NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Eagles-Browns winners and losers

Episode Date: April 21, 2016

A room filled with heroes - Gregg Rosenthal, Marc Sessler, Colleen Wolfe and Lindsay Rhodes break down the second big trade from the 2016 NFL Draft as the Eagles acquired the No. 2 pick from the Browns and share the winners and losers from this blockbuster trade. Then, the heroes discuss the other huge news, as the Carolina Panthers rescinded the franchise tag from Josh Norman and wrap the show predicting potential landing spots for the Pro-Bowl cornerback.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. I am not Dan Hanses. I'm Colleen Wolf and I am joined by a room filled with heroes. Mark Sessler, Greg Rosenthal, and get ready for it, Lindsay Rhodes. We're together. We did it. We are like breaking down barriers here. Wow. Unprecedented.

I know. I mean, like first we find out that Harriet Tubman is going on the $20 bill. Now there are two females on one sports show at NFL. I mean, this is crazy. That's kind of like 1A and 1B, right? Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Tubman is 1B. Right.

I mean, Tubman. Silence. Potato potato. Let's be honest. I mean, the Tubman news is big, but she's been past her prime for a little while. You guys are on the way up. I'm kidding. Of course.

This is a big, big day. Well, you guys were legitimately excited. You said that you ran into Lindsay in the hallway this morning. You guys were just. I was running out to do a segment and I hear, hey, from the other end of the hallway. And we just like started like yelling. Like, woo, big day. This is crazy.

Meanwhile, Dan and Wes feeling a massive tremor in the force. Well, yeah, this could stick. We should say Dan and Chris Wesleyan aren't here today, and they have been traded to the Move the Sticks podcast. Wow. DJ has. Dan's not going to be happy about that. Which is a one person show, so not good news for them.

Who gave up the most in that trade, though? We like what we got. All right. I mean, this is your takeover. I mean, you push them out the door. DJ's got a lot of. pulling the company now so he took them away i think we're i think everyone's happy in this i like the move i think it works out well for the podcast but j is especially excited about the draft

prep that dan and west have done leading up to the 2016 research they've done and sessler i've noticed that you have a new shirt too yeah only in our group good would the fact because our clothing line in general is so mundane dating back years that when one of us buys a new shirt it is legit headline news. It's a simple, like, low-level flannel shirt that I purchased, and it's been discussed all morning. I don't know how. I wouldn't say it's low-level. Do you honestly know that that was new or did he bring that up? I pointed it out. I was informed. Greg knows, though. I had a sort of close to the situation. Well, Dan's really trained me to look at things this way, but he's broken down. Mark only has four shirts. Now five. When he adds

a new one. And if he's on, if he's on camera, like NFL now this morning, he only has really one or two shirts. So that's why it really stands. Well, we've been on NFL Network probably, I don't know, 10 times, whatever it is. If anyone wanted to really waste their time and look back at all those segments, I've worn the same exact clothing every single time. Have you, however, worn high socks? Oh.

Oh, I mean, Greg has really cool shoes on right now, but he's also paired them with black high socks and jeans. Well, Lindsay is referring to the fact that I was on Total Access last Friday. This slipped under the radar. It's late Friday afternoon. And the segment ended with Dan Helly making fun of that I wore ankle socks. My pants like rising up on television. See, I went on the previous Friday, and I went out and bought black socks that go up there.

I should go buy them. Really? I'm going to buy them. In my mind, I'm thinking it's the see-through glass table. You can actually see my feet, which is bad. That's good planning, though. too. I mean, Greg learned a valuable list. I did. The camera literally pointed it, point it, point it down after you pointed it out. But by then I had

corrected things. We were cool. All right. All right. So, um, it's a big day also after the show because the NFL softball league. There's two teams in NFL media softball teams. Dan and, uh, Wes are both on the team. And so is, uh, the Irishman as well. And I am playing my first game. I haven't played since Little League. So, you played Little League? I did. You didn't?

No? Like Little League baseball. Yeah. I think that's awesome. You didn't play? I didn't. I mean, I was awful, but yes. Yeah, I did.

I played on a couple teams, did the whole thing. Really? Until like eighth grade. It was the same time of year as tennis, which I was better at. Oh. At once you got to high school. About eight minutes into the season, I was like, oh, this is definitely not my sport, but it was like, you got to, my dad was, you got to play through.

Yeah. It was crazy how you're like. like travel around to different cities. It just seemed like so much work. It was fun. It was fun. It like dominated your life. We just learned so much about Greg as a child.

