NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Eli Manning Retires ; Active Hall of Famers with Mina Kimes

Episode Date: January 24, 2020

A room filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Chris Wesseling, Marc Sessler and Gregg Rosenthal are joined by the twitter queen herself, Mina Kimes, to discuss Eli Manning retiring, (6:36) the new Vikings offensive coordinator (22:40), and Jay Gruden's new job (31:04). The heroes and Mina debate active hall of famers in the league right now (38:03) before answering some mailbag questions.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hey, everybody. Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the 6th, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else.

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Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. The Around the NFL podcast. Isn't afraid to mute you on Twitter. Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hansis. I'm coming to you from a room that's just overflowing with heroes.

Mark Sessler, Chris Wessling, and Greg Rosethol. What is up, boys? Hey, Dan. And joining us in studio for the first time. We had this person on the phone once and we enjoyed it, but now we got her in the house. I call her the first lady of sports Twitter. Oh, I don't know about that. Her Majesty, Nina Kimes.

Welcome to the Around the Unifference. podcast. Thank you. Don't know how I'm going to live up to that designation. This is First Lady music? That's what I asked for. First Lady doesn't really do much, though. Very majestic, very royal.

Picks the like T settings. Yeah, you know what? Lose First Lady. Let's go with the queen. I don't think they let her out of the house in this administration. How are you, Mina? It's that kind of podcast. I'm good.

I'm pumped. I have changed my mind about who's going to win the Super Bowl. Super Bowl literally every day. I don't know where you guys are with that, but I've got back in for it. I was wondering how a favorite was installed in this game because I've been the same way. You can talk yourself. I think the 49ers are the better team, but how do you pick against Patrick Mahomes right now? I'm in the, since you don't know anything, pick with what you want to happen camp.

Ooh. And just in general. What do you want to happen? I have a fondness for Andy Reid. I feel like he. I would argue that you've all put more work into this than I have. I have not thought about it once since. Sunday so I'm with the yeah I'm Patrick Mahomes this is his moment this is his take the torch game but that might be again more what I'd like to see we don't want to spoil the big reveal from our Super Bowl week shows in we have yeah okay because people are on the edge of the seat and also Simone Sessler your lovely wife Mark who by the way Greg any apologies yet hat in hand well two shows in a row Greg with an extremely offensive commentary about my wife I think it's beyond her at this point she's

I think I was doing everyone a favor. It was... You're doing everyone a favor. In your world, that's how you view that. I was getting you home. I can't name one person who you granted a favor to. I was... Simone's a Niners fan, me and it.

I know. I was trying to get your home on what would be an exciting romantic potential night. That's all. Well, Greg, you are a Cupid if there is ever been one. I'm amazed she listens to your... She listens to... Yeah, well, you know, that is a curious... There's some layers to that.

No one affiliated with me listens to... No, my wife has never listened to two minutes of this podcast in the entire run of it, not one. In fact, we had a TV show for the first time ever, the around the NFL broadcast that aired the last three weeks. I watched. Thank you. Did you like it? I was on the plane. I liked it very much. Oh, good.

Thank you. My wife, she watched the first one, but then she trailed off. She watched 33% of our television. The enthusiasm wanes. Maybe. Yeah. But I guess she doesn't care about football either. So what do we talk about?

Hmm. My family is actually listening to everything I put out over the next two weeks because we're in a very competitive pickum of Super Bowl. There's a plaque in my family's house. I'm talking family parents, brother. Sure. And it's gone down to the wire. Basically, whoever's right in the Super Bowl wins it all this year. It gets their name on the Kimes family plaque. They have an advantage because they're going to know who I'll pick based on my public profile. So they're watching everything I do, like Hux. This is cut throat. I've had this issue with fantasy football, my good friend, Bob.

He has told me outright he knows who like my quote-unquote sleeper picks are who I like because of he's a listener of our podcast. Well, Greg and I worked for Rotter World. Like I was running our draft kit one year and all my high school buddies bought the draft and I was like, I don't even want to do this anymore. I mean, Mina, is it not concerning that you are not dominating your family in this? You are, this is your career and this is your expertise. You should just be devastating them.

It's hard. So we do, I'm part of the ESPN. There's like an expert picks page. And you can see the records. My mother, Sunmin Kimes, who I think is 74 now, has shredded every Louis Riddick, Trey Wingo, Mike Golick, destroyed by Sunman Kimes year after year. But this is the year I could take her. If I get the Super Bowl right, I win.

All right. A lot happening. All right. So me and this year, we're excited. Her Majesty. Forget about the first lady. You're right, because the first lady, it really varies. Some first lady is super plugged in, super influential.

Eleanor Roosevelt comes to mind immediately. Got a lot done. You know, of course. Barack Obama's wife, Michelle, she was. Yeah. Why do you refer to her as Barack Obama's? I started down a bad path. We're on our rollercoaster right now.

The queen, though. Is it charged? I don't know. These days, they don't want to be queen either. Queens are struggling right now. David, for the news. I know that you don't pay attention to the news outside of the States, but there's some issues happening there.

Who said I don't pay attention to news outside the state? I did, right, a few seconds ago because it's true. You're incorrect. All right, here we go. Coming up on today's show, Eli Manning retired. We're going to get to that, obviously. We've been building up to this moment. It's funny, meaning you're here for this show,

because this Eli retires and what's next conversation has been, really, Wes has been, he's been prime for this for years to take his shots at Eli in a big, I feel like I've taken time along the way. I feel like we've said it all. But it's all building. This is when Chernobyl blows. We'll talk about Eli.

And also since Eli, it's the big talk about the Hall of Fame. We'll talk about players who are active right now who are already in the Hall of Fame in our minds. And perhaps we will disagree. Hopefully we will because that's fun. If we have some time, we'll do a mailbag. But yes, let's start with the news. 1714, fellas, what's up now? we are world champion this is what every quarterback lives for and it takes the snap back to throw

under pressure aboard for ross and he's going to fight out of it still fights out of it now throws it deep down field Tyree who makes the catch at the 20s run a point one got to play by manning Eli man I don't know how I got out of there I thought he was on the ground and and then he came out of the pile and just slings it You know, people get on Joe Buck for the Randy Moss mooning call. But the fact that when NFL films puts together a highlight package of the Eli to Tyree pass, the helmet catch, and Buck doesn't even show up, he didn't do a good job on that. Oh, yeah. He treated it like it was like a third and ten out just in like a week four preseason game.

Eli Manning announced his retirement on Wednesday, retiring after 16 seasons. he's 39 years old, the Giants quarterback, who was, of course, supplanted by Danny Dimes this year, but was a rock for the chairman for many years, now heads into retirement. And it makes sense, Mina. In fact, as a New York guy, all my friends are Giants fans. I was on a text chain just the day before this news broke. And we're talking about that Eli is going to retire probably soon. because when you looked at the landscape

with all these older quarterbacks on the market and what Eli's been doing the last couple of years, it never made sense that he was going to find a place to start games or perhaps, you know, he didn't want to be a backup. So this all made sense, but still it is the end of an era in New York. I would love nothing more to come in here

and defy, I think, what you all know I'm about to say about Eli Manning. to not be what Damashet calls us Football Cools I would love to say you know what guys you can't tell the story of football

without Eli Manning which by the way why is he the only person who gets that benefit Do you ever hear people say that about anyone else other than Eli? There's a lot of guys

you can't tell the story of football without Sure Aaron Hernandez being one of them doesn't mean you put him in the Hall of Fame or if you want to look at Pat's Super Bowls I mean they don't want any of them

without Dante High Tower That's the whole other thing. Greg has compared Eli Manning to Aaron Hernandez in the first 10 seconds to this conversation. I see the way that's always like a thin. Yeah, it doesn't have to be reductionist. It could be just one thing you consider about a candidacy. Right. Well, if you want Eli in the hall, it's either two cases.

