NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Gregg Rosenthal, Patrick Claybon and Jourdan Rodrigue’s Reasons for NFL Joy in 2024

Episode Date: July 9, 2024

Gregg Rosenthal is joined by Patrick Claybon and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic for the debut episode of NFL Daily! Before the group tells you what's bringing them joy when thinking about in the 2024 NFL season, they talk about the their thoughts and emotions about the end of Around the NFL. After the break, they talk about changing fourth down decisions (13:45), the new kickoff rules (22:30), year two of C.J. Stroud (29:50), the Steelers (50:45), and more! Note: time codes approximate. NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Welcome to NFL Daily. I'm Greg Rosenthal, and I am beyond lucky today to be joined by Patrick Claibon and Jordan Rodriguez of The Athletic on our maiden voyage for this show here, NFL Daily, in the Chris Wesleyan podcast studio. So this offseason has been a lot. I'm going to talk a little bit. First, guys, before bringing you in, it's got me thinking, what brings joy in life and in football? and we're going to talk about that with our segment coming up in the show but before I do get to you guys I do want to start by addressing the obvious

that this is not the Around the NFL podcast that we taped our last episode of Around the NFL on May 23rd and it was a total shock to all of us and it was very difficult that that was the last show

that we're not going to do another and I know that's going to inspire a lot of emotions from our listeners, from you guys, from anyone that's worked on it. For myself, of course, I get it. Like, I've been going through them, too, for really six weeks now since we did that last show. I still am. We'll go through them together. I love Dan and Mark, and what we built together with Chris was beyond special. Kisha, Chris's wife said it perfectly on IG yesterday that we will always be family. And nothing can take away what we accomplished together.

I do just want to thank everyone, especially like the listeners, but also everyone in this room, you two, and that's ever been in this room, you know who you are and who's in the control room back there and who's been in the control room over the years, whether it's in Culver City. or here, and the listeners, too, because you all helped, you changed all of our lives. You know, you made something so special with us, and you felt like it was always us together, and you stuck with us after Chris died, and we tried not to ask for too much along the way. But I do, I do want to ask for something now. And that's the support the hell out of Mark and Dan and what they're going to do next.

And I love them. I always will. And I want you to support this show too. Give it a chance. Like give both shows some grace and be cool. NFL Daily, it's not going to be the same show. It's not. It can't be.

I wouldn't want it to be. It's going to be different. And we'll get into how, you know, that's going to be different. But it's going to be a great show, too. Like, I'm really excited. It's, as you would say, Jordan, like two things can be true. You know, we can miss that. And this is going to be something we're going to be really proud of.

And I hope you all that are listening are too. I'm looking forward to working with so many people. Colleen's going to be back on the show next week when she gets back in town. And we got Steve Weish and Nick Shook on the show tomorrow. and, of course, you, Jordan, like, welcoming you here. It's really exciting to me. And Patrick, there's no one I, I love working more with, than y'all. And that's it.

I'll let you guys talk a little bit, too. Well, no, and I guess thank you from the standpoint of, obviously, personally, and you know I've said this to you, but from the standpoint of a listener, right because like you get you get guests on a podcast and the relationship is kind of fundamentally different and so i felt right and feel all the things that a lot of people are feeling and then like to have this tangential attachment uh to what you guys built by just being in your vicinity like over on west washington boulevard all the way to over here has just it's been something to experience and like when I think about how much the show means to so many people

I have to remind myself that there's four people and four families who the show means so much more to right and of course when you're experiencing those emotions you like I'm sitting here in the Chris Wessling podcast studio right

um what you guys built it provides people with a level of openness and vulnerability and understanding that a lot of people don't get in real life much less surrounding the discussion of football right um and so doing that it grew the game and there's all these initiatives all of these discussions about how to make the game international right how to accomplish these things i can't think of a better way to protect the shield than to have more people carrying it and that's and that's what you guys did and you don't you don't get that in an excel spreadsheet or an earnings report um there's there's a quality to that that the reason that people feel the emotions that they're feeling is because they

felt that and so i love you guys um and as you said I hope that people are able to get two properties that they can listen to and be a part of an extended family. But I just, sorry, what you guys did is incredible and should be celebrated and in any way that we can, you know, because I haven't known how to react, right? Like, I haven't really known what to say or where to be, and people ask questions, and it's just like, this was incredible, and I'm glad to have experienced it and been the small part of it. Yeah, we've had, at least like a little time since taping that show. I appreciate all that, Patrick, to process it a little, but obviously letting everyone know, letting the listeners know this week.

It's just different. And we're going to get to the football of it all, but yeah, do want to hear from you too jordan yeah i mean it's that openness that you guys created that um it's going to make it really hard for me to get through this next couple seconds here but it's also that space that you guys created that allows me to be able to try right um like the listeners of this show know i am one of them um i've been one of them i've been you know lurking in all the same places they've been lurking for years and years i've been listening um this podcast to me that you and Mark and Dan and Chris, the heroes that you guys created that

so many other people created, it got me through some really hard stuff. And I don't think for a long time you guys knew that the space you created and the safety you created for people to come in and just sit with people who they thought were a good hang and they like listening to. But then that space became really an open door. into this thing that so many of us are passionate about. And for all the words that we can't use sometimes to describe it, because we don't know how, we would turn to you guys. And I would turn to Wes.

And football was a closed door for me in a lot of ways for a long time. And the way that he talked about football and the way that he wrote, because that's what I found first, that opened the door for me and I never got to tell him that but I was here a couple months ago Greg and I know you saw me staring at the door of the studio and having a moment and at the after we recorded that show I had to tell all of you guys what that meant for me that was why I was so nervous the fan base was so nice I was so nervous I'm so freaking nervous still like I'm terrified because this is really hard because it matters. This mattered so much to me and it mattered

so many people and it mattered to you for and your families. And I want to preserve that. I did not have, I did not build the house that we're sitting in right now. I didn't. I watched and I enjoyed and I supported from afar. And I think now I'm getting tapped on the shoulder in a small, in a very small capacity to support up close. everybody to support you to support mark to support dan and i'm going to do that because finding this show open a door to football for me in a way that i didn't know was possible football to me is my purpose on this earth and all i can do is pay this forward to you to mark to dan to everybody as as as as best i can as as as as much as you'll have me as much as they'll

have me i just want to i just want to help keep that door open for people who were like me who still are like me, who doesn't matter what you look like, where you come from, your knowledge level, like I want to help keep that door open, and that's why I'm sitting here. That's why I continue to support you.

