No Jumper - Drakeo The Ruler’s Lawyer Speaks on His Case!

Episode Date: October 4, 2019

Drakeo's Lawyer John Hamasaki, took the time to sit down with Adam to shine light on this unfortunate case. From acquittal to a possible long sentence, John helps us understand how the prosecution is handled. --- FOLLOW OUR NEW SPOTIFY PLAYLIST! https://spoti.fi/2vi9lsD CHECK OUT OUR ONLINE STORE!!! http://www.nojumper.com/ SUBSCRIBE for new interviews (and more) weekly: http://bit.ly/nastymondayz Follow us on Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/nojumper and iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/no-jumper/id1001659715?mt=2 and follow us on Social Media: http://www.twitter.com/nojumper http://www.instagram.com/nojumper http://www.reddit.com/r/nojumper JOIN THE DISCORD: https://discord.gg/Q3XPfBm follow Adam22 as well: http://www.twitter.com/adam22 http://www.instagram.com/adam22 and follow adam22hoe on Snapchat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

No Jumper, coolest podcasts on the world. And today I'm here with Draco the Ruler's lawyer. Introduce yourself. My name is John Hamasaki. I'm a criminal defense lawyer. I'm based in San Francisco. This is the first real case I've dealt with in L.A. and I've learned a lot about the Los Angeles criminal justice system and policing and prosecutors down here, which has been horrifying. fine. How did you get wrapped up in this if you're typically doing law in San Francisco and this is a very L.A. case? This is a, that's a fair statement. This is a very L.A. case and I've gotten a L.A. for dummies over the two months of the trial this summer. Right. So I originally became involved in a case of a Richmond Bay Area rapper, Las the Boy. where it was another case where prosecutors were prosecuting somebody based in part on their hip-hop lyrics, really focusing on it.

And this was about four years ago. And there was started to be a national conversation around this. It was a New York Times piece. And an LA Times piece, actually, they discussed that case. And so I got a lot more involved in, you know, all of the issues surrounding the prosecution of artists. by law enforcement and prosecutors. And so I got to know sort of a community of academics, advocates, artists that were all, you know,

saw this issue happening, saw it unfolding in our, in our court system, saw the way it was being used to target, harass, and prosecute and imprison young black artists primarily. And so there's a, What was the description for Jeff Weiss? I said, what did I say? I said something about he's just a gatekeeper, a pillar of a gate, just a watcher, the guy who's really sort of just been doing the Lord's work documenting L.A. hip-hop,

nonstop, regardless of the extent to which it's popular. Like, that doesn't really matter so much to Jeff. It's like he's paying attention to documenting important stuff going on in the culture. And it's a very valuable service. Yeah. So Jeff was following the case. I think Jeff was one of the people who early on really appreciated Draco's talent. Long before any kind of legal trouble for sure, yeah.

Yeah, right. And so he wasn't one of the people who was just kind of like, hey, jump on the, you know, Draco kind of movement. And so he kind of saw what was happening and saw that Draco was just getting abused by the L.A. court system. and realized they needed somebody who had experience in these type of issues and had experience with the prosecution of rappers. And so he reached out to one of the academics, a guy named Eric Nielsen, who's a professor at the University of Richmond. And Eric and I have known each other since back from that case about four or five years ago. And he said, hey, if it's in California, you know, you got to talk to John.

and at first I was just going to consult with a lawyer that was working on the case and try to help him out. And then it became apparent that my presence here would be of benefit. Okay. Yeah. So in terms of the actual case, because the reason why so much of this is based on lyrics and things that have been done in music videos and such is because there really isn't any evidence tying Draco to this case. It all stems back to the shooting that took place at a, it was a pajama party of some sorts. That's correct. A pajama jam.

Right. And more or less, a couple of guys show up. They see some guys that they don't like. They shoot at them. A couple guys get hit, but one of them dies. And Drago the ruler was nowhere to be found. Wasn't supposed to be there. Wasn't anywhere nearby, right?

Well, no. He was actually there. And he did know the shooter. Oh, okay. But just to be clear, and that's all been public. He's never hidden from that. But did he actually even make it into the party? Didn't he show up and not even actually enter?

