No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - 966: LPGA Check-In Ft. Sophie Walker

Episode Date: March 6, 2025

Cody and Randy catch up with Sophie Walker of Sky Sports to recap the LPGA's Asian Swing and look to what lies ahead in the upcoming months in the women's game. Then, in part two, we're joined by LPGA Player President Vicki Goetze-Ackerman (1:03:00) to discuss the tour's new pace of play policy. This LPGA-focused podcast is sponsored by Titleist. Check out the new 2025 Pro V1 and Pro V1x Subscribe to the No Laying Up Podcast channel here: https://www.youtube.com/@NoLayingUpPodcast If you enjoyed this episode, consider joining The Nest: No Laying Up’s community of avid golfers. Nest members help us maintain our light commercial interruptions (3 minutes of ads per 90 minutes of content) and receive access to exclusive content, discounts in the pro shop, and an annual member gift. It’s a $90 annual membership, and you can sign up or learn more at nolayingup.com/join Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Be the right club. Be the right club today. That's better than most. How about in? That is better than most. Better than most! Expect anything different. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the No Laying Up podcast. My name is Randy. I am joined by Cody McBride. This is a women's golf, an LPGA, although I guess some of it is L.E.T. I never quite know what to say, but that doesn't matter. Cody McBride, how are you, man?

Excited to deep dive into the women's game today. I am so pumped, Randy. We've talked a lot about Asian Swing. We got the Spring Asian Swing, we got the Fall Asian Swing. I'm just happy because I think that the meat of both schedules are finally starting now. So a couple weeks off, we're hitting the ground running all the way through

all these major championships, but thanks for having me here today, buddy. Absolutely. Great show. It's a two-parter. In the first part, we're gonna bring in Sophie Walker. She has been live on the ground covering golf these last several weeks across the world,

but specifically from Asia. So wanna talk to her about what she's seen, what she thinks. And then in part two, we have LPGA player president, Vicki Getz Ackerman. She is going to teach us about the upcoming LPGA pace of play policy that's going to go into effect at the end of March, beginning at the Ford championship

out in Arizona. Cody, before we get into the show though, let's thank our sponsor. I believe it's our good friends at Titleist. That's right. It is Titleist big. I don't know how much you caught at HSBC women's. Obviously, Sophie was there. We're going to talk an awful lot about it. But on Sunday, Lydia Cove made it four straight wins for Pro V1 players to start the 2025 LPGA Tour season following victories from

A-Lin Kim, Yalime Ngo, and Angel Yin. She closed out that final round of the HSBC Women's World Champion in just her second start using the new 2025 Pro V1 golf ball, which she moved from the prior generation Pro V1 X. So wow, she went from an X all the way back to the V. She made that decision from working with the Titleist team on the range back at the Founder's Cup. So pretty quick move and immediate results for her. She found out that the 25 Pro V1 checked all the boxes for her, hitting her optimal spin rates, flying in her preferred window

and performing tremendously through the wind. After testing on the range and on the golf course, she put the new model in play for the first time that week. Now in comparing the Pro V1 and Pro V1X, the Pro V1 is going to give you a mid trajectory flight, low long game spin and maximum short game spin with a softer feel off the face. On the other hand, the Pro V1X is going to fly higher,

spin more in the long game and offer a firmer feel. Both the new Pro V1 and Pro V1X golf balls feature all new and faster high gradient cores reform for more speed off the tee, more control with the irons and more spin in the wedges. Go to Titleist.com use their awesome ball fitting tool. They got a cool limited edition St. Patty's Day balls up there right now. Big, real like nice shamrock green. I don't know what the official green is, but I love that. Awesome. Little kisses all over the place. And of course, thank you to our friends, the Titleists for joining the entire Cushion team for supporting the best players in the world. And you mentioned Lydia Ko,

you mentioned Singapore. Let's bring in somebody that was on the ground, was walking with Lydia. That is our good friend, Sophie Walker. Sophie, welcome to the show. You know, I was trying to put together like a little bio intro for you, but you do so much work. You tell the people how do you like to be introduced, Sophie? Hello, guys. Do you know what? However you like me to be introduced, I would say golf geek. I'm a former tour professional.

Now somebody that watches a hell of a lot of golf talks about it and gets paid for it, a little bit like you guys, and throw in a sprinkling of golf coaching, I suppose. But yeah, I do everything really in golf. Golf is kind of my life very much, and I'm fortunate to stay in the business. I'd probably say right now I'd specialize slightly more in women's golf. I cover most of the ladies' European tour, and then some LPGA stuff like majors and Asian swing. Well, it's great to have you.

We've gotten to know you over the last several years. I will say on top of all that, we consider you a very good friend, somebody that we always enjoy talking to. And certainly when we get to see you and hang out in person, it is a treat. So Sophie, thank you for jumping on. You were saying before we started recording, you're a bit jet lagged. You've just gone back from Asia.

You're back in London. But let's start, I wanna start with Singapore because I find it fascinating, you know, the HSBC Women's Championship specifically is labeled Asia's major. And I was hoping you could kind of educate us, fill us in on why that is. And with that, how good of a test is Sentosa Golf Club,

where the event is played? Well, the reason, you know, it's called, it's the HSBC World Championship. HSBC has been the sponsor from the very start. In terms of Sentosa they've got a couple of golf courses there so they used to play on one of the courses and now they've changed over to this side of it. The hospitality, the way they look after their players, it's just incredible really and actually when Lydia Koh won, how much it meant to her,

like being there and the history of the event. Look, it's a limited field, there is no cut. So in terms of a major, it doesn't have that part of it and it isn't part of the major schedules. But in terms of a big event, I would feel that other than the majors, it's the biggest event for the players outside of America. That's the impression that you get from them. And Sentosa, what a golf course that is, by the way. It's in pristine condition. They have the subair

underneath the greens because it you know, you get quite bad showers. Apparently it rains in Singapore. I've covered the HSBC twice now and I've had no thunderstorms. The LPJ are always really worried about it, but I have nothing. So what's great is they suck the moisture out of the greens, which firm them up. I don't know if you saw Thailand. Thailand was just throwing darts where Singapore was a lot firmer.

Sentosa is a golf course. Start is quite tough. Then you get to the fifth to the ninth, the two par fives that you can go after. You've got to make your score there. Then you hit the turn, lots of crosswinds on the fairways, which make them quite narrow. It gets harder around there. And then as you kind of get to about 13, kind of pick up some more birdies. So it's of course really that test your patience because you'd love to start fast but not many people do and then

you've got to pick it up and just just roll with the punches really and I felt that Lydia, at the moment Lydia's got it on a string let's put put it that way. And that golf course, there was a lot of players that came in, some of the pin positions were really hard, the crosswinds, you know, the scoring was really quite high. If you look at the difference between like last place and first place, it was quite a big difference. But Lydia was just managed the conditions and controlling her new Pro V1 better than anybody else. Hey, great, great little plug there, Sophie. You were paying attention. There you go. Yeah. Well, we're definitely going to talk about Lydia Ko, but you mentioned the

atmosphere out there at Sentosa. How does the atmosphere stack up around other places you go in Asia? And then can you just talk about generally the atmosphere for women's golf in Asia and what you notice about it, what you like about it? It's important if they have a player that represents. So Singapore has got Shannon Tan at the minute that's won on the Ladies European Tour and hopefully that she will start something but I have noticed significantly in Thailand over the last few years Thailand was wild for Gino Titikin like last two weeks ago she she had bodyguards with her they were breaking through the ropes and but also you had Patti Tavataniket in the group in front Marija Tanigun so there was plenty of Thai players

for them to support. Gino had like fan club t-shirts, it was cool. You see that in Korea, you guys had been over to the BMW. Now you're seeing it in Thailand. Then I was in China when Ronny won, Ronin Yin won in China, that was brilliant. I mean, they were popping out of the bushes, like, I'm like, oh my God, there's more people.

