No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - NLU Podcast, Episode 17: Justin Thomas

Episode Date: May 22, 2015

The NLU podcast is back in a big way. The young guns on the PGA Tour are making ridiculous moves on the tour thisyear, and 22 year-old phenom Justin Thomas has been on the verge... The post NLU Podcast, Episode 17: Justin Thomas appeared first on No Laying Up. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most. Alright, welcome back to the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show.

We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show.

We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. We're going to be back in the show. Better than most! Alright, welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to the No-Lang Up Podcast. I am Chris Solomon, I'm ecstatic to announce for the first time ever we have a PGA tour player on the podcast.

Justin Thomas himself. Justin, do you have any idea what you've signed up for? Am I going to get a phone call from your agent demanding that this thing gets taken off the internet immediately once it's posted? Hopefully not. If he does, I'll be sure to let him know to keep it up there for a little bit. Well, I want to talk to you about a lot of things today. First of all, I want to congratulate you on the success you've had so far in your first PGA Tour season.

And before, I believe you just turned 22 years old. You've got five top 10s already on the PGA Tour season this year. But one of the first things I wanted to ask you about and talk to you about, more, is what life is like on the PGA Tour. I mean, this is your rookie season on the PGA tour. And first of all, when you are, I guess, making your schedule or your events for the season, what are the first things you look at for tournaments

that you want to play? Is it proximity to where you live, the courses, the field? What are the first things you think about when deciding where you want to play? Yeah, well, you know, being a rookie, rookie, you don't quite have that luxury of getting to choose as much. And that's something that was definitely difficult to start the year. You really need to play in anything and everything to start.

So you can kind of get in the reach-uffle and all that stuff was so confusing and it was kind of hard to learn. But I pretty much was just told by most people when I ask that just don't worry about it and you know make sure you're prepared and play well and you know have to worry about the reshelf so that was that was my best learning experience I had from that standpoint but um be I mean unfortunate to where I got off the start I did to where I can pick and choose a little bit now and I'm'm just I think more so it's not so much the proximity to home just because they do pretty pretty good job of keeping

everything in a relatively similar area you know they don't go California, Florida, Texas, you know New York anything like that and everything's in a pretty general area and I think it's just most important to just realize what's best for my rest and I know that I definitely don't want to play more than four weeks and that that fourth week and I can get probably a little short tempered and I'm probably not very much fun to work for if you ask my caddy and just you know more so just kind of figuring out what what's what I need to do you know, more so just kind of figuring out what, uh, what's what I need to do, you know, stretch wise to, uh, to bring out my best golf. Yeah, so like, if you get to, I guess, like, maybe your fourth turn in a row, how much are you, how much are you feeling fatigue at that point or how much are you, I'm sure you try to want to balance, you know, when you're playing really well, you, you want to teet up again the next week. I guess, how do you, you probably don't know until you're in the moment, I guess, when

you are truly fatigued, right? Yeah, I mean, it's tough, but I think the biggest thing that I notice is just, I mean, mentally, you just get really fatigued like that. And you know, just, like at the end of rounds, just kind of makes some mistakes. And you know, maybe you go after some pins, you shouldn't go for her you know just make some sloppy mistakes it's not really taking your time but I think that's something that that just kind of comes with the learning experience and you know hopefully I'll be able to pick and choose my career or my you know my schedule for my career to where I won't have to you

know pull myself in those positions too often. I'm also interested to know, I know, you went, you got your PGA tour card through the web.com route. I imagine the change in the system for how you could, we're able to qualify for the PGA tour, you know, needing to go the web.com route and unable to go from Q school straight to PGA tour, that rule change probably happened right about the time you were looking into turning professional. Did you ever have any consideration of going I guess the the

Brooks Keppka Peter Uline route of potentially doing the European tour and trying to get your card I guess the way also the Patrick Rogers is trying to get it now you know through special temporary membership using your sponsor exemptions or was there ever any thought to that? And what are your thoughts on the overall qualifying system for the PGA tour, being a young guy on tour? Yeah, it was tough because, I mean, I think like any, you know, any top college or amateur player when you turn pro, you want to go out on tour as soon as possible. And, you know, it's unfortunate to wear the year I termed Pro, it's happened to be a year after they changed that, you know, that system. So,

there wasn't really too much I could do about it. But in the end, it honestly, I really think it benefited me. It's playing just having a year under my belt, where I played under schedule, and, you know, I played a year work. I want a money list, and, you know I played a year work I want a money list and you know every dollar counts and every shot counts and realizing where what I need to do to you know for traveling and and what days I like to travel I mean that was huge for me and although I would have liked my my first year doing that to be on the PGA tour in the in the end that I think this is that was probably more beneficial for me and I learned a lot

from it, and it just kind of helped me a lot this year, when the times I've gotten in contention, although it's a little different stage in a lot of people watching, I still understand how everything reacts just from, you know, it's just like last year. Yeah. Other than the answer being everything, I would, what is, what are the biggest things that are, the biggest differences, I guess, from playing a season now in the PGA tour versus the web.com tour? What are the biggest things that are more difficult, I guess, to get used to?

Um, I know it's tough. There's just so many, things, but it's crazy how deep the fields are out here. This year has been a pretty crazy year, but it's been a wild, you know, you have a lot of guys that, if they play well, they're good enough to win the tournament. And I'm not saying that that's not the case on the web.com by any means, but I just feel like a lot more often than not, you see guys contending, you know, the best players, you know, like Patrick or Pat and Kazir out there on the web or guys like that where they're really good players, they're going to contend, you know, a lot out there and out here, you'll have a, I feel like you'll have a good week, but you just

don't make a couple of plots and next thing you know, you finish 40, if I 30, if you don't really feel like you played that bad, so that's just, but that's just a part of it. Yeah. Would you say, I guess, has there been anyone in your time on the actual PGA tour that's kind of mentored you? Any surprising older guys that you maybe didn't know before that have gone out of their way to help you? I know your friends with speed and that helps to have a guy around your age who's at least been there for a season or two.

