NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - NFL ATL: Who's winning training camp battles?

Episode Date: August 13, 2014

A room with some heroes -- Gregg Rosenthal, Chris Wesseling and Marc Sessler -- highlight the latest news from around the NFL and debate who wins the top training camp position battles. Plus, Wesseling unveils the top backup quarterbacks in the league.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the League podcast does not listen to your podcast. Welcome to another edition of the Around the League podcast. I'm Greg Rosenthal, and I'm joined by a couple of heroes, Chris Wessling and Mark Sessler. Hey, Greg. It's so good to be here. It's great. Listen, we love Mondays in the NFL because we've got a lot to tell.

talk about i mean i'm just you know the rest of the day we got to file this story got to get over there got to get in front of a camera and it's all kind of stops when we get in this room studio 66 we can just talk some football it's it's our sanctuary that's what the kids say right i was going to say sanctuary there you go well mark sanctuary last night was that a counting crows concert a fading 1990s all right but you saw but you saw dan hansis there you went you went with him so yeah we went together I actually had a chance to, I went over to Dan's household and met his young son, Jack Carson Hansis. That's awesome.

What a great little guy. And the family's doing great. Doing great from what I could tell. And then we went up and snuck our way to the first row of the Counting Crows concert. We were nestled back in like Section B or something and whittled our way down to the very first row. Took some photos. And Dan's wife was cool with him spending the third night of his son's life. with Adam Durrits instead of Jack?

Well, a potentially sticky sign of things to come, but I think she was because her family's there. There was a lot of, you know, listen, Dan's covered his bases in terms of he's been home for days and days. Counting crows were annoying in the 90s. Oh, right. You know, that's... It's definitely annoying now.

I will unashamedly stick up for them. You have bands from your youth that you like, and you don't know why. I mean, I'm not claiming that they're burning the fields down. down now with new content. And Adam Durrits have one of the hottest hot streaks we've ever seen when it came to women. I almost got hit once. He was roaring down from sunset up in the hills.

I was crossing the street and I saw him, you know, from about 20 feet away in a car, he almost nailed me as I was crossing the street. So I almost was killed by the man. That checks out. And yet you still like him. Well, the injury didn't happen. Well, you were at the concert. I was digging into a little Panthers chiefs.

How about the team of ATL was fun to watch in the preseason? Panthers from a year ago was the team of ATL, and they got me thinking, whoo. I was thinking we rode off the possibility of them being the team of ATL two years in a row too quickly, that they look pretty fun to watch. Would anyone veto them? I wouldn't. I wasn't even going there, but that's interesting. I've taken a peek at our power rankings, and it seems obvious that the Steelers are the team of ATL just based on power rankings alone.

that's well nice try you know the four of us that you know dan is off on paternity leave of course and kevin patra and mark and chris and i all put in our power rankings we shook it up in a little snow globe it spit out some numbers overnight and we now have a power rankings that we're going to include in all our season preview content our afc west preview is up on monday and you can check that out on nfl.com slash atl and we'll roll out the rest of the a fc this week mark's doing the afc north on tuesday and yeah the steelers uh they got a lot of love when we when we roll that out they're in the top six teams overall that was surprising to me meanwhile uh the chiefs got no love 19th i put them out in the a fc west deep into third but we really like the chargers too we

don't just see them making it back to the playoffs. We have them as a legit top 10 NFL type of team. You got any team where you've got that quarterback that we trust more than we did a couple years ago with Rivers, and I think that Mike McCoy is an underrated coach and an organizer of offenses. He's done a good job there. The loss of Wizz and Hunt, we don't know how that will affect him, but Frank Reich, they know him. He's not a new entity there. Well, we have a lot to talk about coming out of the weekend. So we're going to do something a little different for today's show. We're going to go through each one of the preseason games and give our takeaways one by one. Now, if you listen to our show last season, you'll remember every

Sunday night, after it's all over, we get into the studio, and we bang out a delirious podcast late into the night, recapping every single game on Sunday. So we're kind of trying to recreate that, but on a Monday afternoon talking about 15 games that didn't really matter as much. You guys ready? Dry run. I've been ready. All right. So we're not going to actually do any news, but we do have a new producer here, not new to the podcast overall, but different.

Zachariah, back in the mix. What's going on, guys? Hey, Zach. How are you doing? How was your weekend? Pretty good. It wasn't going to a Counting Crow's concert. You were here, right?

Well, apparently that's a negative, so. Well, you have to wonder, you know, if you're able to sneak to the front row, how many people were at. It's a really fair question. What I would like to attribute it to is Dan and I's ability to, you know, get the story. Okay, okay. But a fair question is. I would have said ninja-like abilities to move to the crowd. But okay, I guess the story.

That's what it works. Good to have Zach here. TD will be back in the house on Wednesday, but we always like having Zach stop by. And, you know, even though this isn't exactly news, let's just do some news anyways. We start our preseason roundup with the Patriots and Eagles. on Friday night. A lot of action in this one. Chris Wesleyan was locked into it.

Let's start with the quarterbacks on New England side. Jimmy Garapolo, future MVP, next season or the season after that? I don't know how much we can take from what he's done so far, but he looks prepared. He can execute a play action fake pretty well and throw it to a fullback. Scored head touchdown drives on his first two series. Looks pretty impressive. To me, I guess my takeaway is if they only keep two quarterbacks in the roster,

Mallet's gone. No doubt. There's no chance there cutting Jimmy G. No, I just mean like I didn't think three weeks ago they would only keep two quarterbacks in the roster, and now I think that's a possibility. That would be the first time in a long time for them. One thing that struck me watching the game was the receiver position is in a much healthier place for New England than it was a year ago. Ken Brel Tompkins.

making plays. When you look at Tompkins, to me, he looks like the guy that was taken in the second round last year, not Aaron Dobson. He looks like everything that you'd want in a first round receiver, physical. There are two Patriots right now where there's a disconnect between what I think and what the mainstream fantasy football experts think. And Tompkins is one of them. I don't understand why they like Aaron Dobson more than Tompkins. Because he finished last season stronger and on the field, and Tompkins didn't. But right now, Tompkins is on the field.