That's why I continue to support those two guys and will until I'm done on this planet because that changed my life. And so, like, beautiful and bittersweet and just life, man, and this happens so much when I think about the impact. Chris has had on all of us that you're saying those words and sitting in that seat and everything in his studio because like how you approach football, it reminds me a Wes.

Like that's one of the reasons I was really, I've told you this before, but it's one of the reasons why I wanted you to come on the show initially. It's why I'm so excited that you're part of this show when you say football is your purpose on this earth. Like it can mean everything to us. And we also. kind of can put it to the side that it means nothing. And it's just this thing we're incredibly passionate about. The way you see the game that you want to understand it, because I do think it's the one thing is going to be my 21st season doing football since I started at Roto World. And I still love it so much.

And we're going to get to what we're really looking forward to in this season shortly. But like the gap, and this was when I started, what I realized, after three or four months, because I, I live dollar sports was like, the gap between what we know and what we don't is so much greater than any other sport. And trying to, like, fill that gap is what gets me really excited and excited about NFL daily. That it's going to be different, but, like, we're going to have this journey. And it's been a lot this off season. Thank you, everyone that's listening for your patience, too,

because I know it's been silent and the uncertainty. was tough and like I want to be like really open in this show when we do these shows and just honest and like look full full transparent like my family was going through you know some serious health issues that are very uncertain during all this and when this happened you know that that was part that was part of everything part of the decisions and and what I'm going to do and I'm so happy like there's like great news on that front recently and man like this week like the sun's been shining better and and food is tasting better and it all puts it in perspective of, you know, what matters in life.

And that football can matter. As stupid as it is, like, I find joy in this football thing. You guys do. I couldn't quit it if I tried. And so we're going to celebrate it and try to figure it out and talk about what we are looking forward to and the joy that we're going to get out of this season as training camps start. to get going next week and we'll do that in our first segment after the break. What's up everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks.

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Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Okay, we are back on NFL Daily and apologize for that hard transition from whatever ad just played to what we said ahead of the break. and what we're going to say now, too, which I'm really excited about. It's been a minute. It's been a minute since we podcasted, Patrick and Jordan, obviously, you too.

And, like, we're close. The Texans are showing up next week. And I was debating, like, whether we get back in the studio, you know, this week, next week. I want to get ready to go. And I wanted to, like, set this first segment up of just, like, What are we looking forward to? Like, what is the things during this off season for me, that's how I thought about it, during this off season, which been a little challenging, obviously, but I still been staying on top of the football of it all. Like, what am I looking forward to the most?

What do I think is going to give me the most joy as we are looking ahead to the 20, 24 season? And I want to start this with Patrick Claibon. It's over the common theme with all the things that I'm looking forward to is most of it is uncertainty. I like that Because pushing back towards this idea Of how much we don't know Right What part of the things that you were talking about earlier

Okay, so last season Only 19 teams converted more than 50% of their fourth down attempts And I say only Because in the two previous years It was 23 and 24 We raved about how good the Eagles were In fourth down last season

They finished at 73% The year before the Rams had the lead at 78% when the thing they had the lead it that the one thing that the 22 Rams were good at I think right it would go back to 2018 Anthony Lynn's chargers converted 87% of their fourth down attempts they only went for it eight times they got seven of them the the idea of how going forward on fourth down is always better is slowly starting to not become better because I think teams are getting better at defending all of these fourth down attempts.

And so it's pushing towards this uncertainty of what's going to happen at fourth down of all the cycle. And I'm just, I'm excited to see that cycle start to come to its fruition. And maybe we're getting to a point where maybe less than half of the league is converting 50%. I don't know, but it's going to be fun. So I'm shocked, actually. I'm being

serious that that Claibon started with like sort of an analytic bent to it. He's going to make me cry a second time. Right. Right. What he's looking forward to. Because I hear those numbers and I still think, okay, we got a little ways to go. like, okay, I mean, you're saying only 19 teams are over 50%. It's like, okay, that's still pretty good.

And those percentages are pretty high. But you do speak to what's the natural evolution of anything analytic or, you know, the money ball effect when baseball started that way. It's like, yeah, once every team starts doing the same thing, then it is increasingly less effective and you have to pivot. I think we're seeing that now in team building when you think about the off ball linebacker position. And like, the analytical model of building your team

and kind of not worrying about off-ball linebackers was so copied until you got to the playoffs last year and maybe the last couple years. And it's like, you can point to so many teams. Like, the Cowboys would be one. Certainly the Eagles. And you can point to all these teams that keep losing the playoffs. And you're like, literally the entire game plan

that the other team was making is because your off-ball linebackers are bad. And then you kind of look at like, who's got the best off-ball linebackers? linebackers, they're the best teams in football. They're the best defenses in football. So I hear you on the fourth down. Teams will have to adjust on their short yardage strategy and come up with new stuff. I feel like we still have some, I don't want to be, I don't want to stop calling for fourth downs, I guess is my issue. Yeah. Like going for it. I will still be calling for certain coaches who typically don't go for it on fourth down to go for it on fourth down. What team do you

cover on a regular basis? Speaking, the offball linebacker thing, we we actually call that the Shana plan, you know, circle the other teams, middle linebacker and then just spam that player mercilessly over and over and then like laugh behind the play card that you're doing it. But I think it's interesting because when you see changes like that, when you see teams get really good at going forward on fourth down and also more teams who are understanding analytics meets, sorry Patrick, but momentum, feel and flow of the game, when you're seeing the analytics meet some of these like very stereotypical coaching. principles. That's the, that's the shift that you're starting to see a little bit. You're seeing

more and more of that. I mean, you know, again, we joke about it, but Sean McVey hired Stretch at a Tennessee. And he's like one of the game management guys in the league. And even so he, even he is, who is like one of the most conservative. It's like his full name. He's a one name guy. John Stryker. Rihanna. Stretch is easier because I always say, is it stretch or is it striker? And he is tall. So stretch. Well, that's because did they try to hire you first? or? Well, because I, because Jordan's too, too humble about this, but like her getting on them about their fourth down decisions and like writing an article about it. Every week. Every week,

but there was one I remember in particular last year where you really did it. Like, there was a pretty clear before that article and after that article of like how often Sean McVeigh was going for. I'm just saying. That's to get back to the point. But that's true. that's not the first time I'm going to interrupt your point. Praise deflection is Jordan's number one skill. Spinning praise. Like, love your shirt, Patrick, by the way. Spinning praise, is that?

