NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal - Wentz's debut & QB rankings

Episode Date: August 13, 2016

A room filled with heroes -- Dan Hanzus, Gregg Rosenthal, Chris Wesseling and Colleen Wolfe -- discuss the latest news including Tyrod Taylor's contract extension. The heroes then break down the first day of preseason games including Paxton Lynch's debut for Denver. They wrap the show by examining ESPN's recent quarterback rankings.Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comNFL Daily YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/nflpodcastsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hey, everybody, before your show, this is Alex Kelhar from the Fantasy Live podcast telling you to check out our latest episode where we talk about preseason football. It's back, and we've got some takes for you guys. We also dive into the AFC North and add more listeners to the fan leagues. Check up the episode on NFL.com slash podcast, iTunes, your favorite podcast app. Now enjoy your show.

The Around the NFL podcast. Secretly Pines to open a lakeside bed in breakfast. Welcome back to another edition of the Around the NFL podcast. My name is Dan Hansis and I am joined by a room filled with heroes. Colleen Wolfe, Chris Wessling and Greg Rosenthal. What's up, boys? And woman, woman with a Y, not an A. Hey, Dan, I don't know about you in a hat.

I am, no, I look good in a hat. But this is not the hat. This is the wrong hat. This was a hat that was just... You don't look at in this hat. No. And by the way, coming at me, I brought this up before the show. Certain hats, you know, are terrible hats.

This is a bad hat. It's an NFL giveaway hat. Super Bowl 48. It's like a gym hat. And I didn't have the product in my hair. Didn't have it controlled the quaff. I need a haircut. How long have you had that in your car?

A couple weeks. My wife yelled at me over the weekend because it was a bad hat as well. Dad hat. She didn't listen to her. It's a dad hat. it is look see even the front of it like you can collapse it because it's so ppped out in the top you're all dad like where kaleen's just hanging loose in her bob marley sure it's my off day but i'm here for you guys wait i thought you were in today no i'm off that's why i've rolled in like this oh wow we thank you for filling in on uh short notice mark sessler has things he is also off and he was going to come in but he couldn't so picked up the bat phone got connie fox on the line we haven't had you out enough lately It's been a little while. You know, Connie's starting to really make waves in the industry.

It's true. Particularly with NFL media. You've been, not even sparrows, just the television, switch it on. Yeah. And there's Connie at Rams camp doing dispatches, looking very professional, even punching back at the man by not wearing the polo shirts. I didn't wear the polo. That was very good.

Yeah. Well, I did a couple hits last week with Ian Rappaport, and he was like, it's weird to see you professional. And I'm like, really? Really, Ian? That sounds like you. You too had some chemistry there. Thank you.

Yeah. I said, you know, Colleen is doing a great job when she makes Ian seem human. That's what I meant. I can't believe you. I think I got texts from all of you. Maybe not West, but yeah. No, I just tweet out your work. Yes, that's right.

Yeah. We got to get Ian back on the show. Just check in on how he's doing, especially in light of this, this new partnership. Yeah, I brought his suits back to the office. I mean, we're basically my best friends now, yeah. Well, that's good. Have the shadowy league figures come down on you for refusing to wear the polos?

I've just been trying to fly under the rain. Well, you know what? I heard something that it's almost weird that any of the women wear the polos because it's not required of the women. And they almost think it's a weird. Maybe that hasn't been communicated out, but that's what I heard. Well, after the first day, I didn't wear the polo. I came in and there was a stack of polos like in the dressing room area.

Classic Corpo message. Right. So I didn't wear the next day. And then somebody said, oh, they were just in there like for an option. Next week you're going to come in. It'll be a horse's head with the polo on the horse. By the way, Wes is wearing the polo we're talking about. Well, you know my policy.

If you give me free clothing, I will wear it. Amen. Amen, brother. Dream out loud. nice episode today Friday episode TGIF Greg thank God it's Friday we'll be doing Friday shows the next

three weeks I believe throughout the preseason next three weeks Friday shows yep absolutely true because we want to be able to react to some of the preseason games which we'll do today because football began on Thursday with some preseason contests although don't get to upset everybody out there

and you should read my Friday end around column where I talk about that very thing, self-promotion. These results don't matter, but there are things to look for, and that's what we're going to talk about. There's certainly things to take out of preseason games, just not the final scores. I always get so excited for preseason, and, like, I sit down and start watching, and then I remember it's preseason. I kind of feel the same. Every time. But Greg, you do a nice job.

I do notice in your excellent what we learned piece that you wrote last night. I don't think there was a single final score in the what we learned. Oh, yeah, you don't have to worry about that. Who cares? Anyway, so we will talk about what happened on Thursday. Several games took place. Also, we wanted to touch on something that came out earlier this week, but it's interesting, so we should talk about it.

ESPN's quarterback rankings, which if it was just some reporter, some jabroney. Some Gibroni over at the worldwide leader giving his rankings, like stuff that we do, where you do every week. Are you calling him just. I would be that to Brone. I mean, this isn't, I think you're right.

This isn't even ESPN. This is really the NFL. This is Mike Sando, I believe, reaching out to all the coaches and various front office personnel across the NFL landscape. So while this is not a perfect list, it definitely has some more credibility. What's so funny, Colleen?

No, nothing. Kind of smirk. Is it my hat? No, well, you keep itching your head too. It's itchy. It's not a good hat. It's fine. That Bob Marley shirt.

You know what I'm saying? What are you saying? What are you saying? I think you know. Oh, okay. So we will, yes, talk about the ESPN quarterback rankings and see if we agree, disagree and what have you. But before that, we do have to hit a little bit of news. And to do that, not only is Mark Sessler out today, Mark floating around with his MacBook, his new MacBook.

He's a Japanese anime character now through Los Angeles. Also out today, the Irishman. In his place, Sully. What's up, ladies and gents? And you're wearing one of my favorite. You wear these different fishing shirts. I have the white one on today. He has Sully, Sean Sullivan, who does great work here, a real, a utility man.

