NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - New Horizons Monday: 2023 Edition

Episode Date: January 11, 2023

A room filled with some heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, Gregg Rosenthal and Colleen Wolfe recap all the latest news from around the league, starting with the Cardinals parting ways with Kliff Kingsbury and Steve Keim (6:03). The Titans have made changes to their coaching staff (12:40), as have the Browns (16:57). The heroes run through some coaches who seem safe (22:21) before covering the latest on Sean McVay's future (24:29) as well as Bill Belichick's (31:58). The group discusses other vacancies and potential candidates (35:29) before rounding out the news with transactions and items of note (42:38), including Roquan Smith's record-breaking new contract. Note: timecodes approximate.NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the NFL podcast. Stay away from my wife, Mark. From the Chris Wesleying podcast studio at New Year's Eve party that went sideways with Zubalt and Sessler. I don't know. I think he's referring to someone else and their wife that I, like you, namely, that came from you. I, no. Yes, it did.

I had nothing to do with it. I'm Dan Hansis. And I got heroes here. Wow. Scandal to start the show. Colleen Wolf, Greg Rosenthal, Mark Sessler. What's up? Hey.

You know what? This is like stage right now. I'm going to sage to the top of the show here because I feel like that was maybe the wrong way to start things with Mark, for sure. Sure. Years ago. I'm on the wrong foot.

Yeah, so here, everyone's settling. It didn't seem vague. It didn't seem vague. It was directed directly at Mark. It was a warning. Do you know anything about this, Justin? The story behind the Zummy Drop. The Zumb drops are usually inside jokes referencing something that happened on the show five months ago.

It happened on the show and it was words from you to me. Oh, it was. Yes. Oh, so it wasn't a premeditated here use this. It was just something that was cold from a prior show. He is, yeah. It has nothing to do with Jason's wife and you. No.

Good. I don't know how else to clarify that is. The sage didn't work. Do it again. Bring that song back in it. Like most jokes, it's good to discuss what it really meant for like a minute afterwards. You need the autopsy. Yeah.

All right. Humor coach Greg Rosenthal chiming in. That's right. A showman. A showman. A growing showman. A growman. Remember in the off season there will be, did we decide what was the name of it? The showman's showman.

The showman's show man. Where it will just be a dissertation, Greg in the audience, Mark and I teach. Watching him, the glories. I can't wait for that. The performance. Speaking of being a showman, Greg is going to have a stage to work on his craft because that live show that we're doing, the ATN homecoming show from the bourbon room in Hollywood, it's sold out.

What? So like a Taylor Swift concert, go flood the secondary market. See if you can find a ticket for a few thousand bucks to try to get in the door, but you can no longer buy tickets. Of course, we sold the bastard out, and I just want to thank everyone who has supported us along the way. This is going to be a lot of fun in Los Angeles. Yeah, I walked by it the other day, and someone was, you know, it's up on Hollywood

Boulevard, those like iron gates to close it, so it doesn't get broken into it night. But he was opening it, and I just said, can I take a picture of it's got a neon sign? And he said, well, wait, who are you? And I explained, like, I'm part of this football, nerdy football show that's broadcast. He's like, oh, the show's sold out. He's like, come on and take a look. I took a look at the venue. Nice.

Beautiful, beautiful venue. I can't wait to tailgate. There's a big tailgate before, right? Yeah. Cool. So much going on. So that's happening next week. Of course, it's also New Horizons week in the NFL.

A little bit weird, Gregie. We're so used to doing this. There's always, you know, six to eight coaching changes, it seems, every year. And, of course, not all these guys are out of the woods, but we knew Frank Reich and Matt Rule were gone. Jeff Saturday and Wilkes, interim coach. We'll see what their futures are. Cliff Kingsbury was let go officially on Monday. Lovie Smith as well.

So we're just at four right now. Is this the calm before the storm or is this an outlier year? Interesting in terms of maybe. Is it only four for some reason I thought it was five? I don't know. Did you mention the Broncos? I miss the Broncos, son of a. So I think there'll be one more.

So that's five. It's five. I don't know what that one will be. Rossburg. We'll get to Sean McVeigh. That one's hanging out there. I think some of these playoff teams if Mike McCarthy doesn't win

I think he's out I think he's out based on Jerry Jones's preseason comments that we need to advance in the playoffs Jerry's known to you know with the win to change certain opinions but yes especially with another Sean out there

potentially anyway so much to get to so we'll even as this episode goes on you never know we could get some breaking news on another change at the top of a head coach or a coaching staff org chart. But while we wait for that,

let's go through all the kind of news out there's a big news-heavy show here as we get you caught up. Thank you if you made it through the 17-hour week 18 recap of around the NFL. What a marathon. Yeah, before I did my Good Morning football hit with Kyle Brandt this morning, just making chit chat.

Kyle said something like, yeah, man, a pretty long podcast on Sunday. I appreciate him listening. Well, maybe listen. Maybe you just saw a tweet of somebody saying, the show is too long now. I don't know. We're going to try to shorten this one,

but we're off to a great start five minutes in. Let's do a whole bunch of news. Don't let these tears fool you. It's all dog around his mug. Yeah. I don't want to let go of the Lions and certainly don't want to let go Jamal Williams, Connie, our friend.

I love him. We talked about it on the Power Hanks podcast today, Connie, that Jamal Williams, who was really a hard-knock's favorite on our podcast, he ended up scoring 18 touchdowns and breaking Barry Sanders record and then giving the postgame interview over the year. Beautiful. It was the biggest plot twist interview that I've ever listened to because it was definitely leading me down one road. And then all of a sudden it was just a straight U-turn to somewhere else in the other direction. So I really enjoyed it. A range of emotions.

Now, that's a showman. I mean, I thought he knew exactly what to do in the moment. He's born with it. All right, let's get into what's going on. I could learn a thing or two from him. Ouch. Get the sage out again. Showman.

Yes, Cliff Kingsbury. One of the dismissed coaches, Arizona Cardinals. Also, Steve Kime is out. We know Kime's got some things going on and in concert with the announcement that they had, oh, right, they did the Harvard. as well. Cliff out, they also said Kime is stepping aside. So Kimes out. They're

blown up the whole thing. And we learned that Kyla Murray, the quarterback who's rehabbing his own knee injury. And that's a storyline around this team. The owner of the team, Michael Bidwell, had this to say about how Kyla Murray factors in. We're in communication and we should be talking later today. We're texted and either today or tomorrow.