Different cities. Were you on a travel team? Yeah. You had the regular team and then you have like a travel team. Oh, so you were good then. But I was, I was good enough to make the travel team, but not, not be a standout on that team. That was a sneaky humble brag. You just kind of backed in that you were like a top level little performer.

Whoa. I don't know why you didn't sign up. Why aren't you playing? signing all the autographs at the grocery store, you guys. Yes, so I went home this weekend to Philadelphia. I brought back my glove. So I'm going to see, I guess, what, it's like 17 years later, how I fare today in the game.

And Brandon, are you going to come early? I asked a couple people to come early and, like, maybe have a catch with me because I don't even know if I can catch the ball anymore. Has your hand not grown since you were? Probably not. Do you see? No. Wow.

I mean, I don't think so. That is weird, though, I guess. You might want to think of it. Yeah, but I heard last week, like, Chris Wessling had 10 RBIs in the game, and I think Dan Hansis had a home run. And I didn't realize that this was going to be, like, an actually legit team. So I'm a little nervous about that. Those guys are good.

All right. It's all up to you, the Irishman. You got to help me before, okay? I like that you're nervous about that, not nervous at all about hosting this show full of big news. No, I know, you right. You got dropped a big one today. Well, you know what? Let's get to it.

Let's get to that news. Click that for your Emmy Reel. What? I love it. I love it every time. All right. So, wow, this was crazy yesterday. The Eagles trade up with the Browns to get the number two overall pick.

So the swap, it sends Cleveland's number two and a 2017 fourth rounder to the Eagles in exchange for five picks, Philly's first, third, and fourth this year, along with next year's first rounder, and a second rounder in. 2018. Seems like a lot to give up. And I guess they are in love with these two quarterbacks, but they're basically getting the leftover, whatever the Rams don't want. So your take on this. Well, I think we should start with Mark Sessler here. He's a Cleveland Browns fan. And of course, we're going to talk about the Browns a lot this month. But I was taken that when this happened, you were disappointed. I was surprised about that because I think

generally Browns fans like this seems like a smart move. And if you're being honest, just, you know, fully honest, you were annoyed that they're passing on quarterbacks again. Well, initially. Absolutely. Absolutely. That was the emotional reaction. And I had the same exact reaction on the other side. That actually helped me because we went and met with Colleen for a now segment after and she's an Eagles fan.

And she was like bitterly disappointed. And I was like, well, wait, maybe I need to think about this differently. But the emotional side is that, you know, as I was talking to one of our producers before the show, that they haven't had a friend. The producer was born in 1987. they haven't had a franchise quarterback probably since that time. Wow. And it's been decades where you're watching every other team pick, grow, and succeed with franchise

quarterbacks. You live through Manning, Brady, all these other people. And so part of me was like, wait, it's actually hard to get to number two in the draft. Not for Cleveland. Well, but they've actually, you're right in theory, but they've been there at like six or seven. And usually those quarterbacks are gone by then. And I kind of thought that Wence just fit AFC North football. And part of me just kind of fell for the idea of that.

But on the flip side, Mayak loved him, DJ loves him. And there's a reason to it. I think he's going to be good. I think even Hugh Jackson said he's going to be a good quarterback. But a day later, when the emotions kind of go away a bit, I could see that Cleveland, A, I didn't want them to get fleeced. I don't think they got fleeced at all.

And they're very much, we had no explanation for what Cleveland was doing or why. After Sashi Brown spoke today, I think it adds a lot more context They're very much committed to building through the draft, and they mean it. And the fact that Hugh Jackson spoke later, Michael Silver said last night that Hugh Jackson was thrilled with the trade. My concern, have you followed this team at all, is infighting. And the GM and the coach, not agreeing and breaking everything apart. It seems to be the opposite this time around. So if they're all on board, these guys study these players.

I think any Browns fan should at least give this time and be on board with it, too. Yeah, so many thoughts on this. You, from a Brown standpoint, I think I love the move for Cleveland because it looks like Cleveland has a plan in place. Yeah. And that they're not just going to be reactionary and pick a guy that doesn't make any sense on their roster, but they think will placate the fans temporarily, but won't necessarily lead to long-term success.