He likes windbreakers, too, a lot. He likes windbreakers. He likes things that are orange or lime green. Well, he has three of the same exact shirt. Right. They're fishing shirts. You open up in his closet. It's just like 73 versions of the fishing shirt.

Color coordinated. Off white color, which you're wearing today. Yes, yes, white. You have the green shirt. It's like a kind of green, what you call? Like flavorized lime. Yeah, lime green shirt. It's an ugly lime green now.

And then the third one is... I have a Tennessee one. Oh, it's Tennessee. Balls. Yeah. It's a good look. All right. Let's do some news.

It's football time. Way better. That was a good one. Irishman, look out. Sully's coming for the title. Living in America. I worked hard on that. And I, yeah, it's, I'm stoked.

I'm stoked it's back. That was Sully's entire work this week. It's well done. Just the right amount of over the top. All right. Here we go. One big news item before we get into what we talked about earlier. Tyrod Taylor is under contract or an extension with the Buffalo Bills,

signs a six-year deal. But of course, and, you know, I've been talking about. This frustrates me. It's not really a six-year deal. I don't really know what it is. But this is from what I can understand, this is a raise. All right, six years, $92 million, it says. Sounds like a lot.

Which is outrageous. And the reason it's outrageous is because it's not even real. It might as well say 37 years for $7 trillion. Because it be the same nonsense. But really what it is, Greg, and help me out with this. You're good with this stuff. And you were talking to your boy, Barnwell. on Twitter I saw.

Nine million this year. Yep. Nine and a half. That wasn't a shot. It seemed like it. Was it? A little disparaging. No, no shot.

I mean, it was a little condescending, but we're hardly insiders. All right, but you're smart guys. Nine and a half million this year, which is a substantial raise, but it's still far less than any premier quarterback. It's even less than Ryan Fitzpatrick. And then a $27 million figure next year, but he'll never play under that figure, correct? No, I think he does have a chance to play under that figure. I'm so confused.

Well, the problem is when we're taping this podcast, we don't even have all the details. But the reality is he got a raise this year to a well-deserved raise from three to nine and a half million. He is now getting paid less than Ryan Fitzpatrick, 24th on the list of average salary. So he is very low on there. Then it turns into an option where they can pick up a long-term deal, which essentially would be what? five years, $85 million. Who knows something around $18, $17 million a year, which is about average for the starting cord box.

I suspect all that $27 million is the first year. The second year will be much lower. It'll basically be a two or three year extension that they can pick up that option. He's going to have to play well to get it, but I think he has a chance. That makes sense? Yes, a little bit. This is a one year $9.5 million contract. Right.

But I think there's a decent chance. This is where we disagree. If he plays well, that they'll get it. They wouldn't give it to him otherwise. How can you say it without seeing the third and the fourth years? I almost promise you it's a three-year. A $27.5 million option is a hell of an option. And this gives the bills a chance to pick up his option if he becomes an all-pro or MVP.

Look, I think that this was great because if they did not sign him, three things could have happened. One, if he didn't play well, then he would have walked away and they would have saved all this money. Two, if he did play well, then they'd have to probably overpay him the following season. And three, if he did play well, well, maybe they wouldn't have been able to afford him and they would have to let him go in free agency. And that would be even worse. Absolutely. And I don't think they give him.

That's why it feels weird. It's almost silly to argue about it because you need to see the details. But what I would strongly guess is that the second and third year parts of the deal are going to be fairly low. It'll go down to like 10 or 11. and it'll be basically they have the option to pick up a three-year 40, $45, $50 million contract after that where he's paid like a normal starting quarterback. And why wouldn't they do that if he has a good year? If he is a little better this year than they was the year before,

that's very similar to the structure of many guys like Kaepernick or Tana Hill or Stafford where you get a lot of money up front and that's their security. If he misses three games again and fails to see Sammy Watkins open over the middle again, And I don't think, I think he has to play much better than he did last year. And you know why I think that? Because all offseason, Doug Whaley has said he has a chance to be a franchise quarterback. Not he already is one. Let me just throw another thing out there.

So they gave him this money and they got the deal done. But why couldn't you have just had him play under this deal? And he makes the $3 million or whatever that he was due to make. And then if he lights it up, you renegotiate then. Or if you can't get that done, put this franchise tag on it. They've got Stefan Gilmer might need the franchise tech. Here's why, because they had him over a barrel, but it was patently unfair to be paying a starting quarterback

with no competition that played well $3 million, especially when he's not a rookie. But he's a starter. I mean, he is getting paid less than Chad Henney. He's getting paid less than Matt Moore was a couple years ago. And you've got to look at a guy that you've got to, at some point, be fair. Imagine if it'd be like us, you know, think about yourself in a situation, like that. You suddenly have your own show

on NFL Network every night at 7 o'clock and they got you locked in at this low podcast rate. Only you got bronchitis and missed like a fourth of the season and then the other half of the games the other half of the shows you weren't that good. It's like I don't, if I get to raise this because I feel like I deserve it. I think it works

for both sides though. Being a starter is deserving it, period. That's enough. I mean, he was okay. I'd take him over Ryan Fitzpatrick. It works for both sides because if he plays well this year, then he's going to get paid. and the organization isn't necessarily overpaying for him. They're paying him a fair amount if he does play well.

So it was a goodwill gesture, more than anything else. I think that was part of it. I think they were trying to be fair to him. And I think, Wes, you know, I think you're right. He will have to play better. Maybe we can disagree on what's better or a lot better. He's going to have to take a big step. Which is no small thing because he exceeded expectations.

Absolutely. I mean, people forget that's a top 10 offense last year. Six years, but going back to my point, the second paragraph of the article on NFL.com has six years, 92 million. I need all the agents and the GMs and the NFL insiders to get in the same room together and figure the shit out. You're never going to get the agents to do that. No. Let's figure it out for the people. The agents probably went even more inflated numbers out there.