One is longevity, which is, I think, a lot of people throw out because there's just too many guys who would get in by that. And then the other is the two Super Bowls and the story thing. That's just not how I would define it. it just becomes an argument about how do you define the Hall of Fame, I think. Right. And my case against him has always been, and I've been making this case for probably eight or nine years, so this is how long he's been average. He's just been average his entire career, average.

In completion percentage, yards per attempt, he's actually way below average in the law of the interception categories, passer rating he's average. For the time he entered the league to the time he left the league, he was an average quarterback over that span. I still don't like that being the conversation, though, when he retired. We've had this argument so many times that I think we're just tired of it. Like, we've said everything that there is to say about Eli Manning in the Hall of Fame. Eli Manning in general that I actually was annoyed almost yesterday that that's the conversation when a really great player who was a big part of the league.

And, you know, no matter whether he was a top five quarterback, no, he never was. Maybe in 2011, I went through it once. I think I had him a top five quarterback one year, a top 10 quarterback only one other year. Yeah, that's not the Hall of Fame. But like immediately the second he retires, the entire conversation is like the start of the public Hall of Fame talk, which is I feel like going to be never ending. And people are so confident about what's going to happen. You don't know what's going to happen. I don't even be confident about what's going to happen.

People are like, well, you know he will be in. It's like, you don't know that. You don't know that at all. I think the manny name, like this is not a new thought. but just that we've talked about, you know, royalty and stuff, that he's sort of this NFL family fixture that the people voting for this, I think they're going to push Eli Manning right in. It may be different voters down the way.

It depends on who he's against, though. It really does. The conversation will be never ending for five years. Then he's going in. I'm sorry. And I don't, listen, everybody discounts counting stats. And some people get too caught up or will only point at the two rings and the two Super Bowl MVP's.

but I just think there's something to be said if he didn't wing those Super Bowls he's not going to the Super Bowl. He's not going to the Hallfame I get that but there's something to be said and it's always been I feel overlooked both on this podcast but in general because Eli can be a target

I feel like on Twitter that the Giants drafted him or the Chargers technically but the Giants brought him into the team in 2004 they put him in the lineup in around October that year and then they never had to think about the quarterback position again for the next 10, 11, 12 years.

And I know things didn't end very well, but... They should have been thinking about it six years ago. When you're talking about, all right, 10 years, okay? I'm going to say 10 years. When you think about other teams, think about your Browns, Mark, my jets, so many other teams in the league that go through a constant search, a churn looking for a guy and you end up with a stopgap and a rookie who stinks and then a stopgat and then another rookie and maybe you hit on something like the Seahawks got Russell Wilson.

they don't have to think about anything. Russell Wilson's a better player than Eli. But Eli for 10, 12 years, they put him in there. He did his job. He was not spectacular, but he was steady. You never had to worry about him getting hurt because he never did. He's the most durable player ever. You never had to worry about him saying stupid, something stupid to the media.

He always handled that very well. He never had to worry about him getting into a behind-the-scenes drama with a coach and something exploding and him being at odds and using the media to get a point across and all that stuff. He was a Walter Payton Man of the Year guy. He was a total good dude. And in those two playoff runs, then you factor that in for me.

He rose up in a historic way and didn't just beat anybody. Didn't beat the Jacksonville Jaguars, didn't beat a Pittsburgh Steelers. He beat the Patriots. And he'd beat Bill Belichick and he beat Tom Brady. And to me,

if that's not something that should be given added points knowing who the Patriots are and what they represent in this era of NFL football. I'm sorry, I disagree to just kind of just view that as, oh, yeah, he beat the Patriots. No, he beat the greatest team of all time,

the greatest quarterback and the greatest head coach. I think that means a lot. His team did. Right, playing okay in that Super Bowl. I don't think he would say he had the best game, even the play he's known for, you know, is a crazy play that could never be replicated. The 2011 run is what I remember most fondly of Eli Manning.

I think people kind of forget that one. the last game of the regular season that they played, I think it was against the Cowboys. And then the three games in the NFC playoffs and that Super Bowl, he had a collection of some of the most improbable, low percentage, awesome throws for a five-week stretch that you'll ever see.

Joe Flacco kind of had a somewhat similar run. And he had little moments like that. The year after they won the Super Bowl 2008, he was really good throughout that year. But they didn't win the Super Bowl because of he was like, man, and they won it because of their defense. I mean, they won it because of Justin Tuck. And he was part of it.

It's equally reductive to me to say, oh, they won because of Tucker. No, he was, but no one's going to argue for just tuck to get into the, I mean, kind of connected back to the Hight Tower. No one's out here making a case for Hight Tower. You kind of do. You like to throw this one in. I think he is the single most important, like, outside of Brady and Grunk. Like, the Patriots don't have this run of Super Bowls without Dante Hightower, I think.

And I don't think Dante Hightower belongs in the Hall of Fame. But all the cases we're making for Eli, you could just as easily make for like 20 other random players who are not quarterbacks. The case you made for Eli, I think is the case why he's a great, memorable NFL figure. It's just that's different than an argument of whether he's a law of favor. He also talked about it forever on this podcast.

He didn't excel at his position. He was not a top 10 quarterback, I would say, for every year but two of his career. And there's no one in the Hall of Fame you can say that. We've also said forever, and Wes, you've quoted, Vince Lombardi on this, that the quarterback, it's just the most important position. It's where the spotlight is. And that comes with way more pressure to it than Dante High Tower, where his position is. I just think what Eli was able to do in that spot in those two years is something you can't take away from him and say, oh, he was carried to those titles.

Because I just don't see it that way. I think you've stated the case very well. I just think it falls shy of the Hall of Fame. I think if you're a Jets fan like Dan or you're a Browns fan and you've seen nothing but shipwrecked chaos at the quarterback position that the idea that you would draft someone who would play as Eli did before a PR stunt got him benched a couple years ago.

He never missed the game to injure. Right, 12 straight years of 16 starts. And by the way, the guy... PR stunt got him benched. He got himself in. Well, that's fine, but I'm saying, but also the guy... The Gino disrespect. I just think that if you were a Giants fan

and you draft Philip Rivers, and he did what he did, but you get Eli Manning out of it, and you know he's going to win two Super Bowls and essentially be a total Iron Man at the position. He's a Hall of Fame to a lot of Giants fans. I get that. I don't think he belongs in it necessarily either.

Reading a story, just reading up on Eli's career, I completely forgot the whole 2017. Ben McAdoo, I don't even, where is Ben these days? Jacksonville. Oh, Jacksonville. Yeah, Ben McAdoo-Val. He's resurfaced. Ben McAdoo.

Trying to make that a thing. His plan, when Eli was, I admit that, he was in the tank at this point in his career, Ben Magnus' plan was to have Eli play the first half to keep his starting streak alive and then bring in Greg's boy, Gino Smith. He wanted to do the play the haves thing. We'll always say that starting, that Gino had against the Raiders is underrated. He played pretty well in the game. We'll always say that. The Eli durability thing is underrated.

Like, we cannot talk about that enough. Because Greg said he doesn't want to get to the All-Fame debate right away. So that would be where I would focus on him because it's truly remarkable. I mean, they asked us to, I do this daily show, ESPN Daily, check it out. And at the end of the show, I would do like a monologue and, you know, they were saying, well, what do you want to say about Eli Manning? I was like, well, I kind of just want to talk about how durable he was. And the game that, to me, it's not the Super Bowls, but it was the NFC Championship against the Niners.

I'll never forget. That might be his best game. Watching him. Every picture from that game, his helmet is slightly askew because I think he was hit like, you know, 500 times or 20 knockdowns or something. I don't know if I've ever seen anything like that. So it's pretty remarkable. All right. Well, we'll have this conversation again in five years when the Hall of Fame vote occurs.

So let's stick a pin in this. Are we still going to be doing this in five years? That's a good question. I mean, we were looking through, you know, here's a peek behind the curtain in our, you know, database to see if we had had this conversation before? Database is strong. Or whatever you want to say. You did a Google search.

