NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Top 10 Rookies of the year

Episode Date: December 20, 2016

A room filled with heroes - Dan Hanzus, Marc Sessler, Chris Wesseling,  & Gregg Rosenthal – discuss all the latest news from around the NFL including the latest on the Jaguars' search for a new head coach, and Bill O’Brien announcing that Tom Savage will start at quarterback for the Texans in week 16. Then, the heroes break down their top 10 rookies of 2016 before diving into Marc’s latest long-form piece: “Calling the Game.”Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the NFL podcast. Keep pounding. Welcome back to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hansis, and I am joined by a room filled with heroes. Mark Sessler, Chris Wessling, and Greg Rosenthal. What's up, boys?

Hey, Dan. Woo. Tuesday show. Tuesday show. usually last year anyway we had a nice little secret Santa and I thought oh it's holiday season let's bring back Secret Santa

brought it to the room for the pre-show meeting everybody was like get the out of here no no no no no no no no no no no no no no you brought it to the room about 30 minutes before we started the show we could have done that I thought you were going to save the NFL Christmas is canceled on the around the NFL podcast why can't we give gifts at any time you know that's true plus

Because it's very Christmas specific, the NFL advised us, keep it a little more generic. You know, we're not all Christians here. Is that true that they did that? Are you just making that up? And that is an absolute lie coming from a former management figure. We're not all Christians. Greg, what do you got? Well, I'm not Christian.

Please tell me it would not offend you if we talked about Christmas. No, it would not. Thank you. I'm joking. And I was, you know. I was, I think, making it clear that was a made-up story. What on earth is happening? We are not even two minutes into this debacle of an episode.

I have an update on the old mouser, Mark. Oh, yeah? Well, what is the old mouser? The old mouser is the gift that Mark gave me last year, which was a, what, like a super train. It was an underground train that would allow Wes, you know, it's essentially to take just west, yes. From his home by the sea here, under the... entire United States to Huckapoo's his home tavern on Tybee Island at the expense of liquidating the Baltimore Ravens to pay for it.

It feels like the project would potentially cost more than the Ravens value, but, you know, maybe not. All right, here's an update. I had a tour of SpaceX's facilities in Hawthorne, California here right outside of L.A. Humble brag. Friend Dalia, her husband, is involved with SpaceX, and they are. You say this like anyone knows what SpaceX. Everybody knows what SpaceX is, Greg. Did you?

I never. So Dan didn't. Did Mark? Not, I mean, I don't know exactly what it is. I've heard of SpaceX. About space, I would assume. They send rockets up into space, and they are trying to send 100 people to live on Mars. It is the brainchild of Elon Musk, who is also Tesla. Oh, yeah. But Elon Musk is working on, he wants people to do a hypertube, which is a train that functions the exact same way as the old mouser.

It's like the Concord, except in train form. He's just come up with this idea a year after someone in this studio did. It sounds like your intellectual property. Interesting. So a massive lawsuit with Elon Musk about to break out. Mark Sessler, you're going to have to dip into your coffers to get to lawyer up here. I mean, to bring it around, that was the gift that I gave West during last year's Secret Santa. So at least we've got an update on last year's Secret Santa.

Well, it's not too late. We could, you know, we're taping a show on two more times this week, including Christmas Eve. We could do it on Christmas Eve, that show. Christmas is canceled, Greg. According to Greg. Today's show will feature a myriad of topics related to the NFL. Right off the bat, we're going to dig in on the Monday night football matchup between the Redskins and Panthers before we check in on the news.

Some fallout in Jacksonville after they fired head coach Gus Bradley and a decision at quarterback, both in Jacksonville and in Houston. So get ready for that. We're going to check in on Chris Wessling's top 10 lists. Wes writes bangers week after week. This time he wrote about top 10 rookie of the year candidates on both sides of the ball. Well, 10 total. Oh, 10 total.

I enjoyed the piece. I enjoyed the piece. Which hasn't even been written. Okay. I will enjoy this. Do we still have the Lobreveal Magnifico drop? I can't wait. to read the piece so I can say I loved this piece.

That was what I was trying to get out there. And then speaking of I loved this piece, Mark wrote a banger long form published just today on NFL.com. The name of the piece is The Calls from the Booth. No, it is. What is it called? It is calling the game. NFL.com slash calling the game.

Vanity URL. Mark spoke with. A dozen or so. Play but national play by playmen about the craft. Very interesting oral history look at that business. And we'll talk about Mark's piece at the end of the show. But let us start with the final game of Week 15 played at Monday night in Landover. Which is in Maryland.

Most people don't know that. Washington, the sea. a commonwealth or is it a district it's not a common one okay it is the district it is a district of Columbia yeah anyway he stands for in DC Monday night football the Carolina Panthers with nothing to play for entering the game at five and eight go into Washington and really beat up on the Redskins a really terrible performance by Washington a game that started with Carolina getting a field goal Washington gets even And then the Panthers went up and went up for good late in the first quarter.

