No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - NLU Podcast, Episode 120: Kevin Van Valkenburg

Episode Date: February 19, 2018

ESPN’s Kevin Van Valkenburg joins to talk about Bubba’s win at the Genesis Open, what it was like to follow Tiger around Riviera for two rounds, and what we think about the Big Cat going... The post NLU Podcast, Episode 120: Kevin Van Valkenburg appeared first on No Laying Up. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm going to be the right club today. Yeah! That is better than most. That is better than most. Better than most! Ladies and gentlemen welcome back to the No Laying Up podcast Kevin Van Volkkenberg joining us from sunny California. Good to have you back. Second time you've podcasted this week talking about Tiger. Bacon cutch me yet again, huh? He did. Yeah, I got to submit this pretty thirsty podcasting maybe because I think it's this is a nightmare joke on the the hangout the new message board for for NLU and you saw it and you were like, well, I guess I better bring KVV back on.

What's funny. Yeah, I there was a there's a thread on there recommending podcast guests and one of them was a post that just said KVV KVV KVV KVV KVV KVVV and I was like, Oh, wow, this guy really wants KVVV back and I didn't notice that it was you right away It's like you know what I do perfect. I do need to get KVV back on and here we are So I need to rush and burn our accounts to like just go ahead and pop up my profile I will say this week for the first time ever. I'm walking in ropes with a rib I'm with cat and with Rory and and JT I'm you know, I've got my my face in the rib, I'm with Kat, and with Rory and JT. I've got my face in my notebook,

I'm thinking of some good nuggets for a future magazine story. And somebody along the rope line was like, hey, hey, hey, love if you're any guys on the pod, that's awesome, man. And I was like, whoa, I just got recognized for the first time. The no-ling up bump is real. Oh, it's very real. You've never been recognized before that, that doesn't-

Well, not like it at golf sense Not like as a because of my like you know Twitter posse. Did they demand that you do the Gary player on the spot? They didn't and you know what? I felt really bad like I literally halfway up the fairway I was like I should go back and give that guy the Gary player Tident That's the tree you would bring him is that that I owe it to that guy So if that guy's out there listen to this right now, I want him to know. He's like 100 points up tonight.

That's a new record I think minute something in and we already got our got our first Gary player. I had to beg for that one but so you got to see most of Tiger Rory JT I think for a couple of, but I do kind of want to start with Bubba. I do want to get your kind of on course take and what you saw out there. But I know you can get to watch a lot this weekend after Tiger missed the cut, but I'm sure you've seen now that. I'm in Salas from the stuff. I think I can talk Bubba creditably. But that's my point.

As you have one of the people I want to talk to the most about Bubba. So I'll just ask it, is Bubba back? I think Bubba is back. If you were able to go and put some money down on Bubba to win the Masters at 51 before this turning, you're in good shape. I don't think those odds are going to hang for very long. But yeah, I think that it's going to be pretty interesting to watch Bob at The Masters. I mean, my initial impression just watching his post-round interview

and reading his press conference was, God, this guy's such a weirdo. I mean, I love that he is a weirdo in a lot of ways because I think golf is better with weirdos. But like, the whole, I was thinking about retiring ten times and running my minor league baseball team and my card dealership. And then, you you know I was decided to come back and my wife you know heard me say 10 times that I you know couldn't that I should stick with it and you know it's it's insane. I mean this is a person who literally like the most important thing about his game is being able to work the ball like both directions. And for a while, he was such a weirdo that he was more important to him to play a pink or a fluorescent green ball

than it was to have a ball that he could actually work. And that had to be a huge part of why he dropped 150 spots in the World Rankings and was awful for two years. I mean, is it fair to say that we haven't talked enough about how one of the third-ranked players in the world basically changes equipment just to be goofy and all of a sudden he was completely awful? I've maintained that stance for eternity. Somehow we don't talk about this enough, how bizarre it was. Part of it being Bubba, it's kind of like, oh, yeah, he does a lot of crazy stuff But like imagine if like John rom switch to volvitt golf balls

It was playing putt putt balls like right now how ridiculous that would be it is just like absolutely I mean he barely tested them. He didn't even take that much money for him He took about a million dollars from what I gathered and the amount of on course earnings that cost him. I'm sure there's a lot of factors that contributed to his downfall, but that certainly has to be one of them. And the fact that he's playing now without even a ball deal is basically, I don't know who dropped two essentially, but I think he was just done playing that golf ball. It's absolutely insane. It is. And we've talked about a time on this podcast, but I still don't think it's like emphasized enough. I should be talking about that on the broadcast. Look about how he made a significant equipment change to something that no one else is playing.

He watched the world long drive championships and decided he and his interest was peaking playing that golf ball as if he had enough success in his career with the golf ball that he was playing. And now he's back to playing a real golf ball. And he's back, he just won. And one of the toughest tests in golf, and he looks like a scary person again for a Augusta this year. It's kind of, you forget how good he was. It's easy to kind of write him off. And I don't think I'd written him off necessarily, but man, it was just like watching him battle today. It was like, oh, that's right. He is immensely talented. The lines he takes are some of the most entertaining lines in golf and the fact that like see

It's shout out to CBS for the adding the fairway pro-tracer to kind of show that the routes he's taking to get to some of these holes You would never have an appreciation for it if you didn't have that the tracer on those shots But he looks like a bad man again and looks kind of scary and I don't know, I wasn't, I definitely don't root for Bubba, but like I wasn't really rooting hard against him today if that makes sense. I enjoyed seeing like that come back part of that piece today. I mean, I think you can, you know, say like, I don't, I'm not going to be a huge Bubba guy, but still enjoy like what he's in the mix and when he's like a character and golf.

