NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - NFL Draft Primer: 21 Questions with Daniel Jeremiah

Episode Date: March 30, 2023

A room filled with some heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, and Gregg Rosenthal ask draft guru Daniel Jeremiah a series of questions to prepare themselves for the 2023 NFL Draft: (1) How do you rank this draft class compared to others (4:36)? (2) Does C.J. Stroud have any major concerns (5:33)? (3) What should the Colts do at QB (8:32)? (4) What is the ceiling for Anthony Richardson (9:52)? (5) Is Richardson the biggest risk in the draft (10:39)? (6) Was trading up worth it for the Panthers (14:51)? (7) Why is Will Levis dropping (15:42)? (8) Is Hendon Hooker a first-rounder (17:22)? (9) Would you rather the Padres win the World Series or get 29 of 32 picks correct in your mock draft (20:48)? (10) How much do you make (21:41)? (11) What is Bijan Robinson’s value (23:23)? (12) Could the Eagles take Bijan Robinson (25:35)? (13) Why would young athletes want to play running back (26:54)? (14) How do you stack the top tight ends against the top wide receivers in this class (28:06)? (15) Why do you think highly drafted TEs have not met expectations recently (29:25)? (16) Can Calijah Kancey be Aaron Donald-ish (30:54)? (17) With tight end depth in this class, will the tight ends be pushed down the board (33:00)? (18) Why is Jaxon Smith-Njigba so undervalued (34:08)? (19) Is there a Brock Purdy-style ‘gem’ in this year’s draft (35:53)? (20) Why is there such a gap between the top two cornerbacks (39:10)? (21) Do you ever question the purpose of all this (40:17)? Note: timecodes approximate.  NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. From the Chris Wesleying podcast studio, it's around the NFL, colon, 21 questions with Daniel Jeremiah. I asked the sound team and Justin, our producer, to find something that sounded like 21 questions by 50 cent. Oh. And obviously this is a dead ringer. Girl.

What's up, DJ? Nothing makes me feel more important than not even having lights on me in here in the studio. It's like you guys are lit up like Christmas trees over here. And I'm just like coming out of the dark over here in my old black outfit. Did you see my pre-production notes about how to light Daniel Germain on our show?

I noticed my chair was really low. The whole setup here. You have a disturbing shadow on the right side of your face on screen here. It's a motivating. intentional, watch us on YouTube to see how much better looking we are than DJ today. I thought you were going for like a early 90s R&B vibe because that's all Daniel Jeremiah listens to. Yeah, you had some, you were tape dogging recently. Oh, every year.

And what did you have playing on Spotify? Well, I went to ran, this is not, this is out of my wheelhouse a little bit, but I landed on 80s and 90s duets. Cop duets. Duets. By the way, Linda Ronstat, a lot of jams back in the. in that period of time. No, no, Aaron Neville on his game in the U.S. twice, yeah.

It was strong. I've always wanted to ask you, like, you know, sometimes when you're watching, like, game pass and stuff, and it's like you're on your third game, and it's, like, silent. You're just sort of nod off. Do you ever have you just flat out fall asleep watching prospects, and what does that say about them?

So, well, it happens good and bad. Like, I was watching Dalton Kincaid, who's one of my favorite players out of Utah, and they're playing SC. And, you know, I don't know exactly what happened in these games from the fall, so I'm just watching it, And I'm watching all of his targets.

And so he had like 18 catches in that game. So after about the 14th catch, I was like, I must be hitting the rewind. How many catches does this guy have in this game? I literally just dozed off, not paying attention. I did not know what was going on. It happens. Those Mondays after the long Sunday and you're just grinding through the game-pass games,

sometimes it's like, wait, it's late in the third quarter now? Half a person. Oh, okay. Should I rewind? Decisions, decisions. DJ, thank you for the time, because we know you're a busy man. You're a popular man. Your metrics are off the chain.

People are talking about you at all times. People are coming up to you asking for selfies. It just so happened recently. Someone had approached you. True. Do you want to share that? Sure, I'll just give you the cliff notes. I was at a Chick-fil-A, which I'm often at.

By the way, this place makes so much money off me on events because whatever our per DM is, it's like my $6 Chick-fil-A dinner every single night. But I'm there with my son. Guy comes up to me. Couldn't have been nicer. Shows me his phone. He just listened to one of our episodes. It was just a lovely conversation.

And as we're finishing up, he goes, I do have to tell you, I do really like ATN. It's like ATN. I was like we didn't want to start our relationship out, you know, not on a solid, honest footing. Now, he said I did like ATN better. That would have been a real spork in the stomach. I think the fact that he brought it up probably tells me that he did, but he didn't go quite. Did he indicate in the world of this show, which person on the show is his favorite? I'm just sitting, maybe you're not telling us the whole story.

All right, well, that was a false wing you gave me. The rule generally is just play Kate Mark, and then we can continue with the show. All right, that's what we're going to do. Yes, sir. We have 21 questions for you concerning the 2003 NFL draft. We're going to... I mean, I don't even feel like my teeth are white, but I'm so dark over here that I feel like Ross from friends right now.

I mean, it's coming out of the darkness. Justin, can we get the lighting right on our guest? No, no, no. This is lovely. This is lovely. It's a mood. It's a mood.

What do we got? We're going to go through the draft, 21 questions. If we run out of time, because Jeremiah said, I have a heart out. That's what he said to me. It's a lie.

