NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Top 10 surprises of the NFL season

Episode Date: October 2, 2014

A room with some heroes -- Dan Hanzus, Gregg Rosenthal and Chris Wesseling – count down the top 10 surprises of the 2014 NFL season. Plus, they react to the latest news and begin this season's series of "Stick a Fork in Them,” unofficially officially eliminating teams from playoff contention.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. The Around the NFL podcast operates on a higher plane of human existence. Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hansis and I am joined by a room filled with some heroes, Chris Wessling and Greg Rosenthal. What up, boys. Hey, Dan. How are you, fellas? I'm just trying.

I need some shades for that bright. white yellow shirt, Wesleyan's got today. I like it. Wes is like I'm going on TV. He's turning L.A. He's turning L.A. Yeah, that's right. Going on television. I want people to see me.

I want to be stunning. Interesting theories, you guys. I'm in a really good mood because, uh, uh, Greg, you know, the Patriot dynasty's over. Ow! How about that? And, not to toot my own horn, but back-to-back hero picks Sunday and Monday. Decisively.

If, if enjoying the demise, of, you know, your favorite team gave me joy. I would have been the happiest person in the world the last few years. And if honking about picks was something I would do, you know, we could go back. We could talk about your record. If you want to talk about coming in last place, two years ago, fourth place last year, and you're in fourth place right now. You are a sad man.

All I know. You brought it up. All I know is I picked up two games on you in the standings that you're hung up on right now. But the bigger story is the Patriots. are going down, and that's something we've got to talk about all year, and I got a hero pick. I'm picking against Patriots, so it was a nice Monday. Are you hung up on the AFCE standings?

What do you mean? You just said Greg was hung up on the standings for us picking games. Oh, I'm hung up on everything Patriots related. I'm very excited. The Jets are in last place in those standings. The Patriots, we'll see. I'm not giving up on them. Their dynasty, I believe, if you want to use the word,

dynasty has been over for a while. I think they've been a very good team. And I'm definitely not ruling them out, winning that division and being a good team this year. They've come back from worse. Maybe not worse. Well, 30 to nothing opening day against the bills. Yeah. That was a long time ago.

It's different. There is genuine doubt this year. You know, there are problems they've had this year, I think, that are bigger than ever before. But you picked them to beat the Bengals this week, the undefeated best team in the league so far. So it's not like you're giving up on them. I'm not giving up on the Patriots, but I was more, it was just a nice moment on Monday night. For people that have watched the Patriots soar for over a decade now to see that maybe, just maybe, it could be ending.

See, I thought you might be happy for the fans in Kansas City. Great fan base there. Chiefs, not the greatest recent history, but no, you've got to skew negative. Enjoy someone else's demise. And I didn't hear anything. You never gave me any credit about the hero picks. That's why I really brought it up. There goes my hero.

He's ordinary. That was all just, all that was. just to get to that sound drop. Good job. Good job. All right, here we go. Big show. This is a really big show.

And Mark Sessler, unfortunately, not with us again. He will be back. I'm pretty sure he'll be back for our next show on Thursday night. So get ready for the Sizzler to return, firing with, firing with two revolvers. Both barrels? Yeah, both are revolvers firing. Today we got a big show. We're going to be talking about,

I'm not sure we want to go with the multi-revolver imagery. Can we get a video of that or something? Mark will come just like pumping both fists because he's so excited. How about that? Anyway, so Chris Wesleying ought to grow a great piece, I should say, about the biggest surprises in the NFL through four weeks. We're doing a lot of quarter poll content. Greg, is that fair?

Yeah, quarter season awards and whatnot. So, Wes, the positive, the big guys that are doing well so far, nice list. We're going to get into that list. We've talked about it for a couple weeks now. We're going to start forking teams formally on Wednesday. All this was done. Usually we like to do it together. But since Mark's not here, we made sure to check with him first.

He's on board with everyone. We're going to fork today. So get ready to see some forkage. We're going to do a little Thursday night football preview. You forgot the, we're going to have a five-minute. at press conference congratulating you on two picks because that's what Dan asks for every time he gets a pick right

I didn't even see you yesterday I was home I'm home on Tuesday so what did you want you wanted me to come into work and give you a card or something that you got to call all I'm saying is 5 for 9 and hero picks and I just track these things you track things I track things all right so before any of that before any of that

let's check in with a great date date What's going on, guys? How's it going? And again, we're on video, everyone, and you guys are getting used to, you know, being on camera more and being well-dressed. I've got to say, best dress today, and this is a word I'll be giving out every show. Mr. Questin, look at that shirt, you know. He's got that color. He's with the color button, too.

He could have got an iron. Yeah, it might have sounded like I was having fun with you, but I agree with TD. This is not an iron shirt. I couldn't pull that off. It's meant to be sloppy. Exactly. It's a workman shirt. It looks neat, though.

And I feel like you're giving, although I think the shirt looks nice, too, Wes. There's still some heat about Wes not wearing his hat that's being dropped up onto you, T.D. So I'm thinking this is your peace offering, a little olive branch situation. That's all it is. That's all it is. Accept it for now. And I'm in third place, I assume, right? For today, yes.

There's always next show, though. Okay. All right. Let's do some news. Turn down for what? Shout out to. Jay J.J. Watt. I thought there's a shout-out to Wes's Vegas trip, which I imagine at some point.

He is a fan of that song, though. A woozy Wes on a dance floor just like going nuts. Gin and Tonic rocking in his hand is pumping the fist. There are a lot of parts of that story that are true. One part that would be untrue was me ever stepping foot on a dance floor. Oh. Turn down for what? But that song did play quite a few times in Vegas.

You're right. Yeah. There was an inflatable swan. There was. I didn't tell you guys. but I have a friend in Vegas and he basically led us into this big day club all day Friday

comped us some free stuff and hung out with some beautiful young creatures in my pale 40-year-old body. The beginning of that sentence was awesome and then it got sadder and sadder by the period. This is my life. All right, that's good. Let's do some news.