Is there anyone that's kind of a friendship or like an older guy maybe even that you've developed as kind of a mentor in your short time on the tour so far? Yeah, I mean I'm probably a lot different than other guys. I've really tried to branch out to a lot of guys and ask as much advice as possible. I mean there's obviously times you don't want to get too much advice, but I think at the same time I think if you get a lot of advice and you realize the things that you think are beneficial and the things that are going to help you out and you kind of take the small bits here and there over the long run and it will really help you out. I mean I remember when I turned pro last year I called Phil, Michael sent a nasty and a bunch of questions you know when he turned

pro and stuff he dealt with and Davis love his son. But I'll be honest, I've bounced a lot of stuff off of Davis and Scott Pierce, he's been very nice to me as well. I met him when I was a junior and he actually at the bar in Nelson. I was probably up 65 years ago and I mean, he's the same thing. I mean, just asking, asking little questions, like, you know, where should I stay? And there's little things like that going to place like Hawaii

or something like that. It's just anything I can make a little easier on me. It's been good to, you know, ask those guys stuff. Did it feel, I guess, normal and routine? I imagine not in every step of the way, but once you got out on the tour, did you have the pretty much immediate feeling like you belong there and that's where you should be or was there a phase, I guess, when you're warming up on the range and you look to your

left and there's Phil and there's Tiger right there next to you. I guess that's probably two separate questions, but did you ever have to pinch yourself and be like, look, am I seriously out here in the PGA tour right now or is it was I obviously I think you've shown yourself extremely well since you've been there and you've proven you belong there but was there ever any I guess initial doubt or initial kind of starstruck element to when you first came out. Yeah I think when I first got out there I just had a totally, just a totally wrong mindset in the events.

And I was fortunate to wear my plates and events, you know, as in collegeers and amateur got some exemptions and played. And I played enough to where I knew what I was getting into. I mean, I knew how good the guys were and I've played against them plenty of times, especially with all the young guys on the tour now. I mean, I've played so many amateur events against them, and I knew that my game was good enough, but that being said, I don't think I had necessarily the right mind frame, and I wasn't going into events trying to win.

I was just more so going there, okay, you know, hopefully I'll make the cut here, and then see what happens. And this first couple of events, I just wasn't really prepared for honestly and I'm going to show it and then I didn't play well and then once I got in contention at Jackson's recipe, I mean, every week I've heated up since then. I've gone to the tournament with the intention of winning and I think it's, you know, I think much, obviously I feel like I've gotten better and matured and gotten more comfortable but I still think that's helped me a lot.

Well, I want to get into a little bit about more golf specific things but one thing I always like to pick the brains of when I've ever talked to a PGA tour player is what actual life is like day to day during a week of a PGA tour tournament. I'll tell you the foundation for the question is Growing up watching golf. I used to always it. I'm from Dublin, Ohio. I always attended the memorial tournament every single year and I you see these professionals come in and you watch them You only see them in between the ropes and from that role and you watch on TV obviously But from that role the life of a PGA tour player looks like the best possible life in the world.

It looks, I mean, all you think about is the millions of dollars they're making, they're playing golf or living, they're going all over, they can play golf wherever they want. And since then, I've made some friends on the PGA tour, I've had a friend stay with my family during the memorial tournament and when he was playing the tournament and I got an appreciation for what the day-to-day life is. I mean he'd be leaving our house at 8 a.m. coming home at 9 p.m. on the Tuesday before the tournament. So and I always pictured like you just show up at the course. All your bags are taken care of your clothes or ironed

in your locker and like that was not the case. Like I picked them up at the course, all your bags are taken care of your clothes, or ironed in your locker, and like that was not the case, like I picked them up in the airport, he's got four bags, he's on the road for six weeks, so explain what or as best you can, like what the non-glorious part, I guess, of being a PGA tour planner, what the lifestyle is like during the week, like do you fly? I'd imagine being a young guy on tour. You don't fly private too often. Where do you typically stay? I guess what is a normal week like? Yeah, well that's the flying private. That's when it's nice to have good friends that are good to get to make an event. That's hidden value. Guys with different color jackets in their lockers? Yeah, exactly. It's like, hey guys, are you going there next week too? Well, I'm sure I'll come with you guys. It's fine. No, yeah, it's it's really I mean, it's hard to you know sit back and ever complain about anything over it's It's a pretty pretty awesome lifestyle. We live but it definitely is

many things, you know behind the scenes and stuff like that that that it is tough and I think It's just it's wears on you, man, it gets tiring. It's especially those three, four weeks in a row, you got it. I mean, it sounds so crazy to complain about this, but you know, having a pack for three or four weeks and you know, get everything, get all your laundry done,

do all this and you know, make sure you got the you know, right stuff for for which event. And you know, you go someplace cold one week. Next week something like that and you know especially for me this year going to a new place every week I'm you know I'm trying to find the restaurants to go to I mean already a couple times this year I've stated how it tells that nobody's staying in and it's not just for not asking the week that I decided not to and I'm you know 10-15 minutes from everybody and you know deal we go to some places like LA where the traffic is just terrible it is so bad and we got a you know we got an 8am tea time we got to wake up at 4 o'clock and

both time we're done practicing we're hitting 5 o'clock traffic and you know we don't get home till then and it's little things like that that in the I mean in reality. It's nothing to really complain about But it's just over three four weeks span it can't get a little tiring and it can It can wear on you a little bit and make you know those nights where you're just in the hotel room just so exhausted a little worse and But hey, it's it definitely is worth it and it so exhausted a little worse. And, but hey, it's definitely worth it. And it definitely has its perks. Yeah, yeah, it definitely, I'm sure it's worth the money. It's worth it.