The ropes were just worthless. So it does matter that there is somebody representing from that country that gets there. So in terms of Singapore, you probably don't have as many fans because of that. And also it's an island, right? And actually Sentosa is an island of Singapore. You have to go over or under a bridge

and stuff like that to get there. It was not as easy to get to, but the hospitality on 18, funnily enough, they quite like air conditioning and free food and drinks. So that's always very busy. But it's a hot walk. Singapore is boiling.

I really struggled at the weekend of the heat. And I think you've probably seen with the players having umbrellas up, it was incredibly hot. But there's a real appetite for golf in Asia, and women's golf in particular, never mind going to South Korea as well, with all their big names there.

And they're so polite, they cheer on every single golfer. They cheer on all the good shots. There was quite a lot of Aussies and Kiwis down there. Lydia had quite a nice little group of friends. I think one, like a couple of her best mates was there. A sister is always traveling with her. And then Hannah Green, who was the defending champion, she said it's her closest LPGA event because she lives in Perth. So it's five hours. So there was a few Aussies that had come to support them, which is always nice. I think when the Aussies and the Kiwis are down there, they got a bit allowed, aren't they? Yeah, I love it. Of course, to our Aussie friends, nobody loves their sport more than them. I think, so first of all,

loves their sport more than them. I think so first of all, is the course so you said that Centosa has a couple different courses but is Liv, did they play on the same course that this event's on? No Liv's going to the other course that the one that they used to be on. Do you remember the Paula Cremer pot? Yes. But they're going back onto that one. God it's crazy the amount of money that and really good for the global game, but it feels like some of these places, you're talking about sub-air where they like, they can control the conditions.

That's what you want for a championship course, right? Yeah, it's in unreal conditions. So like the bunkers, for instance, on the 18th green, they put this like stamp, this print in the, on the 18th green, they put this like stamp, this print in the bunker on the 18th green, it's their Sentosa logo. It's high end. To play golf in Singapore is incredibly expensive and that's probably the most expensive club there.

But it's, in fact, in Thailand as well, the golf course is in wonderful condition. I got a hard, hard question. I don't want you to get in trouble here, but, you know, we obviously talk about this is the Asian major, rightfully so, limited field event, no cut. I get it. There's things that go against that. But at the end of the day, it does a really good job of identifying the best golfer for that week and somebody who is rightfully deserving.

There's not a lot of luck or fluke or anything out. And it seems like both courses at Sentosa stand up very, very well compared to others. Now, I don't want to begin putting in a tough spot. We have two other majors. Come on, do it. Calendar here, both at Chevron and Evian here. Their golf courses aren't even close to what we get to watch over in Sentosa.

I don't want you to compare and contrast here, but I want you to. So tell me, how far off are we to be like, what is going on? Why could this not be considered an actual major on the LPGA-LET schedule? I was going to say you're going to have to ask the commissioner, but there isn't one. It's it's a better golf course than the other two. Like it is it'll be ranked better in the world. I suppose than the other two.

But we all know why everyone's there like it's it's there because the LPGA and the well the women's Golf needed it and it stepped up and the prize money is amazing. You know, what I would say about, Thailand's got the lowest purse on the LPGA Tour and Sentosa or the HSBC is not that high compared to the rest. So as much as it's an amazing event,

the prize funds, it has increased, but it's still not, it's not sizeable. I mean obviously the majors are more money but I think there should be a major in Asia but what do you do now? You can't add another one, we can't go to six. Why not? Why can't, why not? Well, I don't know. Randy wants to add the, well, we used to want to add the founders in there. Now this year it's founders. I don't know what's going on. It feels like another event

that's kind of lost its identity searching for something here. And I get it. That's not on the, that's not a result of the players or anything. It's just a structural thing. But you're right. You can't have six.

I'm sorry, big guy. We gotta, I would like to know. At least everyone goes back to the same venue every year. Correct. I do, I think that's a good thing about Sentosa as well. I know that calls it, but you go back to the same club as there's a field, there's a history behind it. When you play at Sentosa, there's a plaque.

So there's a plaque on the 16th where Hannah Green hit the par five and two to finish Birdie, Birdie, Birdie to win. So when you're going around there, you look at the Jin Yong Ko shot, all those types of things and you can watch it back. And that's obviously what we used to love about Dino Shore and whatever it's called now.

And that's another thing, like HSBC has kept its sponsor. That is what it is. It's not changed it around. So there's a legacy in it that way. Would I have liked it to have been a major? Yes, but there's got to be a reason at the time, you've got, there's got to be a reason why it wasn't. And obviously I'm not there to say that,

but in terms of how it feels and the golf course yes it's it's certainly good enough to be a major and there is a there's a definite feel around it when Lydia won it didn't feel like she was winning a and I don't want to say a normal LPGA event because now it's 23 but it it felt bigger than than other ones to her anyway. And the players love Singapore. My question to you, my question to you is, because you're the Americans, why does Nellie, Rose and Megan,

like why are they all not coming out for these Asian events? You can throw Lexi at me. Historically Lexi hated traveling. It misses, because it's got everything, but it just misses startup of more big names. Yeah. Well, I, I gotta think Sophie, I'm gonna take your question and maybe throw it right back to you. It seems like we the season

is so long, as is right? You're playing actual events January through November. You add in the Grand Thornton now, which is in December. I honestly don't blame some players for taking a couple months. They play the Tournament of Champions in January, now that the founders got moved up, right? But being able just to take like two months as a bit of rest and respite,

I have a hard time blaming the Nellies and the Roses who have gotten themselves into a position where they can afford to take that time off. I mean, it stinks, right? Having had Nellie played Singapore, I think it would have made, I mean, shit, we could have had Nellie, Lydia and Gino in the final group, perhaps, right? But I can't blame them for the amount of

travel and just how long the schedule is. Yeah, fair. That's good. Thanks, France for in it. Yeah, it just, I suppose as well, they start in America, then you have to go to Asia, then you have to come back to America. If you are genotitian, then you'd get to go home, don't you? Right. I know. And we've talked about that too. Should there be two distinct Asian swings in the LPGA calendar, or is there a way where you could consolidate it into one? I you know, I, I think there's a lot of stuff that if I could twitch my nose or if the commissioner could kind of come

in and wipe the slate clean with the schedule, there are some things that I think would make a lot of sense to change. But you just get into, hey, you have sponsors, and you just have certain things that are difficult to change when they get really rooted in I think I'll jump on it too big and so I know you're what you mean Even though you didn't say it is that we are very spoiled in America The majority of the golf that we play is all around us

I mean we were joking earlier because I was I made a tongue-in-jeek You know comparison to your jet lag that you have right now is what happens when I have to fly to California because my body can't handle it. So it's okay. And I'm okay saying that we are very pampered that we don't have to stretch our boundaries as much as we probably should, and especially for the best players in the game. I don't know. It's also one of those things where it's like

structurally wise, you would think it would be in the best interest of the LPGA Tour that they would also be like, okay, you know, some rule of, you know, obviously there's a minimum event so you have to play in, but every five years you need to hit a certain, you know, you need to play in one event. You know, I don't know if that would help.

I don't know if that would help elevate some of these other, you know, you know, tournaments where they have to travel so long because it's the same thing that we talk about on the men's side of everybody's like, well, why isn't there more Australian events? Yeah, you're right. They probably have the best grouping of championship golf courses in the world, but it's a long way to go for like a one-off spot. And to Nellie, it's very hard to look at the schedule so far and be like, okay, Nellie,

you're going to play for 2 million bucks at the Hilton to start the year and then at the founders in your hometown. And then we're going to ask you to travel all the way to Thailand for 1.7 million. Yeah, no, million. Like. Yeah, no, exactly, yeah. It's just, it's one of those things where it stinks, but it goes back again to like, and I know we'll get to this topic here,

but I think there's so much that both tours could do, meaning LPGA tour and the LAT, to be like, hey, let's pick some events, do more co-sanction and elevate them all. Have signature events that share access. And that means that you have to expand the field to, I don't know, take it from 70 or 80 to 100, 120. You can do it.

