No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - 931: Luke Donald on 2023 Ryder Cup documentary "Una Famiglia"

Episode Date: December 4, 2024

Luke Donald joins DJ and Tron for a thorough debrief on the 2023 Ryder Cup and his captaincy for the victorious European team which has been profiled in a documentary "Una Famiglia" that premiered today. If you enjoyed this episode, consider joining The Nest: No Laying Up’s community of avid golfers. Nest members help us maintain our light commercial interruptions (3 minutes of ads per 90 minutes of content) and receive access to exclusive content, discounts in the pro shop, and an annual member gift. It’s a $90 annual membership, and you can sign up or learn more at nolayingup.com/join Support Our Partners: Titleist Rhoback Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Be the right club. Be the right club today. That's better than most. How about the end? That is better than most. Better than most! Expect anything different. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the Knowling Up podcast. My name is DJ. I have got my guy TC with me here to talk some European Ryder Cup. We had to twist his arm to get him to talk European Ryder Cup, but I think he's going to do it for us. Tron, greetings on a Saturday morning. We're recording this. How are you?

I'm great, Didge. It's always a good day when we're talking European Ryder Cup. You can twist my arm to chat a little bit about that, a little bit about this film that the European Tour came out with. Didge Yeah, we're going to be talking today. We were very graciously offered an hour with Luke Donald to pick his brain about the Ryder Cup and also the film that the DP World Tour, European Tour Productions, Ryder Cup Europe just put out called Una Familia, which is airing, I believe today, if this is going out on December 3rd, it's airing on December 3rd on a couple different places. Definitely the Ryder Cup YouTube channel. I think eventually it'll make its way to Golf Channel, Peacock, things of that nature. It should be easy to find,

but Ryder Cup YouTube channel for sure will have it. TC, before we get into our interview with Luke Donald, what were your takeaways from this film? And I guess to set it up for people who haven't seen it, it's a capital F film. I mean, it's an hour and a half. It is cinematic as hell. It looks awesome. Great access to the captains, the players, the X's and O's of the 2023 Ryder Cup in Europe. It's really, really cool, man. I would describe it as, you know, it kind of feels like an episode of full swing. That's even a little more golfy and a little more substantive. Yeah. It's, you know, not to take a shot at full swing, but it's just, it's that same level of access with a lot more of the stuff that I love to watch, which is the X's and O's golf stuff.

I really enjoyed it. What was your takeaway? Yeah. I felt like it was a lot more for us than it was for a casual fan or a new fan. It felt like a lot of this stuff I've seen before, but it's interspersed with just enough behind the scenes stuff that's really captivating that even the stuff you've seen before, seeing it all in one place, you really get a better sense of the week and the way that they jump back between Rome and scouting trips to Bethpage or like Nico Kohlstraat seeing him pumping up the crowd, Eduardo doing his thing or guys in the caddy room. That

was a great, awesome, awesome little scene there. So I think pacing was great. Like you said, it's definitely a capital F film. And I think it shows you just enough to where, you know, I kind of view the European team as like an iceberg of you see, you're like, Oh my gosh, that's super impressive. And then you realize like, there's so much stuff behind this that they're also doing and not letting us in on, but the fact that they've let us in on this much and they feel comfortable doing that, it's truly like, man, this stuff's pretty simple in certain ways, but it's not easy. And, yeah.

And we'll get into this a little bit with Luke, but one of my biggest takeaways from this is, for all the people who are like, man, the model's there. Why don't the Americans just follow it? My biggest takeaway is there's no fucking chance the Americans, this is not a know, for all the people who are like, man, the model's there. Why don't the Americans just follow it? Like my biggest takeaway is like, there's no fucking chance. The Americans like, this is not a one size fits all thing. This is something that's been building for 30 years. You really see how, you know, there's this reverence for the Ryder Cup gets passed between generations. Like literally here's how it happens. And here's what makes these guys cry. And here's the young players seeing them cry and all of that stuff. You can, you can just, they do a great job of capturing that in a way that I've never really seen before. I was talking to Sally about this. What's really tough as someone who, who, you

know, roots for the Americans is to watch this 90 minute film and then turn around and be like, all right, let me check in on what's going on with TBUSA. Oh, they debated to get paid after this ass beating. Like awesome, man. Like, yeah, I don't think we're particularly close, but I guess we'll see what happens with, with Keegan. Yeah. It's, uh, I mean, did you want to make an announcement of any sort? You know what? I just, I don't know that I can't over to death row. Big boy. I think I'm just gonna, I'm going to be a registered independent for a while because I don't think I could watch this and like just have any kind of full throated support for you. You

said it, you know, we were talking about a little bit before we recorded with Luke and it's just, they don't do this on purpose and I, I, our friends at the European tour, it's not, it's not never would never have like a malicious edit. But as like us with all this loaded context, it's just some of the cuts in here are like just so painful right? And they just, at the perfect time, they're cutting to the shirtless American fans who are chugging beers. And I'm just like, ah, man. Or they're cutting to Zach Johnson just looking completely overmatched and befuddled as Luke

Donald looks like he should be running the World Health Organization or something. He just looks like the most competent professional person in the history of the world. It's just, uh, I'm not sure how confident the world health organization, maybe a bad example. I'm just saying it put them in charge of anywhere. I was going to say run for president, but I don't think he's one of the more competent international organizations. I can't really think of one right now, but he would be in charge of that. But yeah, I think that, yeah, every cut to Zach was just like, oh, I was just like cackling. You know?

But like every time they show Luke just, you know, the upcloses of when he's speaking at any point publicly, you know, someone like me, I'm not a good public speaker. And I'm like, man, you're both a natural at this. And you can also tell that how meticulous and prepared he is. He's practiced that speech 150 times. And, you know, and, and, and seeing with him, it's like, that's how it's, it's all these little things that add up to a larger reality, right? Of, Hey, the team sees how, how much clarity and power I'm speaking with that translates to them. They're watching what I'm doing in all of these little instances. And that just permeates through. And you see it with Luke's wife, Diane, on it. You see

it with, I thought it was really interesting as far as his personal game and struggling, you know, struggling a little bit professionally there and being able to almost pour some of that frustration into his captaincy. Right? Totally. Yeah. I mean, I think all professional golfers or most professional golfers go through this, this weird kind of in between, you know, this weird in between phase when it's like, man, I'm just not as sharp as I used to be on the golf course. I'm not quite, but I'm still pretty good. And I don't want to

hang it up because I think if I could just get the irons a little dialed or the driver fixed or if I can make more pots, you know, it's just, it's really hard to let go, I would imagine to something that you have poured your entire life into. And so they go into that a little bit with Luke where he's, you know, he's trying to squeeze a little bit more juice out of the orange and just like, give me a couple more years of playing high level competitive golf. I think I can do it. And I think he starts to realize, you know, the, well, I guess actually even backing up, like he had put his hat in the ring, like very enthusiastically when they ended up giving the job to Henrik Stenson originally. Right.

