No Jumper - The Kevin Samuels Interview

Episode Date: February 8, 2021

Kevin Samuels shares valuable gems for those who are in need of a reality check in the dating world! https://www.instagram.com/kevinrsamuels/ https://www.facebook.com/bykevinsamuels/ ----- CHECK OUT OUR NEW SPOTIFY PLAYLIST https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5tesvmDS8h50LkjnSAWMOs?si=j6sJD6DkR4mk5NZZWnlK7g FOLLOW US ON SNAPCHAT FOR THE LATEST NEWS & UPDATES https://www.snapchat.com/discover/No_Jumper/4874336901 CHECK OUT OUR ONLINE STORE!!! http://www.nojumper.com/ SUBSCRIBE for new interviews (and more) weekly: http://bit.ly/nastymondayz Follow us on Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/nojumper iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/no-jumper/id1001659715?mt=2 Follow us on Social Media: https://www.snapchat.com/discover/No_Jumper/4874336901 http://www.twitter.com/nojumper http://www.instagram.com/nojumper https://www.facebook.com/NOJUMPEROFFICIAL http://www.reddit.com/r/nojumper JOIN THE DISCORD: https://discord.gg/Q3XPfBm Follow Adam22: https://www.tiktok.com/@adam22 http://www.twitter.com/adam22 http://www.instagram.com/adam22 adam22hoe on Snapchat Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

No jump, coolest podcast on the world. And today I have a person who has become a phenomenon, a force in the culture. He's taken over social media, taking over YouTube. Telling the world a lot of things that they may or may not be ready to hear. Today we have the one and only Kevin Samuels on the podcast. How are you doing, Kevin? I'm good, I'm good. I'm good. Me and AD are such big fans that we've got to at least give you a light applause.

Maybe not a standing applause right now. He's a goat, man. This guy's one of the dudes who put me on to you, so I figured it was right. that we have him on hand while we have this conversation. But it's truly an honor to get to speak to somebody who's making a splash in such a unique way. I appreciate it, appreciate it. Yeah, it's a splash.

I'll say that. So give me a little bit of the history of Kevin Samuels and what you might have done through your life and how you actually ended up kind of arriving upon the format that has given you so much success of late. So my background is like a lot of kids, Born to a single mother, father had many kids, found out that, you know, academics was going to help me get scholarships and things at college,

went to college for engineering. You know, did the normal stuff, but I hated it. I quit my job in engineering, decided to start waiting tables at Papado. And from there, I fell backwards into a career in corporate sales. And if you've been around long enough, you remember with the telecom industry, the boom and the bust. Right. I cut my teeth in that environment. lots of competition, lots of money,

lots of exposure, but it all went away. When that industry fell away, I found myself in advertising and marketing selling it. So I come from corporate sales. Okay. And the last little bit, I realized that I'm becoming older. I can make it up, but, you know, these companies fall apart, such and so forth,

decided to start my own boutique advertising agency. That worked moderately successful, but how I really got into this business was from the PR side of that boutique agency. one of our clients was about to leave and take about 40% of our company's revenue, which is going to hurt. Wow. Hurt bad.

And she was sitting there saying, you know, hey, I'm going to be put before the governor for an emergency appointment to a judge. But here's the thing. I don't know how to address for that. And I'm sitting there thinking about all the money we're about to lose because she's going away. She's like, but you always just so nice. Is that something you can help me with? Because I was doing her PR.

I'm like, well, yes. And I went shopping with her to help her get ready for this. thing. And I went and looked up, I was like, what is it when people help people get dressed for something, so forth? There's an image consultant. That's how I found myself being interested in image consulting, but it kind of goes in what I've done in my life. I've always had a sense of style, a sense of flair. So I got into the business helping men and women. And what really brought me here is when I started focusing on my guy clients, they were coming in saying, hey, look, man, I came into you to get a better outcome personally or professionally. But on the personal side, man, I'm

looking good, I'm smelling good. I'm moving up to corporate ladder. I'm moving up. My business expanding. Now I want to have a wife, a kid, the family, whatever, and I'm not finding any women out here who are kind of at my level or my new level. And then I'm hearing women say, they can't find men over here.

So what I'm really having is a conversation that my guys have and my women have. And I spent the first three years talking to men, but that didn't really catch on. But when I started talking to women about the kind of men they say they want, I asked one question. What do those men want from women? And that's what really kind of kicked this whole thing off.

And, you know, the pandemic helped a lot too because everybody's sitting at home. Right. So that's the conversation that's been happening since the summer. But honestly, man, I've been involved in relationship conversation since 1989 Shahra Zad Ali College campus. I've always been in the mix with relationships. But that's what's taken off here. So and that's what kind of led to to this new burst of popularity. Just having the same conversation that we have in the basketball court, the barbershop, golf course,

and I'm telling women what men really wish they could say, but they can't say this stuff in the corporate environment. I've been there. You'll get canceled. You'll get, me too, you'll get hostile work environmented. And so many women are not understanding what the disconnect is. So what I'm saying is, I'm like, well, the kind of men you want,

are these guys. And this is what they want from women. And are you willing to do that? Or if not, at least now you know why the disconnect is. So that's about as simple as I can put it. Interesting. Yeah, because that's one thing that I ended up saying to one of my employees over there. I was like, you know, I like Kevin Samuels because he just gets crispy every day. I don't really feel like I have that much of an incentive to present myself in that way. But, you know, certainly for you to garner the respect of these random people who are calling you. and in and stuff, it very much helps to accentuate your brand. And you're talking about that like you've always sort of had a bit of understanding of sort

of dressing for what you want to accomplish, right? Well, coming from corporate sales, you know, the first thing they buy is you. So when you come through the door and I'm talking about a multimillion dollar deal or even several thousands of dollars, your image does play a part in it. And I've spent a lot of time, money, and investment in getting coaching. I do the same things that I tell people to do because there's a difference between, let's just say insurance. Somebody works at a local state, farm farmers are all state.

There's going to be somebody up here that's making $500,000,000, and somebody making $30 or $50. They're selling the same products to the same market. What's the difference? Network and appearance. So I've always known that your image can help get you in the door. What you do once you're in the door is the difference. So that's why I stress the points of image.

before I get too deep. Images, four parts. Appearance, behavior, communication, digital footprint, A, B, C, D. The appearance part just gets you a herd, but how you behave, how you communicate, and then how you look online really kind of solidifies all that stuff. And that all comes into fruition on the show because there are people who come in like, I don't like this guy, I'm like nothing. He has to say, what does he talk about?

But then when they sit down and if they actually listen to me, it makes more sense more often than not. Right. I have definitely had more than a few people that I know try to like take issue with you but you know we keep having conversations the more and more stuff that we watch that I'm like listen I can understand how you could say that Kevin is disrespectful I can understand how you maybe think that he's prioritizing things he's prioritizing materialism or money or youth etc I can understand that you might take issue with some of those things but I can't say that I've ever heard him give bad advice I can't there's never been a time where I've been

watching you speak to a woman and thought he's giving her horrible advice. He's completely misleading. You might be a little rough with your delivery at times, but it seems like you really are kind of giving people advice that they need, to be honest. Well, and what's happened as of late, I have a private Facebook group that I talk about. And in this group, it's been up less than six months, and I pretty much handpicked the people that come in, men over here, women over here. And in eight months, and going on about seven months, there have been eight couples that have gotten together. Three engagements. So even on YouTube, a young lady just posted a video last week.

Kevin Samuel's advice is the reason I got engaged. And she got engaged in Aruba. So it's becoming harder and harder for people to say, your tone, your this, you're that, when you're producing results. And what I often say is I'm like, well, Simon Cowell in American Island was allowed to become a multi-millionaire. And he is the reason to show was a successful. was. And we wouldn't be talking about him if he wasn't abrasive with his commentary.

Howard Stern was the pioneer, the shock jot kind of thing. And even to a lesser degree, Gordon Ramsey. And I ask people, is it my tone or is it the fact that I'm right? And my tone just gives you a reason to not like it. Because two plus two is four no matter who's saying it. And we need more of that. And today where you can be a man and you can build all this and be successful for you, your family. And somebody can go back and say, hey, man, something you did when you was a freshman in college really made me feel uncomfortable. Give me half your shit. No, thank you.