It's fine. But I don't know if there's, we don't know where that level of cooperation, we definitely know where it was at. We don't know if there's, we don't know where that level of cooperation, we definitely know where it was at. We don't know where it's going to look like in the future. Yeah, just a couple things real quick. There is a rule. LPGA players do need to play and I don't know if it's once every three years or five years, but I was just looking, Nellie played Singapore in 2023. So I'm sure she's thinking, Hey, I checked that box. I'm good for the next. All right. Hand up. I'm sorry. No, no, no. Because I just remember talking to Warren

and talking about that because she has, you know, Hawaii is another event where it's kind of a pain in the ass for a lot of these players. Like, you know, it's like, yeah, I got to go play Hawaii because I got to satisfy the rule. So, well, at least see Nellie again in a couple of years making this Asian swing, but she's not gonna do it if she doesn't have to. That's for sure. Well, she's earned the right. Like it's not me aiming at certain players.

It's just that it's got that feeling of like, if you want it to feel even bigger, then it'd be lovely to have, you know, the top three at the moment going head to head. Yeah. Well, let's talk. We could, we got, we got, I feel like we, we got bogged down into LPGA talk. We literally get about it every episode. I mean, it is kind of crazy. I do have a couple more Sentosa things

just because that's freshest in Sophie's mind here. Charlie back swinging, you know, rounds, open with 69, 70, 68, and then close with that 74. Disappointed, probably finished for her, but T4 to kind of come out of the year running. Another player who is very protective of her schedule and also likes to take long times off.

So based off of this start, what do we think Charlie's going to do this year? Well, Charlie only plays two weeks and then two weeks and that's it. She doesn't like to play three weeks. That's what she said so far. I just need to address the Charlie thing recently about this running. and that's it, she doesn't like to play three weeks. That's what she said so far. I just need to address the Charlie thing recently about this running. You know, like everyone is so obsessed with,

oh, why is she running before she goes out and played? That can't be good for her. I spent a little bit of time with her last week and I'm thinking to myself, I would feel better going for a 5k run than scrolling through Instagram and TikTok for 45 minutes and my brain just being like, like the run is actually something that wakes her up, makes her feel good about herself and ready to go. She did say something about being sick before she ran on Saturday morning. And she said it in a press conference, sorry,

in an interview. And it was, but I saw her on the putting green on Saturday morning. She ran up to me, she'd beaten her PB, she was pumped. She looked great and she played good. So I think sometimes things come out of her mouth, which she doesn't necessarily process or mean. So, and the 12k run, she didn't run 12k that morning, she ran five because her trainer said to her, do you think you should maybe just run five?

So we'd gone on about her smoking for like two years now and now she's running and that's not right. Okay, so I think maybe because she's not necessarily won enough that you can try and criticise in some ways but I don't feel the running is affecting her at all. I actually think it's making her better because it's helping her mind as well as her fitness. So I just wanted to get that off my chest because it was it's still in my head and I was at the airport coming home and one of the European tour guys like pulled me to one side and he's like, what's going on with Charlie? Like, why is she doing this?

You go in the gym now on the LPGA, they're all in there. Like it's totally normal for this to be happening. It's just that most of them keep it quiet on what they do. And Charlie at the moment is really into it. Like you know, she does go through stages and at the minute she's into this and this is a good thing to be into. Well, I say it's a good, you know, she obviously rubbed off a little bit on you. I know you're in the 5k club now too. I know, but she was coming up to me on the treadmill, like, and in fact on the

16th hole on one of the days, I think the pace of play was a bit slow for her. She like walked the whole 16th hole with me telling me how to run my next 5k. So yeah, that's what she's into at the moment and it's taking her mind off the golf. I think she'll be disappointed with Sunday. I do. And I think she will learn from it, was Sunday, I do, and I think she will learn from it because those two were very, very good and she just didn't have it, didn't hit enough fairways, didn't start very well and from then she was kind of behind the eight ball, so that's something to work on. But she just needs to get herself into contention more to hopefully all get over the line. But you did, you did notice the difference between those two last week. They were very, very good.

I will say, I hope it doesn't seem like criticism of Charlie necessarily, because I think why people talk about Charlie is she gives us stuff to talk about. And I think that is a tremendous positive in how I view her. She is an interesting person. And you can't say that about a ton of pro golfers. You just can't. And so she stands out for her personality. And I think people gravitate towards that. I was going to say, and I think people gravitate towards that. I was gonna say, Sophie, just following up on that point about Charlie and her 74, I mean, how hard is it when you said Lydia's got the golf ball

on a string right now? I mean, it has to put tremendous pressure on Charlie and on Gino and the rest of the field, knowing like, hey, Lydia's not going to give anything away here. If we're going to beat her, we have to go out and get it. I just think that Lydia maybe forces her competitors into trying to do too much. Is that your read on kind of that dynamic at play? So Lydia gives up at least 20 yards off the tee, at least. I think her average last week was

25 yards less than the other two. But that also means if she's on the fairway, she's hitting him first. So she's applying some pressure. And her eyeing game is amazing. I mean, I don't know if you've so what I do is when I do the on course commentary is I go and ask the caddies their distances. So at the back of a yardage book, each player will have the distances for each club. And I'll just take a photo of it just in case I don't get a caddy signal. The good news is Gino Titican has a different color grip for each iron. So I don't even ask. Yeah, so green, eight iron, orange, seven iron. Fantastic. But Lydia's has in her yardage book, so let me just get this right. She has a full swing. She has a gripped. So

where you grip it slightly, she has a mid grip, and then she has bottom of the grip. So she has four shots. So she has a mid grip and then she has bottom of the grip. So she has four shots, so she has a two or three yard gap between each club. So she doesn't have seven yards between her seven iron and six iron. She fills that with how she grips the club. So between about 200 yards and about 75 yards, she has a shot for every three yards.

I've never seen that before in my entire life. It's phenomenal. So when you're clubbing her, you're like, oh my God, she's got 123 yards. That's her grip bottom seven iron, or grip bottom nine iron. Like, it's that amazing. And then now she's got this thing where she like hits it.

I don't see it. It's just this thing with her head, and it like tilts, and her eyes look up and down like this, and where she like hits it. I don't see it. It's just this thing with her head and it like tilts and her eyes look up and down like this. And you're like, it's going in. It's the most, it's, it's, it's, I just, I've never seen anybody in control of their ball as much right now.

And I think the credit is that in 2023, she didn't have it. In 2021, she didn't have it. In 2021, she didn't have it. But in 22, she did, 24, she did, and she started 25 in that way. So, I mean, there was a pin on, what was it, six, six. There was a pin on six. She had 90 odd yards, and the other two probably had 67, 80.

They were a bit close. And I just said on the telecast no one else will get it close to this pin other than Lydia because the the pin was over the bunker and there was a downslope so in order to get it there you had to like cut it in and miss the downslope and she could do that and the other two because they were too close it the flight was lower and they missed the downslope but also missed the landing spot and they were 30 yards past. Whereas she can hit shots into whole locations that other people can't. The second day the pin positions were really difficult, really difficult and she shot 500. Also because she's in the middle of the fairway. If she's in the rough, she struggles. You know, you saw her shot into 18 on the final round

from the rough with no pressure, ended up in the front bunker. Because, you know, pound for pound she's strong, but compared to other people, she's not. So she's in the fairway, she has this like fairway finder where she tees it down and just kind of bumps this driver down the fairway. But if she's in the fairway, she's lethal.

Short game is incredible. And her putting is just, I mean, I actually got brave on Sunday by the chest 30 foot and I said, this is going in because it was just like, and I nearly said it's and I went, it's threatening the hole. And I thought, no, you should have said going in. And it went in. It's she's on one at the minute. You know, when you're on one, you've just got to keep riding it. I mean, yeah. Yeah. Because that was a big round. No, no, no. It's a derby for Lydia.