Ever since training camp started, Tom Brady has gone out of his way to just glowingly say how much faith, confidence he has in Kimbril Tompkins being where he's supposed to be. We've heard a lot of hype this preseason about the Patriots backfield that maybe Stephen Ridley is going to lose some snaps to James White. Mark, I know you saw James White on Friday night, and any thoughts there? Well, number one, Stephen Ridley is going to continue to. lose the football. Stop. Well, that's what he does. But James, you know, Wes and I

watched White up close, and I think we both came away unimpressed after, you know, not really getting a chance to see him practice, which is where the glowing reports have come from. And, you know, we've written a few pieces where he's got a chance to see some starting time, and he's this multi-diverse back.

I didn't see it. The guy looks like a 2.7 yards per rush guy that just sort of smashed his way into the line. It's a small sample size. He looks closer to Vareen than Ridley, as far as how they're going to use him. There's only two backs on this roster that can run with power, and it's Ridley and Bolden. To me, they both have to make the roster, especially if you're concerned about Ridley's fumbled. He fumbled again in the red zone, and Belichick said afterwards, he kind of said, well, it was almost not a fumble.

It seemed like he was making an excuse for him because he doesn't want to bench him already. Right. But to me, they're a much better team with Ridley in the lineup. Yeah, White's a guy. maybe he practiced really well and hasn't played that well with the lights on, which is a problem. That's what you have the preseason 4.

He doesn't have power. If Brandon Bolden is a guy might not even make the team, got a shot, but who knows? I mean, they carry a fullback. They're one of the only teams that still does that. Heat riders try to cut that guy every summer.

Who, James Devlin? Brandon Bolden. They try to cut that guy every summer and he keeps making the team. Yeah, he's the new school. Well, probably helps that they don't have blunt this year also. I mean, he fits that role. On the Eagles.

side, Zach Ertz are making the leave candidate. I like him. He looks like Nick Full's favorite red zone receiver. I think he'll be their touchdown leader this year. I think Mark was right when he predicted this on making the leap. This guy's going to have a breakout season. Piped down with the Rob Gunkowski comparisons, though. Nick Foles threw that out there. Nick Foles, who played with Gronk, or was on the same team as Gronk in college. He tried to throw Ertz in the Gronk category. Ertz isn't blocking like Gronk. No, he's not.

No, come on. He's not like a physical marvel like Gronk is, but he's same kind of size speed type of thing. Another great tight end, Jimmy Graham in New Orleans was looking good on Friday night, like the old Jimmy Graham, Titans and Saints. It was a sloppy game mark. I know you were dialed into that. The Sean Green Bishop Sanky battle was pretty interesting to watch in this game. Yeah, I don't know why we get all caught up and who's going to start in some of these competitions, because it looks like they're both going to work.

I mean, Sanky, to me, is not necessarily – I know that, Greg, you were very hot on Sanky. I'm not sure he's going to finish the year as the guy we're talking about among all rookie running backs, but he's going to get playing time, for sure. Well, he's not going to start the year as the guy we thought, because right now, Sean Green's ahead of him pretty clearly. Yeah, well, Green got hurt in that. game, but it sounds like he's fine. He practiced again today. Sanky's had fumbling problems, too. In practice and in games.

And in the game. So this is an issue. We made the comparison last week that I think this is going to be like Ben Jarvis Green Ellis and Gio Bernard. But right now, they seem to be a lot more comfortable with the Ben Jarvis Green Ellis than the Gio Ivana Bernard in this backfield. One guy that stood out late in this game was

Zach Mettenberger. Now, I think that he's a project at quarterback in a lot of ways, but 20 for 25. 269 yards and two touchdowns, also at a bad interception. But the guy can throw, he has got a strong arm. I know everyone talks about his wind-up and stuff. But, you know, Locker looked good too. And I think the locker actually looked better than he's looked in a while in that offense.

I thought Mettenberger's turnovers were a direct result of his long-throwing motion. He's going to have to change that. So what would you compare it to? I don't know if any, he doesn't throw like anyone else. It's like a javelin or a shabling. shot putters. Is he like that ref throwing that flag in that video? He just brings it really far back behind his head. He did gun a great back shoulder throw to our boy Justin Hunter. What a night in New Orleans for making the leap candidates. Kenny Vaccaro all over the field, forcing a couple

fumbles. One was overturned upon review. Making a big sack. And Hunter was even better. He had the big long touchdown. We know Justin Hunter's fast. But it was two other catches that really impressed me in the red zone made a tough catch for a touchdown and then that back shoulder throw up he's making those catches let's calm down on the fantasy hype for this guy he's still third on the depth chart at wide receiver the one long touchdown happened because the best thing that can happen to a wide receiver happened the defensive back fell down well mittenberger hit him in stride and you ran you know there's a lot of uh wide receivers that don't score in that play because they don't have the jets every wide receiver in the league scores on

that play no that's not true there was nobody around nobody in the picture not every one makes the catch he made from Locker, though. No, no, I thought that play was more impressive than the long touchdown. I heard some excitement over Jake Locker. It was tough to tell, but he did remind me a little bit of the Chargers offense early on just with these first read, short passes, kind of kill death by a thousand cuts, all these little short pass. I think that's what they're going to do with Locker.

And I think one guy, Dexter McCluster, to me, looked a lot like what we saw them do with Danny Woodhead in San Diego last preseason where you started to get a sense that he was going to be a threat in the passing game. I think they're going to try to use him that way. I have to admit, the Sanky bandwagon, if it's not too late, you went off? Eject. I think you should be allowed to do that in the preseason. I'm not saying him as a player in his career and even the season, but as a fantasy pick, he's getting taken in the fifth or sixth round.

