NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Comedown Players of the Year 2020

Episode Date: August 12, 2020

A bunker filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler and Gregg Rosenthal bring you all of the latest news around the NFL including a new contract for Bills Head Coach Sean McDermott (6:03), Lamar Miller to the Patriots (10:06) and a trip to the new Bengals Den (13:15). The heroes recap Hard Knocks (26:36) before stating their Comedown Players of the Year and taking accountability for the players they picked last year (37:18). Patrick Mahomes last year? Dan, really?Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. The Around the NFL podcast. Need a soft reboot. They're coming. Welcome to another edition. of the Around the NFL podcast.

My name is Dan Hansis. Coming to you from a virtual room filled with heroes. Mark Sessler, Greg Rosenthal. What is up? Boyes. Maybe a soft reboot would just be like, you know, we start dressing up more. We start disliking each other instead of like, oh, they're a bunch of friends. No, now they're enemies.

You know, it doesn't have to necessarily be getting rid of us. It's kind of like a marriage at the end. You say, would you do this all over again? I guess the question is, would you? sign up with the same, you know, three other people and, uh, producer, uh, equation all over again. Or would you, would you scramble it and, and bring in a whole new, uh, bunch of people? I would do it all over again. Which producer? That's important.

I would keep our current producer. I would, that's right. I mean, I bet somebody could write a rap for Mark Sessler. Yeah. I still got it during a pandemic. I'm rerun. I'm running this back. Who knows? That other combo, we might be out. we're just you know four guys at a bar chopping it up but what if we became four dudes at a bar slugging it out right that's what i mean is like less like the personnel reboot but more just a plot twist a plot twist after seven seven seasons well that's what they do in professional wrestling it's like every once in a while there's a staleness that sets in with a fan favorite and usually what

they'll do in that realm is okay like turn them into a bad guy see how that plays so maybe we just maybe not 2020 I think we could squeeze one more drop of a baby face version of the around the NFL podcast but maybe like a full on heel turn 2021 against each other not not outward right I've been trying that the whole time so actually I turn into the nice guy and you guys are all jerks I like that that would be fun uh yeah No Chris Wessling today. Wes is going to join us whenever he can. He's not making it this week, but this show, but maybe coming up again soon.

But it's still, I got that kind of afterglow from Wes being back in the mix on Monday. So that was, that was awesome. And we hope to have them back again soon enough. Busy show, very busy show today. We have, what do we have to get through here? Oh, Hard Knocks is back. The premiere was Tuesday night. I wrote the recap that's up on NFL.com right now,

and we're going to talk about the premiere episode featuring the Rams and Chargers. Also, bringing back something from last summer that I thought was kind of a fun conversation, come down players of the year. We all know that come back players of the year are the feel good story. And we talk about how Alex Smith is going to have. that thing on Hyperlock if he manages to hang around with the Redskins this year. But who are

some of the players that coming off a great 2019? It doesn't mean they're going to torpedo and find themselves out of football by next season when we're the heel podcast. It means maybe just aren't going to be quite at the level of production

that we saw a season ago. Come down players of the year. That's kind of phrase there, Greg. Very catchy. I like it. I mean, the world doesn't have enough negativity in it right now. We need to just add on some more. Yeah, I mean, I guess so. I'm joking. I like the concept. I think it's just a sober realistic look. I'm totally joking. I like the idea. We need to start getting ready for this season. It's four weeks away. It's insane. It's time to dig in. Players have helmets on now. They're

practicing a little bit today. People are like decoding really fuzzy images of Bill Belichick walking around on on patriots.com and then tweeting that out as if that's great content here. But that's where we're at right now with Drany Camp. All right. That is where we're at. Very excited to get into today's show. So let's kick it off as we always do with a little bit of news. Hey, and also don't be the guy that takes the four potties.

All right. I went in there. I about threw up. I have a little bit more social awareness. That's to take a, don't take a shit. Don't take a shit in the porta potties. I don't even want to give that context. I'm just going to imagine there's a portion of our audience that did not see the premiere of Hard Knocks.

And so you have no idea what that's all about. And it's just, yeah, the voice of Sean McVeigh, the coach of the Rams just hissing about the use of the old Portajan outside. Well, and it's basic good life advice. I mean, whether or not you saw the episode, it kind of just works, right? anywhere. Well, all right. Without getting too into it. Spoiler, it likes to go number two

in a hideously stinky porta potty with no actual sewage attached to it. Who does that act? Someone in an emergency situation, like a child in an emergency scenario. By choice. A man. Yeah.

Yeah, you don't do that unless you have to. And Aaron Donald cracked that case. And we're going to get to Hard Knocks a little bit later. The NFL films personnel, and there's 30 of them, they don't have access to the building. So let's cut them a little break. Let's not embarrass them. It's a human act. Greg, it's a human act.

Dan clearly, you know, just used the porta-potty and is feeling like he needs to defend this. I seek them out. I seek them out. All right. Let's start the news with the Buffalo Bills, who are really on the right path, it seems, right now, a very steady, uh, franchise with a great roster and good leadership at the top and on the sidelines and Sean McDermott. And they know it because we, uh, just learned today that he was given a five, uh, he was given a four year extension that will take him through

2025. It's a six year deal. And obviously it's one that he's earned very well. Yes, the, the bills from a pure record standpoint, 25 and 23, these three seasons. They haven't won a playoff game under McDermott, but that doesn't tell the whole story, not at all, Mark. Well, I mean, he's brought them to the playoffs twice, and I think especially the first time with a team that a lesser coach would not have been able to reach the postseason. We're fans of Sean McDermott, I think, as a group. He's been on our show. We found him to be, I think, surprisingly engaging where there wasn't a huge impression that I had of McDermott before. It's interesting because he came up for so many interviews before he got that

Bill's job. And there's got to be a couple teams who have been now on their second plus coach at this point thinking we could have had Sean McDermott. Your Browns were one of them, right? Well, sure. I mean, there's that whole mill of teams that sort of went through the same guys. Sean McDermott is perfect for Buffalo. I think he is a top 10 coach. I really do. I think he does certain things really special quality is coaching up the secondary defensive backs. That's translated to Buffalo. they were the only team in the league last year that didn't allow a deep passing touchdown. That's not a coincidence. That's the fingerprints of Sean McDermott.