Like, I think we're all sort of worth off when love is an irrelevant figure. Just to get back to the Volvik thing, it is a very telling thing I think about how much the whole industry runs on equipment dollars. What I'm not asking is for like asking CBS to dump all over Volvik, as they're talking about it, just the same way we wouldn't get on his podcast and you wouldn't dump on Callie because it's but just be like upfront about it. Be like, hey, look, he made a major equipment change. And yes, Volvik buys ad time on CBS. But let's talk about that. Like, did that, was that a factor and bringing someone from Volvik around to sort of defend it and say, well, you know, we,

we still are a huge market in other areas. And maybe it wasn't the bright ball for him, the ball, but it's just, it's so hilarious that everyone like who follows golf obsessively like we do kind of gets that and understand what a weird deal that was and it's kind of goes on, unremarkter on the brunt. Yeah. But he's an artist, he really is, He's fun to watch. The top-tracer thing is dead on like as anything engulf viewing Improved golf viewing, you know, more than putting top-tracer like on almost every tee and in the froway like it just it should be that should be Part of your budget for what you when you put together broadcast of tournament You should have that and because it's cool. It's cool, you know, guys like Rory hit it towering shots, and it's cool to see guys who play it low in the

green like, and it's awesome to see Bubba shape the things around. That should be that should be part of more golf coverage. It should be like the equivalent of putting a shot clock up in, you know, like, broadcasting NBA games, which frankly, they didn't do for a long time. Yeah. No, it is it should be the norm. And it's kind of like, I don't know, for years when you didn't have it, every shot that came off the king off the club face looks like it just goes dead right. And you otherwise, you don't know what you're watching until the ball lands.

But knowing what the ball is doing in the air just adds a totally different level of the viewing experience. I can't tell you the times today. With Finao and with Bubba and like some of these shots are being played, how many times like they, when they hit a big hook into a green like I would be like audible like oh shit like that is sick like some really interesting stuff. You know just adds a totally different interesting element. The silliest shot in golf and I wish we could try to get rid of this for the broadcast of it is when you're you're sort of Face on on a player and then he hits it and the camera zooms up to just the ball. The

whole thing is the ball in the air and then follows the ball to the earth. That gives you nothing. It's just a ridiculous way to broadcast golf. Be behind the guy or beside him and give me some sort of like what Fox does where it shows you visually how the drive looks or how the shot in the green looks. Totally. Back to kind of what you were saying there with just kind of Bubba Bean a weirdo. I do feel like maybe just because he hasn't been

as in contention as much or at the top of the storylines that he's kind of dialed back a lot of his antics and he's just not given us too many like of the easy to make fun of pray for Ted Scott moments in recent years. And I don't know if that makes me kind of, this people are going to be all over me for sounding like I like Bubba now. Let me clarify that that's not necessarily the case.

But like I said, beginning, I just have a harder time rooting against them because I feel like he's kind of, I don't know if I want to say, you call him kind of a weirdo. And it's like, he is just a different guy. And I think it's really uncomfortable with a microphone in front of him. And doesn't know how to relay what's going in his head. And it always comes off wrong. And he just ends up kind of looking foolish.

Like, we're talking to some people in the press conference today that just contradict himself like eight times. And I just think he starts a sentence and doesn't know where it's gonna go and just kind of wings it. That's Baba, I'm Baba. But he comes up with a... Because I'm a witness tiger who never says a list word.

Ever, and it's Baba's just wandering from... I got a putting lessons from Mary Badley, but it was awesome, but of course it didn't help me. I won't tell him that, because he's a great guy. Just the rambambling sort of like drunk at the end of the bar almost kind of approach to talking about golf. I think what I've always thought, and I think we maybe even talked about this before, but when he did that big sit down with 60 minutes where he sort of like cut open a vein

and like basically told you like all of his anxieties about his dying, his social anxieties, his fear of heights or whatever. I actually think that was sort of most people like feel unburdened by like letting them just other people in and just sort of saying yeah this is who I am and this is all my kind of idiosyncrasies. I think I think that was bad because I think it sort of it made by the actually think like, as he was walking the rope lines, like all these people are thinking I'm a weirdo, like all these people are looking at me funny. And like, he just was, you know, I remember the masters, I interviewed him briefly outside the big tree there. And he was like, he was the most uncomfortable, I think I've ever seen in my life,

just asking about that interview and just a lot of people do interviews, you know, I just felt like, you know, time to just talk about something, so maybe people stop asking about that interview and just a lot of people do interviews, you know, I just felt like it's fun, you know, time to just talk about something. So maybe people stop asking about it. And whoa, like, okay, I was just, you know, thinking like, hey, it was kind of appreciating the user to put yourself out there. And then you mad at me for bringing it up. It was weird. It was just weird. Well, I mean, just look at this weekend alone for like how many times he contradicted himself, like first of all, with the long, and I love to bring up a long drive contest that he skipped in 2014 at the PGA because he wanted to focus on winning a championship. And then during the middle of this tournament,

it went and played a celebrity all-star game, which I was kind of beating up for like I thought, you know, you could just kind of get yourself so you can roll an ankle, you can get pretty sore if you don't play regularly. regularly obviously I was wrong there because he won the golf tournament after playing in that so but I just thought that was kind of ridiculous and then talking about how he's going to retire if he got to 10 wins and here he got to 10 wins and no one really thought he was going to retire but he of course didn't retire so everything about this week was kind of peak bubble wasn't it like yeah we have we have a great course like a track that is a classic sort of amazing track that fits his Sort of artistic style. We have him you know balling in the interview afterwards Talking about how he you know 10 wins was all you ever wanted and you thought about retiring and maybe retired 10 times and we have him

You know participating in a ridiculous Sort of fam of an event and pretending like that is more important than the golf tournament that he's gonna go on to win. Like all we really needed was him like berating Teddy and then like you're crying about it afterwards to have a complete like the Boba Bingo. It was amazing. We should make a Boba Bingo. There's an idea right there. Some for the masters. I love that. I love that. Yeah well he's probably gonna be a factor in the masters if he continues this but on that note Where so let me ask you do you want Bubba in Paris?

Right now if you were to decide now if we're taking the team over to play now would you want him? I still am very hesitant to say that. He's just in all of his previous, uh, writer cup stuff. He's proven to be a very difficult person to pair with. Uh, if I've still never forgiven him for getting like, drummed by Luke Donald, uh, in Madonna, I mean, drummed. Like, it was down four after four. Uh, to Luke Donald, he was probably hitting an 80 yards bat.