Yeah, so they were hanging out in a group of people just kind of, I think the term used was parking lot pimping. And some people who had disagreements with another person about certain things, had guns and shot them. And so those people knew Draco, but there's no evidence to suggest that he directed them to go there to deal with anyone. Well, no. That was the famous RJ conspiracy theory, right? Which I think you've probably heard about.

Yeah, the idea that Grito had gone there basically to pursue and potentially kill fellow L.A. rapper, RJ, even though RJ was not supposed to be there, was not there, never intended to be there, was not Builders being there. And he himself has said that he didn't believe that Draco had any desire to kill him at that time. Right. Absolutely. I mean, it was, it was, thankfully the jurors were able to see through it. But the prosecution, they really believe, I don't know if I want to say believed in that, but that's the theory they pushed. you know anybody and this is you know some of the things i've learned about la and la culture and parties down here this was not some party that r j would be at right this was a you know low-key janky kind of party in a warehouse with you know not that many people like it's just like not it's

not it wasn't credible it wasn't reasonable it wasn't logical there was no reason r j would be there But that was a way they could bring him into the case and tie him to this shooting and say he was there with this group of people that were really there to kill RJ, even though RJ was never going to be there. And then they killed somebody else. Right. And so Draco's name gets inserted into the conversation surrounding this murder because he, the detectives are listening to a wiretap to an unrelated case and they hear Draco's name says. Is that correct? Yeah. So what happened is at the time, Draco had a pretty flashy Mercedes that people knew.

And people saw him leave after the shooting. And people like, oh, there goes Draco's car. You know, Draco did it because he's obviously the big name of anybody at this party. Right. And so that's how the rumor started. And then the detective. essentially gets the name and starts watching music videos. Right.

Yeah. And if you watch Drakeo's videos, I mean, there's a lot of lean, there's a lot of guns, there's a lot of just him with his homies hanging out. You could see how, from somebody's perspective, if they wanted to paint him as a villain, that they could just take a look at his music videos and think, oh, there's a whole lot of ammunition to work with here. Yeah, but I would, you know, I think kind of looking back at hip-hop and rap historically, you know, the one thing the prosecutors and the police were not able to do is accept that a young black man who grew up in South Central like Draco could actually be an artist. Right.

Right. And this is like nobody in the real world outside of the prosecution team, you know, who's reviewed Draco's history, his music, what people have said about him, have doubted him as being an artist. they wanted to remove it from all the context of art and say, you know, this is a young black guy talking about, you know, things that exist in South Central Los Angeles, shooting, guns, drugs, lean, and say, because he's rapping about it, well, therefore he must be doing it. Right. Which is crazy. Yeah.

But it's a real, it's a real problem. It's a real outrage. and it's being done all over California. And I was just reading the article that came out today in The Guardian about this case, and I guess they honed in on really specified this one lyric where Draco just says something like chopper, make them go, uh, which is like if you know about rap, you know, that that's just any rapper could just say that. It's like rappers say casual lines about guns and violets all the time.

There's no need to read into it. That is the most generic rap lyric that is not meant to. to say that he committed any sort of specific action at all. The idea that that lyric would be put under a microscope is quite frankly terrifying. Yeah. I mean, and that's, you know, that's what got me out of San Francisco down to L.A. was, you know, Jeff Weiss reached out to Eric and Eric put us in touch. And then, you know, I talked to Draco from jail a few times. And, you know, what he was telling me? I was like, you know, doing criminal work, people tell you a lot of things that once you start to review the case, might be a little bit of a stretched interpretation or might not be supported by the actual evidence.

So I actually flew down here and sat in a visiting room with him at Men's Central jail for like four hours the first time. And we just went over everything. And I was like, man, it seems all was. what he's saying seems all credible and right and supported by the evidence, but why are the prosecutors and the police over here? And, you know, when I did actually get hold of the discovery, the police reports, the grand jury transcript, it really was as horrifying as I think people have imagined it to be. Right. And so this case has already been to trial and Draco was found not guilty on the vast majority of his counts aside from like possession of a firearm, correct?