Right. No, thank you. The world has certainly changed a lot in that regard, yeah. Yeah. So bring it a little bit more of that back and not just, and here's the thing, it's not just harsh or direct for meansake. I reflect what I get from people. So people who watch my show recognize that

I just mirror back and there are times when I'm sitting there talking to somebody who may come in as a real advocate next to you know she's in tears going back to her husband but people like to focus on the things that make their argument stick and really it's about staying comfortable

but I'm like cool be comfortable but just be comfortable with your outcomes don't complain about them right you're making a C I'm good with C's but don't want a outcomes. Right. Because we should have equality of opportunity, but not equality of outcomes. Definitely. So that's the one thing that we keep coming back to from watching these conversations

that you have with people is it seems like a lot of, you know, a lot of the women in particular that I see you talking to, they just sort of have like a contrived image of what their life is supposed to be like. And I wonder where you think that that comes from. Because when you have a woman, and this happens over and over and over on your show, they're 35. Maybe they haven't had a couple of kids. They haven't been a successful relationship, whatever. And then you end up asking them, how much money does a guy need to make to be with you? When they say a quarter million dollars in a year and you're kind of like, this is a very unrealistic world that you seem to be living. And that's a lot of fucking money. And what are you

really bringing to the table that would, like maybe you fall in love with this guy and you get lucky, sure. But it doesn't seem exceedingly likely if you're not bringing anything to the table, right? Well, what I think, you know, and this is where we start to have a multi-track conversation. One thing we all universally, Disney. Disney is always the prince, the girl comes from nothing, the prince finds her in the village and he picks her up and they move out from behalf. It's coming to America, you know, the Eddie Murphy movie in the 80s. This Western culture to where we have to have the cathartic ending. I mean, if you're a Star Wars fan or bona fide Star Wars fan, or bona fide Star Wars,

fan, Star Wars was supposed to end with Luke turning evil. He wasn't supposed to go good. Well, we needed to be happy so we can sell merchandise. So something happened. There was a woman by the name of Sue Ellen Browder, who used to write for Cosmopolitan back in the 70s and 80s. And she wrote a book called Subverted. And she admitted that in the 60s and 70s,

Cosmopolitan, which was Playboy for Women at the time, they openly lied to women, selling them this sex and the city lifestyle. And I did a podcast on how, you know, feminism and that kind of stuff was so supposed to be about one thing. Women having choice. If you want to be a housewife, that's your choice. If you want to be a corporate woman, that's your choice. And I think everybody can get on board with that. But when we've told women, women in particular, you can have it all.

You can have everything. You can bring horn of bacon fried up and pin, never let you forget you were men. I'm a woman, Aja Lee. That's the 1970s. And that kept going on and on and on. but we as men, we know that ain't right. You stepped the hotly over at the bar and you find out real quick what you rank.

Bars? Real quick. So men get a dose of reality often, and then when we took away competition, we started putting all these participation trophies, you get, you know, you get a trophy at the spelling bee just because you showed up. Well, it has an effect upon people,

in particular upon women, because women by nature want to consult. consolidate on the highest value man possible. It's in their nature. But now you've completely deregulated the sexual marketplace. There are no rules. And now you have social media and all these dating apps. So now if you're a man in the top 10, top 20%,

you have almost 100% of women wanting men who can produce this outcome, which is massively unrealistic. You want a man who's making at least six figures? That's only 10% of the population, 14%. And coming from Oklahoma, the Bible Belt, factory worker family, military family. I'm like, yeah, I fit in this category, but I also take exception to you looking at my brothers and saying, hey, these guys aren't good because they're average, but then you get upset when I call you average. That's true. We'll always have that conversation on the podcast where we'll ask like a girl who's relatively young and popping or whatever.

We'll ask her, like, could you date a foot locker manager? Very rarely do you get a yes. Right. I interviewed a professor, Dr. Tia San Johnson, and he's, what is it, University of California, Santa Barbara, he teaches black masculine studies. And the net of it is he is on college campuses, right? And he'll have young college men and young college women in his class. And he asked the question to these women, 19 years old, and they're wanting men at a certain level.

And these men in this room with their peers know they can't date them. They don't make enough money. And these women looking over at them, like, come back to me when you have $100,000. That wasn't how it was when I was in college. Right. This is a recent phenomenon of the last 20-plus years as to where normal average ain't good enough. Everybody has to have a Mercedes and you have to have a BMW. And we have to have a five-bedroom house plus a vacation home.

And we have to be able to travel to Europe. Like, wait a minute, we were happy if we went to Six Flags or Disneyland, but now you've got to go to Paris? Right. We just come from this insatiable we were made consumers. And women have that, and why I say women is because when you start listening to the women who actually sold this, cosmopolitan and all these kind of things are one of the easiest ways to keep money circulating in the community. It's keep men and women separate and keep marketing a lifestyle. Wow.

You don't sell a piano to a middle class person. That makes no sense. you sell a music room. Anybody who somebody has a music room, if you don't have a music room, well, you know, you just, you pay getting it. So all of a sudden, you'll justify buying a piano because, you know, I'm somebody.

Right. Yeah. Then we start talking about pianos. I have a stine where I have this and you can't play a piano for a damn thing. Right. But you got this ancillary music room because somebody marketed to you. Yeah, and you end up with this sort of a weird structure

where you have all, like a, you know, a handful, the top five or 10% of men, and they're attracting a, huge percentage of the attractive, eligible women, even though they have no interest in having a serious relationship with them. And then you have this other big chunk of men who now, like, the media will call them incels or something along those lines, that are a little frustrated with the arrangement because they sort of see the world working this way and they realize that even the women that they perceive as being on their approximate level of value are quite often not

interested with any guy who's sort of near the lower end of the spectrum, right? I spent the better part of a year and a half talking to guys called in-cells. They were labeled in-cells, but they don't want to be. They want women. Women just, they can't get them because women aren't paying any attention. And see, those guys got mischaracterized

as neck beard, Cheeto, eating dudes living in the mother's basement. I'm like, no, no, no. I know guys who are 40 years old making $160,000 of software engineers who are decent looking guys, but they have no real social skills, so they're not being prioritized because

it keeps getting pushed to the margins, the margins of men. And so I started off talking originally to men, my clients who are an image. Then I also started talking, I started realizing I had an influx of these in-cell guys, and I thought that they were guys who were economically unattractive. That's the new word. No, no, these guys are solidly middle class or upper-middle class. I'm like, so what the hell's going on? Does everyone have to have six figures and be a superhero?

And that's really what you find out when you start asking women, what do you want? And my sales background and my way of probing and active listening and asking questions, I can finally get people to just tell me what you want, not what you'll accept. And what you're finding is from GED to PhD, women are wanting two to three kids. They don't want to have to work to pay significant bills or they only want to have to work to pay 20% or less than a family bill. So you still want to provide a male. that ain't the way this country's set up. Most people, you need two incomes,

and then you're saying these guys aren't good enough. I'm talking to a woman in college and I ask you, could you date a plumber? And off the rip, she said, no. I'm like, you know how much plumbers make? Yeah, it's a great job. But I'm like, but it was the fact that not only do you want a guy, now you're discriminated where his money comes from?

Right. It's insane. And that's what this show is starting, the highlight, starting to break apart a lot of this delusion. Because when you feed an appetite, it's no different than drugs. Let me give you a few hits for free. And then now you're going to buy it. They've been sold on this idea that you don't want a high value man,

which is six different things. It's not just money. What you really want is this lifestyle. Then I ask, well, what do you bring it to the table and what kind of relationship skills and what he's going to get? That's what the crickets happen. So now it's really started a conversation that's much needed. We have gotten to the point to where, for the most part,

We don't even know how to relate to one another. We know how to swipe, left, swipe, right, hook up, and get on. Right. It's like the idea of two people who are at the relatively early stage in their career, when I think about my mom and dad, they met in college. They probably didn't have jobs or had bad jobs. And that was the dream. When I talked to my parents about what they wanted out of life when they were in the early 20s,

they wanted to get married, get a house, have a couple of kids, work on their careers, and build a life together. And they did. And they've been together for 50 fucking years. years and it's like that's a beautiful thing but it seems like that dream has kind of been lost along the way where people got so overwhelmed with choice and so overwhelmed with climbing the social ladder and trying to have the best mate that they possibly can that the idea of building something with their partner has sort of vanished to a lot of people. It's social media man it's like now

every young girl that's coming up they're looking at everybody's Instagram every day they've seen everybody with the nice purses like I have a homeboy who gets depressed like when he watches other people's Instagram. I can post a picture and he's like man my day is messed up. How's your day messed up? Because somebody else and you know people spend their money and go their whole life trying to fit

in with everybody else when they're not even in the same tax brackets and have the same social status and stuff. What I try to do is I'm like I don't judge what people want. I just ask are you really cut out for that and do you really want that because you know you talk about this social media has definitely

you know, throwing fuel on the fire where you're saying that used to be the American dream. Now, we're talking about women right now. Women want to, they want the outcome. They don't want the work. And I'm saying, okay, well, at what point do men start making this six figures? You know, that's a 45 to 55, right?