I love his match with Brandon Bean. They had a lot of coach GM infighting for years and there. And we knew some things that, you know, maybe wouldn't have been reported that we heard that was sort of on the border of being shocking of how dysfunctional the team was. And they have removed that dysfunction and success comes. And so I really think that this was a no-brainer move for a team heading in the right direction. He's one of the most powerful coaches in the NFL because I kind of think like Pete Carroll in Seattle

and Belichick and Reed, his say, I think, matters most in personnel. Bean's executing it. Look, there's a lot of work that goes into being a GM, but it's McDermott's team. It's cool to see. I mean, 2025, you know, I like the idea of some coaches that have some leeway. Look, if Josh Allen has a stink bomb season or whatever

and they have to find another quarterback at some point, it's like, I like the idea that they're committed to this coach, because they should be. They've been a top five defense two years in a row, according to football outsiders. That's tough to do. They're actually projected to be the number one defense in the NFL, I think, by football outsiders. He's made good hires, which is really important, including Bean, frankly, because, you know, he was involved in that hire. He was involved in the hire Brian Dable, not a guy a lot of people wanted who I think's done a really good job. The offensive line, which was a problem.

It wasn't just defense. is stable now. So I love it. And I think the more teams that have a little stability, the more they can have an identity. We're at a point right now. Bill O'Brien's one of the longest tenured coaches in the league. He's like in the top five or six, I think six or seven.

I mean, that's how much we churned through these coaches. And I really do think McDermott normally will be there at the end of this contract. Or it has a good chance. Normally I'd be skeptical. But this is a guy I can really see lasting that long. in other news the new england patriots have added a player to their backfield on offense lamar miller familiar name uh has signed a one year deal with the team miller blew out his acel and mcel uh a year a year ago last your boy my boy i've always liked him more when he wasn't almost 30 with a

blown out knee i don't know what he's at at this stage of the game uh but you know it's a good insurance signing for the Patriots who lost Brandon Bolden to the COVID-19 opt-out and Sony Michelle, who had foot surgery in May. It's unclear. He's on the Pupplist right now what his availability is. And he could end up a Pupist guy come week one, which would take him out of action for six weeks, which makes Lamar Miller a nice guy to have in your building if he could still play the guitar. You, yeah, you famously picked him a few different times for making the leap one of the, I think the only, six or seven times, two or three times making a leap guy. I think Michelle, Sony Michelle, who we haven't talked about on this podcast is in, is in some

trouble. It sounds like he might not be ready for the start of the season. There's a lot of buzz in New England about Damian Harris, a second year, third round pick who people liked in the off season last year. Then he got hurt right before the season as kind of the latest Patriots running back who gets taken last in fantasy leagues, but winds up kind of being the closest thing they have. half to the guy. But who knows, maybe it'll be Lamar Miller. Like that, that crazier things have happened than that too in New England. Well, I mean, Damien Harris last year, whispers were generating

that maybe Sony Michelle wouldn't be the lead back because of Harris. And, you know, that didn't come to fruition. I just would say if you're a running back looking to revive your career, you're not going to go there and be a lead back necessarily. They don't really seem to operate that way of late. But what a great place to go as a running back. Bill Belichick, we've said it before, could turn one of us and do a 600-yard rusher in that, in that offense. Maybe no more than that for the three of us. It's going to be a running team, Cam Newton. I think they definitely will be.

I think they're going to be a big-time running team, whether that works or not, we'll see. Or Jared Stittem, you know. That's true. Supposedly, someone noticed that, again, they're like looking at these grainy videos on Patriots.com that Cam Newton was like fourth in the rotation behind their undrafted rookie that's in. So, you know, hey, he's got to.

move up the depth chart. Sessler, speaking of Damien Harris, I'm going to share a little later in the show what our come-down players-of-the-year predictions were from last summer, but you had your eyes on Sony Michelle a year ago as a guy that could be on the fade with Damien Harris on the rise. You might have missed that by one. Well, that's a move of mine, like to usher a prediction that's utterly wrong, but then the year later it becomes true. Was it, though?

Was it wrong? Sony Michelle. Well, I guess the numbers were about... Well, that's true. The numbers were about the same, but no one was... But that's based on those whispers. No one's going to be like, hey, you know, when I grow up, I'm not going to be like, hey, you really missed out on that 2019 Sony Michelle season.

Not a lot of excited. Well, I think to Dan's point, the prediction was not a home run. But now it's looking like closer to a home run. And up next to the news, and I'm really bummed that Wes isn't here because I think he really would have appreciated this, perhaps been perplexed by it, maybe been angry about it, but yes, we know all about, what are some of our annual team fan clubs? Of course, last year we had the fish tank. Got the ravens nest?

The ravens nest. We could go to their less, in my opinion, if we needed to. Is there another one? The Titans, did the Titans ever happen? No, we didn't. No. That just was only two. I believe two.

This year. And feel free to. chime in with your thoughts, but this year, let's unveil the Bengals Den. My son will like this. He spends literally hours a day pretending he's a tiger

and just like biting people around the house. So this is going to be a big fan. I'd have that checked out Greg personally, but sounds engaging. Yes, the Bengals Den. where we study the Cincinnati football franchise, a team on the rise. So let's go through some news items here, starting with cornerback, Trey Wayans,

who could be out up to two months after suffering a pectoral injury. This is so Bengals. I mean, it's tough to open up the Bengals den in this way because this team wouldn't spend money for years and years in free agency. And they hand out a three-year, $42 million deal to Wayans to fix up their secondary. and then he immediately tears his peck so we'll see how long he's going to be out but he will start the season on the sideline it was one of the positives those tigers a bite a little attack it was one of the positives you know I guess of this

totally newsless first two weeks of training camp that there were no injuries because you know there's only like one way to get injured while lifting weights and that is tearing your pectoral muscle Well, and that comes from Greg. Greg is plugged in on these matters in the gym. I mean, I'm sort of joking, but it seems like that's the only way that people hurt themselves. It was a year ago that they... Yeah, you hear that.

