No Jumper - Fleece Johnson on Becoming a Booty Warrior, Turning Men Out, The Boondocks & More

Episode Date: October 20, 2025

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Your heard was, I think your, your hair used to be blonde or something, didn't it? I did a blonde Halloween costume at one point. Yeah, yeah, I see the difference. So, how are you doing, Mr. Adam? I don't know, I just, I can't help, but feel like you're kind of trying to riz me up right now. Now, man, I was wondering if you was in a dressing room putting on some makeup or something, right? We were working on getting the Zoom call all set up. So no, I'm not wearing any makeup.

Are you trying to say that? I look like I'm wearing makeup. No, you're cute. You're all right. I didn't even think about the fact that this interview might go this way. Oh, no. No, I'm going to let you ask the questions. Okay, yeah.

I feel like now you've got me feeling like you're trying to feel me out for being your next sissy. And I just want to say I have a sterling reputation, a lifelong, reputation of heterosexuality and I am a married man, sir. I'm married too and the beat goes on. Who are you married to? Yeah, I got a wife, but I can't tell your name. That's fine. I probably wouldn't know it.

You didn't know I was married? You didn't know it? I didn't know that. That's actually a really interesting detail. I didn't married for six years. How's that going? Like all marriage, you just got it's ups and downs. You know, you got a fight.

for the respect. She fights for her respect. We auger. We go through what every marriage go through. You know, organ, you know, ups and down. Because we're going kind of all over the place already, but I mean, one of the most interesting things to me about your story is the fact that you actually ended up getting locked up before you were ever able to be with a woman when you were young. So your entire introduction to sex and human relationships was pretty much behind bars with other men. Right. That's true. Do you feel like had everything worked out differently that you would have just been with women your whole life and that you wouldn't have been interested in anything like that? Yeah. Yeah, I do. I believe it.

That's wild because, I mean, but you've, I mean, I don't want to get into the most depressing stuff. right away, but I watched another interview where you were talking about how you were basically having other men come at you from a very early age. Yeah, yeah, that did happen. You know, I was molested as a child. What age was that? I was around about 11, 12. And do you feel like that changed you a lot?

And how did that change you? It changed me tremendously because at the time, I was having problem with my you know I got siblings at home I got seven of us in the family there's four

boys and three girls and one day I walked in the room and caught them having sex and so I said I'm gonna tell on you so what they did was they all came up with a story so when my mom and them

came home they came up with something and had me get whooped for something that I didn't do just to stop me from telling what I saw them do. And so at the time, I didn't have nobody

that I can come to and talk to and tell them what's going on and stuff. And then when I got molested, I didn't have a big brother. I can run to and say, hey man, this guy did this to me.

because my brother's name was named against me for me seeing them do what I saw him do. Was that part of a pattern that all your brothers and sisters, like they were all having sex with each other? And did you feel like this was a consensual thing? It wasn't all of them. It wasn't all of them. It was two sisters and two brothers. Okay.

They did it. And do you feel like this was consensual that they had agreed? Yeah, they were doing it. she, one of my sisters, offered me some, and I said, no. And so I hear to live a life, and then I get molested. Now I get paranoid that, you know, somebody's going to see some feminine stuff in me. So I started coming out with an aggressive personality to stop people from seeing that saddle me.

So I would come out real mean, real aggressive, start packing pistols and all this stuff and just to throw people off. You know, really, you know, from what I was doing and then when I got off into that, it took a personality of his own. I actually became that, you know, real tough in the hood. And so,

it's all in my book right here. Oh. Who is Fleece Johnson? Okay, I got to get my hands on that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all in the book about my life. So I'm getting all these whoopings and stuff. And so despite my sister then,

I said I ain't going to cry no more. So they told my mama, so she came in and asked me did I say? I said, yeah, I said, and I mean it. So she whipped me to her nose started bleeding. And I wouldn't cry. I wouldn't cry. Then my daddy came in.

He whipped me until his hands shook. Right. I mean, do you think that that also did some damage on you personality-wise? Yeah, all those beatings. It's such a wild thing to think

of why a parent would even want to do that. That's just part for me to wrap my head around. Yeah. Back then, they didn't have child laws like they got now. Right. You know,

kids got beat. I got beaten. And my daddy bought his sister and hit me in the face because I wouldn't cry. When I got out of the hospital, I said, I'm ready for round two

and they told me you don't get weapons no more. So they killed that. You know, I had to go through some stuff to achieve it, but that's what happened. That's a funny thing about like all of our parents or all of our dads is that they kind of, they whip you right up until the point where you could whip them and then it usually stops. Yeah.

Yeah. Dads are some hos in that way, aren't they? But okay, so you, so who actually molested you? Well, it was two people. You know, because I didn't have nobody to talk to now. I ain't got no family to talk to. They all made at me, because I was going to tell on what I saw him do. I see somebody in the neighborhood.

He wants to talk to me. And we walked around the buildings and stuff, and we talked. And then he started wrestling, you know, showing me that he's stronger to me. You know, he wants to wrestle and peeing me down on the ground and all this stuff. And hunch on me. and uh but he was the only person i could talk to him and the other guy and so uh once he started doing it you know i'm confused about all of this and uh i don't know what to do about it and uh but when i turned 13

and i started packing them guns real heavy uh uh the uh the uh Two guys they did, it come up dead. Just put it like that. They did. I know. And it's a shame that you can't say more about how exactly that went down. But that's... That is a fascinating aspect of this in many ways.

But, yeah, it's a shame that that happened to them. But hopefully they got a chance to repent for what they did to you and probably to other men as well. Yeah, I doubt it. But, uh, they didn't get... Do you say rest in peace to them in any way? Is there any part of your personality that feels sympathy for? No.

No, it's not. No, no. It's, it's... I wish it... I, I don't feel no sympathy. Just put it like that. They got what there was coming to them, and they did. So, but you still, it's something I got to live with and hid the little with.

And so, at aggression that came in me, stayed in me. And I kept getting sent to, I was sent to all kinds of places. I was sent to all the boys' camps, detention centers, juveniles. Every one of them I went in, I tore it up, and they closed the boys. place when I left. And so they sent me to a mental hospital, Central State,

children were. I told my sister them, if they keep messing with me, I was going to cut their throat and they sleep. And they went, I wasn't going to do nothing, but they told my mama, and

she called the police, and they came and locked me up, and when I went to court, they sent me to a mental hospital. And when I get out there, I escape. I escaped twice, and they caught me. The third time I got away,

I bused one on me in the head, took their car. And I was in a stolen car, and I took that car off the bridge into the river, the Ohio River. And you were all right? Yeah, when I got away. I made,

me and the car hit the water about the same time. The air pressure was trying to stop me from squeezing out. I took it off the bridge, because state troopers and them had the bridge blocked off. And so when I hit the water, my pants and stuff started filling up with water, so I kicked my shoes and everything off.

And that's what they found floating. So it was in a career journal, newspaper, in Louisville. and they said a fish, a big old fish, ate me. They thought I was dead, you know, held a fruna, all this stuff. But three months later, I showed up, you know, but I still got this violent personality. And I'm robbing everybody in the city. I'm robbing, I started robbing dope men because,

this woman, she died with a needle stuck in her arm, and she was a real good mama type to me. So when I found that out, I said, I'm going to ride all the dope dealers, and I'm going to throw the dope away, keep the money. And that's what I did. I arrived the whole city. And then I used to mess with the police, see the police park somewhere and just take a stolen car, run in the back, I'll see if they can chase me. They can never catch me, though. I mean, do you think that you would have been acting out this way

and doing all of this extreme stuff if you weren't so angry because of the molestation situation? Ain't no doubt in my mind I would turn out this 100% battle with, you know, less angle, less frustration. And, but all this played out, man. and I kept it, that personality took a turn

and I got in an incident where the police family blocked the 34th Street it's in a career journal newspaper and they even had a picture of the car they shot up said they got shot up worse than Bonnie and Clive car

and I was a juvenile and the whole city was protesting because you know I'm a child and they shot this car up like this. But they knew that you were You were committing crimes all over the city, and they wanted you dead, right? And this is an era before body cams, before security cameras. And I always pick at them.