So you're 22. You want a man in it? Oh, now you want them to be young in the top 10%. And so it's like, to the point to where, they're starting to sit back and say, you know what, this is unrealistic and it's unsustainable because most people aren't there. And even if you do can get there from a look standpoint, there's only one. And what are you going to do to get it? So it's a much needed conversation because, look, even the guys that are up there, they're just normal guys too. I'm like,

you do realize their breast thinks in the morning. They have bad habits. habits, you know, driven, motivated guys, you think they're going to be at home to go to the PTA meeting network in 12, 14, 16 hour days, you know, being a high value man's wife is a lonely life and you got to, not lonely, but you're not going to have everything. And that's the thing that's happened. We've told everybody you can have everything. You can be whatever you want and there's no limit to now you have people thinking they can have it all when they're average.

and then that leads to frustration and depression. When your expectation doesn't line out with reality, people get frustrated. Then you got guys who, you know, hearing these women saying, I couldn't date a guy making $50,000. Like, that's an insult. Like, you know, half of the men in this country make $50,000? That's the median income. So I'm like, so what are we ultimately saying to people

that the only way you're worth anything is if you're over here, okay well are you planning on sharing these guys I mean what are you planning on doing right and so now it's started now it's what it's starting to do is it's starting to separate it's starting to make this conversation front and center because before it was just a one-way conversation and finally men are starting what men want is being heard because if you were to say what's on your mind or you would say what's on your mind it's toxic it's narcissists I get called at here Narcistice, misogynistic, or all these different things.

And last night I did a broadcast about alpha, alpha females and beta males. And I was like, you know, when a woman says, I'm strong independent on any man, I need this, this, this, this, this. I'm like, she can be direct like she wants to. But if you do it, you're demanding, you're this. And I'm like, well, he who makes a goal rule. So, all right, you're accepted over here, accept it over here. And what we're really starting to see is the hypocrisies. And that's what happens in my show.

I just question people and I just let the public decide. What do you think? And now more people are saying, you know what? Maybe I do need to get some therapy. Maybe I need to really, because I push that heavily. You need therapy. You need therapy. And then I think we all can do therapy,

whether you come from a trouble background or whether you're A-O-K, it's maintenance. And then understanding that life is about people. Success is shared and making money as a social activity. You want to get something out of somebody? how useful are you to somebody else? Because at the end of the day, you got your PhD

and this and that, and you look to the right and you look to the left of you, when the pandemic hit and we were on lockdown and you were there by yourself. That was the reality check. Now, people are starting to realize, you know what? I may want somebody to walk through this life with me so somebody can chronicle my life.

So when I finally do die, somebody can tell the people who are there with that hash mark in between born date and death date meant. If you don't have anybody next to you, it was almost like you weren't here. Life is a lot less meaningful

if you don't have somebody that you could partner with along the way. And I mean, some of us figure that out when we're 20, and some people figure it out it takes later into life. But I feel like your show is a consistent showcase of people that figured out too late in life what they wanted to have that. And, you know, it occurs to me, I remember when I was like 20,

21. I realized all the young girls I know, all the 18, 19, 20 year old girls are really, really concerned with being with a guy who's got, you know, cool tattoos, cool clothes, cool jewelry, whatever. And then when I looked at the older end of the spectrum of the girls I knew at the time or 28, 29, I started to notice them being more interested in guys who had careers that could take care of them, etc. It occurs to me when I see a lot of the women on your show, they end up trapped in that 20-year-old mentality for way too. long and then they might break out of it at 35 and realize like fuck it would have been better if I had been building something along the way and and that's and one thing I tell women all the time is that I've yet to I watch the shit damn every day I've I've yet to hear a woman call in and say I just want love you know what I mean it's just like and I've heard you say like there's nothing wrong with with dating the plumber you may be in love with the plumber but because you don't want to walk or go anywhere with the plumber and stuff like that you know I mean it's just the expectation It piss me off too. Like, what's the problem with just wanting love? You can meet somebody that work at Petco. That could be the guy of your dreams, but you work at Petco. You don't want to bring them home to your mama. They're going to laugh at you and shit.

She's crazy. Well, and that's why I have things coming from my sales background. You want to close a deal? You don't give people 15 proposals. You give them two. And you make the kiss principle. Keep it simple, stupid. You make it to wear taglines.

I'm a PhD. That has its own meaning now. the danger zone 27 to 35 if you want a family and kids you need to focus like a laser right here because if you make it to 35 you cross into 36 to 60 no man's land and more women have started to realize that you know what

I never thought of it this way I thought that I could just go out and live my sex in the city life and at 30-some odd I could just turn around and pick a man off the tree and run off and no you can't and I think they're going to have the same selection they had when they were 24 or whatever Dude, I did an Instagram

Because I get a little bit more raw on Instagram And on Instagram I was like, you better put a price on it You better put a price on it How much would it cost? Wait till I'll upload it But I'm like And one woman said

She thought that she should have the same value On her lady parts At 35 and she did her 25 I'm like, what? It's got 10 more years of mileage on it What are you talking about? That's what you always said them with like Can you think of any product

That just becomes more valuable With time? in what time. But see the thing is because see, I'm 51 so I'm in Generation X. We got a lot of bad information. So from 40 to 55, man, that worldwide in Western countries,

it's a bad deal. In Japan and Korea, they got a thing where people are dying alone. What's it called? Kodokoshi. Right. Do you know how they know? They find you decomposing on your futon. Countries are not set up for single

people into their elderly. years. I'm sorry. You know, men, we would end up, you know, going off into the woods and dying alone. We at least have that dignity. Women are going to take their services. We've called them hermits. We've called them weirdos. Homeless? And we'll step right over them in New York City. But homeless women, there's nothing more vulnerable than a homeless woman. And so you don't have an infinite supply of money to fund people who've chosen

you know, middling careers because most people have jobs, not careers. And I just talk straight, common sense that we all know, but we've gotten so far out of reality, and it's like, all right, look, man, you probably had a suitable man at 22 years old. You were together two years. It always happens.

You broke out of, for some reason. You likely blew that. You blew it. All right, now you're 40, just go make a deal. Go make a deal. I'll just give you your insulin shot if you give my dentures. And we'll just figure this stuff out. Because you're not going to get love like you did at 20 in your early 20s. What you need is respect and companionship and somebody who's going to be there.

And that other stuff can come once you know you have somebody there. And I witnessed my mother do this. She got married at 50. But I also witnessed my aunts. One died alone and the others on the way. So this is personal for me too, especially when we talk about turning down the plumbers. I'm like, do you not really? college guys that go to school in the suits,

we just look like money. But these guys with the trucks and they own businesses, they actually can make money a hell of a lot sooner than we can with little or less debt, and they own it because they got a skilled trade of some sort. You know, if you're in corporate America, your ebb and flows go with the company. And you started to see more people started to getting realistic

after 2008 the housing crisis. Because that's the first time it hit middle class people. You had people who had good middle class jobs it just went away. When I was in Dallas, I saw people from 75 to 120. Those jobs just left, and they didn't come back. And many of those guys went to start a landscaping company, became an HVAC technician, a plumber, roofer, something like that. And they're making money hands over fist, but they're not in the suit. They got a polo with their logo on right now. And those are the very men that a lot of women say, it's because of their title. I can't take you

to the bar with Chris. It's funny, too, because throughout you becoming successful at this, you've probably experienced this where you get a completely different level of attention from women because now you have followers subscribers, people know who you are and it's like your financial situation I'm guessing might not have changed that much in the last

year but the level of attention that I'm sure you're getting is completely different and therein kind of lies with the whole issue with a lot of the choices that people make right? You know have no check marks by your name because I come from image and I understand the power of digital footprint you know

I want to say back in September you know I had like 70,000 subscribers because I had been shadow ban because of my content YouTube really wasn't as friendly to men speaking about men's issues so I come from the image and style side

and if I had just stayed over there and kept out of this I would have had a different subscriber account but I wanted to have a different conversation YouTube also injected about $100 million into black content creators. And they said they weren't going to just support the rank and file

PC messages that were going to allow more things to be up there. So basically, I just kind of let it be. I started noticing my yellow limited starts becoming green. I'm like, what's going on? But then I got all the video. I got all the tools behind the scene to make sure I stay in that ballpark. But when I went viral, you notice the watch

time goes up. And now I'm at like 300 $160,000. So it's like 4xed. And with that comes the attention. And attention is the new currency. Attention is new currency. And now I would say the watch time and all that stuff that's gone up to. And of course the money

goes up. But now it's like, you know, the other day I was doing a film the podcast with TI expeditiously. And then the next night, I'm on Instagram and Tommy Lee from... I watched that. And the thing is, I didn't know who there was. I mean, I'd seen her before.

And, like, I'm getting to the point where I got all this, the staff and stuff behind me. So I'm sitting there doing my show and I'm just, and I'm, and I turned off the comments because I thought they were saying, I'm like, who is this they're talking about? So I went and looked and I saw a blue checkmark by her name, but I didn't have time to go through it. But we just had a conversation and I treated her like I treat anybody else. But the numbers jumped up to like 20,000 people. and what's cool is you know

even a woman like that admits I want to be married at first she kind of came off as like you hate women and I said at the end of it she said I love you Kevin I was like Godfather because that's because the truth is

if you've been around beautiful women successful women hot women look man most people just want somebody that they can come home to. And I just acknowledge that fact. And we're just scratching the surface.

But the thing is, I want to have this conversation in a wider format to where people can start having more realistic outcomes. Because what's really cool is when people say, I didn't like it, but now I'm getting a better outcome. I love it when you start to hear people say, I found this or I found that. Because that's what it's about.

