NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Dissecting the New PI Rule; Division Power Rankings

Episode Date: June 24, 2019

A room filled with some heroes - Dan Hanzus, Chris Wesseling and Gregg Rosenthal bring you the latest news around the NFL including Aaron Rodgers not having as much control with the Packers (10:24), Cam Newton being denied in a plane seat swap (15:26) and Carrie Underwood being sued for her Sunday Night Football song (21:10). The heroes break down Al Riveron's address at the NFL talent summit and the new rules being implemented (28:10) and then go through Gregg's division power rankings (44:30)Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the NFL podcast. Wants to know what the soup of the day is. Welcome, always tomato basil, always, to the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hanses. I'm joined in a room filled with some heroes. Chris Wessling to my left and Greg Rosenthal. To my right, what is up, boys?

Hey, Dan. Always, I mean, tomato basil here at the huddle. is what our commissary is called here of the NFL media campus Tomato Basil Damashek by the way still aggrieved over them

some suit in New York taking his name off the soup station here in L.A. David somehow lobbied this is years ago now to have it renamed the Dave Damashek Soup Station and it had a picture of Dave's head

and he was quite proud of it It was like hey fella I have some soup It actually yeah it had a little quote in it Yeah, a little bubble. I mean, it was right up Damashek alley. And then one day it was mysteriously gone, and, you know, Sheck goes knocking on doors.

She'll go up to the third floor, too. He's a big time, like, I'm knocking on doors, I'm talking to people. I want to find out what's going on. And he found out that one of the third floor shadow league figures deemed it inappropriate and removed it. I had a brief conversation with him. And he still holds it like five years later. I wish he was still here.

He was just behind the glass a few minutes ago. We could have brought him in. And he could have given us 10 minutes during a slow time of the year, just ranting about the end of the Dave Damashik soup kitchen. I got some good rants the other day from him after the talent summit. And I told him he should, when he writes his book, it should be called My List of Grievances is Long. It's been a great run with Shek and hopefully many years longer.

Welcome to the Monday edition of the Around the NFL podcast. It is our last week. before we go semi-dark. So we've in the past, we've done for the July 4th week, we've done a Best of show, which never really sat very well with us. We tried it. It turned out not to be really something we wanted to keep doing.

It's a voluminous history by now, so it's hard to get like 2013, 2014 into the mix. It's just a lot of work, too, and Erica was not interested in that either. So we just stayed away from that. It's like a sign of a podcast, phoning in a little looking for a little extra downloads although ultimately people don't want to listen to old podcasts like the best of yeah so what we did this year uh we will have a new show that will go up uh fourth of july week so we won't be dark next week uh so and it'll be one of our recurring once a year type shows will be fun to leave it at that uh with coline wolf the great connie fox joining us that's not the only special guest although connie is more family than a guest on the show at this point But a true special guest coming up on Wednesday's show, our next show of the week, M.J. Acosta, a fast riser here at NFL Network.

She's going to be sitting in for the whole show with the three of us. That's pretty exciting. Absolutely. MJ does a lot of Bay Area Raiders, Niners stuff, relatively new to the network. But we all got to talk to her a little bit at the media talent summit. And, you know, we liked her. And we said, let's get her in the mix. Please.

That's what we do. Especially this time of year, Wes. Oh, she's a natural, and like you said, fast riser, you better interview her now while you have a chance. Right, exactly. Coming up on today's show, speaking of the Talent Summit, we tease this on Friday's show,

which we got a lot of good feedback, by the way. Thank you to everybody that got back to us. They liked the poolside chats. Yeah. In Santa Monica with Jane Slater, of course, and Peter Schrager. Check that out on a Friday show. Shregbaum.

Shregbaum, Thursday show. think it was actually a lot of people took they took like some type of um interpiece or some type of what jane slater was trying to get across about how she lives her life people really connected with that i don't know i think jane could be could have a side business as like a motivational social media sort of speaker personality type of thing how about erika the girls night out that happened i believe that evening that included a lekeesha wessling and Colleen Wolf K. Adams.

Kay Adams. Tiffany Blackman. Tiffany Blackman. Erica Tampozy, nowhere to be found in any of the photos on social media. And then I saw, speaking of it, Grieved, a comment by you wondering where your invitation got lost

in that Girl's Night Out. Right. Yeah, that was a joke. Where are you at on that? I had to go to an improv show that I had tickets to. and then I was leaving for San Francisco because I was performing in a festival Oh yeah, let's talk about that

How was that by the way? It was awesome, right Greg? We had so much fun. Yeah, the other podcast that we do The Jessel Nick and Rosenthal Vanity Project was part of Cluster Fest which was this comedy festival And we did it in a pretty small room

Similar to the live shows that we have And as you guys know, those are a blast It was so much fun But the entire idea of the festival itself that it's like a music festival around comedy was really interesting and cool and a lot of it was outside in San Francisco, which was great.

I saw Courtney Barnett. Like the whole thing behind it, I just thought was delightful. Although you had to, you know, the tickets were a little pricey. This could be like the West by West West West. I mean, it can't be South by Southwest. It's in San Francisco.

Did Erica get to be on the stage or did you put her off? Oh, yeah. No, she played, I would say, a bigger role as Anthony's punching bag in this episode, than maybe any other. Maybe because we were on the stage. But, yeah, she was... Are you okay, right?

I was going to say large and in charge on this, but I know she would take offense to that. And we are going to air that one Tuesday. Oh, good. Nice. Check that out. All right. Let's get to it.

So, as I said, Talent Summit, we teased it on the Thursday show that we're going to talk about Al Riveron, the head of officiating for the NFL, did his annual what how would you call it the where we stand where we stand on the rules we're about to implement right and he and he goes through the process of explaining all the new rules and he has his whole a whole laptop filled with examples and trying to make it clear and a lot of the former players and current analysts go crazy it's always a fun scene we saved it for this show

because we wanted to dig into it. So that's coming up. Also, Greg wrote a banger. I mean, just because it's June 17th when this piece went up, doesn't mean Greg's not going to put the effort in. Put some effort in. Yeah, I would not call this a banger.