And so absolutely want to get the input of our leaders, including Kyler, and spoken with a number of leaders already. Makes sense. I mean, that should always, especially after you get into business at that level of the quarterback, Greg. I don't know how much power you give him in the room,

but you want his voice to be heard. Yeah, it's not going to be that much. But the point of getting a new coach is to maximize Kyler Murray. That's the biggest point. I mean, you have to be able to run the entire organization, and something I'm not sure like Cliff Kingsbury

was incredibly strong at and I don't know if he was incredibly strong at schematically creating an advantage for Kyler Murray and so that's why you see Cliff Kingsbury let go. I did like him personally more after watching this Hard Knocks

and I did watch a decent amount. I think he was like a good guy. Both of them. But I meant Cliff. Oh, Cliff's like a good person trying his best and it just wasn't going to happen for him. Like this was not the job

for him like it was maybe in a little over his head but he was doing his best trying his best like believed in his players i think he was well like like that that wasn't all the problem everyone getting really carried away with them spending all the money on that extension at the time we killed that extension we said this is a ridiculous extension to be extending steve kime and cliff kingsbury through 2027 but it's not my money it didn't matter in the end like the The extension had no difference. If he had added one year or five years, it's the exact same to Cardinals' fans.

So I'm glad they did that. And when you really think about the money involved, your people are like, oh, they're cheap and they don't want to spend all that money. I get that, but you spend more on like one season of Kelvin Beecham than you do on five seasons or around the same of Cliff Kingsbury and Steve Kind.

So in the scheme of things. I think it's the money's part of it, and you're right. Like if you're a fan of the team, It doesn't affect your salary capital. And if your owner's willing to make this change, it shows you that he doesn't care about the money side. If he wants to get it right, that's to their credit.

But their discredit was, as we critique, to your point, Greg, just the fact that they saw enough in Cliff Kingsbury and Steve Kheim a year ago to say these guys definitely need an extension coming off and a playoff wipeout against the Rams. I could say this for Kingsbury. He was in a tough spot this year. They used a franchise record 81 players. They were the fourth most injured team in the league. You didn't have DeAndre Hopkins for a big chunk of the year.

You lost Kyla Murray for the back end of the year. You used four quarterbacks in four games in a row at one point. That's enough to get a coach into hot water and fire. But that also has nothing to do with why Cliff Kingsbury is gone. And yet, does anyone feel that the Cardinals are making a mistake here moving at this point? No, this whole season was a disaster before it even started with Kyler Murray scrubbing any evidence of the Cardinals from his Instagram. And then obviously the contract stuff that happened. and then all of the off-field drama moved onto the field when you had Kyler Murray and Cliff

Kingsbury screaming at each other on the TNF game and Kyler was telling him to calm down and DeAndre Hopkins had to kind of like take him away and move him out of that like whole situation but didn't I mean Cliff was brought in initially for Kyler Murray and obviously that didn't work out and you want to have Kyler Murray's input but I don't know like if it's It just seems like the same mistake will happen again. And they need to bring in a coach that's going to not only get along with Kyler Murray, but also get along with Michael Bidwell because he's really proactive. And just have a better sense of who is a good offensive coach.

Because there are a lot of people who did not believe Cliff Kingsbury was a good schematic offensive coach. And that's the thing that struck me was like people talking about, oh, maybe the Patriots are going to hire him. Maybe he'll go with the Rams if McFace stick around. It's like I think the Cardinals' offense was defined by its lack of ability to adapt over the last. four years. They were one of the easiest offenses to attack. But before it happened, it was because Kingsbury and Kyler Murray

had known each other forever. Sure. But I don't think it was a personal thing. I think it was more like, this guy will maximize Kyler as a player. But Kime didn't even do, didn't do him any favors with the way that the roster was set up because there were key positions. I mean, the roster has no depth in general. But then

the offensive line, you look at what they have coming up in terms of free agents. I think four of their five starters or free agents, they've got to figure out what they're going to with Zach Allen and Byron Murphy. There's just a lot that needs to be done. And they are hiring a GM before the coach, so we'll see. The idea of Cliff always seemed like it was something that the Cardinals liked.

He fit the profile of a guy that was leading the team. He's a young, confident dude. Remember the shot on draft day of him. Iconic. Like in his beautiful den or whatever with his feet up on the table. That's still I think was pretty cool. Desert behind him. Like, there was an image of, like, what this guy brought to the team,

but then a reality of maybe he wasn't really what they hoped he was going to be. So they start over. And the kind of thing, I'm expecting more to the story to come out at some point. If anyone cares to. I don't really need to. I don't need to, but I just think there will be lawsuits is what I'm expecting. Oh. It just seems like whatever was going down with him that he had to leave the team in the middle of the season.

What a mess. It's a mess. He seems like a guy that's dealing with some personal. He'd been there since 1999, and he'd been through stuff before, and we'll see. Had the public DUI, and yeah, close with the Bidwells. I would be a little concerned. Like Bidwell said, yeah, he'd rather hire the GM, but that wouldn't get in the way if, like, the timing didn't work out.

And so now it's just Bidwell hiring these coaches. It had been Kime, essentially, in the past. And I do think it's a logical place for Sean Payton. If I'm Sean Payton, the organization maybe is a bit of a concern. but the Kyler Murray factor would be intriguing. In other New Horizons, we head to Nashville. New Horizons. New Horizons.

The Titans fired four assistant coaches on Monday, including offensive coordinator Todd Downing, who had been in that position for the past two seasons. They also fired their offensive line coach. Keith Carter, secondary coach Anthony Midget and offensive skills assistant Eric Frazier. Hey, first of all, did I get the last name right there? Yeah, it's Tony Midgett. It's Tony Midget.

Okay. Bravedigger. You okay with this? Is Downing an unfair fall guy or was it time to mix things up? And is this just the beginning because they could save 18 mil, I believe, on their cap by moving on from your boy, Ryan Tannahill. Yeah, it's interesting. You know, the Titans offense was the only. The Titans were the only team in the NFL this season to fail to score 30 points in a single game,

and they never topped 28 points in a single game. So, yeah, the offensive line was banged out. They played with multiple quarterbacks. Receivers aren't good. But the offense got noticeably worse after Art Smith left to become the Falcons head coach. Todd Downing had two years to show that he could be, you know, a good NFL play caller. And I don't think he was ever above average, if anything, he was below average or bad. So I think it was the right move for the Titans direction.

