NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - NFL ATL: Preseason takeaways

Episode Date: August 8, 2014

A room full of heroes -- Dan Hanzus, Gregg Rosenthal, Chris Wesseling and Marc Sessler -- recap the first slate of preseason games discussing the Jets' QB situation, the Cowboys' defense, Ryan Mallett's "showcase" performance and more. Plus, Pete Damilatis of Pro Football Focus calls in to discuss advanced NFL metrics.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the League podcast has more holes than the Cowboys defense. Welcome back to another edition of the Around the League podcast. My name is Dan Hansis, and I'm joined by a room filled with heroes. Mark Sessler, Chris Wessling, and Greg Rosenthal. What up, boys. Hey, Dan. That was not a Chris Wessling.

Hey, Dan. We're a little annoyed. You're all the way across the room. I have to yell over there. Let's, T.D., we sat down last show in our new studio and said, this will be the seating order, and we'll get a photo out there. How we'll sit from now until the end of days. But within one show, T.D. is blown the whole thing up. Wow.

TD, now you're seeing what it's like for me. I know. A bunch of prima donnas. Who cares where we sit? Mark, welcome back from San Diego. San Diego. You were sent. to the Southern California City, the coastal city, to cover Cowboys Chargers.

You met a man in a McDonald's restaurant to get your credential. You sat in a press box. Was it Rob Ryan? You sat in a press box like a professional in that dump of a stadium. How was it? It was good. I learned very quickly that they hand out an inordinate amount of food. There was slices of pizza, there was boxes of popcorn, there was pie, it was like peach cobbler pie, which I'm not, I think I've ever eaten that, but I ate it last night.

Very good. And did you, you know, you're a real reporter guy. Did any of the other real reporters ask you to sit at the lunch table? They gave us a sign seating, and the chargers were nice enough to put me smack dab, like right in front of us as a desk, right below is the field. Beautiful. Some guys were six rows up. I'm not sure what they saw. There wasn't, like, a scene, though, where you're carrying a tray and you're trying to, like, make eye contact with the cool reporters, but they're looking down because they said coal reporters.

Well, I did meet again, Clarence Hill, a Cowboys reporter that Wes and I met at the Comb Biden had quite a nice evening with. Yes, we did, Wes. I'll take your word for it. I don't know what that means. I like to think that you maybe encountered a bully, maybe someone from the San Diego Union Tribune that, like, spilled your pizza on the floor and said, get out of here, dweeb. There were like two or three hundred reporters there, so it wasn't as if... What? That's the Super Bowl?

That's not true. I mean, there were rows and rows and rows of reporters. It wasn't it was like every head turned when you walk in a dive bar in some weird town. By the way, the way that T.D. set this up, I cannot even see him right now. Yeah, you can. Usually we connect and we're able to make eye contact subtly. I've got to turn my head 90 degrees. We're working up the kinks, guys.

We'll see him. I almost missed the ice box right now. One of the kinks you're working out is in Dan's neck now. Yeah, exactly. Hey, now. Nailed it. Wes on fire this morning. All right, so we got a great show today.

We are going to have, we have a guest coming in. He is a reporter, a writer analyst, I should say, for Pro FootballFocus.com, a website that Wes has what seems to be a complicated relationship with. He is Pete Demilettis. Pete Damilattis. Of PFF. So he's going to come on later. We are going to stick with first night of preseason action in earnest on Thursday, six games, and we're going to go through all those games, and we're going to do it with a bit of mirth, as we're known for, and we've won awards for that. It's not just the football analysis in my mind.

It's also the mirth. But before that, how are you doing, TD? Other than some of the production issues, I'm very happy to see you today. Guys, guys. I'm doing well, though. It's good times. I was glad to be back in last day of the week. Myself, you, Dan, and Chris Wrestling

shot some hoops earlier this week. Did some good run. You know, Chris Love of the Rich Eisen podcast came out there. Good times, fun times. Chris Love, the Rich Eisen podcast. I'll tell you what. As a fellow big man, banging with him down low, I was pretty sore afterwards.

That is a large, powerful man. He's a large body. And sweaty. And hairy. He seems athletic to me. He has a, he can play. He has a special move. that I call the snot jumpshot

because I was guarding him and first he wipes his snot off his nose and so I back off because that one he just takes a jump shot. It's like what? We're describing him like he's like the bad guy in like a sports movie theme for kids in the early 90s.

He's like the really rottens in the old cartoons. All right. So how are you doing today? I was thinking that you know, most of the news we talked about is about these games. So we're going to do a lot of talk

of the preseason game. So how about this? Can we now do some news? Your team now. Your players now. Your NFL now. Oh. I hate myself.

It's a shameless plug right there, guys. Shadowy League figures. Pat's TD on the head. NFL now, our new format, or new platform, I should say. Digital format platform. Got lunch a couple of days ago, and it's here now, guys. Well, we know. We've been taping hits for it for weeks on end.

So at some point, you're going to be able to see Mark and Chris, and Dan and myself all honking about the latest news of the day. It should be called NFL at some point. Yeah, I fear for people when they take a look at this. I think that I've already been plotting this how long to wait before we stage a friends-style walkout over contract once we get on camera. I was thinking 12 months initially one year, but now I'm more thinking maybe three months. This sounds promising. Yeah.

Well, it would need to happen right when the waters. Here we are. We're doing our thing every day, and it seems like we've got these guys locked in until at least after draft before we get down to talk about the future. Just drop it. Thanksgiving weekend.

We're unhappy. We want more. I had an old boss that once said, make yourself essential. Once we dig in to NFL now, they're going to have to pony up. And Greg, you're going to lead the charge as the boss. No, no.

Chandler will lead the charge. When I leave the studio each time when we tape the NFL, that now hits. That's what I think. That was essential what we just did. Well, all right. All right. So let's start.

