NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Dexter Lawrence Wants a Trade, Kirk Is a Raider and Beef We Love

Episode Date: April 6, 2026

Jourdan Rodrigue and Nick Shook react to news from around the NFL including Dexter Lawrence requesting to be traded by the Giants, Kirk Cousins signing with the Raiders, Travon Walker getting a big-money extension with the Jaguars, Stephon Gilmore retiring from the NFL and more! Plus, Jourdan and Nick tell what beef they love, including the Raiders, Chargers and Browns beefing up their offensive lines and some of the best coaching beefs from around the league! NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. I'm Daniel Jeremiah. And I am Greg Rosenthal. I know that, Greg. We're teaming up on 40s and free agents, the podcast that owns the NFL offseason. This is where teams are built.

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Really wins. Open your free IHeart radio app. Search 40s and free agents and listen now. Welcome to NFL Daily where the kids are all right. We don't have Greg Rosenthal here today. He's seeing his family. I'm Jordan Rodriguez. I'm in the Chris Wesleying podcast studio, joined by the great Nick Shuck, Nick, we're in charge today. We are in charge. No rules. Pizza rolls in the oven. Hopefully we don't burn the house down. Here we go. I'm just sliding around the house, you know, Tom Cruise style and socks, playing music as loud as I can, you know, wearing sunglasses, you know, eating all of the food in the fridge, building pillow forts. It's crazy, Nick, because we have so much news to catch up on. If you've been listening to

the feed, you've got a lot of great shows in the feed 40s and free agents. There's some great Ollie Connolly episodes going over some of the draft prospects, but we haven't had a chance to really catch up and dive back in on the news. And I have to think that Greg has like a little FOMO because we have a pretty meaty news show today. Yes. And it is still the regular season, right? And yet he's not here to dive into the, this is the type of news portion that Greg would really sink his teeth into like a nice steak. Maybe it's extra rare and just enjoy it. And yet he's not here. I know. He's a newsman after all. And I think you could tell immediately who was in charge of organizing the rundown document today.

Yes. Because I was in charge and I have deep and serious mental health issues about organization. No, no. And as somebody who also needs things to organize clearly, I like the bold things. I like to highlight things so that they're easy to find with my eyes while we're in the middle of the show. I appreciate this more than you would ever know. There are bullet points.

There's bolded. There's things that are highlighted. It's all organized. It makes sense to my brain. And hopefully it produces a great show. It's got to produce a great show. I mean, we'll see. We'll see. We'll see how it goes. Like, we'll play it by ear. I'm in the power chair. I had to lower it by quite a bit because when Greg sits in it, it's up very high. The man has a small torso. Let's get into New York Giants' superstar defensive tackle. Dexter Lawrence has reportedly requested a trade, according to the insiders. And that comes after what local New York reporters have said has been like some weeks and months of simmering tension between Dexter Lawrence and the front office. They kind of put a band-aid over it.

Last off-season, reportedly, he's gotten calls at the trade deadline as well. And he will not attend OTAs. This situation suddenly got very, very serious in New York. Yeah, and I don't think it really shines a positive light on Joe Shane, the GM there who is still there, despite them changing head coaches. Some people would believe that he probably shouldn't be there, but he is still there. This is the GM who was once, you know, shown to let Seekwant Barkley walk out of the door much to the dismay of Giants ownership at the time.

And then we all know how that panned out. And now we have this instance in which one of your pillars of your franchise, the guy that you gave a four-year, $90 million contract extension to just a few years ago, no longer wants to play for you because it seems you guys can't come close to negotiating a new extension. He's 28 years old. He's in the prime of his career. He's got two second team all pros to his name. He's got three Pro Bowl nods over the last four years.

He just missed out this most recent season. and it's a guy that you should continue to build around. I mean, we've seen this team go through one phase to the next transition after transition, and he's been there throughout the majority of it drafted in the first round in 2019 out of Clemson. And just now you look at it and you think, how do you let this guy, you know, get upset with you. This is the guy that shores up the interior. You put all these efforts toward, you know, getting Brian Burns and other, you know, acquiring other guys to make this defense better.

And yet the true interior of it is upset. So this is a deal that you got to get done. I think if you really want to, you know, keep this defense altogether. But then again, you know, we do see this when coaches change. Sometimes they're not their guy. And the front office can't get, you know, on the same page as somebody with player representation. Then you end up in this situation where now he goes public with his trade demand. And we'll see if those phone lines heat up again because I know Joe Shane really probably

wanted a lot in a return for him. And that's probably why they didn't get done the middle of the season last year near the deadline. and now is the perfect time to put together a godfather offer for a player like Dexter Lauren. Yeah, and 28, as you mentioned, he's still got, you know, a lot of good years left. And he is somebody around whom they've built this like complimentary puzzle piece or attempted to where of all the things that were not creditable to use a Greg word about the giants over the last couple of years. That defensive line absolutely was and has been. And Dexter Lawrence being the cornerstone of that, you know, I like to. think that maybe the Giants and Dexter Lawrence's camp actually got a peek at our very detailed

rundown before we had the show because later in the show we do have a brief segment coming up called Beef We Love. And so now, obviously, there is beef very much out in the open between the New York Giants and Dexter Lawrence. I'm kind of curious about who you think should be in on this. If this does continue to unfold, if this isn't just sort of a play for getting more money, if this actually does result in a trade. I'm kind of curious who you think should be in. My opinion, I think the Panthers should be making phone calls. They already have that relationship between Dan Morgan and Joe Shane,

do have that relationship. And yes, they already have Derek Brown, but they could really benefit from having a complimentary interior player to Derek Brown, who is more than a role player as Ashon Robinson and Bobby Brown, the third have been. And they really are beefing up, around the edges there as well. And I think the chargers who have a lot of cap space

should be a team that's making a phone call. I think the Bengals should be making a phone call. What do you think? Who do you think should be in on this? That's where I was going to go. So it's funny because the Panthers, so like I just did my first mock draft came out last week and I had the Panthers taking a defensive tackle in the first round and you think, well, you get Derek Brown there.

