No Jumper - Bryan Andrews on Leaving Christianity, Being a Liberal Country Singer & More

Episode Date: August 5, 2026

3:58 Bryan's upbringing 11:13 Bryan explains he didn't pursue music until his early twenties 11:54 He says TikTok unexpectedly launched his music career 14:52 Bryan on Nashville's formula 21:42 Bryan on his faith 1:01:33 Bryan on true friendships and politics ----- Shout out to all our members who make this content possible, sign up for only $5 a month https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNNTZgxNQuBrhbO0VrG8woA/join Promote Your Music with No Jumper - https://nojumper.com/pages/promo CHECK OUT OUR ONLINE STORE!!! https://nojumper.com NO JUMPER PATREON http://www.patreon.com/nojumper CHECK OUT OUR NEW SPOTIFY PLAYLIST https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5tesvmDS8h50LkjnSAWMOs?si=j6sJD6DkR4mk5NZZWnlK7g Follow us on SNAPCHAT https://www.snapchat.com/discover/No_Jumper/4874336901 Follow us on SPOTIFY: https://open.spotify.com/show/4z4yCTjwXa4an6sBGIe7m5 iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/no-jumper/id1001659715?mt=2 Follow us on Social Media: https://www.snapchat.com/discover/No_Jumper/4874336901 http://www.twitter.com/nojumper http://www.instagram.com/nojumper https://www.facebook.com/nojumper http://www.reddit.com/r/nojumper JOIN THE DISCORD: https://discord.gg/Q3XPfBm Follow Adam22: http://www.instagram.com/adam22 adam22bro on Snapchat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I got the best opening question ever. Okay. When you go in the gas dish and what water do you buy? No jumper. What is water in the world? Okay, well, say they were out of that. Yeah. Hard to imagine, but.

I'm definitely, I'm definitely just your average aquafina dude. In my small town, they ain't got all kinds of fancy ass water. They got Fiji? Yeah, they got Fiji and I'm probably going to smart water most of time too. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. It just kind of makes you feel like you're doing something good for yourself. Yeah, that I'm not a complete dumb ass. Yeah, I mean, I, okay.

Do you hear people talk about Arrowhead? Oh, but that's not really on the East Coast that much as, uh, like Arrowhead water? Yeah, do you guys have Arrowhead? I've never heard of that in my life. Really? That's like a huge water out here, and I feel like people trash it so much. But whenever I have it, I don't really understand why.

No, I just, the, the Sonny smoke is like all I know about as far as water bottles, you know. It's like, if you see somebody with a Fiji, they're really trying to tell you. Like, I'm a billion there. Yeah, especially in my hometown. Yeah. Where we're from, yeah, if somebody's getting some bougy-ass water, it's like... You get a lot of ooze and eyes down there? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, that's funny. Yeah, I still live in my hometown, so... Yeah, yeah. So you, you... I heard you proudly say that you pay taxes there. Yeah, in my hometown, you know what I mean? I think that's like the whole point for me to be able to say things I have to say is because I'm still living where I'm from, you know, and then see, you know, people that

don't necessarily agree with everything. I'm talking about, you know, every single day and have to, you know, be friends and interact with these people and stuff like that. So definitely. You think it would just kill you to live in L.A.? No. No, I don't think so. I think, like, well, I don't know.

I don't know if I could live here. When I think about it, like, if I'd have to spend the majority of my time here, I don't know if I could do that because it's traffic, dude. And, like, I think I could drive here if I practiced it for a little bit. But, yeah, dude, I'm from a town that's got one stoplight. So, yeah. It's. Okay.

Like, if you live in the. valley and you have a house and a dog and you got a pool in the backyard and like you go to restaurants, you go to work. Like that life is probably pretty similar to the life that you live down south, you know, but it's like if you're kind of like a younger person and you're really going to bars and you're going to events and you're kind of like outside experience in the culture a little bit more, that's when like the differences would probably like really start to get magnified that like you're going to the weird bar where you can tell everybody's doing coke in the bathroom and they're listening to some goth music that you find kind of scary versus like you probably not going to find too many like country bars around here you know yeah i have yet to find what i've been here like four or five times and you haven't haven't really found any uh country-ass dive bars or anything

i bet you you could find one you might have to go a little bit outside the city center or something because i remember one time going on a day with a girl on tinder i'm talking 15 years ago and she was She just turns out to be a huge country music fan and we go takes me to a bar where they're playing country and I just kind of had to act like I was way more down than I actually was, you know, because it's like I'm on the Tinder day. Like I gotta, this is not about being yourself. Yeah, dude. This is about putting forward the best version of yourself to get what you're trying to get going right here, you know?

And yeah, that's, but now I'm kind of getting a little bit more familiar because my wife has kind of hit that like mid-30s part of her life where like country just is like the thing that like makes sense to her as like a mom, you know? Yeah, yeah. I think like that's kind of the whole vibe of a small town anyways, you know, it's like people move or not move, but I guess people stay in places like that because they want to be away from it all. You know what I mean?

And want to be away from like the big city hustle and everything like that. So I mean, which is understandable. And then like that's why I still live there. I still drink beer with my hometown buddies that I graduated high school with and everything like that but it's a you know since I started doing the political thing it's a little bit different yeah yeah so okay I guess there's certainly people who are probably watching this that don't really know where you're coming from so I guess maybe we should rewind a little bit and come to do this in order so you're from carolton yeah Missouri yep and what tell us a little bit about your childhood what was

growing up like yeah I was actually born in Boise Idaho and then I lived there until I was about seven and we moved back to my dad's hometown in Missouri. They wanted to live in the mountains for a period of time or whatever. So they moved out kind of there. And then both my parents are music teachers, high school educators, and my dad just retired after 37 years. So it's pretty dope. So was there a high level of like music discussion and listening going on in your home,

would you say? Yeah. To be honest with you, like even after we moved back to Missouri and everything, we really didn't have a whole lot of country music playing except for like my grandpa was a big Alan Jackson fan and stuff like that so you know George Strait and all them guys were playing you know when I was with him and stuff like that but both my folks were big like in the 80s

music and stuff like that they were huge rush fans and foreigner and bands like that so but when I got in high I always say you can't outrun country music in a small town like everybody you know listens to it their parents listen to it and shit like that. So you're listening to country music, whether you like it or not, in places like that. And I'm grateful for it, you know, because I love country music and it played a huge role. And like the artist I am and even the person I am, you know.

Would you say your parents were, like, exposing you to a wide variety of music as well? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there was, like, both my folks are definitely interested in, like, classical music, too. And so, you know, we went, we would go to the, I remember going to the opera when I was, like, 12 or 13 years old for the first time. and I was like, this ain't for me. But, you know, we and watched the Kansas City Symphony and stuff like that. So, I mean, we were only about an hour and a half away from Casey.

I mean, like, nothing could be more offensive to your sense of what is right about the world as a young kid than opera. Yeah, dude. Like, that is just the number one thing that makes you just want to just get the fucking out of here, bro. Like, opera. I was like, yeah, dude, when you're like a kid and it's cool to see. like different cultures and art and stuff like that. As adults, we can see this. As a kid, when you're sitting in a

balcony of an opera house and you're like, I have no idea what they're saying. No idea what they're saying, dude. And all this shit sounds boring as hell. I mean, I was sleeping most of the time. Yeah, oh yeah. Yeah. He's fighting that a lot.