It's worth it. But the worth it just came to mind for me when I really saw it is how much of a grind it was. And it's easy to look at a leaderboard every week and see the top 10 guys up there. And you see the same names up there. And you think that life on the tour is just one big glory ride but it's also you forget about those guys that are grinding out there to make cuts or maybe their games not nearly as much in shape and you know you've got you've got the money

is there but at the same time it's a stressful it can be a stressful thing week to week and you know you I mean how much do you i've always curious this as well i mean who i don't forgive me i don't know the answer this or who is your caddy and i guess how did you what is your relationship there how do you guys know each other how do you how did they pick that start yeah my caddy is uh... jason short-always from australia and uh... when i turn pro i mean i uh...

i didn't really know who i was gonna have caddy for me and you know it's I didn't really know who I was going to have Cadi for me. It's the long story of a Grel or Jordan's Cadi. I was going to have him Cadi for me and that punk turn pro before I did. So I lost him and I kind of went through a couple of people and I had this guy, Sammy Pimphold. It was a great guy. Ricky recommended him to me and he worked for me. But this was before

Q-School even so he kept it for me a couple months and then Brendan Steele called him after first days of Q-School and was like hey you know I'd love for you to work for me on tour the rest of the year and any caddy with any sort of brains would definitely take that I mean although, and who knows what it could, what, what may happen in the long run, but you just can't. I mean, the amount of money we played for on the web.com tour and the amount of money that they played, or we played for now on the PGA tour, it's a no-brainer. You know, he had to take that job. So, he did.

And then I was without someone again, and I just kind of had to use some a week to week. And I actually ended up using Griller second stage of Q-school and then I knew JB Holmes Caddy and he wasn't playing when I had final stage so I used him and I just kind of needed someone to help me get through that and then I just kind of got with my agency and we kind of just try to figure some people out and narrow it down through a couple guys and Justin Rose is with my agency as well and

his caddy-fooch is really really close with the shorty my caddy now and they kind of got in contact with my agent and got a hold of me and I just talked to him on the phone and we tried it for a couple weeks last year and he's been on the back since so it's been that it's been crazy you know the those are the stories that people the stories of how guys get their caddies is really as crazy as some of them. It is always interesting to me and it's amazing to be also how often these guys kind of change bags and how there doesn't seem to be, it's not like breaking up with a girlfriend. I know one of my friends on tour, he's had the same caddy I think maybe three

different times and they're cool with each other when he's not on the bag. It's just like, hey, I'm going to go a different direction and you just kind of go with it and it's not, you don't really take it that personal. Is that the way you see it as well? Yeah. It is crazy and there's some splits that are obviously better than others, but in the long run, it's tough for me, especially being the age I am and being the spot-amat in my career. It's really tough for a 22-year-old or a 25-year-old to sit there and you have to fire somebody. There's something that's really very comfortable. But at least I wouldn't be if I had to do that. But in the day,

you know, we're the boss in this situation, we have to do what's best for us. So it's crazy, but you know, it's all part of it. And I imagine the same thing goes that we were talking about as far as being the grind on tour. That goes for the caddies as well, because they're basically... Again, I always pictured it too that players and caddies room together and stuff on the road, but that's not that common, is it? For players or caddies? Players and caddies to room together. You don't room with your caddy on the road. The

caddies do their own thing. They typically bump up together or rent a good share rooms and whatnot. So as much of it as a grind for you, it's a grind for the caddies as well. You have the same issues. You're booking last-minute travel and it can't be cheap. Travel week to week from the tournament. Especially when you don't know how much money you're making that way. It's an interesting life for caddies as well. I've always been fascinated by that.

It is. It's something that I think is very, you know, it's very underrated and it's unbelievable how everybody who doesn't play golf just assume that Cady gets 10% of no matter what you do. Yeah, everything always. Literally not one player on tour that I know that you get 10% of whatever check that they make. I don't know if I just haven't talked to the right guy or not, but it's just not what it is. It's a really tough life they live. Obviously, if you get a great

player and you're on their bag for a while, it's not a tough life by any means, but you know, you're with someone for a while and they have a couple tough years, have to go back to the web and come back out. You have another couple tough years. You really haven't made too much money in. They room with each other a lot. I mean, it's, you really haven't made too much money. And they, they room with each other a lot. I mean, the caddies are awesome. I love going in the caddy tent and just sitting there after lunch and hanging out with them sometimes. And, you know, we'll go out and have some beers or something

like after tournament on Sunday. And, you know, we'll all get together. And, you know, it's kind of a little bond and friendship, a bunch of us have out here. So it's kind of cool to spend that with them sometimes us have out here. So it's kind of cool. It's been that way sometimes Yeah, you talk about guys that have good stories the caddy shack. That's where you want to go. That's absolutely where you want to go That is where you want to go for sure. I totally I totally I mean you can it's weird as a caddy You can I'm literally make I mean the standard is pretty much from what I understand is you do pay a caddy 10% for a win. Is that the general standard I guess on tour?

Would you agree? Yeah, like 10% of a win and then some guys will do like 6% of a cut. Like I do 6, 8, 10 with my caddy, it's 8% of the top 10, 6% of a made cut and then 10% of a win and then give them a standard base fee and some a lot of guys do 5, 7, 10. I mean there's literally there's so many different options but the 10% usually only relates to a win. Right. And then you pay them a baseline fee like per week though, at minimum correct? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what it's basically enough that they can get by and travel and expenses per week. But, I mean, if you're guys missing four or five straight cuts and let's say, if you've got three or four kids at home and you're the lone income provider for the family, that

can cycle. But at the same time, you can also be, you know, you can win the players' championship and make $180,000. So it's, you don't have quite the financial security of a PGA tour player, but you can make a very, very nice living. It's just very dependent on your player. I just find that element completely fascinating. But.