Well, let's get that complimentary, you know, let's create a duo. Yeah. Eric Brown, who's an excellent pass rusher. Let's get a really good run stop. I paired him with Lee Hunter from Texas Tech. maybe it's a bit of an overdraft, right? But if you add a guy in like Dexter Lawrence who can do pretty much everything on the interior

next to a Derek Brown, suddenly you have one heck of a tandem in the interior that really shores it up, makes it into a brick wall of sorts. So that was a great pick. But I also thought the Bengals too, because as we went through remaining free agent fits a few weeks ago, I kept looking at the Bengals

and thinking, okay, well, you sign Jonathan Allen, but how well is that really going to work out? It's still a weakness for you. You still need to make that defense better. Next to him, you got BJ Hill. It would be a massive upgrade to add a Dexter Lawrence to that group. And especially after, you know, you look at what they have done at edge rusher,

Trey Hendrickson leaves, they get Boy A Mafet. But Boy A Mafet becomes that much better if the guys next to him are stronger. I mean, that's really where he excelled as part of a bigger roof in Seattle. So it only benefits the additions that you've already made by adding somebody else like that. The question is, is do they have the capital or are they willing to give up the capital necessary to pry him from the hands of the Giants, which is why if you let this ride out a little bit and the negotiations continue to stall. And it sounds like they're nowhere near, you know, common ground with this right now.

maybe you get them at a slightly cheaper price. I mean, it is early April, but a deal before the draft still makes a lot more sense maybe for the Giants than other teams. But as you construct your roster and try to, you know, how you figure out the draft and where you target your needs, it would make more sense to get that done right now.

But that's definitely one of the teams I agree with. And I like the Chargers as a good team too. Any team that, like, I mean, you can really go anywhere, but I love the idea of beefing up defensive interiors. I think about some of the defensive interiors, like in Houston, for example, not saying that they need this, but I love the idea of a defense getting even better. They don't have the room or the, they really, what they need to make such a deal work,

but I think about guys like Tommy Toggiye making a difference. If you were to replace a Tommy Toggiye with a Dexter Lawrence, that would be incredible. That's more unrealistic. I wonder if teams who were really invested, I think about the Patriots, for example, and obviously Milton Williams was such a difference maker for them last season, but I think about these teams that want to go from solid to great or already good, that want to go to better or be great. And I think about teams that potentially were getting trade packages ready for other players.

AJ Brown is still out there. And these teams, they game theory through what actually is, are we willing to give for premier players? It's not just receiver defensive linemen. It's what are when front office talk about, when front offices talk about this, they talk about what are we, what do we actually have resources wise that we are willing to put forward to premium players at a premier position, players who take an entire position group and change the math for that position group. And certainly that could be a conversation that's happening right now around the league. And I love it. And I just, Joe Shane,

you're in this situation again, man. Like, I just, it's just, it's set your clock to it. Set your watch to it at this point, Nick. I have one more team to toss out there too. I totally agree with everything you just said. What team fell apart in the middle of the season last year, partially because they've missed their quarterback due to injury, but also because they couldn't stop a nosebleed in the defensive interior. It was the Baltimore Ravens. And we still don't know exactly if Matabee is going to come back.

They say he's in good spirits mentally, but we still need to know physically coming off of that neck injury. That's been a big need for them throughout this offseason. I would love that addition there. That would be a headline grabber like Max Crosby was supposed to be. And I think it would make that even better up front. So that's my last team to throw in there. But I totally agree.

Why, Giants, do you continue to find yourself in this situation year after year with all your cornerstone players? I think it's actually even worse. You know, I know Sequin Barclay had a career year right after he left, but I think it's even worse that this guy, a homegrown, developed guy, that you've already handed one extension, is suddenly now not wanting to be there anymore because you can't figure out how to pay him. The irony that it would be, too, of John Harbaugh,

now the head coach of the New York Giants, losing a cornerstone piece to the team. team that gently escorted him out the door. Okay, as great, I'm going to do a Greg impression. Are you ready? I'm going to pull out a couple of these through the course of the door. Okay, we got to move. Kurt Cousins to the Raiders. This happened last week. Kirk Cousins went to the Raiders. He's going to be in that bridge starter slash backup role. It's 20 million guaranteed. The Raiders are not paying much of it. They're paying basically $11.3 million worth of this $20 million guaranteed over the next two calendar slash team accounting years.

Kirk Cousins still has a lot of flexibility in 2027 should he want to pursue another team elsewhere. But the Falcons and oh my gosh, who am I forgetting? The Falcons are paying a significant portion of this and are on the hook for it. And it's a solid contract. He didn't want to play reportedly on the league minimum. I like this for the Raiders. Kirk Cousins, as he often does, kind of broke his own news with this great post on social media. it says the autumn wind for our listeners.