But, okay, so what kind of kid would you say that you were like as a young boy? I mean, just regular, you know, regular kid. Grew up in a small town, and white picket fence and all that kind of shit. I mean, you know, we didn't have a white pick of fence, but, you know, like that kind of vibe. Like, it's very community-based in a small town, so I'm always hanging out, I was always hanging out with my buddies and stuff growing up. And, you know, as soon as we got old enough to get into trouble and shit, he was out drinking beer and stuff like that.

But I've always been kind of, you know, I'd just say left-leaning because my parents are, you know, and they're more liberal. My grandfather was a liberal. I mean, he was a union forklift driver for General Motors for 30 years. So it was just, and my other, my great-grandfather was a union farmer. So, I mean, it was, or not union, but he was a blue-voting farmer. So, I don't know. It's just kind of one of them things that, like, there's more left-leaning people than people think in small towns, you know. And it was always the running joke, you know, funny.

It was, like, funny, like, growing up, everybody would be like, oh, yeah, he's the town Democrat or whatever, you know. And now all of a sudden, since I'm talking about this on a very public level, it's like, Right. You know, it's not a joke. No more. Different level of emphasis. But how old are you? I'm 29.

About turn 30. You're only 29. Damn, all right. Yeah, but I mean, I feel like I have strong memories of being a young kid. And like my parents who are like hardcore Democrats, like worked in local politics and stuff like that to a certain extent that they had like Republican friends that they would have lively conversations and arguments with around the house. And like, I just grew up in an environment where it was. perfectly okay to coexist. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Even though my parents were also, like, really emphasizing, like, on an issue, like, abortion, this is something that we feel extremely strong about. We think that these people protesting this are wrong, et cetera. But then we're also able to, you know, have common ground with these people. And I feel like, you know, that probably still exists to a certain extent. But once you're, like, a public figure, it really becomes a lot more difficult, you know. Yeah, man, I think especially with, like, the way social media is and stuff and how, like, people from areas like mind view kind of social media and stuff you know like when they see

someone you know on a very public platform that they know personally it's a little bit different because they aren't used to that right but i also think politics now is much different than it was you know when i was a kid even so thank you donald yeah exactly there's a few other people who deserve credit but it really takes the cake you know it's just crazy dude when you look at how just and I mean I'm not saying that I'm not divisive in some capacities because I definitely am I think a lot of that you see it and you support it I think it's pretty you know what I mean and I'm pretty vocal about it so right but so would you say that was there any moment that stands out to you as a young kid or whatever where you realized how

much of a gulf there was in terms of how you and your parents were looking at the world and how some of the kids that you were going to school with were viewing. Yeah, I think it was, you know, like as you get older and you start viewing like social programs. Right. Mostly. Because in small towns, like, it's very blue collar, right? So, like, everybody is basically, if you're too lazy to work, then you don't deserve to eat type of mindset. And for me, I was like, I mean, I don't know.

A lot of these people are kids, you know, and like, especially growing up and taking a look, back at it in my adult years, like with social programs and everything, there's a lot of people in small towns in rural areas that I'm, like where I'm from, that don't have jobs or, and they have children and they need these programs to be able to feed their kids and stuff like that. And like, I think most people just assume, you know, every single person on welfare or food stamps is using it for drugs or something like that. And the vast majority of them actually have jobs. Right.

You know, and like they're just trying to get by. I think in small towns, that's the kind of the disconnect. is like, for me, I'm voicing my opinion about these things and stand tall on these things because I've seen people in my hometown not be able to afford groceries because they can't get a job that pays them enough in that town to be able to support a family, you know, or like be able to pay for daycare because they have to work two jobs just to be able to afford to put gas in their car now that we started a war and I ran. You know what I'm saying?

So I don't know. A lot of, I think people are like, oh, you sold out or turned your back on where you came from. And it's like, dude, I'm the way I am because of where I came from. You know. So what is you start to like really get into music and realize that being a singer is pretty much where your life is going? Yeah, I started working on the road when I was 20, 21. And I started writing songs in my hotel rooms after work and stuff like that.

Working on the road? Yeah, I was a pipe welder for different companies and stuff. Building like ethanol plants and like that. Yeah. Okay. Did a lot of like marathon terminals and stuff like that. but, or gas terminals. So, but yeah, I started working on the road and then writing songs in my hotel room

because the only other thing to do was go to the bar and I got tired of doing that. So, you know, started writing songs and then people started posting them online and people started kind of, you know, picking up traction that way and with TikTok and everything like that. And then I really wasn't, I was going to stay away from politics. I'm not going to lie. When I was, and I've said this publicly before, but. I mean, most people in your position do.

Yeah, because I mean, like, dude, I'm a left-leaning person. I've been from a small town my whole life, so I know what people who listen to country music think about people on the left side of politics, especially since, like, Donald Trump has came into the forefront of politics. Right. So I knew, you know, just don't talk about it. And then I would kind of talk about some things here and there where, you know, it didn't feel so controversial and I knew I wouldn't alienate anybody.

But then when the election happened and then I started seeing a bunch of stuff, with ice and everything like that, that's when I was like, okay, I'm going to start talking about it. Right. You know. And like at that point, did it feel like there was some mass exodus of fans or was it more positive than it was negative? There was definitely, like at the very front of it, when I first started it, it felt like some of the fan base that I had created felt at least abandoned or alienated in some way. but I don't know I think about this a lot because I was talking to my dad about it one time and he was like well would you rather you know people you know leave you because your music sucks or they just don't like it or whatever people leave you because you said something they just weren't ready to hear yet and I was like obviously the latter I don't give a fuck anymore you know and I always think of it this way too I heard somebody say this once but um you know if somebody like you see somebody hating on your whatever or a particular fan or whatever doesn't like what you're doing

you know, when you're speaking your true authentic self, they were never going to be your fan anyways at the end of the day. So, you know, I don't care. Plus, I want you to know exactly who I am for you put money in my pocket. Right. You know what I mean? Yeah.

I don't want nobody to spend money buying my shit, listening to my records coming to my shows without knowing exactly who they're supporting it. Right. So. Yeah, because, I mean, if you were to, like, neuter that part of your mindset and your belief system, and instead you were to make your music,

much more general and vague and make it so that you can sort of interpret it to mean anything or whatever, then you would just be like literally like everybody else. And the reason why, I mean, personally, you know, whenever I listen to country, like one of the biggest reactions I have is like, God damn, this is homogenous. It's just so similar across the board. So if you risk being taken and, you know, I, hey, good. Granted, like, you would have the exact same reaction if you were to listen to, like, a lot of the rap that we listen to as well. But, you know, like, I think you can't help but think that, like, I mean, because there's very few people who've had the gall to, like, kind of take on the mission that you've taken on.