Correct. I mean, and to be clear, so I think it's important that people understand from somebody who, even by their own theory, didn't know the murder was going to happen, but they still prosecuted him. They sought what's called special circumstances murder, which is essentially makes you death eligible and they kept the death penalty on the table against drako up until right before trial so they were seeking death up until a few months before trial for somebody that by their own witnesses and evidence did not know the shooting was going to occur did not encourage the shooting to occur did not want the shooting to occur but their argument is that because drako was part of a what is really a rap group

called the Stink Team, but which they were trying to portray as a gang, which is actually really notable because Draco is like one of the few L.A. rappers who, for the most part, has basically avoided really characterizing himself as part of a gang. Right. Stink Team has always been a rap group. Everybody has always regarded it as that to call it a gang is really kind of stretching the interpretation of what a gang is. The Stink Team was not a gang in the sense that, you know, the Pairoos are a gang or that, you know,

any of the various cryptsets around LA are a gang, but they're saying that because they consider the Stink team a gang and because there was potentially violent acts carried out by members of the Stink team, it doesn't matter that Draco wasn't aware of those acts or that he had anything to do with planning them, alleged acts, but it's because he would have ultimately benefited from those acts as a member of this gang, which is actually a rap group.

So that's the 182.5 charge, and that's the one that is especially problematic. I think there's been a fair amount of writing about it by journalists and people in the legal profession. Because there was a pretty infamous, famous case in San Diego of a rapper named Tiny Doe, who was, you know, by the prosecution's theory, gang affiliated, but, you know, by some prosecution's theory, anybody that grows up in a community that has gangs in it, and they know gang members, they're gang affiliated, right? There are a lot of different levels to which you can be in a gang. We know a lot of people who grew up on a Crip block. They might say Crip once in a while.

They might wear a blue hat once in a while, but they don't take any sort of action in terms of any sort of criminal behavior. And then there's some people who actually become part of those organizations in a serious way. And so this guy, his name is. Brandon Duncan, and he's actually, him and Aaron Harvey, two of the defendants who were charged in San Diego like this, have reached out and tried, offered to help, and they're actually helping with this case and getting the word out, which has been great. But in that case, the judge took a look at it and dismissed the 182.5 charges. Here, in this case, the jury hung on those, meaning there was a mistrial declared because the jury couldn't reach a verdict. The

charge was seven to five for acquittal and a juror reached out to me afterwards the day afterwards because he was just, you know, really so moved in a in a negative way by things that the prosecution had done to let me know, hey, you know, even on that counts, we were 10 to 2 up until the last vote for acquittal. And so the other charge that he's still facing, again, that was final, 10 to 2 for acquittal. So generally, in my experience, prosecutors, you don't refile

when somebody has 10 out of 12 jurors voting to acquit them and, you know, not being an L.A. attorney, I spoke to a group of L.A. attorneys out here and just, hey, you know, what do you think is going to happen? Will they refile that? No, no way. There's no reason, you know.

But, you know, they've made a decision. They announced it last month that they want to proceed and try to give him life in prison. All right. And do you think is it any, is it that there's a particular beef with Draco from Detective Hardiman or any other officers that have just a real sheer animosity for the guy? Or is this a case where it's just sort of the LAPD as a whole, just not wanting to see a real true L.A. gangster rapper flourish? Yeah, I mean, I think it's, so this was the detective in this case.

This became, I believe, somewhat of an obsession for him. It was a really strange case to review because, you know, pretty soon within a few weeks, or I'm sorry, within a month afterwards, they had a, they knew who the shooters were, right? Draco didn't have anything to do with the shooting. They knew that. they had an informant who testified who said no actually the shooting broke out and draco thought that they were being shot at and ducked under the steering wheel right was just trying to avoid the gunfire um that's that's been undisputed right so um you know the the i don't know the idea the idea

