I was surprised when I was looking at his numbers that he did have 1,500 total yards last year and he didn't find the end zone a lot, but this wasn't a guy that was a total disaster for them last year

and now they dump him and I get why people are saying this is a tank for Trevor situation because he made their roster more talented, right? I know he's not a stud, but he made them better. I think. for net is one of the year he might be exhibit a for why you need to watch the games in football his numbers are so different from what you're getting for him that it's volume pure volume is what it is

like you can stick a lot of guys in there make on the three down back and they're going to get fifteen hundred total yards i mean that's just the way it works especially if you force feed him checkdowns and dump off passes and he's the exact wrong guy to be getting that stuff you want to hit Leonard Fournett with room to run. As a big guy, he should be making guys miss and running over people. But most of his big plays come from getting to the second level of the defense and just outrunning everyone. Because for the first few yards, he's not going anywhere. And he's just a really inefficient running back. I think he could do a lot better in a different offense. He's probably ill-suited for what Jay Gruden's going to want to come in and do. And that's why they're getting

rid of him. I thought he was much better in 2019 than he was in 2018. and I think he can help a team. But if you're just looking at numbers, you're going to drastically overrate the guy. I would say go read Wes's game notes on Fournet that he tweeted out before the show today in which he gives him the nickname Battleship Fournette. Maybe you can explain Wes why he earned that nickname.

Well, you know, it has to do it. It's like imagining him turning around with his back to a defender in the passing game and trying to make a move on a guy is like a battleship turning around in the Panama Canal. There's just no agility there. Like, you're not going to make anyone miss. You're not, it's a tight space with a guy who's just going to take an hour to unwind and go around him.

Well, how does this guy go for overall? How does he go ahead of Patrick Gajon? Yeah, to be fair to the Jaguars. How did it happen then? I thought that they were crazy to double down on Bortles that year. And we were on the record then saying that because he was coming off a bad year. But everyone had Fournett ahead of McCaffrey, not to mention Mixon and Camara and all the other running backs. He's a 240-pound guy who runs a 4-4-40.

I mean, that's why he got trapped. People were just in love with that tape of like people, like they thought because defenders in the SEC that he was too much for them, that he was somehow going to overpower NFL defenders. And it just aren't many guys like that that come up come along that are so physically dominant. Derek Henry's won. I mean, Derek Henry's kind of done it. but there just aren't many guys like that. It's also the NFL and so much it is dependent upon scheme, coaches, and teammates. Right.

And if you put this guy in the right offense surrounded by the right people and call the right plays for him, it wouldn't surprise me if people start seeing him as a Pro Bowl kind of runner instead of a guy where he's being used wrong, he's getting the wrong touches and he's behind a bad offensive line with a rookie quarterback. And you can't put it all in Caldwell because there's the Tom Coughlin factor who wanted to build a team that got shotguned out of 1936 based around, you know, a big body back where it's like, that can work, but you also have Blake Bortle's a quarterback. They're always blaming someone, though.

It's like they blame the previous GM at first. Then they blame, well, it wasn't our fault. We brought in cop. Well, you were there. You were the one that brought it. You know, you're part of that group that brought in coffee. I guess you can blame the owner if you really want, not Caldwell. But they're always, they're always pushing around the blame.

It's like it's not Marone's fault. It's not called by it's not. It's not what he's fault. We're just the worst organization in the league when it comes to winning games. Right. I was going to say yesterday in my side yard, the bottom of like the wooden gate

was blown to smithereens because there was my two sons in the house and then my friend Bob's two sons and the four of them just going ab and slamming in this batmobile into the bottom. And then when I went for answers, I wanted accountability. It was just everybody pointing fingers

at each other for the blame. Nobody wanted to take the accountability. So when you're being likened to a, let's say, a six-year-old, a three-year-old, a four-year-old, and an eight-year-old. Maybe your organization needs to clean things up a little bit. Maybe. Look at all the talent they've had come through there. And, you know, Greg has pointed out in the past that defenses are unreliable from year to year. When you build your team around defense, you can't count on it like two years from now, they're going to be great.