Having a bad offensive line every single season is coaching. Yeah, and that's why Keith Carter. It's not about personnel. And that's the coordinator. But there's a lot on Vrabel. He is risking becoming a little Bill O'Brien like here because he got the GM fired. I'm just going to assume that,

that he was involved in that decision. And they didn't win a game after that. It's worth saying. They did that in the middle of the season. Not like the GM is doing a lot in the middle of the season to create wins and losses, but just interesting. And then now he's going to be high. and the new coach. It's just a lot.

Well, if he got him fired, part of it was the GM decided to trade A.J. Brown, which completely sabotaged their entire offense. They had the worst wide receiver crew league wide and showed for the not scoring 30 points. I think we talked about Vrable on draft night when they traded A.J. Brown and his visceral and body and body language and everything was just like, no, don't do this. And I think of the dominoes, and of course the injuries are a big part of the story with the Titans on offense. but the domino's starting with that decision how that impacted the quarterback play, how it impacted obviously their wide receiver

and playmaking ability, how that hurt the offensive coordinator's ability to enact a scheme. All this stuff is kind of connected. Sometimes one decision. It's so many dominants. And you have so many new pieces now coming in this season. And I guess it's a good thing

considering how this season went. But, like, I mean, when Graver's talking about the way that they didn't score any points, 30th and yards per game. Second half of games also just like really stood out to me because they just, their second half adjustments were like, we're just not going to show up or score any points. I don't know what that was.

They had the worst second half point differential of any team in the league. And to your point, Colleen, it never got better. Like, they were bad in week one and they were just as bad in week 18. Well, after years of over or under indexing on this show and Dan calling in terms of how much we talked about the Titans and Dan calling them the titoons for years. I think we've over-indexed now with Graver here, and we are now taking a break.

It's going to be a month minimum. Did you just break up with the Titans? Do we want to fire the Titans in the Sun for a little bit? I just said we're going to take a break. I don't know. Don't we want to cover who they hire as their new general manager at some point when it happens? That's a possibility, but it's not maybe not an essential. We'll cover it in a minimalist way.

I'll least mention it. And we'll keep moving. I will say since I became their fan at one point during the autumn. They didn't win a game. They went 0 and 7 and turn. turned into an absolute raging, fiery nightmare. And just for any listeners, that might be curious, this new arrangement with the Titans for the time being,

it will not carry over to other teams like the New York Jets. But the Titans specifically, much less conversation. Yes, just for the time. I just need a break. That's all. In other new horizons, we head to the Cleveland Browns, where Joe Woods. In other new horizons, we had to the New Horizons.

I think that sage snowed under our musical director. That's in the industry parlance. That's the cue when you hear horizons. Got it, got it, got it. Going forward. We need a live harp in here. And like the last five years of the show. The Browns fired defensive coordinator Joe Woods on Sunday night after back-to-back losing seasons.

Mark, I'll tee you up on this one. They did improve as the season went along. But this team, you could say, underachieved defensively, especially terrible against the run. which was a major problem for them. So they are rebooting leadership on that side of the ball in Cleveland. They went into the year really short on the interior defensive line. And so the run thing, that's part of it.

They were in the mid-20s and DVOA for most of the season. They did tighten up since week 13, played some good games and were kind of closer to like 12, 13. But like Joe Woods always felt like the obvious fall guy here because it's like Stefansky is surviving because you didn't have your quarterback for much of the season. and X, Y, and Z. I'm not convinced DeFansky's the guy for Deshaun Watson on any level that they fit together.

But Woods is your scapegoat here, taken out of the schoolbook depository on the breadline now. But I will say this, watching a team waste Miles Garrett's career. You've got to find the right guy. They are looking at Brian Flores, Jared Mayo, Sean Desai. I mean, there's guys out there that could, that... Brian Flores would be a great hire. Brian Flores would be great. But, I mean, there's skills, there's good players here.

They were not used correctly this past season at all. Davian Clownie believes that. That was something that kind of, I know he's probably not coming back. I don't think he made it clear. I would say he is not coming back. He's definitely out when they left the door open for a return. He even turned like Miles Garrett against him with what he did. I mean, it's just like, well, there were so meant that thing that really like struck me was how many players came out and very openly talked about how they needed a fresh start.

Like Greg Newsom talked about they maybe needed to keep things more vanilla on defense and that Joe did a great job. second half of the year just realizing, you know what, maybe we don't need to call everything. Let's just shorten the menu down. And then John Johnson said, I don't even like talking about scheme too much. He said that I think you're getting your players to play. That's the main thing. That's what I want. So that's like a more of a motivation thing.

And we talk about, Mark, to your point, about the defense getting better in the second half. They also, their past defense definitely did. but they faced quarterbacks like Kyle Allen, Tyler Huntley, Andy Dalton, Carson Wentz like Kenny Pickett who's been doing better but it wasn't like powerhouse quarterbacks. Didn't get to face the worst quarterback in the division on their own roster though.

Oh, he got him. Andrew Barry, I thought the biggest takeaway from this was how they're keeping Stefanski and that they were pretty forthright in that, saying like we know we've got a good one and Kevin Savansky we're going to keep him. But great head coaches get involved with the defense. And I think some of the reporting is that Stefansky kind of was just like,

oh, the defense is yours, Joe Woods. He made that hire of Joe Wood. Did you think there was a chance that Stefansky was going to go? No, but with all these teams, you never think, like when there's a surprise firing, you don't always see it coming. So he was sort of on the long list of like, would that be that crazy because of what you're saying with Watson? But they have bought into the Watson and him being a pair. And Stafansky, if you do want to be a great head coach,

you need to be better at hiring your defensive coordinator and you need to figure out how to help that side of the box. Don't you look at like the Stafansky's and like the Dennis Allens of the world and be like, here's the problem to keep these guys. Like they're fresh new fall guys like come week 14 next season to be let go because nothing is going right. And then you're taking your team with no quarterback, the Saints, or Deshaun Watson situation,

and put it into a third developmental or second developmental year. I like I like Stafansky though. I think they should see it through and see if he can. get Watson to work. And if it doesn't happen, it's going to happen. You'll like this. I got this text screen grab on my fantasy football thread for my buddy Elliot. Headline from the Akron Beacon Journal.

