NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Bunkercast XXXIII: Don Shula Passes & London Games Update

Episode Date: May 4, 2020

A bunker filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, Chris Wesseling, and Gregg Rosenthal bring you all of the latest news around the NFL including the passing of legendary Coach Don Shula. Handsome Hank joins the show to talk about what Shula meant to him and the Dolphins fanbase before touching on the announcement of no London games in the upcoming season.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the 6th, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else.

It's everything you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sunday. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Sticks podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Around the NFL podcast takes family walks on the beach. Welcome to another edition of The Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hansis coming to you from a city filled with heroes in bunkers. Mark Zessler, Chris Wessling, Greg Rosenthal. What is up, boys? Hey, Dan. Long walks on the beach.

Not street legal, though. Greg, not street legal. Not in Los Angeles County, no. I have not been to the beach in quite a long time. Although apparently it's a thing that people are like driving down to, you know, San Diego County to take over their beaches. Yeah, that's something that's going on right now in Huntington Beach, Orange County. Wes, I saw, uh, Lakeisha, you know, your wife's the best because she,

She embraces life in a way that I'm not used to seeing, like, whether it was your engagement or the walk up to your wedding or the post-wedding celebration. Now, with the baby upon us here in May, you guys went to the, what do they call it, the wild bloom? The Antelope Valley poppy seeds, but it may be branded as some wild bloom. I don't know about that. Yeah, well, you were the photographer for a final, what do they call? Trimester photo shoot. Yeah. One of your fellow Jets fans, Matt Swicki, who used to work

at the network. Good man. He sent me a few places suggestions to go to because he does a lot of photography and his wife is also pregnant, so they did a similar shoot. Kisha, as you guys know, not only a very joyous person, but

places a very high priority on photographs and pictures, and she's good at him. Like, I thought the photos were great, and it was mostly just because she had set it up in the right locale with the right dress at the right time. Extremely tasteful is how I would put it. And don't cheat yourself, West. You're the man hitting the button, ultimately.

The super bloom is what it's known as. Well, I think I do love photography. I would say in that case, thank you to Apple and iPhone for doing most of the magic. I think Wes hit that button about nine months ago. everybody else doing okay okay? Okay Mark doing great yeah Mark you had your weekend is okay

I wouldn't call it that I mean it no you know it's gotten rough now where the only thing that I that I take joy in my entire weekend is the Michael Jordan documentary that only has two weeks left

yeah yeah it's long gone of the day is I remember, Dan, you and I used to, we were madmen. We're very into madmen, and that would be Sunday nights also. And, like, you would have a very vivacious, active weekend with friends and kids and family. And then, you know, Mad Men would cap it off. Now you're just kind of doing with the Jordan Dock.

It's like two days of housebound chores and life and then an expansion into the Jordan Dock, which I'm finally caught up on a field is a wonderful piece of work. Good, Greg, you're okay. I'm good. Yeah. I enjoy the weekend. There's some, there's at least some hard of these. You didn't ever get a cynical take from Greg about during this entire pandemic? I don't know. You guys want me to like have feelings I don't have. I mean, of course, the anxiety about the world around us is ever present and like reading that is depressing. But the idea of staying home all day, mostly with my family and going out and stuff, like there is a high level of attraction for me. Like that is sneaky what I've always just wanted to do. So I don't mind.

the excuse. There is a missing component there because Mark and I can easily say the same thing because we love our wives and children as well. It is still a lot. The confined space, the fact that you can't actually go anywhere, you can't take the kids anywhere. And as much as I love being with everyone, I still, it kind of gets to you after a while. And I'm just, I'm happy for you, Greg, that you apparently do not have the issue that many other people do. No, of course I, of course it's not like all easy but just on balance I guess like that level of stress I prefer over over most any and you can you can mix it up like we got we got some in and out drive through if they didn't get out of the car this weekend but you know that that was like a big adventure

you know a lot of biking and stuff but I don't know I don't need an excuse to read more it feels well I think like to Greg's point I mean one thing that's not happening is like wait how do you read how are you reading where are the children during during this. Ellis is a good minder of Walker on some level, my daughter. So it's almost like she's a babysitter.

They play their games, you know, when they have their TV time or podcast listening time or whatever. We might have a, the disconnect might be, Mark, and I'm sorry I cut you off there, that Mark and I have two boys, two rares of boys, rambunctious, boundless energy, and that just probably creates a totally different dynamic.

Yeah, I mean, our, you know, Our doctor that has known Luke and Colton since they were born has described them in quotes as active, which is, I think, a code word for a lot of other things. And, you know, Greg, I appreciate what you're saying. And I feel like we've all given props to our family here and there. But for me, I have a theory with family, my family, which is sometimes keep them wanting more. And, you know, when you're in each other's face 24-7, I'm doing a nice job of parenting for the first six and a half hours. But then, you know, then there comes a breaking point for me. And that's just the way that I made.

But I, you know, I'm not father of the year material. But I need a little, I need a little break sometimes to re-galvanize. And that's not happening here on the 24-7 lockdown home scenario. So you're the old carrot and the stick routine is the best route to go. Absolutely, please. That would be a great parenting book by Mark Sessor. Like, leave them wanting more. It's not a bad strategy depending on your, you know, psychological makeup.