So it's not like this was part of the roadmap for the last 10 years. Like congratulations, Luke, get ready for 2023. You know, he almost kind of had the rug pulled out from, from under him a little bit, you know, just like he didn't end up getting the job. So then it falls back to, okay, well, I guess I'll keep trying to squeeze a little bit more out of my playing career and that'll be my purpose. And it kind of seems like he's beaten his keep trying to squeeze a little bit more out of my playing career and that'll be my purpose. And it kind of seems like he's beating his head against the wall a little bit

until all things click and he gets this rider cup role and you'd see in the film, like it's kind of what the whole thing is about is him pouring everything he has into this and this becoming his purpose inside of the game of golf. And it just, I don't know, maybe it listened, maybe Zach Johnson had a little bit of that going on too, but from the outside looking in it, it doesn't, it seems to be apples, apples and oranges. Yeah. Yeah. Just anytime Zach popped up on the screen, I was like, oh yeah, he's the exact counterpoint to whatever whoever just said a couple other things. I was, I was

cracking up about the, the, uh, the number of New York Yankees hats, uh hats on the steps, like when they're at the Spanish steps in Rome. That was very, very funny, which, you know, just some prep there for that page. Exactly. And just not a lot of cell phones out there. When they show the European team in hanging out together on their scouting trip or after hours just in the team room, everybody's mentally present in there and just soaking up the week. And I feel like every time we've seen something from the US team and it's just more like they're hanging out and enjoying each other's company, but it seems like they're on their cell phones

or they're there and it's just like, all right, this experience, this is the reward for all the other, all the pro golf that you play and all the travel and all that. This week, this adds up to this magical experience that you can't put a price on. And meanwhile, it's like, you got the US team kind of complaining about, oh my God, we got to do three gallows or we got to do this or that after hours. And it's just like, you're just approaching it very differently. And what I, you can't take anything away from the US side is like the last couple of times it's been at home, they have absolutely kicked the shit out of the European team. Like I

don't think they have a hard time, you know time playing as the sum of their parts. And the sum of their parts is very often better than the European team. I think what this points out very, very clearly is like this Italian team was like so much better than the sum of its parts. And here are a couple of the reasons why. And that's where it's like, man, if you're going to win on the road, it is not this exact blueprint, but it's, it's treating it a lot differently than we are currently is how it feels to me. Yeah. And I think that too, it's like some of that too is like, you know, they can, like, I don't think that stuff even necessarily has to be a negative though. Like it's just

cultural. They approach golf a different way. Whereas the European tour granted a lot of the guys that are on the European team play, the US tour. But thinking about the scouting trip and vulnerability and all of that stuff, it's from a leadership perspective, there's some things going on there that it seems like, hey, stripping out that hierarchy. And that was a big thing I took away from it was the vulnerability and stripping out the hierarchy and hey, we're all on equal footing here, regardless of whether you're a first time rookie in a one and done or seven or eight time leader. Right? I think another thing we talked, we talked to Luke about this a little bit, but there's

a quote in the film about from Tommy Fleetwood about how, you know, each team needs to have a story and it doesn't matter what the story is. You just have to believe in it. All, you know, all 12 guys have to believe in that story. And just to bring, we're going to talk plenty about your beloved Europeans with Luke. Don't worry about it. But on the American side, like what is, what is that story to them? Because right now personally, I'm like, okay, you don't have anything.

I truly don't know what it is other than don't lose. And to me, I'm like, if I'm looking at this European team, I'm like, man, their story has been building for 30 years, 40 years, like whatever, you can't copy that. Don't try to because Stuart Sink and Fred Couples and Jim Furyk and these guys are great guys but they're not the same Ryder Cup Lions as, you know, Seve and Sergio and all these guys that have been built around, you know, that the European team has been built around. So to me, I'm like, if I'm Keegan Bradley, I'm watching this documentary and I'm thinking, okay, what's our story? And to me, I'm like, man, the story is like, you guys get to write

chapter one of a brand new way of doing things. And like Brooks Kapka, Scotty Sheffler, Max Homa, you guys become the dudes that you guys become the Seve, Oli, those guys that the Europeans have, because right now we do not have those dudes. And it doesn't seem like we're very interested in creating those guys. I'm curious if you agree with that or if you have a different story in mind. No, I definitely agree. And I think the generation know, the, the generation of captains that's gone the last five, six, seven times is like almost seeded that a little bit of like, Hey, that, you know, they haven't been able to come up with anything cogent or, you know, and it's kind of like, Hey,

you got to find something new. You got to chart a new course and you got to start from scratch kind of thing. It's really interesting with the Europeans where you would think that it would be tough to get a bunch of guys from like, you know, like, like Rom says it in there, the two Stoics sitting next to them. Boygarden and Luddy. Boygarden and Luddy. And it's like, you know, they're very, very, they're far more different. You know, the two, you know, a Swede and a Dane are very different from a Spaniard or from an Italian, right? Or Englishmen different from an eco-colsart. It's like all that stuff, but it's very much just, you would

think that that would be from languages, from country cultures and all of that, it would be tougher to cobble together an identity and a team. And it's really interesting that they've been able to do that. Whereas the US, everybody speaks the same language natively, everybody's coming from the same country, all of that. And it's such an interesting dichotomy between those two things because you would think the opposite would be true. Well, in a way it's almost like, and I promise we're going to get to this interview very shortly here, but in a way it's almost like easier to point out the things that unify you when everybody's very different. You know what I mean? Where it can almost be like imperceptible when everybody

feels much more similar. Like they talk in the film a lot about, you know, we all came from, we realized like we all came from sort of similar backgrounds and what unifies us is like, okay, we all play for our families. And that's almost easier to see if people are wildly different. Does that make sense? Absolutely. Yeah, it does. It's kind of honing in on what the similarities are, like you said.

I mean, just going back to Luke too, I feel like you're looking at someone who would be a very good CEO or, you know, listens to people, delegates well. I was blown away because I've always really respected his career of being able to, he talks about it a little bit in the interview of being able to accomplish being the number one player in the world in an era that every trend, every trend line out there was going against his game a little bit. And I think that's one of the more underrated things in golf in the last 25 years is him achieving that.

But just seeing the clarity and the focus and the organization with which he speaks and approaches things, it's just like, man, that's, God, I'd love to see someone like that take on more of a leadership position in the game at large. Cause this whole thing felt, it felt like a really, really nice palate cleanser to everything that ails the game right now and everything we complain about on this, on this here podcast very often. Yeah, indeed.

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dialed over at Titleist.com. Well, without further ado, let's hear from the man himself. Here is our interview with Luke Donald. Luke, your choice here. Would you like to do this interview in your native Italian or should we do it in English? What would you prefer? I'm working on my New York accent right now. So yeah, no, no, we can do English. Thanks for having me on boys. Yeah. Good to speak with you.

Have you kept up with the Duolingo? That was kind of one of the, one of the things I forgot about watching this film back. I know that was a big talking point. Yeah, that was so 2023. No Duolingo, but working on a few other things. Awesome. Well, we're going to talk through the film that DP World Tour put out, European Tour Productions, Una Familia, which chronicles the 2023 Ryder Cup in Rome.

I guess I'll just start here. I can't imagine because I just watched the film, but there's so much work that must have gone into the last now two years. What's it like to kind of see that given this proper film treatment? I mean, it feels like a movie. It is, it's really cool to watch. It is cool.

