NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Sam Darnold Talk With Rotoworld’s Josh Norris & Marc’s USO Trip

Episode Date: April 12, 2018

A room filled with heroes- Dan Hanzus, Gregg Rosenthal, Marc Sessler, Chris Wesseling and Colleen Wolfe- discuss the latest QB rumors leading up to the draft. But first, they welcome back Marc from his trip overseas on the USO tour (2:00); Check in on the latest news, including the rich history of Buck Hill (4:00), Khalil Mack and Aaron Donald contract talk (5:30), Richie Incognito says he’s ‘done’ with football (9:30), Cordarrelle Patterson has interesting things to say about a former teammate (17:00) and changes to the NFL’s Color Rush uniforms (22:00). Marc fields press conference questions about his recent trip (25:00) and Rotoworld’s Josh Norris joins the show for the first installment of “Guys, We Need To Talk About…..” To discuss QB prospect Sam Darnold (34:00).Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Welcome back to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Anzis, and I'm joined by a room. that is just teeming with heroes. They are everywhere. Mark Sessler, back from overseas. Chris Wessling wearing a velvet smoking jacket. Colleen Wolfe, right in the middle of the action. And Greg Rosenthal, to my right, what's up, people?

Hey, Dan. Whoa, big full house. Welcome back, Marky. Thank you. Good to be here. Missed you. You look refreshed. We missed you as well.

You look tan, too. That's from yesterday, sitting in my yard. Not from anywhere else. I'm going to sleep in my yard. What do you think about Wes trying to upstage you with the velvet jacket on your big day back? I mean, Wes is sort of the uptick in Wes's fashion collection has been marvelous in general. So I think it's, I approve it entirely.

I like that. There's something to you right now. I don't know if it's just a little subdued or just a man at peace. But there's. My dog, Mark with his seat. There's something there. Honestly, it was, I was talking to calling before. It was about this morning.

that I did not feel entirely mentally broken from the jet leg. I suffered on the way back. So I'm still crawling out of it. How long was the flight? What are we talking here? The flight was, I mean, I feel like it was in airports and airplanes for like 16 to 17 hours, but it's a nine-hour time split. And there was not a lot of sleep that happened for anyone the night before we left.

And so it was a bit of a rugged departure. Well, put it this way. Carlos Dunlap was going wild that night. Carlos Dunlap is a good guy He could do whatever he wants A little later in the show We are going to Find out more about Mark's

USO trip that took him to Italy And Germany Those two locations, correct? That's the two I have not been to either country But they both seem wonderful And a press conference With Mark Sessler about his USO trip

So get ready for that, Mark I'm going to prepare right now Okay Also today's show we are going to talk about Khalil Mack. He wants to get paid. There was a notable slash controversial

offensive linemen who now still be stepping away from the game. And with the draft now, I don't know, three weeks, three weeks from tomorrow, right? Two weeks. Wait, less than, yeah. Two weeks from tomorrow. Oh, my goodness. We figured we better bone up especially with these big quarterbacks in this draft. So we're going to go through

these big names starting with a discussion on Sam Darnold with Roto World's Josh Norris who I always mistakenly called John Norris, the former MTV Vijay. But no, that is not his name

and I don't think they're related Josh Norris on the show, a former colleague of both Greg and Wess's. That's true. Brick by Brick. And a colleague of Kay Adams. Okay. NBC's own former NBC employee, Kay Adams as well, now an NFL network employee.

Was on good morning football yesterday, Josh. But I would assume this would be a much bigger platform landing spot for him in his mind. Okay. But before we get to that and we get to Josh, we will do some news. Oh, it's good to have the team back together. Let's go, Lindsay. Tom, the history is very rich here. No, no.

What that heck? Man, what the... No! This is an outrage. I can't curse, and this is awful. Why are you so offended by it? Wait, one more time. No, no, no, no.

A normal club, let's hear it. Nobody needs that again. Well, we couldn't hear it because you were just yapping over it. One more time. Tom, the history is very rich here. Buckhills. I'm going to get it, Tom. I hate you.

That, of course, is Colleen in her younger years when she was employee for the Pocono. Stop. Damn it, Lindsay. No more. I should say... The Pocono what? The Pocono Tourism Board.

Let's look it up on YouTube. You can find this online. Yeah, that's great. These are the skeletons that I have. I tweeted out. I did get a text from your husband, Gonso, privately, encouraging any more to talk about it. Really?

Yeah, he encouraged it fully. That's the only reason this happened, really. There will be an inquisition as soon as I get home. Like this is a room full of people, probably almost a nation full of people, that know so little about Buckhill Country Club. How is they going to find out? I hate you guys. All right, let's get into the news.

Nice course thing. Very scenic. Got to love the Poconos. The history is very rich here. I'm going to leave. I'm not doing the after the minute hit. I'm not doing the rest of the podcast. Did I tell you, Liz?

Did I tell you he was going to fire her up? I told you. All right, here we go. Raiders pass rush for Kalil Mack, a no show this week for the start of the Raiders voluntary workouts. A guy wants his money. He's slated to earn $13.8 million under the fifth year option of his rookie pact. He wants a big time deal.

He wants to get paid like a quarterback, Chris Wessling. Do you think Khalil Mack is that level of player, 65 million in guarantees that type of guy? Yes or no? First, nice use of pact. I like it when you just reached. straight from the copy. Yeah.

You're in here packed. Actually, when you have to do contract for the third or fourth time in the story, you've got to go packed. Deal, contract packed. You've got to throw them all in there. I don't think he's quite on Von Miller's level, and Greg might disagree with me. Raiders fans might disagree with me.

But I think Von Miller's the better player, and $65 million seems like a good amount because it's a little bit less than Von Miller, who signed two years ago. That makes sense to me. I fully expect Aaron Donald to get more than Cleo Mac or Von Miller. Isn't Von Miller maybe a little overpaid? No.