that that that um it's why why the detective focused on him, I don't know. I mean, maybe, you know, trying to get in somebody else's head is tough. You know, there's a lot of challenges that I've, you know, you learn about even outside of L.A., about L.A. policing, right? This is actually L.A. Sheriff's Department. It's not LAPD. Okay. You know, LAPD actually went through a series of reforms over the past, I don't know, 15, 20 years. I think there's still some challenges within the sheriff's department. Okay. So you think this might sort of be almost like a relic of like an old-time LA cop mentality

where they're sort of being allowed to prosecute them in a way that maybe wouldn't fly with the LAPD? You know, well, you know, generally there's a lot of, there's checks and balances in our criminal justice system. And if a police bring a case that shouldn't be prosecuted, the DA will, usually step in and say, you know, no, this is, we're not going to file charges. We're not going to prosecute this person. But in this case, it was the, the DA's office and this detective working together since the beginning of the case. And I don't know why they wanted Draco.

The only, you know, you can, I can have a dozen theories, use a trophy. He's brash. You know, he's definitely outspoken. He'll admit himself, he's an asshole. His demeanor is that he really is not the kind of guy who's all too worried about what you think of him. So I could imagine, certainly he could have sort of rubbed some people the wrong way on a personal level. Definitely. I mean, but on another personal...

Great guy. Don't get me wrong. Yeah, I know. You know, Drake is a good dude. And, you know, I got to know him pretty well going through trial for two months. months, you know, eight hours a day sitting next to a person, going visiting them in jail, talking on the phone, reviewing all of the discovery and things they were alleging. You know, he's a guy who's come up from nothing, created something for himself, and has, you know, our criminal justice system trying to take everything away in a way that just isn't

warranted, isn't justified. So, yeah. Are you representing any of the other members of the Stink team? Because a lot has been made about their situations being even sort of more severe. I know Ralphie, the plug has already pled guilty to something, right? He's already accepted some years. No, so, you know, Ralphie is a real example of, like, tragic collateral damage of their focus on Draco. So the focus on the Sting team really was all about getting to Draco.

And so, you know, earlier you said that some of the members of the Stink team were involved in violence. That's actually not accurate. That's not what's been alleged. It was credit card fraud that they tried. Yeah. It was like glorified petty crime, right? Things that would be misdemeanors, things that you go to, you know. Most average L.A. teenager type crime ever that you would never experience.

expect to be wrapped up into this sort of case. Right. And that was, I mean, that was part of the, I was like, they're like, they're a gang of people walking around upstairs. It's not the best studio we got here. It's all right. It's nice. It works. Yeah.

No, but like, you know, they went after all of these guys so hard. And there was a video where somebody had tagged. Right. Fuck too snitchy about a guy who was Stink Team that had given some information to the police in a music video. And they treated that, what, like witness intimidation or something? And so, yeah, and they used all these outtakes and everybody's laughing and joking around. And, you know, it's not like, you know, it's not witness intimidation. It was like a group of young guys screwing around and just kind of slamming a friend who has.

had done something dumb. Right. And so they tagged the witness intimidation with a gang enhancement. So now these guys are facing life in prison. For tagging a wall and not even like, I mean, you know, like it's, it's, and they went hard. And, you know, it's not like generally this is, this is such low level conduct. And in LA, where you have actual crime and actual violence, the amount of resources that has been spent prosecuting these guys has been outrageous. And so Ralphie went, they joined him with Draco and with the other defendant at trial.

And he went through trial and was actually convicted on some counts relating to burglaries, I think he was acquitted of the vandalism and he was acquitted of the witness intimidation, I believe, to my memory. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Let me ask you this. What do you, from your perspective, what needs to happen in Draco's upcoming trial in order for him to avoid the majority, the long sentences that are being thrown around? Like what needs to be proven that what that didn't take place this prior trial?

So this is what you were talking before or you mentioned before that I didn't actually follow up on about the benefit aspect, right? Right. And so the thing in the allegation is that the he somehow benefited because a killing that he didn't know was going to happen happened. and that improved his reputation and it was beneficial to him. And this was, you know, there was L.A. gangs involved here. The individual that was killed was a member of the Bloods. And, you know, for somebody like Draco being accused of killing a member of the Bloods is not a benefit. Right. That's pretty much a death sentence.