It's, it's a little, you know, I'm so, I feel like I'm somewhat humble and it's a little bit of a love fest towards me. And I guess you have to have a theme and a, you know, to these things. And you know, it's a little slightly embarrassing watching it because it is very much said, Oh, you know, you know, everything was because of me. And then it certainly wasn't like, I was just smart enough to talk to some smarter people than me but you know I really appreciate what they've done I think people love to see that

sort of inside sort of behind the scenes sort of stuff and it gives you a really good kind of feeling of how we kind of create some cohesion amongst the team how we got the guys in sort of a right frame of mind, the right kind of create the right culture for them to sort of thrive and do what they do. They're 12 really good individual players. And, but, you know, we sort of, as European Ryder Cup, as we sort of lean into that, you know,

playing for more than yourself, you know, putting the team above all interests. And so hopefully some of that comes across in the film and yeah, hopefully everyone enjoys it. It's definitely a love fest of you, but I think that very quickly disseminates to the rest of your co-captains and your wife and the caddies and all of that.

Can you talk a little bit about just each co-captain and one thing that people may not know that they bring to the table or a funny anecdote from each of them from the work? Yeah, it was really important to have some past experience with that team. Obviously, I was a first-time captain, kind of thrust into the job in unusual circumstances, less time to sort of deal with it. And have Thomas was really important, you know, having him just some of his knowledge and how things worked. And it was quite fresh in his mind being the captain not too long ago. And that was really important. You know, Eduardo is, you know, he's our stats guru

and looks at things in different ways. We all know how important analytics are now in the game of golf and everything that goes along with it. Who else? Nicholas. Nicholas Kolesats. I think he was someone that I just knew loves the Ryder Cup. He's just so passionate.

He only got to play in one in 2012, but it was the best experience of his life. It literally was, you know, he had that one amazing day where he reeled off like eight, nine birdies or something against Tiger, I think it was, and just an amazing person who had so much passion for what the Ryder Cup represents. He was in whistling Straits, I think, around the last Ryder Cup, and he called me up and says, do you have any contacts at Medina? I wanna go see it.

He literally just wanted to go back there, walk around the golf course, and kind of take in some of the stuff that he'd gone through in 2012. And that sort of, that speaks to what it means to him to be a part of a Ryder Cup You had Francesco. I think the Italian connection, you know, he's certainly a possible future Ryder Cup captain Major winner, you know had some amazing experiences playing three Ryder Cups as well I think that was that was important and I loved the connection with the two brothers Italy being in Rome all that that kind of made sense in my mind and then That was important. And I loved the connection with the two brothers,

Italy being in Rome, all that kind of made sense in my mind. And then we brought in Jose Maria. I mean, you talk about Nicholas Kolesar, some passion, this is on a different level. What the Ryder Cup means to him, some of the things we experienced during that week, the tears that he shed.

You just get a real sense of how big it means. You won a couple of masters, but being in Ryder Cup team rooms and teams meant more to him. Those experiences far outweighed some of his individual accomplishments, and you really get that feeling, and you get that connection with Seve,

which he's a really important part of our storytelling in Riley Cubs. I think what's really interesting is as an American fan and watching these very much from the outside looking in some of the, you know, the win it for Seve stuff can kind of be like, all right, yeah, I get it, man. And then this film, I think the highest compliment I can give it is like, oh, okay, like this actually makes sense.

Well, how this stuff gets passed down from one generation to the next. And there's this scene with Ludwig talking about sitting next to Rom and Fleetwood when you're rolling out these videos from their families and you know, these two superstars are just crying their eyes out and him kind of realizing like, Oh God, okay, this, this is a huge deal, you know, and Rory very publicly had the same, you know, went through the same thing with GMAC and Sergio and all of that. So did that come through to you in the film? And I guess what was your experience kind of, did you have a transformational moment like that as well where you're kind of like, all right, this is an exhibition and then, oh wait, no, it's not.

Well, my first Ryder Cup, I was sitting right next to Darren Clark in the opening ceremony and he just sort of tapped me on the shoulder and he goes, once you play in one Ryder Cup, you'll never want to miss another. And I certainly, I realized that pretty quickly. You know, and everyone as a rookie talks to you about that first tee. And in 2004, the first tee was like a normal event. I mean, it wasn't that big. And still, walking towards the tee, I really wasn't that nervous. I felt fine.

But everyone in the background had started talking to you, oh, just be ready for the first tee, be ready for the first tee. And as soon as they announced my name, the pressure of playing for your teammates and not wanting to let them down, it's a different pressure. I hit the worst tee shot I've ever hit in my life.

I literally forgot to close the clubface, hit it 50 yards right. But yeah, I think once you go through a Ryder Cup and you're around some of these people who've been in many Ryder Cups and understand sort of the passion and the energy, it's just a different experience, a different week. It just seems to mean so much more because of what it represents. I think that's quite motivating. And we do. We lean into history a lot.

We talk about, you know, I was inspired by Sevys and Foudos and Wusnams and Bernard Langez and Jose Marias. Those are the guys that inspired me to want to play Ryder Cups because of what they did in Ryder Cups. So, we try and lean on that a lot. It comes across a little bit in the film, it was familiar. It was pretty powerful. Jose Maria, just him sitting in, if that's his home or whatever, he looks like he's got a great setup with the wood vaulted beam on the ceiling. I was like, man, I want to go have a bottle of wine with him there. But him talking about just not having been

involved in the Ryder Cup the last nine years. What did he come back with from nine years away to really impart upon you? Well, again, I knew what he was going to bring. He's going to bring so much energy and passion. We have little team meetings at the end of the, every evening, mostly just to talk about the next day. Like we're leaving at this time. Some of it's to talk about what happened

during the day as well. But when he talks, it's just like a silence in the room. Like everyone respects him so much for what he did in Ryder Cups. But he just kind of gets it. He kind of gets the magnitude of the importance of the Ryder Cup. I think he was an important influence for John. We sort of gave him the responsibility to look after John. I think that was really important for him. You know, again, we give certain vice captains to certain players, and just to create a continuity

and a comfortableness amongst them. But his main role was John, and to kind of look after John, but also, you know, even just on the radios, you know, during the matches, you know, you can tell how into it was, how passionate it was. And he absolutely loved it. So yeah, he was a big influence too, just in the team room, just sitting at dinners and talking to other players,

sharing stories. That's the stuff that, little things that we never heard of that he would have talked about. His first matches playing with Seve. Those things are just cool. I mean, they're just cool for a golf nerd. And you know, I think he brought so much. I think what's interesting is, so we had Eduardo on our podcast a couple of weeks after the

Ryder Cup and he's kind of laying out a lot of the math and here's exactly why we did what we did. Having this film out there, here's an hour and a half on our process. Here's exactly why we do everything that we do. In one side of my brain, I'm like, wow, you're just laying out the blueprint. This is unbelievable. The Americans can just do this. And then the other side of my brain is like, well, no, they can't because I guess actually I'll just pause there. Why can't they? Why is it okay for you guys to lay all this out? Why is it independent to you? Why is it okay for you guys to kind of lay all this out? You know, and why is it independent to you?