And you're right, dude, like, there is a lot of, like, it's just, I felt this way forever. But even people who listen to country music feel this way, right? They'll be like, you know, how many times can you write the same song over and over? Or how many times can Nashville write the same exact thing? Right. And it's true. There's just some extent there's there's truth in that because you know everybody knew that's what was selling everybody always thinks too that's like you know I think labels play a role in like pushing direction of where artists go but when they're sitting there in the rooms you know they're writing the song they want to write that day right most of the time those writers or that artist whatever just wanted to write the next radio hit so they just did what they knew worked already right I don't know for me I knew I was never going to get on radio anyways so right yeah You really feel like that though?

I feel like I mean the door is probably still open to that. I mean, it's kind of like a fine line with you because you have to be authentically yourself, but you also like just don't want to make everybody hate you. Yeah, for sure. You just don't want to be like hated because you're this like detestable, like liberal that is just so annoying. Yeah. Like everybody like it would be easy for you to make every single person in country know who you are. Exactly.

by just being a really cringe asshole you know like like you could you could do that but then like what do you do with that level of notoriety then at that point you know so it's hard to monetize that or the the shelf life of that is not great you know yeah i think that's why like doing stuff like this you know and like getting to show different sides of me other than just you know like a yelling video on social media that i do or whatever the you know it's it's a nice to be able to actually have a conversation and stuff like that and so people can actually see that you know so people can actually see you see who I am as a person and everything. But yeah, I mean, to some extent, there's like, we're still making commercial music, right? You know, so I mean, like a lot of this, I mean, I just put out a song called Yehaw, and the tagline is Yehaw, Fri-Law. And, you know, I mean, I think there was some group of people

that was like, well, fuck him, you know, the whole Blue Lives Matter movement crowd, you know, was like this guy. But I got that saying from my small town. Right. Like people said that in the country long before I ever heard it. in some left-wing echo room, you know what I'm saying? So I don't know.

I think there's people don't realize there's a lot more similarities between small town rural folk and people in neighborhoods that are underfunded and things like that, then people think there are. Right. They both feel like the cops kind of got their foot on their neck to a certain extent. And it's crazy because, like, you know, you'd be able to find like Johnny Cash saying like basically, you know, the cops or whatever, yeah.

But it's like now with the social media and everything, it's like we just have positions carved out for each side. And if you are going to go against those in any meaningful way, you will just be kind of shunned from your tribe. And something like that is like, you know, when I think about like me being a kid, it's like saying like the cops was like a universal sentiment between every single kid that I know and really like a lot of adults as well. and the fact that like you can't just kind of because even saying the law is not like as explicit as saying like you know the police I get how that that's offensive

but like you know even the police will acknowledge that there's a few too many laws and that they can be obnoxious and it's not like the cops are enforcing every single law in the books at all times you know like man I totally agree I think there's also like you know when I was growing up

there's certain things that I've like gotten more left on right you know or the my worldview has been opened up on right so i mean like when i was a kid you know 15 16 years old and like some of these uh cases of police police brutality were going on everybody in my hometown you know you look around to people that you see in your everyday life and they're all saying well you know you shouldn't disobey the cops or whatever and so for a long time i'm thinking well yeah i mean obviously if you don't like you know if you just do what they tell you then you won't get hurt but then in my mind i'm like

or I grew up and grew out of that and saw like, oh, a lot of these people have their hands up and also not for nothing, but you're not supposed to shoot guilty people either. You know what I mean? So, I mean, as soon as I had that shift change of that mindset when I was, you know, 16, 17 years old of, you know, a police officer is not the judge, no matter if it's a police officer or ICE agent,

whatever the it is, IRS agent, any kind of law enforcement officer is not the judge. judge, jury, or executioner. Right. As soon as I realize that, then it's like, okay, yes, there is definitely some problems with police brutality and things like that. Right. Well, I mean, like, if a person's disposition is that they think that the cops are mostly

in the right about things, you know, when something goes wrong, that they usually tend to assume that the cops are in the right. Like, I get that. I totally get that. But, like, we're in a different frontier now where, like, when you see the, the Renee Good shooting as well as like a couple of the other ones that just happened in Maine dude yeah and it's like we now have a situation in which like the police or killing an American citizen is like the things are so politicized that a lot of people on the right just instinctively

and it's basically like endorsed by the the president and his his cronies in office is to say this actually was totally fine and actually the person who did it was a terrorist and like actually you shouldn't believe what you're seeing on camera right now and actually we're not going to investigate this at all because it's totally clear to us that this is fine and then to have people

just blindly get on board with being lied to like that like I can I can respect you if you're a Republican or a Trump report or whatever like we still could have some common ground but that right there to me is so disgusting you are such a moron for falling for that.

And I just like, I just, as much as you support the police instinctively, you just cannot be so far gone that you allow yourself to just fall in line with that bullshit. With fascism, yeah. Yes, it's insane. I totally agree.

That's why I would say, like the people that I grew up around saying, you know, waving the don't tread on me flags and shit like that are real quiet lately. You know? Yeah, right. So, I mean,

and that's what I've been trying to get across in my music. So, And to be honest with you, I think a lot of it is like people just vote the way they vote in small towns because they grew up you know, thinking like that's just what you do. I mean, you listen to a person in Trump's cabinet, Paula White, the White House faith office leader or whatever the you know, she was on the campaign trail saying vote against Trump is a vote against God.

And it's like, are you kidding me? dude and this is this is why I've like just deconstructed so much from Christianity because I mean it's I mean you don't really notice it because I would have I would before probably two months ago or three months ago I would have considered myself a Christian still and I don't call myself that anymore really so what what happened is actually yeah yeah that's very interesting okay so what what what changed in your mind that kind of led you in that direction man I just think it's like you we watch how colonialized religion is especially the Christian faith and like how much the faith is used for power and

control I mean you just watch the Texas State Board of Education make it mandatory for kids in public schools to read the Bible or parts of the Bible right if you and in my mind here's what it is if you need to force feed children your religion then you never gave a about Christianity itself at all. It was only about fear and control for you. So, and I mean, to me, I think hopefully that makes children who are growing up reading it, question it more. It's like, why am I being forced to do this?

Versus, you know, why did I not come to it, you know, through my family or through my own volition or, you know, spiritual journey or whatever the fuck it is. Like, that's my thing. I don't give a, if you're a Christian. I give a f*** that you call yourself a Christian and then go vote for people or advocate for people that continuously vote to underfund things that Jesus would have supported. But would you say that your issue is like commentary on the state of the Christian movement in America? Or is it your fundamental belief in Christianity? Like has that been shaken?

at a certain point, like your actual belief in the nature of the universe and whatnot? Yeah, I think some for sure. Because I think, and I think I would have shied away from that, like I said, two or three months ago, because part of me still felt like if I said that I wasn't a Christian in any capacity, then I was going to lose the Christians. Because in a small town, I mean, not even in a small town, but anywhere, you talk to Christians probably. And at least for me, you talk to other Christians about faith and things.