Shoot the throw, room and time, leans back, going end zone, caught. Ted Gann, touchdown. Carolina, my goodness. 9 to 6, Carolina, and that was lovely. Well, it was 9-3, who had the call there. Mick Mixen and Eugene Robinson at WBT. The final score, 26 to 15, Chris Wessling. what happened in this game

why did the Redskins not show up it was a sloppy game on their end big mistakes cost them two touchdowns the blown coverage from Dante Wittner on Ted Ginn's 30-yard touchdown Vernon Davis getting blocked into Kirk Cousins by Wes Horton on the first play of the second half gift-wrapted

basically a one-yard touchdown for the Panthers that's 15 points in the game right there and then you had a bunch of drops misthrows from Kirk Cousins. I just thought the Redskins were so sloppy for a team that had everything to play for. A little sloppy from both sides. I thought the Panthers could have won this game by a lot more. I mean, they had chances to put it away over and over,

and they had some big plays that they just missed. But I loved watching Jonathan Stewart. Hasn't had a great year statistically? But when you watch him, he's pretty impressive. And this was kind of a nice game to see this late in his career, that he's still got that juice, I mean, that, lateral movement and running through people. And if you watch the game, you'll remember that 11-yard run,

which was about as good an 11-yard run as anyone's had all season. So it was fun to see a Panthers' offense with a running game again. It reminded me of the old 2015 Panthers. Might have saved him from getting cut in the off-season. Maybe. Maybe not. His first 100-yard game in the year, and he's due $5.5 million with $750K and bonuses entering his age 30 season, and he feels like an older back than 30.

It still feels like a team to me that needs to look at that. position in the offseason but it's kind of like what you waited all year for this from jonathan's and this is if you're a panthers fan well you had a beautiful ride last year that ended poorly but again another reminder to me that this team was very close to figuring it out this season and in another reality not too distant from this one i could see them being eight and six right now and being in a thick of things but they just couldn't like figure things out this year and i think that's how the season will be remembered for them and they they play the bucks and the Falcons the next week.

Actually, the Falcons are this week, bucks in week 17. And this is two convincing performances in a row. I know the Chargers aren't a unbeatable team, but they convincingly beat the Chargers. They convincingly beat the Redskins. And they're going to have a say here. They're a tough out.

And would it surprise anyone in this room if they just win four straight to end the season and kind of go into the offseason feeling good? That is a great point. I think that you have to look at Carolina as a team for all their troubles this year. It is not a team you'd want to deal with at all if you're one of those NFC South clubs trying to get into the playoffs.

The one other takeaway I'd have from looking at Carolina that Sean McDermott, this guy has been on the fringe of getting hired as a head coach year after year, and their defense has not, they struggled early, but we've seen what he's done down the stretch, very good coaching, and we constantly look probably more so to the offensive coordinators as the guy that's going to come in and rescue quarterbacks and stuff. This guy is going to be a head coach maybe within a couple weeks. Let's talk about the Redskins, who 7, 6, and 1 now, they lose a grip on a playoff spot.

Their schedule at Bears next week, and the Bears are on Saturday, I should say. The Bears are a little frisky right now. So I would not say by any stretch. Yeah, by any stretch, should we look past that matchup that they need to get to 8 and 6? And then they close at home against the Giants, which won't be an easy matchup. I mean, Greg, how do you explain the performance of this? this team in what was close to a must-win game. What a stinker to lay at home in prime time this late in the year.

I can't explain it because even their other, you know, shaky or loss lately was in Arizona. The offense was okay in that game. And this is an offensive team. They threw the ball 47 times. You know, Robert Kelly had eight yards on nine carries. They gave up on the running game early and it wasn't a blowout game. And I don't know.

There's something about them in Monday Night Football right now. They're one in 16 in their last month. What? 17 home Monday night football games. How is that possible? It's almost, that goes back, it has to go back to the Jim Zorn days. Wouldn't you say that Jordan Reed

playing through a third degree separated shoulder and Dante Wittner playing major snaps are much bigger factors than Monday night football history? Absolutely, but Wittner's been a problem for them all season. I mean, he has given up big plays all season. Safety's been a problem for them every year. Safety's been an issue every year for the Redskin. And Reed was in and out.

of that game. They were struggling and Kirk Cousins was struggling early in that game before Reed was hurt. I was going to say he was kicked out of the game, wasn't he? Yes. Gordon Reed, come back to us. You're punching a player in the helmet in a key late December game. You got to keep your head together. And I don't know, maybe he's so beat up anyway. Is he really going to be able to help the team in this state? But when you want him on the field, you cannot do that in that spot. Yeah, I don't think he was helping the Redskins at any point in that game. He was, you could see him on almost every time he was involved in a play. He was dragging his arm around.

And this is why I think when we talk about Cousins, and look, it's just one game. Although I think for some Redskins fan, this is kind of the prototype bad Kirk Cousins game. He ends up with 350 yards, but he has two turnovers and, you know, through 47 passes. Two weeks is a long time in the NFL,

or three weeks. If he has a weird couple final weeks, that is going to impact how he's treated this offseason. And you heard Jay Gruden after the game said, you know, what happened with Cousins? He said, I don't know. He wasn't really seeing his reeds out there. And you know, to hear a coach say that about his quarterback who's been in the system a few years.

I think it is, it might be on a much higher scale, the big controversy. Ryan Fitzpatrick with the Jets last year, this is on the other end of it where they need to decide if he's going to be paid like $100 million. And I think he deserves it because I feel like you're a little hamstrung at this position. I feel like you kind of have to bite the bullet. He's done enough. But yeah, Greg's right. If he flames out a little bit here makes it a much harder. decision. If we're going to lobby for

guys like Tyrod Taylor to get re-signed, if I'm a coach, I would take Kirk Cousins in a second. But it's a different situation though. This is... Well, here's the situation. It does boil down to. If you're the Redskins, yeah, but you know what? The salary cap is going up incrementally again. Teams have money

to pay star quarterbacks. The other option is, you don't pay Kirk Cousins. He quickly goes to another team and signs that contract, and you're the Redskins starting over. The one thing that they have built and you kind of know what you're getting with the Redskins and happened last night by the end of the first quarter they're kind of a flow offense you know if that offense is clicking or not and they've built a tough running team when

they're clicking if they haven't done it on defense and they have a lot of work to do to build up the other side of the ball Greg you got a 1400 on your SAT don't be shy about it's very it's something you're proud about and I don't even know the splits but that means that your math was excellent as well as your verbal so let's do a little calculations 7-6-1 let's say they win out, 9-6-1. Are they definitely in at 9-6-1? No, because they're out of it right now. They get boxed out by the two North teams.