Like a ninja move. Yeah. So, but I think the more teams get used to the fact that this is going to be the wave now in the NFL. Like, what I don't think a lot of people on the outside see is that you literally are starting to structure practices different. You're literally starting to build more time in, not just for a, more full play sheet, more full play design out of a fourth down bucket, so to speak, do you sort of like that lingo? You know, you don't often have time to build out a full

malleable and adjustable, evolvable, fourth down plan in traditional and typical punt on fourth down kind of situations for practice. There is no time in the week. It's not criticizing the coaches who don't do it. And for a long time, most the league wasn't or it hasn't. It's just that there's no time during the week. You got to get to red zone for. god's sake you got to walk to the bus and install things as you go you got to troubleshoot during walkthroughs like all of these different things with the the week of preparation is so it's so tight to fit all of those things in well now what you're starting to see and and i heard about this this off season is more teams building out that scheduled time it's kind of similar we're going to

talk about it the kickoff the new kickoff building more time during the week not just for what you're going to do on fourth down and all the situational is that you're going to build into the natural part of the weekly plan instead of those guys are in another department on the other side of the building. No, they're in the coaching rooms now. And that's growing across the league. And then also you're seeing by proxy, teams are getting better at defending it because there's more tape. There's more tape on what you're going to potentially do. There's more data. There's more situation. So if you are seeing that and everything springs back around. So basically everyone's just becoming more like Bill Belichick's been for like 40 years. It took what, 20 minutes for you to bring up

Bill Belichick? I'm just saying. I thought we might. I mean, I'm exactly. I'm exaggerating a little bit. All I'm saying is that I think they prepped game management situations on a more consistent and specific level than other teams were. I'm even talking about the Giants back in the 80s and 90s and the Patriots. And that's all. Not that he was perfect about it or that it's all like, it's not about the analytics of it all.

But I think they literally just spent more time doing that stuff than other teams. I know this because every player that's left. there is like we spent way more time on this stuff. The culture of communication, I think in the league has changed a lot. Yeah, I agree. And so you're not necessarily going to have something like a Bill Belichick

maybe taking criticism from the outside and applying it, right? To whereas now there's more communication about the way that people operate. I think people share more now. More information available. And so like while you

could bemoan like people you know, quote unquote, like analytics is this all-consuming monster that does everything. Everybody does it differently and everybody applies it differently. And you can have the Shanahan tree coaching half the league, but it can still be different, right? Because of the

everything is this meta-analysis and then we get the analysis of the analysis and it just creates more uncertainty, which is football. To that point though, like we have so much cool information and so much cool math and like it is so, such an awesome tool, but nothing actually changes in shifts like what you're noticing

until the actual tangible functionality of how the week is planned shifts. And I'm talking scheme, I'm talking position value, I'm talking anything. It doesn't actually start to shift that way until they build in structure tangible things that create those changes that can, you have to rep it. You have to rep it and rep it and rep it and rep it. And then you start seeing like these things trickle out of buildings during training camps, joint practices, I think across the league are going to be huge this year because that's what's going to bring me a lot of joy because we're going to watch the kickoff. Is this one of your things? This is one of my things. All right, let's get to it. Yes, it's the new kickoff. I did get to watch like practices of the new

kickoff this spring. It rules. Really? It's chaos. Nobody knows what they're doing yet, but it rules. But the thing that I wanted to point out is you see, I don't have the specific numbers. I'm failing Patrick already. I don't have the specific numbers in front of me. But you're seeing an increase in scheduled joint practices. A huge reason for that in my theory is people need a clean, like a clean sheet, a clean practice, a safe practice with some contact to practice the new kickoff in. And they don't want to show that tape across the league. A couple special teams coordinators were around talking like the first team that figures this out is going to have such an advantage on different teams and it brought me a lot of joy watching it because it's it just looks so you get

something so weird it's just but it was new this is it this is what we always talk about on this show this is like if you went back and listen to and I'll do this a few times this is our first show this is what we used to talk about on around the NFL like first season like Wes and I would always like talk about like why doesn't the NFL innovate more why doesn't the NFL change more like and they do compared to other sports like their ability to change I think I don't know it I'm very excited about this too. Yeah, it's chaos because the kickers, they compare it to like, so if you're thinking about, I guess, golf clubs, which I don't golf, but it is interesting to think about they're

switching different cleats out and trying to see, okay, this like moldable to my foot soccer cleat on my right foot and then a regular football cleat on my left foot. And like, that's the plant foot. And then it's like, you know, using different clubs that are in your bag to have placement, to have precision, to do different things for your return unit, essentially. And then on the other side, I mean, I just think you're going to see people try some wild stuff. You're hearing buzziness about like outside linebackers returning puns. I am a little worried there's so much talk of like how crazy it is and are they going to get

there and chicken out. But I'm with you. Don't chicken out. This is my message to special teams coordinators across the nation. Do do do do do do do. Do not chicken out on this. I'm shaking my finger. you, Patrick, but don't like, I'm so, I'm so hyped about this because watching them practice and like what, what it could possibly be, what it could turn into. And Bones Fossil, who used to coach for the Rams now in Dallas, he was like the point, one of the point people on this. And hearing him in the little back hallways of league meetings and before the votes and explaining it to coaches, explaining it to owners, not just the safety element of it, but also leading to more