So Dennis Allen, this is something that, there were some rumors, I guess, on Sunday night. You could call them of Dennis Allen being out in Oakland, but it didn't actually come to fruition until Monday. He was fired by the Oakland Raiders after two-and-a-quarter seasons with the team. And then on Tuesday, the team announced that Tony Sparano, the former Dolphins coach, who had been the offensive line coach for the Raiders,

takes over on an interim basis. This is the decision the Raiders decided to make, amid an 0-and-4 start. I know I got a real kick out of and a lot of people on Twitter did as well. The Raiders choosing to polish up their three Lombardi trophies and mount them behind the press conference on Tuesday in which they announced that they were replacing their coach before October.

Gentlemen, what do you take away from the Dennis Allen era? Was this the right time to get rid of Allen? And what do we think of Spirano? Well, I thought the time to get rid of them was in August when I said, you got to get rid of both of these guys because they're running a clown show. And they were. They bungled the quarterback situation so bad that to me you had to get rid of them. You can't just tell your team we're a Super Bowl contender all offseason.

And your veteran quarterback had nothing left. And then your rookie quarterback wasn't ready to make you a contender. Dennis Allen, I'm not sure what he does well as a coach. After two and a half years, what does he do well? They wasted everyone's time. it's a fault of ownership and McKenzie because Mark Davis was quoted this offseason saying Reggie, talking about Reggie McKenzie, the general manager, is my guy, and Dennis is his guy. So you went into the season knowing you were going to fire him.

You were giving him a chance to have a Hail Mary. I don't think Bill Belichick would coach this team to a winning record. It's a lousy, lousy roster. So they wasted it an entire year. And I'm more interested, really, about what happens next. I mean, Mark Davis is already admitting that, yeah, you might give John Gruden a call, and I think that's their big white whale. They want John Gruden.

Is that good? I don't think it's necessarily good for the Raiders. Yeah, I don't think so either. I think Spirano is your ultimate interim coach because he doesn't have a prayer here. He's inheriting a truly crappy team. So you can imagine, you can safely assume they're going to win between one and four games, maybe. And I can't imagine that will be. One game for each Lombardi trophy.

displayed. So I assume that he will not stick around. He won't do enough to stick around. And then they're probably going to try to make a splash. So I don't, my question is if are the Raiders after 10 or 11 straight years of being a joke at this point, how toxic is it? Why would a high profile coach want to go there? Unless you really bought into Derek Carr. One thing that Mike Silver reported on total access yesterday was that there's a quote, emotional connection that remains between Gruden and the Raiders, I think a bigger thing would be the Benjamin connection. If Mark Davis pushed across the table a blank check and said, come on, rejoin us, would that be enough to have Gruden give Mike Tariko a hug goodbye

and join the sidelines again? I think so. I think the interest in Gruden from around the league and big-name college teams has always been overstated. I think that interest is leaked to the media from Gruden's camp. This little song and dance thing he does where he's, act surprise. Oh, why are you talking about me? Why is everyone... Give me a break. The quote seven or eight bloggers, the classic straw men here, there are no

bloggers. He's talking about Greg Rosenthal. He's taking a shot. Yes, he's fired. When he's the one who wants the money, who wants out of ESPN, who wants a good job, and he can't find it. He's playing the game. If he had a good offer the last few years, I think he would have taken it. There's a chance he takes this. Ian Rappaport believes that he really likes Derek Carr, which is one thing that he would. would need in place. But if Gruden goes there, McKenzie's not going. He's going. McKenzie says, I'm going to hire this next coach. Well, he's not hiring John Gruden.

John Gruden wouldn't take him. He'd bring his own personnel guy. And so would a lot of really big-name coaches. Ultimately, I don't think they get anyone like that. If Dennis Allen wasn't safe to make it to October, why the hell is Reggie McKenzie safe to make it into a new season? What has this guy done? The proof is there on the field. He's not going to make it into a new season. I don't think you will. I don't think you will. I think it's easy to say he's safe now. When they're one in 15, then he's not safe. He's gone in January 1st or whatever it is.

And Derek Carr, the next young quarterback that John Gruden develops will be the first one he develops. Name any young quarterback he's ever developed. Doesn't mean he doesn't want him. And Chris Sims doesn't count. He doesn't mean he doesn't want one or doesn't think he can do it. A little outside the box thinking, you hire John Gruden, Matt Schaubes on the roster. You remake that old man. Rich Gannon style.

He is Rumpel Stiltsky. He spun Brad Johnson and Rich Gannon into gold. I mean, I take back what I said about it being a good idea for the Raiders, John Gruden, that it wouldn't be, it would be a good idea. It would be a horrible idea. Go get a good coach, not a name. He would be better. Go get a coach, not a name.

I think he could coach them up, make them a little better than they did. Do you see the Steelers doing this or any other quality or the Ravens? They don't go out and say, hey, we need to get a superstar name. They go out and get a guy who is in the NFL and impresses. you by what he's doing on a daily basis. This seems to be a team adrift, though. So Gruden, to me, makes sense as the guy that they're going to blindly swipe at. And maybe that's the time machine that makes them relevant again.