Since we had a man in the field in San Diego, Mark Sessler will start with the Cowboys and Chargers, a game that if you're a Cowboys fan and you're a little nervous about what that defense is going to do this season or not do, you have some reason to be concerned. The Chargers had no problem moving the ball in the Cowboys. and the only real bright spot was Brandon Whedon, which tells us a lot. So, Mark, I want to tell us a little bit about what you saw from both teams. I will let others chime in on aspects of the game.

I, on the way home, I got caught the 405, which is a terrible highway that runs north-south in California. All five lanes shut down for some two-exit-long construction problem. So I had to go on like an 18-mile circuit around. round up some strange road, got home around 2.30 in the morning, standstill traffic, came up with a list about what annoyed me most about what I saw on the field. Ooh. Oh, I like this. I like this.

Why don't we hear them? Let's hear the list. You sure? I would like to hear it. I don't know about you fellas. I would love to hear it. It is a 50 words to describe the Dallas Cowboys defense that I saw last night. I got a good feeling about this.

All right, let's hear it. Hang with me here. Here we go. Putrid, shipwrecked, dreaming in space, mealy, dog bit, moist, abyss, beaver-like, rustic but not in a good way, cowed, overly cute, unabashedly feminine, lost in a fog of incorrect thinking, control, alt-delete, wind-damaged, childlike, but not to suggest. innocence or purity, an eternally open door, the frightening laughter of the idiot, ultra hazy, viciously below average, we're 20 in, a picture of societal norms. We're 20 in out of how many? 50.

A picture of societal norms unhinged on the grid iron. Wait, so that counts only for one word. Yes, it is terms. It is terms or phrases. 20. Let me know when you get to 30. 2, Greg. Let me know that you get to 30.

Distressing. A scorched. Meadow, a dystopian wasteland of the mind, a 400-year stay in Paramus, New Jersey. Every horrible, every horrible ex-girlfriend embodied in a loose 4-3 scheme. All right, can we stop you there for a second? And then we're going to get back to the back into the list. Because we need to digest the front of that. No, that's fair.

Very fair. I was expecting Marinelli to be one of the words. Well, we're not done yet. So, by the way, so what were your thoughts on the deal? defense. I'm not sure where you were going with that. Everything San Diego tried to do, everything San Diego tried to do, it did in spades. Philip Rivers looked outstanding. Every running back they put out there is plowing for six, seven, eight, nine, 22 yards of carry. Well, Jason Garrett and Rod Marinelli, their quotes

weren't quite as colorful as yours, but they were along the same lines. Garrett's quote after the game was sometimes they did okay when asked about the defense that's not really like a motto you want to print up on your t-shirts Cowboys defense 2014 sometimes they did okay

and Marinelli said we have to tackle better I wouldn't be too worried it was only the first week of the preseason I am taking the liberty to completely overreact and by the way I did mention him Brandon Whedon a bright spot

I already heard it downstairs the way Rosenthal was talking people are thinking about Getting back on the bandwagon that I've been on the whole time. I'm sitting there. There's plenty of space. Tell us about Brandon Whedon. How do you look?

I don't think anyone's, if you put him in there as a 16-game starter with that defense, that is going to be mega-ugly. Well, we're not saying that. I think he, to me, looked like he had grown from where he was in Cleveland based on one game last night against and also not great defense. But, again, if he played a lot better last night, he would have been almost as good as he was last year in the preseason. We all know he blew up last August. Yeah, I mean, this is what he does. We're not saying more than that, but he made some throws. He got hit on his touchdown throw hard.

I didn't see him do that. I think the perception of Brandon Wheaton is actually that he's a worse player than he really was. If you lined up his rookie starts against all the rookie starts of rookie quarterbacks over the last 10 or 15 years, drafting the first couple rounds, he'd be pretty close to that. Because he was 30 years old. That is a big factor. I'm just saying he could have a career as a backup for the next four or five years. be a backup. That's all we're saying.

TD, you had what was called a hot take on the issue of the Cowboys. Not really an issue. It's today a tweet from Des Bryant, actually, and trying to prop himself up in Michael Irvin. He tweets out, hey, Dallas Cowboys Nation, today is 8th, August 8th. Who's going to do something great? At Michael Ever,

hashtag 88. I mean, come on. You just lie. This is like a softball right here. This is an alley-U. You know, you're just walking right into that one. Eight and eight, really? Eighth, eight would be a good season for them. Come on. There's a lot of problems that that was Cowboys, but one of them is not Des Bryant. Well, for enough, that tweet, though, could have used some work.

And it's not their offensive line. What's that? What's up with that? Their offensive line is excellent. Yeah, I'll save the Cowboys fans the trouble of tweeting at us. We know five starters were out last night. All right, relax. Just don't tweet us anyway, because, well, go ahead. I feel like blocking people to do it.

Wow. By the way, I guess I should say nothing really matters, but the Chargers is one that game 27 to 7. Took care of business. 395 yards. Moving forward, the New York Jets opened their preseason schedule against the Indianapolis Colts at MetLife Stadium. The big story, of course, is the quarterback position in New York where Michael

Vic, I would say, did outplay Gino Smith. He got some series with the starters. He led the Jets on their only touchdown drive. He had a pretty 15-yard scramble on a third and nine that kept that scoring drive alive. got the crowd going at MetLife Stadium and showed that he still can move even at age 34. So, and I will tell you this,

Gino Smith did not do anything to lose the job. He led the team on a field goal drive. Didn't have any meltdowns, no turnovers. But Vic keeps things interesting in it, and it lets you, it makes you think what happens if he continues to play well next week. Is it possible he could steal this job? Not before week one.

There's nothing, you know, Smith is going to do that could lose a job. Barring injury. Oh, really? I don't think so. Oh, I think there is. Yeah, I don't know. He could have an epic face plant.