Dexter McCluster's ahead of him on the Deptart right now, and I know it's not. not all about the Debtor right now. He'll pass McCluster, but there's not a lot to get excited about. Too much hype. All right, let's move on. Greg's getting off that wagon. Talk about the Saints for a minute. Well, come on, go. Well, I thought, like, Mark, you saw the game. Kenny Vakero served notice that it was like his Luke Keekly game from last summer. This guy's going to be an all pro. Well, and Greg, he mentioned it. I did just mention that if you were listening a couple of minutes ago. But the way, this guy, he separated the ball from the ball handler twice in this game. The first one I thought actually was a fumble and they ruled it something else.

Like, he is interesting. He's going to be a force. Did that twice and knocked Charlie Whitehurst out of the game. And their fifth round safety, Vinnie Sincere, was everywhere in this game. They stole him in the fifth round. See, you can listen to a lot of podcasts out there, and they're going to talk about, they're not going to get Vinnie Sincerey into the podcast. That's why you listen. Jimmy Graham, you mentioned this, too.

Hansis is at home right now, right now, right in down a night. Notes, Senseri. You know what I'm saying? He's writing a note saying, transition to the next game. Jimmy Graham, I finally found another media person who will talk about the fact that he wasn't healthy for most of last year. Ross Tucker said that he had talked to Graham. In addition to the plantar fascia, he had elbow and knee injuries last year.

There were some games he suited up. He was only 70%. He looked healthy and dominant, and this guy is an MVP candidate when he's on the field. Yeah. He did look awesome. and watching that game with Luke McCown looking very good. My boy, Ryan Griffin, 2019 NFL MVP out of Tulane. He and Garoppel are going to be battling for the MVP every year?

They're going to be the Manning and Brady of the next decade. Looking very good, too. It just got me thinking, is there anything Sean Payton can't do? I mean, you've got to give him a lot of the credit here that he's managed to take a guy in Robert Meacham, for instance, that was essentially out of the league. and now Robert Meecham is starting for one of the best offenses in football. Maybe he's not going to be a great player, but he'll find a way to use it.

One reason that Wes and I have tab the Saints is our number one team where you have them buried somewhere else. I did have them seventh in my power pole, I believe. That is disturbing. Why? How could there be six teams better than the Saints? The Saints, seventh is very high news flash. So you're playing in the divisional round if you're the seventh best team in the league. They clearly have one of the top three rosters in the NFL.

You're asking what can Sean Payton not do? It's apparently not finishing the top six teams in the league, according to you. I think he can not expect his defense to be as good this year. Even though on paper it's better, I just don't think they're going to be that great. And look at the teams I ranked ahead of them. The Packers, not exactly slouches, the Seahawks, the Broncos, the Patriots. I mean, these are all great teams. The other team.

I got you on those for it. I don't want to get to those. I had the Cardinals and the Steelers That's the next step. Above the Saints? Yeah. That is absolutely ridiculous. Well, it's a prediction.

And hey, you got to take some risks. I like that you are higher on Carson Palmer than you are on Drew Breeze. I think that's a good idea. Hey, this isn't a ranking of how safe we can play it going into the season. It's a prediction. And I don't know if you've seen the NFL, Chris Wesleyan. But sometimes teams that aren't expected to do as well before the season, they end up doing pretty well. Just one thing to mention.

that, you know, and Dan is out, and Dan often in our newsroom is a good mixture that can settle some of the tensions in our Pott Cube Farm that we have down there. But I have been sitting next to Wesleyan and Greg all morning long, a lot of heat. You two have been at each other like an old married couple. Well, it happens. We both understand each other well. So we're, we feel free to talk. What I think is you've been on the West Coast too long. I've noticed this with you and Dan. And you think anytime Wes and I, have, you know, a difference of opinion, which we enjoy discussing. You guys, oh, my God, they're at each other's throats.

That's how people talk. By the way. That's how people talk on the East Coast. You've been here too long. We are working in a professional environment downstairs, and your ornery interactions are disruptive. We're never upset at each other. Well, that's not how it looks like to the rest of the room necessarily. Yes, it's Greg and I who are disruptive to the newsroom.

All right. Another thing we're upset about. The Oakland Raiders, Mark, I'm just going to tee you up on this one because... I don't think I'm alone. This is not, I'm not on an island with this opinion. And I, you know, a lot of times Raiders fans, they've got their issue with Wessling. I'm not quite sure why, because, you know, I think Wesleyan's been dead on when he's talked about the Oakland's off season and what they've done. This is a team that's making it hard on its fan base.

You go out, and I understand they got Matt Scha before they knew they'd get a quarterback they wanted in the draft. but you went out and you got someone in Derek Carr who here's the thing there is nothing that Matt Schaub does better than any other quarterback on that roster right now that's my opinion I don't know why they insist they talked about him Wesleyan has something to say on this too my thing is this if you're the Oakland Raiders and if you're Dennis Allen whose job is already on he's already on the hot seat if any coach is you don't have time to toy around with a month and a half of Matt Schaub We know who he is, all right?

We know where he's at in his career at this point. I put Derek Carr in now, develop him, let him play. You're going to get more out of him than you will out of Matt Schaubb. If Derek Carr's not ready, go to Matt McGloin because he's a better quarterback right now than that Matt Schaub. Agreed. And I don't want to throw Matt Shelb under the bus because he's got no help from his offensive line. His receivers aren't catching passes. But to me, it's abundantly obvious when you watch him, he cannot power the ball outside the numbers.

He cannot throw the ball down the seam. It's the exact same issues he's had since Thanksgiving of two years ago. And the Raiders either didn't watch this film on him the last 20 games or they're just lying to their fan base. You really think that, that they don't believe that he's the best quarterback? They watch him in practice every day. They know a hell of a lot more about football than any of us. Greg Olson, their offensive coordinator. And they talk shop up, which seems crazy.

But I do believe that they believe he is the best guy in all. roster. When they signed him, they said this guy is on par with Peyton Manning and Philip Rivers. They said this guy can be our quarterback for three to four years. Then they gave him a contract that says one year and they drafted Derek Carr. So they're not even believing what they're saying. They've been lying to their fan base all offseason and we're getting heat for their line. And they signed a bunch of veterans where it looks like what they do is, I mean, I know this isn't actually why they go and get people, but let's look at a career, the career body of work of Maurice Jones Drew

and then go sign him five years after he's really an impact player for our offense. Shab is overall, I'm not saying that his whole career is awash. The guy was effective for a number of seasons and he was a very effective quarterback, but what we've seen over the last year and a half, you don't go out and make him your franchise quarterback.