This doesn't have the hallmarks of a true Rosenthal banger. I have to be honest, just looking at it on paper. I like went out of my way to try to avoid doing this topic a week ago because it's like division power rankings. What are we really talking about here? Kind of fun, though. You wanted to put, yeah, people like it. People like talking about it.

It's fun talking about the division. You can hit all the team. So we'll hit that at the end of the show. You know, it's a dry time a year when this thing went up a week ago, and it really is meaningless when the first day it came up. And I noticed yesterday it was still in the stack. There you go. There just hasn't been anything to replace it.

Before that, though, let's do some news. What was she wearing today? I mean, when I left, she was in the bed. She was in the bed not wearing clothes when she left. So I didn't see her when she, you know what I'm saying? Oh, okay. And the other one, what was she seen blasting wearing? today?

The same way. She was in the bed too. They have clothes on. Oh, okay. Of course, Jets running back. Levy on Bell. The drama connected to the jewelry heist in his home.

The 911 call drops and it's picked up everywhere where it's confirmed that both of his girlfriends, plural, were nude in his bed when he left for a workout So there's no way to give any type of description to the coppers to go find the women.

Because you assume they put on clothes before they left with Greg. And I know it's personal to you, the Diamond Black Panther pendant as someone that has also had one stolen. Is that true? We talked about it on the show. I think that was a joke. Someone's own made about me. But I'm intrigued by this story, well, for many reasons. But there was some proof that this was a long-term polyamorous.

relationship that the two of them were on social media going out with him as long as like nine, ten months ago and that those were his girlfriends and like in and he was kind of advert you know like so this wasn't it which just adds another wrinkle to the story. I don't know what it means but that's well before the polyamorous part I was going to say I'm reading a book about the 1883 baseball season so like 140 years ago yeah and there are multiple players dealing with the same situation. Not the polyamorous part but you know all kinds of side pieces all kinds of side pieces and the drama involved with that and then you realize if not for wealthy traveling men like red light districts wouldn't even exist

they're the entire reason that red light districts exist um i wonder it's that's really eye-opening and frankly would be alarming to any athlete that's living a a rich fun-filled lifestyle right now which you don't you can't hate on these guys they're rich and young and and they have appetites in a number of fields including love. But the idea of the idea that a nine month con potentially was in place.

Yeah. That's a long one. Well, who knows when the idea came up or either way, but no one's really, it makes you feel like like was his heartbroken here because this was not a like, this was not just an overnight sensation. It's a betrayal. He had a whole setup. Total. Wes, you got out at the right time. It's hot out there in the streets. You can't trust nobody.

I don't think that's the circle I was running in. All right, let's get to it. Let's start in Green Bay. Something interesting, Mike Silver, our own Mike Silver of NFL.com wrote a piece. Matt LaFleur, the new coach of the Packers, implied that Aaron Rogers, who had complete control of the Packers' offense under Mike McCarthy, especially in later years, you could certainly argue too much control as Green Bay went south,

couple of seasons. Anyway, there are an implication that Rogers will not have complete control at the line of scrimmage like he did in the past. Here's a quote from LaFleur to Silver. We're running a system I first picked up while working with Kyle Shanahan in Houston a decade ago and we've never really had a quarterback who's had complete freedom to change plays at the line because that's not really the way the offense is set up. And by the way, Aaron Rogers asked about this. Rogers deemed it a conversation of progress and added, there aren't many people that can do at the line of scrimmage what I've done over the years. West, you're shaking your head. How do you see this all playing out? Well, I think by now we're reacting to the

reaction. This story is about a week old. And what I think has been lost because of the disconnect between Aaron Rogers and Mike McCarthy is that Aaron Rogers, to paraphrase Bill Pullian, And there are four stages of NFL quarterbacking. Stage one, you learn how to call a play. Stage two, you learn what the defense is doing to you. Stage three, you learn how to use your personnel to counteract what the defense is doing. Stage four, which only a few people get to, you learn all of the above and use that to manipulate defenses. Aaron Rogers was doing this seven or eight years ago.

Sure. He was already at that level. The game, remember the Matt Flynn game where he threw for 480 yards and 16 years? Yes. Seneca Wallace told Mike Silver years ago, Aaron Rogers called all the plays in that game. He called the plays for Matt Flynn's best game ever. Week 17 of the 2011.

Five seasons ago, Mike McCarthy said Aaron Rogers is doing more at the line of scrimmage than any quarterback in the NFL. Right. I mean, he called him coach-like in his ability to see what the defense is doing. So to me, for Aaron Rogers to say, do you really want to take away this one special thing I can do? It makes a lot of sense. It's counterproductive to take that out of his hands.

You can't take it away. On the other hand, this could be just, the healthy tension between him and LaFleur. If you read part of this article from Mike Silver, in addition to everything that's going on with this sort of slight struggle about who's going to have control at the line of scrimmage,

Aaron Rogers is very excited about this offense. Yep. And that was the takeaway for me, is he's excited. And he did note that there's a number of kind of line-of-scrimmage stuff still in the offense. It's not like he's taking that away.

It's figuring out the bounds. But it is extremely similar to the articles that were going on in Atlanta before Kyle Shanahan started talking with Matt Ryan that like they were kind of taking away a little bit of Matt Ryan's freedom and was that going to work and it had mixed results initially and then it turned into MVP Matt Ryan. And I think that Rogers is so smart that he's going to have a lot of response. I kind of can't buy. He's just going to have less.