It's a lie. Grabbing by the collar and said, hard out, bitch. And I said, okay, okay, we don't want to keep you for too long. Yes, sir. But we're going to hit 21 questions. Greg, you feel like this could be a challenge for us.

Well, We'll try to go fast at the end if we have to. I'm just saying if we... What if it goes the other way? What if we have 21 questions done in about eight minutes? Okay. I don't think that's going to happen. That's not our way.

We've taken five minutes to get to the first question. All right. So by the way, do you like this draft class? Where do you rank this one, let's say, in the last 10 years? Is this one of the questions? Do we get a ding for each questions? Yeah, that's a good one. That was more like setting the table.

But that's a perfect start. All right, there's a question. Okay. Well, that's a great question, Dan. Thank you. Starting us off here with a real humble. dinger they're number one literally could have gone anywhere you wanted that's where you went anyways let's uh let's look at it from the standpoint that we've got quarterbacks so if we've got

quarterbacks i always say that's good it's good for us obviously we got talking points and it's fun to look at i think we've got five starting quarterbacks in this draft class henn and hooker being the fifth you know right behind the big four that we're going to talk a lot about i'm sure um but outside of that it's a it's a it's the best tight-in group we've had in a decade so if you look individually there that's outstanding i really like the depth of the corners. I like the depth of the edge rushers, and running backs is good as well. But, you know, to me, overall, receiver group's not really what it's been in the last few years. Linebacker group's not great. It's middle of the road, but the kicker being we've got quarterbacks.

Well, I'll start there then with the quarterbacks because from the limited amount of tape dog and I've been trying to do lately, I almost been feeling like these guys at the top, and I'm talking Bryce Young and C.J. Stroud, maybe as the big two, we're almost undersold to me in what I heard as like what this class was going to be and the reputation and I look at the two of them and especially Stroud considering he's kind of been at that two or well below young level and think like what does this guy not have because if you compare him to guys coming out like Herbert at the time we didn't know what Herbert was going to be or Tua at the time or James who was like kind of a lock number one or even if you put Stroud in last year's class I feel like

someone would have been trading up to one and everyone would have thought, that's great. Like, what am I missing what this guy doesn't have? Because it seems like he has basically everything. It's really good. I think both those guys, to me, there's a gap between those two and then the next two. But, Greg, I can't really argue with it.

I think, you know, I'm a Bryce Young believer. I think, again, it's easy to say. But if he was a little bit taller, we'd be talking about him like we were talking about Joe Burrow coming out. I think we'd be talking about him like we were talking about Trevor Lawrence coming on. I think he's that good. Obviously, you've got to get around the size.

But with Stroud specifically, you know, there's some games you watch where he doesn't play to that level. You can look at individual games and moments, the biggest being, you know, the last game that he played against Georgia, he shows you everything that you want to see. Even the Michigan game before that, I would say, which was the other biggest game of this season. Yes, but there are other games sprinkled in there when you're watching him and you're like, okay, not his best. Northwestern I throw out because the weather was terrible in that game with rain and wind.

But I think some of the off-schedule stuff, some of the pocket feel, those things, I think he's good, good. I don't think he's at an elite level. I would take him, I have a higher grade on him than I had on Kenny Pickett last year, so he would have been the top quarterback in last year's class. And you're probably right. Going through the process last year, somebody would have traded up for him. They're going to go one and two. I mean, we can say they're being disrespected, but I don't know how you're going to be the first or second pick in the draft. I guess it's just more like watching him is exciting to me that it's.

It seems like he gets through progressions quickly. He's incredibly accurate. And his pocket movement, I thought was great, like, in terms of, like, making room. And that, to me, seems like someone that Frank Reich would like at one. And it's like, I don't know. I just, yeah, he stands out to me as, like, the best thrower. And just watching him throw. He's a natural thrower.

He's so natural. And it's just like, why would people not be totally fun? Now, if he's going to go second, they are falling in love with him. But I have a question for you about, let's say you're just abandoned that whole thing. We were just going down a road, and now you guys are so hung up on 21 questions. I don't want this to be one of my officials, so we've got to just change the subject. We had such a good thing going right there. Well, we've got to keep it.

I like that he's coaching. The 21 thing does put pressure on it. Pressure is not a bad thing. Pressure makes diamonds. I want to say you're Chris Ballard, okay? Okay. And you have, because I know Jim Ursay is sort of saying I'm not into the guaranteed money for Lamar Jackson. But let's say you get the green light to pursue Lamar Jackson.

But you would know in your mind that Anthony Richardson on a rookie contract would sit there at number four. for the Colts, a different type of quarterback than we've seen for the Colts and on the ever. Where would you go if you were running the Colts? What would be your gut reaction on how to proceed? I would try and do the Lamar Jackson thing if I was the Colts. I've been kind of on record with that. If you're looking at one of the two between Richardson and Levis or the fourth pick this year and your one next year for Lamar Jackson and taking into account the money you'd have to pay him, I would still, I know what I'm buying. And selfishly, and I'm saying I'm Chris Ballard, but now if I got out of Chris Ballard

mode and went into fan of Colts mode and you can put Lamar Jackson back there when you have a big time running back like that and Jonathan Taylor sitting next to and you've got an unblocked defensive in on a zone read and you've got Lamar Jackson or I've got to deal with him. Are you kidding me? I think

