NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Raiders-Lions MNF Recap

Episode Date: October 31, 2023

In a virtual room full of heroes - Dan Hanzus, Gregg Rosenthal, and Marc Sessler recap the Week 8 Monday Night Football matchup between the Raiders and Lions. The heroes start the show by discussing the Raiders play in the game (01:30) followed by how the Lions played in the game (11:08). The heroes wrap up the show by acknowledging the Lions progression to this point (22:20) and discussing the state of the Raiders organization and what they want for Davante Adams (24:30).  Note: time codes approximate.NFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. I've been Johnson and how he teaches each receiver to run route. They put two seconds back on the clock. Here he is. The rookie Leporta and the Lions have their first touchdown of the night. Second down in six. Doff started to his left and he picked, intercepted by Marcus Peters, able to stay in.

He's gone. I see no flags. Touchdown Raiders. Seventy four yards on the return and the Raiders are back in the ball game. Dan Skipper comes in at left guard as they hand to Gibbs. And Gibbs breaks it. Touchdown. What a night for the rookie. Wow. Yes, it was the Jamir Gibbs breakout game for the Detroit lines, the rookie running back, went off for a buck 52, and yes, that touchdown were an incredibly well-built woman lifted him into the stands without any sweat at all. Maybe we'll get to that a little bit later. That was incredible feat of strength by that woman.

The Detroit Lions put a hammering on the Raiders, and the final score, 26, 14 doesn't quite reflect what happened in this game, a game in which the Lions' offense was on the field virtually the whole game. And when Jimmy G. and the Raiders offense was on the field, it was carnage and complete ineffectiveness. So you have two teams going in two different directions. Dan Hansis, Greg Rosenthal, Mark Sessler. Greg, this is good for the Lions, obviously, after the humbling at the hands of the Ravens. This was a nice get-well opponent. Raiders are going to do that a lot for people down the stretch, I think. I know.

The Raiders are three and five, and yet they feel like a one-in-seven team. But tonight was about the Lions getting a Monday night game for the first time in five years and completely dominating. I was thinking about how Dan Campbell said before last week's game that his models of what he wanted the Lions to be like were the Ravens and the Steelers. And then I was thinking about this game. And I was like, well, this kind of reminded me of the 20-23 Ravens. You can see everything.

It's right there to be one of the best teams in the NFL. The defensive line just got after Jimmy G. At the very end of this game, you're able to develop these rookies. Sam Leporta and Jemir Gibbs are great stories for the first half of their season. And Gibbs going, what, over 190 or 89 yards from scrimmage, including five guys. You're seeing all the good things. But they just kept suiting themselves in the foot. They were terrible in the red zone.

You had the Jared Goff pick six. You had the fumble inside the five. You're settling for short field goals. And so there was just enough of like, come on, let's just put this game away to frustrate you. But looking big picture with all their injuries, ultimately, I take the positive that it's like you're on the field with another NFL team. You're so clearly better than them that you can play with your food a little bit and you can still win comfortably. They remind me of the strangely, I was thinking about this, of the 1991. Cowboys, which was the year before they won the Super Bowl.

They, they, they, you know, with no, with no, uh, they went to the playoffs, no apologies. They, they deserved to go, and they looked like that kind of a team. Um, they had their ups and downs. They were learning how to win. They had a couple, like, tough losses during that season two and some controversy. But I look at a game like tonight, they rolled 486 yards and the Raiders who are a punchless opponent had 157.

And you have young players showing up all over the roster, left and right, if you're the Lions. And I just look at the two teams and how they've chosen to rebuild over the last couple of years. And there's such a dark and deep contrast. And I cannot think of a fan base that comes at me harder than the Raiders fan base because of what I say on the show sometimes

and what I've said even in the offseason. And I stick to it harder than any time ever in my life because... Take your victory lap, Mark. Sessler Settling scores. I mean, I don't mind it. You were right. You were going through the AFC teams that weren't going to be any better than the Raider that would be better than the Raiders.