They've been after me a while. I go, when they change shift, I pull up in their parking lot. Get out of car, cross them out, and then peel rub and make them come out there. I mean, but they could never catch me. And so, but when they family caught me, they shot the car up. Right. And then the main police, he stuck a gun. through the wind and empty.

I saw the fire come out and then no bullets hit me. Well, this police, he got fired. My daddy didn't want to file no lawsuit. He told me he said it taught me a lesson from O'Sah. But the police come up dead. Just later, the police came up dead? Yeah, and so I got charged. Okay.

And so I met trial, and then his fat white lady, she said, she saw me do it. But at trial, she said, they said he in his courtroom. She said, no. And everybody in the courtroom just exploded, man, because they was done for justice, right? So I left the courtroom that same day. I walked out of the courtroom, and the police car was parked in the street. Well, it wasn't parked. it was in the street and they was talking, waiting on the verdict.

And I drunk in their car and stole their car right there. So they said, we're going to get him. Right after beating a murder charge, you stole a police car right in front of the courthouse. Yeah. That's a wild tale right there. Who do you think killed the cop? Uh, I don't know. That's wild.

And this was in Louisville. Yeah, he killed itself. So trying to, nothing. Anyway, after that, they caught me with stealing cars and a bunch of robberies. And they said, he's not getting out of this. We're going to send him to the penitentiary. I was in jail at 14. You know, then I turned 15 and then turned 16 and then turned 16 in Pentonetri.

and they made sure that I was going to the prison and I started out with just 10 years, man. Was this before they had separate jails for teenagers and stuff? No, they had separate jails and stuff, but everyone out of being in, out of winning in a total place, they said they ain't going to take me back, you know. You know, I went in our fighting and stuff.

And so they said, we got a place for them to penitentiary. So you're 14 in the state penitentiary surrounded by, I assume, a lot of very cold-blooded gang members, killers, et cetera, right? I was in jail at 14. In prison, I turned 16. I was 15. I hit prison at 15 and turned 16. And they wrote an article in the Curr-Jona News. paper and it was titled 16 year old prisoner want to get out and go straight and uh it's in uh

it's in his book it's in his uh here's the article right here that was in the paper right so even at 16 you were you were kind of toying with the idea of turning your life around no that's just what they said i didn't know how at that time i was like borderland illiterate I ain't been in the school system in about six years I got kicked out of school at the age of 10 and never went back and stuff like it

and so I didn't know how to write my name when I went to prison. Right. I learned all that in a And was there actual school programs set up or did you just have to take it into your own hands to learn?

I took it in my own hands. And I talk to people that got GEDs, they can tutel me, right? Right. You know, if I got a question or something, but I went to the library, prison library, and they got all kinds of books from first grade all the way up to GED college. Right. So I studied myself. There's a reason why podcasters can turn any topic into a little.

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www.4thepeople.com slash no jumper or by scanning the QR code on the screen from your phone's camera. Thank you very much to Morgan and Morgan for sponsoring this episode. Did you start to become a way more hardened criminal or a hardened gangster as a result of being around all of these older guys who are in there for, you know, crazy shit? Yeah.

The people I hung with on the street when I was 13, they was in their 30s. And so I was really feared in my city, man. I carried two nickel plate and 45 automatics.

And I had no problem pulling them on anybody. I can walk in any club. They don't ask me how old I am they know who I am soon I walk in I just let me come in treat me like they like I was in a duck and they know if they didn't I would have robbed him and shot their place for wow that was a wild time you know like it feels like you're just describing like a version of America that is just kind of totally different compared to what it's like these days yeah yeah I In all my robbery, I never put a mask on.

I never wrote a disguise. I run in the place, jump up on the counter, pull my gun out, pop it twice, and rob it. And some places I tell them who I am. My name is Fleece Johnson. You know, I wanted that type of drama, man. It was like I was, what has been happening in my life, mean I started off as a real nice child, man.

Real nice child. And then I hit prison. And I'll tell you, that was other than anything I ever went through in my life. And I never experienced fear, terrible, real torture until I hit the penitenti. Really? And what was your first experience with that like? Like, when did you really start to realize how brutal this environment was? Well, I started realizing that when I took a shower.

I was in LaGrange prison, and I took a shower and this big dude named Reggie. I'm talking about, man, he had a big chest, just muscle up, you know. And he was stirring at me, and his thing was hard. And so I got out of the shower And I told some people, some of my friends, and they said, yeah, he's a freak, man. They'll watch him. So one day he decided to make his move, man.

He got me in a chokehold from the back. And I'm naked and he's naked. And he's trying to pull me in back of the shit. And I'm kicking my legs out. and he's trying to pull me in the back of this wall where he can finish me up and I'm trying to get a sound out where I can alert somebody man, I need help man.

And you're what, 16? Man, yeah. And just so happened, one of my friends walked in there and hollied everybody. He's getting attacked. So all the dudes running out, so we jumped him. We got him on the ground. and I put some boots on

and I said, go give me some boots, man. And dude brought me some boots. I tied him up and I put some underwear on and while he was on the ground, I stomped him. So bad, and here's what didn't nobody see. It was duty all over the floor. But they didn't know that came from me. The pee and the duty, that man, he choked me

till I duty, man. I shit it. But I didn't want them to know it came from me. So after I stomped him so bad, I put it out that I stomped him till he shit it. But the shit came from me, man. That was my first terrifying experience, and I was saved by the bell on that encounter. That encounter saved me by the bell. But I got to fight, and, you know, I got this angle stuff in me.

so they're going to send me to the worst prison in the state of Kentucky called Eddieville. Now, that's why they got the lecture and people locked up for killing their whole family and stuff. So I went down there and had some real terrifying experiences down.

Right. So, but when you first beat up this guy who tried to take advantage of you, did you get punished in any way by the jail for that? or did that go undetected? No, I got punished. Okay.

Yeah, I did get punished. I got put in the hole, right? But back then, in them days, if a black person gets hurt, they sweep that under the table. Really? Yeah, I've seen black people get stabbed and killed, and they swept it right up under the table, man. Wow.

And then if they do go to court, they get something. something like three years. You killed his man that got three years, you know. And so they didn't really care about black-on-black crime in prison. Really? Yeah, I mean, I could imagine that, like, down-south prisons during, what is this, the 90s? It must have been... No, the 80s and the 70s.

The 80s, oh, shit. I went in the prison system in the 70s. Right. Damn, so, okay. But, I mean, think about it. like racism obviously still kind of thrives down south a bit more than where we're at and it just feels like in the prison it's got to be as archaic as possible. Man racism was so bad at this prison.

Yeah. And the first day I entered the prison, I had to fight the first day with me, over some cheese. They had a thing out that if you eat cheese, you're a wreck. You know, I said, who put that shit out? And with nobody in the prison eat cheese, but I said, I'm going to eat it. And a table of white guy was called me rats, and I laughed and finished my meal, then picked that tray up, went on one, and popped one of them in the head.

And then I went to the hole, and when I got out of the hole, because they didn't think I was going to come out of the hole, because in that prison, the white dudes ran that prison. I don't care what you say. They ran that prison and they took pride. If they fought somebody black, they took pride and making sure he don't whoop them. They had a lot of pride, man. But when I got out of the hole, I had a butcher night.