Yeah, it's, it comes natural to us. It's hard to replicate something that, uh, maybe you haven't done before and try and copy something I think it's quite as authentic that way. So it's definitely authentic to us and we, we lean into it a lot. And I'm glad you, you feel like we're giving you the blueprint. There is, there is other things. Obviously we don't show the we're giving you the blueprint. There is there is other things obviously we don't show the team that some of the videos feel free. I was just had you talking to Shane, Shane Ryan and he wanted more,

you know, from watching it. You know, but it's glad to know that you you feel like you do get a sense of what we do and how we try and create that cohesion. And I think that's what the public want these days. They want a real behind the scenes kind of, oh, wow, you did this, this and this, and that made a big difference. So, you know, again, I get frustrated sometimes

watching some of these shows, Netflix, other stuff. I watched the starting five with some of the basketball players in the Braun. And it's great. You get to see his home and stuff, but I don't really understand why he's been so good for so many years. He doesn't really tell you the secrets. And hopefully, hopefully you get a little bit of a sense of some of our secrets. And again, the US are happy to replicate it, but it's not easy to do, I don't think. Yeah, simple, the US are happy to replicate it, but it's not easy to do, I don't think.

Yeah, simple, not easy. It seems like too, there's a genuine trust level and comfort level with European Tour Productions and with everybody on that side of the house, as far as, hey, we're gonna let you into the inner sanctum here in certain settings or certain things, but you're going to portray us in the right light. We didn't give them full access, but we gave them a little bit more access than we would have Netflix. The people in Netflix, we're still trying to create that trust, but the people know

the European tour guides pretty well, so they feel a little bit more comfortable. You want it to be authentic. You can't have someone with a camera in your face and then it just changes the way you talk or interact in the team room. So again, it's a balancing act. I think going back to kind of some of the model stuff and whether there's one blueprint to follow or not, I think what's really interesting hearing you talk and watching the film is how, you know, it's not like this reverence for, you know, Darren Clark or Francesco Molinari or any like it does, that doesn't happen overnight. And it doesn't just happen based on what they did on the golf

course. They kind of get lionized over 15, 20 years is what it seems like. And that's where I'm almost like, Oh man, they're like, as far as this model goes, I mean, they're 30 years ahead turning these guys into superstars. And this is no offense to anyone on the US side, but it's like, man, you're just not going to get that from, you know, Stewart Sink and Jim Furyk and these guys who are like, yeah, great, you know, nice player, man, really, really great career. They just haven't been built up in that same way. And so one thing I really loved was Tommy Fleetwood towards the end, I think he said something like, you know, it's, it's important

as a team that you have a story and it almost doesn't matter what the story is, you just have to buy into it as a team. And to me, I'm just like, man, the US story is, I don't know what it is, other than maybe we should get paid. And the other thing is, you know, trying to, to have the same story that you guys have, like just doesn't work. And so I'm curious your reaction to hearing, hearing that quote from him, is that something that came from you? I think it's a great ending to the show, isn't it?

And I think it kind of sums it up right. Yeah. You have to kind of create a theme, a purpose, a storyline, um, that these guys buy into, then they have to do buy into it. They have to understand that winning the Ryder Cup, the team kind of trumps all the self-interest for that week. And so, yeah, I think that's sort of part of the job with the cat in is to try and figure out that story, that pathway to kind of get the players

in the right frame of mind. That's a culture, right? What's the purpose of us being here? What's the storyline? Those are the sort of things I'm trying to think about for New York as well. When you towards the beginning, you said, you know, hey, this is kind of a consolidated timeline here where you came on a little bit late and you said I'm five or six months behind during some of the things. What were the things in that five or six months that you would have been doing? What was the catch up process like where you felt like you were behind the eight ball and you kind of had to get up to

speed? Yeah. I think it was a little bit more rushed than the one in Rome just because of all the circumstances. Again, as a new captain, I didn't really know what to expect, but I felt like there were just certain things like visiting the team rooms and figuring out some of that, some of the themes around the storylines, the videos. It was just, everything was a bit more on top of each other,

whereas this time around, I've had an extra six, seven months to kind of work my way through it. Plus I have experience of going through it once already. So I know what to expect. But yeah, I just, uh, you know, again, the first sort of call was really to talk about the qualification criteria.

That was sort of the first stepping stone for me is to figure out how do we create the best possible strongest team that we can. We did change it from Whistling Straits, you know, Podrake wanted only three picks. This time we went to six picks. Again, Eduardo was a big part of that in terms of the mathematics, in terms of how do you create the strongest team and give yourself flexibility within those picks to create a strongest team that matches the golf course, that matches partnerships, that there's a lot of different variabilities that go into it.

So that was sort of the first one. And instead of having six months to think about it, I had to have a few weeks to really kind of figure it out because we only had 14 months and the qualification criteria is a year long. So yes, things like that, a little bit more rushed and had to kind of get into it quickly. On that same note, what kind of going from a home captain to a visiting captain, you're meticulous and proactive and all of that. How much does that change going to New York

and knowing that you're going to be reacting to certain things, whether it's course setup or there's some surprises thrown in, right? Yeah, you're going to have to be more reactive and it's going to be different strategies for this time around. I think you can never, never want to sit still. You have to keep innovating, keep moving forward. And some of the advantages we had in Rome are now disadvantages with the crowd and core setup and stuff like that. So yeah, less control. But you can still sort of somewhat prepare because you know things are going to happen. You know the crowd is going to be very pro-American. So you can

start to prepare for it. And I think that's definitely a focus of mine is like how can we deal with this going to be a pretty spirited environment and how do we get players that aren't going to react badly in that kind of environment. So yeah, it's time to think about those things. One section I loved, you kind of glanced at it in the film was talking about buying a bunch of books on leadership and trying to kind of unlock that part of your brain. As I was thinking about it, I was like, man, that's got to be a pretty rare thing for a professional golfer to kind of go down, especially kind of late in their career. And especially if I remember right, weren't you like a fine art student or something?

I don't think you were a businessman. Yeah, I got into Northwestern, not really for my academics. especially if I remember right, weren't you like a fine art student or something? I don't think you were a business. Yeah, I got it. I got into Northwestern. Not, not really for my academics. I think the golf really helped. And yeah, I went with a fine art degree in the end. That was something, yeah, a lot of my brothers and sisters were into and a passion of mine. And I was hoping the golf would work out and thankfully it did. But on the leadership front of me, what, what was that journey like for you? Did you enjoy digging

into that stuff? Did you really just kind of hoover up books? What were your favorite takeaways? I did enjoy it. I think you get a sense of understanding that this captaincy was sort of important to me at my time in my career as well, where individually I'd been working quite hard and not seeing the results and that was really demoralizing a little bit. And so I needed a different focus, a different purpose to sort of keep me kind of energized. And this was the Ryder Cup, captaincy.