And I think that was part of, you know, that was the problem from Mike McCarthy's view is that He lost total control that like, you know, three out of four plays that were happening were being changed. And maybe that was the right way to do it. Maybe it wasn't in McCarthy's, but it's almost certainly not the right way to do it in Shanahan's. The bigger conversation, I think, is Aaron Rogers, who we know, absolutely brilliant quarterback, but a prickly guy behind the scenes doesn't always see eye to eye with people and we'll let you know. Will he and Matt LaFleur, who's only four years older. 35, there's 39.

Is he going to respect the floor the way you need to respect the head coach and have that type of relationship? It doesn't mean you have to bow down to the head coach, but there has to be structure in place and will that be in place? It's a fair question. You have to allow yourself to be coached hard.

And I think that is one thing that has separated Tom Brady from a lot of quarterbacks. You've heard the stories. Bill Belichick is just as ruthless with Tom Brady and Tom Brady allows him to be that way. Look at the Packers have been super Super Bowl contenders for almost 30 years now.

And they have two Super Bowl titles with Brett Farvin, Aaron Rogers, who are two stallions under center. They're not, they're Mustangs. They have to be broken in a little bit and corralled a little bit. I think he'll have as much faith in LaFleur as possible for a good chunk of the season,

and then results will matter. Like this is one where you would, if you're a Packers fan, of course you want to see a fast start, but they would be especially great if you have a fast start and then he gets a little more confidence in what they're doing.

In other kind of head scratching off the field news. So we're trying to piece together in the Lev Bell girlfriend situation, maybe a long con, who knows what was going on, a lot of nudity involved. Well, let's spend now to the skies where Cam Newton was hopping on a plane, a 10-hour flight to Paris,

where he eventually would meet up with Russell Westbrook at various cafes and clubs and have a great time in France. So it all worked out. He got where you needed to be. But it was in the air, Greg, where he hit a speed bump. So he, first of all, Cam Newton, I don't know how much he's worth.

Maybe we could check Spot Rack, but it's hundreds of million, a hundred million bucks or something. He's a filthy rich man. He's had a tremendously successful career. Nice endorsements. It's got to be top endorsement guys in the NFL. I mean, he's got to, you know, you could see him potentially being in the top 20 money makers in the NFL if you made a list, maybe 10.

Anyway, he's sitting coach on a 10-hour flight to Paris. There's the first thing I'm trying to figure out about this story. part two of the story he approaches a man who's in the front seat of coach so you know the front where coach and first class separates that front row has the extra leg room because there's no seat in front of you and they put the TV screen on the wall and it's about maybe let's say two feet of extra space there and on balance it's a good spot to be uh you don't have the TV the way you want it to be right in front of you but you got the leg space and that's good especially 10 hours well cam he approaches the guy sitting

in that spot with the extra leg room and offers the man $1,500 to move back about three rows and sit in an aisle seat. And much to Camp's surprise, and this is all captured on video because, you know, it's 2019 and it was posted on Twitter and right now has over 4 million views. The man politely, it seems, we don't see the man in the photo. He's seated and Cam is standing over him. The man just declines. And Cam offers him $1,500.

cash to move back and the man declines Cam kind of shakes his head incredulous he's surprised and he goes back to his seat and that's how the story ends so some not bad PR for Cam but a little bit of you know

I don't think it's bad it's a tough spot for him that it was on video the interaction but he handled himself well he kind of shook his head like surprise but didn't give the guy attitude or anything what do you guys think about this? I would have guessed there is not one occasion that Cam Newton gets on a plane

without being in first class. Well, here's why. He missed his flight. He had business class. He missed the flight. Is this true? You have this? Yeah, they had that.

Oh, good. Do they say how tall the gentleman is who rebuffed the offer? You don't see that. But he missed his original flight where he had a business class seat. So he had to get there. He was clearly taking the next flight out.

There's no spaces in first class. And so he's just looking for the... He's got to get out of town. Economy extra legroom. Now, Russell Westbrook's waiting for him. I think if Camneu is shaking his head and walking back to his seat, he's cursing himself because there was strategy in the number.

You're in coach. You're in coach and you're thinking, all right, this guy's taking coach to Paris. He's not a huge high roller. But he's, you know, at least he paid for the extra leg room. Like what's a lot of money,

but not, you know, a crazy money? Because that would be nothing to move up to first class. That's way too low. You would have had to offer 15,000 or 10,000. or something like that. But for the extra leg room, I wonder if he's thinking,

oh, I should have offered four or I should have offered three. I guess he could have raised it at that moment, but felt like you're going to come in with one number. And he went too low. This guy wanted that leg room.

Or he wanted the power play of saying no to the rich athlete. It was like, I know you want this. I know you get everything you want in your life, but you're not getting my seat. And it's a weird hill. Or it happened so quickly. And I don't think it would happen

with me necessarily, but I could see it where you're so like confused and stunned in the moment, your initial reaction is just to say, like, no, because like what's happening? No, I don't know. Like, you feel like some sort of con is happening. Has it been confirmed that this man knew that it was Cam Newton? He's wearing sunglasses and a hat. We would know it's Cam Newton, but I don't know it. But certainly not everyone. It's a standard black fedora. He's dressed, you know, he's got a bandana tied around his neck like Bruce Springsteen on the Born in the USA tour. He's dressed in an extravagant

Cam Newton way, but not overly. No, he's almost like an old school Chris Wesleying flannel shirt. Oh, nice. But probably one that costs like $400. I would have taken, I would have taken the $15. But the smart move would have been a, he could have countered too. He could have countered with like five. Let me go the other way.

I mean, Cam would have done it, right? Let me go the other way, though, because now this is going to cut to our pride a little bit, but we're all just trying to make our way through this world. Money is a thing. What is the lowest amount that a Cam Newton would have offered you that you would have move the seat. Would you have moved for $100? Well, I... No. You know, I...