I know, but that's not right. We need to figure this out. The bills are doing the right thing here, as Greg suggested, the agent. need to do the right thing. All right. Connie Fox's last word is yours. I would like them to have... I would like there to be some type of class on the cap

if that was available. I think that would really help everybody out a little bit. To be like three people signed up for that class. I would be in the front row. A class. I was just going to say, in my car right now, it's just filled with binders. Because when I moved out of my old house,

I found a stack of binders, and I kind of felt bad throwing them all away. BinderMobile. I know. I'm like hoarding binders. at this point in my car. Wasn't it, wasn't it Mitt Romney

who was impressed with women with lots of binders? I believe it was. That's great. Hubba, hubbo. We're going to bring that back. All right. You want to bring back

Mitt Romney's binders? Binder bits with Mitt Romney. All right, that's what's happening. In the news, all right. Binders full of women. That's what he had. Binders full of women that you would hire. All right, guys.

Let's talk about it. Football back on Thursday night, six games. Very good, very good, Sully. And Greg, as I said, or I alluded to, but now I'll say it outright, Greg wrote a banger, what we learned, colon, Broncos QB battle remains tight. And that was the headline of his What We Learned column, where we touched on all the games and all the action that happened.

So Greg, we're going to start with you here. What was your biggest takeaway starting in Denver, or I should say Chicago? Well, I think that was the game to watch because it's the defending Super Bowl champions with the starting quarterback job up for grab. So I wanted to see how those guys played. And you saw Mark Sanchez's career in a nutshell in three drives, a perfect first drive where he made a lot of nice throws. Probably one of the least impressive throws was his 32-yard touchdown because the Marius Thomas

was wide open, but he took some big hits. He was decisive. He took a hit on that throw, right? Yeah. And you're thinking, you're thinking, okay, Sanchez is going to take a big lead. And that's kind of how all the Denver writers, you know, said it after the game. I was surprised with that. But the next two drives, bad decision, interception, three and out, and then he's out of the game.

And then Trevor Simeon comes in. I thought Trevor Simeon looked like kind of a professional quarterback. He looked good. Some pocket presents, a couple nice throws. You can only take so much from a quarter, but he had them kicking a field goal in three of his four drives. And I came away with that. It was kind of confirming everything you heard about this preseason that Simeon's a little safer. and Sanchez is more up and down.

That's what you get with him. Three throws from Trevor Simeon that I loved, and I'm not sure Mark Sanchez can do. He had a skinny post right off the bat where he gets the receiver right in the hands. The beautiful back shoulder that should have been a touchdown to Benny Fowler, but he couldn't pull it in.

And then right before the half, rolling out in the pocket right by the sideline, throws a bullet right down the field and puts him in field goal range. I believe the field goal was blocked, but he put him in that right. Where was Paxton Lynch and all this? Well, he played the whole second half

and they didn't score offensively in the second half and on one of his runs and on a couple of his throws, you could see, man, he has a big arm. Oh, he's got a huge arm. He's got a hose, and he's very athletic, but he looked like a rookie that wasn't ready for the big stage yet. You know, he held the ball a while, took some sacks. And so it kind of all confirmed what the writers who have been watching practices have said.

How about that defense, too? I mean, you look at what they did. They had seven sacks in the game, and they didn't have Von Miller, DeMarcus Ware, Akib Talib, Chris Harris. I know it's preseason, but they looked so. good. I looked at that from the bear's point of view. They have major issues at center that showed up throughout the game and David

Fails should probably never play in the preseason again. Well, it really hurts them that their guy went down. Right. That's the thing that it's the second and you're watching backups and third, you know, stringers most of the game. But so it's tough to truly evaluate. But the quarterbacks, you know, I think the longer this goes, Kubiak's got to think if Simeon is a little safer, like he's more careful with the ball.

Doesn't he have a higher upside? He's a second-year player. He's a pretty athletic, too. He can move. I liked it. I like the idea of Simeon starred, and I think there might not be three or four quarterbacks in the league with a stronger arm than Paxton Lynch. Like for the future, he's intriguing. Well, yeah, there was one throw where he threw it all the way across the field on a deep out,

and he was all the way beyond the left hash mark, and he threw it to the right side line. And you just don't see it. Like, Cam Newton makes that throw great. You know, Aaron Rogers makes it, but not a lot of quarterbacks make that throw. All right. move on to the 75,000 time AFC East champion in England Patriots who, of course, are preparing to have Jimmy Garoppolo

as their starting quarterback for the first four weeks of the season. Tom Brady did not play in this game. Garapolo did. Didn't do a lot, but didn't do poorly either. Just kind of existed. I can't figure Jimmy Garoppolo out. There are some things he does pretty well. There's nothing that he's terrible out.

I wasn't really impressed with his pocket presence. He's never going to throw down the field. It was okay. But it doesn't, I don't feel good about the Patriots with him in the lineup. They also had some issues too at receiver. They were missing a lot of the guys out there too. Missing their top three receivers and then probably their biggest takeaway of the game is their fourth. Malcolm Mitchell had an elbow injury and he looked good.

People, by the way, fantasy leaguers getting in on Chris Hogan. There's a reason why he hasn't had any big seasons in his career. He's a role player. I think he's going to be a role player for this team. I don't think he's going to put up big numbers. There's an assumption, and it's founded in a lot of success the guys have had that if you go to New England, they bring the best out of you. So I think obviously what people are basing it off.

Didn't work for Chad Johnson or Joey Galloway. But I think the best for him could be, you know, 700 yards, and he's helping a great team. And, you know, and he's helping on. Right, and he's helping some special teamers. But Malcolm Mitchell, to me, at a higher ceiling. So that could hurt them. I'm with you on Grappolo.

That's why when I did this watch a watch, ability rankings piece looking at the preseason, what teams to watch in the preseason. And I didn't want to put the pats too high because of Garapolo, just because I feel like I've seen Garapolo in the preseason. I want to see him in the regular season. But I'm with you. He doesn't get you going, but I think he could just be good enough that he kind of keep, he doesn't mess things up.

I think it's good that you guys are even saying this because I don't, I'm not hearing. I think a lot of people are under the assumption that the Patriots are just going to cruise in Garapolo because of the pedigree and where he's coming from. He's going to step in the lineup and take care of business. But we still don't have any evidence that the guy can play yet. Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen. On the flip side, you have to keep in mind, he wasn't playing with Gronk and Julian Edelman and Amandola.