And part of that was to kind of dive into, yeah, quickly to figure out how I could do a good job. I think I always prided my individual career on breaking the norms, doing some things that I accomplished that a lot of people probably didn't think that I could, getting to world number one in a time when the game was a power play game where driving was the biggest factor for success and hitting it far, figuring out my own ways of trying to get a little bit better. And I just tried to approach it kind of from that way, like how do I give myself and this team

that just come off their worst defeat ever in a Ryder Cup, we'd lost a bunch of players to live that were stalwarts in the Ryder Cup for a long time. And we're going to have this young kind of newish team against what was talked about as a very young, very strong American team that were going to win Ryder Cups forever, for at least the next decade. They were going to be so strong that Europe had no chance. And that was sort of the message that I was hearing. And, you

know, how do you overcome that? And I had to kind of dive pretty, pretty deeply into some books, and talk to people and sort of have the humility that I didn't know everything. I certainly wanted to learn, I wanted to understand what does make good teams, you know. And time and time again, it comes down to sort of playing for more than yourself. It really does. The self-interest kind of goes to one side. Gotta have a message, a theme, a story like Tommy said, and get these players to buy into it

and kind of put their self-interest to one side for that week. And how could we do that? How could we create a team where they trusted me for one, where they understood that I cared about the job that I had, and that I had a good game plan for them? Again, that was sort of my focus. Any specific books or people that really... I won't go into the people because I'm still working with some of them and I don't want

to show everything. But yeah, there's lots. I read ones called Legacy, Unstoppable Teams, Drive, Belonging. I've read one called How Leaders Learn, Pressure. I don't know. lots and lots of little books just to sort of understand. And honestly, all these books sort of always do come back to a lot of that principle.

Yeah, like, you know, great players, you're 12 great individuals don't necessarily make a great team. Well, I think that kind of leads into another one of my favorite scenes where, you know, you guys talked about the scout trip and the kind of campfire night where everybody's kind of letting their guard down. And I wonder if you can kind of paint that scene for the people that weren't there a little bit and, and how some of that vulnerability came about, because I think that's quite hard to achieve. We hadn't really had an organized practice trip in a Ryder Cup. We'd had a couple of times where

some players had gone to the course before, but never really something organized. And that felt like that was something we were lacking in previous Ryder Cups. And it was important for me to do that. Just to see the golf course, some people, we'd had Italian Opens there for a few years leading up to it, but some players hadn't played it before the Ryder Cup. So just to get them to see it was important. Create some kind of fun things. We did that opera singer on the first tee and the Sebi Tifo was unveiled just for those guys,

which was kind of fun just to kind of give them a little sense of what the first tee is going to be like and kind of get the juices flowing, get them thinking ahead a couple of weeks to ride a cup. But yeah, the biggest thing and I was so wary and a little bit nervous about this was this sort of fireside chat. As guys, we keep our feelings in a lot of times. We, we don't let our guards down. That's not, that's not the way for guys, but it was a really simple thing. You know, we just sat around the fire and talked about some really general questions.

And it was amazing. You know, what came about, I was nervous to see how it would go talking about some simple things about what the Ryder Cup meant and some of the stories about how you got into golf. We realized pretty quickly there was a lot of similarities between how we'd grown up. We were very, from different cultures. The similarities that kind of came about was, our families had sacrificed a lot for us

to kind of get into the game. Some people told us that we weren't good enough and that motivated us. Certain things like that, I don't know, it just sort of brought people together. Some people were more open and some people were pretty, you know, not as open and that was fine. But I think some of the rookies and hearing some of what Rory and John and some of these people they looked up to and realizing that, no, we have some similarities amongst us. That was, I think, really important then. It kind of, again, it got rid of some of the hierarchy within the team and made everyone feel like they're kind of on the same level. Well, I think it also helped, again, me as a viewer from a thousand

miles outside, it helped see how some of the stuff sews together too, where you understand, I think Shane maybe says it in the film, that some of those similarities were, we all came from pretty modest families and our families gave up a lot for us and we all realized that our way of paying back our families was through golf and not that one way is right or wrong, but contrast that with some of the players on the American side. It's like, well, that's probably not really the case. A lot of them came from really well off families and have played golf since they were five years old and they've kind of been superstars for as long as they can remember. And that's just a very different, you can't give that same message to them and have them kind of

fight behind that flag. And so then it's like on Monday of the Ryder Cup, when you're paying it off with all the videos from their families, it's like, okay, now we're like one plus one equals six. And so I'm guessing that was kind of the thinking anyways. It was, I think it was good to try and get everyone feeling comfortable around each other. The practice trip was important,

but the next week we played Wentworth, we were all playing that week, we were sort of staying at the same hotel. We did some dinners, you know, and again, usually when you get to the Monday of a Ryder Cup, there's a little bit of awkwardness, you know, it's like, it's like, it's like, trying to find each other out. Yeah, finding each other out, like, who's going to be playing with each other? You know, it's just a little bit of awkwardness. So I felt like we really

had none of that. Like it was just like, we're just week three of being together for three weeks. And, you know, they felt very comfortable around that. I already kind of talked to most of them about the pairings and how it was going to start. And you obviously have to make adjustments as the week goes on. But yeah, it just felt like we're in a good spot. And Monday night, we had a really nice evening with the families, as I said, again, tying it back to how important the families have been and some of the videos we showed them that night. They're not alone, we're in this together, we're a team, and they've got so much support behind them.

So it was very cool. And it was something that I was quite wary of, the fiery fireside chat, how people just standing around could be sitting around there and not saying anything and just been awkward silences and stuff. But it really worked really, really, really well and I'm glad we were able to make that part of the week. Friends, a quick break to hear a word from our friends at Roeback.

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We like the gala dinner. We like the gala dinner. We like the Spanish steps, all of that stuff. Although I'm curious as to how Fitz was an hour late getting through from, but like, you know, how do you regulate energy levels and rest and bandwidth throughout the week, especially getting there Monday, knowing everybody played Wentworth and then knowing that the golf really doesn't start till Friday. How do you, how do you carve out?

It's a very long week and you sort of try and communicate that again, just like, you know, we don't want to overgolf them. We don't want to overdo it. But you also want to buy into the week. You know, you want to create something that is very memorable for them, that they will remember for the rest of their lives. Being in Rome, just this amazing city, my

wife, she's, I mean, my wife loves organizing parties, loves giving gifts. This is her forte and she just crushed it. I mean, and to come up, she came up with the idea, literally a year out saying, why don't we, can we close the Spanish Steps and have them walk down and we'll go to some venue nearby. And they're like, well, this is gonna, the Italian government was like, it's never really, it hasn't been done in 40 years.

And well, it's like, well, you start that, you got a year to figure it out. So she was pretty adamant about it and we did it. And it was just incredible. Like to say that those cultural, amazing cultural thing in the world in Rome had never been shut down for 40 years. And when we got to do it and experience that, like we try and lean into enjoying the week as well.

It is high pressure, it's high anxiety, high pressure, but I think if you can try and enjoy that journey a little bit during the week, then that helps. And I struggled with that as a play. Like these are 12 very individual characters that are in their own way, in their own routines, in their own things that make them great. You can't get away from that too,

but you want to make the week enjoyable and make it different, make it enjoyable that you'll remember it. Win or lose, you create these friendships and these memories that will always stay with you. Well, it seemed like it was truly like, hey, this stuff is for you guys. This is what makes the Ryder Cubs special. Otherwise, it's just another golf tournament. What happened with Fitz? How is he an hour late? Yeah. So we all had police escorts and somehow he lost his and got stuck in Rome traffic.