No, I looked in the little, you know, whatever you call, the Art 19 thing. And the idea that we have curtains is strong. We don't know. And we searched to see, have we had the, what current players are Hall of Famers conversation before? And it was like, yes, but in 2014. It's like, gosh, you've been doing this too long. Where's the love that we get for being durable? No love.

Where's that monologue on ESPN daily? Specifically from the employer of very little love. Never miss a start. All right. Mark didn't miss the show for, what was it last week? Your eye couldn't close. I had an eye issue. No, that's not.

That is not how I would describe it. That is not how I would describe it. All right. Boomerang IR for Mark. Here we go. Other news in the league, Gary Kubiak's back in a chair. The O.C. chair rap sheet reported Thursday, the Vikings will make Kubiak the new O.C. He spent the 2019 season as the Vikings' assistant head coach and offensive

advisor and he got a lot of the credit for the run scheme that he used as a head coach in Houston and Denver. He's a big play action guy. So now Kevin Stefansky goes to Cleveland. Always felt like Gary was maybe looking over Kev's shoulder the whole time, Wes, and now Kubiak's in the chair feels like a good match with Kirk, right? Yeah, I wonder how much this will change things. I guess he'll be actually calling the plays, whereas last year it was more like he installed the

offense and then Stefansky called the plays. But Greg likes to say all the time, Andy Reid is the best offensive mind of his generation or this century. And I think the guy who's often lost in that conversation is Gary Kubiak, who's been highly successful everywhere he's gone, who basically, you know, Mike Shanahan gets a ton of credit for Kyle. But I think Kyle spent more time in the NFL around Gary Kubiak than his own father. You're in a great chin. I mean, that combination there, Kubiak and Stefanski together. A couple of hotdies. Handsome men.

Didn't you have some Stefanski eat? Maybe this is the time for it. I forgot about this. It was teased before we came on that Mina had a Kevin Stefansky scoop. Yeah. Well, I know we got, you know, some Brown's interest here. Yes. I'm just hoping it's not disastrous news that you're about to break.

Well, so this kind of brings it back to the family. We've been talking about our family members and their interest or lack of interest in our careers. So my husband, Nick, does not watch football, does not, it's not a sports guy at all. But one day he comes home and he's like, hey, he's like, do you know this guy Kevin Stefansky? Is he like, he didn't put it that way. Let me rephrase it. He said, is Kevin Stefansky like a big deal? And I said, yeah, he just.

Pretty big deal. Yeah, pretty big deal. And he's like, what about Joe Judge? Is he also a big deal? I was like, yeah, yeah, this is recently. He's like, yeah, he's like, I know them both from high school. school so he's so excited to tell me this guy i got the scoop for you the scoop of the century joe judge st joe's prep philadelphia uh they were both quarterbacks and he said joe judge Kevin

stepansky took his job joe judge had to transfer out of st joe's prep because stefansky was the better quarterback you have no idea how excited mark is no it's there i he was worried that this was going to go badly first and well and according to my husband the better dude Stavandy, okay. Great classmate, good friend, nice guy, excellent at calculus. Blue skies. He's giving you all the insight. He is an analytics guy.

And I'm like, this is kind of a fun story. Like he's just quarterback, transfer or whatever. And you know, I'm going to just double check no one's written this. Adam Schaefter had it four days before me. Oh, my husband went to high school with these guys. I was thinking this could have been your like your summer splash piece. I know. The time when Stifansky stole judges.

his job and his girl? I had the most inside of sorts. Jeff there does great work. But you know what? The one thing you still have, to me, the top, you know how they teach in journalism school, the inverted triangle? To me, the top headline or the top part of the story, though, is that one of these guys is a jerk.

I didn't say that. One is a lesser man than the other. According to high school friends. According to my husband, who also, by the way, interviewed Kevin Stefanski for the St. Joe's Prep Hocklet and is available, he tells me, for any interviews. to talk about the experience. Probably the first interview of Stefanski. He was very high on Kevin.

Well, I'm just taking the rest of the show off because, you know, when things start to go well, check out and just enjoy. That was a close call. Because if it was Stefansky that lost the job, we would have lost Mark. Yeah, that would have been it. I don't need it.

I don't need any more negative type news. This is the opposite. Thank you. Just for a click on Kubiak, though. Coobes. Wasn't he supposed to retire because of his health? Like, this is, I mean, the dude can't quit football. And I agree with you, he's been immensely successful everywhere.

He's gone. His fingerprints are all over the Shanahan run game. Every offense he's touched. Is it dispassionate life worth living? Well, there was. Ooh. He's not trying to survive. He's trying to live.

That's post-cancer. Stressful job. Well, of course. I mean, you have to go through all that when you suffer a big health scare. What makes it worth living? Well, the thing I found weird last year at this time was, Ian Rappaport would say that Kubiak didn't want the head coaching jobs because of his health. Because, yeah, the stress.

But the coordinator thing seemed fine, which is one of the more underrated John Elway mistakes, I think, of the last few years. You love killing your boy Elway. He somehow let Kubiak get out of the building. I mean, Kubiak wanted that job. And it seemed like he wanted to have the whole Kubiak crew. He's got Clint Kubiak. He's got a couple other assistance. Clint with a K.

I think, what is his name? Donald's, you know, he's got the same assistants and they couldn't come to an agreement there. He also. Oh, he did this. And Elway's laughed, by the way, according to Dan, if you're wondering what the chuckling is. And instead he got Skangarello who last year and now he's with Schumer.

And don't forget, he also had Kyle Shannon in the building. And then he looked at Vance Joseph and went, this one's for John. That's true. What is that voice? Don't ask. That's John. L-Way? That's your L-Way?

No, it's not my L-AW, that is L-W. I just, I like it because I feel like this whole year in Minnesota, you never knew who was calling the shots. Not just between Coobes and Kevin, but also between Zimmer and then when they were like running the ball way too much early on, everybody was questioning. Who's really making these decisions? I think that's a huge question mark on Stifansky is,

wait, one of the best play callers in the NFL is sitting next to you in meetings, potentially doing all the work, and you're getting hired for the head coaching job. Great, great good. Good looking man, though. I don't have a problem with the way he looks. Another family tie into the show.

My brother, Kevin Danger, Hanses. It's good to have a prominent Kevin pop up on the scene because I feel like we had been in a slump. Kevin's? A Kevin in a big spot. Oh, sure. We had Patra. Kevin Bacon's been around forever, though.

I mean a fresh Kevin on the scene. Is there a single NFL? Kevin James was getting a little stale. We needed a new one. All right. Let's move on. Speaking of the flower, Matt LaFleur. This was interesting.

A couple things, a couple nugs around the Packers. First of all, Mike Patton, he will remain the defensive coordinator, although LaFleur kind of said he had to think about some things before making a decision. He decides that LaFleur will return to the staff even after a very grisly downfall for the Green Bay defense in the NFC title game. And then I just wanted to play a quote from Matt from his press conference on Wednesday that jumped out to me a little bit. I'm curious if you guys agree. That's something that I'm still trying to figure out right now as we speak. I mean, I don't understand that because you're there.

You have an opportunity to go to playing a Super Bowl. And for that to happen, it's extremely, it's bothersome. And we've got to look at ourselves, everybody. I got to look inside of myself and see why weren't our players playing with their hair on fire. I think everybody in our organization has to do that. I thought it was interesting to hear a coach talk about that and talk about his team's lack of passion and fire when it's connected to the conference championship game.

Now, sometimes you hear a coach talk like this in week six after a game where a team just has a no-show. But that was a little bit of, I don't know, a little bit of red flag? that he's admitting it and talking in the media that his team didn't show up for the NFC title game? Kind of sounded like his quarterback there. Oh. I mean, some of those spicy quotes that you can.

I mean, he's right. He is right. First reaction. I guess I was surprised that he spoke on it publicly. Yeah. Because it's kind of, isn't it on some level when a team doesn't show up? You could see it as a direct reflection of the head coach.