You're asking for trouble. That's fine. I totally agree with how they handled it publicly. But killing Shab based on these two preseason outings, I don't know. It's not as stats. It's based on his last year and a half. He's had no protection in these games.

He's the same quarterback he was, he's been for a year and a half. You can see it. And he's probably going to be worse because he was going. Yeah, because he's on the Raiders. He was going from a scheme that was suited to his strengths, Gary Kudoviax scheme with Andre Johnson. Right. And now he's got Rod Streeter, James

Jones, and Holmes. And he has an offensive line that isn't blocking. By the way, Holmes was fourth in the rotation in the second game. So they're still trying to figure out what they want to do. I thought Jones Drew actually looked okay. McFadden's looked pretty good both weeks. James Drew looks slow to me.

He looks, at least he was bouncing off some defenders, which I'll take. That's what he does. Shab, though, doesn't even try to go deep. And I think that's where your argument hits home. That's what we've been saying all along. They've been, that the interception came on a deflection. And I was thinking, well, that wasn't his fault necessarily. That's what I thought at first.

But then I thought they're sitting on these routes. That's been my main point. He won't even try. So the defense is, they're not dumb. They're watching film. Sit on the outrout, sit on the checkdown. And there was another throw that ended a drive that it was right on target. And the defender reached over the back of, I think it was Streeter, and broke it up.

And I thought, well, that wasn't a bad throw. But then again, I thought they're sitting on these routes. In this preseason, Matt McLeoyne has completed 10 passes, which have traveled. traveled 10 yards or more. Derek Carr has completed five, and Carr has not showed me much. That's why I can't kill them. Matt Schaub has completed zero.

I don't know if he's attempting. This is, see, you're attempting. I'm agreeing with you. Right, but you were like sticking up for Schaubb that he hasn't shown anything, but this is exactly what we're talking about. He doesn't have the arm. I just think it's the preseason,

and I'll kill them after two weeks of the regular season. I think they wanted a veteran to come in and give some continuity at this position, but here's the problem. You can't roll out a quarterback with limited physical gifts at this stage in his career. Your entire offense is hamstrung if you do that. Carr is not Blake Bortles. We're not saying that. But come on.

Talk about what do you want to do to energize this fan base and to give yourself a chance to develop a young passer? That's Carr. They're going down with that ship. Anything exciting we want to hit on with the Lions, Golden Tate making some noise. Tate looked good. Ebron looked good. They've got a lot of weapons. Tate looked really good.

It's hard not to be excited about their offense. Reggie Bush is the same player every season. He never gets old. Last year, early in the season, we all thought he looked the best he had since USC. And he doesn't look that way right now. But it's the preseason. And I've heard too many veterans like Reggie Bush that are established and aren't fighting for everything. When they talk about the preseason, they admit they're not going all out.

They don't get as intense. And they're not going 100%. Isn't his role? He looked good to me. He looked fine. I think his role is going to be a little bit diminished, though. They almost have so many weapons that how do you, if you're going to get Theo Riddick, this guy that we can't stop talking about in there, too,

and Bell and everyone else. I mean, what do we do with Bush? He's not going to be the same guy as last season. That's good for the lions. I think it's good for Bush, too. I don't think he minds. He doesn't need 300 touches at age 29. Stafford looked sharp, sharper than I've seen him in a while.

It looks good. Also sharp. Seattle, Seahawks. They take the preseason seriously. If every team attacked the preseason like Seattle did, I don't think people would hate the preseason as much as they do. Their game against the Broncos in last year's preseason was the hardest I've ever seen any team play in the preseason.

And their game against the Chargers last Friday night was the second hardest of every team. And I'm guessing both of those games were in Seattle. They have an extra intensity when they're playing. And Carol just said that this game against the game against the Chargers was the best preseason game he's seen from one of his own teams. What about the little Kristen Michael Robert Turbin battle? Michael, to me, hasn't looked as good as he did last preseason.

Turbin looked great. Yeah, I mean, Michael, I am surprised that Turbin is the guy that's out playing him at this stage, but that is what's happening after two preseason games. I guess the takeaway is that Turbin, if Lynch was to go down, Turbin isn't going away. That's a tag team. Well, you're the one, Mark, I believe, that wrote up the Kristen Michael making the leap. Am I correct on this?

Yeah, I didn't. I don't think I even mention Robert Turbin in that because he seemed like a non-factor to me. I mean, Chris and Michael, if there was, you know, we're looking for the team of ATL. We're going to try to decide that before week one. We'll start to discuss that more and more in the coming weeks. Dan will get back in because it has to be unanimous vote. If there was a player of ATL this offseason, it might have been Kristen Michael. I mean, we were standing on top of a table on top of a table.

on top of a table for Kristen Michael. So, you know, come on, Kristen Michael. How about you, you know, give us something back here. We've given you a lot of, a lot of ink. That's fair. Let's talk a little Packers Rams. Sam Bradford quietly made his return from a torn ACL. Does he do anything but quietly?

That's a good point. What did we think of him? Best case scenario in my mind, I'm usually underwhelmed by him, and I thought he looked very solid. So you were still underwhelmed, but underwhelmed as usual. He looked better than Sam Bradford usually looks, which was surprising to me coming off an ACL injury. Brian Quick being a nice catch. He made a nice – he was a nice throw to Quick, and then in that – there was a nice drive that he went out on Bradford.

And my problem isn't always – I'm not sure we – I'd like to see Bradford at some point in his career in a completely different offense. I don't want to harp on this over and over every couple months, but this Schottenheimer, Brian Schottenheimer offense, is the issue. It is a tough watch. Yeah, let's see it in the season. Man, this offense has a lot of moving pieces right now. And so I think it's fair to expect them to start out slowly. You have a quarterback coming off a torn ACL. You're trying to start Brian Quick and Kenny Britt all of a sudden.