I mean, it was 5pm on a Wednesday with the high traffic and I don't know, the driver didn't know where to go, where to drop them off and there was a lot of messaging going on and we're literally waiting. I think the Americans probably thought we did it on purpose just to wind them up because they got there first and then they're waiting for us to come and then waiting another hour for Fitzy to arrive before we could do all the team photos and stuff. So it wasn't on purpose, but he finally made it.

And yeah, it was a good story. One of my favorite scenes too is like Ludwig just walking through kind of that gauntlet and everything, giving that face. Whoa, this is a lot. I mean, Ludwig, what a story was that? I mean, he was just literally out of college. And yeah, I mean, yeah, he obviously performed well and has proven that he was good enough to play, what was he, four or five in the world right now? What's he like behind the scenes?

We've gotten to know him a teeny tiny bit, but he's very stoic, he's very dry, but he's also very funny, I think. I'm just curious how he interacts. I haven't quite figured out Ludwig. He's quite quiet. You don't know really what he's thinking. It doesn't look like pressure ever affects him. He looks so cool as a cucumber, doesn't he? I'm wondering if you had some insight. I'm still trying to figure him out a little bit, but I know he's a hell of a golfer. He can drive

the golf ball better than most people. And yeah, I mean, I imagine coming... I couldn't imagine graduating from college and then suddenly being thrust into this situation and to deal with it how he dealt with it. And creating history. Nine and seven win with Victor over the world number one and Brooks. That's pretty cool. On that note with Ludwig, when I guess two part question, A, when Eduardo mentioned to you, hey, there's this,

there's this kid at Texas tech and he's really good. And like, either he might be on the team or I'd love to have him on the team. You know, how did you feel in that moment? And then B, there was, there was a quote in there about just communicating with him saying, Hey, here's the expectation. We want you to go play a little bit on the European tour and then applying pressure as well. And how did you apply that pressure? And I need you to, I need you to know what you're waiting into here because there's a long running

joke here that you're not going to be aware of that we were sitting in an RV at whistling straights as the euros are getting their ass kicked and Tron is sitting there as a European fantasy. Like, I'm not worried. There's this guy at Texas tech Ludwig. He's going to be on the next team. Don't even worry about it. So, so that's, uh, that's the context here for him. He might have been the original. Yeah. Before Eduardo, he saw the, saw the greatness in Ludwig. And I'm sitting here texting with Eduardo as well. Like, Hey, anything I should ask Luke. He's like, Oh, just ask him about when I first told him about. Yeah. I mean, he certainly mentioned he,

he got to play with him in January at the Dubai. Classic. So he got invited there, part of the PGA Tour U, it's like, you know, leading amateur and got a spot in the Dubai Desert Classic. And, you know, I think through two rounds, it was fourth or something. And just on a golf course, it's very difficult driving golf course and 320 down the middle every time, you know, you're like, you play enough with people to understand when there's something a little bit different about player. I certainly saw that. I played in the Dunhill with Rory in 2007,

and just like, oh my God, this is different. This isn't like every other person, you know? And Ludwig certainly showed that. And I wanted to see it for myself. So I got to play it for myself. So I I got to pay it play with him in Detroit and again, you know just It's the quiet like play we're starting on number 10. It's a short par four as

bunkers at 290 and 330 trees on the left And it just hits this high little looping draw just right over the edge of the tree. Perfect 320 just in front of a 330 bunker. And I'm like, okay, that's pretty nice. You know, usually you're a little bit nervous to start a tournament around and you know, it's a little, you know, might be off a few degrees here or there. And playing with me, he probably understands that I'm watching him. There's already all this media about him. And he's not in under through 16 holes, like nothing.

And I'm like, yeah, okay, I guess this guy can play. We all knew that. And still, he wasn't a certainty to be in the team after that round. Even that week, he'd sort of given up a lead and hadn't played very well on the weekend. Um, and it's not easy, you know, coming off college playing, playing, um, tournaments, you'd never been a part of traveling more being away from home. Uh, unusual courses. You don't recognize, uh, all this stuff.

And, um, you know, he, he had a couple of good weeks as well, but sort of not quite finishing it off and, you know, there had a couple good weeks as well, but sort of not quite finishing it off. And you know, there's definitely some stuff there where this was going to be a real left field pick if I still went. And so I needed him to come to Europe once the FedEx season was over and just show me something like I need to have a little bit more proof before I'm really going to put my faith in you. And first week nearly won, he finished fourth and then he went to Cron the last week and did what he did and won. And I think that was enough for me. That was enough to understand that not

only we were going to build him for future Ryder Cups, but he was already ready. It's crazy how much better his chipping has gotten to even just in the last 12 to 18 months and like the continual improvement in the stuff that he hasn't really. Well, that's the thing too. There had to be a part of your brain that like, as you're kind of laying down this gauntlet, like, okay, well, now go do this. Okay, you did that. All right, now go do this.

There's got to be a part of your brain that's like, come on, I can't pick this guy. Like this is, this is ridiculous. You know, that, that has to be, uh, pushing you to, you know, after I picked him, there was quite a lot of criticism and certainly some people missed out that they thought they should have been on. And that's always the tough part. That's the toughest part. Being a captain is leaving those, those guys out. And, uh, certainly we could have taken a couple other guys that could have made a difference

in our team and done well. But again, this was 14 months of me just trying to study these players, understand their strengths, their weaknesses and what they could bring and how they could fit into the whole overall picture. So I was pretty happy with the pick to be honest. I was pretty confident. Another scene I loved was the caddy scene. It seems like just a couple of little visuals in there.

Caddies clearly have their own section, everybody's name up on the wall, just very different than what you see week to week on the PGA Tour. I'm curious if that's always been the case for Team Europe. Have the caddies always been treated as that big of a part of the team? Was that something new? What's their role been over the years? I think so. I think forever on the PGA Tour, caddies were never allowed in locker rooms. And I always disagree with that. I think they would have substandard food and the way they

were held. This was a major part of our team. And obviously my first seven years on tour, my brother was my caddy. So I tried to tried to step up for him as well. Like, you know, I just I knew what what, how they were treated. And I didn't really like it. I felt like that was a little bit different in European tour, we're always allowed in the locker rooms, a little bit more shared spaces would hang out a little bit more together, off the course dinners and stuff. With me having my brother as a caddy, I hung out with the caddies. He had caddy friends and I would hang out with my brother. A lot of my dinners from 2002 to whenever, 2014, a lot of those were hanging out with the caddies. They have great stories,

they're a little bit more, less uptight. I enjoy hanging out with the caddies, they have great stories. They're a little bit more, less uptight. I enjoy hanging out with the caddies. They have great stories. And again, you have to, this whole show is called Una Familia. It's one family. And that's, we're talking about, I've made a very conscious effort trying to include all the families.