That's what it has to be, though. Right. It has to be an epic face plant by Gino. By the way, Mike Vick threw for 19 yards. I saw the New York Post cover. It's like, Vic is putting on the pressure. It's Vic time. They had two series.

But that's the problem. Right. This is what we've been saying all along. Even if you go into the season with Gino, it's almost a nightmare scenario that he's going to be looking over his shoulder and the fans are going to be clamoring. The papers are going to be clamoring. It's tough. I agree.

But this is New York, by the way. And you're a starting quarterback in New York. And if you're going to, if you're tough enough to handle that, then you deserve to keep the job. Gino is up against it. But I don't think that's unfair to him. The one play. Yeah. Michael Vic made exactly one play in the game.

And it was a play that defines why his career has been a disappointment. He should have gone down. He starts, it was a 15-yard run where he showed off some wheels. But at the very end, he was about to get tackled. And he cut back to the inside. And in the regular season, you're going to get popped on that play, and then you're out. I mean, that's been Michael Vick. You know, had the Jets gone out and stolen Matt Hasselback away from the cults

and had him as the mentor, the older guy. Stolen? You have to steal that Hasselback? I guess. I don't know. He's a possession of the cults. But the problem is, and this is, you know, what Wes and I have been talking about all of season, is you're going to put Gino Smith out there. It's nice you want to believe in your young quarterback.

But they have a close-minded approach to this quarterback battle right now. He's going to start week one, no matter what happens. happens between now and then. That's an issue. That's not how to run a football team, in my opinion. I thought you just said that the job was still open this summer. I think it should be. I don't think it will be because I think they're going to do something

underheaded and start Smith no matter what. But with a guy like Michael Vic in the New York fan base, that is a bad concoction for chaos. See, I don't get, I don't quite get where you're going with this, because in one hand, you're saying that the jets are dunderheaded not to start Vic. But on the other hand, like we're seeing. No, to not have a, not to say, listen, if Vic out plays Geno Smith, Do you think Smith will still start week one? That's my concern.

Yeah, but what if it's kind of, what if Gino doesn't face-playing? There won't be a huge difference between the two. That's the reality. The odds are that they'll both be okay. What is perception coming out of last night to the average Jets fan? Yeah, but we're talking reality. If they watch the game, they would not take it. Rex Ryan called him a huge, huge issue to deal with for defenses, and he said he played great.

But he also said that about Gino Smith in fairness, too. He said he thought Gino played exception, which is funny because all he did. did his handoff. Yeah. It wouldn't surprise me if Rex Ryan and John Idzick are on different pages. That's what I think is happening. That's fair. Rex Ryan had to defend against guys like Michael take his whole career.

I think this is all secondary. The biggest takeaway for me in this game was Chris Ivory got hurt in four plays. He always gets hurt. It's his move. He's going to use it. Right, but that's a problem for them. That's a big. Chris Johnson did not look great.

And then on the cult side, they had injury issues. You know, they already lost their guard. They're starting guard to a season-ending quad injury. That's Donald Thomas. And now they have their center, Khalid Holmes, suffered a ankle injury that he's getting an MRI on it Friday. So you don't know how serious that is. They had another rookie tackle, Ulrich John, go down as well as with a leg injury. So that offensive line, which has been an issue, you have to be a little concerned if you're a Colts fan about that.

But it didn't stop Daniel Boom Herron from scoring a touchdown. I'd be more concerned if I was a Colts fan that Trent Richardson of 2014 looks exactly like Trent Richardson of 2013. Not a lot of sunshine coming out of this game. It was a little early. I don't know if I took. It's only five carries, but that's a slow running back. That's fair. Moving on.

Greg, you mentioned Dan Boom Heron. The Colts running back scored a touchdown on Thursday night against the Jets. That led to an old teammate of Heron, Chris Raney, who was released under mysterious circumstances for breaking a team rule. He tweeted from his couch watching the game, nice TD, boom, even though you was in the hallway with me that night when he was horsing around with the fire extinguisher, man up like I did. Fire extinguisher, folks, we have a reason behind this.

And there was another tweet, right? He deleted them both quickly because he's a smart guy. And then he also said, yeah. He's a very smart guy. Yeah, I'm pissed watching the Colts game when I should be out there too, even though I didn't break no effing team rules, not even. So Chris Rainey, apparently something happened with a fire extinguisher. Boom Heron potentially had something to do with that.

That's probably the straw that broke the camel's back. I'm sure Rainy did other things to annoy the Colts organization. But putting heron on blast. You called him a smart man? Oh, he got that tweets right out of it. No, there was some sarcasm. Yeah, he just blasted the only organization in the NFL willing to give him like a force shot. Probably not a good idea.

Mark. I sense a little bit of injustice here, and I'm going to go from the other angle. It sounds like there was some malarkey. And we've got, you know, you've got Rainy sitting home on his couch because a friend of his wouldn't own up to some shenanigans in a hotel hallway. You have some sort of history with fire extinguishers? Well, yes, Greg and I will not go down a long road with this. It's been in college in the middle of the night. This is why this hits me, because in the middle of the night,

I was with a couple of friends in our dorm, right? We're on the fourth floor of a dorm throwing a Nerf football around. And, you know, one of those little sprinklers in the ceiling, pop one of those things, and it sets off water pipes all along the hallway, and these felt ceiling tiles just melt into glue over the next two hours. It floods the entire building and costs thousands of dollars of damage. Everyone's evacuated for three hours outside. No one caught us.

And we decided as a trio, we got to own up to this. You know what? We got to own up to this. No, and because we did. Unlike Boom Herron. And because we did. I've seen this after school special. You can say it's dumb, but they removed, they held us accountable for nothing because we were honest.

Well, you were lucky. You also have been held accountable for nothing if you didn't admit to it. How about the one guy who didn't know? I had always video for things like that. There's always, you're going to get. get caught. Not in 1988, whenever this happened. This was not 1988.

