NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Preseason Studs in Week 2; Rookie QB Talk with Charley Casserly

Episode Date: August 19, 2019

A room filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, Chris Wesseling and Gregg Rosenthal bring you all of the latest news around the NFL including the Raiders demanding Antonio Brown "In or Out" (6:05) , Josh Gordon returning to the Patriots (12:17), and Josh McCown coming out of retirement (18:14). The heroes give their preseason week 2 takeaways (27:13) and then get to catch up with Charley Casserly to find out the meaning of the name " Joe Hardy" (44:02).Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the NFL podcast arrives to work every day in a brinkstruck. Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast presented by Sirius XM. My name is Dan Hansis. I'm joined in a room that's filled with heroes. Mark Sessler, Chris Wessling, and Greg Rosenthal. What is up, boys? Hey, Dan.

I'm very impressed by the range of fashion. choices in the room today. Dan wearing a Dan sort of shirt. Me wearing a shirt that I've watched. I've done on the show probably 500 times. Greg and he's very fabulous looking. Yeah, let's focus on the fancy boys. Wes has the Lakeisha makeover.

I had fashion before I met my wife. Okay. Hold on. You look different now. You look different now. Not only did I buy this jacket myself. I bought it. One of our podcast listeners got it for me in Minneapolis.

I don't even know if that's legal. And Greg, Searsucker now. Yeah, seer-sucker. And there's a reason why, because Wes and Greg went on the Rich Eisen show. Rich was kind enough to have you guys on, and Mark and I will be joining Rich before kickoff in a couple weeks to do an appearance as well. And it sounds like it went really well, Greg. But you making a bold decision to wear Searsucker on national television,

let's take into that a little bit. Well, how bold is it? I thought that I would be disrespecting my father-in-law. who got me this jacket when I was visiting my family in Tokyo over the summer. If I didn't break it out on the Rich Eisen Show, what better place to use it for the first time? Well, it's the first thing I noticed when I got to the office today, when I got to the newsroom.

And guess what? I wasn't the only one who noticed. And in case you're wondering, he's in fact wearing a Searsucker sport coat here on the program. I mean, if I'm... I just said the same thing. Now as my father and mom is in material. If he's going to buy me a sore sucker...

This is terrible place to wear it first. How do you guys re-listen to our podcast, by the way, and just listen to the sound of your own voice? I hate it. I rarely do. I've never gotten over that. I enjoy fun. I like your voices.

I can't deal with it. Sorry. So good job. Good job with the Searsucker, though, Greg. My one question with the Rich Eisen set up, you two going now, or is it, do you think internally, does that program for you guys has an appetizer, Dan and I being the main course?

We go down, you know, we're going to. Well, they left us. the choice of however we want to people don't need to know that yeah I do believe I believe that's the case but do notice right you guys are appearing on kickoff on the day the NFL season starts that's a more

high profile day I mean today they were having anyone and Daniel Jeremiah was on the show too too so they're just collecting people off the street fabs to the studio anyway so Greg keep an eye on Greg's fashion choices as this season goes on you'll see Greg occasionally in NFL network perhaps different digital shows that we

have Greg's fashion getting more and more quirkier as he gets older. And I mean that as a compliment, you're looking to get outside the box, and it's very clear to me. Well, the only way to do fashion is to make it your own, right? That's what he's doing. Yeah. I mean, I'm not even like, that was a good analysis. I know that West cannot stand the concept that he would not have reached this same place

fashion-wise without Lakeisha. wonder where you would be from a closed horse perspective if she had not come into your life. That is misrepresenting what I've said about the case. Her influence has been tremendous, but usually when you guys pick out an outfit, it's something that I chose or I... I did love Mark's

reaction there. Wes, like, throughout a Wesian philosophy on fashion. It's like, that's how we're here now. We're at the point now in society where Wes has philosophy on fashion. I ever saw that coming. I'm not even exaggerating. You're right, Wes. You have to

Is it what you like? But the second thing I think about is what is Dan going to say? I'm not even joking. I'm the podcast or in the office. Like that's who I'm thinking. I am a day. That's true. Okay.

A lot to get to today. All right? Because we are now inside three weeks before the start of the regular season. So we're really starting to ramp it up. And coming up on today's show, we will have our takeaways on Friday show. We talked about some takeaways. from the Thursday preseason games. We'll share some more from the rest of the games that were played on Friday, Saturday, Sunday.

There's even one more today. I know everybody will be tuned in to that. And also we have, oh, yeah, Charlie Casserly, the great Chas Casserly is going to join us to talk a bunch of things, including the Dallas Cowboys in their contract situations, his take on what we've seen from the rookie quarterbacks and also, Wes, like you. He has some real concerns about the past interference. rule. I think every announcer in the NFL is concerned about the past interview.

Concerned and confused. All right, Ricky, let's do it. What We're Hearing, presented by Sirius XM. Let's do some news. What the Eagles did to Fools was the worst thing the Eagles could have ever done to anybody. I don't know. Nick Foles is going to come and hunt the Eagles later during the future. Now put me in the pocket.

NFL pocket, please. Who was that, Chris Wessel? That was the man running the food truck at a concert that Keish and I went to over the weekend. He recognized him. He said, do I know you from somewhere? And I asked him if he was an NFL fan. And we got around to, he listens to the podcast. So I asked him to give me his thoughts on the Eagles, and that's what we got.

The take is that Nick Foles will punish the Eagles for generations to come. He thinks the Eagles did Nick Fools wrong by not keeping him as the number one quarterback. I disagree, but, you know, that's fine. That's what's fun about football. Well, as you can see, he's very passionate about that. All right, let's get to the news. Oh, boy, you know, we thought that perhaps the worst was over for the Oakland Raiders and this drama with Antonio Brown by the end of last week.

He was back at the Raiders facility, and we were hearing positive reports about the frostbitten feet, and there seemed to be perhaps some movement in the positive direction on the helmet issue, which has been vexing for Raiders brass. But guess what? Antonio Brown disappeared again heading into this weekend. He did, I should say, he did reappear on Monday, and we can get to that Monday today. But over the weekend, he was gone again,

and Mike Mayock, the GM of the Raiders, who I imagine has been biting his tongue this entire time, decided he needed to make some type of move. He needed to make some type of statement. he needed to start taking control of this situation, which had to be a tough decision because it's a volatile situation. Here's what Mike Maik said to a small group of reporters yesterday, Sunday. You all know that AB is not here today, right?

So here's the bottom line. He's upset about the helmet issue. We have supported that. We appreciate that. Okay. But at this point, we've pretty much exhausted all avenues of relief. So from our perspective, it's time for him to be all in. We're all out.

Okay? So we're hoping he's back soon. We got 89 guys busting their tails. We are really excited about where this franchise is going, and we hope A.B. is going to be a big part of it starting week one against Denver. End of story. No question.

