No Jumper - Kisha Chavis on Joe Smith, Doing OnlyFans with Adam, Cam’ron & More

Episode Date: November 27, 2023

Kisha Chavis and Adam break down her relationship trajectory with Joe Smith and how she ended up in the headlines recently. ----- Get the latest news & videos http://nojumper.com CHECK OUT OUR ONLINE STORE!!! https://shop.nojumper.com/ NO JUMPER PATREON   / nojumper   CHECK OUT OUR NEW SPOTIFY PLAYLIST https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5te... Follow us on SNAPCHAT   / 4874336901   Follow us on SPOTIFY: https://open.spotify.com/show/4ENxb4B... iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/n... Follow us on Social Media:   / 4874336901     / nojumper     / nojumper     / nojumperofficial     / nojumper   JOIN THE DISCORD:   / discord   Follow Adam22:   / adam22     / adam22     / adam22   adam22hoe on Snapchat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

So here we are. I'm very, very excited. I've become a very big fan of you over the past couple weeks. Yeah. We got Keisha Chavez. You got pretty eyes. Do I? Yeah.

Thank you. I would say the same to you. Thank you. Yeah, you actually, I was watching the other thing, the thing, like the interview where you both walked out on the guy in the little red coat. Yeah. Which, by the way, like, you don't get podcast that awkward very much anymore. He was irritating. He really kind of rubbed me the wrong way too.

Me too. It's just like bashing you guys over the head with advice. Unsolicited. No, making you watch the video over and over and over. Did you see how pissed off I was? I was like, yo, if he makes me watch this again, I'm going to scream. How did you even meet that guy? Well, when I put my post up, he's the one that's the one that.

snatched it and put it back up because I took it down like almost within like 10, 15 minutes after posting it. He was the first one to get it. Uh-huh. Why would that make you want to do a podcast with him? Well, because he said that he had some advice and it really was Joe's idea to do it because he was on Joe's side. Okay. Yeah. But he's like a relationship expert. He's, yeah, I'm saying he's a relationship expert that's Polly, but his women can't have other men. So, oh, that sounds like a cold leader. Thank you. I mean, all right, I hate to just like jump into it, but I guess I can't help but like talk naturally to you here.

It felt like when I was watching that, that like you were trying to build the bridge, that you were trying to be like, come home. And when you're fighting with your spouse, it's like at some point you just have to drop your defenses and she says she wants you back. You got to just, okay, you know? You know, for me, it's really, you know,

He feels like he has this reputation to uphold. But as far as I'm concerned, it's been damaged for a very long time, you know, only because you've allowed it to be to be so, you know. So when I'm like, come back home, come back home and get this money. My only fans is popping. If I do OnlyFam with you, do you only know how it could, you know, how it could just, you know what I mean? But we want to save face and save reputation and everything.

but whatever. Do you seriously think he would do that? Honestly, I honestly don't know. I mean, I'll put it on the table a couple of times. I haven't gotten an answer. Right. Because, I mean, I think there's a lot of people that look at OnlyFans,

especially if you used to be successful with something else and then you turn to OnlyFans as really seen as like a sign that you're not doing well in your life. Like even when me and my girls started doing OnlyFans together, I got a lot of that. People were like, oh, he must be broke. I'm like, no, I'm fine. I just, like, want to have more money and do a different type of business as well.

Exactly. Well, for me, it's like, you know, he likes to have sex. You know, that's like one of his favorite pastimes. So why not make money doing it? Right. So, okay, what place were you at in your life when you met him? Because there's a lot of narratives that get painted that suggests that, like, he was on top of the world and that you were this money grubbing character.

of a basketball wife that we all hear about. But then when I hear you talk about it, I'm like, oh, it doesn't sound like you really got to reap the spoils of his prior success, right? Not at all. When I met Joe, he was just retired, just divorced and just got robbed from $100,000 from another young lady he was dating. So when I met him, there was no, you know, it was, it's always been a let's try to make it together type situation, you know. And I want to like change the narrative of gold digger Right. Because I am for myself.

Like I've always made away from myself, you know, And it hasn't been on the back of anyone else. It's been on my own. So yeah, I dig for gold, diamonds, rubies. You feel me? Yeah. So that's what you want to do. Let's change the narrative of that.

It's not a bad thing, you know? A lot of people just assume that you must have been one of these chicks. It seems like they really go after basketball players. Did you ever have that? kind of lifestyle before at all? I mean, I dated one basketball player prior to Joe, and that was Cedric Sabalas. I dated Cedric for like maybe two or three months, and he was just a horrible boyfriend, so I just stopped dating him.

You know, and I'm not, if I was like a groupie type chick, I mean, I would have hung on to the bad toxic relationship and, you know, try to just, you know, that's not what I want. I always want to love. My ex-boyfriend said, do you know who Coco Brown is? Sounds familiar She was the That was going to go to space Oh right okay

Okay so she's a friend of mine And my ex in Germany said You wish you could be a gold digger like her But she don't have the heart And I was like That's an insult Right You know

But I mean I want a nice life I just don't want it on the back of someone Who I don't love I can't pretend that long Right Because how long have you been in this relationship Like 10 years or something? We've been together since 20 years

12, so yeah, almost like 12, 13 years. And so how did you actually meet him? I met him at a BET Awards party. I had just come back from Germany and I'm doing music and stuff. So I was in my circle music and he was there. Okay. So you just met him on some regular stuff? You didn't really go out of your way to meet him?

No, I didn't go out my way to meet him, but I did do a love manifest session that night. Really? Yeah. What is that like? So it was a big super moon and my little witchy self was like, okay, tonight I'm going I meet my husband. He's going to, you know, be like this, like this, like that. I just wasn't very specific.

Right. You know, I didn't ask for a guy with a lot of money. Do you feel like that might have made you over commit to a guy that maybe necessarily wasn't best fit? So I feel like because I asked for it, I felt like I needed to. You had to. Yeah. But at the same time, I've come to learn in this life that not everything that comes into

your life or everything that you do is for you. It's for them sometimes. So maybe I put the call out to the universe. for that, but really his call to the universe was for someone to love him unconditionally. Because you seem to me like somebody who's pretty like, you know, conscious and spiritual, which people also are like, oh, she's a former person. They don't really imagine those two things going together. Well, Mary Magdalene was a whore that watched Jesus' feet at the well, so we have his favor.

we all have that duality right yeah because I'm a performer as well yeah my wife and I do adult with all kinds of women and a couple guys um and yeah it is kind of weird how people take the thing and just kind of use that to form a whole world of assumptions about you yeah it's a big narrative that you know people think that you're just like this nasty trial up horror whatever and when people meet me the last thing they think is that I'm You know, it's like, wow, really? You come off so innocent. You come off so, you know, different.