And Clayas Campbell's gone. Dexter Fowler is gone. Jalen Ramsey's gone. Telvin Smith, Malik Jackson. I mean, this was a Super Bowl caliber roster except that quarterback. And it reminds me of an article I wrote like five years ago where Mike Holngren says, you draft a guy and here's the very important part. No matter what happens, you stand by him.

You stand by him in public. You stand by him in private. No matter what happens on the field, you stand by him. At what point are you doing yourself a disservice to the point where you ruin your franchise by standing by the guy. You miss your Super Bowl window because you stood by the guy. All right.

Let's now get into the, around the AFC format. Once again, Wes, let's hit the Jaguars now suddenly without any of their well-known guys from the past. I don't think it's an apples-to-apples comparison because the Jaguars have tried to strengthen their roster. They've gone out and signed some veterans

to fill some holes. But this is the closest thing this year, obviously to the 2019 dolphins where we're unloading our veterans who we don't see could have a future with us. They won't be a part of our next winning team. So my question is, what constitutes a success for the 2020 Jaguars? I would say this real quick. It's Wes, it's funny. I wrote the words organic jag tank because I feel the same way that they are, they're running that going down that road right now. I think you need to, because you're probably going to be the number one or two pick, right? You have to

find out what you had in Gardner Minchew and to the point of sticking with the wrong quarterback. If Gardner Minchu is just a really serviceable fun backup, you need to know that by the end of the year and not make the mistake of not getting the best quarterback out there and staying in the same, you know, dark territory that they've been for so long. I think you have to evaluate the most important position on your roster and aggressively go fix it next off season. I think you hit on some picks and your young players play better. I don't, you know, I think they could be a little feisty on offense. Minchu at his moments, I think the receivers are pretty good.

The offensive line is stable, and that hasn't been the case. I mean, they have their starters back. I think it's having those young players, Leviska Chanel, Josh Allen, you know, the first round pick this year, what was it, Chasin? C.J. Henderson, I mean, they had a couple first round pick. this year. Those guys playing, I mean, Miles Jack was a guy they thought they were going to build around coming off a pretty rough year. So it's like some of these young guys stepping up and the offense being feisty. I don't necessarily think they're the number one pick. It wouldn't, it wouldn't surprise me if they have a dolphins like season where, you know, their fifth or sixth in the draft. And there are certainly rosters out there, I think, that are just as bad or worse. I just say on paper there. And like they, I get concerned about, if you want to talk about like a Corona Risk team, one of these teams where the coach is, not part of the future he's losing the players they start one and eight you're in florida people are out partying saying forget this whole thing i mean that is when you get in you step into a stickier

scenario feels like garner minchu is in an impossible spot because even if he is i mean i don't i have a different view on his ceiling than other people on the show but even if he's pretty good if you're running this organization you're probably going to want to do the bangles thing here or what teams have been doing forever is like we need to reboot we need a new face of the franchise and as cute as gardener is with his floppy hair and his social media stuff like you probably want to get the number one hot shot out there and say this is our guy we're starting over and he's the face of it feel like that's where this is all headed maybe he'll end up five four maybe he'll be the brown's quarterback next year mark you know

as long as he keeps that floppy hair all right All right, let's continue now to roll through the AFC South. Greg, Houston Texans. The Texans gave Zach Cunningham, their inside linebacker, a big contract over the weekend. And it got me thinking sort of about this roster. And I like Cunningham. He's one of the best run stoppers in the league, although they have two highly paid inside linebackers, which is weird in 2020.

They'll probably get rid of Bernadrick McKinney. I think it's a fine signing. But it reminds me this is not a young team, partly because they haven't had drafts, partly because they haven't hit on their drafts, like their hope this year, and it's a dangerous spot to be, is just like the veterans they have have to be

available and better. It's like because those veterans are pretty good. JJ Watt is number one among them. I mean, they're a totally different team when he's out there. But Whitney Merciless is another guy, Bill O'Brien, the GM, gave a huge contract to late last season after one of his worst seasons.