All right. We got a lot to get to. We're going to check in on. the Rosenthal-Wessling top 101 free agency list. There's still, believe or not, 19 guys from that original list that are unaccounted for or don't have a team right now. But before that, we do some news,

including the passing one of the all-time greats in our league. The thing that really is one of my coaching philosophies is somehow, some way, get the winning edge in the ballgame. That is the voice of the great Don Shula who passed away today at the age of 90, the NFL's all-time winning his coach, 347 wins with the Baltimore Colts and then with the Miami Dolphins

where he had most of his victories, including, of course, the undefeated 1972 season. The Dolphins issued a statement saying that Shula died peacefully at home. one of the great figures in the 20th century of the NFL and said to be the patriarch of the Miami Dolphins for 50 years, according to the Dolphins. Let's welcome in a good friend of the show, the great handsome Hank he's known as on the Dave Damashik football program.

We call him Henry Hodgson, vice president of international for NFL media. Hank, you are also a diehard Miami Dolphins fan just thought, we all thought it would be a great idea to bring you in to talk about the great Don Shula who passed away at the age of 90. Thanks, friends. Hi, how are you guys doing?

Hey, bud. Hey, Henry. Good to see you. Good to see you all. Thoughts, Henry. Well, Henry, you look like you're coming back from vacation or something. Yeah, that's not the case. I just heard you, I was to take your listeners behind the curtain.

I was allowed to listen in to the first part of the show and I heard three of you talking about how life with two children is so hard. I have three kids. in the background here. You guys... I told you that was a bad decision. You did tell me at the time it was a bad decision. At the time, I hadn't necessarily counted on a nine-month quarantine.

And if I had done, I would have made very different decisions in my life. But yeah, things that, you know, you guys are amateurs while I'm playing professional furthering. Anyway, this is a great conversation piece for the end of your appearance. I did tee you up on the death of Don Shula at the age of 90. Yeah. No, look, I mean, it's... It's tragic. It's really sad. Don Shula was a great coach. And I think a great man as well.

If you listen to people who played for him, coached with him, fans who've had a chance to meet him, media that's had a chance to meet him. You've met him several times, correct? I've met him two or three times in my life. Actually, I think one time with Mark Sessler. But the first time I met him, I aged 11. The Miami Dolphins played the San Francisco 49ers in London in a game in 1988. and I ran away from home and was desperate to meet my heroes and got to shake Don Chula's hand as he walked off the practice field at Crystal Palace in London where they were where they were practicing and that was pretty cool for me then in 2000 I think it was probably 13 or 14 I think almost the very first show of a football life which was the NFL was an NFL network series which they just put up on YouTube today if you want anybody wants to watch that right and I think full this morning exactly I think there's a big show Marathon taking place on Natham Network tonight. But he came into the studio and they did a show afterwards that kind of recapped it. And I got a chance to sit with him then.

And I told him when I was 11, I'd run away from home to go and meet him. And he asked for my mother's phone number so he could apologize to her on his behalf. That's what he said. That's what he said. He's a nice man. He's a nice man. And then the last time I think I met it was with Mark Sessler. before on a Super Bowl Sunday when the Panthers were playing against the Broncos, and his son

was coaching. Obviously, he was offensive coordinator for the Panthers. And Mark and I got a chance to go and say good morning to him on Super Bowl Sunday morning. Well, one little note on that, because I wouldn't have gone and done it on my own. And I was standing with you, Henry, it was at that time when we were all about to leave for to get on the buses to go to the game. And, you know, I thought, well, I don't want to bother him because he had a few people around him and you were, and I loved your attitude, because in general, I feel like when you see someone and you have that one chance in life, go for it. But, you know, he was in a wheelchair, I believe, and he was just, you know, had family around him, but you said, let's go do it. And I'll never

forget this about Don Chula, because it was at a period where I think a lot of younger people don't really have an idea of who Don Chula is, the same way we didn't maybe know George Hallis when we were just getting into football. And so you're not seeing the vibrant younger version. But when we went up and said hi to him, you know, I just thought it would be a handshake and you're on your way. He held your hand and he said, you know, each of us. And he was like, so where are you from, Mark? And are you married? And do you have kids? And how are, how are things for you? And I thought, whoa, wait, Don Shula is extending this meet and greet that most people would want over in two seconds. So I think there's another side to Don Shul that I learned

about that day. Yeah, that's true. And then there's everything else about him, right? He was a coach that obviously won more games than any coach in NFL history. But he did it. in many different ways. You know, he did it with the Baltimore Colts and took them to a Super Bowl. He went to the Miami Dolphins as their second ever head coach after they'd had a short coaching spell with another guy and then coached them to five different Super Bowls and in entirely different ways.