I mean, I kind of didn't, I would have agreed with that, but then I caught your only fans and I saw how big your fake boobs are. And just kind of like, oh, okay, there you go. I didn't really, some of the footage I saw before I hadn't really realized. You know what? I didn't get these done for the adult industry. I got them done for myself. If you notice all of my films, I have no breast at all.

Really? Yes. Okay, see, I didn't dive into the older works. Like, if you'd go into the older work, I didn't do this for that. This was truly for me and just because I wanted my clothes to hang a certain way. I mean, they look great. I can't lie.

Thank you. Thank you very much. Where were you at in your life when you decided to do adult scenes? Well, I was about, I think 17, going on 18, and I was a runaway at that time. I met Heather Hunter. And she was featuring at Show World. And she was like a star in me. And I was like, I want to be a star too.

And so I went to a couple of her shows, and I hung out there and caught her attention, and she took me under her wing. Really? Yeah. And so all of a sudden, you were just off on this journey? I was her lover, and then we did Heather Hunter's home movies with her roommate slash lover. So you were her lover? You were, like, fully in a relationship with her? Yes.

But did she have multiple lovers? Yes. Okay. I was her living lover at the time. Really? For how long? Like a couple of months until she got tired. of me.

Were you gung ho about the relationship? I was, I'm still madly in love with Heather. Like, I love her so much to this day. We're friends now. But like, yeah, I always will have like deep love for her. Like, if she was like, bitch, come, let's do this. I was like, okay. But so were you, that's when you started shooting?

Yes. And who did you first shoot with? Because this is like the Wild Wild West days. For a big way video. The back in the day world. Now everything's smooth. We've got a couple of the big porn companies, some of the smaller ones. back in the day it seemed like it was just craziness it was i worked for vidway which was like one of

the biggest companies in new york or one of the only companies in new york because everybody was on the west coast right so um with with vidway vidway video dave copeland yeah uh-huh and so what was it like when you got into it um you know if i paid attention to signs back then i probably wouldn't have delved gotten any deeper into it my first scene i almost died of on set. From what? So Heather and I had a bathtub scene together. Uh-huh.

And the overhead grid lights, I'm really tall. So when I stood up and I stretched after our scene, my fingertips touched the gridlights. And you almost got electrocuted or what? I got shocked really good. And the set lights went out. I was really lucky. Like, I've always been really protected. Uh-huh.

Like, I should be dead so many times. But I was like, no, not you. Really? You got to suffer, bitch. How old were you when you got to? into it you were young? I think my first one was 18. Oh, right, okay.

So you started off shooting girl, girl, or you went straight into a guy, girl? With everything. Guy, girl, boy, girl, girl, girl, girl, girl, girl, girl. And were you loving it? I loved doing it when I was with Heather. Like, honestly, it was a job, you know. I enjoyed working with the people that I enjoyed working with. Anybody else is kind of like, eh.

Right. Yeah. That is the weird part about doing porn. is that sometimes you get to work people with people that you think are so hot, you like their personality, you're overjoyed to fuck them on camera, and then sometimes you have to work with people

where you're just kind of dreading it. Yeah, I've had a couple of those dreading it scenes. Right. Yeah. But so how many years were you actually active? From 1989 to 2006. Holy shit. So you got to see the industry change a lot.

It changed dramatically. Like I watched us fight for high rates, for girls to come back down and knock them down the nothing. I'm like, what are you doing? Really? You know, yeah. And so you were just kind of doing whatever during that whole time, or what was your life like? Um, I would be doing, like, during that time, I was like auditioning for music videos and stuff, just trying to get more mainstream, um, just partying a lot, just living in L.A. life, you know, not really focused on doing anything in particular except for music,

which was, um, my main focus. So you were always. always like kind of paying the bills doing porn and then chasing the music shit on the side. Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. And just fucking the wrong people, obviously. Like who? Give me some names. Just back of the day.

I'll give one name. It must have been lit. Lionel Ryder Now, he was responsible for signing like when that signed, yeah, he was A&R. So he signed Tony Braxton to Arista. Okay. And he was working the Whitney project on Arista. And he just like, Lionel, fuck you. Look at me now.

Yeah, she's on no jumper. I'm on no jumper now. No, but yeah, he just was a bad boyfriend. I thought you were going to say Lionel Richie. No. No. No. A lot of executives.

Were you doing epic amounts of blow during the 80s and 90s? You're making it sound fun. Ecstasy too? Yeah. You said ecstasy too. No, I didn't see it was. You said blow. Okay.

No, I was doing ecstasy. I'm a hallucinogenic kind of girl. Oh, okay. Yeah. That's where your spiritual side comes from. I don't know. I think I was just born with it. You have like a tie-dye aura.

Do you like? I am a brown bag, a little hippie chick. Exactly. I can see you like swatting the hacky sack around down on Venice Beach or something. Yeah, I used to live on Venice and Brooks and Speedway. See, look, we're connected. Yep, we are. I see you get me.

But, okay, like throughout all those years, like one of my things about the 90s or even the 2000s that we sometimes talk about with porn is how back in the day, it used to be kind of like a gross out fest or like a shock thing with a lot of the porn because you know you're selling copies of VHS tapes it's like a lot of people like back in the day this is when they started to do all the crazy bucockeys and the just like the the gang bangs with 500 dudes and all this crazy-ass shit people making food with cum and shit like that like there's a lot of wild stuff back there that doesn't really happen anymore and stuff is a bit more vanilla now thank God yeah and I even was talking to somebody who's been important for a long time

the other day, they're like, there's so much less anal these days. That's good. Because the girls kind of have more control and the girls don't really love doing it, so they don't do as much of it. Exactly.

Yeah. That makes sense. Did you do anything wild during your adult career? I think I did want Fukaki. Yeah. I was horrible. I hated it.

You hated it? Yeah, because, like, they were coming, like, 20. From all angles? Do you know how many dudes? Like five or six or something. But it was me and another girl, so I was dodging. a lot of come.