They lost A.J. Green in the first, I think, day of training camp a year ago, and that changed their entire season. And Waynes was pretty, is an interesting case because he was quite annoyed at the Bengals. I thought that they really waited for him to be there in person to sign his contract. and while 90 plus percent of the league had their contract, you know, free agent contracts tucked away, he not the case for him. And he called it publicly a giant headache. And he basically said, this shit's terrible at one point in an interview. And like, for all the Bengals, progressive, active free agency, this was sort of a case

that made them look like the old Bengals a little bit. And then he hits the scene to fix one of the worst secondaries in the league from a year ago. And he's gone in, you know, early on. That's not a positive on any level. They did have this dude. Darius Phillips came in the last couple weeks of the season. I think he played both of your teams. He had three interceptions in about two games.

He played unbelievable in one of those games. I forget if it was against the Jets or Browns. But he's going to step in. Probably the Jets. It's not what you want. It's not what you want. It's not what you want. A little Joe Girardi in a big spot from Greg.

In other Bengals, then news, defensive tackle. Mike Daniels signs a one-year deal with the Bengals, 31 years old he's had injury issues his last two years but you got Gino Ackins on the inside if Mike Daniels could get healthy and approach his former levels of play

you know he got something cooking in there I like Sam Harvard Atkins wasn't the same but your boy from your Europe trip Carlos Dunlop was a beast He's always good He's always good but he was You would think he'd be getting a little older

Gino Ackins looks a little older He was not Gino Ackins that we've come to appreciate last year. But Carlos Dunlap was like on fire at the end of the season. Not many people were too interested in the 2019 Bengals. And finally, John Ross has left Bengals camp to take care of his son. The kid, unfortunately, tested positive for COVID-19. The child's mother also tested positive.

So Ross steps away from the team to be there for the family. Tough situation. But hopefully he's back ahead of week one. So that is what's cooking in the Bengals Den. Good, good premiere, guys. Good premiere, guys. Good premiere episode. Good app. Not a lot of good news in the den.

There rarely is. Let's face it. I mean, we could be entering a den of sorrow. But we're diving in and we're just going to hope for the best, okay? Right. You never see like news. You never see news like, you know, another calm day in the Bengals Den. You know, everything went great today with the tigers at the zoo.

More carnage to come in the Bengals than I'm sure. All right. In other news, Monday night football news. Oh, you know we love talking Monday Night Football. And not even the games, the game within the game, the game up in the booth. Da-da-da-da-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la. D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-Dum. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

See, people only know the instrumental version. They don't know the one with Fox. I love, you know, Andrew Martian. He's one of our, Marchand. He's one of our favorite media guys out there covering all the happenings in this league of hours, our league. And he had a nice little nugget in his mailbag. I mean, people are really stepping up with these mailbags. One thing I had not anticipated in the,

mailbag game was people starting to bury, you know, little nugs of like scoops, putting scoopage in mailbox. Yeah, because I think we've shifted away from, hey, I'm just offering my opinion in a mailbag to now you've got to be breaking news. So, no, Dan, you've got a lot of sources, and you've got media sources, in-house media sources. So you just got to start to lean on that angle because I think that's the hook versus, hey, look at me, here's my opinion on someone's backfield, you've got to be dropping some information that no one else has. And I know you can. A T.A.T.A.A.D.A. Inside. Inside. Inside. Dead. Dance. For the truth. Go to the zoos in the morning. Thank you, Mark. I appreciate your belief in me. And yeah, I think it's kind of a, if you want to call it a wake-up call or

just a challenge. I think it's the natural evolution of things that the mailbag, yeah, used to be a place where you could have some fun and joke around with the listeners. or the readers and crack wise a little bit and throw some football analysis in there. But now there's scupage. They're scupage. And I can't hide from... What is the scupage again here? They're scupage, bro.

It's juicy. It's juicy. He's out there in the middle of a question someone asks about what's up with this new Monday Night Football booth. And Marchand says that ESPN talked to Rams coach Sean McVeigh about being a Monday Night Football analyst. Sean McVe, the 34-year-old Rams coach who seems to be right in the middle of a career

that's going to last, you know, another 20 to 37 years. But no, ESPN kicking all tires. Every tire in the world except for hours, apparently, says, hey, Sean, do you want to come off the sidelines and be our Monday night football guy? It doesn't look like that's going to happen. But according to Marchand, he was approached. They just like look for the guy who was like the most like John Gruden

and was like, well, let's go for him. In fact, Colleen, and we're going to get to our hot knocks recap in a second, but Colleen texted last night that her belief that John Gruden or McVeigh might be turning into John Gruden. Their personalities are starting to merge, and ESPN executives think that McVeigh could be a standout in the booth somewhat like John Gruding, according to Marchand. So my one thing. The record is under contract.

And this seems like it was never something serious, but ESPN kicked a tire. It sounds like he listened, though, which I think is like, that's intriguing. I mean, for me, if you're, you know, they've got Levy and Riddick and Greasy in there for this season, you can't help. I would just be thinking, it's clear they had 15 to 20 people they really wanted more. Like, I remember being like a sophomore in high school and getting asked to like a homecoming at the 11th hour by someone that I knew through my back channel information had asked multiple other people to go to the dance. and they said no, and I said yes because I needed plans. But the entire time I'm thinking, this person doesn't really,

did not really choose me for this event first. And it's a hideous way to go through an experience. So it's kind of tough sledding for the current MNF group to have to go in there and try to prove even their own company wrong, I think, about what they want to do in the future. Chip on the shoulder. And a little word of advice, because I see what ESPN's doing here, Seahawks General Manager, John Schneider.