Well, he tried to say that. I mean, I think he was just recognizing the obvious that the defense and Aaron, Rogers, but I would say that the defense as a whole was just blown off the ball and was blown away. And I think if you watch them, you have to come to that conclusion. Like the two Smith brothers, you know, Zedarius and Preston Smith, who we talked about all year and Kenny Clark, they got railroaded. I mean, they got, they got crushed. I read this, the Bob McGinn weekly grades that he gives the Packers, which is always on the athletic. And this one was like,

From a crime scene, I mean, he went in on these guys and Rogers. He basically, the entire defense in Rogers is having, you know, the worst games of their careers. And the defense especially just kind of getting physically, manhandled and mentally just out of it. Let me ask you guys this, because I was just thinking through this as I look ahead to how do you stop this San Francisco offense from humiliating you with the run game the way they did. How much of that would you put on effort, execution, broken tackles, that kind of thing? some of the secondary being out, the Smith's not showing up. And how much would you put on scheme and Petten not making adjustments, not putting some of his defensive players in the right position to succeed?

I felt like I saw both happening at the same time, which is the very first lady-esque answer. Right. What do you think? After reading about this, the specific game plan from the 49ers was we're going to attack the Smith brothers in the running game. Right. So they're not pass rushing us.

Basically, we're going to go to the edges and take them out, and it worked. So I think when you're talking scheme, like, that has to be a big credit to Kyle Shanahan there. And I tend to credit him more than I blame Petten. I think, I mean, Kyle Shanahan, there are, we're hearing now, and we talked about it before the game. Kyle Shanahan had a year plus to scout Mike Petton and did a better job of scouting Mike Petton than Mike Petton did in reverse. I mean, forget a year plus. I think it was a bit of a controversial relationship, too. They were, there was definitely not the coziest of friendships there.

And I didn't just, I just give it to Kyle Shanahan for understanding how to attack Petton. They crossed 200 yards on the ground four times this season. So it's not out of their DNA, the Niners to do this game. Yeah, and they had some, the Packers had some no-shows. I mean, for a, for a team that only lost four games, the four that they lost, none of them were competitive. Three were just blowout. Yeah, the most concerning thing for me is if you're a Packers fan, it shares a lot of connective tissue with, the meltdowns you saw with Don Capers sitting up in the booth

and his little hair flying around and the Packers' no showing in a January game on defense. I put it more on the coaching being one step ahead of the other team. And then the fact that you've already gotten blown out by this team one time and maybe, you know. Right. Yeah. Insimilar. They had to have, the 49ers had to have felt that they had the Packers numbers and everything

to prove them right. I'm sorry. I was just saying that was the Kaepernick was this, you know, last time they got ran on like that and everyone put it on Capers as well. I just think it's personnel, too, at the end of the day, that Packers just didn't have good linebackers, and you just can't beat. And this is a real concern for me with Kansas City.

As I, again, go back and forth, go back and forth on this game. It's real hard to stop this Niners' offense if you don't have linebackers. If you played that LaFloric... Good ones. For a non-sports fan, the reaction would be, why is this person with a monotone

talking about not playing with your hair on fire? It comes from the person with the monotone. It's fair. What was the take about Dom Keper's his hair? little hair flying around. I mean, that just... I feel like Dom's hair doesn't move, isn't it? Well, that may be true, too.

I mean, it's the cutaways to him looking completely bemused and befuddled in the booth as the Packers are getting... Maybe it's kind of like tamped down. Well, I think the whole thing with, yeah, Dom was it looked like it had, you know, perished 15 years before and he had purchased it. I don't mean to speak too much on it, but yeah. In other coaching news, the Jacksonville Jaguars are hiring former Redskins head coach Jay Gruden.

Fox and Landhouse. He is there. Exactly. Next offensive coordinator. This quote from Doug Marone, who obviously does not see the meteor heading towards. Oh, come on. Doug.

Oh, come on, Doug. Is one of the brightest offensive minds in football, and I'm pleased to welcome him to the Jacksonville Jaguars. Now, he didn't say this, but he could say it, and it wouldn't make sense. And he is also a perfect choice as interim coach when I'm fired on Halloween. I will sandwich prop right here. Yeah.

Jay Gruden is in and Doug Marone is out by this time in 2022. So Gruden has to... So within the next two calendar years, Gruden is in as the head coach and Maroon. You're not bold enough. Basically at some point, Jay Gruden will be the Jaguress head coach. You should say be a head coach this year.

Before, at this time next year, Gruden is in and Maron is out. It could be 10 months from now. Right. I still think it was a great move because their offense is... I'm thinking on it. And Jay Gruden is underrated, and I still believe he's a great play caller and has done a very good job almost everywhere.

It's a good hire. Including Washington. So I don't know. You're going to get, you're going to lose your job. Not for Doug Maron. No, it's a terrible hire for them. Why? Because they need something.

They need something to fix the offense. It's not going to happen with another John de Pallippo year. It's a ready-made inside choice for a coach whose butt is on fire. But he's going to be fired if they lose no matter what. So they have to win. Well, that's true, too. I like it for Minchu. I mean, just set aside our concerns about Maroon for a minute.

Assuming Minchu's the quarterback, man, the Jazz could be real bad next year. But, you know, Gruden's a West Coast guy. Yeah, I'm not as, you're right, they could go in a lot of different directions with court. But if it is Minchu, I'm saying, you know, like a quick passing game, a little more play action. Perfect for Gardner. It seems like a great fit. What about Nick Falls? What is it going to happen now?

That's a interesting. Subplot. I don't think he is because of the money. And he's not a terrible quarterback to have. And maybe Minchu is the starter. Like, you just eat so much money to get rid of him. It doesn't make sense. If you found a trade partner that takes off a little bit of the money,

but it's still, you're eating all this money to not have him on your roster. Counterpoint. Can you tell the story of football without Nick Falls? No. But he is also not going to be. Future Hall of Famer. He's heading to Canton. Got to do it twice.

Oh, yeah. Sorry. That's the bar. Then you really can tell the story of football. In all seriousness, that's a high bar. If you do it twice. Wes, I can't take you on your sandwich prop because it was the first thing I came to my mind.

So if I were to, I don't want to root against it. And I also know I can't get sandwiches by going with you. Well, I already knew it was the first thing that came to your mind because I know you. Okay. I love you, buddy. All right, real quick, let's jump into the fish tank.

The dolphins and their general manager or Chris Greer, they quote, fully expect Ryan Fitzpatrick to be back with the team next year. The 37-year-old who had a really nice season for the Dolphins under very difficult circumstances is obviously a guy who works as a stopgap, but the whole idea, I mean, of the buildup and the tanking was to start over and start over a quarterback. Does it make sense to be paying Ryan Fitzpatrick pretty good money when, you're probably going to go get a quarterback in the first round. The thing I don't like about it

is that, okay, they're going to get a quarterback. Tua is probably the leader in the clubhouse, assuming they're picking fifth overall. They can get him there. They might have to trade up. They have asked. DJ on our air said he expected four quarterbacks to go in the top 15. So they'll get one.

Oh, my God. Jacob Eason. It's going to happen. I'm a Huskies fan. So anyways, I don't love the idea of Fitz being the veteran backup behind the rookie ready to pounce

and out play him at every turn. I know I know we think of him he's a great guy, good mentor, but I just, I don't know,

that kind of makes me nerve. I just feel like there's so many, we have so many examples now of him coming in and out playing these young guys and spurts. How about we send him up to Chicago

and get him the backup to Trubisky? I don't want to see. Back up? Yeah, I don't want to see. Flat out, stard him over Tribisky.

I don't want to see Fitzpatrick also just as, is what will be his final season just sitting on the bench. Well, if it's Tua, Tua might not be, probably wouldn't be ready to start the season. And the contract. He's only making five million. Right, it's the opposite.