Greg. I enjoyed that. I thought it was Mike Mayak, as you said, just someone's got to let Antonio Brown know what's what. And the clearest way to do that is through social media. I think that's what Antonio Brown responded to. So I just thought it was, and I'm not the first person to make this point, that it was telling the Raiders put that out on their Twitter account immediately. Like, he made that statement, and then they made sure that everyone possible could see it, including Antonio Brown. who has been going a little wild on his social media the last few days and over the weekend.

And Antonio Brown returned to work Monday. Maybe the story's over. Well, training camp isn't just to get your body in shape for the season. It's to instill what Mayock was talking about, all in. It's all these guys getting together and being all in as a team, and it's hard to do that when you have 89 guys in one place and one guy in the other place. And I thought the tenor of the coach and GM so far has been. been, they've tried to support Antonio Brown verbally and, you know, on hard knocks the best

they can. But behind the scenes, it has to just be ripping Mayok apart. And it's embarrassing. And it feels like you have to take control of this situation somehow. And that his comments were extremely strong. I thought it was telling last week, John Gruden, and we talked about this, that he went out of his way not to be involved, not to say anything inflammatory to try to keep this thing as under controls he could possibly do. And I think what happened with Mayock here is they reached the point as an organization where they had to kind of, I don't know, roll the dice is the right word, but had to put that out there knowing full well it could create a volcanic situation

because Brown is so temperamental and so, you know, it's hard to figure out where he's coming from next, but they had to do it because this has become, Greg, ridiculous. That's it. I mean, and the Raiders are trying to get together for a season. starting in a couple weeks and their best players still pulling his helmet stuff and it is selfish and it's the reason why the Steelers are lucky to have him gone. I'm sorry. Well, I think all the information that Mike Silver put out on his Twitter account two weeks ago really informs the Mayak statement because if it was just the helmet and everything else

had been hunky dory over the last couple weeks, that's one thing. The helmet issue is just bizarre. I mean, he had literally used the exact, it wasn't just like the type of helmet. Rich Eisen went through the entire scenario on his show to start out today, and he had talked to someone at the league office. It was literally he's played with one helmet the whole time, like the exact same helmet. It hadn't been made in over 10 years, like not even produced. And they went in and they tested that one helmet and, you know, didn't pass the test. And they don't make that helmet anymore. So they're trying to like find one that's similar-ish or what, but it's just kind of a, it's kind of a crazy hill to die on.

Some of the, you know, Eisen had strong comments, too, and so of others, on the transformation of this player's personality. And we don't know enough to really comment, but when he came into the league with a good sort of chip on his shoulder because he did not feel he was drafted as high and should have been and got the recognition, that he was the hardest worker, that he would study relentlessly, that his practice habits were pristine, that he would hit the gym after players had gone home every night. That's completely different from a preparation angle than what we're getting right now. to your point, West, that he's not mentally engaged with the rest of his teammates. He's invested. He's as invested as any wide receiver I've seen since Jerry Rice. He's maniacal about his work ethic and working hard and trying to find advantages. And I think when you're that invested, it probably intensifies feelings a lot more than other people.

Like, I don't want to sound condescending, and it's really not where this is coming from. But part of my reaction to this was just like, is Antonio Brown okay? Is anyone thinking about that? Like, is he all right? I think people are thinking about it, but I don't know what I mean? Like, it just, yeah, they don't know where he's coming from. It's just, I think a lot of people have had that feeling. And they wonder that, especially from the outside,

just because it does not seem like the behavior, a guy that has everything in a good place mentally. But man, what a mess. And remember, hard knocks Tuesday night on HBO. Let's move on. wide receiver news wide receiver Josh Gordon

is back with the New England Patriots the NFL announced that they are conditionally reinstating the veteran following his indefinite suspension

and Roger Goodell released a statement Goodell and Gordon have formed a positive relationship over the years during They spent like hundreds of hours together

Gordon's on again off again issues with the league and substance abuse but Goodell said we are rooting for Josh to succeed both personally and professionally. This is a little bit of a surprise, Wes, that Gordon was able to get cleared as quickly as he did. Perhaps his relationship with Goodell plays a role in it, but we don't know what we're going to get from Josh Gordon. He's still 28. He made a big impact for them last year before disappearing down the wormhole of substance abuse suspension.

How big is this for the Patriots? It's huge, considering their wide receiver core and all the questions they, have there. And I think you asked the same question about Josh Gordon as you ask about the guy we just talked about, Antonio Brown. And for a different reason, you ask how long will it last? Is this just for a few weeks? Is it for the whole season? Last year, we thought he was going to be there all season when he came back. And then late in the season, that bomb drops on the Patriots, you don't have a guy who is trending towards your biggest playmaker at wide receiver. I mean, it seems like maybe they knew more than we did, but their preparation going

of the year, to me, seemed like they had no idea of Gordon would be back, and they prepared around it. And, you know, now you look at you get, you have Julian Edelman, you have Josh Gordon potentially. Jacoby Myers has become one of the stories of Patriots camps. All the drama and the hand-wringing over New England's wide receiver room is starting to look like it's not going to be that big of a deal. Right. You have Philip Dorset, who I think is a nice role player as, as a three or a four, which is what he'll be. Now, you have your first round pick, Nikiel Harry. I think the receiver position is the last of Belichick's concern. This is a team that started

Kembrel Tompkins and Aaron Dobson for 10 games in a 12 and 4 season. Or started Jabbar Gaffey and Rochelle in an AFC championship. Well, that got you. So this grew. They had gronk for a lot of all those years. They did, but they also have James White and Kevin Falk had those years

where it's like, Kevin Falk was just around forever, but every like four or five years he would just catch 75 passes because they need him to. And to me, that's James White this year and Sony Michelle's reportedly looked pretty They got enough pass. I mean, assuming that Edelman is ready for week one, where are we at that? Is that still one?

He's suited up for practice. He just returned for the first time today, so it looks like he's trending that way. Who is? Gordon may not be ready for week one, though. I'm not assuming that. Yeah, I'm not. I mean, yes, they have more depth than perhaps people realize, but I'm still not blown away by the group.

I'm curious who's the odd man out because I've heard, you know, Hosanna's sung over Maurice Harris, of course, Jogobie Myers, Dorset, as we said, the rookie, Harry. Demarius Thomas, I assume, is in trouble now. He has not been activated, and my thought would be he'll be stashed on the PUP list and see if they need him midway through the season. And yeah, Maurice Harris might be more of a special teamer, but he's hurt right now, too.

He could be on the bubble. Why would you leave like a 1,700-yard-wide receiver? All I said was he's going to have a nice roll. Actually, Belich- tells us there is no bubble. What's a bubble? I think he makes the team. They keep six. What did you say 550 yards was over under from a recent?

Six wide receivers. Well, that was pre-Gordon, but yeah. I'm standing by it. Let's shoot down to Washington and talk about the Redskins who have some quarterback decisions to make. Jay Gruden does. Colt McCoy, who suffered that broken leg last year. It seemed like one of those injuries where he'll be fine the next year, but now it's a situation where McCoy might not be ready until two to three weeks into the season.