it makes sense for how they would want to play there. I think it would be a great fit there. So that's where I would go. I just feel like Lamar, whatever anybody's hiccups are or holdups are with Lamar, I know I know this guy's on the field he's going to play quality football we're going to win games I know what I'm buying it might be more

expensive but at least I know what I'm buying What's the ceiling for Anthony Richardson who obviously You know dazzled at the combine but there's the player too from all the tape I would say that he's had Some individual moments like Josh Allen and then that's a comparison people like to make Josh Allen had great games

had great stretches at Wyoming throughout his career there was more body of work to go off of and then with Richardson you're kind of picking out a throw here run there like there's not you're it's you're you're you're buying on the future here and something you really haven't seen consistently but the payoff's huge I think he would make sense for the same reasons I talked about Lamar being able to be in the backfield and run the ball like that Richardson can give you that as you try and develop him as a passer but again

it's an unknown I just feel like I know I know what Lamar Jackson looks like on an see this is still part of sort of Mark's question yeah does this strike does he strike you as the biggest risk of the first round or the whole draft like a guy that can sink you swim your draft class the way I look at if you look at all these wow I did that cost you one you thought you were getting an extra one but we're taking it we're taking it so on the Anthony Richards so I mean I'm still feeling a little burnt because I wanted to hear more

on DJ about Stroud it could come back come back we can come back so with Richardson I look if you look at the quarterbacks thing ever it won't let it go if you brought it up and it's a good it's a good conversation with Richardson the look at him as a lottery ticket If you looked at all those guys costing the same amount of money, a first round pick, and then one of the lottery tickets pays out significantly more than any other, that's Richardson. But, you know, it does come with significant risk.

Stuyken, though, feels like the right coach for either him or Lamar, by the way. I mean, Lamar would be even better. But Shane's, I don't know if anyone's stock has risen more than Shane Stike in this offseason, just like hearing everything that everyone says about him. I'm, like, suddenly confident he'll know what to do if they get a mobile quarterback. From being around him when he was with the Chargers, he's a really good teacher. And I think sometimes we talk about coaches

and game playing and all those kind of things. There's still an element of development with these guys. He's a really good teacher. So that's going to go well with whatever quarterback they end up with. Would you like to circle back to CJ Stroud? Oh, wow. Now you're putting me. Sure.

What if I just give a comment, then it's not technically a question. It doesn't count as much. All right. So with Stroud. Beat the system, don't you dare ding. The system that we created. You can go back and watch, especially more last year. You see it a little bit this year as well.

When he had to reset, when he got moved off of his spot, reset and throw the football, his accuracy went down. It was pretty consistent. That was kind of the issue with him. That's why when you look at the Georgia game, it carries so much weight because he was able to not only, it's not like he's not athletic enough to get away from pressure. It was can you get away from pressure? Can you then throw on the move? Can you reset?

Can you make things happen off the script, off schedule? And he did that there. So that, to me, that was the difference between him and Bryce Young. And the other thing is... Right, I'm not arguing that he should be ahead of Bryce Strong. No, they're going to see that. They're going to be one and two. And then the other thing is, it's kind of beauty in the eye of the beholder.

So with C.J. Stroud, his feet are always in the ground. He's always on balance. The ball comes out from the same arm slot, and he's consistently accurate in those instances. Bryce Young, I was talking to John Beck about it the other day, who's been training both these guys. And I said with Bryce, it feels like you could do an exercise with him when he could drop and you could just say 11 o'clock, 9 o'clock. Like you could put his arm angle wherever you want and he can still get the ball exactly where it needs to be.

A little more next level. But I guess it's maybe that you're right, it's a type of quarterbacks I tend to like too. It's like he can't not, not that C.J. Stroud and Philip Rivers are playing at all in the same NFL, but in the way that you're just like, that's going to be an NFL quarterback. You could tell in NC State. I almost feel like you could feel that about CJ's draft. So one of the interesting things though, and Beck had Herbert going through the process. And we've talked about this on here before, about his development coming through the

draft process and then getting on the field. And he was like, people don't, I think people don't understand. Herbert's first year, his athleticism was what was making a lot of that excitement happen. It was his ability to extend plays. Not even, you know, not maybe on the right read, not making, you know, the right decision, but was athletic enough to buy time, absorb bodies, move around, make unbelievable plays. It's hard when you get labeled as a pure pocket passer now. You know, it's just, you have to acquire the knowledge to be able to use that within a stationary game. You can't do that anymore. You're not going to be given the time to acquire that knowledge.

You're already going to be out. It's kind of funny, though. I mean, it's just funny to think about, like, six years ago and, like, that someone would be criticized for being too much of a pocket passer. Yeah, no, but it's different. It's totally different. I mean, if you look at, oh, like, here's a young quarterback. Oh, he's not athletic enough, which is like, he's plenty of athletic. Yeah.

They're going to throw them all on the field right away. and you have to be able to use your legs to survive until you get the knowledge to be able to play purely from the pocket. And knowing, so Young and Stroud do go one, two, in some order. When you saw that trade that the Panthers made, they give away their best wide receiver, multiple first round picks. In your mind, is this going to be worth it?