The contract is a huge bonus. He's making $8 million next year, which is for a backup, not bad. That's not? I would love to see the, right? For a guy who is the best quarterback in the AFC East last year and can start games for you, yeah, I think that's unbelievable value. I wish there was a Fitzpatrick for every team in the league.

I wish every team. team hit of Fitzpatrick. I thought it was noteworthy just that he said that because, you know, Derek Carr's out here on Wednesday all upset with these quotes that why is everyone bringing up, you know, that other quarterbacks might be coming here? Because I forget what, there was something this week that people were connecting James to the Raiders. Like you would think and he went through all.

Tom Brady. And here's why. Because your coach made it very clear that they're evaluating the quarterback position and went out of his way to not promise you the job. Whereas in Miami, I think they're basically promising it's Fitzpatrick and a rookie. Like, they're making it pretty cool. Do you think that sets up a nice transition? So you're right.

Tua could come in, not play. Fitz comes in. They mess around and win a few games. You can evaluate some of the guys, you know, your Williams is, whatever receiver they'd do you think that could be like a nice? Why not? I think as much as coaches seem to dislike Josh Rosen, they seem to love Ryan Fitzpatrick. And from a coaching staff angle, it would be the perfect.

veteran, to Wes's point, every team would like to have a Ryan Fitzpatrick in that quarterback course. It also kind of says they're out of the veteran quarterback market, if they're being honest, which is a little bit of information. That's what's happening in the news. Ricky Hollywood, plug our live show, please. What's up guys? Ooh, you feel that Caribbean, Caribbean. I don't care how you say it vibes. That's still not Miami, but that's where we're going to be. Oh, yeah. You heard it. Miami Improv. Last chance to get your tickets. If you're a 49ers fan, if you're a Chiefs fan, if you're anywhere in between, if you're not a fan at all. And you just like live podcasts, you know, regarding football. Then this is the place for you. Miami Improv slash events. Check it out. Let's go. 7. Oh, yeah.

Miami. Miami. Yeah, come get your tickets. They're going to go and quick. You've done some live Mina Kimes podcast Miami. How have those gone? I did one in Seattle.

So that was, you know. Homecoming. Yeah. Like the rat king and the, you know, sewer. Wow, weird analogy. Don't know why I went there. I don't know. I was thinking, well, I was like, you know,

I'm surrounded by like enablers and... I like it. Well, isn't a rat king? When a bunch of rats' tails get caught together, Is that technically? And they become a giant rat. That's cool. That's what it's awesome.

That's what that was like. Bill Barnwell and I have done a few. We did one in L.A. I know in Chicago. That was fun. Are you doing any live ESPN daily podcast? Not at the Super Bowl, just doing some we got a studio.

Miami. In Miami. I keep thinking you're saying that. Do you know whose voice that is? And I'm amazed by, is that not Erica? No. The great Connie Fox, Colleen Wolfe. I hear it now.

By the way, the Super Bowl 454 research notes are out and Mina's competitor, she was the ESPN so she doesn't get the look at this. She probably gets her own packet. But the city of Miami has its own chapter. Miami. And I just want to share a couple of fun facts

about the city of Now would be the natural time. It feels like an obvious time for the drop. Miami. There we go. It is the second list. Sorry, I got people chirping at me back. Sure, at Colleen's on her

on her timeline. The second most populous city in Florida. The mayor is... Miami. You have connections to Miami with the Levitare. Yeah, no, I basically lived in Miami for two years. It's Francis Suarez. It's his third year in office.

Of course. Francis X. Suarez, by the way. What city in Florida has more population than Miami? Miami. Famous Miami-Miamians include Stephen Ross, well, the Rock, Pitbull, Gloria Stefan. These are also owners of the dolphins, I believe. Just naming off the owner.

Enrique Anglesias, Ava Mendez, and Arod. Miami. So there you go. All right. Let's get into it. Yeah. Eli, he's going to the Hall of Fame. We don't know.

I think he does. Some other people in here don't think he does. And that's why sports are fun because you get to talk about these things. But let's now get into players that are active in the NFL. Right now, players that are in, if they're, career's ended tomorrow, okay? I have a list here. I think you guys have lists as well, potentially, and I'm going to go through some names. We'll put it in categories and then, you know, chime in with your own thoughts.

Anybody I miss, anyone you disagree with. Here to me are absolute no-brainers. Tom Brady, Drew Brees, J.J. Watt, Adrian Peterson, Aaron Donald, Larry Fitzgerald. Anybody disagree that those guys are, the career ends tomorrow. They're in five years anyway. No disagreement. Oh, if their career ends tomorrow. Tomorrow, they're done. Their body of work is already complete.

Yeah, that's all right. I think you nailed that. Okay. I would put some more in that list, but yeah. Okay, let me go to the next tier and then you guys tell me if they belong in the first tier. I put these guys in the cadet. They're no doubters to me, but they're not the cinch that those other guys are. Russell Wilson, yeah boy.

Matt Ryan, Julio Jones, Richard Sherman, Bobby Wagner, Von Miller, Earl Thomas, and Justin Tucker. Love the Bobby Wackner.

That was a lot of names. Tony Dungy up in here. I like that. Well, I think... Never forget. First of all, Aaron Rogers should be in that first list.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a classic oversight. You might get some heat on Matt Ryan from some people, I think. I loved the Matt Ryan pick. I do too,

but he's not a note. doubter to me. And if his career ended tomorrow, he's definitely not a no doubter. I assume we're in the section now where they have to keep playing a little bit. Well, he's saying if they end tomorrow, you think they're in. And you've not mentioned Ben Rathesberger at this point. Oversight. But I'll put him in the tail end of no doubt. Yeah. To me, Rathesberger would be in the in the total fight me zone. Essentially, he would be in. There's no way Ben Rothesberger, you know, comparing him to Eli, I would say was a top five quarterback seven or eight times.

And Eli's been it twice. Thought experiment. Pat Mahomes wins the Super Bowl this year. Retires the next day. How could you, in good faith, how could you make a case for Eli over Pat Mahomes, who was the best quarterback in football two years and won a Super Bowl? I want to know what Patrick Mahomes is retiring to do. if he's going to build houses somewhere for a developed country.

Oh, the narrative counts. I think if there's a hook to it. Yeah. If it's just like I fell out of love with the game, I'm like, you know, sit on the couch and enjoy whatever you're doing. But if he's got a hook. Interesting. The Seahawks on this.

It matters. I thought were interesting. Earl Thomas, Bobby Wagner. I'm counting Richard Sherman as a Seahawk. Russell Wilson, I think probably needs to play more, but he'll be a hog. Oh, wow. I would put Russell Wilson out. Sure, whatever.

He's in. The other three are. I'm saying the defeated voting session here. The defensive players... It's hard for Earl. I mean, safety's already have a hard time getting it. I wonder, when I made like a, you know, I did a search on pro football reference

for the most first team all pros since 03 I just picked. And Bobby Wagner was tied for first. That's what I was kind of going on. I built this list off all pros. He clicks going in too, but I guess... Last couple years. He doesn't count as active anymore? Richard Sherman, is he definitely a Hall of Famer?

I think what he's been able to do the last couple of years, especially this year and being on all pro again. I would like it if Matt Ryan makes it, but I can't even, even as a huge fan, I don't know about no doubt right now. Okay. He needs to play a little more. I agree with Greg.

I think he's going to get in eventually because his numbers, by the time he retires, are going to rank with anyone's in the history of the game. And a lot of people judge this stuff by numbers. You know who told me that Earl Thomas was a no doubter for the Hall of Fame? and this is timely. Before me. Dorel Revis.

Did not mention Richard Sherman to me. No, I would imagine that not. This is before, you know, the beef. I think if you did the three Seahawks defensive players against each other, it would go Earl first and then Wagner or Sherman next. Well, I think Earl's. Maybe I'm crazy. Like, you're the Seahawks fan.