I mean, he was not a good pass rusher last year. They gave Laramie Tunsell a huge contract. Smart people say he's one of the best in the league. I guess he is. He also had the most penalties of any left tackle in the league. So you want him to be even better, to be to be dominant. You want Will Fuller to be healthy, to be dominant. You want Deshawn Watson, if it's possible, to go up another tier, because that is possible. I mean, he's only entering what year four or five, a couple now away from ACL. Justin Reed played through an injury. I think he's a really impressive player at safety. So it's a bunch of guys who are veterans,

who you're just saying you're already really good. If these guys are all better, like those guys are pro bowlers and this team is a lot to deal with in a division where there's really no big favorite. Well, they have been and they continue to be a particularly shallow team that wins a weak division

because they have stars at the top. And it reminds me of like the Cowboys 10 years ago when they had the star power names, but if they have an injury or two, then you're in trouble. And, you know, on top of it, to your point that the veterans need to show up and be great now, next year is another year where they don't have a first or second round pick. You don't pick till the third.

It's like there isn't, you're not really, there's not a real easy way to add an injection of young talent and build the way good teams do, which is through the draft. I mean, it, it's an interesting team because of, because of Bob's unpredictability around the trade deadline. I still think that they will do some freaky stuff this year. but there's no proof that this plan works. Yeah, and O'Brien got killed, obviously, this offseason. And even as a long time, Bob Defender, I couldn't.

But I also think it's premature, especially we're talking about a division that feels wide open, to think that this team won't be right back there. Will Fuller, to me, is the Djanga piece, the Dameshik Jenga piece, because he's so talented and so good. If his body just held up, he can end up putting up numbers that eclipsed what DeAndre Hopkins did last year.

I think he has that level ceiling. Every wide receiver on their team is like if his body just holds up. Brandon Cooks, Randall Cobb, Brandon Cooks, Piki Kutei. Along those same lines, let's talk about the cults. Because I understand why the contingent of cults, cults hyper optimists out there exist. Philip Rivers is the old star QB with something to prove. you have a smart, proven offensive-minded head coach, a dominant offensive line,

an intriguing rookie running back, a veteran number one wideout who still has juice, an untested but promising second round pick at number two and number three wide out spots and Michael Pittman and Paris Campbell. The ceiling here for the Colts is as high as any team outside the Chiefs on offense for me. But how often do teams with that many factors

that need to go right? Does it actually all click? that's where I'm skeptical that everything clicks for the cults. If it all does, look out. They're going to go 12 and 4 this year. But a lot has to go right. Well, here's what they have gone for them. Even if things don't go right, they have depth because they've drafted and signed really well.

The organization is so sound. The structure is sound. To me, outside of Philip Rivers, disappointing, you can get by with the rest of that, with any other position disappointing. I mean, if Marlon Mack doesn't do well, Jonathan Taylor is there. If Michael Pittman isn't there, Zach Paskill, who had a pretty good gear, is there. I mean, they've got options if guys don't pan out. I don't think it's like an entirely hinging on Philip Rivers, too.

I mean, I think if he's just not a turnover robot. It's a lot of different things. Right. A lot of things that hinges on for this office to max out. I hear real quickly, I think that, like, this is another team where Frank Reich, Chris Ballard, the pairing of them is just very, they're in. in unison. It's very hopeful. And you can't really look past the human side of football and how they overcame what happened with Andrew Luck a year ago. I mean, it's like this, this is a tough,

this is a tough organization. I like this. I like the kind of style of football. I think they're going to, they're going to run on offense. And with a seventh playoff spot, if they're not a playoff team, Indianapolis got hit by an asteroid. I have, I have, we sent in those picks. I had the Colts winning the Super Bowl just because I wanted to pick something that would be fun to root for. And I think they're, they're one of those teams. outside like the top five most likely that that have a shot a lot of things have to go right as as dan mentioned but rivers's camp has had positive reviews that it's like he looks like a guy who's been in that offense before it's mostly short it's not a surprise he has been in that

office that's what i mean and tyy hilton he's he to me is the jengap i mean because when he's right he's a top five type of receiver and right now their connection you can see that working like him and keegan and allen rivers and keenan allen back in the day but hilton's got to stay right and I think I think the upside is there the downside is 8 and 8 and I get that but I think they could be a 3 seed that has the magical run they go through Baltimore and Kansas City