No, I totally agree with you. I think Von Miller, I don't know if he can be underrated because everyone knows Von Miller is great, but I think he is the top at that position and clearly the top. And he does it year after year. There was a thought that maybe Aaron Donald's going to wait for this contract to come out because he is clearly, I would say, worth more than Cleo Mac. And if the Raiders happen to be handed out money to players like they did to John Gruden, and they could set a pretty high bar for Donald to follow.

It's an interesting test for Gruden to deal with all of a sudden, and he's made a lot of changes to that team that, I don't know, I look at it and sort of say, hard for me to totally figure out what you're doing with the Raiders, John Gruden, and now you've got to give this guy some cash. Yeah, and Khalil's their most consistent player. I mean, he deserves it. I think you're right, Wes, when you say, like the 65,

it's right below what Von Miller got. But it's interesting because I think back to the Donald Penn deal, the holdout last year, that happened. So I'm just wondering when exactly they'll get this done. In other contract news, Aaron Donald, the stud defensive lineman for the Los Angeles Rams with all these different moves that the Rams

have been doing this offseason, I guess there was some thought that, oh, if they forgot about Aaron Donald? They made it very clear. Donald's still in the plans. Less need assured reporters last week that a deal had been budgeted and appearing on the Monday morning quarterback podcast with Peter King, Sneed acknowledged Donald can make more money than Indomacan Sioux and become the league's highest paid defender of all time.

Wes, again, you're like writing this copy, so I'm going to set you up. I think it was the only one working Tuesday when all this was coming through. But yeah, I had to go mine for some news. It's called the Kevin Patra role. Yeah, basically. Yeah, make up some news. But I was listening to the podcast and heard Les Neek casually referenced it, that Aaron Donald is, is on the verge of becoming the highest paid player in football.

So the Rams sounds like already have that budgeted in. It's just how much he's going to get paid as the highest paid player or defensive player in football. You go to over the cap and they have about $260,000 in Capram. That is the worst in the NFL right now, if that's where it is. I wrote about that they have this really long to-do list today. And I'm a little confused how confident Sneed is that, oh, we've got it all budgeted.

we're going to get it all done. I guess what it means is they're going to push money into the future and lower their numbers, which is you don't want to go crazy doing that because they have Aaron Donald, Lamarcus Joyner, and who else is coming up next year, Brandon Cooks, all at one time.

And then the year after that, you have Todd Gurley and Marcus Peters and two starting offensive line. It's like a lot of people, and they've said they're pretty confident they're going to sign almost all of them long-term. They can't all get long-term contracts. Maybe Peters is a guy they wait on for a while.

As snug as they are against the cap right now, I've seen multiple places that next year they have very little divided to the cap. You can push it to the future. Yeah, he's slated to make $6.9 million this year. But, I mean, Sue is making double. He's watching these guys who to leave, like cooks, the guys that they just brought in. Obviously, they have to get something done quick.

You can't make him make half as much money as the Dominican Sue when And you're lining up next to him. Just can't. Moving on. Richie Incognito says he's done with football. It was first reported by the Associated Press on Tuesday that Incognito was going to retire. And then to Vic Carucci, who is plugged in up in Western New York, Incognito had this to say, I'm done. That's it.

It's been a long career. Went to the doctor. My liver and kidneys are shutting down. The stress is killing me. It's just about doing what's right. said it in this cadence as well. I just want to be in the Hall of Fame. I was a bit of a non-sequitur at the end.

Which Hall of Fame? Richie Incognito. Obviously had some great... Western New York Hall. Yeah, had some great moments on the field in Buffalo. He became a Pro Bowl guy after all the controversy with Jonathan Martin and Bulligate. Was it Bulligate? Was that what it was, Mark?

Essentially. But was that what it was called? I've seen it that way today, even in print, when I found this... But kind of a career that you could look at it in a couple different ways. I thought he played well for the Bills, multiple pro bowlers. They also lost Eric Wood, so they have to figure out what to do. And Corny Glenn. Right, along their line.

They have some issues. But I think he was, he said that it basically pissed him the F off when the bills asked him to take a pay cut. But then on top of it, this kidney liver thing, he basically said that he's been eating so much high carbohydrate, high protein. food nonstop for years that the internal body is shutting down and it's like enough

maybe start to round out the diet just a bit and become a nicer Richie. I wonder if that's a I don't know. That I guess makes sense but I haven't heard that before with these big beefy guys. You see look at our friend

Sean O'Hara perfect example when he was in the giant with the giants he was a beefy lineman and then within 18 months of retiring he was skinnier than most people at this office and you see how the diet changes i wonder if that's something that's kind of under the radar people don't talk about the damage it does one of the guys actually that works in the studio one of the audio guys he used to play offensive linemen and he showed and i didn't believe him based on the way that he looks now and he

showed me a picture of what he looked like when he played and he was like it was so hard to keep the weight on it was so difficult all i just had to eat all the time oh i hate him I didn't think you consider Sean O'Hara a friend. Like, Colleen's worked with him and stuff, but... Did I say friend? Yeah, our friend. We have had a couple great chats with him. Remember when we did the pick of shown, talked with Sean O'Hara friend?

The answer is, your answer, Greg, is yes, he's my best friend. Football is family, Greg, come on. But I don't know, I don't know, this is, I don't want to give Richie Incognito too much, you know, airtime or like a career retrospective. Because I think this seems like some strange financial thing that he's going to wind up. playing anyways. Florio, my old boss of Pro Football Tuck, wrote an article that he refused to take the pay cut initially, and then he signed a new deal, and now he's actually, in theory, going to have to give back $2.15 million to the bills because of this new contract he signed, whereas if he had just said, no, I'm retiring, or I'm just cut me a couple weeks ago, he wouldn't

have had to pay back all that money. And I saw Sports Illustrated, said that Incognito was strongly considering retiring but might return for a final season in 2018 at the right price. Right. And he just fired his in. Come on. Seems a little scattered. Seems like a guy you can take him at his word. LaShawn McCoy had this to say on Instagram. Wait, wait. No. Wood and you?