Gruden conceded, according to ESPN.com. And then you have the case of Dwayne Haskins, the first round rookie, versus the veteran Case Keenum, ESPN's Adam Schaefter, reported that this is trending towards Keenum now, Mark Sessler, as the starter. Does that make sense to you based on what we've seen so far from Haskins? Yeah, I mean, I've seen good stuff from Haskins. And to me, I like his armies also not looked completely comfortable. And that left tackle situation, like Adrian Peterson mentioned, has, I think, toyed with all these quarterbacks.

But on Colt McCoy, you know, he has the faith of Gruden, and I think this was probably the closest shot he had to starting a week one game in many, many years and maybe ever again. And what's happened with, when he first broke his leg, they initially thought, if I'm not mistaken, that he could even come back last season and play at the end of the year. He tried to. Tried to.

And then it turns into this really rough situation with three additional surgeries, and he's even visiting Dr. Robert Anderson, who has no idea what's going on with the leg either. So this can end the career. It's hard not to think about Trent Williams being upset at the medical staff in Washington when you hear that he's had to have three follow-up surgeries. Although Jay Gruden's kind of put it on Colt McCoy trying to get back too soon. You feel bad for him.

But this is a mess. I mean, this is going as whatever they envision for their three-way battle, wherever they had it in their head, I think they're fairly close to a worst-case scenario, although Haskins looking, I think, solid is, you know, the one positive. He had, you know, a beautiful touchdown pass in his last preseason game. And I think that Gruden, this goes back to we're talking to the hot butt rankings on Friday. He has to walk a very fine line where Gruden has to, he's charged with developing Haskins

and getting behind the rookie, which makes a lot of sense. He's a first-round pick. But he's also got to win games to have any chance to keep his job. So you can understand why Keenan might be a more appetizing choice. at this time so good luck to you j gruden moving on the Philadelphia Eagles have added another quarterback to their room and it is Josh mccown who comes out of retirement the 40-year-old who spent the last couple seasons with the Jets joins the Eagles a team that's dealing with injuries behind carson once Nate sudfeld he has a broken wrist to his non-throwing arm

Cody kessler exited their second preseason game and went into concussion protocol call. Clayton Thorson was the only guy left to finish the last game. So now you bring back Josh McCown. Greg, as a Jetsman, I could tell you that there has been no shortage of thoughtful and entertaining slash enlightening think pieces about what a great man and teammate Josh McCown is. But I will tell you, he got a decent amount of action in the last two years of the Jets. I don't know if he could play anymore. In fact, I don't think he can play really at all. And I'm just surprised that this was the move that the Eagles made. Well, when you have Cody Kessler as your backup for now,

I think you just look at McCown as someone who would be great to help out Carson Wentz. They said this in New York, too. He was practically just like an extra QB comes. I think that's the idea. He's the third string guy. He's got a TV future, but I see him as potential NFL head coach down the road to me. He's the backup for now until, you know, maybe when Sudfeld gets healthy, They like Sudfeld.

But it's like when you have, if Kessler's going to be your backup and he's got a concussion anyway, it's like, well, Wyatt, you're not winning any game. Kessler's going to be a problem anyways. Kessler and Clayton Thorson are gone. That's my read on the situation. And you guys know I've been a McCown fan. He was cooked last year. He was done.

He was better in 2017, though. Last year was problematic, but he wasn't that bad. He couldn't make the throws anymore. And I think Sudfeld should be back by the end of September. They really like Sudfeld, too. I think he'll be the number two. And maybe they keep Josh McCown just to play that, like, player coach role or whatever.

I mean, you know, not to keep going back to this well, but it's an RPO offense. Colin Kaepernick doesn't get a look with this team. Who does he get a look with? That's good question. I thought about that, you know, because, you know, as vocally progressive an owner as there is in the NFL and as vocally progressive a team locker room as there is.

So you're right. If he wouldn't get a sniff in this spot, it's probably not going to happen. Let's move on. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers made a move. with Jason Light, their general manager. Mike Garifolo reported Saturday that the Bucks signed their GM to a five-year extension through 2023. This deal was actually worked out in January just after Tampa named Bruce Ariens their new head coach.

So they wanted to align the GM and the head coach. This one surprises me a little bit, Greg, because what exactly has Jason Light done to, who deserves a strong word. So let's just say to get a new contract extension in Tampa. This is one of the biggest, most surprising news items of the entire month for me. I mean, it's probably a bad sign if you need to Saturday afternoon news dump your GM getting a contract. You know what I mean? I honestly think that's...

I do know what you mean. I honestly think that was the strategy here was they didn't want it to get too much attention. It seems like they... The ownership likes that light helps. to bring Aryans in because of their past relationship. But what is the rush here? Right. I get the aligning.

That makes sense. But let's find out a year in how well they work together. And Jason Light's record is 27 and 53 with a couple concerning draft picks in there. You spend a second rounder on a kicker that is working at a fast food restaurant right now. And on top of it, like, I'm not totally sold on James Winston on any level. Which fast food restaurant, by the way? No, I'll research that. which one he's been to a few i always think their roster looks better than their record but that record

right it's pretty spotty i think he's gotten a lot of good media publicity for building a talented roster which you you could argue for or against well that's that's a vote as a quarterback but i think that i affect i think that affects ownership in some way that's a vote for playing the media game i do just a real news impact from this though is i think james winston has a much better chance of getting a long-term deal now just because Light's the one that drafted him. And if he had a clean, solid year, which is a huge if, it basically almost never happens for the Bucks or Winston, but if that happened this year, I think they'll resign him. Injury news.

The Seahawks are counting on D.K. Metcalf to have an instant impact for them at wide receiver, the second round pick, who had been getting raves from everyone inside the building about his progress this summer. well that progress has been halted by a knee injury suffered it in practice last week late last week and he'll be undergoing a surgery that's Pete Carroll intimated that it wasn't a major surgery or something that will kind of not keep him off the field for too long maybe a scope who knows but the idea that he won't miss too much action but mark anytime a rookie wide receiver gets taken out of the mix when he's trying to get those valuable reps

and playing time, it's not a good thing, especially in Seattle, whether they really need Metcalf. They, I mean, they're a wide-out group. You know, we talk about New England's. I'd be equally concerned about Seattle's, and I know that they want to run the ball until, you know, endlessly.

But Geron Brown, David Moore. I like David Moore, but who is your true game-changing wide out here? I don't know that you hit Tyler Lockett's good, but I don't, to me, when you look at the Seahawks, this is a perfect example why schedule analysis is mostly useless. it's when you play a team and just like last September, you want to play the Seahawks early in the year.