Making her get it. I got a Bukaki tape when I was in like eighth grade and it was probably 50 dudes. Or like 80 dudes. Like I wouldn't do like there are certain things I just wouldn't do like that was a lot for me. That right there was a lot. You know, I just wouldn't do

certain things. I just like no I'm not doing that. No, I don't care. Like I would never work around Jeremy. Really? You knew he was creepy before everybody else? No, I just I don't know he was creepy. I just wouldn't work with him. It was gross all the time.

He just looked stinky and hairy. But he must have been hot back in the day when he started, right? No, he was never hot to me. You know, I liked T.T. Boy. Oh, I love Titi Boy. I watch his podcast sometimes. And then I had to work with him, and he was an asshole. Really?

Like, he had an underwire bra, and he ripped it off, like, and broke the underwire. Like, he pulled it from the back, and I was so mad at him. You're like, I'm not getting paid enough to just blow through a fucking bra right now. No, it hurt. That's what it was. And it wasn't expensive bra, too. Yeah. But it hurt more than anything.

And he was just really like, I felt like he didn't like women while he was fucking them. Really? You know, he just said him like, really just. I seen him say that he used to do like four or five scenes a day, every day, no drugs. I don't know about that. I mean, I don't know. No, there was always like GHB and all kind of shit on our sets. There's always, always drugs on the sense.

So back in the day, shit was just crazy. It was always, yeah. Man, I've done GHB, but I can't imagine trying to shoot a fucking porno movie on it. That's got to be wild, especially multiple in a day. Okay, so did you, would you say that during that time, did you love it and you were, like, excited about it? Or was it just a job? It was a job. Okay.

It was a job. Yeah. Like, a lot of the things that I do in my movies, like, I want to do my personal life, but nobody. You know, like, I want to have that kind of fun. privately, you know? What kind of stuff? Two dudes at once? Yeah, like I've done it once before, but I want to do it again.

A lot of girls love that shit, but they don't really feel comfortable admitting it. I don't know why. Like, we have to say what we want. It's like, I'll give you a threesome. Why not give me one? Right. But as a guy, it is kind of hard to wrap your head around this being okay. Because full disclosure, me and my girl just did our first ever guy, guy, guy, girl, threesome on camera.

How was that for you? Honestly, once we got into it, it felt like no big deal. Did you do a DP? No, we just did like mouth and pussy. Oh, darn. No butthole. You should have did a DP. Definitely no DV.

D.P. No, but I'm not doing DV either. Double vaginal. No, no double vaginal. No, no double. Ew, that's hard. That sounds whack. Kind of gay too, right?

No, not really. Depending on which way you're going in. I know. But like, these dudes with like Lexington Steel ass dicks, they could do the double penetration. And they're like hell of far away from the girl's body. For me, I got a more normal size unit. I'm going to be all up on the homie. I don't know.

I can show you. Only kidding. Only kidding. I mean, I feel like I'm doing all right for a white guy. But, you know, D.P. is serious shit. Yeah. You ever done that? Yes.

Oh, my God. I'm going to get all riled up just sitting here. You were a fan of it? Um, I, like I said, I want to do it like in my private life. Like, you know, like, Because I want to do it, not because I'm having to do it. Right. Yeah, like, I've had so many threesomes on camera, but still sometimes I end up thinking

about back in the day when me and my girl used to just hook up with random girls from the club. There's something about it being that sporadic. Yeah. It's like exciting. That it's just kind of hits a little bit different. But you guys always get all the fun. We never do.

Who's we guys? Guys, yeah. Not me. I fucked with another guy the other day. I'm saying that's like one time, once in a lifetime. We're going to do it again. Oh, really? For sure.

You had fun? Did you like watching her get fucked? Yeah, that was cool. Yeah, did it turn you on? Yeah. It did. Once we got into it. I mean, because like she fucked this other guy on camera separate.

That was her first ever seen with another guy. And I just allowed this. And that was a little weird. You don't like that language. Allowed this. No, I don't like that. We're married. Okay, okay, okay, okay.

Allowed. It allowed me too. I felt a little conflicted about that. because it just kind of felt weird. Like she leaves the house. She gets fucked by another guy. She comes back. We put it out on the internet.

Everybody makes fun of me. It was what it was. But this thing that where I was there, I was like, oh, this is no big deal. It felt like we were all working on a project together. Right. You know? Yeah. I can take it.

That's how I look at it when it's work. You know, we're working on a project. Let's get it done. Yeah. Everybody thinks I screwed baby alien. Yeah. I did not. You kind of asked for it.

I personally understand how this works. And I knew that you did it. Thank you for having sense. Yeah. The fan bus are, they're trolling everybody. They're good at it. Like, wow, that's crazy. They've got people thinking the baby alien fucked all kinds of people.

Really? So he really hasn't? I mean, I have no idea if he's ever actually done it, but they're always, I've seen mad clips of different girls in the fan bus with him. Okay, with him, yeah. Now, yours hit a little different because it was so topical. It was so of the moment that it was just perfect. Oh, my God.

What, they just hit you up and we're just, just like we got to get you out of her. Yeah. Right. They're like, come on, let's do this. You're like, I haven't been to Florida in a while. I'm there. Now I go there often.

You do? Yeah. Doing what? It's a spiritual shit with my godfather. Really? Yeah. Your godfather? Will you take an ayahuasca with them?

With the godfather? No, he's like, he practices like a geruba belief or santaia. Okay. It's a Cuban, Afro-Afro-Cuban relief. Do you ascribe to a certain religion, or are you just interesting in all of them? I think that they all have different attributes that you can take what you need from. But yeah, I mean, they're all really the same pretty much.

So if I told you, I want you to come to church with me, would that be of interest? Sure, I'll go to church with church. I'm an atheist, so I'm not going to church. I was just wondering. Atheist is no good? No, I'm not saying it's good or bad. Okay. So were you still actively shooting when you met?

Joe? No, I was not. I was a full-on musician at that time. Okay. Yes. And did you feel like, you know, a lot of times I talk to girls who do or have done porn and they feel like it fucks up their ability to get into relationships and it kind of fucks up their ability to be taken serious doing other things. Was this your experience? Well, back then it was, yes. Like being taken seriously as a musician was impossible. So I had to leave the country and change my whole everything. And so I went to Germany and I became Kiss major and I made a music career for a music career. myself. And the whole porn thing was a total secret the whole time? Yeah. Really? It was. Even when I did one porn in Germany. Really? I needed some money. So it's like, would you like do your makeup different or something so that they couldn't tell it with you? No, like nobody really like they didn't nobody knew. I mean like I was on the German X factor and everything like nobody knew. Pre-internet was a crazy time. You want to know something? They owe me money.