What order is there? Does there need to be an order? I think he's the more valuable dominant player, but the way we look at Hall of Fame and the accolades, I think he'll have a harder time getting in. You know, Mina. There is an, as a woman who has a Super Bowl 48, 48 tattoo, so you are as diehard as they come. These guys are all in the similar age range.

There is a possibility that they could all go in the same year. You're in Canton for that, right? Like, you're there for the speeches if that happens. Getting emotional just thinking about it. Well, Russell's going to play longer than any of them. Well, Russell, leave Russell out, but I mean the defensive guy. Yeah, that could happen. Could happen.

That would be fun. Anybody, I've mentioned Justin Tucker. Did that just go under the radar or you guys with me on this? I'm with you and I think Johnny Hecker is probably headed to the Hall of Fame too. I think. I think Johnny Hecker is the best punter in history. I like you. What about Adam Vinatari?

You're not, you're on the fence with him. Oh, yeah. You've got to put him in. This list feels a bit scatter shut, but. I feel like it. We don't have to be complete. I like that you put Von Miller in that category and I would agree with you. Okay, good.

Here's the maybe list. Now it gets a little dicey. And Domican Sue. Tyron Smith? I'll stop with the reactive. I don't even know how he got in here. I'm taking Khalil Mack out. I don't know why I put him there.

That was stupid. He's on his shot. He's on the not yet for me. He's on my not yet. Patrick Peterson. I think he probably ends up getting in. I think he's on that border. Andrew Whitworth.

He'll be a fascinating case for how powerful PFF is. Because I would say no under any normal. how they've done Hall of Fame in the past. I think even that Andrew Whitworth that we're talking about it right now is largely due to PFF, which is interesting. I don't think it's a bad thing. When you play for the Brangles, your career doesn't matter to the rest of the league,

so that's a problem he's got. Right, which... Did you do Gino Atkins yet? No. He's on my borderline. I would say he would be on this list, on this... Zach Martin should be on this? That's why I went when he said Tyron because

Martin. and Frederick are probably have better case, to me, might have better cases and obviously Frederick had the illness, but Smith's just been so banged up. Yeah, Tyron Smith is still young. He needs, he probably needs to have like a little resurgent. Marshall Yanda is a borderline guy?

falling off a little quicker. It's tough to talk. Whitten's also getting it. You haven't said Witten. Witten and Jason Peters are like on the ancient list, but we'll probably get in. But he'll probably get in. I have one more maybe guy, Greg.

Yeah, boy. Frank Gore. Oh, I would put Frank Gore in. I don't know. I mean, but if we dismiss Eli Manning's counting stats and then we count Frank Gore's counting stats, like, what are we doing here? Well, first of all, the counting stats for running backs have declined over the year. So that makes Frank Gore's stats more impressive and Eli Manning's less impressive.

I mean, I also would say the last, yeah, the last few years of Gore have certainly helped a lot. But he had a lot of years as a top five, top six running back. Oh, I don't know about that. I think so. What years would you say he was... Yeah, get him! Take off the clubs, me and a time. Get him!

I love Frank Gore. Right. They're like Frank Boar. I would say, first of all, his second year where he had 2,200 yards. Right. Okay. People tend to... I don't have my computer for me.

Granted? But I would say after that, I know the numbers aren't there. The numbers, like, yards from scrimmage would probably put him more like 8, 9, 10. But in terms of, like, the quality of his actual play and what general managers and coaches and coaches would want, I think he was in the time. I'm with you, Greg, but it's an interesting player to make a case against, I guess, as well, but I'm with you. Yeah. I mean, this is where I'm exposed to the total hypocrite because I lobbied against Eli and I love Frank Gore.

And it is, I think it's the same case, basically, or very similar case. Like you say the last few years have really helped him, but like, is it because he had 500, 600 yards? Oh, I think it does help. Forgettable teams. I mean, he gets credit for playing late into it. First of all, he had over 1,000 until he was 34. So he was the oldest guy to have over 1,000 since the 70s. So it's not like he was playing poorly.

All those years after his 2180-yard season where he goes 15, 14, 15, 13, 13, 13, 14. The numbers aren't like astronomical, and those are yards from scrimmage I'm talking about. But I think in terms of like the quality per snap and what coaches and GMs would want, they would have put him top five. I get that. And I'll throw us out. It's not just about stuff like this. but yards per attempt his last five seasons, 3.7, 3.9, 3.7, 4.6, and 3.6.

So, the last five years are not really the reason for. The 2006 season, his second in the league, when he was, like, 23. He was third in rushing yards that year. It was one of the best running back seasons I've ever seen. It just was, I think, the same year, Ladani and Tomlinson won the MVP. When you watched Frank Gore that year, I don't know. I'm not accidentally, actually. Something special.

That was the last time. He was explosive. Bring something out of Greg every time. All right. And here's a list. These are not yet. And Mark, this is where you could jump in. Help me out.

You're saying that I've had some omissions here. Let me know if I've missed any to this point. That should be in the first three tiers. I'm not sure I'm the person to play that. I think Sue, by the way, is a really interesting one that should be a Hall of Famer. His last four years have been, ever since he left the lions, really. Has a chance. I'd rather put Gino Atkins in myself.

I might too. I throw Gino on there. What about Gina Smith? Where are we at on? Smith. Let me to see a little bit more. Did you see that coin toss he had this year? What about Terrell sucks?

I have him written down. Yeah, I think he's on that borderline. Yeah. All right, Charles Suggs. Not yet. I just, this, again, Cam Newton, I don't even know if he's that close. But this is going to be a big stretch ram coming back.

But he has an MVP. He was a very special, different, important quarterback for most of this decade. Mike Evans, Khalil Mack, DeAndre Hopkins, Travis Kelsey, Stefan Gilmore, and Sam Darnold. Anybody disagree with any of those? Sam Darnold.

Well, I mean, he could retire today, as you're mentioning, you know, Patrick Mahomes, same situation. Can we get Sam Darnock to have a slightly average season first? Shut up. Kelsey's a good one. Yeah, Kelsey's a good one. Just receivers you left out, just.

Mike Evans is an interesting choice. I don't know if I would have gone there. I mean. What about Julian Edelman? No. Edelman. No. Antonio Brown.

Yeah, that was, I think Antonio Brown is a no-doubter. And I know you'll get there's... He's made it complicated. There'll be some conversation about this. He's made a complex. He's made everything complicated. The other guys, we've... How he's affected his team, which is fine the last year or two in the league.

I don't care. He's the best wide receiver. I would say he's the best wide receiver I've ever seen. Like, he would be my number, my number one. It depends what you like, sort of. But I think at the very worst, he's in the mix of, you know, Megatron or Julio Jones, he's at that level. Randy Moss, like, that's the level he's at.

I mean, he blows Larry Fitzgerald out of the water in terms of peak. Larry Fitzgerald has two first team all-pro. He never did anything as great as Larry Fitzgerald's playoff run. No, he does not blow him out of the water. We don't really factor in playoffs too much when we talk Hall of Famers in this room. I think it counts. I mean, they're both no-doubts. It's just, they're both no-doubters.

I mean, Red Zone counts, and Larry Fitzgerald for his entire career was a better red-zone weapon that you have something to speak on here. It's silly to compare them because they're both no doubt. Let's have me to break the tie here. I think Antonio Brown is significantly more dominant than Larry Fitzgerald. But another one. Both of you and well that Greg has a recency bias thing that we can never get over. Everything that happened in the last year or two is better than everything that came before. That's not true at all. Yes it is. You've already got Patrick Mahomes as the greatest quarterback of all time. Then riddle me this because recency bias would you turn you against this guy but if you consider his the records he shattered

in his first few years in the league, Odo Buckham Jr. Now, I know where we are with him and there's certainly not a no-doubter, but I thought about it. It's been a rough couple of years. He was the quickest to, like, a number of records. I'll put him in not yet.