scoring. I mean, you've got an offensive trending league. If you just say, to, you know, the coach, half the coaches in the league, like, you could score more points this way, then automatically, you know, they start to, they start to pivot toward that. But, but the way that teams can do it, you're running, it's almost like, um, you're running run game plays. Like you're running a, like, you're seeing counter, you're seeing duo. Like, but in the kick return stuff, like, it's, it's really, really interesting. I'm telling you. And I think it also, to your point earlier, I do think it helps with the international presence too, because you're going to see people try stuff. You're going to see, oh, can this rugby player come do this for us? And that's

his role. And he's like a call-up on the roster. I can't wait for it. It will create a higher scoring average. Now I'm thinking, I wonder if that was part of the pitch and why it did get through. Not because it's necessarily going to be that effective. That's really hard to predict. Exactly. But because the field position is just going to be better. Because so many people, this is what I worry about, is just going to take the kickoff to the 30, that they're going to accept, you know, the touchback and everything and that field position is just going to be increased, but then you're going to deal with that. You have to cut off a 10th of your play sheet.

If you're an offensive-minded coach, and you're saying, okay, we'll accept, we'll acquiesce to the third. Like, you're going to cut, you're cutting off like a 10th or a 12th of your play sheet at that point. So why, you know, if you want, you want, you want, you everything wide open for you, right? And, and all of that. But I, but I do think, like, the reason why you're seeing to circle back, you're seeing these joint practices get scheduled against a wide variety of people, um, because you can't show that tape to anyone else. You can get as close to live action football as possible in a practice setting. So within the safety guidelines and all of that, but still some contact. And you won't really know what any of this, like, it is why I compare it to the run game so

much like you don't actually know what any of this is going to look like until you hit somebody until you have pads on and do it but they also don't want to do this they don't want to show what they've got like offensive coaches defensive coaches they want to be super vanilla in the preseason because if they happen to find you know that one thing they don't want 31 other teams to see it it's like okay if it's two non-conference opponents who see it fine and it's kind of like it's like a lot of things with the NFL we won't really really know until the season starts. But that makes me really excited about it.

I do want to have Sam Schwarzstein on this show. He's been on it before, actually. He works on the TNF Prime video, and he did a recap with me last year. But he helped write this rule for the XFL. Because I don't want to say too much about it because I did spend, like, I don't know if you'll find this sad or lonely.

I'll probably find it sad. I definitely watched like 30, minutes of this one night at like one in the morning when I couldn't sleep. And it didn't help me, it didn't help me kind of figure out how this is all going to work. It's very confusing to me. So I feel like I need to see more. Well, I think that we're going to see, even when we do finally see it, it's going, there's going to be metatrends that, that happened over the course of several weeks. And they're going to be tight-lipped about it. And I'm sure, like, reporters are going to get scolded for video of a kickoff. And when it's like, you know, it's like apartment buildings.

trying to goad me into sending him a video. No, I'm just kidding. I don't, I don't, including the special teams coaches. Because you're talking about checking and out. I know a lot of times special teams coaches get to be the sacrificial lamb, right?

And you're going to have somebody give up a couple of touchdowns and maybe. And so like it's going to be super safe. And, um, you know, I, we don't know how it's going to turn out. Right.

That's the best part. The wild card. The uncertainty. The theme. But that's one of the cool things about this though is like, I've never met a special teams coach who isn't, like, kind of nuts in the best way. So this is, this, this is their moment. It's giving them life.

You're right. They've been kind of marginalized. That play was marginalized. And anything that gets, uh, the excitement of what used to be one of the most exciting plays, I'm all into it. I'm, look, I'm, I'm, I'm for the, uh, you know, the rule where you, where you could choose to, to go for it on fourth and fifth. I'm, I'm all for crazy rules.

I think the NFL, we need. more of this moving forward. We've done two things now. I love it. We're waiting on yours. I'm going to go simple because the reason I mentioned that is because I was like, okay, we're only going to get through so many where this show is going to be three hours. And maybe this seems boring, but it's just simple and it's just true. For me, it's CJ. It's C.J. It's C.J. Stroud. And that's just like, it's not just because my son Walker was the only attendee of the Super Bowl last year at least that I saw

that was wearing a C.J. Stroud jersey. That's like a little part of it. The joy that it brings my son because, yeah, like, C.J. Stroud made my son, I think a Texans fan for life. I think it's sticking and I think he's just going to be

with this guy and this team. And I don't know why that is, but for me, because we're separate. I'm here. He's there. And for me, it's like, he's just got everything he wants. He's had a great off season. I've loved the Micah Parsons.

We're talking about CJ now. CJ, yes. CJ Stroud. You never know. I love the Mike Parsons and C.J. Stroud, like, road show. I love basically every appearance C.J. Stroud has said. So I, like, love them as a dude, but I wouldn't really care about that if I didn't love watching him as a player. And, like, I start with the quarterbacks that I tend to like with guys that first, like, can just make beautiful throws.

And usually, like, at least a starting point, like, beautiful throws with anti- from the pocket. And he reminds me of Philip Rivers in that way, like Herbert a little bit, to what I liked about Herbert when he first came out, how he gets through the reads so quick.

It reminds me a little bit of Gino in that way. And so that's like the starting point. And then there's like what he can do off script, which I think is underrated, and what he can do intangibly as a leader. that to me, like, he's just, I hate the analysis. Like, I know you hate this analysis, Patrick, when it's like, he's got it. But I think that is part of it for me. And it all, like, it all comes

together in this package that I actually don't think people appreciated quite how incredible he played last year, because I did go back and watch him this off season. And I think when you watch him, you can make a strong case that he was like a top seven or eight quarterback in the NFL. A very easy case. Like as a rookie. Simple. And since I've started doing this, I don't think there's maybe anyone else that you could say that about.

Like luck was sniffing there, but not there. RG3 was sniffing there, but not there. Dak was there. Actually, I think Dak's a good comparison. I think CJ Stroud showed even more about how Dak performed that year. And I just think he'll be the, just knowing everything that we know about him and knowing what's around him and Stefan Diggs and all that stuff.