He always sort of calls his shot right before the news actually breaks. But I really like this for the Raiders who I'm going to be honest, they're kind of reeling me back in a little bit, Shook. Like I don't hate any, really anything about their offseason plan. Even the Crosby stuff, you really can't blame them for that over the long term. And I've really liked their like bucket of resources that they're pulling together to basically. say, hey, all of this is going toward developing a quarterback,

including having a really solid bridge starter, who's going to be a mentor in that room to likely Fernando Mendoza at their number one overall pick. Also getting Tyler Linderbaum resetting the market for him. It's costly, including using your number one overall pick. It's all costly, but to me, it's sort of priceless if the quarterback works out. Yeah, you're absolutely right. First off, that tweet at 6.11 a.m., I believe that's Pacific,

But those are real dad hours. Psycho hours. Yeah. It's so good for him. That fits his persona. This, I felt like we could see this coming for a long time. You know, and not only did Clint Kubiak say it during the owner's meetings that, you know, he wanted, he preferred a mature quarterback to come in and lead, you know, this team and this offense in year one and not throw the rookie in there because we all expect them to select Fernando Mendoza with the first overall pick. He kind of signaled it at that point.

And it was funny because it was in this weird period. Greg and I discussed this on on the show. I believe that day, which was that it was this weird period in which Kirk Cousins was suddenly wanted by like four teams. Like Matt LaFleur openly said that they were looking at him. Sean McVey openly said that they were looking at him. And then Clint Kubiak thinly veiled reference to Kirk Cousins wanting him to be that guy. And then so a couple of days later, of course, this deal materializes. And it makes all the sense in the world if you look at it from a one-year deal, a one-year deal in which he makes $20 million. Obviously, it's much larger than that,

but we know that a lot of this is just constructed, you know, with outs and everything else, offer a quarterback a lot of flexibility. It's actually pretty similar to what the Falcons did, which was the sign that they were moving on from him where they moved his void year, his void date, I think to like the fifth day of the league year, essentially giving them a deadline to move on from him. Raiders kind of do the same thing, give themselves and Kirk Cousins, the deadline to move on from each other a year from now. But it answers the biggest need going into Clint Kubiak's first year's head coach of the Raiders, which is that I get the veteran that I can trust to operate this offense and set the foundation. And I,

don't have to throw the rookie in there. Behind an offensive line that was terrible last year and has received a lot of investment, but still needs time to gel. You give yourself room to figure all this out and put all these pieces together instead of potentially damaging your number one overall picks. So it makes a ton of sense. And it's good for Kirk, who is the all-time bag getter. He's getting another bag this year with the Raiders.

He's going to get an opportunity to continue playing. I thought he played well enough with the Falcons last year to deserve such an opportunity. Now he lands one. And a year from now, we could be talking about Kirk Baby saying, you know what? This is the final chapter of my career. I passed the keys to Fernando Mendoza. I did my job as a veteran. I gave him all my wisdom gained from my many stops in the NFL,

and now I'm going to stroll into a TV studio with all this money in my pocket. And I think it would be a perfect final chapter for him. All just preparing for the inevitable cousin Shanahan broadcasting duo coming to whatever network will exist at that time. So it's interesting. I like this with the contract. too. I like how they did this.

It was collaborative between both teams because Kirk will still make that $10 million roster bonus or the $10 million bonus next off season. It's sort of lumped into this initial very low cost for the Raiders where he is technically making the minimum for them this year. But I think if you look at overall what Kirk's accounting will be before he puts in for what will likely be a significant, you know, taxes during that season, every league year, it basically all gets pulled into the, same money. And so this is interesting the way that they're saying you will be making

$20 million over these two calendar seasons guaranteed. It's just going to look a lot like backup quarterback money to start and functionally for the Raiders. And I like that because it's a not a respect and a sort of a, hey, if it does turn out that, you know, some catastrophe happens injury or maybe our young quarterback isn't going to be as ready on time, you're giving him a little bit more of a nod on the back end of such a deal. And then also giving him the flexibility in case he does want to keep playing it. When I was hearing about Kirk in the off season and where's he going to go and all these things. And sometimes by the way, my theory is sometimes that some of these coaches who like him so much are putting in the the juice while they can

and the favors because one day maybe they will need him. He was like, hey, remember that one time at the league meetings when I helped give you a pay bump because we increased. Yeah, because we increased the the bidding war, so to speak, or the perception of one around your status. You know, you remember that time? I think that it's interesting because Kirk, what I would hear this off seems, he has no intention of A, being a backup for long or B, you know, he still feels like he's got a lot of football left in them. I think a lot of these quarterbacks do. They feel like that every season this time of year. But good for Kirk. He keeps rolling. He keeps going. I don't know how much we're actually going to see of him this year.

1.3 million in 2026 for the Raiders doesn't really say this guy has to be our starter. But it's a great just in case for the Raiders. And people say all over the league that they learn, even if the guy's not teaching them specifically or being a mentor specifically to them, you hear all the time about watching habits in a quarterback's room, in a receiver's room in any of these rooms where they have veteran players,

watching habits and making those habits your own can be really, really helpful for the long term. So good for Kirk. We, you know, keep going. Time has no meaning and is irrelevant and a construct. And keep stacking them checks, Kirk. We love it. On to a more serious topic, Shook.

I'm glad you're here to talk with me about this. I know that Greg and Patrick have talked about it. We've talked about it a little bit on the show as well. But last week, the news broke that Puka Nakua, the Ram star receiver, checked into a holistic care facility. Just want to say his lawyer said he's been there since March. And also a team source confirmed that to me. He's been there for some time.