Deshaun Watson wants, quote, man-to-man conversation with Brown's coach Kevin Stefansky on plan. Deshaun Watson, who hasn't had a man-to-man conversation with anyone for two years. Right. Now he wants to dictate the direction of this franchise. Who was a hot mess on the field? By the way, he can because ownership gave him $300 damn million or whatever it was guaranteed. Woo.

Elliot added the addendum. This is insane on so many levels. Your friend is all over this. He's sharp on it. He's sharp on it. Shout out, Eli. Here we go. What else we got?

What else we have? Let's take a break. Let's take a break. Let's take a break. We'll be right back. All right, we're back. Here we go. We roll on New Horizons week here.

It's getting better. Better. I wouldn't say it's solved. Who's safe? Who's safe right now? Zafansky. There's one. Stavansky.

Seems like Josh McDaniels in Las Vegas seems safe. Dennis Allen seems safe, but I wrote about this in the power rankings. This is a bit of a trope of this time of year, almost specific to this day and Monday after the season. When the coach has the press conference, I want to make sure I give you the exact quote, although it is a very similar quote. Dennis Allen has asked about his job status after his first year with the Saints, whether he has a job, whether he's going to be the head coach. And his reply was, I don't think there's any need to discuss that any further. And I'm certainly going forward with that anticipation.

That's the indication that I've been given and I'm excited about it. Always seems like a weird, unnecessary situation and I understand it's the timing also. Maybe the team's not sure what they want to do yet. But when you send your head coach out for that end of season press conference a day after the final game of the year, and he doesn't actually have it on like 100% authority

that he's coming back. So he says that thing like, no one's told me I'm not coming back. So I'm just assuming I am. It always feels like a bit of a tough sitch, put it that way, for the old H.C. And in this case, Dennis Allen. Agree. Like, McVeigh put himself in a different situation. We get to that later, but he also didn't seem to have his own clarity.

I watched the Dennis Allen press conference for some reason, because I just thought it might be awkward. Uh-huh. Did it deliver? He didn't say anything. He just didn't answer any questions. He, it's sort of... He's in limbo. It seemed like he's a guy in limbo.

But it wasn't about his job. I'm saying, like, about the team. and what they're going to do and different things and he just sort of like refused to say anything meaningful. But do you think that might be connected to him maybe not knowing

if he is part of the future? Yeah, he tried to nip that in the butt and you read the quote right away, like stop asking me about this, essentially right away. Stop asking me if I'm fired. It really seems like he's safe because the whole Sean Payton idea

seems to have come and gone in terms of Sean Payton potentially coming back. That doesn't seem like it's at all in the cards. All right. In other news, Sean McVeigh, of course, the Super Bowl winning coach of the Rams. Big story going into week 18 that he might step away from the sidelines, at least temporarily. He spoke to the media on Monday, and this is what he had to say about his uncertain future. I don't get the sense in the least bit.

I'm done coaching. It's just a matter of what does that look like as it relates to the immediate future. I think what I'd like to do is be able to take the appropriate time, never gone through anything like this, but you want to make sure that you're considered of the people that are affected. That's the most important thing, and that's probably, you know, you want to be able to, the consistent conversations and dialogues that have existed with the people that I love and really care about, hey, do what you think is best for you and Veronica. But that doesn't mean it takes away the empathy, the level of responsibility that I do feel

for the people that would be affected, you know, as it relates to my decision moving forward. And so those are the things that you don't take lightly. And we learned that he has let his coaches, his assistants know that it's cool to look for outside work, which seems like another indication. That was from ESPN's Jeremy Fowler, yeah, if you wanted to take another job. And our friend Jordan Rodriguez added some context that there would have been a lot of changes to the staff anyways. We already knew the offensive coordinator was leaving. That was a month ago.

I think that was more of he wasn't going to be brought back and found a job. situation, and I think there could be more. Rahim Morris is a notable guy on that staff there, D.C. Like, for it to get to this point, whatever Sean McVeigh is going through mentally has to be really, really taxing for him to just come out and be like, this is like nothing I've ever experienced. Hey, staff, go ahead, like look for other jobs. Don't stay here because of me because I don't even know what I'm going to do.

I mean, that, especially in this NFL right now and this time, like when you see guys getting hired and fired and fired and all of the success that he's experienced from the jump with the Rams. I just think that there's much more that we don't know about what he's going through. And I bet that everything has been really hard on him this year. Like, the expectations were really high. And I know you guys were talking about this the other day on the pod just about, like, he just got married. And I honestly can't imagine, like, having an in-laws family going through a war-torn situation. Like, that is, I understand, like, you have your, your work life and your personal life, but a lot of times those things have to be in the same scope. Like, you're still

just a human being dealing with other human beings. And, like, I think he has to take whatever time he needs to step away. But it is kind of weird, because we don't hear it all the time for a coach to say, I need this. Yeah, I think it's countercultural. And it's, he's a younger coach, obviously a lot of the guys like the Cliff Kingsbury's were hired because of the Sean McVeigh effect. You go find this young guy that is so driven and so resourceful and he's a brainiac and a wizard and he's going to change your offense. But Sean McVe always took so much on. Like I'll just never think we talked on something of that feature that came out before the season. Just the weight. I remember being at the Combine after they lost that Super Bowl to the Patriots. And Sean McVeigh was up on stage

the Diaz in that big room talking to Good Morning football early before a bunch of press showed up. And there was just this sort of weight to his entire demeanor. Like, that Super Bowl weighed so heavily on him. And I think there's such a release after they won one. But then now you're right back in the thick of it in an organization that maybe if you're thinking personally, like I'm at this place where I'm at this crossroads and need to make a countercultural move and go treat my family situation, my mental health, all that stuff, before football, which is different than the old school coaches that just like burn through this,

never around their families. They sleep at the facility that they're 80 weeks, even if they only need to be there, 54. McVeigh is not from necessarily that world. And he's telling us that. I think he's saying like coaching isn't over, immediate coaching might be, is also being courted left and right by television. And I just think like, I guess from a ram's angle, too, he's done so much for him that you'd be like, we want you to do what you want to do. But do you really, if you're a player, and this is not against Sean McVeigh, because there's no doubt that he's all in. Like, do you want to coach every January taking press conferences, whether or not you still want

to do this? It's like, you need that coach needs to be the anchor. So if he's not, able to be the anchor for whatever reason float away for a bit and maybe we see you again. Well, I think you know, the one thing that was difficult about what he said was he'd never been through anything like this before and that's true in terms of this season but he was going through something exactly

like this a year ago at this time. He considered going leaving the job. Right, it's two years in a row that's what I'm saying. It's like we're getting this, you know, year after year. I agree that you can't be in that spot and put your team in that spot year after year. And he's very conscious of that and you could hear him speaking to that. And