They were hoping Trey Mason was going to provide depth that running back. He hasn't really looked great. He's third on the depth chart. They're still searching for a few things. They are. You know who's not searching? Packers. Packers, because Aaron Rogers was absolutely surgical.

proving once again that he's the best player in the NFL, and it was just absolutely on fire. And they have a nice little seventh round-wad receiver, Jeff Janice. He has gotten a lot of- He was burning up the Twitter airwaves. Right. There are 17 different people that cover the Packers for two newspapers. It's eight for each newspaper,

and they all tweet play-by-play in training camp, and Janice has been showing up a lot. He showed up in the pre-send. I haven't seen this one yet. Tell me about him. He's a small school guy. He's a white dude, and he is big and fast. He's, you think, like a...

I don't know if I could pick him out of a lineup with that description, but you're starting to pay the first. A seventh round receiver, you did not expect him to be like six, three, running a four, five, and blowing up the measurables at the combine, and that's what this guy did. So what you're saying is he is the 2014 answer to Kenbrell Tompkins. The guy who you're like, this is a physical guy. Why was he not drafted or seventh round? I was going to say more like a guy the Packers drafted in the seventh round the year before

and ended up on the Browns roster, Charles Johnson. Spicy. Well, that one's really, you know, worked out so far. Excuse me, Charles Johnson. You know, by the time, if some people are listening to this on Tuesday morning, yeah, Charles Johnson plays tonight against the Redskins. You might see something special. All right, what happens in this game?

What does Charles Johnson do in this magical Monday performance? Well, listen, last game, he is still coming. Yeah, let's hear of specifics. Four catches, 51 yards. Touchdown? That's not too exciting. It's a preseason game. He's going to play like 15 snaps.

But this is, you've set a level of expectations. I expected something more specific. Well, like that was pretty specific. It was underwhelming. I would have thought you would have said like six catches, 83 yards, and he reads a haiku, you know, to Michelle Tovoia right before half. Gives DeAngelo Hall a wedgie. All right.

Well, all those things are in play. I'm not saying that's not going to happen. I'm just saying he will have 15. and maybe the haiku as well. Ravens Cowboys were on Saturday night. One of the games I was watching here at NFL media headquarters in Culver City. Seven games at the same time. It was hard to pay attention,

which is part of the reason I didn't take a lot out of this game other than Tony Romo looks healthy, and he was accurate on a couple throws deep down the field. Des Bryant is healthy. Hooray. I think Des Bryant has separated from the pack and is the clear number two behind Calvin Johnson. He looked amazing.

It's the preseason, though. I'm just saying. I thought he was already headed that way, and I think it's going to happen this year. Okay, you think it's going to happen. But there's no way that has happened yet, right? I think it has. Let's let A.J. Green play the season,

or Julio Jones, and let's see what happens. Hey, I'm part of this podcast, and I get to say what I want. No. All right. There are certain rules. Jeez, guys. Ray Rice, I thought, for the second straight week, look quick. I liked DeMarco Murray

This is a guy that last year A, you can't stay healthy That's an issue But if he can They kept abandoning the run game At points last season With the pass heavy offense But Murray

Murray looked really good to me On this game He looked fast He was a good decision maker That's not Romo and Brian and Murray Are going to keep this team They have a good offensive line too

We've talked about how they're going to Win games 40 to 35 They're going to lose games like that too But this team will score points I, surprisingly, was the highest around the league writer on the Cowboys. I put them in the middle of the pack this season in my power pole. I had them as like a seven and nine type of team. Everyone else basically buried them.

I just think when you have a quarterback that good and you're in a lousy division, you got Des Bryant, you got a left tackle, I'm just going to, oh, Romo will win six or seven games from him. That's the reason why they've won games all these years. If he stays healthy. Yeah, that's fair. And their defense, second game in a row now, a lot of concern. Sure. A lot of concern would be an understanding.

I agree, by the way, with Chris. See, we agree on some things. What's that? Ray Rice, Bernard Pierce, they're looking good. That offensive line was a disaster last year. That could be a huge, huge turnaround if their running game suddenly goes from, you know, a disaster to a weapon. You know, speaking of disaster, Eli Manning. look at that transition that just that was smooth the Giants and the Colts I watch this game

Eli Manning is averaging 3.06 yards per attempt for the preseason in his new offense that will have him throwing 70% completions how about how it's 17% he's one for seven the last week two weeks or whatever two for nine I think or something I don't know it's crazy he does he does not look good he doesn't even look comfortable in the pocket It's bad news. Are we, maybe we didn't consider how difficult it would be for Eli Manning to change offenses after being with the same coordinator for a decade. Does this offense even suit his strengths?

He's always been a attack down the field type of quarterback and now they've got him doing West Coast principles. When you think Eli Manning, you don't think, ooh, quick decision maker in the pocket. You think I'm going to wait as long as I can and take some chances. So it's basically the opposite of what they're doing. They haven't at O'Dell Beckham, but when Tom Coughlin says he's concerned, and sometimes you do struggle in the preseason, then you're fine, but sometimes it just stays being a disaster.

You could tell he's a little concerned. But you will. I mean, even with, in Arizona, for instance, they talked about, and in Kansas City, two teams where they had new offenses last season, and a lot of players talked about the second half of the year. They finally felt at home, and we saw what the Chief specifically. That often started to light it up towards the end of the year. it's a little early to totally write off New York's offense and we're not doing that but it's just that with Manning if he's an attack the field down the field quarterback a lot of times he was throwing the football to the wrong team last year they want to reduce that I think that was the emphasis here well they're not changing offensive coordinators because everything was going well last year they were changing it because Eli Manning was one of the least effective quarterbacks in the league and no one really wants to remember this but it's not a quarterback that particularly

inspired confidence that he's a better than average player right now. How about that? Look at that no argument from Chris. I feel a healing. There's an aura of togetherness in this room now. A couple of quick takeaways from the Colts. The King Nick's looks good. He looks good.