And before this latest lawsuit that alleges he made an anti-Semitic comment and also bit two separate, two women while intoxicated, came out. So I wanted to get into this a little bit because there's layers to it. And obviously, first and foremost, Pukunakua has a lot of learning. and growing up to do this off season. That's one truth. But another truth on this, obviously, is you hope on a human level that maybe the care, if there is a substance issue, if there is something beyond, you know, the mental

or some of the off-season exploits that does need to be addressed, you hope that a person gets care for that. You know, Nick, the other truth of this, though, is that there's been a lot of of mistakes and a lot of just bad stuff that Puka Nakua has been out there and getting into, including starting even in the middle of the season with his anti-Semitic dance that he did on a live stream that's known for platforming, people with that opinion and also white nationalists. You know, Puka later said that he did not know what that dance meant. And these allegations that came out in this latest lawsuit would have placed

the timing less than three weeks after his public apology for that dance and for that live stream. This is concerning on a number of levels. First and foremost, I really appreciated what Patrick said on a previous show that your actions are going to have to speak louder than any issued statements than any sort of team leaking things or team putting things out there or anything like that. You know, the organization has been supportive of him getting this help and being in this facility. He did it of his own volition to my understanding, but the organization was glad he did after increasing concerns about his well-being. And he, there, there is a lot of work to do and a lot of

actions, I think, needed to show that he actually, these were mistakes, you know, because your actions are going to, now are going to speak a lot louder than even your play on the field. Yeah, absolutely. So the incidence has also happened in relatively quick success. session, which is really a very alarming reality for the fact that, you know, we remember what happened the live stream, you know, thing. And then that was during the season. And then this happens, you know, like you said, less than a month later. And what it kind of speaks to for me, when I try to analyze this, again, from the human perspective, like you said, you want somebody to make sure that they get the help that they need or the direction that they need, whether it's team provided or

outside, you know, somebody within his circle, instead of being surrounded by yes, men, and then enablers and everything else. And it seems like maybe that's the path that he's on. But I think about it from a human perspective because I try to understand how could you suddenly do all these things back to back and just make these mistakes. I have to make sense of this one way or another. And what I think it really is is a product of a guy who came into the NFL and took the league by storm. He was not a household name. He was not a name that arrived to the Rams with great expectations. And within just a couple of seasons, became a superstar. And I think oftentimes when fame hits you so quickly, you don't know how to handle it. Most of us are not equipped

to handle fame when it hits you that quickly. That is not an excuse for what he's done, but when you try to make sense of why somebody will act the way they are and so destructively, I mean, relatively speaking, within such a short order, that kind of makes some sense to it. But how do you then counter that? You kind of that by being guided by people who have your best interest in mind and aren't just trying to, you know, take a little bit from your tree or take a little bit from your pockets. And it seems like maybe he's on that right track down going into the holistic care facility. And the Rams apparently, you know, realizing this is a serious situation and that they're going to hold him to account and that they're not just going to let this continue to happen.

The hope that is that this is the first step toward doing more of the right things. And again, backing up your words with actions because words like you said, they really don't matter. Anybody can have a PR team craft a statement that sounds fine. But if you go out and make another mistake, all that disappears. So you hope this is the first step toward the right direction, but I think it does speak to, you know, how success and fame can derail somebody pretty quickly

and you just hope that they have the right support system around them to get them back on track and prevent these sorts of mistakes from happening again. And then if you look at it from a football perspective, he is at that point in his career now where you are talking contract extension. You are talking about your first big payday, and that can all be affected for, you know, if he continues to make mistakes. So as of now, it's good that, you know, he ends, up, you know, checking into this facility on his own volition. We'll see, you know, again,

it's cautious optimism, I think, and you hope that he doesn't repeat these mistakes and that he learns from them. Yeah, I think like I mentioned, and you said, it's very well said, Nick, two things are true here. It's good to seek help and to get the help that you need for whatever issues you are experiencing in your life. And he's done so. Again, he's not a kid, no matter how many times Sean McVeigh refers to him as a kid. He is not. He is an adult man with a child. So he had the autonomy to go seek help and he did.

So I think that's one thing that is true here. The other thing is that accountability is not a one-off thing. Accountability is a lifelong thing. I think a lot of us understand that and know that. And this is something that the Rams, I think more so, just in my understanding and sort of my conversations, the Rams more so than certainly they did in season where there was no, he wasn't punished,

there was no internal suspension, there was nothing. And Sean McVeigh even came out and praised him after that game for his on-field performance just right after that streaming incident and trying to get the streamers into the building and all those things. Now I think that it has intensified internally

that necessity for accountability. I think a lot of things, his fans probably feel the same way that accountability is, is necessary. And so that's not something you just know is going to happen immediately. It's a series of actions. It's a series of steps. It's a life of growth and a life of understanding your platform and a life of understanding what you mean to people and who you are to people who celebrate you for what you do on a football field, but ultimately will remember you for everything, including what you do off of it. So with that, the Rams to me have, in my opinion and my understanding, have made it pretty clear what the stakes are here.

Even to the point where, you know, what's interesting about this to me, Shook, is that they, they don't do early extensions until training camp anyway. So they have naturally given themselves a cushion to see whether or not he is progressing in a way that's like, first of all, healthy. and second of all, that suits their standards of the mantle that they would say someone of that status of their franchise would have to carry. So they have time. So that's the first interesting part of this to me. And second, this is not a team that typically has used the franchise tag in the past. But what if they think they need more time?

What if, like I said, they believe that accountability is a long series of steps? And, you know, it's not just the, how does he appear when he shows up to the facility. It's also, I think it's a two-step process just to get back toward getting on the right track, which is one, looking yourself in the mirror and admitting your faults, admitting your mistakes, taking that accountability with yourself. And then it's also about who you surround yourself with. And I think that's where the Rams could probably find some clues as they have this cushion and see how long they want to ride it out.