Yeah. And you know what? It's like I think, like, I'll say what Wes used to say was like, what would a Raiders fan want? Like, do you want what you have and you want to fight someone saying that they see inequality and problems like they've they seem like a lost force to me like what is the plan well like if you well no sorry but i just i mean i like i we're two years into this and i see no direction and like um not to just go negative on the on the raiders this is more about a lion story this is more about the rebuilding project of the lions and they well let's say you went to the raiders mark so let's

stay at the raiders for a second so i think it's interesting the way you set that up in that the Lions did tear it down and the Lions, you know, and it took a long time and it's been Lions fans know it. You heard the way that building was going nuts because like Greg said, it's been five years since a Monday night game and the energy in there that is such a great passionate fan base. The Raiders are a team that while the Lions, with the exception of having goth there and he's turned into this pleasant surprise, I don't think the plan was that he was going to be the long-term QB, but it's just almost turning into that situation. Like the Raiders almost refused to just truly tear it down at this stage.

The fact that they went from Derek Carr and went to Jimmy Garapolo, that always struck me as just kind of an odd move. And they're just almost trying to tread water. But I think a lot of it goes back to Josh McDaniels was a bad hire. It's clear this team doesn't have an identity. The offense is in a rut. And it doesn't help that Garapolo, who is, you know, in a lot of ways, a lot of the things we talk about with Brock Purdy and whether he deserves credit for what he does in Kyle Shanahan's offense.

People are asking the same questions about Jimmy G. And just look at the difference, and I'll use Devante Adams as an example here, Devante Adams, who on successive drives got overthrown when he was all by himself. And it was basically two catches and 98 yards and two touchdowns worth of missed production there. Graspo just airmailing throws out of bounds when one of the best ones, wide receivers of the last 30 years was uncovered and going into the end zone. That game could have been interesting because the lines refuse to close the door. And it just shows like how vulnerable Garoppel looks outside of San Francisco.

And quite frankly, I don't know he's not popular here, but Derek Carr, he kept he kept Devante Adams as a high level player last year when he was in town. They took a big step down to quarterback. The head coach is lost. Max Crosby can't do it alone on defense. It's just a lot. There's a lot to do there. terms of getting things right.

And I think it starts with an actual tear down. And yes, a change at head coach. But the thing is like, I agree. But their version of a tear down is just hiring a new coach. And then they just tear it down again in another couple of years. It's like John Gruden,

I know they won 10 games and he was doing a much better job coaching overall for the Raiders. Although it was his interim head coach that came in and actually won those games in that year but they were they were moving the ball at least they looked like a functional team but there was like no long-term talent there's never any long-term planning there and you can see that still and this the looks on Josh McDaniel's face as early as the first quarter was just like he is just an energy sucker you know we get emails sometimes from our boss to be an energy giver like just looking at McDaniels takes energy away from me even looking at a TV I can't imagine like playing for him

and Garapolo this is by far the worst version of Garapolo. It's not just that he's not in Kyle Shanahan's system he's playing with

an injured back he's holding on to the ball he's just missing open throws he looked old tonight and the first thing he does on the very first play third and long is he tries to run

for a first down and he gets drilled in the back diving for a first down and it's like this guy is tough but it's the reason why he always gets hurt. Like, that's how he heard his ACL was on a play where he basically didn't give up on the play either. And it's a tough situation. They're going to have to think about going to Aiden O'Connell soon because I think like this is pretty untenable. He was asked

about it, by the way. McDaniels said after the game, he didn't think about turning to O'Connell today. It was still a one-score game for a while, according to Victor for Taffer. Yeah, I think it's probably a few weeks away from that. I mean, but why not at this point? But I also think that if you're you're in a tough spot if you're the coach at this point like you're overseeing a sinking ship but like seven targets to devonti adams he catches one for 11 yards um but he dropped the killer one for the second straight week too which is like it's all bad even the good players are playing poorly yeah and like four of their six drives in the first half went for less than seven yards all i'm saying is that in theory if you were the raiders you hired josh mcdaniel and also you fell for

Josh McDaniels because we've seen him when he escapes, you know, Gillette and he becomes a fraud. And like he, so he did it again. And it's like you get him outside of New England and you've got problems. You've got team meetings. You got left and right stuff going on. I just, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Nobody is. Nobody is. I mean, they'll probably trade Renfro tomorrow if I had to guess if anyone's going to get it. I mean, And you also have like Hunter Renfro like falling on multiple early third downs. It's kind of like they can't do anything right. And the defense has played a little better, just a little, but a little better than I would have expected this year on balance.