Somebody gave me and we all talked it out. And so I solved that problem. Now everybody is eating cheese. Wait, you solve the problem of people not eating cheese with the butcher night. how? Yeah, see, when I got out of the hole, see, I didn't went over at the table and took a steel. They used to have steel food trays back in.

They got plastic now. Yeah, the ones that was called me a red and all this for eating cheese. So it was like four of them sitting at the table, so I'm fighting all of them. So when they locked us up, they were making threats. We're going to kill that nigger. We're going to kill him. We're going to contact so-and-so in the hole.

we're going to have him burnt the death, all this stuff. And so I get out of the whole day. I said, yeah, I'll go back to the yard. And this old black man said, he said, I don't know who you are, but I mind what you did. He said, I'm too old in fight. He said, but you're going to need this. Gave me a butcher knife.

And when I seen him coming, I said, I said, here it goes, man. I know I'm going to die today, but I'm going to take somebody with me, so I was walking towards him. Then I just said, fuck it. And just broke out in the run and was running at him. And I pulled the knife back. I said, I'm just going to run and just start slicing, right?

But they scatter, and they was like, hey, man, we didn't come to fight, man. We didn't come, man. We want to talk, man. We don't know who put that out, man. But I've been eating cheese all my life, and I ain't no red and all that, man. to go I seen you with that knife so I passed the knife after somebody else

they came and shook me down and then saying it you know now everybody's eating cheese now so I mean I'm used to people describing prison as usually the blacks

and the Mexicans have more power than the white guys usually the white guys people describe them as being kind of like meth heads and just junkies and weird man that's a lie then white guys in that prison they were

openly referring to black people as monkeys and nickels and they were talking out in the open and they would dare you to say something about it they had all the weapons and like they let them work in the engineering department where they can use a ground door

they was making swords and they'd come out of with a blanket turn a whole big on foot of weapons and then all the blacks are seeing and they scared the death because they ain't got number two brushes. And then white guys they ran at prison

but they ain't never seen nothing like me when I came in her and they had a land where blacks eat in this land white's eating this land. So I got in the black land and I said there ain't that many people in this white land

so I went over there. They said man don't do that. I said man Cute. I got in the land. Yeah, I did. And I got in the... I broke through the color line. That's exactly what I did.

And blacks used to eat in the back of the kitchen. They eat in the middle and then the front. I set a trade down in the middle. God said, that's reserved. I said, yeah, for me. And I broke through all that. And so, what really saved me in prison was

Now, I'm getting through with all of this And really, I ain't been tested, really tested, you know, like hands. You know, like anybody can whip somebody with a weapon, I'll stick on them, I'll stab them. But ain't nobody really tested my hands yet, right? Right. And so I started fighting the guards, and the guards in that prison was killing inmates. and they said if you cussed one of them goals

they would beat you to death so I said well I'm gonna do something worse than that I'm gonna throw a five gallon bucket of shit on them see what they do about that and I start doing that and to my man I don't know how it hadn't

happened but I changed that whole prison man frame with a cup of shit and I'm serious were you the first person in that prison to start doing that kind of shit. Yeah. I'm the first.

Okay, so there's a new strategy that we've had, like RICO Reckles as a rapper from Chicago who kind of famously went viral for talking about this, but they would call it the Glock Doogie, where basically they would get like a water bottle, fill it with shit and piss, and then they would just keep it right there, and if you tried to fuck with them,

then they would be able to, like, spray you with it, or you take that, you walk down on somebody, you say, hey, Give me your noodles. Give me whatever that you have that I want from you or else I'm about to hit you with this. And that's kind of a way that they do battle in there. Yeah.

But here's something that they didn't know. I was so top of the line with this. If you take shit and piss and put it in a bottle and then put milk in out and screw the top on it, the place it would expand eventually it would explode it would actually bust like a bomb

I wonder why and because it ferment because of the duty mixed with the milk the milk the sour milk and the pea it makes it ferment and it would explode

so I started making bombs I said I tell the God you're going to bring me some cigarettes in there because they stopped smoking at the prison. He said, I can't do that. I said, well, you be wearing this shit. And I would take one and, yeah, and they would bring it it every time they'll bring it.

Because they didn't want to lose their job, first of all. Yeah, they didn't want to lose their job. And at the same time, they can't put their hands on me when I throw it on them. That was my advantage. All they got to do is write a report that he threw it on me

and I will put magic shave in her which makes it really stinks and broken glass and the magic shave will make your hair fall out so I had a psychological effect and I'll take a broomstick and chop all the lumps out

to make it real thick like a milkshake. So when I throw it on you and you rub, you're just smelling it on you, and the glass is going to cut you. You're going to think you got a disease. And then when your hair's

falling out, you're going to go through a mental thing. So I made about in my 40 years, I made about 80 goals quit their jobs. Did it ever cross your mind just holy, like look at the kind of person that I've become.

Not even the fault of your own. Like these are survival mechanisms, but did you ever take a step back and just look at this and just think, like, look at what has become of my life? I did that many times, but I knew I had to continue. I'm in a situation once that wheel gets to turn it, like, I do something to you, and you are officer. So you're going to come and do something back. And when you do something back, that's going to make me do something to you for what you did to me. And then the wheels just keep coming. And then you got inmates, you know, you got to fight because you got inmates that are, uh, done a catering to the goals like, they give inmates, uh, TV's radio.

Tell them you can have a TV to radio, PlayStation, other little things, and these, uh, these are not rights. These are privileges. So they can take them at any time They can't take your rights But they can take your privilege So anytime Emacs still getting real big They'll tell the other inmates

We're going to take your Y'all stuff if he don't calm down And try to make inmates Fight each other, right? And them guys They got time to do They got forever Some of them ain't never getting out

And they cherish what they can get you know that is good and but every time you put me on one of them walks everybody said oh Lord look who they just put on the wall please Johnson please Johnson please don't come on the walk and start no try I say I'm going to do whatever I got to do and y'all do what y'all got to do

for sure so okay how do you get from being 16 and this guy is trying to take advantage of you behind bars you have to fight them off you're horrified by the idea of this raping you, how do you go from that to the point where you actually start taking advantage of other men or dipping your toe in that? I'm going to tell you.

It started when I went to Eddieville, the sale they put me in. Back then, they had double sales. They ain't got it no more, but I'll tell you about that later. But they put me in the cell with this big old black dude, they called Big Doc. I'm talking about he was about six, about six, five. weighed by 285 solid, real dark. His nose was about the size of my fist. He had red ass like a gorilla.

And so I had a little pear knife at that time. And when they put him in the cell with him, he was walking around, and he was wearing some shorts with a lot of holes in him. So every time he moved, his dick would pop out. The head of his dick would pop out through the hole. So, you know, I already know where he's going with this, right? So I said, I better say something.

So I say, hey, man. See, what I didn't know, let me back it up. What I didn't know before I moved in that cell, he had a hole in the wall. Right. A hole. And what he did, it took a balloon thing and put baby powder in it, blowed it up to where it's about ready to bust and stuck it up in that hole

then took a newspaper and I put some cement shit on and went it hard and he taped it over and then painted it where you can't tell it's there it looked like the wall so he's going to make me think he ran his hand through the wall just to get some damn ass right?

I mean that is such an insane level of plotting and planning to like create this element that'll make it look like you're just the biggest psycho ever, like you could just punch through a wall just so you can then scare your cellmate and like, what the fuck? That's just... Man, he scared the shit out of me. Right. I said, man, why don't you show me some respect?