I mean, we and you, you're one of the only people that can provide the insights to that. And my question, I guess, is like. Good is Lydia. I think, as I say, what keeps impressing me the most is that you're going to walk down that driving range, right? And you're not, if to the net to somebody, you wouldn't necessarily go, oh, Lydia Ko's got the best swing. Lydia Go hits it the

furthest. She's not you. The driving range is not golf. There are a lot of girls and guys that rip it on a driving range. But then they get on the course and they can't hit the shot. One of the LPGA players that I spoke to was like, those crosswinds, just, I can't do it. She can manage it. So she hits, what I'm liking about Lydia at the moment is it's like artistry. She hit she pulled one into some trees. And now she walked up to the ball because she had to like hit a low cut round and a little face she kind of went, Oh, as if to say this is gonna be good. Like I get to do something here. So she's just like an artist at the minute. She is playing golf. She's not worried about like how far she hits it. She's playing within herself

and she's content. They'll always be worried about someone that's content. Yeah, that's a great point. A happy golfer. And you're right, you know, there's all this put into beautiful golf swings and power and best putter and everything. Like Lydia is one of the best golfers in the world. Like just all around it, everything. But there might be a time where it goes again, though. And I think that's kind of like that's the story of Lydia, actually, isn't it? She probably never knows how long it will last for. But while it is, you know, she's in it.

I did really enjoy listening to her and Paul Cormack work together. I thought they were an excellent team. So don't get rid of him. Right. I mean, Lydia is kind of the living legend right now out in the women's game. Is that fair to say, certainly with, you know, MB Park stepping away? And I mean, Lydia's, I believe the only like active week to week Hall of Famer. Something we, you know, it's just fun to talk about, but where does Lydia stack up, Sophie, in your mind, to some of the other greats

that you've had the privilege to watch? I'm thinking, you know, like a Lorraine Ochoa, or an Annika, you know, just, because that's the company she keeps. It is, I do think Annika is above and beyond because of just the amount of that she's won but I would put her I think she's gone above Lorena now for me maybe just below Embi, Embi's got more mages hasn't she? Yeah. For the time being. For the time being, yeah.

But hey, there was a time where we were like, is Lydia going to win another one? I know. I think that's what's great about it. If you look at the in B or the Lorena Richoah, they're coming very small pockets. Whereas we could be seeing, like project Carrington says, doesn't he, like, you win in little pockets. We might be seeing, like, a Mickelson won there and then he had some time off and then he came back and won a bit again. You might be seeing something like that in the, in the, because most of the women's game you would say that they just

win intensely and then they, they don't, whereas she's, she won intensely as a teenager. Then her 20s didn't really win a major, did she? I don't think she won a major in her 20s until last year. That's correct. Yeah. Now, speaking of like the pockets, I believe it's four LPGA wins since last January, and then you throw on the gold medal on top of that. It's, yeah, it's fun right now.

Yeah. She's never won in spring. Did you hear that? I mean, my interview, I mean, I could have asked anything because she had already had planned a question by her answer. I could have just said, what did you have for dinner? And she just gave me the, how wonderful Singapore is and how it's her first win in spring, which

I couldn't believe. On the LPGA. So she's no Scottie Schaeffler, is she? No. No. Well, we mentioned Charlie and we can certainly talk Charlie more if you'd like. We've talked Lydia, but let's, I'd love to talk about the third member of that final pairing from the fourth round in Singapore and that's Gino Titicum. I guess

let's start here. Talk to me about her game and what impresses you most about Gino. So I have been getting beaten off golf by Gino since she was 14. I played in that Thailand ladies open when this kid with braces rocked up. Luckily she didn't take the money. So she won that at 14 and she won again at 16. And we never saw her from bits. We were like, oh, maybe she disappeared, but she had to finish school. And then she started on the L.E.T.

So she won the Order of Merit. She won the Rookie of the Year. So she's only been pro like three years. She's just going into four. Since turning pro, her stroke average is under 70. So on the LET, it was under 70. And on the LPGA for the past three seasons, it's been under 70.

And at the moment, since the AIG Women's Open, it's been 67 average. 67, 500 par. It's just mind blowing. She's had 10 top tens in a row. Yeah. It's so crazy to look at her numbers. You just sit there and think too. But like I said, I'm not interviewing them like, oh, but the minute you're the best putter on the LPGA tour, she's like, am I? I don't think I'm that good.

It's like, yeah. 40, I think you guys were flashing the graphic. 43 top tens now, including Singapore since the start of 2022. I believe that's in 66 LPGA starts for Gino. The next closest is Nelly with 30 top tens. I guess Sophie, the big question for meino, the next closest is Nelly with 30 top tens. I guess Sophie, the big question for me is, and it's an unfair one, I think, but she's only one.

And I say only, you know, in square quotes, she has four LPGA victories. Is what do you make of how good, consistently good she is? And I guess a relative lack of wins. What do you make of how good, consistently good she is? And I guess a relative lack of wins. I mean, I can't even believe I'm saying that, but it kind of doesn't make sense for how often she's near the top of the leaderboard. Yeah, I mean, I get it.

She's playoff wise. She lost the playoff in Thailand. She lost the playoff in Thailand, she lost a playoff in Malaysia. I've seen her lose a playoff on the L.E.T. in London. So that's three losses in playoffs. And that's what I can remember. That's off the top of my head without looking into stats. So that's not a great record.

You'd think worse if you'd have picked one of them off, wouldn't you? And but it's really it's hard to criticize Gino in terms of everything. Because she is so young. And the majors are the one this year she's she knows she's got to go and take off some majors last year that she was undercooked. She didn't start till the Chevron because she was undercooked. She didn't start till the chevron because she was out with a thumb injury. So this year this is where she's got to really improve her major golf. She has to be up there more in the major championships. In terms of what she does well, she averages 265 off the tee. I actually looked at a video of her like when she first came out and tore, she's definitely got stronger. That like, you know, the golf swing, she's got a lovely, you know, how as you wind back, your hips start and then your back's almost facing the wrong way.

She's got a lovely X that gets her power. She hits a very high ball flight with driver and it just doesn't move. So if you look at Lydia, she has to tee it down and she's shaping it. Or even if it's windy, Gino just tees it high and just flies it two, six, five. Orion plays very good. If it had to be slightly critical short game, I think it'd be the next stage to improve.

You were playing against the best player within 100 yards. But she carries a lob wedge in a 52 degree. So she doesn't have something in between so that might be something to to look at her putting is phenomenal it's always been good now it's world class which is why she's had 10 top tens in a row or whatever but but like when she won the when she won the four million like the way she was just like laughing when she won the four million, the way she was just laughing when she was making eagle, and then she hold the birdie putt on OT, it was like, oh my God. So I don't think she's fearful of winning. I just think that the looks not maybe gone with her. I think she'll win three times this

year, I'll say it now. I just don't know if it'll be a major. I hope it will. Yeah. I know the only loose shot I can remember her hitting was that 18th hole at Chevron two years ago when she hit it into the water. I believe she was tied for the lead, but other than that, it's like, yeah, she's not out here chogi. She's not gasping, is she? Right. Yeah. No.

So it's, and I think I'm with you. I think she's going to win big sooner than later, which kind of leads me into a next topic. I'm starting to see a big three. Cody, I don't know if you agree or disagree. You're free to disagree, but it kind of feels like between Gino, Lydia, and Nellie at the moment, we have a true big three. I'm curious what you guys think about that.

Sophie, I'll let you start. How quick Lillia falls. You don't even think about her anymore. What about Roddy? I mean, she actually has a major and Gino does it. What the disrespects her big. I'm sorry. You're right.

It does feel like that. But then again, we don't really know the golf that Nellie's gonna play this year, just because we haven't seen very many reps from her. Obviously took second at the hill. I think she'll be all right, Cody. Well, that's the thing. You never know with any of these players,

because I go back and like, we had this exact same conversation last year and everybody's like, yep, Lily Vu has got injury, but I mean, come on, like she's so dominant. How could she not be? No, I remember getting asked at the Scottish Open in 2023 and I said, Jin Yong, Ko, Min Ji Lee,

you're top two. Nelly was there and I said, Lydia, we can't talk about Lydia in that category anymore. And at the time I stuck by it, but that's change and that's the great thing about sport, how it does change. But at the moment, at present, we've got a three. I think Lillia didn't start the season well, did she? She was nearly last, I think, in Thailand and was injured. I do think I worked with Katrina Matthew last week, who by the way, loved it.