So, I don't know. I mean, we'll look, they put Web Simpson on the team just to get along with him. And it was like it made the team worse just to sort of like cover for a guy who wasn't going to do that well anyway. I obviously think Orange is way on the team, he's going to be on the team, but you know, he's got a lot of long way to climb. I don't know. He's already talking about, you know, I texted Jimmy and said, can I be a vice captain? And he was like, no, I want you on the team. But I think I might like to be a vice captain. I mean, it's such a, it's going to be such a mess this year. I can't wait. It's going

to be awesome. It's going to be better question is would you want Kat on the team if he improves a little bit more? Yeah, that's that's poor. I think I talked about that a little bit and it was kind of something I wasn't willing to even entertain before Tori. And kind of waited very carefully into those waters by saying like, look, if he is around like 20 at their so in the standings, like the team, those teammates are going to rally for him to be on that team. Like those guys are going to want him on that team.

So that's the situation I could see it happening. Obviously, I don't know, I don't want to say obviously, I wasn't expecting him to make the cut this week. I wasn't expecting him in Tori for the record, but I mean, he obviously had what was everyone walking away saying good things about Tori Tory finished type for 23rd. If you remember, he had to birdie his eight is 36th hole to make the cut. Like he almost emptied that like if he doesn't get a nice bounce, we don't have that.

And then he was not close to making the cut this week. So all right. So how I quickly transition this whole podcast. You're done. Bubba, aren't you? You're just done. Um, only thing I only things I had left to say about blah blah was he got one really great break, holding his bunker shot today on 14 because that ball was going off the green.

But those are the kind of breaks that happen to like the guy that usually wins the tournament. Yeah, totally. So his putter can be extremely shaky, but he was 21st in Strokes game putting this week. If blah blah is in positive, that if a high up stroke, gain putting, it's usually bad news for the rest of the field. So he was, I remember seeing looking it up during the, when we were talking about, you know, the ball and stuff. And he was still like in Stroke's game, like off the tee,

he was still like third or something. But he was like around the green, he was like 190th or something. I mean, he was losing like two strokes around against the field, chipping and putting it whatever. Which is crazy, right? Like that's, you know, used to have like a really like competent short game at least. He was just streaky potter but my goodness. Like, how do you just not notice that dramatic of the fall off in your in your game and then just not want to go out and paint a pro-fee one green and pretend to play it?

in your game and then just not want to go out and paint a Provie One green and pretend to play it. I will say he was sixth and strokes gained around the green this week. He had his chipping on point. I was aided heavily by that hole out there on 14. But let's take a minute to talk about the new Chrome saw flow motion video that Calloway just released. I don't even I'm not even sure I knew what flow motion was before this. But you may have seen me tweet about it. If not, you have to go check this thing out at calawaygolf.com slash chromesoft or on any

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Let's get back to the pod. All right, so on a tiger. Yeah, you got to, did you follow all of his first two rounds? I did, yes. Okay. Close up, yeah. So just broadly asking, what is your big, what

are your biggest takeaways or what kind of vibes that you pick up on him in person that might, that we might not have picked up on watching on TV? In person, I would say that one of the biggest takeaways for me is what a sort of kind of, I guess, happier, lighter personality Tiger has now. And I don't know if that's just attributable to, he's happy to be back out there, or age, or honestly, which I don't feel like we don't talk enough about. Like, it would be easy to be kind of like angry and pissed off all the time if you were like addicted to painkillers, which he has admitted like that was a problem for him. And now like if indeed

he's figured out a way to to shake that it wouldn't surprise me at all if that didn't play a role in being just sort of a kind of easier going person. I mean I legitimately watched him like I know they're friendly but like Pat roaring on the back and like, you know, say like, you know, great swing and like, not even just like his kind of cold hearted, but like genuinely do friendly things and amazingly, like kind of ask Rory for some swing advice with the driver on Friday and worry was like kind of you know taking them back and like giving it to him like telling him you know that was much better tempo that you did on that drive on 18 and like this is you know you're coming through you keeping your your shoulder kind of more level whatever and I mean if you're gonna go get driving advice getting it from Roy is like a pretty good person to get it from right but like the idea that the way Just the way that he was interacting with both

RNG to DT to me was really Kind of neat to watch because that wasn't him, you know, seven say eight ten years ago You know, he was just didn't have any time for anybody. It was just so cold killer and so I think you see like those younger guys They so like having them back out there. And I think that's the really is legitimately a big reason why he does like being out there again is because that's how he connects with people. Those are his, you know, I don't know that he has a ton of close friends. Some of that is a conjecture in my part, but I think, you know, that's a big reason why he likes doing this is because

he can sort of actually have the ear of people who we respect and likes and inter golf nerds like he is That's it. It's I've always I found it interesting how in recent years, you know He's in the press conferences. He does leading up to an event and coming back. He's just talking about It's just good to be out here with the boys again It's like in his 20s and 30s. Did you ever hear him say that or Or is he talking about, he's talking about dominating people, right? He was willing to win and didn't care at what cost. And now it's just, yeah, it's great to be out here at the boys again. It's like, what, really?

Like that's, that's, that's good for him, if that's kind of the attitude, you know, maybe he's just, you this is like the epilogue to his career and he does just in general, just enjoy, like the company of the guys out there and being out there and feeling like he has kind of a purpose rather than Toiling away injured and not being able to get off the couch. I'm sure just kind of changed his perspective on things How about that picture him and Phil too like when they saw each other on the range?