You had the 72 and 73, you know, winning seasons, that perfect season that everyone knows about with Larry Zonker and Jim Kick and Bob Greasy. And then, you know, two decades later, he was taking a Damarino-led team, which was, you know, at the time, something that no one had ever seen before playing offense in a way that, you know, hadn't been invented up until that point and doing the same thing. And so I think, you know, you talk about Belichick, who's obviously right up there with him as one of the greatest coaches of all time and how his teams evolve

every year. And, you know, Shula did the same thing, but he did it over a sort of 30 or 40-year coaching career. Wes, why do you think that Shula doesn't get brought up in the way that some other guys get brought up like a Hallis or a Lombardi or a Belichick or a Walsh? Well, I think part of it is the era in which he coached was not the most exciting era of football. The Dolphins were the quintessential team of the 70s where they won with the running game and defense

and did not want to pass. It was just, let's not make mistakes. And that came from Lombardi. Shula popularized Lombardi style, really. and since Lombardi, to me, it's Shula and Belichick are the top two. And you see a lot of similarities between them. I think the highest compliment you can give to a football coach is one that was said about Bear Bryant in the South in the 50s and 60s.

He can take his own and beat your own, and then he can turn around and take your own and beat his own. And Bum Phillips said that in the NFL about Don Shula. That's how the quote became popular because Bum Phillips said it about Shula. and I think a lot of people think the same thing about Belichick. It's interesting to me that Dr. Z. Paul Zimmerman asked a few of the big coaches in the 70s while he was writing Thinking Man's Guide to Football. Give me one line about what you'd like to be remembered as.

And Shula said, always fair, never screwed anybody in his team traveled first class. And there's always that sense of fairness when you talk about Don Shula. And the quote kind of morphed later in his life after all, the Belichick drama and the scandals into Shula saying, I want them to say he won within the rules. I think that was a high priority for Don Shula. He touched so much of football history. He played for Paul Brown.

As a player, he was traded as in the biggest trade in NFL history to Wii Buick's team. I think people forget, our listeners who are young might not realize. Don Shula was the coach of the Colts when they lost. you know, as the biggest favorite in Super Bowl history to the Jets, to Joan Ameth in Super Bowl 3. And so John Shula entered that 72 Super Bowl with a pretty big anvil on his shoulders. He had lost two Super Bowls. He had got blown out the year before with the Dolphins. So at that point, he had lost as the biggest favorite ever.

He had been blown out the year before. And then they end up being underdogs the year that they were undefeated. I think you can argue, there's an argument to be made those two teams, 72 and 73 as like a two-year unit if you just want to kind of evaluate what was the best two-year run of all time that those dolphins teams to me would be right near the top I think the cowboys in the 90s would would maybe be another one you throw in there and shula was essentially pushed out of the job after the 95 season a 9 and 7 season and he there were some you know bad feelings about that shula didn't sound like he was ready to go but the organization was ready

to move on. And I think it's notable that they decided that Shula maybe didn't have the edge anymore. And he was a guy that regularly took them to, you know, 9, 10, 11 wins, playoffs all the time, obviously the Super Bowls. And ever since he left, it's been, what, almost 25 years now. They haven't done almost anything in the league, as you know more than anyone, Henry. So I think with time, Shula deserves even more respect for, it's so hard to be consistent, not just year after year, but decade after decade, and that's what he brought to the Dolphins. Yeah, he did.

And I think around that time as well, you saw there were three kind of great coaches in that period, Tom Landry and Chuck Null, who kind of continued coaching. And each of those guys sort of saw their present, perhaps not matching up to their past. But Shula outlasted those guys. I remember just before he retired, they really made a big effort to try and sort of stock up the team for one more run for him. and it didn't work out. But, you know, he continued to,

I think probably the best rivalry at that time was between him and Marve Levy of the Buffalo Bills and just, you know, seeing those two teams go head to head a couple times a season and often in the playoffs as well. It was pretty cool to have that chance

to then, you know, understand that you're watching one of the greatest ever to do it as the coach of your team. He also had a big impact. He was on this competition committee, which I wouldn't have remembered, but I, you know,

Checked out America's game, which is probably the best single book on football history. And the competition committee was Shula, TechSram, the old Cowboys executive, Al Davis, and who am I forgetting here? Paul Brown. And they basically set the course of a lot of the rules of everything that happened during the 70s. When West gives a lot of credits of the NFL for being a league that's always trying to adjust and always try to improve it. It sort of started with those guys in the 70s and Shula was like a huge part of that including like making like looking to make some rules that ultimately hurt him because like you know, he was known as almost like the Patriots in the early 2000s is they were so physical that

they they almost changed the rules because the league was so worried that it was just becoming all defense and and he helped you know to change that ultimately to that ended up hurting him. He also had very bad luck not to go on too much but like after they won those two super bowls with the maybe the greatest teams of all time three of their players left for another league three of their best players you know left for another league and they didn't win a playoff game for almost a decade after that which you know which is it's just hard to imagine henry mentioned tom landry and chuck knoll not just two great coaches two icons of the 1970s in sports and there was another one john madden um who was a great coach an icon. And I remember reading Madden's book, and he said out of all of us, Don Shula is clearly