Really sad news out of Austin, Texas over the weekend, former NFL running back. Cedric Benson died in a motorcycle crash. He was 36 years old. Benson and a passenger

collided with a car at an intersection and Benson and the passenger were pronounced dead at the scene. I mean, Benson came into the league as a high draft pick with the Chicago Bears. It never worked out in Chicago. In fact, it was about as poor as it can go for a guy that was as high of a draft pick as Benson was. But he ended up bouncing around the league and hanging around for a while,

including a stop west with your Cincinnati Bengals where he had a trio of 1,000-yard seasons. I remember him having a big playoff game against the Jets one year. So he had some moments, maybe didn't live up to what was expected. of him when he was drafted in the top five. But Cedric Benson had a lot of people that thought highly of him, Aaron Rogers, to name one of them, who played briefly with Benson, said he used to sit with Benson during training camp and during the season at a cafeteria table and talk about, you know, life, sports, anything. He was one of those guys you could really talk about anything with. So really sad to hear that Cedric Benson has passed away

at age 36. That sort of puts it in perspective, that anecdote about Aaron Rogers, who during his career has seen old school powerbacks like Cedric Benson become an endangered species, just in the span of that 12 to 13 years. This guy would have no chance of going in the top 10 in the draft with his skill set now. Right. That was the same draft as Ronnie Williams and Cadillac. I mean, Ronnie Brown and Cadillac Williams and Cedric Benson all went in the top five.

That draft helped. I guess you could compare him to Leonard Forna, so maybe I have to take that back. Yeah, I mean, that draft changed how running backs reviewed. But Benson, I mean, he started five or six playoff games for the Bengals and had three seasons straight over 11 hundred and 50 yards. Like, he had his moments. One of two players punched by Thomas Jones. I think he would admit he had some problems with immaturity early in his career,

but he was always kind of a person. who thought deeply about things in interviews. Going back to college, he's probably more legendary for his high school, known as maybe one of the great Texas high school players of all times and one of the great Texas Longhorns of all time. And everyone who talked about him always said how thoughtful and smart he was. No, it's the football side of it.

But then, you know, this is someone who's just lost the chance to probably be on the planet for another 50, 60 years and was renowned as having an incredibly engaging personality. and it would have been the post career would be just as interesting as anything he ever did as a player. Cedric Benson, dead at the age of 36. That is what is happening in the news.

All right, let's check out the rest of the takeaways from preseason week, too, which, by the way, and there is always things to talk about, of course, but it is becoming more and more a farce, these games, in terms of the coaches that are all following, Sean McVeigh plan of resting not a handful, not 10, 20 of their regular players

because they just don't see the value in putting them out there for the risk. This is all coming to a head, I feel like, with the CBA. But anyway, that is a discussion for perhaps another time. Greg, how about some takeaways from the games on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday? I guess I want to start because with Wes's guy, Chase, Win a Vend. Oh, man, I've got a whole paragraph on this guy. I just want to... You go, because it feels less biased, you know, talking about a Patriots player.

Well, I sent some consternation from Mark and Dan about the state of preseason play, and if you're tired of watching Samajé Piran being unable to make anyone miss in the open field, if you're tired of watching Ryan Griffin's pop gun arm unleashing creepers all over the field, find your favorite relaxant and dial up game pass for Chase Winovich in the second and third quarter against the Titans. This guy is a terror screaming off the edge almost every single play. The Titans are trying to get a good look at their fancy new backup quarterback Ryan Tannahill. And Winovich is single-handedly dismantling their offense. It's like watching Rambo.

He's up in the trees. He's in a cave. He's down by the water. How many Chase Winoviches are out there? And then I'm watching it. I'm like, I've got to go back and watch the first, the opener. So I'm fast forward and through here, and I see the Lions, or I see the other team complete a pass. And I'm like, well, can't be Winovich.

He's not on the field yet because they wouldn't be completing passes with this guy out there. It's like your defense should get extra points for scoring when Winovich is on the field. You know, it's hard for me to really get excited about turning on a game that involves the Titans. But I did because of what you said, Wes. And I believe it was Tyler Mars, who was the right tackle that just had no answers for Chase. It was a grotesque clown suit being put on the man. As Mark once said, he was fashioning a multicolored clown suit for this man on every play. I go back to watch the first game.

I finally find the Winnevich part. He's doing the same thing against the lion. Can we cut through the preseason malarkey? And is this guy really a player? Or is it who he was playing against? then is he going to have a role in this defense? Where are we at with? Well, here's what we know.

Your backup tackle has no prayer against this guy. We don't know what he can do against starting tackles because we haven't seen it yet. But he is in a different class than anybody's backup tackle. It's a position they really could use someone to step up and they've been talking up Derek Rivers a little bit and they picked up a guy from the Raiders. Shalik Calhoun who's had a good camp.

But I think he'll absolutely have a role in this offense. They don't really have outside pass rushers. It's what they need more than anything. And their rookie class, not to be too much of a homer, but right now, they haven't had many good rookie classes lately. And between Jacobi Myers, who had to be taken off the field at one point during the joint practices with the Titans because they wanted Brady, they wanted to force Brady to throw to someone else.

Because it's just Jacobi Myers everything. And he's been great. So between him, Juan Williams has looked good at cornerback and then Jared Stidham. They have a nice young crop, which they kind of needed. Winovich already has a trademark. This is my last comment on him. You can talk about it all day. If you're passionate about it, keep talking, West.

When he beat you over and over again, and I'm talking like five plays in a row, this guy is shutting down your offense and beating your right tackle, switch him over to left tackle, beats him. Here's the trademark. You just suplex him. You're tired of him being at your quarterback,

so you take a tight end or a tackle, pick the guy up, suplex him, get called for a blatant holding penalty, and at least he's not sacking. He's getting Rob Ninkovich, comparisons from what I've seen too, but he sounds more like Rob Nickavich made out of like iron and gold. I don't buy that.

It sounds lazy. Yeah, I don't buy that at all. He's much more of like an edge rusher type. Absolutely. I thought I might be overreacting, so I went to pro football focus and looked at his grade for this game. It's in the, it's in the area where you only see Aaron Donald and JJ. Right.

And he only played out the game. I mean, it's really not exaggerating that it's one of the great preseason performances I've ever seen. But I don't know what that means. No one's ever won the vaunted preseason MVP award. I hand it out at the end of every preseason, but Winnevich has got to stand. It's the greatest preseason game I've ever seen by a rookie pass rush.

I get goosebumps thinking of the trophy ceremony, Zach Zennar, handing it over to Jason Winovich, the big trophy. Oh, yeah. That's fair. And Lakeisha Jackson Wesleying, if you're listening to this podcast, you know what to get West for Christmas. one of those authentic jerseys not the $75

replicas I mean the $200 job I'm not going to be wearing a jersey All right I'll throw one out there And then Greg I'm going to come to you But I want you to actually talk about something Don't tee up West Because that was a double T up

Why are we having double T Ups? Well it was just that was the most To me it was kind of a blah preseason weekend I was like building up to Wes And there was like You know Some quarterback talks I know we're going to talk about Charlie Casterly with that later, but there wasn't much, I didn't have a ton of us, but I do have, I am ready.

Okay, all right. You're on deck. No, I changed my mind. You're up. Wow, look at this. Well, let's talk Tony Pollard, because I think that was a big takeaway from the weekend, how I think he had about 50 scrimmage yards in that first drive that they're using the fourth round pick for the Cowboys between the tackles. I think he's looked solid. He made a couple really nice plays. I think he's had some big holes.