I mean, obviously they know what the presents cup stuff like they've hugged and differently been friendly stuff before But just like the joy on each of their faces about like, hey man, look at us, like a couple California kids back at Rive, you know, isn't that kind of a fun, and you could tell, like they were both really genuinely happy to see one another and they were next to each other on the range on Friday too. I mean it's like they would have you know been as far away from each other as possible or Phil would have like in a needy way like wanted to go stand by him on the rand and talk about it was completely iced him and that's just not the way it is anymore and I think that's kind of fun to see. Now like game wise I just don't think he is even remotely close. I think you made a really good point talking about the Slaswick on pod where he was

talking about, you know, his round's a Tory, he really saved a lot with the putter, he was kind of just scraping it around and made it look better than it was, and when the putter went sideways on Friday, he was, it looked ugly, you know, he was just, he was totally on the buggy train, I mean it, every miss on Thursday was right, and so he was kind of like i mean i'm fine like i just need to really you know swing harder with the strap i just getting you know no that with this shaft i can really just crank it and i'll still be in the fairway

and then on friday he was just trying to crank it and everything was left he had a snap hook parathana was standing behind and i think it was on i want to say like twelve thirteen and maybe thirteen behind him. I think it was on, I want to say like 12, 13, maybe 13, any just it should have been like lost ball into the bronca like stuff. It caught the trees and landed turp but it was as bad of a snap hook as I've seen him hit since he snapped that one into the ocean and bubble in 2000. It was ugly. So I

just don't know. He made the point that I thought was interesting that he can't hit his irons like to the right distance right now He's actually hitting it flush in a lot of ways, but there's he can't control his distance And so I don't know what that is whether you know, he's not quite You know comfortable with the swing he's making or his clubs aren't well, right? It was sort of where he feels comfortable with him, but he you said, you know, my whole career of hit the ball can high. And right now, like my hands, when right now I just can't, I made it long or a minute short, and I can't go, I forgot why.

It's just reps. It's a process, you know, my fields are all off. You know, we're going to get all those. No, but that that, that to me, that, it's not alarming to me. That's exactly the kind of, I don't know if Russ is the right word, but the exact kind of a hole in the game that I would expect to see coming back after a ridiculously long layoff. There's some stints in there where he played obviously, but we're talking about a seriously off from professional golf. So that, but that, you know, I expected some waywardness off the tee.

I expected just kind of some sloppiness in there. I didn't expect the putting to be as good as it has been, but kind of also knowing that's not something that you can totally rely on to be there every day. Like you just mentally can't get yourself that out of position on that consistent of a basis and rely on your putter. And just to, you just can't maintain that kind of momentum. So yeah, I was kind of concerned when I went and looked up

his stats for the week. The only thing he did on a positive stroke-scape putting basis for the week was on Thursday. He was in the top 30, I believe, in stroke-scape putting. But off the tee, he was 13th on Thursday, 129th on Friday, off the tee, he was 13th on Thursday, 129th on Friday, off the tee, 125th and 115th. He also lost strokes to the field,

approaching the green both days and lost strokes to the field around the green both days. So legitimately, the only thing he did well was put it well on Thursday. But again, it's a course that, I think his lack of success there is kind of a bit overrated and that he is one there, but he's not, this isn't like a course that you know, I think is is lack of success there is kind of a bit overrated and that he is one there But he's not this isn't like a a a course that he can't really figure out

But Riviera is just a much more serious test than Tori Pines is Tori You can kind of hit it. I mean the fairways are narrow, but you can hit it kind of all over the yard there and not get yourself in too much trouble Whereas if you're hitting it just off the fairway at RIV, you're dealing with a lot more trees, your angles, and your angles into the greener where you get really punished. So often, especially on Thursday, when he would reach for a driver in Missway,

he put himself in the worst possible spots. And I think he played the holes that he missed the fairway the driver, he played him like four over or something on Thursday. So yeah, that's kind of why I wasn't surprised to see a miss. It's like, Riv is just a totally completely, you have to be in control of that your distance,

especially with that firma greens. Like your distance with your irons is especially important and he doesn't have that. So not surprised to see him fade, disappointed, obviously, didn't really give us a ton of great moments. He had made five birdies on Thursday, but yeah. What do you think about Honda? Would Honda. That was my next question. I don't feel much better about it. I wouldn't call it like it's not like a similar test to RIV in any way, but it's

windy there. There's a ton of water. There's some really brutal par fours that really demand you to hit driver. I don't feel definitely don't feel great about it. I could be wrong, obviously, but it's not it's not the same as him teaming it up at a course with a track or D as like Torrey Pines you. I don't I mean if it the win really blows there I think you could shoot 80 I mean I just if it gets it's not quite as you know there's not quite as many subtleties I guess as is really it's just I don't want to see him dumping balls in the bear trap, you know, in the on the Sort of three-hole stretch that's that's brutal, but you know, he's you know, he could play it safe there if he feels like it's coming apart and And be okay. I just don't know it's that it's

He needs he needs to play and I honestly like We keep laughing like saying what well, what if he won? Like, you know, I still can't quite get out of my head. Like, well, he could drive it up badly at Augusta, and he could know where to miss, and he could shoot 72. And who know? You know, he's not going to win, but he could sort of,

you know, scrape it around. And then just watching him this week, I was just like, yeah, he's so far away from actually contending. And that's OK. Like, it's okay to just have this you know just stay healthy and figure out what's next but but but but what if he won just what if you let's talk about that what it is yes I want to get to fill in one second but I want to know like first what on the on the on the what was I mean, first of all, it

was just like a who's who watching PJ tour live watching all you guys walk by every shot. How many media people were out following that group and where the galleries around that group is big as they appeared on TV? On Thursday, the galleries were not huge. I mean, part of it is it's like seven in the morning when he's staying off or whatever. On Friday, the galleries were insane. I mean, they were just packed like crazy.

And it was so hard. My parents from town said, I walked a little bit with them outside their oaps, and you just couldn't see anything. I mean, even if you ran a half a hole ahead, you could barely get a spot to see something. It was really interesting. You know, Roy talked a little bit about this after the round about how Tiger loses half a shot a day to the field because of all the Yahoo's who

like want to scream stuff in his backs when I want to say stupid things. And it's true, like when you really experience it, you know, right there on the ground, I'm not a follow-tiger for a few rounds, but you know, some of them were over and it's got one and stuff, and so it's not quite the same atmosphere. At a place where RIV, they don't limit the tickets, so whomever wants to come, can come. You're going to get a lot of people who are only tiger fans, they're not golf fans, and so they're going to act really stupid. It's really interesting just to hear like, people so desperately want

him to be good again. And it's still so much like, I still believe you're the greatest. I still love you, Tiger. I still know you can do it. And that's kind of encouraging, but there's also still so many people who just want to be like, okay, great. You know, you think you realize how awful that must be to just hear the same things over and over again.

Like, or if you're Justin Thomas, be like, Roll, God, man, roll, God. Like you're not, you're not making that play or happy by yelling dumb shit. Like, I don't quite understand the impulse. I, I, I said this after I caddyed for J.C. in the program of the Memorial last year, and that was just a pro-AM. Like after 18 holes, I was annoyed. And that was my first time going through it at just the stuff that was being yelled at him during that day.