Right, and Nate sold to look terrible. To me, that was a bigger concern because he's coming off a terrible year last year, and you kind of think he'll bounce back. He's in the middle of his career. I also give the hope that he's going to look better in the regular season. That's the thing about the preseason. It's just, it's different football. So I don't know.

maybe he'll react well to playing in real games, but I've seen him a lot in the preseason. We'd be remiss if we didn't talk about Michael Thomas. I'm so excited about Michael Thomas. Let's hear it. High five, baby. All right, let's do that. That's what I was so excited at watching him.

See? I'm stepping right in. But just thank God the Saints have somebody else that can catch passes on that team because Drew Brees last year he threw for so many yards, but he was throwing to like Brandon Cooks and who else? Benjamin Watson? Willie Sneed. Willie Sneed, yeah.

So this guy, he really looks like he could be good. Now, this might be one of those preseason hives where he gets drafted too high in fantasy and people think he's going to be really great. But he was the fourth option out there last night, and he's going to be higher than that. Well, and he's confirming that's what you like out of the preseason. It's kind of like how people treat the combine for the draft. You kind of want to see it confirm what you think about a player. And Michael Thomas has been among the busiest players in the league.

And so for him to have a couple big highlight reel grabs and, four catches and big production. I think it's taken them so long to get a nice young nucleus around Drew Breesing and now they have it because Cooks is good and Brandon Coleman doesn't need to have a big role. Steed's a good player. Like they have a great little running, a great running back group.

It's a nice offense around Breezing there. Oh, go ahead. My takeaway from Michael Thomas was he's, they've been saying no long he's going to step right into the Marcus Colston rule. And for years, Marcus Colston was the biggest slot receiver in the NFL. Well, Michael Thomas is making these plays down the sideline deep. He's playing outside the numbers. Yeah, he looks like a much more explosive player than Colston.

Big update. Grossest sports injuries power rankings. Oh. Wow, this is an update from a few years ago, I think. Last August, actually, in fact. Last year's ranking Dislocated Elbow, which poor Malcolm Mitchell suffered, of course, on Thursday night. last year ranked number five dislocated elbow oh it is flipping spots with number four last year collapsed slash punctured lung oh god so punctured lung drops to five the top three remain the same

number three ruptured achilles tendon number two muscle torn from bone number one compound fracture this is disgusting compound fracture you know dominant in that number one so katie ladecky like oh yeah no okay moving on Carson Wentz. Let's talk a little Wentz. Mark Sessler wrote about Wentz. His debut with the Eagles, the number two overall pick in the draft, of course. Workmanlike showed some things, according to Mark. One thing that jumped out to me, guys,

and I don't know if you guys got a chance to watch Wentz yet, but Pro Football Focus noted that he had a 0.0 pass rating of dropbacks under pressure. So, you know, that's a classic thing that rookies have to deal with in all quarterbacks. but obviously another work in progress there. I kind of wish Mark was here because I don't want to pick on him, but I saw a different game than he saw when I read what he wrote. He saw a guy with a lot of talent and athletic ability. I saw that too, but I saw a guy whose mechanics are a mess.

His footwork is awful. It reminds me of Blake Bortles from – Blake Bortle's August of his rookie year played really well because Jordan Palmer had worked with his mechanics. But Tom House, the great quarterback guru, has always said, every game of the year, a quarterback loses 1% of his mechanics. And I think Blake Bortle's probably lost 5% every game as rookie year. That's what Wentz looked like to me.

The pass protection was so bad, though, that it was tough. Even when he was standing in, his footwork was like Cam Newton's footwork. There was only a couple plays where he in Mayock at one point, Mike Mayak, who was announcing the game, really asked for it. He wanted to see him just stand in there and throw a ball from the pocket where he had a second to throw it. There was only a couple throws like that. Now they weren't that accurate. That was what worried me more.

But he's more like Jake Locker, where he's better throwing on the run. I talked to a GM who said that when he was evaluating both him and golf and some of the other quarterbacks, he said that he was really impressed with Carson Wentz's mind, that he's really, really smart. And he's one of the smartest quarterbacks he ever met and talked to. But he said that his accuracy, especially on deep balls, is really off and really needs to improve. Does he know where the sun rises? I think it'll be a few years before we see a 60%.

completion rate out of Carson West. See, I think we should be very, I think we got to be hesitant. Like, I really held off even tweeting something about him because I didn't want to have a hot takeoff of a couple quarters. But I think mechanics are different. Right. But you don't know what's going through his mind. Like, everything going through these guys' mind at this point is different than it will be

even in a month. I get that. And that can change. And I think he has a bright future. I think he's got a lot of Big Ben. He's got a lot of Andrew Luck and Blake Bortles to his game. but I think if you look at his mechanics, you can see that it's going to be a long process.

I watched him and I thought Cam Newton. That's what I thought too. Cam Newton's not a 60% thrower either. No, because his, first of all, his rookie preseason, if we wanted to bring it back to that, people were losing their minds because he looked terrible and he was inaccurate and he didn't look like the speed of the game

looked too much for him. And then he showed up in week one and he played well. He had a nice rookie season. But he could make an unblocked defender miss. I mean, he's so athletic. You could see the arm strength. He got beat up.

And like Cam Newton, he just kind of, like, he'll get beat up and just stand there and take it. Almost maybe to a fault. We'll have to see. I think we're agreeing here. Yeah, no, we are. He's got a major upside, but he's raw. And Cam Newton still, until the last eight games of last year, was never a really good passer. Yeah.

One other quarterback from that game, by the way, is watching it downstairs before we came up. You know, we hear about this guy every, every offseason. Oh, where's Mike Lennon going? Where's he going to go? He's got such a stud. You want to talk about bad footwork. Every throw I saw and is watching downstairs, he's throwing off his back foot through a terrible interception.