Who? The porn company? Man, do they ever? my attorneys right now writing letters for everyone that has movies of me on the internet because I signed up for VHS and DVD. Oh. Wow. I'm like Cassie, when you see this picture, I never thought of that,

that's kind of brilliant. Yeah. Wow. And now that I only have a voice, people are listening to me, I've been saying this shit for years, but, you know,

now it makes sense. Now it matters. So do you actually not want the stuff out there, or do you just not want it out there? I want my money. Right. run my check. Wow.

Yeah. Because people forget. Or take it off the internet. Either way, cease and desist, pay me. Either way, both are going to happen or one of the other. I know girls who are legitimately famous who did porn five, ten years ago, and that shit is still getting so many views on porn hub, getting sold by the company who made it, etc. And these girls are long gone from the porn industry.

Yeah. And the companies are still making hell of money, maybe millions a year off that shit. We're going to get our money. Right. And if I don't let me band up with the other. Afro-American black girls from that era because we were seriously exploited. Tell me more. Anything in particular that happened to the black performers?

I mean, just contract issues. Like a lot, like Jenna Jamison and a lot of them had contracts where they were, they get residuals, they have, you know, just things that are fair if you're a big star like that. Right. You know, and we never were offered those things. Our sets were different, just everything. Really? That's interesting.

Like, they would have masseuses on their sets and, like, top, like, crafty catering, and we'd have some bullshit and no masseuse and, you know, just shitty environment. That's a shame. Yeah, whatever. But so, okay, you were living in Germany when you met Joe or no? I had just came from Germany to visit for a while. I was going to come home and stay for a couple of months and then go back. And I met Joe.

Right. And was it a passionate? it love from the beginning or how would you describe it um it was i i pick up on people's energy a lot and spirit so it was more like i was feeling his pain and i wanted to make it better because he didn't deserve all that like he's been good to so many people and he took care of everyone and then for you just to be in pain and no one cares taking your kids from you and you know just all kind of whack shit So like the divorce and this girl stealing money from him. Yeah.

And then like his mom just died also. So he was like, pow, just hit with like a lot of shit at one time. You know? So I came in feeling his pain and wanted to like just nurture and make it better. Right. Yeah.

But so was his financial situation all the way fucked up then? I mean, it was pretty fucked up. It wasn't like I didn't, I didn't know the depth of how it was really because he didn't, allow me access until a couple of years into the relationship. I can think maybe four or five.

Right. So I really wasn't abreast of what was really going on. But once I got a clue, I was like, oh, shit. Because that's one thing that I really got from watching some content, the concept, specifically you and this guy in the

little red coat arguing, where it just like the little red coat. It looked like a tourist soldier, but I'm not going to get into that. But like I've never had to go through that that like fall in the sense of like having money and then all of a sudden you don't have money. And it must be so fucking hard, especially when you have a family and everything like that. Like your ability to provide is just when you're a man, it's so intrinsic to what makes you a man that it's got to really like be one of the hardest things as a guy to experience that fall. I mean, I can't answer that. That's a conversation for you and Joe to have together.

I mean, I would say, I would ask you, what would you do in that case? Would you fight your damnness to get it back? Or would you just be depressed and wallowing your misery? Well, I mean, depression's kind of out of your control at a certain point. But, you know, for sure I would want to fight to get it back. But, okay, this is the problem is that when you've seen those heights and you just had to pay, I mean, I assume millions of dollars to your ex-wife and shit like that. Now you're in a position where it's not. not as simple as just going and getting a job doing construction or getting a regular fucking

job because the amount of money that you're going to earn is probably not going to put a fucking dent in what you owe or what you really need to like maintain anything close to the lifestyle that you had previously and that in and of itself has got to be a fucking really tough spot. I mean, and that's where the league steps in to a degree where, you know, they have programs where you can go take commentary, you know. lessons and you can get a reel done and you can go to school and get a second you know like he does music you know he was doing engineering it's really a matter of what your goals and your drives are you

know like if you have a hustle spirit and you want a good life you're going to make a good life for yourself if you feel defeated and you just don't care anymore you're going to react that way and I think that's basically really where we got to in life that's actually really cool the NBA does that I didn't know that They have a couple of stipends. They give you, like, they give you $40,000 in a lifetime that they'll give you as a stipend. It's the league, and the Retires Association does this. They also have programs, like I said, there's like the sports commentating that can help you get your, you know, your real done.

But at the same time, there's work that you have to do on your own. Like, you know, along with taking those classes on the side, take an elocution class. So you can, you know, speak properly and know when to inflict or win the pause. and, you know, just how to do that professionally. But okay, is it hard to be, like, I feel like every woman I've ever been with if I would have really got down to the truth of it in asking them what they were attracted to about me,

I feel like almost all of them would have said that one of the main things was like my hustle and my ambition and my just like desire to be something. Yeah. And it feels like that's one of the key points that you were frustrated with, is that a certain point it became hard. for you to accept that he was just kind of

down in the dumps. That's what it is. Yeah. Like, you know, it's like taking care of someone that's never going to get well. You know what I mean? It's draining. It's depressing and eventually, you know, they're going to die. So you just kind of like, you know what I mean?

I don't want to take care of someone that's not going to get well. But the stereotype about like these MBA wives and shit is that they're really quick to get out of there. Like, that they are not going to ride this thing out with you. So that kind of stands out to me that you apparently cared so much that you were down

to try to, you know, for 10 plus years to try to make him a better version of himself. I just have the conversation with him today. Like, babe, you know, I don't know what you're doing over there, but I'm grinding. You should be grinding. I don't know. I want to take this ride with you. You know, I think that my delivery is a little harsh sometimes with how I say things, so it's not received well.

but I mean it out of love. I mean, I was raised by the streets, you know. I heard you say that. Like, I ran away at a young age. So life has been, you know, people don't say nice things. They say it how it needs to be said. Right. And that's pretty much where I come from.