If ESPN calls you about Jamal Adams, do not even pick up the phone because if that gets back to Jamal Adams, he will never forgive you. You can't even pick up the phone if there's a call. Don't pick up the phone. Look at the call waiting. It says ESPN, just in the case

that Jamal Adams' name comes up, don't pick up the phone. Because you would not want to anger him because he would get upset about that. As a Monday night football contributor, you're saying that they may chase after Okay. I think that's good advice for John Schneider. I didn't see how you can make this about the Jets, but you did it.

And finally, one more bit of media news. Happy trails to Dionne Sanders, who leaves our company after many a year to join Barstool. This is all over the sports media beat today. And I just got to say, guys, and I'm curious if you're in the same boat. I am a little bit sad. I'm hitting the 10-year mark of my time at NFL media next week. And I worked with Dionne Sanders the entire time. He was a colleague.

And yet, we never spoke. And I'm not even sure I ever saw him. Dionne Sanders, best of luck. Well, yeah, I think it would be news to him that he was. Do you guys ever talk to prime time? No. Well, no. And, in fact, on our network show,

Do you remember that I pitched him as the ideal candidate for a last dance scenario if we were to do that about an NFL figure? I thought I would, and I tweeted about it and with some video, I thought for sure that would stage the beginnings of a friendship and total dead air. No response at all. The closest we got, sorry, the closest we got, I think, was when we left a mess of like used peanuts in the special Dion Sanders studio. Like, you know, it's a big, it's a big play set of a network, but it's pretty impressive that Dion had his own studio essentially for his own show. But we broke in there one time. We cleaned the mess, I believe, but we were also told never to use it again. Right?

Well, I think we called the cleaning crew to do it. I don't think we even had enough integrity to clean it on our own, to be honest. Well, we cleaned up. We tried to clean up after ourselves, but it was messy, as I are called. And I don't even know if that was Dion's studio at that point. I think it was just his own private green room during Sundays. Right. It was just his room.

Yeah, it was just his room. They eventually repurposed it. But the other thing is we were able to access Dion's private green room with our key cards. And then shortly thereafter, after that viral internet stunt gone awry, you no longer had keycard access to the room. So they went into the system and took care of the heroes in a big spot. So anyway, bye, Dion. good luck that's what's happening in the news

hard knock stuff that's yes the 15th season of the acclaimed HBO docu series premiered on Tuesday night Hard knocks Los Angeles

It is not a criminal procedural that your grandparents watch on Monday nights It's a study of the Rams and Chargers as they prepare for the strangest NFL season in our league's history We talked about in a Friday show I had that conversation with Ken Rogers

VP at NFL films and the guy who's been running the show for years, that the premiere episode was going to be a lot different. You weren't going to see a lot of football, and that made sense. That wasn't some narrative choice on Tuesday night's episode. There was no football really to cover, for the most part, because the first week of August for the Rams and Chargers

and every other team was getting back to the building and doing obviously the testing for COVID-19 to make sure everything was clean and figuring out the logistics. You think about what a head coach is asked to do for a team. I thought it was interesting. You're actually watching both Anthony Lynn of the Chargers, but a scene with Sean McVeigh,

where he is hands-on and trying to figure out how to build out this big overhang canopy tent where he's going to hold meetings and various walk-through practices with the offense and the defense. How much thought and work and cleaning and disinfecting is going on in a constant. cycle to just try to keep your team from the absolute tragedy that would be a outbreak that would ruin their season and potentially blow up the NFL. So for me, Greg, in the first

episode, that was what was interesting to see. How are teams trying to keep the players and the coaches healthy? And then how do you balance that with actually trying to start preparing for a season, which is five weeks away when they tape this? Right. You didn't have a lot of the same beats. It's not going to be as high octane, especially the first week or two in terms of the football. You're also not going to have as much time inside the player's houses for obvious reason and going home and sort of having that features. And so on some level, it was like more informational and like less just total entertaining. But I still, I found it fascinating because I'm just, I'm interested in this world. I love football. And like this is, this is what football is

right now. Now, I don't love this part of football, but I am sort of fascinated to see how the NFL is dealing with this, as we all are in different ways. Now, we're not going to work in the same way, but in many ways it makes the players and the coaches relatable in a different way because they're going through some of the same things. And you get to see kind of what people are made of behind the scenes, too. I mean, just what they're like. And as much as we've always heard about, Anthony Lynn is like a guy that just everyone will run through a wall for like you kind of get it now like watching him and McVeigh for that matter to handle this situation as grownups as leaders and how they are going to navigate you know trying to lead 80 90 people and even more you know when it comes

to their staff yeah I think that I agree with you Greg and I watched it twice and I really to be honest I just I didn't enjoy it the first time I didn't find it to be unlike other a lot of hard knocks vehicles. I just found it inessential. That's me. The second time I watched it, I had a bit of a different take. And the positives for me, it centers almost entirely around Anthony Lynn, who I'd been curious about, I think he, along with Sean McVeigh, and I love your note, Dan, about Sean McVe organizing how that huge tent would be organized, because that's what you hear about Sean McVeigh is that he's in everything, and he has ideas about everything, he's ingenious, and it's going to be his program from top to bottom. With Anthony Lynn, too,

I think it's just that these coaches today, they're not going to work if they don't relate to players. And the opening scene with Anthony Lynn jumping on a Zoom call a little bit late, where you had, I think it was Mike Pouncey about to tell a story that maybe could have been a little off color, who knows, but Anthony Lynn jumped on and said, I'm here, I'm here.