Mike Lennon. Both of those reasons he hasn't been traded yet. It's better off him just being the backup that everybody talks about. There has to be a level of concern. It's only the preseason. You can't get too carried away. But I think the Eagles offensive line, which we talked about last show, there's got to be a little bit of concern that they don't have depth of

tackle that it's a big drop off with lane johnson out and that showed up and games too and i think tampa should be excited and again it's just it's just the preseason but nois spence has earned a starting job right off the bat and he looks like they're past russ he looks like he's going to be a good player robert airs who people at twitter a couple of guys on twitter were like oh robert airs he had one good robert air has been good for a few years so robert air spence and mccoy that's three good players. And Levanti David, if he gets back to being Levanti David, suddenly that buck's defense pretty good.

By the way, did you hear the crowd go wild for once when he came in? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Philadelphia Eagles. I think their receivers might be, you know, when Jordan Matthews isn't on the field, that's the worst receiver group in the league. It's not even close, right? Chase Daniel looked terrible.

The L.A. Rams are like, what about us? No, I mean, that's what I mean. If you take Matthews off the field, it's not even close. They were getting excited about Ruben. They really need Aguilar to step up, and there's been no indication just from the reports in Mayak talking, for instance, last night that he's going to. Let's move on the Washington Redskins at Atlanta Falcons. And Greg, you had a little bit of concern about the backfield there, Matt Jones, and Keith Marshall had seven carries and did not get a single yard. Yeah, you don't want to get too crazy.

It was more of their offensive line guy. I like that, Greg, you're offering that qualifier every single time. We're got it. We're with you. Okay, okay. But we're talking about the games. Yeah. Yeah, I wanted to see Keith Marshall because we've heard about him,

and, you know, he had negative yard on five carries. There was no room for him or Matt Jones to run. But I'd like to flip it the other way and just give some credit to the Falcons defense. I like that young linebacker duo of Jones and Devondry Cambril. They're suddenly a faster group, and those guys are going to start, and they're just going to look different, and you have Keanu Neal in the back. It's just, it's something to watch that they, suddenly got these speedy guys that they think can play right away.

And they've been talked up a lot in camp. And again, it was confirmed. They had a great game and they were flying around the field. That was my main takeaway from this game. Dionne Jones and Devandre Campbell, the two rookie linebackers. Because Brooks Reed and Paul Warlow are decent starters. But you're going to have a below average defense if those guys are in your lineup. If Dion Jones and Devondry Campbell have a chance to start and be an improvement,

as rookies, like Greg said, they're going to be a lot faster. That shob looked good, everybody. Who knew that the mic was excited in the office. That shopped to Aldrich Robinson Deepball is the most effective play of the night. Greg is like pitching himself when we were watching it downstairs. I literally was trash talking Wes and Wes wasn't even in the office. I was like, Schaub's throwing that to stick it in your eye, Wes. It's like he's back.

He's been working on that shoulder. I don't know. One of those throws. No question his arm is stronger than it was two years ago in Raiders camp. Yeah. But that happened. Not even sticking in your ear, sticking in his eye. Right in his eye.

Ouch. That's when you're really sticking it to someone. Oh. All right. Let's talk about the Baltimore Ravens who knocked off the defending NFC champion, Carolina Panthers, 2219 at M&T Bank Stadium, guys. No. But Terrence West, who people are bullish about this guy in this room,

he looked very good in this game, had some moments where he looked explosive, scored twice. Wes, you're excited. Well, I want to see the next two weeks. He's still on track. He looked better than his numbers would suggest. I thought he was very decisive, put one foot in the ground, got up field. I thought he was the most impressive running back.

I saw Thursday night. That's a bold statement. But yeah, that makes sense. He had about three or four runs that were really good. I mean, again, it was continuing a theme, a guy that's lit up camp, lighting up the preseason shots of power. I also like Kenneth Dixon. Me too.

Big guy downhill, broke tackles on three or four runs. there was a run in the fourth quarter, and this is where it's tricky because you're playing against third teamers, but a big guy in the hole with some quick feet that made people miss, and I suddenly thought, you know what, the Ravens are fine at running back. I think they're going to feel like they're fine between West and you have Dixon as a guy on the goal line that you'll probably work in, and who knows what four set's going to give you, and you're fine. Buck Allen.

Buck Allen should be the best receiver in that group. He's just a much better receiver than runner. Yeah, and it can only help Joe Flacco, too, coming off that injury to have such a nice deep backfield. Well, it makes me think Forcett's not, there's a chance that's not,

there's a chance for set doesn't make the team, then, depending on how healthy he is. Because if you've got two young guys playing that well. Although John Harbaugh said he looked like Justin Forset pre-injury, and, you know, Harbaugh's been effusive in his praise of Forset. He didn't even play, which suggests he's locked in. But we'll see.

I thought it stood out that the depth in the backfield compared to Carolina, which if Jonathan Stewart goes down, they're in trouble. Yeah. Finally, let's head to the Meadowlands where the New York Jets open there,

preseason slate against the Jaguars, and it was the one-year anniversary of the punch. I.K. and Impali, knocking out Gino Smith. Gino on the field actually gets booed by his home fans for when he throws a couple incompletions to start. But, you know,

great job, Jets fans, booing the guy who gets punched out that was your starting quarterback. He was never the starting quarterback, you know, going into last season. He was. He was the favorite. He was the favorite. You know, who cares? The starting court.

The point is, and you tweeted, you're all excited. He's already had a much better career than Christian Hakenberg or Bright Petty ever will, and they're booing the crap out of him. And they probably love those guys. There's no nothing, there's no much better career than anyone. He's been terrible. Greg, still on this hill. You'll die on this hill.

This is what Greg wrote, and is what we learned, in fact, which I actually enjoyed it. After getting booed, he bounced back to throw a go-ahead 17-yard touchdown because that's what Gino Smith does. That had to be tongue and cheek, right? What do you mean? Like, he's, like, known as some type of warrior in the face of adversity? You know, sometimes you have little running jokes to yourself. Every time, every time I write about Gino Smith on our website, I allude to his greatness. Okay. I make sure. All right, now I'm with you. Now I liked it. And the other side of the ball, Alan Robinson, stud looked amazing. And D. Milner's going to have nightmares. I couldn't even get mad at D. Miller. He misplayed one ball on a deep ball where he could

have probably played it more aggressively. But in general, Alan Robinson didn't look like he could be covered. Marquis Lee made an amazing catch down the sideline. Blake Bortles was spinning it. That offense looked really good. I love their first team offense. Blake Bortle seemed more in control than he did last year too. And then the Ivory yelled in tag team.