Right. He said, the only thing I'm going to show you is this big black cop. And he took and hit that wall. And when I seen his hand and when I heard that boom, and his arm went up in her and when he pulled it out and all that white shit on it I'm thinking it's fragments or the cement or something I ain't know it was baby powder you're thinking he's got like superhuman strength

man that I'm and when he ran up on me he's like stand up I say hey man can we talk about this he said stand up knicker and I stood up and I was holding his wrist I said man don't do this so he said

do I got to fight you? I said, no. And I'll give it to him. I'm not let nobody run their hand through my, like he did that wall, right? But his mistake was, it saved me. He tried to kiss me. I already felt his thing up against my booty and everything, but he pulled my head back and tried to stick his tongue in my mouth.

and that was the nancy's feeling I ever felt in my life and I almost I gurgitate I said I said hell now and back that time I realized that I heard

that little prayer knife because I moved and it stuck me on the hill I said man he's gonna have to kill me so he said hold your head back I said man

no and I pulled that knife and I just started swinging and I was cutting him man I was cutting I here's what I believe I believe he died

See, but like I was telling you about racism back in their days They, them girls, when they came to get me I was standing there shaking holding this knife He's laying on the ground, cut the hell, blood everywhere They pulled him out, they pulled him up out of there They took me to the hole And I'm thinking I'm going to get a lot of time But when I went in front of disciplinary community

they say we know who he is, we know what he does. You'll never see him again. And they put me, let me out of the hole that day, then dropped out of charges. Now, when all the inmates heard about this, they like, oh boy, that little young dude, that boy, you don't want to mess with him. But they don't know, they don't know,

I was right there. I was getting ready to give it to him. So why do you think he was dead just because they said you're never going to see him again? Yeah, I never did see him again. I don't, and all the prisons in my state, I was sending letters to people. They said, no, nobody like they came to this prison. So I don't know what happened. That's crazy.

I feel like nowadays you would just find out, you would hear about it. But I guess at that time, shit just got lost. Yeah, yeah, they did a lot of secret stuff, man. It was a lot of stuff happening like dungeons. Like torture, torture style. They used, they was hiring people to break me. They hired this man, he did 21 years into the military interrogation. He was a captain over the interrogation of the enemy.

They hired this man to come in the prison and break me And they gave him a house across the street from the prison And he put word out Anytime I eked up Ain't nobody to deal with him but me But him So He was

He did waterboarding with me What he? I mean But I tricked him on that Because when I was in a hole They gave me 12 years in the hole Well, 27 years, I end up doing 12. And ain't nobody ever heard that type of, never did that type of time in that prison in the hole.

You spent 12 years alone. Yeah. Oh, my God. That's insane. And most of it's naked. You know, fighting the goals, the girls coming through, take my food trade, say, please. Who's your food? Boom.

And just throw it through the bars like that. I got to get it off the floor. and off the walls and stuff to eat it, right? I said, okay, I'm going to get you, and I always got them. I get back at him. So that's the type of fighting we were doing tonight. But what happened was I started winning. When I start throwing at duty on him,

it screwed him so bad, and they kept running to the lawmakers in Frankfurt. Can y'all do something about this? They said, no, you work there at your own risk. For six years, I threw duty on him and had all the inmates to do it too. I'm talking about all of nurses, doctors, gores. They brought people in from our state capitol building, corrections cabinet department. They come in and wearing them suits and stuff and leave out covered in shit.

I did all that. And when they made it a felony, that's when I stopped. you know but about that time man I was controlling the prison at that time I mean it really says a lot

that you can take men who have literally nothing in some cases they're naked they're alone and that they're still going to find some way to fight back even if it's to take the only weapon

that they have which is the shit coming out of their own asses and that will be how they fight back. Like, it's crazy that they couldn't kill your spirit enough to just make you just give in. You still were going to take the last possible resource you had and fight back with it. Well, the guy that they hired to break me, he died trying to break me.

Independent attention. His heart, his heart busted. I said, I said to myself, I said, you know what? You called him, tell him, man, I'm done. I was getting ready to give in. That man took me through some torturing stuff. And when they brought him, when he came over, he said, you want to see me? I said, yeah, I never forget it.

He had a pack of nine-fifth of camera cigarettes. He took out his pocket, did like it. And when he lit it, his body buckled. And he left and went outside my door on the side of the wall. I said, oh shit, something is wrong with his heart. And when he came back around that corner, I said, I'm going to tell you something, man. If you don't leave me alone, I'm going to bust your heart. You're a dad messing with me.

And I spit in this place, and it was on. So we went through another big fighting, and then three days later, they come through and said he died. he was dead okay but so when you so you just told that story about that guy trying to

trying to molest you and that you basically may or may not have killed him when do you first take interest in another man and actually go about breaking another guy down break down that scenario

I was in a shower well every time they bring ciches in the prison I was the one they'll run my mouth to him cuss them out telling them they were dirty and nasty, that I hope God I'd take them

and put them in bundles and burn them. All this stuff. And then they brought one in. He was, man, he was just like a woman. And he had a big old butt like Sharina Williams. And he was real nice. He said, can I talk to you? I said, no, you can't say nothing to me fag.

You know, all day he said, what did I do to you? I said, shut up. And then one day, I was in a shower by myself. I usually like taking travels when nobody's in. I don't want to go through all that old shit. What were you scared of in the cell? Everybody coming to, see, in the prison I was in,

they had this thing called Salt Peter. You ever heard of that? Salt Peter? Yeah. Yeah, what is that? I forget. It's supposed to something you put in the food. It's supposed to make it to where you can't get around.

Right. Yeah. But if you put too much, it'll have the reverse effect. Everybody's hard, right? Oh, wow. So they had cissies working in the kitchen, and they was deliberately putting more to get everybody hard and rocked up all the time, right?

So every time you stand up, your shit is locked up. So I'm in the shower, and this dude come in, this little gay dude. I didn't know he was in a, and I was washing my, I had a lot of hurt then. I was washing my hair. And I heard somebody and said, and I turned around and looked. I seen him from the back, and that soap was going down his back and going through the crackling his big old bubble ass in here. I said, oh, God.

And I'm hard. So I'm like, uh-uh. I said, I'm fucking him. I said, he screwed on me already. So I said, I'm going to take his chance. So I went in the back of him. I said, hey, he said, yeah. I said, can I get something at?

He said, yeah. I said, if you tell somebody, I don't beat you to death. I said, I want you to know. Anybody you tell, he said, I ain't going to say nothing. So, that was the first time I ever come was in a man. And I was blacked out, man. My whole body just went numb. I said, ooh, is this what it feels like?

And so I want it again and again. Wait, but so was this guy gay? Yeah, he was already gay. Okay, so this didn't take any convincing on your part. No, no, he was already. He came in prison, gay, and he just, he wanted to be respected. And there was a lot of people wanting him, they were trying to fight over him to get him. They were offering him like tens and 20s or thousands of dollars, and they hid that type of money.

To be their boyfriend? Yeah, see, when you take a prison, They had one guy in earth that I protected, and he got 387 acres of land. He got over 150 heads of cattle. He got all that. He was never been in trouble. But came home one day and called his wife with another man and killed both of them, so they sent him to prison.

You got a lot of people in prison that is filthy rich. They made a mistake where they killed somebody. do some type of jealous relationship. But when they come to prison, they need somebody to protect him because they got a lot of money. And so, you know, people were trying to fight over him, but the third time I got caught,

some dude caught me pulling out of him. And he was one in a kid that I know he's going to run his mouth, so I might as well go on and fight him right. now. And I popped in mouth so when I came out of the hole everybody was coming to me they said man you're in the game

I said yeah I'm in the game and I don't care what y'all think right but I didn't know nothing about sex right? Yeah yeah and that boy that he still getting paranoid so I was gambling one day and he whispered in my ear

and said I want to tell you so I said what is it baby he said I've been to the doctor. I said, what's wrong? He said, I'm pregnant. Man, I went nuts. I actually thought that I got him pregnant, right? Because I didn't know nothing about sex, right?