Are these guys, do they have the potential to be good enough to make up whatever you gave up? Because now you have a star at quarterback for a decade plus. Yeah. I think it's always worth it if you get the quarterback. If you, you know, as much as I love DJ more and I'm excited to see what he does in Chicago, you're not going to give up too much if you get your quarterback for the next 10 plus years. There's no such thing as an overpay. And I like the fact they did it early because now they can go through the whole process,

get the people involved, they want to get involved, go do private pro days. It's a difference to, trust me, if they called Bryce Young right now while they hold the ninth pick and said, hey, we want to fly out there and do a private workout, he's going to tell him, no, we're not doing that. So now that they're all the way up there They can do all their homework on all the top guys I think so I think they do I think it's gonna be Bryce Young we'll see

So the fourth quarterback Will Levis Like you have him I looked at your top 50 You have them as the 12th best player Right now but in your mock And I mean like you can see how this would happen He tumbles down the boards To number 19 Tampa Bay

And Bucke Brooks has a new mock out Where he falls out of the first round entirely So this is the first quarterback That clearly people are very split on and the variance is high. How is he the 12th best player and he's going to fall that far? I mean, it's quarterback need,

but you could just see everyone. I always assume everyone's just going to jump up for quarterbacks, and they're not going to let Will Levis slide that fall if you need a quarterback? Would they disrespect you that much to not draft your 12th best player? No, for that's not a question.

That's not one of the questions. It's a very, very, rescind that question. This is ridiculous. Snarky comment. That counts for two questions. That's the rules. Damn it great. Edit that out on the show.

Look, I think when it's all said and done, and you play around with different scenarios, and Bucky did it in his latest one, and I had him looking at it. To me, it's like, okay, Mack Jones, we were talking about him being the third pick. He ends up being the 15th pick. Justin Fields, we thought, would go up there top,

and all of a sudden, Carolina passed on him, and things happen, and quarterbacks end up dropping. So it's exploring different scenarios of what could happen. Look, I do, and we've talked about this before. I do mock drafts off what I hear, not what I would do. I do my top 50 off my eyes. I do my mock draft off my ears and I think when it's all said and done

once we take this winding road once we get to the draft, I think all four of these quarterbacks are going to go really high. Yeah, like the Raiders just sit out there as a team that they're a Levis team. We're not going to just let a Levis fly by them. Everybody I talk to around the league pegs Levis with the Raiders. That's a spot

there. Maybe let's wrap the quarterback talk then to get to Hendon Hooker while we're here. Because you've been higher on him throughout the process, I feel like, than the rest of the draft. You know what? Cognacente.

Yeah. And now it feels like that's becoming the trendy thing to do. They're catching up to DJ. Would you like to stick it in anyone's eye in particular? No, but this is right in their eye. This is the way it happens when you're with teams too because you'll go in, you know, say you're an over-the-top scout. So you've come in after the area scout.

So the area scout gives a low grade to Henan Hooker. And then you come in and you give him, you know, and let's just say if you're doing working for a team that does. as rounds, you know, say they gave him a fourth round grade. You come in and say, I think this guy is second round grade. I've put myself out there. I'm a hen and hook and guy. And then all of a sudden you go through the draft meetings.

And then, like, the quarterback coach gives him like a mid-first round grade. And you're like, you know, you're not a hint and hooker. I'm like, no, no, no, no. I thought I was really going here. Now you just leapfrog me. Now that Tannenbaum just went big. And he had him in the-five, I think. He put him in the top five of his mock draft.

You know, intermittent around the NFL listener, Mike Tannenbaum. And the two-lane grad. This would be one you. He might plug in on, too. Yeah, so we love you, Mike. There you go. No, he's a nice man. To me, I like Henn and Hooker a lot.

I do think he's going to be a solid starter. I wish he was a little younger. I wish he was not coming off injury. That is what it is. But can we just take a quick? But that's like a big deal. He's four years older than these guys. I mean, that isn't that like a monster deal?

I know, but it's not as I was just talking to somebody that you know as well, assistant GM this morning. And we were talking about this. He's not in a team that's going to take a quarterback. And he was like, the H thing's overrated, that's not, you can't look at it like that anymore. He's like, we're thinking about even take quarterbacks out of it. He's like, you tell me this guy, we go through the medical process.

The doctor says, this is going to be a one contract player. You're like, great. Give me four great years. That's enough for all of us to get another extension here and we'll figure it out when we go along. Like that thought process has changed a little bit. You have him to the Vikings. He would sit behind cousins this year because he's coming off in ACL2.

Nothing long term with Kirk right now. So he'd be 26, but a bit their theory is, well, he could play to his 36 and that's a a lot better than searching for eight other quarterbacks. Yes, even if it would give you seven, eight years, that's tremendous. And five of those years are going to be cost-controlled, cheap starters. Did you have an aside, by the way? I had an aside because I wanted to take a quick pause. Is that a question?

I don't know if you guys do commercials. But I was just thinking about you guys. Are you making us take a break? So all I'm saying is this. I love baseball. You love baseball. Sure. Greg, you love baseball.

You do not. So you're going to enjoy this. Okay. But I wanted to do something. I was trying to do my homework and prepare, you know, Unlike you guys, I try to prepare for this interview. And I said, let me go and try and find a picture. If I can find a picture, a baseball picture of Dan and Greg,

maybe they've been to a game together or something. So I was able to locate a picture of these guys in a ball game. Do we have a picture over here? Yeah, there they are. Look at that. Mark, aren't they cute? I'll just look wonderful. That's an adorable photo of the two of them. Yeah.