It's good when Ivory doesn't have to carry the ball 15 to 20 times. Oh, this is the best time for Ivory. Yeah. From now till November, you're going to get one of the best running backs of the league. Well, they signed him with the right idea. Don't make him your workhorse. Make him a committee. back. I like everything about this

often. And I think it was the right idea for Yeldin too, who's good but not great. You know, I don't think you need to give him 350 touches. And back to the Jets QBs, Ryan Fitzpatrick knocked the rust off a little bit there threw a touchdown, didn't have a turnover, so

I was good to see. I think that this year, I'm pretty high on them too. I think that they looked really good yesterday. Yeah, they do. I mean, the Jets defense looked like, but they couldn't, they could not stop that first team. So, yeah, I mean, I've been vocal.

Let me see Blake Bordell's really put it all together, and he led the league in interceptions last year. But what I saw yesterday, that was pretty scary. You've got to be excited if you're a Jags fan. You can't have a newcomer come in and steal a show. All right, so there you go. Good recap of Thursday's action. When we come back, the next show on Monday,

we will talk about the rest of the games from the weekend. So make sure you tune in for that. Let's move on now, guys, and talk about ESPN's QB rankings. I think they had a fancy title for it. Should I respect them and find out what the fancy title was? Sando's Day of Dominance. The QB Tier Rankings. QB Tier rankings.

Thank you. And that's a great way to get into it, Connie Fox, because let me break down the tiers. They break it into four tiers, and these are what the tiers were. Tier one. Quarterbacks can carry their teams week after week and contend for championships without as much help

and only three quarterbacks in that tier. Tom Brady and Aaron Rogers. Oh, what a cop out. Tied for first. Big Ben, number three. And I believe Big Ben moves up to the first tier from the second tier last year. And it's important.

This, again, is coming from coaches and front office officials. And they have only three guys viewed as the cream of the crop. Greg, your thoughts on that? Well, I love this late career appreciation of just how good Ben Rathisberger is, and it took him getting the right coach and talent and stats, where I really think he's been close to this type of tier throughout his career, that he's been that good, and they've had different offenses. He's gotten even better, and that's kind of my takeaway looking at that tier.

My takeaway was just reading the comments. You know, last year, I remember at the end of the year, Greg and I would tweet how great Big Ben was playing, and people would point to his interceptions. Mike Sando said every, out of the 42 coaches and executives he talked to, there wasn't one complaint about his interceptions because they knew how well he was throwing the ball, that he can make any throw on the field. And here's a quote from a quarterback's coach. He is a stud.

He does some shit that is just off the map. There are some things that fall apart and he gets off schedule and that guy just makes plays. He has a hose. He is huge. He is so hard to bring down. He is competitive. He is gritty.

He is smart. We played him the past year, and our defense struggled that day because of him. That guy can win for you every week. Can I throw out, and I love Big Ben as well, but one bit of, you know, what you would call it? Devils. Advocate? Oh, wow. Devils eggs?

It's right. It's the hat. It is the hat. His splits last year, he was very mortal without Martavis Bryant statistically last year. That will hurt him. I mean, as good as he is, that guy was a superstar, a breakout superstar, not going to happen for the entire year. If you're saying that Tier 1 is can carry his team each week

and the team wins because of him, why isn't Cam Newton in there based on what he was able to do last year? I think the key word, part of their description for Tier 1 was consistency. And their complaint was in the first half of the season, he was a poor passer. It wasn't until the second half of the season that he started passing better than 55%. He could be at the top of this list if he doesn't. That was what he did last year in the second half.

And I think that's what everybody would agree on. Now, Tier 2. And just so you guys know, two quarterbacks from last year on this list dropped out of that tier 1, Drew Breeze and Andrew Luck. Here's Tier 2, which is 4 through 15. And this should make us all proud at the Iran and the NFL podcast, who was the last guy in Tier 2. Cam Newton, Drew Breeze, Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck, Phillip Rivers, 8, Eli Manning, sorry, Wes, 9, Carson Palmer, 10.

Tony Romo, Joe Flacko, Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, 14, interesting, and Andy Dalton 15. Colleen, who jumps out at you on that list for either not belonging or should have been higher or what? Well, I thought that I know last year was just sort of an anomaly for Andrew Luck, but I'm not sure about his placement on here. I would actually put him maybe a little bit lower. Would you put him in tier three? No, no, no, no, no, no. not tier three, but just maybe move him down a little bit on the list. Well, I should say what the tier is.

I would put him higher. Tier two QBs are, really? This is a quote, less consistent and need more help, but good enough to figure prominently into a championship equation. That means the people they talked to were really bothered by Andrew Luck season last year. Because Carson Palmer, I know that. He still seven, though. That's pretty high.

I would put Carson Palmer a little bit higher and maybe that would move Andrew Luck down a little bit lower. It really, the way Carson Palmer played in the postseason, I know it hurts him a lot. And that's what most of the negative comments came from from the executive. And that makes sense. But the reason they were so, a huge part of the reason why they were so successful was Carson Palmer. Well, let's unpack West.

You saying that luck, you would have him higher. So who on the list would you rank him ahead of that he is below? I would take him over Cam Newton, over Drew Brees. So both of those guys. I would have Russell Wilson higher to hire too. But here's one quote from Andrew Luck. That's bold. It's not bold.

I mean, you're agreeing with everyone else. I'm writing off last year as an injury-prone disaster. It doesn't even factor into the equation to me. So I understand. And you're not factoring. It does factor into other people. I get that.