What a hero she is. Everyone likes her. It's hard not to like. What's that about? I know. She was taking me into the players' lounge. I was like, Katrina, I shouldn't go in the players' lounge. She's like, oh no, it's absolutely fine.

Fine. You look at Lillian, she's clearly struggling with that back and if the back's good she's good to go and that's what's such a shame with her because you know I'm a big Lillian Vu fan. And Minji Lee the putter obviously I don't it's weird I don't watch a lot of golf when I'm walking the course because I only watch them three people but I did look back at the the LPGA do like a 20 minute highlight thing and you can hear it. And it sounded like Minji Lee was holding putts. So that's got to be an improvement.

And she was hitting par fives that others weren't. So she's, so once they then putt start rolling in with the long putter, takes a lot of guts to change, doesn't it? So I think she's accepting of that. I would expect Minju to start coming back as well. I don't know. And Ronny, like you can't, I think, Randy, you've got to be careful on Ronny because she won two out of three in a- No, I'm not dismissive. Yeah. No, I just think week to week, like, I don't know, I see those three as just that upper echelon

right now. But yeah, that's great that they're from three different countries though. And then if you chuck Ronnie and you've got four, like, that's cool. Well, personality wise and stuff that Ronnie Ronnie and Gino give you something. They really do give you something. Yeah, I was just gonna add to like, if you look at Nellie, Lydia and Gino, those three, I get Lydia is only 27, which is still wild. But you kind of have the living legend Hall of Famer and Lydia, you have Nellie who will be a Hall of Famer, who's kind of, you know, peak of her career

probably right now. And then Gino, the young 21 year old. So you have kind of a nice mix of players in different stages of their career a little bit as well. But I guess that's what I was gonna ask you too. You know, we've said Ronning, you said Minji. Anybody else that kind of has jumped out at you as like, hey, we need to keep an eye on this player. Well, in terms of like very, very top, maybe not quite, but just below that, like I think

Nana Kurtz-Madsen, the more I looked at her like in the last few weeks, the more I thought, how is she not in our, how is she not in the European Soulhound Cup team? Like she's playing nicely, like top 20 and stuff like that. So from a European point of view, that's something that was quite interesting to keep our eye out, because we are clearly going to have a changing of the guard at the next Solheim, like the Americans did last two times.

So she's 30 though, so it's not like she's new to it, but there's signs that she's looking more comfortable. And then what's cool is you can have all the new rookies coming out, aren't you? You know, now they've waited long enough. I feel bad for them sometimes. It's like, oh, you get your tour card in November, December, you got to wait till, was it end of March or whatever to tee it up. Yeah. It could be a great rookie class. We were talking about that in our season preview. I mean, there's already a couple like top 20 players

in the world who are rookies, the Japanese women. You have some big amateur names that we've been waiting a long time to see have a full season. Hey, just going back to speaking of long putters, did you have a chance to watch much of Yalimi Ngo? She's somebody who was like flat out, like the long putter has been the, I won't say the complete difference,

but she was like, yeah, it was just, I had the yips putting, it kind of wrecks everything. And now she's playing really good golf. I mean, she's somebody that's like, she's good. She's good. She's really good. And if she can make putts, it's like, I, you know, she could be a 15 player, I think potential. I'm not saying she necessarily will, but I'm excited for her playing good golf. Yeah, and I listened to your pod with her and I thought I'm going to see the potter

because the old lab is getting very popular out on tour. And so I just wanted to see how she held it in here because I think when you look at some people, there might be a lot of the men that do it, they might be a bit bigger chested and big, so it looks like they really are anchoring it. But with the girls, because they're so slender, you can notice, we see the gap.

So I was like, oh, okay, so how's that working and stuff like that. But I think how comfortable, even Minji, like how comfortable they look with it is a credit to how quickly like they put it in their game. And as I say, I kind of only saw the highlights because I was out on course, but she was holding her fair share of them. And I think good honour for coming out and saying the yips. I'd like Mindy to talk about it. I do think it helps.

Like a problem shared boys is a problem half. Like you gotta accept it and say, look, you know, I ended up doing this because still there. And then people stopped talking about it. Right. Just get on with it. Unless the cigarettes are running, I guess, and people don't stop talking about it.

Yeah, true. She was just checking the wind direction when she was on. Yeah, crosswind. Well, Sophie, anything else? I want to give you a chance to empty the notebook for lack of a better term. Any burning hot takes or any other observations that you want to share with us from your time these last few weeks? I think we need to talk about the Thailand angels win. I mean, that was record breaking. That was flat out balling. I think she missed one green in regulation

one greening regulation on the weekend. And the finish to that event in Thailand, that 18th hole, it just shows the importance of having like a reachable par 5. There's the first two days, I think they put the 18th back and it was just a boring three shotter. And we were like, come on, you've got to get it back to what to what we know as a reachable par five. And Aki Ewaiz, five-wood in there was just, it could have been the shot of the year, but she didn't win, so it won't be the shot of the year. And just how far Angel was hitting it off the tee. And those two were just like throwing birdies at each other. It was really just phenomenal to watch, like the levels. And I think that's what kind of gets me excited about watching the women's game.

It's the levels that they can now get to and they can pull each other along with it. So yeah, the Angels was a really good win for her. And you know, she's spoken about not getting into the Solemn Cup. And, you know, she's spoken about not getting into the Solheim Cup. And if you look at since then, she just played lights out. So good on her. I was looking at, sorry, I was looking at final rounds,

like her fourth round average is like one of the best on tour. She's better than Nellie's. So if you're better than Nellie in any category, like you're playing good. Well, we were talking a lot earlier about Gino and her winning that $4 million and everything. People forget like Angel is, she only lost by a shot. I mean, could you imagine what Angel would do with $4 million? Come on. And then a couple of weeks later, comes back right around and she gets, finally gets that win, you know? Yeah. I think Angel. Yeah. Angel is another one like Charlie, right? I just love the personality. You never quite know what you're going to get, what she's going to say. But it does seem like Angel's got, I mean, shit, she's ranked 12th, I think, in the Rolex rankings

right now. She's somebody that would not surprise me if she picked off a major here in the next couple of years. Like, I just, if she's healthy and she's right, it seems like she's got a ton of game, Sophie. It isn't. And look, they say you've got to lose one to win one, haven't you? She's done that now. And that's maybe what we

thought with Charlie like the Lillie of Boo one at Walton Heath we thought right she's been in the mix now then hopefully she'll she'll get over the line again soon but those type of characters and that's what's been quite enjoyable about the last few weeks because when you do go to Asia you're all in the same hotel so they can't get away from you. That's why I go to the gym now Cody to get my implants. But it is and they're a bit more relaxed and you just see the personalities come out and if you're walking with them more you watch their interaction. I mean obviously the beginning of the rounds they don't talk to each other that much but by the, you watch their interaction. I mean, obviously in the beginning of the rounds, they don't talk to each other that much,

but by the time Halfway came on Sunday, I mean, Lydia is laughing out loud at Charlie, because I mean, God knows what she's saying. Good job, the mics aren't amazing. But yeah, and then you just think, oh, that's something, and like Gino and Lydia were walking together for the first six or seven holes, which look, maybe that's not great for competition or whatever

but Gino does talk to anybody and I spoke to Gino I was like you're walking like next to greatness aren't you? She's like yeah it's like so cool that I'm playing against Lydia Ko and yeah to see them to see them all things are changing I think I think they're starting to give us, give us more. I did know you wanted to ask me quickly about the pace of play, didn't you? Before we left. Have you noticed the difference? Yeah.