Like Snapchat. It's like that's it. That's what you're yelling. That's somebody like, yeah, that's a phone app. And so I always wondered like how tiger handles that. And if he truly hears it, like if he hears people yell his name anymore after hearing it for 20 years, like, do you maybe tune it out? I really am curious.

And just the approach that he takes versus what Phil takes, fascinates me, right? I mean, what's fascinating to me, yeah, I mean, Phil, I think DJ was making this point on a podcast he was doing about, well, like, Phil can nod to a thousand people whole and give them the thumbs up, and it's like, if he doesn't do it to the one person,

like that one person must think, I would've jerk, I feel like boo me off. What's fascinating to me to watch Sias, he ignores 99% of it, and how he hears like the occasional people that he does kind of acknowledge, it's almost always a kid, or it's a military person or something.

So it's like he is able to internalize it. And yet he will only kind of hand out the sort of the dApps a little bit to someone who he thinks like is worthy of his like hello. And that's kind of cool to watch. So before we go on to fill, you saw obviously as a byproduct of being there, I'm assuming mostly to see Tiger, you saw a lot of Rory this week. So being the resident Rory fan that you are as well, were you encouraged by what you saw from him? I was encouraged by the putter on Friday. I was pretty dismayed by the wedges, which is always going to be,

I think, the issue for him. I mean, I don't look, I'm a 15 handicap at best, you know, like, I can't, for me to critique where his golf swing would be laughable, but I just don't quite get how he's missing wedges by 10 yards. It seems to me like as a professional golfer, if you miss a wedge it should be by three or four yards or you know it should be not long and short. That's what he's missing. He had a wedge I want to say on 17 on Thursday where he bogged both the par five on Thursday with a wedge in his hand. And that just seems like inexplicable. Like hit that, you know, we should hit those to 10, 15 feet.

And if you make the pot great, if you don't, you know, you move on to the next hole, but you should never fly that five yards long. And I just don't quite get, you know, we've, I've made as much as many as he's cruises for Roy as anybody. Love the guy as a, as an interview as an athlete, as a competitor. But, you know, he's changed the ball. He's changed the equipment. He's gotten healthy. You know, he's got his personal life in great shape.

Like all of the things that I've kind of felt like, well, wait till this is done and then it'll be fine. That's done. And you know, he's still, he's just not sharp like he was in 14 and that's the worry I want to see. I think that's the worry we all want to see. And hopefully we will. But to do that again, you got to figure out how to hit those wedges like a distance that's going to give you makeable puts. Yeah, I think the most encouraging thing is everything you're saying, everything I'm thinking,

everything we're all thinking while watching them is just kind of not disappointed right now, but just ready for, ready for contending Roy to be there. And we're talking about a guy that finished T20 this week, you know, he's not, he's not missing the cut, he's, he's not, but at the same time, doesn't seem that close. So I'm encouraged by that. He is, I think I may have said this, we have too many platforms where we give takes down, they've been live show, may have been, may have been the podcast, but I said like watching him in Abu Dhabi take on the lines that he

takes off that he was my first real, and I've watched a ton of Rory, but my first real appreciation for exactly what it means to be a great driver of the golf ball. There were some corners he would get around that Matthew Fitzpatrick is 70 yards back because he has to take a different club. The narrow parts of the fairway that he's willing to put the ball in, it's truly, it's an incredible skill. Now, the only way you're gonna greatly benefit from that

is if you're taking advantage and stuff getting close from those spots. So that he's not doing right now, I don't know. He's gonna have weeks, you know, he's hit a ton of wedges to 20 feet and not rolling in the pluts. He's gonna have a ton of weeks where he hits everything to 12 feet and he runs in half of them

and that's when he wins. So I feel like he's, I feel like it's weird to say, I never feel like he runs in half of them and that's when he wins. So I feel like he's, I feel like it's weird to say, I never feel like he's in tight, like in super close with his wedges, but he's always putting from like 10 to 15 feet when he's playing really well and he just makes enough of those to win. So I think what's going to happen with him this year is that what really needs to happen maybe is that he just has one kind of swing thought one day that sort of takes it like, you know, the first couple he gets, he hits it tight and he just rolls off a win and then it's like, oh my god, like I've won one for the first time in like a year

and then, you know, maybe reels off like two of the next four or, you know, three of the next eight or whatever, like he's, I think he's, I don't know, it doesn't feel like he's close, but for him it's so much about confidence and sort of swagger. If he gets that back that he hasn't had for quite for a year or two, that's going to be really fun to watch. It's not the kind of thing you'd get back at Augustaac because that place is always going to have a little bit of demons for him, but somewhere along this year, he's going to tear up a course. And he's here at 62. Like he did back when he was winning, just dominating courses.

And then all of a sudden, it's going to be like, all right, he's in it. It's pretty great to go. He's going to win the PGA. He's going to win the British this year. Yeah, no, I think getting in contention, those first two events there in the Emirates was big. I don't want to say in like good enough, but for him, kind of woke him up to be like,

yeah, I still got this, like I've got this. I'm not that far off. So I mean, not a great start to his state side season here, but he's gonna play a ton, and there's gonna be a lot more to judge him off of than these couple weeks. And again, talking about a guy that finished 20th this week, it's far from the end of the world there in that regard.

So, all right, let's talk about your boy Phil. Finish T6, coming off at T5 and a T2 in the previous two weeks, leading up to that, are we feeling that a win for Phil this year is he finally gonna get off the slide, no win since 2015? It would be great if he did. I still think that like all that really matters to Phil is like putting more majors up like he doesn't need to win like a 44th tournament. I would be nice to like if he did it so he didn't people wouldn't talk about it.