You're not factoring the buzz around his camp this year that he's been a little up and down, which has been out there. Well, I've told you before. I don't really know if beat writers are qualified to really weigh in on that stuff. Okay. But here's one GM's quote. I'm much higher on Andrew Luck than a lot of people because I think the problem with Andrew Luck

is all that surrounding him sucks so bad, including their defense, that it impacts him as a player. There are days I want to put him as a one, but I will go high, high too right now. Yeah, I agree with all that, and I think he's about in the right spot. I probably have him maybe below rivers,

but that's about it. So I wouldn't change him too much. But I think, for instance, a Drew Brees, it makes sense right now that he's ahead of, him because you have seen Drew Breeze with a lot of things wrong around him and he doesn't he's had some seasons where he's thrown more interceptions like Andrew Luck does and he's had some seasons better than others but you don't have him have the type of stretch that Andrew Luck ever did and that's even before Andrew Luck reported injuries last year and I was about to get fired up about

Matthew Stafford at 14 and perhaps you could argue that Dalton should be ahead of him or Stafford should be way lower in this list but it does speak to again the Dalton scale or the Dalton line. Oh, that's so true. And the drop-up, because here we go. Let's move to. I'm really surprised, let's just say it, well, that Stafford's at high. I mean, aren't you guys surprised that Stafford would crack that tear?

Well, that's what I'm saying. The comments from the people who were interviewed was basically, he was inconsistent for several years because the coaching was so bad, and they really like what Jim Bob Cooter did with him. Coots. It is incredible. Go, Vols. What Jim Bob Cooter did.

Can he do it again? Cooter. All right. So here's Tier 3. This is labeled as quarterbacks who are good enough to start, but need lots of support, making it tougher to contend at the highest level. And you could argue Matthew Stafford this far in deserves to be in that class potentially as well. That's right. But here is Tier 3, number 16, Derek Carr, 17, James Winston, Alex Smith, Marcus Marietta, Kirk Cousins, number 20, J. Cutler, 21, Blake Bordles, 22, Teddy Bridgewater, 23, Ryan Tannahill,

24, Ryan Fitzpatrick 25, Tyrod Taylor, 26, Brock Osweiler, 27. And rounding out that list, Sam Bradford, right on the edge at number 28. Colleen, your thoughts? I was actually just going to look up to see what Tier 4 meant because I think a lot of these guys belong in Tier 4, and I'm not really sure why they're in three. Yeah, what does that mean? Tier 4 is typically, typically reserved for unproven starters or those who might not be expected to last in the lineup all season.

Voters use the fifth tier sparingly. Interesting. Okay. Because how can you really assess Brock Osweiler just on the sample size? How can you really put him in tier three? I think because under those qualifications, he is going to last in the lineup this season and he's seen as a long-term option, even if he hasn't done Jack to observe that. Well, here's who thought it.

John Elway did and Rick Smith thought he was that much because both of those guys were ready to make them, you know, big-time franchise quarterback offers. He wasn't, he was going to be a 16-game starter, and he's at the very bottom of it. It's tough. I think you have to keep in mind what this is really grading, which is a snapshot of right now. It's not who they would want to have. I don't think necessarily Marriota would be right next to Kirk Cousins on the want-a-have list, but it's where he's at in his development.

And I found it interesting. Winston is up there at 17, a couple spots ahead of Mariotta, ahead of Kirk Cousins. I like that, because I'm a Winston believer. I have two major issues with this tier. Marcus Marietta is way too low, and so is Blake Bortles. Yeah. And here's a quote about Marioita from a personnel director. The games he played, you watch him, he has poise.

He can run. He's a very good athlete. He can make all the throws. You just see a composed player. Coverage has kind of got him at times. He tried to force things, but those things are fixable. He is going to be a top five quarterback in the next few years. Totally agree.

I tend to agree and think he has a good chance to do that. And yet, man, I think there's a lot of people in around the league that just believe that Mike Malarkey is going to ruin him. I don't think that we're like some skeptical jerks that are just like taking pot shots at Mike Malarkey. I think he's in a bad situation right now and it's going to be tough. That's not Mario's fault. Can I offer a rejoinder? Please. It's absolutely the right thing to do.

to establish a strong running game and a dominant offensive line and protect Marioada from getting hit like he did last year when Ken Wisenhutman calling the plays. Well, let's see if they can accomplish any of that. Well, that's their plan. I think they got the right bodies this offseason to do that. I understand the skepticism about the play calling and scheme, I guess, but I think that's a smart thing to do to get a strong running game

and develop him and not have him taking hits on them. I mean, some of the numbers of Mike Malarkey's offenses, I saw Chris Brown at Smart Football tweet out. I think his last five times he's been in charge of an offense. They ranked 27th or lower in football outsiders' offense. Something to that effect. He's playing in 1980s football. Right.

And he literally is on the record saying this isn't a passing league this year. Well, look, the San Francisco 49ers and Seattle Seahawks have succeeded with that mentality, as have the Carolina Panthers. I think it really stinks too for Sam Bradford. I know that we always sort of rip on him. But still, he's never really. played with a great offensive line he's never had a great weapon to throw to and he's gotten hurt so it's like he really is a tease and that's what sando talks about in his article

well well he's also never played well it this tier just looking at well his rookie year he had some moments right also awesome austin davis came in in his first three games and did think sam bradford never did i always thought same personnel i always thought his rookie of the year was one of the most overrated seasons of the last five years he got that rookie of the year He was okay. I think it was his third year. He had a bad injury, second year. He was solid in his third year.

This tier, though, gets me thinking, like, I don't know if we have to change how we think about how good quarterbacks are or not. But, I mean, these are mostly guys we think of as pretty good quarterbacks, pretty good numbers at the 24th spot. I mean, we got Blake Bortles and Bridgewater. This is why. And the Hill's putting up numbers. It's like you have to recalibrate because everyone gets good numbers now.

This is why every November, when they're. There's injuries, and everybody's talking about, how can you not find 32 people who can play quarterbacks as deep now as it's ever been? You could have the same complaints in the late 1980s or mid-1990s. There aren't 32 great quarterbacks, but there's 25 pretty good ones. And I don't have a problem. You say 25, number 25 in list is my boy Ryan. Yeah. It's fine.