And people talking about, oh, well, maybe they'll give them an ownership stake. If John Gruden gets an ownership stake, I mean, he's taking that job. Give me a break. They're not going to give a coach like John Gruden, an ownership stake. And if they did, there's no way he wouldn't say no. Here's your plan for relevancy. Have a winning record two years in a row. bingo you're relevant right not because you hired a name and went four and twelve again all right so the raiders are one franchise in tumult right now now we move to orchard park where the buffalo bills have you know they invested i believe a first round pick in e j manual a year ago and now he is on the bench kyle orton announced as the starter by doug morone who in his press conference announcing orton the thing that to me was really uh jumped out of me was

is Marone referring to the front office. I didn't ask for an agreement. I just went in and said this is the direction I'm going. So Maron used this press conference as some type of power play on some level, it seems. And Kyle Orton signed to an incredibly large contract right before the season started, which was a sign that Manuel perhaps wasn't the guy

that they believed in. Now is the quarterback as we enter October. This is the state of E.J. Manuel's career. He's been benched for a 31-year-old who accepted a backup job for Tony Romo when he could have got a starting job and tried unsuccessfully to retire four months ago. And has a mustache that doesn't belong in this time and place.

He can't pull up any facial hair. He's tried so many types. He can't even pull up retirement. No. I mean, the only thing he's good at is making a lot of money. But now they're asking this guy that you could safely, as Wes is alluding to, his heart might not be truly in being a part of a winning football organization.

organization. Now you're giving him the keys to the kingdom and a talented roster, a team that could actually go places if they had a quarterback that can do anything. But Kyle Orton just does not seem like the answer. I don't blame them, though, because E.J. Manuel did nothing well. He was so far away from being ready and being a halfway decent starter. You want to talk about the state of Manuel's career. His rookie number one wide receiver, Sammy Watkins, after one practice with Orton said, Orton reads, talking about what's the difference between the two, he reads it quicker, the ball is coming out faster.

The way he talked, the way he handles business, the way he looks at plays and breaks down defenses, it's kind of different than E.J. That's not Aaron Rogers. That's Kyle Orton. Right. And it's also a rookie mistake by Watkins because he didn't need to take Orton

and compare him to manually. He could have just pumped up Orton. I'm sure he was asked about it and he's honest. He reads it quicker the ball's coming out. I'm glad he would be the quarterback again. Hey, let's not try to encourage players to start using cliches. That's fair. I just think, Manuel, what if the organization still believes in him on some level?

I don't know if that's the case. They don't. They just gave Kyle Orton $5 million and started him. And it's a really interesting time in Buffalo because they're going to have a new owner soon. They have a GM, Doug Whaley, that didn't hire this coach, Doug Marone. There's a lot of competing agendas. as you said he was making a statement against the front office. I think what that was was he was trying to tell his players, tell the fans,

I'm not just a puppet for this front office that signed Orton. Because there were reports he never wanted Orton in the first place. It's just, it's a bit of a mess, and they know they need to win right now or else they could all be gone. I like this Bill's team is a funny thing. I think they could win. They're a lot more interesting now. Their quarterback can pass.

Is there any way Orton steps in and is effective as a quarterback? Yes. Yes. I don't know if he'll be that effective, but effective enough to go eight and eight and win some games. And maybe win a division in the AFC East. We might find out if Hackett and Maroon can coach. Right. I mean, you watch this Bill's team. There's a lot of things to like about it. I think they have a lot of offensive weapons. I think the defensive line is as good as there is in the league. I agree. They can win the East now. I'm not saying they will. I'm saying it's possible.

I never believed it was possible with E.J. Mangle. I never believed it would be possible that we'd be talking about the bills potentially winning the division because Kyle Orton became the start. That's not the reason. Yeah, it's because the Patriots aren't that good. Oh, shut up. All right. There it is.

The shut up is back. It's back and better than ever. And more dismissive than ever. People love it. I couldn't help myself. It would. Moving forward, Steve Smith, who is, listen, Chris Wessling's hero at this point,

the older brother that Wes already had, but just another older brother. Except he's younger than me by half a decade. The younger brother, I should say. Listen, I get confused sometimes. Steve Smith is having a hell of a week. It started with an amazing game against his old team, the Panthers, lighting him up for well over 100 yards,

a touchdown. And then he got to talking, doing the Steve Smith thing, a sound bite that the inside the NFL people grabbed from the sideline. Take your, I'll use the words, buttocks here. Take your buttocks back to Carolina. Make sure you mow my lawn while you're out there. Bang. He didn't stop there, Wes. And Wes, since you love Steve Smith so much, and you have been our beat writer on this, why don't you explain what he said about Dave Gettelman and

Ron Rivera? He went on a radio show, WFNZ, I believe, in Charlotte today. WFNZ. And just went nuclear on the Panthers, especially Gettelman, saying, that Gettelman called him into his office in February after Greg Rosenthal basically started this whole thing at the combine by asking Gettelman. It was your question. Yeah. Is there a chance that Steve Smith, you know, doesn't make the roster or something along those lines? Right, and he stammered and didn't really give an answer.

We talked about, are we making too big a deal of this? Because we almost didn't write a post on it. Right. And then it somehow gets back to Smith. Smith said today that I was getting text messages and tweets from friends telling me, look, your future in Carolina's up in the air. Greg Rosenthal sniff this out. Greg, real quickly, your general thoughts on the butterfly effect.

I have no comment. Shut up. See, that one hurt. Gettman calls him into the office and basically tells him you're washed up. You're a shadow of your former self. You're a distraction. And we think you're jealous of Cam Newton. Oofa.

What? At least he was honest. That's weird, though. Do we believe, I know we don't want to say that Steve Smith could be unscrupulous in the media, but do we believe everything that is saying, would Gettleman really say that to him in a meeting? There could be some embellishment going on? I think he would. We've heard Dave Gettelman.

He's a straight shooter. So if Steve Smith asked him, why are you getting rid of me, boss? Maybe he would just tell him. You're wicked jealous of Cam. Isn't this exactly what we read about in the Charlotte Observer? That they thought he was a divisive locker room presence, and they wanted to hand the organization over to KM and not have it be a Steve Smith team.