on the road in the playoffs because there's no crowd what if they're 3 and 5 do you think the backup gets back in no no you think there's any way no yeah reset gets back in really yeah supposedly he hasn't looked good in can be ugly the week to week league

all right close it out in the division mark sessler tennessee titans i think you know speaking of you know going into baltimore and going into kansas city tennessee's playoff you know magic from a year ago fell a little bit short but was one of the more enjoyable um developments that i can recall in a long time and i think the question for me i feel like with as much as any team in the afc we almost have to look at the titans and say here's how they get back they get back by the masterful arthur smith um needing his two dudes, Derek Henry and Ryan Tannahill. We spent weeks wondering which, which one will they keep? They kept both. And they have to almost mirror, I think, last year's success. I don't feel like this offense is built in a way to suddenly, hey, let's shift gears and be like an air raid

offense or roll out like the run and shoot with Mouse Davis. Like they are who they are. And we're asking Henry and Tanna Hill to kind of duplicate. And that to me feels very difficult for both of those guys. It's just a lot to ask. In their defense, always to me, they were, feisty, but they feel a little anonymous on that side of the ball still. Titans to me right in the mix, but last year was sort of magical. Can magic duplicate itself? I think that's a fair question. I don't think you can count on everything going so perfectly on offense.

For instance, there's no way their play action attack is going to be as effective as it was last year. It was just, it was abnormally effective. So to me, the improvement has to come on the other side of the ball. and the 2017-18 and 19 first-round picks, you need Adoree Jackson to be a Pro Bowl cornerback. You need Rishon Evans at inside linebacker to be a tackling machine, and he had one of the most impressive goal-line stands I've ever seen

last year in the playoffs. And you need Jeffrey Simmons to make Jarrell Casey an afterthought. And Jeffrey Simmons is talented enough to do it. To me, those guys have to be absolute stars, not just solid starters. It's a fair point because, you know, when you look at the names, there is a chance this defense. gets better. They lost D&Ps, their defensive coordinator. It's a little unclear how they're going to call plays, whether it would be Vrable or what they're going to do. But Malcolm Butler

actually played better for them last year. Like he's not a bad starting corner. You have Kenny Vicaro was solid. You have Kevin Byard in the secondary. Like you need a little more pass rush from Harold Landry or Vic Beasley. But add up all those names you said with the young guys. Like there is a top 10 defense upside. We haven't seen it since Vrabil's been there. And I agree. That's what they need because Tana Hill, it's going to slide back. It's just like how much. Is he sliding back to like a solid above average starter? I think he can do that.

He's not going to be a top five starter again. It's just too crazy to expect. Derek Henry's last, let's call it, 22, 23 games have been as good as any running backs we've seen in some time. Is that sustainable? I mean, the abuse he takes, the what they ask of him, maybe he's still young. Maybe he still has another two, three, four years in the tank. But that's another question, Mark.

Will he be able to sustain that greatness? I love like Rabel, though. Two, one, zero. The masterful Arthur Smith. I know. I think Arthur Smith is an underwell. I think he's an underrated O.C. He's a great job last year.

Wait, he's the FedEx. The FedEx Air, right? Skyon. Who, you know, who tried to kneecap the Washington football team helped change their team name his dad, I guess. So it's all weirdly connected. Arjuna, don't be shy

with that tranquilizer gun now. Oh yeah, I forgot it. Let's close it out. The AFC West, the great mailman will deliver on the defending champs the chiefs. So I was going through Leonard for net landing spots

and the one that intrigued me the most, I think, was Kansas City. so if you have the rookie what's name Edwards E. Lairr? E. Lair, yeah. Clyde, the glide. So you have him in the old C.J. 2K

get the lead role with a playmaker, play him the first half, get the league, let him make plays, and then bring in Leonard Fournette in the keep the league clock killing rule in the fourth quarter, the old Lendale White rule. So you need Lendale White to be humble enough to accept that role

and the paycheck that comes with it and it would mean he has to go through the waiver wire probably maybe sit out for a few days nobody picks him up and then he's like well maybe my best bet is go win a Super Bowl with the Chiefs and then try to get a contract off of that to me that that's intriguing because I don't like the death behind Edwards Eilair you know it's so fortune smiles on the Chiefs in ways that it's never done before because you draft Edwards Elair let's say they hadn't and then Damien Williams you know that wouldn't change he'd still opt out I think and then you're asking about maybe Leonard Fournett being your feature back and nobody likes the idea of that.