I said, oh, God damn. I said, look, man, somebody took my hand over. I picked him up in my arms and swung him around. I said, did they tell you if it's a boy or a girl? He said, no, not yet. And so it got so bad that the warden at the prison.

He had me brought to his office. And I said, look, Warren, I know I can't keep the child here at the prison. So I'm wondering if y'all can put my child somewhere where I can get some

visitational rights. And he just looked at me, like saying he's sick, you know. And he had a therapist in her and this lady, she said, well, I want to talk to you, Mr. Johnson. I said, about what?

She's about your chair. I said, what about my child? You don't have it? I said, look, man, who's this bitch? And I'm ready to go off, right? And it took me, they had to take me through a whole bunch of mental stuff before I realized

that he wasn't praying because he put something up on his t-shirt and made his belly big. And when I I try to touch it. He's a get away from me. Don't you touch him.

You ain't got the right to touch his baby. Because you don't want to say you didn't want it. And you let everybody tell you I wasn't praying it. But, niggas, you looking at my stomach right now. What do you think now? I cried everything, man. So he was just on some crazy shit? Or was he just looking for attention?

He wanted to be a woman so bad. Oh, wow. And he staged that little scene. right down. Well, it took me through a lot of mental stuff, but it didn't stop her. That's one of the craziest things I ever heard. Was there, okay, when you first

had sex with this man in the showers, was there any part of you that just felt kind of disgusted by having had sex with a man? Or was it just pure happiness? Yeah, that's the first time. Once you do it, the first thing is angle. you get anger at yourself you'll be like man

I can't believe once you bust that nut a lot of times you feel different even with a woman yeah man I felt angry I felt like angry and then

I kept thinking about how good it made me feel though you know I said I calmed in him man as shit I didn't know

nothing about sex except that you know I gotta take care of my wife and and uh I went nuts over him because were you masturbating in the lead up to this or not really? Man, I used to masturbate six, seven times a day.

Every time I get angry, the only thing they can really calm me down was masturbation, right? Wow. You know, like they locked me up and I'm in a hole. And when they leave myself, I'm cussing, kiss my ass. Y'all. And then about 20 minutes later, I'm done. jacking off, you know, getting all that angle and tension out of me.

It stayed in me, man. I had a jack off. I got caught one time doing it. Jerking off. Yeah. But the lady was showing me, you know, she worked in the guard tower, and she opened the door and let me see her on the toilet and stuff. And I stood up on a table, and I was slow jacking,

and this sergeant was making rounds. and he walked in there. He said, you are out. And I jumped, fell out the table, my baby oil turned over. All that stuff was spilled all over me. I'm laying her neck and I had to get up. He said, you're going to the hole. You are going to, oh, my God.

So they walked me to the hole naked with baby oil all over me. And I was still shooting. Cums still coming out of me. and uh that sounds so crazy like they must have been so grossed out by having to even touch you when you're all baby lubed up and it

them people when I do some shit on this goal one day they come in my cell they said we're going to take all his cups and buckets now he ain't got nothing to throw So I hated they going so bad that I stood up and was talking to him And put my hand back her and shit it in my hand

And then pulled him up to the baza and rubbed it in his face right And so But how they got me back If they fold pointed me I'm on my stomach hands four pointed to the bed and my feet He commentates their feet police, somebody's here to see you. When I looked, turned my head.

He stuck his head through the door. Then when the door opened, he came in and put out some latex gloves. I said, here it goes. They get ready to do something. He put out some latex glove, took some lubricants, put it up my ass, took out a whole can of mace. Forces in my hand and spray emptied a whole can of mace in my asshole. They did shit like that.

What happened after that? What did the mace? Man, I was burning. Shit and burning. But I, you know, I know I got him so he just, you know, I looked at like, you know, you do this to me. I'm going to do something back, right? It's just so crazy that like we have prison systems and that this ends up being the kind of shit that happens between the prisoners. Well, do you know why I start throwing, do you have any idea what made me throw shit on him?

What did you do? This is what made me do it. They were locking me up, and they put me in a cell that had water all over the floor. So I told the guard, I said, look, man, I've seen some empty cells that was clean. Can you put me in one of them? He said, no, you were. I said, well, let me talk to a lieutenant. He said, lieutenant's busy.

I said, all right, lieutenant. I saw a Holly Lieutenant Lieutenant. So when he come up, he said I was disturbing the wall. Told me turn around, get handcuffed. They took me down to the dungeon. And down there, they stripped me naked and foe pointed me. Okay. Like that, naked on a steel bed.

So it was about 115 or 20 degrees down here. I'm sweating. So I cussed a little. then I went to sleep and what woke me up, I had about 500 flies buzzing in the crack of my ass. It sounded like I had a vibrator up my asshole. And I couldn't get them loose because I'm handcuffed.

Why were there so many flies in your ass? Do they put, like, food down there or something? No, the place was condemned down there. That's the place where rats come up through the toilet. The toilet you sit on, a big old red will come up through that. That would really change taking a shit. That would really ruin the experience. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And so when all them flags was buzzing in my ass, man, I felt like such daddy me. I ain't never being disgusted, treated like it in my life, right? It was the most disgusting feeling. And if I try to shake them out, they go deep. So I just took it. You kind of just have to give up on life. Yeah, yeah, I said, yeah, yeah.

I said, when I, I'm going to get them back. I said, when I get upstairs, I'm going to get everyone. They're going to pay for this shit. And that's what made me start throwing shit on. I said, I'm going to throw shit on every one of me and her. I'm going to get them back. And I did.

Crazy. So, okay, but that was your, you already covered your first time, like, consensually having sex with a sissy behind bars. When did you first start to kind of, because, like, you have this reputation as being, like a... I don't know to what extent you would agree with that.

Would you say that you were actually taking it from dudes, or did you always just kind of mentally break them down and condition them to have sex with you? No, what happened was I was over a Skirt Strait program. Okay. Now, remember, I'd do all this shit on these goals. I'd have went in a federal court in Badoca and won a $200 million lawsuit against the Department of Correct.

direction. And the case is called Kendrick versus Blaine. That's the case. You can look it up, Google, it'll come pop up. You won this huge lawsuit against them? Yeah, because what happened was, I filed a lawsuit. I wrote the Department of Justice

in Washington. Told him they was trying to kill me and all this stuff, right? Well, about three months later, three black ladies come from the District of Columbia sent by the Civil Rights People Division. came down and represent me.

So they said, Mr. Johnson said, there's a class action already pending in court against the prison. We can take your case and consolidate it with that one and get one judgment for all inmates. Or we can just do your case, get you on the street, put some money in your pocket. What would you like? I said, well, let's get one judgment.

So when they joined that, they took over the lawsuit. So when we get to court, all the people on death road that was coming to testify, they tried to escape. They knocked a big old hole in the ceiling and got caught. So now the federal marshals is sending us back to prison. So now we can really lose our case, right? So I said, man, let me testify. She said, I don't see what good it would do because you don't come in the federal judge's courtroom

turned up and expect him to help you. She said, I don't know, but they took me after. So while I was after, the warden was doing shower. That's his name. And he's the one that shot me in the leg at another prison. And so me and him been fighting battles for years and I know how to kick him off, right? How did he end up shooting you in the leg at another prison? See, that's a different story.