It is. It's crazy. Do you feel like, from week to week, or just, oh, now that you are top 100 player in the world and you're a established PGA tour player, I got the sense from some people I know out there that people are always wanting front something from you and I'm no exception to this because I just hit you up and said, hey, do you want to come on a podcast? So I'm not putting myself above anyone at this point, but do you always, I felt like there was always, you need to do this. Can you do this? Can you do this for me? Can

you, can I have your ball? Can I have for me? Can you, can I have your ball? Can I have your glove? Can you, can you leave me some tickets? How about this? Do you get, is that kind of overwhelming? There's somebody that's getting used to that. That's something that, that was actually, I forget who, I think it may have been a Dickey pride to be another person until it gave me a lot of advice and maybe an Alabama guy

and I mean, Dickey's about as big of a piece of work as I come and he's a character he's funny to talk to but he that was one thing he said because he just I remember here's an event and I was there and especially the rookies you know that all those club guys and guys with you know putting drills or you know swing aids they see these rookies and they're like all right this is our chance because they don't know any better stuff. They can come up to us, all you know, check this out, hit a couple with this, do a couple with that, and Dickie just came up to me and he's like, dude, you gotta say no to some people.

Like, you really think you're about to go use this, you know, I've used this Scottie Care and my whole life and this person's gonna come up to you with a potter with like the shaft going in, like the back toe that I'm like, really about to use this. to use this it's like no dude just look at him and just politely know you know I appreciate the interest but I'm I don't want to change and then it's done you know yeah and that's something I've had to get better with because you know I have some people want to do like pro-ams or dinners or stuff like that and as

much as I love that do all that stuff it just it goes with all the all the thing I'll say I need to say rested and need to just kind of you know get my priority straight and realize you know I'm here to perform at my best in my golf tournaments and for me to do that you know I just need to realize what what to say yes and not to sometimes yeah because I mean I imagine that just takes a toll when you're adding up week to week because you go into one town, you know, you're out in LA and you have a buddy that you went maybe to middle school

with that you haven't spoken to in years, that wants to get dinner and wants you to get tickets for six of his friends and whatnot. It's just, yeah, it's gotta be hard to pick and choose what you can say yes and no to. Yeah, it is, it is, but at the same time, you know, it's cool because like you said it's actually funny that you said that about L.A. we had some I mean Jordan

and I had some good buddies that will play golf at UCLA and we went out to like dinner with them one night so you know there's stuff like that where each week it is crazy especially in the sport we meet so many people and tickets to just kind of go out you know I've dinner I have a couple drinks with some friends we haven't seen in a while it's it kind of go out. You know, I've dinner, I have a couple drinks with some friends. We haven't seen it in a while. It kind of keeps us, you know, at our age and keeps us, it just kind of keeps us relaxed and everything, but at the same time, yeah, you'll get someone you literally won't even get friends with in high school. And then all of a sudden they're all, bro, what's up, man?

It's like, dude, we're not that close. I think I'll need to be saying that right now. I'm just, okay. That's, That's an interesting transition when I wanted to ask you next is I feel like a lot of I guess golf riders and media types love to lament to the fact when back when guys on the tour weren't you know in the fitness trailer at 6 a.m. and whatnot. They were out at the bars with the riders till 2 a.m. every night. There was a big party I guess aspect to the PGA tour. I think everyone would kind of agree that has died down in recent years at least. Would you say is there

is there kind of maybe a divide on tour between guys like yourself that are kind of on your grind and the up and coming and the guys that are kind of have made it in their career, so they've made, you know, $15, $20 million or maybe on the back half of their career. Is it clear to you who is out there really to, I guess, to really grind and make their way up the ranks and who has actually made it on tour? And like, do you see that, I guess, on the range and who puts in the time and as well like socially like who goes out I was still there's still guys that go out till 3 a.m. when they have a 8 a.m. t. time. Yeah you know I think I don't think it's as much as is their you know care for their golf or anything like that it's just you know it's just people's

personality and so you know you'll have guys that aren't really big grinders that they're not going to go get a lot out of practice and six hours a day. And then that's how they are. There's guys that like to go out and have five, six, seven beers at dinner and they're fine about it. They're going to be, you know, they're going to be content the next day. And, yeah, there's always, I think it doesn't matter what age or, you know, what's point the game is at. And I think this is an any sport. You're always going to have people that are going to, you know, they're going to do

their own thing that they've always done and they're always been accustomed to it. But, yeah, I mean, for some of the stories I've heard, heard there's definitely I would say it's a lot more tame But I mean you still get your guys I like to go on has some fun and I think that's I don't personally I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I mean it's not like it has as Any impact on me or it's not like it. It's it's making anything bad It's just that's what they like to do and there's no reason for them to change just because, you know, some people want them to. Yeah. I'd great that.

All right. Now, all right. I'm going to transition to one of my favorite and most fun topics. And that is, of course, tour sauce. So I guess, how familiar, first of all, before we get into it, how familiar are you with tour sauce? I feel like I'm pretty familiar with it enough to know that I probably will have my fair share of moments during the course of a day, let it let it let it let it let it let it

let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it

let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it let it I've actually hit me a couple of drives that are offline. I talk to my ball all the time. I'm terrible with that. I'm not near as bad as Jordan is. That's his whole fame level there. Yeah, yeah. He's on a totally different level.

But yeah, I mean, I get a good kick out of it. I'll definitely, some of us guys out there who understand it will give each other a pretty hard time. That's awesome. Well, for those listening that don't know what it is. Basically we came up with this about a little over a year ago. It's a list of things that a PGA tour player can do and it makes sense because they're in between the ropes and they have galleries there. That if you did in a regular round with your buddies would make no sense at all.

Such as if you hit a way where a regular round with your buddies would make no sense at all such as like if you hit a way We're drive you point with your club as if there's a Marshall up there to you know to watch for your ball And so I always say like all right. Yes. There's obvious moves that a torplier should can do or should do during a round Those that being one of them like you should warn the crowd ahead of you But I love pointing out the particular torso moves that only pros do that really just don't make that much sense. Blaming the spike mark, yes. Exactly.

So do you see a lot of these moves that you look at with a new look at them? Are you serious man? Really that spike mark is that why you missed it do you see a lot of that out there so torsino that my group I mean I know it enough to where when I see it I do genuinely think it out there

and I mean especially you know like the like I remember I mean I hate to call them out like this but like Kevin nod. I remember in the players shot. And I'm like, I mean, hits this. And this is like so typical what Jordan has done so many times. Just yelling at his ball like, oh my gosh, this is terrible. And it goes to like five feet. And I'm like, are you kidding me? Like, why are you just yelling at your ball like that?