I say things how they need to be said, not how I think they're going to make you feel better or try to do it. So I don't hurt your feelings. Like, sometimes your feelings need to be hurt. The truth needs to be said. And I was basically like, yo, your ex-wife even told me,

you don't answer the phone. And I've watched you not answer the phone. You know, like right now money's calling. Answer your phone. Right. Because I'm going to be all right with it without you. Right. And now-

I'm worried about you. But now shit's even more fucked up because you're on your grind. You're seeing exponential growth. You're having this feeling of growth that is such an amazing thing to go through. And meanwhile, he's kind of, you know, he's not there for it. You're moving around. You're traveling. You're getting bags.

you're doing the only fans thing big time. And then it's one thing when he's like not doing that great and you're kind of like doing whatever at the same time. Now you're fucking killing it. That's got to really make you look at him and be like, I don't know. Is this like really what I want to be doing with my life? I'm sorry to me to laugh. My manager just asks me the same question. Honestly, I want him to, I want to take this ride with him.

You know, I want life to be good for us together. But he has to want that also. And I'll say it again. If not, I'll be fine. You know, I will be just okay. But you're still holding on. Because you could have easily cut the cord as soon as your shit started going up, as soon as he, you know, all these little viral moments and stuff.

And I think a lot of people are assuming that you're not really invested in the relationship anymore. But when I'm sitting here talking to you, it feels like you are. Um, I am and I'm, I'm like, I'm, I'm riding the fence, you know, I'm on the teeter totter, you know. I was like, I'm on, I'm off, I'm on, I'm off. Like, whatever. His, honestly, his plays over the next couple of weeks and months will, um, let me know what decisions I make. Right. And he just better not hope somebody else just, just could have stuff.

I know, because that's when we saw the thing with Cameron. And there's something that happens when you see a woman who, who's been married for a long time. And she doesn't necessarily get as much, you know, attention from guys as she maybe would have at an earlier point in her life. And they get a guy hitting on her. And it just feels so good. And you just know how she feels like to have a guy talking to her like a piece of meat. And we saw that with you in Cam.

Right. Where it was like obvious that you think he's a cute guy. Yeah. Obviously he's a generational talent. Yeah. And you seem to. Like you couldn't help but appreciate him talking to you a certain kind of way. I mean, okay, well, let me just say this that, I mean, they're not famous people that are hitting on me, but I get him on all the time.

True. So that's not something that, you know, I'm always flattered, always makes me feel good every day all day. Like, I don't not love hearing. I'm attractive. If I saw you in Starbucks, I might have to shoot my shot. You know what I'm feeling? Yeah. How you doing?

Yeah. Hey. Hi, how are you? I'll pay for her coffee That's pretty good, right? Yeah That would win you over Um

We could go on a date probably Me and you Oh We could maybe I mean we're already in Starbucks Oh we are right This is a date right Let's just sit there and have a Danish

While we're at it The Danish is probably like the best thing we got I agree But okay Was there like Was the camera on massage A particular issue with Joe? No, not at all

He didn't really freak out about that A lot of guys were freak out about that. I mean, I'm going to be honest. Like, he doesn't call me. Like, I said he hadn't talked to me for a couple of weeks. He called me the weekend I was in Vegas. Really? Matter of fact, the night that I, after this show, I think you probably watched it live and he called me or text me, what you doing? Really?

And I was like, I called and I was like hanging out with all the guys here at the house. That jealousy is a motherfucker. You know, but that's what I was like, you don't call and check on me anytime. I leave the house all the time. I travel all the time. I call. I'm the one that calls all the time and says, hey, are you okay? What's going on? You know, I'll be out of the country

and he doesn't call and check on me. So that was very funny. I was like, is that what most of your relationship was like where he's just kind of distant and just not really as involved as you'd like? Yeah. Because a beautiful woman demands attention.

I got tantra books and all kind of fly shit. Like, I want us to try. He won't do it. Tantric books? Tantra, like how to do tantra. Tantric sex, like weird positions and shit. Yeah, that's all kind of. Yeah.

Not even just that. Just all kind of shit. Like, I want to try. I have a book of physicians, you know. We don't, he's not into, like, I want to play games. Let's play a sex game. Right. You know, I was like, play with me.

Let's like play one day. I just started playing with him because I like to play. I haven't played in years. If you want to break out of that sadness, sometimes you need to do something goofy. Exactly. But it's like, no. Really? Yeah.

Damn. Was it always kind of, was he always kind of cold and distant like that? This just happened over time. No, it's pretty much been like that the whole time. I've been making excuses for it. That it was depression, you know, and that he just, if I just keep doing, if I just keep being, it'll change. You kept in that one interview I keep referencing,

you kept bringing up the cheating. Like that was crucial to you making the decision to start the only fans. Over the course of our relationship, there's always been, like, maybe not actual physical cheating, but there has been that also. But even like just entertaining conversations where you, you know, just kicking me in my back. You know what I'm saying?

You know what I mean by that? Like just like throwing my dick in the mud, like talking shit about me. Like I'm not shit to these bitches that you're with or I'm not making you happy or you're trying to get rid of this. Or, you know, it's like the conversations that he has with them really piss me off.

It's one thing when your girl finds out about you cheating and it's another thing when your girl finds out about you, talking about her to these bitches? Yes. Like when I talk, I talk to my friends about our relationship,

those are my friends. You know what I mean? Like, and I'm talking because I want to get some resolution. If I bring it up to a stranger, it's because I think they can help you, you know? But I'm not pillow talking with no nigger

talking about you, you know? And I'm not going to lie and say I haven't done my dirt also. Over the last, like, couple of months, I've had some infidelity is because I'm just like whatever you're doing you I'm doing me right so he's been out the house for what like a month yeah pretty much now it's been about actually I haven't been home for like two weeks so he's been at the house right yeah have you been having a great time just moving around and just taking advantage of all these opportunities um you know I've been just really enjoying quiet and peace and a clean room and just like hotel's good for that right yeah you know just I could stay at my friend's houses out of here, but I just, like, I'm really enjoying, like, just spending time with me, you know,

and finding out, like, talking to myself, like, what do you want? Like, things are changing and life is going to be different soon, so. I mean, it's, it's about the most out-of-left-field glow-up that I can imagine. You know, I'll tell you, I will tell you, my, one of my last readings with my godfather, there are, like, ordu, like, like an or-do, like an, like an or- And it said, with humiliation will come great success. Wow, that's interesting. Yes. And so here we are.

I'm like the butt of everyone's joke talking shit about me, but whatever. Do you really feel like that or you feel like he's kind of the butt of the joke? Honestly, no. A little bit of both. I mean, he needs to embrace it. Well, people are using you as an opportunity to moralize and say, look at how bad women sometimes are. She was so nasty. She's so nasty.