$100? No. 200? You wouldn't move for... Oh, yeah. No, because I know it's Cam Newton. Oh. Well, let's say you don't. Okay. No, take him out of it. Just a regular guy comes up to you. Yeah, it's a 10-hour flight. It's going to need to be way

more than 100. $500. No, it's going to need to be more than $5. I'm moving for 5 because it's an aisle seat. Right. You're not moving into a middle seat. I don't know if you guys have noticed, but my legs, not like, super long. you know, barely above, you know, like where I have a metal. Every seat's fine. It's like the one place on earth where it's an advantage to be small.

So, yeah, 500 sounds about right. I'd do it for free if it was a nice guy. To a middle seat? Maybe not to a middle seat. As a man who cuts a husky figure, the middle seat is not great. Right, I have changed seats, but not to a middle. Some guy wants an aisle really bad and he's huge. Let's close out of the news

with a little double shot of drama starting with Carrie Underwood. You all know Carrie Underwood, the country superstar who took over for Faith Hill a few years back is the voice of Sunday Night Football. A lot of anger around Sunday Night Football theme in this studio with this show, particularly with Mark,

but in general it's not a very popular song. Well, what if I told you that in addition to the Sunday Night Football song Game On that's been used the last couple of years, it might not be an original composition, Wes. What if I told you that? I would believe that. Well, there's a lawsuit.

There's a lawsuit that Carrie Underwood's been hit with, a woman named Heidi Merrill, who's had some success in her own right. She had a sports-themed song called Cornhusker Strong back in 2015. But she had a song called Game On, same title in 2016, posted it to YouTube in March of 2017, and three months later, four months later, the Cary version, which Cary presented

as an original version, debuted on NBC. Let's hear these two songs now, and I want you to tell me if Heidi Meryl has a case against Cary Underwood and Associates for stealing her original composition. Who do you want to hear first? Let's hear Cary first. All right, let's hear the Game On by Cary Underwood.

All right, now let's hear Heidi Meryl's version. Lord here should be sitting down, get up, get loud, and make your mama proud, game on. Game on Based on those two clips, I don't think it's that strong a case, personally. Open and shut. Also, open and shut case, they're definitely the same thing.

Also, Heidi Merrill, he left this really key point out, submitted this song to Carrie Underwood's agent, and then a few months later, Carrie Underwood had the new song game on. Well, that, yeah, that is, That's huge. Carrie.

Because it sometimes gets a little confusing. You know, a little confusing. You know, there's different tracks going around that different people will be on. Like, you'll hear, like. It's like a country rock with the words game on. Like a Cardi B song that was like originally, like, or like Enmigo song that was originally like a Jay-Z song. But then they decided not to use it. So things get like passed around sometimes.

But that's not the case here. I think she's got a good case. What happens? Does that mean that this carry version is done? Are they going to put it six feet under during litigation? Maybe we'll have a chance at a much, much better song for Sunday Night Football. Well, I wouldn't hold your breath. Whatever, even if this was replaced, the chances that, like, a banger drops.

I thought people kind of like this song. Really? I thought it was fine. I mean, it's a, it's kind of like a tough, it's a losing proposition. Here, write a song, or that's like about Sunday Night Football working in all these angles. That's what the money's for. It's a losing game before you start. Well, that's what the money's for.

You guys are forgetting about the Jonas brother wife. I hope you love it in my set to. But that was her original. See, I know that was her original song before they used it. So maybe that's the way to go. Maybe that's the way to go. Find something that's a little bit. That sort of works.

Yeah, it works. It's not so on the nose. Well, either way, we'll find out. We'll be tracking this case very closely. Finally in the news, Erica, let's bring you back in got some gossip i got a scoop here um not my original reporting so i don't want to pass it off as such it's it's aggregate reporting but someone in the newsroom connected to the charlotte uh gossip scene let me know uh that olivia culpa do you know that name of course i do

who is that miss universe um and also danny amandola's ex-girlfriend and danny amendola playoff amadola and olivia colpa their relationship ended on under less than ideal terms correct correct what happened um well there was some you know scuttles and cheating involved and danny and the worst part of it was danny wrote an incredibly embarrassing instagram post about it where he owned self-owned himself He cheated on his girlfriend and then in a panic move wrote a horrific social media post That's a good taste of men

When she was caught with like Zed From Coachella photos where surfacing He is a Swedish DJ Zed Zed dead baby All right so New York Post Runs an item in early May headline Christian McCaffrey Set sights on Olivia Colpo

After her messy NFL breakup And then just, I think in the past week, someone snapped a photo at the Charlotte airport of McCaffrey and Colbo together checking in. So guess what? It's game on for Christian McCaffrey and Coppah and Amadola is sucking wind. Yeah, wow. I did not hear this. That hurts, doesn't it? I didn't know she was like, it's like an executive going from one, you know,

organization to another, that suddenly she was available and different NFL players could just, like, apply by letting the New York Post know or just letting the public know and then it works? I think that's how it works. Yeah, they were spotted together at the TSA checkpoint line at Charlotte Airport. The Morning Toasters, which apparently some type of podcasts, one of the people from that show saw it and took the picture. So deal with that, Ricky.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, whatever. I mean, McCaffrey seems he's much younger. Maybe it's more age-appropriate, you know. Amadola's kind of, yeah, he's at the end of his career. McCaffrey's just a star in the rise. I'd be more interested. Not a bad move by Culpa. Yeah, I mean, that's great.

I'm just waiting for his next Instagram post to flip out. That'll be great. That's what's happening in the news. All right, so as we promised, let's get into it. Al Riveron speaks at the NFL Media Talent Summit, fireworks ensue. I'm going to start right. here guys just to get it going west i i don't think i owe you an apology because that's strong

but i will say that i am after it wasn't just this but this meeting kind of put me over the edge where it's now very clear to me that instant replay even if the intentions are good this is not heading toward a good place and um you you thought this you had this opinion from the beginning after the of course blown call in the nfc title game that which has led to this new rule of instant replay on pass interference. What I got out of this, and that's how we'll dig into this, is that there is going to be a lot of gray area

when it comes to officiating replay on pass interference. And I'm on Team Wes on this now. I don't know where you are, Greg, at this point. But I'll let you get it going, West, because I'm curious what your thoughts were, because it's not the only thing Al Riveron talked about, but it was the main course all building up to, where Riveron gave examples, various plays.