It's Branch Ricky, an elderly overweight man and a little boy next to him. Now, I know you've never, you work on TV a lot. We love what you do with the draft that you've done. never had your own podcast before you do realize this is in an audio medium we're pulling people from audio into video that's how it's done that's how it's done that's how it's done yeah come on guys come on hey along those lines the wholesome assassins makes facts um would you rather and then we're going to take a break all right graver would you rather i try to tee that up the san diego podres win their first world series and team history this october or hit 29 of 32 and you

your final mock, including the top 12. Really? Including the top 12. Padres. Mock drafts is a crapshoot. Because that's with your ears, you said. But 29 of 32 would be talked about forever. Right.

I know, but anybody can put a list together. No human has done that. Anybody can put a list together and guess. Like, anybody can do that. It's meaningful to win a world series. I can assure you that's true. See, exactly. I do one annually and it's a simple.

But think about, I wonder what your agent would say. What, I mean, what a negotiation tool that would be. I think DJ is saying this from a relative position of security that he knows he's doing a good job

you know. How much do you make? I'm just saying that one. He's confident in his work. He doesn't need the mock draft whereas the Padres you know that would be a miracle. So I told...

Mayock, we haven't heard a lot from him lately, you know. I told Bucky if the Padres is in the World Series I think I'm going to get Kevin hearted. Like I'll be at the game. And I'm going to try and get up on the podium. They're like, who are you?

What are you doing? Get out of here. Get hearted. I mean, if they can do it to Kevin Hart, they could definitely do it to you. Well, yeah, that's a fact. All right, we'll take a break, and we'll talk more with DJ. All right, we're back. Justin Graver.

Have you ever met Gravedigger, our producer? I know a lot of people, behind the glass, people aren't allowed to make eye contact with you in the studio and around this building. That's in your rider. But that's Justin, and he's a good person. Hold on. Just real quick. Let me get, okay, I was going to get in Dan's light so you can see me. Hey, hey, good to see you back here.

How are you doing, bud? Grave Digger is a UT alum, a big time college guy. And I said, do you have any questions you want to ask? Oh, okay. The great Daniel Jeremiah. Yeah, let's go. Yeah, first I'd love to just. Oh, before you do.

Uh-huh. How many questions are we in so far? What is that? Nine? I feel like we have more than we thought. I think we're lost at C. Okay, we've done 10 so far. Ten.

Okay, so we got 11 left. Keep that in mind, everybody. Well, this is number 11. DJ's starting to give us the side eye. We're good. We're good. What do we got here? DJ, I want to say thank you first for hooking me up with the Titans Chargers Tickets last fall.

That was awesome. I do have a question for you here. This is what we do. We're just a man of the people over here. I mean, you've seen him many times since. No, he's already thanked me multiple times because he's a good human being. Justin, you're our producer. We're not supposed to show that Daniel's a good guy.

Oh, right. Whenever possible, we present him in a critical light. Okay. So we're going to cut that out of the show. Go on. Sure. Here's my question. How much do you weigh positional value?

versus talent, for example, a guy like Bijan Robinson from my alma mater, who's number three on your big board, but if he's such a knockout talent, why aren't teams more okay with foregoing the positional value and just taking a guy that they know is going to be a plug-and-play playmaker? That's a good one. That's my producer. That's actually the best question I've got today, to be honest with you. Maybe you might have heard another one back there. That was impressive.

Well, they can't be too good. Then he doesn't get any work with them. So we need to internally decide that one. Cut him off. To me, running back thing is a standalone. You can talk about other positions as well. The running back thing is unique. I will say with Bejohn Robinson, he's my third highest graded player. So when you watch the player and you put the grade on him of what he's going to be, I think he's going to be a multi-year Pro Bowl player. I think he's going to be one of the top backs in this league during the next five, six years. So with me, to me, there is definitely, you know, positional value. If you've got somebody that's close in terms of the grade that you gave him, you're obviously going to lean with past rushers, basically every other position you're going to lean just because of the lifespan, the longevity of that position. But I don't buy into this. You can't take a running back in the first round. I just think when it comes to running backs, all their carries have to be meaningful. You're not going to waste their carries.

If we all agree that they're going to play five, six years of really their top shelf football and then it falls off a cliff, which has been exactly what's happened. I don't want to spend three years giving you the football on a crappy team, and I'm wasting three years of your carries. and that's why, and I know they will never do it because it's not their philosophy, but I continue to make the case at the Philadelphia Eagles where they're picking at 10. It's rare to have a team that's that good that's picking in that spot

that's literally a Super Bowl caliber team right now. Every single one of Bejohn Robinson's touches for the next five or six years are going to be for a playoff team. They're all going to matter. And so if you look at him as a playmaker instead of just a running back, I mean, the 49ers are not dumb.

There's a reason they saw where their team was and Christian McCaffrey could come in there and do an unbelievable job and maybe get them over the hump. I think Bejohn Robinson, you get that, he's cheaper, he's younger, and you're going to have a five, six-year runway here with him. Don't you think your guy, Howie could Zig

when everyone's not expecting him to zag or whatever the reverse is? I guess that is a question. Yeah, that is a question. Because if you look at the 10th player contract, wasn't Garrett Wilson was 10th last year, right? I believe so, yes. So that's four years, 20 million.

That's not a crazy running back contract. No, no. $5 million a year for one of the best running backs in the league. And I think Howie would like it because everyone paints them as the analytics team. And they are certainly. But part of analytics is like once everyone starts going in the same direction as you, then you zag and you stick it to it. And also to your point, you know, there's self-survival involved with these front offices.