So I like the fact that they're essentially admitting without admitting, we are not going to be good for a couple of years. This is going to be a rebuilding project. be patient. If anyone can afford to be patient, it's you, Cleveland, you've waited this long. So we're offering you a light at the end of the tunnel. We've got a plan to get there. Just let us do this and roll with us. And I think it makes sense to bring in all of the other pieces around the quarterback position. Daniel Jeremiah said something yesterday that totally made sense to me as far as copying the Seahawks model and getting all of the other pieces in place

through the draft largely, which requires picking the right players also, not just having the fix. But then once you're ready to compete, then plopping in a low price draft pick quarterback, and now you're ready to make the most out of those five years that you have that quarterback at a low price. It could be competitive in that time frame. Well, the Rams have shown it's easier to build up the rest of the team. That part's not that hard. It's been hard for the Browns to be consistent getting to seven wins, but it's not that hard to win seven or eight games in the NFL.

It's hard to win titles and win playoff games often, and you need great quarterbacks for that. And that sounds great that Seattle, you know, they built up the rest of the team. That's true. But they also just, they tried to get Charlie Whitehurst and spent a lot of capital on him and then Matt Flynn. And then they take a couple players in front of Russell Wilson

in that draft and they get him late in the third round. And he turned into Russell Wilson. It all comes down to you just have to find that quarterback. So they can say all this about this is the plan and patience. Browns fans have had a lot. lot of patience. They've had to be forced to have a lot of patience over the years. They're going to have to watch Josh McCown and Robert Griffin the third this year unless they take a rookie quarterback. And I don't think that's a bad idea at all. Maybe not

with the number eight pick, but I wouldn't be surprised if they take someone in the second round this year. Not at all. Not at all. And keep trying. Keep trying someone every year. That's what I liked about Seattle's method is that, okay, Whitehurst didn't work. It's not like they were quarterback geniuses in terms of figuring out what's going to happen. I mean, they They gave up a lot to get Charlie Whitehurst. They paid Matt Flynn a lot, but at least they tried to get someone every year. So the Browns need to do that. It would be a little depressing to just watch RG3 and McCown this year.

I agree, but the Seattle reference is pointed for another reason, too, is that Carol and Schneider are married hand in hand. They work together well. That is what has actually been missing in Cleveland for probably about 10 years. I mean, some of the GM meltdowns that people will even forget about because it's five or six GMs ago are epic. A book is going to be released at some point with the background story of all that. If this is one where they are actually all on the same page, that's what's different.

You're going to hate read it? I'm going to love to read it if they're, you know, that would be fascinating. It's interesting. Gilbrand tweeted this out that the Browns have traded out of the top 10 and four of the last six drafts and the players taken. We all know Julio Jones. We talk about that one. Julio Jones, Matt Khalil, and Sammy Watkins.

So I don't know if that means that Carson Wentz is actually going to be like some amazing quarterback, and this is going to work out for the Eagles. But my first reaction was, oh, my God, they gave up so much to get that quarterback. And if he doesn't hit, I mean, obviously how he is out of there, if that happens. I mean, if he does, yes, he saved his job and he came back from the dead. But it's like, the draft is about gambling, really. And you don't know if you're going to hit on any of these players. So I have the idea that it's better to have more picks than that.

not and better and higher picks too so you can try and hit on some of these guys so it's just the pressure is going to be on whoever comes in here obviously i think it's going to be whence um i say here like philadelphia god i can't believe i just did that but whoever goes into philadelphia i know i know wait now i'm like starting to get hot and like red okay um but i just feel like this whoever comes in they're going to be under so much pressure in philadelphia as you guys no doesn't really deal well with an athlete that comes in. Totally disengaged fan base. Yeah, right. Whoever, whoever they take at any position is going to be under a ton of pressure there in Philadelphia, whoever their quarterback is going to be under a ton of pressure in Philadelphia.

And if you, I think the one thing we learn from this is that maybe Howie Roseman thinks that he likes Sam Bradford, but he doesn't think Sam Bradford is the guy that's going to get him to the Super Bowl. Otherwise, you don't make this move. So if you think that one of these two guys has the potential to be that guy that's going to be your long-term Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Philip Rivers, even, or like an Andrew Luckman guy in Indianapolis, then that's the only way that you're ultimately going to get where you want to go anyway. So that's, well, let's get into the winners and losers of this. It was Connor or, right? That's right. Wrote, uh, wrote the article. Um, you guys can check it out right now. And one of the, one of the losers I thought in this was Sam Bradford and is Sam Bradford

because they just paid him this money. I don't know why. It just doesn't make sense that they paid him this money. And then now they're moving up in the draft. It almost feels like a panic move by them to have paid him. And I wouldn't be surprised, and I know it seems crazy, if they cut him. I know they'll have to eat the money, but they have the cap room. So it doesn't really matter.