Tons of examples. Tons of examples. How it would have been handled. And he picked the hardest plays possible to his credit because, like, what that's the point, you know? And it was murky. And he would say, what would you do here? Half the crowd would say one thing.

Half the crowd would say the other. And it all felt like a terrifying look ahead to what's going to be an interesting season in the NFL. I like that you approached this the same way. Reveron did. He went through a lot of stuff. And then he said, okay, showtime. OPI and DPI and that way he knew that he was playing to the crowd at this point

this is what everybody came for so it starts out he says it has to be clear and obvious visual evidence you start with the premise that the ruling on the field is correct and the key phrase is significantly hinders does the defensive player significantly hinder the receiver and like you said when we saw all these examples on several of them half the crowd was like yeah that's past interference, that's not half the crowd was, you know, it was all over the map. One thing I saw was that it's almost impossible to overturn an OPI call on the field. If it's offensive pass interference and a defensive player touches him, it's going to stay

offensive, or if the offensive player touches him, it's going to stay OPI after the review it. The difficult part is going to be DPI, as we all knew. And as Riveron said at the end, this is one of the reasons why we like him, because he is a direct guy. There is no convolution when he speaks, and he usually comes around at the end and tells you how he really feels about it. And he said, we could be diving into things that maybe we shouldn't be diving into here. That was his last takeaway for the defense.

You know, it's only going to be here is what he said. It's a trial system, so we'll see. Well, I think that's, you know, he's speaking for a lot of officials. This rule isn't popular with officials, and ultimately he's an official because they think it's going to create. some issues and, you know, it puts them a little more in the spotlight where they matter less. You know, my takeaways from it, yes, he picked some hard ones and the room was split. There was only one call the whole time because I was keeping track that I was surprised by

where they said they wouldn't change it or that they would change it. And the rest, I was like, I get it. That was what I thought was going to happen. That is what happened. And I get it. He tried to emphasize, and this is what I hope they actually do. and I'm worried because in the past at this meeting, he's emphasized a similar point

and maybe not followed through. He tried to emphasize how often the call is going to stand, that the call on the field is going to stand most of the time, that it's going to be really hard to overturn it. Is it clear and obvious that it needs to be overturned? I think the one play that confused the most people in the crowd was the second to last play, I believe, of the Chargers, Chiefs game.

Big 15. Yeah, great touchdown catch by Mike Williams that would have been called pass interference for the offense and the defense at different points in the play. And Riveron stressed that once the play is reviewed, then everything that's reviewable can be reviewed, which is something I think we haven't thought a lot about. So not only can pass interference be reviewed, but anything else that's possibly reviewable from that play could be reviewed. and in that play, there was an offensive pass interference,

which apparently occurred before even the defensive one. And there's just, it's a lot that any aspect of the play can be reviewable, but I am hopeful that they're not going to overturn much, that mostly it's going to be calls that standing, even a couple times where he kind of made it clear that most likely that was pass interference, but since it wasn't called, then he'd stick with the call on the field or the reverse,

that most likely, even though that's probably not PI, but you can't really tell from the end. angles, that it's 100% dependent on the TV angles. That was a key point. There's no extra, they're not seeing anything extra that the viewers at home aren't seen, period. So if they don't have the right camera on it, because it's a 10 a.m. game between the Panthers and Dolphins and they only have so many cameras there,

like you're not getting it overturned, sorry. That play that you just talked about. So, yeah, Chiefs Chargers, Week 15, Chiefs ahead by 7, Chargers marching. This would blow people's minds. And Rich Eisen wrote about it. He filled in for Peter King on his football morning in America. Happy birthday to Rich.

I was in 50 years old. How about that? Happy birthday, Rich. Happy birthday to Emeka Rosenthal, too. How about that? My wife, I'm not going to mention her age, but, you know, what a day, shares it with Rich. Ageless. That's how I would describe your wife, if I'm allowed.

Is it appropriate? No, I love it. It's too late now. Anyway, so it was third and 10, right? And Mike Williams, the offensive player. Kendall Fuller on defense, like you said, I don't think the ball was actually caught. It was a DPI call that put the ball down at the one.

My bad, yeah. Now, yeah, he caught him. He was out of bounds. Because it's inside two minutes, this would be a play that Riveron said would get buzzed down to take a look at it because it's such a big play. And like Greg said,

what Riveron said was that there was not enough evidence to overturn the DPI. So that call would stand. But there was enough evidence to call OPI. So it would be called all the stadium be going nuts. announced this is two penalties offsetting and instead of it being first and goal from the one with

eight seconds to play it's third and goal from the 10 and that to me just it's convoluted it just seems messy to me and that's what gets me nervous about how this is going to impact the league in 2019 i found it interesting that Greg chose that example because that was the one replay where I said this makes perfect sense there was obvious offensive and defensive past experience i agree i think it would have been the right call but it was the one I think that the room was sort of like Dan is saying. Let's talk about the real confusing ones. Yeah.

There is a defender wearing, Kyle Rudolph is wearing a defender on his back. The defender slaps down on his wrist before the ball gets there. Rudolph catches it. But if he drops it, Riveron said that will not be past interference, even though the defender got there first. Because it obviously did not inhibit his ability to catch the ball. You're not allowed to slap the guy's wrist before the ball comes. Well, that was one where I think the angle was the key, where it seemed like. that but you never really saw no it was obvious that the defender hit his wrist before the ball got there

and then there's another one where i believe it's Evan ingram downfield and there's a slight push off from a linebacker like 30 yards down field and they he said the coaches want this to be called pass interference and everybody in the audience that was the one that was the one yeah see that was the one me and mike giardi were in the corner we were talking about that and we both said immediately that is clearly pass interference and and i know the audience everyone was saying like it's 30 yards down the field, but if you see someone, you know, making contact that far down the field, and it clearly moved the guy a little bit. When you're moving that fast, it seemed like about as obvious as it got to me.