They've been pretty close to average in general. And the offense is just one of the very worst. And they should not just because it would be good for podcasters across the country and beyond, but they should trade Devante Adams. Like where this team is, where they need to go, they really do need to do a systemic reboot of the whole operation. and Adams is still a supremely talented wide receiver who could put a team over the top and the type of guy that I know we always seem to overvalue these veterans and trades, but I think that guy could absolutely fetch a first round pick. If you're the Raiders, how do you not like think about that if you get a phone call tomorrow

given where you are now? Now, back to the line. So, yeah, the stats tell the story of complete domination. There's a level of frustration to the game as well because they were a little sloppy. You know, Jared Gough threw a terrible pick six to Marcus Peters. Riley Peterson misses a 26-yard field goal. They turn the ball over in the red zone. They have to settle for four other field goals, a couple of them pretty short.

So it wasn't a perfect game, but like you're saying, it is a little bit of just playing with their food type performance. And I think the more important part is, yes, that Jemir Gibbs, who, you know, a draft pick that wasn't overly celebrated, back in April because he wasn't Bijan Robinson, who was the flashiest name in the draft class. And because they cleared out their running back room, which was very productive last year,

it's like, why are we doing that? Well, what you saw from Gibbs today is like an explosive young player and a guy that's going to keep it getting better. And the Sam Laporte's side of things, their tight end, this isn't new. He's been doing this really since week one. He again looked like a young star on the rise. It's just all there.

And can they put it together? when it counts because the division is there. So they're going to win this division. They're going to have a home game. Can they get into that conversation for a lot? If you're a lion's fan, I'm sure they totally agree with you, but they also probably are just like, okay, let's continue to get there. Like I know that's probably going to happen, but we being the lions, haven't actually won a

division in 20 years or won a playoff game in 20 years. So let's enjoy this ride and get there. Even the most pessimistic sports fan. Uh, if you are a Bears fan and you wake up on Tuesday morning, uh, if you're a Lions fan, you wake up Tuesday morning, you're six and two. Uh, and behind you in the standings is the Minnesota Vikings who just lost their quarterback to, uh, an Achilles tear with no one behind them. The Packers who are as sloppy as any operation in the NFC right now and the bears who are totally lost at sea. Oh, you're right. I'm not arguing. Very, very well.

You know how many teams they play with a winning record the rest of the season? One. One. Yeah, they could win. team at Dallas. Like other than that, they have an at Saints and an at Chargers. Those are the three hardest games left with nine games left in the season. So it's set up very well for them to actually compete for the number one overall seed. Can I give you an odd comparison? Because I think they're the kind of team that could beat Dallas, number one.

But during the game. The 91 Cowboys. No, not the 91 Cowboys. Greg, I know you've read these books, Little Women, Pride and Prejudice. I think it's underrated. Pride and Prejudice also. And like these are books where it's like a fleet of sisters, right? And there's like the lead star where like the course the lead star is going to go get the guy.

Tom Wamsbegging as a younger actor in like Pride and Prejudice. But I would say this, the lions are the sturdy like second sister. that gets a totally solid great fortune too. And I'm not sure it's all going to happen for them this year. Wait, so they're Kira Knightley? No, Kira Knightley is like the star. She gets like the main one. But it's like the girl from Gone Girl that like gets a second guy with the rain here.

Their Rosem and Pike. Because when they were younger, though, it almost looked like she was the bigger catch because it's maybe more conventionally. Hey, guys, I don't know what they're talking about either. Don't worry. I know. Well, it's getting, I like this. I like this.

It's getting subjective. But I'm saying they're more the second fiddle. little bit to some of these other you know the eagles but they are in the picture they are viable they are real why are we saying that though they're full of fire too on the inside they're full of fire when you've seen the lions in full flight and even today where they're not in full flight but the damn dangerous and good like why did why did we even see them as so far behind the eagles like i don't i don't i don't i mean i'm so far behind why can't they be the prettiest girl because the because the eagles have fulfilled that journey to show us that they already can get there.

And I still think their DNAs that they can get there. And the Lions are the team that like a week ago are, to me, are like the newer great team that are learning how to be that team. And they got wiped out. That's not the DNA of great teams. And they, that won't happen to them. That will happen to them less and less. And I see them now more and more as a rising force.