That's also part of your legacy, too. That's also part of their dash. So if I got to say it in a way that's going to grab your attention Because come on you have to have a certain amount of entertainment value I had a very good I had a very good friend Behind me saying I love your content But you're dry as hell That's kind of why it's so good

This is back when I was still in my suit I was making no jokes he's like come on man He's like you're hilarious behind the scenes Like when you're on it's like you're very corporate He's like man you need to relax you're corny I'm like I'm like bad So I was like all right

Let's see how it happened And lo and behold, guess what, I became more relatable. Instead of looking like that goofy in the suit, you're like, all right, I mean, I want to dress like him, I don't deal him, but I like what he's saying, bro. Hey, I like the, uh, get the dog. That's the best. By dog. Jigsaw.

I said, oh, my God. That was classic right there. Oh, man. So you're from Oklahoma originally? Okay. So would you say that that influences your perspective on this a bit? Because I feel like the issue of people not really being. able to, you know, link up and marry or whatever, that that problem is more of a problem

on the coasts in the big cities. I feel like in a small town, people still have a bit of that understanding that, you know, linking up with somebody who's more on your level makes more sense. But I'm guessing that you're also sort of seeing that mentality seep into smaller areas. See, I'm from Oklahoma City and I was, so that's middle America, the Bible Belt, and I was raised in the church, baptized in five. and then we went from Baptist to Christian Church of God and Christ

that's some of the most fundamentalist firing brimstone so that informs a part of that. Then I also come from a blue collar factory family family was domestics that, you know, salt to the earth people. But from there I moved to Texas, I moved to Houston, Dallas,

then to New York City. Then I go to the big city and you know, I start to see an entirely different dating scenario. Bigger city, more options, more money. But what I'm starting to realize is when I get back to Oklahoma, they're even having these issues. You know, so I'm like, why is this creeping into the middle of America?

Why do you have women in Tulsa? I have women. This last week I had women in Little Rock. Little Rock. Come on, no disrespect. Because they're on Instagram just like everybody else. So they end up taking on a lot of the same ideas, right? Mississippi, Arkansas, Louisiana.

States are statistically usually at the bottom for a lot of categories. And I'm like, man, you're in Little Rock. And you're in your mid-30s and you want a and you're on a man making a 150? I'm like, what are you talking about? That's like eight guys. Right, especially there, making that much money is damn near impossible. So, and I use a lot of facts, a lot of data,

a lot of statistics, and I have a mathematical mind. So I can actually take that stuff and inject it into a conversation to make it make sense. Like I did an example one day where I said, you're roughly looking for less than, you got 7.5 million women looking for roughly less than 200,000 men. And that's just

in our community. They're like, oh, I'm like, yeah. And what it does is it's starting to really crystallize. Do you really want that, or do you just want to be safe? And that's what I find most women want. They think

safety and security is coming in money and what it really comes in is having that something that's unique between one man and one woman. There will always be an understanding in a relationship that no one else will but those two will. And it works for them.

That's why you get the 50 years. But we don't get that anymore. We're still trying to get these things and hoping that makes us last longer. It just makes you look better on the way to breaking up. I hear that. You know, it's interesting

because sometimes it feels like within hip hop or, you know, black entertainment or whatever, that a lot of times they want, the media, perhaps, wants the liberal attitude, the leftist attitude, to be sort of the default attitude. But then I think more often than not, it seems like it's somebody more along your lines who really is kind of the center of the conversation.

Like the average person watching this kind of content probably falls in line a lot closer with your way of view in the world versus the sort of myth that has been spun about everybody in that community wanting to hear sort of like woke propaganda all the time. And then somebody like you comes out and all of a sudden you get a huge fan base seemingly overnight. And it kind of is crazy, right? Yeah. And I mean, what do you think of that? Do you think that like?

What I did is, you know, I did a lot of work and research and polling and stuff behind the scenes. I kept asking myself, why is it in the black community? We can't seem to make families like we used to. We used to be married at a rate of 80% in the height of segregation in Jim Crow and, you know, the worst parts of the racial Bible. We were married at a rate of 80%. We had churches and families and communities and all sorts of stuff. But now, our numbers, we'd like the tip of the spirit.

We can't seem to get it together. What's going on? And we would say, well, it's the marital structure in the family court. I'm like, well, wait a minute. other folks are doing this, why can't we used to do it? So ask a lot of questions. I mean, one thing that you used to keep coming up is this whole high-value man thing, high-value man. So what I did is I said, all right, what does that mean?

I went and defined it because it can't just be money. And I said, what men across time, across any region, across any country, any system of government have separated themselves from other men and what are the characteristics they shared? and I defined it by, you know, making a certain amount of money over a certain length of time, being accepted and acknowledged as a high-value man by other high-value men or having the potential to be in the group, because it's like a little fraternity guys, having a network of high-value men and other people, and then being useful to others and the group. So guys like that are always in demand whether or not they're 100,000 or 100 million.

And I said, all right, well, and women tend to say they wanted a man, they wanted this. They wanted these things because the money is cool. But if it's an Anchorage, Alaska, it ain't doing you any good because you can't be seen doing these things. If you have no connections, you can't have, you know, influence over other women. And that was what really was the callous when I started defining it in that term and asking ladies, well, what do you want? And they were saying they want this. I'm like, all right. Well, you do realize that's rare, right?

And you can't be this at 30 years old, typically, because who makes that kind of money over a three to five year time frame and all these other criteria? That's what really started doing it. And one thing I also did is I said, all right, no disrespect to my friends in athletics, entertainment, or music. But their money comes differently. I want to talk about a business class. So I don't, because I often get, well, are rappers and actors and are they high value? I'm like, they make a lot of money, but high value is this. So now we start talking about men who make this and they do tend to lean more traditional.

They want more traditional outcomes. They want, okay, they want to, there's a, you're going to have to be married and bring your wife to the company Christmas party. Or you want somebody who's going to be able to, you know, raise your children right. When you're out on the road driving their truck for, you know, four days a week. and it's not the liberal quote unquote narrative it's much more of a you know because the black community has always been much more traditional and now we're just having a conversation saying how do we get what we want and it's through the if you want to have a community or anything else like that it starts with the fundamental building block it's the family so I don't judge

what people want I just say what do you want and how do you get there and more people say they want that than anything else. And I focus on that. I don't focus on the 10, 20% of men or women who say, I don't want that. I want some different kind of range. I'm like, cool, that's over here. And I keep it very tight and very focused. So if you watch my show, I have asked the same questions and the same reason to get to the same place to see, are you playing here? Are you playing there? And more often not, we're starting to see more people do want these kind of things, but are you willing to do what it takes to get what you want? That's what it comes down to. And then, too, like, I like what you say about women,

rather be a baby mama before a wife now. And I said, you know, that's really part of the problem as well, too, is, you know, you can get sex and, you know, have a baby with a woman, and she's not going to prioritize getting married. It's like it went to reverse. You know what I mean? I feel like it would be a lot more successful couples if somebody dealt with somebody, and they demanded that they get married first

and then have children and then it do that. And it's like, it's the, I got two kids with two, you know, I got two baby moms. It's just. Well, coming from the church, you know, if you had, if you were in the 60s and you got pregnant, they would send you from Oklahoma up to Chicago. And all of a sudden you came back with a sister. But now I see the same women going into the church coming in with two kids by two different men, pregnant with another.

But they sit on the front pew right here. And the pastor's shouting them out. I'm like, we've taken away consequence. We've taken away judgment. and also men have left the church because they're like, uh, this is not right. So you have women being fed what they want to hear to keep them buying books, paying ties and also the kind of stuff.

But the men aren't in these places because the men say, I don't want this. You can do that. You want to have children. That's fine. But I don't want to pay for another guy's kids. And now the women who find themselves in that position are like, well, wait a minute, this is cool three years ago.

I really wasn't. Guys just couldn't say anything because if you were in a position to have a platform to say something, you'd be deplatformed. This has only been something that's been all right to talk about in the last under 12 months. So make hay while you can, right? Because it's the reality and more women are starting to realize that if you do have kids, okay, understand. What that effectively does is it reduces your overall marketplace value

and don't get mad at the market. Just adjust a coroll. It's not a death sentence to say if you have kids, but it does mean that it's a different mating calculus. And women have this mating calculus too. If you don't make a certain amount of money, if you're not a certain race, height, look, junk size, I mean,

car. Y'all like, y'all have a calculus. Ask a typical woman what she wants to them in. She'll write war and peace. Ask her what she's going to be at a table. Doesn't even fit on the back of a stand. There's a problem there. That's a problem.

There was a video that went viral on somebody's podcast or show, and I can't remember the actual name of it. But he brings up, he asks, the co-host, the woman on the show, he asks her, like, could you date a guy who was making, I forget what the number was, like $150,000 a year? And she goes, maybe if he's selling drugs on the side or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I was disturbed. I'm like, that is the worst thing. And she said it like she wasn't joking, which really pissed me. Did she have a short haircut?