Do you think if guy lost his balance more than more than we're already having this? I think we should all be in agreement, though, the biggest takeaway from that play was, what a beautiful ball by Eli. What a throw. Why, he could have thrown it out a little nicer. Dropped it right in the bucket. That's a slow down. Between the numbers.

So we're in the. We're in the weeds here. Wes and Greg just mouths agape watching Eli's throw on that. Yeah, and then Hail Mary, Riveron hit Hail Mary. That was the one thing I really didn't like. Right, and maybe you'll have a different thing. But I was just, it made sense to me logically, but there's no, since there's no official rule like what constitutes a Hail Mary, it's hard to say how the rules will be, at what point do the rules get relaxed and you let them play, let the boys play.

and even if it's a little more pushing and shoving, because it's not like anything outside the 45-yard lines, a Hail Mary. So it's all a judgment by the officials and the people upstairs, and that leads to more, you know, it's just indecisive. You don't know what the call is because you don't know what official is going to decide what a Hail Mary is. Riveron said it will not be defined, and in very judged Potter-Stewart-style on obscenity,

says we all know what it is when we see it. Well, that was one of the things that I thought will be changed with this rule. So it's a one-year rule. And I think something unforeseen is going to happen with Hail Marys in general, that they will have to define it, that it will change in future years. Because River, the most interesting thing I think he said was about the Hail Marys. And he sort of said it without saying it, which is essentially, they're not calling PIs on Hill. That's what it seemed like.

So they're not, he didn't say that to be clear. but he said it's going to be officiated the same way that it's been officiated the last 20 years and i think there's been like one pass interference called on a PI so he was essentially saying there's going to be pushing and shoving and jumping and they're just not going to call it and they're not going to really review it either unless it's like crazy where someone you know where you're just jacking a guy but it's it's like it has an unofficial uh separate set of rules and that just made me think well they're going to have to actually make a separate set of rules If you're a smart play caller or a smart quarterback

and you're, let's say, at the 35-yard line with 11 seconds left in the half, aren't you throwing it twice for the end zone now? Or I'm taking... I always thought they should do that more anyways, but yes. But it's like from the 35, is that a Hail Mary? Should you take back-to-back delay of game penalties to make sure you're in the Hail Mary zone?

That's why I chose the 35, it's in that gray area. One rule that is not connected to this. Did anybody else have anything else on the one of because he did go through the other rule changes? There is one rule change that's way on my radar because I have talked about this time and time again. It's why I didn't like the extra point getting moved back because there's enough pressure and kickers decide enough in the NFL that you don't need to add more. But this rule, now say you score a touchdown, okay, and your wide receiver, you're running back or whomever gets a little crazy, maybe uses the ball and pretends a toilet paper and wipes his butt and throws it into the crowd. He gets called for unsportsmanlike conduct. It happens a lot after touchdowns.

Now, the new rule, it used to be that 15-yard penalty gets enforced on the ensuing kickoff. Now the opposing coach will have the option to take that 15-yard penalty and tack it on to the PAT, which will lead to a 48-yard P-A-T attempt on any penalty for unsportsman-like conduct or a personal foul of any kind. Guess what? I'm calling it right here. Mark it down. That will decide a game this year. I hope so.

Somebody yank in a 48-yarder on what should be an 18-yard kick. Well, I'm torn here because on one hand, usually you don't really like these unsportsmen. Like, a lot of them are tic-y-tack and, but they had no consequence, just like an extra point, which is what you want. You want the extra point to not actually happen, to not be a play. I don't like that. No, it's a play.

I like the 48-yard extra point. There's mechanics to even the, we're not going to go down this road, but, you know, it's just like why we keep on making it harder and putting more heat on the kicker? You live the kicker out of this. Because, yeah, the old penalty didn't matter because you got to touch back like he would have gotten anyways.

And anything that adds a little spice to the after. At the kicker's expense, always. I'm totally, I want to get rid of the extra point. I think it will happen eventually. Let's just kill it. Two final thoughts on Riveron. One, when he's dealing with the players, he's the master of the chide.

He will gently chide the player before he makes a point. Even Steve Smith, which is really playing with danger. Steve Smith, he would say and, like, we're off topic here, but I'll address your point. You've got to make sure he tells him he's off topic. DeAngelo Hall, knee, knee, knee, knee, running your mouth just like you did on the field. He did.

Michael Irvin, he's like, Erf, we thought you were sleeping over there. You know, he's got that child. Herb, by the way, wearing a bedazzled Dallas Cowboys hat in public 20 years after he retired. The other thing, you know, we're, I don't think we're exactly houseboys or shields for the NFL. People can accuse us of that because we work for the shield. And, I mean, that goes along with it. But Wes is wearing a pullover right now with an NFL shield over his heart. But go on, Wes.