Who is he surrounding himself with when he's not at the facility? Who is he leaning on? Who is he turning toward, I think back to, what was it, a couple of years ago where they talked about the workouts in Cooper Cups Yard or whatever and throwing up in the yard. That was a good sign at the time.

You need more of that. You need to be surrounded by people that can guide you in the right direction and not lead you down these roads of mistakes that you've traveled down far too often recently. It's going to be something. We don't know the results now. And OTAs are set to start.

His lawyer has said that he will be participating in the team's offseason programming. I'm sure that the beat report will have a lot of questions, continued questions. Curious how the team will handle this as well from an optic standpoint, let alone from an internal standpoint. So just something that's going to continue to be a really big story in the NFL. And one, like I said, you know, a lot of layers to it and a lot of,

a lot of nuance to these types of things. What you see externally is not always what's happening internally. I want to move on to Trayvon Walker, a player who I know we both like quite a bit. He just agreed to a four-year, $110 million extension with the Jacksonville Jaguars. That includes a reported $77 million in guarantees and $50 million guaranteed at signing per our pal rap sheet. What do you make of this extension, first and foremost, shook? And what does it say about this Jaguars defense and what they believe they are building moving forward? We are in the sunniest, most optimistic.

Everything is flowers and sunshine and candy period that the Jaguars have seen in a long time because they're coming off of a very strong finish to a regular season and disappointment in the playoffs, but every reason in the world to believe that the best is yet to come. So it makes a lot of sense that they sign one of their key guys on the defensive side and also confirm their former pick first overall pick in Trayvon Walker by hitting him this deal. But it's not like this is just a handout because it's not. over the course of his career he's got 27-5 sacks he's got 10 sacks in 2023 10 and a half in 2024 and yes he only had three and a half last year but he still made a difference he still made

an impact over the 14 games that he played if you are constructing your team for the long term and you're figuring out and identifying exactly who are the key parts of your squad as you try to continue to build toward the ultimate success and the ultimate goal which is winning a super bowl now is the time to do something like that before he enters the fifth year of his rookie deal and you lock them up. You lock up a guy that is going to be the future of your edge rushing department because Josh Heinz Allen for as good as he is is not as young as he once was. And in the meantime, you have both of them getting after quarterbacks and it keeps one of your guys at a relatively affordable rate given what the edge rushing market is right now with the hopes

that he outperforms that contract within the four years that he'll be signed to it. So it makes a lot of sense. I saw you put a little note in there that the Jags got cute in the contract structure by giving him 27 and a half average annual salary, which is equal to his career sacks of 27 and a half, which, all right, that's sweet. I like that. That's cool. Nice little nod. But what I really like most about him is he has, like, he's not the cleanest, most polished edge rusher. He's not an absolute force right off of the snap and just wins immediately. Like, I don't know, you think about Miles Garrett or some of the most premier edge rushers. But what he does and what I think really bodes well for his long-term success to the Jaguars, he never gives up on

place. He is every highlight you find of him, rarely is it an immediate victory. Every once in a while, he'll get into the chest of a tackle and knock him off his platform, run right through him and get the sack. But a lot of them are, didn't win initially, continues fighting, continues fighting, and finds his way to the ball. And he just does it over and over and over again. Sometimes it produces a turnover. There's the one time he recovered a fumble and took it back for a touchdown in Philadelphia. It's just all the signs that you want from a guy. He's not taking those plays off. His motor is relentless on these plays in which he makes a difference. You hope that that is the foundation that he builds upon and really lives up to this

contract. And that's why you sign to a deal like that that's, you know, relatively affordable given what the market is. And you hope that it ends up being a cheap deal in the larger picture. Yeah, I think the Jaguars are smart. They're looking at things beyond some of the premium numbers that we often look at with past rushers. His sack totals are respectable, obviously.

But they're clearly paying him as a second effort player, which tells me that they do have a construction idea of what they want to do moving forward. A second effort player like Trayvon Walker often lends well to a very, very creative first effort player who the second effort player has to and truly has a sort of a knack for understanding how to bounce off of whatever that player is doing. Something that Liam Cohen, by the way, saw over and over and over again. He mentioned at league meetings. He really wants to have a situation with Trayvon Walker, similar to that that he used to see with Aaron Donald, who is one of those initial effort, third and fourth and fifth effort players who,

uh, they used to have to kick out of practice and because he was just abusing the guards too much. This is how the veteran rest days, by the way, came to be for Aaron Donald who's never needed a rest day in his entire life. They would assign him veteran rest days because the guards were not getting enough actual work in because they were, they were setting and panicking the entire time.

Um, and so that's what Liam Cohen wants to see at Trayvon Walker. And certainly because he has such of that knack and that ability to pursue, even after the first contact on a play. He is able to have that creativity. They could basically over time, Shook, you mentioned it. Josh Heinz Allen is great,

but over time, whoever they plug in with him, he is going to be able to play off of them because of that particular and very specific, as they would call it, superpower that he does have. And next step on their list,

I think, is extending Parker Washington, who we love on NFL Daily, really came on middle to late last season. And Breton Strange, who had a little bit of injury issues, but is certainly someone around whom a lot of their offense is designed as sort of a hinge player in the passing surface and in the running surface too.