I think so, yeah. I want fast money. I need that fast money. Right. And you want a guy who's going to be risking 20 years in jail for trafficking cocaine? And you think that's cute? And that's the thing, too, like, coming from where I come from, like, guys will take penitory chances every single day to impress other women. Bro. You know what I mean? I know guys who had good chemical engineering jobs who were trafficking narcotics.

I'm like, you got a master's in chemical engineering, but you decided to be an age dealer? Why? Because of the clout. I'm like, all right, bro, this is nuts. So when you hear women saying that I don't want to know, and that's what really pissed me up. When I started hearing, and I don't want to mention the content creators, when I heard women saying I don't want no 9 to 5 guy, I need a guy who has an entrepreneurial mindset to match my flow.

And I'm like, you just going to shit on every man that works? Right. I got a real freaking problem with that. Yeah, I sit in an air-conditioned office and make deals, but I come from salt to the earth, hardworking, mother-effing people, and you just, no, no. You ain't good enough. Right.

And because at some point, that will be me because it keeps going where does it stop and no one could tell these ladies that you're saying I want a man and she has would you like a man to work at the bank yeah but you know and whatever and maybe if he was hustling doing a little fraud or something but okay let's just say he did all that he did all that to get you well then when he goes when he goes away and get his goodfeller sentence you're going to stay down bang bang you're gone you are gone she's out of here not not even going to wait a week you ain't going to stay Lord You ain't going to stay down to Webay.

You're going to be gone. It's a wire reference, by the way. Classic show, classic show. I mean, it's pretty incredible. And you got to wonder where this sort of mentality came from, where the idea that having a 9 to 5 was a bad thing, that working was a bad thing, is just this really sort of disturbed mentality.

Yes, it would be nice. Of course, a lot of women would like to date a guy who owns his own business, sure. But they're not discounting there, is how great it is to be able to go home at the end of your 9 to 5 and not have to be thinking about the business 24-7 like I am. Not to mention that having a 9-to-5 is, like I look at AD. Like we brought him on.

He starts doing podcasts with us. It's helping every other area of his business. At some point, maybe he could start a completely separate business from what he's been able to accomplish on here. A 9-to-5 is nothing but an opportunity to help you get to the next level. See, one of the things that's going to piss women off is because men are much more numerous. We have to get into the numbers. We're cost-benefit calculators.

If I go over there to take down that wheel, the water buffalo, he's big. I may get him, but if he hits me with that tusk, I'm out, or I'll break something I'm dead. There's a rabbit. There's not as much meat on there, but that rabbit ain't going to take me out. I'm a little tired. I'm going to fuck with the rabbit. I'm a snack on your ass, and then I'm going to come and get your ass in the minute when I get my boys. We laugh because we understand because if I do that right now,

I'm gone because there's no one coming to get my back. Men have to run these numbers. So what I find is women often say, I just want the water buffalo, go get it. Wait a minute. Do you don't understand that's a different risk? So I want it. Right.

And I mean, and I've had water buffalo before. You're some kind of punk. Why can't you get water buffalo? Perducey. It's like, wait, hold on. Hold on. Hold on. You were eating berries at your house.

I can bring you rabbit, which is better than berries. rabbits and berries may be pretty good tricks is for kids but this one of the five you want but you want me to go get this and you want me to go you boss you want me to go get this thing why to prove to you what and when i do that and if i miss are you going to help me back to hell nurse me back to hell no you're going to eat them berries and go find somebody else to go no and that's what they tell these men i'm like what are you telling the guy you want to do fraud to do what? To get you $50,000 to do what? Just because I need it. For what?

But it's because you've had this, and I hate to use hip hop and that stuff as a, as a culprit because we came to live from hip hop. But, you know, there has been a market change from the message to the watches and the cars and this and that. But average people used to understand not everybody got a AP watch. That's a house. You were good with your Seco 105, there's $300. G-shock. Exactly.

And you were good with that. You didn't think because I didn't have this. I'm less than a man because I don't have this watch. No, you're still a man. And men understand that I don't look down on you because I got a Rolex, you got a G-shock, but when women start making the distinction saying you're a better man because you have this, then you start, because men will do what it takes to get women. men are starting to reject that saying, look,

I'm done. If this is what it takes, if the only men you're dealing with is over here, and then even those guys, what was the actor's name, getting Johnny Depped, you know, even those guys, you got guys who are supposed to be Apex Alpha Male,

got everything else, and they're getting left. Why can't they keep them? And guys are saying, you know what? No, Moss, I'm done. that's never happened before. Well, guys have chosen to just say, no, the game's rigged. I'm going to just put the ball down and I'm going to go here. Now, you have an abundance of adult entertainment online now.

You got, yeah, man. You got an adult. I mean, I used to keep the, I used to keep the frat porn collection. So you got to, you got to. I'm in there. He's in porn. He's in porn. Great guy.

He's got to make it super explicit. Hey, man, we made a lot of money on OnlyFans, my friend. See, and the thing is you have more access, and here's the thing. Back in the day, it used to be kind of taboo for guys to go to escorts. And I'm openly promoted. I've taken an escort to a company function. Really? It helped my fucking career.

Wow. I went to a company function. Unless somebody else that recognizes her. Hey. No, no, no, no, no. That's what did it, bro. Oh, okay. I went to a company function.

I've hired one of the top escorts in Dallas to go to a company function. with me because you don't want to go to these things alone and I had heard that this is a good idea so I hired her like a lot pretty woman stuff and I was not rich and I took her and I'm in the company where in the executive washroom because they had the functions all the bathrooms are open so us normal little peons could use that so I'm like sure why not I'm going there a guy comes out of the stall and all he says is walks by wash his hands that Kelly is an incredible girl. And he walks on out and I'm like,

he was the VP of marketing. Right. Three weeks later, I get a call. Mr. Johnson would like to see you in his office. And I'm sitting up there, Mr. Johnson. We're just talking about the weather and cowboys and this and nothing. Nothing at all. Nothing.

It was like banile water cooler talk. About three weeks or four weeks later, I started getting premium accounts handed my way, more opportunities. My managers start talking to be completely different. I started getting invited over to the, you know, come over to the house for dinner. I didn't know I had an advocate.

And it turns out about three to six months later, I got into the manager program. And what ended up happening is I went and I played golf with these guys in the scrambling. He's there. And I asked, I was like, are you like my secret benefactor or something? He's like, he was a red. of the girl that I took there.

And he's like, anybody who had enough sense to bring her as somebody I need to keep my eye on. Because she is one of the most discreet people. He's been seeing her for years. And he's like, I know how much she costs. So that tells me you're not stupid. And she's not, he's like, I just need to see who you were. And he's like, I've done my research on you,

and done my work on you. And he was like a real life benefactor. So what it taught me was there's a different level of power. moves and we have stigmatized that stuff to where you shouldn't do that but hell if it opens a door it opens a door now nowadays

you know escorts porn that kind of stuff is nobody bats an eye out anymore yeah so now sex now women don't have the monopoly in lockdown on it like they used to I guise some you take out the trash no I'll just go go to Eros

in call $300 out call for okay I just okay right and I'm out while I got a wine and dine to court you just for you possibly to give me some starfish sex, I'll just break you off this for and I'm good. Cash app, that's what they call it now and days.

And I'm realistic about it. I'm realistic about it. And see, as an image consultant and a dating expert or whatever I'm called now, you're not supposed to talk about this. I'm like, this is real. This is real life. When I was in corporate sales, I did not play golf well.

So I'm like, most guys did business on the golf course, I did my business in the strip clubs. Monday through Saturday, I was in the strip clubs. I'm the guy that the premium strip club, I was in so good with them. I got VIP on Valentine's, New Year's,

and Halloween. You have the NFL and NBA players trying to get in, no, he can't go in. It's for so-and-so. And that puts you an entirely different world of power. And I'm floating around seeing how all these people move and just taking notes. But I'm still just one of these guys.

I'm just being able to be in places and use that and try to give guys this fundamental knowledge that, look, man, they're no different than us. They just make different choices. So you seem like you had a real hunger for figuring the game out and networking your way into the position that you wanted to be in the long run and really sort of understanding the entirety of how rich and powerful people move and you were willing to put in the time and the sacrifice.

When I would go to the men's club in Dallas, men's club in the lodge, When I'm going in there seeing guys that I normally couldn't talk to, I actually, I'll tell you a secret. Tell your story. When I saw how much business was being done in these places, let's say I'm trying to do business with you, and we get to a point you're like,

you're not returning my phone calls or whatever. We're done. The sales is dead. I actually knew girls that work the lunchtime. They tend to be the hustlers. They tend to be the ones that are about their business because the shifts are shorter. And I'm like, all right, come with me.