Just like you were saying, they don't care so much about the second contract. Give me the guy who's going to make our team better for three or four years and we'll figure out everything else after, right? maybe there will be a sea change in time. I don't know. Yeah, and I think that's totally, you know, it's a different topic but related. That's why I love comps. And some people, there's lots of people.

There's a weird section of the population who hates comparisons. And everybody, you know, comparisons to the thief of joy and you hear all this crap, right? It's valuable because if I'm telling you, this is Eddron James. If this guy reminds me of Edron James when he was in the league,

like, holy crap, you take Edron James and put him with Jalen Hertz, and now all of a sudden you've got Devante Smith and we've got A.J. Brown. Like, we're cooking with gas now. I wonder if we get to a world where, like, if you're a player that could play multiple positions, you're a top athlete in your town, why become a running back? If this is your career, you are an isolate, outside of kickers and punters, like,

your career money-making opportunity seems completely out in an island compared to where it was decades ago. And it's like, why do this with your career? And, well, it's hard because kids like to touch the football. So you can say and you can preach to them about money, but when you're, playing in the backyard and when you're playing for your junior high and you're playing for your high school and I get to play running back and I get to touch the ball every single play versus not knowing at Puxetani High how my quarterback can actually get me the football at wide

receiver. If I'm going to play corner in high school, they're going to go. That's where the best player is at flag football. So right from the beginning, that's what the best way is. Yeah. So that's kind of how that works. But I, you know, I would always argue in lobby for high school receivers and I would see I would be like, just play corner. Just every year the receiver group in the draft board, we're having to lop off all these names and put them on the sideboard on the free agent board we have too many corners we're like did anybody else play corner do we have any other corners like are we too low we got to put more corners up there so that's why i've always said for young kids if you want to get to the NFL and you've got a choice between those two positions play corner all right if you

have a pick in the middle of the first round and you're you need a weapon and you're trying to stack this tight end versus yeah the wide receiver class kind of agnostic let's say a team like the patriots who could use both it's not like they couldn't use a tight end I guess they have Henry and Gaseki. Whatever, though. Good long-term player. Like, just these players specifically, how are you comparing this thing out in his mind? Like, it's a little scrimmage, a little scrimmage taking place there.

They could just use a good player regardless. But, like, how do you stack the top of the tight end class versus the top of this wide receiver class? I love Dalton Kincaid. So he's ahead of the rest. For me, I just, he's such a dynamic player. And I hate the fact that we didn't get to see him healthy through the process. He had a little bit of a back, so we didn't get seen him at the combine.

I think he said the other day, at the pro day he wasn't able to do anything he's going to be able to run routes sometime in mid-April and he'll show teams i talked to teams about the the physical and the medical they said he passed so it wasn't you know like this guy's going to go on this long fall but he's he is so gifted and to me when you're looking at tight ends guys that can separate and then also guys that can make combat catches usually you kind of get one or the other you know you get somebody that's undersized that can get away from people or you get a big you know physical slug that just catches balls and guys on his back all

the time. He can do both. He's a, he is a really, really good player. We have not talked about a defensive player yet. One second. I had one more follow up about tight end. Go for it. It's through the ship. So, um, with the tight end draft, so you have two guys, Kincaid and mayor in your latest draft going, uh, in the first round. Um, why do you think highly drafted tight ends in the last decade or so of not, um, or have not met expectations? Do you think it's more about like the team they landed with in the scheme or is there something more to it from the going from one level to the next. Well, if you'd have told me, I mean,

I thought Kyle Pitts would emerge as the best tight end in the NFL, like, fast. And it hasn't all clicked. It hasn't all come together there. Obviously, his first year, I think you saw more. Last year was kind of frustrating watching it. But it's a good point. Teams have been able to find, you know, big-time tight ends in the middle rounds

and some of these high picks. Hawkinson's been a perennial pro-bowler. He might not be, it's weird to say he's a pro-bore, but he's not like an elite, elite player. It's kind of like a pro bowler that like Andy Dalton got a pro bowl or two in there. But he's been to a couple. And he's been traded already for, what they traded for a two this last year.

Good, really good, but hasn't lived up to where he was picked. Noah Fant did not emerge is what you hoped he would be. I think there's, you know, it's a traits position where you want guys that are big and athletic, but it's also a nuanced position. And I think in college it's just you don't have any of that, you know. So in terms of some of the polished route running stuff in college, you're catching a seam. catching a bubble, you know, it's just you're not as refined. So it's a little more difficult to

evaluate. We have a team of ATL every year that we pick a team to ride with, and it was the Lions this season. And I love what you have done in your mock because you have Colisea Cancy. Brad Holmes, the GM. He had spent years with Aaron Donald. He knows what Aaron Donald can do. There's comps there, obviously. I just think he's a perfect fit for the Lions. What is, can he be Aaron Donaldish? Or is that too rich of a comparison? Yeah, I mean, it's, There's just nobody like Aaron Donald in terms of the explosiveness and the strength that he has. You know, one thing talking to D-Line coaches, they love guys that are a little bit short with long arms because it's an unbelievable leverage advantage, you know, when you can get underneath.