But these meetings are helpful to see how passionate a person like Jeff Miller, whose health and safety, is about reducing concussions and how passionate Riveron is about setting an example for high school kids and lower kids when it comes to safety. And some of the points that he emphasized, Riveron, we can no longer ignore the stats and the data. We're better for it now, some of the safety rules that we had in the past. we've got to stay ahead of the times this must be coached differently we have to coach this behavior

out of the players it's our responsibility to ensure this trickles down to high school that's our job we've got to change the culture and I think you know a lot of people see the NFL is this giant monolith printing money and really not caring about the players but the people inside there a lot of them do care and they're very passionate about it so I just wanted to say that

well put and I think we're ever on who you know we've come out of these and been singing his praises and maybe the shine as, you know, wore off for some of us during last season when people were upset with Riveron for how he was handling his job. To me, on some level, it's almost like,

it's almost like the presidency. I mean, you can have, you know, I don't want to get too political here, but it's like you can have a president. No one's going to be happy with him no matter what. Like there couldn't be a president at this point that is going to have, like Obama had so many people that you're going to be upset with the head of officiating,

no matter what he does. also on some level what i mean it's like commissioner i haven't going to be satisfied with him either i have it in my notes from that week al riveron has an impossible job he because not only is it always going to be it's bipartisan uh it's always going to be fighting on both sides of the aisles so it's not yeah it's not it's never going to be a situation like everyone agrees that they don't like officials i know maybe yeah maybe in that sense you're right but like the idea of he's just here to enforce the rules that the league's putting into uh place he's not the one the push this through legislation.

Like he's trying his best, and he's, it looked like he was going to be the fall guy after the NFC title game. He survived that. You wonder if, if this goes sideways, the OPI, DPI replay stuff, if he becomes a sacrificial lamb because of it. He's just kind of in a tough spot. And I came out of it, yeah, I'm not as giddy about him now three years in, you know, watching these presentations.

But I also respect the guy and I understand what he's up against, is it's a reason why Dino Blanino took the paycheck and went to Fox to be on TV because this is kind of, you know, it's like a job that will aid you like it does. Right. That was why I wrote down. He was kind of like Obama. He was a couple years into the presidency right now, Riveron. Very charismatic.

Can handle the room. Maybe not, you know, as effective pushing that legislation through. But we can't do better than Al. Be careful what you wish for. I think where you and I, Greg, differ on replay, is. Riveron says the OPI or the DPI role, this is meant to pick up on the big miss. And you sort of believe that that's all it's going to be.

It's going to correct the big risk. They don't have some problems. And I have no belief whatsoever that the officials will be disciplined enough and the coaches will be disciplined enough to leave this to the big miss. It's going to be minor picky plays. All right. Good talk, guys. Can't wait until next year.

Hopefully, Al's there. Finally, Greg wrote a banger. Here's the headline. Greg wrote a banger, Ricky. Ladies and gentlemen, may I have your attention, please? NFL division power rankings, colon NFC North, stands above the rest. He ranks him. Greg, every division.

You got it. One through eight. Game over. Not a banger. NFC North. I think has the best division because it has the most teams that I could see in the Super Bowl

with a good last place team too. So there's kind of two different categories here. But I could see the Lions, the Bears, or the Vikings. I mean the Lions, the Packers, the Bears are the Vikings. I could see any one of those in Miami, us covering them in the Super Bowl. I think it's possible.

The Packers, the Vikings, or the Bears. Those are those caliber of teams. It wouldn't shock me. Number one with a bullet. And then you look at the Lions as the fourth team. That's a nice little last place team that you got, you know, in terms of talent.

Who knows if they'll actually come in last. But I think compared to some other fourth place teams, they've got Stafford, they've got some players. You put that all in one mix. I feel safe that that's the best one. That's one way of looking at it. I look at it like the Lions are going to be a better team this year. They have done a good job of kind of filling some holes that they needed to fill.

And it won't make any difference. What a tough job Matt Patricia has turning this team around in this division. You have the AFC North at number two. Was it close? Gregor is a pretty clear cut to you. I don't think it was close enough because I don't think much separates any of these divisions.

Like, it's the NFL. Like, there's just not that big of a difference, but they're similar to the NFC North in that the Ravens Steelers and Browns, I consider them contenders. It'd be a little more surprising to see the Ravens or Browns in a Super Bowl, but like the NFC North.

There's just no easy games. I kind of favored them that way. Instead of having like one or two super teams, I like the divisions where I don't see any, easy games. I think the Bengals are going to be pretty tough and I definitely think the Brown Steelers and Ravens are going to be tough. I would probably put the AFC North number one because I think that's fine. It's hard for even it to make a case for the Lions as a playoff team but with AFC North

would any of those four teams surprise you if they were playing? The difference for me is the I think the Steelers are you know who knows at this point but I would be surprised to see the Ravens or Browns in the Super Bowl and so the Steelers to me are more they're a championship contender but those others are a little more underdogs where I thought the NFC North had more powerhouses. But who the heck knows? Why? Because you think the Browns are going to be in the Super Bowl? I think the Browns are clearly a better roster than the Steelers.

Maybe. But I guess... Super Bowl, though? That would be surprised. I guess so. Maybe there's something about it that I just got to see it. Maybe that's my lack of vision. I got to see it from the Steelers.

All right. At number three, you have the NFC South, the Saints, Falcons, Panthers, and Bucks. Similar setup here. I would think that you have three playoff contenders and people. including a true powerhouse in the Saints. And then the Bucks, you know, if you squint hard enough, you can see the Bucks as a frisky team. I think so.

I think it's still the best division of quarterbacks. Although, you know, maybe the NFC North could challenge them. Or the NFC North could challenge them. It's the best division of quarterbacks. You got two MVPs and Drew Brees. And just looking at the division, though, it made me realize Dan Quinn and Rivera might be having kind of a faceoff where only one survives.

Because I think if either one of those teams misses the playoffs, maybe all three, maybe the Saints, Falcons, and Panthers make it like they did two years ago. But if only one of those teams makes the playoffs, I think that could be a coaching change. If Bruce Ariens unlocks James Winston, which is, you know, a big if, this division is going to be wild. I love those games, as you know, year after year.

Also, a good food division, Atlanta, New Orleans. Remember our Bruce Ariens conversation about how plugged in he is? on this go round he's not even coaching winston it's all left which i don't i don't buy it he's not even in the room i love this it is very funny to see west's heel turn on arians now that he's i'm just being realistic i don't know if dan i think dan might have missed this episode but that is is now that arians is with winston suddenly he's out to lunch he doesn't care about it he doesn't care about his job he's retired he's just if you can't do it in 11 hours you got no business on it he's Phil Jackson and with the New York Knicks right now.