the best coach. Right. And that's high praise for Landry and Noel. Right. And, you know, and it's, it can become ponderous when every team releases like endless statements when something like this happens. But if you go through and read what Belichick wrote about him and how close Shula was to Belichick's dad, and like you, Henry Belichick got some of his starts in scouting by sneaking away from the college he was at to go sneak into stadiums to watch things. I mean, Shula, to me, seems to be, I don't know where we're getting the idea that he's not respected, other than the fact that I think among fans, had he won a Super Bowl or two with Marino, that might have shifted the perspective among people, maybe my age, because we certainly

saw the tail end of Don Shula, but he has 125 more wins than Andy Reid, 203 more than Pete Carroll on that list of all-time wins. Belichick is the only human being that could potentially catch him and he's 43 behind in our lifetime. I mean, it's not just compiling either. He went 14 seasons before he had a losing campaign. I mean, this guy was absolutely about as much as you could imagine as a coach, and someone like Belichick reveres him to the end's degree. Right. And the other thing I think you can measure a coach by is how many Hall of Famers they coach. Shuler coach 15 Hall of Famers during his career, which I think is a pretty huge number. I think only Paul Brown, I was trying to dig for this earlier.

But I think Paul Brown coached 18. But other than that, he's way out in front. Yeah, the fact that he did it with two franchises and so quickly kind of sets him apart from those other guys, I think, of his era. I think the reason why he's maybe not viewed quite, and I think he would be on the Mount Rush North. So I don't really maybe even buy that premise. But it's probably just, you know, the over obsession with titles because of what, he was two and four, I think, in championships. if you count the Colts. Yep.

And so, you know, you turn that into five and one or something, and then people feel differently. But it shouldn't all be about the titles. And finally, just for a little bit of context on this, as everyone knows, 347 for Shula, Belichick is at 304 right now. He's 43 wins off. If he sets the record for most wins,

which I think people expect, but if he does it, he'll be in his mid-70s nearly or even beyond that potentially when he does it. So that just kind of puts it into perspective how good Shula was for, you know, so long. All right. Don Shula, dead at the age of 90. Rest and peace. Henry, we don't want to keep you on for more bad news, but we do have more bad news, don't we?

This coming in a very different realm. But you are obviously, as the vice president of international, the man, or one of the men and women behind the scenes, planning out how to spread. the game and build the game and grow the game across the world and we got some very bad news officially today didn't it? Yeah, unfortunately we won't be able to play games this year in London and Mexico. All the games for this NFL season will be played in the US, which is obviously sad news for our fans who I know, listen, a lot of them listen to you, both from the UK and Mexico actually. But, you know, the good news, I guess, is that we definitely, we back in both of those countries in 2021 if events allow.

That's the plan. But, yeah, certainly upsetting for fans in those countries not to be able to see their favorite sport being played locally. I see a quote on NFL.com, our story from an individual that I'm sure you worked very closely with, Christopher Halpin. I'm just curious why you're not getting the quote in this story. I mean, used to be the chief content. guy on.com before you took this VP job. I'm just, it doesn't make sense to me. It doesn't

match up. Okay. Well, I'll have a word with people about that and see what we can do. Thanks, Tan. It's a huge bummer, though. It really is. And I imagine, Henry, I know you have the power to, with a snap of a finger to decide whether we go back to London. But I imagine in a very different world that we won't be heading overseas this year either because everything is going to be if anything happens at all everything is going to be very different this year so it is uh if that is indeed our fate as well we're really disappointed and i know the fans overseas uh we went we've been lucky enough gregg the last two years to go to uh these games and the place is packed to the gills you see uh uniform uh people wearing jerseys from not just the teams playing the

game, but it's an opportunity for these UK fans and overseas fans to kind of pledge their allegiance and wear their own jerseys for whatever team they want. So to lose that is just another thing stripped away from not just the NFL, but like the sports calendar. It stinks. Yeah. And as cool as, you know, the Twick was, Twickenham Stadium and the games at Wembley, which they're still, they're still doing. I think the game that's Tottenham, which we were at last year kind of puts it to a different level. I mean, the crowd felt like another level. Maybe was just the sound, just how new the stadium. It just felt like it was like a Super Bowl-type atmosphere

that they're going to be playing in. But this is kind of the first big change. The schedule is expected to be released later this week. And I'm sure that this is kind of the warning. I don't expect a ton of other big changes in the schedule, at least not off the bat, but they're building flexibility into it in case other things need to be changed.

I mean, I know I retroactively have probably won 45 sandwiches thanks to the coronavirus based on now expired sandwich props. But I think it's a huge bummer. Congratulations, Mark. Well, thank you. But in our- Winters and losers from, you know, COVID-19. Mark Sessler, the only winner. There's no bigger winner than Greg, apparently.

He's having a time of his life. I don't tell you. But in my keep him wanting more theory, I mean, that little trip to London was critical to build into the year for just a little bit of personal space and time in a nice hotel and meeting wonderful people. Well, Henry, I mean, this probably wipes out six or seven weeks to travel for you. You were going to go to Mexico.

Six or seven. Well, you do the thing where you go and do like, hey, let's go to London for a week to look at the stadium to make sure that it looks good before we go back as second or third time, right? I mean, what happens to you now? I don't know where you get this from. I don't know where you get this from. But, yeah, sure. I do have to make a few trips. You're right.