But you know what'll matter is if if he goes out, you know, on Thursday Augusta and shoot 68 like that's all that he really is. He's got to want. He looks, honestly, we're making a little bit too big of a deal about this in the broadcast, but he does look trimmer. He looks pretty in good shape, start to season. With him, maybe he's got his fitness and the arthritis stuff is all under control and maybe it's just like Ready to go and he's he's putting a little bit better and certainly driving like if he just drives it Okay, like he's gonna be in contention because it's gonna hit great irons and That's where he's that like he's it is kind of remarkable that he's I think he's 47 this year I'll turn 47 to go so open this year

He's older than Nicholas was when he won the masters when it seemed like a huge deal So if he won a major this year it would be you know, it'd be the oldest majorolder than Nicholas was on any one of the masters when it seemed like a huge deal. So if he won a major this year, it would be the oldest major winner other than Boros, whatever. So that's the kind of a remarkable thing that he's still this good, this competitive, like late into a career where the field is much deeper. It isn't like, our polymer winning, the Phoenix Open when he was 50 or whatever, whatever, like he's, this is a field where 100 guys can win, not six guys can win. Right, and I mean, him at age 46, 47,

and playing five weeks in a row, like that's no joke. I was, I didn't even realize that until today that he played five in a row. When I go to a tournament, I mean, I do, I do walk a decent amount on the golf course and I try to get out every single day and follow some guys and whatnot. I'm not playing around a golf every day and dealing with everything they've got to do. But after that week, I'm pretty wiped.

I'm pretty like, that Monday, Tuesday is kind of a dead day for me usually. Just some kind of jet lag or some kind of travel. Obviously, flying private and stuff makes it, makes it a little different for him. But man, five weeks in a row is a lot. I'm sure I'm going to have played that well. And the thing is back is it's putting. He's top 10 on tour right now in Strokes Game putting.

Still not driving at grade. He's, that's not going to change in this far into his career. But I don't know. I think the putting thing is very encouraging. And it just, he seems to have a little bit more spring in his step this year And I think he really did deal with some fatigue issues last year It seemed like he just couldn't last four rounds, but having some really strong finishes these last three weeks kind of makes me think like

All right, this might be things might be I'm not expecting like a huge career resurgence But I do kind of disagree. I think I think he does want to win one really badly And it's just really in some tournament. Yeah And it's been almost five years since he's won. I think that matters to him. So I think he would start believing a lot more that he can win majors if he won the St. Jude Classic or something like that even. Would you feel more confident in Borey closing the deal or the guests that are leading in the fall round or leading to the fall round in Borey closing the deal?

I guess they're leading in the fall round or Phil, leading to the fall round in the open closing the deal. Oh, God. I think we're worried. What would have you more on the edge of your seat, like tearing apart of no-ling up towel like Geri Tarcanian used to do? To be honest.

I would be more nervous for Phil knowing the amount of attempts through our left, right? And I think it's so easy to get, you know, if, you know, if Rory has a five shot lead on the back nine Augusta and blows it this year, people are going to say he's, he'll never win a master's. It's like, well, it's probably got like 15 good more chances at this. And it's so easy to kind of, yeah, so if, yeah. So if I wouldn't, I don't know.

I don't also don't really believe that much that Rory's really got demons, at least. I don't think it relates to 2011. I don't think there's legitimately issues with, or just holes out there that he has trouble with, or certain shots out there that he does have trouble with that are always gonna kind of give him trouble more so than that back nine collapse.

If anything, I kind of view that that 2000 masters is something he hopefully draws back on. I was like, I can definitely compete on this golf course. So I do think he's gets tired of talking about it. The same way that Jordan got tired of talking about, you know, blowing it on 12, like every year where he kind of comes to the masters with like a different sort of like mentality of like, Oh, I didn't play as much this year. Oh, I played a ton this year.

Or, you know, I'm not really like worrying too much about it. Or, yeah, I'm embracing the pressure. Or, you know, it's so it's like, when you start talking your way around it, like those different kind of things, I think it gets in your head a little bit. Like, I don't think it quite, it would be impossible for Phil not to get nervous

if he was leading on the back on it. Shini this year. Oh, of course. Yeah. I mean, he's got to start seeing, seeing, reading the tea leaves and knowing, I mean, I think he's got one good run and left in him in the US open. I don't know where it's going to be or what.

But yeah, he's got it. He's got to know that it's kind of a last, but I don't know. The storybook way he won in 04 when it kind of really did feel like, all right, is this guy ever really going to win one? Makes me think that it just makes me think that that guy is capable of rising to the rising to the situation in a way that not everyone is capable of. And he's proved that so many times in his career that the fill presser of the one that has opened. Oh my God. I hope he wears that leather jacket

that he wore that unfairity. We'll see it's actually not that hard to win a US open. All right, we got a great look at Patrick Cantley this weekend. Yeah. It wasn't his best weekend, but he gave us kind of a taste for what kind of a player that he is. Are you ready to pencil him and for France? I hate to make, I hate to make everything right or cut. Yeah, but that's what we do. That's what we do all year long.

So, if it keeps up, yeah, I'm really, I'm big on Cantley. I'm really, I'm buying stock already. Like it's like the swing, love the pedigree. You know, he's got the town of Justin and Jordan and those guys. It's just career kind of got derailed because of the car accident and some other stuff and I feel like totally like I'm, I'm, you know, on that. I'm always wanting to go younger on the sort of the bottom end of the Ryder Cup because it just helps build for the future and I feel like those guys totally embrace it and I just don't like, you know, did Ryan Moore really like help out the Ryder Cup team that much?

Like he was okay, but like obviously JT should have got that spot, you know, in retrospect the idea that literally like one of the three most talented players of his generation didn't get that last Ryder Cup spot seems ridiculous like it would have been such a good building block for Paris if they had given it to GT and instead kind of gave it to a journeyman and that's that's why I think you just need a captain who doesn't really feel like it's about to the media pressure or whatever like who it would have lasted about five minutes

if people were like, it's so unfair, that Justin Thomas reasoned on anything. Well, I'm the captain, I get to pick one on a pick. That's why they named me the captain, you know? So, as soon as balls go in the air, like there's no fair, unfair, like it's a really different scenario. But the one thing I kind of go off of though,

and I've said this a lot, but like that team that won 16 1 1 2 1 1 1 a half that didn't have JT didn't have Cantlay and didn't have and this could be for better for worse, but didn't have bubble on either. Like if we get a elite performing bubble back that maybe has a resurgence in the rhetoric, I think that team all of a sudden becomes ridiculously stacked. And I know I've gotten way too excited about this US prospects. But man, I think people don't fully, fully appreciate how good Kampley is and kind of how, you know, well,