Let me finish this one right here. Good point, good point. Let's put the, yeah, I'm going to write that down. Okay, and then when they brought me out, I know it's all on me because they've been taking all the other inmates back. They're taking them back to prison. This is all over the news, the Badoca. We went to the Western District, called it Badooga.

They had it all over the news of federal mortals, taking all the inmates back to prison. And so she asked me, she said, what happened, Mr. Johnson? And I wouldn't say nothing. I'm looking over at him. He had his head down, and he had a pencil. He pen and he kept tumbled in it.

And then when his attorney said objection, he looked up. I said, he called me a nigger. And it looked like I was crying. And he stood up. He said he ain't crammed. Can't y'all see he's pretending? The judge said, oh, this courtroom,

I would now have another eye burst like that. I'll hit you with a contempt. He said, you can take your contempt, stick it up in your ass. And when he said that, the federal marshal put his hand behind his back, and washed him out of the courtroom. And then two weeks later, they came and said, y'all won. So at $200 million, it means they got to take all them double sales and make them single cells, take all the billy clothes.

They are almost bankrupting. They were so mad at me. they was telling inmates, well, we're going to have to give y'all a little metric just to have thanks to fleece. Thanks to fleece, y'all don't get to eat chicken no more. Everything, no more poach chops,

no more this and that. We're going to have to hire earmark to come in and feed y'all small portions. We're going to have to give you boots that will hurt your feet now because we can't afford a real army boots no more. Thanks to fleece. They kept trying to throw all of it on me, trying to get somebody that hurt me, right?

But all the inmates, they respected me. So that happened, and then when I tore up the lecture, I'm the only in America that ever took a mob wrangler and beat a lecture out to stand, towed up, and it was in the newspaper, The Cour journal, that it cost $650,000 to prepare the damage I did enough. You destroyed the electric chair with a mop wringles, steel mop wringled. Okay. How that you even get access to the electric chair?

I would think that that would be kept separate from everybody who wasn't actually being executed. I was fighting on every walk they put me on, throwing shit and getting all the inmates ride up. So they put me down on death row, on that death row down in the dungeon by myself. So to keep me away from inmates and shit, right? So this girl named Steve Galusha come down on, and he wanted to bring my food and stuff. And he said, I want you to, Martha Lane Collins was the governor at the time.

He said they give me to execute somebody. I want you to go in here and just don't touch nothing in here, but the little mat around the tree. That's the only thing you take out and wipe out. Don't try to wipe nothing else. I said, okay. He said, now look after your own food and stuff. So when I went in there, I sat down in a chair

across my leg and lit a cigarette up. And when I got to think about it, I said, they can even execute somebody. So I don't like this, man. You know, so I got offended and took a mat ranger and beat everything in their chair, right? I beat it off the stand. And they never put it back on her.

here to build a new building and build a new one. And so she was the governor, and when she came to the prison, she stood in front of my door, and I spit in her face. They put that in the newspaper, too, in the career journal. Martha Lane Collins. She was governor then. So how much money did you actually end up getting from the prison? Well, it was for our inmates, and the money was supposed to go

to the renovation and like in the hole they didn't have no air conditions in the cellhouse is no earth so they had put in century air century heat they had to take the double cells and break them to a single cell they had to give us a better legal library

better school better medical better programs better everything right and they owned up to it and but they blame me and see

and so what happened was now this is where it gets interesting so it came a time in my life where I'm calming down now I got all this money in prison I got stores, poker games I got weed whiskey I'm blackmailing everybody

they bring me everything in her and so I'm satisfied that I ain't never going to hit the streets no more you know, I just sauded a gore. I got 15 years. I took a 5 gallon

bucket of boiling bleach and threw it in the gall's face and put him in the hospital for 18 months. Bunked his whole face off. And so, for what he did in me. But

when I started calming down, I didn't realize that you don't fight these people the way I fight them, inspect them, just because you calm, down for them to calm down. So MSNBC came in and wanted me

to do a documentary. What year was that? It was in the 80s. Okay. 90s? I think it was the 90s. It seemed like it was pretty decent quality footage. Yeah. But anyway, they came in an institution and I'm like, I'll do it. I ain't

never getting out, you know. I don't, shit, I don't, I'm never get now. And so I'm going to get up here and say whatever I want to say, right? A lot of people in that situation might kind of lie about what they have going on. Like, I feel like... Yeah, yeah, you just, you, you, you exaggerating a lot of shit, too. Well, also, like... I said, I'm not going to tell them that the prison ain't like that right now.

It was like that when I first entered the prison, but after I'm doing all that fighting and shit, I changed that prison. I'm just saying that a lot of people might sleep with other men while they're locked up and then get out and act like it never happened. I feel like that's the norm. You were the one dude who got an opportunity to do a documentary, be on TV, and you just said everything. You just laid it all. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what we represent here in a hustler spirit, man, is the truth, man.

We were raised on my shirt, man, stack of style, man. That's a different type of hustler spirit, though. Yeah. that spirit, man. We don't lie. And my agent, he talks to me and he tells me, look, man, these people want

to hear the truth, man. Now, you don't have to tell them a truth if you don't want to. I say, man, I'll tell him because you know, because what I talk about people don't talk about. But, so now, to get back to the gay stuff.

People are unbelievably fascinated by it, but they don't, there's very few people who are really going to talk about it, you know? Yeah. And so, but I don't fear nobody. You know, I don't fear people. I told somebody that

said he got respect for me. I say, first of all, I don't need your respect. Your respect don't put food on my table, clothes on my back, I'll shoes on my feet, man. You keep your respect for yourself. I don't need it. I have always stuck with that.

so I don't care about what people say about me because I know everybody in this world has did some bad stuff. I ain't the only one. I'm not the only one. I'm the only one is get up and talk about it. But I'm not the only one that ever did something, you know, that people disagree with.

Now, on sex, man, I had sex with a lot of them in our... When I took... That first time, I said, I got to get more booty. I got to get as much booty as I can in her. This is all I got to go on. I'm never getting out. You know, I don't know what it will feel like to be with a woman, you know. So I went hard, man.

And but, okay, so when did you start, and did you ever start taking it from men? Or would you always break them down mentally until they would consent? No, they was already broken down. Here's the point. See, you think that most, I don't know whether people get this notion that in the penitentiary, you got to take somebody's booty. Then people, out of 20, I was in the prison and held 2,500 inmates. Out of the 2,500, only 30 of them get regular visits every week.

You can see them on a visit every week. Out of $2,500, only maybe $150 or $200 gets money from somebody from home. All the rest of them, they don't burnt to all their bridges. They ain't got nobody sending them nothing. And then the next thing you know, they'll do anything for some noodles, cigarettes, weed. if you got weed, you can probably have sex with whoever and not. Yeah, a pack of cigarettes go for $500. So easy.

So you're saying that there's just a lot of guys who are willing to have sex when you're in there. It's really not as crazy as we think it is because in our minds, a straight man is just never going to consent to having sex with another dude. You're saying that in that environment, and it's not that crazy. No, uh-uh. See, it's, uh, you got people like one guy owed me.

And, uh, I, I, I, I, I, I, I said,

well, how are you going to pay me, bro? He smacked his ass cheeks. He said, with this. I said, with what? I said,

turn around. Let me see it. And I said, pull the trust down on a little. I said, spread it over. I said, yeah, I said, I got played off like I'm used, boy, he had a hell of ass on him, though. It was powerful.

And I said, look, man, I get this anytime I want to call. I got money and stuff. I said, but, yeah, I said, we can work something else. And that's how I do it. You know, and I've seen, if I really want somebody, What I do, man, is introduce myself to him, let him know I got all the money. I'm the one with the weed and the whiskey and all this stuff.