It makes you think that he will go away, but it's hard to guess. And I think Jordan, our friend I'll mention again, like hit on, I think a key point here. You said like there had been this sprint from him, basically his whole football life since he was like John Gruden's mentee almost 15 years ago of like getting to the mountain top, becoming the best coach in the league, getting all the thing, winning the Super Bowl. And you hear this from a lot of people who have experienced a lot of success in their lives. and they realize when they get to the top and they achieved everything they ever wanted to that actually isn't that satisfying.

That it's not that fulfilling. It is in the moment, but it's not going to change who you are in the long term and that whatever he wants to do, like that alone isn't going to make everything okay. I don't know. I think we've probably seen the last of them for the Rams right now. It seemed like does a Super Bowl,

winning a Super Bowl galvanized you to win five mores or was it more of a relief? And it just felt like it was just more of a relief. belief to Sean McVeigh at times. Then, like, I want to do this for 30 more years. Don't ask it again. Think about when we reached the end of the season. Oh, man, just put me on the bus.

The burnout that sometimes we feel, I can't imagine being a head coach and knowing that they are the amount of work that they are pouring in, the hours, everything. That burnout must be next level. Stafford says he's coming back regardless, by the way. Whether McVeigh is here or not, he doesn't, he's playing football. And I'm sure that Sean McVeigh is. sincere about the passion he has for the job and the idea of burnout, but I'm not ruling out the possibility that it takes a ton of money to work for Fox for a year

and then signs a huge new deal with a different team in a much better place. Yeah, like we're watching Sean Payton potentially do exactly that. I think the year off is pretty massive. I'm just saying. I'm just saying. I'm not trying to be cynical about it, but like it could, it could be like this is all too much for him, his personality type, or it could be he thinks it's time for a reset as well.

It's sort of like players retiring and then like all of a sudden coming back and playing for a different team. Again, the guy who he learned from John Gruden did the exact same thing essentially and I always remember this article by Bill Belichick for some reason Bill Belichick wrote a column in the New York Times after John Gruden

won the Super Bowl and it was kind of like all right, what's next? Like your life just changed so much and you're going to have all this thing happen and then at some point you're going to realize It's like, oh, I'm just back to being the same coach I was before. And I was reminded of it with Jordan's article this week. Speaking of Bill Belichick, he will be coming back for 24, his 24th season on the sideline with the Patriots.

And, you know, he's a perfect example. Like, everyone's wired differently. I don't, I'm sure McVeigh lives and dies in every single way with his team. But don't tell me Bill Belichick doesn't either. I mean, he's, and here he is. is now in his like, you know, 50th season on the sideline in various capacities. He can't get enough as he's, I think, 73 years old now, Belchick. He's coming back, but he also acknowledged that the future for the Patriots, you know,

things have to change, is what Bill had to say. As we do every year, evaluate everything and try to make the best decisions that we can to move forward to be more competitive to have a stronger team in the future so Robert and I will talk about that talk about that as a staff

certainly individual conversations with many of the players as we always do all the players but there's some that are oh my God this is terrible urgent or will be more timely than others. He's the best.

He is 70, by the minute. I just want to run through a wall. He's choosing his words carefully. He's choosing his words carefully. Did you watch the game on Monday? I wish I had asked for it. This would have been, you know, better showmanship here. What you mean when you were yelling at our producer behind the glass before the show for having too much?

That is not true. That is not true. Too much sound? Never would yell. Never would. You didn't raise your voice. that's not true that is now you're making things up

I said you didn't raise your voice oh it didn't raise your voice Tom Curran was like Tom Curran who's been there forever just came out with it and said well a lot of us thought it was dubious when you hired Matt Patricia it just said the word dubious

and then you didn't really and let Belichick answer it and he gave his Belichick answer of like I was just doing what I thought was best for the team and then Tom responded by being like Yeah, but like when we think you do things that are dubious, you don't ever give us like an answer.

So we just have to just sort of say it and then it sits there. And at that moment, Belichick actually started smiling and laughing. And then Kern was like, this is not really a question. It's more of a statement. And Bill was just like, thank you, Tom. How about this? Flashpoint Belichick with Tom Currant. Oh, we'd love that.

That would be good. The series is just. We got Flashpoint Rams with Jordan. field in the past. Are you saying I'm sorry? Wow. Write these down.

Oh, that's excellent. No, Rams was on our radar 100%. I was to hear that. That's really good. One more time, Draver. Come on, bud.

I want to hear it again. Oh, my God. The flashpoint. Oh, sound bit. Wow. That was Sid? Yeah, I think she's had a couple of glasses of wine there. Our legendary former producer, Sidney Carlson, crushing the musical theater scene in Utah.

Amazing. All right. In other news, Bob McNair, Cal McNair, excuse me. Discussing the Texans situation at Coach Nick Casario could step away. Nice. if a new head coach chooses that as the more righteous path for the organization. Interesting. The team is also as requests out to Jonathan Gannon, Agiro, Avero, D.Mico Ryan's, D.C. of the Niners, Shane Steichen, and Ben Johnson, O.C. of the Lions.

So casting a wide net as they look to replace Levy Smith, who is fired on Sunday. The Broncos, by the way, also a team look. to replace a head coach. They have scheduled interviews with Dan Quinn, the Cowboys, D.C. Or a request, not a schedule. They've got to be granted. Request to interview Dan Quinn,

Damico Ryans, and Morris, who we got, Morris? Rahim. They interviewed. Who will get that request granted. They also did interview A Giro, Evereaux, their own defensive coordinator. All right.