Does this feel like an 8-7-1 team? That's where we're going to end up here? That makes sense to me. I think they'll beat the Bears, but I don't feel too confident in them in Week 17. Ties come back to haunt. Yeah. All right, that's the Monday Night Football Breakdown.

Thank you very much. That was a tabulation from NFL Networks. Greg Rosenthal. that's NFL Network's Greg Rosenthal See one of the downsides of fame is you can get fans that maybe you don't want You get the good fans Yeah

The adoring fans and then you get these fans That's NFL Network's Greg Rosenthal Stalker A little, you know Dangerous situation I would say just look over your shoulder Before you go into your home or your family sleep Right yeah you don't want to walk in

and just show she's there. No, you do not. That's NFL Network's Greg Rosenthal. Very frightening stuff. Let's do some news. Top Savage is real. This is the stuff that when you hit a certain level of notoriety, as Greg has now that he works on the television realm,

it's the cost. It's the cost to be the boss. It's an occupational hazard. And you'd think going in, you know, I would even look forward. to having a stalker, but when it actually happens. Yeah, especially if she's a hot babe. I mean, problems.

Problems on the home front, problems in the workplace, problems in the mind. Hot babe. Yeah, you definitely don't want like a hand that rocks the cradle in its situation going on. All right, let's start in Jacksonville where, as we know, Gus Bradley was sent packing immediately, and I mean immediately after a loss to the Texans on Sunday. And the decision was made. And we read the tea leaves on this situation on Sunday. We all got excited about it that the man who always had a plan,

Doug, Doug Marone from the Bronx, he always knew. He knew it. And he took his job as an offensive line coach with the Jags two years ago, and now he is a head coach, an interim one at that. But a head coach, he is succeeding Bradley for the time being to finish out this season. Of course, Mark, he's a logical in-house candidate, because the 52-year-old was the former Buffalo Bills coach before his bizarre resignation a few years back.

Yeah, I mean, you mentioned a master plan. You know, he's going to have a two-game stint as an interim head coach and then probably be out of a job when they hire Tom Coughlin. Okay. Maybe I'm overreacting a little bit. Well, what if he rallies them for two straight wins? Went out, baby. They said he's a candidate.

I don't buy a word of it. Win out, baby. You can't come out. of this hiring Doug Maron. I just came up with the new catchphrase. Just win, baby. That's fresh. Al Davis rolling in his grave right now.

Who? That's fresh. Yeah, so Doug Maron takes over and other Jaguars news. Blake Bortles, right now still has a job. Morone announced that Bortles will start next week. But Jags' GM, Dave Caldwell, announced that the next coach, whoever that may be, won't have to. play Blake Bortles.

So the honeymoon... That's nice of them. That's nice. The honeymoon period. You can't have a newcomer come in and steal a show. Greg, Greg, the honeymoon period's officially over for Blake Bortles now. Well, it's almost crazy he has to even say this. I keep, I'm surprised that, you know, I've heard, you know, people talk about the different jobs and

well, it's like at least, you know, a positive for the Jaggers. Well, you know, they have a young quarterback. It's like they do not have a quarterback right now. I mean, I have never been like more surprise or wrong about a player. And I'm sure the Jaguars feel the same way about Bortals, but there's no way you could go into next season thinking he's your quarterback. It doesn't mean you cut him, but he can be on the roster. He can't be your starter.

One thing, it is crazy that maybe he has to respond to it, but we'd be killing any group of reporters that didn't ask one question about Blake Bortles. No, no, I know. He had to answer it. And I thought that he answered it honestly where he said that he was, open to someone coming in with new perspectives about every position, certainly including the quarterback. But again, you got to, you got, this is, this is, this is the GM that picked him.

It's going to be awkward. Devil's advocate here. And I was, I never like Bortles. But we went into this year with, with the Jacksonville Jaggers and a lot of people outside of the organization thinking he was their quarterback for 10 years. So does what does one 14 game stretch, Wes, wipe out all the promise he showed up to that point? Let's break this down. And last year, we were high on him for good reason.

He set franchise records for touchdowns and yards. And contrary to the narrative that spun throughout this country, it did not all occur in garbage time last year. He had a good season. He led all NFL quarterbacks and plays of 20 or more yards. All NFL quarterbacks. Right. That's a promising young quarterback with the tools to be good.

And Gus Bradley's comments are very telling. When he talked about Blake Bortle's season and what it meant to that team, he said this really stings. It really hurts that team. My hope is that sting hurts enough that it really challenges him to go in a different direction. That's telling that Blake Bortles

didn't put in the work in last off season and maybe throughout this season. Well, and there have been whispers in Jacksonville coming from a variety of people exactly to what you said that this is not someone who, this is a 24-7 gig that he's waking up at 4 in the morning,

first one at the facility. This is not to say he doesn't work hard. They talk about him working hard, but that doesn't mean that this is his number one priority. There have been whispers about that. I'm not saying you have to cut him. He can be competing for a job, but you cannot count on him.