Just cause you know, obviously that's coming down the pike. Yeah, I've noticed, well, they're talking about it, which is good. They're asking, you know, do you think it's going to work? Do you think it's going to come in? Are they going to? So there is that aspect to it. It was hard to get it on. The trouble is, right, when you do a first and a 10th tee and there's nowhere to go, you could play the front nine in two hours, but then you're going to be

waiting on the 10th. So it's only going to really look good when they go in two or three balls and they play one tee start and the cut works. But there is a definite feel of them talking about it more. And I do think as long as it's regulated, it will work out. The stove players are still slow, but now people are like, they know that they're slow. And now there's going to be a process where you can actually be individually timed and that. But they might need more referees. There weren't loads of referees in Asia. So that's an issue as well. They need to get the refs on them. But players are talking about it, which is a good thing. And it might go too much the fast way before it comes back and there might be all over them and they might not like that for a couple of months but I do think it will improve. Well I think there's certain players that will not

like that. I think that the majority though will all very much appreciate that. Yeah like last week I noticed if one player was there was a player that wasn't ready that often in my group so they just yelled across and went I'll, which is a nightmare for TV. Right. You're screaming everywhere. Yeah, so I'm saying, oh, like, first the play is so and so. And then the next thing you know, I'm like, oh, no, Charlie's going, Charlie's going.

There was one hole where, like, they put it out on nine. So Aileen Kim tapped in, right, for a two shot lead. And we missed it. And I said, did you, because Aileen's quite, I like Aileen, she's good, she calls me Sophia. Sophia, yeah. And she calls Katrina Matthew, Matthew, which makes me laugh.

And I go, Aileen, have you just tapped that in? She said, yes, I was like, the leaderboard's changing. I said, we didn't forget that on TV. She's like, oh, so are we. Like this. So, yeah. Hey, Sophie, before you get out of here though, I want to ask a couple of LET stuff because you are my LET expert most of the time. I know bad weather going on in Australia, unfortunately, so they have a three event stretch coming up, right? But when you look at the LET, and there are certain names that jump out to us because

we're more familiar with them from coming over and playing on the LPGA tour, but like, where are we at with, I think a Dick Shot Dag or I think of Bronte Law, like some of these, these names that have made their way over an hour back playing full-time L.E.T., what are we kind of expecting from them in the season? And then, and then down the road, I think we got to talk about Helen at some point. I'm surprised you made it this far.

All in on Helen. Come on. Buying stock. She is in the next Solemn Cup team. I called it in June last year when she was an amateur. I was like, she's in. God, I'd love to hear that. That's no questions. I mean, so yeah, no, no question. Like, what, what, what a talent she is.

Um, and then like, yeah, Bronte just played in Taiwan. So good honour for like going out there. She top 10. So, um, that was a good week for her. I suppose the likes of Dick Shadagga and Bronte are that. We have a thing about hitting it far enough. And there, so for instance, Bronte is similar yardage to Lydia Ko, but really only Lydia Ko can compete at that yardage.

So if the courses are like Kenya, Morocco, well, standard LAT courses, Bronte could like play and it's just the's just just the length is not just quite there um but yeah she'll she'll she'll go she looks settled now you know she's married she's she's very she's a good um good person to go to dinner with broncy yeah she's good talker so she'll be she'll be all right. Who else are you thinking? I'm not, my LAT brain's not on at the minute Cody. Well I know I'm just trying to think because we mentioned Solheim Cup and kind of what could be for the future I

always think of Alexander Fosterling and think yeah who Anna Trevino. Yeah yeah there's a big group of young players out there and it's just I don't know it's What Anna Trevino? Yeah. Yeah Yeah, they're young players out there and it's just I don't know it's always funny to watch them and Obviously they're playing full-time Let and then when they try to kind of make the jump to either be like I'm gonna try to either money qualify into more LPGA events Meaning that's a ton of travel for them or they're going to wait and then we see them come through Q-Series. Yeah, there's a few that sometimes you think, oh, have they gone too early?

First, Aline, I thought, I'd have loved to have kept you for another year. But then you get greedy because I wanted to keep Gino, and obviously she went on to be world number one, and Lin Grant, and so that... So some are ready, but very few are in that sense so I'd be happy to see Firstaline come back a little bit and play because she just don't want to get them lost. I know Pauline Roussard got beaten up a bit by some LPGA events last year

so I'm happy that she's kind of back in Europe establishing herself. I remember Georgia Hall saying like, you know, you've got to be winning, you've got to be dominant in Europe before you go out to America. But because you get into Q series, you've got to try. If you're in the top 10 on the L.E.T., you've got to go and try and get it. And what happens is they're playing such good golf that they end up getting it and it's like right well this is quite a big big jump for me so when they do come back they they kind of play their golf is probably good enough to play LPGA but their consistency of golf isn't quite yet and that would probably be be mine. Oh by the way, Lynn Grant in the gym jokes.

She is an absolute warrior. Yeah she's a beast. I walked in and like just walked back around the corner and walked away. Yeah so she said to me some of us are golfers and some of us are athletes. I thought yeah you like you know what I mean? Like, you're just pure athletes. Well, you have a new captain for your Solheim Cup squad. I'm sure you got to be thrilled with that. I'm excited because there's a very high potential that you could have a playing captain here

based off of pure qualification, which is fascinating to see. But also, I got to beg the question, how many Swedes are actually gonna be on this team in two years? I know, I call them the Swedish house mafia. I don't think Anna will play. Saying that right now on whatever date we're on, March the 5th, I don't think she'll play.

I don't think you can. I feel like she's wise enough to know that. I don't, well if she gets in automatically then who knows, but I just don't think she will. I think it means too much to her to get it right. Chances are, you only get one go. She's been around captains, what, she got seven or eight now? It's like unbelievable, the amount of solons that she's been in. So I would say that she's not going to play.

But I do think she'll be a good captain. So Anna was to the press never gave a lot you know was what maybe you might think like a stereotypical suite in the press conferences but I think now you know she's had a tough few years yeah in a private life and I think the Solheim Cup and the people that were playing in the Solheim Cup and those vice captains have become like family to her and it's made her realize how much the Solheim Cup means to her even more but maybe not just the golf but everything else around it so I think she's going to be an excellent captain I really do and I think we'll probably see the side of Anna Norquist that her family see, like the bananas that support her, you know, that side of her. So I'm really looking

forward to it. I used to play junior golf with Anna, so I'm really proud of her career and now becoming a captain. But I do think you probably have to be careful with the amount of people from one country or one area for the language barrier and how similar you are. So in terms of her vice captain, she's probably going to have to balance. So what she is as a captain and then she's got to find vice captains that will suit other areas, because it is dead easy to pick your friends, I suppose, as vice captains. And it's not necessarily the winning formula, is it? Well, that's part of the game, Sarah. She settles everything. Nobody gets around with anything.

No, and I didn't like those rumours that we weren't getting on, because that's not your route. That needs to be sorted straight away. So, yeah, she'll be a great captain. Who's your captain? Do we know yet? No, I don't know. We're trying to figure out right now. Okay, no, we got bigger things going on. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you got loads to worry about. Yeah. Well, Sophie, thank you so much for joining us fighting through the jet lag. It truly is a pleasure to talk golf with you. We'll have to do this again soon. Best of luck.

I know you have some time at home, so get settled, get recuperated, and then best of luck as you set back out later this spring on the road. We can't wait to see you at the women's open for sure, but we'll see before that sometime. Come on. Come on. Come on, let's go to Wales. I'm going to play some golf in the next few weeks.

That's what I'm doing. Yes. There you go. Yeah. All right. Well, take care guys. Nice seeing you. Thank you.

And for everybody listening, stay tuned. We have an interview with LPGA president Vicki Getz Ackerman. She is going to talk about the new pace of play policy, which we referenced just a bit ago. And you won't want to miss that. That is coming into effect at the end of March at the Ford championship. So without further ado, here's Vicki Getz Ackerman. Vicki, do I have this right? You are the player president. And first of all, okay, welcome to the show. We're so excited to have you. How long have you been in your current role with the LPGA?