Absolutely. Just because he's with Winston, please. If he was in Marriota. Right. You would love him. That's a great way to put that, Greg, except for the very obvious point that the man retired because he had enough of football. Well, he had some health issues, though.

He also said, I'm done. I'm checking out. I'm done. But you have to be honest. And I'm only coming back for the Browns. West, be honest. I'm only coming back for the Browns. If Ariens goes to Tennessee, you're singing praises.

No. You're saying this is the year, Marcus, Not built on James Winston. This is built on this guy retiring because he had enough of football. Now he comes back and it's all on Byron Leftwich, not Bruce Ariens. Take us, Greg, take us through the Tampa Cuisine, like the top food options. That's where I realized that I said it was the best food broke down a little because what do I really know about Tampa strip club cuisine or Charlotte for that matter? Although you hear a pretty good thing.

Great food courts in Charlotte. Good barbecue. They got a great TGI Fridays at the airport. Charlotte. NFC West at number four. Wow. You know, right to the middle of pack, Greg, Rams, Seahawks. But I guess it's a front-loaded division.

Well, I think the 49ers have a good roster. So that could be a team with, that could be a division with three pretty interesting team. You have like one of the safest teams, I think, in the Rams. This was the only pick that I totally disagree with. I thought the NFC West was way too high on this list. Hmm. Well, the Rams have won 24 games over the last two years. That's one team.

They're about as safe. The Seahawks have been the best team of the decade. Borderline playoff right now. And they made the playoffs last year. And then the 49ers, I think they've got some boom potential. They've been terrible ever since Kyle Shanahan's been there. Can we at least let them do something before we crown them? That's all I'm saying.

You've got them as a team that has a ceiling of 12 wins in your article. Sure. Well, you just said the Browns wouldn't surprise you if they're in the Super Bowl. Well, the Brown's roster is way better. I think 49ers' defense is pretty good. And then Kyle Shanahan on paper. I'm definitely tired of the Niners being positioned as a... Yes.

Well, no one's doing it this year. Until the quarterback does something, you know. All right, here we go. Number five, now the back end of the list. AFC South, Texans, Colts, Titans, Jaguars. And they've made progress. You know, if I had to pick a riser and I'm, you know, I'm not a big Titans fans and we'll see about Nick Foles and the Jaguars if they could turn it back around.

But if I had to pick a division that could shoot up these rankings a year from now, Greg, I might just north AFC South. I think my initial rankings had them lower, and I just thought you should give this division a little more respect now. Even if they don't, they have the Colts, and then you're not totally sure what's going to happen, but that's part of the fun. I think they'll be very watchable,

and it used to be a division that's not too watch. Wes, another shot across the Joe Flacco slash Chris Wessling Bow, AFC West. Ooh, number six. AFC West, definitely a stronger division than NFC West. Ouch, Greg, did you put the right research in? Or do you think that Wes is just wrong? Well, Wes is just looking at last year's rankings, you know, last year's records.

I'm looking at all the data available, Greg. You guys should have done a two-hander on this. It would have been a lot of fun. Like, hey, do the free agents. I don't really care that much. Oh, okay. Number seven, the NFC East. More like the NFC Least.

Well, this is why, like, is there really that big of a difference between the NFC East, the 7th Division, and the AFC North or? whatever, who's second. There's really not. It's the NFL. This has two really good teams. It's just that not many divisions have two teams in it, and that's why I put the AFC West lower.

Two teams in it where I'd be surprised to see them make the playoffs. AFC East. That too, but I was saying AFC West. Broncos Raiders, I'd be surprised if they make either one of them make the playoffs. Redskins Giants, I'd be surprised if either one of them makes the playoffs. So if you got two of those teams, you're sorry? No, 49ers are, like, in a different tier than the Broncos? I do. I think they have a much higher upside.

And finally, bringing up the rear of the AFC East, and what can you say? I mean, listen, he was a Jets fan that has a lot of optimism at the season. Things can go sideways in a hurry in New York. It's happened many times before. Buffalo, people can get excited about the kid quarterback Josh Allen. The defense made some noise last year, but what are we going to do? The dolphins are the dolphins. And, you know, I'm sure you put this, you took this into consideration too, Greg.

The Patriots are heading towards a decline. this could be one of the worst divisions that we remember. Well, it's not going to be much worse than it was two years ago or even last year, even if the Patriots took a step back. I mean, they could be good. I think like the AFC East, when they play out a division, wouldn't surprise me if these teams figure out how to have a winning record. They're a little more feisty than they've been in the past,

but it's kind of just to my point that there's not a huge difference. The difference is... Come on, that had to have been one the easiest picks you have was putting AFC. That's true, because it only had one team that you could see. in the Super Bowl and most almost basically every other division you could see at least two all right but that's why we play those games no one saw the 99

Rams in the Super Bowl you know no one saw the 01 Patriots in the Super Bowl fair enough pull up history lessons with Greg Rosenthal check it out NFL dot com Rosenthal Simply the best Energy NFL division

power rankings NFC North good morning stands above the rest All right. That's it. Good stuff, guys. We'll be back Wednesday.

We got, like I said, M.J. Acosta will be joining us. We'll have some fun talking about the NFL in late June. Pinch yourself, Greg. Are we going to post it Wednesday night? Or is that a Thursday drop? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know. Maybe Thursday.

So if it doesn't land on Wednesday, just know when you wake up on Thursday, it will be there. Don't worry about it. Erica's got you covered. Right, Ricky? That's right. Won't let you down. All right. Let's get out of here.

This is Dan Hansa signing off for the mailman, the old boss, Ricky Hollywood, behind the glass. Till Thursday. This is an eye heart podcast.