And I'm the one to get things popping. You know, if you want to roll with me, you know, holly at me, right? I'm seeing you. You know, I think you look good, you know, and whatever we do, I'm going to keep it discrete. You know, you don't have to worry about nobody in your business. You can keep your mustache or whatever. I just want your booty, man.

How much more relief did you experience having sex with other guys as opposed to just jerking off? Because maybe I'm naive, but I would feel like as a straight dude, I would always be okay with just jerking off and that I wouldn't necessarily need to go and use another man's booty to get the job. I'm going to break you through something on that. It's a lot of people trying to take that approach,

but here's how I used to bust him out. Now, we have sex, triple-X-rated magazines in prison. That people like, hey, man, you want to rent that magazine now? So, yeah, look through it. Nothing but whole core sex in it. Now, what do you see, penetration, com shots and stuff like that. So I usually keep a stack of them, and you don't have to rent them out. You want to look at them.

So after they're done being looking at it, so I, I told dude one day, I said, look, I said, you like this one? He said, man, I love this one, boy. I said, did you get off? He said, yeah, I got off. I said, watching his dick and another man's dick and a woman gets you out. And he said, yeah. I said, so what about man?

Oh, come on, niggum, you know we are. Hold up, bro. What I realized through them triple X magazines that the tendency to have sex with men was already in them. They got the tendency already in them. When you leave the streets, your sex drag goes with you. However you was having sex out here, it don't freeze up on you when you get locked up. You still got that urge that's more powerful now.

You know, and then when you go through the masturbation thing, that'll work for a little while. Well, it gets old. And you're in an environment now where you see men walking around that is built like women and fronting themselves to making their ass pop, bending over in front of you. And you're like, oh, my God, my woman didn't have a butt like that. You know. And, you know, you're masmerized. And so I stopped caring about what people think.

I said, I want him. And I make my approach. Can I talk to you for a minute? I feel like you almost ended up, like, there's a whole conversation, you know, about trans men, women, et cetera. Is a trans woman, really, a woman, et cetera? But in your mind, you're locked up for decades. And it just becomes like, is a man that different than a woman? Like, for your purposes, it's not.

that different? Man, to me, I never heard a woman, so I didn't know the difference. I can see how your mind would get there as the years drag on. Yeah, but from where I look at it now, having heard of woman, and then I think back to that time, I'm just be true for I ain't seen a woman out here yet that has pussy, as good as some ass that I hear in that pen 10. not yet and I hate to say it but man I had some real good good butt booty support is what we call it

you know like you like me you knew each other on the streets and I've been locked up a while then you come in and yeah I know your whole family and stuff but when I sit down and talk to you man I'm saying look bro you know I've been locked up a while man and uh you know I need some booty support. Right. You know, say you straight out, I'm looking for booty support. I ain't looking for no conversation

and a whole lot of riffraps. I want booty. I gamble. The main thing I did in her is gamble, fight, and booty. And if I ain't gambling,

I'm chasing bucks. And I just didn't chase any buck. I chase the best that they got in her. I don't mess with no dirty people. that don't take showers, don't stay clean. I got their medical rack. I get everybody's medical record before I even socialize with them. You know, we can get that into paying attention.

Get your medical files and stuff. That's smart. That's just like the business, really. Anyway, okay, so you do this interview for the news and you just kind of put everything out there. You expose all this craziness that at that time, nobody in pop culture really had any kind of reference for like what was going on in prison or whatever it's not like it was something that they were just talking well maybe it was on the news a little bit

but like very rarely was this stuff ever making it to the surface where people really knew about it it comes out and does it just start kind of making you famous right away and what was that like now what happened was after i did a documentary i didn't think none of they said it's going to be to help the juveniles or something. I didn't know that somebody had a real hatred of me, right? From all the fighting and shit throwing and all that, making girls quit their jobs. That they don't take it so personal,

but they're going to fight me to the end. So they took about two years later, a girl come to me and say, hey, please, you all over TV. I said, what do you mean? Oh, man, you ain't going to like it. They said, they made a cartoon out of you. I said, get out of her.

Because I ain't know nothing about it, right? How many years after you did the interview was this? About a year or two. Okay. And people were telling me that they made cartoons and boondocks. I never even heard of it. Right. And, like, in prison, your TV channels is programmed in.

You can't get everything. Y'all watch out here in prison. Right. And so we can't get YouTube and all that. and so when the lady girl told me the contents and stuff so I still get mad

I said ah I so they want me look like a predator I said okay so the fights on so we fighting again so I go up for parole they tell me one day

you're going on for parole I didn't forget about parole I ain't never getting out and I went in front of the pro I said I'm gonna kill this right now because I got about nine years left I can do it I went in there and I said you know what

y'all they said excuse me I said you know what I say I said all that kiss my ass your department and I and I kicked the cheer over and I went back to my cell and laid in the bed

I cussed them out so a lady coming to my door the same day her name was out of grief and she became Deputy Warden. She said her exact words was I quote. She said, you're the first at what you do. So I said,

what you mean? She said, I never seen nobody cussed in the way you did and still get parole. I said, parole. She said, yeah, they gave you parole. I said, when I go home, she said, tomorrow. So, I wasn't even prepared for all that.

You know, I wasn't prepared for none of And I didn't realize that somebody's done had a trap set for me. So when I get out on the street, every time I put in for a job, they say, man, you're a hell of a worker, but you got some stuff on the internet saying you're a predator,

so we got to let you go. I lost about 40 jobs going through that. And then I went in the church, and the church told me I couldn't even be a member in the church because the Internet said I was a predator. I got kids and all this. And that happened, man. And so I couldn't get jobs or nothing.

And then I started working under the table and stuff like that. But then that's when I eventually hit the Internet, and I told my story, and I did you the same way. I would give you permission through my agent to get all my criminal records. my juvenile rackles, my medical records to every institution, jail, a prison, detention I've been to, and see, let you see what you can see or not. Because I have never been charged with sexual or anything,

taking nothing for nobody, never complained ever being lodged against me. You know, so when you take into account how I have. made parole cussing people out and that's unheard of that you can cuss them and still get parole then go home the next day unheard of it was a setup from the beginning so all that stuff they put over on the internet they put me in a position where I can scream that ain't true this ain't true that ain't true and the more I scream at people gonna say it is so what I did I said, okay. Well, okay, so my friend, but I did get a lot of booty.

Oh, right. I believe that for sure. But, okay, so I have a friend, DJ Vlad, and he's previously mentioned that at one point, he was going to interview you. He wanted to interview you, but then he basically had a realization that he didn't want to be platforming someone that he considered a. And you're basically saying that that is not an accurate description of, of what you were doing in there.

Right, right. It's not. And Vlad knows. Vlad knows he didn't have no proof, evidence, or nothing, that I ever did, none of that. Only thing they went on was when I did my interview and said, booty is more porting water in the Internet, took it and edited stuff.

and I had one person showed me a picture of me he said man you were swore I said that's not even my body they took my head and put it on some muscle man body and said yeah I take booty and all this stuff

and so but I can assure you no I don't take it that's crazy I was I ain't gonna last either I was getting booty and giving up booty. So tell me about that.

When did you first start giving up your booty? Man, I was in a hole that moved a dude next to me. And he had a real nice big bucket heads. I said, boy, I got to get some of that. But he always say he ain't gay. So I'm going to have to break him down another way. So I said, hey, man, when you get time, you know, just hot. at me, you know, you can stick your mirror out and look over in my cell.