I totally believe in them. I think they're totally attractive. But like, they're not the lead horse. Okay, I think it's an interesting question, though, to think about it's, I can't get it's a second show in a row where we're recording later at night from the home. And you just have a totally different even tone to your voice. It's, it's really messing with me. Do I do? I don't, I don't, I don't, I'm what might be my microphone, but like, I'm just saying, like, I don't, I don't need to, I'm not needing to shove them into the number one spot in the NFC, but they're, no, I think it's a good question to ask because why, why wouldn't they be with the Eagles and the 49ers? And a couple of. And a couple. I don't. I don't. I don't. things pop up number one to just be their cornerbacks i think they could make it if someone was going to make a trade for like an adory jackson not like a superstar but just someone that can play some snaps i think the lions would be there they're injured there they've been very injured in general the oh line was injured you saw that tonight golf was under a ton of pressure especially early in this game they'll get

healthier but their cornerbacks but the the biggest answer dan would be other than experience would be are their best players close to as good as the best players of of the best teams. And you got Laporta and Gibbs. These are two rookies that are getting better. You got Montgomery. You got Amon Ross, St. Brown. He's a good player.

You got Hutchinson. You got Branch. You got this nice group. Alim McNeil really made a big fourth down stop early. Good, good player. Are these guys ready? And golf is kind of in that group to level up even a little more. Well, I think that's...

To get closer to the Superstar Club. Not that they'll be superstars, but will they be that level of players? that's why I don't put them quite with those top teams. But I think sometimes you can add it all up and then they can have a magical night and a magical run and it could happen. But that's why. That is a great way to put that, I think. It's funny because I thought you were edging toward, and maybe you were, even if you

didn't say it, like Jared Goff. Like, is he going to be a guy that you could count on to level up? I mean, he's been to a Super Bowl before. We always seem to kind of forget that. But yes, he's part of like the rest of that whole thing. But yes, he would be part of it. But like, yeah, I look at, you know, even I think Jalen Hertz is somebody that I see when we talk about the big teams in the NFC, he, he's a quarter ahead above these other guys. But like, do I think that Dak Prescott is so much more superior to Gop? I don't. I think he, he, maybe I would take Dak if I had a pick one, but I don't think it's that crazy. Brock Purdy, obviously, he's in a little bit of a slump right now, but I think he's a good quarterback. I think Gop is every bit his equal.

And I think you just look around the NFC. There's, I think, but AJ, Debo, Samuel, all, you know, that I understand. But Amon, I mean, look at Amon St. Brown. Like this guy, he's a true number one. They would really help if Jameson Williams turns into a guy for them. But every week, it seems to be one step forward, two steps back. They had some booze when Jameson Williams dropped one. Yeah.

Early. He did make a nice catch later in the game. And then he was also set up for. the most thankless end-around play in the history of football when the second he touched the ball, Max Crosby exploded his body. It was like Randy Johnson's pitch hitting that bird in spring training 20 years ago. Right. Poor Max Crosby.

It was insane. Max Crosby is insane. Like he's not going anywhere, by the way. He's a top 10 defensive player in the entire NFL. He might be below Miles Garrett and Watt in Parsons, but like if he is, if he is, it's barely below. All right, let's stop right there. It'll take a break and then we will continue on.

All right, we're back. Well, you mentioned Max Crosby prior to our, and that break was great. Like, it's great to, I love listening to the ads and taking a real break and just enjoying myself during that time. But like the, so when I went to, I did a long form that you guys. always talk about these long forms they used to do like um it was the the raiders last home game in oakland um and along the sideline you got you had you had your john grudens you had a lot of raiders legends you know hanging out but max crosby's mom was like a an official raiders photographer

down on the sideline with like a massive like scope lens and like all sorts of equipment and couldn't have been a nicer woman and like was so proud of her son and like It always made me think of Max Crosby differently, but then it was like he was a rookie then. And I was like, I don't know what he's going to become. Then it's like he's a superstar now. So that's one thing they've got. They don't got a lot else.