There was, even in Westing Straits, that the family hotel was a two hour drive on a bus ride to get back to the hotel. It wasn't a great experience for them, that the families that could travel with COVID, you know, and so, you know, I wrote some handwritten letters to some of the families and just tried to make them all feel a part of it. And the caddies were part of that too, you know, they're the guys standing next to their players, they have a big influence on

them. So you better have to make sure that they include it. And it was nice to kind of do the thing for Billy. I was his 15th Ryder Cup, he contributed 25 points with all the players, such an amazing history and to give him like, again, one of those replica Ryder Cups that once we see over my shoulder, those mean a lot to me and I'm sure it meant a lot to him and hopefully will create continues that sort of that culture of including the caddies as much as possible.

I feel like he was almost underrated because you guys were up by so much, but it almost seemed like Fitz's matches didn't matter, but he was just beating the hell out of everybody. Sorry, John. Go ahead. I was going to say just it's funny seeing Dwayne Bach in there. It almost seemed like Fitz's matches didn't matter, but he was just beating the hell out of everybody. Sorry, John. Go ahead. I was going to say just, it's funny seeing Dwayne Bach in there. Same with like, Beth Pave, right? You should do a podcast with the American caddies who can see what they say.

That's a great idea. Your wife, Diane, seems like a pretty remarkable woman and just her involvement and the thoughtfulness. And I loved the scene of you guys in your kitchen at home. And you seem like very different people in ways, but you also seem both meticulous and both very complimentary kind of your skill sets and everything. Was there ever any discussion amongst you guys of like, man, that was a lot. I don't know if we wanna do this again.

There was, it is a lot of work. It's something that takes up time and I certainly try and work on it daily. It is a focus of mine and maybe not quite as much from her side side but the last couple months leading up to it she worked very hard, she works very hard on the gifting, the ideas, the story again telling that story creating the gifts that were sort of related to where we were in Rome and making the partners

the wives the families feel very comfortable and very very included. So, you know, again, I think we're always stronger when we're a collective. I think that's where your your highest motivation comes from when you feel like you have a role and you're included and you belong. And so, you know, again, Diane's involvement in that was massive. The schedule of the week, what went on in the team room, how the team room looked, all these little things. You certainly couldn't do it without her help. And that's definitely, as I said, that's her forte. She loves, she's a good friend to people.

She's someone you can rely on. She loves entertaining, She loves throwing parties. She loves all that kind of side of it. I'm happy to stay at home and have a quiet night. She's quite the opposite. But we're a good mix because of that. I think we complement each other. That was a big takeaway I had from the film

of just investing in people. And it seems like if you invest, you've poured your heart and soul into this and we'll have for four years. And it seems like you've done that in a way that you're going to get it back tenfold through the rest of your life, just because, you know, you bought in that much. That's what it is all about really. That's hitting the nail on the head. You know, we, the players don't need to be motivated for a Ryder Cup, but you want to create cohesion. That needs concentrating on the people. Any other specifics around some of the themes?

I know that you guys said Monday was family night and then they didn't pick up too much on the rest of the week. Well, every night there was a gift in the room that was somewhat related to Rome themes. But Monday was more family and a lot of emotive stuff for the players. So those videos that they got in their rooms, we didn't want to do that on a Thursday. Just with playing on Friday, it was going to be too much. So kind of went off. See, Tuesday was more just a kind of casual evening.

Wednesday was the gala dinner. So we were kind of enjoying the city. And then Thursday, we brought Novak in. So again, a little bit more fun, relaxing. We played some fun videos on Thursday just to kind of get a laugh and create some, some, some fun with it. Um, and then we had, we had no back there as well, but who was, you know, again, very, um, he enjoyed the fun.

He, um, I don't know if you heard the story. He, he was meant to be a surprise and it kind of got out in the bean year that he was coming. And so I had to tell the team that he was coming, but he still wanted to sort of surprise the team and he dressed up as a waiter. And like we snuck him in like while I had him dinner, like, and he was serving champagne, he had a fat suit on and then all this stuff. Like he's a super fun character and just really enjoyed the whole experience and brought his Wimbledon trophy. And, you know know there's a seriousness

to it obviously and like what makes him great and all that kind of stuff that was fun for the guys to hear but yeah then after that it was sort of just time to go. What was some of his message if there's anything you can you can share? Well I think it was just the mentality of how to deal with a crowd that's not always on your side. I'm not going to go into that. But he's funny. He sort of doesn't get the best rap always with the media. I think Roger and Rafa were the loved ones amongst the fans. But you meet Novak. He's the nicest, caring, most down-to-earth guy.'s, he's had a lot of people against him for whatever reasons. But you know, it's how he uses that, reframes it into a positive

really, uses it to his benefit. I see so many parallels between Novak and Ram, just the way that kind of that simmering energy underneath and funneling some of that, those slights. Yeah, exactly. Well, where, where's there room for improvement? You know, you talked about, you know, the big love fest, you know, you want to steer away from that. We can, we can talk into, you know, where did you, where did you drop the ball? Where, what are we, what are we trying to get better at?

Well, again, I think you always have to innovate. You always have to keep moving forward. You always have to change some stuff. And there's certainly stuff we'll continue to use to try and build that culture, that build that everyone together. And, you know, I'm certainly leaning into a lot of that, but I'm going to have to have different strategies for an away rider cup and a lot of it's to do with the crowd and overcoming that and how to deal with that. Is that just an exciting drill into that? Is that like a personnel thing? Is that a is that a pairings thing? Is that all of the above? What is that? What do you mean by that? It's just a messaging like you know how

are we gonna react towards this crowd? I think and that's stuff I'm still kind of working out but I'm still kind of working out, but I'm talking to a lot of people, how to figure that out. What's the best way to neutralize that to some degree? Because we know it's gonna be spirited and there's gonna be a lot of fans supporting the US. You should call up JJ Reddick of all people.

I'm just thinking about a Duke guy that went on the road and I mean, literally, like just universally. Some people rise to that stuff. Exactly. Some don't. And again, it's part of that is identifying through me, you know, who those guys are and who aren't. And obviously, trying to create some messaging amongst the guys that, you know, if you aren't one of those guys, how do you become

one of those guys? Right. And, you know, I think that's, that's up to the individual to figure that out. Are there any guys that you talked a little about it with? It was I think it was Rory, and Tommy plan, similar golf ball, or like on your team? Are there any guys that you would love to play together in all shot? And you just can't because it's just diametrically opposed. It's one of the toughest things with Foursome and putting all the puzzle together is the golf ball. I think 20 years ago, you had maybe two or three brands and one brand within each brand.