I know we're not going to, you don't want to do business, but come. Let's go to the lodge. They got a great lunch. Prime rib, all of the stuff, some fun. Who's going to turn that down? Free T&A plus prime rib and crap. So we're sitting there, and you're sitting there,

and all of a sudden, here comes Darien and Dary and he's like, oh, this is your friend. Any friend of Kevin is a friend of mine, and she rubs your head and I love him. Kevin's a wonderful guy, such and so forth. Blah, blah, blah. Next thing you know, you sign a contract. Wow.

No sex, no nothing, all above board, and I gave her 10% of the contract face value, straight up. And it got around to the dancers. It's like, if you work with Kevin and you close business, you get money. So I found out that I started closing more business in these places because everybody's on the golf course. Everybody's over here. But what man doesn't want to be around beautiful women?

How do you avoid getting lost in the sauce during times like that in your life? Like, how do you not? I see my friend, A.D., he might be networking at the club a little bit, but he's also having a few too many cocktails and, you know, whatnot. Well, and see, you can And that's the thing. Well, first of, you know, when you get to really understand that world, it's a fast world.

You know, those girls get the best of all candy and get the best of all offers. Don't partake. Right. Don't partake. And I would say don't shit where you eat, but there's too many hot pieces of ass not to do that. But you got to be, you just got to pick your shots, man.

I only deal with people who have something to lose. I don't care how hard you are. So, like, some of the women there would be smoking, but I'm looking for women who own property who are really dancing. They're not screwing every client because when it goes left, as it always will, you don't find yourself. This is prior to social media explosion, too. So keep it business. Keep it business because, look, man, it's the oldest profession in the book for a reason. And I just accept, see, I'm a realist.

I accept we are human animals. and if as long as it's legal, I'm good. And what happens between two consenting adults and my presence. At the end of the day, what never happened was somebody I did business with, whether they signed the contract here or in my office, it always worked for them.

It helped them achieve the goals they want to do. It improved their bottom line. Never was somebody, man, I wish I hadn't done this, man. No, it was a good outcome. So the means may vary, but you got a good deal, I got a good deal. Everybody wins. Some people would say, well, that's immoral. Okay.

A lot of times when I see you talking to women and you kind of corner them into realizing how diluted they are, then they try to switch it up on you and say, well, are you married? What are your thoughts on that? I noticed that you did come in here today with a woman who seemingly is a high-value woman. Allegedly. Allegedly. And you are out of town. What about your own personal relationship mentality at this point? Well, whenever that happens, it's what I call sign language.

Shame, insults, guilt, and the need to be right. That's the typical playbook from many women when they get cornered. Shame, insults, guilt, and the need to be right. So that's a deflection. Well, are you married? No, I'll be married twice. or I can't take advice from a divorce man. Okay, so what you're telling me is if I've been married 30 years of one woman,

you listen to me then? No, because all you know is doing woman. What you're really saying is you don't like what I'm saying, and any old excuse will do. Now, for me, I've actually been over singles ministries or churches that I've been in. I talk like somebody who has a lot of experience because I do. And I ask the ultimate question,

how does my being married or divorce change your life? is two plus two, four. And that's really what the problem is, because that's people not wanting to deal with the argument they wanting to deal with the person, an ad hominem attack. And if you've ever taken debate before, the first person to go personal in an actual debate loses.

So coming from a sales background, and I've always had an interest in philosophy and debate, it's a debate tactic. So you learn how to stay cool and calm under questioning and fire and understand when they hit you with their biggest punch. That's it. Then they're going to hit the big bomb.

They're going to hit you with it. And you just answer it directly. Yeah. My thing is this. As far as personal life, some people want to be married. Some people want open relationships. Some people want just to do their thing.

I have a friend who's a self-proclaimed heatness. He never wants to marry and have kids. I don't judge a person's outcome. I don't judge what they want. I just say, okay, what do you want, what do the kind of people you won't want, and then what are you willing to do to get it? Those are the only three things.

What do you want? What are the kind of people you won't want, and what are you willing to get it? And if you know what you want, if you don't know what the people you won't want, and you're not going to get it. If you know what the people you won't want and you're not willing to do to get it,

you're not going to get it. So knowing what you want is the, easy part. These two. And this is where the friction tends to come in because either they don't know or they're not willing to do to get it. Like, let's be honest. Most women know that men don't

want women that weigh more than they do. So when I say, hey, you know, dress size this or that, oh, how can he do that? He judges such and so forth. I'm like, Miss America, Miss Universe, cover a college, I mean, before

Tess Holiday. But anyway, we We understand that there's a, there's beauty of subjective. There's an objective standard too. And I just don't act like these things don't matter because you couldn't put, what was the dude on Howard's, Beetlejuice on the cover of, GQ calling him the sexist man of the year. That would not work.

We would chuckle, but we try to feed that crap to men and I'm saying men don't want to eat that. Definitely. Do you worry that you, in terms of your future, you could be a victim of the same issue that we frequently are describing on your show where you're all of a sudden reaching a different level in your career. You have more and more women reaching out to you.

How are you going to eventually settle on one if you're constantly being inundated by more and more women reaching out to you who are of more and more higher value by the day? Yeah. Good problem to have. See, here's the thing. I've already been through my whole phase.

I don't have a bucket list anymore. There's always going to be a hotter, sexy a woman. you know, that's cool, but I would rather have somebody that I have, that I could be myself with, and they understand who I am, and they can match my irregular flow

and let me do what I do. That has a value to itself. That ultimately comes a relationship between one man and one woman to where they understand each other, to where that's more valuable than money, status, power, or hotter TNA or new vagina. You know what? I never expected, but I've really realized

in recent months or years is that there's no better turn on than being in a business with your girl and making money together and actually doing something for yourself together. It went my whole life having no idea what that would have felt like and then in recent years of really kind of now you have a real partnership. You know and once you can

actually be building something together, not to mention the kid, because then all of a sudden you've got like this costly unpaid business that you're starting together that is immensely rewarding. I mean that'll really join you together and get you thinking on the same wavelength. See, one of the questions I asked early 2020 is I asked a question to our black male audience.

I said, what do my non-black middle class, upper-middle class, and lower upper-class men know and understand about marriage in today's environment. They marry divorce and remarry. What do they know and understand about the institution of marriage that middle class and lower upper class black men don't? Because the marital rates are so different. And one thing I noticed in corporate America is, as a young black professional, young black women, summertime, my counterparts were all the white women were going to weddings, being bridesmaids. And we were all going to the club. Right.

So it was like everybody else was getting married. But then you realize that you can work hard, you can be good. But there's a level of which everybody upstream is married or has been married. there's a marriage cap because men being successful, I mean, think about it, it's hard to sit in a room full of married, successful men to talk about wife, family, this and that, and you're a single guy. You have a different motivation, a different calculus, and being on both sides of it, I understand it, and I speak to that. Because if you look at our divorce rate, that's 50 plus percent, right? the divorce rate drops to about 20% above a household income of $250,000. Wow.

The more money, more people stay together because it's more than just sex. It's about legacy. And your best assistant is your spouse. Whether they're directly involved in the business or whether like many high value men, their wives will come work for the business. She'll be the office manager. You know, she'll do all the details like, I hate details. So my next ex-wife is a joke, but my next, she would be good at doing all that stuff for me because that means if we don't have to outsource it, that's one less payroll headcount that I have.

That's more money back to the family to be invested back into the business versus continuing to hire employees, such and so forth. And that's what I noticed when I started really studying success that you look at millionaires and billionaires and you rarely see lifelong bachelors. They're usually married. And I'm like, well, and people used to say, well, man, marriage is a bad deal. And, you know, Jeff Bezos, I'm like, Jeff Bezos, ain't saying that shit. Jeff Bezos, yeah, he lost half his money. But guess what, he doubled his money after the pandemic. He ain't sweating it.

That's one thing that I noticed that the men who had the money, for the most part, weren't complaining losing half the stuff. It was the men who were projecting their middle class sensibilities onto rich people. I'm like, you can't do that. That's a different calculus. Yeah. And when you're up there, you need somebody that you can trust. because the person who's most likely to do you in

is the person that's sleeping next to you. So if you study men of power, there was a show on HBO. It only ran for a couple of years. Marco Polo. And the character who paid Kublai Khan. Kublai Khan, if you know anything about Genghis Khan, one in six of us carry his DNA.

He got it in. All right, but Kubla Khan, Kuwla Khan was his grandson. and the guy who played opposite of Dr. Strange or the Asian character he played Kupla Khan study him

his consorts but study his number one wife that woman right there is the kind of woman that high value men would kill for because her main motivation was making sure that he was great and his greatness benefited her

and by extension benefited his son and by extension benefited his son and by extension benefited the entire Mongol nation. Right. It's always been that way with us. Definitely. Do you feel, how do you personally, how much faith do you personally have in interracial relationships?

Do you feel like there is a big divide with a lot of the people that you talk to? Because that's one thing that I feel like I don't hear a lot of on your show when you're talking to young ladies is that it doesn't feel like there's a lot of overlap that they're mostly dating within their circles. Do you feel like there's anything inherently unlikely to work in between interracial relationships? What I can see from the data is 80 plus percent of people are date inside their group. Me personally, I've dated everything. I say make yourself the best version of yourself and pick from the best you have available. Because at the end of the day, we're all human, but most people want their group. Right.