Listen, I just think Rainy is sitting home because his friend wouldn't stand up for. Well, that's a great point. They probably did check the video. There are videos. And you know why? Because, you know, Heron's not a pain in the butt, and he's better at football. So they're like, yeah, well, that goes a long way. Rainy's sitting at home because of the other 37 knucklehead decisions he made over the last few years.

That's also very fair. There's a, there's a scene in the Christmas story, the classic movie when a flick gets his tongue caught on the flagpole. and then the teacher comes back after the fire department takes flick off the pole and they're like whoever was involved with this has to own up and come forward and then Peter Billingsley's character Ralphie says you know kids we know better you never own up to anything because you're going to get busted if you do well I wasn't a kid Dan I was a man that was the day you became a man by the way I do want to ask the question that all of our listeners have been thinking for the last 10 minutes

we are going to get to hear the end of Mark Sessler's list of adjectives about the Cowboys eventually, right? At the end of the show. Always leave them one and more. I'm just making sure. I want to know for my own. I've been on the edge of my seat. Me too. That was a Jets 1310 win.

Thank you for putting these preseason scores out there, Dan. A late field goal by Unknown Kicker, whose name I cannot recall this time. Fernie. Fernie. Right through the uprights, and away we go. 1-0. Almost there to the game. Dan, tell the listeners what you prefer.

proposed last night. Fernie for Mallet. Straight up. Who says no? Who says no? And that leads us into our next game. Greg watches game with a glum look. With a glum look on his face.

The New England Patriots opened their preseason schedule against the Washington Redskins, where Ryan Mallet, in what Greg wrote, was called Operation Showcase Ryan Mallet, off to a very slow start, did not look comfortable in the pocket when five of 12 in action did not get a point on offense to not leave the offense anywhere, so things kind of backfire there. So if the Patriots thought that Ryan Mallet could be showcased for a deal, it blew up in their face, Greg, like their face. I don't think anyone wanted to trade for Ryan Mallet before this game.

I don't think they'll want to at the end of the preseason because he has never been good in the preseason. He's never comfortable. He's never accurate. This was a particularly bad performance, 45 yards and no points in an entire half. but he never feels, looks like a natural quarterback. And that's bad news. I had the same reaction.

He doesn't look like a natural quarterback. If you watched his counterpart, Kirk Cousins, had a much better handle on what was going on. If you turned on the Chiefs game, Chase Daniel has a much better handle on how to play quarterback than Ryan Mallett does. Of course, the Patriots started guys that have no chance to make the team. We're in their starting lineup. It's ridiculous that people have to pay full price for a preseason game to watch that nonsense. But I'm going to spin it positive, Dan.

Because as a Jets fan, you had to be a little worried watching the second half of this game and realizing that the Brady to Garapolo transition is going to be like Farrv to Aaron Rogers and you can just keep them on top of the AFC East for 25 years. I can't wait to see the Patriots turn against Tom Brady like the Packers did with Farrf. No, we'll never do that. I'm just saying the guy is there. The future MVP is in the clubhouse. He threw a nice touchdown pass at the end of the game.

but I am not worried because you don't you don't get lucky Greg all the time an organization is lucky to get a Tom Brady once every 50 years what about the cult well that that's what I was thinking too you're not at the cults just the AFCs two best teams you're going back to the Patriots that you were for years and years and the AFCs will be wide open again all jokes aside Garapolo as reportedly at a poor training camp in practice but he looked he had almost a perfect half of football there wasn't just one throw. He had three or four great deep passes. He could have had another long touchdown if they had challenged a play. He had as good a half as he could against third and fourth

teamers. Yeah, we should note that it was against people that would be, you know, working for UPS and like shop right four weeks from now. By the, Mark, does it bother you at all or does it make you happy at all that maybe the quarterbacks that played the best, the two best quarterbacks on the field Thursday night, Colt McCoy and Brandon Whedon. Colt McCoy, eight for nine, 102 yards. I would not put weed in that category, but Colt McCoy sizzled. And you know what? I'm all four call McCoy keeping a job in the NFL he's got to make that team he's going to make good team three quarterbacks yeah it reportedly it's had a really good camp and i think they like that he adds a little veteran even though he's not much older than the other two guys he's just

a good guy to have around can't you see him being a future coach like he's that it all yeah i could see him being texas coach it also helps your own son's legacy if the guy that he was named after makes it to your son's kindergarten year yeah that would help and uh simona is a niners fan and so she She was sad to see Colt McCoy off that roster. They could use them. But she actually captured an image of our son, Colt, watching Colt McCoy on television, which was a perfect marriage of reason and result. And by the way, that final score was Washington Redskins 23, New England Patriots.

Six. Sessler's boy, Lake Seastrunk, looked great in that game, by the way. Rookie Sleeper. I will need to watch that because I don't know if this happened to you, but a game rewind or game pass where I was. was not functioning too well last night, a little bit off the rails. I believe the product is excellent, and if there were any technical issues, I'm sure it will be taken care of immediately. I assume for one, adore game pass.

A lollipop. All right. Oh, fine. It's all on the Wi-Fi connection at the Chargers. Oh, wait, we work for them, too. The NFL. How do we get out of this jam? And all its properties are infallible.

All I do is we're, we, we know what. Lollipop. Lollipop. All right, moving forward. Hey, rematch folks of the Super Bowl last night. The Broncos and the Seattle Seahawks squared off at Mile High Stadium in a game that felt like it would never end. There were 25 penalties in the game. There was a lightning delay. What we did see in terms of takeaways, watch the game.