He had five for 53. He should have had six for 89, but had a 36-yard taunting penalty that raised the ire of coach Chuck Piccona. Trent Richardson, I saw him make a defender miss. Oh, really? Yes. One of his five or six carriers. He made a defender miss.

Can we have some sort of celebration sound? Actually, there's high-level executives in the office right now. Shadowy League figures have entered the building. I didn't even notice, but I think they're going to shut down this operation for Mark Sessler and Chris Wesley. It's been nice having a podcast. It's been nice having a life. No, I'm kidding. Let's move on to the Vikings and Cardinals.

Castle and Bridgewater really was the best. Of all possible scenarios for Minnesota, Castle held serve looks great. And then Bridgewater, I don't know, did his best John Elway impression in the last two minutes. Very exciting preseason game. That's what that was. Stadium chanting Teddy over there was a lot of crazy endings to these preseason games this week. Bridgewater being the best one. I mean, he's not going to take first team snaps too much this week.

Maybe he will in practice, but he's not starting the third preseason game. competition looks all but over, but did we see anything different out of Bridgewater this time? He certainly looked more poised. He looked more under control. The rush didn't get to him. He seemed like he was going through his progressions. I thought he looked really good. He looked like what we expected coming into the league.

Yeah, I mean, I think there's concern over his, maybe his deep ball. But honestly, one minute drill, first chance to do that in the NFL, he couldn't have executed it with more poise. And this is of all the situations where a veteran guy is standing in the way of the rookie, I have the least problem with this because I think Bridgewater probably could use a little bit of time to develop. But if he goes out in this next preseason game and sets the place on fire again, I'm not sure this competition's over. I'm just not, it's pointing. But he's only going to play the fourth quarter against the second and 13.

I feel like it's too late. Well, they said he may see, you think it will just be fourth quarter? I think that's fair. If he's not doing this against first team defenses, that's a lot different. Well, there's not, in this situation, though, like I said, I don't have such a problem with Castle opening the year. He's a good fit for this offense, obviously. But they've got a, this is a team that didn't have a quarterback for so long. They know in Teddy they've got something, it's not a loss cause.

That first game was a starting jitter for him. Well, you pointed out that Norv Turner knows how to dial up some preseason offenses. Yes, he does. Because Brandon Whedon and every other Brown's quarterback look great in the preseason. That's right. It's really hard to evaluate. Although I do give pro football focus a little more credit for accuracy now that they have Matt Castle ranked as the number one quarterback of the preseason.

And you are a noted Castleite. Yeah, I think I'm it. The evolutionary Randall Cunningham, according to Greg. No, I said he was the poor man's update of Randall Cunningham. A very impoverished individual. He's like slightly more athletic than Ryan Fitzpatrick. Oh, give me a break. Give me a break.

The other first round pick, Anthony Barr looked great. He's up to one and a half sacks in the preseason. It looks highly athletic. He didn't look as good as my defensive MVP pick for the preseason after just two games. Gerald McCoy in Tampa Bay. He's just been living in opposing backfield. I don't know if Dallas Thomas is going to keep his job in Miami as a guard because Gerald McCoy just destroyed.

Took his lunch. Pretty much dominated the game while he was in there. Gerald McCoy is actually a sneaky pick for defensive player of the year for the entire season, don't you think? If they had a better record last year, he and Levante David would have been in the discussion. They deserve to be. He feels like a guy that is going to have a defensive player of the year award at some point in his career. It could happen. And he's kind of reaching that point right now where he's at his peak.

And he looked great. I think this Buck's defense is going to be really good. I didn't take a lot of other big things out of this Buccaneers game. One big takeaway. I'm infringing on Sheck's territory here, but the Dolphins' uniforms are beautiful. The home uniforms and the Bucks uniforms are hideous. You can hardly watch the game. No one likes change.

You can hardly watch the game their uniforms are that bad. Their numbers specifically are outrageous. I feel like I have to wake up because my alarm clock's going off. I have a question for West. wrestling on the bucks because we got a little, we got to see a little bit more of McCown and Glennon because they weren't spending the entire game on their back with the offensive line. I thought Mike Evans, Mike Evans had a nice game. Safarian Jenkins made a nice catch. Vincent Jackson had a nice catch. I mean, that's what we thought we'd get with McCown. Do you feel as a making the leap

candidate you picked him as that, do you still feel good about McCown this season? I feel like McCown is who we thought he was. The same player he was with the Bears last year, He just needs protection up front. And that's iffy. Of course, we don't know how they're scheming. And we don't know if that's going to change. But that's, yeah, I think he'll go as far as his offensive line goes. And the protection wasn't that much better in this game.

He was under pretty good heat. They really didn't move the ball. The only time they scored with McCown in the game is when they got the ball at the 25-yard line and they converted on the short field. Yeah, I think we're going to see, I just, if it's Doug Martin or someone else, catch a lot of passes this year because one thing, they shifted in the second game. was quick passing, get the ball out of the quarterback's hands quick. And you saw Martin, he had 49 catches, I think it was, as a rookie.

I think he'll top that. You know who else going to make some catches as a rookie? Ryan Shazier, except they're going to be coming out of the hands of opposing quarterbacks. How about that play the other night from your boy, Chris? I saw a rap sheet retweeted one of my tweets that he said he looked like a safety. To me, he looked like a cheetah or a gazelle. the guy can move like once the last time a linebacker

moved like that when it was in practice a couple back during OTAs when Shazir made a similar interception like that where they started to talk about him being used in a Troy Palomalu fashion because he does have that safety

that athletic prowess it's not just a linebacker's type body the guy can move around one of the Steelers beat writers tweeted or opened his blog post by saying it was the best introduction by a Steelers player that he had seen in 22 years of covering the team

and compared his performance to Forrest Whitaker's character in the legendary scene from Fast Times at Ridgemont High where he just wrecks the opposing offense all by himself. I have no idea what you're talking about. You've never seen Fast Times at Ridgemont High. I have seen the film, yeah. Charles Jefferson? I was born in 1979.