Did you reconnect with Max Crosby's mom for your Mother's Day long form? No, you know what? You know what's so incredible is that it had nothing to do with the Mother's Day long form, but I just continue to connect with moms and mothers all over the place. I mean, you're getting mileage out of this Mother's Day one. We got to bring it back, father's day do a father's day uh sequel i mean i was largely mark just keep talking bud just go what did i do like i'm just telling you the truth like no go i want to go down that mom road a little

bit more i just i don't know i've always i feel like you i was the kind of person that always greg would be this way too i think whenever like you'd be young and like you'd have a paramour young person like like the mom always was like this seems like a relatively safe individual for my uh you rhodosthal the lead singer of delaware the that's greatest like acid proggy moment yeah out there Delaware is like Delaware went out of operation like 18 months into it's you know

it's run so hey don't talk don't talk bad about delaware and yes i do love a little mom energy in this world we need we need more shout out to max crosbie for donating a million dollars to his university tonight they announced there today a million dollars I don't know about, I don't think I would give any, I don't give any money to universities. Universities seem like the last place that need us to donate. Right. It's a borderline, most of them are like borderline criminal organizations, but that's another podcast.

You're talking about Tulane. Yeah, well, yeah, I'm sure, you know, every institution is crooked, but maybe down there it's a little worse. I don't mean crooked. I just mean like they're taking all this money and, you know, you could go to a school for. I get a ton. I get a ton. I get a ton, like everyone else. I guess, of junk mail from my alma mater, Northeastern University.

I've never opened one of the envelopes. Never once. All right. Anything else from this game or anywhere else? The trade deadline is closing in tomorrow afternoon. Well, just from this game, this is one of the reasons why you take Gibbs, by the way, is you're going to have different points of the season where you can't give him 30 touches or 25 like they did a week going to 30 day every week.

But this is why this is the reason to have. have two running backs. Sometimes one's gone and then the other one takes over and then Gibbs is gone and the other one takes over and then they're in better position when they get to the very end. I think the lines have done a nice job on that like throughout the roster. You see they rotate in seven, eight defensive linemen. It's why they've been able to survive injuries. It's a really well-built team. I'm glad they gave Brad Holmes some pop their GM who's done a really nice job on the on the broadcast. And they're a smart team. I notice that they're always very well prepared for situational football doesn't mean that everything ends up going right but i always get on

coaches for clocks and like being ready in the moment they're never scrambling to get that play in they're they're never wondering what they're going to do at fourth and three or fourth and one and they always have a plan for it and i really admire dan campbell and the staff that they have they they're going to be a fun team that's going to have a lot of monday night footballs it's fine and dan this will be far less intellectual than that comment by Greg, but like, um, if we, if you're watching the YouTube, I do think we have the copy of like that extremely strong woman pulling Jemir Gibbs into the stands. Yeah, forget about little women. Let's talk about a jacked woman right now. Like this is a powerful moment for all women. Touchdown. One a night for the rookie. Wow. Look at that. Come back.

Jamir come back I think that woman clearly seemed to be paired up with a gentleman you know next to her at the moment but then she just pulled Jamir Gibbs right in between them couldn't have been more excited

about the entire scenario watch out watch out for what she might join the team or I mean you never know what's going to happen you never know what's going to happen so like just like that you know just clear the runway

Let Mark finish all his thoughts tonight. Go ahead, Mark. No, I'm just saying, like, I thought it was a surprising moment for multiple people. Like, that one little, if you go watch that video, multiple people were surprised by it. Well, that's a great point, Mark. Thank you, Tony Grosie. I think, like, I just think that that's, you know, it was one of my favorite moments of a largely forgettable moment in evening for the Raiders. And Raiders fans don't even just settle down for a little bit.

fair jimmy gropolo said he's pissed he didn't play well quote i have to be smart with the football get the ball out on time we have to keep plugging away there's so much love in that locker room it sucks to have played like that yeah he's had some stinkers in his career and he's been around for a while now but um he was so lost in this game and and there is one even a completion he made uh where you kind of dropped it down sidearm was turning away and he completely to the past but it was clearly just trying to protect himself it seemed like almost i'd never seen him playing with less confidence and my last raiders thought is we're all piling on josh mcdaniels and that's fair because he's really not doing the job there and he hasn't ever done the