I got to head back to West London and stay at a Notting Hill flat so I can test the fish and chips at the stadium. Henry's definitely read the Leave Em Wanting More Parenting Book by Mark Sessler. Yeah, by Mark Sessler. I did read it and I decided I would really adopt that pretty hard. All right, Henry, you know, kind of not the greatest circumstances today. Don Schula dies and the international games are wiped away. But you are a man that can give us great information on both those topics. And you did it out of the park.

I did my best. Do you want to add something positive? More than anything, it was, no, well, I bet the positive. about Tua? No, the positive is I got to see you guys. It's nice to, it's nice to see all your faces, and that's the most important thing. That's the best thing that's come out of today. All right. Well, we miss you, Henry. I miss you guys, too. I'm looking forward to when we can all be together again. In the meantime, Wes, I'll be around in about 35 minutes walking the dog. All right. We'll see you, see you and disco in a little bit.

Exactly. All right. See you, buddy. See you guys. Thanks very much. How well. See you, Henry. All right. Yeah, that's a bummer. But what can you? need to do. Everything's different now. They'll go back to London. I mean, to me, like, I know the NFL hates the word exhibition, but in the old sense of the word, these international games are exhibitions of football. They're a spectacle, and without fans, they just, they don't, they don't work. Yeah, well, that's certainly fair. All right. In other news, Andy Dalton has a new team,

but it's not the team we expected it to be. Last time you joined us on the around the NFL podcast, The Jaguars were said to be interested, and that seemed like a sensible place for him. But he ends up signing a one-year deal with the Dallas Cowboys to back up Dak Prescott. The team announced it on Saturday. The deal has a base value of $3 million, could be worth up to $7 million if he hits all the incentives. Dalton, of course, played the first nine years of his career in Cincinnati. It was released last week after making a request to the team. He's 32 years old.

And Mark, this is an interesting landing spot for him because on the search. surface, it's a, it's certainly a, there's a chance he just rides the pine for an entire season and then hits free agency again. But also there is some drama, obviously, with Dak Prescott in his contract situation. And now you have a very capable backup behind him slash another option for Jera if he chooses to go down that route. Well, I'm sure it won't be the end of the Dak Prescott, you know, drama bullets that we seem to talk about almost every show. But for me, I love the signing for Dallas. I love it for. Andy Dalton. He grew up in

Katie, Texas. You know, it's funny. His offense coordinator, Kellyn Moore, he squared off with in two bowl games. So there's a lot of like connective tissue here for Dalton. I think it was probably from a family angle. A great thing for him. It's like, you know, when we try to figure out these landing spots, you look for need.

And the Jacksonville Jaguars seem to us with Gruden there also the team that needed someone. And also, you know, maybe a great spot for Andy Dalton to pick up six or seven starts. But I would say this about Dallas. think of those seasons back when they had Tony Romo and he would suffer one of his like four billion clavicle injuries

and the guy behind him was a non-functional backup and the season would go totally down the gutter. So I love the fact that they went out and got someone that I say they love Cooper Rush, but they went and got someone they can trust. And Annie Dalton is immediately the best backup in the NFL. Yeah, these one-year contracts that he and Winston signed And it makes sense to me that if it's the most oversaturated quarterback market we've ever seen and there's no way they're getting paid, find the best spot possible where if the starter goes down and you get placed in there, you've got the weapons to go crazy and get a big contract next year.

Yeah, Texas kid that played at TCU. I mean, there's got to be part of him. It's like a dream to play for the Cowboys. Then he's got to be thinking, if I do get to play, I could light it up with this. team and rebuild my value, the fact that he's only making like a $3 million base is just wild to me. It's like Jalen Rashard got more money than that this offseason. You know, Chase Daniel was getting that money more than that regularly. And so it really does show the kind of the market supply and demand just apparently has too much supply of quarterbacks. It doesn't quite check out,

but you got to think that the Jaguards weren't offering like a ton of money either and that he just chose the Cowboys because they thought, you know, that it was a better situation. Well, also the Bengals did them no favors by, you know, they knew they were going to get a quarterback and they dumped Dalton after the draft. I mean, there would have been other options for Andy Dalton back in March. I wonder what those options would have been other than Chicago. Can't blame the Bengals for trying to trade him. I don't. I'm just saying the timing probably didn't help Andy Dalton. I think he said that as well. He wasn't ultimately thrilled with it. And I was thinking about it on Friday, we're saying, oh, this makes a lot of

sense the Jaguars could be a good spot for him. But then I thought about it some more today. And it didn't make too much sense on either side. I guess it would make sense to Doug Marone who needs to win games. But if he went to Jacksonville, he could end up just being the next Nick Foles there where the team stinks and he's the veteran quarterback that seems to be going nowhere. So it's like, why isn't Minchu playing again? And then Minchu would go back in and he would just be his brand would suffer as a result.

And from the Jaguar's side of things, I mean, what are you trying to do? Are you trying to go organizationally? You're trying to go eight and eight or whatever? Like, because Dalton, we know is not a guy. I think they are. I mean, you do. I know, I know, I know, Greg. I know everybody wants to win every week and all that.