And I think it's just an interesting topic because the comment that Jerry Jones said about Zikou, which apparently is annoyed Zeke Elliott. And his agent. If you watch it in context, He wasn't trying to offend him. And I don't think the Cowboys know that this guy probably isn't really capable of carrying the load. He was the third running back at his college,

including behind Daryl Henderson, the Rams rookie. And he only had, I think, you know, what was it, 70 carries last year. He's never had more than that. And I don't know if he's really an Alvin Camara type who, when he gets to the NFL, can actually increase his workload. So I think a little bit of this pollard hype It's a nice player to add to that offense, and I think they need it to have more weapons. But it'd be a huge, it's totally different if you're playing in the regular season, giving him 20 carries.

Well, you know, Jerry is winning on the scoreboard versus Zeke pretty handily right now. And Pollard's a big reason why. But to me, you get excited if you're the Cowboys, because Zeke will eventually be back. Right. And now you've got this hybrid player who's kind of half running back, half slot. And that's what's good in the NFL right now. I want to talk about Tasum Hill

who you know this is interesting so he's been like a fun little gadget player for the Saints and maybe that's just what he'll continue

to be but then you see things and again the preseason lies as they all say but then you see what he did against the Chargers so he comes in at the half

for Teddy Bridgewater who looked terrible but he was also six so we're going to give Teddy a pass on this but then Hill goes off and he just lights up L.A. with his legs and with his arm,

come back win the whole thing. It does, it makes me think that where Taysamil is at a player as a player right now, which is obviously exciting and electrifying, potentially, if Sean Payton, the offensive genius

that he is, that there's not a bunch of stuff rattling around in his mind about what he could possibly do to add to his offense moving forward. And I'm wondering what that would mean in terms of Hill getting more snaps, potentially, and Drew Brees getting less as a result and how Brees that would sit with Brees.

If that's even a question, if that's even something that Peyton would broach with Drew Brees. But it just seems like Taysam Hill is somebody that could add yet another level to this offense beyond what we've seen the last year or two. I think for me, and I had the similar note, Dan, I wrote that Tassum Hill makes football fun. I loved his performance. He seems so comfortable out there. He's versatile. He's confident.

and it just makes me glad that he's on a team like the Saints with Sean Payton's mind versus him being couched on the Detroit Lions where we would essentially never see him again because certain teams just wouldn't know what to do with him. And we got there last year to some degree with his role expanding and him being such an X factor. It's a great question. How do you get more of him on the field because he's that valuable, that interesting? Well, he's let it be known to the beat writers there

and the announcers of the Saints game. Sean Payton's compared him to Steve Young, that he might be our Steve Young. He said that, and it's been a little below the radar, but they've been talking about how this year, his third year, they haven't done any gadget plays at all in camp because they said we can practice those in the regular season. Camp is all about him as a quarterback,

and they think he's really made strides as a real quarterback in this camp. I mean, anybody that knows football knows what happened with Steve Young, what happened with the guy who's playing behind. Went pretty well. Is that where this is headed? I mean, Stacey, listen, again,

he's going against all third and fourth stringers and bouncers and UPS drivers. He's also 29 years old, which is under the radar. That is under the radar. I didn't realize that. I think Sean Payton thinks he has a real chance to succeed Drew Brees,

which is interest. I think he's kind of letting that be known that he thinks he's got a chance. He was around 30 years old when he finally got a chance as well. Mark Sessler. One guy I want to mention quickly is Cleveland's MacW. Wilson, the linebacker, who over two games has been a playmaking machine. And it's not just in the

games. All camp, all these practices that have been going on, he has been raved about. And it's just, you know, they needed someone to come in at linebacker and do what he's doing. So good start for him. And for all the issues with the preseason. And it is a tough product. And there's no reason for us, for anyone we don't. We just be totally honest about that it needs fixes. One thing that I Saul that I would like to see more of in the preseason was having Andrew Siciliano get Sean McVeigh on the headset during a Rams defensive series. And it's such a covert culture, the coaches. And you don't really get to hear what they're doing during games very often. Otherwise, it's like Bill Parcells swearing at a ref or something. But it was incredible. It was a brief segment to hear McVeigh just

break down what he was seeing. And he was so just informative and interesting. I want like hours of that. It needs to be like a television station that offers that the entire game. We're never going to get it because they're never going to allow it to happen, but it made football so much more interesting. I like that too. I did. I tweeted out last night that I couldn't figure out who Sean McVeigh sounded like and then it light bulb went off and it was freaking Bon Jovi. And if you know what Bon Jovi sounds like when he talks, check it out if you're interested. You'll never, you'll never hear Sean McVeigh the same way. It's exactly the same voice.

There are many McVeys, though, that would be that dynamic and compelling and be able to mentally, to be able to speak that well. I mean, it was incredible to hear how quickly he mentally processes from that view, everything that's happening. And I think most, I think most coaches probably could mentally process things that fast, but they couldn't explain it verbally that. He loves doing it, too. Just like he loves reciting the plays.

We would learn a lot about coaches that we think we already have the book on. Here's the thing, though, McVeigh, I think one underrated thing about him, and I noticed Zach Taylor is absolutely in the same mold, and he was under McVeigh. McVeigh is incredibly transparent. He has been since day one. He gives you injury information, and actually no one even makes a big deal of it. He tells you who's playing in the preseason. And I've noticed Zach Taylor's a little like this, too.

He's just transparent because he's confident, and he realizes so much of this stuff that coaches aren't transparent about doesn't matter. And I love that. Here's my number one takeaway from that whole exercise. Who in the entire football world is capable of criticizing Sean McVeigh? You watch that and you think any analyst on TV, anyone writing, anybody on Twitter, you think you're going to criticize Sean McVeigh? Luckily, no one has.

He got a little bit of it after the Super Bowl. He laid an egg in the Super Bowl. People criticize that. People hit from that a little. No, I don't think they said. Because it's been all, you know, bouquets, sunshine and bouquets. Well, that game, though, like I, for me, the Rams were a little annoying to me because they got good so quickly and suddenly everyone was in love.

I think they're much more intriguing now because they have to show, this is when you have to do the job of a coach. And McVeigh, I think, is shown from a personnel and from an organizational standpoint, how strong of a leader he is. One more real quick one, and then we've got to go. We're running a little late today. Well, maybe we'll hit on it with Charlie, but I'll give my two cents in Daniel Jones, which is that if I was a Giants fan, I would love what I see.

Because, yeah, I know he's going against a second team offense. They're not game playing, all this stuff. But he's doing things like changing the plays, changing the tempo, which they did. And young quarterbacks aren't necessarily that great at that rookie quarterbacks where they go from slow to fast and then back to slow and then to fast. And he's doing that. He's going to his third read. And it's those things you see.

you don't normally see from a rookie quarterback he just seems very together into performing. It had two turnovers too, so it's not like it was a perfect game form by any means. But man, if I was a Giants fan, I'd be excited.