like that or about religion, just subjectively having a conversation about it. And if they think you're a non-believer, they don't give a fuck what you have to say. I mean, it doesn't matter. You could make all the sense in the world. Doesn't matter because you're not a Christian. Right. Like I think America, like the number one excluding factor for like a presidential candidate is atheism. Like if they're an atheist that basically would would cause, I think it's like 75% of Americans to automatically not vote for him. And there's like, no other excluding, like you can be like a murderer and they'd be more likely to elect you than if you're atheist, which is why it's like I would really kind of, if somebody wants

a future in politics, I would probably suggest that they find some other sort of language to describe their religious beliefs than just saying I'm an atheist. And I say that as a lifelong atheist, but it's just the world has sort of yet to catch up to the fact that not believing in God doesn't mean that you're an immoral person and you're like actively trying to destroy society. Right, dude. And I think, like, that's for me. Like, I think at least how I view it in this moment right now, I think that, like, there might be something out there, but I don't know it. And I think Jesus was probably a real dude that had some dope-ass morals. And I think that for me, I would love, you know, to live my life closely or as close as I can to those morals. And, you know, like, feed the poor, heal the sick and things like that. But as far as, like, you know, a Jesus that came down here and died for my sins and rose from the tomb three days later and things like that. I don't. Yeah. And I'm not trying to be disrespectful. No, no, no. And one thing I've really kind of learned is that like a huge percentage. I think almost like the majority of biblical scholars

actually like don't really think that the crucifixion happened the way that it's presented in the Bible, which is kind of crazy because those are the people that are like the most. most educated about this. And then meanwhile, if you were to have a conversation with the average person down at the bar and you were to say, like, I don't think that the whole Christian thing took place the way that you're saying, they would pretty much think that that was enough to eliminate you from being considered a Christian in any way, you know? And they totally cut off the conversation.

It's not that they cut off the conversation. I think some of those people hold space for it still, but they totally shut their brain off to being open to anything that you're saying after that point. Right. You know, so, but I think for me it's like I just kind of have stopped caring about that as much because I think that, you know, we live in a world where, especially in the United States, where it's the American thing to do to express door, that you do have a freedom of religion and not just of religion from religion. You know what I mean? I think that's where a lot of people get it wrong and, you know, I don't know, people say that I'm wrong about that, but I'm just saying, I mean, it's the free. freedom from religion. So that way religion should not play a role in government, you know,

or in policy. Right. And our belief in how those sorts of aspects of our government should be structured should be more important than our religious beliefs, you know? And that's the definition of what it is to be principled. And it's crazy to see people like, you know, Republicans who have power and basically decide like let's just completely go against that in order to sort of signal boost to our audience that, hey, if we get enough power, we're going to basically force our religion on as many people as possible. Yeah, and you see all those people and they'll be like, oh, they claim the American flag and say that they're the most patriotic people on the planet.

But if you ask any one of them who they put first, their religion or their country, they'd choose their religion. And I think that's pretty patriotic, considering in the First Amendment or First Constitutional right that you have, it's a freedom. of religion and from religion. So. Damn. Yeah.

Okay, here's my question. How much do you think, though, like, you making these sort of divisive statements about, you know, your political leanings? Like, how much does that X you out of opportunities within the country music world? Like, is that so serious that people are like, no, we're never booking him for a festival or whatever? Or is it the kind of thing where it's like, oh, okay, that's cool. Like, let's have a little bit of.

Variety. I think in the beginning it was pretty much like people were like, oh, this dude, you know, blah, blah, blah. But now that it started getting more popular and we're kind of getting some traction, I think doors are opening. At least people are holding a little bit more space for it. But I also think that a lot of people within the industry, you know, feel similarly to me because musicians are just more empathetic, you know, type of people or more compassionate

human beings than a lot or creatives are you know so but i do think yeah i mean i'm i'm not going on tour with jason al dine anytime soon you know what i'm right so i think like when you when you think about like opportunities as far as like touring and stuff like that yeah sure because even the people who may agree with me like bigger acts in country music and stuff who may agree with me and stuff like that they may not want to make any kind of political involvement so and i would assume that they would think taking me out on the road with them is a political statement, which is totally fine. You know, I don't want any animosity towards anybody that doesn't want to be involved in the conversation at all or doesn't want to feel like I'm misrepresenting them in any way or anything

like that. So, but for me, I don't give a fuck. You know, we'll do it ourselves if we got to. It's interesting because, like, you're still on your way up, still growing. And it's like, you still need the support of the actual country music industry. So many of those opportunities, These are just like the building blocks of what you're doing with your career and stuff. But then hypothetically, let's take like another country superstar who really took like sort of an alternate path to start them by starting as a rapper, which is Jelly Roll. And the fact that like jelly roll is somebody who's like 100% known by the Grammy committee and all these sort of people or whatever. He's kind of like their darling boy at this point. And it's like with somebody like him, once you have that level of attention on you,

I feel like any statement that he makes that in any way shows support for liberal causes or left causes, I think would be, you know, earn him a ton of positive attention from the people that know about him and everything because he's kind of gotten to this level where so many of the eyes that are on him tend to be left leaning. So it's kind of interesting because it's like maybe at a certain point, if you get to that level, all of these things that have been negatives to a certain extent so far will become like more magnified in a positive way and I heard you say on another thing that like you had to be clear about who you were now

because think about if you did that after you win a Grammy you're going to look insane you're going to look like oh my God he's he made it there he's part of the sex cabal he's at the ditty parties yeah I mean that is crazy they're like you had to you had to come out early Real Canadian Superstore has everything you need this back to school season. Save on lunchbox savers like Ziggy's sliced deli-meat products for always 375 and get life brand pure Vita shampoo or conditioner for $8 each at Real Canadian Superstore. When you're ready,

we're ready with a whole world and more. Exactly, man. And that's the whole thing of it. It's like I wanted people to know early on who I was and what I believed in for reasons exactly like that. Like I didn't want to get to a point of, you know, my career where I had built this fan base. And then I said, you know, like I don't think ice is a good thing or whatever the f***, any kind of polarizing statement. And then people be like, oh, he was a, he sold out, a sold his soul of the illuminati or the devil or whatever the f***. You know, so like for me, I also just don't give a fuck anymore.

You know, like it's, I'm making music that I really believe in and really love. And that's the most important thing to me. And how people take it when it's released is for them, you know? And like, that's why I like, we get bad reviews a lot. Like, you know, the country music spaces are not especially kind to me and everything, you know, when they're writing their blogs or whatever. But they're entitled to their opinion. I don't give a fuck. You know what I mean?

Like, they can talk about the record any way they want to. So. But for me, I'm doing whatever it is that I feel like I'm believing in at the moment, you know? And I think it's resonating with people. I mean, we just announced a tour, 20 show tour in the fall. And in three weeks, eight dates are sold out. Really? Wow.

And it's a club tour, you know, and everybody's like. oh well it's only 250 cap rooms and i'm like dude people that's 250 people in each city that's spending their harder in dollars to come see me and in this day and age you can't take that shit for granted no dude them fans deserve it way more than i will dude especially when you just consider they're like yeah in nashville or la or whatever you might have like a big potential market but a lot of the smaller cities you know getting 250 people come out it's pretty amazing yeah exactly man and so that's i'm just extremely grateful for it because those people who paid that money, deserved to have a good show.