And you just saw them, their eyes changed, their energy changed, their head coach was there. And I just think that there's a chunk of head coaches around the league that when things go bad, especially, just don't have that grip over their players. Anthony Lynn is a man's man I'm not a big barbecue guy obviously but I love watching him

barbecue with like a wedding china spoon that his wife was a little annoyed he was using wrapped in a napkin to base various meat products I just came away thinking highly of both coaches some of the stuff in there it was 25 minutes in and it was all corona

which I get it I totally get it I just am excited to see where we go in the next couple weeks I don't think hard knocks could be judged off of the first episode almost ever. I do see predictable beats heading. I know we're going to get an Austin Echler episode. You know we're going to get a huge thing on basically Aaron Donald and Gough and all of it.

It's all coming, but they did, I think, they had to tackle this a certain way, and they did it. I'm glad you had that second rewatch mark because you were sending out some very angry text last night about the premiere. Can I tell you real quick what's going on? Like, I find one thing I'm not going to do, again, is watch the show with Twitter open. It's a hideous tugging down of the experience that should just be watched on its own. Yeah, get off Twitter. Well, but it's, but even like the pressure of having to, I don't know, the whole thing, I just want to enjoy it the way I would a normal television show.

It's not a top 10 show in my world. It is an NFL-based show. It's pretty good. You've always got mixed feelings about hard-hast. I have mixed feelings, but when it's good, it's really, really good. And with Anthony Lynn, and it taught me about him, that's when it's, really good. Yeah, Lynn came off really well in this episode. I look forward to learning more about him. Just some quick notes that I had in kind of my recap. I want to go through here.

Aaron Donald with his shirt off. I want to talk shirtless dudes for a second here. We'll start with Aaron Donald. Your boy, Mark, Miles Garrett to me, I always thought had the most impressive hard knocks body. But I don't know. I mean, Aaron Donald, 6-1-285, and literally muscles on muscles on muscles. He looks like somebody from like Conan the Barbarian, if you remember that old Schwarzenegger movie. And he's the greatest player in the NFL, arguably. He's the best player in the NFL.

And like the cornerback, Dante Dion could be squawking. And Aaron Donald's just like ignoring him. He's like this huge thing that's just in Dion's like this little fly. So he's just like, oh, get away for me. I couldn't tell with Dante Dion if he was like a lovable team jester or just that guy that you hate to be around because he won't shut up and he felt like that hard knocks guy

like it just seemed like the every hard knocks cast someone to play that role and but maybe I'm being too cynical I just it seemed like we're going to be dealing with this guy for five weeks now hang in there Mark I want to talk more shirtless dudes by the way I mean it's not like they have to cast

it's real yeah those people exist speaking of shirtless dudes does somebody want to tell first Sean McVeigh the pool scene where he says he's been teaching his dog new tricks and all of a sudden his shirt is off

and McVe is like hey make sure he get me on camera in my pool and then he's saying check out the dog trick I have going on and he's throwing a football at the dog with a basketball hoop next to him and the ball's just clanging off the dog's face and there's no

aloeuv slam from the dog there's no tip in there's nothing like that and then you just start to wonder it's like was this all just a ruse to get McVeigh with his shirt off to show off the work he's putting in in the home gym across my mind Greg agree or disagree I think it was a pleasant I disagree with that but I'm a little worried about this you know CTE with this dog here it's kind of like Airbud you watch a you know he took a lot of footballs off the head I don't know that's what I mean it doesn't seem like a trick it doesn't seem like the best thing for the dog I think if you're

Sean McVay he's obviously been putting in the work because we had a chance to meet him in person in that one summer, and he is jacked up from that time. He wasn't a dainty individual back then, but I think you've got to jump in the pool with no shirt to show it off. He lives about 10 minutes from us, and he is living life in a different way than we are living it.

That is my takeaway on Sean McVeigh. 10 minutes in distance, but in every other way, it is a much different life. Tyrod Taylor's new look with the big hair and the beard. That's good. I like that a lot.

Yeah. I like them a lot now. he just feels I don't know there's something about him though he's got a little bit more to him I always liked him as a dude he can be

frustrating as a conservative passer but he always seems like a cool guy well we're gonna by the way Melvin Ingram he I don't know if that's on your list but he has to be the first player ever to be in the song credits at the end that was his own song he's rapping

that was that was I was trying to figure out Melvin Ingram is a wild man he is one of the most intense players I've ever, you know, like, seen in an interview situation. I feel like if I was going to pick a guy who's going to be a rising star out of Hard Knocks, he would be it. And Marcus Grant of our great fantasy team here at NFL media, liking Tyrod Taylor's new look to Donald Glover, Childish Gambino,

in the This Is America video, which definitely did sync up with me as well. And let's see, any other thought I have? That's about it. I'm looking forward to episode two and more football, but I did really like the peak behind the curtain of how this actually works. And I'd be interested to think other teams, the other 30 teams, what their protocols are. And if it's any different than the Rams and Chargers, did they learn anything from watching this?

Because you know every team watches hard knocks, every front office does. So that's interesting to me as well to think about. football has to be the only career where when you get fired and you walk into your bosses and you say like you got to be fucking kidding me and then the bosses are then talking about like I like this guy hey I like that fire from that guy bring them back to the taxi squad yeah tight end Andrew Valert didn't like being cut immediately uh I thought that was kind of a pretty ballsy move and yes he did Anthony Lynn did say to the GM Tom Telesco that he did admire him showing emotion, but then he also threw in a zinger at the end. Hold up, man. You're

an Antonio Gates now. Does it bother anyone? Sorry, does it bother any? It honestly disturbed me to, because I should know this, but that Justin Herbert was born in 1998. Like it just, to me, it was a defining low blow to the viewer if you're my age. Yeah, that was rough. He gives me no doubt about it. McCoy vibes from Friday Night Light a little bit, Justin Herbert. Hmm.