DeMarcus Ware looks very, very healthy and very effective. And he got to the quarterback, sacked Russell Wilson, blew up a play in the back field. Got some hurries. He looked like the guy he was in Dallas when his arms and his legs weren't bothering him. So that's something very positive for Denver. And the Broncos also had a little bit more running back issues. I know they lost Monte Ball to an appendectomy last week. C.J. Anderson, who's fighting to get a roll head of Ronnie Hillman, suffered a concussion.

So he, we don't know how long he'll be out. But those are the two big takeaways from me. Where's huge. You ran down Russell Wilson on one play. and forced him to throw the ball away. I mean, he was on pace for about the best game ever. Two hurries, a sack, a stuff at the line of scrimmage. And that's what the preseason can be forward.

Okay, this veteran is back healthy again. Okay, this rookie quarterback looks okay. You can take that away. Yeah, and teams like this operating at this high level, you know, one of the biggest subplots that any of the starters get injured. No, everybody got out of it healthy. Manning and Russell Wilson, both lead touchdown drives. One kind of funny note was right when the lightning delay hit,

and the Broncos had gone up 7-0. The local Denver announcer had this quote that I had to tweet out, and I'll read it to you guys now. As dominated as the Broncos were in the Super Bowl, they're returning the favor right now. Terrible. By the way, the score out. Revenge.

Oh. It was 7-0 at the time that he said that. I did. I wish you weren't a liar. And then the Broncos... Such an anchorman move. The Broncos went on to win 2116, so I guess, you know, they got revenge.

Stephen February 2nd, 2014, never happened. All ill swiped away. That wasn't the only Super Bowl rematch last night. Ooh, you're right. Great transition, Wes. Wes, I'm really proud of you there. The Baltimore Ravens in San Francisco 49ers also played. This is a game that Chris Wessling watched,

so that explains why he was so on point there, especially with the transition. And I ask you, Chris Wessling, what was your takeaway? I'm very curious about the Ray Rice, Bernard Pierce dynamic. We've heard both guys look good. Ray Rice maybe got his burst back. Is that true?

The first team offense was only on the field for one drive with Flacco, and they looked better than I can remember them looking in a long time. I think the Kubiak offense suits Flacco well. Ray Rice had burst. He looked closer to 2012, Ray Rice, in 2013. But with splitting snaps throughout the first drive with Bernard Pierce, who got the goal line love, they both look good. You know what might suit this offense in Gary Kubiak well,

being a coordinator. Like, it just hit me like, maybe he's Norv Turner. Maybe he's Wade Phillips, a guy that's one of the very best coordinators in the league. Haven't you always thought that, yeah, yeah? Wes, are you confident that the snowsuit is off Ray Rice? I am. I thought he, whereas Trent Richardson looked exactly like last year, Ray Rice did not look.

I thought he looked streamlined. Did Steve Smith play? Steve Smith did and looks taller in a Ravens uniform. Taller. Yes. Hashtag analysis. I like that. What does that even mean?

I'm just telling you what I saw. Maybe he is. I hate to go on Greg Kossoe with you here, but all I do, you guys know what I do. All I do is watch the film. And on the other side of the other backfield here, Carlos Hyde did some things. He looked good. It's hard to separate him from the blocking, which was excellent. Bruce Miller had a fantastic block that got him to the edge.

Stevie Johnson had a really good block. But he looked good. And I thought watching Jeremy Hill for the Bengals and watching Hyde for the 49ers, Bengals fans at some point this season are going to be wondering why they didn't take Carlos high. It is a good sign for him in terms of vision and just understanding the play that he is following the correct blocking. We don't always see, you know, I was watching some Browns games last year. I could tell you that's not always the case. Yeah.

Wes is Blaine Gabbard in the NFL on September 1st. That's a good question. I would say he'll still be in the NFL because they don't really have another option and because I would think that hardball is the stubborn type who thinks he can turn him around why what happened yesterday he looked like probably worse than he looked in jaguar's uniform he set a new standard for the gabard zone which for new listeners is you know a yards per attempt average somewhere in the fives generally his yards per attempt yesterday was 1.7 yikes finally with a big interception that's spurgeon wind zone

finally the kansas city chiefs and Cincinnati bangles offense if you like offense You should have been there. Andy Dalton, a 53-yard bomb to A.J. Green in his only series. The Chiefs, Travis Kelsey, really made a play that turned heads. Caught a ball ran 69 yards for a touchdown. Basically outran everyone. That was an interesting look. Not a lot of defense played here, Greg, huh?

Well, when Jason Campbell was in the game, the defense perked right up for the chiefs. I mean, Campbell packed more into two quarters than you could possibly want. He had two touchdown passes. He had two passes that were returned for touchdowns, and he was injured. This guy moves the needle. I'm just saying, yeah, that's why we're diving deep in the camel. You saw what happened when he doesn't check down. Pick sixes.

They don't have a quarterback right now if he's hurt because A.J. McCarran hasn't been able to practice either. Backup quarterback, that is. How about Black Mamba making a play? Who's Black Mamba? Oh, yeah, the Anthony Thomas. Come on. Snoop Dogg gave the name before Kobe. got it. De Anthony had it in Pop Warner Ball.

De Anthony Thomas has reportedly had a great camp and everyone says he's too small for the NFL. He bounced off tacklers last night on his way to a long punt return touchdown. Between that and Travis Kelsey, those were the two most explosive plays of the entire night in the NFL. Greg and I, we hate to throw any shade on Roto World. But come on, you can't write off the Anthony Thomas before his career overstarted. He looked like the NFL game is not too fast for him. No, and not too big. I love the fact that he kind of got out of a jam. I mean, that stuck out to me that he could be a fun factor on special teams.

Travis Kelsey, one of the fastest tight ends in the NFL. I have never seen a tight end run like he did on his test. That's what he said for Lederius Green last year. Well, that was two. Well, they keep getting faster, apparently. None of them are faster than Vernon Davis. 260 pounds, and it was just whew! Yeah, he's fast.