So all Steve Smith is really accusing Gettleman of telling him to his face, which is what you would want a person to do. Well, he also said he didn't have the Cajonese to release him to his face. And he said he felt like he was stabbed in the back by Ron Rivera, who never bothered to talk to him. Steve Smith has a lot to get off his chest, it appears. I'm loving this. My favorite line was when they asked him,

do you have anything to say to Dave Gettoman? And he said, I got nothing to say to Dave Gettoman. He told me what he thought of me, and I told him what I thought of him with my play. Smile, the glit, and Wes's eyes when he talks about. Steve Smith, his little brother that he always had. You should love this. I mean, the Steve Smith victory tour

after beating the Panthers is like you after getting a couple of hero picks. I mean, no one's going to hear the end of it. This is like five for nine, baby. It's like a wrestling, it's like a wrestling figure. I love it. I don't know, maybe with the hero's thing, it's just because you're my boss. I wanted you to, you know, be like, good job, then. You want an accolator to?

You looked at the crystal wall, and you saw it. Well, everyone, every employee is different, and you're right. That I, that you do need, you like positive affirmation, whatever it's called. Give me what I need. I'm clearly not good at it. Give me what I need. All right. Moving forward, bad news for Carson Palmer,

who suffered a setback with that nerve issue in his shoulder. Bruce Ariens said earlier in the week that Wednesday was going to be a key day in determining whether he'd be ready to play and return to the lineup against the Broncos on Sunday. Instead, Carson Palmer doesn't even practice. He's going to see a specialist to get this thing checked out. Ariens said via Alex Flanagan of NFL Media, he threw a bunch last Thursday and Friday and then regressed.

So it looks like we're getting a number. another, Drew Stanton start this time against the defending AFC champions. Wes, you said yourself a couple weeks back before their by week that you were looking forward to seeing the Cardinals in Denver and if they could put something together and win or play really well, they could be a real team of ATL candidate in your eyes. Kind of a bummer now that we're not even going to get the full Cardinals attack with Drew Stanton involved. I did say that, but in the offseason when we talked about the team of ATL, I also said

They're a more interesting team to me with Drew Stanton that quarterback. Ooh, tasty. Well, he hasn't looked worse than you would really expect Carson Palmer to be, maybe a little bit so far. I think if they can keep winning with Drew Stanton, I mean, just give the coach of the year right now to Bruce Erians. They should give it to him three years in a row. That guy's great.

I wonder when I read this, though, are we going to see Carson Palmer again this season? Look, we're not, we don't know anything about the medical situation, but you start hearing specialists, it gets worse, setback. I mean, these are the things you hear when suddenly Carson Palmer put on injured reserve out for the year. It's kind of Peyton Manningy. We're hoping that's not what's going to end up happening where he's going to need some type of procedure to save his career. But, you know, the issues with being able to throw the ball, gripping ball, all that stuff,

it doesn't seem to be heading in the good direction. So when you hear, my nerve has to wake up, and it's not firing. I mean, we don't know a lot about nerves, but that's problematic. Speak for yourself, Wes. You can't just go rehab this. It's not like a normal recovering from a sprained MCL. They have no idea.

And the fact that he just can't throw the ball, I mean, it's scary. The New England Patriots, we talked about them at the top of the show, you may remember, are coming off that bad loss. Now they have to go on Sunday night to face the Cincinnati Bengals, who are allowing a league low. 11 points per game. So for the Patriots offense to wake up, they're going to have a tough challenge.

Tom Brady was on WEEI in Boston. He had this to say, there's no magic scheme. It's up to the players to play a lot better than we're playing. This hasn't been an isolated incident. I don't think offensively we played well all year. So, Greg, I ask you, this appears to be a spot where a bad timing on the schedule for a team that really needs a big win. and a nice offensive output to shut everybody up.

Instead, they get one of the best defenses in football. I think it's a good spot. You know, it's a short week in a game that they're going to be the underdog, which is very rare in Foxborough, almost never happens under Brady and Belichick. In a big stage, everyone's going to be watching. This is generally when you can see what your team is made of, and that's kind of what they need right now. Isn't that what they needed on the big stage two nights ago?

Right. But that was a huge letdown performance. They've had a month of poor offense. They were last in the league and yards were play before Monday night. So they've been struggling each and every week. This is a spot where Brady and Belichick over the years would respond. So I think it's a good spot because you'll learn. If they get blown out again, then they're a bad team.

Brady played very poorly in one half against the Dolphins, played poorly against the Raiders for part of the game and had one of the worst starts his career against the Chiefs. He isn't playing well, but I thought it was interesting in that article.

Albert Breer had talked to quite a few executives and they were unanimous in the decision that he is not the issue. It's the talent surrounding him. That was weird, by the way. After he came out of the game and Garapolo came in, Garapolo got the score

and came back and was talking to the offense coordinator, and Brady was just sitting there staring straight ahead. I don't remember ever seeing, I know we've seen Brady frustrated on the sidelines, but I don't remember seeing Brady just that dejected in a way, maybe in that Bill's game that was forever ago. But it was very unusual to see Brady just at a loss, it seemed. I think of two games immediately when they got trounced in New Orleans and they show Brady and Belichick just kind of standing on the sidelines.

I can't remember what year that was. I think it was the first. year he was back from ACL surgery, and then later that season, the darkest moment, any Patriots fans should know this, of the Brady Belichick era, 33 to 14, home loss to the Ravens in the playoffs, light booze cascading down on Foxborough, a half-empty Foxborough, it's probably Ravens fans booing as Brady, you know, kind of jogs off the field of his head down. At that point, everyone said the Patriots dynasty is over. The Globe wrote it. CSN New England did a big, thing about it. Everyone picked them not to make

the playoffs the following year. Then they had the number one seed. So we're five years removed from that. I don't know if they can really pull it back, but I don't know. I'm not giving up. Finally, gentlemen, Charlie Whitehurst, who we talked about a little bit last week, made a start,

who's named one of Nashville Lifestyles 25 most beautiful people in 2014. He has a shot with a jaunty cap, just as skew, his long hair, and a shirt not to similar to Wes's shirt, only a different color, posing in the magazine. But the one thing that jumped out, we talked about how Chaz Whitehurst thought that maybe

he had a bunch of acoustic guitars could play maybe a little bit of glycerine. I think he can play pink houses, too. Maybe pink houses. Vaseline, I think, by Stone Temple Pals. Perhaps parts of it, he gets frustrated. It's pretty easy. Just try it. He gets frustrated easily, clipboard Jesus.