Real quick, I'm kind of in the same boat as you guys that I think the bills could surprise people this year, especially if Josh Allen develops and he looked good against the Panthers and keep an eye out on Cole Beasley. PPR leagues. You forget about that guy? but they have they've been targeted he's been targeted six times in the two preseason games

six catches for about 70 yards that could be a nice combo I'm treating this like the preseason in my own farm team and I'm trying to get Jim Miller a job the game analyst for the Chicago Bears he's also on Sirius XM NFL radio former Bears and Steelers quarterback this guy is fantastic pleasure voice well informed he's got a genial personality he knows the quarterback position inside and out. He is better. He's like tuning into a game at like Lambeau Field or Mile High. The ambiance is just better

when Jim Miller is involved. He's better than all but three or four guys nationally. I'll stand for Brian Baldinger. Obviously anyone that loves football, if you're watching his tapework and his breakdowns, they're awesome. They're brief enough where you can catch a few of them like the day after the games.

And I thought that he appropriately shredded what he saw from the Detroit Lions in their last outing. And you go, and you can just go, I'll let you go watch it, but he sort of goes case by case on four or five players that look completely like they are out to lunch. And there are players on the ground, wide receivers getting hit in the back of the head because they didn't even know the ball's coming their way.

And I realize it's the preseason, but they've got Josh Johnson in there running bizarre college scheme stuff that will never be used again with Matthew Stafford. And I just enjoyed his rant. I have questions about the lions. I've had for a long time. Where is your identity?

What is your identity? And he just went into him and I kind of liked it. That's part of where you're sitting all your starters in the preseason and this is what happens sometimes. You lose your pretty weak backup quarterback, Tom Savage. You sign Josh Johnson. You refuse to play Matthew Stafford. So they played Josh Johnson three days after he signed in a preseason game.

It made him play like most of the game. Kind of like it's a redskins and you're charging full price for those games. Give me a break. At least they could block somebody in that game. Nine sacks in the first game against the Patriots that did pass-protect better. Well, yeah. Give them that.

Good positive note. The Lions are just wasting everyone's time with this preseason. But that's true of several teams. All right. Good job, guys. Good analysis. Real pros, pros. Let's move on.

All right, it's time to welcome a very special guest. Last time he was on the show, he was in the studio. This time we have to settle for the phone. But we're very excited to have him. he is a former general manager he's got three Super Bowl rings you kidding me three Super Bowl rings well we got one it's uh we put that one in a back closet because we lost that one but we got three winners and one and two there you go there you go and now you know the voice now he works for NFL network as an analyst charlie castle welcome back

to the around the NFL podcast hey it's an honor to be with you guys excited about it yes absolutely charlie um it's great to have you on because you're on fire you got a lot of things you want to talk about and and we want to talk about them with you so we we want to get right to it and talk a little bit about the dallas cowboys a topic that obviously will always have a lot of intrigue here uh the america's team angle and all that and they have what they have a tricky situation as a former gm uh charlie when you look at the situation of course zeke holding out dac wants money reportedly 40 million and marie cooper wants his money how do you play this put us put us in the GM shoes here well I think in what the cowboys have done I would have done

the same thing they've given them all really good offers um Mari Cooper uh somewhere I my guess is somewhere to 17 to 18 million uh because they say he's in the top five so um I think they did the right thing there now he has one year to go on his contract so if he's not signed and you have the free agent tag you can uh the franchise take the franchise of next year my gut is that thing gets done on DAC I think they've offered him according to reports that I've been able to verify over $30 million now we'll come back to him in a second now Zeke they offered him number two money number two money can be anywhere from between $13 to $14 million they have to understand the cowboys they've never lost the player they

want it Jerry Jones knows how to make a deal but if nobody's going to negotiate with you and you're out of stance still because nobody's doing anything, you're only going to go so far. And you're going to have some room at the end. And remember, now, the general manager there has the backing of the owner. That's crucial because Jerry's the general manager. So he doesn't have to answer to anybody in this thing. That's kind of a unique situation.

So I don't see why the Zique thing doesn't get done at some point. What I was told is he did not have an intention of reporting the training care. The old save your body trick here. Now, he loses the accredited season because he comes in after August. fifth or sixth to where that date is. Well, that is important. The big picture is if he does that next year, he's not a free agent. You only have three credit years.

So this is kind of the one shot to sit out. But again, I think they're close there. To me, that deal has to get done. Now, Dax, here's the unique thing about him. All the quarterback numbers and all the big-time players who are up, the threat of the franchise tag causes them to get a contract, Not their ability. Cousins didn't get $28 million a year because of his ability.

He got it because it became a free agent, but the franchise numbers kept forcing him up. So here's Zach. Dean told me, estimated $29 million if they franchise him next year. If he doesn't do an extension, then it becomes about $35 million. If he gets to the third year, it becomes $51 million. So the agent says for three franchise tags, that's $38. million dollars a year. This is all theory now, okay? But this is what happens. See, the team

will look at two years, 29 and 35 for a 32 million dollar average. Most deals come in somewhere around that two-year average, maybe a little bit more. Now, is this guy worth 30 million dollars? Not my opinion, he isn't. Put him out there in the open market. He's not a 30 million dollar quarterback, but the franchise tag forces you into either signing this guy or finding an alternate. They don't have an alternate. The agency he's working for has a history of saying, let's go play those franchise tags out. What's got to happen here is Dax's got to come in and say to the agent, I want to get this deal done, I want to be a Cowboys, guess what, $30 plus million is enough.

And I think that's kind of what's going to happen. That's my bet. So going back into Cowboys did the right thing, aggressive offers, room to work. Very good, Charlie. I mean, if you had to lose one of these guys, Wes, I mean, Is it conceivable to have all these three, these guys under big contracts? Is it smart business-wise? I mean...

Well, here's your model. See, the Colts were the first one to do this. They had the highest paid quarterback in football anytime he did a contract. Okay, then he had Marvin Harrison, Dwight Freeney, okay, and all of them were big-time contracts. Okay, Edgren James, he was on a rookie contract. He was the fourth guy. It was 40% of their cap. they were able to win consistently and compete for the championship every year.

Patriots didn't exist with Belichick. They would want a bunch of more championships. So the formula is there with a certain percentage of your cap a lot of to your top players. Now, what has to happen here, though, is the offense has to be dynamic. That DeMarcus Lawrence fitting in there, okay? So he's already paid for one pass rusher. Remember, the Colts had Freeney, okay, and they had Mathis, so they had a second pass rusher. So what you have to do is decide you're going to win on offense, rush the passer, and draft well for everybody else, and you won't keep everybody else.

Maybe you keep a couple more. Because the Coast did keep a couple more good players. Have we reached a point where every franchise quarterback expects to become the highest paid quarterback in the NFL when his contract is up? What happened to guys like, let's say, Andy Dalton, or even Kaepernick, you know, five years ago, or Alex Smith? Like there was a second tier, which I believe DAC falls under as a player. What happened to that tier? Is it non-existent anymore? You know, it has eliminated itself, and I don't know if it comes back.