Listen, 1500 yards. I'll give you 300K. Cash. My favorite white boy ever. Can't retire. L.O.L. laugh out loud love you dog is that the cadence he said it yes there we go two peas in a creep pod i mean Greg you you put it well on twitter yesterday so there there was a little bit of a you know cuddly uh memories of the richie incognito experience but yeah well yeah there was this whole sort of post bully gate like oh he's not such a bad guy he's actually really hilarious if you get to know him and just the

I think people forget not just the Jonathan Martin stuff but I retweeted something from Pablo Toria ESPN of all the stuff he did to this Japanese trainer that it was in terms of it was a creep if you're not the one who's the object of his

derision I'm sure he's hilarious if you're in on the joke right sounds like a bully he's hilarious aka a bully meat head guy like sophomore year of high school yeah that guy was that guy was a riot working at the gas station now give me break Greg just went there with the gas station.

I'm going to be an adult. You're going to be working at a gas station movie. No offense to any of our listeners who are working at gas stations. Yes, it's very important to have petrol. You need it. Petrol. Cameron Meredith has bound for New Orleans, according to Mark Sessler, an NFL.com, because the Bears have opted not to match the two-year 10 million offer sheet,

the restricted free agent wide receiver, signed last week with the Saints that per rap sheet. feet. So he is heading to the bayou. Meredith was a very productive player last season, 66 catches, almost 900 yards, four touchdowns. But Torres ACL, that was in 2016, excuse me, but then Torres ACL last August, so wiped out his season. Good pickup for the Saints. He's going to do some damage down there in the bayou, right, Mark? I think it probably means bad news for Willie Sneed, who was hanging out there is an RFA that they extended an offer to. And it's like you got Michael Thomas, Ted Ginn.

I like Tommy Lee Lewis a little bit too. And then you throw in Meredith that's clearly, they didn't pay him $5 million plus guaranteed to have him be a total fringe add-on. So I think he's got a roll there. I don't know how the Saints can be confident of who this guy is. I know he impressed a lot of people down the stretch in 2016 before he tore his ACL. That was in a lost season with the rest of the receivers injured, so he was targeted at a higher rate than he will ever be targeted in New Orleans. So I don't know who he is coming off the injury and with those stats in Chicago are kind of inflated. They have Curtis Johnson, the old Tulane coach, who also was the Cameron Meredith's receiver's coach in Chicago. So I think he was pushing for this

move. He supposedly kind of saved Meredith's career in Chicago. And you're right. He's not going to get that many targets, but I can see him having a specific role that they've used for other receivers in this offense. Brandon Coleman, a little bit of some of their deep threats like Devery Henderson. I know Ted Ginn does that. A lot of money be paying for Brandon Coleman. Right. A much, much better version of him. Although he had a ton of targets, like he was a guy, I think, did we do making the leap? We didn't even do it last year, but I remember going back and watching him. Like, I loved Cameron Meredith from the end of that season. He looked like a special difference maker type of player. And from the Bears,

point of view, they just signed Alan Robinson, who's also coming off at ACL, but they, I think the wide receiver position for them now becomes an immediate area of need in terms of the draft. I mean, they had money. They could have kept him if they wanted to. So to Wes's point, I wonder behind the scenes how confident

they are about him raging bad health-wise. They've spent a lot. Gabriel Robinson, so that would have been Kevin White's a wild card. Yeah, they've spent a lot of money there. Connie, you're in the Good Morning Football family. I am. Just Monday. Well, and Saturday. That's pretty cool.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So Corderole Patterson was on Good Morning Football on Wednesday. He is now a member of the Patriots. I don't know if, Mark, you went to Europe. Maybe you're a little behind, but Patterson now a member of the Pats. I caught that. Roto World, the app, which is wonderful, still works overseas.

Pretty sure it happened a little before. It did happen before I left. Just, you know, there's a lot of, you know. But I appreciate the fact that you're correct that a lot of stuff I don't. know what's happening at all. I'm just sort of on the fly here. Isn't it especially once you have kids? The brain is kind of like, or dogs, Connie.

Yeah. The brain is like a hard drive. My dog, Mark would have seen. The brain is like a hard drive. And sometimes to make room, stuff's got to go. You take on all these memories hanging out, partying with Rex and everybody. Maybe. Corderole Patterson is probably the first thing to go.

Anyway, Patterson had this to say when the topic of Marquette King came up, of course, the Raiders punter that was dumped unceremoniously by John Gruden and then signed with the Broncos, said he wanted revenge, and also Marquette King had this to say, the people that work at the Broncos encourage you to be yourself. Well, that led to Bruce Irvin of the Raiders asking to play punt return on that team when the Raiders played Broncos, assumedly to kill Marquette King or maim him somehow.

and now Cordell Patterson had this to say on Good Morning Football. People didn't like him, though. He was just like too much. Yeah, he was like kind of like a diva, but he wasn't. Like he really ain't sure that much, but like he was just, he was crazy, man. He had fun though. You know, I respect him as a person, but he just, he did things a little different. I liked how it started.

People didn't like him. He was kind of a diva. And then ends with, I respect him as a person. Yeah. I think like diva is one of those things you're either all in or you're not. You can't be kind of a diva but not. I guess that's what he's saying. And maybe that when you only go halfway, you just come off as kind of, I guess, a dunce.

Well, remember when. Let's go get some wine, man. Remember when Brandon Lloyd got released because he was a locker room weirdo? Yes. Not that he was a locker room lawyer. He was just a locker room weirdo. It sounds like Marquette King's got a little bit of that in. He can't have that from a punter.

Brandon Lloyd, the first player that Dan interviewed here at NFL.com some years ago. Wow, really? Yes, the first one. And he told me about this hamburger. that would be his favorite hamburger to have ever. Don't look it up in the archives. Definitely not worth it. He was promoting the B. Lloyd's rap album.