But from like a big picture viewpoint, why wouldn't you just give Minchu the reins of the team? And if he's great, you have an answer. And if he stinks, you stink. And then you get a top quarterback in the draft next year. Maybe even the big guy. Lewis Riddick put it well to me that, you know, the backup quarterback, he thinks is a top 30 roster spot. That's how he would look at it. you know, that that's more valuable than about 20, 25 rosters.

And I would agree with that. Like, it makes sense to invest in quarterbacks. It's a great move for the Cowboys. I mean, if Dak Prescott has an injury, he could keep, he could keep them afloat. And it's a lever-chance. And it's definitely goes way better. Two more notes. Cooper Rush was waived today.

So he's out of the picture in Dallas. And Dak Prescott has started 64 of 64 games since being drafted. in 2016. So there is a, you never know in football, of course. But he is as durable as they come, DAC. So Dalton, you know, we'll see. He may never throw a meaningful pass for Dallas. We will see.

All right. Moving on. Got a little caught up in that and forgot what we were talking about next. We got some of a fifth year options. Oh, yeah. Fifth year option talk. Another daily reminder that Mitchell Tribeski exists. another popular topic.

He is, of course, the headliner here because the former number two overall pick of the Chicago Bears, the man that was infamously and this will go down in Chicago history as basically the was at the inverse of

Michael Jordan dropping to the bulls with the third pick. They passed on both Patrick Mahomes and Deshawn Watson and traded up for Mitch Trubisky out of North Carolina. And he doesn't even make it to a fifth-year option pickup after a woeful third season in Chicago where he regressed in almost every way possible.

Trubisky will play out his contract in Chicago this year potentially, but he has no fifth-year option, which is almost a given for a guy. You would think, Greg, one of the great surprises, to me anyway, was how much they were in on him this time last year. To think that you fast forward one year and they wouldn't even be picking up the option, life comes at you fast. Right. I mean, even back, you know, in January, them talking about Chubisky because I think listeners should understand when you don't pick up the fifth year option, it is, yeah, I don't know if disrespects the right word,

but it's saying you don't think much of the player. I don't, like, you can't play it any other way because there is very little risk for this one last year of the fifth year option being in the current rules of picking up the option. Now, starting next. year, it's going to be fully guaranteed. And then that's a totally different equation. But for this one year, the only reason it would be guaranteed is if he suffered like a big injury. So they're basically saying, we don't think there's any chance that we're going to want to pay him, you know, over $10 million a year next year. And if there is, whatever, we'll franchise tag him. Like, we think there's almost no chance that he's going to be a standout at the position.

And the tiny chance that he gets injured, we don't even want to take that risk. Like, that's how little we think of them. That's how I see it. Yeah, I think for me, I mean, if you're a Bears fan, you know, we all know a few, and they've been through a bit. I don't know if I trust the general manager at this point, based on the backstory to this and a lot of other stuff the Bears have done, the team has somehow completely lost any sense of identity during Matt Nagy's run. And I would say this about Matt Nagy. Also, this is a loss for Matt Nagy.

You were brought here to coach up and develop this quarterback. And I get that the player is not ready. Mitchell Trubisky is just not an NFL starter. And we've come to that conclusion previously. But for all the pretty words and the poetry that we heard about Mitch Trubisky and all these tedious offseason meetings with these coaches and GMs, in the end, they both couldn't get it done. And I think that when they go to the cutting room floor with some of these players on the bears,

I think it's time to go a little bit higher or think about going a little higher. Well, you're talking about Ryan Pace. And yeah, yes, I am. It is at the end of the day, this is, this could be a, you know, Babe Ruth sold to the Yankees type of thing for the bears. If Patrick Mahomes, because Greg, you've already said this is one of the greats of all time, right? Or something like that. He could be. And he just won a Super Bowl and he's got an MVP, Mahomes. And I'm not even bringing in to Sean Watson is also one of the great young quarterbacks in the game. If Mahomes does end up being an all-time great, that you trade it up for a North Carolina quarterback.

Who played one year. One year. There were a lot of issues with Trubisky coming in. I keep hearing from Bears fans, it's like, well, you know, you couldn't have known then. It's like, no, actually, they were sticking their neck out a little bit on Trubisky. It's part of the reason why it was so negatively received that Watson, a lot of people, everyone had Watson higher just about. And a lot of people had Mahomes higher. So it's not going back and making a change.

It was kind of the draft Nix who got super into that one year at the NFL. I mean, at UNC, they got so high on Chubisky that it's like, look, I mean, you put your, you put your jobs in line when you take a risk like that. It's just how it goes. Hey, stop banging the garage. Ouch. I couldn't hear it. And to your point on Nagy, Mark, all right.

But it's like, it's kind of he's damned if he's due damned if you don't because you can't tell me that it's on him for not developing Trubisky, but then also say that Trubisky can't play. Well, I would say, I would say. I would say this, let's go wider and, you know, not to belabor the point, but the entire experience of the Bears' offense. Matt Nagy came out of Andy Reed's, you know, tree as described as like the most capable, ready to be head coach guy.