I mean, they've got a few other guys there, but that would be messy. Instead, I think they're one of these teams. They remind me a little bit of like the Packers in 2011. You're going to go 15 and 1 and you just got to look out to not get waxed in January in one of these sort of more stunning playoff losses that comes to mind. What a place to be as a franchise. I think also if Fournett doesn't want to take that role, maybe call up the real Lendale White. I love that guy. I think he can do that. I want to see where he's,

or is he weighing in these days. He's got to be younger than Frank Gore, right? That was a fun group, Johnson and White, for like one or two years there. They were good. I do think you can find flaws in this Chief's team. I mean,

the defense was bad enough to give up 24 points right off the bat to the Texans in the playoffs, which could have ended their season for the second straight year. And then we would have just talked about how disappointing their defense was all offseason. They're starting cornerback,

I think right now is going to be Legerius Sneed, a rookie fourth round pick or Rashad Fenton. Bashad Breland, who's suspended for a month and so he'll be back is their best cornerback. It's like, okay, their second best pass rusher is either Alex Okiefer, you know, I'm talking about On the Edge, Breeland speaks.

It looks like it's going to be a... Who is that good? Passingong. I can never say his name is probably starting there. But, you know, those are questions. You know, those are key. spots, cornerback, past rusher. I mean, I think

they might be a very average defense in their hopes. I guess the worst case scenario is that they're back to being a bad defense. It's scary to think about Patrick Mahomes being injured for much of the last year and what they were still able to pull up, but there has not been a repeat

champion since like 2003. It's hard to do. I wouldn't pencil it. Penciling it, Mark? No. No. You took the Ravens. that's right Devere Broncos all right consider the current state of the Broncos on offense new offensive coordinator in place it's Pat Schumer by the way new QB coach they got a couple new offensive linemen two new wide receivers both rookies in a pandemic year drew lock as has been documented often here remains a theoretical answer at quarterback rather than an actual one at this point the offense i don't put too much in it i'll say it the offense really struggled in a scrimmage this past weekend so i'm just going to ask is it fair to wonder if the denver offense is a prime

underperformer candidate at least in the early part of the 2020 season it is fair to ask for all the reasons you outlined but you're not going to rain on my parade dan hansis i still have plenty of faith look i mean and most of it stems from jerry judy who has been as advertised in camp already seen as one of the best route runners in the NFL and has been phenomenal in camp Albert O, another rookie, the rookie tight end looks really good. This team, the depth in their skill position talent

compared to where they were two years ago is astonishing. And if they're a little bit of a freestyle team with Locke, it's like he makes guys better freestyling and to the point where maybe their defense can carry him. I mean, Noah Phant was better one slot. got out there. Philip Lindsay was better. Their receivers were better once Locke got out there because he can make some he can make some plays even if it was out of structure whereas their previous quarterbacks couldn't in your county on the

defense to carry this team I think. Well the defense gets more than four games this year from Bradley Chubb and I like that a lot and I think Vic Fangio is quietly one of the best defensive coaches around and you know I mean in ages my thing is like you talk about luck or he is masterful you talk about like I'll tell you I don't think it's masterful as Pat Schumer. I don't, Pat Schumer and like Drew Locke freestyling don't fit together to me. I mean, I think he did a nice job with the Vikings, okay?

But I still remember Pat Schumer being pinged by Michael Lombardi for like people calling up Lombardi saying, whenever I watch, you know, Pat Schumer's offenses, I know what's happening by looking at the formation in one second. So is this, can he do, I think, what you want with all this talent and question mark? Is he the right guy? I don't know.

I think they'll start slow because of what the answer. said too. I think they are, they could be particularly hurt by the pandemic. But the offensive line, especially on the interior, it does look better. It's always been a weakness. They don't really have a right tackle after Joanne James opted out. But that's always been a pretty big weakness for this team. And on paper, they look like they could be a lot better. Dalton Reisner looked great as a rookie. You know, they broaden a quality starter in Glasgow and they have a rookie center, a cushionberry that people seem to love. So they could be better up front. One concern with Bradley Chubb, just keep an eye on it.