ATD, I know you've been called Young Kobe. during your childhood as a basketball player. Young Kobe nickname precedes both a black-mounted nicknames. Did you ever have any reptilian-type nickname? No, no. See, Kobe nicknamed himself. That's not allowed. That's not allowed at all.

That's not allowed at all. All right. So those are the games. Oh, the final score there was 41 to 39. Oh, got to get that score on that recent. Shootout in Cincinnati? Or was it? It was in Kansas City.

It's in Kansas City. All right, we're rolling. Shootout. And oh, by the way, Eric Fisher was the number one draft pick last year. I know we're trying to move on, but that's been an overlooked story. The number one picking the whole draft, moving to left tackle. He immediately got beat for a strip sack, lost the ball. That was the worst draft ever.

Yes. It was. Remember that draft is the most boring, mundane draft with the least amount of impact players, at least in the early first round. All right, gentlemen, so as we spoke about earlier, we have a guest on the line. He is a writer and analyst for the website, pro footballfocus.com, a site that proudly claims its stats and analysis. are, quote, beyond compare.

Here's a writer and analyst, Pete Damilatis. What's up, Pete? Welcome to the Round of the League podcast. Thanks. Thanks for having me. You know, I'm a little ashamed to say this, but I actually hadn't started listening to your guys' podcasts until, I think it was back in May around the time where Sessler was freaking out about drafting Johnny Mansell. But since then, honestly, you guys have kind of flown up my boards,

and you're listening to me, but I haven't missed an episode since. Savvy way to start an interview. Yes, and Pete, you know, as a listener, that we all use your website a lot when we do our post and just doing research of the game. Chris Wessling, however, a man famous for his PFF qualifier statements, I'll give an example. Now, I don't take this as gospel, but PFF says Brandon Marshall is the best blocking wide receiver in football. So Chris Wessling, a man that has had some issues at times with the metrics. Pete, Wes.

Pete is one of my favorite followers on Twitter, a good guy. By the way, Pete's Twitter handle at PFF underscore Pete. I think, I believe every adult should think for themselves and not take anything as gospel. That's why I always give the qualifier. And it's clear that NFL teams don't always see players the same way PFF does. So that's one of the things that I always want to prepare people for But without a doubt one of the most valuable services out there is provided by PFF I think I'd probably cite their material as much as any writer out there over the past few years

So I appreciate things like run after catch ability, which they highlight or quarterback pressures You don't get this stuff anywhere else and their signature stats are great too So what are your issues then? Well, I would just like to ask Pete how he sleeps at night with Ben Hartsock is his number one ranked tight end. Oh, man. I think if you look at it, you'll see that Ben Hartsock is our number one ranked blocking tight ends.

So, and that actually, you know, does. No, he's number one on your grade above some of the other guys. He's number one in your overall grades for tight ends for two days. This is true. This is true because, you know, we take blocking into account, and Ben was really great at that last season. So, you know, we, uh, yeah, and, West, to your point, I think that, you know, you don't take PFF grades as gospel. I don't think anyone should take PFF grades as gospel. And I think

our analysts themselves, I don't take PFF grades as gospel. You know, I don't, you know, evaluate a player by saying, okay, well, this guy was second in our grades. This guy was third. So this guy is clearly better than, you know, player is better than player B. And, you know, I think you kind of have to put them in context. So I think the PFF grades are a data point. And I think they're tremendously important one because I see all the work that goes into it and and all the analysis and man hours that we put into coming up with those grades. But I think even the people behind the scenes who are coming up with those grades themselves and giving them out, wouldn't say that looking at a guy's PFF grade says, you know, is the end-all be-all. Now for a guy, you know,

like a Ben Hartstock, you know, it's a, I think that speaks to one thing that makes us a unique site is that we're looking at things that go beyond just your surface stats. So we're looking at blocking. We're looking at quarterback pressures for defensive ends and also, you know, the offensive linemen who are trying to block them. And we're even timing those pass rushes to tell you, you know, how great that was. Was it the sack a, you know, a sack where the defensive end blew up the offensive tackle, or was it kind of a clean-up muddy sack where the quarterback just ran into his

arms? So, I mean, I think you can see some of the grades on our site. work that goes into it and that's why you get some things that like ben hartsock being the number one ranked tight end but really if you look drilled down into it he's he's by far the best blocking tight end of the league last season but you know not not so great as a receiver right so just out of curiosity that's all very well explained but when you see something like ben hartsock is your number one ranked tight end when he didn't catch a pass and played about one fourth of snaps at jimmy graham why are you guys not going back to the drawing board and saying maybe we

should not count blocking as important because blocking tight ends aren't even drafted in the first five rounds in the NFL. Well, I think it's because when you look at the grades, you know, we're trying to evaluate performance, and we're in many times, you know, in many instances, we're giving out the grades as if there are any other player on that, on the team. So, you know, if he's trying to make a block and he, you know, does a good block, it's kind of the same thing as if an offensive guard is trying to try to do the same type of block. Now, the difference is that we normalize it across the different positions.

So that's how you get some instances where a one good block for a tight end might matter a little bit more than a block for a guard who's kind of out there blocking for 60-70 snaps of games. So, you know, I think there are differences. And I see your point, West. You know, I'd say that if we go back and we look at it, you know, maybe the, we shouldn't have blocking grades maybe as high, but, you know, those are grades. We stand by them, and to be honest, you know, that's why we say we don't take it as gospel either. So you kind of have to take everything into context.