Yeah. You know, and they deserve, you know, somebody who's going to speak up about the things that they also believe in. And we're building a community and things like that. And I think that's the best part of it, you know. And so I haven't, I haven't, like, I don't regret anything I've said for sure. I think, you know, there's some things that I think I probably could have gone about in a different way than, you know, holding my phone up and in the moment talking about

something that I was really frustrated about. Because you must feel like now, if you're going to come out with an opinion, like do you feel like there's enough pressure because now you feel like there's enough attention on every time you come out and say something new that you need to do your research and like really make sure that you're not saying anything haphazardly? Yes, which I also think is not a bad thing, right? I mean, like, I think it's good for like me to feel the pressure of not only my own community, but the community that hates me and is waiting for me to slip up

to be educated about the things I speak about because if not, why the fuck am I talking about them? You know, and so yeah, I mean, I think being able to talk about the things that I believe in and I'm also well educated about, I feel,

is awesome, you know? Yeah. But, yeah, I mean, there's just, and I don't,

to be honestly, I don't feel that much pressure when it comes to like, because I care about this. Like, I care about what a, trade war or tariff war is going to do to farmers in my hometown. You know, all we got is soybeans and corn where I'm from and a little bit of wheat. But soybeans are under the f***ing right now.

Right. Because of tariffs. Yeah. So. But do you feel like when you speak out about those things, do you have people show up in your DMs who are like, hey, I'm a Trump supporter, but I agree with you? All the time. All the time.

Right. Because, I mean, these, stuff like the tariffs. I mean, something like abortion. All right, yeah, that might not. Yeah, I'm never going to get them on that. Yeah, it might not apply to a huge percentage of Americans who just, like, aren't directly impacted by this on a regular basis. But something like the tariffs, like really, or the gas prices even,

it's like really hitting people in their pockets. And, you know, people are feeling that shit. And I'm sure that they aren't shy about reaching out to you. Yeah, like I said, I mean, there's even in my hometown, dude, like people that, you know, I've grown up around or whatever, that'll shoot me a DM and be like, hey, I know that a lot of people probably don't appreciate what you're saying, but, you know, I do. Yeah.

And, you know, even, it's really started showing up in my comment section more as of late, like with the release of some of the more, I guess, commercialized country music that we've been putting out. And also just, I think people kind of seeing what this administration is doing and also not agreeing with us. So, like, we find common ground there, even though I'm a leftist and, you know, Democratic Socialists and they're a Republican, I guess. I mean, I think a lot of those people I would consider probably more on the libertarian sign. But I would say that, like libertarians and leftists kind of

meet somewhere. Right. In the middle. So, I don't know. I mean, there's a lot of people who like pretty self-admittedly like don't really give a fuck about being a Republican at all. They just really, really resonate with Trump. Yeah, dude. Like the majority of these people. Yeah, I was just talking about. me Kelly about this earlier but it's like that's how you got mom Donnie Trump voters yeah you know

what I'm saying and because people are desperate for a new kind of politics for people that are actually going to you know areas that are underfunded or whether it be rural areas or inner cities you know they're desperate for people to come actually talk to them so and and try to figure out a way forward but yeah this politics that we see now with with this administration is I mean any way you look at it objectively it's bad. Yeah. Right?

Just the way the way politics is represented in America now, it either turns people completely off of politics and makes them want nothing to do with it, which is a bad thing because we need to care about the place we live and the decisions that people are making on our behalf and things like that. Or it makes people ultra-polarized, which is also negative. So your first time going viral wasn't political so much, though, right? It was the liquor and pills thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It was back in the day my hometown radio station. That was my debut single. Right. And they played that song on the radio and I had that video of me and my mom. And, you know, it did numbers. The, that's the thing.

You know, like music back then for me was much more about like my personal experiences in life and like, you know, mental health. I'm still a big advocate for that. Right. And I love to making that kind of music and still do now. Yeah.

You know. I mean, when I heard that, I thought that was pretty interesting because it does feel like your sort of, code that you figured out to get ahead in the game is basically like, I'm gonna make a song that is like a little bit too

personal or a little bit too in your face or a little bit too political more than you might feel comfortable with because, you know, like a mainstream country artist just probably isn't... They'll rap about being f***ed up on drugs or something, but they're not going to say pills. Somehow that just carries like a little bit of a different

weight and you kind of figure that out. And there's a lot of people who relate to that because, you know, like pills and look at it. a pretty potent combination. Yeah, I think that's the, like, exactly. I feel like I've been kind of in people's face, mostly my whole career, or not necessarily in people's face,

but I was never scared to say anything, you know, or like it's at least how I feel or about my own personal experiences and shit. And I mean, liquor and pills is, yeah, I mean, that's what it was. I was snorting Xanax, like it was going out of style. How did that kind of unfold? Like, how did you expose to all that?

I honestly, just being in high school. When I was in high school, I tore my layroom, and that's the first time I had been exposed to, like, painkillers. Layroom? My layroom, yeah, it's in my shoulder. Oh, okay. And you were doing sports or something? Yeah, playing football. And then I didn't want to get surgery for a long time, so I was just on painkillers for, like, seven or eight months.

And then I finally got surgery on it this summer after my senior year and ran out of painkillers. So I had to find something, and I found Xanax, you know? Right. So because it was easier to go to the doctor and say, hey, I've got anxiety. Right. You know. And so how many years were you gone off all that? Oh, just a couple.

Okay. Yeah, it was pretty bad there towards the end. But luckily, you know, both my folks were really, really great about getting me help. And, uh... You had to go to rehab? I did not go to rehab. I didn't do a outpatient thing. And then I lived at home with my parents for about six months.

Really? So, yeah. Was it tough to beat it? Like, were you, like, scratching to go out there and find more at some point? Honestly, I think part of the time. Part of it was I was so depressed and I knew that like I didn't want to be, honestly, I just didn't want to be alive. But as soon as I got sober for those, you know, that week that I was in, that inpatient facility, it was very clear to me that I did not want to be dead. I just wanted to do something different with my life.

And I wanted it to be better, you know, like you're just constantly in pain and like you can't outrun it. So for me, it was easier to be able to say, like, you know, I'll go find something to cope. But then once I got sober in there and I went home and I was surrounded by my parents, you know, I didn't go out or nothing really. I was just at home with them and they were great about letting me stay home and stuff. And kind of kicked it that way. But, and I wasn't, you know, like, it wasn't like I was for 15 years just doing pills and drinking every night and things like that. I was severely depressed. And that's the reason I was doing.

pills in the first place. But I know how you feel because like I have friends who like, you know, had their druggy section of their life. And like I feel guilty even like weighing in having a conversation about it because their was so much and more gnarly than you know, where like dudes just like off heroin for 10 years straight robbing stores and shit to get money by heroin. And I'm like, damn, like I used to drink and do Xanax for a while there. And like, you know, when I stopped, it was like not that big a deal.