But they asked him this question, which was interesting. Is there a skill or activity that you want to take up slash learn or one that you have mastered? His answer, I need to learn to play my guitar. Bang! Bang. So it means he has a guitar, a guitar, potentially multiple guitars. Who knows, but at least one, and he doesn't know how to play it.

Exactly as you predicted. Certain guys have the look. The guys that have the guitar but don't know how to play. You saw right through the Chaz Whitehurst affectations. Just a real quick survey of this room. I think that counts as another hero pick, by the way. Oh, right. I think it counts as a Sessler.

Every time there's a segment of the show that we didn't know was coming, it's always somehow patting Dan on the back. This was disgusting. I love this white. I'm just curious, who has this counts behind the glass as well. Who has a guitar but doesn't know how to play it? One. I've never owned a single musical instrument.

Okay, I thought it would be more. I have a guitar that I don't know how to play. Oh, really? Yes. I once out of Val Lynn that I could play but then stopped learning how to play. My brother majored in classical guitar and was a great, great guitar player. I try. It's very difficult.

I learned to play a portion of Santa Monica by Everclear. How big of a portion is down out, down, down. That's all right. That's it. That's it. Biggest regret in my life, not keeping up with the violin. Really? Really?

You've had a pretty charmed life if that's number one. I'm just saying, I would love to be. My violin lessons fell off. If Carl and Banks back there I mean for a man that became known as young Kobe For his basketball skills and genial looks Can you imagine what would happen If you knew how to play violin

I ask myself that every day He'd have to use the violin stick thing To hit away the women Stick thing What is that thing It doesn't have a name All right so let's move forward gentlemen And let's talk about Chris Wessling's list

The top ten surprises Of the first quarter of the season West did, just to use a damageic term, gangbusters work on this list. I really enjoyed it. A top 10 that was also an honorable mention, get excited everybody. So why don't we talk about it? Maybe Wes will throw some out to Wes or maybe throw out a couple of ours that maybe did not make it on to Wes's list. Let's have some chatter session about the top 10 list.

And we'll start with number one, Chris Wesleying. That's what we've got to talk about number one. Rolando McLean, Cowboys linebacker. Nobody thought McLean would be an NFL player the way his career started. All of a sudden, he's a key cog in the middle of that defense. That is a lot better than people realized. Talk about Kyle Orton unsuccessfully retiring. Relyne McLean did twice before age 24.

He did twice this offseason. And he had that one arrest where he was getting in the car like this. Remember that? Yeah, I do. That was awesome. And now he's a starting middle linebacker who legitimately looks like a difference maker, Not just, wow, I'm surprised that Relinda McLean is halfway useful. I'm surprised that he's helping them win games.

You would have never guessed that. He's playing better in these four games than he has in his entire career. Number eight overall draft pick. Well, now we're learning why. Maybe Jerry Jones, the GM, turning it all around. Oh, no, wait, there's Morris Claymore, about 5,000 other examples of him being a disaster. I mean, do you think this is going to keep up? Do you think McLean we're going to look back and he's going to be?

second team all pro or something is he playing at that level and do you think he'll sustain it i do not think he's going to be second team all pro i don't know if he'll keep it up because i don't know what his motivation is this is a guy who said before he doesn't even really like football that much i'm surprised number two on your list steve smith that was stunning that because to me you shouldn't be that surprised you're the number one steve smith fan right and we did predict on this podcast he would leave the ravens in receiving this year no one thought that he would have be second in the NFL in almost every category and has already seven more plays of 20 plus yards than he had all of last season.

That's a surprise to me. He's not coming back as a slot receiver. He's coming back as one of the best deep threats in the NFL. Devin Hester was a name that I was thinking had to be on this list, and there he was, because we've seen what he did over the years in Chicago when it was on offense. and all we ever did was kill the Bears for trying him on offense. Because they didn't know what they were doing. Well, but we didn't know that.

And now he's out there. He looks like he's still a very good return man. It seems like he's extra juice in his legs. And now he's actually a useful offensive weapon. No one saw that. I think Dirk Cutter, the Falcon's offensive coordinator, is very good at what he does, whereas the Bears' offensive coordinators were never good at what they did.

And Cutter is using him creatively. He scored on a reception, a run, and a punt return, and he's probably going to score on a kickoff return, too. He's breaking tackles. It's such a huge test for Cutter and Matt Ryan, though, because they lost two more starting offensive linemen for the season this week. I feel like Matt Ryan is playing like a top five quarterback so far, but how many people can you lose and still put up 30, 40 points a game?

I guess if you want to look on the bright side, the backups to those two linemen that they lost aren't much worse than the starters. I'll just real quickly go through the top 10 McLean 1, Steve Smith 2 Larry Donnell, the Giants tight end at 3 Terrell Austin, the Lions defensive coordinator at 4 Devin Hester, Darren Sproles, the Ravens Offensive Line, the Chargers cornerbacks,

Jalani Jenkins, the offense linebacker, and Levyon Bell at number 10. And one thing I wanted to point out before Greg we get into maybe guys that aren't on this list, honorable mention I see Brian Hoyer on honorable mention and I must say because Mark Sessler isn't here that I believe that Brian Hoyer considering everything heading into the season

what we all felt deserved to be on the top 10 somewhere he's playing very well for a team that is playing competitive football and very easily could be in the thick of the AFC North by the midpoint of the season. I find it incredibly generous of you to say he's playing very well. Wow. The numbers are very good. He is exceeding expectations.