And the reality is that the season before, they were last in the league in scoring. And this whole, you know, it's going to be up to the next coach. I think it goes with the whole honest evaluation of the roster I was talking about, that they're calling it an exceptionally talented roster. Exceptional by Jacksonville standards.

But I don't buy that. I don't buy that. Telvin Smith is their best candidate for a Pro Bowl. Like, okay, you can find five decent young players. Big deal. So can every team. The Jaguars have lost more games than any franchise in the entire league since Shod Khan took over since Gus Bradley was there.

That includes Browns includes every team. So, okay, you have five good young players. I don't see superstars there. I hear you. but I also think we're entering the season and we play into this. I wouldn't say that we, I think we've learned our lessons in some cases where there's only

four or five vacancies and they're typically bad teams and they are spun and sold once the new coach comes in, oh, this quarterback, we've got a lot of promise, we've seen a lot of improvement. This young defense, we added this defensive tackle and all this nonsense spins all through the offseason

and then September comes and it's like, oh wait, the Jaguars were a hype train. There really wasn't much here. And going back, Wes, Blake Bortle's numbers tell the story. Fourth quarter, the splits, by far his best numbers in the fourth quarter. This is a quarterback that's 10 and 33 as a starter, so they're losing almost every game in the fourth quarter by a ton of points. You have to separate 2015 from 2016 and 2014,

both years in which he had huge mechanical flaws. 2015, he was not just a garbage time king. All right. His career he has been. In one season, you're saying, he wasn't. 2015 is what he can do when his mechanics are working out when he went and worked with Tom House for his, it was, it's his own fault that he didn't go do it again last year.

Go do it again, Blake Borrell, save your career. Last, last known on the Jags, Tom Coughlin is a candidate for the coaching job. Caldwell also confirmed, which makes sense. Coughlin was the founding owner or the first, excuse me, the first coach of the Jaguars when they came into the league in 1995 when they had their greatest successes. and he obviously wants back in, so expect him to be connected to this job. I don't like that either.

Do you guys? I think it's like when you've dated a certain type of person for four years, and whoa, suddenly you're on the market, and what you want initially is something completely different than what you just had, and it's probably not the answer either. I don't know. Tom Coughlin feels like a move from the owner,

but there are other people in that organization that have worked under Tom Coughlin. Did Gus Bradley run a country club? because that would be to me the, then you go get Tom Coughlin. That's what I'm saying, though. When you go date the next person, it's completely different. Oh, but is that how Gus Bradley was thought of? I think Gus Bradley was a super encouraging, beloved players coach. And Coughlin, you know, when Rex Ryan was in New York,

remember all those Giants players that wanted to defect and play for Rex Ryan, the players coach? Our friend Jags Lady has some competition for the Beach House. Who's that? Remember Jags Lady? Of course. and I was in Miami with my new beach house. Well, it was a couple minutes from the beach.

Look at our friend, Intrepid reporter Connor Orr tracks down Kevin Gilbride, Tom Coughlin's former right-hand man. And Gilbride points out Coughlin built a home down there in Jacksonville to retire to on the beach. Right, that's the type of coach. The actual beach. Right. He's closer than Jaguar. Not a couple blocks.

Because why would you lie? It would be nice, though, if the Jaguars are the NFL's inland beach house. if you actually hired a coach that had a home on the beach. Yeah. I think that makes sense. I think everybody should be on board of this. Now, moving on the Tom Savage is real. Tom Savage is real.

It's filled with occupants now and barreling through Texas. He will be the starter. Bill O'Brien, who had those comments that irked Chris Wesleying and many others by saying any decisions are not made based on. money we love our quarterback room but just get to it bill and just admit that rock osweiler is a mess right now and you're sticking with tom savage took a day but that's what he did it will be tom savages start uh in week 16 uh and uh they need another win do you think uh gregg that you've seen enough from tom savage i think he could win some ball games here and get him in the playoffs i've seen enough

that you got to give it a shot you know that he he can throw the ball down the field i think he has a better chance to throw the ball down the field than Osweiler, that was probably his number one weakness. He couldn't even keep the ball in play when he tried to go vertically. The Texans have been playing with half the field all season. They don't throw outside the numbers and down the field

because Osweiler can't do it. And you see when Savage comes in there, he opens up the whole field. You have more possibilities. You can go to DeAndre Hall. They were aggressive with him. He had control of that offense. You could tell he's been in Bill O'Brien's system for three years. and O'Brien on Savage's first drive

calls a fourth and one shotgun pass. On his first drive, his debut drive, and then at one point calls 10 straight pass plays on a field goal drive. That's not the play calling Osweiler was getting. So if you were that much more confident in your backup-wise, why wasn't he already played? Well, he heard of the thing.

He missed two weeks, and it was, what, week 13 and 14 or so with an infection in his throwing elbow. I think that might have slowed this transition down a little bit. But at this point, you'd have to say players like Newk Hopkins that have a voice in that locker, I'm going to say, you want to see me at my full power? Let's continue. We did.

I mean, I cannot think of a team, though. Every time they go into the playoffs, it seems it's not with the quarterback they originally planned to have in. It's T.J. Yates. It's fill in the blank. It's this guy. It's like, it's never according to plan. Ryan's precious quarterback room.

DeAndre Hopkins would have revolted if they stuck with Brock Osweiler. He was targeted 17 times on Sunday. It was actually, it got to the point where he was just forcing it at Hopkins, like five times every possession. But Hopkins is a guy that he wants the ball. He's gone through a very difficult season. So having him involved in part of the offense as they moved down the field and continued that comeback, I knew right then there's no way they can go away from the guy.