It's fine. In fact, the head coach said of Ryan Fitzpatrick, he was with Chan Galley and Chan is good. If he leaves Chan, he needs to get back to Harvard and redo that degree. Jen has been a football lifesaver. That's all true. That's all true. And I think, and this is also, and this is why, Greg. Coach has to mention Harvard.

That's like, they go to move. And this is why your boy, Gino, got booed, is because Ryan Fitzpatrick is a mensch. He's a great dude. This is what Ryan said when asked about being number 25. Let's say each team puts their top three quarterbacks out there, 32 teams, 96 quarterbacks, he said. And you line us all up there in shorts,

and you put ski masks on us and have us throw. I'm going to be in the 90th or lower percentile, I'm sure. But I almost pride myself on that because I'm not a combat guy. I'm not a guy that got recruited out of high school. I'm not a guy that was a first-round pick. I'm not a coveted free agent. I'm just the guy that comes in and works my tail off and tries to do my job. What a great answer.

Wow. That's why we wanted him back because we love the guy. Do we do like a little round of applause for him? Surprise he didn't mention growing up in a coal town. Did I grew up in a cold town? Yeah, I heard that. It wasn't easy. I'll tell you that.

What was the name of it? Roll River, New York. I feel like we, uh... Town of friendly people. So not a coal town, from what I've heard. No. By the way, uh, Kurt Cousins. Any thoughts on, uh, 20th of this?

I feel like we have to talk. 20th because he made, he's making $20 million this year. Makes sense to me. Oh, yeah. Bang. I don't know. Feels, who's a... Here's a quote.

Here's a quote. Personnel, pro personnel director. In my opinion, he's kind of a manager. If you get after him and hit him and hit him. I don't know if he rises to that challenge yet. He has to prove it to me this year. I don't think he can do it by himself. That's fair dog.

I would definitely put him both. Oh, a defensive coordinator likened him to Ryan Fitzpatrick a little bit. That sounds, I think that's a good one. Well, I would put him lower than Cotler. Fitzpatrick takes more chance. Cutler and Bordels. Certainly. Oh, yeah, absolutely.

By the way, things change in the NFL very quickly. Just another reminder. Peyton Manning was in Tier 1 last year. Nick Foles was in Tier 3 last. year. Oh, my God. Cam Newton was number 14 on this list last year. Wow.

So things change. Things change. And finally, that last tier, which is the really, this is the super depressing tier. Colin Kaepernick, once viewed as the future of the quarterback position, now number 29. Blaine Gabbert, ooh, it's going to be a rough year in San Francisco. His competition in San Francisco at quarterback number 30. Mark Sanchez, 31, who may be the starting quarterback of the defending Super Bowl champions.

RG3, the Browns quarterback, he, the fiery meteor heading towards Berea, number 32. And good thing Mark's not here. And number 33, the worst quarterback on this list, Case Keenum, who might be the week one starter as the Rams tried to get a foothold back in Los Angeles. That's why Jeff Fisher's a bad situation.

Got a first round tender as a restrictive free agent. That's some seven to nine bulls. All right. Good stuff, guys. Good talk. See, Greg, you were a little nervous about that. I wasn't going to work as a sag. I wasn't at all.

It was fun. It's always fun talking about it. Now you're just making up. Was he a little bit nervous about the sag, Wes? I don't know what was going on with Greg today. I wasn't, I wasn't nervous. Are you distracted by something? There were two things.

I hadn't seen all the writing of it, so I wanted to, but I don't. and have ESPN Insider. Second of all, I was distracted because K. Nishikori was saving match points to make the Olympic semi-finals. Way to go. Oh, my God. Got a Dean scream?

Yeah, thank you. Congratulations. That's big. It's big win. You could have wore a hat today, too, by the way. Oh, yeah. Do you want some of my Redkin downstairs? I'm in trouble right now.

Have I ever seen Greg with a hat on? No. By the way, Greg's not a hat guy. Is that Redkin still in the Now studio? Uh, no, they removed it almost immediately. I wear hats all the time. Oh, I think it was in there for like, at least a week or two. We're not really a respective entity.

Weekend morning. I thought you, uh, you hit it underneath the couch. I don't know, maybe. I don't know where it is. It's just gone now. Yeah, okay. DJ was, DJ was, uh, maybe thinking about stealing it, swiping it? He could use it.

Yeah. Yeah. DJ shouldn't just cruise. Shots. We won't talk about Sally's comments from the other day. when DJ put out a picture on Twitter. Oh, yeah. Sully threw our whole podcast under the bus.

No, I didn't. What'd you do? This is all. I just, I just, I just, he. See? Yeah. I'm trying to, I'm trying to think of what exactly. Lop sweat.

I'm trying to think, no, remember, no sweating with this. Sure. What did you say, slime ball? No. I'm trying to think of the exact gifts that were used, but it was, oh, it was the reference the Phillips. Yeah, right? It was a Phelps gift.

When you open up, move the sticks, and it's an ATN promo. And then I, uh, uh, we did back on. Yeah. It was Snoop dogs saying, uh, uh, I like that or something along those lines. Yeah. That was great. Yeah. Yeah.

Uh, good talk. Good talk. Yeah. Great story. Yep. Round of applause for myself. Oh, no. Well, it was nice having you here, Sally.

Thanks, guys. It was a good time. You are a delight, so. It's like siding with Robert E. Lee in the Civil War. whatever we will be back i'm sorry i was probably hit too close to home from the south no yeah uh we will be back on monday colin thank you very much you've done it yeah it's great you've done it again everyone no no one doubted you but everyone's like she's been away for a while will she be able to sit back in the chair and it was a last minute thing

last minute thing you know you're like the backup that's to get off the bench and start throwing and warm real quick. Right. You did it. Thank you. Thank you very much. No problem. We all thank you.

Greg. I mean, the Marley shirt, she just said it. Says it all. Thank you for coming on in your off day. You can now do some Bob Marley things. I'm going to go listen to his music. Yes. Okay, good.

All right. We'll be back on Monday with another episode. Make sure you check it out. This is Dan Hansa signing off for Connie Fox, the mailman, the boss, and Sully the turncoat behind the class. Until Monday.