I would be surprised. There's reports, you know, behind the scenes that he's not happy about this. And he's going to show them. Why would he be? best quarterback, which is great. Let's see some fire out of you, San Bradford. I mean, that's a good situation if he gets angry and starts playing better. I don't think it was a panic move because they made the signing in February when you're

looking at the whole situation. They're at the number 13 pick then. You think of what they gave up to move up. They had to trade with the dolphins, Maxwell. And Kiko Alonzo. To get up to eight and then you move up to two. And this is a team that I think they lost their second round pick with DeMarco Murray.

They expect to be in the playoffs every year. I think they expect to be competitive this year. And from everything we've heard in terms of Howie Roseman, they never viewed San Bradford as that great an option. But what they did was they said San Bradford is better than the situation Cleveland's. And we're not going back to 3 and 13. We need to be competitive every year while we're figuring this out. And the stop gap rate right now for starting quarterbacks,

league average is like $18 million a year. So they raised that bar that that's now the price. for just a mediocre 18th best starter in the league. But the 18th best starter in the league, if it's Sam Bradford, is so much more valuable, I think, than Josh McCown and Robert Griffin III.

People say, what's the difference? You still don't really have a quarterback. It's like, no, those two guys might be terrible. And Bradford, I think, in the right situation, he might be okay.

I think they have a good defense. You got Chase Daniel also there. They didn't know that they were going to get Chase Daniel for sure. The smile is creeping on your face. I'm just to say that. They are losers in this situation. I agree with that because Sam Bradford's probably won and done in Philadelphia unless he plays outstanding. But oh, by the way, like, if he plays great, then they have a trade chip next year.

They do. And I would say that Roseman is a winner because, yes, you're right. If the whole thing burns, Roseman's going to be looking for work. But Roseman a year ago was essentially a vanished ghost. And he was just someone hidden away in the dark corner of the Eagles building. I think he went overseas. I think he left the country. Had he, we wouldn't have even noticed because he seemed to have no.

part in Chip Kelly's program at all. Based on his press conference, I think he was working on his stand-up routine. Oh, my God. Well, he has some more work to do. Around the little, around the clubs in Philadelphia, just some good one-liners. Well, did you guys hear the way that he was describing Carson Wentz and Jared Golf? Oh, yeah. It's like vanilla or chocolate, Rube, you know?

It's like pepperoni pizza or sausage, you know. What do you like better? I like vanilla and chocolate. No, wait. That's real. And Lindsay's right. That was ultra creepy. I've only seen it like the video of him talking and that's weird enough.

But just the sound of it like, do you like pepperoni? Ew. It sounds weird. And what you didn't hear is the follow-up question. What flavor is Sam Bradford? That went unanswered. And most people definitely have an opinion between vanilla and chocolate. So I don't think his point was even that relevant.

I mean, that said, though, we got to keep that, by the way, for a sound drop. Here's why Roseman, if you want confidence as an Eagles fan that they are evaluating quarterbacks correctly or there's a chance of that, that they don't think that Bradford is the long-term answer, that they felt like, you know what, we are still one of those teams that doesn't have the Rivers, the Troy Aikman of Old, the Tom Brady, and we have to go find that guy. And if they believe in Wentz and it hits, Roseman is a winner because he will be looked back upon when this organization in the aftermath of Chip Kelly and how embarrassing in the

way that ended as a complete savior, no matter how nerdy and how poor. his jokes are, he built a good team. Imagine if he hits on a franchise quarterback. Man. I mean, he will be the savior. He will be praised for this. And I mean, he'll be there. He'll be so safe with that one move. If this one thing actually works, he's going to look like a genius.

He will be the genius and not Chip Kelly. Yes, right. His whole career is now on Carson Wentz. I think Carson Wentz is a winner in this trade, too, because he avoided the Browns. he is going to play for an organization that's won a lot of games over the last 15 years. I mean, they're not exactly, you know,

the Steelers and the Seahawks right now are the Patriots, but they've won a lot of games. I think it's a good organization. It's a good defense. It's a good situation. You don't have to play right away. You make more money up at the number two picking the draft. He's not going to slip past that.