Like, I just think the growth from year one to year two is just like, I can't freaking wait for this to watch this dude play. And I'm not even like tinging at the, he's got it. Right. Because the it in this instance, right, is his natural ability as a football player and also the honesty that he approaches the game with and discussing the game where you hear C.J. Stroud say something.

and of course, you know, those of us who agree with him, we're like, yeah, he's a ball nowhere. But like, legitimately, it provides a window into, oh, well, yeah, if you go into the huddle with this guy, of course you're going to believe what he says. And, like, the way that he discusses a play break. Like, of course, people remember that viral interview with Cooper Cup and Bridget Condon, right? And so, like, you get that level of discussion, and it's like, yeah, that that's what it is

this guy is a person who I can who's one of the most talented people on the planet but I can actually relate to him as a human being and oh yeah he's a very good quarterback and I think that's what it is and of course like that's exciting I'm glad the Texans are good now yeah it's it's fun

it's such a fun team also for so many reasons but he is at the forefront of that and like he speaks how he plays he's he I have in my notes CJ Stroud dash ball knower Supreme ball knower But he speaks how he plays in that he has this assuredness, this conviction, so much about what a rookie quarterback has to learn how to do in his first year has nothing to do with anything that happens after the snap. A lot does, but it's all how you control the huddle, how you manage your teammates, how you learn with your receivers, how you get people to do what you need them to do, and how you absorb what other things people need from you.

but doing so with such conviction and such an assuredness. I mean, the dude oozes leadership, first of all, for someone so young, it is really fun. Again, we talked about being, you know, as fans of the sport, it is so fun to watch. Somebody be so, he is like basically an on his sleeve player. Like you're going to know where he's at because he will show you and he'll play like that and he'll be that dude. And I think what's cool is they're not going to have to start in a typical year two with him.

They're not going to have to go through a teaching progression that I would think would be typical for a quarterback going into tier two. I'm really excited to see. No, you saw during the season last year. The difference between him in week three to week 14 or whatever was massive. Yeah, he's advanced. I mean, he has gone past what the normal steps would be when you think about, okay, how do we give this guy what he needs, but not too much because he's still growing and

he's a kid and we've got to get, you know, an NFL, full NFL. off season and all of those things. But he showed that very early on, you know, it was super interesting to watch sort of the collective conscious wake up to the qualities and the traits that he had already showed. He already was that guy. And so to see like the collective sport really appreciate, but then I think whatever, you know, he's kind of given that appreciation right back to the sport. I mean, I've loved hearing him talk on, on the podcast and all those things because It's just fun. You just think this guy is going to be around for a long time.

And he didn't show what his ceiling would be and instead showed an extremely high floor. And that's super important when you think about team building, when you think about when this team is going to be ready to really push, to really go all in. You think about everything centers around how fast you can get through these years. And he's going to go through him in a truncated time.

And the throws are pretty. Like, oh, yeah, they slice. Like, that's sort of like where it starts for me. Like, they're just, oh, dude. They're just sort of majestic and the anticipation of it all. And I do want to be careful of expectations. I'm not, I thought now when I think more deeply about it, since we started, since, you know, we did around the NFL, Justin Herbert, like, was the guy I was most confident going

into year two would like, you know, be an MVP candidate, that sort of thing. And, you know, his growth since then has been. I think there's reasons for that. And I think reasons that CJ Stroud will avoid in terms of the continuity with the coaching staff and certainly the talent around Stroud. But I do want to be careful of just like expectations. Like some things could be, could be bumpy. Like it doesn't mean that he's going to climb to the very top of the quarterback like ladder this year.

But I'm not ruling it out either. Like defenses would, we'll adjust. But like I've just, I've seen enough. We know. And it's, it's going to be fun to be a long. the ride from. We are going to take a quick break and then we're going to come back with some more things that we're looking forward to in 2024. What's up, everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take

you inside the game from scouting reports and player development to team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week we study the tape, talk to decision makers, and share the insights you won't find anywhere else. It's the kind of conversation that connects the dots from college football prospects to the NFL stars of tomorrow. We break down the draft, analyze matchups, and evaluate how teams put it all together on game day. Plus, we dig in the coaching strategies, roster construction, and the trends that shape the league year after year. Whether you're a diehard fan or just love understanding the game on a deeper level, we give you the full picture. If you want insight that goes beyond the box score, this podcast is for you.

Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Six podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Matt Jones. Now, I'm Drew Franklin. And this is NFL cover zero. We're just here to try to give you an NFL perspective a little bit different. Did you see the Colts pretzel? That was my other big takeaway from that game.

What was that? Oh, my. We think NFL coverage should be informative and entertaining. And twice a week, that is. exactly what you're going to get. Listen NFL Cover Zero with Matt Jones and Drew Franklin on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more.

I'm Marcus Grant. And I'm Michael Fiorio, and together we host the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast. Ready to dominate your fantasy league this season? Then you need the NFL. Fantasy Football Podcast, your ultimate source for player news, draft tips, and winning strategies. Whether you're a rookie manager or a fantasy vet. We've got the insight to help you crush your opponents. Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. All right. continuing on with the things. related to the National Football League, Patrick, that get you up in the morning, you know, they get you going. We've had a little break and we're back at it. And I want to get back at seeing teams go from worse to first.

Okay. We just talked about C.J. Stroud and the Texans were very close, you know, and looking at the bears, the chargers, the Cardinals, the Panthers, the commanders, the Patriots. unfortunately the Titans like we don't believe it right now but there's a chance like of course we did this exercise on game day view and the obvious answer is the Cincinnati Bengals right but I think one of those other teams despite all of the things that they're facing has a chance to do it and I it's it's one of those situations you have a specific one or just saying any he wants

you to say Patriots so bad no I don't I don't do you want me to say the Patriot? No, I've been emotionally disconnecting. I got a lot of heat for that, but it's just been the facts. Drake May being back, then Drake May in the mix, though. I'm going to enjoy it. But no, they're not going to win their division. Because we just saw

the Houston Texans have this incredible turnaround and the bears were making like, I think you can make a case. Bears, I think so. I think so. The Chargers. I think the Cardinals, you can that there be a fun team. Yeah. Probably not win the division, but a fun team. Yeah, their division kills them, but yeah, they're...