So that's the Jaguars who, you know, probably were feeling a little impatient because they didn't go out and do a bunch of splashy things, but they're sort of now taking a step back, playing the compic game, this free agency and trying to build sustainably instead of sort of chase outliers, which in the best way, their first season under Liam Cohen was. Yeah, super exciting for them. Sometimes when you look at your roster and you see the success you had, you just think, okay, I like most of what we had. Now let's start paying some of our own guys that make small ads here, small ads there,

and continue building toward our greater goal. And look, as somebody who was not necessarily a big believer in what the Jaguars were putting together a year ago, I was so wrong. And I'm so happy to be wrong because I think they're on the right path forward. And it all obviously all hinges on their quarterback and how he plays, but he played so well the back half of last year that I'm just like, I'm all aboard, baby. go.

Jags go in the South in 2020. I know. I love it. I'm biased, obviously, but yes, I love it. I'm already, I do feel like Greg,

sitting in the power chair. I just got a producer text from Eric behind the glass. We're honking too much, Nick. We're honking. That doesn't surprise me at all. It doesn't surprise me at all. This is just a look at our conversations

when Nick and I actually do get to see each other at these league events. All we do is sit there and talk about things we're interested in, which we are interested in. which we are interested in, but we know a lot of the population is not. Okay, here are some small news tidbits. The NFL announced in a little bit of a Friday news dump last week that its investigation into chiefs receiver Rishie Rice has concluded.

In their words, they found he has not engaged in conduct that violates the personal conduct policy, end quote. So as of now, he will not be disciplined by the league. Rishi Rice obviously was previously accused via lawsuit and social media posts by the mother of his two children of repeated assault. The NFL additionally said that its investigation into those allegations by her has concluded. And the great, the legend, the five-time pro bowler, two-time all-pro, again, I cannot believe that Greg does not get to opine about this here today.

Stefan Gilmore, Patriot, longtime Patriots cornerback, pride of Rock Hill, South Carolina, pride of the Carolina's region overall has retired. I'm going to read in short part of his statement to my first love football as a young scrappy kid from Rock Hill, South Carolina with humble beginnings, the eldest of six. You gave me focus, opportunity, strength, and friends to last a lifetime. He goes on to thank his wife, his children, his coaches, and the fans and says he's excited about his next chapter, which could include scouting or coaching or pretty much do whatever you want to do, Stefan Gilmore. Like you earned it, man. Yeah, he earned it.

and what a career that he had started in Buffalo, proved himself as a very physical corner, willing to put his nose, get his nose dirty, and he did it plenty early on and throughout his career. And then wasn't the right fit for Sean McDermott and co when they showed up. And so he said, you know what? I'm going to go play on the other side of the rivalry in the AFC East. I'm going to go play for the Patriots.

I'm going to go win a Super Bowl with the Patriots. And he stayed there for four more years. That's where he really peaked, hit a couple of first team all pros, four Pro Bowls. And then he went back home to Carolina, an abbreviated appearance because of a quad injury that led to his trade from the Patriots to the Panthers then became a mercenary, as many do,

and finished on a strong note. Heck of a career. One of my favorite guys to watch when it comes to just a highlight reel because of how physical he played. He was a guy, again, that was not afraid to get his nose dirty. He got in there. He sacrificed his body.

He laid it all out there on the line over 13 years. A retirement that is well earned, well deserved, excited for what's next for him and the pride of the South Carolina Gamecocks, Defon Gilmore. you know, sneaky, best Twitter username handle combo, gillil lock and bump and run

Gilmore, which two things that, you know, if you know, you know, it's good stuff. It's true. I can't believe Greg, I would really love a Greg monologue about Stefan Gilmore and like the interception in the Super Bowl, against the Rams. It's 10 to 3. The Rams are driving. It's the lowest excitement Super Bowl in ages.

But who provides the final juice? Stefan Gilmore, pick it off Jared Gough to lock it up. Here, wait, I got another one. coming. And we are so back. And then I try not to say, I love my Patriots family. That's my great. There's my other great impression. I know the listeners are going to love that one. Do we take a break, Eric? Well, I don't know. The kids are in charge. I feel like we just are freeway. Yes, please take a break. Please take a break. Please for the love of God. Take a break. Okay. We're going to take a quick break. And then we're back on the other side of NFL Daily, Kids Edition.

With beef we love. Nailed it. I'm Luke Wilson. Join me each week for Film Never Lies. Since retiring from the NFL, I've had a lot of my mind, and now I've got my own show. So if you're tired of lazy takes, if you want honest conversations,

join us each week. Film Never Lies available on all TSN platforms in the IHeart Radio app. I'm Daniel Jeremiah. And I'm Greg Rosenthal. And this is 40s and free agents. The games may be over, but the NFL never stopped.

This is my favorite part. of the calendar. Yeah, mine too, Greg, free agency, the combine, the NFL draft, pro days, trades. This is where teams

reshape their future. This is where Daniel Jeremiah makes his money. On 40s and free agents, we break down every move that actually matters.

From my draft evaluations, mock drafts, and team fits. To my top 101 free agents and how real rosters are built, cap space, contracts,

and all the tough decisions included. You got quarterbacks on the move. We got teams rebuilding. It's hope season. Yeah, absolutely. It's hope season. We'll tell you what's real, what's noise, and what it means for your favorite team.

Smart analysis, real conversations every week. I don't know about the smart, but definitely analysis. Listen to 40s and free agents on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Second down and 10. There was a guy who wore number 21 for the Patriots with a saving interception in an end zone to our white several Super Bowls ago. Oh, they're coming here. Now golf with three to the left, takes the snap. Harmon out of blitz. Gough throws it to the right. Gilmore's there. Intercepted at the four.