I mean, before Lavion Bell came along, B. Lloyd had some bars. I mean, he had it streaming on his website. This is like 2009, 2010, 11. He was doing it. And just having that out there, he was ahead of the game. He was a Trailblazer.

And soon, soon Lavion's album will join Brandon Lloyd's album on the bargain rack, your local thrift star. Ray Lewis's album there? Ray's album, I think, got shelved by Jesus himself. Like, Jesus is like, bro. Can't handle it. Never released?

Can't have it. Can't do it. Gone. Did you break any news, Colleen? I'm sorry, Jay-Z. On Monday on your Good Morning Football appearance? Break any news? Like this Cordarell Patterson type of situation.

Ouch. I mean, just like, what was there a big moment? No, Greg, I don't think I did. Thanks for reminding me. Whatever. Oh, God. On a country club dig? It's just such a serene setting.

Can I just say that Chris, my friend Kristen, who you guys all know, she used to work with me there. That's how we met. At Buck Hill. Yeah. Or for the Poconos Tourism. The production company that did this. And so we will still get drunk and pull up these YouTube videos and watch them.

Well, now many listeners will be doing the same. So have fun, everybody. Unfortunately, there's only three of them that I can find. Three might be enough. If we contact the Poconos Tourism Board, maybe they have some things in the archives that we could dig through. You never know.

They have like their version of NFL films. With just all Connie Fox, early Connie Fox. 75 clowns will be on your front lawn tomorrow. This is how you know that news is fairly slow ahead of the draft. Headline NFL.com and I saw them playing this up pretty hardcore. I think there was even a photo gallery that went live on our site. is NFL's color rush era in danger of fading away. You guys ready for this?

You guys ready? Lay it on us. A little color rush. It's annoying to me. A source informed of the situation told Mikey Garifolo that the uniforms aren't going away completely, but they might no longer be exclusive to Thursday night games. So is it in danger of fate?

I'm confused. I'm reading this for the first time. There are some additional changes that could be coming to the NNN. NFL uniform policy as well, Mikey said. All modifications would have to be approved by the spring readings. Wes, you're a man that tends to not mess with this type of stuff or be interested in it. So I'm curious. Have any thoughts on color?

Let's start with you. Picture what, like, a member of the NCAA committee would think about the color rush uniforms, and that's basically my opinion. Krusty old white man's opinion on color rush. They're hideous, and I'm glad I don't want to see them across many platforms on different days. I want them gone for good. I wish they would do throwback Thursday. I don't understand why they would be good.

Thank you with the throwbacks. Yeah, the main news, I think, was from like a Fox executive, which was basically saying they're no longer going to require team. They're not going to do it like every Thursday and all that. I like the color rush. Give me the throwbacks. What? Throwback Thursday is a perfect idea.

That's fundamentally. Yes. Yep. It's perfect. Everybody would love that. This week's sign. All right. All right.

This week's sign. Colleen is tube drops away from like a mental facility. Yeah, I don't want to... I'm sweating right now. I'm really hot. Let's hold off so she can do the up-to-the-minute hit, please. Yeah, like, honestly, how cool would it be if on a Thursday night game, Jets, Pats in the old Pat Patriot uniforms, Jets in the green with the 80s like a streak of the jet? Let's have some fun.

Let's mix it up. Well, the Browns are trying to, like, completely redo their uniforms because they are hard on the eyes, no doubt. and they're like, oh, we're going to use next season in any way possible to use old uniforms and I thought it would maybe be color rushed. Well, you can't take away options. We can't look at that uniform anymore. Get new stuff in there.

For all these teams, some of these teams, uniforms are utter disasters. Like the conversation around this story on Tuesday combined with the furor over the draft hats that were released, which got a lot of buzz. That was this week's sign that the NFL is king. It's like, oh, yeah, it's a dying sport, but you've got like the most two trending topics on Twitter

are about like uniform and hat changes. Although I would say like this two, three week period leading up to the draft, I wrote about this on my mailbag today, which you could check out at NFL.com slash hansis. Ooh. Let's, if I took over as like the emperor of the NFL, let's just move the draft up. First week of April.

Oh, that would be. This period is annoying. Thank you. It's needless. It's interminable. Let's just move. it up first week of April. I hate it.

I like the break. I feel like the owner's meetings, especially since we went. That's like the end of our season. And we need a little time, like to go to Europe or whatnot. We need a little break. West goes to.

But you just get a long break. I've been here, but it hasn't been crazy. Get a little calmness. And then the draft will be here soon. Coaches won't do it because they'll say half of them haven't even checked out these players. If this was a debate,

Dan just won. Yeah. I mean, it's hideous. This month of just like tearing down prospect. for no reason it's it's hideous get rid of it i can't deal any more mock drafts i don't want to see them i don't care what your mock draft is and i didn't say i didn't say commissioner i said emperor so basically it would be like the draft is now april second figure out your shit just figure it out also emperors don't have the debate right just emperors by fiat well i think if you really look at

the trends going on in the world right now a lot of authoritarian leaders taken over a lot of concern about that. I think you have a chance, Dan. I'm just saying. The climate is right. How about this? You go combine. You're a made for your time.

Combine wraps on what, usually like a Tuesday? Yep. Draft that Thursday. Listen, get your act together. Hey, you want to be a great team? Figure it out over a 48-hour period, which players you like from the combine. It's just one 10-day event, and then everyone's done with it.

See you and see you in August. The owner's meetings that you refer to? We don't need them. Cancel them. That's not necessary. Don't need those. Send me the swag. The free swag.

The bag of goods. but the owner's meetings could be a conference call on a quiet Tuesday. You should definitely run for Emperor. There's no running. Or it's stalled. Or just raise your military and win. Right.