Would make his life very complicated, yeah. Very complicated. And, you know, I think there's, there's, certainly been repercussions since then, since people believed the prosecution theory and said, oh, yeah, Draco had something to do with this. So, you know, it's, it's, the, there's, there's a way that these gang cases are prosecuted, and they say, you know, everybody, everything is for the benefit of the gang, but this is a little different when they're saying that somebody who had nothing to do with the killing benefits.

Right. And they say, because Draco's name is Draco the ruler, he's the leader of the stink team gang, right? Which, you know, we like the instinct is to laugh about it if it wasn't so serious because it seems so, you know, farcical. Right. That's life. Are we supposed to believe that Master P is really some sort of military leader of the no-limit army, you know? You know, and that's the thing. And I think that I'm glad the guardian piece came out.

I'm glad that people are paying attention. I'm glad that we're doing this and we're talking about it. Because, you know, to the degree that this prosecution is allowed to continue and he's going to trial, you know, I'm confident, but anything can happen in the trial. And, you know, when you have an office like this, the prosecution in this case, not doing the right thing, right? I think the right thing would have been not to prosecute him in the first place, but certainly not to retry him. Then I think really people, it's helpful that people know about it and are educated and can speak out and reach out and try to stop the prosecution before it happens. Is there anything realistically that people at home could do to, like, raise awareness about this? Do you imagine that the conversation about this case could potentially reach such a fevered pitch

that somehow higher-ups in L.A. would be forced to maybe step in and say, like, hey, maybe we should have some more eyeballs on how this case is being tried. Like, do you see that as a possibility? I mean, so part of what I see underlying this re-prosecution, is actually an article written by Jeff Weiss and Fader. Did you have a chance to read that one? A masterpiece. A masterpiece beautifully written, very long, but extremely unkind to the prosecution and law enforcement. Brutal.

And, you know, whether it's fair or unfair, you know, I don't think, you know, nobody's called into question the, the, the truth of it. So I get the sense that they were really badly embarrassed by that article. They lost in a very public way at trial. And so really there has to be something that changes the momentum, right? Because, you know, we're speaking about it and people are, people in the activist community and the civil rights community are... They seem to start it.

They're starting to really get interested in this, right? Yeah. But it's, I think people after he was acquitted by everything, kind of like, okay. And I went back to San Francisco. I'm like, I'm done. That was great. You know. But then, you know, when they refiled it, everybody was like, whoa, this is not right.

Right. And it's interesting too because, I mean, you've got like a Meek Mill who's sort of become the face of criminal justice reform in terms of hip hop and everything. Meek Mill is a huge name. It's a huge money earner. for these corporations, and he's got people like Jay-Z behind him. When you look at Draco, Draco's like a god to L.A., but he's still more of an underground rapper. He doesn't necessarily have these huge industry cosigns to go to Batforum.

He doesn't have, you know, the mega high-end lawyers, I'm assuming. I'm assuming that you're largely doing this out of the goodness of your heart. Am I correct in that? It's not at my normal rate. I think that's fair to say. Yeah, now it's challenge, it's like, you know, as a lawyer, I run my own practice, so I have the opportunity to do cases that I consider important. To me, this is a really important case.

But I think you're right. You know, I think that in the greater community outside of the world that we're speaking in now, it would be helpful to have some light on it, which is why I was glad to come on to this program. I think that L.A. rappers, I think they should be paying attention because, you know, Draco's the test case. And if they can get away with it here, like, think about everybody, think about every rapper, any rapper you know in L.A. And if they have, you know, you know, use air quotes, gang affiliations. And one of those gang members kills somebody. This opens the door for the prosecutors to start prosecuting people that don't have anything due to do with the killing or the

violence. And, you know, there's a, there's an aspect where, you know, prosecutors are like everybody else. There was a, you know, the timing was really interesting here. There was that LA Times article about Draco. There was like on the front page of the, I think the style section of the LA Times that came out right before they filed the murder case. And, You know, it's a trophy. He's a trophy, you know, a big fish for them to try to take down, I think. And I think that added some, you know, motivation or encouragement to them to go after him. We have to just get to the point where it's more beneficial for their public image to just leave the shit alone instead of retrying it because you know they're humiliated because they didn't get them the first time around.