I think your point that he's not a rookie is the big one. I mean, he has been in this offense longer than Derek Carr has been in his offense. I mean, he's been in the league for three years. He's not a rookie and he's had continuity. It looked like Oroplo running the Patriots offense. It looked a lot like that. And I think, to me, I don't even hate watching the Texans anymore. They were an easier watch.

I think it makes them more interesting. It makes them less tediously annoying going into playoffs. Plus, like, I know, by all accounts at this point, he's real. But. Tom Savage is real. Yeah, that's what the drop says. But did you only bring up this point to get that in? Mostly.

But you have to admit watching the game. Like, it's still in your mind that. you're not a hundred percent sure that he's real. The payoff there was intense. Totally, you know. A lot of legwork there to get to that punchline. I liked it. I'm not saying he's a savior.

He's still, teams are going to be able to prepare for him. Now there's tape on him now. There was no tape before. And you're still going into the most important two games of the season with a guy who's never made an NFL start. Oh, you mean for real? No, I mean real. That it's not some sort of conspiracy. Like a hologram?

Like a Tupac hologram situation? Hey, look, I'm just putting it out there. You're not ruling anything out. Well, they don't have a clear path, by the way. They're 8 and 6th. Home to the Bengals, which is not an easy matchup at Titans, which also should be tough for them. So we'll see what happens.

I like the chemistry between Greg and Sidney there was seamless. But I have to mention something. Mick Jagger and Keith Richards in 1971. It was. Sydney, you were nice and nice. enough to, she drove me home from the holiday party, so I don't like doing this. Yeah. But there's been another occurrence, and it's going to be the last one because it's not going

to happen again, where Sydney, I don't know what was going on. I get, you know, this came in last night. I get another text from her, which is one of these ones where the box is so long that you have to click into the box, and it's like, what is this person thinking? I'm bringing it to you because I think you brought some sense out of it last time. Anyways. Yeah, let's hear it. I'm going to read it.

It says, hey Mark. Just one more question about my financial largesse. Last night, I received an email from a consortium of Shanghai-based revolutionaries calling themselves the final light. They operate off the Chinese mainland as a counterinsurgency militia using brute force to erase secret government factions at points east of Sri Lanka. The final light is a grassroots organization just trying to make its way in the murky underworld of gangsters and white-collar drug runners. With cells scattered throughout Asia's

Golden Triangle, they've asked if I'd be willing to invest in their growing business. It's a chance to get in on the ground floor and turn my $75,000 that I net weekly into something meaningful. Whoa. Whoa. I know. She says, I know you said you aren't good with money, which is true. I'm not. But what do you think, she asks? Should I pour my liquid resources into this cadre of pro-violence do-gooders? I believe in rebellion, but I definitely need help funneling my wealth to a discreet European bank account, perhaps out of Geneva, Switzerland, or a nondescript burgh in the low countries. You wouldn't, by chance, know anyone in the region with an eye for deep shadow financial maneuvers, would you? Yours truly, Sydney, aka New Money, sign up for Mr. Flames' high school economics class in the Hague, the Netherlands, today at www.flameclass.com.

I think she's run off the rails. Well, here's the issue. And I'm just going to, Sydney, as a friend, I want to let you know, you got to take this stuff offline. This has to be cloak and dagger. You meet in a coffee shop and you make sure there's no bugs around. Paper trail. You do not, you leave no paper trail. You cannot leave texts about joining an insurgency and bankrolling a violent coup scenario.

Much less getting. This is good. I'm taking notes. Us involved. Why are you implicating us? Well, what were you thinking? Because the last text you sent like this, Mark immediately read it to hundreds of thousands of people. What were you thinking sending him another text?

Well, then I gave him a ride home and I thought he was in the crew, you know? Oh, that makes sense. There it is. It's too hot. It feels too dangerous. I'm not, I got too much going on at home. I can't get involved with Chinese insurgencies. How is this betrayal taste?

It's not great. It's not great. A little bitter. Okay. Speaking of betrayal, how did, you know, How did Simone react to the news that you were brought home by another woman? Do you want the party? I see that simply as a friend saving.

She's happy that I didn't spend, you know, $22 on Uber. So the company could. Well, let's stick into that a little bit. The company announced before that you can expense that. Sure. And it's you have to go on your phone and fill out all these forms for one cab ride, which I would never do. So it's money saved.

Mark doesn't have great feelings about our expense report system. well that sounds like another that sounds like a topic for another podcast the expense report podcast coming up later this offseason all right moving on chris wessling will write a banger rookie of the year top 10 and i'll tell you what here's my initial reaction uh god's the honest truth god's honest truth what do we even need to do this for it's zeke or zeke or zeke or maybe deck what are we even doing here tell me why i shouldn't be looking at things that way well well several reasons there are other rookies performing well that's the first reason secondly this has to serve as a public service announcement for any people who don't watch football games and

think that someone besides joie bosa should be defensive rookie of the year you're a fool watch the chargers play jalen ramsie is very promising maybe an all pro in the future Leonard Floyd, Noah Spence, the two guys on the Falcons, all having fine rookie seasons. Very promising. Joey Bosa, already one of the best players at his position. All right, let's start then. That was a good explanation.

You're saying, yes, of course Zeeke and Dak are at the top of my list. Well, and they can't win defensive rookie of the year. Absolutely. Also, Zeek clearly above Dak. Zeek clearly above Dak. On my list. That doesn't mean we shouldn't be breaking down who have been the real standout first-year players. And you have Joey Bosa at number three.