Hmm. And remember Peter Schrager as the official Hard Knocks podcast. If you want a real deep dive on every episode, check that out. I believe you had Anthony Lynn on the debut episode. So make sure you check that out wherever you get your podcast, the Hard Knocks podcast, with Peter Schrager. All right. Let's move on. Come down players of the year in 2020.

And yeah, Greg, I see you. I know you were joking, but yes, you could look at this as a negative segment or it could just be more a segment rooted in keeping it real, that you don't necessarily have to fall off a cliff and be terrible. You just might not be the same guy you were a year ago because sometimes it's hard to kind of stack up seasons like that over and over again. So they just come down. Maybe you guys have people that just fall off a cliff, but mine or more come down, just down. Gradual decline. Gradual decline. There you go.

It's good to bring that back up. It's already been used now. It finally came through for me. It took a long time. But it did. So let's throw out some players who we see potentially in a gradual decline. But before we do that, I want to share with you what our predictions were last year. So that's fun.

And also, it's good to, that's accountability. You know what I mean? I like it. Please do. Here we go. All right. Let's start with the Zooser. I had Patrick Mahomes, and I said that it was, I kind of likened it to the 1984 Dan

Marino situation where you are, sometimes you just have a season that's so beautiful and so perfect that you'll never match it again. And to me, I was right. Holmes wasn't the same player from a regular season standpoint. He got hurt, of course. His numbers didn't sniff what he did in 2018. In the playoffs, though, he got hot and won a Super Bowl. So me, my prediction was that he just wouldn't be as statistically incredible as he was.

So I'm taking the W there. I mean, if someone told you that he was going to operate. He won the Super Bowl. A dislocated decap for most of the season. We're not counting the playoffs? What is this like stats or something? Why wouldn't we count the playoffs? He was a top three quarterback.

I don't think he, even in the regular season, I'd say in any argument he'd be a top three quarterback. Do you think he was just as good as he was in 2018? No. You think he was just as good? He wasn't just as good. The Chief's offense wasn't just as good. But aside from the injury, maybe he came, maybe he just came down a little bit? A little, maybe.

But I'm saying top three and then he won the Super Bowl, I'm not giving it to you. He's legit playing through an L. I won't give you an L. I'll give you a tie. All right. I'll take the tie. I also had a push. Come on. I also had Drew Breeze.

I'll take the loss on that one. I don't think he really came down. I believe he's still Drew Breeze. Claibon was on this episode a year ago. He had Aaron Donald, which I guess he came down, but not really. Still Aaron. Mark Sessler, Eric Ebron. Well, nailed it. And you predicted Moe Allie Cox turning into a major factor for them.

We don't need to mention that part of it. This is also before Andrew Luck retired. It should be noted. I had Adrian Peterson, Greg, you had Dante Fowler and Jared Gough. One for two there. Fowler played well. That was a hit. You know, that was a hit.

Yeah, that was a good one. Matt Nagy, nice job by Claibon. That was well done. Cessle, you chimed in with the Bears' turnover regret. on defense, which I'm sure happened. Nice job by you. That was right. Mark really swinging for the fences here

with turnover regression and Ebron. Well, you know what? It's like, let's actually give the listener something that's going to be correct. And that's what I did. I was correct twice. That, you know, what else can they can rely on me to get it correct and right?

And matters. And then finally, Sessler, Damien Harris is going to be a bigger role chewing away at Sony Michelle's job. So that was last year, now this year. Get us going. Greg Rosenthal. All right.

I'm going to start with Richard Sherman and the 49ers secondary in general. But Sherman's sort of the leader. I mean, look, he was a second team all pro last year. It was kind of amazing, and I think he will be a Hall of Fame type guy, and I think a Hall of Famer, I do think this second act in San Francisco

is going to help him get there. No one thought he would be that good. Yeah, I think he is Hallfamer. And I think that their secondary with him as the leader in general really overperformed. And I look at it, and I think if the 49ers are going to come back to Earth a little bit, that's an area where they can be attacked. It's a tough division.

And I think asking him to be that good again and asking that secondary where I'm not really sure the talent is totally there to be that good again is a natural come down. I think he was PFF's number one cornerback. So if he were to finish number two, you would be correct. Technically. I would give you the W on that. I mean, if he's still an all pro, I'm not taking it.

But yeah, I think this 49ers team, you know, the analytics, like football outsiders, for instance, they think there's a big reason to believe that they'll regress this year. Now, on paper, it doesn't seem like that. There's a lot of 49ers fans that think that they're going to be better. But it is true. When you improve that much in one year, usually you come back to the pack a little bit. You come down. Mark Zessler. How about a come-down player of the year, candidate? Well, I don't like having to pitch this because I think his story is awesome.

But Darren Waller from the Las Vegas Raiders, he had 90 catches, 1,000 plus yards and three touchdowns last year. And I think the offense is just changing. They're just simply, they've added more weapons. You've got rugs in there, your first round pick. They added Brian Edwards, another rookie. Hunter Renfro would maybe have a larger role there. I think they're just going to diversify and spread the ball around a little bit more, and I could see him, I don't just mean like eight less catches. I just think he had a bit of a breakout season that will be tough to duplicate for him. I wouldn't be surprised, you know, not by necessarily a fault of his own,

that the production comes down by a third, perhaps. Not really a fan of human interest stories, are you, Mark? Well, I opened by saying I wasn't happy to pitch it, but nor am I a PR agency here just like, you know, throwing out feel-good stories for I don't see it. I mean, he's a young player who looked a dynamic last year. He's still the best receiver on that team until I see someone else step up. They just had no one else really step up last year. I just think that with rugs in there and others, that you would want that to happen if you were Gruden, wouldn't you? Would you want it to be based the entire

passing game based around your running backs and your tight end? I don't, I know. I'll go with, I don't. I don't. I don't know if I want to make how broad I want to make it. Let's start here. Ryan Tannahill. I was on my list too. And I know I just got out of trouble with Titans Nation. I thought we had a clean break.