So I think he was a big winner. And that's why for everything that you said that makes sense for the Browns, and I think what they did was safe, and I think it would make sense. and you're like it all just comes down to whether wents is great or not if he's a top 10 quarterback then you're writing an article in 2022 about the day they passed on cars and wens like you were writing yesterday about the day they passed on ben rothusberger but that's right and when it

comes down to any team that does sorry to put you in a no no but same with the titans when you get this bundle of picks right now it looks awesome but if you usually when you look at the and you review how these things go most of the picks don't hit maybe two or three or three redo. And Cleveland's in a planning process where really probably eight of them need to be legit starters for people to say this was the draft that turned, you know, this entire franchise around. They can't have one of these guys become a star. But if those are the odds, then you need more picks. So your likelihood goes up that two of the eight do hit. Yep. I mean, as long as you don't keep trading down until you own the seventh round,

like you got, you still have to have some relevant high picks to get true players. round the camp chancellor richard shermans i like that i mean people we've made fun of people saying well money ball is getting is explaining too much people are just saying oh they're doing this money ball thing but this is a proven analytics type of study that you know adding those picks is going to help your chances at least that's a belief in the analytics community that obviously you'd rather have the it worked out for sam hinky in philadelphia you'd rather have the buffet of picks than you would just that one big meal I just love that if they're going to do that, do it. Do it. Don't have someone in the building that's going, oh, no, you got to go with your gut or something like that

and fighting them. Let them do it so that they can either sink or swim. And we know that their idea played out, not that they weren't given a chance to actually do what they wanted to do. Yeah. That in itself is a victory for that team. What they do with it, we'll see, but you're absolutely right. How weird is that locker room going to be, though, in Philadelphia? Oh, my God. Yes. Because I think San Bradford does not get traded. or cut. I think Sam Bradford is their stop gap and they're going to sit Carson Wins or whoever it is going to end up drafting and that he's like the number three this year. And you've got Daniel

is your backup and you've got an ideal situation for a quarterback that teams all say it's best for a quarterback to come into a situation where they don't have to start. I think that they're going to give him that opportunity. But Sam Bradford in a leadership position on a football team is going to be a lame duck. Yeah. And how weird is that? And I think like when you, I think Jimmy Kemsky it was who tweeted out a picture of the actual lockers in the room, just like the three of them right next to each other, how weird it's going to be next year. And, and the fans, they're so, they're starving for a successful quarterback. The Eagles haven't won a playoff game since Donovan McNabb was there. So you've gone through Kevin Cobb, Michael Vic, Nick Foles. I mean, Sam Bradford, they need somebody there. I was surprised that the fans didn't like, I was surprised that Brown's fans seem to like this move, according to some. radio hosts that we're on our air and that the Eagles fans did not like this move because to me the Eagles side of things is much more exciting but the Eagles fans seem to disagree yesterday

this is the stupidest trade in the history of sports literally my whole life is my mother and my family and the Eagles like I love this team more than anything and I cannot believe that we gave up a first runner from next year and a second round of from 2018 for a guy who has not even played division one talent. I just think they're giving up way too much for unknown commodity. I agree with the first caller. And if this thing blows up, what's going to happen? I mean, you know, it was going to be anarchy in city of Philadelphia. I am beyond furious. I had to really sit down in a corner and keep myself from crying and I had to promise myself that I'm not going to sit here and cry to millions of fans out there on national radio to make me look like a girl. This is insanity. This is

Wow. 94 WIP, they did it again. So sometimes I will just like listen to WIP sports talk radio. I used to work there, right? I used to work there. That's actually where I started in sports. And I don't know what show that was in particular, but it really makes me miss home. Anarchy.

It's true, though. It will be anarchy in Philadelphia if this is not work out. I like that the first caller was literally the character from Silver Linings Playbook. Absolutely. Well, I mean, honestly, this was the same fan base that booed Donovan McNabb. when he was drafted. So maybe the fans, you know, they'll chain their tune will change if Carson Wentz becomes that guy.

And that's very much a possibility. Their tune will change if San Bradford is the starter. Then they'll love Carson wins. Right. San Bradford throws one interception and Carson Wins will be the most popular guy in town. Oh, everybody's going to be crying for him immediately. I mean, you can almost guarantee that. Chase Daniel continues to make massive bang by just putting a football uniform on and standing

for three hours every Sunday. Well, it was tough out here. And I think that was what was lost a little bit in the shuffle on Wednesday was Chase Daniel Nation, of which I'm a part of. Chase Montana. It's a bursting nation. Chase Montana. I mean, it was tough. It was a setback for a guy who we know is going to become an all-time great and has just been waiting to make that leap since I wrote making the leap piece about him in 2013.

And I thought this was his chance. And I still do think Bradford will struggle. Daniel will come in and he'll have his moment in the sun. So case Montana fans out there, don't sell your journey. Don't worry. It's going to happen. We'll get there. One good part about all of this and the stockpile of quarterbacks is that the Eagles

have guaranteed that they will not be last year's cowboys. That's so true. They have options. That's what you want to avoid. Who else were winners here before we move on? RG3. RG3 for obvious reasons. I mean, they could still draft a quarterback.