He's the quarterback of, what, one in three team? One and two. One and two. But they're pretty easily in three and O. It's not because of the offense, it's because of the defense, I think. Right. They could be winning. And as you said, Greg, that Johnny Mansell is further from the job on October 1st

than he was on September 1st, which really is a credit to Hoyer, considering how the entire franchise turned toward Johnny Manzell as the savior. I mean, give you a break. Put him on the list. You should be in two sets of softball pants after what Brian Hoyer has done to you. I think you'll find that the top 10 players on the softball. Everyone of his top ten players is a good player. So you don't think Brian Hoyer is a good.

I think he's a very mediocre quarterback, so that's why he's not in the top ten. Let me just go over the stats. Might as well throw him out there. He's completing 64% of his passes. He's not thrown in interception, three touchdowns, and has a passer rating of 97.5. That's good production for a guy that maybe a lot of people thought was a backup at best. If you watch the games, he's missing a lot of throws. Right.

And they are coaching him really well. It's like they're coaching, like the Bill's coached E.J. Manuel. It's a lot of play action, a lot of inside the numbers stuff. And that's fine. He's getting it done. But it's not like he's making the same passes as Aaron Rogers. It is crazy, though, that Johnny Mansell has turned into a non-story at this point. And that it's the Browns, if the Brown's defense had played as well as we thought, they would be 3-0 right now.

And they don't have Jordan Cameron. They don't have Josh Gordon. They have a great running game. Give him a little love. And all right. So now, Greg, why don't you throw out a name that is not on Wes's list and then listen to what Wes has to say, shooting you down? Or perhaps saying, oh, I forgot that guy.

Well, good one. Well, actually, it happens to be on his honorable mention list, which I didn't realize. Awkward. You know, Terrell Austin has been great. Big question mark in Detroit going into the year, and he's been terrific. But he's not even the most surprising Austin in the league. Austin Davis.

I mean, none of us could have said anything about, Austin Davis a couple months ago. We would have said it was a travesty and a complete disaster if he ever gets in the lineup for the Rams and he's given them life. You watch him compared to, let's say, a Brian Hoyer. I think he's light years ahead of Brian Hoyer. I mean, he's helping them win games. I mean, he's very accurate. He doesn't have a big arm, but he's connecting deep down the field. He has touch. He's a fun quarterback to watch. He makes the Rams kind of watchable, which I never would have seen. He's playing like Case Keenum played last year when he first got the job attacking down the field and i mean that's what austin davis neither one has a

big arm but they're both attacking them damned with faint praise there well you know what happened to case keith look yeah i don't know austin david's going to be good for the next four weeks i know he's played two and a half games and for those two and a half games he's looked like a solid NFL starting quarterback yeah i know he's done something in the three games he's played that sam bradford never did in any three games stretch of his career by completion percentage and yards per attempt 69% completions and 7.5 yards per attempt for three straight games. Sam Bradford never did that. The guy that jumps out to me, and this is cheating a little bit

because I know he had a nice season last year, and we all agreed that he was a good player when he could stay healthy. But who saw DeMarco Murray becoming, potentially, I know there are some people that argue Levy on Bell, but DeMarco Murray becoming the best running back in football. Four straight games, over 100 yards. He has a touchdown in each game. He was shredded.

the Saints on Sunday night. He's doing it every game. You know, if he could stay healthy, this looks like the season where he's going to be the 15, 1600-yard guy with the double-digit touchdowns and a real MVP candidate. When you look at the Cowboys who are 3-1

who are a team-wide surprise while we're here, and they have a chance to go 4-1 if they could beat the Texans at home on Sunday, DeMarco Murray is the reason why, because they waited for Romo to get healthy. It looks like he's getting there, but Murray's been a major piece there. I considered him for the list.

the only reason he's not on there, he led all NFL starting running backs in yards per carry last year. So to me, I can't consider him a surprise. Yeah. And he's great, but you also don't know how much credit to give him and how much to give that offensive line. Because I'm not, we always joke about how we can't evaluate offensive linemen that well, but they are becoming the first offensive line that I've ever had fun watching.

Like, they are one of the best offensive lines. when you put on the game rewind that you just see Tyron Smith. I like Ronald Leary. That guy's big and he just throws people around. I mean, in the running game, they are dominant. And they have a chance, I think, because of that offensive line, to be good all year. And next week, gentlemen, just a little teaser because this is where it gets real fun.

Wes will do his top ten disappointments at the first quarter of the season. That might be even more fun. And then we dig in and we get negative. All right, so that's it. gentlemen you would not be on my surprise list because you're all great guys all the time see we can fight at the beginning of the show and now we're just back together so yeah it's okay to get you know share feelings and and say that we appreciate each other that's all yeah it's like you and mark are always worried it west and i argue saying it's awkward

or something sometimes a lot of people listening to the podcast will write in oh there was some real tension between west and gregg or dan and whoever it's all it's all love It's like your family. No, it's, yeah. Our listeners know us well enough to know that, I think. Let's not say it's all an act either, because it's real human emotion. Not like you'll get on these other podcasts, and I won't name names. But this is, it gets real in here.

Yeah. We've heard that we've taken some shots on these podcasts. People are taking shots at us. If I listen to them, I would know. Exactly. But I'm not going to make time to do that. All right. So, it is time, gentlemen.

We've talked about it for a couple of weeks. It's time to get out the old utensils. go in the old drawer, take it out, the one with the points on it, and do some stabbing. Not the knife, that's dangerous. The forks, stick the fork in them. Stick a fork in them. Stick a fork in them.