I guess we'll find out if it comes back because you got Marcus Marioti, you got James and Winston. Those guys are in the position, really, of Dak. I mean, they're going to be free agents. The only reason I disagree with you, Charlie, is that I think if DAC actually made the free agent market, he would get $35 million. See, that's the thing with these quarterbacks. You say people aren't worth it, but if they actually got to an open market where there's multiple teams bidding, and I'm with you on not really seeing Dak necessarily as a top 10 quarterback at all, but his numbers are great. The Cowboys are going to pay, they kind of know they're going to pay.

And if he got out there, just the fact that enough teams are missing quarterbacks, someone would pay them the money. You're worth as much as you're going to get. And I do wonder what the next CBA, like that hanging out over these negotiations, what impact that has to. Well, I think on the next CBA, you're going to see a strong push for the owners to have some kind of stronger repercussions about guys under contract not showing up. I think that's going to be high on their list.

Now, you're right. It only takes one team to pay that. When you talk to teams that play the Cowboys, they want the ball in the hands of Dak. They don't want it in the hands of Zeke Elliott. That's the guy that beats him. And Cooper's a good player. There's other Coopers in the league, but they were lacking one. And he has made a difference for him.

All right, Charlie. Let's stick at the category of quarterbacks. And you're what they call a real tape jockey, right? Right, Charlie? You're a guy. You chew up that tape. I don't know. I like it.

No one's ever said that. That nickname. We'll go ahead. Anyway, but you've been watching these rookie quarterbacks, and I'm sure you have some real takes on. We talked about earlier during our news segment about Dwayne Haskins and how the Redskins quarterback situation is shaping up. What have you seen from him through two games? It's kind of a mixed bag.

You see the highlights. You see some deep throws, some big-time arm throws. You see a little bit of everything positive. You see some timing throws. You see him make plays outside the pocket. You see him make some few reads. But then you see everything else. The biggest issue we had in two games is an accuracy, which is his footwork.

His footwork in the first game was not very good at all. It was a little bit better. But he doesn't tend to step through on throws with his front foot. Therefore, sometimes he's coming off the front foot without a step. He's up on his toes and the ball sails. So that's one. you'll see Ms. Reeds, like last week he took a sack when people were open. He bailed on a pocket where people were open.

So it's a combination of inconsistency in all phases. Now, they're giving them the entire offense. They're not trying to find something that he can work with. They're giving them everything, checks with the line, the long verbiage, all right? And they're giving them a lot of playtime. And I think the idea is he's not going to start the season. Okay, at some point what's going to happen, okay, Keaton will start the season. at some point this guy probably will play

and then you've known what he could do and couldn't do in free season now you'll scale it back and zero in on the things he could do for example I think he's only have one or two RPO's I would think he'll get a lot of RPO's if he has to play

speaking of guys that would be a dynamic in an RPO situation Kyler Murray who's a lot of people are excited about Cliff Kingsbury and Murray and Arizona now he came back to Earth a little bit in the second preseason game definitely was unable to move the ball

and had some issues with the clap snap. Charlie, take us behind the scenes. What are people saying about the clap snap? Is that a real thing to be worried about for a rookie? I haven't called the NFL to get their version of it. I guess it wasn't an issue when the officials came into practice. It wasn't an issue in week one. It was an issue in week two and how it was interpreted.

When you read the rule, it sounds like it's totally an interpretation of what they see on the field. What I saw was in the first game was not, I didn't study everyone, but clap, snap, clap, snap. Well, you don't think the defense gets against that. So we'll have to see how they interpret it. You don't know anything to me about this guy in two games for this reason. Number one, I don't think they're running the offensive you're going to see. In week one, men, every one of you could have been five out of six throwing a football.

No doubt. Now I'm telling you, you could have. How about six out of six? Well, you see, he was six out of six Because the guy's got out of bounds That's true Get those feet down What he made

It was outside the pocket Now you go to week two Still, to me They're not running the offense That we're going to see The one that he knows You got a lot of blitzing this week They weren't ready for the blitz

Okay, now he had two good plays Versus pressure He missed some deep throws I thought he was affected by the rush He was inaccurate on a bootleg He bailed with pressure And we had an open receiver So it was not

a good performance at all. But again, I don't think there was, there's obviously no game planning, and I'm not sure this is the offense we're going to see. Let's put you on the spot then. This isn't the offense we're going to see. Is Kyler Murray more likely to do what RG3 and Kyle Shanahan did to the NFL early in the season? Or is that team so talent deficient that they're likely to struggle coming out of the gates?

It's a great question because your second half of it is the appendix, it about, you know, they can't stop the run so people can play ball control and keep them on the bench. And it'd be interesting because they're playing, the first two games of Detroit, Patricia's a good coordinator, and then you go to Baltimore, Martindale's a good coordinator. When I talk about talent, now we're talking about coordinator, because you're going to have to come out and defend something that you're really not sure what you're going to defend.

Baltimore has an edge because at least they'll have some film. And so that's going to be. thing there. I'm excited. I'm more excited to watch them on opening day than any game in the league. Just to see what happens. And I don't have a feel how it's going to go. I really don't. Charlie, this is going to

be, this is going to sound sick. But my colleague, to my right, Greg Rosenthal, for half of his life, his favorite team, the Patriots, has had Tom Brady carving up the NFL winning rings. It's a disgrace if you ask me, Charlie, to have that embarrassment of Richards. And then, you know,

you and I are going back forth in the email before the figuring out what we're going to be talking about. And you got all these positive notes on Jared Stidham? No, Charlie, I can't have another good Patriots quarterback. We need a decade of stink coming from that positional room. You know what? I'm saying, okay, why do Stidim? Well, this guy's important.

Brady's 42, going on 32. Looks like he's 22. Yeah, that's not suspicious at all, by the way, Charlie. Yeah, you're right. There is something. in a joking matter now You could joke I mean the guy doesn't make top dollar

And he's 42 and he's still beating people What? It's something here now anyway Hey He knows his nickname's Joe Hardy Look at that one up for you okay Now that's a joke now Okay Joe Hardy

All right wrote it down All right Google that You'll be interested in research Joe Hardy But anyway And it's a joke sports fans all right So here's the thing It's not to be taken seriously Brady's a good man

He wouldn't do it But here's the thing, with Stittem. Brady doesn't have a contractman next year, which nobody's taking that seriously, because Phil he'll be back with the Patriots, but you never know. But somehow they've got to have a guy to replace this guy at some point, and Stidham's a rookie. So by the time Brady is 45, see, this guy will have some experience. But I was excited about, I didn't know what I was going to see.

See, in college he had talent to throw, but the pressure killed him. This guy was not good versus pressure. I hadn't had a lot of pressure in New England. First week, a little conservative, but really played well. I did a social post on it. He had Brady feet out. Brady bounces in the pocket and he never goes anywhere and nobody ever touches him because he's got great sense.

This guy kind of looked the same. So he's made good decisions. He's been accurate with the football. So I've been impressed with the guy. Now, the guy had two interceptions that were dropped, okay, last week. So the stats are a little deceiving. But overall, poise, accuracy, seems to understand the offense. It's been a surprise to me.