He left the scrimmage early when that surgically repaired knee acted up. He said he didn't feel right. Hmm. All right. They said it's not serious, but... Not good. Oakland, excuse me, the Las Vegas Raiders, Mark Sessler. They kind of remind me a little bit of the Broncos because I look at the Raiders and I'm like,

I can talk myself into seeing them as a wildcard team. If things went right, I think Gruden is, you know, is fine. Mike Mayock has kicked some butt is GM. You got Henry Ruggs, you got Darren Waller, Josh Jacobs. So you can kind of see it coming together as a frisky AFC entry. But then I also look at like the games that they totally blew last season. Like when I went up, you know, to watch them play the Jaguars in a historically important final game in Oakland. And they totally blew it by being way too safe and conservative and not seizing the moment.

They got screwed by the officials in that game. We all know it on that out of bounds play when they stop the clock. Part of it is the quarterback in the way of his. style of play. I'm sorry. That capped a four-game losing streak down the stretch where they were outscored 136 to 49. So I just don't think they're all there yet. I mean, they just as easily feel like an eight-and-eight sidepiece to me, but I think Greg thinks they're a little frisky. Does anyone else see them as a sleeping giant? A what? They need sidepiece, yes. Sidepiece. Like a gumar of the NFL? Kind of. Like you kind of keep that team.

them hidden you know you don't you don't advertise the team you take out on saturday night yeah keep them a little you keep them in the shadows i think you're right mark that they were like a five and 11 team that won a couple extra games more than they should last year they really weren't a good team but they're a very different team now i mean whether these transactions work or not this is a very young team they're having their rookies play a lot they're having their second year players play a lot the free agent pickups that they had like travon mullen is their number one cornerback right now after they cut Amukamara on Monday, they're counting on these free agent linebackers.

They picked up. It's just a totally different team. It's a good-looking offensive line. I kind of want to believe in this tight-end crew and the running backs. They're going to have a lot of heavy sets. They're just going to be zigging while everyone's zagging. And I at least like that for a little diversity on my Sunday viewing.

But do you believe in the quarterback? No, I believe he's like an eight-and-eight side piece, I guess. There you go, basically. Eight and eight, by the way, with an extra playoff spot, might actually get you into January. I think they're a nine win type of team, though. Because I do think that there's so much room to improve on defense that they should, that even if they're like the 20th best defense,

man, that would be a big improvement for them. And I do think their offense can be pretty good. They're county on their offense to be a top 10 offense. Anything less would be a disappointment. What linebacking crew improved more than the Las Vegas one? I mean, Corey Littleton and Wes is. you know man crush that's a good little pairing right there quick kowski mhm yeah this is the first team we've run out of things to say

we're just in awe and admiration there's no there's more meat on that derrick car side piece bone but we don't have time so i'm just going to say i think he'll be okay i'm gonna get blocked again i'm still blocked finally gregg closed it out the los angeles chargers yeah we mentioned um like the the The injuries, like Nick Chubb, for instance, I mean, Bradley Chub is such a mystery right now. There's more mysterious injury situations around the league than I think we know because there's less reporting. But Derwin James's injury on Sunday, we know.

We don't know the extent to it. But I know that it's the most, or I think it's the most costly big time injury that there's been since camp started. It's crushing because I think he brings out the best in the coaching staff getting to be more creative. This is a bad defense with a lot of talent last year. They weren't in the top 20 most efficient defenses. A lot of good players. Yeah, I know they didn't have Derwin James, but that's pretty disappointed. He unlocks the cornerbacks, you know. He, he unlocks his tag team partner, Ray Sean Jenkins, who played really well. I just think he's such a unique special talent.