It just kind of stopped, you know. Yeah. I think for like probably the first month or two, it was like this sucks, you know, because you feel like you're in a cage because you don't, you know, nobody around you trust you to be by yourself. And you don't trust yourself, really. So, I mean, figuring that out is, is difficult. But, yeah, I ended up going back to school and then dropped out of college and then started

working on the road. And I think working on the road, honestly. I mean, people drink on the road, you know, and I know a lot of guys that I worked with on the road that they could not outrun the bottle. You know what I'm saying? But like for me, I had started writing songs and playing guitar and stuff and found healthier ways to, you know, cope with it. So that's when I first started writing music, it was pretty much all about working on the road and like how I would watch guys like not necessarily throw their whole life away, but really throw their whole life away because, they can't be with their families or, you know, like it's, and it's just a tough life, you know, and when you're out there and guys are, they have whole families 10 hours, 12 hours, 16 hours away from

them. And, you know, their wife calls them and says, hey, I'm at work, but our daughter has a 102 degree temperature. I don't know what to do. I don't have anybody here to help me. And you just got to be like, I'm 16 hours away. Yeah. What the f*** am I going to do about it, you know, and I'd watch that happen a lot and it would suck. You know, like people, the road life is good. You can make a lot of money out on the road, but it's tough, especially if you've got a family like that. You've got to be really rock strong in your relationships and things like that

because, I mean, guys just can't pack up. A lot of times they're the sole provider. So they can't just pack up and go home. And even if they did, you know, would they be there in time? Like, you know, if your kid is really sick and it has to go to the ER, obviously any parent would want to be home for that, right? But do you make the decision to say, I'm going home? This is an emergency enough.

Knowing that you blowing off this job is going to have massive financial consequences for your family. Yep. But then at the same time, how are you going to feel if the unforgivable type situation takes place with your kid? If she's really sick like that, I mean, God, what a terrible situation of being. See, and that's the thing, too. It's like, you know, a lot of the, like stuff like that, that's all people don't think about it but that is all political too because you think about like situations where guys are like that i grew up around they only worked those jobs because they couldn't find jobs in town that paid them enough to be able to support a family and give their family the life they wanted and things like that so they were out there all the time working those jobs and that's kind of my thing it's like dude i'm advocating so that workers can have families in their hometowns and corporations have to pay their workers enough money and be able to feed their children and put them through daycare and things like that.

Like, I don't want you to have to be out here doing this if you don't want to. I mean, it's pretty amazing that so many workers have basically been convinced to vote against their best interests, you know? Fuck. It's amazing. Like, my hat is off to whoever engineered that. Yeah, dude. That's impressive.

I've always said that. Imagine the propaganda it would take to make somebody vote against their own best interests. And it happens all the time. We see it mostly with workers' rights, but in the religious aspect of everything, too. But yeah, especially working on the road, that's where I kind of, you know, had seen stuff like that take place. Being on the road like that, it's kind of like you've got a bunch of empty space, you know, you're your nighttime when you're in the hotel room or whatever. And you could fill that with something. Would you say that?

And also, like, being on the road working like that, it's kind of this like soul. lonely mission that, you know, is sort of romanticized in a certain way. Were you able to basically take that and that same gap in time that a lot of your co-workers turned into rampant alcoholism? You were able to turn that into taking the music a lot more serious, you know? Like put you in the proper headspace because when you're at home, you got all these responsibilities, all these things to do. It's not really like sexy for you to, you have no time to sit back with your guitar, right?

Yeah, for sure, man. I think, you know, if I, I will always say that I don't, if I, if I wouldn't have worked on the road, I don't think I'd be here. You know, because it gave me, it gave me time, even though we were working 60, 70 hours a week, when you're off work, unless you're going to the bar, you don't have shit to do. Right. You know, so a lot of these towns we worked in were towns like my hometown are smaller. Yeah. So there was not, there wasn't shit to do anyways. You're staying at a low-rent-ass hotel because you're trying to save as much of that per diem money as you possibly can.

And then, you know, for me, it was just easier to go back to the room and really just write songs. And, you know, once social media came around, it was easy to post. Yeah. And so I just started doing that and it took off. But, yeah, I think working on the road is a huge part of where I'm at, why I'm here, and who I am, you know. Definitely. You have a girlfriend? I do now.

Yeah, when I was, yeah, that's the easier thing for me, too. when I was working on the road, it was easy to look at other guys that I worked with and see their lives because I was single the whole time. Yeah. So when you're missing somebody back home, that makes the whole thing so much more painful. Exactly, dude. And like I miss my, you know, my friends and stuff like that. But I wasn't missing my wife or my two-year-old. The kid, once it's put the kid in it.

Like working on the road is like just so much more difficult to justify. Yeah. So, but yeah, I do have a girlfriend now. And we've been dating for like four months going great. Great. But I do like, I mean, we don't live together or anything, and I'm gone a lot now. So I get the, you know, the missing somebody part a little bit more now. But, but yeah, I couldn't imagine what it would be like to be working a job, 70, 80 hours a week, 16 hours away from your home.

And you don't, like, you're watching your kids grow up through a phone screen, dude. Yeah. Like, and I mean, I hate to say that because I don't want to vilify the road. I think the road is a great way of life for some people, and I think it can provide a lot of things for people, you know, as far as like financially, you know, security and things like that and do great things for people's families and stuff. But you have to know what you're getting into.

Like go out on the road, stack your cash, be smart with it, and come home. Yeah. You know. Yeah. I mean, I know dudes in like hardcore bands that have just been torn for like 30 years straight. Yeah. They make no money. Yeah, man.

And there's just this like militant commitment to it of like, I have to do this forever. And yeah, but then at some point they always like crack and just kind of realize like, this is crazy. I can't keep doing this to my family. Yeah, exactly. And that's what it is right there. And I think a lot of people, a lot of guys that work on the road, they end up, you know, either divorced or, you know, they're just not in their families like they would be or like they wanted. to be, you know, but, and I would say it's not, not their fault, but sometimes it is, you know, like they had, they made the choice to turn into an alcoholic. Yeah. Um, but I think that

there should be more resources, I think, for those people, you know what I'm saying? Like, to not turn to alcoholism and, and like, give them better opportunities where they're from or, you know, whatever. And that's why I'm such a big advocate for like workers own and the means of production and stuff like that. And I would consider myself a Democratic socialist because, and, like, of that. And, you know, I just think that, I don't know, it sucks because, like, I can think of so many people off the top of my head that I've watched their families just kind of break apart because of, because of the road, you know, and, like, working those blue collar jobs, and they're tough jobs. You're out in the sun all day or you're out in the, you know, negative temps all day long.

Yeah. And, I mean, you're out there busting your ass and sometimes life happens and, you know, you have already men's I mean I always said like the women who are with these men that are out there on the road are just just as strong it doesn't just impact you know the man who's gone the women the women that stay home and they're basically you know turn into single moms other than you know monetarily yeah but they're still getting kids to daycare somehow by themselves or you know handling kids sicknesses by themselves or especially ones that are you know not very family oriented and don't have a whole village of people and, you know, back home and stuff like that. They're just kind of doing it themselves. Yeah. Especially if they're working, you know. Yeah, yeah.