So they're like, oh, it's double down. Let's really go for this again. We just have to get to the point where it's so embarrassing that they realize that it's time to just abort ship and leave the guy alone. I think that's exactly it. You know, I mean, I work with prosecutors all the time and you get the range and there's some good prosecutors, good people that are doing their jobs. This has been really, like, from a lawyer legal perspective. and there's a lot of people in the legal profession that are very well respected that are outraged by this case. But, you know, for them to refile and the way they did it, I think was really disturbing.

You know, we showed up last month for sentencing, not a word beforehand, not a courtesy call to his lawyer and saying, hey, which is normally what would happen, hey, look, you know, this is the office's decision. Here's why. They showed up in court with the two detectives who were, you know, they were having a, like, it was really, it was hard. They were having a good time in court when they read out that they were refiling the charges and the detectives who, you know, I guess, I understand it was a humiliating experience for them. They had, they got beaten publicly, but they didn't.

never should have brought the case, right? It's so painful that he's sitting in a cell through all this. He's sitting in a tiny, solitary confinement cell, which I think you probably read about in the article or I've heard about. Right. Because he tweeted, uh, or that his dreams had been broke, crushed, and I'm going to take all my music down. And then he wrote, thank Detective Hardiman, right? Right. And so, you know, that's all he tweeted. Some of the fans wrote, you know, fuck Detective Harderman. You can't say anything about anybody online without expecting some percentage of your fan base to find that person's account and message them and say, fuck you.

Right. That tweet, I believe it was, the Draco poster, actually was so sad, so depressing because you're realizing that this is a guy that we all know to be a tough, strong guy, really regretting that he had ever tried to be. become a rapper because it had gotten him into this situation. And that he had genuinely wished that he had never tried to become an artist. Yeah. Because it has been used against him so mercilessly.

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, like it took all of the accomplishments that, you know, if it wasn't a rapper, I mean, like somebody achieving that level of accomplishment and then saying, you know, we're going to use that accomplishment, that, that artistry. we're going to imprison you for life. I think you nailed a he spoke from a place of pain. He spoke from a place of, you know, just, you know, there's a part that being in jail, you know, I've just noticed from clients over the years.

It's not a good place to be. Draco's, you know, Draco was in, you know, general population. I think he was okay. And then he tweeted this and the detective went and went to a different judge, not even our judge, and got him placed in solitary confinement in Shug Nights old cell. I guess Shug had just moved out. Symbolic? Yeah.

But there's high security in the jail, but this isn't high security. This is solitary. And so he's locked down 24 hours a day except for a couple of breaks where he gets to go out, call his lawyer, you know, gets to go out outside into the yard a little bit, but is in one of those cages. Like he's, you know, the leader of the Mexican mafia, you know, some large, powerful prison gang for tweeting, you know, I'm taking my music down and thank Hardiman. And he's remained in there for eight, almost nine months now.

And, you know, we've asked the judge to, you know, undo all of this, to let him out. But, you know, it's been to no avail. And you could easily imagine a scenario in which Draco was on house arrest sitting in his house or the fucking ankle monitor on waiting out the last nine months. And that maybe being an acceptable thing. But that's not the case. No. Instead he's by himself and a cell.

He's by himself. I think there was something interesting that was raised in the article that was actually kind of resonated with me, which was about when we actually went to trial. And, you know, going from a tiny cell. where you can reach out and touch all sides to being in a giant courtroom, and you're doing jury selection. So there's like 80 people in there, and they're all staring at you. And it was tough, because, you know, solitary, there's plenty of studies that, how it impacts

your body, your mind, your heart. I mean, it's considered torture by Amnesty International and other international organizations. And there's a lot of movements in the reform community. to disallow solitary, but that's how he's been living. And I'm sure a day or a week of solitary is brutal, but, I mean, nine months is... Nine months. You know, I've... There's the side of him, you know, I think you're saying he's an asshole, but I've gotten

a lot of respect for him because he's been able to handle it and manage it with just a degree of strength that I think you rarely see, like instead of letting it break him. And he's had some tough times, but he's, you know, focused and focused on, you know, if we have to go to trial, focused on winning again. But it's been tough on him. Right. So when is your estimate of when he's going to be able to seek justice again in a court of law? It's been pushed back, right? Well, we're seeking justice tomorrow morning in Compton Courthouse.