So don't take this as an attack on your organization. You obviously made the right decision giving up on Marcus Marriota. I don't think you made the right decision turning around and giving Ryan Tannehill off 12 or 13 games a four-year, $118 million deal. And when you look at the money, it's almost 30 million. 30 million per season, 62 million in guarantees. He's going to be on the books, no matter what, probably, for years with this team. And, you know, he's a top 10 guy now in terms of being paid as a quarterback. And that'll be great if he's still the guy he was in 2019.

And I'm not even going to say, I'm not even going to point to Greg and feel free to tag team this one with me. I'm not even going to point to the playoffs and be like, look, he was already regressing in January. because I understand the playoffs are a different beast and Derek Henry was running like crazy over everybody so they played a different type of game plan on some level.

But I just don't think it was sustainable. He's 32 years old. And if you look at the history of our league, guys that don't break out within the first three years or so, if they do have a big season, they usually do come back to their old form or self more times than not.

Maybe Tanna Hill is an outlier. But last year he was fifth in passing DVOA, first in yards per attempt, playing in an Arthur Smith offense that was perfectly suited and everything kind of came together where Henry was a monster. The offensive line was great. Tanna Hill was playing with confidence. And I just don't know if we can expect that again. And the worst case scenario is that he really kind of becomes that Miami guy again. And then what does Tennessee do? They have a boondoggle on their hands at QB.

good use of boondogel no i totally agree with everything you said and i think two things can be true that dan you'd be right about this and that tannel he'll be fine that he'll be like a top i think that's what the titans should hope for he there's no way he's going to produce like that again i mean he was he was one of the three i would put him in the top five quarterbacks in the NFL last year for for when he played and i would include the playoffs in that um because he was efficient and he did his job what what they asked him to do in the playoffs um but But I agree. He kind of reminds me a little bit of Alex Smith, who had his struggles, kind of had his

breakout with Harbaugh, and then he settled into a nice solid starter career. And I think that's what you want on the Titans. But I do think that's a pretty big step, a big, pretty big come down of where he was a year ago. I'll just, I wasn't going to do it, but I'll throw in Derek Henry with this, too. Okay, that's what I was thinking, whether to throw in Arthur Smith and Derek Henry and just go with it. I think it's a lot to ask that.

offense to repeat at that level again. And even if you look at Henry, how kind of he was a lot slower in terms of his production in the first half of the last season versus the second, I just think it's hard to build an offense where you're that efficient. I mean, their play action numbers were like among the best in NFL history. And I think it's tough to win that way. And so I expect them both to come down a little bit. Yeah, I mean, they were.

Kaharski, Titans Nation, don't come after us. It's just football analysis. It's not personal. I would imagine some of those guys would agree, though, right? I mean, they were at peak levels down the stretch. And if you think you're going to get the playoff version of the Titans out of the gate, I mean, offense just doesn't typically do that from year to year. You're going to need to get better in other ways.

Their defense, you know, primary among them. All right, Greg, let's do another round. Oh, I thought that was like I was on. Oh, you just went, Mark, you're up. This is how I went last year. You know who I pick? I would look at Zadaria Smith and Preston Smith, who were awesome for the Packers last year

and produced 25 and a half sacks. I see that coming down, and I'll throw another guy in there, and this is not trying to be on brand here, but the idea that Jack Barrett's going to go out and have 19 and a half sacks. I knew you were going to do it. I totally knew it.

Again, again, if my predictions are like a year too early, I was telling you that all last year, wrong, but I just think he's a good player, but I mean, it's going to be, let's lock you in on this. Let's lock you in on this, Mark. If you're going to come after Shaq Barrett for another season, and now we're going to have to track it for another season, let's put more numbers to this, because it would be a come-down season if he doesn't have 20 sacks this year, potentially. What do you think Shaq Barrett will produce this year? I'm not doing this to say he's going to have 18. Like, that's not really, why are we doing this?

All right. What do you, what do you predict? How many sacks is going to have this year? 12 sacks. 12 sacks. Yeah, that's a come-down. You can say that's not a come down, but that's like 40% of his production from a year ago. The Bugs would be happy with that, even on the big tag? Again, I'm not saying that he's, he gave him 12 sacks and stayed healthy. It's a safe pick.

I'm not saying this is a wash that the player shouldn't have been re-signed, but this is a big problem. It just 12 from 19 and a half is a pretty clear regression, no? It's kind of like Mahomes picking Mahomes last year. I think it's fair. It's a natural pick because he had like 18 quarterback hits. He had over 50 hurries. He was probably the most consistent past rest of.

the entire NFL. So that is a come down. I would disagree on Zadaria Smith. Man, I love that guy. And Preston Smith's fine. He's a solid player. Well, I said the combination of the two. I just think you're not going to get that out of both of them.

Preston Smith didn't have, I think, he was about what you would expect last year. He wasn't sensational. Zadarius Smith, I think, was just unreal. And you're right, maybe he can't keep up that production. To me, Zadarias Smith, you know, I think our buddy Bob McGinway on the show, thought he was, you know, arguably the best free agent. you know, one of the best free agent signings in NFL history. And I went

for one year and you went through the list and I would say that's true. Shaq Barrett is too. I mean, the productions, Adairius Smith, that was unreal. I'll stay away from an obvious candidate here because I did the same thing with Patrick Mahomes last year, so I don't feel the

need to go into why I don't think Lamar Jackson will do what he did last year. See, probably won't because again, it's the Marino 84 corollary, where sometimes you just have such a special magical season that you just never match it again on some level, even if you stay a great player, which is kind of what I expect with Lamar Jackson.

So I'll instead go with Michael Thomas of the Saints. I will say that Michael Thomas, there's no reason why you would think he is going from a physical standpoint, fall off and not be the same guy. He was a monster. But I think the Saints are going to continue to transition on offense. and a year after they targeted Thomas, 33% of the time last year. When they dropped back to pass, one third of the time, the throw was going to Michael Thomas.