You have to do it within the system. It's like in Hungary, you know, and then eventually suddenly you're the only option that they can vote for. And it's like, hey, I'm a democratically elected leader. I got 100% of the vote. I just want to see the campaign, though. That's what's happening in the news.

Okay. Okay. Now it's time to open up a press conference Mark Sessler at the podium back from his USO trip Mark the floor is yours

first question who's got one? Okay I got one here Mark I saw a lot of pictures of you on social media where you were at dinner and you were drinking and it looked like you were having a good time what was the most bizarre conversation

you had with anyone? Woof, the last night Definitely some conversations got bizarre and a little off the record. But I don't know about bizarre, but listening to Rex Ryan talk for like 20 or 30 minutes where he gets fired up about something. And it's some stuff that I would have to tell you over beers myself. Rex Ryan is an incredible chatter. He had like he mesmerized a table of like five or six people where they were just like staring at him as he was on a riff. He's very good at that.

I got a question. Yes. Rex, in that recorded message that you sent to us, which was well done there, great reporting, did you pick up, did you sense? Did he have any conversations where he really got into how much he misses being a coach and how serious he may be about returning to the game? I think he's been a coach for 30 years,

and I think it's hard for him, came from a coaching family. I got the sense that he does miss it. said that to you guys directly in that message and that came across a couple times. Wes. Considering your creative proclivities as a drinker and Rex Ryan's volatile

nature, was there any thing that happened that had the potential didn't obviously had the potential to sort of blow up into an international incident? There was a lot of, I would say, you know, off when the work day was done, when you'd go from

one place to the next, which happened a couple times, the conversing with people in the streets, because you're walking around with like five or six human giants. I mean, Rex Ryan is huge himself. And Rex Ryan is noticeable. And so constantly getting stopped. No incidents, though. They were all, I thought as the night went on, they got more pleasant to each of these. Oh, I was more referring to whether you were. Oh, no, no, no. No, no, because and he rants about how his, you know, he loved the media a little too much back in 2013. No, no. I, I did. I made a No, I made it very, I made it put a check on myself to keep my act together the best I could. The governor is to the very end, until the very end.

Mark, Mark. All right. Dan, Craig. What is this first grade? You call on people? I mean, this is not a problem. I don't know how it works. Well, tell us more about that last night. Well, the last night we went into. Wait, wait. You're supposed to use the jargon and say, talk about? Talk about last night.

No, I don't know. Talk about that last night. Last night we went, we were finished and it had been a long week. And these guys especially having to sort of, they were almost like, everywhere they went people wanted to take photos with them have them hold babies have them chat about a million things that i think everyone kind of they did an awesome job and when we got to the end we were kind of free the whole group to we have the plane next morning you just go out and have fun we went we went into frankfort which was like an hour 40 minutes or so from where we were and let it rip it was fantastic it was fun time talk about dan talk about mark ingram love mark ingram he's just like

Like, all these guys, none of them knew each other. I'm about marketing. They, none of them knew each other going in, which, like, by 24 hours in was shocking to me because they were all, like, kind of ripping on each other and having fun the way that we would if we went out and hung out in Mark Engelham especially, I just think has, I was told before and he's really going to be like a fun element of this, and it never ended. And it has, it's one thing, the little stuff that we sent out, but him, just in general, was had people rolling.

They're all funny, though. He was easily one of the most entertaining people I've been around. Who is another under the radar one? Under the radar? Latavius Murray is funny. I think all of them, though, Carlos Dunlap is a quieter guy, but an awesome dude. They got a good group. None of them were boring.

They were all kind of like taking their turns, dropping bombs. Hi, hi, Colleen Wolfe from Buckhill. Did you share any appetizers with anyone? That was, I think I had to recover early on because when I kind of mentioned that I was a vegetarian at the first restaurant, I think everyone's just like, please, who is this guy? And these guys can eat, man, they're ordering like appetizers, then a main dinner, and then like a giant fish would come by that they'd carve up and all eat. Like, they can eat and they need, that's part of their off-season. Something tells me you weren't giving like Carlos Dunlap the derisive mocking, you know, comments about how much meat that he was. was eating.

I bet you you kept that quiet. He's like, oh, you guys eating your cow intestines? Nobody got that type of. I kept a lid on that stuff thoroughly. I'll go west. Knowing in the past you're a bit of a free range traveler, you like to go off on your own and explore, was there any little place in Germany or Italy that became a favorite of yours?

Well, we were on the move nonstop, and so I didn't actually personally, I think these guys who are armed with a little bit more cash than I am and a little bit more wherewithal. A little bit more. Yeah, they went off on some little voyages, but not so much for me. What were you doing during that time then? Like when they were on voyages,

like what is Mark Sessler goes? What is it? Greg's the guy that's right on the railing. No, no, I know. It didn't leave it four in the afternoon. They would leave late in late. I'm getting answers. Yeah, there were other people hanging out of this, too.

Did you meet any podcast fans? You know, I did not. I thought that especially in Germany, I thought in, well, I don't know about early, but I thought in Germany that we would, but no, and it was clear that the players and Rex Ryan also had literally no concept of our podcast going in either, so it was quite a footprint.

Two more for Mark, two more for Mark. One more for Mark. Germany or Italy, if you have to go back. I would move to Germany tonight. All right, he's got to go. Would you do it again? Yes, I will do it. He's got to go, guys, he's got to go.

I have a quick one. Yeah, sure. Did you meet any Browns? This is the side, like, you get like the beat report. The side bar. No, I don't think I did. the entire time. They somehow, like a ton of Saints fans, it was all a pretty NFC South heavy group of players,

and those people maybe were the ones that were wearing their jerseys and stuff, but I didn't meet any... I think people that when you leave the country, you probably leave the Browns behind as well. That's shocking because I know they have, like, crazy Brownsbackers bars all over the country. Right, I don't, yeah, I was...

Those have all shuddered. You're right, you're right, so no, it didn't happen. Wow. All right, good presser. And I am looking forward to the over-drinks conversation, Mark. That is the one, that is the one where I really feel like we're going to. Wow. So you're that guarded.