Too late. It's a classic. E.J. Manuel also struggled in that game, and I think really the best thing I could say about, E.J. Manuel, or maybe the most telling thing I could say about E.J. Manuel is that Patrick Carley, our friend down in the newsroom, who's a big Bills fan, says he woke up during the weekend thinking about how much would it cost to trade for Mark Sanchez for the bills. Well, you don't have a first round pick to trade to anyone because you gave that to the Cleveland Browns. We kill the Raiders for their approach to the offseason. The bills deserve a little bit of guff here, too. They said at the combine that they're going to look at all alternatives for the quarterback. they could look into acquiring several more.

And they decided that Thaddeus Lewis was a good backup player. He might not even make the team you're saying. This was your backup plan. And Jeff Toll, who doesn't have an NFL arm, is maybe going to be your second? If E.J. Manuel's not the answer, you're in trouble. You know who doesn't need a backup plan? Marvin Lewis, because he's got the $100 million red rifle, Andy Dalton throwing passes down the field in the preseason.

Some of us call him the $36 million red rifle. Well, you know, and I think Dalton's one guy that the narrative on him feels cooked. Like, no matter what he does, it's like, oh, but it's Andy Dalton. He really, really did look. Some of his best football came out in the last couple games. It's the preseason. It is. He's United us in the preseason and Gabbert in the postseason.

Again, that's right. But if we're going to talk about the games at all, we might as well acknowledge that Dalton has looked sharp, has been quick with his decisions. You know, there's that group of quarterbacks, and there's about eight or ten of them, that every one of these preseason games, they're coming out with six for six, 101 yards, and a touchdown. In this preseason, he's been in that group.

Andy Dalton may be a candidate for preseason MVP, if he has a big third week. Well, and, because all the, you know, we are going to give out these awards. Coveted award that. The first time anyone's ever done it, we're going to make history, give it out on the podcast.

We're going to have a post. So send your candidates into our Twitter account. It's a death knell considering that we didn't want that would have won that last year. Clowny Chazier, Calvin Pryor race for defensive rookie of the year is going to be Sterling. I loved Rex Ryan after the game. First of all, he made the joke that I just referred to, which is that Andy Dalton looked like a $100 million quarterback against us. Every time he plays the Jets, he lights him up.

And then I also love they asked them about the cornerbacks on the team. And Rex basically just refused to answer it and just started talking about Calvin Pryor and then called out the reporter. It said, looks like we got that one right, huh? Basically just wanted to change the discussion from all the terrible cornerbacks. Rex is hilarious. He said, Calvin Pryor, knocked two dudes out. One guy, he hit in the knee. That's great.

Another guy, unfortunately, went down to a big knee injury this weekend was Falcons left tackle, Sam Baker. Rupured Patilat tendon out for the season. They announced on Monday, Jake Matthews is going to move over to the left side. Does this worry you when it comes to the Falcons offense? I think it could actually help their offensive line. Come on. I'm not kidding. Sam Baker was a below-average left tackle,

and they stuck with him because of their financial investment in him. They doubled up, though. They took him in the first round, and people don't realize they gave him a big-time contract before he was a free agent when he was coming off his one really good season. Jake Matthews was billed as a left tackle coming out, and to me should be an upgrade immediately. on Baker, who was one of the worst left tackles in football when he was healthy last year.

You also, though, you have to suddenly, you've got Lamar Houston in there. Lamar Holmes. Lamar Holmes in there on the right side. That's not a player of much aplomb. I mean, there's issues there. He was drafted in the third round, and his first chance to start was last year. Most people assume third-round picks will get better in their second season, so we can't write him off yet. And Sam Baker wasn't Joe Thomas.

Right, but they basically made line play their priority this off-season. and they just lost their starting left tackle. That was the biggest injury of the offseason. Knock on, I mean, of the week. Knock on what, again, it was a relatively light week for serious injuries, which I love to see. That means the other shoe will drop. No, it's not.

Another Falcon who I saw in this game, Devante Freeman, I'm more impressed by him than Bishop Sanky, and he was drafted a couple rounds later. Why aren't the Falcons coaching staff more impressed, though? I don't know. I don't watch hard knocks. He seems like a very light. likable guy. He's a great hard knocks character. Put him in with the starters. Let's see a little...

He looks really good as a runner and a receiver. I think he lined up out wide a couple of times in that game. You were getting really excited about your boy, Alfred Blue, in this game. I like Alfred Blue. I mean, he had a small body of work, but he had a couple runs in a row where he ran with power. It looked a little bit like a better version of... He looked like Ben Tate when Tate was healthy. I was going to say he reminds me a little bit of Arian Foster. The way he moves and his size? He looks like, and it sounds like a cliche, but he looks like an NFL running back. And this is kind of a random guy that has really good size, but great movement. He looked like a power running back.

I mean, you were getting crazy about the red zone carries. I like this, Alfred Blu. You know, that team went out and they dumped two running backs last week and brought in some other journeymen, but I think he's going to play a role in this offense. I can confirm, Mark, I know this is going to hurt you, but Tom Savage exists, and he was in the game as the second string quarterback for the time. He might as well not exist. Yeah, the box score was suggested a phantom-like individual.

He attempted five passes, completed four of them for eight yards. Oh, my gosh. Well, we're going to have to, that's one point. He's in the Eli Manning zone. 1.6 per pass. 1.6. And that gets us to the new Gabbard zone. Which is under two?

The Gabbard zone for new listeners has always been a yards per attempt between 5 and 6. Really anything under six, that's Gabbert. He's the worst quarterback statistically of the last 20 years. He's got a 5.6 yards per attempt average. In the preseason, though, he's under two, Blaine Gabbardt. What is he at? I think, well, he moved it up to two. He had 2.9 in his second game.

Oh, he was 1.8 in his first game. Right. So he might be a little over. But yeah, the new Gabbard zone, Savage is joining him under third. That is why come week one, Colin Kaepernett's backup will be Christian Ponder. Ooh, interesting. Ooh, I like that prediction. I kind of like that, too.