job um when he's been given this level of responsibility but dave ziegler is also there he's the general manager i think this is his second year um and you i see what you're saying Greg that yeah you know why tear it down just going to do it again three years and now like but if they don't have the right leadership in place and this is you know just you got to find the right people and it and look at the lines are a perfect example i mean how many times did that organization go through coaches and GMs and quarterbacks and just tear down and tear down until finally there was a setup that that stuck i feel like the raiders fans who are it's a great passionate, loud, rambunctious fan base, they deserve better than what they're getting

right now in this era of Raiders football. And it's been a while now. I mean, this has been a rough, rough 20 years or so now for the Raiders and their fans. I agree. And in that case, you can also point to ownership and wonder if it'll ever change, you know, if certain things stay the same. But it changed with the Lions. They did head it on eventually. And for what it's Worth. The team owner has another team that's won two straight championships in the WMDA. The ACEs. They're back in the Monday Night Football podcast. You know, Mark Davis is killing it with his other team. So I'm with you. It's kind of like a player, a first round pick. That's one thing Josh McDaniels and Bill Belichick were good at with their bad draft picks.

They know when they're bad and they just get rid of them quickly. So I think you're right. I think McDaniels is out this year. I feel like when you keep mentioning the Las Vegas, It's like you're trying to bait me into saying something to get myself in trouble, but I'm not going to do it. I just was pointing out that the ownership is like terrible or curse or thinking that way, but then I was like, well, he literally has one other team that is dominating that sport. So maybe just needs to hit on the right guy and it's not Josh McDaniels, that's for sure. Football is completely different than basketball.

By the way, I'm going to get out of here when we hit record as fast as Devante Adams got off that field. I mean, he was sprinting out of there. is fed up he is fed up honestly i i didn't pull that number out of thin air those back-to-back possessions i think it was in the fourth quarter if you added up one was from the two-yard line no safety over top if and he had beaten the the corner he is going for 98 yards and a touchdown and then on the next drive that's from their 40 once again he runs a beautiful route this guy's still an elite player and he just gets uh overthrown again out of the out of bounds now the that one maybe a safety cuts them off and stops them scoring. Maybe, but it's very likely that's

two catches for 98 yards. And all of a sudden, a game that the lines refuse to put away is getting away from them. But Garoppolo just didn't show up. And that's, and that's very frustrating. And even I'm not going to defend McDaniels, but like when the quarterback's missing layups like that, um, everyone's going to look worse. But obviously there's layers to the issues with the Las Vegas right now. I'd say one little quick thing like, like to your point before Derek Carr, for all we think of him like plus and minus, like he and Devante Adams worked a year ago. They worked fine. That's why, that was a large reason why Devante Adams came there along with the money. And the player we just watched on the video on this broadcast here is a

player that does not want to be where he is. He does not want to be there. And this organization needs to figure out how to deal with that situation. And I wonder if it could be dealt with as quickly as tomorrow, but I don't think it will be because they don't figure that stuff out. And it's like, I'm not, I'm not on my previous comments. I'm not trying to kill Raiders fans. I think the Raiders are a great organization historically, but you cannot sit and just rip people that rip the team because this is a mess right now. I just see a mess from all angles. I see a mess. Well, look at, look at the Lions and see Hope. These are the only two teams in the NFL that have not won a division or a playoff game in 20 years. The

lines on the Raiders. So in that way, they're the least successful teams. And one of them has got it right. And that's a good tease mark, because we're going to be back right when trade deadline happens. We are taping another podcast. And that is in about trying to do the math 16 hours, I think. So see you then. Guys. Devote Day Adams had 100 catches for 1,516 yards and 14 touchdowns last year. And now they can't, they can't even get, get him the ball. And I will say to his credit. And you've seen wide receivers, which are a different breed, shut it down or like become malcontents and you could tell that the effort level's not there. I think Adams is a really good teammate and a guy that's giving everything he has. He's just being hung out to dry

by an organization that's just rudderless right now, which is he made the decision to go there. He kind of engineered that whole move. I wonder how he's feeling about that right now. know probably I don't know could a trade happen I guess we'll wait and see all right we will be yes back like Greg said tomorrow and hopefully we have some blockbusters to talk about but I guess you got to come back and find out don't everyone that listens to the show do not get your NFL information from anywhere else just listen to our show like cold Connie Fox joining us it's our Wednesday heed the call This is an I-heart podcast.