Harmon enforced the pick, and Gilmore comes up with it. His second of the postseason. What a call. A possession of the Patriots. What a call by Brian Flores. Pressure on number 16. You know the kid was going to crack,

and he did there. And what a play by Gilmore. Let's go. Back on NFL Daily. And what a call. What a game. What a moment. Stefan Gilmore told ESPN's Mike Reese that that was probably the favorite moment of his career.

What a player. What a legacy. Two things that really pop out there from here, Jordan, real quick. Number one, Zolak, always talking over Sochi on the call, even in the Super Bowl way back then. And then number two, he made another great play the year before. He broke up the fourth down pass from Blake Bortles that sent the Patriots to that Super Bowl. So primetime clutch player. You know, he'll never forget that.

Blake Bortles. Okay, so the segment we're going to do today, you know, you and I love offensive line and defensive line analysis. And we also love petty arguments among professionals. So we've combined those two passions of ours into a segment that we have named Beef We Love. So, Shuck, I'm going to tee you up to start. What is one beef that you love?

One beef is really, it's not an argument. necessarily, but it's, it's an appreciation for some red meat, some real protein here and some teams that desperately needed to up their protein intake. We're going with three different teams that invested in the offensive line this offseason. First up, they weren't graded the worst, but they were undoubtedly the worst, the Las Vegas Raiders. They had a terrible offensive line last year. If you need proof, go look at Gino Smith's interception numbers or go look at Gino Smith's demeanor by the end of the season. They were terrible. Since then, they overpaid Tyler Linderbaum, and I say overpaid respectfully,

if not with a bit of a compliment, because they had to pay the tax to get Tyler Linderbaum to leave the Ravens, to go to the Raiders. It trades the black and purple for the silver and black, makes as much $8 million more per year than the next highest paid center.

And it's all going to be worth it if they can hold up. They also added Spencer Burford, the interior offensive lineman who was previously with the 49ers. So they're shoring up their offensive line as they bring in Fernando Mendoza. And now Kirk Cousins,

as we discussed earlier. Another team that, invest in their offensive line out of necessity, the Cleveland Browns, because they had a bunch of veterans who were headed out, who had some void years added to their contracts, who they weren't going to be able to keep.

Wyatt Teller, you're gone. Ethan Postick, you're gone. Jack Conklin, you're gone. And they needed to sign a lot. So what did they do? They trade for Titus Howard. They hand him a contract that's probably too expensive

for what he's actually going to do, but they answered the situation to right tackle immediately. Zion Johnson, an ascending guard. They sign him to fill in at left guard, and then they go get Elton Jenkins, who if he can stay healthy, will be one of the better interior alignment in the NFL.

Three out of the five spots addressed right away in the off season. The situation they created, Chuck. Please don't leave this part out. Oh, don't worry. Don't worry. The Browns are never without seeing in my world. Trust me. Your beef is my beef and everybody in Cleveland's beef.

But at least they did something to try to make up for it. And lastly, the Chargers, a little bit lower level, but we already knew that they had good tackles, very good tackles. Sean Slater, Joe Alt, Alt. When they're there, they're a better offense. We saw what happened, even when they just got Alt. back last year before he got hurt. And if you remember the Chargers,

evisceration of the Vikings in prime time before Alt exited for the rest of the season, they invest in the interior because you're only as strong as all five. So they get Tyler Biotish and they add Cole Strange, a guy who I was pretty high on coming out of college that never really quite stuck with the Patriots. Now he comes in there with a fresh opportunity to add some depth because my biggest complaint

with the charges over the last five years has been, yeah, you're starting five might look okay, but I know your depth is poor. They get a little bit deeper there. And hopefully it bodes well for them. hopefully they can avoid the injury bug. So I love investment in the offensive line. That's the beef that I love.

I love that. There he is. Giving you meat. It's like, oh, Greg. Thank God you're not here. It just slides in. Oh, my God. Giving you meat.

We're up. Okay, one thing I wanted to say about the Chargers is they, did bring in Butch Berry as their new offensive line coach who got the most out of like some maybe players that fan base and certain talent evaluators are maybe a little bit more skeptical

on but over time really got some great play helped identify their star center who's out there now. I like that because if someone's going to kind of take a player like Cole Strange who a lot of these zone teams were high on that draft that it came out. I think it was 2022.

too. Really, you know, a lot of these like teams that wanted to run like us more of a stretch zone or a wider middle to outside zone, they, they thought he had good movement skills and and good technique. So we'll see if that goes. Well, my first beef that I love, let me be clear, I love the Panthers continued rebuild of their defensive line. I don't think they're done. We mentioned at the top of the show, so we don't have to go back in depth over like how much a great addition to Derek Brown's already formidable presence on the inside would be if they brought in a really good partner for him. I like that they added Jalen Phillips. I know there's some risk there with the injury history, but he's so young. If he can stay healthy, I love this juice on the

outside. I already liked the way that Nick Scorton started to come along at the end of last year. I think partnering him, taking some of the onus off of him to be the guy will really help set him up in a complimentary way. Bobby Brown is a good interior, like, role player, but I would really love to see them add, continue to add on the interior. We mentioned them as a should go or should at least pick up the phone for a call on Dexter Lawrence. I do think this is a position they could hit the draft to find an above average player here in the higher rounds. This is beef I love. This is building in a complimentary way, in the right way around your stars, not being afraid to invest in positions that really, really matter.

The meat, the literal meat and potatoes positions up front. I love it. This is beef. I love. What is your next beef? It looks beefy. I should have known what we were getting into with this. How many beef sound drops do we have?