For all of these teams, maybe you could make a case for the Titans, but all of them are better than they were a season. Well, I think the Patriots are going to be better than people think. I was shocked when I saw the, like, you know, spoiler, unless everything changes on the desert front, like we, every year we've done a, like, before the season, we've had Bill Barnwell on. He's coming on later this week, by the way.

I'd be excited about that. And, you know, drafted over unders. The fact that the Patriots, I think, were four and a half or five and a half. Yeah, like, forget that. Yeah, I'm so excited to see what the Bears do. Their defense was already solid. Kind of came along a little bit better. Iber Fluse is kind of maybe coaching for some tenure here.

You know, just give or take how the year starts. And I am so excited to see Caleb Williams. I mean, you guys get, you guys know, living out here in L.A. Being awake, watching the games, you know, well after the sun has set, you know, he's, he's so special. And obviously, this doesn't even need to be said because he was the number one overall pick and highly touted prospect and legendary thrower already. But, like, still, putting it all together can be so hard for teams. We've seen that. We've seen that with teams with number one overall picks.

And that can be really difficult. But I think he has, I don't want to, I don't want to put. too much optimism in the Chicago Bears before we actually see proof of concept, but I do think life gets a lot easier when you find the quarterback. I personally think they've found the quarterback, and now building

around them will be important. I do want to give you guys my hot Cardinals take, because I don't feel like the Cardinal, they're crushed by their division, and so I think they get overlooked a lot, right? Like, not overlooked in the sense that it's unfair because they've been bad and

gone through a lot of different things, But the stuff that they were doing last year, Drew Petzing, Nick Rallis, under the Jonathan Gannon sort of umbrella, it was weird and it was cool. And you would hear quarterbacks talk about it like, I don't know what they were doing. I hadn't seen that what they were doing on defense. They would sometimes do these things where they'd like do like a walk around pre-snap look where they'd sort of just like and all of a sudden rush to the snap. They were just trying stuff.

And I thought it was cool. I was like, they were doing a really good job for that. And then you look at the end of the year and it's like dead last and like EPA for play loud. So defensively, I did want to balance it with that thing. I thought like it felt like it was cool and it was good and they were overachieving. And then I looked and there was like actually their defense was a sip. Offense totally different. They improved a ton.

But I do, I mean, statistically they were not a good team. Like let's be clear on that. Like let's be very clear. But sometimes when you see process stuff like that, when you see troubleshooting, when you see what works, what doesn't work, it's almost like I would kind of with those two coordinators, I would almost compare it to when you give a quarter. when a quarterback has a year to sit instead of coming right in. I mean, obviously, they didn't have a year to sit and, like, cut their teeth on being

coordinators and being a real team and all of that. Like, the results were the results and the stats were the stats. But it was similar vibes where, you know, Kyler was hurt. You weren't going into it. You were kind of like, what is this going to be? Okay, let's just see everything we're not first. Like, let's try, let's try things. Let's do these different things.

I'm not saying that they're going to be a contender here. I think they could be really fun, honestly. I do think that, especially, you know, with healthy quarterback and all of those different things and the draft classes that they've put together, like, they could be really fun. Yeah, but I think that they did some stuff that was interesting and fun. And a lot of times teams do not get an opportunity or even a chance to do that without super high stakes. And that could potentially lead to something cool. So it's not like a super hot, I guess it's not a super hot Cardinals take.

It's a very lukewarm. Cardinals. Kyler Year 2 is on my long list, which we're not getting to like almost any of them at this point. But they were the number two of rushing attack last year and EPA per play after Kyler return. Full stop. Like they were just by the numbers about a top 10 offense

after Kyler returned. I thought him in that offense, and you could see he wasn't fully back from the injury physically and was getting up to the speed of the offense. But I thought he did things... just as a quarterback that I didn't always see with Cliff Kingsbury. I saw growth, like, process-wise. And, man, that makes me very excited about them.

And I think the ceiling side, you meant, we mentioned the Bears, by the way, and all that. We're going to hit on tomorrow's show with Steve Weish and Nick Shook. Everything we've missed, everything that has happened in the NFL, essentially as much as we can, like as much news rundown that we think matters. One of them is that, yeah, the Bears are the Hard Knocks team, which is cool. So that we can get into getting into this team. I like, I'm into like eight weeks straight of Hard Knocks.

The first episode, I know people had their doubts on the Giants' Hard Knocks, but it was, I found it compelling. I thought it was a good addition. I'm going to give a quick one that you guys don't need to comment on, and then I'll throw it to you, Jordan. Just a very quick one is just like, if you look at Week 18 last year, here are some quarterbacks that did not play, Aaron Rogers, and that will be playing week one, hopefully.

Aaron Rogers, Kirk Cousins, Anthony Richardson, Joe Burrow, Caleb Williams, Jaden Daniels, Drake May. That's a quarter of the league right there. And, like, those are all dudes, and they're going to be playing, you know, health-willing week one. So that's just a quick one that I'm excited about. It's so nice that your point actually sets up my point, so thank you for that.

I'm looking at like year-two quarterbacks in general, And I'm, I think, maybe more excited about these guys than possibly guys that are just coming in and being rookies. Because I try not to grade rookies too difficult, like with too much difficulty. There's a learning curve. There's, you know, the whole ship has to get built around them at some point. And like we touched on with C.J. Stroud, it's, you know, he's a very pleasant outlier in the sense that so much worked and he really worked and everything really clicked. But the year two guys, I mean, obviously we talked about C.J. I'm so excited to see.

I hope Anthony Richardson gets a full season. I think he is so special. Some of the throws he was making last year before he got hurt. There's some controlled chaos, but in the best way, in that way that makes defenders hesitate. What the heck is this guy going to do? And he can hurt you every which way. And pairing him with Shane Steichen, like a lot of these year two guys,

I mean, Bryce Young, that's to me a really compelling story after what he went through last year and what it must have done in terms of, like, how do you manage that mentally? That's going to be really significant and unproven, really, relatively unproven play caller in Dave Canales. And you're going to kind of see,

can you write the ship with this young man? Like, can he figure out, can they maximize some of the qualities that did make him a really strong prospect, you know, coming out of the draft that weren't necessarily available to him? Does he actually have more skills and more tools around him? And I kind of, he doesn't qualify structurally. So nobody dig me on this.