I just, I haven't seen it yet. I don't see a huge differentiator. We talk about there being four or five coaches that really make a difference on Sundays. Matt Nagy, and he's had some issues put in his lap, I just, I don't see him as one of those guys, not close right now. Well, maybe not a stud. Coach of the year. He went 12 and 4.

He looked, I thought he provided such a huge advantage for them in 17. And that was one of the reasons I always stayed down on Trubisky, thinking it was almost all coaching. And so I am curious to see Nagy with a different quarterback, even if it's Nick Foles. Well, who will stay healthy for about three weeks. And then you'll have Mitch Trubisky in there with no option having to ride out the season. Good team planning. Here are some other notable 50-year declined options, Leonard Fournett, who actually had his best season last year,

but still seems like a knucklehead and it wasn't exactly a glowing season, statistically. Let's see, Garrett Bowles, Tack McKinley, John Thomas, the number five overall. John Ross, Cincinnati, Corey Davis of the Titans, who is supposed to be a big-time ex-receiver. It never happened. Oh, yes, it is, it's a failure of the organization when you have a pick. You're declining a fifth year option, essentially.

Unless there's an injury or something, typically it's just kind of a bad look for the management that in many cases has already been swept out by the time this decision is made. All right. That's what's happening in the news. All right. Greg and Wes and also Dan and Mark put together top 101 lists. Mark, do you remember what was the pick, what was the name that we just had a little, flip, I believe, in the 60s or 70s. Yeah, we had Carlos Hyde at, I believe, 64, switched with a different player.

And Greg and Wes, you know... I thought it was Vaitai. I thought it was by Thai. I thought it was involved Carlos Hyde, if I'm not mistaken. But it's, you know, Greg and West very in a strange series of events, somehow after we left, you know, our physical list on your desk, Dan, back when we had desks, put out a list identical to ours, save for the two players being switched. So, you know, concerning.

It's fair to say that they had higher on their list, and yet he still doesn't have a team. There you go. Case closed. Chouche. All right. So here is a list of their 19 players remaining out of the 101. I'm just going to kind of rip through the list,

and then you guys want to point out anybody that jumps out to you. Cam Newton, Janavian Clowny. We know both their situations. Everson Griffin, Logan Ryan, Jason Peters, Dark Wes Dynard, Eli Apple, Carlos Hyde, Marcus Golden, Damar Dotson, Michael Bennett, Prince of Mukamara, Clayton Gathers, Eric Reed, Terrell Suggs, Damon Harrison, Michael Hendricks, or Michael Hendricks, Tony Jefferson, not or, it is Michael Hendricks, Tony Jefferson, and Jordan Reed.

Those are the 19 players, and Greg, it jumps out to me, there are players here that you can help that will help rosters, especially there are a ton of teams out there that need, I'll start here in the secondary. And I see guys like Eric Reed and Prince of Mukamara and Eli Apple and Logan Ryan. These are guys that are kind of starter level replacement type guys. Why aren't they signed yet? Yeah, Eli Apple had a deal with the Raiders and that fell apart.

I don't know if that was a health thing. He was coming off of an injury. I would expect all of those guys he just mentioned in the secondary to find a team, especially Logan Ryan, who was playing at a really high level for most of last year. there is a date, and it's unclear what the date is, but it's in the next week or so when the signings no longer count for the compensatory pick formulas, and you would think that's when some of these guys could get signed, because you're right. Like, those guys could start.

Logan Wright, I mean, Logan, right, and he has been mentioned as a possibility for the Jets. Like, I'd be super annoyed if one of these guys, one of these guys is not on the Jets. I would be legitimately annoyed if at least one of these guys isn't signed by the big man, Joe Douglas. Logan Ryan stands out to me because Cam Newton, Chedevia and Clowny have injury factors. I think that have weighed into them not signing. Everson Griffin had some mental issues a couple of years ago, and I think it's hurt him not being able to meet with teams. Logan Ryan doesn't have any of those issues.

I think his problem is he pretty much made it be known. He's not taking a penny less than $10 million what he was making last year with the Titans. And maybe teams don't see him at 30 years old, a guy who a lot of, of people feel like is best suited to the slot as a, as a $10 million guy. Here's two buy low guys that jump out to me. Damon Harrison Snacks, who really struggled last year in Detroit. But before that, and by the way, there's some bad vibes, bad juju going on in Detroit, as we're hearing, and he's spoken out on that.