And for those that might be new listeners to the show, when we fork a team, we are saying definitively that they have no chance of making the postseason. We've been doing this for two years. We've never been wrong, ever, even once. It's not true. We were wrong two years.

ago but last year we were we were clean and this year we're going to be clean again that's a guarantee which i might i may add though you guys when the redskins did you guys wrong you guys are a little too safe last season okay safe we're we are going to let's be a little more bold i'm often the one that's playing it safe i view it more as an official pronouncement that your season and is over not trying to be bold so we'll try to get out on a limb a little bit more but i think we go back to what the policy was the first year if we're wrong about any of these teams, we stick a fork and stick a fork in them. I thought you were just circling back to your charity endeavor from when you promised

if you got one wrong that you would donate to a charity and then you wouldn't let us forget it for the next year. All right, let's get our forks out. Here lies the Tennessee Titans. Who to be forked must technically exist. So this is perhaps a good thing. Anyway, the Jake Locker era can mercifully be sent to its own version of permanent injured reserve. The Titans are done.

Oh, Titans fans out there. You probably hate us. I don't blame you. Usually, I would say you're being too sensitive. You know, it's not personal, but I don't blame the Titans fans for taking it personally because Dan especially just keeps needling them. There was a... They're a team like any other team.

Yeah, I feel bad. This kind of got going a little bit that they're, whether they're real or not. And there was a Titans fan on Twitter, who, it should be said, said that he was forking the around the NFL podcast for not giving the Titans any respect. But if you really want to be serious about it, the reason why we make jokes and we kid is because the Titans have zero identity. It's been that way for several years now. This year has not been any different.

They are one in three, I believe. and they are not showing any signs and Charlie White, Chaz Whitehurst, as much as we love the man. He's already started a game which means Jake Locker was already hurt. So that hasn't changed. Everything seems to be the same in Tennessee,

which is more of blandness. I don't feel bad. I don't feel bad at all. Look, if you're a fan, you need to be a grown-up too and grown-ups think for themselves. Don't blame a podcast. Find fault with your team's GM,

your team's owner, your team's coach, the people who make the decisions, not some random podcast. I'm glad you went there because I thought you were going to say quit the team the way you did the Bengals, and I don't want that to happen. I don't know that any Titans fans can build up a case that would be as strong as mine when I left the Bengals. I want to give Ken Wisenhunt and the new GM and Ray Horton like a little time to get it going. I don't really blame them 100% for the blandness that is their roster.

But to me, if the Titans can be summed up in one player, it's the player that's been there almost the longest. They are the Nate Washington's of teams. They are the 40th best wide receiver in your fantasy draft. They are 600 yards and four touchdowns. They're perfectly acceptable, and that's it. TD has a take. I've said in the last couple of seasons,

the worst matchup on the NFL schedule is always the Jags and the Titans. You have the worst team in previous seasons and the most interesting and the team with no identity. Worst matchup. That's fair. I agree. All right, so goodbye, Titans. Next up.

Here lies the Oakland Raiders, who thought Matt Schaub would take them to the Super Bowl and now believe Tony Spirano will take them to respectability. In lieu of flowers, please just try to visualize the Mark Davis joke I would have used here had I been allowed. That sums up my feeling. The laugh.

Dead last in scoring. uh not dead last in scoring differential the jaguars are worse than them so you got that going for it it's really a battle for that number one is that a spoiler alert by dropping the jack system not on purpose could you pick a more uninspiring interim coach than tony sperano it was really if you wanted to pick one guy that you know is going to be 12 and done it's the spa man yeah it's like all right so we're going to we're going to see a lot of wildcat now well they they watch he's like a A lot of great offensive line play. They watched the 2012 Jets offense, and they said, I got to get me some of that.

You know, let's get in the mix. Or the old Dolphins teams that were just brutal to watch. What about all the free agents they brought in and the defense and... Paycheck veterans. Everything else? Nothing worked. Everything that's not how you build a team. We heard for two years that Reggie McKenzie was the guy, and once his hands were untied,

that he would be able to build a roster because he showed a lot of potential in, Green Bay, but then he was given that opportunity and has been well documented. We don't need to get into it too deep here. He went and bought, as Wes says, a bunch of veterans that were on the other side of their prime, that were really in it for the money, potentially, but just weren't playing their best football anymore, and this is what happens, and you don't have a quarterback, and then you don't believe in your coach, and you can. I mean, things, it's been bad for the Raiders for a long time, but it's, if I'm a

Raiders fan, I'm probably never been more kind of depressed about the outlook of my team than I am right now. are a winning team and you bring in a core of veterans to help put you over the top Patriots have done this kind of stuff with Junior Sayou and earlier than that with Roman Pfeiffer and some other guys it makes sense

but when you're a losing team and almost all of your players are new what's there to keep them interested I was thinking you know all the veteran signings haven't been that bad like I think Justin Tux played pretty well when I watched and I was like how's Lamar

Woodley doing? I really haven't heard much too much of him so I looked up his stats he started three games in those three games he has a tackle you know he has one tackle this season Lamar woodley snaps Lamar woodley's stat line right now is a tackle so maybe Dennis Allen isn't smarter than Dick Lebeau when you pointed out this off season yeah we think that Dick Leboe's been using him out of position all along I wish you weren't a liar he's actually a defensive end not an not an outside linebacker come on Dennis Allen I want the Raiders to be good again it's great for the NFL

I like their fan base how they're a little crazy I know they drive you crazy West I love they're a real international history national fun team I love their history I love the organization until about 10 years ago

all right the Raiders do have a good afterlife somewhat to look forward to a stud rookie linebacker Kalil Mac that's true plus Well done. McKenzie looks like he hit a triple or maybe a home run with that first round pick. Got to give him that.

Okay. So there's something to be positive about. And then John Gruden's going to be the coach and they're going back to the ball. Finally. Here lies the Jacksonville Jaguars, who honestly believed that man named Toby could be a respected running back in the National Football League. In lieu of flowers, please make a donation to help disinfect that weird see-through pool at Everbank Field. He's taking shots, unnecessary shots.