No, I see that with like, because my, my wife is like Armenian. And so, like, she has a huge family out here. And there's just like so much support that, you know, obviously she didn't have a kid until she was like, you know, old enough to like really be able to handle the responsibility and everything. But I just like realize that if you were somebody who had a baby when you were like 18 or whatever.

in this sort of environment it would be way less difficult because there are so many people that would be able to pick up the slack and help like take care of you whereas if you're really isolated which it feels like a lot of people are these days you know and you don't have that sort of family safety net it's got to be so much more pressure yeah dude it's it's definitely definitely difficult for all those people so you know I always always will always have special place in my heart for for the road and the friends and relationships that I made out there and everything like that I think I wouldn't be I wouldn't be who I am without them so right what uh do you ever have issues dealing with like the fame aspect of it especially being that you're famous

and kind of a very small short form so the way where like kind of a lot of people probably like recognize you and then they're like scratching their head and they're like you're that guy yeah yeah it's definitely weird I mean especially being from where I'm from, you know, like you don't, you don't never expect to, you know, be where I'm at. Not a lot of TikTok stars down there. Yeah, exactly. Out here in LA, we got a few too many. Yeah, see, that's the thing. Like this guy, the culture around here is a little bit different because, you know, people are actually being influencers or artists or creatives or whatever.

But where I'm from, you know, nobody does that. So it's definitely different, but I don't know. There was a point I can remember, I had like 3,000 followers on TikTok at one point, and I was like, oh, I got to go home and make content. We were all day drinking out of the pond or whatever. And one of my buddies was like, you really think that's going to go anywhere? Like, why are you doing that? You know, just stay here, drink beer.

And I'm like, no, I'm going to go do this or whatever. Because I always thought to myself like, oh, if I could just get to like 10,000 followers, I could really do something with this, you know, or at least play music for fun and make a little bit of money doing it and stuff. But, yeah, now it's turned into what it's turned into. Yeah. No, I remember that. Like when I was, you know, like 29 maybe, like there was a time period where I really like had this sort of epiphany where I was like, if I keep going to the bar and drinking and trying to meet chicks every night, because, you know, at a certain point, I was just doing that like, you know, five nights out of the week. And then at a certain point, I'm like, bro, like, if I just do that every night for the next like 10 years, I'm not going to get anywhere. But if I like stay home and like, fuck. I was like very much the time period where I was really like figuring out YouTube and podcast. And like it was a time period in my life where I could easily stay up until five in the morning just watching videos online and sort of like realizing what was out there because this was kind of like the very early days of YouTube.

And I feel like me blowing off opportunities to go out drinking was like, you know, the number one thing that helped me to like be early on YouTube and podcasting and stuff like that. But I remember having friends who. would just be shaming me beyond belief for not being willing to go out drinking with them and you know would just be on my ass about it and just realizing like there's always going to be people trying to drag you down and and and make you stoop to their level when you go out of your way to start trying to better yourself yeah I think some and like I don't hold it against any of those friends or anything like that because it's just different from where we're from but um yeah I mean it's the same thing you're you're you're close

closest friends will be your, I don't want to say biggest naysayers, but they'll be, you know, kind of doubtful just because they know you better than anyone else. And also, like, they can't, they don't do it. So, you know, they don't see how you would be able to do it, especially when you're hanging out in the same spaces and things like that. Yeah, if you're going to, if we're buddies and we're on the same level and you have this dream of becoming a music superstar, and I have no such dream, it's pretty understandable that I'm going to kind of, you know, maybe not consciously, but I'm going to be a little bit offended by the notion that you think that you could be a million air off music and that I, I don't even have, before you even

accomplished the goal, the fact that I don't even have the ability to conceive of doing something like that with my life, it's understandable that somebody would be resistant to that, you know? Yeah, dude, I think that's the biggest part of it. It's just their, you know, lack of understanding, but I don't hold that against them because why would you understand it? You know what I mean? Especially where I'm from, you know, but I think once it started catching on, most of my friends were really supportive. And even now, you know, like a lot of my friends in my hometown, don't necessarily agree with everything that I say, but we can have candid conversations, one and two, they support me like through everything I do, you know? And so I think it's really

a big part of why I stayed in my hometown, you know, and I don't know. I also think that, like, Like there's some people, you know, on the left side of politics, this is something that frustrates me about the left is that, you know, there are a lot of times people will be like, well, how do you still hang out with these people or how have you not cut these people out of your life? And it's like, did you ever think that maybe you from suburban America next to some city or something like that may not be the best spokesperson to talk to these people about these issues? You know, like don't you want them to be able to be on the same page and like where we can

collectively fight for each other? Right. You know, so I think for me, this is my job. You know what I'm saying? It's not the leftist from, you know, L.A. County's job to speak to people in rural America about why they should vote for Democrats because they're a farmer, not in spite of it. You know, I think that's probably someone who looks like me or to be educated about, you know, policy as it pertains to African-American communities or Latino American communities or things like

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Luxury sales claim based on S&P Global Mobility Canadian New Vehicle Total Registration for calendar year 2025 for the Cadillac definition of luxury. Yeah, I mean, the last thing that people on the left need is to just, like, isolate themselves into their own little corners on the internet. It's like, no, you need to be trying to figure out how you're going to, like, sit your ass in front of, like, all of the right-leaning candidates or pundits that you disagree with the most because you, like, you just need to, like, create examples for all these kids who really are like incapable of imagining taking anybody seriously unless they're a Trump supporter.

Yeah. You need to give them a model of like, okay, this is what a dude who's on the left and is actually a cool guy looks like. Yeah, dude. This is not exclusive to people on the right for you to be like an alright guy. And I feel like I end up like just from knowing so many people on the right, I end up getting that reaction of like, damn, you're the only Kamala Harris voter that I've actually enjoyed hanging out with.

Then I'm like, okay, well, maybe that's a start. Exactly, dude. And that's actually, I experience that all the time in my hometown, you know, where people were like, oh, well, you know, it's crazy that, you know, you're actually not that bad of a God, even though you're a Democrat or whatever. And it's like, yeah, if you just would fucking talk to people on the left, you'd realize, you know, even though you probably wouldn't stop on the side of the road to piss on me if I was on fire, I still want you to be able to afford health care.

You know what I'm saying? So, I don't know. That's what it is for me. Like, I don't want to see anybody, especially in places where I'm from. That's why, like, people say I talk about my hometown all the time, but, dude, I love my hometown. And I want to see the people that are there be successful in every way. I want them to be able to hang out with their families. And I want them to be able to go to the cookout on the weekend because they don't have to work, you know, because their job pays them enough.

They don't have to work weekends. Right. So, I don't know. It does frustrate me, though, because I'm like, dude, I wish. And that's why I enjoy doing these kind of sit downs and being able to, like, actually. express in a lengthy manner how I feel about some of these things because I just want people to know

you know the politics of it all is the politics of it all and short form media is short form media but it's never that surface level thing you know we should be able to look at different policy with nuance and not solve it

with black and white policy you know like I don't think that I don't think that you should be so scared of trans people and immigrants that you vote against your own best interests or vote for a fuck or clap your hands when we're going to war with a foreign country. Yeah. Or at least you should like be conscious of the fact that they are using trans people to distract you from things that are a lot more material in your life. Because for some reason trans people are a lot more like shocking and offensive and attention grabbing to the average person. That's what I say to people like in small towns all the time is they're like, well, I just don't understand it.