That's what my next question was going to be. I guess who we call Porter and I from CBS made like a Torsox power rankings, I guess. Who are it? Well, first of all, who are you comfortable calling out for? I'm not saying Torsox necessarily bad thing. I find it really entertaining. I find it entertaining. It's fun. Who are some of the guys that you know and tour? I guess there's a guy's you're comfortable calling out for being that should be pretty high up there in the tour sauce rankings. Oh yeah golden top is definitely number one on that list.

I don't know. No doubt. I mean other guy I don't know. I mean that everyone kind of I don't know if there's there's, you know, everyone has their fair share of things, but it's, I mean, it is funny. I mean, we do do things that it's just unnecessary and you don't even think about it, but it just happens and see yourself on TV or some little tweet of that and you're just like, well, how did I do that? What are, what tour sauce move, I guess, are you most guilty of? Like, what is your, I guess, if you had a go-to tour sauce move,

what would you say yours is? Mm. I don't know. Like, you're not the one, one of the guys in the fairway that, you know, if you miss, if you go long or short, you don't go to the yardage book after the shot to really question whether or not you had the right yardage. or you're not looking up to the trees to see if the wind changed, right?

I do the wind thing a lot. I've been guilty of that one. The yardage book will not so much. I mean, I've done it a couple times, but that's only if it's just an absolutely absurd, distance differential that would make me even question it. But yeah, I mean, there's plenty of times where I've hit a shot and looked up at the trees and I'm like, you know, how's that? And that's a perfect example. Like why are you looking up at the trees?

Exactly. That's over what I'm going to do. Yeah, that's such a bad habit to get into. I'm not sure I wind expert could tell you anything additional about the way a tree moves that would have give you enough information to tell you how your ball came up longer. And even if you knew it doesn't matter because your shot's over with and it's sucked obviously that you wouldn't be looking so it's tough to do. All right, I want to transition a little bit into talking about, I guess, more actual golf

matters. And I asked some of my friends before we came on here, what items I should talk to you about or what questions I should ask you. And almost unanimously, people wanted to know what it was like playing with Sergio, the final round of the players' championship. Because it certainly appeared on TV and the announcers were discussing about how he was getting kind of, I guess, not even kind of, he was getting heckled by the fans during the final round. I am very guilty of making a lot of Sergio jokes in my past, but I will never stand for especially American fans, I guess harassing foreign players or harassing anyone. So I particularly did not

care for that, but I noticed after he made the putt on 17, I think you gave it, went up and gave him a high five or gave him some acknowledgement, was that kind of like, what was that like, I guess playing with him with that kind of, with that going on to distract you and what was that experience like? Yeah, it was really cool. I mean, that's the thing, but I mean, the guys I got to play with on the weekend, you know, Graham and Sergio or two people that, you know, have done some serious damage to us in the runner cups. And it was, you know, that was tough. And I mean, I think I'd be lying if I said that I had, at some point, here to get some

in my career. I mean, you know what I mean? Yeah, of course. Four or five years ago, I'm in high school and I was watching them in runner cups. I'm obviously going to pull for, you know, America. And it's nothing against them whatsoever. And I really, really, really gain, they were so nice to me.

And they said so many, so many nice things. And this, the stuff that people are saying to Sergio, we're crazy. I mean, I understand in Phoenix, when everyone there's so drunk and it's just kind of what What the 16 is known for people yelling at you, but you know to be to be one back on 17 It's all grass to that pen down land without a journal and You got people yelling at you 2013 and people yelling at you don't hit it the the water. I mean I just I couldn't believe it. I

I felt bad for him. I really did and I think that's why I honestly when he made that putt out I was happy for him You know, I didn't not that I was cheering for him over anybody in the in the playoffs I mean I didn't care. I was more upset with how I did but I Just to see him have to go through all that and such a heated moment and such an important part of the tournament was crazy. I mean, I didn't, it was, I definitely kind of got aggrassed for, you know, experiencing it live.

There's one thing, you know, what you see in here on TV, but when you're out there and dealing with it right there in person, you hear everything and it was, it was crazy. Yeah. And I'm probably as guilty as anyone as far as like being unfair towards players or making jokes and what not about players but it may sound kind of cowardly to say but it's one thing to kind of do that online. It's different to or you know you're sitting there watching TV with your friends. It's different to do that to a person at their place of business.

You know like that's not the way golf should be. I'm not above criticism in any way. People get on me for being too hard on certain players or whatnot. It may seem big cowardly that I wouldn't say these things to Sergio or anyone to his face. But you can't harass someone while they're playing golf. That's not fair. This isn't the Ryder Cup. I feel like the final stretch of the players has kind of turned into a little bit like the

Wastemanagement. Those guys were hammered. Yeah. Yeah. It's too many places they're trying to turn into the Wastemanagement. I agree. I think it's just taking a lot out of the game. It's just, it's not what golf's meant to be. And I mean, it's easy for us to say. It's, you know, a

lot of people look at the game and golf and they're like, well, the sport's not fun unless it's like that. And, you know, if it's not, but just don't come out of here with that. It's tough. And, you know, the game is that a spot where in a spot where we need as much as we can in support, but that's just not really the support that we need. Hopefully it will get better. It golf is in a great time and a it'll calm down. Yeah. So was that pretty much the craziest atmosphere that you've played in so far, that final stretch of the players? Does it rival, I guess, this? I mean, I don't know, that feeling.

Yeah. It was. Just because I wasn't really in contention that much at the players on those holes. I mean, I was up till I'd say probably 15 was when I really didn't have a chance anymore and then But I mean at the at the player earth the waste management

You know even when you're not in contention to be the last couple of groups I mean I was in the last group on Saturday when the most people that come to a tournament of all time any tournament any year and I was a big fan of group for that and I mean the stuff like trying to try to hit 120 yard wedged out with you know you got 40,000 drunk people screaming at you it's like your adrenaline it's just it's crazy and it's it was this not so it was it was really cool to do and to spend that day and play with a burger was pretty sweet. So it was fun.