It looks beefy. Well, this one's beefy. And it's beefy in the, I guess, the Urban Dictionary Forum, which is, we got conflict. Joanne Jennings decided to be the heel of the NFL last year. Juan Jennings versus the world. And by that, I mean the football world. We remember the altercation he had with the Browns when Willie Collins was on the cart and Joanne Jennings was talking trash.

And Shelby Harris was very angry about it and let the world know afterward how he felt about it. I remember dot, dot, dot. And I want that known. Let it be known. And I want that known. We do still know Shelby Harris, how you feel about Joanne Jennings. But then he took it a step further. They're playing against the Colts in prime time.

He scores and he goes up to the fans near the end. zone in the seats and he acts like he's going to hand him the ball and then he goes psych and keeps it for himself and you can hear an audible oh disappointment joan jennings the heel of the nflb but the funny thing is it all comes back around eventually because we are now at april 6th 2026 and guess who is still unsigned joan jennings and if you google his name he's the darling of every team that still wants a receiver the team blogs they all want their team to go after joan jennings one quick google search today listed the Saints, the Falcons, the Titans, the Chargers, all his candidates who should definitely absolutely go assign Joanne Jennings, but maybe it's a difference in money. That seems to be

the vibe right now that maybe he wants a little bit too much, which again is the perfect capper to a beef because it's Joanne Jennings versus the football world and now it's financial too. I love that one. That was such a fun arc to follow. I wonder if he's starting to be on like the Chauncey Gardner Johnson path a little bit. That was my next candidate. He'll be a little bit more of a mercenary, but like a highly entertaining one who will give you some really, really valuable snaps, but then perhaps not be on your team like the next year. I am, your entire coaching staff, yeah.

Who then will come back around five years later and re-sign you. And sign you again. Yes. So I love this for him. He will always be cashing a check once he does get signed. This is, that's a really good one. Shook, for my last one, I'm calling this a beef to remember. Beef we loved among coaches in the 2025 NFL season.

My memory was refreshed on this as I went to league meetings and watched specifically who was not talking to each other. Matt LaFleur of the Green Bay Packers and Ben Johnson of the Chicago Bears. I love this type of rivalry. I need this rivalry to continue. This is good for the sport. It's good for the NFC North. Let's see.

Who else? jumps in. Oh, wait. Dan Campbell of the Detroit Lions, perhaps against Ben Johnson of the Chicago Bears, guys who once worked together who Dan Campbell had to spend an entire season last year, answering questions about the departure of his former offensive-minded genius to the Chicago Bears in the same division. And finally, probably our favorite of the entire year. Liam Cohen versus Robert Sala, again in the same division. Liam Cohen and Robert Sala famously had the on-field confrontation mid-season last year. And that was so early in the season, I'm kind of wondering what pops off here in the middle.

Noted that they were standing on complete opposite sides of the coach's photo. But apparently both did attend the Jay Glazer day drinking session. And so maybe some bridges were healed at that point. This is a beef to remember. They did say that they've mended fences and put that in the past. I think Robert Sali, even like two days later, apologized, said he wished you would have used some different words when describing their very effective legal sign stealing operation that they had there.

He's like, gosh, I meant it as a compliment. Yeah, I don't believe that. But they did say they joked about it since then, right? We'll see what happens when they meet on the field, though. Maybe that an animosity could bubble back up now that they're in the same division. I love it. I am issuing this challenge now to all the coaches and all the coordinators, frankly, because we need more, you know, lower middle to lower tier beef as well.

I think all of you should fight more, frankly. I think that it's good for the sport. I think it is better for the sport and the competition of the sport. If you just start letting us know how you feel, I was watching some of the earlier seasons of Top Chef recently. recently. And I noticed that they're all so much meaner to each other to their faces in these earlier seasons because they are so highly competitive and so at the top of their game. And you know what? It makes for a great show. Top Chef has never once fallen off in my opinion,

but they're all so nice to each other now. You guys want to kill each other in the kitchen. Come on. I need more beef. I need this to be a thing. I'm not a fan. I'm not a fan of post-game hugs. Yes, this seems to be the beefiest. SDA prime cut beef next year. Coaches, find an enemy, find a rival. Find an enemy. To quote Robert Sala, to quote Robert Sala, who was quoting somebody else, if you ain't got haters, you ain't popping, okay?

Build haters. I need it. We need it. Nick, how do you think this went today? Do you think we nailed the show or do you think it's like, I'm giving it like, you're a 10, I'm giving my own effort like a five or a six, you know? Well, Jordan, one of our many commonalities,

beyond our love for trench play. A crippling self-doubt. And offensive and defensive line is both crippling self-doubt and the inability to properly accept a compliment without feeling excruciatingly awkward when receiving it. So I am going to deflect back to you. And we can go back around in a circle all day. Let's not.

And I think you were and the show. And I was whatever number you were. And the show. Play the music, Eric. We don't want any more text from you about how long we're taking to talk. Okay. Next in your feed, you will see 40s and free agents with Greg. I'm Greg Rosenthal, DJ, and Ollie.

That's the trifecta. I cannot wait to listen to that. Thanks for putting up with the kids. The kids are in charge today. I'm Daniel Jeremiah. And I am Greg Rosenthal. I know that, Greg. We're teaming up on 40s and free agents,

the podcast that owns the NFL off season. This is where teams are built. Free agency, combine, pro days, trades. Every move matters. From my draft boards and mock drafts, to my vaunted top 101 free agents and how rosters come together. Quarterback movement. Surprise signings.

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