Well, Greg is in here pumping his fist. This concerns me that it would be sort of a Brett Favre to Aaron Rogers type of stuff, but too early to tell, I'd imagine. Before you let you go, Charlie, last thing. You were a member of the Competition Committee for eight years. Yes. And this pass interference rule, which we've talked about on the show, there seems to be some type of internal power struggle, at least from where we're sitting, where, you know, the owners passed this rule after, you know, the trauma of the NFC title game. And now the officials, the way they're officiating it so far in the preseason, there's an obvious disconnect here. What have your takeaways been?

And if you were still on the competition committee, knowing what you know now, midway through August, would you have gotten behind this? Here's what would have happened. I was the most liberal guy on the committee. I was yes on every instant replay voter. I didn't even hear the question. I voted yes, okay? That's be liberal now. The opposite of Mike Brown.

Mike and I just cancel each other out every year It was like Samuel Jackson and Bruce Wilson Unbreakable There had to be each side of the spectrum All right If you want to talk history In the national football

Get him on He'll never come on But he's a tremendous historian And he's a tremendous person Now here's the thing I would have been liberal And then I saw the tape That we saw

At our NFL Network Summit And I sat there and said, and I sent a text to somebody at a high level at the NFL, I said, this is a mess, okay? It is. I would never have voted for it. The obvious one is obvious.

Now, we were always told one play does not change a rule. You have to have a history of it. And as I sat there, and I remember, I know how they think. And I saw that, and I said, no, that's it. And Alan, I couldn't agree on it, right?

He's saying, no, that's the other one. Well, the way the committee works is, we would sit there and vote on these things. And if we were getting 7-1-8-0, which that's what it would take to change something, then we would change it and tell the officials that are officiating, this is how you're calling it based on what we see. Now, a lot of times there was a disconnect because the officials don't want to take that advice. Here's what I see happen.

Number one, I'd never have this because there's too many what-ifs in it. It's not clear, okay? I think they're going to go with the clear one and everything else they're going to stay in line. and they're going to stay where it is. That's my gut on this thing. That's what I think they've been told to do. I don't know that's going to happen. It's going to vary from crew.

One last thing on it. The Redskin game last week. Now, I'm watching it on television, like all of us would. Again, there's a call, offensive pass interference. The replay shows the receiver coming back for the ball. Okay? Nothing wrong with that. However, the flag was thrown on 20 yards of head of it.

The TV crew doesn't know that, and there's no coverage on the TV copy to show it so they can't overturn it. So they say the call holds, and everybody on television is confused. You know, I texted the league, and the league cleared it up, but I wasn't on television. So here's something as a coach. I see this. I think that's a penalty against my player coming back. I sort of flag. Well, guess what?

It's not. There's something on air. So they lose the call there. To me, there's too many ones that you can't be sure on that the official is going to see it the same way. I would never have voted for this, and I was a liberal. All right. And I proposed it, too. Charlie, all right, Joe Hardy, who's Joe Hardy?

He's from the Hardy Boys, right, Charlie? Oh, my God. Come on, you guys. What, what, okay, what, you have any Yankee fans there. Yeah, some of the damn Yankees, but I'm not familiar with that, that play. Great play. It's from, it's from damn Yankees. Joe Hardy's a Washington

Senator fan. The senators are in last place. The devil comes to him and says I can give you the pennant, Joe. Tell your soul to me. He sells his soul and then Joe Hardy turns into this young guy

nobody ever heard of, walks out of the sticks like the field of dreams in Iowa and all of a sudden starts hitting home runs and drives the senators all the way and this is what I don't remember the punchline. is he's rounding third base what I guess the home run to put up in the World Series, and all of a sudden he turns into Joe Hardy again.

Okay, the old guy sitting in the chair, drinking a beer, watching the game. And I don't know how it ends. The old devil hasn't caught up to Tom yet. Wait, so who's Joe Hardy? Jared Stidham or Tom Brady? Brady. I hope Brady was just Brady and Stidham is Joe Hardy. We got another 20 years.

Oh, stop it. This is a joke, okay? Tom Brady's a good family Christian man, I'm sure. Charlie has to say that. I don't. Okay, so you choose which side you want to believe. Charlie Castley, you're the man, NFL network. Follow him on Twitter.

What does that Twitter handle again, Charlie? Bad host. That's Charlie Cassily and Charlie's L-E-Y. There you go. Strong Instagram game as well. Charlie gets it. Bottom line. All right, thank you, man.

Thank you. See you, see you. See you. I was in the weeds there on Joe Hardy. I got to be honest with you, but it makes a lot of sense to me. There's no one like, Charlie. That, I mean, to me, when he said sports fans, that was my favorite.

Yes. Yeah, you see, sports fans? He keeps certain things alive. Like my uncle Bill, who would come to family parties and we'd be shooting hoops in my driveway, and he'd come out and hit 10 out of 10 underhanded free throws. Like, there are people like Charlie that are keeping things alive. And one of them is Joe Hardy references. saying things like sports fans see and we love having trouble

and Wes by the way you are correct one of the hardy one of the boys sleuths or the Hardy Boys was Joe Hardy also I'm not saying the broad-shouldered one yeah it was also an entrepreneur and the founder and CEO of 84 lumber company I didn't know I had to go back further even than the Hardy Boys Charlie's reference

finally we found somebody on the show deeper reference to us I feel about him the same way I feel about how confused we are Dennis Miller announcing. Yes, I get your reference. Yeah, baby, cha-cha. All right, we'll be back on Wednesday.

And remember Wednesday is yes. And we got a big fish. We got a huge fish. Real among, come on in. Evan Silva is getting in the boat, formerly of Roto World, now of Establish the Run, which is a hot new website and multimedia project. That is a concerning sound effect that we've incorporated. That is a real.

I get what it is. I feel like you're disconnected from the future. And if people don't, like, and people only know Evan through his Twitter account, I mean, he is a real big fish. Just physically, maybe the largest man writing about football in these entire United States. And arguably, he's like Nate Solder. Oh, yeah. He's like Nate Solder. I think his breadth of knowledge is up there with everyone.

He's got his hand in college football, the draft, analytics, fantasy football. DFS, tape watching, gambling. So when we have our annual fantasy extravaganza, we get the biggest fish in the boat. So we'll have Evan on the show Wednesday. Excited about that. So with all your drafts coming up, be excited. And a return, of course, to Mark's Fantasy Corner, which I understand there's been some gentrification. You know, listen, I can't control the way neighborhoods grow and evolve, but there has been some changes.

All right. Well, we'll get to that, I'm sure, on Wednesday as well. All right. We should all raid Sully's closet for our favorite fishing shirt in advance of the show. Absolutely. We miss you, Sully. All right, let's go. This is Dan Hansa signing off for Quiet Storm, the mailman, the old boss, Rick Hollywood behind the glass.

Thanks again to Charlie Casserly. Can you not? What? Rick. Till Wednesday. I was wondering how long that would take. This is an I-heart podcast.