Losing Derwin James is devastating for this defense, and it's going to put a little more pressure on their offense in Tyrod to score some points, because I don't think you can count on them being a top five upside defense when Derwin James is not on the field. I don't like that term. More pressure on Tyrod Taylor to score points. I know that everyone is fascinated with Tyrod Taylor right now, and it's playing out, and it's not fair to him,

but it's almost exactly what happened. Who's fascinated with Tyrod's care? Well, no, I think it's like a little bit of the hard knocks afterglow. I know what Mark's saying. It's just that that's what happened in Cleveland. What a leader, like what a guy. And I think he is. And I think the coaching staff really loves,

Anthony Lynn loves Tyrod Taylor the person and wants him to be functional, but the problem is Tyrod Taylor stops being fun about three weeks from now. And then you got a rookie quarterback that... When Freddie Kitchens is coaching him, he did. He had some moments, to be fair, when he was in Buffalo. In Buffalo, yes, not in Cleveland. And, I mean, I just think that there was, I don't know, come on. I mean, Austin Echler, to me, is the centerpiece on that offense.

I believe in him until the end, but their wide receiver position right now. He's not. But look at their wide receiver position. So what, how do you, you want to talk about scaring a defense with a mobile quarterback. but they can't do anything they're going to they're immobilized how versatile they can be through the air i think it's a rough place for justin herber to get starts early too i don't like that at all it feels like a receiver with mike williams injured is jayling gaiton good luck they're a little thin seems to me like a lennard four net

possibility for a landing spot but joshua kelly their fourth round rookie is getting as much hype out of that camp as anybody on the team. So maybe they don't need Leonard Fournett there. This feels like one of those eternally snake-bitten franchises. I remember writing about Durham James earlier this summer. The people that track these guys say Dermyn James is as special as anybody that's come out of that position in decades.

And now for back-to-back years before the season starts, he's getting ripped up by injury. Huge leader, too. Huge leader. Hopefully he's back midway through. I took him as my number seven seat. I believe in you, Tyrod. What a way to go out.

A masterful performance. You know what? Just unleash one more dark, please. Just for the heck of it. He likes it. He's actually into the tranquilizer juice. It makes me feel alive, finally. That was good.

All right. We just went around the AFC in 48 minutes, and we will. We promise before our kickoff, Chiefs, Texans, a week from Thursday, hit the NFC as well. And you know if you're a long-time listener that this is a fun time of the year on the podcast where we really ramp up in terms of season preview and looking ahead and making predictions, all good stuff. So make sure you check in Wednesday with our show or Friday rundown show, our NFL network program that we tape and airs on Saturday morning. and Wes, we're just happy to have you for another Monday with Wes session. Well, if the timing works out, excuse me, I want in on that NFC, 48 minutes.

And we do have a little bit of breaking news. You got time for a breaking news? Yeah. Hit it. Logan Ryan has a home. Former Tennessee Titans, New England Patriots. $10 million. I think he got $7.5 million from the Giants.

Pretty good at this point of the office. Wow. Not bad. They needed him. They needed him. That is a huge pickup for that. We were just talking about how their defense, which was not good looking even before DeAndre Baker and these injuries, they needed somebody. Can Logan Ryan play the guitar the way they needed him to?

Maybe not Logan Ryan, guy that had big numbers that Tom Brady picked six at the end of the playoffs, but some people say he's a little limited. I guess it depends how you use them. Hopefully you won't get exposed. He's a solid guy. He's immediately the best player in that secondary. And he's a grown-up there that can play.

They just didn't have guys that you could just put out there that you could feel comfortable, weren't going to just get filleted. I mean, I still think they were a defense. If you're a fantasy guys going up against the Giants, you're going to be, you know, everyone's hanging. You're selling James Bradbury short. Oh, that's true.

I take it back. I'm blanking on Bradbury. What better way to do it than, you know, take the entire off season as your personal vacation and cash a $7.5 million check, you know, at the eve of September. Not bad. Well done. You can make it happen.

All right. That's it. Thank you, Arjuna, for stepping in to Ricky's shoes. You killed it under difficult circumstances. No pressure, no diamonds. I did my best. I did my best. And it was good enough.

All right. This is Dan Hansa signing off for the mailman, the quiet storm, the old boss, and diamonds behind the glass. I mean, that's good. Anybody to be happy to be diamonds. Sounds like a gripper. Two Wednesday. Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here.

And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Six, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else. It's everything you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sundays. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Sticks podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Marcus Grant.

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