So they want a defensive guy. The Panthers, while we're here, Panthers are talking to Jim Caldwell, Ken Dorsey, Shane Stuyken, Ben Johnson, Frank Reich, Steve Wilkes, Mike Kafka? Yeah. Wow. Interesting. And speaking of the Panthers, there has been a lot of speculation about Steve Wilkes

and whether he did enough to earn the job. I didn't get the vibe listening to Fitterer that that's really going to be an option. I know Wilkes is formally interviewed or is scheduled to this week for the job. But here's Fitterer talking about. How he sees the Panthers' job is very, very, you know, savory. Hmm. Tasty. It's a tasty gig compared to the other ones.

It's a young team. This division is up for grabs here in the next few years. There's no dominant quarterback. They look at our defense. Sorry, Tom. The offensive lines and the pieces that we have in the way we're growing right now. And with a few tweaks here and there, you know, this is a division that we can take over. you know that opportunity is there

no dominant quarterback including on your roster that's been the problem and Scott Fitterer has not solved that it's not just a small tweak to find a dominant quarterback by the way unless he knows something we don't know I guess Tom Brady is either no longer a dominant quarterback or he'll be in Vegas in a couple

of months well I think I think he's probably right about that yeah I think he probably won't be on a box but maybe he knows he's definitely not dominant this year I really was surprised that Wilkes I agree with you doesn't seem like he's getting a great chance here just because he did so well and I think did a lot of the hard things about being a head coach and the reporting is he has a

pretty concrete plan of what he would do in terms of hiring an offensive coordinator. So if you, if Steve Wilkes shows up with a great offensive plan in terms of who his coach would be, that would be attractive to me. But everyone else they're interviewing is essentially a defensive guy. I mean, he had some, this audition this year was pretty great for him. though, considering the way that the offense looked before he took over in the team in general. And then afterwards, they had a single game record for total yards, 570. They had a single game record for rushing yards.

Like, they were the NFL's most efficient passing attack for six weeks. Like, they, no one thought that they were going to be able to do anything on offense, especially after trading Christian McCaffrey. And then all of a sudden, they were able to run the ball really well. I know that he's a defensive coach. but the team in general looked a lot better under him. If they would have beat the bucks

in week 17, there's a good chance he keeps the job. That's possible. It's a results oriented business. I think Wilkes did a great job, but also sometimes you got to win that game. I don't know. I'd point to, I think it's a hazard sign for coaches don't take these interim jobs because Rich Pesachia a year ago did go to the playoffs

in a whirlwind of turmoil and with a team that was vaguely suspect to begin with, did a great job, goes, and doesn't really get a shot to get that job because you know we want to time of his life though there is something to that yeah but yeah but I'm real that time of his life is great but it's like if you think that it's a pathway to get the head coaching job what more could Steve Wilkes have done here that team was a hot disaster and

he totally turned them around they beat up on teams showed a lot the players responded and you don't really get in a fair shake here yeah I wanted to circle back to the Texans quickly because the Casario part of it was very strange to me he was sitting up there knowing that he needed to take responsibility, that he hadn't done a good job. You know, he'll be the first GM in NFL history to ever get a chance to hire a third head coach after hiring two straight, one and duns. Of course, that's never happened before. Like, where the Texans are now are as dysfunctional as in that way of, like, turning over head coaches

as any team in NFL history right now. And those were his choices. And he even said, well, admittedly, will let other people be more involved in this head coaching search, like the McNairis, but I don't think it's a choice. And then he also kept saying, like, if the new coach chooses, I guess, like, you know, and doesn't want me here, I'd have to work with him. I could step away.

It's like, what is he doing up there on the podium then? That sounds like a disaster. It sounded like he didn't necessarily know, kind of like these coaches, what his status is going to be. So I took from that that, look, if they hired a big. name, but it doesn't seem like they're going for one, then they could get rid of Nick Casario, but they're going for assistance around the league. And there was a report, too, that D'Amico Rines might not even want to interview with them after, you know, how they've treated the two. Last black head coaches that they hired and pretty much got rid of quickly. I know it's always like

just take the open job. Someone's going to take it. It's like, I'd be really careful about some of these openings. That one especially. Such a shame, too, because the opportunity there with two first round draft picks this year and next year for whoever is coming in? Like it looks great, but then you realize it's the Texans and their track record recently is abysmal. What's the record, by the way, for how many

coaches one team has paid at the same time? Clemese one point was paying Rob Chisinski, I believe, for three different outings as a Browns coach at the same time. The Browns around the mid the early... The three coaches in three years is very unusual, and

I'm wondering when's the last time that even happened. They're probably still playing Bill O'Brien. So they might be on to their fourth. That's amazing. I'm looking concurrently. I'm like, what is the red? This is the type of stuff that the, you got Drew behind the glass all nine foot four of them.

Like the research, would they know that? Would the research group here at NFL Media? I think they would. I think they have the ability to check that out. John Madden might know that in a local lavatory, a Super Bowl city. I don't know. Who knows?

You just got to get the information wherever you can get it. Let's take one more break. and then we'll finish things out. All right, welcome back. Let's see. Other transactions, Dean Peas. Dean Peas. I said Bill Belichick was 73.

No, it's Dean who's 73. And he's retiring, the defensive coordinator of the Falcons. He's actually retired two other times previously. But he said this time he thinks it's going to stick. He had some health issues this year. I got run over on the sideline a couple weeks ago, but he said that had nothing to do.

with the decision. He just said it's time to walk away. So Dean Peas has been coaching for, I think, 50 years. Happy trails to you, good sir. Defensive coordinator on the 18 and one Patriots, Dean Peas. Also the defensive... He's got that conference championship ring. They also mentioned that a Super Bowl ring, too.

Isn't that like 600 times when Dean Peas was squaring off against Tom Brady in week 18? These guys know each other from, you know, their time together, their shared time together in New England. He really won his Super Bowl with the Ravens with one of the worst Ravens defenses of all time. Oh, the Niners year. Yeah, the year they won the Super Bowl was one of their worst. Is that a credit to him? No, but he stuck around and they had a lot of great defense. He made a work.