And it was okay because Michael Thomas, 185 targets, he caught almost 81% of the balls thrown his way. I mean, the guy was marvelous. And he had 149 records. and he, you know, he took fate and into his own hands and got risky by breaking that record that we're not going to talk about. But I just think, and I didn't, I'm not going to bring up Drew Brees either because I think his gradual decline has been overstated in general. I think Breeze was still excellent last year for the most part at 40 years old, but with Tassum Hill in the mix there, I do, I agree that McVeigh, that Peyton is going to continue to, be cute and try to have the offense operating in that way with breeze off the field occasionally. I also think that they're going to be a very run-heavy team and Emmanuel Sanders, which I thought

was maybe low-key the best signing team had in the offseason. He's going to be so great for them. He's going to be a perfect fit. And I think he could even end up flirting with 1,000 yards and like 7 to 10 touchdowns if he's healthy. And that will just take some targets away from Michael Thomas. So I don't think he's going to have, if you, if, if, if, if Sanders has that type of season, the saints are in great shape. But fantasy owners of Michael Thomas might feel this thing a little bit.

So this one's almost a little bit of a fantasy preview, uh, come down. Hmm. And, you know, it all was laid out beautifully and, and, um, with good context. But this is the type of haterade, you know, that Michael Thomas fuels himself on, you know? No one is more aware of, of anybody in his way, but they'll slug. The slightest bit of doubt, he's, he's, can you believe that, though? 33% of their passes. That's why I agree with you.

I think that. Do you want to know what the record is, by the way? The record, Mark, I'll ask you this one. I'll give you a hint. The record is 208 targets in one season. And it was set by an NFC West Wide Receiver in 1997. Hmm. I was going to go flip on.

And it wasn't Jerry Rice. Right. I was going to go Jerry Rice until you made it to... I'll give me another hint. You know, I like to bring it back, a former New York jet. Isaac Bruce? Rob Moore. How about Rob Moore?

Great players. It's a 97. Great TechMobile player, too, by the way, back in the day. Let's do a couple more. All right. I'll do it quick. know we got this all-hands meeting, you know, all-N-Fel meeting on Zoom we got to get to. You didn't go Lamar, but I am going to go Mark Ingram as kind of a representative of the entire Reds, the Ravens rushing attack.

Mark with a seat. Because I just, I think what they did was so historic. They ran to the ball at a higher rate than any team, you know, since the Tim Tebow Broncos. They, you know, they got more yards than any team on the ground than any team in NFL history. They had the highest fourth down rate in NFL history. It's just like they're such a unique offense, and they add Gus Edwards there who can take away some of Ingram's shine. But I also think as a group,

LeMarr is like the most unique weapon there is in the NFL, but I don't think the rushing attack can be as dynamic as a whole. How could it be? It's asking too much, and I know they're going to develop things, but I think that'll be maybe leaning on the passing game, little more, changing things up a little bit, because there's only so many different kinds of runs Greg Robeman can come with, and I think defenses will be a little more ready than they were a year ago. And I hope that Mark Engram has 3,000 yards, but I mean, I could see

J.K. Dobbins starting by mid-season, if not earlier too. I mean, they went out and invested a lot in that position. I'll give you a quick one at wide receiver. We all love DeAndre Hopkins, but I could see his production, 104 catches a year ago, 1,000-plus yards, seven touchdowns. he's a perfect fit for them, but they run a lot of four wide receiver. They'll use Kenyon Drake to catch a ton of passes. I can see him being perfect for the team, but the numbers where you talk about Michael Thomas, they were so reliant on Hopkins in Houston year after year that maybe in a good way for him, it'll be a little bit different in Arizona out of the gate, especially after a weird offseason where he's barely worked with the attack. Let me look at his numbers.

That's swinging for the fences. That's not going to you, Braun. That's a good one. Fifteen games, 104 catches, 1165, 70. You know, his numbers weren't eye-popping last year, and I think, I'll disagree with you on that one, Mark. I think he's going to have a ton of targets still, even with their offensive setup, and I bet he eclipses those numbers if he stays healthy. Let's see how it goes.

Let's track that. All right, that was good. Come down players. See, we didn't bury anybody. We didn't say, well, Tanna Hill kind of took some heat there, but. Not really. We're saying he can be. a top, you know, an above average

starter. What more do you want? Can I be honest with you? I think he might be one of the buss of 20. Okay. Well, you're going hard. Well, now you've dropped a bit of a bomb on him, but that's okay. I kind of, I guess I should have been more clear in that. I just, I don't know. I've seen it. You've seen guys that come out of nowhere

in a perfect setup and have that nice year and then revert. We'll see. I wish the best of luck. He's solid. I think he's solid. Lauren Tannahill, his wonderful wife. The whole Tannahill clan has my support.

I just, you know, that's what we do here. Chop it up. Football talk. All right. One more show this week. Actually, two more shows this week. This is fun. We will be back on Friday with a newser show where we just get you caught up to date

with what's happening in the league. And then also we'll be back on NFL. network on Saturday and on the digital side of things Friday. It's the same show. So we're taping a show on Friday, the return of the around the NFL broadcast that will air on NFL.com and on YouTube on Friday, and then we'll re-air on Saturday morning on the network. So we got a lot of content coming your way.

The train mark has left the station. I know we're in very uncertain times, and you don't know what's coming next. But as far as our workflow is concerned, the train has left the station. No going back to the station. Don't even remember what it looked like at this point. Don't feel like we spent a lot of time there. We're moving. All right.

Let's head out of here. Happy birthday to the beautiful Jack Carson Hansus. He turned six today. I'm going to go celebrate with my boy right now. This is Dan Hansa signing off for the old boss, Quiet Storm. The mailman of Ricky Hollywood. Till Friday. Hey,

Hey, everybody, Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Six, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies. To evaluate team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers,

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