So I was president back when I played in 2007. And then in 2011, they started realizing that everyone who was president and playing was losing their job as a golfer. So they made it a non-playing position. So I've been in this position since 2012. Adam O'Reilly Well, we really appreciate somebody from the LPGA organization coming on to talk about the new pace of play policy. I think it's a great step towards combating what's been an issue, not only on the LPGA tour, but we see it across professional golf.

But I was wondering if we could kind of start, Vicki, if you don't mind, with outlining what the old policy was, and then as best you can kind of describe how you got player buy-in and was this new policy something that the players really pushed for at large? Did it come from a certain faction? Could you kind of talk about how we're arriving to a new pace of play policy? So this is definitely player driven. I've saved for the past couple of years, a lot of players have had strong feelings

about our pace of play, the waiting, not making TV windows, et cetera. So we've been talking about it for a while. And actually this past summer, I started organizing with officials to put together a committee and us work on it. It might be easier to explain what the changes are because there's not a lot that's changing. We're still doing target timing.

We're still having a warning. We still do what we call banking timing. And I can explain that where instead of per shot, it is the whole that you are timed on. So for each shot, you get 30 seconds, unless you're the first to play on an approach shot or on a putt or on a par three or reachable par five, those you get an extra 10 seconds. So let's just say you weren't the first to play at all

for a par four, you'd have 120 seconds. And so a plus time would be anything over that time part. So we've kept a lot of what we had already in place and looking at our data, we found that people who had plus times of plus six to plus 15 was the majority of where our fines were coming from. So we wanted to address that. And we felt that by going to a stroke penalty from the plus six to plus 15 and addressing where the errors were being made

by our membership, they would heed the warning and start moving a little bit faster. So that was the thought process behind those changes. So I'm gonna ask a lot of maybe dumb questions and I appreciate your patience. Can you walk through how the players first get timed either then now it sounds like the same, do they have to drop out of position

to then get timed per whole? Could you just kind of walk through the whole ecosystem around timing players? So in order to be on the clock, you have to be out of position. We either out of position with just the group in front of you or also out of your time bar, the set amount of time that is supposed to be in place for you to finish. And that's on the back of the scorecards. And that's something that our rules officials kind of map out what they believe

that the golf course should play in. But the key indicator for a member, unless you're the first group out, is where's the group in front of you? You should be able to see them. If you don't see them, you're out of position. And that's when you would get the warning, which then we hope will cause people to move along quicker. Adam Suellentrop And so in reading the new policy, it's my understanding that what in the under the old

policy, what would have been fines, or what were fines will now turn into one stroke penalties? Is that correct? That is absolutely correct. So we do have a still fine structure in there for a plus time from plus one to plus five. We had one person last year that fell in that and the rest of the group fell into the plus six to plus 15. With this new policy and the current conditions of last year, we would have had 23 players

get a stroke penalty. In addition to the eight players that got a two stroke penalty. So we believe that the threat of a penalty versus a fine, the fine was not moving the needle. It wasn't changing the behavior of our members. We realized it. The members are the ones that are the ones initiated us

looking into this and are encouraging us to do this, which is, I'm super proud of our membership for taking that stance and trying to make a better experience for our fans and our brand. So where we're at currently is, what I think you're saying is that if you're a little bit over, the majority of those people wouldn't be considered like slow players. They're just whatever it was just for that one because you're saying that there's not a lot of people between the one second by second group.

The majority of people that would or this applies to instead of being fines and now the one stroke, the six second to 15 second. Those are ones that you kind of have a feeling like these these people are more deliberate. I'm not going to say slow, I'll default to deliberate players here. Now, I'm sure for them, they feel like that they're being targeted now. So from a tour perspective, or position, you know, how do you grapple with that? Absolutely. So the reason why we waited for Arizona is to educate our members. I mean,

we do not want anyone to get a stroke penalty. We just want to play a faster round of golf. And we also want the shots to be hit faster. Each round is going to be varied on the time it takes by the difficulty of the golf course, the conditions, hole settings, how many reachable par fours and par fives. So we can only, we can control that by changing certain things, not obviously the weather, but we still need our members to hit within their time allotment

to make that experience of watching. So we were having multiple education sessions via Zoom, as well as on-site when we get to Arizona and Utah. We're also sending our members their feedback from the times that they were holed or times that they were timed or holed timed and they will find out where they stand relative to the membership in those categories. Were they in the top 10 percent of the slowest numbers? Were they in the top 10 percent of the fastest? Just so that they know where they are. Our officials are willing to work with any of our members to make sure that they're in

time with their routines. And also we offer this to our caddies as well, because this is a group effort. It takes all of us to make this happen. I heard the previous podcast where we talked about pace of play and I know it is like a traffic. You know, if you have that one group that stalls it up, it kind of backs up everything else. So our goal is to eliminate that possibility

as much as possible. Will the one stroke penalties, again, perhaps a stupid question, these will be incurred in the moment? Will the players know or will it be a situation where they're signing their scorecard and find out? It will be incurred in the moment. Okay. Yeah.

Because I just think back, you know, last year, a rebuttal process to this, you know, there is an appeal, there is an appeal process, but it will happen before the scorecard is signed because anytime you have a penalty, it has to be resolved before people leave the tent because it affects multiple be resolved before people leave the tent because it affects multiple things down the road with the cuts, where they finish, all those different things. Yeah. I commend the new policy.

I think it's a step in the right direction. I, like everybody else, I think is eager to see the implementation. Do you think fans either watching on TV or on the ground? Do you think there'll be a noticeable difference, Vicki? I mean, is that the goal? Well, the goal is to make a better experience for our fans and our brand and actually our members. I mean, I'm not sure too many people want to take six hours to play around.

So I think, you know, this is a work in progress. We look every year at all of our policies, whether it's pace of play or something else, and evaluate whether it's achieving the goal of our membership and what we need to do. I expect that there'll be continual changes over time, tweaking things if there's different things that we need to do to move the needle. I do believe that this will. Not saying that there won't be other things that come to it, but if I were a player and back when I did play, this was what you got. You got a penalty. And I believe we played a little bit faster back then.

Now saying that, I know that the conditions are different, especially in the LPGA, we're playing some unbelievable golf courses now compared to what we played from before and the difficulty level. And I do know that they're playing for a lot of money, but at the end of the day, we need to make our decisions quicker

to put on a better product for our fans. I mean, end of story. That's what we need to do and our members want to do it. And they want a better experience themselves too. As there been, we were actually, we recorded a podcast, oh gosh, after the Genesis on the PGA tour. And we were saying how good the pace of play was. And a lot of that was they had gone off in twosomes.

And I recognize that the LPGA is often in a spot that's maybe not ideal for you guys, but trying to fit to a certain television window necessitates sending groups of three off the front and back even on the weekend. Has any of that been discussed internally? Does you know, I got to think because that plays a part in pace of play as well. Absolutely. Field sizes, whether you're in twos or threes

absolutely does. But at the end of the day, we have certain limitations of when we can be on TV with our TV slots. And that doesn't change. None of that changes the amount of time a player takes to hit a shot. And I think that that is something that is a variable. I mean, you can look at the overall end product of how long did it take to meet your TV window? Did the we make it in five hours? Was it four and a half? But if you're watching someone and they're taking a minute, a minute and a half to hit the shot, that's hard to watch. That's not something that the fans want to see.

So it's not only how long the round takes, but it's how long to hit the shots. And we can show more shots then too. Yeah, a definite upside there. I would say this, the new policy, which I think is going to be great. We'll see what, you know, nobody wants to see anybody get stroke, but I think something is definitely needed, right? Doesn't go into effect until Arizona and the Ford Championship. But I think from the moment that you guys announced this, there is an immediate impact,

at least on the first full field event at the founders. Like the times of those rounds were truly incredible and nothing had changed. There's no rules that have changed or anything outside of just a heads up of this is the route that we're going down. Anything that you can add color to that, that just all of a sudden, you know, we went from five plus hour rounds to four and looking at sub four. Well, it does seem like whenever we have these conversations, people tend to play a little bit faster. I will say that and every other time I've seen the history of it.