Please don't yell at me for this. But Jordan Love in year two of like being the dude. No, that's not acceptable. Well, I'll just, I'm going to go. That's actually the end of NFL Daily. Killed the show. It's been a good first episode. Like, it's fine.

Yeah. Yeah, it was all right. But year two of being. the dude like like fully having the reins fully being you know with working fully with matliflor fully having sort of the um you know the shadow not a negative way but the shadow of like the legendary quarterback who came before him fully away from that building um and i you know obviously structurally he does not qualify as a year two quarterback but a year two as franchise guy um i i loved how he put together that season last year i loved seeing the collaboration um um

between him and Matt LaFleur. I think it's like so magical when the coach, you know, and the quarterback can suddenly, you can see the planning together. You can see them truly collaborating and troubleshooting together. That's what I think a lot of these year two guys do have in common. We have yet to see with Bryce Young, obviously. But they do have that really heady way of being able to vocalize

and verbalize what they want, of being able to really construct an offense all of these young quarterback. do. And that's really exciting to me. I mean, that's, that's really fun for the sport in general. But it's also really fun when it's like, get out of their way a little bit, let them cook. And I think a lot of these guys have that in them. And so much of the like, should a quarterback start, should a quarterback sit discussion to me is based on our perception of who they are. And so we, if it goes bad, right, we perceive them as bad and think that, oh, well, our bias has been confirmed. This guy started early and now he's bad. Right. But,

Bryce was in a horrible situation. Oh, yeah. And I think we can go back to look at camp reports and conversations surrounding Jordan Love early in his career where it's like, this is not working. And I think... Or Aaron Rogers. I can't remember, was it Craig Knaul or something?

Like, he was the fourth quarterback. He was struggling his rookie year in camp. And I remember it was two Super Bowls before, two Super Bowls ago. we were talking to Aaron Jones on Super Bowl live and Michael Robinson asked him before the segment like hey how's Jordan Love doing

and Aaron said oh Jordan Love's ready like this is it Jordan Love is a quarterback he's real he's legit and Mike Rob was like hey we're not taping right now you can be honest and there was like there was that level of skepticism and then early on in the season the skepticism was still there

and all of a sudden he goes nuclear and it's like this is it and Jordan Love would never be question now. And I'm with Jordan. Like, yes. I think we can get that from some of these year two guys and completely shift our perception because it's, that's football.

Well, Jordan loves specifically is like a bit of a mystery box. I think the floor is higher than we ever would have expected. The ceiling is through the roof. As Michael Jordan. As Michael Jordan. Like, he's just preposterous. He reminds me of

Kaepernick and Josh Allen, at least just in the way that he makes me feel when he sort of first came out, just like, oh, like anything is possible here. I don't know what's going to happen. And some of it's going to be bad. And those are the two guys. And I think it's just because also just their physicality and just their just talent that just is undeniable that he reminds me. Not that he plays exactly like them, but just in the way that he makes me feel like he is an incredible value

ad as a quarterback. And that's that is kind of what it's about, at least for me. Like, it's like, when you're picking which games to watch, ultimately the games that you don't want to watch as much are the ones and the quarterbacks, you're not going to be excited about. I'm going to do one more and then we're going to take

one last break. And it's just the Steelers being stealery. I was, I actually am, I genuinely am into this. Like, we have so much, you know, none of us have done a podcast. We haven't talked about football in a while.

Like, we have a lot to get to, and we're going to get to it. It's called NFL Daily. So we're going to have plenty of time as we build up to this season. But I mean it, like, the defensive front reminds me so much of the Steelers teams in the aughts

in the early 2010s that just like, well, that's what the Steelers are. They're two preposterously good outside linebackers. And then a third, that probably is better than your second. And then they're, and that's, you know, T.J. Watt and Alex Highsmith. And I really like Nate Herbert coming in. And then, oh, yeah, by the way, there's also like a couple massive difference makers in the front

with Cameron Hayward and County Benton, who I think is a making the leap type of candidate. If we do a making the leap show, like really good last year for them on the inside. And so that's their defense. And it's Tomlin. And they recently, you know, they got Larry Ogun Joby. I think Jerry Porter Jr., he's a dog like. they're just, I think they're quietly going to be one of those Tomlin defenses. And then, oh, by the way, it's the Art Smith revival. It's like the run scheme. Like, you can fault Art Smith for a lot

of things, but it's a pleasing run scheme to watch when it works. And what I think of is just, you know, the pulling tackles and stuff. And when Broderick Jones came in last year as a pulling tackle, they improved, like, day one, and he is just like a monster of highlight blocks on the edge. And now he's moving to left tackle. And who do they take in the first round? Troy Fautanu, who is the most massive, the most intimidating, like, pulling blocker. And I don't, I don't know if this is all going to work. I have a feeling. We're going to be talking with Nate Tice. You're going to be on this show, Jordan next week, about stuff schematically that we're excited about. That's going to be Monday's show. Maybe I'll stop talking.

because I have a feeling Nate's going to hit this. But like those two dudes in Art Smith's running scheme and two really good running backs, I just think that's very steelery to me and I think they're just

going to be very steelery. So he's also rebranded to art is what, you know, we go from Arthur, but he's going to be painting. He's going to be painting. Oh, there it is. This is where you're,

I mean, you're breaking some news here if he's rebranded. We will call him. I like art. I like art. I think art, art is better for,

you know, it's like kind of more of a, it's a punch you in the mouth kind of name. Art was like the holding the microphone stand a little too tight. I mean, Arthur was holding the microphone stand a little too tight as a head coach. Art is the one cooking up a 1980 style with some twist running scheme in the lab. Art's going to run triple option. Art Smith. Art Smith says,

give me the biggest, beefiest offensive linemen you've got and we're going to pull your ass to the sideline. like art smiths got some lettuce right like arts arts arts at the whiteboard with an easel you know he's he's drawing he's drawing up plays they walk it they walk in and all the all the whiteboards in the building have been changed out and i think there is some some truth like he he was in that stressful position uh as the head coach of a football team with a million different things to do it and to worry about and and now he he can be art smith right he can just focus on play calling and facilitating an offense.