I can look in his cell. So I made sure I got a nice plump, a nice little fat butt on me. And I was bending over. I said, I know he's going to look. So he said, damn. So when he looked over at me, he said, damn, that's fine. I said, he like that. He said, yeah.

I said, all right. I said, let me push something. He said, no, let me keep looking. I said, he didn't let me see nothing. So when I looked over at him, he showed me his buck. I said, oh, boy, I'm going to get that. I got to get that. And so we played the buck game until I got it.

You know, it wasn't no shame in my game, man. I've been molested before, so I already know how it feels, you know. But so you don't consider yourself gay, but. I just want to. You don't consider yourself gay, but you didn't mind. No, no, I'm going to say you this. I'm going to keep it real. Now, I was forced to answer that question.

Yeah, right now, no, right now I don't see myself as gay, but I look at it the way they look at it in AA meetings and stuff when they said, I'm an alcoholic, and I've been clean for 22 years, but I'm still an alcoholic. you know, in other words, you still got the symptoms, something in you, feelings and stuff. And I ain't going to lie to you, man, since I've been out, even though I don't indulge.

And before I hit the streets, I went back 18, 20 years before I hit the streets, man, well, I didn't have sex with nobody or not. And, but before I stopped, I had sex with a lot of, over 50 or 60 that I've been in, and I ain't going to laugh about it. But I'm thankful. You're saying for the last 20 years that you were locked up, you didn't sleep with him. Yeah, back the last 20 years, I didn't. No, no.

You just quit? I haven't. Yeah, I quit, man. I had reasons why I quit. I was going through stuff and I was with God. I thought I was on top of the world, man. I ain't believe in God. I ain't believe in Jesus.

I ain't believe in the Bible, none of that. And when God revealed itself to me and it scared me. And then when AIDS came out, that scared me. And so I was done, man. And I'm fighting. I can't do all this gay stuff and do all this fighting at the same time I was doing it. So I chose to fight and just forget. all that.

But when I got out on the streets, I seen a gay guy out here once that I was about tempted to speak to him on that, to get with him. And I came close to, and then I met a woman. But, you know, I used to wonder about that.

once you go went down that road can you ever you know say you ain't gay or nothing like that but I don't let it bother my conscience I don't let it fake my conscience

man I know what I'd have done in my life you have any gay stuff in your life I don't but no no I never had to go down that route I think I slept with like over a thousand women So never even really thought about it, to be honest.

Ah, I heard of that. They said, somebody said, you had a man sleep with your wife or something? Yeah, so we do. And at one point, we decided, let's go viral. And my wife slept with a black dude with a huge d. Yeah. See, I wish it was me, man. I bet you do.

I got 12 inches. I got 12 inches. I really did her some justice right time. Booty-making. Wait, are you serious? You have a 12-inch? Yeah, I'm dead seriously. Now, I went to Drusky camp, right?

Drusky. And why we were... Oh, really? I didn't even know that. You know what? I've been... No. Yeah, it could have been in a house episode.

Oh, I should have watched that. So when they brought the people... Yeah, but listen, you can call them here to tell you. They said one of the sisters came out and said, you're talking about you got a 12-inch. I don't see no 12-inch right there on camera. I stood up, pulled my pants down, dropping to my knees and shoulder to him. Right there in Drewski, the whole 12 inches.

Right. And then she liked it so much that when we finished filming, the lady come back and said, can I see that again? I said, yeah, you can see it. Yeah. But he didn't show it on TV, but he got the video of it.

I just like... Do you ever think about doing... Yeah, I don't. do. I'll be a huge success. I know. I could get you in the game. I know I'll be a huge success in that. For the simple fact, everybody

wants to see. Yeah, no jobber should produce your first. Well, my agent produces my first. I got an agent, you know. No, no, he can talk to me about it. No, he can, you can talk to my agent about it. What do you say? You ain't going to watch it.

I love it, boy. I would love to get naked and do it. And, yeah. Yeah, I'm really interested in that. You can talk to my agent about it. Yeah, that's a good idea. So, okay, so, yeah, I mean, it is kind of crazy.

It's like people just sort of accepted this narrative that you were this, just when you never really said that, but the boondocks kind of implied it, right? and that sort of painted the picture for a lot of people. Yeah, it did. And they got stuck with it. He couldn't fight it for 20 years. Yeah. Yeah, you couldn't say shit, yeah.

2015. Yeah, and then when I get out, the slap their face, I hear, like, at the time I got out, I heard, now I got about seven more years left on parole. So I said, I'm going to do something that's crazy. I'm going to call 9-1-1 tell them to send me back to prison so I can get off parole, right? And because our prison system got programs if you do six months in there and knock a year off your sentence. So I went and got inside programs and did one year and kept that whole seven and a half year that I had left.

So you would think where a person after doing 40 would say, I don't never want to go back? I said, no, I'm going back. They're going to get me off parole. they did some crazy shit to me, man. And they're like, the warden, the warden said, I was at a halfway house. His wife would come and get me. He's retired as the oldest serving warden in Kentucky. His wife, Susan, I go to the house where the state house where they let the warden live to pack their stuff. They moved in the Crestwood.

So the came up with. She said that I f*** up. And I'm going to show you how they do power. They took me. I came from an attempt service job. Police was waiting on the Louisville police. Locked me up and drove me without any due process to Kentucky State prison. What happened to me over the Internet came from a lot of,

some real serious, powerful people that they don't want to see nothing good happened to me after the way I fought in when I was locked up. They were paying a print. They were hoping they could get me killed out here with all that stuff they put on the Internet. Right. You know, nobody gave me a job, nobody talked to me,

nobody liked me or none of this. They locked me up, took me to prison, said I, I f***ed the warden's wife, since I've been out. And I was in prison two days without going through any court proceedings or anything. And she came up and got me and brought me home. Yeah. That's crazy.

It's crazy, Adam. And then Flaed, your friend Fled. Let me talk about Fled. Now, Flaed did a lot of cartoons and stuff like that. Now, I expect somebody to make. money, you know. You put yourself out there, somebody make money out for you. It's all good.

But when you lie, when you lie on me, that's what bothers me with Fled. When you lie and you ain't got no evidence of proof of nothing, man. You're going by some bullshit, nothing legal. And then you stay, I say,

you know, because I would have liked to have a relationship with Bled, man, where we can do programs and do some more cartoons since you know just go on go do a whole new set of everything I would have loved to do that

with him but I don't think I asked Brad to do is to respect me man you know know that I did get a bum deal they did all that cartoon stuff without my permission I didn't get nobody consent to do that

nobody and so and for somebody set up her thing. I got a wife and she got to hear all this shit you know and so, but she's cool with it. But I would love to have a head

of relationship with Blair where, you know, a relationship with Vlad where we could just make money, man. And I take it step, you know, and like with you, the opportunity is done for you.

You know, you're talking about whatever, man. I'm, I'm, I'm I'm ready to make money. All right. So to everybody watching this, we're having connection issues. So we're actually going to have to kind of call this quits a little bit early. We didn't really get to cover some of the topics that we wanted to cover there. But we're going to run this back at some point in the near future.

Fleece, thank you for your time. Sorry that we didn't really get to finish this out the way that we wanted to. But I appreciate you telling your story. It's an insane story. Yeah, and tell Vlad, I'm not really mad at him just, I have mad at him because he won't be true, man. He won't come true with me, man.

I would love to sit down with Led and do a whole bunch of episodes of cartoons and everything, man. But I don't know, man. You just talk to him, Adam. Okay, I'll talk to him. I can probably try a broker a peace tree. He's a fair, dude.

All right. Fleece, I appreciate you, man. Thank you for your time. I booted man out Do they got some good booty in that What are you Yeah