But I will say that Brayton Country Club, a great venue, it's an easy walk. I mean, the holes are right on top of each other. And we did have very mild conditions. So with the talent of these players that we have right now, I mean, it was easier for them to get around this golf course. You know, you change it to extremely difficult golf course with high winds, you know, it's going to slow us down a little bit. But again, it's still talking about making the decisions faster. And that's what we need to do. And we're up for it.

That's what our plan is. I know that there's the education window that's built into this and you guys rolling this out, not only to players and providing workshops and caddies and everything else, but did that impact the timeline and when you wanted this policy to go into effect? Or was it just strictly looking at, we're going to wait for the tour to come back on

US soil and we have, I don't know, maybe more tour officials there or more people available to answer questions. Talk me through the timeline. It was definitely the education process. I mean, yes, we've been talking about it. We opened up, we had the committee that worked along our rules officials and our staff. And we had a lot of players send in their thoughts about the pace play policy. But as a whole, we

weren't able to come back with a finished product till that that tournament at founders. And so we felt it was unfair to the membership to, you know, throw this and say, Hey, yes, you wanted it, but to not give people ample time, especially the people that might be borderline or worried that they would be in to get that stroke penalty. So giving them a few months, actually it was seven weeks from the time we announced it, we felt was the right thing to do. But looking forward to Arizona, putting it in place, seeing how it pans out. I'm sure there's going to be bumps. Right now, putting it in place, seeing how it pans out.

I'm sure there's going to be bumps. Right now, everybody's rah-rah. We're great. This is fantastic. And then someone's going to get that shot, and it's going to be tough. But at the end of the day, we truly believe this is the right move for us as a tour, and we'll keep analyzing it to make it better. There were a couple of high profile quotes last year. I'm thinking of Nellie Korda and Charlie Hall specifically bemoaning

the pace of play at some points. Vicki, you don't have to name names, but if you could kind of guess in thinking about the player membership, what percent was for a more beefed up pace of play policy versus those that were dissenting? Was it 75-25? Was it pretty overwhelming wanting to play faster, in your opinion? I think it's a majority overwhelming

that they wanna play faster. Even the players that might struggle with their pace wanna play faster. They may not even realize that they are part of the problem of the pace. So I believe that as an overall, the membership does want to play faster and we're going to need the whole membership to want to play faster. I mean, you get just a few people and they're the outliers and it's going to have that domino effect.

So we need to do this as a team. And that's our plan. I know you said that moving forward, everybody's going to be told or be, you know, they'll get some sort of reporting back of where they're actually stacking pace of play wise. Was that the case in the past? Only people who had gotten multiple fines and whether they were in the double fine category would get that. So no, and I would also say that Intel this past year, we haven't had the amount of data that we've had. So I think we're in a better place. I

mean, no, we do not have ShotLink, which would be so fantastic if there's a sponsor that wants to help us. That would be great. But our team in particular, and on our team, has done an unbelievable job with just the manual work to get the data that they have to give our members information that they need to understand what their pace is. I mean, I told the players in a player meeting back in the day when I played, I remember getting all these time sheets in my locker and I finally was like, why am I getting these time sheets? And I went to one of the rules of vicious dog, my dog, what's the deal? Like, you know, and he's

like, he goes, Vic, he goes, you're slow, you're slow on the green. He was just to the point. And I was like, Okay, okay. And so we talked through it. And I got a lot better. And I was very deliberate. I mean, we say deliberate, slow, whatever we want to call it. But I had some issues pulling the trigger. But I think it's just some awareness too. And I think that this information will be very beneficial to our members so that they understand.

Vicki, obviously you were a long time player on the LPGA tour. Now you're in a different position where you're staff, but you're definitely probably still have the heart of the player at everything that you're trying to do. And you're the perfect person to bridge this gap. Now, obviously there's a lot of things that the LPGA is doing to try to grow not only exposure,

but fan base and everything else. When you get put in these positions and you wanting to successfully execute your job, are you getting pushback? Because I'm sure at some point in time, whether that's television partners or anybody else, it's seeing it as like, hey, we have a pace of play issue. And would have this been moved through if you wouldn't have had the high level player support, somebody like a Nelly or like a Charlie be as vocal as they were? Well, from my standpoint, like my position,

I represent the players and I am actually hired and fired by the membership. So it's a really unique situation and I am the liaison, the person in between. And I always say, once a player, you can't take the player out. I mean they're always there but it's been fascinating listening to all the business aspect and trying to bring that education to the membership and educate you know the sponsors and tv and everybody else on the player's perspective. I think having the strong voice especially from the top players saying that they want this to move and to be better is very impactful. But saying that we've had other situations where we've had to approach the membership about different things

and had to educate the membership like, hey, we need to do this because of this. And sometimes if it doesn't seem like a direct effect to somebody, they don't know all the ins and outs to it. So this is a little bit, the needle moves a little bit easier. But again, we'll get to Arizona and we'll see the little bumps to come through the road, but we'll make it over. Will any of the, I'm guessing no,

will any of the fine or slow play information be made public? Is that something people can check on or is that just shared within the player group? So that's a great question. So no, we're not gonna have this like kind of hit list that's publicized. Things do seem to surface, I don't know how, but they do.

But I believe that when a person gets a penalty that is actually in the notes of the tournament because it affects their score. So things of that nature will come out. And obviously, depending on if a penalty took place with someone that was higher up on the leaderboard, it seems like that might have a little bit more traction because we do, like I said, we had, we actually had nine, was it eight or nine? I think it was nine two-stroke penalties last year,

but I'm not sure too many people knew that we did that. Again, it was nine. The mass was in the part where they were still getting fines from the six to 15. So that's where we need to play a little bit faster. It's so interesting that the fines weren't as much of a deterrent necessarily. When you think about like a one stroke penalty,

what does that wash out in? That's gonna wash out in your finishing position, which will cost you a little bit. You know, it's kind of like a little bit the same in the end, but it's just amazing what actually is a motivating factor. Right? I think, I mean, ultimately, I think the fines, you know, they were substantial for some people

and not for others. It depends on where you are on the money list. But a stroke penalty changes your finish, which probably outweighs the amount the fine could ever be. I mean, think about it. If you finish fifth and you got a stroke penalty and you would have been third, I mean, that's a substantial amount of money. It also changes CME points, it changes world rankings and what you get into. So the trickle down effect of having a higher score, however you make it, whether it's a penalty or not, it hurts you a lot more. So again, I can't enter it enough that we really do not want someone to get a penalty. Like

that's just, I mean, it almost makes me sick thinking about it, but I do, you know, we need to play faster. We need to make our decisions quicker. It's just better for a brand, better for a fan, better for TV. I mean, it's just all around better. So it's going to be a group effort. My personal theory is I think whichever golf league really strives to play faster will have a competitive advantage, at least in the marketplace of viewers. I just think LPGA is positioned to,

hey, if you make fast play like your thing, that could attract a ton of eyeballs. And I think it's something that people would gravitate towards. So I'm excited that you guys are taking this first step. I was gonna ask, you know, we've bandied about the idea of a shock clock. Is that ever something that you think is possible in professional golf and women's professional golf? You know, I'll never say never.

I mean, it's come across my mind and I know others, as you've said, making that happen. There's a lot of variables, but maybe one day, maybe one day I'll just leave it at that. All right. Well, Cody, anything else for Vicki? She has a golf lesson after this, so I don't want to stand in the way

between her and improving the golf game. Vicki Gatz Ack golf lesson after this, so I don't want to stand in the way of improving the golf game. Vicki Gatz Ackerman, thank you very much. Really appreciate the insight and just shedding more information. And like I said, I just answering some of my stupid questions. I really appreciate you joining us.

Yeah, thank you so much, Anthony. I think this is incredible, not just for the tour, but for the game at large. I mean, the more people see people, you know, players playing a little bit faster, I'm not saying going to say fast, but a little bit faster, it improves it all the way around. Yeah, we will be running, but we're going to make our efforts. So that's for sure. But thank you so much for having me and everybody on this program.

It's great to be part of.