He had a lot of great defenses with some adversity. He was also the Titans defensive coordinator when they ended the Brady Patriots dynasty. Oh, and the late interception there. Yeah. We talk about the Titans. A lot of Titans talk. A cantankerous fool. Is that what Wes called him?

I believe, he just believed, he loved how fiery. I like my coach's a little, yeah, he gets agitated during press conferences. I mean, that happened with the Falcons before the season. I mean that in the best way. That's what I liked about Mike Westoff, the old special teams coach. Just a cranky old, oh, he's on our show, and he's cranky with us. Yes, he was. One defensive coordinator, not going anywhere is Joe Barry, Matt LaFleur.

The Packers head coach said that Barry will return. So there's a little. I'm going to say that Nathaniel Hackett might come back, leaving the door open for Hackett. I think, as I understand, he was asked about it. And he's like, yeah, we're open to that. And perhaps it will happen. But that's interesting. Hackett, of course, is the QB coach.

That's putting Hackett into something that he, sometimes you just get elevated a little bit too high. It's like, let's just bring you back to where you need to be. You'll be fine. Come back home. We'll leave the lights on. Come back home. All right. In other news.

So that's kind of like the roundup of all the coaches and what's going on in that realm. A little league news. There was a significant signing extension today. Roquan Smith, who's done very good work with the Ravens, since coming over in that trade at midseason from the Bears, agrees to terms on a five-year, $100 million contract extension. That is a lot of money, $45 million fully guaranteed, 60 million in total guarantees.

And for a team that I've told you on this podcast, I'm kind of over. They kind of bore me. Giving a $100 million extension to an off-ball linebacker is on brand. It doesn't get my juices flowing, but it doesn't matter. They're very happy with this man, and he's made their defense better. So good job, Roebuck. What's on your radar?

They're just kind of boring. The Ravens are boring. It's boring, right? Oh, huge signing out of Baltimore. Roquant Smith, 100 million. He changed their defense. We'll get to it Thursday. I think they're a tough matchup for the Bengals, just the Bengals' offense.

They have the franchise tag now if they want to use it on Lamar. Right, that's huge. And he also served as his own agent and got the biggest money ever. So, you know, the agents are sweating this. We do have some more coaching news, though. We have some breaking news.

We told you what could happen. Oh, no, is it Dennis Allen? Do you want to give it to Mark? Yeah. You don't have to. Please. I don't know. I just let you know.

We have some breaking news here. Let's go. Well, we already covered that. The audience knows that. We already have that. I just want that. All right, give it back to Greg then for the... Greg, you announced what it is.

I just want to announce the music. All right, there you go. We came down in a good spot. All right, wait, wait, wait, wait. Let's start out. You take the music out. We got to sage it again, sage the place. Mark wants the bump.

He wants the pop of I'm coming in. Say the last line about Roquant Smith. Just close it up. What a guy. We do have, by the way, a little bit of breaking news. Whoa. Mark, on top of things, as always. Greg?

The commanders. have fired offensive coordinator Scott Turner. Young Turner. Shoot. This is how you become not Young Turner anymore. This will age you. He just ran out of time.

Like a sitting president. This is a scape, another scapego-term. Commanders in Washington, D.C. in the Pentagon. There's less lately. I know. Well, maybe. They're losing commanders at a rapid pace. Ron Rivera was talking on Tuesday,

so I guess he sort of strategically did this right after his press conference. of like how he wanted to be a run-first team. That's how you win in the NFL. You control the time of possession, this and that. And I'm just like, uh, and I'm also thinking, why did they wait until week 18 to see C.M. Howell? That was fun.

Wait, by the way, down the stretch, they were one of, they were like the most run-heavy team in the entire NFC. And if anything, young Turner was using all sorts of different players and creative ways in the ground game. Yeah. Where'd that come from? Young Turner, like, you know, son of Norv Turner deserves better. He does, and I'm sure he'll get another opportunity out there.

Well, he will. You know, there's a lot of talk, by the way, about the nepo babies right now. You're hearing all this nepo baby stuff going on out there. I'm not saying his career is indebted fully to that. But I think Scotty's going to, Scotty too hot, he will land on his feet. There are some nepo babies out there. But he also has done some things on his own, you know. The NFL is rife with nepotism.

It certainly is. To your point. Nepo babies all over. this joint Let's see Let's see What else do we have Do we have anything else

To add on Roquan though By the way Or did we I think we wrap You deemed it boring Mark came in I don't think it's boring And I understand

We hit the salient points We hit the salient points The Ravens excite me I didn't Greg announced breaking news To break away from Roquan Smith I thought like the conversation We were moving on Dan

Yeah okay I was just trying to Get a feel Button things up I can't I can't You guys too dynamic Mike McDaniel said

the Dolphins head coach that Teddy Bridgewater could have played on Sunday okay dislocated Pinky he suffered in week 17 against the Pats but they went with

the kid Why don't Skyler Thompson who's now banged up I don't think he's saying like he was at his full strength but it was a pretty good indication to me that Teddy has a strong chance to play this week

can I just ask you this though like it was a win or die playoff scenario if there ever was a time to put... Do or die, typically. Winner die. You could do something poorly and then you do die.

But I was saying if there was any chance, and I know we talk up Teddy pretty highly on the show. He hasn't done a lot in recent years. But he would have given them a much better chance, I would think, than Skylott Thompson, who is not ready for this. Could he throw the ball with a broken finger? They were playing the right team at the right time. They were saying in practice it did not look good for him throwing the ball.

I don't know why you need to say that if you're McDaniel. Yeah, that's a weird comment. But I like a lot what he says So I'm not going down that road The point was more that like he was close In his mind and that I think he'll Every time I saw him on the sideline With the walkie talkie and the aviators

Like I couldn't help but laugh He's kind of funny I did enjoy that He's kind of funny He's what we thought we would get two of those We thought the other would be Nathaniel Hackett And that turned not fun In about six and a half minutes into week one

Right I wonder if Hackett will You know sit it out a little bit Get back into the hip hop dance class Getting paid like a ton of money Yeah. Why rush back into anywhere? Yeah.

All right. Grow a beard. Grow a beard. Hey, the Eagles, your Eagles, Connie, are not playing this upcoming week. So we're not going to dive deep on the Eagles. But I did think it was notable because I wish I would have seen this on Sunday night. We didn't see it. It didn't get to it.