If he comes back and has a couple good seasons. He's in the mix. I mean, yeah, he's in the middle of his career. And I don't think the Brown thing is controversial. I mean, at his peak, and in terms of first team, all pros, there's very few receivers in the last 30 years. I'll say this.

You definitely can't tell the story of football. No, you cannot. Tony O'Brown. And it should be said, Antonio Brown, if you want to make the case to keep him out because he's been a knucklehead and he's had issues off the field,

I'm putting Terrell Suggs in either. And the voters are some other ones too. Explicitly told not to factor in any of that. But they do. They seem like you do. Antonio Gates does retire and you would think. Antonio Gates. He'll go against Eli like that year.

Please don't forget any because we're going to get killed in Twitter if we forget somebody's favorite play. What list do you have Taysam Hill on? Taysam Hill has not made it yet. He's just below Sam Darnold. Gotcha. Looking at your list right now. By the end of the Taysam Hill story,

we will be looking at a hall of him quarterback. Oh, Harrison Smith is a really good choice. Harrison Smith. Oh, that's interesting. Boardline. Cam Jordan, too. But he's on your not yet list. He has to do.

Yeah, these are all. I'm looking at the. got all the... Calaisus Campbell isn't interesting. I saw him, thought about him. Eric Weddle. I think Eric Weddell's going to end up in the hall of very...

I think he has played his last year. I think he'll get discussed Eric Weddell, but if... Yeah, if Rodney Harrison's not in it... It's tricky. All right. There's so many of these guys who are young... Michael Thomas, unless a major injury befalls him,

that guy's definitely on the track. They're on their way. But I'd put him in like the Patrick Mahomes category. Right. Yeah, you got this whole list of young guys. Teakley's interesting because Patrick Willis, for all the love we've given him, he was eligible this year. He wasn't even in the finalists.

Well, that's because the voters do this whole waiting, wait your turn thing. There's like a pecking order. That's like far away from waiting and turn. I think he will get in eventually, but that's like he wasn't even on the short list right off the bat, which was surprising. Are you guys interested in a quick Cliff's notes? People don't even know what Cliff's notes are anymore. But a quick look at what we were talking about in 2014 in the same exercise? So I dug it up.

All right. These were the definites back then. Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Adrian Peterson, Drew Brees. Greg at the time wrote, he's the only one that raises my eyebrows. You weren't in on them on him back then. Bill Belichick, I guess we mentioned a coach there. Troy Palomano, Troy Pal Malu, Big Ben, Larry Fitz. So Larry Fitz, we all agreed it was a no-brainer in 2014.

Reggie Wayne, which there was a little pushback on, Champ Bailey. Oh, I can't say that. And then guys who are very close, Megatron, J.J. Watt, Aaron Rogers, Revis, Shady McCoy. Shady McCoy, you fell off. He's not even in discussion. I think he is. You think he is still? I don't know. He's going to have a hard time making it, but there's a pretty strong argument that he was like the second best running back last decade.

I completely forgot he was on the Chiefs. I'd vote for Morshon Lynch over Shade. I would too. Would you put, he should be in the conversation too. Would you put Pete Carolyn? No, I wouldn't. I don't, I don't know where the bar is with coaches. I just haven't thought about it.

It is, it is tough to, but everyone's always hating on Pete Carroll. I just think he's, right. He's reinvented himself like 12 times. Would you put him over guys like Mike Shanahan and Mike Holmgren? There's so many. No, but I would argue that more coaches should be put into the hall of him.

The fact that we had to wait for Jimmy Johnson this long is absurd to me. Totally absurd. All right, let's, good conversation, guys. Really fun. Before we get out of here, let's hit the middle. bag let's do a few questions Mina I'm ready sound good sounds good all right

what is from Eric Jensen what is the current music of choice on the heroes's playlist and we'll include Mina Kimes as well right now and I made this very clear in a private text to some of our closest friends this morning that I'm very into the 1998

Madonna album Ray of Light specifically the single The Power of Goodbye and that's what I'm all about right good album Oh I get to meena you brought rap Well, yeah, so I'll do a rapper. Again, shout out to my husband, who is a producer, a rapper that he produced, is playing Bud Light concert in Miami this week.

That's legit. Channel Trace. Also, he's in a commercial. What's the name? His name's Channel Trace. And if you've been watching the playoff games, they've been doing these Apple commercials where they do like slow motion selfies. It's a song that they made. Oh, the lady's face.

Yeah, yeah. That's Channel Trace. That's, yeah, my husband produced that. Channel Trace, check it out. Does he get a residual every time that commercial gets on? Let's just say Lenny's eaten well these days. Yeah. Yes.

That for you. Greg, you like rap. I do. But you like other things. I like a lot of other things. I've been listening to a lot of high women lately, which is like a countryish. High woman. You know, music women band.

I've listened to a lot of men. Women or women? Multiple or more. It's like sort of. It's like a super group sort of copied after the highway men, which was like a famous country music. Oh, I love the highwayman. See, there you go. Wes, how about you?

Anything that you're spinning? I like to have my favorite relaxant put on some jazz music and cook, but lately the Buena Vista Social Club album has been like, that's getting a lot of run. Can't go wrong. Mark? I don't have a playlist. I know that makes me absurd. I just, I don't involve myself with it. Will Brinson asks, who is on the Twitter council?

This is, it's good that Will asks us because this came up recently. The idea that during the playoffs, there's too many people tweeting relentlessly about the same game. And we need a council to decide who gets to tweet in these, you know, high profile spots. Will is on the council. Mina, I think, is on the council. Yeah. And by the way.

I thought Claibon was president. Claibon's got to be on there. But forget about, now that I'm thinking about it, forget about this first lady of sports Twitter. This is the president of sports Twitter right here. So, of course, the president is going to be, Her Majesty, the president. Maybe in like a Jamal Adams sense where I'm not really the president,

but I call myself that. But no further than that. Okay. But you are on the council. You have to be because we all trust your judgment. Appreciate that. How many people are on this council for? I think, well, how many do we have?

Three, right? You got three there. I think three is the perfect number. Me, Brinson, and Claibon? Claybond. Some diversity of views. That's what we're looking for. And people that have...

Claibon's been preparing for this role. Almost every minute. Blaybond's feisty. The last few years. He has feisty. Gets into it. Can't wait to see Brinson. Always good to see Brinson at the various tent pole events.

This from Sing for the Day. Now back in Florida, as we head to... Miami. Yes. Will Mark and Greg reunite his jogging buddies? And can Ricky film it and put it to 80s montage music? Yes, for people who don't know, during one of the owner's meetings a few years back,

Mark and Greg put on running shorts and sneakers, and I assume like a pullover of some kind, and went jogging together and bumped into Anderson Cooper. Oh. Yeah, we didn't. I mean, it was kind of totally surreal and striking to be jogging down a path with Greg. That part feeling normal.

But then suddenly Anderson Cooper jogging by us and same a little. thing like people I made it out to be a strange thing people have been jogging together and you know life for years have you ever had a jogging buddy no neither of I it's because you guys have never run it's got I had a second base for the knee started barking but it's just funny you guys running together then we spoon it is I mean it's I thought the whole thing was very organic one it was one time it was in Orlando not in Miami but I'm down I'm definitely bringing some running clothes definitely bringing some running clothes I'm gonna ask you a football

question, Mina. Okay. From Alex Finnis. Sorry. I still had the visual of them and they're jogging shorts. Very high shorts. And on the way back, we saw Bill Belichick.

That was the more memorable sighting to me was we saw Bill Belichick and Linda Holiday holding hands kind of sweaty coming back from the tennis court. Yeah, I almost said Linda Tripp. It was definitely not Linda Tripp. It was Linda Holliday. I forgot about her. So political on this podcast. Come on, Tripp.

She wasn't a very good friend. She was not a really good friend. I've been listening to Slow Burn, which is a good podcast about the Lewinsky's skin. I'd recommend it. Alex Finnis asks, which team do you think is most likely to do what the Niners have done and go from a losing record this season next year's Super Bowl?