And now Titleist five or six different balls, Seleme the same, Callaway, Shricks on, you know, it goes on and on. And it's very tricky even amongst Titleist players that some people are very easy and they're like, just give me the ball, I'll figure it out over one round. And I'll make the adjustments and I can play with anyone. And some people are like, I just can't, I can't play with this. Like there's no chance. And so they just get crossed out. That happened in Wisconsin. We had a situation where we tried to put two guys together. It felt like it worked and it just the the ball was a massive

Deal breaker and when you change one pairing then you have to change a lot of the others. Yeah, and so it's Yeah, we we talk a lot about Golf balls and who's playing who we try and get golf balls to Specific pairings we're thinking about leading up to Ryla Cup for them to test and try and think about those things. But there's so much going on. It's a difficult puzzle to put together. Any pairings that you weren't 100% sold on going into Rome of like, you know what, I

don't know if this is going to work, but I feel this more than say what the data is telling me or the opposite. Not really. The Friday, I think, kind of went to plan. And obviously it did go to plan. We're very lucky we didn't have to adjust too much because we got off to such a good start. Obviously winning the first session for nothing.

And then the second session with those amazing finishes on 18. Saturday, I did want to rest John, just to give him a little more energy for the singles. And so that created a different partnership. I was going to have him with Nikolai again. And then we ended up putting Nikolai. One pairing that wasn't quite what we wanted. But we had the flexibility with the lead. And it's funny that the Saturday afternoon was the one session we lost. And that was a little bit of well, we'll try this partnership. You know, we'll try these to arrest some of these guys. And it's funny that because again, those weren't partnerships. I probably keyed up the guys before,

and they struggled a little bit, you know, the U S one that session three, one. So it was funny how like, you know, the pairings that we had in our minds and we talked to the players about and they were kind of expecting they did, they did better, better in those ones. What would have been your initial impressions of Bethpage just from a, from a golf perspective, from a host venue perspective? Yeah, big, big property. Um, you know, lots of room to do stuff, you know, I'll see, can they can go any which

direction they want with the golf course. I think, you know, I've only known it as a, this long major type championship setup. That's not usually the U S players Ryder Cup players, uh, MO like, um, are they, are the corridors like pretty wide? Like I know they always grow the rough up a ton, but I widen the fairway. Yeah, they have, we widened some of them already. Um, and usually they'll, they'll cut the roughway. Yeah, they have. We've widened some of them already. And usually they'll cut the rough down. So it's still a biggish golf course, you know, with the back tees. They can obviously move some tees up if they want.

But you know, it's never going to be an easy golf course, but they can certainly make it a non-major championship setup where there's definitely some good opportunities for birdies. Yeah. It's super interesting thinking about that of, Hey, if they set this up like they've like it normally plays, it would, it would play into the hands of you guys have talked about the long iron play being such a strength of your team and you know, how, how good you guys are from 175 to 225, say. Yeah, I think the closeness of the stats in the teams is pretty close.

You're trying to find little marginal gains here and there. We certainly tried to do that in Rome. It doesn't always work out that way. The fifth hole for us at Rome, we made a driveable par 4 because the stats were saying that the US were much better wedge players than us. So, we thought we'll get rid of one of the wedge holes and make it drivable. And in the end, the US played that hole a little bit better than us. So it doesn't always work out, but you're trying to find the little gains, the little

errors that you can sort of gain on it. But it's pretty close these days, the statistics with these players. What about schedule going into this year? Have you guys talked about that? You talked about having the three-week boot camp where everybody was together last year. Have you put that stuff on the calendar yet, or what will that look like? Yeah. Wentworth, I believe,'s two weeks before the writer cup. So hopefully most of the guys will be playing that week. And then instead of the week before the writing up being the practice trip,

it would be the week before the writer cup. So we'd go straight from, from, uh, from Wentworth to, uh, to Beth page and sort of a climatized, you know, beyond, beyond the time. My wish would be that all 12 guys stay in the US and not have to deal with jet lag and be ready. So we'd spend a couple of days at that page probably early in the week, the week before the writing. Does this feel like chapter two for you or a whole new book? Well, it's probably only two. I think there's only two chapters in this book. It probably

does feel like chapter two. It's just, it's the next chapter, but a different storyline, you know, had some challenges to deal with last year, but it all went to plan. And I think this year, there's going to be some stuff that probably doesn't go to plan and I'm going to have to be able to be quick on my feet for it. So, uh, I think just the difficulty of, of an away rider cup is going to present that, um, there's going to be some, some more challenges and it won't be, uh, won't go quite as to plan as last time. It'd just be my guess, you know,

and I think you have to be ready for that. You always have to understand that there's going to be obstacles and you've got to be ready for those. Hopefully I am. I know you weren't declared the captain yet in the press conference after the victory, but what was going through your head with Rory's, basically we want the ball and we're going to score. We're keeping the group together and we're going to go win at Beth page. What was, what was going through your head then? Well, obviously when we were on that podium lifting the cup for the first time and Shane starts shouting two more years, you know, I, uh, I had no thoughts of doing it again at that point, to be honest.

I was just happy that it turned out the way it did. Uh, I really, uh, wanted to enjoy that, you know, enjoy that evening, enjoy it with the guys, have some fun. And it wasn't until a week later really that I started to really seriously consider it. But yeah, it somewhat makes sense to have a repeat captain, especially if you're victorious the first time, it's a bit more continuity. And there's just been so many different people that wants to be in line and obviously would live and what happened. Some of those people became ineligible and I grasped the opportunity and we'll see to have a chance to go back to back is incredible for me. It's a big challenge.

Some people say I'm putting a lot at stake, but the Americans are expected to win. I think it's only positive from what I can see. If the Americans do win, yeah, of course. There'll be a little bit of a less shine to probably my captaincy, but the upside is immense. I've always gone towards things that are difficult and things that are challenging and that's sort of motivating for me. Beyond the assistant captains and the families and the caddies, anybody else you wanna just shout out

or that's absolutely integral to the success that- We have a great backroom team as well, the team that works behind the team, Michael Gibbons, Katie Klayman this year, these people are the glue that really get everything going. He comes up with a lot of the ideas too for the story and how the team rooms look. It's a nice family. We talk, we're on Zoom every couple of weeks. We're talking about things all the time. You know, and then there's personal thing,

people to me that have helped me. I'm not gonna go into those right now because they're still part of the team and I don't want to expose them just yet. But you know, again, I certainly, I think the biggest thing for being the leader is being humble enough to know that you don't know everything

and you have to have people around you that are great and smart and guide you in the right way. You can don't have to listen and then act on everything they do but you have to be open enough to wanting to learn and wanting to understand you know the best way forward. And that's certainly not just your way. There's a lot of people involved with this. And I was a little bit embarrassed watching this in a familiar, because it is a bit of a love fest towards me. And I certainly appreciate that. But there's so many people that made this possible.

And without those, we have no chance. I think if you made a ledger, if you made it somehow made a ledger of like all the best things that have happened in golf over the last 20 years, no one touches more of them than Gibbo probably. And it's really funny in the film too, like for people that don't know who he is, which is probably a lot of people because he's always behind the scenes. He's the guy like the back of the head that you see hugging all these players as they're getting off the off the bus, which is very, very fitting. I feel like he's great ideas. Yeah. Yeah. He's great. Well, Luke, thanks for taking an hour, man, to, uh, to talk through all this stuff. Thanks for all the, all the, uh, access in the film as a golf fan. It just, it made me even more excited for the rider cup, which I didn't think was possible. And, uh, yeah, just congratulations on a great, great two years and best of luck, uh, coming up at, at Beth pages here. Thank you guys.