But here's some sound of Siriani, Nick Siriana, talking about Jalen Hertz on Sunday post-game about him, you know, making his way through that. Giants game coming out of it okay even if he wasn't really okay this is just something notable I want to get on the record we didn't feel like there was more risk but you know I know he was hurting he was hurting bad and uh but that's the kind of competitor that he is that's the kind of person that he is and the kind of teammate and leader that he is um that he was able to go out there and stick and tough through it I know he was hurting and then he doubles in it he's hurting bad and I'm just thinking of myself after two weeks he comes back and he comes back and clearly less than 100%, got the dub, got the buy.

There's just no guarantee, Connie, that he's going to be 100% even after this buy. It's going to help, obviously. But I thought it was notable that he came out and said how badly Hertz was playing in pain during the Giants game. If he was hurting so bad, why in the world did he drop back 42 times? Like, they have the ability to run the ball and do other things. And they just weren't employing any of those concepts. Like, and they needed to. And obviously they needed to for a couple of different reasons,

like one to put away the giants who were playing their backups, but also to preserve Jalen Hertz here. I didn't like it. It was strange. And he did not play a great game. No. It's worrisome. I agree.

We talked about it on the Power Rankings podcast. That interception in the third quarter was one of the worst decisions I've seen him make all season. And they played a very conservative game plan to avoid making Jalen Hertz get him in positions where he could take hits. I get all that. So I don't make too much of the fact that they only had one touchdown or all that.

It's more about... Well, one got called back for a really bad call. An illegal man downfield, come on. And he threw an interception on the next place. I just wouldn't tell whoever your opponent is. I wouldn't let anyone know that your starting quarterback is hurting anywhere. He's fine.

He's great because let's be real. Physically emotionally. Everything is great. Keep it inside. It's like in hockey. It's a lower body or upper body injury. Right. All right.

Okay. Howie, Mother Friker. That's a good one. Be a good Catholic. Just bury it all inside. Exactly. Nothing's wrong. Everything's fine.

That organization, right? All right. Brandon Cooks wants to be traded. FYI. We knew that over in Houston. Everybody wants out of Houston. Not shocking. He doesn't want to be part of a rebuild.

Well, you better not be in Houston. And finally, well, not finally. Penultimately. Love it. Love it. I know. this interest people, because he's going to always be asked about him. But Zach Wilson spoke to the media and was asked how he'll handle competition,

knowing that it's coming to the Jets quarterback room in 2023. You said you're a competitor. So if they come to you in March and say, look, we're going to keep you. We like you. We're going to develop you. But we're signing Veteran X to be our starter. Rich Samini. Yeah, I'm going to make that dude's life hell in practice every day.

You know, I'm going to go out there and do my best to just. show the coaches that I deserve to be there and, you know, and it's not, it's not in a negative way. It's a positive way. It's making everybody else, you know, better, hopefully, and you go out there and you just attack every single day. Oh, he's just a sweet baby. I don't know. He looks like he's younger. What it, he needs a beard. What a change, by the way, that sound by compared to what things were entering training camp. Also, in print versus hearing him say it, it's kind of, like, in print, it's like, why did you say that? Just don't say that. It sounds inflammatory, but then in the Uriam state, it's just like a nice little kid.

It reminds me of, like, Tim Tebow joining the Jets saying, like, competition's going to make us all better. I'm going to work and make Mark the air. Iron sharpens iron. The real story that people should pay attention to coming out of Jersey yesterday was that Quinn and Williams, the best player on the Jets, arguably, a pro bowler and potentially an all pro, he said, I'm not going to be heading to voluntary. military workouts unless I get my new contract.

He wants to be the highest paid defensive tackle in the sport. And the Jets do not have a great track record of taking care of their own stars. Get this one right, Joe. Or you're going to have a problem with me. Finally in the news. And Rich Eisen. I mean, and the two people that you don't want to mess within the world. Oh, God.

Me and the face. Finally, and this is good news. Great news. DeMar Hamlin, Bill's safety. Back in Buffalo. So he gets out of the hospital. Cincinnati out of the ICU. He's got all of his mental functions.

He's speaking. He's still recovering, though. So he's still getting hospital care. But he's back in Western New York. So great news on Demar Hamlin. This could not as bad as things were a week ago Monday. They could not be in a better place than they are right now. The doctors from UC Medical Center, I feel like I have now gotten to know them from

watching the press conferences. and really, I just want to say that I feel like they're America's doctors now. I know that tweet they sent out wearing the Hamlin jerseys, just like saying thanks. I love them. I mean, I was like, that's too much. Mark, you have a couple. Yeah, I mean, just like, it could have gone in so many directions. And I'm glad that it quickly got here for the bills, for Buffalo, for football, for everything, especially for DeMarne Hamlin.

I mean, just like, I couldn't, I think we're in the best possible realm at this point. Beautifully said. That's it. I think you're totally, the listener, caught up. And if you're just finishing now the Sunday night recap, you can now roll into this episode and say, oh, it's a tight 60. We did it.

Well, we're disciplined. We'll be back on Thursday. And Thursday is an important episode that you cannot miss because it is our super wildcard weekend preview, breaking down all those games. And again, if you want to go see us at the bourbon room in Hollywood, secondary market. And I would say

You keep saying that as if there is How could you find it? How do you know? Your kids' college funds, nothing should be off limits in terms of finding away into that building. Yeah, chip away

any family finances that might be hanging in the balance. Oh, I think my little girl's going to need braces. She'll be fine. She's like, open up that account. We have thousands of generations

what lived without braces. Right. They were fine. Who needs teeth? You don't even need them. Well, her teeth are going to be there. They just meant, not be a straight, but you will be at the bourbon room for the ATN homecoming show.

If you guys want to get under an hour, you should wrap it up right now. Good. Okay. Why do you don't think this is essential conversation? No, I just like, do you have a goal of actually coming in or does it not matter? I don't know. Do you want one more New Horizons? Keep an eye up.

We'll also, we're going to continue, yes, to track this week, New Horizons, Thursday coming up. Mark, I'll give you the final word. Goodbye. You said a word. It's beautiful. You nailed it. Just like that breaking news. You nailed it.

All right, until Thursday. Heath a call. This is an eye heart This is an IHeart podcast. Thank you.