You're like, out of respect for his head coach. I mean, I wasn't there as like some sort of heat-seeking football information, man. I don't want to tear that up now. Shout out to Germany. My dad was born there. My brother is strangely a citizen of Germany. Oh. Also, my family is from Wesleyan, Germany.

That's right down the road from Marx. And I did ask West. I found out that we were like some of the people that you drove. of my family out of the country. That's true. The Germans. We were about an hour from where you grew up with. The history is very much here.

All right. Let's move on. This will be the most important draft like ever. Guys, we need to talk about Sam Darnold. Sam Jarnold. I just said that. Oh, sorry. Six foot three, 220 pounds.

grandson of Dick Hammer, a former Marlboro man and a former Olympian. His name is Sam Darnold, and he could go in the top three. He could go number one. He can go maybe number four, probably not. But it's wide open with Sam Darnold, who is the USC quarterback that about a year ago, Mark, and hopeless Jets fans scam for Sam. and all that. He was the guy that was the clear cut number one, it seemed.

But now it's less clear. Mark, before we get Josh Norris on the phone, I just want to touch base with you get a temperature check because if you go back to the Sam Donald Pro Day, there was a lot of reports out there that Jimmy Haslam was having dinner with the parents and the entire Browns organization had gone to USC. And it seemed in that moment that this was going to be a done deal.

But now, again, there's some. seems to be some murkiness. Do you want Sam Darnold to be their first pick? Josh Allen is getting more buzz right now. But for me, I, like, they, I have like 80 people on their payroll scouting this. Get the right guy, please. You've drafted 12 quarterbacks in this millennium. And it's all been. You don't care who they play. I honestly, because I mean, you know, I trust them to get it right. Just don't, just don't get it wrong. Yeah. It's not like Mark's been out watching. I'm not scouting these guys. But you don't have a preference. Like, you don't, in your mind, you're not like, I would like.

Well, Josh Allen, if nothing else, is going to be more controversial and certainly not as popular a pick with the media. Does that impact you at all? I mean, I think if five weeks into him playing and he's good, it's going to shut everyone up. I just get the right guy, please. Okay. So speaking of Josh Norris, of Rotoworld of NBC Sports, he joins us now on the line. Welcome to the around the NFL podcast, Josh. Hello, beautiful people.

How are you? Wow. I don't know if that's ever happened. That was a nice way to start the conversation. He's clearly never, you know, seen video of the show. Craig, you're beating yourself up a lot today. Just accept the question. Greg is down on his own looks, but I think Craig is a pretty debonair looking guy.

That's how he got the nickname, Cute Boy. Now we're all feeling good about ourselves. Hey, Josh, good to see it. Do that for people. Josh is a, what would be the title? The draft analyst? What is your, I'm a guy who watches football and talks about it. And that's the guy that we want because full disclosure, Josh, we are not college experts.

So we wanted to bring one in. And we're going to go through each of the quarterbacks that are getting the most buzz leading up to April 26. And I guess a good way to start is what is your overall feeling on Sam Darnold, who has been positively connected to an Andrew Luck type talent? Is he that type of guy to you? or much less than that, or maybe more? I would say less. Look, Andrew Luck coming out of school was about as easy as an evaluation as you could find, right?

Sam Darnold's kind of all over the place. If you look and really, when you talk about evaluating quarterbacks, it kind of starts from the bottom and then you work up. Like his footwork is all over the place. Sometimes his feet are pointing in completely different directions. his base is not balanced at all but with that said his arm is an absolute canon and completely compensates for a lot of his you know mechanical and technical deficiencies i'm no coach i don't subscribe to mechanical twitter okay but i i just know that he looks dangerous out there in mechanical twitter playing the quarterback position than a lot of others but once that ball leaves his hand

and it's beautiful. So, again, he's a super young quarterback as well, and I'm sure we'll get into that. But I would not, not put him in the same tier as Andrew Luck. He's got the mechanics issues. He's got a history of turnovers. He's got the history of USC quarterbacks working against him. Obviously, a talented guy.

But why specifically is he – he seems to be rated higher in the minds of most people than Josh Rosen. Why is that? Yeah, I'm not sure if I can tell you. because I have Josh Rosen as the number one quarterback in this class. But if I were to put myself in that position, look, I don't know Josh Rosen at all. And I'm sure you guys have covered this topic a lot. But for some reason, there's like this narrative out there that he might not get along with everyone.

Look, Wes, you know, two people might meet you and they'll obviously have a different opinion. No, everyone likes Wes. That's not. I've had death threats. Maybe that was the wrong example. but again with Sam Donald we go back to it right if he starts in week one

which you won't if he goes to the Browns or any other team really then he'll be the youngest player ever to do so at quarterback isn't that crazy that is crazy but there are as you mentioned I mean he turned the football over or put it on the ground like 25 times

12 fumbles 13 interceptions he only lost nine of those samples but still putting it on the ground is what matters but it's one of those pieces of clay that a team thinks that they can coach up, right, believing in your own coaches. And I guess I could see that he has a higher ceiling than a Josh Rosen, who is a what you see is what you get type playing and play out.

Meanwhile, Darnold is kind of all over the place and create some big, big plays out of absolutely nothing because he does combine mobility with a cannon for an arm. You don't even have him in the top 20. So you don't think Josh Rosen and Sam Darnold are close by that, you know, evaluation Rosen is your number one player. I'm looking at your big board on rotorworld.com. People can check it out. And Darnold is your number two quarterback,

but you have him 21 overall, kind of in a cluster with Mayfield and Lamar Jackson. So that's putting Rosen on a totally different level. I'm guessing is that you just think Darnold has a much bigger sort of boom bust potential? And just to give it a little more context with Josh, once you get to 21 on Josh's big board, you don't even get a blurb anymore.