That's like Greg and I. There you go. We measured those yet? Well, I mean, let's go out the short part then. But he doesn't, he's, he is so, like, explosive and dynamic and quick. He can get up the field, get on edge and go. The difference is Aaron Donald could put his hands right in your chest plate and, you know, just run. you flash over. He's not that

type of power. He doesn't possess that type of power. But it's hard to find guys that can penetrate and guys that can be disruptors on the interior. I contend it's harder to find those guys than it's to find edge rushers. So when you're having a debate in the room about an edge versus a defensive tackle, to me

I think Chris Jones, Quinn and Williams, Aaron Donald, those guys can impact the game more from in their run and pass than you can coming off the edge. I'm going to answer his question. It is unfair to compare him to perhaps the greatest football player of all time. Well, I mean more that there's flashes, though. But it's the role.

Like, to me, you can say I'm not drafting the same player, but I'm drafting for that role. He's going to play the Aaron Donald role for his team, and he has some Aaron Donald traits. He doesn't have. Aaron Donald's, you know, again, could go down as the greatest defensive one of all time. Another one from you, Grave-Digger.

Okay. What number are we at, too, Graver-Digger? This is going to be 16. Graver-Digger? 16, okay. This is going to be 17. Oh, excuse me. Keep that mind.

DJ is counting the time right now. Don't be the reporter and ask the terrible question, the final question in the press conference. Right, when you're writing your own feature about offensive linemen and you're burning questions during the media time, go ahead. Okay, this is following up on the tight end comments. I'm curious if you think with it being such a strong tight end group all the way through, does that depth lead teams to waiting, knowing that there isn't much drop off from, you know, say the, the, first guy to the fourth or fifth guy, or does it push up those elite guys even higher because they're the best of a really good group? I've been leaning towards, you know, we could see some of these tight ends drop just because

there's so many of them. But the counter argument to that is I don't think this receiver class is anywhere near what we've had the last few years. So, and I think if you listen to some of the stuff coming out of the meetings, Brandon Staley, and it wasn't the only one, but I just remember that one caught my ear where he said, you know, Somebody asked about receiver and he's like, we're looking for playmakers. Like they try and just categorize these guys as playmakers. So to Greg's point about how you would stack receivers mixed in with tight ends,

I think teams are going to say we need more firepower. So I don't think that that drop is going to happen. I think they're going to say, we need difference makers, guys that can make plays, whether you're a tight end, whether you're receiver, we're going to take them. And I think the tight end group is just more impressive than the receiver group. How is Jackson Smith in Jigba? you know, maybe at the top of this class, but not everyone's favorite receiver class

so overlooked in terms of like top end when he's on the same team. Just explain it to me like, I'm an idiot. He's on the same team as Chris Olavay and Garrett Wilson and he produces way more than most of them. And I see this in Free Agency too. I feel like everyone is always grading the previous year instead of just grading the whole thing.

If he had come out last year, wouldn't he have been a higher pick? And then he knocks out the three cones. in the shuttle, like he's got the great timing. Like, why wouldn't he seem like a very safe receiver pick? Because it seems like he can't miss. If I'm a GM, I just want to keep having picks where they're like, oh, that guy's smart.

He keeps taking good players. Like, and there's been very few bad receiver picks lately. Yeah, and especially coming out of Ohio State. He's a slot, so that's it. So you've got Wilson and Olivae on each side working against the number one and number two corners, and you're in there working against a college student. I get it, but that's what they said about Justin Jefferson, too, when he was coming out yeah but Justin Jefferson's taller longer faster like all those things you know play he can

jump above the rim like all those different areas he's going to be over him and Justin was also coming off of like a 20 touchdown season his last year Smith and Jigba didn't even play fair this last year so those are some of the differences there and to me Jefferson that was the whole is he a slot like no no he was he had played outside he had played inside he could do everything every team that I talked to and when I evaluate Smith and Jigba I think he's going to be a 80-9 100 catch guy in the slot. He's going to be high-volume player. And there's obviously teams that covet that and have that need, and they're going to love

him. And there's other teams that are going to say, we have somebody we can play in there. We want to get somebody that plays outside. One of the most surreal things that occurred last season was Mr. Irrelevant yanking a team to the NFC title game for, you know, if you're not a quarterback needy team, but you want to go find that gem, it's probably popular now to, you know, to focus on one person as like this year's Brock Purdy, maybe slightly annoying to you if that's the case.

But is there someone hanging out in the deep distance who someone might grab late who has sneaky upside, a little bit of a gem? Well, I'm going to turn around and ask you a question. Don't count this one. This one's free of charge. So when Debo had all that success as a receiver, we did a thing,

and I came up with a really creative way of saying it, finding Debo. Okay, so it was like finding Nembo, find Debo. Okay. Got it. We've still been searching for the next Debo, Samuel. We haven't found him. Like, there's some guys that are different.

So I need a catchy pun for Purdy. Like, how do we try and find the next Purdy? Anything? Trying to think of Pixar films from the 2000. So, look, everybody's going to try and find that. You know, it's darn near impossible. And I still contend, you know, with Brock Purdy, if you take him and throw him in a different building in a different scenario.

It would be chaos. Who knows what it looks like. He is the perfect match. There's the thing, I don't know if you guys have read up on the S2 test, have you guys done any work on this? So it's a processing test that are now being given to, especially quarterbacks. It's been big in baseball. So it'll be like six shapes pop up and one's different.