See, I think the disconnect comes when you feel. feel like you're having to pick from lesser options, but that's a function of you. Like you said, if you make yourself the top choice or become the best version of you, and you can say, and know not what you want, but know what you

need, that's a difference. Know what you need and then pick for that and outcomes, not for short term. That's relationship. I mean, think about you and your best friend. Y'all don't want to kill each other sometimes. This guy want to kill each all the time, now?

But, let somebody fuck with him. Oh yeah. You know, I'm coming. That's it. That's it. That's it. And that's the thing. We have that as men. Men want that with women, too. And women want that with men. And the thing is, that person may look different from a want standpoint versus

a need. And I just actually speak to that. And if you look at what it did with, the thing with Tommy Lee came on when she said, you know, I really do want that. I'm like, I just want to trust. I'm like, I get it. I get it. and more women would be likely to get what they need if they're willing to be vulnerable and risk saying that because what they've been told is

every man out here ain't shit ain't nothing going on but to rent bills bills bills such and so forth and women today in my opinion don't truly know modern men they know the caricature they know the character of men I'm like well I mean the icon kind of men. Now, what you need to do is understand, if you actually understood that they're

got wants, needs, and desires to, it will be a lot easier for you to let your guard down and let yourself risk being in a relationship, because it's always a risk. I saw a video of you discussing this sort of Instagram live that Tommy Loren did, and for those who don't know, Tommy Loren kind of a conservative commentator and whatnot, and I had heard about the video because I was vaguely aware of it when it went viral. In the early days, basically a bunch of people dunking on her and try to act like what she was saying was crazy. I actually watched the video in the context of you sort of reviewing it. And I mean, what she was saying was unbelievably commonplace, obvious shit. She was basically saying, if you're a guy and

you want to be with me or any of my friends who apparently also have good things going on for them who are accomplishing something, don't do this, this and this because these are things that are going to make me not take you seriously. And as a person who's now in a relationship, I'm listening to or talk, I'm like, of course, if I was a guy and I wanted to win over this girl, you're going to not want to do anything disrespectful to her. You're not going to not make it obvious that you're just trying to hang out with her at 2 o'clock in the morning because you just got home from the bar, et cetera.

And somehow, sorry, I thought you're going for that. Somehow, this is considered controversial. And I'm watching you sort of like explaining that essentially this is pretty standard, good advice if you want to be successful in your love life. Yeah, and see, we have made this so damn complicated. And somehow this is political

as well. It's complicated. I mean, we've over complicated it. And see, one of the beauties of my show is, I acknowledge men are visual and women want, I'm all about hypergamy. I don't, yes, you want the high value man. You want a man who can protect provide, whatever that comes in. That's what

you want. That's nature. I accept that. And men are individual. We have over freaking complicated. So I go back to something I said a little while ago by my Facebook group. You know what's unique about that? I just picked from men

I just asked some basic questions. How old are you? Your marital status? Do you want to be married? Do you have any kids? And then I just went and verified, you know, where you work. I don't care where you work, but just that's it.

And from women, I pick women who are feminine. beautiful and reasonable. That's it. I'm not a matchmaker. I'm not a love demigod. But I truly believe in human nature because image is human nature. I took men

and women who were like-minded and I did something novel. I put them in the room together. And I said, here's what we're going to do. All the stuff that's outside, we're not going to bring any the salacious, you know, stuff that is going to be openly controversial. We're not going to

talk about that. This is a group for men. We're getting here, network together. You know, talk about business, da-da-da-da-da-da. And women are our welcome guests. Guess what? Women get a chance to sit back and see me, you and us to work together. Talk, communicate. They come in and ask questions. I was like, you've got to be able to be willing to answer

questions because this is a different kind of woman. She's already admitted. She's feminine. This, and she wants to be cooperative and work with a man. Guess what? Couples are getting together left and right in there. I'm like, you let people, you leave people alone and we will sort ourselves out. It's called a sortative mating. Just let people be, but we've tried to engineer

relationships based upon these false standards or standards, I want to say, things that create a narrative that ultimately doesn't make either sign very happy. And you leave people alone. What's funny is, what's really funny is when a woman says, you know what, I never would normally consider the guy like this, but he had already passed this basic litmus test. And I got a chance to see how he moved.

And I like that. It's the opposite of Tinder. Like, when I was on Tinder back in the day, I remember really feeling like this doesn't make sense to me because I'm, you know, I'm a guy who goes to the bar and tries to meet girls. I'm a guy who goes to the club and tries to meet girls. Someone I'm sitting here looking at this app. It's got like potentially infinite women. And it makes me feel miserable swiping through looking at them one by one because of the overt. choice embedded in it.

And what you're talking about is like, let's put a couple dozen people or whatever in this group and actually see what happens if they try to take each other seriously. And you're picking on straight appearance. That's seven seconds. That's a very small time frame.

And I've actually helped guys write profiles. And honestly, I'm on these apps because I like to know what's going on. Tinder, which was one before tender. Bumble? Bumble's a big one that's, or it used to be. But Bumble has changed. They've taken away the weight

and things. They don't want, they want body positivity years of this week. But I said, okay, okay, you want that, but are you going to take the height and income thing away from men? Of course, you know, that didn't work. But I look, you know, Match.com, plenty of fish, and I'm like, I witnessed

these things. I've dated on these things before and it reduces people down to swipe, left, swipe, right. But then what's the success out of this? The success comes from just asking some baseline questions. You know what the Sadie Hawkins dance is? Oh, yes. Yeah, that's what the girls ask the guys.

We miss that these days. And basically, that's why I did with Match doc. That's what I did on Facebook. I said, these guys are provider males. And you are women who want men, Sadie Hawkins. And I look up and somebody's like, oh, I'm inside the first week, I'm in Boston, she's Atlanta. I flew up there.

I'm finding out there in a relationship 30 days later. I'm finding out, you know, I was going to go move out of here and I'm going to go to the DR. I joined your group just because I said I would. Now I found my wife, my fiance, who's now my wife. I'm like, well, and the thing is, how can the guy who's an image consultant who's now become a relationship guru of sorts? How can I do that?

And all you folks who are in this business? that's really where I'm at now. Where are your matchmakers? Where are your results? Where are these people? Because as an image consultant, I want you to come in, I want to get you square,

and not want you to go out and win. I don't want to keep you on the payroll for a lifetime. I'm a failure if this is. If you need me to dress you for every that-gum thing, different at a higher level. But you know, and see what I'm saying. You're supposed to get people to where they can move on

and do something else. But we have a relationship industrial complex, as a word, that keeps people single, miserable, taking Prozac Zoloff, drinking wine, and watching Netflix and chill movies. That doesn't benefit the end user, does it? And you mentioned Japan earlier,

and I remember one thing that I saw when I went to Japan was the realization, you know, the guy who's showing us around, says, this is a building where you can go in and you can hire a woman to cuddle with you. Yes. It's not a prostitute. You don't have sex with her,

but you lay there and you hold her and you're staring into her eyes. So they've actually managed to commercialize every part of the relationship so that if you're looking for an intimate connection, here's a 20 bucks an hour. You get to stare into our eyes. Oh, there's another side of that. Don't think that's the worst. There's something called Rent Agent here in this country.

Rent Agent. You need somebody to install a Sydney fan. We've got Brad. Brad's an Ivy League educated rugby player with green eyes and a jawline, and he'll come install that for you. Rent a gent. Wow. You can take them out on a table.

Yes, we've commoditized relationships. So this cuddle thing, it was, and what, you mentioned intel's, that whole, the sex robot, right. The, the, the, the, the, the, um, that thing, the production of that is stepped up. Right. Because guys are like, between VR technology and sex bots,

women are going to be obsolete, I'm like, no, they're not. Because at the end of the day, whether you're renting a gent as a woman, they don't want to do that. And whether you're paying somebody to hug or stare in their eyes, you're paying for the BFE or the GFE, the boyfriend or girlfriend experience.

People just want to get that without paying for it because it's not as fulfilling because it's not real. But the fact of we have lost the ability to do things real because we've told everybody you can have everything. If people were just more

humble and more realistic, you're likely to be able to find somebody with somebody just as jacked up as you. Definitely. It feels like there may be, at some point in the future, an oncoming expose or analysis of Kevin Samuels. And I say this in the sense that I tweeted out at one point. I can't wait until the mainstream media finds out about Kevin Samuels.

And I had at least one feminist journalist like that. tweet that made me like, oh, no, he's already on the radar. They're already thinking of how they're going to take them down. Well, and that's why I said, you know what, I never purport to be perfect. I'm jacked up like anybody else. But this stopped being about, that viral, that video went viral about the average at best. I said that stopped being about me at about 180,000 views. It's got millions. And that's typical. They would want to come at me. Why? Because I'm wrong. Why?