So that's a little bit TBD because you talk about Bradford getting. booed the minute he throws a pick. I mean, that's going to happen in Cleveland if there's a rookie sitting there. Not so much of it's McCown. How about Josh McCown? Because at this point, if they didn't draft the quarterback, I'm starting to think maybe Josh McCown's their week one starter. I would trust him in a battle. I think maybe the Cowboys and the Chargers. Connor put that in his piece and he's right. I mean, if Dallas wanted one of the quarterbacks, all right, not so great. But really a lot of people did not. Most people don't feel like these quarterbacks are the two best players in the draft. So suddenly the Chargers and the Cowboys have

a chance to really address needs. All right. So let's move on. Yesterday, that was surprise. Yesterday was just like a crazy day. One thing after another. I mean, it's serious.

I felt bad for you guys doing all of the posts and everybody that all of a sudden had to just like jump on and start doing all sorts of breaking news. Yeah, how is that for you? Put us in the mind of a, you know, a television host hosting a live show. What happened on your side? When this is dropping just hours or an hour before you go and you have to blow up the whole show. No, I'm not going to lie.

because we were sort of anticipating that something like this might happen. We're talking about Josh Norman, by the way. The Panthers rescinding the tag, yes. The Josh Norman thing blew everything up because I was so excited that the trade happened in the morning. Like when that happened at 1030, I was like, woohoo. We don't even have to rip up the rundown. We can do the entire show around this.

We've got plenty of time to plan and structure the chats accordingly. And then Josh Norman, boom, everything's out. Yeah. So, yeah, that definitely throws everything into. That's when you start just, like, being really, really aggressive with your producers, Richard Ezakow, you know. Lots of back and forth. Are you yelling? You and Dan Helly.

No, what happens? And I always feel like I owe an apology at the end of the day to like one or two people when things get heck. I bring in cake pops. That's happened. What happens is that whoever's working the social media, like the what's trending wall and all that kind of stuff, those people come up to me throughout the day like pitching tweets. Like, hey, this guy just tweeted that. And I'm like, no, I don't like that one. Yeah, that one's good.

I can do something. Take it away. The old stopover. And people will like, so throughout the day, that's kind of our thing, right? And then it gets to a certain point in the day where they walk up to me. They go, do you have a minute? And I go, nope. And don't even load up.

And they just go like, okay, and walk away. And that's how it was yesterday. And at the end of the day, I go, so that happened and that happened. And I need to go around and apologize to people because I'm just like, don't talk to me now. No, it happens, especially like if you're planning a segment and then somebody wants to come up and talk to you about a segment that's, like, tomorrow. And you don't mean for that stuff to happen, but it just kind of does when you're on deadline. Our newsroom breathes that.

I give Lindsay a lot of credit, even before we even really knew you at all, but you sat in the same space with us. Back during, like, the Tim Tebow days, Lindsay was the first person on the newsroom to stand up at times and just fight people and say, uh-uh, we are not doing another Tim Tebow segment today. We're not doing it. And she would get very vocal, and it's, but it's right, because it's you that has to sit there and sell it like you're interested in it. Lindsay does a great job for the fans battling the low hanging fruit. She does not want to do the low hanging cheesy debate. And it's a fine line that you have to sort of balance because you don't want to look like the high maintenance person

that's no, this is wrong and I don't want to do that idea. But at the same time, it's like you don't want to be the person who's sitting out there doing the Tim Tebow segment for the 1900th time. That said, for that reason, yesterday I was like giddy, like a total nerd. when I sat down at my desk. Like, you guys are so many different things that we could talk about. I know, I felt the same way. We could go chargers. We could go Paxton Lynch.

We could go, you know, it was like all of the different levels of like legitimate things to talk about. It was so exciting. It was like Christmas morning in terms of news in the off season because it was legit news with many different layers and there were so many different conversations. But the Josh Norman thing, that happened. And so now he's an unrestricted free agent and he's hitting the market six weeks after free agency happened.

And you go back to Combine, and Dave Gettleman said there, it doesn't make sense to draft and develop players for other teams, right? And Ron Rivera went even a step further, and he said that he wasn't even concerned about the team paying him. And now, Rob Rivera says today, well, I guess I just have to trust the GM. Well, yeah, if you're a coach, you're going to be disappointed in this, a defensive coach who's built up this defense with superstars at every level of the defense. and he just lost his superstar at cornerback.