I like that we're not taping these segments on camera because we know this is too negative. This is for NFL.com. We could carry the water and be positive, but we have to get negative. Sometimes teams deserve it. Jaguars are another one. You know what? This one won't come back to haunt us because Gus Bradley's defense that he's built is just as bad as it ever was. worse under mike malarkey or jack del rio or whatever but blake portals could make us sweat for a week

a little bit when he gets on the run because i think he's the real deal and they're in a lousy division you know some better days are ahead that's all next year well this year has to get better because they're one of the worst teams in nfl history right now so they could pull off a repeat of last year where it got better and they finished with five wins or something but that means you go four and four in the last day games or something like that and i guess yeah Groundhog Day. If Bortles shows progress. This year maybe it was a little premature to think this would be the year they got better.

Next year, if Bortles is healthy and plays well down the stretch here, yeah, maybe there is. Somebody will fall for it again. What do they have to like on defense? So that's the problem. What do they have to like? On defense. Nothing.

Well, they're going to have the number two overall pick in the draft. Maybe they can grab someone there. Right. That's what we're talking about. They went all offense this year. They got picked up receivers early quarterback. They need offensive linemen. This year is, I'm not even saying this, like, facetiously.

This year is a resounding success if Blake Bortles is four-fifths as good as we think he is. I agree with you. It's all that matters. It is so hard to find a guy like that. And everything else this year is going to be gravy. All right, so those are the three-four teams. It's over. If you're a fan of those teams.

It's official. Yep, look toward next year. Also. It's over, man. It's like October 1st. Also, Rams and Bucks fans count yourself lucky because I had you on the fork list and you were saved by one other member.

We met and spoke about it. They just, they are alive. So if you're a fan of that team, be excited. Those teams, yeah, still alive. Be excited for your 4 and 12 season. Finally. West, this game, the stick a fork in the segment is right up your alley.

I love it. It does bring out the teeth. We'll move on finally, we go, the Thursday night game, the Green Bay Packers at home coming up a really nice win where they got their mojo back a little bit against the Bears. Now, in come the Vikings who had a really nice winner their own at home against the Falcons in which Teddy Bridgewater looked great. The big question, and we don't know because he's questionable for the game, is will Teddy Bridgewater play? He has an ankle issue. You know, if he's 50, 50 to play.

We could have a situation, unfortunately, where Christian Ponder is going into Lambeau field in prime time. We don't want that. We want to see more Teddy, right? Well, Christian Ponder does have a history, not of going into Lambo of winning, but of beating the Packers in a huge spot to send the Minnesota Vikings to the playoffs.

It doesn't get much bigger in the regular season. He had over eight yards per throw in that game, three touchdowns. Who knows? Maybe Christian Pond. And then he didn't even play the next week. That was weird. They have to bring him back from his banishment in Siberia to actually have him start the game.

I really hope Bridgewater plays because he had about as exciting a first start as you could have. I know you watched them closely, Chris. I thought he was even more impressive than Blake Bortles. Last week, I agree. With the caveat that Bortles was actually running a full offense, and Norv Turner called a great game and basically did what the bills were supposed to try and successfully do with Manuel. He gave him a lot of play action, a lot of interning routes, slants, curls, crossers, and Bridgewater, I'm sure you saw the same thing.

His accuracy between the numbers was incredible. Well, he didn't face any pressure, so you're not going to get that in most games. I mean, the Falcon's pass rush was totally absent. Bridgewater could do what he wanted, but he was so accurate. And the thing that I didn't know, because I didn't watch him as much in college, he's just such a good improviser when the play does break down in terms of getting away from pressure and the spin moves and the speed and then throwing on the run or scrambling.

Which is why I don't like to. of comparisons pre-draft to Andy Dalton because that's Andy Dalton's big weakness facing pressure. I thought Bridgewater looked great. And then even for all that coaching that Norv Turner did, more like a poor man's Aaron Rogers just without the big arm. All right. Whoa. All right.

For all that coaching, Norve did when the Falcons came back to take the leave, they kind of took the shackles off of Bridgewater and let him play. And he came back and moved the offense really well. What got lost in that game was Bridgewater didn't just play well. had 558 yards of offense. That was against an NFL defense. So it wasn't just bridgewiner, too. Kind of an NFL defense. Technically.

Jerich McKinnon. Looked great. Look pretty sweet. And Asiata, you know, they rushed for 240 yards in that game. I don't think this is a walkover for Green Bay. I think we know who Matt Asiata is. Right. He had a good game because of the defense he was

facing. Right. But if Jared McKinnon can be a weapon on a weekly basis, that's big. You know how fast McKinnon is? He's a type of fast that he can slow down in the middle of his run and just start sort of gliding while he's sort of looking at what everyone else is doing and they just go buy him and then he speeds back up might be the best athlete at running back in the NFL who needs adrian peterson the viking too not cool but uh anyway i think uh all right we just talked about the vikings almost the whole

time but do any of us think that they're going to pull it off here it's kind of hard to pick them No, not on a short week, but if Bridgewater is playing, I think they have been equally good as the Packers this year overall as a team. And for those of you on Twitter that have pointed out that the Vikings should be a team of ATL consideration, we'll see what happens after this game. I don't know, the Peterson thing is. It's tough. It's bad.

All right, so that's it for today's version, today's edition of the Around the NFL podcast. will be back Thursday night of quick turnaround. We're going to preview all of week five games, go over the Minnesota Green Bay game and talk about that with the gentleman that will be covering that for the run of the NFL team. But until then, this is Dan Hansa, signing off for the mailman, the boss, and T.D. Behind the Glass. Until Thursday. Here lies the Oakland Raiders, who thought Matt Schaub would take them.

to the Super Bowl and now believe Tony Soprano let me do that again sorry he's not Tony Spirano okay okay yeah this is an I heart podcast