That's awesome. So are there guys that, I guess, when you get paired with or in general when you play a practice round with, are there specific guys out there that you want to out drive? Like you want to, you want to hit it past a certain guy's like, I'd imagine if you, the golden child, you want to hit it past him probably at least a- Well, I mean, I would want to, but it's really not even a competition hit it past him probably at least took a while. I mean I would want to but it's really not even a competition I fly him a lot every time I get a drive so that's I'm not too worried.

He has gotten longer he can get a little closer to me but uh but yeah that stuff like that it's not even a competition I just kind of hit it out there and it seems to get passed him every time so that's easy. I think I think you answered my next question is how much pride is they're out there with guys on tour trying to hit it past each other is it something you guys kind of ribbed each other on it's probably not it's it's probably too it's too much of a deal to me that it probably is other people I mean it's it's funny I'm someone I'm I'm kind of a golf nerd I like watching

golf and I'm not playing even if I playing. Even if I'm playing in the afternoon and there's coverage on in the morning, I'll watch it just because I enjoy watching golf. And time, I've been in contention. I've tried to have it recorded just because I like to watch it and see how I handle it and see how I do everything. And it's really cracking me up. How every single shot I hit, they just tell me, I just swing in too hard. do everything and it's just it's really cracking me up how everything will

shine a hit they just tell me I'm just swinging too hard. I mean I'm just like no I haven't been on TV every my life until this year and they just don't understand that that's how I play. That's your swing that got you there. Exactly and I do understand the other maybe times where I could swing and softer but it's like there's people that are better when they're between clubs with one club or the other and I mean that's just my game and that's how I am. So that's Well, it's definitely take the pride in a little bit, but you know a lot of the older guys probably don't care at all Yeah, well, I mean imagine I was about a good point you made about and about rewatching around

a good point you made about it and about rewatching your rounds. How sick of it do you get as far as the same narratives that they say every time you're on the screen? It's one of three things. It's, well, you know, he's friends with Jordan's Beath or, oh, he's 145 pounds soaking wet or this will be the new one as well. He's roommates with Patrick Rogers. Like, do you feel like that sometimes I had not to get on the CBS or NBC guys too much? It's like they don't even try to look into coming up with new things or things to say about somebody. It's the same stuff over and over again. Oh, Jason Duffner, he's lost weight.

Like, does that get on you at all? At least a little bit or do you notice that kind of thing? Something definitely did. It was, I mean, because I felt like I'd played well and I'd, you know, got my name out there and then Jordan won the Masters and I've literally had more media than I've ever had in my entire life. I was like, I really just want to be like, you know what? I'm happy for him to career. It's awesome. It's motivating, but I just don't want to talk about him more like, yeah. And in no way do I mean that this

is like the Jordan I mean I am there's a reason I went out and practiced that morning and watched the entire phone around I mean I was pulling form harder than anybody but it's just like I mean that's I'm worried about my own thing and I don't want to be associated as Jordan's friend I want to be associated as myself and and be known for the things that I do on the course, not just, you know, for knowing somebody. Right. Imagine being in maybe 10 years ago as like a guy like Phil answering the questions about Tiger. And Adam Scott winning the bridge stone and answering questions about his caddy who would use the caddy for Tiger. Like it draws me nuts as far as the narratives that some of the media tries to drive.

And I guess, how much attention do guys in the locker room pay to? Do you guys ever roll your eyes? I guess some of the things that get said, is it a point of discussion? Is it, I think it's crazy how the smallest little things turn into a blog post or something on every single major golf website. Is that something you guys notice or care about? Is it annoying? I think we notice it sometimes. I mean, it's obviously some things are different than others.

But yeah, I mean, we just will definitely roll our eyes at some things that are sad or done, but at the end of the day, I mean, that's whether the media that's their job, I mean, they're trying to get stuff out of us or, you know, try to make a story out of something. I mean, we can't really, I guess, you know, fault them for that. But although there's things that are talked about that we probably wouldn't care if they're talked about. It's not really a whole lot we can do about it.

Yeah, the only defense I'll give, I guess, is the media is the fact that they're covering an individual sport where the golfers inherently aren't that interesting, I think. I mean, there's just not the same drama that goes with the NFL season where there's 1800 players or, you know, the team aspect of the NBA, etc. So they don't have a ton of things to write about. So I'll at least defend that. I think they got many people writing, writing these same stories over and over again. But it's, it can be difficult to cover, but I think that they try way too hard. I think like something like that happened last year where Rory, they claim people are claiming Rory

was throwing shade at Phil and Tiger because he said they were on the back into their careers. It's like, yeah, that's just literally the most easy observation you could possibly make. No one's gonna argue that they're on the back into their careers, but I imagine that stuff has got to, and people like Rory have taken note of it and are not as open with the media at times, I think.

Well, and it's tough, and I mean, they ask questions to try to get that stuff out of us too. It's like, one question that I'll never understand why Guys getting trouble for answering is you know when they ask them how they feel that they are about their game or how You know where they think that they are you know or how good do they think they are? It's like well what person would say that they don't think they're one of the best in the world, right? We're playing the sport to try to be that and we're playing each week expecting to win So why would we sit here and say, yeah, I'm probably at top like 60.

I mean, maybe in the top 60, I'm average. I've reached my potential. That's it for me, yes. If you're head to head with Rory, I feel like the media go out to you. Do you really think he can beat him in the world? Yeah, I do. I mean, understand it might be harder than being to you like do you really think he can beat him in the world? It's like, oh yeah, I do. I don't know why.

I mean, I understand it might be harder than it being a 300th person in the world, but I played well to get there. And you never know what's going to happen in the day. So it's just, if that's a part of it, you know, like I said earlier, that's their job. But it's, you know, it's whatever. Yeah.