Ram is kind of emerged into a top three player in the world. But there was a time there where DJ, Speed and JT, you were the top three ranked players in the world. And it's kind of, that's a tough top three. You know, those two, those three guys are going to play four matches and It's it's a formidable team and it's going to continue to get stronger I think throughout the year, but Man, we're gonna I can't we should keep a tally on how many times a rider kept gets mentioned on this pod between now and then I Was literally just thinking that I think you should give a t-shirt to someone who will keep a tally of all the people that you and I have put on the Ryder Cup team over the years talking about this, whether it's De Shembo or Fina Hal or whomever, like we have we've put a lot of different dudes,

you know, whether it was, I'm trying to stuck on not Lee McCoy, but the other Stanford kid who is dead. Oh, Maverick Pigneli, but nearly we don't feel like we threw his name out there. Patrick Rogers has been out there from time to time. I think Bryson, I think even I may have mentioned that a couple years ago. So it's going to be fun. Free T-shirt, free T-shirt to anybody who could pause the entire list of people. Yes, correct. On KVV's time, you're going to buy that.

Other guys in the mix, Finau and Nal were tied for two and some quiet top 10s for Speed and JT and also Zander Shoffley. Another guy could be on the back end of that team. So I know you didn't get to watch a ton on TV, but will you entertain me at least a little bit while I vent about the broadcast? Gonna try not to beat the Dead Horse too off too much

that's been covered, but I wanna get your perspective on it too as a journalist and a media member. It's making sure that we're barking up the right tree kind of with what we're talking about with television coverage. So you've heard me say it a million times in a million different ways. I just want you to confirm that we're on the right track. And don't, okay, if we're wrong, don't tell me. You're on the right track.

And I think the criticism is totally fair. And I think that any idea that it's unfair, I mean, it's clear that they're listening a little bit because of all the kind of subtle comments of like, showing a lot of life golf today. Wow, isn't that your job? I think they are so the point that you made about DJ, like the number one player in the world shoots 64, you know, almost shoots 28 on the back nine, and they don't show a single shot of his until he's second shot

into 18. And then they show highlights. So it's like, it wasn't like there was in cameras on him. No, no, no, no, no, they showed highlights from the second round. They didn't have, yeah, they didn't have cameras on him him during and that same nine on Saturday, Halhtong Lee made an ace on the sixth hole, one of the coolest par threes in the world. And they didn't have video of it. They didn't even mention it on the air. Like, I don't know how that happens. I always thought like every, every shot is essentially recorded in some way. I know like some tournaments like in my a coba and stuff and they don't have cameras on absolutely everything. But I mean, if somebody makes like an ace on a Thursday morning, that, that, I know like some tournaments like in my Acoba and stuff and they don't have cameras on absolutely everything, but I mean, if somebody makes

like an ace on a Thursday morning, that, I see that highlight somewhere. I can't remember hearing him the whole one that I can't watch in some way. Yeah, I don't, you know, it's, it's inexcusable. And I mean, look, if you want to tell me like, look, we didn't have a camera on me, so we can't show that like, okay, I understand, like, I think it's an error because here is a player who has a potential market of two billion people who are seeing his golf.

So maybe talk to CBS China and see if you can't get a camera that falls around with a whole round and get a special feed to Mac home to Beijing. But the idea that the number one player in the world would play really great and it would be like, it wouldn't even matter is bonkers. Like what in the world? How does that even happen? Yeah, it's just an enormous whiff. And like, I forget, I think it was Jay Rigen made the point where he said, like, look, part of what we're relying on you for is to be able to handle the unexpected, right?

I mean, that's kind of what's in it for in sports is to be able to tune into something that's unexpected and exciting. So, and also, when was the tournament that JT literally almost won? It was speed. It was speed and he bogeyed 18 to finish a shot out of the playoff. And the first hole they showed him was the 17th That was like in 2015 I think before he was before he'd won the Masters and that was here at Rivera Correct. Yeah, that was it riff

What's up with riffs being sneaky like you would think that DJ and spieth would be people that they would kind of you know Want to pay attention to yeah, I mean there was he was only shown a few times this weekend too, which again, quite curious. But yeah, they, they, they, they brag about how many shots they showed. They showed 183 this year. And we had charted on the same Saturday, two years ago, same guys in the intention bubble leading. They showed 184. So I go over to, oh, despite all the, we're showing all this live golf. They, they did not show any more golf shots on this Saturday.

First of all, that is a laborious, I don't know if that's a word, but that is a laborious task. Laborious task of counting all those shots on that Saturday. We were aided by some alcohol, but we had some fun doing it. I don't know. The thing is, it just kind of, obviously I'm a diehard golf fan and I can't sit down and watch the tournament without being distracted by something because it just has no flow.

There's so many commercials, there's so many ad breaks within, they don't even go to commercial and CEO interviews and it just has so little flow that it makes me upset. Even if ads pay the freight, I understand ads, you got to have ads, that's the reason why we can watch it But why are we showing like tap ins like the idea that we are wasting 40 50 seconds a minute and a half to what to go to someone tap in is ridiculous just tell me like Yeah, Bubba made his tap in there and we go now to 13 to watch you know, can't lay like it like it's just absurd Like I think it's and and it's certainly a product of there's no competition, you know, so CBS is just kind of kind of do what it's going to do.