This is one of the most surprising stories that we've had in the NFL, just in terms of a pure business transaction, I think, of the last six, seven, ten years. First of all, you don't really see tags rescinded. You certainly have, we haven't seen it in six years, and that was for a guy, Leroy Hill, and that was Corey Simon before this. You don't see.

Don't downgrade Leroy Hill, Greg. You don't see a top-level player just become a free agent in April. If Chris and I were doing our top 99 free agents in March and Josh Norman was available, he would have been number one easily. He's in his prime starting cornerback and he's looking for Dorel Rivas money.

I don't know if he's going to get Dorel Rivas money. I think that's an open question. But for the Panthers to just say, no, we don't really like how you're approaching this contract situation. We want to avoid any distraction. Like, we'll see you. Like, that is unprecedented. I kind of want to know what else happened there behind the scenes.

I feel like something. I feel like there's got to be something else. I mean, unless it's just they didn't want to spend that kind of money on a one-year lease for him. I just look at Gettelman just spent three years trying to get out of the cap hell that he was dealt when he took the job. And he kept saying there's going to be tough decisions every season. They let Steve Smith go, you know, not entirely because of money, but a lot to do with that. And in general, having to, you know, that position is not a position that they've handed out. The Gettelman's hand a lot of cash to.

and Norman's asking price started to become outrageous for a guy that, frankly, has had one great season, right? I mean, he's had one great year, and at cornerback, we've seen these guys that call themselves the best cornerback of all time, and two years later, they're not even in the top five when we talk about those discussions. So you have to be absolutely sure that he is Daryl Green part two.

If you're going to hand that kind of money out and get him in a way, it's painful for the fans, but it might have been a smart decision. Well, as Eric Davis said on Total Access last night, and he certainly knows more about playing the position and the Panthers defense than I. He said that it's not a corner-based defense. So it's not, everything doesn't stem from the corner.

So it doesn't make that much sense to put all of your money in the corner on your defense. Right. And they were willing. Like a Rex Ryan defense would. Right. And so I made some calls after work because I was like, we're missing something here. It doesn't make any sense. He's so good.

Why would you do this? is like it going to come out that he was arrested or is he do guys on the team not like him or is there some more stuff going on here and all i heard was that he's great we like him uh everybody likes him there the problem was legitimately they thought um what gettelman said it was in that they were he maybe not going to come to a long-term deal and they thought that josh was enough of a wild card personality that he might actually take uh a hold out pretty far like through maybe even into the season and that this is a team and we heard Jared Allen say this when he came through about a month ago after his retirement he said and he's been on so

many teams Jared Allen that this was the most special locker room that he'd ever been in that there was a no drama like no drama at all and I've heard that from a few different people to play on that team that it was like weirdly cool in that locker room last year well you could tell too just based on all of their shenanigans on the sidelines They loved each other. We like hate it. We like to hate on it. But at the same time, it's like, oh, that's so cool.

They were way into each other. Why can't my team be doing that? If you want to carry that over into next season, then it would be weird and distracting and maybe throw a wrench in the good vibes of that room. If you have to answer questions about Josh Norman or if he's doing sit-ups in his driveway. Well, and they just don't think he, they think he was good enough to pay $11, $12 million, but I don't think they believe he is irreplaceable. There was a great piece by football outsiders. in their annual book going into last year. This is before last year that basically the secret sauce

of what the Panthers have been able to do is develop a secondary with putting almost no resources into it. That they change players every year and these guys like Benway Benwickery or Charles Tillman who has washed up at this point of his career. They stick all these guys in and they've had great secondaries year after year despite changing names.

Josh Norman was a guy we didn't even know about two years ago. They coach it up. They get pressure up. front, and they've managed to avoid spending lots and lots of money in the secondary, and they I think believe in that. Well, and Gettleman certainly does. Gettleman's theory is defensive line and quarterback, and that front seven is part of the reason that someone like Josh Norman succeeds. It's also because he's extremely talented, not at the price tag, but it's two Super Bowl GMs this offseason that have had to make a series of very difficult choices. And the point is, do you trust

Gettleman up to now and what he's done with this team? Personally, I do, and this is, I think, think you can't throw your cap back into the situation it was in just a few years ago. And did you guys see what Patrick Peterson tweeted out yesterday? And then delete? Wait, so he tweeted, know your worth, definitely throwing shade right at Josh Norman here. And then he deleted it. And he said, not my style. So I decided.