And that brings us to our last game of the weekend, Panthers and Chiefs. They played on Sunday night. Cam Newton's return from ankle surgery. Differing views in the newsroom about whether Newton's ankle looked okay. Wes, I know you didn't think he was moving very well. I thought he was dragging his foot around, hesitant to do anything on that ankle, really. I thought he didn't want to let it go. start scrambling, but that's because

it's the preseason. I don't think he would have done that last year either. He knows he needs to practice in the pocket. He's not going to be running all over the place in the preseason. We should have a better idea after the next game. But to me, it looked like it could be an early season issue because

Cam Newton without a scrambling ability is not a very good quarterback. He missed throws early. They only had one yard in their first three drives, and there were some comments, wow, Cam Newton not looking good. And it... That's what? he always does.

Exactly. Sometimes it's just like we have one narrative for a guy and it's like, okay, Cam Newton is now good because he's coming off a good season. And I've always been a huge Cam Newton fan. But even at his best, he is as streaky as any quarterback in the league. All of last season, he would have entire quarters or even halves where he couldn't hit anything. And then just like that, he'd turn it around. He was very good on third downs and he'd be on fire for an entire half.

And that's kind of who Cam Newton is. I was three feet away from a sweating Adam Duritz, so I didn't see a second of this. But what about all of us are lower on the Chiefs, a little bit down on the Chiefs in general. What about their offense? Like what's going on with Alex Smith? Well, their offensive line, where they lost three starters, looks like a disaster. Alex Smith, I thought, played very well delivering throws under pressure. But Eric Fisher was tossed around.

He was embarrassed. And when did the Chiefs start getting really worried about Eric Fisher? Because this is the number one overall pick in last year's draft. And I know it wasn't a good draft, but he wasn't just struggling like a rookie last year. He was arguably the worst starter in the entire league. Football Outsiders has a stat blown blocks. And he led the league in blown blocks per snap. Yeah, it's a problem.

Their offensive line is almost, I mean, it's entirely different from last year. But I agree with you on Smith. Every time I watch him, I come away a little bit more impressed. He's a smart quarterback. I feel like he stands in the pocket well. He commands the offense well. He's very tough. Dwayne Boe looks a lot better this year.

To me, he's moving much better. Travis Kelsey looks like a weapon. I would like to see him start making some plays with the first team offense instead of the second team offense. Ooh, that's another candidate for preseason MVP. He's got a long touchdown in both games now. I mean, how about Aaron Murray? First pass in an NFL game. Granted, it was a preseason game.

One for one for a 40-something-yard touchdown. Just retire right there. Murray was tabbed as the most handsome rookie quarterback downstairs in the newsroom. By who? By Dwayne, our social media guru. I went with Blake Bortles. Doesn't it be very fetching? Well, with the helmet on, a very handsome guy.

This is coming from the guy with no hair. Yeah, I don't think you can go Bordles there. I don't even know what Murray looks like really off the top. One quick thing on the Panthers, I really like Jonathan Stewart. He only had a few carries, but he looked like 2011, Jonathan Stewart, who was one of the best running backs in the NFL. Yeah, I have said that statement 17 different times in the last 10 years, that Jonathan Stewart looks great. Or Jonathan Stewart, if he's fully healthy, has the tools to be a top five NFL running back. He is a guy that, like, we will write 45 articles on him a year, and 38 of them will be about like an injury.

situation that has him on the side of practice. He did look really good. I mean, if he was healthy, it totally changes what they can do. Because DiAngelo Williams at this point, he's like a souped-up Pierre Thomas. And I say that, that's not a bad thing. I love Pierre Thomas. I'd rather have Pierre Thomas on my team than DeAngelo Williams. I think I would, too.

Maybe he's not even souped-up Pierre-Thomas. Well, I meant he can run with power a little better than Pierre-Thomas, although Pierre can do it all. John and Stewart's still 27 years old. Really? That's insane to me. Going on 46 physically. Not from what he showed last night. Yeah, he looked good.

And it did make me wonder if we've sold this Panthers team short because like the Seahawks, they have an unbelievable front seven and an unbelievable aggression. And they just seemed well coached. And even though they're secondaries, all new players, their secondaries was bad players last. I've never seen a preseason game with a pair of starting cornerbacks making that many plays the line of scrimmage. Now, I don't know if they can cover, but they can tackle it the line of scrimmage. Right. You got Keekley and Davis is the most fun duo to watch. You've got a lot of good pass rushers. Someone by the name of Wes Horton practically destroyed Alex Smith

last night. They just find pass rushers in their pockets. Maybe Ron Rivera is a genius. Well, we open the show by saying that maybe we've overlooked them as the team of ATL, but we can't go the same team two years in a row, can we? Why not? We could. I mean, technically we can, but I mean, for real. That seems a little anti-climactic. What do you think, Zachariah, as we wrap up the show here? I was talking about, you guys are talking about Gabbart and all them. I watched them all weekend.

He was horrendous. Red Rocket did well. What do you think of doing the Panthers as the team of ATL back-to-back seasons? Is that clearly not listening to the last... No, I like that. Because that's a TD trait, and that's a nod to TD. I like that. I don't think the Panthers is going to make much noise this year.

I don't. It's not all about... predictions, although obviously we'd like our team to do well. It's more about a team that, you know, gets us up in the morning. I mean, if you guys are talking about NFL, you know, the NFC South and how you guys think the Saints of the team, how could the Panthers be active? That's mathematically, he's made a good point there. It's like Matlock is behind the glass.

Just shooting holes in our theories. On that note, I think we're all done here. We're going to be back on Wednesday and Friday this week. Wednesday, we're going to cook up something a little special. You'll have to wait to find out what it is. I guess I'll have to wait, too. Right, and for us to figure out what it is. But it's going to be special.

Could be the fantasy show. Could be a little start of the season preview. It's going to be meaty. And we're going to dig in. That's all I got for you today. For Mark Sessler, Chris Wesseling, and Zach Behind the Glass. I'm Greg Rosenthal. We'll see you Wednesday.

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