Because it's not producing results. No, because it's uncomfortable. But when you start having more people, more women are coming out and say, you know why? I used to watch your videos. I didn't like it. Or I didn't like your tone.

I didn't like this. But when I started listening more. And I mentioned this last night on one in my show. Ladies, they're coming after you now. Now it's going from, we can't really deal with him. Now they're going to say, well, these women over there, they're the ones that are a problem. but like the people who are saying that

do they have your best interest at heart? Are they trying to give you a better outcome or they're just telling you, go back to sleep. Go back to sleep, but don't look over there. There's nothing over here. Just do your thing? I'm like, rarely do you find anybody who's trying to say, give you a different alternative? And you mentioned journalists,

well, I go back to Sue Ellen Browder of causal politics. Journalists is what started this in the first damn place. Reits a verdict. When she talks about the we openly sold delaying marriage consequentless sex and reproductive choice

and telling them that these women weren't in New York City or L.A. said put them in Middle America around the world and call her Erica and take city landmarks and put things in there to make it seem real and lie about it if you have to.

So if the journalists want to come at me, what they're going to have to do is go look at their own damn profession and realize that You guys are the reason this is propagated the way it is. Journal, media, sex in the city, right? The woman who actually lived this sex in the city lifestyle said, I was actually like Sarah Jessica Parker's character, Carrie. I was miserable.

I put all that up and I went and became more like my mother and my grandmother. Now I'm happy. So, yeah, it's going to come, but why? The bigger a magnifying glass they put on you, the bigger, the more it's just going to call attention to the fact that there are a lot of people who are very willingly having those conversations with you on camera and clearly there's something missing. There's a hole that is not being serviced that you are helping to fill at this point and it's clearly there's a need for it. Well, and see, the thing is realistically, women have been able to have this conversation

forever. Right. It's just when a man is having this conversation and he's unashamed about it, It's almost like, who do you think you are? I'm like, well, so you can have a standard. But if a man has a standard, he's being misogynist. You can have a preference, but if a man is having a preference, he's an is to some sort. I'm like, you can bully a full human and have full human expression as a woman. But if I just happen to say what I like as a man, for myself, I'm subhuman.

So I welcome it. But you better be able to make sure that you, you got a better alternative because if what I'm saying or what these people are agreeing to isn't right, what do you got to offer? Or is it just turn it off or is it more, what it really more likely is, don't watch that, watch this.

Because rarely does that come from somebody who's actually got better numbers of doing better and more traffic. Definitely. At the end of the day, journalists are pissed off because they can't control the narrative and because there's other stuff out there that's more potent than what they're selling.

Oh, well, you know, that's the thing. what is this, the whole thing they're trying to break up Facebook and Google and because you've seen so many people in mainstream media who are upset because you're doing the kind of numbers you're doing. Trust me. I looked at my numbers

and I've had many conversations. I'm like, you know, you do a video and your numbers are unreal. You're a two and a half hour video and you're getting 100,000 views in 12 hours and you're getting this kind of watch time. That's attention. That's convertible. And right now, it's just straight,

conversations this and that. They want that kind of attention, but here's the thing. Whether you like Trump or dislike Trump is irrelevant. Trump understood one thing. He understood how to talk to people who felt disaffected. If you can't get people to hear you, it's not because we're wrong. Why are they listening to us if you were right? We should have to fight you for the audience instead of them coming to us.

So don't make us the enemy because you can't do your job better. That's very true. My last question, where does Kevin Sammo's take it from here? A lot of people could imagine you or the TV show, could imagine you doing whatever, but then again, the power of social media is crazy. How do you view the next couple of years of your life? My goal now is to use my platform to help people get what they want. I have this thing called the prize and the catch.

So it's almost like the bachelor and the bachelorette. From regular, normal, everyday people. you know, you're single professional woman and use my platform and say, here's Brenda. She's a 27-year-old accountant from Minneapolis and interview her and give her a spotlight for that two-week period and then do the same thing for a guy. And then I'm also profiling one healthy, excuse me, one married couple a month, one normal, this is what it's, this is Rob and Heather, they're married and they

aren't, you know, taking it and showing what productive stuff looks like. Using your platform to help people get what they want, I'll get what I want. Gary V. Gary Vaynerchuk, shout to Gary V. Jab, Jab, Jab, right hook.

Give, give, give, give, then ask. Always deliver. Always deliver value. Anybody that knows me, I work like a madman, and I'm always trying to help somebody get what they want. I'll get what I want by and by. Ultimately, I would like to connect people. You know, if I'm in front of the camera on a TV show or something like that, that's great. That has a life, that has a time frame.

But at the end of the day, Clarence Ava, a black godfather, I'd rather be behind the scenes connecting people. Because I truly believe life is about people. And if you help people get what they want, they will help you get what you want. And more importantly, they'll protect you. They'll protect you when people come for you. because of like, well, wait a minute. You know, they'll least give you benefited

a doubt if they feel like you're doing something. If you keep it all about you and it's my money, my goal, my this, my this, my that. My might like's that guy. Definitely. Yeah, I mean, I see you as someone, I'm always telling, like, YouTube creators or people who want to start something.

I'm always saying, just you need to be able to be an expert in what's going on and then find the holes. Figure out what is missing that needs to be filled. And what's pretty amazing about your content so far is that you didn't just find something that's necessary on YouTube. You found something that's missing in a lot of people's heads, like some percentage of their brain that needs to be filled in

with some information about how to be happy in life. So I'm very much in awe of what you've created and really looking forward to see where it goes down the line. I am too. You know, it's pretty amazing. There's riches and niches, but there's always going to be something in helping people get better outcomes.

And then, you know, as an only child, you know, I used to want brothers and sisters to play with. They never had that. I didn't. I'm very much driven on, I want to leave behind something, a legacy. And if somebody can say, you know what, I'm better off for listening to that video or knowing this or knowing that. I think that's a life well lived. I got one more, too.

For sure. I recently found out you had Stade Street cancer, right? Yeah. Yeah. That made me look at things even more. I'm like, man, maybe he to the point now, like, I don't care about it. He's a nobody. I'm going to tell her how it is.

Well, when I was 21 years old, I was diagnosed with stage three, Hodgkins lymphoma. And while everybody else was about to go graduate from college and go off into live life, I'm looking at my own mortality. So I've always, you know, even though that's one of the highest cure rates, I've always known that we're all on borrowed time. All on borrowed time. So I'm like, you know, yeah, through hook or crook, I want to be. the best of what I do to try to get the most out of this life that we have because it's not

promised to us. So it's not to do it to make it rich or whatever. It's really because I want to have a life that was being worth lived. That's actually a really good question and an interesting answer just because that kind of is the thing that you wish that you could give a lot of young people is like, how do I convince you, even though you're 21 and you're just having a good time? How do I convince you to take your life a little bit more serious when I see the potential? And it's interesting that it took something as extreme as that to make you see how serious your life was, even as a young guy. And that whole thing, what did it wasn't average. What really made it stick was dying alone.

And that came from Kodokoshi because you've been there. You've heard them talk about it. And many women have said, I never looked at it that way. But this is where my aunt or so-and-so is. If I don't change this, I'm not going to have anybody around me. And that means when I leave, I will leave by myself. And that may scare some people, but if that's what it took to get you to do something different, then you need to be scared a little bit.

Definitely. So there we go. Well said. Kevin Samuels. We shall see what happens with this one. I feel like this episode, I feel like we just changed them alive. There's definitely people watching this that are going to live their life differently after watching that, and that is a very good feeling.

Yeah, and, like I said, the journalist, the next one, here's the thing. I've always said this isn't about me. And when you make it bigger than you and you're really trying to help other folks, man, it's always going to work out. Everyone has dirt, everybody has problems. But when you're seeing people saying,

when I look up and I see a woman said, I called into your show, and you gave me some advice that I didn't want to hear, but it started, it germinated the seed. And I acted on your advice and now I'm engaged.

I'm like, huh? She sends me a tape of her fiance proposing to her in Aruba. And I remember that phone call I had. She's like, that was the genesis of all this. That's big, man. Because a family

is going to be formed from there that wouldn't have been formed or when I have a woman call in and say my husband wanted me to watch this and I did not like it but now my current generations and my future generations owe our thanks to you that's one a few times I've ever been speech so I'm like whoa like I can really change shit

I mean the thing is just that's that middle of America anybody can make a change if you're willing to just say something that can help somebody get what they want. Guys, it's been great. I think this is dope. Amazing, man. Kevin Samuels.

I think it was dope, man. Huge fan, and we've definitely made an impact on both of us, for sure. Okay. Kevin Samuels, No Jumper. Coolest podcast in the world. Check us on YouTube, SoundCloud, iTunes. You guys aren't idiots. You can find them on the internet all over YouTube.

Nojumper.com if you want to support. And thank you so much for your time, man. I mean a lot. Appreciate it. Now watch his channel, man. Watch his channel. Get some bars. Appreciate everybody out there.

Bars. Much love. Bars.