And I don't think you would, even though Ben Hartsock is our number one great tight end, I don't think anyone on the PFF team would tell you that Ben Hartsock was the best tight end of the league last year. We're talking with Pete Damilettis of Pro FootballFocus.com. Pete, when you look at the numbers, because the way you guys study the game is different than a lot of other people, I'm just curious, last season, was there a player that, according to your data, completely transformed himself from an average guy to a star player or maybe the other way around? Is there someone that really, when you studied the data, really kind of jumped out at you one way or the other? Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, there are a couple of those younger players who have been in the league for a couple of seasons that took major leaps last year. I mean, at the top of that list is Robert Quinn. He went from, you know, in the past, he'd put up some good numbers and good grades by us. but we saw a tendency of him to beat up on easier competition, specifically when he was playing teams like Cardinals, who kind of can have a bit of an offensive line, some offensive line issues.

Robert Quinn would just rack up stats against them, but then against tougher competition, he would sort of get shut down. Last year, he took a major leap, and he was dominating very good competition on a consistent basis, and he was actually our number two defensive player in the league. you know, he would have been, you know, when our defensive player the year award if it wasn't for the greatness of J.J. Watt.

So he's a guy who made leaps and bounds. I look at another guy like a Cameron Jordan who, you know, in the past had sort of the same thing that, you know, he had flashed some talent, but, you know, former first round pick, but he hadn't kind of put together. And last year we really saw him do that where he, you know, he put everything together. He was a force on the interior. It's kind of great to see.

I think it's also a bit of a league-wide trend when you see guys like J.J. Watt and G. Atkins and Cameron Jordan, guys who are kind of bringing that pressure from the interior, guys like Gerald McCoy as well, who took another leave last season. We did our PFF top 101 for 2013. He was our fourth graded player. So it's nice to see that the game changing going towards the past. You're seeing a lot of interior rushers disrupting offenses in a way that we haven't seen in the past.

How about somebody that went the other way? Someone that went the other way. I mean, you look at some veterans who, you know, I, one guy that comes to mind is the Nike Taylor, who, you know, for years, the Steelers had him as a, you know, as a sort of a island cornerback where they asked him to do a lot of man to follow the number one receiver around the field. And he did pretty well in that role. And he never even got the highest PFF grades, but that's, again, the instance where you have to put our grades into context because his job was a lot harder than

than someone who just had to, you know, would line up on one side of the field in zone coverage. But last year, he kind of took a big step back. He, but towards the middle of the season, they weren't even having him shadow receivers anymore. He had one of our worst grades as a cornerback. So he's a guy that kind of jumps to the top of my head as a guy who took a major step back. So, you know, and of course you have your obvious candidates like an Eli Manning, who was consistently a top 10 quarterback in our grading year after year. And last season, the wheels came off the offense.

He didn't have any chemistry with his receivers, and we all know how that went. I think we'd agree with you there. When it comes to the process, let's say, you know, last night the Jets played the Colts, and they say, Pete, go up, break down this game, grade it. I mean, nuts and bolts, what's the process for you to do that? So we have, so this is why I have a lot of trust and pro football focus in our system. It's because we have so much, we put so much work into it, and we have such a flesh-out process.

So we'll have a couple guys who are doing what you call player participation, where you're looking through and you're marking where every player is on every play and who's blitzing, who's lining up inside the tackles, outside the tackles, what receivers are in the slot, who's up on the line of scrimmage, stuff like that. And you're marking all that, and that helps us normalize those grades at the end of the game because it makes a difference if a guy has a sack when he's only in the game for five snaps rather than he has one sack and he was in the game for 70. And then we have another couple analysts who do the actual grading.

So they're going through and they're looking at what's exactly happening on the play, what was supposed to happen if a running back at stop for a loss, was it because, you know, he took a bad angle, the hole was there, and he kind of bounced to the outside for some reason, you know, like say maybe a Trent Richardson or Chris Johnson said it to do last year. or um you know if it was a blown block by a guy and and to be honest uh for the most part most players on a on a specific plate don't even get a grade because you know they they they held a block well or you know they got a piece of defender they didn't like shove him back

and and open up a wide hole but they didn't get pushed back either and it's sort of you know that's uh that's a null-no but you know that you'll only have you know a couple handful of guys that get great on every play. But then, you know, we are going through, we're putting that information into our database, and at the end of the game, you have a grade. And it's kind of shocking how, and the reason I like it is I like to call it almost quantified,

quantified scouting, because if you can go through a game and you can see a guy who has a sack and a tackle for loss, and you're saying, oh, wow, he had a good game, and then you see the grade at the end of the game. You're like, actually, you know, it was kind of average because, you know, I forgot that he kind of didn't hold the edge on that one play and he got pushed back and then he missed that other tackle. And then after all, you know, once you add everything up, you see that, you know,

his grade was kind of not as great as you expected or sometimes a lot better than you expected. Ryan Tannahill ranked last year in Pro Football Focus's rankings ahead of Tom Brady, ahead of Aaron Rogers, way ahead of Andrew Luck. What did you think people saw on a game-to-game basis that would put Ryan Tannahale in the top five quarterbacks in the league? I think Tana Hill I think that honestly

he did a good job I like to intermediate accuracy his deep ball you know he had a he had some deep ball issues that I think that are well documented he tended to hold on to the ball a little too long

I think the Miami offensive line got a lot of heat for the amount of sacks they gave up but some of it was Tana Hill's fault as well but you know I think that he did a pretty good job on his accuracy and also in general you know I don't think that his his mistakes were

grossly more than a lot of other quarterbacks out there. And it's funny to see, you know, interception numbers and then to see kind of our grades, because you see a guy like Andrew Luck, who has a little bit of a worse PFF grade last year than Matt Stafford and Ryan Tannahill.

And you kind of look back at, they actually kind of all, we chart throws by, you know, we'll give negative grades for throws, and you've got a really bad grade if you have thrown an interception, like a wildly erratic interception or a path that goes nowhere near the receiver. And Andrew Luck had just as many of those as Ryan Tannahill and Matt Stafford did last year,

but for one reason or another, you know, we saw a good amount of dropped interceptions from Andrew Luck that he got away with. You'll see, you know, the stats kind of don't even out. So even though our grades are a little bit higher on one guy over another, you might, you know, that's, I think, what makes people a little bit shocked by everything because you'll see, oh, Ryan Tannahill and Matt Stafford had so many interceptions, but sometimes it was just unlucky plays as well on their part. Yeah, that Tantahill grade is just crazy.