Not just get to the playoffs, go to the dance. And it's very early saying because there's no draft and no free agency, but just for fun. Yeah. What was the Steelers final record? Eight and eight, I believe. Not eligible. It doesn't count.

Shoot. Shoot. Okay. We got the standings. What if the Colts get a quarterback? The Colts with Phillip Rivers? Do we think they're going to move on? With the cult of James Winston, let's fly.

I'm going to answer one. Well, you answer first. Yeah. All right, well, me the things, Greg. I want to go Lions because Stafford looked so good before he went out, but I hate the rest of that. I would say the fact, I'm going to go Falcons. The Falcons is wrong about them enough that Lanier. They're not changing anything.

What about the Bengals with Joe? Burrow going 14 and 2 as they will. They don't win playoff games. I've lost faith in the Chargers. Some weird stuff could happen with Miami. All right. How about this from Big Hicks, Say J? How will the Sizzler get revenge on Greg for the wife oiled up comments?

That's a fair question. I mean, why would I, you know, what's this, what's this man's name or this person's name that? Big Hick. Big Hick. Yeah. I mean, why would I reveal my plans verbally on the show right now? When you plot like revenge, it must be a slow cook affair, and it will happen at the perfect time. Eric Sabo asks, I wonder if he's related to Chris Sabo, Wes, one of your reds.

That was a jarring juxtaposition of names there, Eric and Sabre. Should the Broncos take a QB in this upcoming draft, or have you already seen enough from Drew Locke, Wes? Well, I don't like the binary nature of the question. I haven't seen enough from Drew Locke, but I don't think that means that they, should take like a first round quarterback this year. They have other needs. The binary nature of this question is for John. I haven't seen enough from Drew Locke.

I don't think they should draft a quarterback. He's their offensive coordinator now that Skanks has gone. Pat Schumer. Get excited. Moving on. Ricky, this one, I want to tee you up because you did a nice job, Rick Hollywood. On Instagram, you're very youth-oriented. Thanks.

You're our connection to the zeitgeist. and you did a Q&A on Instagram and did very well. And someone asked about the best Super Bowl snack of choice, and I could not have agreed more with your answer. Oh, Buffalo chicken dip. You've got to do it. You got to do it. It's like buffalo wings, but better,

but you just like got the cream cheese and the shredded cheese on top and the hot sauce. It's delicious. You dip the tortilla chips in it. Oh, man. Everybody wins. Well, in Cincinnati, we have Skyline dip, which is similar, Skyline chili with cream cheese and chips. Could you do a vegan option of?

buffalo. I bet you could. I bet you could create a similar flavor. Yeah, definitely. You can do buffalo sauce and like chunks of tofu or something. Are you a meat eater? I am a meat eater. Chunks of tofu. Chunks of tofu. You can tell I don't eat. It's Mark's favorite band. Fun rewarding. Don't need chunks of tofu. A couple more. This one, I'll open it up. And Mina and you're your big time in the podcast industry as well. So from Kieran Westbrook, have any of you ever had a terrible nightmare slash romantic dream involving other members of the pod

and did you tell them? So I co-hosts a ridiculous podcast with my dog who I dream about. The great Lenny. And I have had nightmares where he's in danger or so yeah. Affirmative. Yeah, I have. I've definitely had dreams about this crew,

the three gentlemen in the room. And some have been very disturbing. And I've decided not to share them. In a romantic way? No, not at all. We were told by HR not to share our dreams with people. Oh, yeah, that was a direct. So I've kept it, you know, I've kept it under wraps.

That was a direct order not to discuss your dreams. That was. You shouldn't have that one. Eric Zabo getting us in trouble. I don't think that was Sabeo's question. You got to put that one. It's like four questions. You got to put that one on Kieran Westbrook.

That was the hick. Finally, Mark, I'll close that with you from Sir Awesome of Sauce. Hey, first time, long time. This question is for Mark. if you could go back and tell your younger self to be a fan of any other franchise, would you, and for what team would you tell yourself to be a fan of?

I'll hang up and take my answer on the air, hashtag debate club. No, I wouldn't change. I know that seems absurd because it would be much more enjoyable had I naturally grown up in Giants Terri, just the Giants territory, pick the Giants. But I don't think I would even be sitting here if I rooted for some team that just won it nonstop.

I think football as a fan is about pain too, and I learned from it. It's the only positive of being a fan of a terrible team. It is character building, I feel. I mean, to be... Some would argue in my case that's not occurred, but that is the potential is there for that. That's what's happening in the mailbag.

All right, Mina, listen, you came, you brought potato chips, you brought Migos, barbecuing with my honey, with a dab at ranch, wrap snacks from wave. This is some of the best gas station merch I've ever seen. the Cardi B jerk barbecue. We're going to save these for Colleen.

Cheddar barbecue, which I didn't even know was a flavor. Greg, you take the Migos. You like rap. And that was so nice of you to bring that. And you also brought some sour gummy bears, which is great. I'm going to take one of those because my boys will love that.

Same here. All right. And you played her. You fought through some pain and you played her. A little under the wild. Until the end, I appreciate it. Yeah, no, you're the best, Mina. And this is what you need to know about Mina.

She's the senior writer. She's one of the best. The best football writers there is. So you've got to check out her stuff. And also the great ESPN Daily podcast, which going well. You feel good about it so far? Yeah, we got a bunch of fun stuff. A few months in there, right?

Super Bowl week. Yeah, we've been, we have my friend Bill Barnwell on a lot to talk about the games. We'll be doing stuff from Miami all week. And then I do a straight football. I do a straight football podcast called The Media Com Show featuring Lenny that Greg has been a guest on, actually. That's good times. Yeah, he has a hat.

Limited edition. How come only, Greg? What's going? Probably for the same reasons I haven't been on throwback. I told you, you have a standing in front. Or wait, you have a baby on the way.

I'm just kidding. But I did want to ask Mina a question. I saw you're invited also to the Sloan Sports Conference. You are a person in high demand. There must be multiple times per week where you just think about going to the mountains

and staying there for four months and just leaving everyone in the dust for a while? No, I mean, I... No, you love being in demand. She likes the crank. Yeah, I'm like, I'm the kubiak of sports podcasters. I can't stay away. I can't turn down.

And long-time listener to this show, not every week. I'll be honest. Sometimes I fall behind. It's a lot. It's a lot. But I'm cognizant of some of the inside jokes. Can you put that on like our box set release?

Cogniz. I'm cognizant of some of them. I love their inside jokes. Nina Kynes. Yeah. I love this show. Thank you, Mina. And we love everything that you do.

You're the best. And please come visit us again sometime. See you in. See you in. A city where a football play ball. There we go. Erica. You know, I thought I had a great out there.

No, it was perfect. Feeling good. All right. Let's start the whole show over and get it right. All right, let's go. This is Dan Hansa signing off. Oh, by the way, stay tuned for after a little Easterer. Walking with Giants is back.

Stan Fands is signing off for a Quiet Storm, the mailman, Mina Kimes, the old boss, and Rick Hollywood behind the glass till Tuesday. It's that time, the time you all know, the time you've been waiting for,

it's time for walking with giants. I'm your host, Chris Walken, Uber, New York football team fan, the Giants. New Jersey, more like, don't even play in New York, but nobody. wants to associate any sport team with New Jersey.

Even the Nets moved to Brooklyn. They'd rather be associated with that than a thieves. But I digress. We're here to talk about Eli Manning, retiring. Some say the greatest football player of all time. First about Hall of Famer beat Tom Brady, beat his britches right off his cute little face, makes Peyton look like Little Off and Annie

running around with his little curly hair and his tiny little dress hanging out with the big bald man. Eli, you've done so much for me. You've made me feel so good, at least twice in my life anyway. I just want to say it'll be great to see you play again

in 2020 for the New York Giants. What does the word retire mean, by the way. college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluate team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision

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