Yeah, that's true. That's pretty harsh. Was that just like it? Donald doesn't get a blurb. That's calling me out for my work and my work out. That will change very soon. No, what happened is with Josh Rosen, what I see on the field, I don't necessarily see a fatal flaw to his game. Sure, off of it and with the injuries, with the concussions, the shoulder there might be.

But I don't know those things. I don't have a lab coat, right? I'm not a doctor when I go home at night. With Sam Darnold, there are fatal flaws potentially to his game, okay? And it all comes from his base and his tendency to turn the football over because if he kind of continues on this path of being reckless with the football and if his mechanics and his technique kind of allow him to be put into poor situations, there's only so much, again, that your arm can do. It was able to do it in college. And so I'm not saying completely overhaul him. It's honestly, guys, a very similar evaluation to me, like with Patrick Mahomes coming out of school last year.

I'm not sure if that's a comparison you'll hear a lot. But you remember with Mahomes, he was, you know, termed or compared to Brett Farr. It's kind of this gunslinger mentality who you might have to reel in. I'm not sure you have to reel Sam Darnold in as much as you need to work around his flaws and his tendencies. Because, again, I don't think even as hard as you work, you can completely change. the mechanics of a quarterback. I guess I'd ask because John Dorsey was attached to the chief's front office that traded up for Mahomes. And from what little you know about Dorsey, I mean, who do you think that he actually likes here? Is he going to, is this Josh Allen buzz of late? Does that have more credence than Sam Darnold? Or is it all, are they maybe quietly looking at Rosen behind all of this? And there's a lot of nonsense out there trying to get someone to trade up. I really think it comes down to two names. And it comes down. to Josh Allen, it comes down to Sam Darnold. I mean, you guys know how quickly things can

change in a week, right? Like after Sam Darnold's Pro Day, it was basically written in permanent marker by, you know, three prestigious draft analysts that he was going to be the number one pick. Meanwhile, in the past couple days, it's been Josh Allen. I have no idea, and I have no idea why, though, the Browns might lie in this scenario, because since you're at the number one pick and everyone knows you ever take a quarterback, you select the one that's number one your board and you just go from there. But yeah, from his background with drafting Patrick from our homes and moving up for Patch from our homes, either of these quarterbacks may sense, but I easily, easily prefer

Sam Darnold over Josh Allen. Josh, have you noticed his like his throwing motion that he has? He has like a little bit of a looping throwing motion. Have you noticed any of that on tape and how do you think that that will sort of translate? Yeah, you know where it pops up more often is these fumbles, right? Like since he kind of drops it below his waist, it will get knocked out in the pocket and absolutely how he carries his carriage in terms of where he moves the football as he's moving around in the pocket. You know what?

His motion might be elongated, but I would say his release is quick. Yeah, as much as people might want to change that like they did with Tebow, really the only person I've ever seen change their throwing motion is Aaron Rogers. Maybe you guys can correct me on that. And that took, what, multi years of work? And just with quarterbacks now, we don't see them wait and sit that long. So I'm not one who thinks he has to change that because, again, once the ball leaves his hand, the velocity and the placement and accuracy he puts on it at really every level of the field,

it compensates for that kind of loopy, windy throwing motion. I would be much more concerned with his feet that really are like hands on a clock and pointing in completely different directions. It's one of the craziest things I've ever seen in the quarterback. I'm surprised you're not higher on him, Josh, just because it sure seems like he shows some of the things that you can't teach, not just that he can create plays like an Andrew Luck, but that he anticipates, you know, that he goes through his reads pretty quickly.

Like, guys in the NFL don't do that. And what I've seen from him is that he can do that. He reminds me of James Winston coming out a little bit. Not that I watch James Winston. a ton in college, but because of the turnovers, which maybe is just something that is part of your game, and it's still part of James Winston's, but

those are things that you kind of can't teach, and it seemed to me like the USC receivers kind of killed Sam Darnold, that they did him no favors, and he probably would have had a much better season, if not for them. You're absolutely right, and actually a few months ago, record a podcast with Matt

Waldman, who we talked about James Winston in reference to Sam Darnold. And it's, what's interesting with James, though, Greg, and I'm sure all of you can touch on this, what dirt cutter is trying to do with him is reel him in a little bit, right? Like they're trying to prevent him from making these mistakes and wanting him to be more of a game manager rather than kind of riding the wave with him, right? Like, you know he might tank you on a few drives, make some awful mistakes, but at the same time, he's going to hit some home runs, some big time throws that other quarterbacks won't. And Sam Donald, as you said, is exactly the same. This year, as we talked about, he was much more turnover prone, and there are other instances where he acts completely poised, that he sits inside of structure, looks off that first read that's not there, and anticipates a crossing route over the middle.

But then other times that first read is not there, he just completely drops his eyes and moves around. Again, we're talking about a super young quarterback who makes mistakes, and hopefully those mistakes aren't compounded and added on to, and instead. Instead, he can kind of just learn from them and just go to the next nap. Do you think this was a guy, Darnold, and he's not even going to be 21 until June that could have used another year in college, or do you think these same problems probably would have followed him to the draft next season? Yeah, I mean, at some point, there's only so much coaching you can get at the college level. I mean, what's interesting with Darnold is his process is so different even from high school

than a Josh Rosen, right? And if we can talk about them coming out of the same state, Josh Rosen was the top high school recruit coming out of college. Meanwhile, I believe, and I'm not big into high school recruiting, but Sam Darnold was like a three-star recruit, and actually guys played linebacker, I believe, until his junior year of high school. So it's not like he's spent, again, a long time at this position. He reminds me a lot of Tony Romo again and how he moves, and Matt Waldman used this term, but he has like a get-or-done mentality at the quarterback position. All these things can go crazy. And again, it's probably because he hasn't spent a lot of time.

at quarterback, but once it leaves his hands, it's beautiful. Hey, he's just a linebacker playing quarterback. He's a football player. We're going to hear that. How come nobody's coming after, you know, Lamar Jackson catching heat? How come nobody's coming after Darnold that he should be a linebacker? Like, what's that about? I will say this, guys, there is actually a linebacker slash quarterback prospect in this class.