I'm curious, how into, I guess, the new wave of golf stats are you? I mean, I don't know how familiar you are with, like, strokes gained, putting strokes gained T-degree and kind of a new way, new Mark Brody way of looking into, like, I've read the book every shot counts. I don't know if you have, how much do you look into our understand or invoke that into your training or your analysis of your game? Yeah, I look at stats a lot. I probably do more than usual. understand or invoke that into your training or your analysis of your game. Yeah, I look at stats a lot. I probably do more than usual. I mean, I look at mine from each week after I finish just because it.

I mean, I just feel like it's pretty, it's right there. So obvious to look at what you need to improve on when you can, when you have it all right in front of you. I mean, I put it I put it great last week and I and I did it at the players too and I mean I knew that and I just had a couple days where my ball strike was a little loose and am I driving and at the days where I drove it well. I mean that's you know I drove it well on Saturday both both players and last week and I played well. It's like it's not it's no secret or anything like that and I think that's where stuff or stats really at least for me helps me just because I learn and know what to practice. Yeah okay so do you buy but are you looking into like these strokes gained aspect of it or do basically my question is I think these certain stats like driving accuracy greens and regulation even are kind of outdated stats right i mean you can look at the end of your round

and you have twenty eight puts and you could have had a great-round putting or you could have had a terrible around putting depending on where you were in regulation so do you are you aware of those like as concepts and you do you it do you like as study or have you learned about those in recent years yeah i mean i I definitely do understand that it's supposed to for someone like, you know, like in my distance, driving, you know, fairway percentage, which is obviously driving accuracy, is that isn't as important because, you

know, if I'm missing fairways by, you know, four yards, or if I'm missing them by two yards, but I have sandwich in as opposed to, you know something like that then I obviously the fairway is extremely important and many tournaments is firm and fast as the greens are but there are also some weeks where I'm trying to you know you got probably allow for one whole day where I'm trying to drive it up by green and I'm not going to hit it on the green I'm probably going to hit it in a bunker or green jet bunker or rough and then you're going to have a you know a hole where I'll hit a good drive but it'll just go through the fairway or something like that. So it's just that's why it's important for me to look at them because I know I'll have weeks where I feel like I drove it well and I'll be at 60 percent and that's fine but I can look at my I missed 10 pots inside 10 feet this week and I'm like, okay, you know, I just need to practice a little bit more. Like I, my, I didn't make any

pots outside of 15 feet for the first part of this year and I've really, really worked on that. And I mean, the last probably four or five weeks I've made, I mean, at, probably at least four or five pots over 15, 20 feet each week. So that's something that looking at those stats is really beneficial. Yeah, that adds up too. So what is I'm going to put you on the spot with this one. What is the most shameful layup you've ever had in your professional golf in career? Like, can you think of off top of your head where you'd be like, oh man,

no, leg up is going to get on me for this one. I believe it or not. I definitely remember one at the Phoenix. I had like, I had like, I think I had like, 243 or something on Sunday. And that green is just, it's sitting weird for a right-hander, I think. I think it's a great green for a left-handed because it would help a cut in there. Is this 15? No, it's on a four.

Three, three, four. Oh, three. Is it three? It's the par five, yeah, yeah. So the pit was down in the front, and like long is no good, and shorts that hazard. And I'm like, well, it was just cold enough for the ball wasn't really fine.

And I was like, well, I need to fly it about 230. And I couldn't quite carry my forearm that far without just peering it. And my two iron, if I hit it good, it's going to go over. And I was like, I can't do this. I'm not, all reality not going to make a three going for it. And I know if I lay up, it's such an easy wedge.

I'm not going to have more than about six feet. But I'm like, I can't believe I'm laying out from 240 right now, this is pretty tight. What's funny is I've made a no secret on Twitter that I'm a big fan of your game and that people will tell on you to me. I literally had a guy like, just in time it's just laid up from 267.

I'm like, wait a second here, like 267. That's not like a guarantee, but just be careful out there. It's all I'm gonna say is people tell on you. I'm just sitting there trying to enjoy the tournament. I don't wanna hear these things. I don't wanna hear about people laying up. So just be careful out there and know that if you got a shot inside 250 and you lay up, somebody may tell on you.

Yeah. Well, I like every year, number 10, that whole stuff hard, but that's another hole where it's not a very good distance for me, because it's way too much. And for a right hand or to cut a three, well, that's a pretty good three, would you get it down just over that green. So I don't think it's that hard of a workshop personally.

I mean, you can at least hit the green saw. I was like, I got to lay up every day. And I'm like, I know one day I'm going to get bashed by no leg out of this. That, you got to lay up every day and I'm like, I know one day I'm going to get bashed by no laying up with this. I kind of exclude number 10. I don't get on people for laying up there. I'm not senseless. I'm not like, yeah, no laying up,

but it's like you don't have to be stupid. You know, I don't encourage you going jumping off a cliff. Like, you have to play within your reigns and that whole, I still, I watched all the live that coverage for that whole. I couldn't tell you what the right play is, I really can't. I don't know if that makes it a great or a terrible whole, I like the whole, but you have to play smart. You're playing for the lowest score, I'm not an idiot. But yeah, you give a free pass though.

I can't get on you for ever laying out just because of how often you do go for it. So don't, don't, don't. I'm glad to hear. It definitely is. Actually, I'm talking to my caddy about it just because we do. We are getting a little bit portaled

and too aggressive on the going for it. We're getting like 280 to a, you know, a pan a little end of the land, and then you can't be short-right. And I'm like, let's just, I think we can get there and I like, heal it. I'm like, why did we just go to that? I was so stupid. Waited for the green to clear too and missed it by 40 yards yet.

Exactly. Well, I had a terrible one last week on 14. It was like 290 to the front and it was like a little downwind and it was one to where, you know, know if I turn like if I turn over my Three would off the tee. I mean I can carry about to 85 to 90 and that's gonna fly Front of the green and go over the green. I'm like man if I hit like a low Kind of hook and two iron with that slope. I'm like I can get I think I can get this on the green and I can definitely get The other front and I waited for the green clear and I just chunked In the water like not even remotely close.