And I'm like, yeah, but they don't understand you. But they're, you know, they don't care how you live your life. Right. Live the way you want to. And they'll be like, well, I just want to be left alone. Yeah. What the fuck do you think they want? Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like, I just, I'll never understand that whole like, oh, well, I just want to be left alone thing. Yeah. The whole, the whole notion of small town folks saying, well, I just want to be left alone stops when you go to the voting booth and vote for people who will not leave people alone. You know what I'm saying? So if you truly want to be left alone and you want other people to be left alone, then start advocating for it. Yeah, no, for real. I mean, like, the thing that stands out to me with you, too, is that, like, I've moved around a lot because I grew up in New Hampshire.

So I lived in New York for a while. I lived out here for a while. I bounced around, like, all different parts of Southern California. And it's like, I'm not really, like, connected to the dudes that I hung out with when I was in high school. You know, it was like, as years ago by, I haven't lived there in, like, 25 years. kind of like fades away. And from my perspective, like, if you've got buddies that you really like grew up around that you really love and have that like super close connection with, that is like the most important thing in the world. And for sure, you being a little bit

of a dumbass racist or whatever, I'm not letting that like get in the way of the fact that we've been friends for 20 years. You know, like if you have that kind of connection with somebody, like that's the kind of connection that should be able to weather you guys having slightly different opinions about things. Yeah, it's being able to like, like you said, the dumbass racist thing. It's being able to look at one of your friends who says that and says like, hey, dude, we're 30. Yeah. You know what I mean? Don't be, this is why this is racist or something like that. And being able to have a candid conversation, maybe change their worldview on that. Yeah. And if you don't agree with me, let's argue about it. And then whatever we can get you have friends afterwards,

you know, that's like really, really important, I think. Yeah. And I think that's the big thing. Like, you know, I think a lot of my friends, maybe at the beginning of when I first started doing this, kind of struggled with, like, oh, you know, he just like gets online and says all these things. But then he talks to us a certain different way. But, like, every time I talk to them would talk to them about it, I'd be like, look, I'm not conceding. Even when we talk, I'm not conceding on the things that I believe in. Yeah. You know, I just think that if we talk about them together and in a meaningful way, we'll see things in a better way, you know, moving forward. forward and like we're better for it. I think I'm closer with my friends that I went to high school

with now than I have ever been. You know, and like a lot of them are conservatives and we actually agree on most things, you know, because we are from a small town and we see the same things and see the same, you know, policy affect who we are and how we live and things like that. So, you know, I don't know. It's a hard, it's hard because like there's times where I'm like, well, maybe I should move to Nash because it'd be easier. Like when I'm doing trips like this and stuff, it'd be easier to not have to cram everything into, you know, a couple weeks here and there. But I would lose that, that sense of like groundedness, you know, from where I'm from

and why I believe the things I believe in and things like that. And I always want to be able to, you know, be close with my friends, you know. I mean, there's some friends I've lost. Don't get me wrong, especially in my hometown. There's some friends that don't with me anymore and that's okay. I heard you said on this other thing. You're like, there are people that I respect. that talks about me all the time.

Yeah. As far as like people you grew up with or whatever. And I'm like, that's cool that you would just even acknowledge that and not let it turn into like, well, you've got issues with me. You're talking about me so I no longer respect you. I think you're a piece of shit now. Yeah, because just somebody not liking you does not necessarily have to put you into the box of hating them, you know?

Yeah, exactly. That's my whole thing. Like, everybody's entitled to how they feel. So if you're going to, like, if you're going to feel a certain way towards me, then I can't do anything about that. that. That's how you feel. So, I mean, if you ever want to have a conversation with me about it, the door's always open, you know, but like, I mean, if you're going to go run my name down, then that's on you, dog. That ain't me, you know, I'm not, I'm not going to sit here and beg you

to be my friend. You know what I mean? So. But I'll never lose respect for those people. You know, I'll never, especially people that, you know, helped me growing up, you know, small town, like everybody, you have interactions with everybody and you have interactions where, you know, somebody helps you one day or whatever. Right. I'm not going to forget that. Yeah.

So it is what it is. Like I said, if you don't fuck with me, then you don't fuck with me, but whatever. Yeah. No, definitely. I think that's good. The problem is that you got to be like,

like, you almost like can't afford to be an asshole because all these people being able to get along with people on the left, kind of like you're the case study of that. So it's like if you slip up and you're, it's kind of like dowel then be like, well, this is why we're not supposed to be kicking it with liberals anyway, man. Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, I think there's a space where like you got to, you just got to meet people where they're at sometimes. Like, because like I said, there's things that I've gotten further left on as I've grown up. So I know if my worldview can change, even if it's a little bit, isn't that good?

You know? So I don't know. Like I said, there's certain people. that are meant to speak to different crowds and things like that. And my job, I feel like, is to talk about issues that I see. And, you know, maybe if they're on the federal level or whatever, and they're just trickling down to affect all of us, you know, then that's okay too. But, you know.

So are you, do you feel like you really, really, really need to make a hit record at some point in order for your career to keep moving? ahead because that's kind of like you've had all these viral tic talks but then like the hit record that actually makes us way to radio and everything's kind of like the next graduate step towards you becoming like somebody who's taking more serious as an artist like what's your thought process on that and do you allow that to like permeate your brain when you're sitting around writing songs yeah no I don't ever think about it when I'm in the writer's room I think that like if uh you know if we get a if we get a hit then we get a hit if we don't I'm always going to be

trying to grow this organic fan base, you know, and like this organic group of, our community of people that believe in what I'm saying and, you know, believe in me as a person and as an artist. You know, I always just say, I make this music, or people would always come at me and be like, oh, he's only making that music to sell his message or saying the message to sell his music. And I'm like, no, I make the music to sell the message. Right. You know, like, I want people to start treating people with dignity and humanity again. You know what I mean?

Like I always said, the thing that doesn't really drive me up a wall is it's not the, like, advocacy against or anything like that. It's that a lot of people just don't give a, like, they'll see, that's the total apathy towards specific issues. like they'll see a ice agent shoot somebody in the street. And they don't, they don't, like not only not supported or anything, they don't give a, right. It never crosses their mind again. Yeah. You know, like, that's the that really runs me up a wall because I'm like,

how can you not care about this, you know? And I just want people to be knowledgeable and care about where they live and like who their putting their trust in you know what i mean so i don't know i think if you're not if you're not doing politics in today's day and age politics is doing you whether you like it or not so there's a lot of truth to that um what do you want people to check out or like what's your message to the people out there who uh managed to make it this deep in the interview yeah thanks for watching thanks for having me on dude i really appreciate it oh yeah my pleasure for giving me the platform and everything be able to come out here like i said i just it really enjoyed being able to

talk about some things in a more candid way instead of just short form content like that yeah no like for people who were curious about how this happened i just like literally saw one of your instagram reels or whatever and i watched 10 more and i was like this guy's sick and i message you and then there we go so it's like pretty you know i guess like that's the value of the clips and the short form content is that you know you never know who's going to see it and just be like hey let's let's do something yeah yep yep yep so i appreciate it man thanks i've been watching no jumper for a while so yeah it's Hope to be here and appreciate everybody for watching. That's like to hear.

Oh, yeah. Thanks, man. Appreciate it, man. Brian, appreciate you, bro. Thanks so much. Everybody go turn him up on all streaming services. No, John Merger, coolest podcast on the world. Like, comment, and subscribe.

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