She's horrible horror. She's like, whatever, whatever, whatever. But, you know, I look at it like this. I've been, you know, I've started several businesses over the course of these 10 years. COVID really threw a monkey wrench in one of my main plans, you know, that I invested a lot of money in that I really didn't have to invest, but I did it anyway. Which one was that? Puppy friend social club. Okay.

You know. So, after. that and then after just everything. Is that like an animal cafe? No. It's a, it's a, your pet's vacation home away from home. Oh, okay, okay.

Yeah. Because I've been to Japan where you can just like chill and drink some coffee and then you got like a ferret running on across your shoulders and shit. And there's just all these animals just hanging out with you in this little cafe. That's kind of dope. That's a good idea. They haven't, they have like a cat version in L.A. too, I think.

Really? I want to go. We're here. I'm in L.A. Now, that's a date. That's okay. You'll drink coffee with cats? I want to go.

Okay, I'll get your number later. Okay, cool. This is a really romantic tale. Your wife can come. For sure. Morally, she's going to monitor me. She's going to wait across the street with a fucking Drake out in case I'm making any wrong moves. Okay.

But, okay, so the COVID thing fucked it up. Yeah. And I started dancing at a club. You know? And that's what I'm like, the, excuse me. But like, dude. I dance at a strip club. Like, what the fuck is wrong with only fans?

You know what I'm saying? You got people touching me trying to grab my ass, my boobs. I got to grind on laps. And he knew about that. Yes, he was dropping me off at work. Really? So how dare you have an attitude that I have an only fans page and I didn't tell you? Right.

I mean, I understand the argument of everybody too because it's like, yes, I feel you. But at the same time, if you're in a relationship, You're not really supposed to make any decisions like that without. I started going back to the club and I asked you for help me not have to be here a situation and you didn't come up with one. Whatever the fuck I do at that point I do. Okay? Because I said never, ever would I ever be back in a club and look at me now.

I mean, looking like these young girls kicking it. But still, you know. Yeah, I bet you were giving them a good run for their money. Yeah. But who wants to do that? I don't want to do that. I'm not saying, but I'm a 70s baby. That's my friend Google.

Either way, I mean, yeah, you definitely look great for your age. But however old you are, which is, or even, oh, 71, 29. Okay, shut up. I'm going to throw water at you before this interview is over. Don't trip you red me. But, okay, so you're doing the stripping thing. But all right, I'm going to be honest with you. A lot of people in their relationship, they get out of the relationship,

they start cheating. Like they don't want to actually have to have the tough conversation to break up. They'll just cheat. They get caught. It's a big huge fight. Okay, now I separate. Okay. I feel like you starting the only fans was kind of like that.

No, no, no, no, no. Me bringing a whole stud home. Because you had to know he was going to find out. Me bringing a whole stud home and saying, this is my girlfriend, who was that. And then he was like, I'm with it. And so we all got together and we had a whole relationship, you know. So that was, I thought he'd break up with me then. Like he's seeing like little, you know, his little, let me,

all the girls that he talks to were women that he was entertaining when he was married. Like the roster is old. Really? You dust it off. Wow, I can't even imagine. If I would have to restart now, my roster would be all new. I don't even remember any bitches from back in the day. Man, who are you telling?

I'm going to have all new roster. Maybe one or two. Right. Half my roster is dead from back in the day, bro. Yeah. I don't know what those dudes. Terrible. The bitch is doing fake zanz and shit.

Oh, that's horrible. No, a couple of my roster still alive and kicking and looking kind of good. Wow. So do you feel like a lot of this press that you've been doing and stuff, though? It almost feels like this is you sort of like slowly walking away from the relationship because some of the stuff you've been saying and doing and you guys both walking out on the interview live and stuff like that. I mean, this has got to kind of be putting more and more, you know, scar tissue on top of the relationship and making it less and less likely that things are going to work out, right?

kind of stuff I'm saying. I actually don't think that you've really violated him, but when I think about the camera on massage, just in general, doing press and tough. It was on camera. Yeah, that's the problem. And it didn't happen privately. It happened right there. I oiled his ashy back, and that was it.

You had an ashy back? Just a little bit. I'm sorry, Cam. I'm sorry. Don't hate me. But I was like, damn, man. I think I said it, but nobody. I was like, that's like, kind of ashy. That motherfucker's in my top five all time. I don't like thinking about him with an elephant back. His skin is actually soft. He just probably didn't have time

to put a little. You know what it was? I just imagine him being a soft-skinned man. I'm going to tell you what it was. He had on a silk shirt that day. Okay. And that's why he didn't put oil on because he didn't want it to get on his silk shirt.

We have that pink silky shirt on. Right. Like if you put oil on that, it's going to, you know what I'm saying? Okay. I imagine him being a moisturized man. You know, I was thinking the same thing. I was like he's going to be so soft and supple.

Not that he wasn't soft, but he was just a little ashy. Really? His skin was soft, though. We can't be perfect. They had a nice back. You had a nice back. That's just such a good compliment. You don't hear that a lot.

He did. I believe you, for sure. But, okay, has any, have any guys spoke to you after all this stuff started popping off that kind of surprised you? I'm sure you've had some suitors that were of interest. I'm not a pillow talker. I can't, I don't, I'm not, yeah. Some people, but I'm not going to say who. Really?

Yeah. Anything that got your panties in a twist? I mean, honestly, everything gets my tides in a twist these days. Because you've just been off the market for so long? No, just because I haven't done it in a couple of weeks. Really? So you've been on camera talking about sex a lot, but you haven't actually engaged in a while. I haven't been engaging.

And I haven't even had time to do content. Like, I try to get to masturbate for myself and for my fans. But really? I haven't had time. I'd be too tired by the time I finish running around all day long and I don't have to set the camera up while I took my makeup off. Right. Yeah.

What do you think he's doing? Who? Joe. I don't know. It's kind of hard for me to imagine what his days would be like. Well, I'm like, well, he's at home right now. So if he's at home right now, I know what he's doing every day. Hang out of out of bitches?

No, not at my house. Oh. What is he doing? Well, his day was... I'm not... I'm not going to. Okay. Because everybody says I'm a mean girl and I'm talking bad about him.

So I'm like, shut the fuck up. I'm not going to say shit. Just know he's home. Damn. That felt like it was about to be brutal. You're just like breaking down his daily schedule. I stopped. I stopped.

I know, I know. But it felt like it was about to be bad. So if you were to get back into the game, like is that the plan? If you were single tomorrow, would you start shooting adult scenes? for your only fans? I don't know. Like, I need a lot of money to do that. Really?