He's free to be art. Yeah, he can be art. Be the art that you want to see. I want to see them run pistol. We're going to get to it. Don't let Nate steal pistol for me. And I do want to make the first NFL daily apology just to all the great people and storylines

and trends that I didn't get to. But I'm going to save them. We're going to do them at some point. That's podcasting 101 there. You'll use everything. I've learned a lot today. Eventually. Let's take one last quick break.

and we're going to wrap things up after that. What's up, everybody? Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move the Sticks, we take you inside the game from scouting reports and player development to team building philosophies, coaching trends,

and how front offices construct winning rosters. Every week, we study the tape, talk to decision makers, and share the insights you won't find anywhere else. It's the kind of conversation that connects the dots from college football prospects to the NFL stars of tomorrow. We break down the draft,

analyze matchups and evaluate how teams put it all together on game day plus we dig in the coaching strategies roster construction and the trends that shape the league year after year whether you're a diehard fan or just love understanding the game on a deeper level we give you the full picture if you want insight that goes beyond the box score this podcast is for you don't miss it listen to the move the six podcast on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts Hey, this is Matt Jones. Now, I'm Drew Franklin, and this is NFL Cover Zero. We're just here to try to give you an NFL perspective a little bit different.

Did you see the Colts Pretzel? That was my other big takeaway from that game. What was that? Oh, my. We think NFL coverage should be informative and entertaining. And twice a week, that is exactly what you're going to get. Listen to NFL Cover Zero with Matt Jones and Drew Franklin on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. I'm Marcus Grant. And I'm Michael Florio, and together we host the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast. Ready to dominate your fantasy league this season? Then you need the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast, your ultimate source for player news, draft tips, and winning strategies. Whether you're a rookie manager or a fantasy vet,

We've got the insight to help you crush your opponents. Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. Jontie. Back on NFL Daily, wrapping up our first show together. a lot of motions, a lot of football. I'm really glad you guys were here for it.

And just to let everyone know, like, what is NFL Daily going to be? Like, what is coming up? I think the first week and plus is a good, you know, example of what's coming. Our show tomorrow we're going to talk about, as I mentioned, a lot of everything that's happened. Since there's been a podcast here on this feed, so Nick Shook, Steve Weiss is going to join me. For that, we're also going to have. one of our insiders in Rappaport, I believe,

believe us just for a little news as part of that show. I'm going to be breaking down kind of previewing camps with Mina Kimes and Bill Barnwell later in the week. On Monday, we mentioned the scheme show

we're going to do with Nate Tyson and Jordan. And then it'd be great to have Colleen Wolf back in the studio. Patrick. Hopefully you're available for that one. I'm really hoping you are. Anytime.

Pressure. And so that's, the next week and going from there. It's daily. We're going to be posting five days a week overnights for now. That might get adjusted once we move on into training camp and more news is coming out. And yeah, even Monday mornings, you guys will have something in your feed. And so before we go, I do want to do something that we might do every day. We might do some days. And it's like a little after-dinnerment. Like when I would go to my grandfather's house, Heinz Rosenthal in Connecticut.

Every Sunday we'd go there and we'd get back to his house and he would have this little jar of mint, after-eight's they were called, very old school. And you would have like a little after-dinner mint. We were home from the restaurant. We would always go out to eat. And it's just like a nice, this little after-taste, a nice little thing to leave you on. And so our after-dinner mint, our after-eight, today. is going to be a picture

that I was so excited to see while we were on our break. If you're watching on YouTube, check us out there too. This is Austin James Roberts, born May 25th. So just a few days since we talked to you last. And Eric, as the ATN listeners will know, it's a great producer for us.

And he's doing some work from home for now, but he's spending time with Austin. And he will be back with us in the studio, doing a lot of work for us, I believe, in August. And in the meantime, Randy Chavez is holding it down behind the scene. So we love you too, Randy. But we really love Austin James. So congratulations to Eric and to Lee and especially to Austin. You got some badass parents.

And it's really exciting. Yeah. Existence is awesome. You're going to enjoy it. And I look in... You don't know any alternative, frankly. I mean, existence or not. But yes, compared to the alternative, you're going to enjoy it.

And when people, because it's always interesting when you have kids and it's like, you know, you tell them how old your kids are. It's like, oh, that's a good age. And I was thinking like, oh, a month, like, oh, that's a good age. They're all great ages. And, you know, Eric, grinding out and doing everything and being a new dad, it's awesome. Great dude. And you'll get to know him, too, Jordan.

when he's back and you're right. I push back hard now because now that Ellis, my daughter, is 12. It's now to the point where people think it's not a good age. And I'm kind of like, fuck you, you know. Like, that's my daughter you're talking. It's like, oh, teenage daughters. It's like, all right, you know how you're so happy, like, that you're like one year old or two year old, like,

walked without shitting themselves or whatever, or they did one little thing. Like, can you imagine how proud I am of what my badass 12-year-old is doing on a daily basis? Like, it's exponential, the pride. That's all. Let's hit the music, Randy. Yeah, for this first episode of NFL Daily, again, thank you to everyone for their patience and their support and their love. It means a lot to us.

And for checking out the show. And hopefully you will tomorrow, too. Until then, for Patrick and Jordan. I'm Greg Rosenthal. I'll see you next time. Hey, everybody, Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky Brooks. On Move to Six, we take you inside the game

from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team-building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision-makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else. It's everything. you need to understand the why behind what happens on Sunday.

Don't miss it. Listen to the Move the Sticks podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Marcus Grant. And I'm Michael Florio, and together we host the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast. Ready to dominate your fantasy league this season? Then you need the NFL Fantasy Football Podcast, your ultimate source for player news, draft tips, and winning strategies.

Whether you're a rookie manager or a fantasy vet, we've got the insight to help you crush your opponents. Listen to the NFL Fantasy Football podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toyota, the official automotive partner of the NFL. Visit Toyota.com slash NFL now to learn more. This is an IHeart podcast.