So I guess Knowing that the Tannahill grade is crazy And I know you guys grade like Pete's like why am I on the show right now Well it's just it's jibberish It's nonsensical It's weird because the way you're explaining it If this level says that Tannahill played at an MVP level

So I would sort of expect PFF to have a big push Like Tannahill is an Aaron Rogers level guy I don't know No I guess I guess the thing with Tannahill is I don't think that he should get the full black that he does, where the coaches are almost, you know, calling him out of the off season saying, well, this is, you know, put up or shut up time. And that's what, I think that's a general sense that people have around Tannahill right now. I don't think that's

the case. I think that he's developed in his couple years. I think he's shown a pretty good amount of skill. And I think there's a lot to build on there. So, and frankly, I think Andrew luck had a better season, if you asked me last year, just because of, you know, the weapons around him. I think he didn't have as many, as much to work with as, as Ryan Tannehill did. And I didn't think his offensive line was nearly as good. But honestly, I think that, you know, Tannahill doesn't deserve a lot of criticism that he gets. So what I was going to ask was I feel like I learned that you guys give like a plus two or a minus two,

the people who do the grading on each play. What are the qualifications for the person doing this analysis? what qualifies them to do that job so a lot of it's just you know that we just have a very stringent we have a very stringent application and training process so so we have guys who have been doing grading for a few years but you know to get to that level you have to do player participation for a season a couple seasons grading you know you'll you'll spend the entire offseason going through games game after game putting in grades till you get both the accuracy and the efficiency to have a game graded, you know, by the next day, you know,

for when the teams that use us need our grades by. So, you know, we'll basically, you know, the qualifications, you know, that we don't have former coaches, you don't have former defensive coordinators or anything doing our grades, but, you know, we have a lot of knowledgeable guys out here, you know, Steve Palzolo, Sam Munson, you know, I'd put their football acumen up with with anyone out there um and and i think that you know going through we have this a string enough process and a string of checks and balances um where if if we see a play and we see that you know two guys have a different grade on it we'll talk it out and look through and say okay well this guy you know why did you think you know it was on the cornerback why you think it was

on the safety and another another important point to put out as we don't guess so if if we don't know, you know, what happened on the play. And we think that, you know, there's really no way to tell. And honestly, most of the time you can tell, you know, who is at fault. But most of the time, but if there's those few times where you can tell, we're not going to kill a guy with his grade because we don't know, you know, what coverage they were supposed to be in. And I think that's a, I think that's a good point that Pete makes. Sometimes you, you get the feeling when you follow sports in NFL specifically that you have to be a player, be a coach or something to really understand the game. But these are guys that do their homework.

and that's why we use Pete's site all the time, pro football focus.com. Pete, thank you for coming on. One last question, and I'm just curious. I like to ask other human beings this question. Will Wes eat his softball pants? I'm firmly, firmly believe that he will not.

I don't buy the... See, Wes and Pete, now in the same tree together. Well, it's interesting. I don't buy the... You know, we're not going to start, Manzo. I think they're going to start. Honestly, I think we're also going to see.

Blake Bordel is up out there starting by, you know, week two, week three. You know, I think taking these guys so high, and I think also quarterbacks are more NFL ready than they have been in the past, sitting a guy who you invested so much in for a year or however many weeks they're playing on doing it, I just don't buy it. Well, Pete doesn't think Chris will eat his softball pants, but I have noticed a little change as we're heading to week one of the preseason that even Chris Wessling seems to start being accepting his role that he will be eating some softball pants they exist and they will be eaten that was said by chris wesley he was talking about his softball pants last that again last show

they exist and they will be eaten that is taking way out of context i now feel like uh how athletes feel when reporters take their quotes out of context it's a quote it's a fact all right pete thank you very much for coming on you could follow pete at at pff underscore p pete you Pete, a great follow, and a great football site. Thanks, man. Thanks, Pete. Yeah, thanks for having me on, guys. It was a pleasure.

There you go, Wes. I feel like you did, as TD remarked on IM during that. You did not back down. You had points you were going to make. You can see why I'm conflicted, though. They give very valuable information. It's based off film watching, and nobody watches more film than they do. But they do ridiculous stuff, like Ryan Taylor,

ahead of Big Ben and Andrew Luck, when it's just absolutely a farce. I mean, it ends up being a farce of a grade. Well, there's so much value in them watching every single snap. They have such good information from that. I really like the, I think it's called the refocused every week. They have just takeaways from watching. To me, that's the best value you have in the written word. The world, not the numbers.

The world of football analysis is a much more enlightened place because of pro football focus. I mean, I do want to make that point implicitly. All right. Well, that's it for Friday's edition of the Iraq. Man in the League podcast. We will be back next week with three more shows. Until then, this is Dan Hansis, signing off for the Sizzler, the mailman, the boss, and T.D. behind the glass.

And why don't we play it out with Sessler finishing up his list of Dallas Cowboys defense commentary? It's 50 terms of why they are. Yeah, where are we at right now? We are at 23. 50? I feel like it's 500. All right, go ahead, Mark. Well, it does feel a tad long.

Here we go. Every horrible ex-girlfriend embodied. in a loose 4-3 scheme. Sterell, a wasteland of ideas, the bottom of the food chain. I'm going to go back to the human attraction. Dead leaves, a corpse. Yeah, I'm back to you guys. A wreckage, scattered parts, fat-faced, never sexy, intellectually suspect, untravelled, pockmarked, soiled.

I'm going to go get some lunch. Swirling into a pit, level below human, pistol. This is an I-Heart podcast.