How quick can you identify the one that's different? How quick you can process information? If you think about for baseball, pitch recognition and all that stuff, it's very valuable tool and it's made its way over to the football the last five or six years. Josh Allen was off the charts on it. Mahomes tested off the charts on it. Last year in the entire quarterback class, Brock Purdy had the highest. number had the highest grade on that. This year it's Bryce Young. So processing information.

Is this public info? No, but that part is. But you just gave that. But so to me with Brock Purdy in his ability to process paired with Kyle Shanahan's system with all the pieces in place, hey, just Bing, Bing, Bing, get it out. Get it out. Get it out. Get it where he needs to go. He was perfect fit. If you're going to go play action and ask him to power comebacks down the field and a different offense, you might not see the same results. That's all I'm getting Your final question, Greg? I think Mark is just in love with Brock Purdy. That's a great story.

It's a great story. Wonderful. If your son had been born like 10 years later, it'd be Brock, not Colt McCoy, Sessler. Well, I didn't name him Colt McCoy Sessler. There's no McCoy involved in the name. Brock Sessler is almost worth having another kid for. Well, it's the right possible. I did ask Matt Campbell at Iowa State, his coach.

I said, what did we miss on Purdy coming out? What was it? Any other cool phrase? He used a phrase, he used a phrase, competitive excellence, and then I'm like, okay, what does that mean? And then he just went through, like, every single practice was, like, the Super Bowl of this guy. Like, even when, you know, they lost some of the pieces around him, you know, it was just every single day. Like, you don't know it unless you're around it and you can feel it and sense it. Like, this guy is just wired, like, ultra, ultra, competitive.

Basically, my six-year-old son in Little League. Is he like that? Yes. It's literally game seven in the World Series. Locked in? He's obsessed. Competitive excellence. Which one?

Harry Hansis. Harry. Yeah. All right. Greg, your final question. You have a decent gap here for your top cornerback between Witherspoon and Gonzales. And Gonzales? Why? I think Witherspoon is just a better overall player. And so he's not, you know, you're going to see bigger, faster with Gonzalez.

I just think Witherspoon, in terms of the instincts, I fell in love with him from that standpoint. He sees everything so fast. He plays with no hesitation. I was around Assante Samuel, Sr., when I was with the Eagles, and I've seen Junior, you know, with the Chargers. And guys that can play off and trust their eyes, they just go and make plays. Like, this guy's going to be able to make a ton of plays.

And he's incredibly feisty and tough. The days of saying, the old clip that everybody would pull out of Dion saying they pay me to cover, they don't pay me to tackle. Not in this NFL, not anymore. Not with as much outside zone as you're seeing. Not with how they're bringing corners into support because as an offensive play caller,

I can find out who your worst tackler is and we're not going to block him. We're going to block everybody else so we're going to make him be the force player. So to me, he combines that feistiness and playmaking and all kind of comes together in a really nice package. All right. Final question for Daniel Jeremiah, NFL Network's own.

Draft Guru. And we thank him for his time. And he has a podcast. True. You ever think about what we do and specifically hear what you do and every year it's a new draft class a new breakdown of prospects within the same parameters and think what is this for am i happy is this how i want to be remembered am i a hamster on a wheel sometimes you can't even see a pattern until it's right in front of

you your thoughts good question to me there are moments there are moments when I'll tell you exactly what it is I try and get all the guys watched in the run up to the combine so that I can talk about it when they get on the line to run I want to be able to talk about them that I've actually seen them and not read out of the research packet so it's a lot of air time it's about 30 35 hours a lot of time to fill so there's I go position by position when I'm watching them and when you're watching interior offensive alignment and it usually it'll take you a week to get them done and it's like I've just dedicated a week of my life to watching mac interior offensive linemen and then like I'll see a play that's really exciting I'm like hey babe check check this out we see this scoop block here real quick this guy from northern Michigan's pretty good and she's like I don't care but that's the good sign because if it was like if it was the point where like ominous synth is under you and you see the mac he trucks somebody you're just like good block by the that play make notation like you haven't gone mad yet i just i wonder if that's something if you do this too long it's fun you know what i i love one of my favorite things along those lines is i have an old phone which i don't use for anything except for texting a couple guys in the league so i'll be watching tape whoa and then that frees me up to use it that frees me up to use the other phone because if you're if you're on the phone with somebody yeah you can't video so if i'm sitting

there watching tape and we'll just be sitting there on the phone talking each other for a long time and I'll go, oh, hold on this play. I'll use that other phone as a camera. Take a, you know, video of the play, text him, and then he'll be tech. We have these text changes going back and forth of these different plays. I like hearing about the process behind your. Yeah, we've got to hear more of that. Genius. Now we're talking how the sausage gets made. Oh. Anything else? Anything else? We have, we're over time with that Jeremiah. No, no. I think we should set him free. We've done enough. What do you guys do? Daniel's got many, you know, kind of

quarter zips that you could wear to play golf, but also to work out, but also to the office to go out and buy. They go to weddings and funerals. It's versatile. It's very versatile. You have stepped up your wardrobe, my friend. Yes, buttons. Somebody got a new contract. Collars buttons. By the way, I didn't know structure was still in business. Apparently, it's still a thing. It's weight and strength. God is on fire. That's why they call him the wholesome assassin. Check him out a path to the draft with our friend Colleen, Wolf, and everywhere else.

No more plugs necessary. Thank you, buddy. Thanks, guys. Good to see, man. All right. We will be back later this week. Until then. Heat the call.