Yeah. I mean, I think you'd probably have a crazy payday on OnlyFans. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I'm making good money just playing with myself. You know. Yeah. But right now you're in the middle of the, the hype bandwagon moment.

Maybe in a month or two, it's like, I don't know, maybe there's a podcaster. I'm hoping that. that in a month or two, I am like, I'm working on music right now, so I'm dropping some soon. So I'm hoping that that's happening. I've got some possible show ideas as well as offers probably on the table. So I'm hoping that all of that stuff, you know, takes presidents. And I don't have to even think about, you know, upgrading my only fans. And I can just keep it simple. But if you were to upgrade it. If I were to upgrade it. If you were. Are you interested in working with like, I don't know, a somewhat handsome Caucasian tattooed 40-year-old podcaster?

Like, would that be on the list of possibilities? I mean, if I was to consider, you're very handsome, so I wouldn't be a bad, like you're not, yeah, I'd consider doing one with you. Well, we have a lot of report, too. We do. When's your birthday? November 24th. What you're Saturday? Coming right up.

Yeah. About to hit 40. We get along with badges. You do. What are you? Cancer. Okay. I don't really know a lot about that world.

But a lot of these other male pornsters that you might end up working with, I mean, some of them, they're all dick. Not a lot going on upstairs. Yeah. Just dick. Just cocked. I can kind of do both. You got brains and beauty.

And some of them are geniuses. I know this guy, John Legendary. He's an astrophysicist. Is he? Andy slings dick. Is it good? It seems like it. I've heard good things.

Okay. Right. I could introduce you to him, too. No, like right now, I'm not considering that. But if I did, I'd be like, hey, oh, Adam. Really? It's that time. And you'd be like, okay, it's that time?

Like, yeah, it's that time. And then we'd like, but. Some of my most powerful sexual moments throughout my life have been with Ebony Queens. Really? Yes. Are they your favorite? I'm married to an Armenian woman, so I certainly couldn't say they were my favorite. it. But, I mean, there's something. There's some energy there. Black girl magic.

Black girl magic. Is that it? Is that fair to say? There's something special. Yeah. It's kind of hard to put your finger on it. But I'm just like an overall. About that berry. I mean, there's something about Asian women too. They're different. There's just, there's a vibe of a sexy Latina. I'm revealing how fucking morning I am right now. You just like exotic women. That's what it is. I'll take a white. Give me a Taylor Swift. Give me a boring white woman.

I'm in there like swimwear. I got to appreciate my own kind as well. Of course. Is there something about Papa Johns that made him walk out during that one? What is it about Papa Johns? Oh my God. You made me just really crack up like a crazy person. Okay.

I don't know. I think it's because I was like, tell Shaq to give you one. Oh, that's what you said. Yeah. Hell Shaq to give you a Papa John's. Oh my God, that is kind of brutal. Okay, I didn't realize that's what you were saying. Isn't it really that bad?

Was it that bad? Every man wants to be respected as a provider. And when you sort of like name drop his rich ass friend who realistically took the NBA career thing to its, you know, took it about as far as you could take it. Everybody thought wasn't that intelligent. Right. And managed to do a hard-ass thing like be a sports commentator.

Yeah. And, you know, had a super long NBA career was one of the greats. They'll be talking about them forever. I mean, it's got to be tough. I mean, you know, it's all about your drive and what you want to do. Your hustle is everything. People underestimate that, you know, like some people got it. Some people don't.

You know? But I sometimes think women are kind of bullshit when they say that they're like a hustle. What they really like is a guy who's got something going on for them. But in lieu of that, they'll take ambition. I love ambition. Like, because I'm so creative. And so if I can throw an idea at you and then you can go, you can expound upon it. Oh, it's a fucking hot.

If a girl, I've experienced this in my life, if you're courting a woman and she starts telling you about her business idea or some dream that she has and you can actually give a real. feedback, that'll take you far. It will. It's definitely a turn on. Yeah. Because a lot of women feel like they don't get taken seriously as entrepreneurs or whatever. No, we don't. And then we also, like, you know, if you're supportive, you know, like, wow, I got this idea,

babe, and I can help you embellish upon it like this. Matter of fact, here's a couple of stacks. Don't make that should happen. That's beautiful. Right. Definitely. So have you been approached with any other opportunities that, you're not? really stand out to you, like things that you can use to make the most of this moment?

Yeah, but I can't talk about them right now. You're still plotting your moves? No, I'm just, my manager said, don't say nothing. That makes sense. With so many things on the table. Yeah. When you start to say, I'm going to do this, this, and this, and then you don't deliver, it starts to make it look like a loser as opposed to, like, you bring it to the table once

it actually seems like it's going to happen. Right. How tall are you? 511. That's a tall drink of water I'm 6'3 We see each other in the hallway Obviously you got heels on

And it was this weird moment Of like oh my kind My tribe We're tall Both tall Tall, tall porn people Yeah You want to come to the AVNs this year?

I'm going to I'm definitely going to the AVM this year I think you should you should host I think I should too I think they should have me host He hasn't Penn Davis Back in the building Wow

You know I like that We've got a booth for plug talk Really? Yeah Oh, you got to come by Oh, I would love to, yeah I'll go through some tics I got introduced her autographs and shit

I got introduced her to my wife too I would love to meet her Is she here? No, she's like 5 too You should fucking dominate her I like little Really? Heather was little

Oh yeah Yeah she's teeny Dude I met a girl the other day She got four million TikTok followers She's a 4-9 She's a midget She's hot Like a dwarf

She's a fucking grown chick She's like mid-t 20s, but she's four. I don't think I ever ran into a chick that small. Big ass fake boobs, too. Did you fuck her? No, I wish.

She was with her boyfriend. Because you could just be like... I know. I mean, that's got to be an insane feeling. Like, how much could she possibly weigh, like, 80 pounds? I don't know, but then I'd get kind of, like, freaked out like I'm, like, I'm fucking a child. Yeah, you got to put that out of your head. No, but you're a very...

You want to see this? Show me. Okay, show me. Okay, show me. My girl was taking fucking nudes with her, right? So, uh, I mean, this goes hot. Where is it? Me too all of a sudden.

Oh, here we go. I wear glasses, but... That's a pretty good... The one on the left? Yeah. Is the little one? Yeah. She's fucking cute-ass shit.