Any chance, Wes, if he signs that contract is in shape or doesn't have that hamstring issue, that he could be at the top of this list. Because you're combining, to be clear to the list, or you're combining offense and defense. I have combining offense and defense. Top 10 rookies. I don't think Joey Bosa,

you have described, Dan, as Mark Gastinoe of the 21st. An evolutionary Mark Gaston. I believe it's a great comparison. Thank you. He has that ceiling. Zeke Elliott already is one of the best running back. in the league, and could have the best rookie season in NFL history. So, yeah, he's, Zeke Elliott is number one with a bullet for me.

Although if Joey Bosa played all 16 games, I would still say Zeke Elliott's the rookie of the year compared to him, but I think you'd have to say per game, Joey Bosa's in the mix with some of the best players at his position. I'm not saying he's better. That's why he should be defensive rookie of the year with ease. Right, he's not better than Miller and Mack now, but he's, He's that kind of player. He's in the mix where he's in the top, you know,

five, six, seven pass rushers in football. I like to play the 10-year game. Mark, I'll throw this one to you. Who would you rather have for the next 10 years? Ezekiel Elliott or Dak Prescott? Ten years. If Dak Prescott is going to be a franchise quarterback for 10 years, I'd take that over.

That's up to you. You don't know that. That would be my assessment, yes, that I would take him that position over any other position. I mean, you're going to get, I think, almost 10 good years out of Ezekulalia, but running backs don't typically last 10 years. Give me the Hall of Famer. I want Zeke.

Really? I think it's a fair argument. For me, I guess I have not lived my life. I'm thinking from a fan, too. I've gone 25 years without a quarterback. I want a quarterback. Well, and Zeke's safer. If you're trying to paint scenarios where one of them tails off eventually,

it's a little easier to see that happening to DAC. and yet I'm with you, Mark, I would take Dak Prescott because that's how important quarterbacks are and he really looks like a good one and possibly a great one, and you take that chance. You take a quarterback. You know what's the worst, Mark? And this goes for both of us.

We both could have had Dak Prescott. The seventh quarterback taken. Yeah, 100% and these are painful things to look back on. And actually, if you look at the whole list, what I think is promising from 1 to 10 is that I don't care if my team drafts a rookie and he doesn't win a rookie of the year, but a guy like Jack Conklin,

who you have at number six, the Titans went into the offseason saying, we're going to become this as a team. Conklin from day one, plug and play, absolutely helped make them become what they envisioned. That is a true success story. And not a sexy pick when it happened. Oh, they were nailed for passing up Laramie Tunsell.

Credit their GM. They traded up for Conklin. And to watch Conklin just absolutely. Stonewall Justin Houston in Sunday's games. Everyone will know who John Robinson is two or three years from now when they're playing multiple national games and they're winning playoff games. And Dan's not allowed on the bandwagon.

I got my own. I got my own. It's a very sad bandwagon, but I'm on that Chatspan. This is a bad year to be a great rookie. I mean, Dak Prescott would be rookie of the year basically any other year. Tyree Kill, who's number four on your list, I think he would have been rookie of the year last year maybe over Todd Gurley. He would have been in that

That's how good Tyree Killsman. I agree. He would have certainly been it over Percy Harvin won it. I don't know about that. Sam Bradford, he might have won it over. Definitely over Sam. He would have won it over Matt Ryan? Eddie Lacey.

And this is a guy who's not even going to be considered with good reason because of the Cowboys. Jalen Ramsey, too. When's the last time you saw a cornerback with five past deflections, a force fumble and an interception in one game? He did that against the Texark. You got him number five. So you would have him, even though you think it'd be crazy to vote for anyone, You have Ramsey as your number two cornerback.

I have him as my number two defensive rookie. Leonard Floyd's in the mix. Dionne Jones from Atlanta. And poor Noah Spence, I couldn't even get him in my top ten. Most years, he would definitely be a top. I'm surprised Jordan Howard's as low as 10. I mean, he's what? He's got to be in the top six or seven in rushing yards right now.

Is Michael Thomas, who you have at number eight on this list? If he was not on the same. Yeah, but Jordan Howard over Michael Thomas. That's my take. Howard's a 10. Michael Thomas, you have it. eight here, is he on this list if he's on any other team? Or is he a little bit of a product of where he's playing right now?

I don't know the answer to that. He's been really good. He's been their best receiver in a lot of games this year on a team with Brandon Cooks and Willie Sneed, who are also quality receivers. I don't know how to answer that, Dan. I would also say that part of when you see this list, it's teams knowing to draft for their own schemes. And you see better rookie years from teams that aren't changing coaches every five minutes

and going from a 3-4 to a 4-3, you get Michael Thomas. I think the Saints knew this is what we need and we're going to use them right away versus being stashed under a coach that might not play them as much. He's physically talented. I mean, he might be the most talented receiver they've had.

Where is Christian Hackenberg on this list? I feel like there's a lot of promise there, second round pick, big arm, really promising freshman year at Penn State. I think he's like Tom Savage. I'm not sure he exists. We might have to get to work on that one. Top Savage is raised.

Some of your honorable mentions, I think, show the work of someone that's watched pretty much every game in the season. Thank you, Mike. I mean, I think that the average fan, you know, Hunter Henry, yes, fantasy people know him. But yeah, some of these other guys, Cody Whitehaired, does the average fan know who Cody Whitehares know? Wesleyan's watching. Chris Jones is one of my favorites. He's had a really good rookie season. Jordan Howard, I'm going to make.