So what we did was file a request. to the judge to use her powers as a judge to dismiss it under a section of the penal code called 1385. And so a judge has this power when either it's just in the furtherance of justice, which seems like a pretty fair case here, or when no reasonable jury could convict somebody. So, you know, I'm optimistic, but I'm also realistic, right? Right. I'd love to, I'd love the judge to step up, but that's a pretty, you know, challenging thing to do when the DA's office is so invested in this case. Like, this is, this has become like.

Pet project for them. I mean, it's more than a pet project. They, you know, they have spent so many resources, have, you know, multiple attorneys working on it. Yeah, it's, it's been their baby. and, you know, I think maybe a better hobby would be in order than trying to give a man life in prison for something he didn't do. For sure. Yeah.

I mean, I guess we'll see what happens tomorrow. And regardless, we got to keep trying to keep the chorus of people who are talking about this. We've got to keep making that grow one way or another, whether it's just finding more and more big names that we can get to comment about it or just kind of. creating more and more of a public outcry. And anybody who sort of works in the journalistic world, I mean, the Guardian is great. I mean, I can imagine a scenario where if this really goes as far as it could,

that we could see the New York Times getting interested in talking about and stuff. Because these really are like very far-reaching implications. It's not just one man's struggle. Right, absolutely. And, you know, the thing is when that case happened in San Diego, that was national. Like, that was in the Washington Post and all over the place. everybody was talking about it. It's kind of, it's a little bit harder to do the story.

They're doing it again because it was such an outrage then. And then also, you know, Draco's Draco. And he's he's not, um, he's not changed his attitude, you know, towards kind of speaking out or being, being silenced by, by, by, by, by, by this prosecution. And so I think, um, you know, he, he's, he's rough around the edges, I think to some people. But that's, you know, that's the core and the soul of hip hop is people coming out of, you know, tough areas, broken areas, areas with over-policing, with abuses against the citizens and coming out and making art out of that. And so, you know. And this ain't no regular rap,

either. My man, Draco, is crazy. If there's anybody who's just watching this purely from a sort of social justice perspective, just know that one of the finest men to have touched a mic in the last however many years in LA in particular. That's what I hear. All right, anything else that people at home should know or things they should keep in mind if they want to support him? No, I mean, I think you really nailed it is, you know, injustice in the dark. If nobody sees it, that's how injustice flourishes.

and, you know, I'm really grateful for this opportunity. I'm grateful for your support. I know Draco is. Draco's talked about you a number of times over the time I've known him as an importance and good dude in the rap community that's kind of really helped elevates L.A. hip-hop in a way that I think L.A. hip-hop and rap needed to be elevated. So, you know, really, we just need the word out. We need people paying attention. We need people, you know, on social media.

We need people talking to the DA. We need the people in power to say, hey, you know what? You had your shot. You gave it everything you had. It didn't work out for you. Move on. You know, it's not even, you don't even have to get to, like, you didn't, shouldn't have brought the first case in the beginning or it's like, what's done is done.

What's done is done, but like, let the man go home. This has been too much, too long, and just, It's brutal what this is done to his family and to his soul just when they, you know, when they announce that they're going to try again to give him life. So keep spreading the word and I appreciate you having me here. I appreciate you come in. Let's definitely keep making noise about this thing. Great.

Thank you. Appreciate you, man. Hey, this has been Nojumper, coolest podcasts in the world. Check us out on YouTube, SoundCloud, iTunes, like, comment, and subscribe. And go support Drake of the Ruler, I guess. listen to them on Spotify or something. Go follow the man on Instagram. Show him some support.

I'm sure he's hearing about it from somebody. Thank you. Appreciate, Joe.