That's what I'm saying. You know, she's sexy. My girl looks like fucking shack compared to her. She's like a normal height woman. She's pretty, too. Thank you. Appreciate that. Yeah.

Oh, what? I hope. No, you kind of like left us for a moment. You were in another world. I did. I was gone, huh? Did I? But you're like far-sized?

You can't see it unless it's far away? Yeah, I need to see like that. I need my glasses. I had the eye surgery, but I used to be. How is it work? Is it good? Yeah. So I should do it?

I would do it. I got it done over 10 years ago, probably 15 years ago. And it was only like two grand or 2,500 bucks. And they fucking put all this tape and shit that hold your eye back. like that and then they fucking did some droplets. They don't put you to sleep. They don't put you to sleep, but they give you like a zan and shit so you're super fucking laid out.

And then they have this little laser that just goes zing and it just chops off a little chunk of your eye. Not everybody is like able to get it. Like you have to have like a specific type of eyesight. I think I should do that. You should definitely do a meeting though because I got 15 years ago, the best thing I ever did. Really? I mean.

I hate contacts and my glasses like always fall in off my face or something stupid. I dropped them. I did like 15 years of. I'm not taking my fucking dirty fingers and put them in your eye and then they get scratchy, right? And then you get your glasses that falling off your fucking face. Have they ever gone behind your eyeballs before? Oh, that definitely happened to me. Yes.

We'd lose it and it all the way in the back. And I have to keep rubbing until it comes back. Terrible. Worst feeling in the world. Anything I was. You ever get like a hair in your eye and you can't see it? You can't see it. You're just sitting in front of the mirror.

All the time. Yep. I hate that too. I've had some like good days in my eyes. my life somewhat ruined by having to try to find like a microscopic little piece of dirt inside my eye. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Sucks. So what are you doing tonight? Um, probably going to have dinner with my nephew and then, I don't know. Oh, I got to go see Miko. I'm going to hang out with Miko Grimes tonight. Really? Yeah. What's your relationship to her?

Um, she interviewed me. We became friends and now she's really cool. Wow. So we're going to have some drinks and smoke a little bit and, yeah. You're a weed girl? I think time. What do you smoke? Sliffs, blunts,

I smoke, when I'm in Europe, I smoke spliffs rolled with tobacco. When I'm here, I smoke blunts. I went in Rome, I do what the Romans do. I went to London one time, came back, and the spliffs never left me. I left the blunts behind a couple years ago. Did you? Yeah. I don't know why.

When I get home with some reason, I think maybe because the tobacco is different here than it is there. So when you put the tobacco and you roll it, it's just different. I think I try with cigarettes here and it was like, ugh. I've been having one of my guys, actually right here, roll splits for me for so long that I can't even like... You can't roll? I have a friend who can't roll. Really?

I'm like, he's like, roll. I'm like, he's like, I can't. I'm like, are you serious? And you buy weed and you smoke weed and you don't know how to roll? I used to be a bad weed roller and now I feel like I'm just like a non, like I don't think I could do it anymore. Some days I'm really good and then other days I'm really bad. Like my blunts have like, you know, good days and bad.

I never felt like I was the best blonde roller anyway. Like some of the Chicago guys, they'll take the blunt roller, bow, throw it at the wall. And shit wouldn't break. That's a serious blunt. And I'm talking a big, fat fucking wood with like three, four grams in there. Why do you, why do they do that? That's a waste of weed.

You still get high on a little bit, the same bit. I think it's like a penis thing. Oh, like, but then. If you're a rapper and you're walking around with this massive fucking cannon between your fingers. But if it's a penis thing that means you want to suck on one. Yeah, but I think they don't think of it like that. But you can't be, listen, if we're in Atlanta and we're in the studio and you got two chains, Cuepo fucking Gucci, I'm just imagining.

Everybody should have their own blunt. Who knows where their lips have been. For sure. You ain't passing blunts when you have that function. But I'm saying like you can't be the guy with a skimpy little swisher when everybody else got the giant fucking woods, right? And now they use loose sleeves, I think, more often than not. I like these kind of things Or

King Pomp Oh the loose leaves over there I like those Yep that's my boy That's so dead on there I like those Great American Uh huh

Yep And as you can see Do you know Jason Lee is I do I do He awarded me I would love to hook you up Yeah he gave me The Mandingo

All the Fame award Okay Hey But I'll ask him Are you on Mandiago Well he gave me that award I would never claim that I don't think

white men have their penis referred to as a mandingo very often. I have something for you. Oh, Lord. What is it? It's something nice. Look, look, look, hold on. Is it your foot? You want my foot?

I mean, you like me? Oh, look at this. Okay, so this is my nephew's company skateboard. It's called company skateboards. Wow, that's awesome. And I saw you had a wall, so I was like, oh, here. Let's do it. We're with the company.

Yes, we're with the company. Wow. We are the company. Shout out to him. I'm going to have to do my Googles and see what they got going on. Let's get it. That's lit. Thank you so much.

Company. Company is actually a pretty funny name for a skateboard company. Isn't it? Like, that's pretty clever. Yeah. Because we have company and we're company. Yeah. And it's just, it's a word you're so used to use them, but you don't really think of it as like,

oh, there could be a company called company. That's smart. I've already got faith in them. I'll do my Googles, though. Thank you so much. Thank you, too. You got let me know your next time in town. or if you decided you want to get back into the industry.

I will. Make sure I get your digits. Yeah, yeah, of course. Am I shooting my shot too overtly or was this tasteful? Oh, you were tasteful. Okay. Like you didn't say, oh, my God, your cleavage is. Your cleavage is cleavage is cleavaging.

Your cleavage is cleavage is cleavage. Yeah. Right. Don't have, no, no, no, no, ma, I'll leave it like that. So funny. Thank you so much for your time. I really appreciate it. I had fun with you.

And I feel like I'm excited to see what the next weeks and months of your life are like. I hope I'm coming back and I'm telling you. And I'm telling you really great things. Or I'm coming back and we're fucking one of the two. I love option too. Part of me wants to see love carry on after all these years that you've been working on it. So do I, honestly. But then part of me wants to see Keisha just be free as a bird.

Well, we'll see what the future holds. Yeah, we're going to have to. All right. Keisha, thank you so much. Everybody cop the OF. Oh, yeah. It'll be linked in her Instagram bio. I copped it today.

You're welcome for the $15. Thank you, darling. Minus 20% or whatever. Appreciate you so much. I appreciate you as well. Thank you for having me. No Jumper. Coolest podcast on World.

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