Early in the season. you weren't too sure if he was going to really be a guy and i was 100% on board with you i think the more we've seen jordan howard the more you like it him and he really does look like a guy that can carry load he right now is seventh in the NFL and yards from scrimmage which is pretty impressive yeah i like him he reminds me i think when i first watched him he reminds me of anthony thomas remember him yeah thousand yard rusher for the bears as a rookie and never train similar style where they're both like big burly guys who try to run you over. Jordan Howard, I thought, was too slow.

And if you let him get started, he will run you over. I think teams have to string him east to west. And he's done a good enough job of sharp cutting enough to get north and south. You look at this list, though, and you have to say a team that we couldn't have been less hopeful about the bears two months ago because you kind of get a sneak. It's kind of a sneaky rookie in your quarterback, too, who's essentially never played in the NFL. Along with your honorable mention, there's three bears on here.

And it saved the GM's job, I think. I mean, had they, you know, lost out and there was no promise. They could sweep everyone out of there. I see no reason for that GM to be fired. I don't have any problem with anything. He's done. He was left with Jay Cutler. Barkley is a free agent, too.

He's kind of an interesting free agent. Are they going to try to – it wouldn't surprise me if they signed him before, you know, to try to get a little low deal. As a fan of a team that is trying to get a quarterback in this draft, I would love if the bear said, let's stick with Matt Barkley going on. By the way, I crunch some numbers on Jay Cutler versus his backups. since 2013.

Oh, it can't be pretty. Josh McCown, Brian Hoyer, and Barclay together have a higher completion rate, higher yards per attempt, and higher passer rating, and lower interception rate and lower sack rate than Jay Cutler. Wow. Who's making $20 million more than them. I thought Westavis is over. Yeah.

And I thought another tradition was ending, which was Chris's undying love for Josh McCown. But I guess that tradition lives on. No, it's the... Along with Josh McCown's career, you know, and shipped into coaching, I think. It's more of a love of pointing out all the people who still believe in Jay Cutler like he's some franchise quarterback have been misguided all along. Yeah, but you love Josh McCown, too.

Don't ever pick him to be a preseason MVP candidate. Please. I'm sitting right here. I think those days are over. You don't have to sub-tweet me right in front of him. All right. Check out Chris's Bangor. I believe it will be published on Wednesday.

Wednesday. Correct. Nailed it. So check it out. NFL.com slash Wessling. Is there also a vanity URL? NFL.com slash position rankings. And I hope ever, I will say here, I don't know how the translation is from our listeners to our readers.

You should check out the stuff that's being written by everyone in this room because there's some bangers being written out. It should be NFL.com backslash rank it. It's like you could quickly, you could quickly type that in and it's like you're ranking something every week. Adam Rank is going to lawyer up if you didn't have that. All right.

Tushay. Respect that. Now, a lot of lawyering up today. And now it's time to talk about Mark Sessler, who has been very busy the last, I'd say, I'm going to say about six to eight weeks working on this project. Is that about accurate?

Seems that long. All my time situations are checking out right now. on the phone. You have a young baby. On the phone. Yeah. On the phone. I'll be right back.

I got a phone call. Up. I'll get to you in a second. Got a phone call. And so what he was doing. He wasn't calling some teen party line. He was talking to some of the biggest names in the business that call games and it has resulted in Mark's latest long form. This is what's going on in the booth.

That is not the name of it. No, it is NFL. Booth Talk with Mark. What is it again? It is calling the game. Calling the game. An oral history. I like the way you went with it.

Let them tell the story, how they got into the business, what are some of the nuances of how to get it done. What was your, how about an overarching takeaway after talking to all these different people? Well, number one, I think the four of us, I don't know too many people in my current friend group that are, that we're, that we're, We all watch football together, and half our talk seems to be about the people announcing the games. And I wanted to learn more. I came away totally impressed with how much they appreciate the fact that they have the job, number one, and how hard every single person. And it sounds like I'm just going to say that, but they point by point talked about their preparation for games,

what they do personally stuff they know will never probably see the light of day. and it just blew me away with how passionate they are about football. It's not just, oh, you know, it's a job and it pays well. They love football. It's a tough job in the sense that I was listening. I believe it was Chris Collinsworth was on the Simmons podcast a couple of weeks ago. And I think Collinsworth is one of the best in the business, if not the best color guy in the business. And he said if you go into his mentions on Twitter, all it is is people absolutely shredding him every hour of

the day. So it's like even if you're great at this job, everybody hates you. Joe Buck, who I thought he's come a long way in this business and you spoke with him as part of this piece. I think he at the beginning of his career had a long way to go. I thought his Super Bowl 42 call of the catch was one of the worst, not a big playing NFL history. Addressed it on the Damashik podcast recently. Yeah. But I believe now he's come to a place where I really enjoy Joe Buck games. Some of these guys don't get the credit they deserve. They don't. And it changed my opinion about a number of them who I just, you know, I was apathetic to, but after you realize how much they care, my opinion of them was changed. With Joe Buck specifically, I think the one thing,

this is a guy that grew up under Jack Buck, so he saw his dad do in a certain way. And he's probably of all the guys I talk to. The guy who still is the old school prepare, he sits at his table and does it by hand, his board, is with all the names on there. He has it printed up at Kinko's. and one reason I think that you've seen the improvement talking to him is that he's been with Troy Aikman for such a long time and it's a comment that reminded me of our own show to be honest because a lot of times they'll go out to dinner on Fridays and Saturday nights on the road and he called Troy Aikman his best friend like they are truly good friends

and that he doesn't know how you could do the job without that being the case and that they just go out and talk about life and if they do circle back to talk about football I talked about a conversation they were having about Dak Prescott versus Tony Romo, and they started digging in. Aaron Andrews was there, a few others, and Joe Buck basically said, hold on, save it for tomorrow. And it made me think how often we're sitting downstairs and we get into a

discussion and someone will say, save it for the pod. And it's right, you want to bring it fresh. And he said that comes with the trust that he has where he knows Aikman wouldn't be offended to shut him down the dinner the night before, but to say, let's do it live. The name of my memoirs is going to be saved for the pod. It's got to be. Was it a nod to Dan that you opened your oral history with Tariko?