The only thing that can really change it is like if people get upset if they sort of are like, yeah, you know, I'm disappointed in this broadcast and you know, that I think that happens with every network. That's the only way that things change, you know, it's just, it's, things change. But the one thing that we always kind of noticed in the open championship is if you can watch the actual like Sky Sports broadcast, it's so dramatically different from what you see in the States and so much better. It's just like a minimal this kind of golf. It's its golf. How much would you pay to be able to watch just golf? You could name a price

and you would and I would pay it. That's what I'd pay. PJTore live. I mean, that's just it's not a full-on broadcast. I'm not showing every player in the field, but you get I mean, that's awesome to get every single shot from six guys as long as they pick the right guys. Like they hopefully, I would assume they got some major subscriptions of PJTore this week. You pair Rory, JT and Tiger together. Like people are going to sign up to watch that. That should be like just the test case for if you build something good then people are going to pay for it and get it. So I think that's what that seems to be more where they're trending of like,

we're going to have a super group and we're going to put it on PGA Tour Live. Like sometimes when the PGA Tour Live is awful, like, you know, there's been some, like, last year, we all kind of joke about like, are you kidding me? Like, that's, you know, it's like Westwood, like Mike Weir and I don't know who else, but like, you know, it's, sorry, just shout out to those guys, shout out to Mike Weir, but, I think that's, you don't want to watch that. Like, you want to watch as the best players in the world. Like, if you offered me, like, NBA, NBA like league pass and I got to watch you know like

God what what is some of the worst like Charlotte versus you know The Kings like every night like I'd be furious, but that's like the equivalent of not getting to watch good players Right. No, it's it's it's the back to like how tongue Lee they, people should hear his story, right? It's kind of a big deal that he's over in the States playing and he's this, I think he's 22 years old and he's like got a lot of personality. Like he's a funny guy from everything that I had. He's huge too, right?

When he shook Roy's hand after the, I was like, oh my God, this guy's huge. Like a six four or something, like. He just wanted Europe, like show him the show, two of his shots and talk about his story a little bit rather than You know, I mean, I don't we showed every one of Kevin knowledge shots. I think this afternoon That's fine, but if you're capable of that then you capable of showing a lot of other things too So I mean not finished T2 that was probably not the best example, but

All right, that's that's all I had for my furious note taking. Is there anything else we missed from the week? for my furious note taking, is there anything else we missed from the week? Um, I think we're good. Did anybody, anybody miss cut that was surprised? And we were, uh, no, I, I thought, I mean, DJ almost missed the cut first of all, got himself back into contention and almost, yeah, that was,

that was extremely impressive and kind of an underrated storyline. I thought he was toast. I mean, tripled number five on Thursday and was four over at one point I think and then battle back to make the cut. That was that was impressive. But now other than Big Cat missing the cut, there wasn't anything, anything major that stuck out. I mean, Ribb is, we touched on it, but man, it's so cool to watch guys. Everyone's kind of ripping on the first

hole, being too easy, but it's like, I love that they just kind of hand you a hole to start with It's like here's your birdie hole now the rest of it get really hard and there's even like interesting Strategy elements to that first hole where you play it and was that your first time at Riv? It was first time there so it was a cool. You get to see it was fun to walk around with Andy Johnson Friday again Johnson and him be like, oh, yeah, the place is pure, but this I'd cut these trees down right here. There's a, they're an abomination. I can't imagine how many trees he would remove on that property.

Oh, I got it. It would, it would be super controversial, but it would also be super fascinating to, to see Andy get like his chance to tear apart riff. Did you get to watch much of number 10? Yes. And it was fun. It was certainly cool to see both Tiger and JT laid up the first day and then worry, tried to drive with Threewood

and gotten a horrible, horrible lie and then chipped in from the flu, the green, and then chipped in. And the other guys hit great wedges to a few feet. So it was, I did watch some of the other players as I was kind of walking around. It's, it's fun, but it is kind of, you know, Andy was, I saw, did write up, making some points about how 10 is great, but it could be better.

I want to see the, the funnest shot I saw all week was Tiger Birdied 10 on Friday. And then he came to 11 and he was obviously needed to like make around to make the cut. He hit a bad drive left into the trees and it looked like he was kind of in jail and like I was standing just a few feet away and where it was completely like chaos all around. And finally got everything calm down and he hit a four iron that went about a hundred yards, like maybe six feet off the ground and then started to climb.

I don't even know how that's physically possible and then started to draw left. And I was like, oh my God, this guy's still got something. And that there's only maybe three or four guys in the world in golf history who could do things like that It's heavy was one but just the artistry and the strength and the balance that that took You know, he maybe hasn't figured out what it's like to hit just a normal shot anymore

But when he has to sort of summon all of his gifts and do stuff like that I mean the the roar that went up it was like it was as big as any birdie roar when that happened because everyone around just couldn't believe watching the ball shape in the air like that. That's one of those shots that's worth the trip just to be able to see that because you'll never was said was, you know, Peter Cossus was teed up and asked what he thought of the 10th hole and he's like, I think it's too severe. I think the green complex is too severe. And like, that's, that's what the like, put Brando on a broadcast and that's the kind of things that he's going to say. He's going to make points and not be afraid to ruffle feathers. Like, that's not that controversial of a statement, but like you don't, you just never hear that kind of analysis. And I give him credit for kind of trying me because I've argued that 10th hear that kind of analysis. And I give them credit for kind of trying me

because I've argued that 10th green is way too severe. And I think the whole is a bit silly, to be honest. I think it really could be a great strategic hole, but it's not because there's just not that much incentive to lay way back off the team. You gotta get really just, and essentially you gotta get lucky on your T-shot that it goes the right distance, right?

And it's not really fair to ask a guy just like all right you got to hit this 287 yards and not 292 because you're blocked out if you do and I just don't think that's the most ideal fair test question of a player so yeah no I agree I I'm a big person who believes that like the a great shot and a bad shot shouldn't be determined by just luck. That's, you know, I think you should get, it should be strategic more. You know, if you're willing to take on something, like you have the potential for trouble,

but you can be rewarded and good. And I just don't, if that pain is in the back, literally no one should hit driver because there's no good scenario that comes out of that. I'm supposed to go drive at the bunker and try to tip it close, but it just doesn't, most of the time, it's going to run way off and you're going to make four or five. I do salute a hole that's going to mess with guys. They need more of those. They do, but I do think there's just some changes they can make to that green contour.

Why need a bit and kind of give, encourage guys as blasphemous as to say encourage guys to lay up. I want guys to have an option with a wedge from the middle of the fairway at least like make the decision off the tea interesting, but they'll get there. So all right, brother, I'm going to let you go. Sunday night. Thank you for thanks for taking the time. Happy to get your own course reporting and we will be hearing from you. Probably soon rather than later, really enjoy having you. All right, we'll speak soon, later, man. That is better than most. How about him? That is better than most.

Better than most.