Then he tweeted that he did delete it. It said, not my style. So I decided to delete positive vibes only. Hashtag, don't press send. thinking out loud there's a lot of shade thrown at Josh Norman I think other cornerbacks don't think he's really that good and he didn't play as well in the second half last season I don't think they think he has the sort of skill set that that a Peterson plus that position group they love to go

at each other right I mean every off season cornerbacks talking about cornerbacks I mean that might be the big like maybe behind wide receiver that's probably the biggest diva position in the league I'd say and for that reason I'll say this is neither here nor there, but you might find it interesting. When he, when Josh Norman came through total access a month ago, I was so surprised because I thought he was going to be a diva based on his play on the field, his swag and all that kind of stuff. And frankly, I like his swag on the field. I'm like a fan. You're pro. You're a football statement. Right. I'm pro Norman. So it wasn't going to throw me off or anything like that, but I was expecting him to be a bit of a diva. He was one of the most

unassuming, just chill guys that has come through total access. You have a lot of like, smaller names that come through that throw out a lot of attitude and you're like do you have any idea how many people come through here on a daily basis and then Josh Norman rolled through and he was like hey good to see you wow and you're like we haven't met but I appreciate the enthusiasm I appreciate that because he attacked me on Twitter early last season when I made a horrible prediction that was incorrect and he was correct to uh you know take me to task for it but that changes my impression he sounds like a sweet guy he was just an anti-diva in my experience and I was surprised by Greg and Colleen over there writing notes back and forth on it.

We have to bail out of it. Don't worry. We'll keep the show going while you guys do your thing. We have to bail out of the studio a little quicker than we expected. Can we do landing spots real quick? Yeah, we can just talk real quickly about, like, is another team going to see him as that top player? I think that's an open question. And I wouldn't be totally stunned if he returned to Carolina.

I'd be a little surprised, but it wouldn't totally shock me if the best deal out there is still from Carolina any return. But early, we're hearing what? San Francisco? I think San Francisco is a great spot because they have over $50 million in cap room. So they have the money. And they, as Mark mentioned in our now hit today, they've been so quiet and free agency. It's been like kind of boring. So they could use a splash.

Plus they really need a guy in that secondary too because their starters are Kenneth Acker and Tremaine Brock. But they need so many things that if I'm Josh Norman, why would I go play there right now and essentially be the rebuilding piece? Yeah. I mean, he's got a choice. at this time it's not where do we trade him i mean i if you want to look at a defense that's up and coming the chicago bears i mean they've got they've got some money to play with not as much as the nineers but they they certainly have a need at the position and i think vicangio is starting at every level of defense in chicago there are parts in place and norman would make that a very

interesting unit to watch rappelport listed uh some teams that were interested and he left the rams off the list and i'm curious as to why that is because since they do you have there who he he said niners bucks titans jaguars bears and redskins were among the teams that were interested i don't know if that's just that the rams don't have money or because i don't know i like that there i mean they put you know they've spent money at that position they also lost genoris jenkins i think the jaguars if they really want to go for it because that there's a lot of good things happening in jacksville with the coach and gmm if things go horribly wrong again and they go 2 and 14, they could be out.

And so maybe you just make that final push. Jacksonville, Jaguars, add Norman to that defense. That would be, there would be a lot of new faces there. Very interesting. You just have so much money, they, I feel like they just want to spend it all right now. What is happening to you over there? Oh, we're trying to figure out. We got to get out.

We got to abort. I think they heard that there's two females on one show and they're like, this needs to end it. End it now. NFL media is like, no, no, no, no, no. Can't do that. A lot of shadowy league figures. behind the glass I'm seeing.

It was a pleasure, though. This was a revolution that we started. I just got TD in my ear saying, I'm a big fan of this, Colleen. Well, if you're a big fan, as he us out of here. Let us finish our final segment then if you're such a big fan, TV.

I think we're wrapping up. We got to wrap up. What are we back? When are you guys back again? We will be back on Monday. All right. Okay. On Monday.

So, that is it. This has been real, guys. This has been super fun. So let's, let's end it then. Let's do it. For Client Storm, I don't know how to get that. For the boss. For the Linsmeister?

I think that's maybe your nickname. Linsmeister. I don't know. Until Monday. By the time. By the time we got to the end of the set, the end of the set when he did do Purple Rain, that was one of those times where things just worked magically and there's nothing you can do but just say thank you.

Only want to feel she laughing in the purple rain Purple rain, purple rain, purple rain Purple rain, purple rain, that's all right Come on y'all Purple rain, purple rain, oh yes Don't it feel good? Hold on you when I see you. Can I play this guitar?

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