It was so embarrassing. It's terrible. Oh, that sounds like a normal, I guess, amateur. That anytime I'm waiting for a green to clear and I gotta wait and sit there with my three wooden my hand, there's a 3% chance I hit the ball first. I mean, it's impossible after a long way. I mean, I guess, do you notice, I guess the pay,

I feel like pace of play has not really been a noted issue this year on tour. Maybe it's just because we've had so many good storylines, so much success out there. Do you feel like there's a pace of play issue, I guess, on tour? Do you notice it or? Yeah, I definitely think people should play faster. Yeah. And there's just too many times where I feel like we're, you know, just having to wait.

Or we have so many rounds over like, you know, five hours. Last week was awesome. I mean, it was, pace play was the best spin on a year, I thought. And, uh, but yeah, I just, I don't know if it's what they need to change the consequences or what they need to do. But I definitely think that the pace play could be a little bit better. Tell me what you think of this idea. I want to bounce this idea off PGA tour player. This is my half-baked idea for how to fix slow play.

And by half-baked, I mean, this obviously could literally never happen. But tell me this wouldn't speed up the pace of play. You get a warning, and then once you have failed to keep up the pace, you get what we call the belt. This is an idea. I put this whole thing in a blog post. You get what's called the belt. And a ref comes out and basically shames you with a belt, like a WWE style belt that goes around your ways. that will randomly like vibrate throughout while you're walking or while you're swinging and you can't predict how it's going to vibrate. Tell me that the shame having to wear a belt and the fact that it could mess up your swing,

tell me that wouldn't pick up pace of play. I think, you know, I think if we could work on it being like, see through or something like that, where there are sponsors or anything, you could cover it up, I'm on board. You could even have it sponsored. That's how you make, that's how you can do it, you could sponsor it, then the PGA Tour would want to do it. You know, here comes the belt presented by FedEx and I tell it, you know, you can't tell me that wouldn't be a must-see TV when somebody's coming down the stretch and they- People have talked about some ideas. I mean, I've talked about-

I mean, Shorty have talked about like a guy. Just, you get each- how each group has like a score and like a standard bear- a guy. And when there are 45 seconds is up, the airborne is blowing. Whatever, where they are. Exactly. It's gonna keep blowing until they hit their shot. That's perfect.

I mean, there's so many options. The guys in the neighboring groups would love that too. Exactly. It's going to keep pulling until they hit their shot. That's perfect. I mean, there's so many options. The guys in the neighboring groups would love that too. Exactly. We'd run into a little bit of conflict today. It's, uh, it's pretty funny, I guess. All right, I'm going to get you out of here. I got two final questions. If you could go back this season, any shot you've made or taken on the PJ tour this year,

if you could go back and redo one shot, you get one mold again this year. What's the shot? What tournament? I'm T-Sion on 16. Yeah, man, for sure. Yep, that's it. That's exactly the one I had in mind. Yeah, it was.

Well, you hit it two-iron, right? Yeah, I did. It was 270. It was like 273 to the bunker. Yeah. I mean, I carry that club about 240 usually, and it rolls out to 262, 265 and you know that was my first really time in contention at Torvette. You know really

in contention and you know my journal just got the test. I mean I just murdered it and that was loud learned from it and I'll know to hit a point next year from in contention on that whole. I'm glad you said that one. That was the exact shot I had in mind. I haven't seen every one of your shots this year, but I had waged on you to win that tournament. And I was, I mean, you were charging. You were making a furious charge that day.

And I couldn't believe that you could, that two iron would go that far. I knew, I mean, you had to be thinking that you were safe with that club. And I think you just kind of shut the face a little bit and then rolled out on you. And it's, yeah, I mean, I turned, I picked up the tee and everything and kind of worked the face a little bit and it rolled out on you and it's uh... yeah I mean I picked up the tee and everything and kind of worked up and just too hot right in

the bunkers I was like all right there we go I was I wasn't over to look at four. Well learning experience so. Exactly. Lastly rather generic and cheesy question but do you have any specific I guess goals for the remainder of the season is president's cup on your mind is it you know do you want to make your way to the top 50 for you make sure you're in all the WGC events and all the majors I guess what are your main goals I guess for the year? Yeah I have a bunch of goals actually looked at a couple days ago it's funny you say that I

at the beginning of the year I put all my goals for the entire year on my phone just to have and look at everyone's in a while and so when I'm through on the year I put all my goals for the entire year on my phone just to have and look at everyone's a little island so when I'm through on the year I can look at them. I mean I haven't shared all of them with everyone just because I know once you bring them up then people talk about that. Don't do it. Yeah, but yeah, I mean it's definitely stuff like making teams or getting in the top certain ranking in the world is definitely out there, but I think the most important one. I definitely want to do it the way that

at least once this year, I felt like I'm definitely good enough to do so, and it's just a matter of me keeping on putting the work in. And just making sure that I'm staying healthy and rested and my games in the right shape. And just keep put myself there and whether it's next week at the bar or the middle of the summer or next year or whenever the time is going to be right, it'll be right. So I just have to let it happen. Excellent. All right.

Now, you're the first PGA tour player we've had on the podcast. Who should I be looking into next? Who is an underrated guy that would be really good to talk to or something that I haven't thought of that would be a really witty, a good guy at good guest or who should I be going for next to get on the podcast? I'm pretty good boys at Max home, but he's pretty funny. He's good. I know he has been playing as well as he would have liked the last, you know, month or so, but that's, you know, that's just kind of a part of golf. But I think he's one of my best friends out there, and you know, we hang out a lot together and we hung out a lot last year.

He's, sometimes we'll say, get a little dicey on the edge on Twitter sometimes. He's pretty funny, but he's a good dude and he's, good dude and he's honest, which I think is a good thing. Good. All right. Well, I'll let you go, man. He kept you for an hour. This was much appreciated and congrats on all your success this year and best of luck the rest of the way. I know, obviously, we'll be following along and we'll be keeping in touch about the year

and hopefully catch up again sometime later in the game. Yeah, sounds good. Thanks for having me, man. You bet. Take care, Justin. See you, man. Give it a big club. Feed a right club today. That's better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most.