Maybe it was just a bad year for him. I think he might have been banged up, too. If you are a team that's getting killed in the run, maybe you take a flyer on snacks at the stage and maybe he gets the eye of the tiger back and gets healthy. Jason Peters is the other guy. He was a top left tackle for a long time. I know he's older. But at the very least, maybe a depth guy or I feel like at this stage, maybe like Wes, you're saying, some of these guys still value themselves at a higher place than what teams are willing to spend. But two other guys that could be starters, I think. Does Jason Peters want to leave the Eagles? To me, he's never said anything

about it that I know, but I've had the sense that that relationship, has gone on so long that he might not want to play for anyone else and he's waiting for them to kind of extend an olive branch and bring him back. I don't know. I kind of feel that way about Everson Griffin going back to Minnesota. I mean, he's on the record saying he'd do it in a weird offseason where maybe, you know, you can go back to a team that would welcome you. They would need him. The scheme is known. You know everything around. You don't have to move. I mean, some of these guys might wind up in familiar spots because of something, because of what we're on with right now. Yeah, the pandemic almost takes off the urge for these teams to sign these guys

quick because they're not going to have them on the field anytime soon. Anyways, Griffin is the guy who stands out to me. I mean, obviously Clowny and Cam can make an impact, but Griffin played really well last year. I mean, Griffin was probably more valuable or as valuable as Clowny was in 2019. I know he's older, and so that changes the equation, but he's been about a steady a pass rusher. If the Vikings can add him back or the Browns who just seem to get thrown around for whatever reason, probably because they are interested in Clownie and Griffin, if they could add one, like to me, that would change the way either of those teams look. They already look pretty good. I'll throw one more out there. There's someone on this list that's in the backhand

of your top 101 that has done something that Jadavia and Clowney has never done in six seasons. the guy that won a $20 million a year is have 10 sacks in a 16-gain campaign that is Marcus Golden coming off a 10-sac year. That seems like a guy that should be off the market. Teams are always desperate for somebody that can get to the quarterback. Ten sacks, it doesn't mean you're a stud, but it means that you know what you're doing. You're a tactician at the very least.

And Genevian Clowny, come back to me. You don't even have 10 sacks in your whole career. You have been, you know, quietly a little down on Clowny or suspicious of the Clowny hype for a long time and I hear you but maybe he's my version of Mitch Trubisky for you that when Bill O'Brien is being assassinated for that trade to Seattle people are viewing

him as Lawrence Taylor. How about when I was being dressed down as being like you know stop with your takes telling you that Mitchell Chubisky wasn't good three years ago you know oh calm down Mitchell Chubisky will be fine please it's just like Mark doesn't Mark you stop with your football opinion over there you don't know

what you're talking about. He's saying that toward us but barely not me. Let's circle back on the Trubisky thing real quick then I think our viewpoint on that was that none of us thought he was like a stud or anything, but he had he had progressively like kind of been growing or trending. How dare you talk ill about Mitchell Trebisky? You're talking about the playoff game, which I'm totally with you on. Well before the playoff game.

Like, yeah, come on. Anyway, Marcus Golden deserves a home. How about T sucks? This is the end for T says that's fine. He seems like a guy who's got to join halfway through the season and like, win another Super Bowl or some nonsense. I'm done with him. I was showing my kids.

We have like clips from our. Michael Bennett, too. You can go. Yeah, Buck Bennett can go. You'll be interesting somewhere else. I was showing kids these clips of the Ravens locker room after they won the Niners Super Bowl with the blackout because they were very into the concept of why the energy

went out in the middle of the Super Bowl. And, you know, we're having this nice time watching Ray Lewis celebrate. And then T. Sizzle walks into the room and drops like six F bombs in seven seconds. I'm like, all right, we're going to stay. Thanks a lot, Suggs. The gift that keeps on giving to the one's family, please. I feel you, man. Came out of nowhere.

All right. Anything else? That's it. Check it out. We gone. We gone. We'll be back on Wednesday. Oh, we should make an announcement here.

Hmm, where to start. Okay. So we have a show coming up on Wednesday, an audio show. going forward effective this week at least we're going to have a our show is back on NFL network it will be the around the NFL show on NFL network it will be the lead in show to total access the flagship program on NFL network we're very excited for it so it's coming check it out this Friday so you're this week you're going to get podcast today obviously podcast Wednesday TV show Friday, 3 p.m. Pacific, 6 p.m. Eastern NFL network. The around the NFL show is

back. And we're excited about that. We'll be planning it all week. Working title, partial access. No accent. So that's it. Big news. Yeah, that's big news. We're excited about it. Check it out. This Dan Hans is signing off for Clyde Stubhouse. I'm the mailman, the old boss, Rick Hollywood, silent show for Ricky Hollywood in her apartment. Rick, you there?

I'm here. Like you guys forgot how to podcast over the weekend. It's like just get out. Get out of it. It's a tough Monday. It's a tough Monday. Hi. How are you?

Hi. Did you have a nice weekend? I did. Yes. I did. I've been really excited. Do you want me to elaborate? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, Mark's version of Mitch Trubisky is my version of, like, Greg, being like, I don't understand why anybody would have any issues being at home with our children. I haven't said anything. This is all in your own head, but you're trying to make me make up an experience I don't have.

There are no problems in my house. It's like, good. I'm glad. You're in the minority, that's all. I'm happy for you, though. Sound bit. Um, all right. Anybody else have anything to say?

No. All right. Let us, let us end the show mercifully. Dan Hansen signing off for Glide Storm, the mailman, the old boss in Rick Hollywood in her apartment. Until Wednesday. Thank you. Hey, everybody. And I'm Bucky Brooks.

On Move the 6th, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape. decision makers and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else. It's everything you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sunday. Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Sticks podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.