His name is Joel Lannning out of Iowa State and was listed at both positions, but he's just bad at both. So we don't. Oh, wow. Ouch. Sorry, Joe. Sam Darnold and Josh, Dan here. I'm a Jets fan and I was all excited the last 48 hours or so where I'd be like, oh, you know, Donald could be slipping to three and the Jets might fall to the Jets left.

And now you got me all freaking out about this. I can't get comfortable about anything. Bring on the draft. Here we go. You know, Jordan Ronan is a great beat writer for the Giants and he says, if Sam Darno is on the board, he'll be the picket number two. Again, we don't know anything, but it seems like if Darnon's the pick, or on the board, the Giants will select him.

So maybe you won't even have a chance. I would actually be celebrating more that you won't have to draft Josh Allen, okay? Interesting. And did you know, I'll help, Josh, I know you're incredibly knowledgeable, but did you know that Sam Donald's granddad is Dick Hammer?

I bet you didn't. I thought you were going to say Jack Nicholas because we came down that road. All right, Josh Norris, you killed it. Not surprising. Check out Josh's work. follow on Twitter at Josh Norris His stuff on Road to World

Including that big board Maybe With more than 20 names With more than 20 names Check it out Because there aren't many more knowledgeable people In this realm than Josh So thank you for coming on the show buddy

Thanks Josh Thanks everyone Bye bye All right there you go I'm legitimately That spooked me I was getting excited about Donald And now I'm like

I have this sense That it's going to be Darnold to the Jets too Not that we have any idea. You think he would fall past the Giants? Because there's now those whispers out there that the Giants and Bills potentially have a deal in place. Who knows?

Well, there's also out there that the Giants are, they loved their visit with Chubb. I mean, that's why the Emperor's got to come in and move this up, man. Can't take this anymore. What about Josh Rosen? Josh Rosen, you won't you want him? I would like him. I just don't think the Jets are going to.

I think it's going to be Darnold or Mayfield. That's just my gut feeling on it. I think as we go through this with each, of the quarterbacks, though. You're not going to get freaked by each of them, but none of them are pristine perfection. And so when we get to... Rosen might be, though.

It's just this other stuff that is being thrown into it. I don't mind that all... I'm tired of like, oh, a football player actually is smart. Like a ton of these football players are incredibly intelligent. Lay off for Rosen. But none of these guys are the automatic number one pick. Oh, Mark, this is scary. End of the Josh Allen thing.

That's got to spook you. I think the Jets, man, you're going to go get... You're going to go get chub. But I... Yeah, that's what you need. You're a little spooked about this Josh Allen stuff, aren't you? I'm spooked by essentially everything the brand's doing. It's in my bloodstream at this point to be freaked.

Will Brinson, a friend of the show, was on his Pick Six podcast, and we were talking about the one guy, and I don't know college football well, but the one guy that would really scare me was Josh Allen, just because everyone's saying boomer bust, boomer bust, and I just drafted Hackenberg two years ago. So it's like, give me the other three guys. I don't even want to deal with the stress of hoping Josh Allen can play the game. When you go through 1 in 0 and 16, there's no, it doesn't matter anymore.

Just let's just fly on. We're still not buying it. I just can't believe Sakewan is not like not an automatic, like top pick. I feel like the Bradley Chub stuff coming out of the Giants is just a smokescreen. So the Browns automatically go quarterback first. Coming up on Friday, by the way. So that's part one of our quarterback, draft quarterback breakdown. there was a really tremendous piece

on ESPN, the magazine profile Q&A with Josh Rosen of UCLA. Sam Alapur wrote it and Sam will be on the show on Friday to talk about that which Wes did you read the did you get around to that? I did read it. I thought it was fascinating.

Yeah, and I thought it was interesting how Sam clearly was kind of on a good wavelength with Rosen and got a lot of good stuff at him so we could talk to Sam about that conversation. as it moves on. Yeah, and no offense to Mark for the comments you made a minute ago, but a lot of people on Twitter yesterday were saying that, you know, there's other smart football players.

I don't know if I've ever heard or read a football player as smart as Jocker. My point would be that I don't, I get that. I just think that it's, we struggle with the idea that football players are also incredibly creative, intelligent people. And there are other football players that have come along that have been free thinkers. Also, I don't think the job, Rosen is a smart guy. He is, I don't know, I'm not going to go.

I just think that let's lay off the idea that he's an astrophysicist playing football. He's a smart, independent thinker, and that should be welcomed, not create so much chaos. He's a curious thinker, and I think what gets most people is he's authentic. He says what's on his mind, and that's rare in 21st century big time sports where all the money is. And he's a millennial. Do not forget that. I mean, he's going to be playing against other millennials. I don't get that.

This whole draft class. He's a super millennial. I feel like all this whole draft class. They're all millennials. They're all millennials. Okay. So, yeah, we'll be back on Friday talking about Josh Rosen and anything else that's going on in the world of the National Football League. Connie?

I'm excited to listen. Did it again. Thank you. Yeah. See you. The history is very rich here. See you next one. You, Dan.

See you next. Yeah, we'll see. We'll see. All right. Stan Hans is signing off for Quiet Storm, The Mailman, Connie Fox, the old boss. Thank you to Josh Norris. And, of course, to Lindsay Fulton behind the glass.

Till Friday. Hey, everybody. Hey, everybody, Daniel Jeremiah here. And I'm Bucky, Brooks. On Move the Six, we take you inside the game from breaking down college prospects and NFL rookies to evaluating team building philosophies, coaching trends, and how front offices construct winning rosters. We study the tape, talk to decision makers, and give you a perspective you won't find anywhere else. It's everything you need to understand the why

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