And not only that, but you put Tariko right over McDonough sort of subtly making a ranking there. I did not. That was not unsubtle or subtle or planned in terms of the positioning of those two. I think Tariko, and this will rankle Greg and Dan specifically West Lessso, and I'll tell you why. because we've had a battle over text for probably three and a half years now where Greg and Dan are anti-Bob Costas. I don't know how else to put it. And Wes has seen this. And so Wes is the –

I don't know if we need this, you know, 30 laundry air. Three and a half years later, I still don't understand the bit. Save it for after the pie. No, no. Like, Costis is one of the reason that I loved football growing up, and I saw the young Bob Costas doing this thing. And to Rico point – he went to Syracuse. You know, he was a huge Marv Albert fan, but he talked about, you know, talking to them,

who got them into the business. He pointed to Costas. He pointed to Marv Albert. And these guys were just like we were, and the average football fan is where you're obsessed with stuff. You're sitting in science class. All you can think about is football. All you can think about is the kind of career you'd want to have that would be fun versus

working in a cheese factory or something. I don't know. You know, if Bob Costas is so great, where is your precious white whale and your long form turned you down didn't he that's classic cost no it's not he's not he's not typically a play-by-play guy right now for football so i you know and i we tried didn't happen so yeah i don't think that you know you know two of my favorite stories charles davis telling the johnny unitas anecdote about where unitas basically told a tv exec off because they the tv exec said oh yeah we don't correct former football players and hall of famers and unitas was basically like how am i supposed to get better at my

job if you don't give me feedback that's a rotten way to run a business yep that was a good anecdote and matt money smith uh i won't ruin the punchline but it pays off when he's talking about radio instead of tv i thought money smith he showed up in this a number of times because he he's great we know him and he is he's got a great sense of humor and uh it came through in this i thought i love i love the note cards that you put up of dan hellies when he was the play-by-play guy that those were his right yes that was that was really cool and i i thought something Phil Sim said is great advice that you better really love football. It's kind of a good piece of advice for anyone who gets into sports as a career.

Because I think you better really, really, really truly love it because I think that carries you through, you know, it's a lot of tougher times. I think it would be the one thing that would knock a lot of people out along the way. Two quick things, like talking to the color analyst, number one, the Mike Mayock, Phil Simms, Charles Davis, you know, the guy you just mentioned, all of them, that they, Phil Sims, their tape preparation is incredible. And it's the kind of thing where you guys do a lot of it. I do a little bit less, but we try to inform our opinions with it

and that they do the same thing, that they say you cannot know a team without doing that work, that they could never go into a booth and call a game without doing these seven or eight hours and the multiple games they do each week. I mean, some don't, though. Well, no, some of the play-by-play guys don't. Some of the better people here.

But a lot of people will read this or listen to this conversation and be like, I can't even listen to a lot of games because there's so many bad guys in this business. Sure. But if you're interested in the people that know what they're doing and are good at their jobs, that's what Mark's piece is about. You hope that people can tell the difference if you've done your homework and watch the games. But at the end of the day, and Greg has talked about this a few times. You're doing it for yourself.

Pride and a job well done. Yep. You can check it out. NFL.com slash calling the game by Mark Sessler. Great work, buddy. Should have pride in a job well done. Yeah. Also, I want to say your last two long forms, the one with Belichick letters,

my favorite part always in the Sessler long forms is the window into the soul of a coming of age, Mark Sessler. The Mark Sessler of 18 to 22 or whatever, whom I never knew. But you can tell a confused person. Right, but I love that part of you, how much you love sports and which. part of sports you loved, that's my favorite part of your long for. I don't think I would have written this if I, you know, I can, you can, the people can read it up top. But there's a reason that broadcasting was a huge deal to me growing up and why I wanted

to know more about what they do. And so that's why I did it. All right. So check it out. And that's it for today's show. We will be back on Thursday with, of course, our recap of the Thursday night football game between the Giants and the Eagles. and then we'll break down all of the yes week 16 games and a reminder because it is Christmas.

What? Breaking news. Breaking news. What do we got? In the podcast studio. The NFL is fine. The Giants $150,000. Oh, Ben McAdoo, $50,000.

They've also moved the Giants' fourth round pick in 2017 to the back of the fourth round after all the compensatory picks of that. that round for illegally using walkie-talkies against the cowboys. All right. So, you know, all you Patriots fans, Wes can shut up now. What? They moved it from the middle end of the fourth to the very end of the fourth. It feels fair.

Feels fair. There's no comparison. Oh, favorite nation status. It feels. It's better than texting down to the sideline. That got someone four games, if I recall. The punishment was handed down. work by the league on this one.

I don't see any suspension in here. What an episode. Goodbye. Close the book. It's been done. All right. Interesting. So we'll see the fallout from that.

We'll be back on Thursday. And then, as I was going to say, Saturday, when all the games get played, we will do a Saturday night pod and then get it out to you before the holidays. There's our Christmas gift. All right. That's it. This is Dan Hansa signing off for Quiet Storm, the Mailman, the Bull. boss and new money behind the glass just got to be careful i mean people can track this stuff

now till thursday This is an IHeart podcast.